Morbid - Live Show 11/19 Providence, RI

Episode Date: December 2, 2019

Weirdos! It's a holiday treat! This episode is the audio from out live show at AS220 in Providence, RI on 11/19. We apologize in advance for the sub par audio quality but it's a live show, so we did our best. We cover Leopold and Loeb and the mysterious death of Thelma Todd. Enjoy! Check out our sponsors! Quip Quip, makers of the quip electric toothbrush wants you to know the one single discovery that matters most for your dental care. It is simply this, that if you have good habits, you are good. And if you go to GetQuip.com/Morbid, RIGHT NOW, you’ll get your first refill FREE. The Bouqs Company You know, good things come in flower packages. Celebrate life’s moments with farm-fresh Bouqs! Get 25% off your order from The Bouqs Company with code morbid at Bouqs.com/Morbid See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

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That's ANGI. Ordered download the app today. You guys get the most excited ever been in your entire lives, okay? So that they know it's time for them to come out. Alright guys, one, two, three! I'm a little bit nervous. I'm a little nervous. I'm a little nervous. I'm a little nervous. I'm a little nervous. You hear it, though?

I'm Alaina. What the fuck are you all doing here? I'm not going to say it. This is real weird. This is real weird. Thank you so much for coming to our space. for coming to our space. Oh, one more time. Let's hear it for Liz and that guy, Ferry Brown, because I'm still laughing so hard.

I will buy that kids' album. That's why I'm not making tape suits. Seriously, I love it. So what we're going to do tonight is we we're gonna do two cases for you guys. Woo! We're gonna be in Happy Birthday by the way. Yay! I think I saw the delay, I was like, this is a yes girl.

I'm like, what is this? We're gonna do two cases, I'll do my case, which is probably gonna be super long And then Ashley's gonna do her case, but in between we're gonna do a fun trivia game Test some of your Crime knowledge we have a little gifty little We just have some of your serial killer and some crime knowledge. We have a little gifty, low-merty, good-duty for anybody who would all choose to do it. We're not going to tell you what it is yet.

We're not going to tell you what we do it. But yeah, you'll love it anyway. Yeah, you'll love it. So I think without further ado, let's get it. We're going to get it. Did anybody come to the first live show? Woo! Hey!

Oh, we're doing the same cases. We're totally kidding. We're just wanting to kiss you off real quick. I'm not doing anything. And also, well, you probably heard this at the first live show, but I feel like it's pretty relevant now. I just have a really quick little story about how dumb I am.

In high school, I tried it out. I was auditioning for a play. And I had to respond to the person who was saying to me something like, and justice will be done. And my line was supposed to say, amen, but I read it. I am.

And I said it like vigorously. I was like, um. And so I feel like tonight we'll go better than that. So that's what I'm hanging on to, right? I mean, it went better last time. It's been a great time. It went better last time. I'm going to make this up.

Say, I did it. We're OK. OK. So my case tonight is one summy you might know, Leopold and Lou. Because I said this to a couple of people and they're like, I'm like, you'll know, and it's Leopold and they're like, no, no, no. She types me and I was like, yeah, I know what that is. I'm like, I'm shaking so much.

So Leopold and Lou, we're going to start off. This is a night, we decided to do like, roaring 20s murders because there's fun murders, you know. This was in 1924. I'm going to start you off with two quotes from the defense attorney and from the prosecution. So you get a little idea of what this is going to be like. So the prosecution said for this murder, quote, this cruel and vicious murder, this gruesome crime, this atrocious murder, the most cruel, cowardly, dastardly murder ever committed in the annals

of American Judas Prudence. Damn. That's a little funny. And the defense attorney about this said, everyone knows that this was the most unfortunate homicide. They tell you to be honest. It wasn't one of those fortunate homicide. It was pretty unfortunate, though.

That it is the cruelest, the worst, the most atrocious ever committed in the United States. It's pure imagination without a vestige of truth. A death in any situation is horrible, but when it comes to the question of murder, it is doubly horrible, but there are degrees of atrocity, and as I say, instead of this being one of the worst, it is perhaps one of the least painful, which it's like what's that? It's a journey. I don't know if you can speak to that, I feel like maybe the victim should speak to that, but okay. So we're gonna start off with this guy on you Nathan Frieden Thalley a whole junior was born on November 19th 1904 to Florence and Nathan senior Chicago, Illinois

He could use Jonathan Van Ness to help him. Oh, yeah, he could. He was the youngest of three boys with brothers Michael and Samuel. His parents were Jewish immigrants from Germany, and he was from a lot of wealth. His father's half of the family was highly successful in the freight and shipping business and his mother's mother's mother's I'm breaking it, it's okay I know I know His mother's side had a bunch of successful bankers because you know finance, money, oh

His father in fact was one of the wealthiest businesses in Chicago at the time, and his family was super prominent, super-relatable, respected, so you know it's all good. He was incredibly smart from a young age. I'm pleased to ignore my hands shaking. They shake anyone's minor to work at. But I'm nervous. So he was super smart for me on age. Of course being so brilliant can be tough because it usually doesn't come with the whole social aspect of things. All this brilliant people know that right. So he had some tough time making friends and this was also due to the fact that he was brilliant but also the fact that he knew he was brilliant and he also the fact that he knew he was brilliant. And he thought

this made him like superior and everybody else so he kind of acted that way. Unfortunately, you can know every single one of the first trillion digits of pie, but if you can't flip a cup or like chuck a beer funnel, you like to do that. I mean, what's gonna happen? Nothing. Yeah, you're good. So he was also, as if that wasn't like, it's sufferable enough. He was also just a super dick about how much he was, even though it's like your parents are rich dick. You didn't do that. You're like 15 right now.

I'm unimpressed. So, unfortunately for Nathan, he was pretty ruthlessly bullied, which I never cool with. Um, believes they're just universally dying bags of shit. So, just always. I think I can make that blanket safe. I'm without a family, anybody. I'm just a polyscar. Someone's like, Rela Bay right now.

It's like shit. There's a different time. There's a different time. There's a different time. There's a different time. You were. You were. You were. Oh, I don't know. So, basically, he was targeted for all the above reasons. And also because he was small, he was shy.

He didn't really like any sports. And he also had like a governess that would like bring him to school, pick him up. So people are like, you're weird. I want that. Right? That's awesome. You're not about that. The governess name was Matilda Sweeney once. You know, and she basically took over as a mother of the house when Florence, the mother, went bedridden. They adored her and she was apparently very like outrageous for the were in 20s.

And in a second you're gonna find out she she really was outrageous like that was an accurate description it wasn't just like oh my god she's wearing pants how outrageous she was so she was exactly what you needed out of your replacement mom for like part of the time except that there was also this part where she started sleeping with his 17-year-old brother in him on his 12th. That's outrageous. Pretty, truly outrageous.

That's hilarious. I would say so. Yes. Someone got Jim from that. I say that all the time and no one gets it. I was like, that's truly outrageous. And I was like, yeah, it is. So he's way too smart for his age.

He's got a superiority complex, stemming from his parents being wealthier than digits can comprehend at this point. And he has a fucking governess because he's wealthy and his parents don't want to actually raise him themselves. And the governess is sexually abusing him. So I mean, he's also small, he's shy, he's a boy in the 20s who hates

19-20s gender, and over-and-boy things, like sports. Really what did anybody expect? Yeah, it's like, poor kid really didn't have a lot of options. He was kind of made for bullies to pick up. But don't feel that for him long. He's a dick. This guy, this guy. Like at first I was like, oh, anything. Then I went read the West, and I was like, oh, fuck you Nathan! And that's why I was like, oh, that can't. Now normally there would be someone to turn to, to give a kid encouragement, they could go to someone to be like, how do you pull me?

But his brother was really didn't give a shit. It really sucked it out of the cup. And then his dad was off being a successful businessman. His mom had apparently become bed ridden with some weird illness when he was choosing pregnant with him, so he was just kind of on his own, so he was alone a lot. So we don't get the fuck remember that. One of his classmates was quoted as saying, Nathan was very egocentric, practically all the time I was with him. In ordinary social conversation, he attempted by any sort of roots possible to monopolize the conversation. It didn't make any difference what was being said or what was being

talked about. He always attempted to get the conversation revolving around him so he could do most of the talking. He thought his mentality was a great dear superior to any ordinary person. Dick. So he took a very, this is also kind of funny. He took like a very intense interest in ornithology, which applies to one, it's just a tiny bird. I got to know. He was a bird person, so that's like being any kind of like, blah person. I feel like you should just like, you don't want a transition from being like just a person to like a that person I don't know. I don't know. The just the fact that he was in D'Birds

Maybe like I'm a wheelie. Sorry, I heard him hurts. I think this is my husband's phone. He called me dates, birds, and I think he's out in all today. I don't trust you, he's a real big one. See, he's, in fact, there he's like shivering in his own group, birds. So this summer before entering the University of Chicago, however, he met a hot older guy by the name of Richard Glove. Oh, hot is like... I mean, he thought he was hot. You have really high standards.

I do. Wait until we get to the end. Just look at John Van Gogh. Oh, thank you. You're not being polite. That's lobe. Oh, yeah. Does it not mean polite?

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I know. I know. I know. I know. I know. Richard was like Nathan in the sense that he was a young prodigy too. He was like super smart like way too smart for his age. He also had a governess as well. His governess did not sexually abuse him so like points to her. She just read him stories and like made him study and was cat and was an all around mom to him. She didn't she didn't do anything wrong but there is something that can make low the little relatable. He was super into true crime. He was talking about it. Alright, low. Alright. I don't want to make him one of us. I was just gonna say, like continue hating him though because he's lower. But like, for a moment I was like, I'm right.

