Mum's The Word! The Parenting Podcast - Roxie Nafousi

Episode Date: August 21, 2021

Welcome to Mums the Word! The Parenting Podcast with Ashley James. Our first guest is the wonderful Roxie Nafousi, who opens up about her journey as a first time mum from finding out she was pregnant, her experience of pregnancy and why she chooses not to breastfeed. We also hear more from Ashley about her own story and how she has found the new world of motherhood.---A Create Podcast Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

hello hello hello welcome from me ashley james welcome to my brand new podcast mum's the word parenting podcast do you know what when i found out i was pregnant i was like i will not be a mummy blogger i will not have a mum podcast and here i am with six month old son like and here I am with a six-month-old son, like, here's my mummy podcast. But I am so excited to be able to basically just share my journey and talk about my journey and get you guys involved as well, as I feel like motherhood, parenthood in general, is just, nothing could have prepared me for the amazing highs, but also the really confusing and conflicting feelings and the lows as well so I feel like I just wanted to create a podcast where nothing is off topics there's no taboos and also I get some help and advice from different celebrity

guests people of interest and also hear from you guys so So I'm really, really excited to kick things off with something that I think we all struggle with, or I definitely am currently struggling with this week more than ever is the mum identity. Because, you know, before I was pregnant, I was DJing, travelling around the world. I was also like, I never want to be be a mom so that just shows that you never quite know what life will throw at you and to be honest I have found it really difficult to kind of know my know my place and also to figure out the bits of the old Ashley who is obviously the same Ashley what bits I want to keep and what bits I like no longer serve me and it's so hard because I'm still coming to terms with being a mum and all the feelings that come with that and

I think the biggest surprise for me was as someone that calls himself a feminist and considers himself really progressive I realized that I was actually like really misogynistic about mums and society in general I think has this kind of negative attitude towards mums in the way that you know dads are praised for kind of parenting really you know people call it daddy daycare or babysitting their children or being hands-on dads whereas we're kind of just expected to get on with it all whilst recovering and I don't know I've just never experienced change like it you know changing my routine my relationship my friendships my social life my body work my sex life basically just about everything has changed and I feel a little bit out of control

I feel disorientated and let's be honest honest, change is hard. I found leaving university hard. I hated it. I never wanted to leave uni. And here I am now as a mum, more in love than ever. But also, it's just hard, isn't it? And the reason I want to talk about the mum identity is because I feel like there's so much sort of guilt and shame and feeling of being good enough but also I really find that I just don't have the time to do everything that I used to do and I'm such a perfectionist I want to be a good mum but I also want a career and then off the back of that I'm desperately trying to scramble to have time to have friendships which sounds ridiculous and have self-love or time to myself that doesn't revolve around trying to catch up on work and babies and I think it's just good to talk about

because the mum identity is something from chatting to lots of you that everyone seems to struggle with and it's got nothing to do with how good of a mother we are or how much we love our children. I actually learned this word called matricence, which is a bit like adolescence, but for mums. And it basically is this shift, like obviously our bodies have changed, our routines have changed, everything's changed. And it's that psychological development that we have when we become a mum. And even just knowing that it's a word kind of helped me because I was like, oh, it's not just me that is struggling with all of these things. So without further ado, I have an amazing guest to help me basically tackle the mum identity.

I am so excited to have today's guest, my debut guest, Roxy Nafusi. She is a self-development coach and manifesting expert. She's actually just been described by Forbes as the manifesting queen, which is just the coolest title ever. She runs workshops to over 500 people. She has an amazing podcast called The Moments That Made Me. And last but definitely not least, she is a mum to Wolf, who has just turned two years old. Hi, Roxy. Hi, my love. Thank you so much for having me. Thank you for joining. I'm honestly so excited because when we speak about the mum identity, I feel like we actually had pretty similar journeys in that we met someone and had a baby quite quickly, but also that we were kind of living a kind of party lifestyle. So let's start with what were your first feelings when you found out

you were pregnant? Oh my gosh. So when I first found out I was pregnant, basically what had happened was I had met Wade and on Raya, which was a dating app, and we kind of, it was very whirlwind and he kind of didn't get on his flight home essentially he was traveling through through London and so we were kind of just in that kind of bubble where he didn't really know anyone in London he moved in with me after five days and you know the honeymoon phase just incredible and we went to he went back to Australia to get his visa to move here and after he went back we met in Dubai which is where my parents live and we had a holiday and at the end of the trip I started feeling um just really tired a bit down um and really flat like my

