Morbid - Episode 468: The Tragic Murder of Grace Millane

Episode Date: June 15, 2023

On December 2, 2018, the parents of twenty-one-year-old Grace Millane, a British tourist on vacation in New Zealand, became concerned when the birthday wishes they sent their daughter went unacknowledged. Having completed her degree at the University of Lincoln a few months earlier, Grace had spent several weeks traveling during her gap year but had been keeping in regular contact with her parents since leaving for her trip. When they still hadn’t heard from their daughter three days later, Grace’s parents called Auckland police and reported her missing. A week later, Grace Millane’s body was discovered in a suitcase near an access road in the Waitakere Ranges, a dense wooded area about twelve miles outside Auckland. A day later, investigators arrested twenty-six-year-old Jesse Kempson, who was the last person seen with Grace on the night of the murder when the two were captured together by a CCTV camera going up to Kempson’s room at the CityLife Hotel.Please Consider Signing this PetitionThank you to our favorite David White for research assistanceReferencesBBC News. 2018. Grace Millane: Man appears in court charged with backpacker's murder. December 10. Accessed May 3, 2023. https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-essex-46502649.Creed, Rebecca. 2021. "Former flatmate of Grace Millane's killer says he was." The Echo, November 15.Critchell, Matthew. 2019. "Backpacker Grace spoke to men on bondage chat rooms,." The Echo, November 20.Emes, Toby. 2019. "Accused killer admitted Grace was dead in second interview." The Echo, November 14.Faulkner, Doug. 2019. Grace Millane murder: A trial that gripped a nation. November 22. Accessed May 2, 2023. https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-essex-50515326.Feehan, Katie. 2018. "Brother of Wickford woman missing in New Zealand says lack." The Echo, December 5.—. 2018. "Police release last known image of missing Wickford woman." The Echo, December 6.Graham-Mclay, Charlotte. 2018. "After backpacker's killing, New Zealand looks again at violence against women." New York Times, December 13.—. 2018. "New Zealand murder case leads to rebuke of Google." New York Times, December 15.—. 2018. "New Zealander accused of killing tourist." New York Times, December 9.Humphries, Will, and Bernard Lagan. 2018. "Distraught father flies to join backpacker search." The Times, December 7.Jesse Shane Kempson v. The Queen. 2021. SC 11/2021 NZSC 74 (Supreme Court of New Zealand, June 29).Kirk, Tristan. 2019. "Guilty: Fantasist who killed Grace." London Evening Standard, November 22.—. 2019. "Guilty: Grace jury takes only five hours to return verdict of murder." London Evening Standard, November 22.Kolirin, Lianne. 2020. "Grace Millane's killer attacked other women." The Times, December 22.Lagan, Bernard. 2018. "Body found in search for missing backpacker." The Times, December 10.—. 2019. "British backpacker's 'killer' lied about their Tinder date." The Times, November 13.Lagan, Bernard, and Will Humphries. 2018. "Father appeals for clues to help find missing daughter." The Times, December 8.Leask, Anna. 2020. Who is Grace Millane's murderer? Unravelling labyrinth of lies and a fatal Tinder date. February 20. Accessed May 1, 2023. https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/who-is-grace-millanes-murderer-unravelling-labyrinth-of-lies-and-a-fatal-tinder-date/PDGHMSM67MZQ5VBH4GT2XIXZ7Q/?c_id=1&objectid=12287282.MacDonald, Stuart. 2021. "'Rough sex' defence for murder could be banned." The Times, May 29.Roy, Eleanor Ainge. 2019. "Grace Millane trial: blood in hotel room likely backpacker's." The Guardian, November 8.—. 2019. "Grace Millane trial: witness says she feared she would die." The Guardian, November 11.—. 2019. "'She should have been safe here'." The Guardian, November 22.Smith, Anneka. 2020. "Grace Millane's life: far more than the details of her death." Radio New Zealand, February 21.South Wales Echo. 2020. "Grace's killer 'raped another Brit tourist'." South Wales Echo, December 23.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

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here and you it makes me happy. Yay. You know? Love and positivity. And also, Mikey made lemon champagne cupcakes and they are literally the yummiest thing I have ever put in my face. They are so really fucking good. You can't have the rest of it. No, just can't have. You can't have the rest of it.

They're delicious and refreshing and I'm sorry that you're not eating one right now. You can't have the rest of the rest of the... You can't have who can't have the rest of the... They're delicious and refreshing and I'm sorry that you're not eating one right now. Me too. I want to be eating one right now. I just, you know, it's been a crazy day. It has. I had to go to explore it a little bit. Yeah, pick up the pieces.

Pick up the pieces. You like the rest of the stuff? You know, it really good happens. It happens. Everything's okay, we just have like family stuff going on. Yeah, we're fine. You know, but we're okay. We're fine.

We're gonna be just fine. We're swell. Sorry, well honestly I have a pretty sad tale to tell you. Great. So, let's get into it. This is an example of a Tinder murder. Oh, so very sad. Those are sad and scary. They are very scary. They are cautionary tales for sure. Let's go.

In early October of 2018, Grace Malayne left her home in Wichford Essex, United Kingdom, and headed to South America. She had this really big plan. She was going to spend six months traveling around the area and then she was going to head to Auckland, New Zealand. Ooh, she wanted to travel the world. Damn. She just graduated from the University of Lincoln. She got her bachelor's degree in advertising and marketing as well. It was like a month earlier and this trip was going to be the beginning to her gap year. Okay, and she wanted to spend it backpacking across the world, and she was super duper excited just to learn about, you know, all the different cultures and experience them, and basically, she was having a little eat-pre-love situation. Get it, you know? Now, while she was in Peru,

Grace was obviously making it a point to keep in regular contact with her friends and family back home. She would send them daily updates through tech. She was posting the social media, so everybody could see the cool stuff she was experiencing. Her best friend Amina Ashcroft later told reporters, Grace was really loving her travels and I could feel her positivity.

I think Grace was happy in her life because she was achieving her long-term goals in realizing her dreams. Good for her. Just like so beautiful. And what is that? And actually, what made this even more special is that Grace's mom had done a similar trip during her own gap year.

So it had even more of a special meaning to her because she was retracing her mom's footsteps. I love that. That's really cool, right? So after six weeks in Peru where she'd been traveling with a group of other young tourists and backpackers, she left South America, and this was when she made her way to New Zealand. And she spent a little over a week traveling around the Northland region before moving on to Auckland

on November 30. Now, during the first 10 days of her trip around the Northland, Grace was still sending regular messages to her family, to her friends, still posting pictures of the trip, the Northland. Grace was still sending regular messages to her family, to her friends, still posting pictures of the trip, sharing that with everybody. And just ensuring everybody she was really having the time of her life.

Her brother Michael later said she was just sightseeing and traveling around New Zealand. She was in good spirits and was enjoying herself. Good for her. This sounds great so far, which is really upsetting me. Yeah, it's, yeah, because I know it's not gonna continue that way It's not unfortunately. So on December 1st, 2018, which was the day before her 22nd birthday. Oh, man. It makes She's so young even worse and also she's a Sagittarius, which like of course she's traveling the world. Oh, yeah

You're always saying that Sagittarius Humans just want to get out of here. We just want to explore. We just want to go crazy. And that makes sense that she was one of us. So Grace texted her best friend Amina from Auckland to let her know actually on December 1st that she was going out on a date with this guy that she had met through Tinder. She said he was the manager of an oil company. All right. And Amina thought to herself, she was like, it's kind of weird that you're looking for a date on a dating app on what is essentially a vacation, but whatever.

