Morbid - Episode 286: The Murders of Nancy & Derek Haysom Part 2

Episode Date: December 23, 2021

Suspicion in the case starts to fall on Derek and Nancy’s daughter Elizabeth and just when the police focus in on her and her boyfriend, they bail. They make their way over to the UK and start living a quiet life where no one would ever find them. Just kidding, they get caught in one of the dumbest ways possible. Hold onto your butts! Beyond reason: The True Story of a shocking double murder, a brilliant beautiful Virginia Socialite, and a Deadly psychotic obsession. Written by Ken Englade https://www.amazon.com/Beyond-Reason-Brilliant-Beautiful-Socialite/dp/B08XLX55YR See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

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That's W-O-N-D-E-R-Y-P-O-D. Audible.com slash wonderypod or text wonderypod to 500-500 to try audible for free for 30 days. Angie's list is now Angie, and we've heard a lot of theories about why. I thought it was an eco-move. For your worst, guess paper. It was so you could say it faster. No way. It's to be more iconic.

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That's ANGI, or download the app today. Hey, weirdos, I'm Ash. And I'm Alina. And this is morbid. We're back, babies. That one felt like this. Yes, felt good. This is morbid. But felt good.

I appreciate, you know what? I'll just get right into it really quick. And this will be quick. It won't be 15 minutes. Will it be other one? Will it be quick, Alina? You guys rock. You rule.

You roll. You do all of it. I love you all. I was looking at you. All the kind words. I was trying to think of another. Yeah. Of another word.

Center. Center. But seriously, you guys are amazing in that last episode. We kind of spilt everything and it felt really good to say it. I felt like I was like talking to my friends about it. So I really appreciate it. That's like the most therapeutic. Very cathartic. I almost just said that's like soul. That is. You sound like my littlest one. She is the cutest little list, right? But honestly, you guys were amazing. We've had so many kind words, and everybody's been really cool. And a lot of people are like, if you want to take more time,

I'll feel free to, which again, thank you so much. But honestly, it feels good to be like, I like thrive. Like, hello, it's Capricorn's season. I'm so scared. We're here. And we're gonna ruin everyone's lives with our richness. Oh, yeah. Has like fully bathed in the Capricorn season.

I feel good today. I feel good. Terrified. Yeah, see, I feel good. My littlest one is feeling good. She's back to being her old, like, her, her ragy self. Like, she's really like, she's in the thick of it yelling at everybody. She was feeling good today.

Pist that she could have gone side because it's raining and she was like I gonna put on my boots and put my boots in both sides. And I was like well you can it's pouring rain in you literally have COVID. She was there if I want to. She's like you know what? She's great. I got it. She's feeling it. She's not capricorn but she's feeling it. She's not capricorn, but she's feeling it. She might as well be. She's feeling the answer. She's feeling it. But she's doing good. We got little from our vet. We got little like paw prints and a nose print of Baba. The nose print. Ruined. Ruined me for a second, but like the card was so sweet. We heard from like

all her doctors. Yeah. And just seeing her little nose again was a little pause. I smelled it. And I just looked at it, it was like, you know what, she's here now. We have every piece of her now, so she's here, she's in the house, we got her, I feel her. I swear I heard her slurp the other night, and I was like, Bubba, and then I was like,

oh, you're not here. But then I was like, yes you are. You're right there. She stays slurred. So I feel her. I feel it, and you know, everybody's starting to get on the mend. We're feeling back in the groove.

I just, I'm feeling good today. And I think like you all had a really big part of that. So I appreciate it immensely. Because everybody was just awesome. Like we got a really, like you guys are really cool. Yeah. It's kind of like, you guys are cool. You guys are like, you guys are really good.

I'm just really good at, we have this like, community of like best friends. I know. I said to somebody like they guess like, you look like a problem. I'm just really good at it. We have this like community of like best friends. I know. I said to somebody like they were like, oh my god, like take off next week, but like it was so great hearing your voices, like something along those lines. And it was funny because you and I were just talking about it

and we were like, no, we like missed you guys. Like when we sat down the other day to record, I was like, oh man, like I needed that. It felt right. Like, yeah, we had that week that we took, and but it was more of a week, it was a week of chaos. So it definitely wasn't like relaxing, reprieve, or something.

We were not really up, vibing, per se. But then I realized, and at first I remember, we were like, you know, we were gonna take that week before Christmas, and we were gonna kind of have it be like a little bit of a reprieve, or whatever, from just like working constantly. But then we realized after this last week, we were like, actually, it feels weird not to.

Like I don't like that. It's not, because we just, this is what we do now. We like to do this. This is us. This is us. This is us. This is us. Is that her real name?

I literally only know her. More in-gram isn't it? This is us. Oh no, she's a not other one. I was like, we are family. I was like, we are family. Somebody's probably. Karen had, thank you.

There you go. I just, like, we are family. What are those? Like, I'm surprised, that's not what she was. I was like, wait, Mandy Moore is in this is us. But you know what, that's neither here nor there. I'm surprised you know that. Just wanted to say thank you so much.

You guys rule, we're feeling good, we're back baby. And I have something that has been just eating away at my psyche for the past 24 hours. I know I just said everything's fine, but this is different. This is different. Different. So, as you know, the West Memphis 3 case is a case that like I am very, it's like very close to my heart.

And there has been a huge, huge newsbreak in this case. Now, we heard recently, I think it was like, but the past year or so, we've heard that when, they were trying to test the evidence that they have from it, because they're trying to prove that someone else did this, obviously. Yep. And we're trying to find out who, there are three eight-year-old boys who lost their lives that are still, that killer or killers

is still walking around free. It's making me crazy. And for the last like year or so, we've heard a lot of reports and we've kind of like talked about it just a little bit that the West Memphis Police Department said that all the evidence that they could use to test any further was lost in a fire.

And then everybody was like, what in a fire? And it was devastating at first. It was like in a fire, we're never getting that back. Like that's gone. It's over. Like we'll never be able to, it was devastating. What fire? But then everybody was like, wow, when was this fire?

And they were like, yeah, it was like, I was at a time. It was definitely at a place. Unrecorded though. And it was hot, like fire is. And we were like, oh, okay. And then, you know, authorities were like, can we like, you know, maybe see like records of this fire? And they were like, no, no, we can't do that.

Sorry, I don't know. And they were like, why though? And they were like, I don't know. You see, you know, fire, it's fire, it's fire. You know, like, we can't do that. And they were like, why though? And they were like, I don't know. You know, fires, fires, fire. You know, like we don't need to talk about anymore. No, like, you know. They're like, only you can prevent fires. Yeah, that's it.

The end. And then they just kind of shut, it was like, what? But, you know, Damian Eccles and Jason Baldwin and their attorneys, Mara Levret, who wrote Devils and Not, she's been like, really into this case. And everybody else who was advocated for them was like, no, no, no, no, no. You're gonna show proof of this fucking fire.

Where's that fire? Turns out, fire department came, I was like, there's no fire. Like there was no fire. What are the, who's talking about fire? No. Can you imagine, like, who just pulled that out of their ass and was like, no one will ask.

Who will follow up questions? That was weird enough. That they were like, there was a fire and there wasn't a fire. I just love that they didn't think anything was gonna come up. Yeah, and then they came out and were like, there wasn't a fire.

And it was like, okay, now what? Can we have that? What did it send? And they were like, it's lost, I don't know. So now, yesterday, right before Capricorn season started, because we're gonna get shit done in Capricorn season, I'm telling you. Oh yeah, I'm telling you today

I feel it is today is it today? So all of a sudden it came out that one of the attorneys for Damian Eccles Patrick Banka said that he was in West Memphis. Now the police chief Mike Pope resigned by the way quote unquote resign He resigned Don't know why. Quote and quote. And I'm not sure why. But Banka was in West Memphis yesterday morning and told Damien, oh, I, here's all the evidence.