my mood was just low and I we flew back and I had lunch with my sister and her kids and I said you know it's so weird like usually after I come back from Dubai when I'm seeing my parents I'm always so rejuvenated and energized and you know I'm in this new relationship I should be feeling really good but it's really really flat. And she was like, you sure you're not pregnant? I was like, no, there's definitely no way. And she said, I'll just take a test. We went to Sainsbury's with my niece, you know, and got the test and went home and they were, Wade was there and they were unloading the shopping. And I went to the bathroom and I just went, what does the cross mean? What does the cross mean? And I just had silence. And then my sister just goes, you're pregnant. And I just burst into tears, like

uncontrollable sobbing, because I, I knew for me that in that moment, I was, I knew I was always gonna then, I was going to become a mother, right? So there was no question for me, but I was felt completely just like, just couldn't understand how this was happening. Didn't feel ready at all. And I, my kind of mental health very rapidly declined, like really almost within days because I felt like I just didn't even know this guy and he, and Wade didn't really know anyone in London. And I was, how was I going to have a baby with him? And how was I going to, I was still smoking at the time, you know, I was smoking 25 cigarettes a day and still partying and I just felt totally unprepared I wonder if anyone ever feels prepared do you know what I mean because I feel like even when you really really want a baby

the moment you find out you're pregnant like I do feel like it's such a there's so many questions of like how am I going to cope? Am I going to be a good mom? What will I have to change? What can I keep? And I don't know about you, but I found that from the moment I announced my pregnancy, I was kind of inundated with advice. A lot of it I didn't want or ask for.

And it was mainly negative. Did you find that? Do you know what? I have so many nieces and nephews and so I've seen how much how every child is different and I already was felt very aware that any advice I was getting given was coming from a good place but that it didn't wasn't going to really make a difference to how I parented because in the end it was going to be my journey so I did find that people wanted to part their knowledge but I maybe I also didn't have as big a social media platform as you I feel like you're a much nicer person than me because

you're like I really saw it came from a good place whereas I was like stop giving me advice I think people just really there is a definite what I do get the sense of is like there is kind of this real bond with amongst mothers where we have I think it's really different depending on your platform but I definitely get the sense that it was like you're joining some club and I quite liked that and so I liked hearing everybody's advice but I never put I also never picked up a book um like a parenting book that wasn't definitely wasn't my vibe yeah that's interesting it wasn't really my thing either because I very much I feel like as someone that has always loved to travel and love to experience life and kind of take it as it comes I found like the over planning and maybe that's also why I didn't like all the advice

because I was like I kind of just want to like figure things out on my own and have my own journey totally look and there is no judgment because everybody has their own experience and some people really prefer to be planners but I would definitely say that even things that you know like going into childbirth, or thinking about breastfeeding, and all those things, I just knew that anything I thought I was going to do when I was pregnant was not going to be what I would end up doing. So it was like, there was no point in attaching to an idea. Yeah, that's really interesting. Because I personally, like I said, I didn't really plan a lot. But even what the kind of ideas that I had

in my head about so many things have actually, they're so different because I feel like once you have the baby there, your kind of maternal instinct just sort of kicks in. Totally, totally. So let's talk about obviously when Wolf was born, how did you feel about your mum identity and how did you come to terms with becoming a mom? Oh, so I really didn't have the kind of wolf arrived and I was madly in love. That's the truth. And in fact, after such a horrific, I suffered such extreme depression during my pregnancy

and the self-loathing was paramount. I mean, I'd locked myself in my house essentially for about six months um I come for eight I gained 30 kilos it was just I was in the worst place I've ever been mentally and when Wolf arrived after this kind of 36 hour labor I I they tried to put him on my boob and I was just like, get him off me. That was, I just was like, I can't, I felt sick. I was just like, I couldn't. And I found the bonding really difficult in the beginning because I didn't love myself. It was so, you know, and I really, this is why I talk so much about self-love now, because I honestly had so little love for myself and my own world. I didn't even, I didn't have the love to even like

give to what was around me and even my own son. And of course I, not that to say that I was like completely, it wasn't like there was a negative feeling towards him, but it just wasn't that, that love that people describe that kind of, oh my goodness, he's in my arms. This is the best thing ever. It was, it was definitely not that. I love that you said that, by the way, because I was waiting for that moment. I actually love my pregnancy. But I, the childbirth was something that I really wasn't prepared for. I don't think you ever can be prepared for it. I felt like I was going to have this really like spiritual amazing experience where I was like so connected to mother nature and it was good because I wasn't afraid of it but it was quite a traumatic 18 hour experience so