But I was like, no, I'm okay. I feel like he's gonna be like, too much of a true crime. Yeah, yeah. Okay. I know. You know that. You're on this. I was like, no, I'm okay. I feel like he's gonna be like two, a did you true, Cran? Yeah, yeah. Okay. I know how to play like. You know that, you're on this. It's called a play. I actually don't. So he loves detective novels, Cran stories, and he takes that way too far away.

He was also the opposite of Lamppold because he was outgoing, he was popular. Somehow he got both sides of the equation because he was like super popular super cool and also super brilliant So you want to have that? He's a Gemini. Oh, we probably, is he? No, he is. Oh, she said June 11. You always know who he is. I mean, I'm not. That's Gemini. You always know like, the pitch is a gem. I told Demi in the closet over there. He's like, you. He's a giant no-dum. And he didn't throw me his no-dum, and I know I see him. Woo! Thank you.

He was the treasure of his class. He was seemingly an all-around charismatic individual. Unfortunately, he was also kind of sheltered, because his governess was really obsessed with getting him to just study, study, study, get good grades. He was a amazing person. So she kind of kept him in. he didn't really get a normal childhood. He couldn't talk to this about this with his parents because like Leopold,

they weren't really concerned with actually raising him, that's why they got a governmentist, they were like, yeah, you do that. He was only 14 years old when he started classes at the University of Chicago, which, excuse me, that's like a baby. I barely did freshman year when I was like, so most joe, yeah, that's so shit. That's a lot. And it was in October of 1919. We're in foul.

Ayo. I think you're gonna be a bitch. So crazy, guys, this is money. Everybody's in prohibition. We're doing great. We're doing great. We're doing great. We're doing great.

We're doing great. We're doing great. We're doing great. We're doing great. We're doing great. We're doing great. We're doing great. We're doing great.

We're doing great. We're doing great. We're doing great. We're doing great. We're doing great. We're doing great. We're doing great. We're doing great. We're doing great. We're doing great. We're doing great. We're doing great. She ended up leaving the family at 1920 when he was 15,

because his parents were like, oh, he's all done growing, you can leave now. At 15? Yeah, they're like, he's fine. He's fully presented, don't worry. We don't need to raise him anymore. He could drive. He could've used a little more cooking, I think.

He said that, he said that this really affected him because she was a real tough lady, but he relied on her for a lot because she was basically only good surrogate mother. So he said, quote, when she left, I sort of broke loose. And that is like the fucking understatement of the session. You can't not let this talk her face. So I just kind of broke loose a little. It's like, dude, just wait, he's really nervous. What did you do? He did not so much.

He's so much. He looks like he heard something. Yeah. In that chin, he has the argo's in the chin. That's not what matters all. His chin is so big because it's holding so many secrets. He's really big because it's all secrets. So when he met Nathan Leopold in the summer before Nathan I'm not even gonna say that because it's all secrets.

So when he met Nathan Leopold in the summer before Nathan entered the University of Chicago at 15 years old, so they were both like, wait, you come to the old. He was already kind of in a bad state because his governess left. It's the worst one on how many years old. You know how it is. You're governess leaves, you're like,

put me in a bad place. That's what I'm gonna say. But he was six months younger than Nathan, but he acted like he was like this older, the guy who is, Robert, this leaves, you're like, put me in a bad place. That's what I'm really. But he was six months younger than Nathan, but he acted like he was like this older, cool guy, because he'd already been to college, and he was like, oh, I know the ropes, I'll teach you. When they entered school in October, 1920,

Lope was not really giving a shit about academics, and really just wanted to join a friend. That was his shit. Even in 1920, he was like, I want to be a friend, dude. He seems like a friend. I was going to say he was. No offense to any friends. No, we love you.

We love you. I swear. Don't make me funnel up the air. Go, go, go. He was slowly slipping into rebellion now, this guy. And it was basically because of the government, this piece. Isn't it funny that once that higher nanny is gone, his parents were so ineffective that he literally lost his shit? Like his parents could, he was like, that was it. I know what could help me. I have no idea. That was it. I got my nanny left, and I just

said, I'm hurt and cold. I'm as good as no more fit. Leopold, however, buckled down and wanted to graduate as quickly as possible because he really did like school because he got bullied. So he's like, let's get the fuck out of here with my degree. So he got tons of good grades. He spent a lot of his time studying. Leopold eventually, the other one with the uniform.

Leopold fell head over heels in love with, but why? The good boy mom with that deep heart I mean, much in though that's much in though the crazy chin I will say he has like a little way to cheat bones going on

like they're in there I feel like he's small for the 20s something's happening this one's happening we shouldn't share I don't share that I mean, yeah we should yes, yeah we won't we're in the 20s. Sounds intact. This sounds happening. Yeah, we shouldn't share. I don't share that. I mean, yeah, we should. Yes, yes, yes.

We won't let that happen. We're getting it. Together they started doing shitty things together because, you know, they're shitty. They started cheating at card games with their friends just with a thrill of cheating their friends out of fucking money. That's right, it's just friends of things. Next low started drinking a ton and you would make Leopold drive him to a street near campus, where you'd run out of the car with a brick and smash all the parked cars windows,

while Leopold just hung out with a car like, what a time! So it was so fun. When Lo realized that his key to his mother's car, which was a Milburn electric car, which fit all the cars in the same make, he started stealing cars like that because he stole her key and made a copy of it. So you just steal cars.

And then just like, leave no places. That was like pretty like thrifty for him. Yeah, time. Well now the fucking rich, it's like, dude, you guys are rich just go spend your money. Like, why are you doing this shit? That's what I would do if I was rich., you guys are rich, just go spend your money. Like, why are you doing this shit? That's what I would do if I was rich.

I mean, you're supposed to do money. Yeah, you're supposed to spend your money. Like, uh, you're supposed to do the plaza. You're supposed to do the plaza. He was obviously going through something, and the thrill of being an absolute shit flower was somehow insane, that was excited for him. And he was just bringing the whole world together. I feel like he's just like, for the ride he is but then later

There's a moment where you're like oh I'm sorry Leopold really does stop that no But Leopold's gonna he's gonna shock you okay he comes out like with the like Yeah, what I have a you're like, oh shit, that's dark. So he started upping the ante with his criminal acts like each time. Like he needed, this was all about the thrill. This entire crime that they end up committing just for the thrill,

there was no other reason for it. Like that's so fucked up there. That's what I was just scary about. They just bored Runchkins and they were like, I feel like we can do this in a way with it. So they started upping the ante. They started setting fires, smashing windows of storefronts. He was saying that these little acts were like sexually throwing ten. They were good. And so whenever somebody's like, oh, when I like destroy property or set fire to things,

I like start getting a big turn. You know that shit is not gonna get involved. Like there's the deep cut. There's gonna be more. There's gonna be more here. Like there's gonna be a bad shit. Like this is P2K, it's straight here. That's what I'm saying.

This is P2K, it's right here. So yeah, so it's gonna end up real bad. And right by the side, this whole time was lethal, That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying.

That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying.

That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying. and Liam holds was he got me more and more willing to do literally anything for lobe. You can feel bad for like a second. And while lobe was being more and more invested in his own narcissism, his constant need for thrills was creating fucking bad. They were just doing so much shit. Then in 1921, lobe decided he

wanted to transfer to the University of Michigan and they are like I don't know where. He was leaving his mans? He was leaving his mans. Oh no. Obviously Leopold lost his fucking shit. Because he was like a camera for that too. So he didn't want anyone down to that situation. Leopold transferred to the University of Michigan for no fucking reason except to follow lobe to the university. Never chase a boy. Don't do it. Don't do it. Because this doesn't end well. This is a cautionary tale. It always is. And that fall, Leopold's mother, the Unibrow, finally

passed away from that Miss Realness that she was bedroom from. So apparently it was real. All RIP model? Yeah, RIP florins. I think. Sure, florins. What?

Thank you. You're welcome, girl. He was devastated. Like, that's it. And he stayed back in Chicago for the whole thing, like the memorial and all that good stuff, or that stuff. When he got back to school at the University of Michigan, he was like, hi, love. Love was like, yeah, I'm good with being friends with you anymore.

Like, I don't know where he was. He was like, nah, I'm over it. Oh, my God. Yeah, so, yeah. And he was like, you know why I'm pledging Zeta Beta towel fraternities? Come on. And what happened was this fine association told him, you can't be friends with Leopold because he's a suspected gay. And that's just not something we're cool with. So, whoa, it was like, okay, I'll just cut him out. I shouldn't. Fuck you, love. Also a quick little side note, I hope somebody understands this. Zeta made a tau, keeps making me think of in screen 2, which is arguably the best screen. Yeah, Sarah Michelle G Gellers is like omega-beta-zeta.

Every time I hear it, I was like, oh, it's Cece Cooper or omega-beta-zeta. She's the super sister, she's great in that. I'm glad all the people knew that. I love that. I had a friend who only answered his phone as omega-beta-zeta. It was awesome. So yeah, this will won't do you go. I had a friend who only answered his phone as Omega Bay de Zeta. And this person was just, he was awesome. So yeah, this is a long deco.

And I really do think this is one of the best screens. Yes! Right, it is. Like Mickey, love, love, and everything. Timothy, like, hold up. Yes. Elephant, whatever fucks you're talking about. It's definitely on the fence.

We're into people. That's all we care about. It's going to stop us here. It's going to stop us here. Oh. So now we have pulled this devastated, just simply devastated. And he tried to hang, but instead he just transfers back to the University of Chicago. Oh! I know.

That's really sad. And that was in fall of 1922. I mean, that's a lot. That's a lot. I don't know if the next slide is. Oops. I went ahead. But what? Is that a child? There we lot. That's a lot. I don't know if the next slide is. Oops. I went ahead. But what are we?

Is that a child? Here we go. Then they are together. They make kind of look alike. They do. Yeah, they do. That's a reason. And also without his uniform around, like, he's alright.