It's all here. And he said specifically, even the ligatures. That's so haunting. It is there. He, he, they lied. It's literally there. Not only that, they released photos this morning, one of the news stations around there, they lied. It's literally there. Not only that, they released photos this morning,

one of the news stations around there, and all of it is not only there, it's all there, it's pristine condition, and it was catalogued. It's insane. It's perfectly there. When you see this photo, there even the bikes are there, at least one of the bikes.

When you said that, I like, the ligatures are there, we can test this shit when you said that I like the ligatures are there we can test this shit Yeah, and it's not this is not on the national news. What the fuck is going on the fact that it's not really crazy that police chief resigned This week resigned and then this comes out and they have every piece of evidence They have been hiding and first of all let me tell you we're doing an episode where we are going to talk about this. I just needed to get this out right now because it's happening, but trust me, we're going to do a full blown episode on this because holy shit, I hope it just goes to the stratosphere. It will.

These police officers, this department, were covering up for a murderer of three eight year old boys, three children who were brutally tortured and murdered and they are like withholding evidence and lying about evidence, they lied. They said it was gone and all of it is right there. That's wild. I know this happens all the time, but for a case like this where it's just like,

they, especially with that Alfred plea and everything involved in this, the fact that they took these three men, the West Memphis threes, their lives away. Absolutely. And continue to. Almost two decades, like in prison. And then in afterwards, they still have to walk around

with that stigma. And it's like kicked them out on their ass. They just get to maintain their innocence. They didn't get to, they didn't get to sue for all of the time that was stolen from them, all the medical conditions they suffered from it, all the psychological torture, everything. And like try getting a job when you have that as your record. None of them got a dime from it. No.

None of them were able to get their themselves officially acquitted and cleared. And this, in the state of Arkansas is just sitting there being like, well, and it's like, first of all, if anybody in their right mind thought that a state would let three child murderers walk free when they knew that they were guilty, that it tells you right there that they knew they weren't guilty. They would never let those three men walk out of there that afternoon. If they for one second believed they were guilty, no way. They wouldn't do it. No.

They knew they had nothing. They knew that they didn't do it. They know who did it. And they're whoever it is. They're covering up for these people. And it's insane. Well, in because there is no other reason that they should keep that evidence. And I guess Damien was told that the police chief was going to be fired.

And then he never was fired. Oh, yeah. It came out that he quote unquote resigned, but that's interesting. Oh, yeah, he was going to be fired on December 21st, which was, wasn't that yesterday? Yeah. That he was going to be fired on December 21st, but he resigned. Interesting. It's wild to me.

Interesting. So I'd promise you, we are going to go so much further into that on another episode, but man, I had to like just scream about that because I'm going crazy. And also, I want to find a way to tell, get this to all these news stations. This should be national fucking news. Of course it should. This kind of cover up and this kind of bullshit from a police department should be every one. Well, and another reason that it should be is everywhere is like, what if they destroy it? Now that they, well, they can't now. It's been taken out. Oh, and another reason that it's shady is for you everywhere is like, what if they destroy it now that they, well, they can't now.

It's been taken out. Oh, they took it. There's a photo of people going through it now. Oh, it's out. Because that's scary. And now they can't. I'm honestly, it's like, of course, but I'm like, it's surprising.

I know. But it's more just like, this should be known. Yeah. Now there should be a real investigation into this police department. And now, like, let's get the shit tested. Let's start getting like the real suspects in here. Let's solve this fucking case.

I just can't believe that that was all setting there all. Like, I do believe it, but like I can't all believe it. No, I can't. Like, holy shit. I know this shit happens, like corruption happens like this all the time. But to that level. And when you just see it play out like this,

the way this is played out is just so like job, like just jaw dropping. It's amazing. It's amazing. So it's like really crazy. But hopefully we'll have way more updates to do a full episode so we can talk about this because I am so hoping for some kind of justice for Damien

Jesse and for Jason and for Michael Stevie and Christopher. Yeah. Like, all six of these boys deserve to have their best friends. They're just family. They still have family members that are alive, obviously. And then it's like, it shows how these original like,, how these original like, like fogum in there and shit from the original investigation. It shows how they looked not only at the three,

the West Memphis three, but at the families of these victims that they weren't worthy enough to get justice. And it's like, these were children. I mean, they got, like, he literally used it just to get Damien in prison. Yeah, it's wild. It's wild.

So go on. So if you want to go listen to the West Memphis 3 episodes, you can hear all about the case if you're not sure what we're talking about here. But again, we'll do another one. I mean, it's like a four-parter. So that will not be five. It'll probably be more.

But yeah, had to scream about that for a minute. But now I will hand the mic over to What if you were trafficked into a cult over shot nine times or fell in love with a vampire or went into a Minor surgery and woke up one week later Paralized what would you do? I'm wit missile dine the creator creator of this is actually happening, a podcast from Wondry that brings you extraordinary true stories of life-changing events, told by the people who lived them. From a young man that dunes his entire future with one choice, to a woman who survived a notorious serial killer, you'll hear their first-person account of how they overcame

remarkable circumstances. Each episode is an exploration of the human spirit and personal discovery. These haunting accounts sound like Hollywood movies, but I assure you this is actually happening. Followed this is actually happening wherever you get your podcasts, you can listen ad-free on the Amazon Music or Wunderly app. You can listen to Add Free on the Amazon Music or Wondery app. Hi, I'm Lindsay Graham, the host of Wondery's podcast American Scandal. We bring to life some of the biggest controversies in U.S. history, presidential lies, environmental disasters, corporate fraud. In our newest series, we look at the Kids for Cash Scandal,

a story about corruption inside America's system of juvenile justice. In Northeastern Pennsylvania, residents had begun noticing an alarming trend. Children were being sent away to jail in high numbers, and often for committing only minor offenses. The FBI began looking at two local judges, and when the full picture emerged, it made national headlines. The judges were

earning a fortune carrying out a brazen criminal scheme, one that would shatter the lives of countless children and force a heated debate about punishment and America's criminal justice system. Follow American scandal wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen ad free on the Amazon music or Wonder App. I took it. She did. So when we left off in part one, everybody, things were going crazy. Net, and chaos. Why did I just stutter? It's like, it's like I start and it's just like, right all up. You know what happens? Nancy and Derek Haysam had just been found absolutely brutally murdered in their home.

And seemingly it was like a dinner gone wrong because all the chairs were pushed back and everything. So the sheriff that arrived on scene, HC Wells, immediately assumed that this was a male killer because of the brutality on scene. Yeah. And the fact that whoever this person was was able to take over Derra Kason because he was like a big dude.

Yeah. And presumably they had to be fighting Nancy off at the same time. So it's like, he definitely thought that a man had to have done this. Yeah. And presumably they had to be fighting Nancy off at the same time. So it's like he definitely thought that a man had to have done this. Yeah, but the question was, who would want to do this to the Haysams and why? Like why did this happen in the first place? That's what I'm wondering. So at the time of Virginia, they had actually set up a regional homicide squad where the six counties agreed that if a homicidal investigation became too big for just one county, they would all work on it together. And this was actually one of the first times where they had to band together and do this

because really, like they had some good evidence, but there wasn't a lot to do with it at the time because remember this is the 80s. Like there's not a lot of testing that they can do unfortunately. So some of the evidence left behind were bloody fingerprints, which needed to be sent out for testing. A bloody handprint found on the dining room chair, a mouse trap, a bloody footprint impression that they

were able to determine came from somebody wearing only socks, and had it been made by a woman, the shoe size would have been a six and a half seven, and if worn by a man, it would be a five or six shoe size. Okay. There was also a piece of hair that did not belong to Derek Ornancy found in their bedroom. And the hair evidence was quote, a Caucasian head hair approximately one and a half inches in length from root to diagonally cut end. Now again, it sounds like a lot of evidence, but this is 1985. And like, it's not a lot they can do with it. Forensics had not come that far yet. Yeah.

