Murder With My Husband - 91. Rebecca Zahau and Max Shacknai - The Mansion Curse

Episode Date: December 20, 2021

On this episode of MWMH, Payton and Garrett discuss the mysterious deaths of Rebecca Zahau and 8-year-old Max Shacknai in the Spreckles Mansion. LIVE ONLINE SHOW TICKETS HERE! https://www.moment.co/murderwithmyhusband Case Sources: https://informationcradle.com/jonah-shacknai/ ABC 20/20 Youtube https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Rebecca_Zahau#Max's_death https://marketrealist.com/p/jonah-shacknai-net-worth/ https://timesofsandiego.com/crime/2021/07/12/10-years-ago-rebecca-zahau-saga-began-with-a-bound-body-beneath-a-balcony/ https://fox5sandiego.com/news/local-news/judge-sets-deadline-for-sheriff-to-answer-questions-on-zahau-investigation/ https://www.kusi.com/reexamning-the-rebecca-zahau-case-a-decade-after-her-death/ Links: https://linktr.ee/murderwithmyhusband  Ads: Warby Parker: www.warbyparker.com/husband Seed: www.seed.com/HUSBAND and use code HUSBAND HelloFresh: HelloFresh.com/Husband14 and use code husband14  Apostrophe: www.apostrophe.com/husband use code HUSBAND True Bill: www.truebill.com/husband Bombas: https://bombas.com/husband Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Hey everybody, welcome back to our podcast. This is Murder With My Husband. I'm Peyton Morlin. And I'm Garrett Morlin. And he's the husband. And the husband. I feel like we've been gone forever. I'm so happy to be back with all of you.

It just feels like home, you know what I mean? And it's weird because we recorded a head of time though. So to everyone else, it probably seems normal. Normal, right? To us, it feels like it's just awesome. It's weird, though. We've been missing you guys. All right, Gary, you have your 10 seconds. Well, many of you probably saw that we were on vacation for about a week, which was amazing.

It was so amazing. Seriously, it was like a dream. It felt good. It was the first vacation that Peyton and I have taken since our honeymoon. Together, yeah. So we were really excited about it. It was great. It was also fun on social media. I feel like so many people were just like involved with it with us. So that was really fun. So thank you for making this last week's super fun for us as our week off. So that was one in Peyton's surprises and the other one actually came. Yeah, so Garrett got me a customized license plate that says MWMH and like at the very beginning of this I was like I think that would be so cool, but I knew that we would have to be consistent and whatnot, so we just finally,

it was that time I guess. She's basically she's always wanted it until finally. Finally got it was that time I guess. She's basically, she's always wanted it until I finally. Finally got it and so excited about it. Yeah, so those were the surprises. I got super sunburn while we were on vacation. So my entire body is peeling like crazy, like a lizard. Rookie mistake. And then we got caught in a snow storm on the way home from the airport.

It took us three and a half hours, which normally only takes an hour. Mm-hmm. We were just, I was literally out on the freeway, standing on the freeway, pushing our car because we were stuck. It was, it was pretty crazy. Like in the middle of the freeway,

everyone else was stuck, everyone was sliding off. Like, some eyes were overturned, it was super dangerous. I hope everyone was okay. I know we made it home okay, which was such a blessing, but it was pretty crazy. It was pretty crazy. For my 10 seconds, I guess, I mean, guess I was in my 10 seconds, but there's a show called The Witcher on Netflix

and season two comes out, well, it came out. I think yesterday, anyways, I will be watching that. I don't know if anyone else watches it. Is it about witches? No, I mean, watch it with me. No. So that'll be my 10 seconds. Other than that, we're hanging out.

We're doing good. Also one more thing. If you're listening to audio, it might sound the same, but the next two weeks that we do, we're actually going to be traveling for the holidays. And so we're going to be recording at a different area. So just a heads up. Oh, also, I did want to mention that while we were on our

trip, we ran into some listeners, a couple of them actually, and it was so awesome. So I do just want to remind you again, that if you ever do see us like come up and say hi, it's like the coolest thing we seriously love it. We want to meet you. We want to know who's listening. So we really appreciate it. All right. So our case sources for today are information cradle.com, Wikipedia, marketrealists.com and ABC 2020. Some YouTube videos times of San Diego.com, Fox five San Diego.com and

KUSI.com. All right. So our case this week begins in Coronado, California. Coronado is kind of like an island with a bridge coming out of it into San Diego, and the island is beautiful. Okay, we're talking huge mansions, just really a luxurious area. It's in California, the beach is nearby, you know what I mean?