He's still a beautiful, beautiful girl. No, I didn't like take away the uniform around. Oh, oh, oh, oh, I was like, girl, it's better. He's the one who I'm talking to. Who make you a little greasy? The 20s. The 20s. Oh, I was like, girl, it's better. He's her own daddy. Who would be here? You're the Chrissy. It's 20. It's 20.

It's 20. So, yeah. So, what's crazy is once he got back to Chicago, he was so devastated, but he excelled so hard in school. Like, he was like, I'm going to put all my energy into school. And he was super psyched about birds again. Like, he was a college doctor. again. She's been published two papers inside a scientific journals about birds. What? Yeah. I'm a scientist. I'm fucking published paper.

The Leopold graduated with honors from the University of Chicago in March 1923, and he was planning to start law school at the University of Chicago Law School. Not the same law school, but you were. Right, that was the just you were there. I was a little bit of a liar, but I lost you. You know law thing, you know law-eaters. You do all of it.

Well, graduated without honors, well, well, from the University of Michigan in June 1923, and having earned whatever grades in undergrad, like just like man at grades, he decided to pursue graduate work in American constitutional history at U.S.D. University of Chicago, as he's following his man, so we have home in Lowe, or DAC again.

Oh, girl. It's not frisky, it's not because they should have stayed apart. So September 19th, 23, maybe 10 friends again. Because Lowe was like, well, I'm not fludging that for charging 4, so we could be friends. And Lowe was like, cool, cool, cool. All right. And so Lowe also charmed liipold's pants off literally

because they started sleeping together damn it don't go I mean don't be permanent I was like yeah boys but I'm like oh no of course lobe pretended to still pretendedwardsly to be a ladies' man. Like, he tried to be like Sebastian from Chrome Tensions and talk about the conquest of Sebastian. Yeah, Tensions. We need Tensions.

Another ceremony, Michelle Gallard-Movie. Girl. SMG sponsor podcast. We just called tomorrow. There are a few as a person, just sponsor us. And we'll just do a quick ad that's like, Sarah, show the guy what she's neat, right? All right, back to the show.

So this is when the two of them got back in the committing relatively small crimes, again, for a little bit. And then they began to discuss how easy it would be for two brilliant wealthy fuckheads like themselves to commit the perfect crime. Now, what is the perfect crime? Well, to look, it was kidnapping a child, shelling said child, and then getting the ransom, but not needing the ransom,

because you're fucking rich. Just doing it, like just about it. That's not perfect. Just do with it. Like just without it. That's not perfect. It's absolutely good to do it now. As a primer for this horrific idea, the two of them drove back to Ann Arbor with revolvers in their pockets, and they broke into Bloop's old fraternity house. What?

Yes, the Omega-Vatization. And they were planning to rob them. They were like, let's just throw this out real quick. They stole $74 from the courtroom, so like, yes. And I thought that was good. I mean, sure. Why not? I mean, the rich, so it doesn't matter.

They were like, they stole some like odds and ends. They also stole a portable typewriter, which Leopold, like, almost like blew his load over. Everything I read about Leopult is like this type of So I super awesome typewriter And but again, it was just for the thrill of getting away with being shit So liapult is kind of pissed though because he was studying to feel like he was just being the lackey to lobe, which he was. Just like, yeah.

And he was like, you know what, we're not sleeping together enough for me to be doing this for Leopold. Which, like, good for him. I mean, he's like, what am I getting in here? If you're dragging me out on these fucking excursions. You better off the ship. So, Lowe was actually super annoyed by Leopold's like super obsessively. Just admiration of him with all the way. But he knew he was in too deep with this friendship and like obviously Leopold knew way too much shit now that he has done. So he was like, you know what? He was like, okay, how about you keep committing crimes with me that will only escalate each time we do them,

and will probably lead to a horrific murder that will forever be known, and we will be hated for and forever. We can sleep together three times every two months. What? What? Like, scheduling, like, Tuesday, I'm free, how about you? Every time, every two months, that seems like a piss for offers to me.

I don't like that. It's like, negotiate. Go back to the drive, like the board table, and be like, all right, no. This is why I'm tired of something. Yeah. But, leave, move. Yeah, come on. The leave home is like, Cocoa now works for me.

That's fine. All right, that's awesome. He's a down-ass bitch. I'm here, I'm here for a damn's awesome. He's a down-ass bitch. I'm here. I'm here for... Damn. He is. I'm down-ass bitch. He's a down-ass bitch. He's a down-ass bitch.

He's a down-ass bitch. He's a down-ass bitch. He's a down-ass bitch. He's a down-ass bitch. So literally right after committing this stupid fucking proud-hose burglary that didn't even get to anything except that like cream-worthy type... I'm sorry.

I'm like being told that was just like... Oh, so like... I'm sorry. I'm like getting both of them to be like, oh, so like, no. That was so real. I'm getting very vivid. I'm sorry. I don't know what's come over me today. So they immediately start planning the perfect crime because the load was like fired up. He's like, let's do this. So they thought they would kidnap a child like they talked about.

Demand the ransom through some like, but they wanted to do some like intricate method of getting the ransom. They didn't just want to be like, hey, give us, you know, $10,000 and we're going to give you a kid back, they were like, no, we're going to put it on a train, we're going to send that train here, they were going to have to throw it out the window, then one of us is going to pick it up, we're going to put it in the can, it's going to go to a drug. They're gonna call him again And we're gonna do this and clap three times Just stop guys. Just stop because that was kind of his thing. He just liked planning Like he was like, ooh planning got it. Yeah, he just loved it He loved it. He's Sparky big time So after demanding ransom from the parents, they're so crazy as method, they would of course kill the child

because they were looking to get away with this shit and you can't keep someone alive that could possibly identify you for the useless shit bags that you are. So up until this point, it looks like Leopold is the sad blackie. Like we're saying. Like maybe we should just kind of like Pee-D, and maybe he said, because his governess was weird and that reaches in like, and that unit bro. I'm here to say wrong, wrong, wrong.

So as soon as they start talking about this, and we have pulled is like, so I have this little fantasy that maybe could be part of this. I'm real nervous. What's he gonna see you say? Step back, because're little leap old has a fantasy and it involves a group of, he just is like, I always think of this like a group of German soldiers just assaulting a French woman.

Excuse me. It's like what? Okay, I just popped it to my, like, I remember every one of you. So, to get him out, it's like, I have this fantasy. And he was like, and sometimes in this fantasy, he was a soldier, he participated in this. But sometimes he was like, I just stood there and watched. Which is like, so in your fantasy, you're also fucking useless, lackey. I can even wildest, serene, Charlie Charlie can I just sadger and watch? It's great So he was like because of this can we kidnap a girl so I can assault her and live on this fantasy?

Don't worry. They don't Now I'm probably staring at this fool in silence for like 10 minutes low was like no and silence for like 10 minutes, low was like, no. What? You can't do that. That's not, because apparently this was where he drew the line as it says. He's like, well, fuck down.

No, that weird, like, French woman fantasy is where we don't do that. I'm just so making a million French women. Right? But I bet you wouldn't say. Put it down. And he was like, so let's just kidnap a boy because you're weird

and young people. So all throughout the winter of that year, they meticulously planned this scenario out. During the winter quarter, details of the kidnapping plan grew bigger and bigger. They figured they would somehow get a random boy into their car, probably using Leopold's charm and charisma, because you know, he's got that in space. Then they would get him unconscious somehow, which I'll have to like, we'll just get him unconscious. It'll be fine.

Like, he's a fucking human. Like, it's hard to get someone unconscious, which they find out later, by the way, spoiler alert. So far, this plan is shit. And just like, we're going to get him in the car somehow. We're going to knock his ass out somehow. It looks like Erin knows who you are. It's like her next grab.

You probably don't want to be just like, ad living with improving mess as you go. No. So, they were gonna get him unconscious. And once they had him unconscious, boy in the car, they would then go to some pre-determined spot near the border of two states. And they would hide the body in this random drainage ditch. So they figured the drainage pipe would create an environment that would quickly decompose the body,

because the constant flowing water and the hot summer heat would not run. But they sucked at it, so it didn't get to them. They sucked at her. Now, a little bit showing this diabolical side because when they're discussing this and they're like, how are we going to kill the kid? That's important. His main focus was that they both needed to be killing him. Like, one of them was not going to be more culpable than the other.

So they were like, we're both going to kill him at the same time. So they were like, let's just strangle him by yanking on a rope together. Let's go to the next one. That's terrific. Logistically that makes no sense. I've no idea how this is gonna work. Like, are you guys still working? I have heard. Yeah, it really is. I was getting nervous. It was. It was good, but it was worth it. It was more good. Hashtag more of it. So they decide $10,000 was a good random amount because they didn't give shitty the way. So the money was not the point.

So the only 10 grand, sure. The point was just pure thrill. But how they were going to get the ransom while still maintaining their anonymity. Do they have to say anonymity? An anonymity? An anonymity. I can never say my. I can never say that. I can never say that. I can never say that.

I can never say that. I can never say that. I can never say that. I can never say that. I can never say that. I can never say that. I can never say that. I can never say that.

I can never say that. I can never say that. trained from Chicago to Boston, departed, departed Central Station at 12th street in Michigan Avenue each day in the train left Central Station at 3 o'clock every day. 18 minutes later it stopped at 63rd Street Station. You're probably like what the fuck are you talking to this early night? I'm give a shit. this, I'm not a givish. No, I'm not a boss. I figured you were. I could feel that more of a stop. No, I'm cares. It's important. They figured they would call the father of this boy that they killed.

And tell him to go to the pharmacy on 63rd Street, next to the train station, and they told him, we're going to tell him to wait for a call. When they called again, it would be to tell him to get on the train that would be coming from Central Station. You would be told to walk to the caboose and look in the telegraph box where they would have stashed a letter ahead of time. That's so fun. I'm already like, no, not doing it, not going to do it.