So they started from square one. Ricky Gardner and Chuck Reed were the two lead investigators on the case. And their first move was to talk to the neighbors. Have you seen anything? Like has anything weird been going on? Anybody who knew the haesums, they just wanted to get a picture of like what had been going on.

Yeah, like tell us everything. And they obviously were having to track down all the Haysam's children, who I mentioned in part one, they were like scattered all across the map, like all across everywhere. But interestingly enough, the neighbors didn't really seem to know Derek or Nancy that well. And those who did, like just didn't have any information to give the police. Like nobody really had anything to say.

Um, and all of Derek and Nancy's kids had alibis, didn't have any information to give the police. Like nobody really had anything to say. And Olive Derrick and Nancy's kids had alibis because most of them were literally in another country when this happened. Most of them except for Elizabeth were in another country. So Elizabeth was the only one who lived in Virginia with her parents. Like she was living at school but then when she would come home, she'd be at home. But she had been off with her boyfriend Yen's that week doing a little road trip from DC to Charlottesville. So they were like, what the fuck? Who did this? So early on in the investigation,

and mostly because I think they didn't have a lot of other places to go just yet, they wondered if this was somehow satanically motivated. Oh, there it is. Because again, 1985. So we are in the height of the satanic panic era. And when I came on the scene. Yeah, literally. And the investigators talked to like some kind of satanic ritual expert, like, I don't even know who that would be. Same guy from the West

Memphis 3K, probably. Yeah, I would like the printout debris. Exactly. This person claims that there were a lot of signs that this was some kind of ritual killing. The experts first noted that all of the chairs at the dining room table that were pushed back were facing north. Okay, so that's huge. Yeah, it is. The bodies were also facing north.

And this one, I'll give to them. Derek had that little V cut into his chin. Uh-huh. So they're really weird. That's ritualistic. And then they also found another little V in some of the blood by Nancy's body. And next to that V, they also believed that they saw the number six, which is like huge and satanic rituals. But it was like a very little marking on like the wood in the floor. Like in the blood. Are there any crime scene photos of it?

I think so. I'll have to double check. If I didn't see any with the number six in them. But maybe the crime scene photos are very intense. Yeah. But there was also the way that the blood was surrounding the bodies. Whoever had done this had gone back like at some point

and like just in their socks with the blood pulled around the bodies, they had like switched it all around. To me, that kind of just says like they were doing it to like clean up or like destroy any like maybe something that they had left behind. I don't know why that would be satanic, but they were like Satanism rituals. So Satanists like use their socks to like, yeah, okay, okay, just to like swear I don't know if they felt like the pattern it was literally just like swirled around but all right So yeah, I mean who's to say who's to say I'm not a single virtual guy

Yeah, I don't claim to be one but speaking of blood later into the investigation They were able to do lumen all testing on the scene and it showed a set of bloody footprints walking from the living room To the bedroom and then into showed a set of bloody footprints walking from the living room to the bedroom, and then into the bathroom off of the bedroom. So the killer at the very least washed up in there, but they also thought he may have taken a shower, which is so haunting to think about. Like you have two bodies lying in different rooms

in that house, and you're covered in their blood, and you're just gonna hop in their shower. And you just did this brutal, awful, chaotic murder. And then you just gonna shower in their blood and you're just gonna hop in their shower. And you just did this brutal, awful chaotic murder. And then you just gonna shower in their house. Like what? No. Now they did testing outside of the home too, and it showed two sets of footprints.

And they were both the same size. So it showed obviously the killer had come outside and gone back in. And they think this is one person, because it's like a set coming out and then a and gone back in. And they think this is one person, because it's like a set coming out and then a set going back in. Okay. And they thought like maybe he had gone outside

and like been spooked by something or like maybe somebody saw him so he went back inside and waited longer. Yeah. Or maybe had gone inside to make sure that like he'd really killed them and maybe at that point their throats were cut. That's what they were thinking.

Okay. And later on when the FBI was able to profile the scene, they disagreed with the sheriff. They said they did not think that this was the work of a male killer, but a female who knew the house well. So in a quaintance at the very least. Okay. So just as they got to the point

where they were shifting the focus to a female in the case, and maybe involved in the Haysom's life, one just offered herself right up. Her name was Margaret Louise Simmons, and she just walked into the police station, and was like, why have any of you guys talked to me yet? And they were like, grab a chair, Margaret. Sit down, Marge. So, Marge, at one point, had been engaged to Derek's son, Julian, and she was also Nancy's first cousin Oh, but remember Derek's son is like for the previous marriage so they're not really yeah, no that took me a second

No weird stuff going in your sign Crazy going on. No, no So she told the police a lot about her and Julian's relationship and how Derek and Nancy didn't approve of her And she thought that they were the breakdown of her and Julian's relationship. So as they got to find out more about Margaret, they also learned from one of her friends that she had recently shown up to his house

with a couple of knives, and she was saying to him, like, the demons are back again. Oh, no. Yeah. She also apparently told him that she was scared, she was gonna do something bad. Like, she was scared.

Oh, she's having a legitimate mental health crisis. Yes, exactly. So everybody's seeing this. Is everybody okay? So the police were like, instead of helping you, can you actually just sit down and do a polygraph? Yeah, for sure.

Like, we know you're kind of stressed but like, do you mind? And she agreed. And when the results came back, it showed that she had been deceptive when answering two specific questions. One of them was, were you at the Haysome House the night they were murdered? She showed deception on that.

And then she showed deception when they said, did you kill the Haysomes? Which polygraphs are doing anything. I'm talking a trench coat. And also, she's clearly going through a mental health crisis. Like very clearly. There's several things she showed up with not- And that's just somebody's house and was crisis, like very clearly. There's several things. She showed up with nine items. That's just somebody's house.

And it was like the demons are back. Right. Said I think I'm gonna do something. And then walked into a police station and was like, why is no one talk to me? That's like, guys, call someone. Please call someone. And it's like, I don't think she's sitting down

to a polygraph and is gonna be like, like, did you do the test questions? Like, did you make sure that she is in a state where she should be taking a poll? A proletarian? And clearly she wasn't. No. She called it a show.

I don't know why I made that noise, but she called it a show. So the more and more that they talked to Margaret about what happened that night, they realized there was no way she was capable of the murders. No. She would go on really long diatribes about when her and Julian were together,

different vacations that they'd gone on, just things that were not relevant to the investigation. And they realized that she was suffering from mental illness. She had actually gone to hospitals and gotten treatment before and pretty recently. So she's definitely not our leading suspect. She's just gone through it.

And she actually asked if she could take another polygraph test at a different period in time. And she actually asked if she could take another polygraph test at like a different period in time. And she gave the investigators, fingerprints, footprints, DNA, and she was totally cleared from any wrong. That's not talking to me at all. No. But so they then made, like they were like,

okay, but like we still need to look at the females involved in their life. And like, so who are we gonna look at? Let's look at Elizabeth. She has an alibi, but like, she's the closest one. She's close and there was like some weird stuff at the funeral that we'll talk about.

So they were like, we need to talk to her. And she's the one that's like gone through a lot. She's gone through a lot. She's also the youngest. And she still lives there. Like to a point. Makes sense why they would look at her. Yeah, so she had this alibi.