But on Coronado, there's one specific mansion that holds a bit of history. It's called the Historic Spreckles Mansion, and it was named after a sugar king when it was built. I think a sugar king is like a candy. A candy king? I don't know. Oh, okay.

Well, if anyone else would have sugar king, he'd let us know. These are my two guesses. Like, either, because isn't sugar like a harvested? So either like he owned a lot of sugar things or whatever or he's like actually was like a candy king, like Willy Wonka. Okay, well we don't know.

So anyone knows which I'm sure someone out there does. We're sorry and please let us know. This Spreckles Mansion had multiple grand staircases and probably more bathrooms and bedrooms than anyone would actually want to clean. But in 2011, the beautiful and grand Spreckled Mansion was tainted. The architecture and design splashed with darkness

when someone found something near one of the mansion's spacious balconies. A body, hanging from the balcony by a rope. The Sprechle's mansion now turned into a horror movie. You couldn't make this scene up, the haunted mansion all over again. So Rebecca's the how was born in a remote country at the time known as Burma. And Rebecca was born into royalty over there. Her family was one of prominence. Rebecca was beautiful and funny. Her friends and family knew her as someone who could put a smile on anybody's face. But Rebecca and her family safe and secure life in Burma would eventually be overrun by political war. Their beautiful life shattered as they were forced to flee their home for safety.

So that is how Rebecca and her family actually ended up in the United States. And despite the tragedy that brought them there, Rebecca had the personality that could take a sour situation and make it awesome. She looked at the relocation as a chance to start a new chapter in her life to do things she had always wanted to do. And so that's what she did. Once in America, Rebecca worked her way and eventually began her new job at an ophthalmology office where she worked as a tech. So she would get people ready for surgery at the office

and she loved it. She loved the education of all of it. She loved helping people. It really was right up her alley. And it was one day during this new life that now 32 year old Rebecca met Jonah Shachny while at work. He had actually come in as a customer and began talking to Rebecca.

Jonah immediately thought Rebecca was full of life and enthusiastic. Their connection blossoming right away. And unbeknownst to Rebecca at the time, Jonah wasn't like some of their other customers. Jonah Shacknye was rich, rich. He was loaded. The founder and CEO of Metisys Pharmaceutical, which according to the ABC 2020 report on this case, is basically like the Coca-Cola of the Medical Cosmetics industry. Oh man, okay. This company is worth billions of dollars. We are talking very big company

and he's the CEO and founder of it. Got it. Jonas Google NetWorth today says he is a former pharmaceutical executive with a net worth of three billion dollars. Holy crap. Which includes his assets, money, and income. So that's like the type of money we're talking about

that she just met. Yeah. So when Jonah walked into the office and met Rebecca, she really didn't know the lifestyle change that she was about to get into. As they begin to date, Jonah says that both of them loved the outdoors. Together, they practiced clean living.

They loved working out together and hiking. So it was really easy to get along. Do you know who asked who out first? Um, I don't know the exact, but I know that both of them when they met at the office were like instantly, okay, she's cute. He's cute. They were both interested. Okay. And the attraction was more than just physical dejona. He learned about Rebecca's past and the struggles that she had endured while escaping Burma and his love for her grew as he admired how strong she was. Now,

I do have to say her, she's very gorgeous and very younger than him, not a ton, but she is younger than him. So that's kind of why he's reiterating that it wasn't just a physical connection. And most people looking in from the outside could say that Rebecca just stumbled into her fairy tale, a great guy with great money who could make it so she could never, you know, have to go through the trauma that she had experienced just previously.

But Rebecca's family wasn't having it. They didn't support Rebecca's new relationship, how serious it had grown so fast. They didn't support Rebecca's new relationship, how serious it had grown so fast. They didn't trust Jonah and his dating record was a little more decorated than they would have preferred. He had been married multiple times and had two teenagers from his first marriage and a little boy named Max from his second marriage.

So there were three kids and Rebecca didn't have any kids and she had never been married before. And as this relationship between them progressed, Rebecca began to stay at home with Max and take care of him as her own, despite the fact that Jonah had not popped the question yet. And this is what bothered Rebecca's parents.

He obviously had no issue with getting married, so why would he not ask Rebecca to marry him? Do you know how old were they exactly? So at this point in time, she was 32 and he was 54. Okay, so 22 year difference. Yeah. Instead, she stayed at home and took care of his kids is how they saw it.

