Morbid - Episode 317: The Horrific Murder of Katy Hawelka Part 1

Episode Date: May 9, 2022

It was August 1986 when Katherine “Katy” Hawelka started her second year at Clarkson University. She was 19 years old and looking forward to the start of classes and reuniting with her college pals. As a bright, kind and hard-working young woman, she was set to set the world on fire. Her mother and sister (who was her best friend) dropped her off on campus and after settling in Katy went out with some friends. Unfortunately Katy would never make it to the start of classes. Her precious life she would cut short when she was brutally attacked and sexually assaulted by a monster named Brian McCarthy. Please consider signing this petition to keep Brian McCarthy from receiving parole. Katy's family has to go before the board every 24 months to keep their daughter's killer behind bars: Petition to Deny Parole for Brian M. McCarthy  This book is a phenomenal resource and I highly recommend it to get a real look at Katy, her family and more: A Stranger Killer Katy by William D. Larue  As always, thank you to our sponsors: Best Fiends: Download Best Fiends for FREE from the App Store or Google play. BetterHelp: Morbid listeners get 10% off their first month at BetterHelp.com/morbid  FirstLeaf: Sign up today and you’ll get your first 6 bottles for $29.95 plus free shipping. Go to TryFirstleaf.com/MORBID  Curology: Get started with Curology just like I did with a free 30-day trial at Curology.com/MORBID  Just pay $5 for shipping and handling.   Daily Harvest: Go to DAILYHARVEST.com/morbid  to get up to forty dollars off your first box! See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

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That's W-O-N-D-E-R-Y-P-O-D. Audible.com slash wondery pod or text wondery pod to 500-500 to try audible for free for 30 days. Angie has made it easier than ever to connect with skilled professionals to get all your home projects done well. Whether it's routine maintenance and emergency repair or a dream project, Angie lets you browse home on her reviews, compare quotes from multiple local pros, and even book a service instantly. So the next time you have a home project, just Angie that and start getting the most out

of your home. Download the free Angie mobile app today or visit Angie.com. That's ANGI.com. Hey weirdos, I'm Melina. And I'm Ash. And this is morbid. Hey! We're here. We're back with a brand new wrap, with a brand new terrible case to tell you about. This is going to be a two-part error because I don't think I need to explain myself anymore. You know me by now. You should just start saying this is gonna be a two-part error because I am who I am. Because I am who I am and that's all that I am. But this is a really gnarly case.

But before we get into it, I just wanted to say it was really fun to see everybody's walking up to the batter's box song. You guys had some good ones. I did. I feel so remiss. One of the Patreons commented, and they said that their song would be Bad Girls by MIA.

And I was like, how did I not think of that? She literally did. She was like, oh my God. Like, I miss that. I love that song and that's such a good walk-up song. Yeah, you guys, you pulled some out that I was like, oh, damn. You're right, that's a good one.

But honestly, I think together, we would all be a great team to watch, walk up to. At least walk up to the batter's box. I don't know what would happen after that. You're good at sports. I'll carry you all. Whenever we go to a sporting event, I usually just say, go sports.

Go sports. I don't really know how promising I go. There we go. At least we all have great walk-up songs. But keep them coming, because it's been fun to watch. And we appreciate it. And we also appreciate how much you loved Trid and Sheena being on for the listener tales episode.

That was such a fun episode. I'm so glad that everybody liked it as much as they did. Yeah, you guys have been amazing. We were like, you know, you just never know with guest episodes because, say, you know, we all listen to podcasts, we all get comfortable sometimes when anyone else comes on, it's like, why are you here? It's like, you can't sit with us. Yeah. It can be tough and it's hard with a lot of people in the room to like make sure

you're not talking over each other. So it was really cool to see that you guys like had as much fun with it as we had with us. And we will be back. Yeah, we'll bring them back for sure because they're the best people ever. But literally, thank you guys for being so like kind and amazing about it. It made them feel so good too. So thanks you guys. You guys are wonderful. We love this little commune. We do. So let's just jump right into it today because we just want to, there's a lot to talk about in this. So this is the case of the really brutal murder of Katie Hualca. This happened back in the 80s. It happened in Pottsdam, New York. This is a crazy case, and I just want to start by saying that Brian McCarthy, the man who was responsible for the crimes I'm about to describe, he's up for parole every 24

months. So every 24 months, the family of his victim, Katie, who else is family, has to fight to make sure he doesn't get parole. And I'm going to talk about this at the end of the episode as well, and I'm gonna share a petition that's been created by the family to make sure that he doesn't get parole. I'm gonna sign it. I think once you guys hear what he did,

you are going to want to sign it too. And I really urge you to, but obviously, listen for yourself. Right. I think you'll come to the same conclusion. The family, this family really fights for Katie's legacy, like the Huwelka and the extended family. They fight for her legacy, they fight for justice, and I really give them a ton of credit for putting themselves out there constantly and fighting for this. And the fact that they have to go before the parole board every 24 months and see this guy. And just basically beg for him not to be let out,

which he's an animal. He's an animal. And in my opinion, he deserves to be behind bars for the rest of his life. I think you'll agree. I'm so nervous to hear about that. Yeah, it's awful. Now, again, like I said, I will put the petition

in the show notes. I will say it at the end again. So we'll hear about it and we'll talk more about it in the second part. We'll talk more about the parole stuff, what they've been through, what they say about it. So this tragic case takes place at Clarkson University in Potsdam, New York, and it took place on August 28th, 1986.

So a year after I was born. Wow. Now immediate side note, Clarkson University has a very interesting origin story. Oh, okay. And I am going to ask you to read a book that is on this case. I think it's the only book on this case. The author did an amazing job. His name is William D. LaRue. Oh cool. And I know, I'd say cool name, just saying. But he, I mean, when he did such thorough research, he spoke with the family, he spoke with investigators, he poured over every single document in this case. He really wanted to get the whole thing out there. It's called a Stranger Killed Katie by William D. LaRue. And I'm going to obviously link it like we always do. But I just wanted to tell you right ahead of time that his information in there is amazing.

You're going to get even more stuff that I'm not going to put in here in that book. So I really encourage you to go read it. I love when you can just find like such a good book on a case. Yeah. When somebody really did the due diligence, like it's really, it's nice when somebody really does it. It's like, I wanna make sure you guys read it. Now, again, like I said, super thorough, super engrossing. And he's really put a spotlight on Katie,

as a person. And also her family. Like, he's put a huge spotlight on her family, especially her parents who like seem like, just, this seems like a really great family. It really does. The more I read about them, the more I was like, I just want to hang out with you guys. Like you just seem like a cool family

that just like supports and loves each other. I love them. But yeah, definitely check out that book. Now, according to LaRue, according to that book and confirmed with additional sources, I went on like a deep dive to Clarkson University history. It's actually a memorial. It was made as a memorial thing, like a memorial thing after his death. It was after 57-year-old Thomas S. Clarkson,

who was a businessman in 1894. It was after he died pretty tragically. Oh really? Now, on August 14th of that year, 1894, he was helping his co-workers on a job at a sandstone quarry that he owned. Now, he was aiding them and moving a 4,400 pound steam pump. And suddenly, without warning, the pump began to tip over. Oh my God. They all ran to get out of the way.