She was with Yens on a little weekend trip. But they were like, that's cool. We just want to like get to, to know you a little more. Yeah. We just want to know what's up. Um, so they had taken note that Yens at the funeral had some bandages on his hands and also had a bruise over his eye. Oh, yes. And although this is not a crime, it was like Elizabeth really didn't seem too emotional, not only at the funeral, but just in day-to-day life. Like, people were commenting on her lack of emotion

with like the brutal death of her parents. Yeah, which people always are going to. And we talk all the time, like that's not really like, that's not like, smoking gun or something. It doesn't mean you're guilty. No, but it definitely can be a, it can be a weird thing when there's other stuff that can point to you. Reza't mean you're guilty. No, but it definitely can be a, it can be a weird thing when there's other stuff that can point to you.

Reza's a eyebrows. Yes. So they brought her in for an interview. She literally brought a sandwich with her. Okay. Brought a sandwich to her interview about... Like blood sugar, I guess. Like, girlfriend, what?

Like, I understand a fellow hungry gal, but I don't know how much I would want a sandwich when talking about the brutal murder of my like elderly parents. Yeah, no I could barely eat after after putting Bubba to sleep. No, like of course not. Never mind my parents. She brought a Is it Marmite? Marmite? Oh, yeah, Marmite sandwich and they were like, oh, okay. Yeah. Anyways, that's not really important But I just wanted to put it in there. I think it's Marmite. I hope I wasn't just like, yeah, any Google it. Yeah, let's Google it just to make sure. Marmite. I was right. Yeah, you were right. Good. We're good here guys. Marmite. So during the interview, the detectives learned all

about Elizabeth's time at Wickham Abbey. Say it right this time, Beot. Wickham! I actually wrote in my notes, say it right this time, be out. She did, I thought. I like so somebody tweeted at me they were like, oh I actually went there and like you don't say it how you did. And I was like, oh fuck. And I looked it up in part one. Oh fuck. And then I just didn't write it down I guess.

So it's Wiccom Abby. But thank you for telling us. Yeah, thank you for telling us because I didn't want to sound like a moron. And you were like super nice about it. So the person that said it was like, yeah, nice about it. And they went there so they know. Yeah, they were like, you know, just saying they were like, nice about it. So the person that said it was like, look, nice about it. And they went there so they know. Yeah, they were like, you know, just saying. They were like, and they were saying that,

like Elizabeth's legacy is quite crazy. Yeah, it's crazy. Not as I shouldn't say legacy, like just, yeah. Yeah. So yeah, they're in this interview and they learn all about her time at school, her version of the time that she spent in Europe as a runaway.

And that was when she said that her parents were just glad that she got it out of her system, a few listen to part one. That's what she said their attitude was about the whole thing. And she just really wanted to make it clear that she had a great relationship with her parents. She loved them, they did everything for her. It was like they almost loved her too much.

Uh-oh. And she said, the last time she had physically seen them was the weekend of March 23rd, and that when she had seen them, she had planned to talk to them on the phone on Tuesday the 26th. And then, no, no, no, excuse me, I'm so sorry. So she had seen them on March 23rd, then she had talked to them on Tuesday the 26th. And then, sorry, made plans to talk again on the 31st, but when she called them that Sunday, there was no answer. So that's when she didn't hear from them on Tuesday, and she called that friend to go check on them. And then obviously we know what happened

from there. The Haysams had been discovered on Wednesday, April 3rd, but police were able to determine that they'd either been killed Friday or Saturday. Oh, okay. Yeah, like the Friday or Saturday before. So they were in there for Friday or Saturday. Oh, okay. Yeah, like the Friday or Saturday before that. So they were in there for a little bit. Now, when asked what she was doing the specific weekend, like that they were killed, Elizabeth explained the whole Charlottesville DC trip. She said, we rented a car, we went sightseeing,

then we spent the night in a hotel, the Georgetown Marriott, and they went to see a couple movies which she bought ticket stubs for. One of them was Porky's Revenge, and the other one was the Rocky Horror Picture Show. Hell yeah. And she agreed to give them her DNA, she agreed to give them fingerprints.

This all sounds great. Which also would be found in the house anyway, so like, it's really not that helpful. Yeah, that's true. Because she lives there. But I mean, yeah, I guess you're right. I mean, well, yeah, like her DNA is all like- Yeah, I was just gonna say she literally lives this. I was mean, yeah, I guess you're right. I mean, like her DNA is all like, I was just gonna say she literally lives there.

I was like, we'll wait the DNA and then I was like, the DNA. No, she literally lives there. Yeah, like for part time, but she was free to go. And before she left, she was sure to tell the investigators, you know, daddy has a lot of enemies. She called her dad daddy. Has a lot of enemies and like a lot of them are

from like business dealings and like his time in different countries. So like, I just want you to know that. She's like just throw that out there. Lots of enemies. So they were like, yeah, cool. Thanks. And then she left.

Interesting. Chuck Reed and Ricky Gardner looked at each other and they were like, she was weird, right? Like that was such the whole thing. That was really off. Correct. They both agreed like, yeah, that was weird. So they went to check out the car that Elizabeth and Yannes had rented.

And they were like, maybe we'll find something in there, like maybe some blood or something. Yeah. It didn't find blood or anything like that. But they were able to find out that the car was returned with a lot more miles on it than a trip from Charlottesville to DC would have taken. Oh! 429 miles to be exact. You're gonna notice that.

429 extra miles. Yeah, that's gonna flag. Weird too, because that actually would have been the distance from Charlottesville to Washington, Washington to loose chippings, and back! Weird, so crazy. Weird how that all worked out. So they said, hey, Elizabeth, what's up with the 429 that we got?

You want to explain that? And she was like, we are so silly, me and Yens, we got lost for 400 miles. We got lost on our sightseeing trip, and we just kept going in circles, and it was so embarrassing for 400 miles. And they were like, yeah, that's weird. The lost on our sightseeing trip, and we just kept going in circles, and it was so embarrassing for 400 months. And they were like, yeah, that's weird.

That's a relatively short trip that you took. It's like a two and a half hour ride. And you're a fucking world traveler, and so is your boyfriend. Yeah. And you guys got lost sightseeing on a two hour trip. Yeah. Oki-doki.

For 400 miles. Yeah. Oki-doki for 400 miles. Yeah. Oki-doki. Like, okay. So by that point in the investigation, they had talked to Yens two once or twice, but he refused to give anything. No DNA, no fingerprints, no nothing.

He was like, fuck that. Bruh. And he said, he had a reason. He said it was because his father was a diplomat. And if all of this was going on, he was worried that it would become public. And then this whole investigation thing would be placed on him.

It would make his father's reputation go down the tank. That's cute. That's a good story. Yes. That's really nice. But you still have to cooperate with investigation of which you are now a person of interest in. Also, your girlfriend's two parents were brutally murdered, so like, yeah, I think people might find out that you're attached to her at some point in time.

You are literally a person of interest in this investigation, so you kind of have to cooperate. Thank you. You can't just be like, well, my dad. My dad's a diplomat. My dad's a diplomat, so... Sorry. Can't, uh, it's like, no, that doesn't work. That's not, that's not like, will my dad, my dad's a diplomat? My dad's a diplomat, so. Sorry. It's like, no, that doesn't work. That's not, that's not like, oh, okay.

Oh, shit, all right. Yeah. Yeah, it's not like my doctor says I can't do PE today. Like, no. It's not the same, it's not like I have my period. I can't do this. It's not the same. I had my period every single time we had to do anything in gym.

I loved gym. I have cramps, sorry. I was a weird kid. I hated gym so much. Clearly. So every time they tried to talk to Jens, that he would talk to them, and his story would be like,

very, very identical to Elizabeth. It's like too identical. So finally in early October, the investigators were, like they felt like they were close to getting Jens to hand over some DNA. And he said, you know, I just have to go home, I have to clear this with a German embassy.