I'm like, you know, this is too much. I like five more. Yeah, I got a few more, not doing it. I'm not gonna do it. I'm like, you know, I just keep it. I'm like, you know, this is too much. I like five more. Yeah, I got a few more. It's fun. It's too much. The letter would say, Quay, Quay. Quay.

Quay. Hey, throw your ricks. I was gonna say, hey, throw your ransom from the train five seconds after your passes, the red brick water tower that belonged to the champion manufacturing company, this random thing had to be in a cigar box, to the champion manufacturing company, this random

thing had to be in a cigar box, by the way, that was specific. So this person had to go buy a cigar box, put the ransom in it, throw it from the train five seconds after it passes this fucking brick building. That's too much. And by their calculation, the box would hit between Like around 74th Street and they would just be close to it and they would just grab it and run It's a real dumb to me What's this you're just gonna run up to it? Trying to be anonymous here, they'll just run out the most street, Brad, and it's fine.

Brad, daily, that's fine. No worries. Now, they rehearsed this. They went through it together. Like, they got on the train, they threw it out of the thing. They were like real serious about this. Wow. It's a lot of fucking effort.

Well, and it worked. When they rehearsed it worked. So they were like, all right, all right. You know, the perfect car. Yeah. And they decided they needed a rental car because Leopold drove some like fancy, fancy douche rocket car. And they figured there would be like two suspicious

because somebody was gonna be like, oh look, there's that douche rocket car. And they could spot it again. I know that asshole. So you know that asshole, you see it around. So they adopted alter egos and they got a rental car. Ooh, yeah, good for them. On Tuesday, on Tuesday, May 20th, Leopold went into a drug store.

He asked for a pint of hydrochloric acid. And that was what he casually said. And let me have a half pint of ether also. Because I'm feeling greasy today. Well, in the harnesses, he was like, hey, why do you think that acid? Like, it was just like, what, tell me? And William Pol just like, an experiment. And he started doing type-to-op this idea.

Like, since they were already told that in the pharmacist, it was like, cool, here you go. I mean, just give it to him. Like, no questions asked. Here you go. He's hard to cool like acid and ether. You're probably fine. Do you know that what you will? Yeah, you have an, and severe acid and ether. You're probably fine. Do you want it what you will? Yeah, you have a severe unibrow. Everything's probably... You're nearly as weird as I'm now that it pulls. Why do you want that?

Yeah, it's just the... There you go. It's time to turn that cheek. I'm trying to take care of that. I will do that even. That's the experiment. Wow, it's so cool. Yeah, it's an experiment.

While he was doing that, Lowe went to the hardware store on Cottage Grove Avenue, and he brought a rope and a sharp chisel. Yikes. Yikes. Those are not casual items to buy. I don't put a bowl or a loaf as I expected, you're going to get away with that. You know, I just need a rope and a chisel, please. You know, separately?

Yeah, that's fine. One stay May 21st was the day they picked to commit the crime. They, oh, by the way, they also composed the ransom note on that fucking typer. Of course they did. Which in the alcohol there's probably like, yeah. I'm sorry. I just said nothing was. Every time it like shoots a, he's like, oh shit.

It's party big time over and over and over and over. So I wouldn't say May 21st, they were like, we're going to do this. It's happening. So the full plan was they were going to pick up low of it 11. Go back to me at both house to get the sharp ended chisel, the tape cloth to gag the kid, the ether, the acid, a flashlight, and boots because shoes. I know it's money.

And these two fuckers are not getting money, that's for sure. Well, they don't want that. So they're like we need boots. And they were going to get the car from the rental place using the fake name Morton Ballard. Seals. I would believe one of them was Morton Ballard.

I think maybe they were. Yeah, that makes sense. They were going to bring Leopold's ostentatious rich-kick car back to his house. Drive the rental car to a restaurant called Cramer's. Have a little lunch. I'm not a fuel up. Then they would both drive to Jackson Park and wait for all the kids to start coming out of school

at the Harvard School nearby. And this is when they would choose a boy walking all alone. And the Harvard School was like a private elite school. So they knew any of these boys were gonna have rich as parents, so they were like, we'll just grab any of them. Anyone killed them. They would kill the boy together of course because loa was like no way it's one of us getting more of this than the other. They were gonna use the rope they were both gonna pull it

together. Both of them had loaded revolvers on their person in case shit went over high which is likely going to and they like I said, they were willing to kid, rather like any old kid that was walking through Harvard, but they did have their like, you know, top fantasy list of kids that they'd already like, checked out, not weird at all. Maybe still, so they're dreamless to victims. They discussed each of these kids as they were watching them come out because they both had to

great on the kid of course. One of these boys was named Armand Du Doich. I want to say, I was going to say Duich. I want to say Duich. I want to say Duich. I want to say, he was 11 years old. He went to the Harvard School and he was the grandson of Julius Rosenwald, you know him, right? He's definitely rich. He was the president of Sears Robot Company.

Rich, now remember, one of their fathers was the vice president of Sears Robot Company, so it's like, whoa, step back. So these guys are thinking this is brilliant. They're gonna go for kids that are connected. They're like, you know what? We're gonna go to kids that are like. They're like, you know what? We're going to go to kids that are like close to us because it'll be easy. We'll be able to get them in the car. But it's like, yeah, they're also connected to you. You fucking dumbasses.

Yeah. And the next one that they were thinking of getting was Johnny Levinson. Johnny's father was Saul Levinson. And he was one of the wealthiest attorneys in Chicago. The boy was nine years old. No, it's too bad. Don't worry, they don't take him. Spoiler, boy.

When I heard that, I was like, oh no, he's not. Like, don't do that. They're like, take one of the old joys. Don't do that. They're like, take one of the old joys. They're like, take one of the old joys. They're like, take one of the old joys. They're like, take one of the old joys.

They're like, take one of the old joys. They're like, take one of the old joys. They're like, take one of the old joys. They're like, take one you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love you, I love to have this to like all of a sudden he's like you know what the connections might be a bad thing but then they saw Johnny Levinson come out of school and lobe was like yeah I want him so he just walked out and he walked out to Johnny Levinson and he's like oh hey Johnny like you're in my brother's class like that's fine right that I'm jumping to and he was like what are you doing after school kid? And the kid was like, I'm going to play baseball on 49th Street, I guess.

And Lou was like, cool. See you later. Then he went back to Leopold. And he was like, this is perfect. We're gonna go, we're gonna watch this kid play baseball. And it's like, what the fuck? You're gonna go watch the play for those far-end kidnap him, this weird.

We're gonna watch him play baseball, then we're gonna get kidnap Johnny. We're gonna kill his ass, and then the whole plan is going to go great. So this was the plan now. Johnny Levin said, he's the guy. So Liam pulled to went home to get his glasses because of course he did. It's like a wrongly glasses. I know this is important, but I probably got to the... And the loo was like, alright, I'll go to the drugstore. He looked up Johnny's address in the telephone book, and this way they figured they could follow him home and snatch him on his way home.

Like monsters, like heinous monsters. Now drugstores back then, by the way, were like, they had like an ice cream counter and like candy shit. Like it wasn't like, writing today. And certainly you get like, root beer counter and like candy shit like it wasn't like writing today and suddenly you get like groupier floats and shit and then they just had like telephones and telephone books like it was weird because when I first read that I was like you went to the drugstore to look up the address like what you know

they didn't have Google so it was a trip when they got back to the baseball lot they were like I want to do this but the game was over. They messed up fucking game because they're fucking stupid. Like they're so smart, but so stupid. Baseball games last like a good amount of time. That's what I'm gonna take you to get your fucking life. I think Leopold was like, has like an array of tortoise shuttles.

And he was like, which one's gonna work today? Which one's match these boots? Yeah, which one's gonna work today? Which one's match these boots? Yeah, which one's match the boots? So the game was over, Johnny was gone. They missed their opportunity, and Johnny lived. So yay, Johnny! Can you imagine being Johnny after this would be like, holy shit? They got to be like, kill those others out of the team, other team and baseball we got to go

So they kept driving around for lone children to snatch like fucking monsters because they weren't they were like we're not done Today is the day Johnny didn't work out, but we're doing it. So at one point they went back to Leopold's house and just watched kids play on the corner Rose on the corner. Gross. Gross. You're not supposed to do that. And it turned out that, because they were like, we'll just watch these fucking kids play, we'll wait for one of them to wander off by themselves, and then we'll just snatch them up. Like the fucking boogie man. Bummer for them, because they were all hanging out with each other,

none of them loved to be by themselves. Because they were all smart kids who were like, buddies with those. So at this point, it's like 4.30 p.m. they've been out of her couple hours so Leopold's like, oh let's do this tomorrow. I'm going to get back to that time right there. Like, fuck I just want to type shit. Let me just say it's like, it is really just staring at the table.

It's like, we do this tomorrow. And loa was like, well let's just try one more drive. If we don't find a good one, we'll go back at it. And if you get tomorrow, you can go back to your typewriter. So Leo pulled Drove and Lowe sat behind him in the back seat. A little past five PM, Lowe saw someone, a boy, about 14 years old, walking alone. He was walking around Ellis Avenue and according

to the book that I was looking at a lot of this information for called For the Three Love It by Simon Bats. This is Simon One. Bats, oh this is the one. So I feel like he's like, this boy is wearing a tan jacket just a set of the scene. wearing a tan jacket with matching knee trousers. So adorable! I like knee trousers, that's so cute. I co-enture a neck tie and he had brown shoes on and black and white checkered socks. What a little nugget. Love it.

So low-bleens forward, Glee-A-Pold, and says, that's the kid. And Lee-A-Pold looks over and it's like, that's the kid. And Liam pulled the sofa and it's like, that's your fucking cousin you got did not bad. That's not verbatim, but like it feels like talking to a guy. I feel like he's like, he's fucking kidding you. That's your fucking cousin. It was his cousin. Oh my God. And this is a fucker in the back seat. It's like, you're fucking kidding me. That's your fucking cousin. It was his cousin. Oh my God.