He tripped and fell, and it literally fell on him. Oh my God. Now his employees and coworkers lifted, they actually all lifted the pump up and he was able to like pull himself out. This is a roll out. How rithic it truly is. He had a broken right femur,

the tibia and fibia beneath that were crushed completely, like bone dust. He was taken to the hospital, and by August 19th, only a few days later, he had fallen into a coma and passed away. Oh, yeah, so it's really sad. That's tragic. Now, he had lived at the time, he was single,

and he was living with his sisters, Levinia, Frederica, and Annie. That's adorable. After his death, they decided they needed to do something to honor him. So they got together, his sisters, and decided it needed to be an institution of higher learning. And so they went with a technical school in Potsdam. They wanted that to be what was his legacy, because he had always talked about how much he admired and supported higher education. Oh. it always talked about how much he admired and supported higher education. Now in 1896, using their money, they built and created the Thomas S. Clarkson

Memorial School of Technology, which would later become Clarkson University. So it's just a tragic and very interesting beginning to the central location for this very tragic case. Right. Is there like talk that it's like cursed or something? I honestly have not heard anything that it's cursed because up until this point, it was a very safe school. This is a very safe community, really.

In the books and in a lot of the interviews I've seen with the family, they actually said they were very happy that she had chosen to go to this school instead of one in the city because this was so safe and they weren't worried. Now, technically the evening of August 28th, 1986 was where this story begins. Now, on that evening, 31-year-old Kim, avidigian, I believe is how you say it, he was a security guard at Clarkson University.

He found himself working the overnight shift, and he was tasked that night, basically with protecting the computers that were being stored in the walker Arena on campus. Now, he was just a security guard and at this time the security guards were what I think the chief of police actually talks about it in the president of the university. They were basically just night watchmen. Okay. Like they weren't university, they were basically just night watchmen. Okay. Like they weren't properly trained to really handle a lot of craziness.

Because there really wasn't a lot of craziness going on. Yeah. And I think they just like didn't really make a big, like police force out of this whole thing. Right. But basically they were there to, you know, protect, make sure that nobody was robbing a building, essentially, like that or like doing, you know, that all the doors were locked. So like all that kind of thing, like they weren't really trained building essentially, like that all the doors were locked, like all that kind of thing. Like they weren't really trained to handle like confrontation of any kind. Right.

You know, just putting that out there ahead of time because it gets a little angry. So he's working the overnight shift. He's just gonna be in the walker arena on campus, making sure nobody's gonna bust in there and try to steal the computers, which were like the new thing because it was like the 80s. And everybody on campus got a computer. I think it was a Zenith computer,

which is like one of the... I was gonna say. That means nothing. It was like a big draw to the university because you all got your computer. That's cool. No, it's like you got an iPad. Exactly. No, you got an iPad and like a kindergarten. Literally. No. He was doing his thing basically looking out for any funny business going on. He was only one of two security guards around the campus at this time in the night slash morning. Small campus or large campus?

I think it's a pretty good size campus, but again, it's just like not a lot going on. Why? No, around 3.25 a.m. on August 29, 1986, he started to hear what he felt was someone banging on the doors of the arena. Ooh. So obviously that's concerning, especially at that time in the morning. Just going to say that. He contacted the other security guard that was on duty for the evening on campus, which was 30-year-old Donald Chanty.

And he let him know, you know, I'm hearing something weird. It sounds like somebody's banging on the doors. They might be trying to come in. I don't know. So Chanty was like, sure, like I'm hearing something weird. It sounds like somebody's banging on the doors. They might be trying to come in. I don't know. So Shanty was like, sure, like I'm gonna head over there. So he heads over there, because the guy, like, Ava Deke, Ava Dekean was in the walker arena. Shanty's like, patrolling outside.

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That's friends without the R best fiends. So he goes over there in his patrol car and he turns into the area and he said he could see one thing next to the arena immediately. And that was a couple that appeared to be having sex outside of the arena. Okay. On the grass next to the building around the back of the parking area, he said the man had dark hair and that he literally looked up at Shanty as he drove in and then just continued what he was doing.

Okay. So the way it was described is that they could see the man from the back and the woman had her leg up and he was holding her leg. That is what they did. I'm only describing that so that you can understand why I and a lot of other people think that this should have been looked at a little bit. Yeah. Now that's weird, right?

Like she's lying on the grass in front of him. Yeah. Now, Shanty at first obviously was like what the fuck? Like that's shocking to come across him first. Of course. But he had been working there for a couple of years. And he said, he said weirdly, he has come across students having sex outside. And he said, it's weird. It's weird to handle it. It's like not a good situation for anybody involved.

Right. And so he was kind of just like, oh, like hopefully they're just going to leave because now they know I saw them So maybe they'll just leave and yeah, I don't want to be a part of this So he went to the front of the arena and he spoke to Avadigian So he just left them there and because he had shown the light on them and he went around and he was like Hopefully they're not there anymore, but like we're gonna have to go over there and see okay So together they drive to the other side of the arena over there and see. Okay.

So together they drive to the other side of the arena, have a deacon and chantey and hoping that they had left, but they were still there. Okay. But now the man was trying to be inconspicuous and seemed to be like crouching, like trying not to be seen. So they drove away again. Okay. This is when I'm like, why did you drive away?

Because I was hiding. Now, my immediate thought was, why are we just allowing students to have sex outside the walk or arena on campus at 325 in the morning? Right. Like, that is illegal. Like, why are we allowing that? Like, that's illegal everywhere. And also, why aren't they going to make sure this woman is okay?

Yeah. And these questions may be yours too. And I'm assuming they are. There's a few things here. It's a weird position. You should make may be yours too. And I'm assuming they are. There's a few things here. It's a weird position. You should make sure she's okay. Well, because I mean, the first thing for me is like, you can't see her face. So you don't know if she's okay. She's lying down and he's not like, okay, you saw her leg, but like, but that's a man can move a woman's like, he's controlling it. So it's like, she's laying down. He is not. It's 3.25 in the morning, right? When all the students were out at bars and everything, you should make sure she's

awake. Yeah. Like, that should be a thought in your head. Again, there's other things with this, but to me, I'm like, what are you doing? I also feel like this unfortunately happened in a time where we weren't looking into these things. No, definitely not, which is really sad. Exactly. But so there definitely should have been, they should have stopped this. Absolutely. They definitely should have not even just for the assault if that is what's occurring.

But just because you stopped it. You can't have sex on campus if that was the case. Yeah, it's like you got to stop this man. You can't let people be having sex outside, okay? Yeah. You just can't, that should be part of your job is to make sure that was the case. Yeah, it's like you got to stop this man. You can't let people be having sex outside, okay? Yeah, you just can't, that should be part of your job, it's to make sure that doesn't happen. Like if you're allowing that, you're setting a precedent. Exactly, but then to play a bit of devil's advocate,

because I truly don't think these security guards were properly trained at all for this shit. And that's on the university, to be quite honest, they're not police officers. So they haven't been given training in this kind of thing, at least not in depth. They're basically, they're not trained to observe that in the way that we're thinking about it in that moment.

Like hindsight, sure. But they're probably in the moment just like, oh god, I don't want to deal with this. It would be like, if you and I were like seeing that, like we do essentially, I don't know what we're supposed to do. That's the thing. It's essentially any of us seeing that because they're not trained. Right. At all.