And then once I hear back from them, can you imagine? I just have to clear this with the embassy. And then I think they're gonna get back to me. I'll come in tomorrow and we'll figure this out. Like I'll give you my DNA. Okay, Dorothy. Yes. And they were like, oaky-dok.

Yeah. Tell us what the embassy says. Toads. So, well folks, you could DNA. Okay, Dorothy. Yes. They were like, oaky-doke. Yeah. Tell us what the embassy says. Toats. So, well folks, you could imagine what happened. The next day came and went without Yens ever telling them. Oh no. So the police went out to the Inelisabeth's apartment and they were because by this time they got an apartment together because obviously she still not living in that house. Yeah. But they were met by the couple's roommate who handed them a letter that Yens had intentionally left for investigators read and gardener. And it read, oh no, dear offices read and gardener.

I assume that you, especially a Mr. Gardner, will be very excited by now, which is why I hate to disappoint you. Well, that's not exactly true. I suggest that you continue your investigation as before undoubtedly you will find whom you are looking for. As for me, I'm afraid you must remain as officer read put it, only 99% sure of my innocence.

From what Liz has told me of what you discovered at loose chippings, I can only say, I'm incapable of such a thing. I do not have many friends, but I think they will all substantiate this and my long-standing dissatisfaction with my life here. Okay. He is literally written by somebody who wrote an early Aught's WB like drama. Yes. He's a villain?

Yes. From, you know, whatever those like, you those, they would have the Superman or the Batman teen dramas before they were actual adults. That's Lex Luthor. From those. Like a WB writer. CW writer. Wrote that.

Wrote Yens. Wrote that. You can also watch interviews with that. Are you kidding me? With, yeah, you can watch interviews with him and he's, he very much gives off those vibes. That's so bad. Like that's so bad and so cringey.

In the part where he's like, I hate to disappoint you and then puts in parentheses, like, well, that's not exactly true. No, that was the part where I was like, oh no, like, somebody in the CW writers room was like, oh my gosh! This is really gonna drop the mic. Like what, this is his bill,

bill an origin story. No, that's the worst thing I've ever heard. Yeah, and then I love that he was like, I don't have a lot of friends, but they'll substantiate that in and murder anyone. But my no friends will substantiate this. Okay, we'll go hunt them down and that will be evidence and a court of law.

Thank you. Wow. So as the officer of the reading, that letter, Elizabeth and Yens were most likely on their plane rides to Europe because they ran away to fucking Europe. Yeah, of course they did. So to get out there, they traveled separately and in disguises.

And then when they met up in Europe, their whole plan was that they were going to rent a car and like go on a road trip together. But unfortunately, yeah, go on a road trip together. But unfortunately, the road trip and yeah, fucking love a road trip. Unfortunately though, they ended up in a car accident and they had to fly again, which was something they didn't wanna do obviously

because they're on the fucking run. Yeah, so they flew to Bangkok actually. And it was there that they went to like a printing shop and they got all kinds of false traveling documents. They got Canadian drivers licenses, certified passports and citizen certificates, and each of them had three different sets of photos for each document to make sure it didn't look like it was like the same day in each one. What?

They like would change up their hair or like put like a different shirt on or something. What? Yeah. Cool. Raising. How is this real? It doesn't sound real at all. They also started going by different names

and made up different backstories in case anybody asked. Now they were a Canadian couple, Jim, excuse me, Tim and Julia Holt. Oh, okay. They had gone to college together at the University of Kent and then it had been married shortly after that. How lovely. And it was with those fake names that they set up

their bank account with Lloyd's bank. Now, they were able to get check guarantee cards, which made it so that the bank would still honor a bounce check up to 50 pounds, or 60 US dollars. It was like a policy that that bank had back then. Okay. And by this point, they were back in London. And they had come up with this scheme

that they were going to do together while shopping at Marx and Spencer. One of them would buy a leather jacket at the store and they would use their guaranteed check. And then later on, that same day, one of them would come back with another jacket from a different location and return it for cash. So the scheme worked because Mark's and Spencer

were never missing out on their money if you think about it. It takes a minute to make out. Yeah, it does. And Lloyd's Bank had a policy at the time where they didn't report fraud under 10,000 pounds. So it was kind of genius. No, that's like really cunning. Yeah, like very cunning. Because through this little scheme, Elizabeth and Yens made a profit of around 6,000 pounds

or at the time $9,000. Holy shit. Yeah. Like, wow. Just doing that single thing. Just that, just returning a weather jacket every day. Yeah, they would just go on like different locations around the city. Damn. So with that money, they opened up an account together at Midland Bank under the name Tara Lucy No and Christopher Platte No. Yeah. They moved into like a little apartment or flat, I should say, in Bath.

And they kept up their Mark Spencer scheme. So usually they'd go inseparately in like hours apart. But one day Elizabeth wanted to spice things up a little bit and she thought they should go in at the same time. Oh, and do this whole thing. Yeah. Now that was stupid because you're an employee at the time realized what was going on

and like hauled down an undercover police officer and they were arrested immediately. Wow. Yeah, just because she was bored. Just because she just wanted to spice up their fucking scheme. Yeah. So it was April 30th, 1986, more than a year since Elizabeth's parents had been murdered. So on May 29th, 1986, Detective Terry Wright called Detective Gardener

and asked him if the name's Elizabeth Haysum and Yen Soaring sounded familiar at all. He was like, do you know these names? Come on. We have them in custody. And Detective Gardener was like, hell, yeah, I know those names. Oh my like, do you know these names? We have them in custody. And Detective Gardner was like, hell yeah, I know those names. Oh my god, imagine that call. Oh my god, after a year. He must have been so excited. Seriously. So he hopped on the first plane out to London. And he was able to

interview Elizabeth and Yens that weekend, but that was all the time that he was going to have with them because technically they were like in custody, in like UK custody. Yeah. So if he couldn't get one of them to confess, then the UK was just gonna proceed with their fraud charges against the couple, which like they wouldn't have gotten that much jail time. No, and they would have just been gone.

They would have just been gone. But if he could get them to confess, it would be a totally different ball game. Oh my God, this is like the most high stakes interrogation. It's huge. Holy shit. So Yens decided that he was ready to talk. They got one recorded interview with him, I guess, and then he said, come back the next

day without the recorder. And I'll tell you what you need to know. And he signed. And when they try to get like the power, and like you, they like kind of have to give it to them because they need what they need. So he signed Solicitor Waver Forms and he said, come back without the recorder. I'll tell you everything. And he made a full confession.

Oh, no. He said that Elizabeth and he had planned to go on that trip. That road trip was for real. But that on their way to DC, they started talking about how much they both hated Elizabeth's parents. And he said, you know what, I'm gonna go out there and I'm gonna try to gain their respect. And if it doesn't go well, I'll kill them. Why are those the only two options?

Yeah, I don't know. You either gain their respect or you murder them? I don't know. There's one thing we're thinking. There's no in between? No, there was a lot of drugs involved here too. Like Elizabeth was like using. Oh, okay.

It's unclear whether Jens was using, but I think we can all use our imaginations. Yeah. So he drove out there and Elizabeth, they came up with this whole plan. She was going to go to two different movie theaters to get the tickets as an alibi in case they needed one. She literally took notes on the different architecture of both theaters so that she'd be able to talk about it later. Wow. She also cashed a check-in-yans name and ordered room service for two people, so it looked like there was two people in the room. And then the plan was that he would come back and they would go see the Rocky Horror Picture Show together,

and they would create a scene at the Rocky Horror Picture Show to like, to show that they had been there. Wow. And Elizabeth joked later on, she was like, but everybody causes a scene at Rocky Horror Picture Show so it wasn't a very good plan. Like, you guys know it, right? It's so much fun. So much so cultured a little bit.