when you say 30 plus hours I'm like oh my god you deserve a medal um but I was waiting I was like this is the moment I remember that feeling of like pure relief when Alf came out of me and then I was like waiting for the moment and they kind of like put this like wrinkly wet little thing on my chest and I was a bit like is that it like I don't I just want to I remember thinking like I still love my dog more I just want to go home and see my dog um but obviously it grows and now I love him to death but I am it's really nice to hear that somebody else didn't feel that instant love at first sight totally and I think it's really it's definitely like you know the movies and people talk and some people and a lot of people do really feel that and that's incredible but I just think it doesn't happen for everyone um

and for me it, it took time. Like, I don't know, do you remember that feeling when you take them home from the hospital as well? You're like, wait, wait, wait, you're just gonna let me just take this child home but we don't even know what we're doing. And it was just like, it's so wild, the idea that when you leave hospital

that you're just, that's it, you're then just responsible. And I had a very different experience with breastfeeding than you in that I really didn't enjoy it and I really struggled um I really struggled with it I think I did a few weeks and then I pumped exclusively and then I went on to formula did you feel a lot of like pressure or judgment or even guilt because you couldn't breastfeed? You know what? Not at all. I think there are so many women that don't or can't. And I think it's incredible that we do have formula that really works.

That to me, you know, it's not breast is best, but fed is best. is best and you know it's like I knew he was healthy like thank thank the universe he was loved he was in a safe home he was in a safe environment it didn't matter to me how he was being fed as long as he was being fed and I really um I really try to avoid any judgment of myself or others and that's just how I live my life and it definitely really helped me during that time and my decision around breastfeeding I think that's amazing and probably so comforting to people who are listening who maybe couldn't or even didn't want to because I do feel like for some reason how you feed your child and how much your child sleeps seems to be this really divisive topic of conversation and there is so much judgment I'd say on both sides and I'm a bit like you I was formula fed myself

so whilst I breastfeed I'm also fully aware that formula is amazing and I'm fit and healthy as can be and I was a formula baby. So, um, I love that you kind of, that wasn't part of your struggle with feeding. Totally. And also I was very much on a journey to get myself back to feeling as good as I could mentally. That was really a big priority for me. I thought, okay, if I'm going to like step up and be like the best mother I can be, I need to be the best that I can be mentally, physically, emotionally. And so I really needed to make sure that I could, you know, for me, it was really important to start eating healthily straight away, to start moving my body, going for walks

and doing whatever felt right for me at the time. And if that meant not breastfeeding, then that was what I was going to do. Welcome to Paranormal Activity with me, Yvette Fielding, a brand new podcast bringing together people's real ghost, extraterrestrial and paranormal stories, as well as getting some inside details from those who study the supernatural. I'll be listening through your paranormal stories every week and try to understand them, as well as chatting about my own encounters with an occasional paranormal investigator too. You can find us wherever you get your podcasts from including

Apple Podcasts, Spotify and Acast. Just search for Paranormal Activity with Yvette Fielding. you mentioned that you felt depressed during your pregnancy how did you feel like you suffered from postnatal depression or what was kind of like your journey to the position that you're in now which is just incredible where you're not only clearly have a lot of self-love but also you're helping other people to find it as well oh thank you well you know I think actually strangely enough I don't know if this had anything to do with it but I had my placenta encapsulated and I really think it helped me with my mood afterwards because I um although I was you know there was still I was still on a journey of self-love of course it wasn't like it went but I didn't feel I felt actually really hopeful after because it was

the end of a really dark period of pregnancy my mental health definitely got better after I had wolf so again it's really interesting isn isn't it? Because mental health around pregnancy, and most people don't really know about prenatal pregnancy, but postnatal pregnancy is very, you know, we hear a lot about, but actually, you can get either you can get both. And it's just really important to just recognize it and not judge it and understand that the body is going through just so many hormonal changes that really is largely out of our control but then there are things that we can do to help ourselves. I think what's really interesting and you touched on it that there are so many hormones going through our body and yeah it is so important that people kind of know and recognize it and don't judge it both in pregnancy and after pregnancy because also not just the hormones but I feel like this mum identity for me it was like the psychological side of it that floored me and and I think it's really interesting as well talking to you because it just shows like me and

