Morbid - Episode 229: The Tragic Death of Natalie Wood

Episode Date: May 3, 2021

Natalie Wood had one of the most troubling back stories a child star could have, a stage mom that crossed all imaginable boundaries, a violent alcoholic for a father and men that took advantage of her all throughout her life. She thought she had found safety in Robert Wagner, who she was married to twice. But the events on the final night of her life leave some with questions about Robert Wagner… did he push his beloved wife overboard? Book mentioned in episode: Natasha: The Biography of Natalie Wood by Suzanne Finstad  As always, thank you to our sponsors: Hellofresh: Get twelve free meals—including free shipping!—when you use code morbid12 at HelloFresh.com/morbid12. Embr: You can save $50 on either product by visiting embwave.com/Morbid. Hunt a Killer: Go to HuntAKiller.com/MORBID and use MORBID, for 20% off your first box. Clear: Right now, for a limited time, you can get your first two months of CLEAR for FREE.  Go to CLEAR me dot com slash MORBID and use code MORBID. BestFiends: Download the 5 star-rated puzzle game, Best Fiends FREE today on the App Store or Google Play See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

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That's ANGI, or download the app today. Hey, weirdos, I'm Elena. I'm Ash. And this is morbid. Hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey, it's an Ash centric morbid. Wookie, wookie, wookie, wookie, wookie, wookie, you know, here we are. It's like fresh off a listener like, fresh off a listener tale. Fresh off a listener tale.

So if you guys have to go listen to Scream this week because it was like the funnest episode that we ever recorded. And the only reason I thought of that just now is because I said wookie, wookie, and Elena at one point. We were talking about like one of the things in the movie and just how ridiculous it was and the person looked like a sim.

And Elena just goes, you looked like a sim and a lane it just goes He looked like this when he threw that thing in there. You just went wobby bow And we just laughed and laughed and laughed for like 25 minutes. I'm telling you. It's a great. It's a great episode of scream Wobby bow only I you know I just brought forth my simlish Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo!

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Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! Bo! B. B. You won't. Hold on, I gotta think of it. Oh, I can't. Hold on. I can't do it. Oh, mom. We give the people what they want. I can't do it. Well, she did it in front of Jon and Jon was like, you're so weird. He literally said that. We just horrified him every single time I love him.

Literally, he was like, you're so weird. And he just said it very exasperately. He was like, oh, you're so weird, but you're good to have around. I am. I think so. Yeah. Alina actually, I sliced my finger up on on Alina's house today. And she fixed it for me. I try. So you're going to have around. I'm just trying to keep everybody from bleeding in this house. That's my job. How did you feel when I was bleeding? I felt stressed. Oh, okay. I don't like seeing you. But you didn't yell at me to put it back in

because you didn't make this blood. No, I didn't make this blood. Well, we are blood. But I didn't like seeing it. Oh. That's precious blood. I was just laughing. All right, well, this has nothing to do with anything.

But I love an old Hollywood case, as you know, when I know that we just did one, but sometimes I get a little bit addicted and I just have to do another one. The more the merrier. So, I decided to cover the case of Natalie Wood because also- Natalie Wood! A lot of shit just kind of happened in this case, pretty like in recent years.

So see? So it's just like- Uh-oh, I was gonna say let's just dive into this, but that feels- Ooh, then poor taste. That's in poor taste. It is. That is in poor taste. And you know what? If anybody watches Gilmore Girls and has watched it

like a hundred times like I have, do you remember Miss Sabrina? No, Miss Selene. I think her name is Miss Selene, the like old, clothing designer lady. And when she sees her, her life she goes, not really would.

And I think of it every time. Not really would. What a great fucking compliment. Oh, I hope someone knows what I'm talking about. I hope you will. If you have somebody, will. Somebody remembers. Somebody will.

Well, Lurlie Gilmour, no I'm just kidding. Natalie Wood was born on July 29th, 1938, to Maria and Nikolai Zakorenko. I think I said that right. I like it. Thanks. At birth, she was named Natalia Nikolavina Zakarinkov. Ooh, yeah, beautiful name. I did not say it pretty, but I bet everybody else did.

God. Now both of Natalie's parents were immigrants from Russia, and they left Russia actually because of the civil war going on at the time there. Nicolai's father had actually been killed in a street fight during the war, and that was when the family kind of realized that they needed to get out of there. They were like, all right. Yeah, so it reached a point. It reached a point.

So his family, or excuse me, know the mother's family, Natalie Woods' mother. First, they went to China, and then they went to Montreal because she had a brother there. And eventually, they made the way to San Francisco where Natalie was born. Hey, oh. And then about eight the way to San Francisco where Natalie was born. Hey, yo. And then about eight years later, Natalie's little sister would be born Fetlana, but they called her Lana and her last name was Gerdin. In Santa Monica, after the family moved closer

to Hollywood for Natalie's career and they changed their last name. All right. All right. I like all these names. I do too, but we don't like Maria very much. We don't. Mm-hmm. Okay. Maria always wanted her daughters to like live out her dream and become superstars. That always works out really well. Except not at all. Yeah. It's always very loving and very supportive.

Yeah. That's kind of family. Yeah, nothing ever happens. I would like to live vicariously through you. Yeah, it's always, it's always perfect. Yeah, so I don't understand what could go wrong here. It's a five out of five you. Yeah, it's always perfect. Yeah, so I don't understand what could go wrong here. It's a 5 out of 5 recipe. Yeah, absolutely. Now Maria's number one dream growing up was to become a ballet dancer or an actress. And a traveler had once told her that her second born daughter was going to be a star known throughout the world.

But that Maria should be wary of swimming or anything like that, because the woman said that she saw her drowning in dark water. Oh damn. She's like, if you don't die in this dark water that I see you drowning in, you're gonna give birth to a star. Wow. Why? And how weird.

I know. Like what a weird... Okay, we're gonna get into it too. There's like a lot of weird shit surrounding this. So when Maria had three daughters, she actually had an older daughter named Olga from a previous marriage, but she thrust her dream upon them

as well as instilling an intense phobia of water. All of them were like super duper afraid of water. That's horrific. Yes. That's considering how this all ends. It is. Now in the book Natasha, the biography of Natalie Wood, the author Suzanne Finstan points out

that the household Natalie grew up in was basically just rooted in fear. Maria was like very superstitious. So there were other fears that she passed down to her children. Like, one of them was that if you picked up the salt to pass it to somebody at dinner, you were gonna get in an argument. So you had to slide it over to the person

who asked instead. Oh, okay, and it's like, things like that every once in a while are like, that's fun for some salt over your shoulder. I do think all that, but it's like when you're really hammering it in, like bad things are gonna happen, that's a recipe for disaster. Yeah, and that was just like one of them.

And then Natalie's father was like a pretty, like a pretty fearful guy too. He like wouldn't let her out in big groups because she was so small, he was afraid that she'd somehow get hurt. Oh, I know, it was just like really good. She said he was, he was an interesting man. Like he had, he was a very like violent tempered man.

But he really loved Natalie like, because that was his first born daughter. Yeah. And they had this bond, but also he was like a very frightening man in her life. So was he like abusive at all? I couldn't find anything to say that he was abusive toward her or Maria, actually. Okay. But he just doesn't like a violent temper.