Like she was just basically playing mom, almost like she was a live in Nanny instead of Jonas' wife, Jonas' better half. Surprise. His net worth is so crazy, he's still working, not retired, you know? Yeah. His resume is very decorated still. It was like CEO of this, founder of this.

He did a thousand things, like it took me so long to get through it. So once again, this is how her family is seeing it. I'm not saying this is how it was or how it wasn't. I wouldn't know, I wasn't there, but this is how her family is seeing this relationship. But despite these accusations, Jonah claims that Max and Rebecca had an amazing relationship.

Max is his little boy, which is why they spent so much time together. He says that Rebecca was such an attentive and warm person with Max, and because she had no children of her own, she really took Max under her wing. Jonah insists that Rebecca was a good influence on Max, and they loved each other. But, like I said, Jonah had been married before, and Max still had a birth mother who was in the picture, which, as suspected, began to create problems in this fairy tale story. picture, which, as suspected, began to create problems in this fairy tale story. Jonas first marriage was to Kimberly James, the founder and president of the Dream and

Color Foundation, which is who he had the first two children with. Then he later married Dina Shacknye, a post-doctoral child psychology fellow in Scottsdale. Together they had Max Aaron Shacknye, which is Max, who was born on June 7th, 2005. After their divorce, you know, and Jonah moving Rebecca into the Coronado Spreckles mansion home, where she ended up taking care of Max full time, Dina, Max's birth mom, was I rate. She says that the fact that somebody else was taking care of her six-year-old son was hard and she wanted to meet Rebecca, but she didn't disapprove of Jonah's new girlfriend being involved. It was just difficult. Like, why couldn't Jonah just raise him?

Rebecca's family, however, claims that Dina and Rebecca had an awful relationship and things had been bad between them from the start. And Jonah backs this up claiming that yes, Dina had made it really difficult for Rebecca since they had started dating, and that Dina and Rebecca were definitely not friends. But despite the drama, the dirty laundry of their blended family,

nobody was expecting what happened next. Nobody was expecting the movie-like story that would soon enfold in this relationship. On June 11, 2011, Jonah woke up and left to go to the gym to work out in the morning. Back at the Sprekels mansion is Rebecca, her teenage little sister Zina, and six-year-old Max. Zina was just visiting Rebecca, the mansion that morning.

She was in one side of the house, which I'm assuming was like the guest area. Rebecca was on the other side of the mansion, probably in her regular master bedroom living area. And Max was playing on the second floor of the house like six-year-olds do. It was at this point that Jonah, Shacknye, and the police department both received a devastating call. There had been an accident. Six-year-old Max had somehow fell over the banister and was now lying on the main floor unresponsive. Yeah.

So Zina had called the cops while Rebecca called Jonah. So he basically, there was like a staircase overlooking the main floor. Yes, and he fell over the banister and fell to the main floor. Okay. Jonah obviously rushed home and found Max lying on the floor. Max was then rushed to the Rady Children's Hospital and Jonah and Dina both followed him there unable to leave his side. So now birth mom Dina is also at the hospital with Jonah with

their son. I can't even begin to imagine the nightmares already taking place with drama between the two girls. Yes. So Rebecca told everyone that she was in the bathroom. One max fell and she ran out and found him. She had no idea how it had happened. Zena, her little sister, remembers running out and seeing Max on the floor as well. Rebecca was also confused at what happened. This is what Zina is saying. Rebecca told Zina in that moment that Dina was going to kill her because she had not been

watching him close enough. So this is the first thought going through her head because kind of like what you said, she was acting as guardian over six-year-old Max at this point and he had been hurt on like her watch. And now Dina, his his birth mom, is going to be really matter-abekka considering their relationship is already on the rocks. So is he okay? Like what's going on with him? So while Zina and Jonah were stuck at the hospital waiting for news on Max, who was alive and but he was struggling, police created a 3D rendering of what they think had happened based on Max's injuries

and the kind of the scene where he had been found. So basically, it's a three story open staircase. Three story, yes. Oh my gosh. Yes. So one railing on one side that is the top floor, a middle landing with a railing like perpendicular to that, and then you turn the corner and it goes down that raillling directly across from the top relling and then you're on the main floor. Like pretend you're drawing out a box, one line, two line, three line, but now make those like staircases

with a landing in the middle. They claim that Max was playing on the top floor when he somehow fell over the top relling, hitting the chandelier, which then knocks out of the ceiling and falls to the ground. Max continues falling with the chandelier, which then knocks out of the ceiling and falls to the ground. Max continues falling with the chandelier, hitting his back on the downward sloping railing that's like going to the main floor and finally falling face flat onto the main floor. So he like, boom, boom, boom, down, took the chandelier like it was a hard fall. Did he just? No one knows. Did they say that it's so there's no like, did he run out like? No, no one was.