At no more training than you were. I do. Like they're literally just there. So that's someone is there. Exactly. Just for like a body. Right. But it's like especially in the 80s, they're really just around to make sure those doors are locked, no one's stealing those zenith computers. That's it. So to them, according to all police reports that I could find in both of their own words, they thought this was just two students

consensually having sex. They were trying to make this situation stop in the easiest way possible without having to actually have some weird interaction with them. Okay. They were trying to do it at like a arm's distance, like we're gonna flash the light on them. Right.

Hopefully they'll get up and leave and we don't have to talk to them or have some weird solutions. Well, in a weird way, I'm also like, you're kind of respecting their privacy. I see. Which is not even privacy. If that was the case, there's a lot of angles to it for sure. But now, I would have to say I'd advise this, that, you know, this kind of situation always be looked into.

Because I believe it would be more routine to always check and make sure nothing unsavory is happening, and that it is indeed just a mutually bad decision made by two consenting adults. Right. If that's the case, then by see you later, go on your way. Don't do this again. That's gross. And you would hope that today it would be treated differently. That's a thing. but on the flip side, you got to intervene, man. You don't know if she's safe. And that's like, to me, I'm like,

you got to look at that. There's a, I can see both sides. I totally get it. I'm not going to, like, it's by no means, you know, anyone's fault, but Brian McCarthy's fault, but they're just, I'm like, I can understand why the family would be upset, of course. Knowing that two security guards saw the progress,

like this in progress and didn't stop it immediately. So it's like, I get that because I'm assuming a life could have been so. And I understand that. So what we'll find out is that likely, I'm not sure if it would have absolutely saved something from happening, but who knows? You just don't know that's the thing. And we could sit here and be like, you just don't know.

And the family having that in their head that you just don't know. Yeah. It's like, that's hard. But then these two security guards, I don't, and I don't think anybody believes that they had any ill intention or they wanted something bad to happen. They were just kind of negligent, to be honest, but again, I take it more to the university to train them properly, to have people that are more trained and ready to deal with this kind of thing because it's on the university to ensure the safety of its students.

Of course. And that's the thing. So there's really just like a trickle down effect of just like bad decision making going down here. But Alan H. Clark, the president of the University at the time, later commented on this whole thing, and he said quote, they were night watchmen. They weren't charged with enforcing public morality. Yeah. And it's like, well, maybe they should have been. Yeah, like that's that's a that's a bad thing. Or if they if it weren't them, like you have a different set of actual security guards monitoring the campus. Exactly. And if they, if it weren't them, like you have a different set of actual security

guards monitoring the campus. Exactly. And what they did is normally, like on campuses, now you know there's like police forces attached to them. It's like, yeah, there's a lot more. There's call boxings and all that. But in here, they had two way radio radios that didn't even connect to the police. So they would have to go find a phone to call the police if some emergency did happen. Yeah. Which is what happened here. They had to go find a phone. Oh, man. Because again, this is the 80s. They don't have a cell phone on them. Right. So they're two way radios didn't even connect to the police station, which is like, that's negligent guys. Definitely. And that's not on those security forces on the campus. It's just a

lot going on. A lot of missteps. But he basically, the president said, you know, they were initially checking in on the noises they heard around the walker arena doors, thinking they were possibly stopping a burglary in progress. And when they saw what they believed to be two students having sex, they dealt with its second and kind of in a hands-off approach, which is wild to me because again, we're happening even if it's consensual, but you know, whatever. Now a university spokesman later said to quote, they had no way of knowing they were stumbling upon the worst crime to take place on this campus and it's 93 year history.

Oh my gosh. Which of course they didn't, of course they did not. And I'm sure they have a lot of regrets, for, to be honest, and for that I feel for them. But they also were not given the correct tools to know that, and they didn't really give themselves the correct tools. There's a lot. Now, the police chief Clinton Maytot, who is a player in this whole case, he actually like interviews, Matt McCarthy, he's a part of this whole entire thing.

He said he agreed that, and which I do too, that they were not intentionally ignoring an assault in progress because they just didn't know what was happening. And I fully agree with that. Right. Now, he said it was definitely a casual response to students out in the open like that. He was like, that's pretty fucking casual to just be like, hopefully they go away. But it wasn't like, again, they were trained to handle it appropriately. Do I think they intended to harm, for harm to come to Katie?

No, not at all. Do I think they were negligent in stopping this regardless of whether it would have saved Katie or not? Yes. Yeah. And that's the end of my thoughts on it, but I would be interested to hear what anybody else thinks too. But either way, they decided to leave again after this second time.

And this is after he was hiding, after he was kind of hiding, which could have been that he's embarrassed. Sure. And that he was hiding. And I'm sure that's what they assumed. That's probably what they were assuming that they didn't want to get caught. Exactly.

Like they were trying to hide now. No, they apparently, so they leave again. And at this time, apparently they discussed with each other, you know what, should we call the to hide now. Now, they apparently, so they leave again. And at this time, apparently, they discussed with each other, you know what, should we call the actual police now? Because again, that's the protocol for when things get like crazy. They're like, we've given them a couple of times, they're not moving.

I don't know what to do. But they were like, we really don't want to call for this. Because we're, and I think that it was, seemed to me from what I've read in different places. They didn't want to call because they were kind of given the notion that like call for emergencies don't be calling Willie Nilly. And I think they were like, is this an amr- I don't like- Oh no.

So again, it's a lot of like, ah, that's a tough situation. So they were like, no, we don't want to call. Let's do it one more time. We'll shine our headlights on them until they get embarrassed and just leave. If it doesn't work, last resort, we call the cops. Basically, they were going through a three strikes in your out kind of approach. All right. I can understand the thought process. I can. That's the thing. You can understand both sides of this. I can 100% understand how on the side of things, Katie's family and anybody on that side of things

being like, what the fuck? Absolutely. And I am like, what the fuck? Because if that's your loved one, you're thinking like, no, this could have been stopped and you were the people that could have stopped. And even I'm thinking that. I'm like, what the fuck?

And I still think that when I take myself over to the other side, I'm like, I understand the thought process that you didn't think that if you had known an assault was happening, you would have jumped into action, but you didn't know. But you didn't go to find out. Right. But it's also like, it's easy to see it that way as somebody who's not actually connected to the person that's happened to. Exactly.

And it's like, I have never been in their shoes in that situation. So I can't say what I would think or do. Exactly. And it's like, I have never been in their shoes. No. No, that's a situation. So I can't say what I would think or do. Exactly. And I've never been in the family shoes. So it's like, I'm not going to speak for either one of them. But I can say I see 100% both sides. I respect both sides totally.

I just hate that. I just hate that. It's a tough one. So again, they're going to drive over there a third time. They're going to shine a light on them. If they don't move, they were calling the cops. That was their decision. I get that.

So they drive over there again. And now they see that the man is gone. So they see that they're gone. And at first they're like, oh my God, then goodness, they left. Like it worked. But then they look closer and they see that the woman is still there.

She's lying there alone now on the grass, very still and partially nude. Now, this is tough. I just want to let you guys know. This is like we're talking about sexual assault. We're talking about a very rough assault. I just want to let you know. When they got closer to her,

they noticed she was lying in a pool of blood that surrounded her head. Oh gosh. And they freaked out now. Like immediately they sprang into quick action. Okay. So they really went, they went right into action. Avedikian ran to call police and Shanti ran to the woman to try to help her.