Yeah. And to stop along the way. Exactly. And Amina had just gotten off a long flight herself. And she was like, I'm not going to ruin Grace's night by being like, what the heck are you doing? Yeah. And I'm not going to complicate things.

She's just having fun. So as the night went on, Grace would text Amina updates about the date whenever she could. If he headed off to the bathroom or if she did, she was like, it's going great. She told Amina that he was also spending time traveling and he was currently living in a hotel in Auckland, the guy that she was on a date with.

In a few months, she said he actually had plans to travel to London. And in her last text message to Amina, Grace wrote, literally, I click so, I click with him so well, I'll let you know what happens tomorrow. But that would be the last text that she sent. Oh my goodness. To anyone. Now the next day, her family and friends, because again, it's her birthday now, are all sending her birthday wishes. Like, happy birthday. Hope you're having the best day. birthday now are all sending her birthday wishes. Like happy birthday.

Hope you're having the best day. Everyone's texting her. Everybody's DMing her, sending her message alerts on Facebook. But hours and hours and hours are going by and nobody's getting a response from her. So at first her family was like, okay, I mean, she literally just got to New Zealand.

Maybe she's getting settled. Maybe she's out celebrating. So at first they didn't see any cause for concern. But the next day, the day after her birthday, all the birthday messages Grace had gotten were still going on acknowledged, and that was just totally out of character for her. Her brother told reporters,

on Monday, it was weird that we hadn't heard from her. So yesterday, we started to make inquiries down the right channels and realized the last time she was seen was on Saturday by one of her roommates in a hostel. So they're starting to like fully panic. I was just looking at pictures of her. She's so beautiful. Oh my God, she's gorgeous.

Oh, it's like, oh, it just kills me. It's so sad. And I'm just like feeling the panic for her loved ones here, especially on her birthday. Yeah, seriously. She's just about to turn 22. 22. Like has the whole rest of her life ahead of her. Wild.

So two more days went by with absolutely nothing from Grace, and that was when her family really started to lose it. Yeah. So they decided to contact the British consulate in Wellington and an official Missing's Persons report was filed now with the Auckland police. So now there was going to be an investigation into this disappearance. And would that Grace's father hopped on the first plane he could to Auckland so that he could aid the investigation in any way possible. That's a dad right there. That's a dad.

Now a day later, Auckland police detective Scott Beard told the press since receiving a Missing persons report around lunchtime yesterday, police have been piecing together Grace's last-known movements with the last sighting being on Saturday night, using the extensive CCTV footage captured from cameras around the city. So luckily, there's like so much CCTV, I feel like, in other parts of the world. Oh, yeah. I know we have it here, but I feel like it's way more, it's everywhere.

Seriously, so luckily they were being able to like put together her night through the footage. And investigators also released an image of her that had been captured from a camera at Auckland Sky City Entertainment Complex on the night of December 1st, the last night she'd been seen. Okay. And that image luckily generated a ton of leads from the public.

In one instance, a resident told police that she had seen grace standing on the side of the Southern Motorway and Manukao, I think is how you say it, which was about 14 miles outside of Auckland. The woman told police, I can honestly say, 100% I saw a young girl absolutely so close to her description that it's not funny and No, there was no way I was going to stop. She was in a very unusual place to stand I looked at the photo and I was quite adamant. I had seen that girl She had like a raincoat. She had a bigger sort of jacket not a fashion like one Hmm, but it was weird as like I don't really think that tip led to much

But she was super super adamant that she had seen that tip led to much, but she was super super adamant that she had seen Grace and described what she was that she had a jacket on. That's so wild to me because I think about it. I could never tell you if I saw somebody or not. I don't know. I'm so unobservant. What I wore yesterday. Yeah.

I have no idea. Like I'm observant in the moment, but it's not sticking around. Sometimes I'm, I think it just depends on where I'm on that day. I think there was something that you changed recently, maybe in your kitchen or something. And me and Drew were talking about it. And we were like, oh, did you change that? And you were like, no, we've had that for a while. I was like, oh, sorry, we're not very observant. Yeah, I just think about it. And I'm like, if somebody put up a picture of somebody

and they were like, did you see this person in Boston yesterday? I'd be like, I don't fucking know. I have no idea. Maybe. Because you think about how many people you passed throughout the day that I'm always a big piece.

So you're not paying that much attention. Thank goodness some people do. Honestly. But then what sucks is that other people who don't actually pay attention say they do. And then they give you like a false take, exactly. But investigators also discovered But then what sucks is that other people who don't actually pay attention say they do. And then they give you like a false take. Exactly.

But investigators also discovered that all of Grace's belongings were still in her room at the hostel, which indicated to them that she hadn't left the country at least. Yeah. Detective Beard told the press, we've spoken to a number of people at the backpackers hostel because she was in a room where there was at least four people staying. Okay. Now, the thing was, the sad thing was that none of those people she was staying without any additional information. Yeah. They were like, she went on on a date and that's the last we saw.

Yeah. But back in Essex, Grace's family was working to aid the investigation themselves. They were able to access her social media and they saw that still she hadn't read any of the messages that had been sent to her since December 1st, which again, very out of care for her. And in addition to that, they also found that her itinerary, this is quote, her itinerary, had been changed from her original bookings and she planned to stay in Auckland until the eighth and had paid for the hostile until the eighth, which she hadn't reported to anybody.

So that was kind of strange. Yeah. Now, at the time of the press conference, which was five days after Grace had gone missing, police were not totally ready to assume foul play. But between the unread social media messages and the abandoned belongings and no contact, there was cause for alarm.

Yeah. They were ready to go right to foul play, but they were tiptoeing that long. Yeah, essentially. Our day later, investigators released additional CCTV footage that was captured from a camera at City Life Hotel in Auckland, and it was recorded about two hours after that original footage from Sky City. And in that new footage, Grace is seen with a man getting off an elevator on a higher floor. Investigators reported having spoken to the man and they said that they quote, conducted forensic tests at an apartment at the city life hotel. So things were starting to get up. But still, they said they didn't have any other information that they were willing to

share. But the case was not going to go cold because on the night of December 8th, Auckland police made an arrest. At the time, his name was being suppressed, but they had arrested a man. The one that Grace had just gone out with on the night before her birthday, 26 year old Jesse Kempson. According to 26, and we until you hear what this fucker had done in his 26 years of life. According to Detective Beard Cemeson had come to their attention because of that CCTV footage and said that quote an examination of Cemeson's vehicle and of a room at the hotel where Miss

Malaine was last seen had let officers to conclude that she was dead. Oh, no. She'd been murdered. So in a statement... Like this... Yeah. Yeah. This... Oh, it kills me.

So in a statement to the press, Beard said, we still do not know where Grace is, but we are determined to find her and return her to her family. Oh. That changed the next day, because Grace's body was found. Oh, no. She was found in a suitcase. Are you kidding me?