Yeah, violent temper. So when Natalie was around three, she started taking ballet classes and her mom would also bring her to the movies constantly. Now this wasn't just like to hang out and like have some other daughter time. This was Maria's way of training Natalie as a young actress, because the family didn't have a ton of money at the time,

so that was the only way she knew how to do it. School. Yeah, school, she's like study, take notes. Now, ballet class and going to the movies all the time sounds like a pretty great time, but for Natalie, this was like her job. Like it was not a fun hobby that she was doing or it wasn't like bonding time with her mom.

And behind closed doors, like I said, things weren't as stable as they appeared on the outside because like I said, Nikolai was a very violent man with a drinking problem. And then Maria was just always putting a ton of pressure on Natalie to just be absolutely perfect. And I hate that. I feel like I could cause like a mental breakdown

in a grown adult, never mind a child. Yeah, I never understand when people are like that with their kids. Just to have all of that on you at like three or four years old. Yeah, they just like why are you trying to force perfection on something like? No. Because you just want to look at them they just like, why are you trying to force perfection on something? No. Because you just want to look at them and be like, you are so far from perfect yourself.

Why are you trying to force it on a four year old? Well, that's a thing. It's like, you didn't do any of these things that you wanted to do. And like, that's not her fault. And look, you're fine. And what if she has, you know what it's like to have a dream?

What if she has a dream that's different than yours? Yeah, and you're just taking that away so that you can buy, carelessly live through her. Right. Like, that's so weird. It should even. And never understand parents like that. When it starts so young, it's always just so alarming.

Like, yeah, because kids need to be kids. Yeah, and a lot of these kids that get involved in Hollywood, they just don't get a chance to be kids. Oh, yeah, you look at these, like, childhoods. I mean, you look at the really sad stories, like, Lindsey Lohan and I know that. But these fears. Like, it's, you look at these like childhoods, I mean, you look at the really sad stories, like Lindsey Lohan and not like- Britney Spears, like it's, you look at it and you're like, that's so sad.

That not one second of your life was just being a kid. Not one second, especially not not a leader. Because it's like if you want your kid to be an actress, one that's not for you to side, never understand that. I don't get it. I would like my child to be this. Let your child decide for themselves what they want to be. But it's like, if you're hoping they become an actress,

encourage them to play Make Believe. Yeah, as a kid. Yeah, like don't make it a pressure. You don't have to put pressure on everything. It's so strange. But with all the pressure on her, Natalie actually did have a lot of talent. And much to Maria's Delight, she was discovered by, excuse me, at the age on her, Natalie actually did have a lot of talent. And much to Maria's delight, she was discovered at the age of four, by crew members working on the set of

a movie, discovered at four years old. I hate that. Yeah, it's, it's, I feel like we shouldn't be looking at like four year olds and being like, wow, she's so beautiful. Like let's put her on TV. That's not about that. Just like, it's just off. Excuse me, the Ikea. I don't like it. No. Hi, I'm Lindsey Graham, the host of Wondery's podcast American Scandal. We bring to life some of the biggest controversies in US history. Presidential lies, environmental disasters, corporate fraud. In our newest series, we look at the Kids for Cash Scandal, a story about corruption inside America's system of juvenile justice. In Northeastern Pennsylvania, residents had begun noticing an alarming trend. Children were being sent away to jail in high numbers, and often for committing only minor

offenses. The FBI began looking at two local judges, and when the full picture emerged, it made national headlines. The judges were earning a fortune, carrying out a brazen criminal scheme, one that would shatter the lives of countless children, and force a heated debate about punishment, an America's criminal justice system. Follow American scandal wherever you get your podcasts.

You can listen ad-free on the Amazon Music or Wonder App. What makes a person a murderer? Are they born to kill? or are they made to kill? I'm Candice DeLong and on my podcast Killer Psychie Daily, which you can find exclusively on Amazon Music. I share a quick 10-minute rundown every weekday on the motivations and behaviors of the criminal masterminds you read about in the news. I have decades of experience as a psychiatric nurse, FBI agent, and a criminal profiler.

On Killer Psychie Daily, I'll give you my expert perspective on cases like the mysterious New York City drugings, breaking down Lori Valow, a.k.a. Mommy Doom stays motives, and what drove Caitlin Armstrong to murder? I'll also bring on expert guests who add even more insight into these criminal minds. I promise you won't regret adding these 10 minutes to your morning routine. Hey, Prime members, listen to the Amazon Music

exclusive podcast Killer Psychie Daily in the Amazon Music app. Download the app today. Now William Goats and David Lewis worked as executives for RKO radio pictures at the time, and they decided that young Natalia would need a stage name. So that's obviously where Natalie came from. So Natalia is like a beautiful name. I know.

Not that Natalie is in, but Natalia is already a gorgeous name. I don't know why you would change it. Like that's a very actress name, I feel. That's what I think too. But not back then, you needed like a very Americanized name, which is bullshit. Yeah. So Natalie was their pick for the first name obvious reasons.

And then for the last name, they decided on Wood because of a director Sam Wood that actually Natalie would eventually work with. Huh, look at that. Yeah. Natalie Wood. Natalie Wood was born. Now her first big role on the big screen lasted about 15 seconds. Fun. Yep. It was in the movie Happy Land and her character just drops an ice screen. It's pretty compelling shit if you ask me. Very for you. It's very on-brand

for a four-year-old. Yeah. I will say that. You could do it. She probably nailed it. Yeah. She was awesome at it. And around that time, Natalie caught the attention of a famous director called Irving Pichel and the pressure coming in from her mother just kept building. Maria told her five-year-old, her five-year-old child, that she better make Mr. Pichel love her. Oh, gosh.

She was like, you have to make them love you. Oh. Like, why are we teaching a five year old bat? No. Now, of course Natalie did. Well, it's so gross. Oh, it gets fucking weirder because Natalie, like, totally, like, she worked it, whatever. I mean, she's trying to make her mom happy. Right. And Irving Pichel, like, took a liking to her. And I didn't find anything that said it was like in a creepy way, but this is like super weird. He wanted to adopt her. And he went as far as sending attorneys to Natalie's childhood home in hopes to adopt her.

Was this like, was there like a citizenship? No, she was born in the United States. No, she was born in the US. I'm very confused. It was so weird. Now here's the thing. It was in that book that I mentioned before that I'll link in the show notes. And different sources were like, yeah, I heard a different version of that story. Like, I heard that like, actually, he just like made a joke about it and then nothing came of it. And basically, what people said is that like Maria wouldn't belish stories. Oh.

And like Lana, her Natalie's younger sister was like, yeah, I remember like that joke. But I don't, and I remember like him coming over to like, like meet our family, but nothing like no attorneys. Like oh my goodness, I want to adopt you. Yeah, exactly. And it was like very weird. Yeah, it's all weird.

Super, super weird. Well, Irving Pitchell later did help Natalie get cast in a larger role in the movie Tomorrow is Forever. Now for the role, she needed to know how to cry on cue. But as a five year old. As a five year old. But because I literally my accenten says because she was a five year old and lacked formal training,

she didn't know how to cry on cue. No, but that's okay. Because Maria knew how to make somebody cry. Oh, okay. Because Maria knew how to make somebody cry. Oh, I'm sure Maria knew how to make somebody cry. She did. She just took little five-year-old Natalie aside and she said that maybe you should picture the childhood, or excuse me, the family dog dying.