So fun. Yeah. So Yen said that once he got to the hay somehow, it was everything was all right at first. Derek and Nancy invited him into their fucking home, gave him a drink, like they sat down together and obviously like maybe offered him some food. But at one point in the conversation, it became heated. And he said that they threatened to have him kicked out of UVA if he didn't just leave Elizabeth. Wow, which I'd be like cool all-dip. I will leave. So it was

at that point that Yen said he got up to leave, but that when he did, Derek Haseum grabbed him and held him up against the wall, like jerked him up against the wall. And Yen's had a knife on him, which he said was for protection. Oh yeah. But as he got it out, he started stabbing Derek in the neck. So.

Oh come on. Once Nancy saw that Yen's had a knife, she got her own and tried to use it to fight off Yens, but he got control of the knife and he was able to wrestle Nancy down. And he also started using her as a shield, like against Derrick Haysam, like using Derrick Haysam's wife of years and years and years as a shield. My God, like this is, it's horrible. They invited him into their home. Yeah, he's dating their child's like they have every right to have an opinion about this and she lives with them. He's like an 18 year old boy When would you ever expect that something like this would happen to you?

In porn Nancy like jumps up to try to like defend He has been with a knife and he's and he's well It's just this is like to horrific. So once he had her down, he cut her neck and the next thing he said he remembered was throwing away any evidence that he could. Yeah, I always, my favorite thing in these things is they always say, and then the next thing I remember, it's like, no, you remember.

You remember every second of it. You're just being out of here. Yeah, you're just an asshole. And he said, so he threw away the evidence and while he was doing that, he realized that his hands were cut up really badly. So he went inside to wash up and decided at that point, he would use his socks to wipe up some of the blood

to make sure that he didn't leave any fingerprints behind. Shocking. And he said he was going to swirl the blood around the bodies to get rid of any footprints that he had made. There you go. So, so satanic. So satanic wicked.

So once he and the scene were all cleaned up, he said he wrapped himself in a bed sheet. So he also took one of their fucking bed sheets. So turned off all the lights in the house and just drove back to be with Elizabeth. Yeah. And I have no words. As he finished that story, he showed Detective gardener his hands and pointed out the scars that he had gotten from that night Like you literally had scars on his hands So Elizabeth made a full confession too when she found out that Yens had and the points matched up perfectly like

Yeah, that was clearly what happened She didn't want to go through having a trial actually, so she said, I'll just plead guilty. Wow. Which is, they were like, are you sure? Because if you plead guilty, you're gonna get it. We might be able to figure out a plea deal. And I guess she was like, no, I don't want to. Like, wow.

I was plead guilty, which was interesting. Yeah. So she applied guilty as an accessory before the fact, and she was given two 45 sentences for each death to be served consecutively. Wow. Which was a huge like sentence for an accessory. It would still be a huge sentence. So during her confession she also said, are you ready? No, probably not. This it, this shit is a movie. Like it's crazy. She told detectives that she and Yens had actually followed Detective Gardener home one day

after they were being questioned and said that they had plans to kill him. They were going to kill the lead detective on the case and they were both able to describe what his house looked like. And this detective didn't realize he was being followed, that's a little scary. Yeah, I know, right?

Like, I'd be like, whoa, all right. Followed him whole Monday. Shit, so scary. So Yen's trial was much different. Because his original hope was that he'd be tried in Germany where his father had certain privileges. Yeah, of course, asshole. In Germany because of the 1961 Vienna Convection?

Convection. Yeah, I don't know why. Convection, like we're about to be cookies. Convection, thank you. No problem. Direct family members of a diplomat would receive immunity from most criminal and civil prosecutions, which I'm like, you think that because your dad is a diplomat, you can murder someone.

Well, that's not like, you can get away with it. Yeah, none of their kids can be evil. That's no way. I don't know if it applies to like that, sir. So if he were tried in Germany, Yen's knew he would most likely be tried as a minor, and he was assuming he'd probably get a maximum of 10 years, and would definitely get out on the pole too,

before those 10 years were. Go more and murder more people. Moida. Moida. But the UK wanted Yen's extra-dited back to America because these murders were committed in Virginia, again, in America. So committed in Virginia, again, America. So Germany said Virginia also known as America, like America. So Yens, excuse me, Germany asked if Yens were to be tried in America that he not face the death penalty.

Okay. And they were like, well, maybe, maybe, maybe, sure. I don't know. So Yens learned that he was going to be extra-dited back to Virginia, that he had no hopes of only serving time years in Germany. Good. Took back his whole confession. Of course he did the little shit. Who's like, no, I was actually under duress when I confessed.

That doesn't work though. They made me because the Elizabeths matched right up with yours so that doesn't work. Oh, just wait. Like, good try. He said it was not me who committed these murders. It was Elizabeth. She went and did this.

I didn't even know that she was going to do this. And then she just came back all bloody. And she said, you know, we have to figure this out. And so she told me, this is what he said. She said that she told him, describe to me, like what you would do if you murdered my parents, like what you think I did. And then the parts that you get wrong,

I'll say no, try again. And you'll just try until you get to the story that like I did. Oh my God, this is the worst thing I've ever heard. Like you think that anybody is gonna believe that that is what happened? That is the stupidest shit I've ever heard. And also he has scars all over his hands.

Like, he proved like, hi, here's all those scars. Like scars on his hands, exactly. But he said, no, it was her and she told me, just tell me what you think I did and we'll get to the story together. I'm truly question mark. Go for it, old man. Like me, I'm like that guy with like all the equations

surrounded. Yeah, just what? Like what? And he said, you know, I'm like that guy with like all the equations surrounded. Yeah, just what? What? And he said, you know, she's the woman I loved. I was willing to spend 10 years in prison for her, but not more than that. Oh, no, I've, you know, that's, that's a whole different kind of relationship. Exactly. It's one thing to be willing to spend 10 years in prison for someone. 11? Never. 11? We're talking marriage now. We're nuts. That's a lot. So not ready for that commitment yet. I just, I truly cannot.

I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm the funnel. I'm taking a back. Yeah. Exactly. So while getting ready to go to trial, the investigator searched Elizabeth and Jens flat in England and came back with a myriad, a myriad of incriminating letters and diary entries. You don't say. Gensite written a letter to Elizabeth saying, where I to meet your parents, I have the ultimate weapon. Strange things are

happening with me. I'm turning more and more into a Christ-like figure, a small imitation anyway. Oh my god, kick him so hard in the nuts. He goes, I think. I think. I believe I could either make them completely lose their wits Get hard attacks or they would become lovers in an agape kind of way of the rest of the world There's so much time back there. Yeah. How does someone get a heart attack? Where do you get? Yeah, get hard to get them at that spot? Where can you pick one up. I'm turning into a more Christ-like figure, I think. I think. I'm pretty sure I don't know. I'd be like, I can't be sure.

I just feel it. So somebody repeatedly kicked this dude in the nuts. Please. For me, please. She wrote back to him saying, it seems my concentration on their death is causing them problems. My father nearly drove over a cliff at lunch. He nearly got squashed by a tree when he got home and he keeps falling over.

And my mother, drunk, fell into the fire. I think I shall seriously take a black magic. We can either wait till we graduate and then leave them behind or get rid of them soon. My mother said today that if some accident befell them, she knew I would become a worthless adventurer. More maternal acumen. I love how she literally lays it out perfectly. She's like, well, we could just graduate and just leave them behind and never talk to them again. Or we could murder them now.

What do you think is the best option? What is it more rational decision? You're not just saying exactly what you should do. Graduate, leave. They'd probably be fine without you. Exactly. So just go away. Right.

Exactly. And she's like, you know what, I feel like the best course of action here is just a brutally murder them in their own home. I think so. I don't know. I feel like that's the best way to go about it. She wrote another one.