And this is a fucker in the back seat. It's like, that's the kid. It's like, what's your fucking cousin? And that's not it. So, love's a love. Love is a love. So, love's like, that's fine. He's the kid.

What? I'm not, right? Is that the kid that you saw? That's the kid. Oh, my God. I can be the pastor now, because I'm really sorry. The boy's name was Bobby Franks. He was 14 years old.

He was Moab's fucking cousin. Loab had actually played tennis with him the day before. Are you sure? Yeah. So they followed him, pulled up alongside him, and lobe yelled out, hey, Bob. Hey, Kazo. What about Bob?

And he looked at them, loa pushed open the passenger's side door and said, hello Bob, I'll give you a ride. I said, hey Bob, so many times. He's like, hey Bob, and Bob, he, right, Bob, he was like, no, thanks, I'll just walk. It was like, good for you Bob.

Um, and then he was like, no, come on in the car. I want to talk to you about the tennis racket you had yesterday. I want to get one from my brother. And this kid loved tennis, so he was like, oh shit, okay. We'll talk about a tennis racket. Am I gonna cry on stage? Maybe. Maybe.

Maybe. Maybe she will. So Bobby agreed. He's 14, at least he's not like nine. You know, he sits a chair like you've had it. It's been good. So Bobby was like, so Lov is like, you know Leopold, right? And in this, when I was reading the book, he was like, you know Leopold, right?

And I thought, God, it's going to be like, oh, yeah, I know Leopold. But he said, you know Leopold, right? And he said, no. Okay. And that was it. Like they didn't explain it. He was like, oh, well, that's Leopold. And he was like explain it even like, oh well that's the evil. And he was like, he don't mind us taking you around the block, do you?

And Bobby said quote, certainly not. Well, he wanted to go for like a drab with his older cut. Sure bit. The two talked about tennis. And when Bobby turned back around to look forward, he'll load, grab the chisel. The fucking chisel? Grabbed Bobby, look his left arm, covering his mouth, and then he smashed the blood side of

the chisel down on his skull. Then he did it again harder, but Bobby was still conscious, because remember, you don't just knock people unconscious just by being like, oh, that's good. I hate that you knew that. I know. Chis, just remember that. I'm not going for anything with you. I don't know. I know. Cheers. Cheers, remember that. I'm not going for any of those with you.

So he did. So Bobby turned around to face lobe. Looked him in the fucking eye. His little cousin is like, what the hell are you doing? It's like that chair for you. Why are you beating me in the head? And he turned around, he looked at him, and that's when lobe smashed two more hard blows

onto his forehead. The fourth one created two more hard blows onto his forehead. The fourth one created a legitimate full pole with his forehead. I mean he like smashed through. Gross I know. Blood went everywhere because head wounds are crazy nice. So when all over both of them it was all over the inside of the car, the rental car, by the way, so they did not think this one through. Yeah, that was dope. Like, what do you do in it? Still, the boy who was conscious. Are you with a fucking hole in his head? Yeah, it happens.

Cool. But he's pleasing. He bleeds. Please, please, and I'm really sure. I think I've broken. I'm not. I don't know what happened. I need to get plugged in, I don't know, I need to charge.

So he's causing a scene. So low just yanks bobby into the back seat, He got plugged in, I don't know, in charge. So he's causing a scene. So Lowe just yanks Bobby into the back seat, which is like some next level shit. And he took the cloth they brought, and he just jimmed it as hard as he could down his throat and taped it over his mouth. I need to take a deep breath now.

Bobby's dead now. That was the end of that. So not exactly how they planned it, with both of them lovingly yanking on a rope together, I wasn't at all. What happened here? Now, Bobby's on the floor in the back seat, and the entire car is covered in blood. So they drove to that pre-determined place about 20 minutes away, Gary. It was only a bit past 6 p.m. and it wasn't dark out. And they were like, we need nightfall that just posted this body.

And then they were like, I'm hungry, are you hungry? It's starving, because like, you're gonna say, you know, so Liam holds grabbed some hot dogs and two root bears, and they just sat in the car and had some hot dogs and some root bears. Oh, fucking things to eat too. Yeah, you know, I know hot dogs.

I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don. I don. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don't know why. I don. I don. I don. I don. I don. I don. I don. I don. I don. I don. I don. I don. I don. I don. I don. I don. I don. I They rolled Bobby onto the blanket that they brought and carried him into the ditch. They removed his clothing that Leopold poured the bottle of hydrochloric acid on Bobby's face. Oh, God! This was intended to burn the skin and render him unidentifiable. Then, and this makes me question his supposed intelligence. This is weird. So, Leopold poured the rest of the acid on two bobby's nether reasons. He did this because someone told him once,

you could be identified by the goddamn shape of your junk. That's not true. It's not true. I'm here to stay for the record. Don't be true. Like they don't show up to a dead body,, oh my god, the face has been kneeled. They said, you have to be on the floor. It's like this.

He has no idea what they've heard. The fingerprints are going to be as no teeth. Oh, look at that penis. That's chill. I'm going to film what you really did. I was called the family. I was going down here. And I was definitely a pole who was like, this must be true.

Well, like, what do you know about this? Oh, we have pulled. Oh, we have pulled. I was just about to know. He then shoved the body into the ditch and threw into the drainage pipe, because he was like, no, we'll find it here. We'll find it there. No, there's spoiler, right?

And there's spoiler alert. I'm just kidding, guys, friend. This is a tense case. I don't want to like shock anybody too much. So as they walked back to the car, Leopold thought he heard something fall to the pavement. He was like, well, what was that? But he flushed the flush so they didn't see anything and he was like, oh, it's just my crazy imagination. So they drove back into town. They went to the drugstore, purchased

a postage stamp, and they sent the random letter to Bobby's father. Now, when I read this, I was like, see, went straight to the pharmacy. Were you both like completely covered in blood? What do you want in there? Right. And once this is the same pharmacist, I was like, what's he doing with that? So did he? And he was like, it's experiment. And he was like, okay. And they said, are you really still there? Still experiment? They're like, sure are. So that's kind of weird.

So they sent the letter, then they went back to Loeb's house. They burned all of Bobby's clothing, because they're trying to be smart about this. Then they went back to the drug store, and they called Jacob's, or Bobby's father, Jacob. And they wanted to let him know that the ransom letter was going to be on the way to Maharong. Like they were going to call him and be like, just stay by your middle. Because the ransom letter's coming.

And it's one of these osos uncles. Yeah. For sure. It's Loeb's uncle. Yeah. Damn. So Leopold is the one speaking because it's what we've done. Leopold spoke with Flora Frank's, the mother, because Jacob Frank's was out that evening. And he said, quote, this is Mr. Johnson. Which is kind of funny.

Johnson. What's a gem of telly of, that's not a lie. Your boy has been kidnapped. We have him and you need not worry. He is safe. He's not. But don't try to trace this call. We have him and you need not worry, he is safe. He's not alone. But don't try to trace this call. We must have money.

We will let you know tomorrow that what we want. We are keep the spartus funny. We are kidnappers and we need business. We need business, mister. And if you refuse us what we want, or try to report us to the police, we will kill your boy. Then they hung up on her and Liam pulled drove low home. Now on the way home, low realizing like was fiddling around in his pockets,

and he realized like, oh, should I have the chisel still in my pocket that's covered in blood? So you just, again, tossed it out the window. And at that moment when he tossed it out the window. And at that moment, when he tossed it out the window, a night watchman named Bernard Hunts just stepped out and picked it up. And I was like, huh, it's a chisel, carved and fun, weird. So he looked up and goes like, oh, there's that car

that I'm gonna remember, and I'm gonna report later and testify about it. Amazing. So, good job, Bernard. So well done, boys. Liam pulled, had a chauffeur, because of course he did. His name was Sven Englund. And he testified later that he saw the boys scrubbing

the interior of the rental car the next morning. And Liam pulled with weird and shifty about it and claimed he had just spilled wine in the car. Lots and lots of wine. So very coagulated wine. Very weird. I don't know what happened. Now it was ransom time.

So they set up that whole train business where Lowe left the ransom note in the telegraph box and the train's caboose. All that shit. So Leopold called Joe Jacob Franks the boy's father and said's like, I have a warning meetings. He's like, I should do. Can I do a flavor? And they said, quote, no, sir, you can't have any food. I'm not going to do it.

I'm not going to do it. I'm not going to do it. I'm not going to do it. I'm not going to do it. I'm not going to do it. I'm not going to do it. I'm not going to do it. I'm not going to do it.

I'm not going to do it. I'm not going to do it. I'm not going to do it. I'm not going to do it. I'm not going to do it. I'm not going to do it. I'm not going to do it. I'm not going to do it, I'm too late to do it. He's like, I have a morning meetings. I kind of shit to do. Can I do a flamin' And they said, quote, no, sorry, you can't have any more time. You must go immediately to Nick.

Okay. Now, where am I? So as they were going back, I was like, no, yeah, so for a no, he didn't. So as they're going back to the training station and they think they have the ship wrapped up that we're doing this, they just notice like the Chicago Daily Journal is out and it's saying on the front page that police had found a young boy's new body in a ditch.

Oh no. The body of Bobby Franks had been found less than 24 hours after these fuckers murdered and dumped him in there. He was unidentified at this moment but that was gonna change soon. This was obviously not part of the plan. He was not supposed to be found literally the next day. So they banned in the ransom plan now because they were like well now he's dead. He's gonna be identified whatever so whatever we don't need the ransom anymore we're just gonna go with this

Everyone in their respective homes was also talking about the murders because this was huge news So like both the pants are like can you believe that boy got murdered and they're like sitting there just like Getting off on this whole thing because everybody's talking about it. They're like stroking the typewriter But he's just sitting there just like typing and being like, I know he's crazy. He's like, hey, you want his wildness. So every month is wild, Luke. It's writing an editorial about it.