Is he running and slipped or? Yeah, the only two adult homes, Zina and Rebecca were both in different rooms. So no one actually knew what he caused the fall. Okay. He had injuries to his spinal cord and facial bones, which doctors initially concluded affected his heart rate and breathing.

So it was kind of the injuries then made it really, really hard. He was really struggling. All of this is so awful. And every friend and family member is devastated. Like, sexual maxes literally stuck in the hospital. This is when Jonah Shacknye's brother, Max's uncle, named Adam Shacknye, came into town to help in whatever way he could, just like family would if there was a tragic accident.

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because she's not gonna go to the hospital with Dina. So she's still back at Spreco's mansion just kind of watching over things. So on July 12th, she dropped her sister Zina off at the airport to fly home and at the same time picked up Adam, Jonas brother. Got it. Rebecca drove Adam back to the Spreckles mansion

where he would be staying. And later that night, her, Jonah and Adam actually ate dinner together with a friend named Howard. Now, I don't want you to think this is weird. Jonas stayed most of his time at the hospital, but he would leave for breaks and to eat and whatnot. Like, he can't just stay there full time. So his brother got into town, he made his way home and ate dinner with them.

Now, at some point that night, neighbors noted loud music coming from the Sprekels mansion. And also at some point, Jonah returned back to the hospital to be with Max and Dina. Adam was staying in the guest house. Rebecca was in the main house of the Spreckles mansion. The next morning, July 13th at roughly 6.45 AM, a 911 call came into the police department once again from the Spreckles mansion.

Yeah, I got a girl on her shelf. The guest house of a, it's an ocean bowl of art across from the hotel. Same place that you came and got the KBS today. So what you just heard was Adam Shacknye on the phone with a 911 operator. He is reporting that Rebecca had hung herself from the balcony of the Spreckles mansion. What the heck? While on the 911 call, you can hear him cut her down and begin chest compressions before fire

and medical get there. I'm doing dogs compressions, yes, right now. By the time help had arrived, Rebecca Zahau was already dead. Oh my gosh, OK. Adam Tex Jonah, who is back at the hospital with Max and explains that he needs to call him right away. So when Jonah calls, Adam breaks the news. Rebecca had taken her own life.

Jonah was sitting in a hospital with his struggling son and had just been told that his girlfriend was now gone. Everyone's confused. This couldn't be real. How does this happen? It was days apart, both at the mansion, like what's going on. But it might not be real. When police arrive on scene to respond, the state of Rebecca's body does really not look like self-illumination. Rebecca was naked, like but naked. Her feet bound violently together with red rope wrapped over and over and over again. Her hands tied behind her back with the

same red rope. Oh, there's no way she did this. A t-shirt was wrapped tightly around her neck three times and then gagged into her throat. Rebecca did all of this and then somehow hobbled off that balcony. No way. So why, and furthermore, how, right? This is what everyone's thinking. It just seems impossible. A graphic and bizarre death at the Spreckles mansion.

Due to the nature of the scene, the San Diego Police Department launches a full investigation into Rebecca's death. The police report shows that one end of the rope was tied to the bed up in the bedroom, where it was then guided all the way out over the balcony and around Rebecca's neck. There's no way she did this. Rebecca's footprints were found on the balcony, as well as a men's boot print. There was also a witchcraft book found on the bookshelf that showed images of a naked woman with her hands tied behind her back with red rope.

What the heck, I'm so confused. Also on the floor of the bedroom, there were two kitchen knives, one smaller and one bigger. The bigger knife had what appeared to be small traces of blood on it. But Rebecca had no open wounds. I wasn't like she was stabbed with that knife. Rebecca was menstruating at the time of her death and small blood deposits were found in the house that were Rebecca's, despite the fact that she had no bleeding wounds.

Okay. But the most puzzling piece of evidence found immediately at the home was actually right on the bedroom door. She saved him. Can you save her was scribbled on the door in black paint? She saved him. So basically she saved Max.

Can you save her? Is that what you're getting out of it? That's what I'm getting out of it. So no one knows what to make of it. There's no explanation for what this means. No one, I mean, we're not. But it does seem right. It feels like it has something to do with Max, right?