And, oh no, no, no, we're not done yet. Because when that didn't really work, there was a butterfly in a jar on set. And Maria took it out of the jar and ripped its wings off in front of Natalie. And so Natalie started crying. And Maria grabbed her arm and said, she's ready now and tossed her on set

after ripping a butterfly's wings off in front of her. Maria, you're a twat. A twat. A twat. A horrific. Yeah, you suck. You're a horrible monster. Like Maria. What?

What? What? I can't even, I can't even form words. I can't, I can't imagine people somebody doing that to a child that they don't have a relationship with. Like somebody on set, who's your child? Who's your child? Who's ripping my eyes off of a butterfly? Like that is, you have to be an evil monster

to do that, especially as an adult. Yes. Like kids don't even do that. And then to just make her upset. Like your child. Grab her by the arm and be like, oh, like she's right now. Like, like you literally destroyed your child,

made her cry. Yes. She gave her a horrible image to have stored in her memory forever. Two, because now she's picture your dog dying. Oh, wow, I'm very angry. It's still very bad for Natalie Wood. It's awful and you're gonna feel even worse

by doing this. Like life just failed, Natalie Wood. Man. Now, tomorrow is forever ended up being a huge success and it led to Natalie not only having psychological damage from her mother's display of animal cruelty, but also a contract with 20th Century Fox on a lighter note. Oh, good.

And another role that would be her biggest yet. I don't know if you've seen this movie. It's a miracle in 34th Street. Oh, no, I've never heard of it. Yeah. It's a pretty big movie. It's pretty big. So yeah, that was her biggest role.

And then from then on, Natalie's roles were kind of just like falling into her lap coming constantly because that was such a big movie. She was in at least 31 films over the course of her career. And some people say over 50. Wow. Which is a lot of freaking movies. Wow.

That's a lot. Yeah. She died when she was 43 years old. I was gonna say, I was like, wow. Yeah, that's a lot. Yeah, she died when she was 43 years old. So that's like, wow, yeah, that's a lot. Yeah, that's like a movie. Especially about it. Yeah, wild. Damn. So Maria must have been happy. I was going to say. And at one point, she actually spoke to a reporter about Natalie, and she told him, God made Natalie. I invented her. Wow. Like, okay Regina George, I don't even know. I don't even know how that works.

God made her, but I invented her. Because God made Natalia, like technically. And she's saying like, I invented Natalie, exactly. Oh. But it's like, we're not talking about like someone like that you're their manager. You're her mom. And she's a child.

Like she's Natalia. And she's a little baby child. You didn't invite invent anything. She's still Natalia, your child. Yeah, exactly. Wow, yep. She really sees her as a commodity. Oh, she absolutely doesn't.

So does Hollywood, because as we all know, Hollywood's bright lights are just mainly there to cast dark shadows that ate and destroying childhood innocence. I wrote that sentence myself. That was beautifully said. Thank you so much. I stumbled a little bit over it, but I felt so good when I typed it on my computer. It was powerful. Now, Natalie was no different than most of the child stars that we've talked about before and she faced more than her fair share of trauma

at the hands of adults who like should have done better for her. Yeah. Apparently when she was 15 years old, people literally say that her mother like quote unquote pimped her out to Frank Sinatra, who was 38 years old at the time. I hate everything about this.

Natalie was on set of the silver chalice, and Frank came into the studio to shoot a different movie that he was doing, and when Maria and Natalie noticed him, Maria suggested that Natalie go introduce herself. And when she did, Frank invited her and Maria to a party at his house. So Natalie was encouraged by her mother to go by herself because it would be good for her career. Maria. But there was definitely like an underlying. Worse and worse.

And it only gets worse. Like a nurse. It was later speculated that Maria turned a blind eye to the fact that 16-year-old Natalie was having a quote-unquote affair with a director named Nicholas Ray on the set of this movie called Rebel Without a Cause. Oh, this movie. This movie. The this movie Rebel Without a Cause. I don't know if you've ever seen it again.

All of the movies that she's in are like, you know, just this movie. Just that movie. But I say a fair because she was 16, he was 44, a whole last grown man, She was 16, he was 44, a whole last grown man, which is like a fair or assault. A fair or assault? Well, assault. What you decide? Because there is rumors that Natalie was pressured

into sleeping with Nicholas Ray to prove that she could do a film like Rebel Without A Cause because Rebel Without A Cause was a lot different than her usual roles. She usually was cast in younger roles and obviously in a more innocent light. So they were like, people point out that that's why this happened.

It's like initiation. She had to prove herself. You have to sleep with an old director. Jesus. But there's other rumors and Natalie actually confided in some of her friends and her mother that Nicholas Ray had raped her. Yeah.

Which she did no matter what. When a however old man is having sex with a 16 year old, that's right. A 44 year old man. Now, he learned her into a hotel room on under the guys that they were gonna talk about the script, but it ended up being a trick. And her friends were horrified,

but when she told her mother, which she didn't even want to, according to Suzanne Finstance biography, quote, her mother, excuse me, her mother, which she didn't even want to, according to Suzanne Finstance biography, quote, her mother, excuse me, her mother, quote, thought it was great that Natalie spent tonight with Mr. Shobbiz. Like, no, she didn't spend the night with him. She was rapes. I literally have no words for Maria.

I have none. It's unreal. I don't like that's. I just feel like Natalie was probably so sad all the time. She was. And she just had so many emotional problems. The doll she used to have these little cut out dolls in her room and she would talk to them and she thought that they were talking back to her a little bit too old into her. Because she's been traumat traumatized. Yeah, it's... She's living a life of trauma. She feels it.

She feels it is instigating it. And she feels like she doesn't have anybody, because really, who does she have to go to for safety? Because that's it. That's like, when you get successful like that, like, we've heard every single star say it, that like, although they're surrounded by a ton of people, they feel like they can't trust anyone, they feel like no one really likes who they are, they just wanna be around all the success and yay.

And so they're totally alone. And sometimes the only people those people have are one their true friends, the ones that have been there, or their family, and she doesn't even have that. She has like nothing, she has nobody. When foodie turned to, she must have felt completely alone. I can't imagine. I can't imagine.

I feel so bad for her. So that happened to her. She tells her mom and her mom is like, oh, I'm glad you spend the night with him. Like, that'll be wonderful. That's good for your career. And that's all I give a fuck about. She's.

Now Natalie didn't officially get the role after that. He just like kept her waiting and a bunch of big names were trying out for this particular role. And it wasn't until she got in a really bad car accident and had the responding officers call Nick Ray that she got the role. Because when he got to the hospital, she told him that they called her a delinquent

and she was like, am I rebellious enough now? They called me a delinquent. Oh my god. And he was like, yes. Am I rebellious enough now? She literally was like, can I have the fucking role now? She is. And apparently that was sufficient in his eyes

and she was cast. Oh good, all she had to do was get an Acara accident, that's good. Yeah, and be rapes. Yeah. Now later she was nominated for an Academy Award for the role. Wow.