Sorry, I'm sick. And so Loan even talked to a reporter the next day and said, quote, if I was going to murder any boy, but he was just the kind of cocky little son of a bitch that I would pick. Wait, he said that. In an interview, like, no. Before he was caught.

Sure did. I was like, I didn't murder that boy. But if I did, I'd be old-jade before old-jade. Old-jade. It's been, if I did it. It would be that cocky little son of a bitch that I did, which was like, oh my god, you can't feel like that? Sweet little boy.

Who could have done that? Nope, he was just like, yeah, I would have done that too. That puts you like top of the list for some time, right? So also, this is like them discovering the ditch with Bobby's body in an unfortunately. So then it was revealed that the body was Bobby Franks and the hydrochloric acid had just discolored his face. It did not burn to skin. And the thing that lobes our Leopold thought he dropped,

but he couldn't find anything, was it glasses? That was just his distinctive tortoise show glass. I thought he knew it. So Thursday, May 29th, 1924, Leopold was about to take a group of schoolchildren to look at fucking birds. I told you it's weird. He's too old to get up about it. Because he's got it weird.

He's likes birds and now hates you. Just don't hurt our schoolchildren and then take them to see birds. That's weird. I don't know. I don't know. That's weird. It just keeps coming around. That's all. And police showed up at his home and said they wanted to take them to the state's attorney's office. And then they asked him,

he liable, do you have glasses? And he was like, sure do. And they were like, did you lose those glasses? And he was like, no. And they were like, where are they? And he was like, I don't know, I'm somewhere by house. So they were like, why don't you find those fucking glasses while we sit here? So people tended to look around and obviously could not find the glasses. And they were like, yeah, why don't you come with us real quick, because we have something to tell you. There's the glasses. So they brought both he and Logan for questioning separately.

Through the glasses matching handwriting samples from the envelopes and one of Leopold's maids confirming that he owned that stolen typewriter that the notes that the notes were typed on, the case was started to just close in on that pretty easily. And then Sven England the chauffeur. He came in and was like yeah the boys were driving a second unknown car on the daily murder's because Leopold's car was in the garage all day and Leopold had told the police I was driving my douche-cropped car all day. And he was like to round quote. He was not. He was in the garage all day because that

trucker like came up to him and was like, thanks Mike Briggs and then just dropped it off. So he remembered that. He was like he was a dick. He was at the garage all day. Because that fucker came up to him and was like, fix my brakes and then just dropped it off. So he remembered that. He was like, he was a dick. He dropped that car off to me to fix his brakes. I'm just a chauffeur. I don't pick scars. So I don't remember that. So he smashed their aisle.

I'll buy the pieces right there, which, like, could jump spin. In Bernard Hunt also testified that he was like, oh yeah, I saw the throw bloody truth this whole front of the fucking cup. We got a fast one of those. So on May 31st 10 days after the murder, Loeb, which is shocking, was the first one to break down and confess. And then Leopold followed. But each one of them put the shit on the other one. So like, Trayol, I do. Trulomge. They were just like no he didn't. He totally did the ship on the other one. So like, train all I have to. True love.

They were just like, no, he didn't. He totally didn't. I'm just the lucky. Leopold admitted that they did it purely for the thrill of it. He said to a reporter, quote, a thirst for knowledge is highly commendable. No matter what extreme pain or injury it may inflict upon others. A six-year-old boy is justified in pulling the wings from a fly.

If by doing so he learns without wings the fly is helpless. The fuck? That is not the same thing. Like no. It's also a really dark analogy. Also like no, as a six-year-old you should not be pulling wings off of things. That's not okay. Things off of things. There is in this jail cell where you're in the 15 piece suit. And he's like, Fran! He's like, can you bring me a temporary dinner? I can't.

I can't bring it. I hate this. So, the state's attorney, Robert Crow. Whoa! It's like bird! So the state's attorney, Robert Crowe. What? He looks like a bird. That's not Robert Crowe. Actually, that's the other guy. Robert Crowe's next.

There's Robert Crowe. He's more adorable. He was up against the defense attorney, which was, that's scary, man. Clarence Dero, which was a famous lawyer. He looks like a character Harry Potter. You live in Joyce? Yeah, yeah.

You saw that. Yeah, yeah, it's velvet. Yeah. I mean, that skin has seen some shit. And since then, that shit's our secret. And I like the little hair just a lot. I'm just thinking of his face and he's like, I'm sassy. I'm just gonna take a look. I. It's like, I'm sassy. I'm supposed to take a tan.

I'm just a lot of kind of sassy. And then this adorable man's situation all in itself. I'm not going to see him as you jeep. I like his glasses. I'll go with it. So they were looking for the death penalty against them. So July 21st, 1924, they began trial. And it wasn't a matter of proving their innocence because they confessed.

But they wanted to see if they're age, which at the time they were 18 and 19 years old. They were young. Yeah, they were super young. Wow. They wanted to prove that they're age, they're confessions, the fact that they said, like they pleaded guilty, and the possibility of getting them denied insane, they were not insane. William Allenson White, the president of the American Psychiatric Association, testified that they

were both completely neglected as children by their parental figures, which were, yes, they were. And they said that the abuse from the governance probably had something to do with them turning into new jessles. Hugh Patrick, president of the American Neurological Suicide Association, William Cron and Harold Singer, who were authors of the insanity of the law, and Archibald Church, professor of mental disease

and medical jurisprudence at Northwestern University, all said that neither one of them had any indication of insanity or mental defects. They all were like, no, where the gods and goddesses of this subject and they are fucking sane. They did it, they did it exactly. I was like, woo-woo. So September 10th, 1924, the sentencing was broadcast across the city. Their age is what kept them from the gallows, because they did decide not to do the death penalty. I'm like, I'm like, I'm glad though.

Like live with them. Yeah, live, live. Good. Think about it every day. They each got 99 years for the kidnapping and then life in prison for the murder. The judge said, quote, the court believes that it is within his province to decline to impose the sentence of death on person who are not full age.

This determination appears to be in accordance with the progress of criminal law all over the world and with the dictates of Enlightenment humanity. See. In 1936, inside of State's Bill Prison, James Day, a prisoner serving a sentence for Glenn Grand Larsony, stabbed Lowe in the shower room, and despite trying to fix him on that, he died at 30 years old of his wounds. Yes!

Leopold served 33 years in prison and then got paroled in 1950. Oh, shit! Yeah. He moved to Puerto Rico. He got a degree in social work at the University of Puerto Rico. He wrote about fucking birds. And now he's talking about tropical birds. Because they don't have a car.

And then the damn light. He did. Fuck that car. And in 1961, he got married. Oh, fucking married him. Yeah, I don't know. Some lady. The bird.

The bird. A bird, man. That's what happened. In August, 2019, 1971, he died at the ripe, young age of 66 of a heart attack in Puerto Rico. Good to join that heart attack. So it's good. I'm glad your heart rebelled against you.

And just to end on something, two fun facts. In letters from prison, Lobe referred to his parents as mopsie and popsy. That's like disturbing. Hate that. Leopold and lobe were called dicky and babe, throughout the trial, and I hate that, and now you all have to know that too. And I just didn't want to be alone with that.

Dicky and babe. Who called? I'm not so sorry. You don't really know. But there's some whispering to each other during the trial. There's them with great cheekbones. They really look so much alike. That looks contours. He got the Kim K-ballot. He's really good. And that is good. and K-Pallet, you do it too. And that is good. It's true. So that is not the story of Leopold and Blue.

Woo! Woo! Woo! I'm so happy you're here. I'm so happy you're here. Woo! You did so good. Thank you.

I'm sweating. Same, and I'm like Alright, so now I need to like shake it out for a second. I'm like there. Oh look at the picture of Ash All right guys, so I'm gonna talk to you this girl from the Todd I hand her my notes because my nails are too fucking long to type with So I know I almost took a video for a last time to put in this slideshow being like it was hilarious. It's really fucking hard. I was dedicated to her because it was very not a good in its type whatever. Okay, so Thalmaton was an actress in the mid-1920s and 30s who was found dead in her car on the morning of December 16th, 1935. She was 29 years old,

so she died really old. Yeah, very sad. I'm like trying to figure out how to comfortably hold this. I feel like I'm reading you like a bit. I'm just worried. I'm like what's that? It's not a 10. I'm like a very long-form woman. Can you start snuffing next to me? So, what better thing to talk about at this live show than possibly murdered actress. That's why I asked myself, yeah. That's why we're here for you. Yeah, so we're going to go back to the beginning and I'll be using this really beautiful, but like gruesome picture of what happened.

So, Falma was born July 29th, 1906, and Lawrence Massachusetts. Oh! Donna Boston's role. That's two-fifth. Her parents were John and Alice, which are like, I just like those babies. Yeah. This is respectable.

Thomas Dad was involved in the town politics as superintendent of the streets, which sounds like he has street cred. But really, we have just one alternative. So he's pretending to have the streets. He's running those streets. I think he just like was in charge of like what went on the streets.

And her mom was probably a stand-up mom because it was like 1906 and she couldn't even wear a pants yet, so. The film did really good in school and after high school she went to college to pursue her dream of becoming a teacher. She was a mess fuck. The film was mom really wanted her to compete in beauty pageant. She was like, you're fucking gorgeous. What are you doing?

Deja. So she did that. What are you doing? Deja. She's like, it's don't waste her time. You need to try to do it. It finds your pretty. Well, I'm just saying what her mom was like.

She was pretty. So, the one was like, yeah, I'm sure, whatever. And she actually won the title of Miss Massachusetts in 1925. Oh, wow. And she also competed in the Miss America Patrick, which is fancy. She didn't have the point of that, but it's fine. So while she was there, she caught the eye

of some Hollywood scouts. She started acting in short films, which they were primarily like silent films at the time, but then later on, she gets to start talking in her films. We don't, you know, we've been up close. If you go to the next slide, this is her and Zazoo Pits. They were like hair together. That's actually a picture of me and I was like,

I see the real thing. That's the recording of the part that I was doing to. That's kind of what my told you slightly. I love it. That's a good idea. So how Roach was the producer, slash director, that had the idea of setting them up together because he thought it was time for a female comedy duo. It was.