Was what's her name at the hospital this one time? Or are we gonna get to that? So we don't know yet. We're assuming, that's where she says she is, but we haven't gone to video camera footage yet. So we will like clarify her all of my. Right, it's the cameras. So it doesn't make sense. What does this even mean? She saved him,

can you save her in black paint on the door? That's insane. Two small paint brushes with Rebecca's prints on it were found on the floor in the bedroom as well as a black tube of paint with no prints on the body just Rebecca's thumbprint on the cap. Now, it originally was the Coronado police that responded to the 911 call, but their department was small. It certainly wasn't equipped to handle a case of this magnitude. I mean, they're in Coronado. It's not like they are doing homicides all of the time.

In fact, police actually left Rebecca's nude body tied up and uncovered out on the lawn so long that media helicopters were actually able to take pictures of her. Oh my gosh, it's horrible. A Trochus, that is absolutely not okay. I'm gonna get that behind here. Right, and it took 12 hours

after her body was discovered for the medical examiner to even arrive and begin looking at the scene. Okay. Which is not okay. They also didn't even have a full time homicide unit. So fairly quickly, the San Diego County Sheriff's Department was called in. Like the Coronado Police were like, we're not handling this, we're not equipped to do this.

At this point, neighbors are also interviewed, and one neighbor claims to hear screams of help coming from a woman the night before. Adam, um, Shacknye, the brother who found her. Because he was there the entire time. It was just them too at home alone. So Adam, Shacknye was given a polygraph test the day that they found Rebecca's body and the results were inconclusive. And my gut says right now, I don't think it's him.

It just seems too obvious that it would be him. I mean, he technically was the only person at the home with Rebecca that night. But Jonah claims that this is the exact problem. His brother Adam is a good person. And just because he was at the wrong place at the wrong time, his life was now being turned upside down. All fingers pointed at him.

He was the only guy home, right? And to really put the last twist in this case, to make matters so much worse, as everyone is trying to figure out what really happened to Rebecca, just three days after her death, six-year-old Max suddenly dies in the hospital. Oh my God.

Dude, complications from his father. This is not real. So within three days, two people had died at the hands of the now infamous Spreckles mansion, the once beautiful and spacious home now holding mystery and darkness that no one could scrub out. But with the investigation into honestly both deaths now buzzing in the air, Rebecca's family feels like Absolutely Rebecca did not take her own life that they heard Rebecca say the words Dina's going to kill me days before she died. Yeah, and on the other side Dina is begging police to look into her son's death more, as now it had been ruled an accident,

but she doesn't believe it is. She thinks Rebecca had most likely done something to her son and then thrown him over the banister. So I think this next part is ironic, because we are now about to have our third eyewitness neighbor come forward and claim that they saw something. And honestly, it all seems a little like Salem Witch Trials to me. We'll still mention it because there are three like eye witness accounts from that

night. And eyewitness says that the night of Rebecca's death, they saw a woman matching Dina's description, walk up to the mansion's front door late into the night. But as days turn to weeks, no arrests are made. No news is delivered. Until randomly police announce they are doing it. They are holding a press conference about the whole case. They're answering everyone's question. They have figured out what has happened. And this is what they have to say seven weeks after the deaths of Rebecca and Max.

I feel like it's a long time. Yeah. They asked the question at Rebecca and Max. I feel like it's a long time. Yeah. They asked the question at the press conference. Was Rebecca and Max's deaths homicides their firm answer after seven weeks of investigation? No. Neither Rebecca or Max's death involved criminal conduct. They say Max tripped over the relling,

grabbing the chandelier, that he probably just tripped over a ball or the dog or something. And Rebecca's death, the autopsy DNA and fingerprints show that Rebecca had not been attacked. There's no way. Max's, I'm not sure about, but Rebecca's, I just feel like there's no way with tie your own hands behind your back. Right, I'll go through some of the evidence to see how you've laughed at her. So all of the fingerprints were from her in the room. The DNA all on the rope was from her as well. And the boot print that was found on the balcony accidentally left there by an officer. And the neighbor hearing the police for help all alive, she was lying.

They claim toe impressions on the balcony confirm that Rebecca had moved up to the balcony and thrown herself off like leaning off and taking her life. They even showed a video of a female officer recreating the same bindings on her hands, which basically involved her slipping, a hand, tying them up, slipping a hand out, moving them behind her back,

putting them back through the ties, and then tugging it tighter. Was it possible that she could have tied her own hands in that way? Maybe. Okay, yeah, maybe. But they did quickly mention that there was more DNA, not from Rebecca, found on the larger knife that was in the room, but the DNA was too small of a sample to test. They also say there was foreign DNA on the doorknob to the balcony, but once again the DNA was too small to test. Of course it was.