Yeah, she did. Why don't my parents just lie down and die? I despise them so much. Would it be possible to hypnotize my parents? Do voodoo on them? Will them to death? And then actually that part that I read before is actually in this letter. We can either wait until we graduate and leave them behind or we can get rid of them soon. Yeah, it's a simple solution. The first one. So Yens answered that letter saying, the fact that there have been many burglaries in the area opens up the possibility for another one with the same circumstances

only this time dot dot dot. I hate these two. You're like literally saying exactly what you're going to do. So much. And then finally, we have a diary entry made by Elizabeth, which said, the case is about to be solved. Perhaps fingerprints on coffee mug used by Yens and Bedford interview gave him away. I have to leave. Like I have to go, I have to go reevaluate everything. I have to leave.

These two, for two people who came up with like some pretty cunning, I mean, that, that Mark's pretty smart things. And that's pretty smart things. Man, they're dumb, truly. For being able to come up with some really, really cunning things, they are dumb as rocks and insufferable. Insufferable. They are insufferable. Like, you wanna take a black magic? They are out of here.

No, I just have to leave. And like, they think that they have powers. Like, they're like, no. You know, I think us thinking about this is like a tree almost fell in my dad today. That is horrific. Your father is 72 years old. No, they are that couple that you're like,

you would be around somewhere and like not choose to be. Oh god, yeah. And then you get in the car with your own significant other or your friend and be like, what the fuck was that? We're never doing this ever. We are never turning into those people. We are never hanging out with those people again. Why did you bring me here?

Also, can we point out that this man, her father, Derek, literally moved his family out of Zimbabwe before it became Zimbabwe because he was worried about his children and his wife. Yeah. And like worked his whole life. Like Nancy wanted to go back to Virginia to give Elizabeth this beautiful life. Like all they wanted for her was the best it seemed. Wow. Yeah.

So before the trial started, both Yens and Elizabeth were evaluated, and at the time, Elizabeth was actually diagnosed with borderline personality disorder formally. Okay. And Yens was formally diagnosed with shared delusional disorder. But he was deemed fit to stand trial, obviously. So his trial began on June 1st, 1990, wedding anniversary. Look at that. And there seemed to be a solid amount of evidence against him. There were four different blood types found at the scene, type A and type AB, which were Derek and Nancy's blood

types, one spot of B blood, which was Elizabeth's blood type, and five different samples of type O blood, which was Yen's blood type. Oh, okay. To be fair, it's also the most common blood type. I was just going to say it's a very common blood type. Yeah, but they also talked about the bruise on Yen's face, which he, himself, said, came from the struggle he had with Derrick Asum and the cuts on his hands. And finally, there were the impressions found at the scene believed to have been made by somebody wearing socks. So this expert testified saying that Yen's footprint was a perfect match to this impression.

Later on, the judge said that that evidence regarding the sock print was not admissible because he was like, I don't even know how the fuck you figured that out. I was just gonna say because he's probably like, it's a sock, bro. He's like, they have those at pay less. It is, it is. For you to measure your kids' feet. Like sure, but no. No, probably not a great one.

And it was a good thing that he didn't make that evidence admissible because it turned out that that expert was a tire print expert. Yeah, not a barefoot sock impression expert. And so one of those things, you line up a tire and a foot and you're like, oh, so close, so close, so close, not the same though. Yeah. So there wasn't necessarily really any

physical evidence directly and undoubtedly connected to Yens. And the problem though was that he didn't do himself any favors on the stand. So while there wasn't a lot of like shocked by that, a lot of like for real evidence, he was like, I'm shocked by that. A lot of, like, for real evidence. Yeah, it was like, like, he was kind of handing some, he was. Which is not shocking at all considering they are the most insufferable two people on planet Earth. Oh yeah, the jurors literally said,

like, he came off as the most arrogant friend. The jurors, like, we hate him. Well, like, I don't even know him. I don't know if he did it, I just hate him. Like, he was, like, smiling on stands, he was, like, correcting lawyers with no things that they had said, like, oh my God, I'm trying to be it, I just hate him. Like he was like smiling on screens, but he was like correcting lawyers with no things that they had said, like, oh my God, I'm gonna be like, I'm smarter than you.

And he'd like laugh. And they'd be like, you're on trial right now for a double homicide. And you have time to wall. Okay, wow. So they were like, yeah, like no, like he's arrogant. And they couldn't get past the fact that he had literally confessed.

Yeah, and given a perfect confession that matched Elizabeth's. Yeah, exactly. And Elizabeth also testified against him, and literally, like, she was very believable on the stands. She was like, I'm over this. Let's just... Exactly. The other thing was that in the confession, he was the one who did everything and, like, knew all of these details,

but then he took it back and said, no, Elizabeth did all of this, and, like, tried to go with that whole story of like, oh my gosh. She said, say what you think I did and they were all like, no, that didn't happen. That truly, there can't be a person on planet Earth that said that he hears that story and is like, that's likely what happened. No, exactly. Nobody would do that. No, it's so bad.

So all in all, it took the jury four hours to find Jens. What's the surprise? It took that long. To find Jens guilty on two counts of first degree murder The judge sentenced him to two life sentences and he was sent to the Buckingham Correctional Center in Virginia Hi during his time in prison He published five books and like mostly came to kept to himself while maintaining his innocence and he once said if I had committed the murders I would have committed them the way I committed the check fraud

with care and planning. The slaughter of the haisms appeared risky, messy, and personal. Honey, that's not the, like, burn that you think it is. Like, that's not, that's not like the dunk that you think it is on anyone. Like, you're literally doing the,

if I did it. I was just going to say, you just took that from OJ. Yeah, nobody is, nobody cares what you, if I did. Okay. It's like, don't make that sound. I thought you didn't. I was just going to say, you just took that from OG. Yeah, nobody cares what you, if I did, okay. It's like that, don't make that. I thought you didn't do it. And like, so your mind is capable

of murderous activity. It doesn't make any sense. No, so in 1995, he filed an appeal and they said, fuck you. And then flash, that's what literally says that on the record, it's like this, fuck you. And then flash forward to November of 2019. I don't like that look in your face. Flash forward.

I don't like that look in your eyes. On November of 2019. What's he doing Ash? Yen Soaring and Elizabeth Haysam. We're both released early from prison. She's up. She's actually up. She just, she was, oh, she's coming back. She's coming back. She's, she's, I'm not. She's, if that was on video, I was like, I don't know what I have to tell the rest of this time. I'm nobody else. What?

What? Where are they? What's going on? They were released early after 30 years. Why? According to the Richmond Times Dispatch, the chair of the Virginia parole board, Adrian Elbenit, said quote,

the parole board has determined that releasing Yen Soaring and Elizabeth Hayesam to their iced deportation detainers is appropriate because of their youth at the time of the offenses, their institutional adjustment, and the length of their incarceration. No, no, no, yeah. They weren't like 16. Like this isn't like, they were like 14 and she was 20 like come on exactly So while he was in prison Yens did make a few points about new evidence that was able to be tested

There were 42 samples from the crime scene that were not linked to him in any way. Okay. 11 of those sample Samplees the sample is 11 of those samples directly excluded, not only him, but Elizabeth too. Okay. 24 of them couldn't be processed for DNA. And seven of them didn't contain enough information for comparison. Okay. I personally think that Elizabeth and Jens

are 100% responsible for killing her parents. I think if these murders had occurred when more testing could have been done, it would have just given us a clearer picture of who did what? I was going to say that I think it would have locked it in if it was do it at a time when we just didn't have all of that. But I still think the right people went to prison. Yeah, I do.