Along an access road in the Y Talkery Ranges, which is a popular hiking area, just like 12 miles about outside of Auckland. Peace, peace, guys. Peace, guys. Fucking garbage. So obviously the discovery of Grace's body was completely devastating for her family. Yeah, they were hopeful throughout the investigation

that they were going to find Grace alive and this was literally their worst fucking nightmare. Luckily their community rallied around them and the memorials and outpouring of support began literally as soon as the discovery was reported. Actually, the mayor of Wellington at the time, Justin Lester, tweeted about what a terrible nightmare this murder was and similar sentiments were also shared by the New Zealand Prime Minister at the time, just in our dirt, I think it is. In a public statement, she said that Grace's murder caused, quote, an overwhelming sense

of hurt and shame that this has happened in our country. On behalf of New Zealand, I want to apologize to Grace's family. Your daughter should have been safe here, and she wasn't, and I'm sorry for that. Oh, that's awful. Also, why we need more woman leaders. Yeah, right.

They say they get it. They get it. Like, the fact that she took the time to actually, like, apologize that this happened in a place but that she was in charge of. And to say, say like she should have been safe here and she wasn't like I'm sorry for this and I'm sorry. So investigators they were able to find Jesse while they were scanning Grace's social

media pages for any indication of her wearables. Auckland detective Diana Levinson was scrolling through the comments on Grace's photos. She was on Facebook and she saw one from Jesse Cumson. The night that Grace disappeared, he left a comment on one of her pictures that said, beautiful, very radiant. Are you shitting me? Nope. What the fuck?

The night she disappeared, like very clearly did that after he did what we will find out he did. Wow. So the detective reached out to Cempson and explained they were trying to locate Grace, which is then when they learned that he had met her through Tinder and that the two of them had gone on a date Saturday. And the Saturday that Grace went missing. So he told the police, and this is a quote, we drunk a lot of cocktails at the burger bar,

and we were having good conversations, but he said the date ended a little after 9.30 and that the two went their separate ways and that he ended up meeting up with a colleague from work. False. Lire. Not true. Lire.

And the thing was to the detectives to Beard and Levinson, the fact that Grace mysteriously disappeared less than an hour after supposedly parting ways with this guy, they were like no way. So they kept him in mind as a potential suspect and they continued to chase down other weeds, but he was at the forefront of their mind. What makes a person a murderer? Are they born to kill or are they made to kill? I'm Candace DeLong and on my podcast Killer Psychie Daily, which you can find exclusively on Amazon Music, I share a quick 10-minute rundown every weekday on the motivations and behaviors of the criminal

masterminds you read about in the news. I have decades of experience as a psychiatric nurse, FBI agent, and a criminal profiler. On Killer Psychie Daily, I'll give you my expert perspective on cases like the mysterious New York City drugings, Breaking Down Lori Valow, a.k.a. Mommy Doom stays motives, and what drove Caitlin Armstrong to murder? I'll also bring on expert guests who add even more insight into these criminal minds.

I promise you won't regret adding these ten minutes to your morning routine. Hey, Prime members, listen to the Amazon Music Exclusive Podcast Killer Psychie Daily in the Amazon Music app. Download the app today. What if you were trafficked into a cult over shot nine times or fell in love with a vampire or went into a minor surgery and woke up one week later, paralyzed? What would you do?

I'm Whit Missildine, the creator of this is actually happening, a podcast from Wondry that brings you extraordinary true stories of life-changing events told by the people who lived them. From a young man that dooms his entire future with one choice, to a woman who survived a notorious serial killer, you'll hear their first-person account of how they overcame remarkable circumstances. Each episode is an exploration of the human spirit and personal discovery. These haunting accounts sound like Hollywood movies, but I assure you this is actually happening.

Follow this is actually happening wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen ad-free on the Amazon Music or Wonder app. Now, using CCTV footage, the credit card receipts, and then of course the communications like the ones between Grace and her friends, investigators were able to put together a pretty thorough timeline of events on the night she disappeared. On November 30th, she used the Tinder app, and that was when she matched with Jessie Kemsen.

They chatted pretty briefly, and then they arranged to meet for a date the next day at 545 outside of a Christmas display in downtown Auckland. Oh, God. They just met up in front of a Christmas display. Now, as far as anybody could tell, between 5.45, and when she was last seen at 9.40 pm, Grace and Jesse seemed to be enjoying each other's company. They drank at the Bluestone Room, which is a bar near the city life hotel where he was living. And Amina told a reporter from Radio New Zealand,

I sensed Grace was having a good time, and she seemed to be pretty drunk and really enjoying herself. That's so scary. Like she just thought that she was having a good date. Because they were just having a good date. Yeah. That's what's so scary about this. Like, he wasn't, this sounds like it was just, you would have no way of knowing. No, absolutely. You're just having a good date. You're just texting your friend about your good date. Yeah. And it's also like, dude, like, it's even scarier because you're like, did he know that she was texting her friend?

And it's like, if you knew that she was texting people, like if you, like she's connecting with people as this is happening. Right. And also, you're still gonna do like what? And you would also assume that like, you're probably one of the last people that she matched with. Like, you're, what is wrong with you?

Like, damn, there's so much wrong with him. Now, it was in the course of their investigation that detectives discovered that footage from the city life hotel lobby. And in that footage, Grace can be seen going into the elevator with Jesse Cumson and getting off on the floor where his apartment was. The pictures are chilling.

Chilling. Chilling. Because she has a smile. Like, how's your daughter super happy? She thinks she's just going back to this guy's apartment that she's really headed off with. I mean, I speak for myself how many fucking times have I done that? It's a very normal thing to do.

It is. It's just so sad to think that you can't hit it off with somebody anymore and go back to their place. No, you can't trust anyone. You literally can't. It's like how do people date anymore? I honestly don't know. I wonder that all the time. It's so true. But the thing was the footage alone was proof that Camsen had lied to the investigators when he said they parted ways around 930. So they went they went back to question him a second time and that's when they were given a very different and way more elaborate story

than the one that he told them previously. Of course. Excuse me. According to him, everything he told the detectives about his night with grace up until 930 had been true. But he was like, you know what, I was lying when I said we parted ways after dinner. But now I'm ready to tell you the whole story.

Oh good, that's real nice of you. Gee, thank you for getting our fucking time. He said they met up a little before or six on the night of the 1st of December. They went to that sky city entertainment complex and then they moved on to the blue, blue stone room for dinner and drinks. And he said the date was going pretty good. So around 940, once they finished up dinner, he invited her back to his apartment and basically said that he implied that they would hook up. Okay.

And it's here that the story changes from the previous version. When they got to back to his room, he said he put on a music channel on the television and he and Grace started kissing. It gets a little graphic here, just if you're listening with people you don't wanna hear graphic things with. Okay. He said they were kissing and talking, but things escalated and he told them, this is a quote, she asked me to turn off the TV.