you have such different experiences that I love my pregnancy you've like suffered with your mental health during pregnancy and then I had a really positive experience in what they call the fourth trimester. But then when Alf got to three months, and even now, I would say that my mental health is in the worst place it's ever been. And for me, it's because of, but you know what I mean? I thank you. But I also, I kind of recognize that and I try to be really open about it. But I just feel like there's so much that I had no idea about before I became a mum that I couldn't even account for and it's things like the expectation on mothers to kind of put up and shut up and do it all but then to go to work and never ever talk about it whereas men this that even the language is different you know like hands-on dads

daddy daycare doting dad whereas I feel like we're almost expected to do everything and get no praise for it but also the expectation is that you either go back to work and you never talk about your child or you stay at home both of which are totally like perfectly valid options but it's somebody who wants to do it to do both and especially because Tommy and I agreed to 50 50 parenting and he is amazing but I'm like I feel like society is so unequal that it's not fair like I want I want to be able to go to work and you know do all of those things and that's kind of like the place that I'm finding myself like struggling more with. Do you relate to that? Or? I'm so sorry that you're feeling like that, by the way. And I think it's I'm so glad that you

are talking about it and that you're aware of it. And I've certainly think that just no matter what anyone says, no one prepares you for that first year and I really think it is the whole first year that is just such a roller coaster because it's just it is just you know you get those days where you absolutely just think I don't get a day off from this you just it's like this realization that like this does you don't just you can't switch it off then which is amazing but also just really overwhelming and it is really exhausting and I totally get what you mean I saw you did a post about this a while ago about the language around um like praising dads when they're helpful and I I totally, I totally agree. And it is so true. I

hadn't really thought about it till you pointed it out. But I think, yeah, look, finding the identity stuff is really interesting, because I think that we remember that we're really a result of our conditioning from when we're really young. So even as kids, you know, in when we're playing, okay, so you'll see young girls have the dolls and playing and mothering and, and they're put like that kind of role play when you're kids, right. And so we're already kind of told that when we become mothers, really, that's, that's it, that's going to be our sole job and that it's our responsibility to to look after the our children and to create a nice home and not just look after the children but keep everything tidy and do the washing and do the cooking and you know all those things it's

like you know looking after your baby is one thing but keeping a household going and running it's like a whole other thing and then trying to do them together is just i do have a newfound respect for 50s housewives because i always say to tommy like how did they also have the food on the table and have a tidy house like i used to think it was just kind of like this ladies who lunch you know like oh all i have to do all day is like push my pram around have a glass of wine at lunchtime and then while the baby's sleeping I'll clean the house I I it's so true yeah so we kind of have that mindset when we go into motherhood um and although things are starting to change um and we ask you know it is becoming more you know spoken about that we can be working working moms and all of this but there is still some old conditioning there that we have to get

past. But I really think that it is this kind of, it is always going to be about making sure that you are doing what is right for you and always questioning how much you're acting to please others or to fit with so that you don't feel judged by others so if you you know for all of us and for some people by the way they want to be stay-at-home moms and I applaud that it's like do you know what this is what I love and this is what I want to do and I think that should also be completely celebrated because there's also pressure the other way where what you're just to stay at home mom and I don't think that's right at all I think as we've said it's a full-time fucking job like and it should be you know appreciated and valued but if you want to be someone that is um that wants to be a working mom or not only you want

to have a career you want to have a social life you want to spend time doing self-care you want to feel like you can go out and feel good i think it's really about understanding that you can be all these things like we are multi-faceted people and being a mom doesn't have to be that it would and shouldn't be the only thing that you are. We're all more much more than that. And I think that I really try to certainly the way I live my life is that Wolf is like my angel, my soulmate, love of my life. I enjoy every minute I spend with him, but he is just still just a part of my life. And I still really value my work. I still really value my time for myself. I still really value my friendships. So I think it's just, and day, you know, and day to day, my priorities do change. So on a day where work is

my priority and I know he's going to be with Wade or he's at nursery that's okay. How long did it take you to get into that place though because I'm in I'm in a position now where I have six months and he's still breastfeeding so he literally can't be away from my boobs for long um and I'm a bit like oh my god I want to work and I want to have a social life um when will I get these back because I love Alf and like you said I love him he's my soulmate but I'm also like but I need a break and there's no time for self-love so did you find when you know in the in the in the first year that it took you that bit of time to adapt and like when did you start to feel like you could have it all it definitely took time but I would say that the difference is that I wasn't breastfeeding so it was easier for me so don't