Okay. Now in the police report, Shanti said, quote, the female was having a hard time breathing. She was laying flat on her back. And I think her airway was filled with blood. Then he stated he had tilted her head to the side to try to aid her in clearing the blood from her mouth, to try to help her breathe easier,

because he said she was gurgling and seemed to be choking. Oh, God. Now, he was very worried. He said he was struggling to breathe. There was so much blood. And when police soon arrived on the scene, they stated that when they got there, Shanti was still holding her head in his hands to comfort her. So this is, these are good people. That's the thing. So it's like, I by no means think they intended for harm to come

to this. And I think that action alone shows that they would have done if they were, if they had known what this was in the first place. Yeah, and I am very glad that she had like somebody who was comforting her in that moment for sure, and that they weren't just stepping back and like not touching her. Because it's like I'm glad she had someone. So they looked to the wall behind the victim and there was blood spattered up to what they said, like seven feet high on the wall.

Oh my God. Immediately investigators theorized that this woman's head had been smashed into the wall at least a few times Now police were on their way and avid deacon ran back to the scene But on the way to the scene he noticed a man with dark hair Balled up under a metal stairway and this was about 50 feet from the victim's body like hiding like hiding Now he didn't know if it was somebody trying to hide or He said it could have been someone

who was hurt and like, like, balled up under there. So he notified police, like, he let them know. He was like, by the way, like somebody's over there. So there's the lurking. So a couple of the police officers went to the victim and a couple of them went to the man under the stairs. Now officer John Kaplan, officer Dale Culver, Officer David Bartlett, and Sergeant James Lewis were the first ones on the scene, along with like the EMTs and everybody.

They dragged the band out from the stairway immediately. I'm so glad that he was still there. I thought you were going to say they got over the pier. He was gone. Nope, he was conscious. He was unhurt in reality and intentionally hiding. He had dark hair and a scruffy beard. He had blood on his shirt and he was over dramatically whining and bitching about his back being hurt. Like they tried to pick him up and he was like, no, no, no, my back. How are we?

Like freaking out, fuck off. So they found an idea on him that said he was Brian McCarthy and he was 23 years old. As they tried to ascertain who he was and what the fuck he was doing under the stairs near a woman who was battered beyond recognition, he kept asking, how's the girl? Uh huh. And they found this strange and it was also not coming off as sincere. It was coming off as almost like a ton of things like, how's the girl? Like, and they were like, what the fuck? She was because he knew what he had to her.

Now he claimed immediately he claimed he was only there because he said, I heard her screaming and I tried to save her. But the attacker who was a man with a black jacket had kicked him in the back. And he had passed out. He had passed out, but then he made it underneath those certain heroic act of trying to save somebody. Wild. Although he had some real fucking problems telling them where exactly on his back this occurred

because it went from his lower back to his upper back to his head at one point, because he's lying sack of shit. Now, when they saw the victim, they could see she was blonde, but her hair was completely soaked in blood. Oh, God. Her face was bruised, swollen, and battered savagely. She was partially nude, wearing only a sweater

and a button up that had been crudely pulled up to expose her body. As emergency personnel showed up, she coded at one point and they brought her back to life. Wow. Now, at the hospital, the victim was identified as 19-year-old Clarkson University student, Katie Hawelka. 19. 19. And you said this is August. Yeah. So this is like before

anything even started on campus. She had been dropped off by her mother only the day before for her second year at Clarkson. The day before. Her mom was literally woken up before dawn with a police officer calling her and saying that her daughter Katie was attacked on campus. On her first at the hospital. I can't even imagine how that would feel at all, but a day after you drop your kid off at school. And that, I mean, because that happened at like three in the morning, that was literally that night essentially. Yeah, literally. Oh my god. This podcast is sponsored by BetterHelp. People don't always realize that physical symptoms like headaches, teeth grinding, even some

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I'm going to look it up because I don't want to fuck it up. So hold please. All right. It's O'Nida, I was right, but I wanted to make sure. Now her parents are Terry Connolly and Joseph Huelka. Her mother worked in sales at Pitney Bowes in Syracuse, and her father was a dentist in Onida. Now, she was the second oldest of four children

with one older sister Betsy, one younger sister Carrie, and one younger brother, Joe Jr. Although Terry and Joseph divorced in 1972 when the kids were very young, it was an extremely amicable divorce. There was no bad blood, no custody issues, nothing. Wow, that's like literally unheard of. Oh yeah, it was one of those healthy divorces that you rarely hear about.

Yeah. So the kids just adjusted and were we're totally happy and fine. Cause there was no conflict and no turmoil around them. Now Joe Sr., he remarried a woman named Janice in 1974 and the family's blended and got along perfectly. Awesome. Now Katie's friends and family only ever referred

to her as Katie or Kate. Her mom liked to call her, never a bad day Kate. Stop. Because everyone said she was truly just a happy young woman and had been since she was a child. Never a bad day Kate. Yeah, never a bad day Kate. She saw the best in people and she took every opportunity to make the most of her life

and make accomplishments for herself. Now, she and her siblings were so close. So close. Everyone who knew this family knew those kids would always have each other's back. And this family was just a really big, supportive unit together. Yeah, it's like a, they would like help each other out. They would always hang out with each other.

There were stories in the book that I told you guys about of like Little Joe, Joe Jr. He was having trouble swimming at one point, all three of his sisters adoven and like saved him. Oh, like without even thinking. I love this. It's just like things like that. They were on it. They took care of each other. Now, again, according to the book, on December 21st, this like really blew my mind. On December 21st, 1975, all the kids and Joe, senior and Janice survived a house fire when their Christmas tree went up in flames. Oh, that is so scary. Now, they had gone over to Joe, senior's house for like to open gifts and all that. So Terry was at her home when this was happening.

So she went and I'll tell you the whole story, but when she woke up, she was like, I almost lost my entire family in one swoop. Yeah. And like it didn't even hit her until later. And I I encourage you to read the book. I'm linking because he tells this story in such detail and it will give you like goosebumps.. Oh yeah. The way this story went down. But I'll give you like the overview. So the house fire happened because the Christmas tree went up in flames and they survived because Joe Sr.

leapt 30 feet from the house, the roof onto the driveway and then caught his children and his wife as they jumped into his arms. Are you kidding me? He literally told them all, you don't have, they were all in the roof. And he was like, you don't have to worry, I'm gonna get down there.

You will jump into my arms and nothing will happen to you. And they all trusted him. Not one of them hesitated. Like he like, shit. Like even like Janice said it, she was like, those kids, I know I have, I have very much. I have so much. He said not one of those kids even took a thought about it

because their dad said, I will catch you and they believed it, because he never gave them a reason that he wouldn't. I hate, I felt like this beautiful family was like, I had to deal with this. Right. Now, so he caught them all and his wife. He did this after he fell, when he jumped,

he broke his right leg. I was gonna say, and his left ankle, in his own jump. And then caught everyone else. And then caught them all after he did that. Wow. During the escape from the home, the kids all helped each other.

They made sure to get their little five-year-old brother themselves, like the girls all made sure to get little Joe. These are the kind of parents they were and the kind of family they were. And they seriously just seem to be what you would want in a family. Like if you could write down, here's what I want from a family, they are it.