And the last foreign DNA from the crime scene was found on a pair of gardening gloves on a coffee table, but once again, too small to test. So any DNA that doesn't belong to her was too small to test. Everyone in the crowd is dumbfounded. Like possibly, yes, this could be true, but probably it just seems weird. Like everyone's like, what happened at the spread calls mansion and now they really don't have any more answers. And why would Rebecca take her own life anyways?

Police say that's because Jonah had actually left her a voicemail that night explaining the grave condition that Max was in. And police claimed that Rebecca knew it was at her hands, that she wasn't watching close enough, and she just couldn't bear it. Both Dina and Rebecca's families are devastated by the news at the press conference.

Rebecca's family felt like no one cared about her, that they didn't even want to investigate it. They believe that someone who held her responsible for Max's death then killed her for at the Spreckles mansion. So they decide to exume Rebecca's body and have a different doctor perform another autopsy. And this doctor determines that the head wounds in which, so she had four head wounds on her head. The first coroner credited them to the fall,

but this doctor says they might actually be like blunt force trauma from a struggle with somebody. There's no, that the way she fell, she wouldn't have actually hit her head on anything. And this doctor concludes that the ropes that Rebecca supposedly tied herself with were tied so tight that they left bruises on her ankles and her wrists. And there's no way she could have done that herself. It seems.

Just would be really hard to tie him that tight. I mean, your ankles, you could tie yourself, but your hands behind your back, it seems impossible to me. So also, I do have to mention that when the police like recreated their their drawing of the knot, so that she like got it to wrap around the top of her wrist and then tied it with the knot at the bottom right by the wrist, right? Because that's where only your fingers can reach. Yes. But on Rebecca's body, the knot was at the top up in her forearms. Oh, you can't wait for that. No. Like, bend your arms up there and like tie it clear up there.

You know what I mean? So they're like, oh yeah, this not as possible, but the knot was actually like reversed. And you know, on top of this, Rebecca's family also petitions for the police to reopen the case. They're like, please don't close this case. Can you just take another look into it? But that petition is denied.

And Dina feels like there's no way her son's death was an accident as well. How does a six-year-old get over the tall railing initially unless he was climbing on it, I guess, but that was a pretty far drop down. So it would be a weird place for a six-year-old to be climbing. It also would just be hard for a six-year-old to get all the way up and then fall.

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And both of these families are going on Dr. Phil, CNN. And they're probably blaming each other. Yes, like Dina thinks that Rebecca hurt her son. The Rebecca family probably thinks that Dina killed Rebecca. Oh my gosh. So it's such a mess. And both of them are like now that the police have closed it. They're now turning to the media for help. So they're going on all these shows, like trying to say here's the evidence that we know there's no way it

could have been an accident. I don't understand how I saw it in a YouTube comment. I don't understand how I don't know any of this. This whole story. And everyone listening probably does, and I've never heard any of this. So actually in 2011, this case was in the top 10 most Googled cases for the year. What was I doing with my life? I don't understand. So here's some points that could possibly poke holes in the finding of the police when it comes to Rebecca's death,

which this is the evidence I'm going to tell you. So one point is, how was Adam's DNA not found on Rebecca's body if he cut her down and performed CPR? So they're like, oh no, it was only her DNA. There was no foreign DNA. So that's how we know she wasn't attacked. Oh, I didn't even think about that. But if Adam performed CPR on her and cut her down, how was his DNA not on the rope that

he grabbed? How was his DNA not on the rope? When police claim it was only her DNA on the body and the rope. So I have an idea of what I think is going on, but I won't say it yet. So also the binding was very intricate, like we talked about, and it would take knowledge despite the fact that police said it would be pretty easy. And I'll be honest, I couldn't tie the knot that I saw in those pictures.

It was very intricate, it was very detailed. Like there's no way I could even replicate that just by looking at it. A rope expert was brought in and he even says that someone in office would not be able to like tie the rope without expert knowledge and that it was a pretty difficult knot. But Rebecca had tied down Jonas' boat on multiple occasions, so maybe she would have,

no way. Yeah, yeah, I know you're saying that. Not knowledge, but also Adam Shack and I worked in the boat industry as well and tied knots as well. So I mean, both of them could have learned to tie an intricate knot. It would also be hard to be tied up, bound, and gagged, and then hop your way out onto the balcony, then to literally gruesomely just like throw yourself over without any

hands. But yeah, then they say that she climbed up with her feet. So her feet were on the balcony, like footprints, but it wasn't like on the top of the balcony or anything. What police say are saying is that she painted the door, tied herself up in the room, then hobbled her way out of the room onto the balcony, which her feet were tied tight and it was that she would have had to hop.