Just progressive as fuck. Yeah. He also worked with Moral and Party if you're familiar with them. Yeah. So at Thelman's, as we were like the female version of them, I just progressive this fuck. He also worked with Moral and Party if you're familiar with them. Yeah. So, at Filman's, as we were like the female version of them. I'm sorry, I suck. Zazuin Thelma did films together, like show business, the pajama party, which I feel like that's the pajama party.

For sure, you know, that saucy robe. That's very stuffy. And they also played in a sleep in the feet. Which sounds painful. What? You're talking to me to love in me. Sazu and Thalma did, over a dozen films together in just three years. But Sazu wanted more money because she was like, I'm also, I'm a great silent actress.

Very expressive with my face. And Halrinch was like, yeah, I don't want to give you more money. So, Sazu left. And she was replaced by a next slide, please. Patsy Kelly. Who is also you? I'm so happy. Oh, again. Perfect.

They did films like Beauty and the Bus and Three Chumps ahead in 1935. Although she started in silent films, like I said, a film I went on to talking in her films, which is good. Eventually they started calling her the ice cream blonde in hot-totty. Hot-totty? That's what you're asking me. So, my hot-totty, yeah. Do you?

It's what. I do, I call you that. I call you that. Fine, you're back. I'm talking about only such a hot-totty. That's me. So, Thelma started a film called The Corsair, which was directed by Roland West.

And if you wanna see him, I can go to the next slide. I do wanna see him. He's like nothing special. So. Oh my God. I can't be bothered to think of him. I really hate that so much.

It's hard, but he doesn't feel like anything. He doesn't really hate that. So, he does hard, but it doesn't feel like it. It really feels like it. So, yes, he does. He has like a lack of brow. But that's gone over here. I'm worried I'm confused. So, Ilma thought he was awesome. She was like, you're a hotie hotie. I'm like myself.

And they started hanging on the low. And by hanging on the low, I mean, he was married and... They were having a fair. Not a great one. On the low. Their affair was really often on again so when Felma met Pat, I think it's Dissicco and I want to say that because he sucks. So that's just what I'm just sick of. It's really good to check up. I'm gonna say Dissicco. Whatever. And Fel and Love, I wrote Fel and Love by Shark because it doesn't sound like love to me.

She was free to do what she wanted because she wasn't tied down to this man, so he was married. So she needs to say go and they decide to get married in 1932 and they have a straight up fucking nightmare of a marriage. Yes, so I'm going to go to the next slide. He's kind of a babe but he's a fucking asshole. What a fucking dude. He's already not having fun. He's like, this is like a dick. He's already not having fun. Yeah. Because it's like a good little last.

Selma, unfortunately at this point, was basically addicted to diet pills. Because previously, when she had started acting, they put a clause into her contract, called the potato clause, where she couldn't gain more than five pounds, or she'd get fired. What? I thought that was just like everywhere I go, I need a potato clause? Where she couldn't gain more than five pounds or she'd get fired. What? I thought that was just like everywhere I go, I need a potato.

That's what I thought. Well, I'm putting that in my contract. I'm gonna be like everywhere I go, I need some form of potato. Hash friends all the fucking time. A potato french fries. And that's so many options. I wish I got a wish. Well, the judges didn't even need ainoes because they were like no much to look

about, which is sad. I know, that's all in the 30s. Also she wasn't fucking about. But whatever. I digress. I lost my place because I said sorry. What's the impossible thing? Tata and Patti do as well.

So Thalma and Pat fought a shit ton. She was on diet pills and also they drank a ton, which is not a good combination. Never. Never a good combination. 9 out of 10 times their fights ended really badly. One time she broke past nose. And one time this is really fucked up and I'm going to say this word wrong. But she had to have an emergency appendectomy. Appendectomy? Yes.

Thank you. Thank you. For obvious reasons, the marriage didn't last long. And they got divorced after like two years. Quick fun fact, he was also married to my girl Gloria Vanderbilt. Oh, shit. And he was really, really awful to her too. If you watch like a documentary, you stalks all that.

She's like, hey, beat me all the time. Oh, it's not nice. It's okay. She's so casual. So casual, yeah. So it doesn't work out with him. They get divorced and she starts hanging out with Roland Westigan.

That may read you guys on the low. And they decide to open her cafe together, which was called the El Mataux Cafe. It was right along the Pacific Coast Highway. It opened up in the summer of 1934 at 175-75 Pacific Coast Highway and it was just a huge among the filmers like fellow actors and actresses. Like anybody who was anybody was at the fucking cafe 24-7. There was private areas upstairs where the more leakess could go hang out.

You're looking at it so distantly. You're like, I wouldn't go there. I'm like, fuck you, I wouldn't be allowed in there. I wouldn't be allowed in there. I wouldn't be allowed in there. I wouldn't be allowed in there. I wouldn't be allowed in there. I wouldn't be allowed in there.

I wouldn't be allowed in there. I wouldn't be allowed in there. I wouldn't be allowed in there. I wouldn't be allowed in there. I wouldn't be allowed in there. I wouldn't be allowed in there. I wouldn't be allowed in there. I wouldn't be allowed in there.

I wouldn't be allowed in there. I wouldn't be allowed in there. I wouldn't be allowed in there. I wouldn't be allowed in there. I wouldn't be allowed in there. I wouldn't be allowed in there. I wouldn't be allowed in there. I was like, did I have to do something to you? Did I have to do a letter in? Yes, oh my gosh, not. So, elite rooms upstairs, and then there might have been some gambling going on, but that was legal, so let's not talk about it. I totally agree with that. There was definitely someone who I'm like, well, I'm... Thelma loves being there. She was always working behind the counter, she would make change for people, she would put drinks together, a gin fizz was apparently really popular back then, and

you could get it for cheap, which had both ones at the very 20s. And there's a ton of pictures of her at the restaurant, and they were always like, surfacing and newspapers and magazines. In October of 1935, the Ellie Times reported that the cafe was doing so well, and the film was planning on doing so well, and what Felma was planning on building an addition, and was also ready to spend about $10,000 on improvements, which in today's money would have been $140,000. Damn, I typed that to look it up. I took me about 25.

Thanks to Typed Up until the key. So that's chill. I'll have it at $48,000 to you. Do you imagine? So, the weird part about this whole deal is that Selma opened the cafe with not only Roland, but his fucking wife as well. Which is weird. You can say what about that, that's weird.

Yeah. So, um, her and his wife was Joel Carmen, who apparently was like the chillest of home girls because they're like, they all also lived either, I found multiple things, they either lived together in an apartment above this, or if you see like that house thing up there, one of them lived up there and then one of them lived on the bottom. So we think they were like straight up rumies or like straight up neighbors. Yeah, that's the chillest white pepper. Yeah, far too close to the house.

Especially like, that's your man's side chick. Like, you don't need to be that close to. No, it's the chillest white pepper. Especially like that's your man's side chick. Like you don't need to be that close to. No, not at all. So when Thalman Rollins Affairs at one of its often points, she heads over to the coconut grove, which I want to go there. And she runs into Lucky Luciano. No. Yes. I think he's a fucking bitch She literally was like I question everything You know what it is when I was young younger I was a fucking obsessed with mob lives And I was like that requires a lot Go too. And he's my friend. I don't want to get into that with my brother's fate.

I don't want to get into that. So he was a well-known knock-out who was involved in all kinds of shooting business, including being the official head of the Genobbee's crime family, which shit. And Chano, he is literally considered to be the father of modern, organized crime in the US. So maybe it's because he's doing some shit that makes the cow or that you're like, not funny. Let's get that head looking for space and be like, no.

No. Why? Like, he has a big head. And he's got the guy who so excited. I'm so excited. I'm so excited. I'm so excited. I'm so excited. I'm so excited. I'm so excited. I'm so excited.

I'm so excited. I'm so excited. I'm so excited. I'm so excited. I'm so excited. I'm so excited. I'm so excited. I'm so excited.

I'm so excited. I'm so excited. I'm so excited. I'm so excited. I'm so excited. I'm so excited. I'm so excited. I'm so excited. I'm so excited. I'm so excited. I'm so excited. What are they doing? So, he and I said, and here's a total babe, because I've already got point.

I feel like they have an exciting one. I heard it down, sorry to say that. You gotta read it. I said he would have had me swim, swim, swim, and all over the cold in the morning. I'm sorry. Except for, forget I tell, forget I said that when I tell you this love story,

because it's not beautiful. I'm shocked. It's like a really nice meet Q. So, he used to use Thelma, and he's like, hey, good looking, what's going on? this love story because it's not beautiful. It's a really nice meet-cute. So he sees Thelma and he's like, hey good looking what's going on. Come have glass of champagne with me. Hot stuff. That's how people talked about that. That's how we went. He did that. He did that. He was like, oh I gave up drinking because my ex, my ex husband, like, sold me all the time and we used to get to try to argument so I thought that was bad.

So no thanks. And he fucking grabs her and pours a bottle of tonnbury on down her throat. I'm so ashamed. Straight on. I don't know. I feel like well. I wouldn't be that bad. I'm I don't know how to do that. I don't know how to do that. I don't know how to do that.

I don't know how to do that. I don't know how to do that. I don't know how to do that. I don't know how to do that. I don't know how to do that. I don't know how to do that. I don't know how to do that. I don't know how to do that.

I don't know how to do that. I don't know how to do that. I asked Monster, wow, got her connections to much stronger diet bills, which I just put there, not fucking diet bills. They're doing like that on the back of you. It's fine. It's crossed over straight up. Yeah, that's a whole sort of love story for you. Which as you can see, it's kind of felt this thing at this point. It's not that bad.