I would want my dad to save me and catch me after he breaks his femur and ankle. Like, oh my God, you gotta read the book because there's a couple of little stories in there that I want the author to be, because he's the one who got them, so I want him to be able to tell you it. And they're just like little heartwarming moments

that happened during this. Like there's one that just like my heart melted and you really gotta read it, because it's a really amazing story. But Katie was close to all of her siblings, like they all were. But she and Carrie, her little sister, were literally best friends.

They did everything together. In the book, Carrie is quoted as saying, my friends couldn't believe that my sister and I were so close, and that she drove me to school every day. Many of them had older sisters who wouldn't even acknowledge them in the lunchroom hallway. Oh! And she's like, and literally like, I think what was it? They went to the same prom even though they were in different grades. And like Katie was super excited that Carrie was going to be at her prom. And it was like that kind of thing. Now eventually Terry, the mom married a man named Martin Connolly and Joe ended up divorcing Janice and marrying a woman named Donna.

These new step parents got along really well with the kids in the spouses and things just were continuous. I'll just were. Continue to be smooth and happy for everybody. Now Katie was in the brownies when she was little. She took pride in being a community helper whenever she could. This family like raised money for like, there were like kids in the neighborhood that like a kid that was sick in the neighborhood. the kids raised money for them to get like medical treatment. Wow. Yeah.

She was a great student. She had a ton of friends. In eighth grade, she received a very coveted Good Citizen Award because she was just such an all-around helper and like pleasant, smart, all of that. She was a babysitter for a lot of the neighbors and would literally watch like their infants in like eighth grade. And was apparently amazing. She was wicked good with kids and was super trusted.

Now in high school, she was a cheerleader. She was part of the student council. She was on the PEP club. She was student body president and all the acting. She played clarinet and band. She was on the yearbook staff. She was treasurer of Kappa Epsilon Phi Sorority in high school. She was the quintessential preppy kid too, aesthetically.

She wore those oversized polo shirts and collared shirts with the oversized sweaters. She was just cool. I was like, I want to hang out with Katie. She just looks cool. And she graduated with honors, and she was accepted at her first choice school, which was Clarkson University,

where she was going to pursue finance or business degree. I feel like she would have absolutely slayed anything she did. She would have. She would have killed it. Like the fact that she did- She would have let the world on fire. The fact that she did so many things in high school alone. Yeah. And like not only within high school,

but outside of the high school at home and in the neighborhood. Like, and I just hate that the only reason we know all of this is because of this horrible thing that happens. Exactly. And I feel like it's like, you can tell that these parents like instilled such good values in these kids because they just without thought or being asked would do things to help each other

and everybody else. And it's like, that's parents. What's going to say? That's parents doing what they should do. It's like the way that their kids are says so much about who they are for sure. And just that story alone of her father, of her father in them trusting implicitly that he would.

Right. That shows you that those kids felt safe with those parents. And that they created like a family system that they, that is like something that I wish everybody kind of forced to be reckoned. Yeah. Now Clarkson University actually didn't start letting in women students until 1964. Wow that's great. It was an all-new college. And one of the reasons Katie wanted to go there was she and this was according to her family. Her sister

Kerry especially said she wanted to be part of the movement to break down barriers for women there. Hell yeah, she was ready to show that like women belong in higher education. I'm gonna like fuck the world up. Like, you literally wanted to go there to like, buck all the stereotypes. To stick it to the man.

Yeah, she's just so fucking cool. Like, it's, this just sucks. Now, during her first year there, she made a ton of friends immediately. Obviously. Obviously. Like who wouldn't want to be friends with Katie? She had a roommate named Nancy Parks,

and they were like immediate sisters, like best friends. Poor Nancy, like when she found out what happened, it was like the most devastating thing, because Nancy had transferred out to another school. Oh, no. So she heard it like far away. That must have been so helpless. But Katie stuck it out at Clarkson,

even though Nancy transferred out. And she returned for her second year to live with three roommates in the Woodstock Village Apartments on campus. So that's where she was gonna be living that second year. Now, in the evening of August 28, 1986, she had arrived on campus only the day earlier with her mother and sister, Carrie.

Of course, Carrie came to drop her off. Now, that night, she went out with friends and her roommates to a bar they frequented off campus called Bobies. She hung out with friends in Clarkson University students. One of them in particular was Todd Kilburn that night. He was like a frat guy. He was like a really good friend of hers. He seemed like a sweet dude. He and Katie had some beers and then left the bar around 2.30 a.m. Okay. And I guess they all were like

using fake IDs because that's just like, because it's college. I wish I still had mine. I kind of want to see yours actually. You made me rip one of mine up. I did. I did guess what? She had a backup. Of course she did. No. He walked, Todd walked back with her to campus,

which was about a mile away. And he actually insisted. He was like, I'm walking to your apartment with you. Yeah. He was just being a gentleman. A good guy. No, they started to walk and they stopped because she had actually heard her foot, I think,

during the summer. And she was like getting over the foot injury. So, every now and then, she'd be like, yeah, I gotta stop. Okay. And he also just had to pee because they had been here. You're here. So, seal. At one point, they stopped because he was gonna pee by a fence near a Kentucky Fred chicken, of course.

Iconic. And this was very close to campus. So, when they stopped for this, Todd said, he noticed another male with dark hair was peeing by the fence as well. Didn't think anything of it because it's, you know, in the, it's like 2.30 in the morning. Do its BP. Everybody's back on campus. Everyone's pee in everywhere because everybody's been drinking.

Yeah. You know, everyone's just pee in everyone. They're still in summer mode. Exactly. No, it was here that there was also a gate behind the Kentucky Fred chicken. It was like outside of the parking lot. It was there was a gate there that leads to a shortcut that was used by students to get back on campus. The shortcut started, it started right at the walker arena on campus. Okay. Now at the gate Todd went to walk through

the gate with her, but Katie was like, no, just go back to the, to the Fratt house. She was like, it's too far of a walk. You're walking so far out of your way, and now you're gonna have to walk way back. Like, I don't want you to do that. I feel bad. And he was like, no, no, no, no, I'm fine. Like, I want to make sure you're okay.

And she was like, it's campus. Like, I'm on campus now. I'm okay. And he was like, you know what, you're right. And he was like, at the moment, I think. Which I get it. I get it. And he walked her all the way to campus. Yeah. And he was like, you know what, you're right. And he was like, at the, why would I think? I got it. And he think he walked her all the way to campus. Yeah. And he tried.

And campus is supposed to be safe. If why would she ever think that it wasn't safe? Right. Neither one of them would. Sure, she had spent a whole year there. Exactly. So she was like, it's campus. Like I'm going through the gate.

I'm fine. Like I've watched this walk how many times I'm sure. And then she was being thoughtful Katie and being like, I don't want you to have to walk extra miles to get home at 2.30 in the morning when I can just go on campus and I'll be fine. I wish there was a shuttle. So they were both just being like very,

I know I was thinking that too, but they were both just being very considerate of each other. And that's like, man. Now he was quoted as saying that when he left her, she was completely fine. She was not impaired. Like she was not drunk. And he not impaired, like she was not drunk. And he said, quote, she was in good enough condition to walk back to the dorms, or I would not have

left a girl by herself. At that time, she was walking and talking quite well. Her speech was not slurred, and it had been at least an hour since she had her last drink. Okay. So he was just making sure, like, I did not let her stumble on the campus by herself. It doesn't sound like it. And it doesn't sound like Katie was the kind of girl who would stumble into campus. It just doesn't seem that way. Now, unfortunately, Katie ended up battered, beaten, and assaulted behind Walker, not only moments after this, moments. Like, he was walking home and this was happening.