Yes. She later reminisced on her childhood instead of it, quote, I learned at an early age that if you were nice to men, you could get anything you want from them. I think that's like her. Her mother taught her that it's her mother taught her that when she was four. She was like be nice to that guy over there and like maybe you'll become a big Hollywood star. Oh yeah that's literally like just here's what you're worth. So that's all that men are gonna see you as. Yep and you just need to work it.

Work it. And bring home your paycheck to me because you're literally like feeding this family. You don't treat your child that way. No, your child is not supposed to make you money. Like, that's not a reason not of children. Like, just, I hate that. It's like, you, that's not your second shot at success. Is you spawning? That's not, it makes me crazy.

Like, let them have their own life. Yeah, it's like, I just don't understand, looking at a sweet little baby and being like, you know what, let's make you famous. Exactly. Let's put you in the Hollywood machine where everything is happy. Like, let's make you start working at the age of four.

I think that sounds like a really good idea. Yeah, absolutely. You can retire early. Yeah, you'll retire early, but you're gonna work all through those toddler years. And then you're not gonna have a fun retirement because you're gonna be working through a lot of psychological trauma. I'm gonna say and then you're gonna be traumatized and aged well beyond your years. Yes, correct.

I couldn't even, when we got Bailey, like dog Bailey, she was the most beautiful puppy I'd ever seen in my entire life. Absolutely. And everybody would always stop us and say how beautiful she was and they were like, Oh my God, you should, like, she should be in commercial. I show dogs. And I remember John and I were like, oh my God, you should like she should be in commercial show dogs And I remember John and I were like, well, that'd be so cool if we could like she would be in commercials And then we literally sat there and we're like, I couldn't make her do that No, and she's a dog like I was upset about I was like, we could never do that to you

Bobo, you're gonna just have your life and it's like so I can't imagine doing it to my children No, I'm gonna make money off you. Like, go to work. Geez. And just teaching them like that you can get whatever you want for men if you're nice to them. Yeah, what an awful, awful, awful thing to teach your, especially your daughter. Yeah, not good. No. But Natalie did have a lot of different men in her life over the years,

but she was a bad bitch. She got to hang out with Elvis Presley. Oh, okay, Natalie. Dennis Hopper. Ooh. And Nikki Hilton. Ooh. Apparently, it's like, not that awesome.

She was once engaged to her high school sweetheart, but Maria knew that a regular guy just wouldn't do for Natalie Wood. Just wouldn't do. And Natalie wanted to get married. Like she took the ring and she was planning on getting married. Maria made her return the ring. And then the guy was so heartbroken

that he attempted to kill himself. Oh my God. Yes. Maria's just ruining lives everywhere. Maria, her reach is so far. It's, she's wild. She's a far reaching evil head. Yeah, she's staying so nice.

In 1957, Natalie got married, though. And she got married to actor Robert Wagner. Oh, yes. Just that guy. Just that guy. Little did she know, though. She had, or, damn it, little did he. You know, though. Damn it, I'm a little did she know though? She had, or damn it, little did he know though. Damn it, I missed it.

Gosh. She had, I don't know if you guys have been listening to the ads. I don't know if like one is hit yet, but like, wow, I really, I was really trying so hard, but I just couldn't speak. It's, you know what, one of our patrons, I wish I had remembered who, like the name of who set it, but it was hilarious.

They said, I'll try to show you on next time. They were,. I'll try to show you on next time. Because during our listen, our tails episode last night, I just was like stumbling over my words. I don't speak. There was a few times I was like, what is happening with my mouth right now?

I think you gave it to me. And our list is one of our Patreon, I call them Patreons all the time in Peter and a sec. For Tronise. For Tronise. She said she calls it having rented lips. Rented lips. She's renting your lips and I was like that. I like that.

I guess I didn't pay my rent this month. Having rented lips, they're not mine. I'm just trying them out. I like that and they're not working out for me. I want my lips back. But little did he know she had actually seen him on set years previous. She was like 11 and he was 20. There's eight years between them. But she went and asked for his head shot at like for at the studio.

And then later on she taped it up in her bedroom wall and she told her mom that someday she was gonna marry him. Oh my God. And then she fucking did. That's like Katie Holmes and Tom Cruise. Oh, she said that. Yes. I was like, that's weird. I think that's weird for different reasons. Oh, we're Katie Hulps. Oh, I love it. No, when they crossed paths again, she was 18 and he was 26 and they hit it off. At the time Natalie was kind of dating around a bit and she actually had to choose between Robert and Nikki Hilton.

Wow. Now, her friends were all trying to help her make the right decision, and they were delicately warning her that they had heard rumors that Robert Wagner wasn't necessarily straight. Now, unfortunately, at that time, the controversy surrounding having different sexual preferences wouldn't have been good for an Adelaise career. Yeah. Like, that's so fucked up, but it was a thing. So fucked up, yeah. But it was a thing.

But according to Natalie, that was not the truth. She was like, no, like, I don't think so. I think it's fine. And he's really handsome, and I really like him. And I don't care. Yeah, like whatever. Yeah. Even at that time, it's like, what, you know, could he be by?

Like, and can't he. And that's what he like both. That's like basically what the rumors were. They were saying that he was either by or day. Yeah. And it's like, I'm like, okay. He's obviously by if he wants to marry me. He's a beast, so that's fine.

No, she's like, I'm not a man, so I think it'll work. I'm into it. And she was in love. Yeah. Or at least she thought she was, because one of her friends who was worried about the relationship said and they They call him RJ so at different points in this I'll call him RJ

Okay, cool RJ presented such a grandiose thing. She was in love with love and he was extremely handsome Surfacedly extremely charming and she was being pushed by all sides studio mama Everybody and it seemed almost you know when things almost seemed too perfect I told her nothing's that perfect and it's like he loved bombed yeah he loved bombed a little bit I guess and Maria told Natalie so she kind of like pressured her into getting married but I don't think she wanted her to pick Robert because she told Maria told Natalie before she married Robert quote no good will come of this. Whoa.

And that's like the one thing that she wasn't really saying. It's like the one thing. And that's where I was saying like earlier, it's kind of spooky how much foreshadowing there is in her life. Like when you look back at it. There's a lot. You guys have to read this book, and I'm gonna link into the show notes.

There's just like little things that you'll be like, what the fuck? Like it was like a sign kind of even those Even like the ripping the wings off a butterfly has some kind of like symbolism in there. Yeah, it's like when you think about it Natalie's wings were ripped off of her. Yeah, it's just like this innocent things innocent beautiful thing and you're ripping its wings off Like it just it has like a whole symbolic thing. It really does the whole thing. I'm like this doesn't seem real No, it really doesn't I wish it wasn't. I also wish that, but this is a true crime podcast. Unfortunately. Now, no matter what her friends or her mother thought, though, Natalie was gonna

marry Robert. He had proposed by putting a pearl and diamond ring in the glass of, uh, fuck, why can't I talk? I'm just saying regular things. He had proposed by putting a pearl and diamond gauge-bilt ring in a glass of champagne for Natalie. Oh, I always get scared about that because someone's gonna choke. Yeah, that's so funny, because I thought the exact same thing. And also, I don't want my ring to be sticky. That's true.

Not that champagne is sticky, but it might be a bit dry. I want to dry, so yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And once it was announced, the media went bonkers because these were two like it people individually and then we put them together and boom. Oh yeah, Brangelina of their time.