She told me there's a few things she likes doing that she had done with an ex partner. We started having sex. At first it was normal, it was very placid. And then she started biting and she asked me to bite her, so I did. I stopped at first and said, is this really something you want to do? And then at that point he claimed that they stopped having sex and they started discussing bondage. And then he said it was at that point that Grace mentioned the book Fifty Shades of Grey

and told him that she did have an interest in BDSM. So he said she told him that she had been exploring that kind of sex with a previous boyfriend before they broke up. And then Jesse said after they had that like quick conversation about going through with that kind of sexual act, they kept having sex. And he went on to say, she was holding my arms above my head and just biting. And then she hit my butt. Then she held me around my neck and pushed down. She indicated that it made me harder. We swapped over. I got on top. We started having more, I guess, violent sex.

Then we ended up on the floor, and then we kept going. She told me to hold her arms tighter, and then she told me to hold her throat and go harder. So he said, the two of them then took nude photographs of each other, which is not true. And when they were done having sex, he said he went to the bathroom and he alleged that he fell asleep in the shower after all that.

Okay. Yep. According to him, he woke up still in the shower a few hours later. A few hours? Well, he took like a full nap, sir, you would have drowned. Yep. Mm-hmm.

We'll come up in a few hours later and he said it was still dark, so he crawled back into bed and he fell asleep again and did not wake up until the next morning. He said to the detectives, I thought Grace had left. I woke up the next day and saw that she was lying on the floor. I saw that she had blood coming from her nose. I screamed, I yelled out to her. I tried to move her to see if she was awake. I was in shock and I didn't know what to do.

I took a whole heap of tablets that I had. I realized she wasn't alive and I just wanted to end it all. Literally not one part of that makes sense. None of it makes any sense whatsoever. No, one part of that is believable whatsoever. So clearly he was trying to say, just like if, you know, that this was an accident gone wrong,

they had too rough of sex and that she had been killed in the process. So he is trying to tell us right now that they had this like violent whatever sex and that when they were done, he just got up and went into the shower. She was dead. Yes, but he didn't notice that.

He didn't notice that. Yeah. That makes so much sense that you would just get up after having sex with someone and not realize that you had killed them in the process. Yeah. And basically, what we will see is that he is saying it happened while he was choking her, like she died during that.

You would know if you killed someone like that, you would know. And also, it takes a long time to manually strangle someone my guy. We'll see exactly how long. And it takes a long time with consistent pressure. She would be showing... Pretty much what the medical examiner said.

She would be showing a lot of signs of being in... She has to be in real distress. She should be struggling. And you would be having to sit there with constant consistent pressure. That doesn't make literally any sense. No. And after minutes and minutes of doing that, you don't know that she's dead.

No idea. And then you just crawl back into bed and you don't see her on your, like even if that had all happened and you had no idea that she was dead, which like that didn't happen and never would. But in an alternate universe where that was possible, then you just walk back into your bedroom and you don't see her where you had just have sex and you just crawl into bed. It literally nothing. That is the stupidest fucking, like, story I've ever heard

in my life. And then he said he took the heap of pills and tried to end his own life when he realized what he had done. But then he also claimed that in a panic, he went to the warehouse, which is a store on Elliott Street in Auckland, and that's where he bought a suitcase. So you said that you just took this whole heap of pills, but then you're saying that you went to a store and purchased a suitcase.

You did that at 100% after you took the amount of pills that you were using to end your own life? Yeah. No. Yeah, that's all it all adds up. Like what? That's very, very legit. What? He said, I went back and at first I didn't know what to do.

I just put the suitcase on the bed and I think I left again. I could remember. It was literally a couple of days ago. Love that you planned. You went there and got a suitcase with a clear plan. And then I was like, I didn't know what to do. I didn't know what to do. Really, you just bought a suitcase.

Didn't really have any idea what you were going to do with it. He said, I just was thinking that me and Grace had such a great night Oh, yeah, we were talking about catching up in London Fuck you the fuck you Fuck yeah, you're not going anywhere idiot. So detective you in settle. Oh, I love that name. I know you do you in settle Interrupted Kempson at one point to ask why if the death had been accidental Did he not call for an ambulance once he realized she was dead?

Exactly. And he said he did put the number in his phone, but he didn't follow through with the call. Oh, so close. He said, there's a dead person in my room. I thought it looked terrible. Yeah, I mean, it does. It does look pretty fucking terrible.

That is the one thing I can say that you are correct about. But you know it looks worse. You purchasing a suitcase. Because that pretty much implies that that's how you're going to get rid of the dead person in your room. You fucking asshole. So rather than call emergency services, or literally any other person on this planet who could help him, Kempson loaded Grace's body into that recently purchased suitcase.

He said, I was just in shock the whole time. I couldn't put her in it because it just didn't seem right. It just didn't seem right. So I left and Grace was half in, half out of the suitcase at that stage. I couldn't do it. So that's worse. I'm without words for this thing.

Yeah, me too. So according to him, he then left the apartment to buy cleaning supplies, which is true. It was captured again on CCTV. Wow, once again, we're doing great with the not suspicious thing here. Yeah, seriously. And then when he returned, he texted a friend a chat. Yeah. Because he said, I didn't think it was real. No, I think you were just looking to make sure that you had some little paper trails here there just looking to make sure that you had some little paper trails here there and everywhere to make sure that you were like, what, I was just talking to my friend,

I wasn't. I wouldn't be doing that after I killed someone. This isn't even the kind of paper trail you want. He was just trying to explain something away because through the course of their investigation, police would learn that the friend he was talking to was actually just another tender match that he was planning to take on a date that night. Wow. You just murdered a girl. You said you really connected with in your room and you're so upset and distraught and you took so many pills and you don't want to be here anymore,

but you're planning a date for tonight after you dispose of your date's body from last night. Wow. Psychopath. Also, imagine being that girl and finding that out later. That's really funny because I literally wrote Imagine Finding Out. You were a poor person on that date with him that night. Because he did go on a date. Oh my God. He did. Yep. When he returned home from his other date, that day. So this man is still claiming after that he went on a date that night. He went on a date that night. And he is still going to claim later that that was an accident and he was devastated by this all of it Wow

A fucking fake ass word wow So yeah when he got home from his date That was when he managed to get graces body into the suitcase and after cleaning his apartment He took the suitcase down to the parking lot and loaded it into his car Which is also on CCTV. So you can literally like He's carrying the suitcase out of the hotel. I saw those pictures fucking haunting And horrifying to look at because you're just looking at that being like graces in that. Yes

She never left that hotel. Yeah, like you we see her walk in and we never see her walk out So fucked. So he takes the suitcase down to the parking lot, loads it into the car, which again, also captured. And the next morning he drove it out to the Y-Tocke, I think that's how you say it, Y-Tocke, excuse me, ranges. And he took the suitcase out of the trunk.

He said that he went to the brush and started digging. And then he said he took 20, maybe 30 peresita malt tablets because I didn't want to be around if Grace wasn't there. And I didn't think I deserved to be around because of what happened. I love that he's like, yeah, I just keep taking pills. It's they just don't affect me. Yeah, it's wild.

I'm just taking so many pills. And also, you know what? You don't deserve to be around. Oh, you're disgusting. You murdered someone. You fucking asshole. So he dug a hole and then placed the suitcase inside and covered it up and then drove over to a nearby reservoir

and he claims he sat there and waited for the overdose of drugs he'd taken to end his life. But it just didn't. So he drove back to the city and went to his apartment. Like, so now he has taken two overdoses of pills and neither have taken up. And they've done nothing. Nothing. He's been able to drive function, all of that. It's like, I think you're lying like a liar. I think you are.