And had he was that Brian who he saw Pia? It seems like that is Brian who is seeing them both go there and he followed Katie into the campus. Brian's a literal fucking monster and don't worry, we'll get into what a monster he is, but like I just hate this guy so much. Now after the devastating phone call that their child had been assaulted on campus that morning,

Katie's parents got together with the step parents and they all immediately went to the hospital. They left the kids like the siblings at home because they were like, we don't know what we're going to see. Right. So they all arrived at House of the Good Samaritan Hospital in Watertown, New York. This should tell you how bad this was. At one point, Katie was wheeled by her family in the ICU. They all saw her and did not know it was her. Oh my goodness. They thought it was something that would have been like a car accident.

Well, and you had said that she, like she was pretty much like, oh, it was horrific. And she, they watched her go right by them with tubes and lines and all manner of life-saving machines attached her. And in the book, Terry says she knew it was Katie. And she actually said that's Katie. And I guess they were all like, no, that's not Katie. Like don't do like that's not her.

And they were like, and she was like, I just knew it was her. Like a night, that's just like mom shit, she just knew. And I don't think it's because she recognized her because none of them did. I think it's she just knew. Like that's just like a was her. Like a night, that's just like mom shit. She just knew. And I don't think it's because she recognized her because none of them did. I think it's she just knew. Like that's just like a mom feeling. She's like a mom feeling. And obviously this family is so close,

I fully believe that was just like mom to a shant like knowing. But that should tell you how bad and how ruthless and monstrous Brian McCarthy is. He's a fucking creature from the depths. He's awful. Now, she was an intensive care and on life support, and the doctors told them that she had been beaten so severely

in the head that if she recovered, she was likely to have significant brain damage. So she would never be the same if she recovered. But they said, we don't even know if she's going to recover. Okay. Now, meanwhile, reports had come in that the previous night, August 28th, a man named Robert Warren Jr. had picked up a hitchhiker on Route 11 going towards Morristown, New York. This hitchhiker, he said, wreaked a valka hall. He appeared to be in his early to mid-20s. He had dark hair and a scruffy beard.

He told them his name was Brian and he asked Robert Warren Jr. if he could give him a ride to pot stem and he agreed So he's like at this time everyone picked up his chikers. This was not ladies He's like I thought he was a college kid. I was like sure. I'll bring it to campus Yeah, he said he just babbled about like anything everything, including saying that he was possibly related to the Snells family, which is a very wealthy and well-known family. And Warren Jr. was just trying to get him to his destination because he seemed he was not threatening me or anything, but he was wired and just freaking me out a little bit.

I just wanted to get this dude out of my car. Yeah, well, it was later when he picked him up. It was later, so it wasn't crazy. Later it was probably like 10.30, but still, it was like at night, a swired stranger in your car, no thing. And he already seemed like he was on one, and it's not that late. So he was like, I would really like him just to get on my car. Yeah, but he was being nice,

and he ended up telling Warren Jr. that he actually, he was like, you know what? It's crazy. I actually got into pretty violent confrontation with someone earlier today at the Shatto bar in Winthrop and he said the guy accused him of stealing three bucks. So he told them they got in a fight and he had shot the guy in the leg and then fled and he said he planned to make sure that guy was dead by 4am. All right. So Warren Jr. is like, you want to get out here? Cool.

You want to get out right there? Yeah, so he was like, he told him, so then Brian says, Joe, I have a gun. Do you want to see it? Nope, no, I don't want to. And Warren Jr. was like, I do not want to see it. Do not show me that gun. Do you want to see it? I'm not telling you.

Like, he literally was like, my car. Pro, I believe you. Don't show me that gun, because I I'm gonna kick you out of this car. So he didn't show him, he dropped it. And he dropped him off in the downtown area of Potsdam or on 10.30 pm. And then he went right to the police, which I was like good for you, Robert Warren Jr.

He went right to the police with this story because he said he was worried this guy was dangerous or that he had indeed shot someone. He's like, I didn't know if he was lying, but like, I'm not gonna just let that go. And he said that he was making sure he was dead by these like, he might be trying to kill someone. So he filled out a description in the report and he said his hair color was dark. He had the scraggly dark beard. And he said he could remember saying that he was wearing, he was wearing a silver watch with a silver elastic band. Okay. And he's like,

that's the one thing I just like noticed. Hey, son. And they put out the description for this guy. And officers were on the lookout, but they didn't see him that evening. And it sounds a lot like Brian McCarthy. No? Sure does. That's because it was Brian McCarthy.

Yeah. No, Brian McCarthy was born in Meriden, Connecticut. He was the oldest who gives a shit when he was born. He was the oldest child of six siblings when he was born. He was the oldest child of six siblings and he was indeed related to the self-family. His mother was Florence Snell and his father was Milton McCarthy. Now, quick note, his mother Florence was working at Clarkson University when he attacked Katie. He used the campus where his mother worked to do this while. That sounds like some Edmund Kempershit. I was, you took the words directly out of my brain.

I was like, damn, okay. Now as a child, Brian was described as a Dennis the Menace kind of kid. Everyone said he was just mischievous, always getting into something. In the beginning, it was never bad stuff. It was just like he was an annoying kid that just always did shit.

Okay. But when he got into his teen years, he wasn't Dennis the menace anymore. He was turning into an actual bad kid, like a criminal. He was doing drugs. He was drinking. He was just doing, like, hanging out with bad crowds. And he was actually kicked out of his home in his late teens because he was so out of control and had quit high school before graduating. It was just like a wreck. Was there any explanation as to this behavior? They said that like he has siblings who were completely fine. So there's no evidence.

Yeah. There was abuse in this home or anything like that. I think he just, he's an angry kid. That's the thing, it's not always. It's not always. It's not happened in your childhood. Absolutely. I feel like more often than not it is for sure.

And it can help aid it along. So it's strange that all his siblings are just completely fine. Yeah, it seems like I don't know what was going on, but his family name and his family had kept him out of serious trouble because they were able to keep his crimes from the public and the papers when he, like before he became an adult at least.

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So, illegal as fuck. Gross. He did this in upstate New York while he was staying with friends. He almost killed her brother when he dared to stand up to him and tell him to leave his sister alone because her older brother was like, you fucking predator. Now he literally beat him to a pulp and broke his jaw. Oh, oh, oh, oh, after that incident, he took this girl to pot-stam with him. His parents would not allow them to stay with them because they was like, they were like, you are fucking disgusting.

No, lowkey kid. Yeah, they were like, absolutely not. And so they were like, no, you're not staying with us. So they ended up staying with friends and he would make her burglarized places with him just to get money, like, including a church and shit, just to get like money for food and drugs and stuff. Wow Now it all fell apart because he was arrested for these crimes and she had like a breakdown

and was like I just want to go back to my family because So her parents actually bought them both bus tickets to come back where she where they were living in Virginia But they wouldn't allow him to cut like they gave them both bus tickets to come back where they were living in Virginia, but they wouldn't allow him to cut. They gave them both bus tickets to get them there, which was, wow, I would not give that fucker a bus ticket. I would tell that kid to kick rocks. But he had to go somewhere else, but she could come home luckily.