Exactly. Exactly. And like you said, from that point on, they were the it couple of the time. But like were things all that great? Probably not. No. I'm thinking no.

No. Things really didn't go that well the first time around and the marriage actually ended pretty abruptly after just four years. Oh wow. Yeah, everyone had their speculation as to what ruined things. Team Robert rumored a cheating scandal on Natalie's part with her co-star Warren Beatty. Warren Beatty, you mean? Did you really just not know who Warren Beatty is? I don't know. And anyways, team Natalie.

Dream together. God, I don't want to go on Twitter for like weeks now. Whorn Bady. Whorn is a Bady. Yeah, Whorn Bady. I know that name. Yeah. I do.

Well, everybody thought that she was cheating on on Robert with Whorn. Robert, that's awesome. I don't know. Whorn Bady. She said, no, no, that she wasn't. No. And team Natalie surmised that Natalie had found Robert and bed with another man. Oh. And the people closest to Natalie were told the latter that she had found him in bed with another man and literally like suffered a mental breakdown that actually sadly led to a suicide attempt on her.

Oh, that's so sad. Yeah. Now luckily Natalie was brought to the hospital and she was given treatment. She actually was in a coma. Oh my god. From this. Yeah, she swallowed like a bunch of pills. But everything started to get better. She started to do like really intense therapy multiple times a week and she probably needed it for everything that she had gone through up to this point, not just the sudden end to her marriage. I would say so. Because I don't really think that this mental breakdown was only over the fact that like her husband

was cheating on her, I think it was her entire life up to this point was catching up to her. Yeah, I mean, from when she was a toddler, literally. From literally, probably when she came out of the womb. Yeah. Like let's be honest. Straight out of the womb. Now, both Natalie and Robert married other people and had children with them, literally. From literally, probably when she came out of the womb. Yeah. Like, let's be honest, straight out of the womb. Now, both Natalie and Robert married other people and had children with them, actually.

Natalie had her daughter Natasha with Richard Greggson, a Hollywood producer, and Robert had his daughter Katie with actress Mary Ann Marshall. Now, both of the remarages were actually pretty short lived, and when they ended, Natalie and Robert rekindled things with each other. Natalie had only been divorced three months at that point, but she said that she and Robert never stopped loving each other.

Which I was like, that's cute. It's sweet. Totally get to the end. Also, this is Warren Beatty just so you know. Oh, what were we working with? What the fuck? I'd be cheating on everyone with him. I mean, like, he's aged now, but like, that was him then.

I figured that wasn't the impressive day. Just to make everything clear. I don't know what else to transparency. Transparency. Transparency. He's a babe. He is. Now, they got remarried in 1972.

Not only said like to both of their surprise, like I don't think they went, the either of them went in planning on this, but it's just what happened. Romance. Nevermind. Yeah, from the sounds of it, they got together to talk about things, and their time spent apart.

They talked about that, and I think they realized that they both grew up in different ways. That's good. And they both became kind of like different people, and they worked better together this time. Yeah, they evolved into people that could be in a relationship together. Yeah, and I think something that kind of helped

at the time was that Natalie's career was slowing down a bit. She was still like a beloved actress, and honestly, her career slowing down is just like everybody's regular career in Hollywood, because she was wild and firm in it. She's bringing it to average. But now she wanted to focus on like her little blended family

and be in a mama and a wife again. She and Robert were pregnant within the first two years of getting back together, and things kind of seemed like a fairy tale this time around, like they blended their family and things were going well. But also, it kind of seemed like that the first time around too, and then it was just like whoosh, whoosh. Now, this time it was Robert's career that was wild in.

He was working on it, takes a thief, and then later he got his biggest break starring in Heart to Heart, which premiered in 1979. So he was working a ton, and now Natalie wasn't, so I could kind of see why that would like cause some problems. Yeah, the power shifts a little bit. It does, but Natalie was still working. She was going back to work, and she was working on the movie that would be her last brainstorm. Now filming for brainstorm started in September of 18 of 1981. I was like, whoa, of 1891. She looks great. Now apparently I borrowed dyslexia from someone.

She was to co-star with Christopher Walken who was also a fucking babe. Oh, yeah. Christopher Walken was like, like take your breath away, kind of hands. I, because everybody was, like everything I read was saying that, and I, because I know what he looks like from like, Stepford Wives, and I was like,

us, everybody sure? And then I looked and I was like, oh, bitch. Oh yeah, you type in young Christopher Walken. I did. I've typed in young Chris, and the first thing they came up with. To Christopher Walken. You like? Because everybody's like, what now? I did. I've chipped in young Chris and the first thing they came up for. To for a walk in. To for a walk in.

You like? Because everybody's like, what now? Wow. Yeah, he was like a beautiful, beautiful man. He was. Let's look. Yeah. Look at, he's pretty.

It's the eyes and it's the jaw. Yeah, he's got a bowie-esque kind of shape to his face. He does, you're right. Which is pretty. Somebody put a picture of him next to Scarlett Johansson and I was like, wow, that's like really fucking weird. Oh, it's scary, yeah. When you put them on top of each other, they have the same exact face. They do. Why does that happen? They're both beautiful.

God just. Now, it was widely known however, that Robert Wagner was a pretty jealous man. And Christopher Walken and Natalie were going to be playing a pair of married scientists. Ooh, ooh, which I love that. I know. That's hot. As I was reading about this movie, married scientists. Ooh, which I love that. I know. That's hot. As I was reading about this movie, I was like, oh, I need to see that.

But that wasn't going to go well because he was so jealous. Now, people always want some kind of cheating scandal, but there's a lot of controversies surrounding their alleged affair. Like, some people are like, oh, for sure. And then other people are like, I don't think so at all. Because Lana Wood, Natalie's younger sister said, quote, I don't know if Natalie's love affair with Chris

was imaginary or real, though my strong suspicion is that it was all in her mind, and that perhaps she was only wishing it to be so. Oh, but like even that is like. That's still pretty spicy. That's not allowed. That's an emotional affair. That's not okay. There's something there, but then the director of Broadway storm. No, no I mean like it's fucking Christopher Walker. Yeah, what Walker? Jesus Christ

I mean, I'm not saying I would right now. I'm saying Natalie. She's I want to return these rented lips Everyone's gonna be like hey Ash are you okay? All right. And guess what? The answer is always no. The answer is Warren Beatty. You're stuck. I just said, you're stuck. It's not even my notes. I can't read. It's like the thoughts in my brain. Just cannot compute. You're stuck. That's what happened to me last night. I couldn't catch up with my own brain. At least it was listening to our tales. Yeah.

I couldn't catch up with my own brain. At least it was listener tales. Yeah. But the director of brainstorm Douglas Trumball recalled that there was quote almost no physical charisma between them at all and actually on set during this like sex scene that they had to film. He was like no Like that's when I realized that like they definitely weren't having an affair because like holy shit, it was horrible. I feel like, is this how you imagine who scientists having said? It's very rigid, it's not good. It's gonna test tube and like try this out somewhere else.

But if Robert was so jealous of Christopher Walken, why would he invite them out on he and Natalie's yacht in the first place? Why? Because we're getting to the yacht. I gotta know. Robert and Natalie's yacht was named Splendor. Splendor.