She's not that bad. She's not that bad. So Lucky was pretty much, if you're thinking he was solely in this because Thelma was this young gorgeous, ridiculously successful, Charlotte, your half right. He thought she was hot. He was like, you're successful. But also, he definitely wanted to use the unused third floor

of her cafe as like some illegal casino rundown thing. That's the official name of the project. He wanted to put a casino up, yeah. But she didn't really want to do that. So he was trying to coerce her in doing that. But let's get you back on track now that you're familiar with the shady characters in the film's life. On the night of December 14, 1935, he almost getting ready to go to a party being thrown for Stanley Lupito by his daughter, Aida, who was also an actress. I think she was like 16. She got dressed in, let's hold,

a moth and potato moth. She got dressed in a potato moth and silver evening down with an expensive mink wrap and was decked out in gorgeous jewels. You. Yeah. Me. And a full. Look at this mink wrap. She was about to get into the limel where her mom and her driver and the repeaters were waiting for her.

Roll-in yelled after her. You remember the married guy that she's like, oh no, not again with. Because then he's like her neighbor's left for me he's like you better be home by 2 a.m. she's like fuck you all the moment 2 o' 5 that's a direct quote get it though well she was out of the party guess who she runs it to no is it this part?

it's to sicko oh to sicko and to sicko wasn't fucking invited to. No, it's DeSicco. Oh DeSicco. And DeSicco wasn't fucking invited to this party. So it's like, Larry here, and he was there with one of her fucking friends. So they get into this heated argument that everybody is like witnessing, so that's my room. And also, apparently, he had asked Ida to not only invite him to this party, but to see him next to Thelma if he did get invited

because he knew it was gonna piss her off. He's trying to stir some shit. Yeah, exactly. Also it was at the Troca d'Ara on Sun Sepul of Art. That's what the party is. It is because. I think they met there in the middle of Harvard rules once. For the rules!

Oh, wow! So yeah! Other than fighting with Jessica, Thelma, all her friends friends that she was excited for the upcoming holidays and despite downing a couple of cocktails of dumb burial she was like getting a buzz on but she was by no means sloppy or incoherent she could handle her fucking liquor probably because of all the time bills what? so later during the party she sat at Sid Braumins table and he was really fancy.

He made the tiny, brown, and the Chinese food. Yes, thank you. Yeah, we're from California. She comes from California. She's cool. She's so cute. That's amazing. Thank you.

You're welcome. That's awesome. That's so cool. Damn. I'm glad you're sitting there. I'm glad you're here. What did he do? That blew my mind every time. Yeah, I really don't.

So she says at his table, and she's hanging out with him for like a half hour, before she asked him to call Rollwood and tell him that she'd be home soon, because, you know, she had to be home at two. But so she gets into the car. Her chauffeur said that she was unusually quiet on the way home,

because normally she was very chatty. And he dropped her off at 3.45 am. So not even close to 2 am. You know, yeah, real fuck you. I'm on my way home. He offered to walk her up the stairs, but she declined and she was like, night night. And the next day her maid, Mae Whitehead, was the month to find her dead body at 9.30 a.m. on the day of her home. She found Thelma slumped over if you go to the next

side and her Lincoln, Faton and the driver's meet. She still looks, I mean her hair looks like her hair looks great and she's got that main coat on if you're gonna die that's what you want to wear. I mean her hair looks like a hair looks great and she's got that main coat on if you're gonna die That's what you want to wear I'm saying, just thoughts So obviously the driver's side door was wide open when she found it which is like kind of weird So May said that the doors to the garage where Thelma's car was parked it was actually Rollins wife's garage where she's the car was parked which is weird The door to the garage was closed,

but it was unlocked. So after realizing Thelma was not just asleep, she rushed down to the cafe and he got rolling and she's like, oh, she's dead! She's dead! I don't know why she has the next one also. Everybody did, so do you know that? The California. That's totally weird. Yeah, totally. Um, so... Yeah, the corner of the world, the film may have been dead for 12 hours before she was discovered. But a couple witnesses say that wasn't possible, because they had seen her Sunday afternoon,

which is creepy, because the corner said she's supposed to be dead. Because I got confused. I was on the phone. Martha Ford said that she got a call from Felma and Felma had asked her if it was okay if she show up to a party that was supposed to happen that day. It was Martha's party wearing the clothes that she'd worn the night before, which was very unlike Felma.

Like she obviously, it's fucking an actress and has plenty of clothes. She's fancy and she is going to be like photographed. So why would you be photographed in a single fit place? I mean, I wouldn't do that, but she wouldn't. She would not. So Martha's like, yeah, that's fine. And Thalma's like, you just wait until I walk in if you'll fall dead. But really she was already dead Supposedly choice words. Yeah choice breaks Out of she said you'll fall dead because she was bringing a surprise chest, 100% believed that she had spoken with Elma and not in a posture when she told the authorities this.

And then, Joel Carmen, Roland's wife, said that she saw Elma driving Sunday morning with a handsome stranger in the passenger seat, which is convenient if she killed her because it's interesting that she saw her elsewhere, you know, setting up a little, seems fishy, seems fishy. So although Thelma's death was officially ruled in accident, many people disagree. The police said that she was either warming up her car to get warm or like going somewhere, or maybe she had planned on sleeping there because the role of Polly Lacher out at the house and she was a moment to him. And she died of carbon monoxide poisoning. But there's a few red flags. It's not that simple. First of all, when Thelma's mom was informed of her daughter's death, she screamed at the top of her lungs. My daughter's been murdered. Oh, I've said not to scream at the top of her.

I'm sorry. I think I was in here. She screamed. I'm sorry. Immediately, Pat DeSicco is considered a suspect because he's a douchebag. He's a sickum. And also he's your ex-exesbent. And I'm really bad at this today. And it just had a public fight, is what I was going to say.

At the party, and everybody saw them. Lucky Luciano also had his time in the hot seat because he wanted to put that gambler in and apparently like days bruvia somebody saw them out to dinner and he was asking her about putting the casino on the third floor and she was like over my dead body and apparently he said that can be arranged. Ooh that's a a mobster shit. And also, he, at the time that her body got discovered, was on a flight out of California at 7.45 AM. Can be, can be. And he never returned to California. I'm interested in doing enough. It can be. Yeah. So maybe while she'd been involved with

him, she found out something that she shouldn't have also and that's why he decided to kill her. And he was probably worried that she was like going to sink his mob ship. I didn't like taking his mob ship. His mob ship, you know, that kind of... His vision also fell on Roland West because he was the one who won Yeld at her that she better be back at two o'clock. Two locked her on the house which led to her fucking death anyways. And three, he was super jealous and possessive and Thelma was out partying without him and doing her thing which probably pissed him off.

And after May had found Thelma, Rollard could have had time to make Thelma's death appear like an accident before the authorities got there because he was other than May the first person to discover her dead body. And some people say that on his deathbed, Roland admitted that he had a lot more to do with her death than he initially let on. People always do that shit when they're on the deathbed. Like, they don't get any real details. They're just like, maybe that happened.

I might have had something to do with it. I know. I don't know. You guys are not at all. You still miss the light. Yeah. I know. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all.

You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all.

You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all.

You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are all. You guys are't, like she had to have got somewhere in between the party and the car. Yeah. The car. It's a really weird thing. And so she, like nobody knows where she would have gone, unless maybe she went into the cafe and not going to explain it, but it's a little weird. Number two is that according to the medical examiner in the corner,

Thelma's only bodily injury was a split lip and a chip tooth, which was presumably from like, her face on the steering wheel, once you passed out. But some people say that they got bruising along her neck and that some people say, she had a broken nose. And if you look, I didn't agree with you here

because it's a little gruesome, but her autopsy photo, if you look at her neck, it does kind of look like there's bruising. It could be like her heart. That's what somebody said, but then somebody said that it wasn't enough time to set in. I didn't look for it for a second. These animals can't be taken too much. I'm just throwing up.

I'm just throwing up. I'm just throwing up. I'm just throwing up. I'm just throwing up. I'm just throwing up. I'm just throwing up. I'm just throwing up. I'm just throwing up. I'm just throwing up. I'm just throwing have like passed out that office microphone. I wouldn't have passed out that hard to like break your nose

by hitting the steering wheel. Yeah. Again, after an investigation, a grand jury probe found that there was no evidence of murder and that the homicide bureau decided to close the case officially listed it as an accidental death with suicidal tendencies, but all of Felma's friends and family were like, there's no way she would have killed herself.

It doesn't make any sense. She was in like the prime of her career. So nobody knows what happened for sure. To 29-year-old, Holly would start with Felma Tom. Oh, you go to the next time, Dr. Fuhrer, if I die, I better not have any fucking case. I'll be so pissed on my life. If you die, what would I do? I'm a mortal, but if I die, it's my life. I want that. I want that.

So many flowers. All right, so that is the end of our show. Thank you. Yay! Thank you guys so much for following us. We're gonna stick around and we'll say hi and do whatever. I think we're gonna go in the restroom. We'll hang out for however long you guys want to.

I have to wake up at like 3-15 to feed my newborn anyway, so let's do this. But I'm sorry. My baby was in like an hour. I wake up at like 3-15 to feed my newborn anyway, so I'd like to do this. Sorry. My baby was in like an hour. So, and if you guys want, we have t-shirts in the back that my wonderful friend Vosko designed. And John, that beautiful man, creature back then, is going to be selling them. And he might cook you dinner.

I feel definitely so you're sure. So if you want to go do that, feel free and we'll see you guys soon. Bye! Hey, Prime Members! You can listen to Morvid, Early, and Add Free on Amazon Music. Download the Amazon Music app today, or you can listen ad-free with Wondery Plus and Apple podcasts. Before you go, tell us about yourself by completing a short survey at Wondery.com slash survey.