Now, when detectives asked why he decided to change his story until this new version, he said, because I want her family to know that it wasn't intentional. But I also want her family to have closure. And the other night when I was questioned by police, I was still shocked, and I apologized for misleading. Wow. You put a woman in a suitcase and buried it, and you think that's giving the family closure? Yeah, closure. What? And then he still claimed that he had absolutely no intention to kill Grace, but it didn't matter. He had killed her. And now he was officially

being arrested on murder charges and taken into custody. Wow. So it did not take the investigators long to poke holes in his story and conclude that he was not being completely truth. No, they were able to theorize that Grace had been murdered sometime between 9.40pm when she seen getting off that elevator and 129am when he logged into his computer to use the internet. Directly after what had happened. What? His first search was for those Y Talkery ranges followed by a second search six minutes later for hottest fire. And also, he spelled hottest wrong. Wow. And then, he made further searches to find out whether there were flesh-eating birds

in the whitetalka re-ranges. Yeah, that's not real. No, I mean... That's real. He wanted to know if there's flesh-eating birds. He searched for flesh-e eating birds in that range. Are there flesh eating birds and the whiteockery ranges? I'm without words. Yeah, he has an explanation for that later, don't worry.

Oh, good. I'm eager to hear that. Erb, his lawyer, Stan, which like, I was like, even better. Wow, that was a reach. But he signed out about 20 minutes later at 146 p.m. and then spent three minutes taking intimate photographs of Miss Malaine's body. Are you fucking kidding me?

Yeah, no, I'm not. But that is exactly why he said they had taken photos of each other while being intimate. He obviously knew that police were gonna find his phone, search it, find these photos. And apparently he didn't realize that the detectives were gonna know whether or not she was alive when the photos were taken.

You dumb fuck. You think people can't tell if she's a liver dead, you idiot? You sick. Holy shit. You took photos of her. He's a sick fuck. And tried to say that that was like something they did in the course of their BDSM.

BDSM. Disgusting. Like that's not BDSM at all. Wow. Now, a search of his apartment turned up even more evidence. During their initial search, crime scene technicians found traces of blood, quote, on the foot of the bed in the footprints walking towards the bathroom

and in small splatters on the fridge. Oh yeah, and if you, they have pictures online of the Luminol. Yeah, light up. That's a lot. That's a lot. That's a lot. A lot. A lot. That's a lot. According to the technicians, quote, somebody had walked in blood with their left foot

and transferred blood around the room. And then they believed that the smaller stains were likely spill over from a bucket. Like somebody would use to clean a mess. Holy shit. Yeah. Now, because the body had been left undiscovered for nearly a week, the autopsy technicians couldn't be precise in the measurements and conclusions, but the medical examiner was able to conclude that the cause of death was manual strangulation. Holy shit. They estimated that the killer had, quote,

applied sustained strength and unrelenting pressure for somewhere between five and ten minutes. This is why that's like the stupidest fucking story he could have told. Five to 10 minutes of sustained, strong pressure. While somebody struggles on me. And he's claiming that like fuck off. Like even right now, I just thinking about that, I had to take a breath.

Yeah. Five to 10 minutes, there's no way she wasn't struggling. No. And they also noted that there were burst blood vessels in Grace's face, but TN, particularly hemorrhaging in her left eye, deep bruising on her upper arms, neck, and left shoulder, that is described as being, quote,

typical of restraint. This was not, no, sex. No. No drugs were found in her system, but due to the time that had passed, the medical examiner also couldn't determine her blood alcohol level at the time of her death, which, in this case to me, it doesn't really matter. Yeah.

Now, digging into Kimson's personal life, detectives found a tangled, confusing web of lies, half-truths, and audities, I guess you could say, that provided very little insight into who Jesse was, what his personal story really was. But this is what we do know. Okay. He was born in Wellington, New Zealand in 1992, and he was raised in and around why Newi out, Mata and Poweru Rua, I really tried.

And I did. I literally put Fanatic Spelling. Wow. He was raised around there. But when he was nine, his parents divorced, and his mother ended up moving away from the family, and she moved overseas. Okay.

And after that, he had little to no contact with her. And eventually his father met and married a woman and they kind of blended families. Okay. From what investigators could tell, he had a very poor relationship with his family. According to one former acquaintance, they were all, quote, appalled

by his constant dishonesty and fevery. Makes sense. No. The tensions between him and his father and his stepmom eventually led to them giving him an ultimatum. And we don't know everything involved here, but basically they told him he could get psychological help or he could get the fuck out of their house.

Wow. So he chose the latter. And in 2013, he moved to Australia where he lived until 2016. And in 2016, he then returned to New Zealand. Now, while he was living in Sydney, he was arrested multiple times for disorderly behavior, which was a pattern that continued when he returned to New Zealand because he was arrested in New Zealand for drunk driving. Okay. Yes. Basically, his issues seemed to follow him wherever he went. Yeah.

When he returned to Auckland after leaving Australia, he found a shared apartment situation and told his new roommates that he, quote, was coming over to New Zealand to buy bars to add to the franchise his father owned. That was not the case at all. The roommates problems with him also began almost immediately. He failed to pay his rent on time constantly. His former roommates said there was always an excuse. He was waiting on money from his accountant

in Australia. Eventually you stop believing the stories. There were so many stories that you start to say, really, it stopped making sense. Mm-hmm. And then other remates even found his behavior to be odd or sometimes threatening. One of them, a female, was so freaked out by Jesse that she kept a knife by her bed whenever she was in the house alone with him. Oh my god. Another roommate elaborated and said, he came home drunk and broke some furniture and she was scared. When he was drunk, the facade goes just a little bit. Damn. So for detectives, the picture of Jesse that was coming through from their investigation was that of a troubled and most likely mentally ill chronic liar, who struggled to maintain relationships with anybody. Damn.

Now, it was his criminal history, though, that convinced them that Grace's death was not an accident. In 2017, his former girlfriend went to the Auckland police and reported that he had violently raped her. Oh my God. And repeatedly threatened to kill her over the course of several months. Oh, so he's an actual full blown in every gender, like every direction you could possibly reach

piece of absolute garbage. Garbage. Yeah. And actually about eight months before he met Grace on Tinder, he made another day on the app with a woman that he ended up sexually assaulting at the end of the night. She told reporters, I was just frozen. I let him do what he needed to do

so I could try and go to sleep or go home as soon as possible. Oh, that's awful. I wish there needs to be like a central place where people can report. Yeah. This stuff about specific people. I know, I don't know.

I wonder if that's how I got to know anything about dating apps, because that was way out of my time. Yeah. But I wasn't on them long enough to luckily have to. I feel like there should be some central place at each site that you can report a profile and they should really regulate it.

If there's even one report against you, you should be kicked off that app. Because I know you can report profiles, but I don't know how it works like after you've reported that. Yeah, there needs to be a very specific and it needs to be a fucking like put the hammer down kind of thing. Seriously, it's so far. That's horrifying.