Splendor. And they decided to invite Christopher Walken out on the boat for Thanksgiving weekend getaway in November of 1981. Because if you're super jealous of him, why are you inviting him? Yeah, I know. I would definitely not do that.

The world may never know. They were gonna cruise over to Catalina Island and they were gonna just have like a nice little getaway together. Christopher actually wasn't the only guest invited for this weekend, but a lot of the other guests turned on the invite because they were like, it's gonna be like real choppy this weekend

or you guys sure you wanna go out? C-Signus is not on my agenda. I am all set and they were like, motherfuckers, this is a yacht, will be fine, like, who cares? Mm-hmm, no thanks. Look at me on land. Here I am. But instead, just the three actors

and Captain Dennis Davern set out for the island. And just a little side note, this is another weird thing. Natalie's daughter Natasha was like freaking out that they were going away. She did not want her mom to get on the boat. But Natalie didn't want her daughter to have the fear that her mom instilled in her about the water. So she was like, it's okay. I'll come back. I'll be back. I always come back. I'd be like, you know, I understand the fear thing, but it's like choppy water is choppy water. Choppy water is not just that's not fear.

That's just like being smart. That's just rational. Yeah, let's just not go on choppy water. But isn't that said? Like her daughter was like worried about her girlfriend. Yeah, and it was her own trauma that was stopping her from like making a rational decision for herself. Yeah, so the first night was the Friday after Thanksgiving.

And this night just seemed to be like really fucking weird. Like, overall. Yeah. Because the day was completely normal, everyone went ashore to do some shopping, but then the night brought a lot of tension. Robert and Natalie were arguing apparently because Robert wanted to move the boat

and Natalie was too afraid to, because the swells were getting really high. So he was like, we need to get out of this area. And she was like, no, like, I just wanna stay here. Like, I don't wanna maneuver the boat in this water. And so they were arguing about it, which I feel like I would probably just like wanna like get off the boat immediately.

Yeah, I would just wanna rock it into space at that point. Yeah, I would want to do any of that. And Natalie just decided to dip. She ended up leaving the boat with the captain who drove her to shore and spent the night in a hotel with her. Which is, it's just like I'm so confused about this part. There were two rooms purchased, but only one of the rooms was disturbed the next morning.

So people were like, they must have stayed in the same hotel room together. Now, they returned to the boat the next morning and like, that's pretty much all we know about it. it, but the captain kind of lied about a lot of things when he was asked about it later. At first, he didn't even bring it up to the investigators, and then when they were like, people at the hotel came forward and said that they saw you.

He was like, yeah, but we had two separate rooms. And it just seemed like something was weird there. Nothing ever really figures itself out from that point. It's just like kind of weird. Also Yeah. Nothing ever really figures itself out from that point. It's just like kind of weird. Also, I just fucking hit my finger that I sliced open. It really hurt. Also, it's really unfortunate how attractive Robert Wagner was.

Yeah. There was everybody that we talked about so far. I have a track so far on this boat. I don't know what to do with it. Pretty attractive. Too much. I didn't look up the captain. Maybe you should.

Maybe I should. What's his name? Fucking Dennis Davern. Because maybe this caused some kind of like weird cosmic issue to happen, because it's just like too much hot on one boat. Too much hot on one boat. I love it so much. Maybe that's what it was, but that the official report.

Yeah, there you go. So yeah, it's just weird because nothing ever sorts itself out from that night. It was just a weird thing. And then on the night of November 28th, everybody got dinner together at Doug's Harbor Reef. The night manager remembered worrying about the force of getting back to their boat safely because they had gotten like pretty drunk at dinner.

And he actually asked a harbor patrol man to make sure that they did get back okay. Oh, okay. Which they got back to the boat okay. Yeah. They left the restaurant around 10.30 that night and when they got back to the boat shortly after, Christopher, walkin' and Robert

got into like a really heated argument together. Uh-oh. Now at this point, allegedly, Walker, why am I saying Walker when it says walkin' right in front of me? Walkin' was trying to tell Robert that it was fine that Natalie wanted to get back into acting and that she could have a family and a career.

And Robert was like really upset and agitated, pointing out that Natalie was a mother to multiple young children and that should be her focus. Okay. So like they were like really arguing over that. It's like guys. It's like why don't we let her decide that she wants to do?

Can we not? She's 43 years old, I think she can make her own decisions at this point, for that. It's like guys. It's like why don't we let her decide what she wants to do. Can we not? She's 43 years old. I think she can make her own decisions at this point, but apparently nobody ever let her. Don't need you two boys. It's cool. Now, it didn't help that Robert was pretty convinced at this point that something was going on between Christopher and Natalie, because when they had gone to dinner that night, Christopher and Natalie had gone off like themselves and Robert met them later. And when he met them, he felt like they were flirting with each other. Okay. So he got like pretty mad about that. And actually one of them smashed a glass at the restaurant. Oh. And then it seems like things kind of chilled out. And then they got back to the boat and

things picked up again. And the argument on the boat got so heated that Robert didn't break a wine glass this time, he smashed a bottle of wine on a table. Damn. And then Christopher just stormed off, apparently. Whoa. Yeah. Now, Natalie at this point, they believed, was in her own room on board, and upset that the two were fighting. Like, she could hear what was going on, and she just went into her own room,

and was like, ugh, like, this is stupid. Yeah. But around 11.05, Robert said that he realized Natalie was missing and the boat's dinghy was also missing, which it was weird because she was so afraid of water. Like, it's just a little weird. Yeah. Now, Robert apparently didn't want to turn on the boat's

flood lights to search around in the water for Natalie. Like, the captain suggested that they do that because why the fuck wouldn't you do that? But Robert was like, I don't wanna bring too much attention to the boat. Like, that doesn't seem like a good idea. What? Probably because I threw my life over a board.

That's the dumbest shit I've ever heard. Yeah, no, he didn't wanna do that because he didn't wanna draw too much attention. But... What? By that point, attention had already been brought to his boat around that same time anyways. I mean, there's smashing glasses and shit.

You're literally screaming. Yeah, like you're screaming at each other and smashing bottles of wine. I think attention has been brought. Attention has been brought. Now, a woman named Marilyn Wayne was on a boat just 50 feet away from Natalie and Roberts boat that night. And around 11 p.m., she said that she and the people on her boat heard the voice of a woman calling out for help,

screaming that she was drowning. And these calls, or these calls out for help lasted like a half an hour. Did they just finish like their game of gender or were they calling someone? No, so Marilyn and the people on her boat called harbor patrol. Okay, thank you. But no one picked up their call. Ah! Now, they think that no one picked up their call because onshore, which like wasn't like crazy far away, like it was far enough away that it would be a long swim, but it wasn't crazy far. There was a party going on and it was like super duper loud and everybody was like was like the harbor patrol there like partying. What? That's what people thought. Because there was because they also called

harbor patrol on this boat were not only what missing and they didn't answer then either. Harbor patrol what the fuck? Harbor patrol you're supposed to be harboring and patrolling. You're supposed to be patrolling the harbor. Now she said that short this woman Maryland said that shortly after the cries started, she heard a man's voice say something along the lines of, all hold on, we're coming to get you. And he said this in a slurred, loud tone, and sounded agitated.