give yourself like I wouldn't worry that it that's like six months is still I would say really early on in the journey and you're remember everything is about kind of your priorities at the time and for you I would say that right now you've chosen that you want to breastfeed because that feels like the most amazing thing that you can do for you and Alf and your family and so there is a kind of it does and I and I mean this in a kind way but of course right now that is going to make you feel like you don't have the time for as much to be like separated from him um but I think it really will come to that thing of going it's not forever this is like an amazing sacrifice that I'm making for now um but what I can do is really get myself ready for whenever I decide that that time is is up or that I introduce you know whether you start whatever process you do it but you know you can

at least take those gaps to yourself to prepare for for what you want to do or to really take those you know the two hours or three hours between feeds how can that be like really focused you time and that's really just about like not having split focus so it might be that you really have to be in another, like, you know, Tommy would have to actually take Alf out the house, or you need to be in another room or just, it's almost like having to force yourself to, to have like physical separation for an amount of time so that you can have that focused time for yourself. I love this. It's basically becoming a counselling session and I'm writing down like, tell me more, what can I do?

Because I honestly feel like the last, I'd say for the last few weeks that I'm on a treadmill that's going faster than I can keep up with. And when I'm not with Alf, as much as I want self-care and need self-care and also want to like hang out with my friends, I'm also like, oh my God, now I need to catch up on this work. Now I need to catch up on this work now I need to catch up on this and I feel like I'm constantly trying to

be really present with Alf but then also get everything done and it does feel like I literally don't have enough time in the day to like send my friend a happy birthday text and then it makes me feel guilty because I'm like I don't want to be that person that forgets their friends, if that makes sense. Did you know what though, you, you can't do it all. Like you just can't. Right now your priority is, should be, is, well, is that you're breastfeeding, which that's one of your priorities. Okay. The other priority, you decide what that is, but you can't have like five. So your other priority might be that like right now you can't have like five so your other priority might be that like right now my mental health isn't feeling its best so maybe I'm going to

just prioritize some self-care and I'm gonna there's going to be some aspects of my work that right now maybe is actually causing me too much stress I need to let go of them for now and remember that everything is not forever this is just like a small chapter and you just want to give yourself the best opportunity to feel your best and so it might be just about really sitting down and letting go of some things and just going this is the time for this because all the other things will come your friends are still going to be there you know that's all gonna it will they will understand you just got to do what's good this is a really precious time for your mental health and for your family and so really just don't rush

it and just honor yourself i actually love what you just said because it's kind of like saying everything's waiting for you in the future but elf will never be the age that he is now again so it's kind of trying to live in i feel like as humans we're pretty bad at you in the future, but Elf will never be the age that he is now again. So it's kind of trying to live in, I feel like as humans, we're pretty bad at living in the present, aren't we? Totally. I wish, you know, one, and I don't really have any, I'm not really someone that has regrets, but I wish I had embraced, or I wish that I had been in a mental state where I really could have enjoyed the newborn stage more. And it definitely is one thing that I had been in a mental state where I really could have enjoyed the newborn stage more. And it definitely is one thing that I look back on. I think, oh, I really missed that because I was so in a rush to feel better and to feel myself again. And look, yes, now I'm in a

great place. But I do wish I just actually slowed down a bit at the beginning and enjoyed that time because you never get it back. How long do you think it took for you to start to feel like yourself again like how old was wolf when you were like i feel like i'm getting to grips with this identity thing honestly i kind of threw my heart and soul into getting i was i remember i was driven from such pain so i was in such a bad place and I don't want to say this and make everyone feel like oh fuck but I would say by like five months I was like I'm back because I would but that was because that was my focus remember it's all about like priorities and my priority I wasn't breastfeeding so I didn't I was much more I had much more freedom in that sense and I just went for it I just thought I'm

just I have to just get back but also I had Wade who was very hands-on as you have told me which helped but everybody's journey is very different but I would say anyway from a year that was there was another shift again then it's like everything just became so much easier that's good I'm right holding on like I'm gonna enjoy this time but six months to go and um did you find that how did you how do you feel now looking back of the person that you were before wolf came along and the person that you are now how did you decide to juggle so the way I see the identity thing is that before pregnancy or especially before childbirth you've kind of got jigsaw and you know for me personally I'd spent a lot of time on like self-love and self-development so I almost felt