Yeah. And then got up to the balcony ledge and then just leaned off. Okay. Which is pretty gruesome, like in pretty hop. Yeah. And then got up to the balcony ledge and then just leaned off. Okay. Which is pretty gruesome, like in pretty violence. Yeah, very. It's not impossible though. Like she could have done it.

I mean, she could have. It's not very probable, but it's not impossible. Something's going on here. It's also possible that someone could have thrown her body over the rail without stepping on the balcony. So they did test and they realized that someone could have thrown her body over the rail without stepping on the balcony. So they did test and they realized that someone could have lifted her up and put her over without actually stepping out onto the balcony, but it still would have been hard

because they would have had to like lean her body against the railing. So each, like it's just all a little weird. So there are more holes in the police investigation despite the shoddy work we already know about, which was like leaving the body out, the medical examiner arriving soleil, and the boot print literally on the major part of the crime scene. Like how did a officer step on the balcony?

Yeah. Like that's the most, that's the biggest part of what they're looking at. And another thing that they did wrong is that the drawn up diagram of the crime scene from the police does not actually match the crime scene photos. So there are items in the wrong place, some items even weren't included on the diagram, which when we're talking about something as big as a possible murder, this level of work is not okay.

These mistakes. Is this the Coronado police or is this the San Diego? Coronado police. Okay. the San Diego Coronado police? There was actually a dry, but then it was the San Diego police's effort immediately after. So someone could have caught on. You know what I mean? There was actually a drier sheet on the floor of the bedroom in between like laying in between the two knives that you can see in multiple pictures, but it's never listed as any like as evidence and even on the diagram it doesn't exist. Like it's like it wasn't even

out there. And might I know I did learn this. Dryer sheets can thoroughly wipe down prints. Really? Yes. Like people can use dryer sheets to get rid of prints. Why wouldn't you use just like a rag? It's a for dryer sheet. You could too, but. They're just saying you can use a dryer sheet. But it does the same thing They're just saying you can use a vagina sheet. Mm-hmm. Okay. But it does the same thing. So if you didn't know now, you do. Crazy.

So Rebecca's family actually like went on to file a wrongful death suit against Dina, her sister Nina, which I think they're twins because they look pretty alike. So Dina and Nina and then Adam, they're accusing them of teaming up and killing Rebecca and then staging it as're accusing them of teaming up and killing Rebecca and then staging it as a suicide that night. So because police are like, we close the case, this isn't a suit that would end in prison time, just monetary value.

So they're like, we're taking you guys to court, a wrongful death suit and you're gonna pay us because of it. But when everyone starts looking into it, Dina proved that there was surveillance camera showing that she was at the hospital the whole night. Okay, so that's what I was gonna ask. So she didn't go anywhere.

No. Okay. So she was at the hospital on camera the whole night. So she's dropped from the suit as well as her sister because you can't be in two places at once. So basically we just have Adam now. Yeah. So Adam now is the only target of the suit. And Rebecca's family believes that Adam knew Max was her and thought Rebecca

was responsible. So he took care of it. They think Adam confronted Rebecca that night and escalated and she was hit on the back of her head before being thrown over the balcony. But at this civil suit, all Rebecca's family attorney has to do is convince nine out of 12 jurors that Adam more than likely did it. Doesn't have to be solid, it doesn't have to be concrete. And this is a suit, this is for money, not for him to go to prison. Exactly. And so that is what he sets out to do as trial starts in February of 2018.

Okay. So this case happened in 2011 and this civil suit just happened in 2018. According to the market realist, in the end, nine of the 12 jurors determined that Rebecca did not die by suicide. Wow. Okay. And the jury ruled that Adam was liable for her death. But because it was a civil trial, it was damages at stake, not

prison time. So the jury awarded Rebecca's mother $5 million in damages plus $167,000 in compensation for lost financial supports. In December of 2018, although maintaining their initial ruling after the civil trial results, the Sheriff's Department reopens Rebecca's case. So this civil suit like ends, the jury's like, oh, he did it. And the police are like, no, no, no, no, no. Okay, you can say that there,

but we're maintaining our stand that he didn't do it. But then months later, they randomly reopened the case. Okay, so I'm going on here. Something is going on. So during all of this, Adam actually files an appeal, obviously, for the findings that are accusing him, like in the civil suit, but Rebecca's family finally agrees to settle for $600,000 and drop the civil suit

in 2019 and he agrees. So, the civil suit is dropped. They get paid out $600,000. I'm actually assuming by Jonah, Jacques Ney, and then like it's dropped and that's the end of that, that's the that's the case. I'm surprised they didn't go for more money. Right. Also in 2019, the police that reopened their investigation closed it again and said, nope, we're maintaining our stand that this was suicide.