Like, oh, no coming. It was a cool little girl. Oh, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, anything else. And she said that days later, she received an anonymous note at work that said, if you value your life, keep quiet about what you know. Oh. Now, whoever sent that note wanted Maryland to keep quiet, because on November 29th, 1981 at 43 years old, Natalie Wood was found dead in the water on Catalina Island. For some reason everyone on the boat decided to wait. Four hours. One, two, three,

four hours before calling the Coast Guard. So they made that one call to Harbor Patrol. That was around like one in the morning. So already that's like two hours after she's been missing. And then two hours after that call, they call the Coast Guard. So four hours in total, they waited. And none of that makes sense. It's like you're on a boat.

She can only go so many places. And when 100% of those places are in the water. Are you just waiting for her to swim back? And none of that makes sense. It's like you're on a boat. She can only go so many places and when 100% of those places are in the water. Are you just waiting for her to swim back in those four hours? Like what are you doing within those four hours? Yeah, no probably cleaning something up and I fucking have getting rid of evidence perhaps probably And it wasn't until 8 a.m. the next morning that Natalie's body was found only about a mile away from the boat Isn't that so weird? Like a mile away. Just the fact that she drowned.

It's so sad. It was like her background just being taught like to fear water so much. It's just that's just that. And just the fact that like somebody like predicted that that was the fact she was gonna die, that should have wild. That's really wild.

She was found dressed in a night gown, wool socks, and a red quilted down jacket. And they said that if she had taken the jacket off, she may not have drowned. Because it was obviously quilted down jacket. It's going to weigh you down. But if she hadn't taken it off, maybe she would still be here, which is so sad to think about.

And she was found closed by the dinghy that had beached itself, but had clearly not been driven to this location. So it was just kind of like somebody cut the dinghy from the yacht and it just went, like nobody had driven this boat, which is fucking weird. Yeah.

Like, you know, just find an abandoned dinghy that hasn't been driven somewhere. No. Doesn't make a lot of sense. Dr. Joseph Choi, I believe is how you say it, was the one to perform Natalie's original autopsy. She did have a blood alcohol content of 0.14, which is pretty fucking high.

Yeah. But like, she was living. Yeah, she was living. She was living. She said, fuck me out. I was gonna say they were partying. Like, what would your blood alcohol content be on if you were gonna get?

I don't know. A lot. But there were also bruises on her body and a facial abrasion on her left cheek. All of the injuries, according to whoever looked at this, seemed to be consistent with the story that she was trying to tie up the dinghy, securing it to the boat, but then fell overboard.

Like, that's what everybody surmised had happened. OK. Now, remember that intense phobia of dark water? Yeah. I think we talked about it a little bit. Yeah. There remember that intense phobia of dark water? Yeah. You talked about it a little bit. Yeah. There's no way she would have gotten that close to the water to tie, like she would have just asked somebody else

to tie that thing. Yeah, exactly. Because I wouldn't do it. I hate dark water. You're afraid of water. Yeah. I'm not afraid of water. And like in choppy waters,

I wouldn't be bending over a boat to tie a dinghy. No. Like, there's a fucking captain on board for that. Yeah. call Dennis. Call Dennis. Now Robert was asked if Natalie was up, passabely, possibly suicidal, and he told the police that there was no way

that she was suicidal. The official cause of death was ruled on November 30th and accidental drowning. But stories have changed a lot over the years and the people on or around the boat have come forward in years past, saying that they either know more, or that they weren't telling the truth the first time around. I gotta know what Christopher walk in those.

He won't fucking tell anyone. I know. He literally will not say a word, but apparently did say a word to somebody, and it's kind, it's good. Okay. All right, so we're not starting there though. No. Dennis Tavern, the Captain of the Boat, that night actually co-wrote a book

goodbye, Natalie, goodbye Splendor, where he talks about what really happened that night. He says, and this is like the truth, but like he redacted his last statement and said this instead. Okay. He said truth allegedly. Yeah, exactly. The truth allegedly. Who knows what the fucking truth is here? He blanked allegedly over all this honestly. He said that Natalie and Robert were also in their own fight that night after Christopher walkin went to his own room.

Not before Robert screamed at him asking if he was trying to fuck his wife. He like screamed at him and said that. Wow. Now, Dabbert went on to say that he heard the couple arguing, and then all of a sudden everything just went quiet. And he believes he did not see, according to him, but he believes that Robert pushed Natalie off the boat. And also the last thing he said that he heard before it got quiet

was Robert Wagner yelling, get off my fucking boat. And also the last thing he said that he heard before it got quiet was Robert Wagner yelling, get off my fucking boat. Wow. Telling that if that sounds damning. If that is the end of my fucking boat. That sounds very damning. He now the captain did obviously lie in the original investigation and he said it was because he was scared of what Robert Wagner was capable of. Now for like a year after Natalie's death, this captain actually lived at Robert Wagner's house. And like anytime the police were around or anything, he kind of like kept him up in this bedroom, like locked away essentially.

What? Fucking wild. Wow. Like, I wonder if he heard like a splash or anything. I didn't hear anything about a splash. He said he heard, get the fuck off my boat and everything went quiet. Also she was petite.

So she wouldn't have made like a cr... And if it's already like the waters, the swells are crazy. It's chocolate water. That's true, it's chocolate water. It's already hearing a little bit of fresh anyway. A splash anyway. Unfortunately, if you were gonna kill somebody, it would be like the perfect night to do it.

Yeah, yeah. Well, I hate to even say that. No, it's true though, but it is the true. Now, Davan isn't the only one who didn't tell the entire truth of what may have happened that night. Michael Franco was an intern at the coroner's office at the time when Natalie's body was autopsy. And he said that there were friction burns along Natalie's anterior thighs and shins. And he went on to say, quote, I remember the striations were in the opposite direction

of somebody trying to get onto a boat. It was almost like somebody being pushed off. And because of the significant amount of bruising in the lower anterior thighs and shins, that's what caught my attention. She would have had to have been forcefully pushed off, or was a force that was pulling her off or something. And he said, the amount of noticeable bruising to the thigh shouldn't have been there. Wow. So that's weird. That is weird. And was that not put in the original report? Not put in the original report. And he asked about that. He was like, I noticed that.

And he brought it up to Dr. Noguci, who actually I'm pretty sure worked on Marilyn Monroe's case later. Like at the reopening. And it's a different familiar. It's Thomas Noguci. He examined Natalie's body. So when Michael Franco asked about this,

he was told that some things are better left unsaid. Whoa. The doctor allegedly looked at him about this, he was told that some things are better left unsaid. Whoa! The doctor allegedly looked at him and essentially said some things are better left unsaid. Whoa, allegedly. And then just he like, he said that he lifted his head up and like kind of looked at him and looked like this knowing look and then he just went right back to what he was doing. Like, we don't go there. And also like some things aren't better left on said when it comes to murder.

Yeah, most things are better left said. Yeah, you should probably say everything. Say it all. Now Vidal Herrera was another man that worked on Natalie's case and his job was to photograph the body. And in doing so, he said that there were significant wounds to Natalie's head. Though, no such wounds are noted in the original autopsy. That's strange because if there was just wounds and they were noted in the original

autopsy, you'd be like, okay, maybe she slammed it into like rocks or something. Or like hit her head on the dinghy when she fell. But the fact that they weren't noted is like why weren't they noted? Excuse me, sir. Exactly. Now the investigation into Natalie's death was actually officially reopened in 2011. And Ralph Hernandez, who saw the photos that Vidal Herrera took, said that the wounds were troubling

and, quote, she looked like a victim of an assault. Ooh. Now, when the investigation was reopened, the cause of death was actually changed by the doctor to drowning and other undetermined factors. Now, this isn't the same coroner's office. So, actually, is it Dr. Michael Baden or Baudin? It's Baudin.