It's so scary. I, you couldn't pay me money to online date ever again. Seriously, and that's so scary. And it's so scary. And it's so scary. And it's so scary. And I think of the people that do. I mean, I know people who have gotten married after meeting on Tinder or Hinge or any of course, you know, like it happens. Yeah. But then you have to think that this could also happen. Yeah, it's true. It's so scary. But it makes you even,

it makes you further realize that the internet and like social media and stuff is so fucking toxic now. And the grid needs to just crash. Because even, it's the same thing is like, like when you meet someone in a bar, you don't know that person. No, they're brand new to you. So if you give your number to them, that's essentially the same thing. But something about the internet makes the more nefarious

aspects of it become real. And it's like, it makes it more. It's so weird. It is. It really is weird. Yeah. I don't know what it is. I think it just gives you a little more power to put in hide and to put like an alter

ego in some of the fun. Yeah, exactly. He could put on his profile that he's interested in, because he saw that grace was interested and done it some of the fun. Yeah, exactly. He could put on his profile that he's interested in, and da da da da da, because he saw that grace was interested in da da da da da. Exactly, that's exactly what it is. It's like they can cater themselves to, it's honestly a bad person's kind of,

what dream? And they are because it's like, they can really cater themselves to be what you want them to be. Yeah, and then a lot of times they do. It's really bad. Let's just let the grid crash everybody. Let the grid absolutely crash a leader.

There's a sun spot on the same girl, which is why all that sun spots can go on the sun. Yeah, to say hey. But it's four times the size of Earth, and apparently it has the potential to cause a lot of solar flares, which could crash the grid. Yeah, let's just go back to like researching

out of books and the librarianship. Unfortunately, I think everybody would lose their which could crash the grid. Yeah, let's just go back to like researching out of books and the librarianship. Unfortunately, I think everybody would lose their fucking minds of the grid. Oh, yeah, for sure. So I would just like hide in a book. We're too deep now. Yeah, far too. But one can dream.

You know, well, in his first court appearance, Jesse Cumson and his defense team petitioned to have his name suppressed in all the public records and media. Fuck you. Which I'm very confused about why because he was 26 years old. It's not like he's a juvenile.

No. But the request it actually was initially denied, but that decision was later reversed due to, oh, this is why I do know why. I do know why. Due to the open investigations and to the other assaults that he was now accused of committing before Grace was killed.

That's why, but I don't really get it. Maybe it's because it would influence that decision. Yeah, it's like one of those things where I think it's they, they don't want those things being part of the new trial kind of thing. I mean, I hate that shit because it's like, I'm sorry if you're a terrible person and a rapist, yeah, we should be able to take that into consideration when looking at how you murdered a woman in a hotel room. Yeah.

I don't think we should be like, well, I'll just forget all that. Luckily, the jury was able to find out, like, we'll see, but it's so weird, right? It's very strange. The justice system is weird. It's very strange, and all of them are so different. Yeah. And remember, this is New Zealand.

That's true. But then the thing, then this is the thing. So this ruling was only enforceable in New Zealand by keeping his name out of it, which immediately caused problems in the case because it was being focused on all around the world. Yeah, of course. Now, there was also a big leak of Jesse's name

because it was through Google when Google sent out their like news roundup, I don't know if you got that. They named him to users across the world. Of course. And it caused this massive like issue and like tension within the trial. That's so crazy. And like I never thought of the fact that like somewhere like New Zealand would even have that be a thing. Yeah. Like an adult. Their name could be kept out of it. Yeah. And I think their name is kept out of it. Like we were just saying because of other cases. It's just interesting.

It is. And the New Zealand legal system was fucking pissed at Google. Like really mad. But then Google said that they never received any kind of suppression order. And it pretty much went nowhere. Oh, okay. There was like discussions that were had about how fucked up that is that we can't name people, but whatever.

So Jesse Cumson's trial did start on November 4th, 2019, almost one year after Grace's death. And the trial was overseen by Justice Simon Moore. And he put unusually tight restrictions on the local and international media in the courtroom because of that situation with Google. So that's why I had to mention it. The crown was being represented by Brian Dickie, a Crown solicitor, with more than 24 years experience and prosecuting major criminal cases

at the highest courts, which I think is cool when there's multiple courts. High courts. High courts. Now, Cimson's defense team was led by Ann Brookie, a private solicitor, who actually had a history of prosecuting cases on behalf of the crown.

So that was interesting. In his opening statement, Dickie told the jury the facts of the case and noted that even though Jesse Camsen claimed Grace had died accidentally, his actions afterwards were not those of somebody experiencing panic. No. They were deliberate acts of a murderer

trying to cover up a crime scene and just cold, careless acts. Yeah. He was like, he did not regret this one bit. He photographed her body, he searched for ways to dispose of her, stuffed her into a suitcase, and then went back on Tinder to find a date that same day. That's outrageous. And he argued.

They argued incredible. Incredible. And he argued that he was eroticizing Grace's death by taking intimate photographs of her body and looking up pornography while she lay dead in his room. Oh, come on. Absolutely, fuck monster. But in their opening statement, the defense, of course, argued the opposite. They said that Grace and Jesse shared dinner, some drinks, went back to his apartment and engaged in

consensual sex. Shut up. Like, no. They said it was then that grace. It was graceous fault. Of course it was. She asked Jesse to choke her, which resulted in her accident until death. And they said, as for Kensen looking at porn and searching for random things later, those were quote unquote random drunk searches. And they said, him searching for random things later. Those were, quote, unquote, random drunk searches. And they said, him searching for the white talkery ranges could have just been something as simple as him searching, quote, somewhere the pair had planned to go for a day out. So wait, let me just get this straight.

He's drunk. And how do you spell that? Ready? W-A-I-T-A-K-E-R-E. Okay. So you're, we're being very serious when we say that he is drunk and searching that particular place. Yeah. And just looking up porn after he already had sex.

Okay. That's nice. Yep. Okay. What? And when you know what, when I've had a few drinks, the first thing that I think of is like, oh, I wonder if there's flesh eating birds out there. And that's the other thing.

I'm like, oh yeah. It's just my curious mind. He's just making sure that there's no flesh eating birds that will get them while they're out on their date. That's literally all I think about when we go on a hike. I'm like, I hope there's no flesh eating birds around because they're so common. That. What?

Wow. Wow. And it's just a coincidence that you buried her body out there, huh? Just a coincidence. Just a coincidence. So weird. Crazy. I know.

It looks so bad. Totally. But please believe me. So it was clear that the defense was going to portray the murder as just rough sex gone wrong. That'll defend us. But thankfully, the prosecution was going to portray the murder as just rough sex gone wrong. That'll defend us. But thankfully the prosecution was very prepared for that. Their second round of witnesses, they hoped, would show that Jesse Cumson was a sexual

sadist with a history of violence against women. In total, the prosecution called three women to the stand, and each of them had varying degrees of contact with him, and they all had their identity suppressed for their own safety, thankfully. The first woman testified that he had contacted her through Tinder and, quote, told her he liked rough sex, domination, and strangulation because it made him feel more superior and in control. I literally, I can't even write.