That is, this makes zero sense. Yes. In 2020, Rebecca's family attempts to sue the Sheriff's Department after they denied the family's request for investigative records. So in March of 2021, a judge actually agrees to hear arguments for it in court. So he's like, okay, we'll go through with it, we'll hear it. Now just in November, like literally just last month, the judge required that the sheriff's department produce some answers about the investigation and the shoddy work by the next

hearing, which will be in late January, 2022. Oh, yeah, crap. So now police are going to have to come forward and answer some questions about the investigation the mission. So it's still going on basically. It's still going on and we have no more answers. And Dina, the police have like never ruled her ruled Max's death a homicide or even like reopened it. This is crazy. I had no idea any of this was happening. I think it's just one of those cases where it's like Coronado wasn't even big enough to have a homicide unit and then two deaths that are accidental and suicide happen in the mansion within three days. I just,

I don't know, I feel like there's no way that Rebecca. Tied her in. Yeah. I actually feel that way too. After like researching everything I'm obviously not gonna say for certain because nothing's proven in court and I'm also not blaming anyone like I'm not saying Adam Did it. I'm not saying Jonah did it. I'm not saying do I'm not trying to get sued by it. I don't know. I'm just saying someone There's some foul play going on. I do They'd say someone, there's some foul play going on. I do kind of agree as well. I just, there was some journals that were found on Rebecca's phone and she was just talking about how she needed to remain strong after everything

that had happened and that she wasn't gonna let Dina, she didn't say Dina, but these opposing people get to her that her love with Jonah was enough and that she knows who she is and that she kind of feels bad that she gave up all of her life just to live Jonah's life and now look at the mess it got her into but never once were any of the thoughts suicidal or anything like that. Okay. But the writing on the door.

Yeah, that's no. There's no, I just think there's no way we're beckoned to that. And also they're like, oh, well, only her fingerprints were on the paint brush in the tube. But here's the thing, there was no like palette that the paint was squeezed out on to. So the paint was like squeezed onto the brush. Does that make sense? But remember, there were no prints on the actual tube, just the cap. So how'd they get the paint out?

Some weirds going on. Unless there were prints wiped down and prints planted. I don't know, I really don't know. And the neighbor said that she heard screaming and she continued to say that up until 2020. She's testified at everything. And the other neighbor said that they saw someone. A woman. That they thought was Deena, but she was at the hospital because the camera is, so I don't

know. But maybe she still saw someone. Yep. And that neighbor, please, was at the hospital because the camera's so I don't know. But maybe she still saw someone. Yep. And that neighbor, a police are like, oh, she couldn't have heard that. She's lying, but the neighbor to this day is like, no, no, no, I heard a young woman saying, help me, help me. Oh my gosh, it's horrible.

So we just don't know. Yeah, it's just a mystery. I guess we'll see in January kind of what how it's you know continues playing out But I do need to say that Jonah has since remarried but her identity is obviously remained a secret and then back in June of 2013 the spread goes so two years after this all happened the spread goes mansion was put up for sell and sold for 9 million dollars, which was far less than the asking price. Oh yeah, I'm sure no one wanted it. Yeah, and then in most,

its most recent sell was actually in 2020 for only $11 million, which you think about it in 2013. Yeah. It was nine. No one wants it. And I know, okay, $11 million is still a lot of money.

I know that we're like, oh, it's so, you know, but it has been tainted. Like the deaths of it have really stained that house. And it just, it's not gonna hold the same value, this historic value, the sugar king, it's not gonna live with people, it just doesn't have it. So that's kind of the history on that.

But either way, two people died in this case. Accidental, suicide, homicide, we don't know, but either way, we need to remember Rebecca and we need to remember Max for the tragedies that happened in 2011 in the Spreckles mansion. Crazy. All right, you guys, and that is the case this week. Thank you so much for supporting us. Thank you for loving us.

If you wanna check out our Patreon to further support the show, that's at patreon.com slash murder with my husband. And we will see you guys next week with another episode. I love it. And I hate it. Goodbye. you