like I was down to the final 10 pieces that I was like wow I feel like I'm really starting to get this thing called life figured out and then suddenly pregnancy came and childbirth came and suddenly there was like a hundred new pieces. But I didn't have any more spots to to fit everything in. So I was trying to I guess I'm still trying to figure out which ones to take away and which ones to keep. And, you know, like which bits of myself from before I want to cling on to and which bits I have to let go to kind of embrace this new life, if that makes sense. So how do you feel like you've changed? Well, I mean, I couldn't even describe the person I am today to the person I was before. And I think actually, it's really nice what you've said, because a big part of this and a big part of

any self development journey is letting go of these ideas of who you were and actually just embracing yourself as a whole new person. Because of course there are parts that we want to cling on to, but really, even those are new. I, at the beginning, I thought, oh, maybe I still like partying. And I remember going out once and like having a hangover and thought, no, I don't. I actually just don't like this anymore. And that's okay. I've just grown out of that. That doesn't make me boring. It doesn't make me this.

It's just not who I am anymore. Or, you know, I think really, yeah, it's just looking back and going, there are things about myself, my life before that maybe I want to incorporate now. But then there is a lot that you just do want to let go of. And I think we have such a fear of letting go. It's so empowering. And really, you know, I really just, I'm all about transformation. And every day you're someone new. And so it's really just, I would say that I've never, I've definitely never felt better or felt more empowered or content. And I think one thing about becoming a parent is that I realized that I am just at my happiest, you know, in a playground, that I am just at my happiest, you know, in a playground, watching Wolf play in the park.

And that is genuine joy. And whereas before I thought that joy came from, you know, drinking, taking drugs, smoking, that wasn't real happiness. That was just a chemical high. And now, you know, you'll be sat, you know, reading, you know, I read Wolf, his bedtime stories, or I see him on his scooter or him chatting. And, you know, there's no feeling like it. And you realize that life is just made up of all these beautiful moments. And having a child really gives you these precious moments every day. So many them and that's incredible oh my god I absolutely love that and I feel like you've given so much hope to me and probably loads of other people who are battling with the identity and it's interesting what you said earlier how you know you didn't want to be just a mom and whether you or not you choose to go back to a job or whether or not

you give you give up your career you're never just a mum and it's definitely not a negative thing which we think before we have children or at least I did anyway like it's so nice and reassuring to hear you talk so yeah it sounds like you've got everything like really together and that there is hope out of the kind of what I like to call the matricence period that kind of like adolescence of motherhood um so thank you so much for coming on here and like sharing your journey with me and um yeah I feel I feel optimistic for the future but I now know that I have to live in the present as well oh thank you so much for having me, love. And absolutely. It's just keep saying it. Life is for living. So there's no rush. I love that. Thank you, Roxy.

Thank you, love. So every week I'm going to answer a question from one of you guys. So if you want to get involved either on a topic that we've talked about, something you want to talk about, then leave a review on the Apple podcast. It genuinely does help to leave five stars because i'm more likely to see it this is not emotional blackmail to give me five stars but it will help otherwise you can obviously dm me at ashley louise james on instagram and that is how i've heard from this lovely lady sarah she says i'm currently seven months pregnant and i'm really on edge for what's to come what preparations preparations did you make before the due date? Is there a set of essentials I should be packing to

take to the hospital? How nicely does that follow on from Roxy's advice of like trying to stay in the present? But also I get it because at seven months pregnant, I was like, what do I need? And I spent so much time researching hospital bags and you know what that actually gave me so much reassurance and for me personally I literally packed everything but the kitchen sink and I didn't need any of it however you can't you can never plan childbirth because it's so unique and different and you know you might be in hospital 20 minutes or you might be in for a few days. So personally, I found that it was better to be overprepared than underprepared. But equally, just know that you don't really need anything like they even have nappies. They've got milk. They've got anything you could possibly need.

So my only bit of advice would be don't forget you because it's easy just to think of the baby. But actually, you know, you're going to need something like a nightie maybe a nursing bra lots of pads um yeah whatever it is just remember don't forget you and I guess we can both take advice from Roxy that try not to plan the future because it's unplannable and just enjoy the present and take lots of pictures because honestly I look back and just think how beautiful I looked in pregnancy like my bump and everything and I love knowing now that it's Alf that's all we've got time for today though so thank you so much for listening to me Ashley James mum's the word the parenting podcast make sure to hit subscribe or follow button so you never miss an episode and if you're listening on apple podcast like i mentioned please leave a review a

five star one it helps others to find us and if you do want to spread the news tell another person about podcasts and help me to reach more people and i'll be back next week with another episode same time same place different guest