They wouldn't allow him to come. He just bailed on her with no warning, and it was because in 1985, he went to jail for stealing a car. Okay. So he just went to jail, and that's the last she solved him. I'm very glad. After he like traumatized her and like brought her various places with him. But I'm so glad that she got out of it like physically. They hadn't because had she stayed with him.

He absolutely would have hurt her. 100%. But unfortunately, so he went to, when he got caught stealing the car, he went to prison and he was out on, or he was going to go for like two years, but he got out early on parole, because the system is so smooth and great. And they totally know who should be out and who shouldn't. Yeah, definitely. That really great at that. Immediately when he went out on parole, he got caught again for larceny and got 60 days in jail. Because it's like, dude, this is a pattern here. We are escalating here.

Exactly, but in here, this happens more often times than not. New York and Virginia never communicated this or he probably would have gotten in trouble with Virginia for violating parole and he would have not been around to attack Katie Huelka. Because this happened right before. It is mind boggling how often this happens. Paperwork.

And how people haven't just realized that clerical errors, you just don't know. We don't have time for them. You know what? There's certain times when a clerical error is fine when it's like I'm returning the grill that I bought from Lowe's. That's fine.

You fucked it up. We'll figure it out. Sure. You can't have a clerical era when it's somebody criminal. It's always violent criminal and could and literally ends up killing someone. Right, like that's not a clerical era, that's you being horrible at your job.

That's a monumental fuck up. You should be fired immediately. Now, he was already someone, as we've seen, that has a past of violence and assaults. Yeah. And only one month before Katie's attack in July, he had gotten into a fight at a bar with Leonard F. Page, who was a 35 year old insurance agent in the area. Again, this is only a month before Katie's attack.

They had gotten into a fight and they ended up bringing that fight into an alleyway next to the bar. McCarthy beat Paige to the point of very nearly killing him, like almost killed him. So this is like the second person that he's in. Yeah, incredibly like violent and like unstoppable raging at. Yes.

Now he didn't press charges for some reason. Maybe, I mean, he probably just didn't, I don't wanna, he probably just didn't, but it's like, whoa. And he was probably terrified of us. I'm sure. Now, yeah, but it's like, whoa, and he was probably terrified of him. I'm sure. Now, yeah, it's wild. Now, seven hours after the attack on Katie,

McCarthy was interviewed by, and that was just to show you like what kind of past we're talking about in up to a month before that. Like, was it ever verified that he had shot somebody in the leg before this? So they, and they mentioned it in here, but no, it was never, they never were able to bring that up.

Either the person didn't report it, or it didn't happen, and he was just bullshitting. I feel like it might have happened. They definitely could have happened. Like, absolutely, I wouldn't be shocked at all. But it all, it becomes a thing where they were never able to verify that information. But there were people that said

there was like a little altercation in the bar. So maybe he just took it to a higher level. I think he actually was. But only seven hours after the attack on Katie, McCarthy was interviewed by Chief, was it Maytot? I think it's how you say it. And Lieutenant Terry McKendry. Now he immediately told them he would talk because according to him he had nothing

to hide. Yeah. Yeah. He told them that at the time Katie was attacked he was peeing by offense near the walker arena. He was the man Todd Kilburns. He said he was walking past the arena after peeing and he heard some screams. And he said he heard some scream again and then again and again and he yelled something, but he didn't know what. And so he just burst into action because he's such a fucking hero. And without any thought for his own safety, he just tried to help this stranger who was screaming.

But then again, he said, I didn't see her. I just heard her, but I was just running towards it. And he said he ran by some steps, and then he said, no wait, I went into where the building dips in. And like so he's got, he goes like back and forth with it. He's like, so I ran by some steps. Nope, nope, I went to this part. Oh, actually, nope, you know what, you're right. I went around this side. Oh, wait, that doesn't fit. So no, I'm going to say I went over here. He corrects himself in real time because he is lying just in real time. Yeah, and he's not good at it. Yeah

So the chief literally chief meita was like I just let him Because he was just incriminating himself as he went so I was like yeah totally seriously That's definitely what you did was he on drugs at this point I don't think he was on well actually He wasn't technically on drugs at this point, but he was definitely impaired. He could have been on something. That's not verified, but he was definitely drinking.

Okay. So, yeah. So, he's just correcting himself from real time, but he says he ran around to wear the building dips in. He saw nothing there, and then he said, he walked, he walked back out to the road, and then he said he didn't hear anything else. So he said, he walked back over to the road. And then he said he didn't hear anything else. So he said he walked back over to the steps. I don't know why he walked over to the road.

Loves the steps. And he turned around and he said, and this is what he said, he goes, so I walked over by those steps and I turned around and looked back and looking back and that was it. That's all I remember. He turned around and I looked back and I looked back, looking back, that's it. And they were like, helpful. Okay. And so they asked him, they were like,

well, did you see the girl there? And he said, no, he didn't see them. And they were like, that's weird. Did you immediately ask how the girl was? So we didn't see a girl. That's weird. And he said, no, I didn't see anyone. And then he was like, oh, no, no, no no wait I did I saw some guy in a black jacket

We because remember that was his story at the scene and now he's all of a sudden like shit I gotta yeah I gotta get it back so he's like I can't say I didn't see anybody now I saw a guy with a black jacket and they're like okay, so he was like okay Yeah, I got a stick to this bullshit story so he says so now he starts getting very detailed Which is always a sure fire sign that it's bullshit? I got a stick to this bullshit story. So he says, so now he starts getting very detailed, which is always a surefire sign that it's bullshit. And he was like, you know what, I saw this guy, he was wearing a black jacket,

and there was white stripes on the wrist of the jacket. Okay. But he said he couldn't tell who was wearing that jacket now. He said, so they were like, I thought you said it was a man. And he was like, I don't know, maybe it was the girl wearing that jacket. But you never like the girl. You didn't see the girl.

And he was like, no, I did see the girl, because remember I asked about her at the scene. And they were like, I don't know, maybe he was the girl wearing that jacket. But you never like the girl. You didn't see the girl and he was like, no, I did see the girl because remember, I asked about her at the scene. And they were like, yeah, I know. Yeah, you're tripping yourself up. That's literally what we're trying to catch you in here. And he's like, proven. He's like, no, but he's like, I don't know. So the police were like, I was looking back. Looking back, I was looking back and I don't know.

So the police were like, okay, because he started acting strange like he was breaking a bit. So they were like, we're just going to keep this going, keep going he pushing and so he goes I'm trying to think what I did I walked around the corner. I don't know. I just went out. I was gone. I don't know what happened I saw stars and then everything went black and I could taste the grass and that was the last thing I remember I got hit I was see I know I got hit I got hit I know I got hit And they're like okay and then so the chief is like where did you get hit and he says on my neck on my shoulder my back somewhere I don't know it all hurts on my neck back my down

my back in my shoulder blade in between my shoulder blade it hurts they took X-rays at the hospital and they can't find anything broken. He sounds inebriated he certainly does. No, this is also him lying because he's terrified. And not knowing how to lie. Yeah. And freaking out because he knows he's fucked. So he danced around this jacket thing and acted like he clearly knew more about what was

going on. But chief may talk, just kept asking, like basically kept him talking, just knowing he's not lying. just knowing he's going to actually incriminate himself here. So then he tells them that the last thing he remembers is the cop showing up and pulling him out from beneath the stairs he was hiding under. And he said he, quote, heard a bunch of radios and then he was pulled from the stairs, thrown into the ambulance.