I was just going to say I have so many thoughts right now, but... She said they went on a date and they did engage in consensual sex, but at some point, he became more aggressive during that than she had anticipated. And she told the courtroom, he grabbed my forearms and put all the pressure on my arms so I couldn't breathe and I couldn't move my arms. I started kicking, trying to indicate that I couldn't breathe. I was kicking violently. He would have felt me arms. I started kicking, trying to indicate that I couldn't breathe. I was kicking violently. He would have felt me fighting.

I was terrified. And later when she confronted him about the incident, she said he told her, in an accusing and cold tone, you don't think I did that on purpose, did you? You, he's so disgusting. Yeah, did you see him? Yeah.

He looks like a fucking asshole. He's repulsive. Now, according to the witness, she did stay in contact with him for months after because she was, quote, concerned that she'd given him too much information about her life and that he would stalk her if she cut off contact. So that's how afraid she was. Yeah. Now, on the morning of December 1st, 2018, just hours before he went out with Grace, he was trying to get in contact with this witness to get her to agree to a date. Oh. But she declined and said she had other plans, and he kept up with her all day asking,

let's head out, let's head out, let's head out, even in the days after Grace's death, but she repeatedly declined. He would have killed a lot of these women. Not a doubt in my mind, you wanted to kill another lot of these women. Not a doubt in my mind. Yeah, not a doubt. Another woman. Now, the next witness called for the prosecution claimed that she had also matched with him on Tinder and that they had been exchanging messages for weeks, but she declined his request for a date because she said, quote, she turned down his offers of a date because of some of his sexual requests, which included strangulation, made her feel uncomfortable.

Yeah. Now, like the last witness, he also contacted this girl on the morning that he went out with Grace. And then a third woman, who he met through Tinder nine days before Grace, had a similar experience in which consensual expixiation was introduced by Kempson. So after the prosecution had presented the three witnesses, the defense still tried to portray what happened to Grace as an accident.

They said that she had a sexual history involving BDSM, and they actually called several witnesses to the stand to testify as to her sexual interests and preferences. That's fucked up. Like how fucked is that? You are brutally murdered by a tender date, and then their lawyers go on to make your sexual history public to everybody, and making it seem like you asked for this. Imagine going home and laying your head down on the pillow

and night after doing that to a dead girl. No, I wouldn't. Yeah. The attorney, Camsen's attorney there, presented the jury with forensic evidence that he collected from Grace's laptop. Basically, she was on a BDSM website talking to people, which she is perfectly allowed to do.

She is a consenting adult. Yeah. The chats were between her and two separate men and they occurred between August and September in 2017. The transcripts were read, read aloud to the courtroom. She is dead, everybody. And was killed. And this is nothing to do with it.

Nothing. All they were trying to do was prove that she had an interest in BDSM. And it's like, okay, she liked BDSM. Does that mean that she should get murdered for it? Like, that's not BDSM. That's not BDSM at all. Like I can promise you that.

Mm-hmm, it's crazy. So one man that she had been talking to was called to testify about his conversation with her and he told the jury everything. And then a second witness for the defense made similar claims that she was new to this world of BDSM trying it out and she did enjoy being choked. That was a preference. Not to death, everybody. Exactly. And then in a statement, again, read aloud for the court, an unnamed female friend of Grace's, which like, you did your friend dirty. She said grace enjoyed her partner putting his hands around her neck.

And again, sure, maybe she did enjoy that, but it didn't mean that Jesse Kempstin had the right to strangle her for over five minutes and then take photos of her dead body, because that is not part of BDSO. Okay, I'm like, I love that they're trying to be like, well, she liked 50 Shades of Grey everybody. And that is a lot of women. I'm sorry, what part of 50 Shades of Grey is this? Can you point me to the part?

Can you point me to that? Because I don't see it. Ridiculous. Like this is fucked up that they're pretending that this is anything to do with her sexual preferences. And her family is sitting there in that courtroom. Her family is actually desecrating her name. Her family, this is what kills me with this shit, because it's like this girl got fucking murdered.

Murdered after going on a date. And now her family is sitting there and she gets to have all of her shit laid bare when she's dead. She was murdered. And she's not here to tell us actually what she likes. And what she didn't like. And what she didn't like. And what she didn't like. And what she didn't like.

And what she didn't like. And what she didn't like. And what she didn't like. And what she didn't like. And what she didn't like. And what she didn't like. And what she didn't like. And what she didn't like.

And what she didn't like. And what she didn't like. And what she didn't like. And what she didn't like. And what she didn't like. And what she didn't like. And what she didn't like. And what she didn't like. And what she didn't like. And what she didn't like. And what she didn't like. And what she didn't like. And what she didn't like. And what she didn't like. And what she didn't like. And what she didn't like. And what she didn't like. And what she didn't like. And what she didn't like. And what she didn't like. And what she didn't like. And what she didn't like. And what she didn't like. And what she didn't like. And what she didn't like. And what she didn't like. And what she didn't like. And what she didn't like. do that to a girl who has been murdered is beyond me.

Beyond, but they did, and they did it at the time. To try to do it to get this guy out off too. That's what's wild to me. Who you know killed her. Not only you know killed her, you know has assaulted at least three other women. Yes, and how about all the women that were probably too terrified to come forward?

A violent rapist. You're trying to get off on murder that he has admitted to. He raped his own girlfriends. Yeah. So, and again, they did it all the way to the end. In his closing arguments, Ron Mansfield, to his a member of Kempson's defense team, reinforced their position that Grace, excuse me,

had initiated and encouraged the sexual behavior that resulted in her death. That's what they said. Wow. And I have like no words. I have many words, but I'm not going to say them right now. They said, everything comes and did after was out of fear. Mansfield told the jury, people do things when they're stressed, when they're panicked. No matter what he did, once he realized she had died, unless he called the authorities, that was not going to look good or stand him in

good stead, because who was going to believe him that the death occurred during a consensual activity? No one, just like no one's gonna believe it now, you blundering it, idiot. And also like sure, yeah, you're correct. People do do things when they're stressed and panicked and no matter what he did, other than calling the ambulance, would look bad. Him looking up porn is a lot more than bad.

Him looking up the place where he buried her body is more than bad. Him then doubling down to see if the birds we eat the flesh off of her bones horrific. Those aren't just things people do when they're stressed. No, when I'm stressed, I knock things over, I trip. You don't Google weird shit. I don't kill someone, look at porn and then take photos of it. Take photos of their dead body. So in his closing arguments, Brian Dickey disagreed

with the defense's case entirely. He pointed out the medical examiner's estimation that the strangulation lasted between five and 10 minutes until the jury, this is a quote, this isn't just a little bit of sex gone wrong because the person doing that must have known that they were hurting her. Yes.

Causing her harm. That might well cause her death, but they were reckless and carried on and she died. This is not an accident. No, of course it's not. And they've shown a pattern that he's the one who likes doing that. Yeah.

She is interested in BDSM, obviously. But it's showing, like, he's making you seem like, oh, she wanted me to do that. I was so wholesome. I had no idea how to do this. He has a longer history than she did. He had a long history of doing this. And actually, the defense for him only kind of fucked themselves there, proved that because

she was super new to this. Exactly. Nice job. Yeah. Now, the Dickie there, the one that we like, he also noted more importantly that the evidence presented at trial didn't even support the defense's claim of an accidental death. He partially, excuse me, he particularly pointed to Jesse's actions right after Grace's death.