Personally, there's people out there that don't. But I think the biggest part of this case that confuses me is motive. Now, Elizabeth definitely had a lot of anger toward her parents based on everything that happened, like, yeah, and you can hear her talk about it in the different letters that she sent Yens. She's actually gone back and forth a lot of times when it comes to her relationship with her parents. She sometimes said that they were like the most doding and loving parents. In other times, she literally said it was that they loved her too much. Okay.

At first, I was like, how can somebody love somebody too much? And then I kind of got into like cryptic thinking with that. And then I was reading more about this case. And it turns out during a lot of interviews with police, they asked about her specific relationship with her mother, Nancy. And at one point or another, Elizabeth told Detective Gardner that her mother had been sexually abusive towards her.

Oh boy. She said specifically that Nancy would quote, come into her bed naked very often and indulge in some very affectionate hugging and kissing. Eek. Now, she later took that statement back and said all she meant was that her mother was aggressively affectionate,

but not that she had sexually abused her. Oh, boy. So when she took the stand for her official testimony, she said Nancy was not sexually abusive and that she just loved her too much. She said she loved me. Like separating too much. It was like her fault. Okay. Like two of faulting me. Yeah. But because she has so many different versions of this story, regarding the relationship with her mother, people who look into this case, you kind of just have to make your own conclusion based on the evidence. It is, however, worth noting that during their search of the home after the murders,

investigators did find five photos tucked away in Nancy's art studio. The photos were of Elizabeth when she was younger and she was naked in all of them. Oh, her genitalia was covered. And it was seemingly like for art purposes. And those who knew Nancy said they must have been for her paintings because she literally did do paintings of people in the nude like they actually found one while they were going

to the studio. But Elizabeth was like a younger girl in these photos and it was just a little bizarre. Yeah, that's unsavory. It's unsavory for sure. For sure. Like that's not something you can just be like, oh yeah, that's what parents do. Like no. No, it's not something you can just be like, oh yeah, that's what parents do. Like no. No, it's no.

Very, very strange. That's really all there is to that because Elizabeth has gone back and forth so many times, which if she was assaulted or abused by her mother, it makes sense. It makes sense. Clear motive. Yes, clear motive.

And it makes sense like she's going back and forth because I'm sure a part of her feels guilty for killing her mother if she did. Oh boy. Oh, that adds a whole different way to this. And she was dying. You can't really make a call. Well, you can't.

She was diagnosed with borderline personality disorder and a lot of times, not every time, but a lot of times people with borderline disorder, borderline personality disorder have gone through some kind of sexual assault in their childhood. And obviously, again, not everybody. Not everybody, but it's like a blanket statement. It's a big part of it. Yeah, for sure. So we just don't know. Wow.

But that changes a little bit. I mean, obviously, it doesn't, it doesn't change the fact that they were murdered. Yeah, and it doesn't, you know, you can't really know. Like, all we have is Elizabeth, and if that's what she went through, then dear God, that's so terrific. But I guess it does give you a bigger piece of the picture of the motive here. Why she was so angry. Right.

If that is the case. Right. But again, it's like the two people who this is being said against are not here to defend themselves, or to present any kind of evidence to the contrary. Right. So that's tough. It is. I have no opinion on that. I'm not going to sit here and pretend I do. No, it's just not fair to either party.

Yeah, it's bizarre. But those voters are bizarre. And it's a fact. It's just that. And it's facts. And it's worth noting, which I'm glad you did, because you don't want to hold stuff back. No. Of course not. No, that's wild. So to end this story in January of last year, January of 2020,

Elizabeth was deported to Canada and Jens was deported to Germany and they are both prohibited from ever entering the US again. Wow. And that is the story of the murders of Derek and Nancy Haysam. Guys, that was a wild ride. A wild ride. And again, the story, the book that I used for a lot of the research here is beyond reason, the true story of a shocking double murder, a brilliant, beautiful Virginia socialite

and a deadly psychotic obsession written by Ken Englade. Wow. Yes. I mean, regardless of what went down those letters between the two of them and the diary entries and shit, it's still insufferable. You guys are talking about murdering them, and then they got murdered. And then you got to feel like Ruzon is face at the funeral. He said he threw a coincidence.

Yeah, like he had a bruise on his face. He said he was thrown against a wall like that checks out. Yeah, he had cuts all over his hand, that checks out. She has these tickets from these movies. No, it all ends up to them doing everything for sure. It's just now it's just become sticky with a matter of like motive and all that. Exactly.

And the fact that she pled guilty anyway. Yeah. Like and she was like, no, I don't want anything like. Yeah, like I just wanted to do it. I did it. I did it. Wow. Like that, that's very telling. I just want to do it. I just want to do it. I do it.

Wow. That's very telling. That's truly outrageous. It's really just like sad case all around. I feel like it's like I knew part, maybe. I knew the names in this case, but I had no idea the details. I didn't know any of this. Exactly how I feel.

Because when I saw the book, I was like, obviously, we were joking. I was like, oh, that drew me in. Yeah. And then I was reading a description, and I was like, Elizabeth Haysam. I was like, why does that me in. Yeah. And then I was reading a description and I was like, Elizabeth Hayesum. I was like, why does that name sound familiar? Very, yeah, definitely.

Wild. That was crazy. Wild. Thank you for bestowing that horrible. You're welcome. Thank you, Rihanna, for leaving. Well, if you were, I just, I didn't know what to do. I had to go.

I had to go. I did not see that coming. I wish that that had been out of it. And I was like, and they got out of prison. You were like, and I'm out of support. I've got to go. I don. I did not see that coming. I wish that that had been out of it. And I was like, and they got out of prison. You were like, and I'm out of it. I've got to go. I don't see you. I'm leaving.

I had no idea that was coming. Usually I didn't tell you. But when I saw it, I was like, what do those eyes do? I didn't tell you. I could see that twinkle in your eye. Oh, yeah. I'll fuck you up in a second. Because I was telling her little bits about this case,

like in between the two recordings, but I left to like big huge parts. Oh, yeah. Because she did. I wanted like real raw reaction. You got it. Boom. You got it.

Yeah. Crazy. Wow. Well guys, as always, thank you so much for listening and happy holidays. Yeah. Exactly. Hope you enjoyed your time. Is this the last one before the holidays?

Before the holidays. Yeah. All right, so perfect. I just wanted to say I hope you all have a merry and bright holiday with your family and Eat whatever you want. It's gonna be so y'all be it is gonna be wonderful open all your presents and then guess what This is my final message if you have not done this by yourself a Christmas present Yeah, I buy myself a Christmas present every year my great grandma used to buy her self a Christmas present every year and My great grandma used to buy her Christmas present every year,

and I think everybody should do it. Yeah, but it's just even just something small. Yeah, it doesn't have to be huge. Of course not. That makes you happy. I got myself a pair of Adidas Swift runs. Oh, there you go. Fancy.

Yeah, love that. Oh, I got a candle from Anita's apothecary on Etsy. I think you guys should also get yourselves one of those because they are the most beautiful candle. That's like a Tuesday for you. Yeah. Anita's apothecary. I got I mean, he does. I got something. Get it.

I love Anita's apothecary. Elena's house is Anita's apothecary. I love her with all my heart and soul. She makes the most beautiful candles. She's an artist. She is. And she's wonderful. And she ships them so fast.

Oh, yeah. I think she teleports them to your home. She's just a very like, she's a very like, she puts things together very carefully. And it's just like you can tell she gives a shit. She does. She's just like, yeah, I love her. So go take a look at her own Etsy.

But don't buy them all, because I want them. Don't buy them all. All right, well, we hope you keep listening. We hope you keep it. Yikesies. Hi. Hey, Prime members, you can listen to Morvid, Early, and Add Free on Amazon Music. Download the Amazon Music app today, or you can listen ad-free with Wondery Plus and Apple podcasts. Before you go, tell us about yourself by completing a short survey at Wondery.com slash survey.