And he said he got to the hospital, was strapped to a gurney, and police officers started asking him questions and he said, quote, and then investigator John Pareta tells me that I'm being charged with a assault or something, and then you're telling me I'm being charged with rape. Chief Maytot had not mentioned rape, and no one else had mentioned rape to him. That was never mentioned. He was never charged with it at first. They did not say this woman was raped. Nothing about it. So he was waiting for them to say that and probably felt like

somebody had said that to him because he was like, because he knew he did it. He knew he did it. So he was sitting there being like, well, you're accusing me of rape and he's like, I have not accused you of that. He's like, nope, he did that. That happened. Literally no one and he's sitting there telling me, you're telling me I'm charged with rape And he's like, I'm not telling you that. So immediately chief Maytott's ears perked up. And he just let it ride. So he's like, he's already sold them out. There it is. So he didn't correct him because he was like, I'm not, I'm gonna let you keep going with this. So he insisted again, he didn't see any girl. And then he corrected himself several times saying he saw girls walking but not this girl in

particular. He then asked if she was going to be all right and said quote somebody told me it was really bad. Peace of shit. And at what point did someone tell you it was the only bad you that he's a piece of actual garbage. Now he told police he had been staying in it's I thought it was called it's spelled Madrid. Okay, but it's Madrid, I think they call it. Locals call it that, which is a town about like 10 miles from there. He told Balese he got there that night by hitchhiking because he didn't have a car. He had been drinking at a bar and went thrift all evening. Exactly what he told him.

Upon more questions, he admitted that he had been in an altercation with a guy at a bar that previous evening because he had accused him of stealing $3. Bingo! Hitchhiker. But he said he had at least three six packs that night. Holy shit! So we got 18 beers going on. I never know what a mountive beer is a lot, but I'm assuming that 18 beers from what

he feels like a lot. For a person who is a lot of beers. I can have one beer and I'm like, I can't even like taste one. And I like nurse one forever. Yeah, I don't even remember the last time I've had beer to be honest. You guys know Elena and I like to crank out that content, honey, but sometimes I'm like done Resturching and I'm done recording and I'm hungry But the last thing I want to do is cook dinner. I've just exerted myself all day When your fridge is empty that urge to order in and skip cooking happens way too often like the

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slash morbid to get up to $40 off your first box. That's dailyharvest.com slash morbid for up to $40 off your first box. Dailyharvest.com slash morbid. So he just keeps insisting he never saw a girl and he'd gotten hit, he'd gotten knocked out, but they kept telling him, you know, like, that's weird. You don't have any marks on you. Right. Like, we looked. Right.

We have x-rays, like, there's no marks on you. He had no explanation for that. He was just like, yeah, I don't know. He did, however, have a swollen right hand and what it looked like, an almost broken finger on that hand. Mm-hmm. And he was trying to hide it the whole time when chief May Todd asked to see it. And he said he wouldn't let him see it.

Like, dude, we're gonna see it eventually. And he was like, fuck you, I'm gonna see that. He said, he said, for your damn hands. So he's like, so he's hiding it. And chief May Todd is like, dude, I already saw it. Like I literally saw it. Right. And he's like, what is that? How'd you get that? And he's like, you didn't mention that injury. And he's like, what is that? How'd you get that?

And he's like, you didn't mention that injury. And he was like, oh yeah. I probably got it earlier than the night with my friends. And he goes, oh yeah. I tore down my friend's door last night. That's probably it. What? What?

And he's like, they're like, care to explain. And he's like, no. Well, okay. So after this, they sent an, care to explain and he's like, no. Okay. So after this, they sent an officer to check that story about the door. They went to that friend's apartment. No door was damaged and they were like, no, he did not do that.

He was like, you imagine like your buddy says that he tore down your door and the police arrived and you're like, what? Nope. Like, no, he did not tear down my door. He's actually not my friend. No, I actually, he's a monster. Thank you though So in the end of the interview he said quote, I wish that I you know

If I did it I would admit to doing it, but I did not do it So I'm not going to admit to doing it. That's all I can say and at that point they're like do what? Well, and at a accusing you of anything. Well, and at that point Maytot stood up looked him right in the eye, and he said, Mr. McCarthy, you're being charged with assault and rape. And then he left the room amazing, which I was like, can throw the book at him. Like I would have literally just been like, watch out and just throw

living out of that as I walked out, honestly. So he officially told him he was like, you just gave me everything I needed. Thanks for not. Thank you so much, sir. You are now being charged with assault and rape. Hang on in this room for a bit. You piece of fucking shit, Jackass. This is where we are gonna leave it for part one,

because part two I would like to start it with Katie. Unfortunately, this does not have a happy ending, Katie does pass away. I just wanna let you guys know that. But we're going to talk more about her family. He goes to prison, fuck this guy. We're going to talk about that. I really want to talk about the parole stuff

that they keep having to go through. But I want, like, part two to be like, Katie, Katie, Katie. Katie, Katie and Katie's family. So that's where we're going to leave off on part one that he incriminated himself, that they immediately are going to be charging him with a salt and rape and eventually murder. Yeah. And we will pick it up in part two, which you are going to get very shortly. Cool, because it's already like done.

Awesome. Love to hear it. So stay tuned. And make sure you look at that petition that I'm linking in here. Awesome. Because this guy does end up going to get convicted for this. He did it. And we are also going to go over the medical examiner's report. I'm going to tell you what he did to her. Okay. If you already aren't convinced enough to sign this and keep this fucker in jail forever,

that'll definitely prove it to you. But I'm'm gonna post it so you guys can do it now I think the family would be like very happy to get a lot of signatures on there So I'd love to be able to do that for them But yeah, so This is a rough one it like hurt my heart. Yeah, they all do but like this one just like they all hit different They do this is a really tough one especially because It's just brutal. Yeah, but well told. They do. This is a really tough one, especially because, oh, it's just brutal. Yeah, but well told.

Thank you. You're welcome. And we hope you're listening. And we hope you keep it weird. If I have to tell you not to keep it as weird as Brian, you should not be listening to the show. You gotta go turn yourself in or something. Bye.

Bye. Bye. Hey, Prime Members! You can listen to Morvid, Early, and Add Free on Amazon Music. Download the Amazon Music app today, or you can listen ad free with Wondery Plus and Apple podcasts. Before you go, tell us about yourself by completing a short survey at Wondery.com slash survey. Hi, I'm Lindsey Graham, the host of Wondery's podcast American scandal. We bring to life some of the biggest controversies in US history, presidential lies, environmental disasters, corporate fraud. In our newest series, we look at the Kids for Cash scandal, a story about corruption inside

America's system of juvenile justice. In Northeastern Pennsylvania, residents had begun noticing an alarming trend. Children were being sent away to jail in high numbers and often for committing only minor offenses. The FBI began looking at two local judges, and when the full picture emerged, it made national headlines. The judges were earning a fortune, carrying out a brazen criminal scheme, one that would shatter the lives of countless children and force a heated debate about punishment and America's criminal justice system. Follow American scandal wherever you get your podcasts.

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