He said the internet searches and the taking photographs were specifically undermined by the defense. Yeah. And said either Miss Malaine was dead when they were taken, or he had searched for the white talkery ranges where he buried her body while she was still living, thus showing he planned to kill her. Yeah, it's like, so do you really want to go with that one still?

Exactly. Because then we're going to have some premeditation here. So... Exactly. So after almost four weeks of graphic, graphic testimony and very disturbing evidence, the jury retired for deliberation. So before they headed out, just just more reminded them that they were not deliberating whether Kempson was guilty of having caused graces, death. We all

knew that was true. Yeah. He said, you're deliberating whether he intentionally caused that death or not. And he said to them, consent only comes into your deliberations. If you have rejected murder on either the basis of the murderous intent I have described above. It is not relevant to the murderous inquiry. No person under our law may consent to their death or the inflection of the sort of actual bodily injury that could well cause death.

And that is the reason why if you find either of the murderous intentions proved, thus proving the murder, the question of consent does not arise. Okay. Now, the jury deliberated for just about five hours before returning a unanimous guilty verdict.

Oh, thank goodness. Okay, you took a second and looked at me and I was like, if you fucking tell me. I just like to see where you're at. I will be very angry. Unanimous guilt. Good. The decision was obviously bittersweet

for Grace's parents to have it. And I think it's Jillian, but it could be Gilean. Malaine, it's with a G. So I think it's Jillian. Yeah. Who told reporters, the verdict of the murder today will be welcomed by every member of the Malaine family

and friends of Grace. It will not reduce the pain and suffering we've had to endure over the past year. Grace was taken in the most brutal fashion a year ago and our lives have been ripped apart. This will be the rest, this will be with us for the rest of our lives. Grace was a beautiful, talented, loving daughter. Grace was our sunshine and she will be missed forever. She did not deserve to be murdered in such a barbaric way or on her gap year. We must return home and try to pick up the pieces of our lives without our beloved Grace. Which I have chills reading on. Yeah.

lives without our beloved grace, which I have chills reading. Yeah. In February of 2020, actually, which is crazy, Jesse comes in with sentence to life in prison with a minimum of 17 years before he could ever be considered for parole. Good. And in the months that followed, he was also found guilty and too sexual assault cases. And he got sentenced to 11 years in prison for those to be served

once he was done for the murder of Grace who was the criminal. I like sentence that. So tacked it right onto the end. Of course, he and his lawyers appealed the sentence and they argued that there was a quote, credible narrative of consent, basically saying that he believed Grace

consented to the act that resulted in her death. Shada, but the justice is rejected the claim on the basis that an individual does not have a right to consent to their death. No, of course they don't have a reason to shut up. You fuck. Get out of here. And the appeal also alleged that the prosecution didn't present enough evidence or credible argument that could sufficiently warrant a guilty verdict.

Honey. But the justice is also rejected this. Yeah, they've rejected that outright. Are you kidding me right now? Exactly. Like, wow. Okay, glass house. No, absolutely ridiculous.

They said by their verdict, the jury showed that they were sure that if the applicant did not intend to kill the deceased, he at least intended to inflict bodily injury, which he knew was likely to result in death. Yeah. The most that could be taken from Camsen's account is that Ms. Malayne may have consented to the application of manual pressure to her neck for the purposes of sexual gratification.

But there is nothing in what the applicant told the police to suggest she consented to, or he believed she consented to the inflection of bodily injury of a kind likely to kill her. No, of course not. No. So on June 29, 2021, the court rejected that appeal and they upheld the courts a returning ruling. Stay there. Now outside of the courts,

Grace's murder brought up a lot of questions about the safety of female tourists and backpackers in New Zealand and just the safety and protection of women in the country in general. Now, like overall New Zealand is seen as a very safe country. Yeah, I would say.

Country, they've actually even had three female prime ministers in their history. And in fact, I'm pretty sure that the reason this was probably brought up after this case is because it is such a safe place that they do it the right way. Where something like this happens and they go, whoa, whoa, whoa.

Like what did I do? We gotta take a look at what's happening here. Well, it's crazy is when it comes to domestic violence and violence against women in New Zealand society, recent reports found that, quote, 35% of New Zealand women had suffered physical or sexual violence in their relationships. Wow.

And that the country lacked a comprehensive strategy to tackle the problem. Damn. So according to an associate professor of criminology at Victoria University in Wellington, a woman named Jan Jordan, New Zealand had quote, lauded and valued an incredible toughness in men, which in turn had created an insidious culture of violence. And she went on to say, we get lulled into thinking we're actually quite an equal society,

but those women who have made it to the top are actually a tiny minority. Wow. So after the trial is finished, people were completely appalled by the rough sex, gone wrong, strategy that the defense used. They called it what it was, ultimate victim blaming. Yeah. And according to Fiona McKenzie, founder of We Can't Consent to this, the argument comes in defense used meant, quote, he gets

to tell her story. He gets to tell the story of what she liked and how she asked for it. Families not only lose their loved one, but these men steal the public perception of them and destroy their reputation. Yes, exactly. It's appalling. She is. So thankfully, once Jesse was convicted, things kind of like, this case shook things up. An activist and New Zealand started advocating for change and the laws that allow the use of once Jesse was convicted, things kind of like this case shook things up. An activist in New Zealand started advocating for change and the laws that allow the use of such defenses because that is a real defense. And Fiona McKenzie told reporters with nearly 40% of women under 40 saying they've been violently

assaulted in sex, the criminal justice system needs to be ready to respond if these women report and not just dismiss the violence as something they asked for. Now, as of 2023, the laws have not changed yet, but it's a very much still ongoing debate. And I'm actually going to include a petition calling for the end of the rough sex defense and the show notes. Good. So definitely make sure to check that out and sign if you are waiting. Yeah. I signed it. So you should do it. But yes, that will be in the show notes, and then I will see if our girl Avery can also put it on social media. Yes, absolutely.

But that is the tragic, tragic story of Grace Malayne and how the legal system really tried to defile her name, but didn't end up working out for them. Damn. That's an awful story. Such a sad story. I hope something good comes out of it. I hope that log gets changed. I hope that log gets changed.

I hope that log gets changed too, like big time. It's time. That was a brutal one. It really was, but we love you guys. And please stay safe out there if you're using dating apps. Yeah, be careful. Go on double dates. Yeah, there you go.

Oh my gosh, my friend has this really cool boyfriend. I think you did it all. Let's go. You want to do a double date because I don't want you to murder me. Yeah, there you go. Yeah, perfect. Or have your friend just like go on a date with her significant other.

At the same place as you, just so they can keep an eye. Yes, love. Follow you. Yes, you know. I love that, I like that a lot. Yeah. All right guys, well that's your tip of the week. We hope you keep listening.

And we hope you. Keep it. Weird. But that's where your voice cracks at the end. Bye. Yeah. Hey, Prime Members! You can listen to morbid, early, and ad-free on Amazon Music. Download the Amazon Music app today, or you can listen Add Free with Wondery Plus and Apple podcasts.

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