It's Dr. Michael Baudin. He said he was like, it's kind of a big deal for one new coroner to question the other coroner. It doesn't really happen a lot because it's just the thing that you don't do. Because it's not really something where you have an opinion on, you know? It's usually fast. Actually, it's pretty based in fact.

So you're not gonna have a very, very sense of what's going on because science, it's what's in front of you. Exactly. So that's very interesting. But he was the fact that this happened is the kind of telling. Yeah.

Because somebody wouldn't do that. Like most people would honestly be kind of afraid to do that. Yeah. Because you're essentially disrespecting the person who worked before you. A colleague. You know? Absolutely. But according to the Los Angeles Times, quote, the coroner's report cited unexplained

fresh bruising on the actresses right forearm. Wow. Forearm. Left wrist and right knee along with a scratch on her neck and a superficial scrape on her forehead. Officials said the wounds opened the possibility that she was assaulted before drowning. Geez. Now those bruises were actually the exact reason why they chose to dress paddling in a huge fur coat for her funeral, because they didn't want people to see them. Now in addition to that, the new doctor says that in the original investigation, they never took nail clippings to see if Natalie scratched anyone or anything, which is like, it's

kind of a huge deal. Because if she was involved in an altercation, she probably scratched somebody. There you go. Or if she fell off overboard and grabbed onto the dinghy, there might even be debris under her nails to say that. Yeah, it's evidence in many ways. But why would you not take it? The original dinghy doesn't exist anymore.

And they didn't take the nail clippings, and now that's gone. I mean, how many years has it been? So that sucks. That really sucks. And in 2018, Robert Wagner was officially named a person of interest in the case. And Christopher Walken, who allegedly made comments

to an anonymous source that he saw Robert pushing Natalie off the boat, has since loyered up. Oh, damn. Now Lana Wood, Natalie's little sister, said that she was told by the lead investigators on the case that quote, the only way Chris would talk to them is if it was never disclosed. After they spoke with him, they told me that they had enough to charge RJ, so... Oh man. Now, as of 2021, no one has been charged

with the murder of Natalie Wood, but there is a new district attorney who according to Okay Magazine, quote, privately pledged to push the case. I hope so. Yeah, me too. And Ralph Hernandez says that there are two new witnesses that the investigators actually track down

and that they're very trustworthy sources with valid information that is going to be like helpful to the re-investigation. But they were probably scared to come forward. And that's what he was like, that's why they're trustworthy because the whole reason they didn't come forward is they were fucking terrified. Yeah, which more people have said that the entire time. Right, but they have information that hasn't been let out.

My God, I need to know. So it is possible that we could hear something about this case soon. And Robert Wigner just to end this, he's always maintained his innocence, but Lana would, and many other family friends think that he's the one who took Natalie Wood's life. Oh my god. Wild. Allegedly. Allegedly. Allegedly.

Oh wow. He's also like, what sucks is that he's, I think he's like, over 90 at this point. I'll look it up really fast. But even if he does go to jail, it's like, I don't even think he's gonna make it there because the trial is gonna take so long, you know? The trial's gonna take him out.

It might, he's 91. Yeah, I mean, he's in his twilight years. Yeah, which sucks. Which, I mean, he's in his twilight years. Yeah, which sucks. Which, I just like, I don't want it to be true. No, of course not. I gotta want her husband to have killed her. But I think he allegedly did. Father for children, like, oh.

I think allegedly he may have. Allegedly. Perhaps. I'm on Christopher Walken. Well, and then the other thing that we can hope for is the deathbed confession. I've been thinking that this whole time. I'm like, who's deathbed confession?

Are we gonna get it? It's like, you gotta, you gotta, what is it called? Like, you absolve your shit? Yeah, like, that's what it's called. You absolve your shit. Yeah, that's what they say. That's what it is. So, he needs to absolve his shit.

I want him to absolve his shit. Christopher Walken's only 78, so. But he does not want to talk about this. And it's like, I love Christopher Wacken. I don't think that he... I don't want him to, like, be holding on to this. No, I don't think he had anything to do with it. I think he saw something that he didn't want to see.

And I think there are people. I mean, it's fucking Hollywood Hollywood Wilds. I'll protect you. Just let it out. Well, I mean, he told one person and then that one person is a new witness. Tell me, Christopher. But it doesn't matter because everything he told that person, they're a credible witness. So like, it's coming out. It's coming out. I mean, is that not hearsay though?

I don't know. I don't know how it, unless it was like how it's all coming. It seems like all the new stuff they're keeping close to the chest. Which I love. Because I love and hate. I love it. I want to know, but the fact that they're doing that means that they're doing it right. Right, so as frustrating as it is, I'm like,

I know. I thought that I was gonna like, I thought I was gonna crack the code, and I feel like I did, but I just want it to be, I want someone to say, ash you did. I, I feel like I did, but I just want it to be, I want someone to say, ask you did. I feel like I know what happened on that boat, but I do. I would love for them to come out and be like,

that's not at all what happened on this boat. Yours would happen on the boat. Love to hear that. But, but I'm not sure. They actually did that first. They were like, here's what didn't happen on the boat. Yeah. And then they were like, here's what did.

Yeah. And then everybody's like, what happened on the boat? What happened on the boat? What happened on the boat? what didn't happen on the boat. Yeah. And then they were like, here's what did. Yeah. And then everybody's like, what happened on the boat? What happened on the boat? What happened on the boat? Guys, what happened on the boat? I don't know, but I hope I wake up to like a sea and an alert in like the next couple of weeks. Like, I don't want anyone to die, but.

That does happen a lot with us though. It does. We'll do a case and then like the following days, all of a sudden, something cracks and we're like, damn it, we did it today, to where? The Lori Vallow, when that one happened. I know, and we still have to do like a full update episode about that. That could be like a whole last episode updated.

It probably will be. I'll do that. Yeah, we'll do that soon, actually. Yeah, let's do that. Cool. Well, guys, thanks for listening to me fucking really try my way through that case. Natalie Woods.

Natalie Woods. She was so gorgeous. Oh my god, she was. I found a really good picture to post if you're... And our kids were so cute. I know sad. I know. And I don't... I saw that Courtney believes her father. Oh really? Mm-hmm. I want to believe. I want to believe we don't know. I don't know. We don't know. We don't know till we know. I don't know allegedly. I don't allegedly know anything. But I hope that you keep listening. And I hope you keep it Gonna have somebody to have somebody to have a boat no matter who you are because it's really weird if you don't ever do that. Hey, Prime Members! You can listen to Morvid, Early, and Add Free on Amazon Music.

Download the Amazon Music app today, or you can listen Add Free with Wondery Plus and Apple Podcasts. Before you go, tell us about yourself by completing a short survey at Wondery.com slash survey. by completing a short survey at Wondery.com slash survey.