My Favorite Murder with Karen Kilgariff and Georgia Hardstark - 215 - Three Small Hot Dogs

Episode Date: March 26, 2020

Karen and Georgia cover the mysterious death of Natalie Wood and the Boxcar Killer.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

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What was that? And welcome. Welcome. To my favorite murder. To my favorite murder. The quarantine episodes. The So Far Away and Yet So Close episode. Yeah, we're doing it.

We're on Skype. I'm looking at Karen in your second bedroom. That's right. We're pointing at each other over Skype. Steven is watching us silently from a distance. Steven was helping me set this up earlier and I tried to set it up on my phone. It's so hard. It's A so hard.

Props to Steven. Four years running. Yeah. The uncomplaining sound guy that's actually holding so much shit down that we don't, they're only now beginning to understand Steven. We love you deeply. Thank you. Thank you for keeping us always between 18 and 12.

We appreciate it. And, but the Skype for some reason, the way I was doing it was taking pictures of my face at random times and I'm not, you know, I'm not camera ready right now in any way. That's rude. It was. I, my face is sliding off my skull and Skype wants me to know it. So anyway, how are you doing in this, in this fucking global pandemic age of enlightenment? I guess I'm focusing on superficial things to distract myself.

Like, so I've definitely been putting a lot of under eye cream on lots of phone calls, lots of joking around, but I did have to on my sister's behalf today, text my dad and say, Hey, dad, for real, stop going to Costco. Like, Oh, does he just keep going? He just keeps telling my sister, like that's what he's going to do. Like he just keeps telling my sister of errands he's going to run and she's going insane. And it's, and I finally had, cause she's, of course, he always hears it from her.

So he doesn't pay attention to what she says, which I can relate to, but I finally just texted him and it was like, listen, you're driving Laura crazy and you're scaring both of us. You don't need frozen chicken cutlets. Go home. Stop it. What are you doing? And then he didn't, what was funny is then the dots came up and then they went away and he didn't say anything else.

So I'm going to tell her what, you know what? I should save this for after my first bud. Yeah. I might call him tonight just to go, Hey, you mad at me because that's what he does when I'm mad at him. It's like, you're not in my family are not allowed to be mad at each other because they'll just give you shit until you talk to them again. I might just do it back to him, but it's a kind of thing where like, look, this is, we're

in uncharted territory. There's no leadership. We all have to kind of do what doctors say and we have to do what the people on the frontline say. And there is no seriously. Yeah. There's no reason not to be doing exactly what they say. There's who is saying this?

I'm sorry. Cause I'm taking in so much content about this stuff. But somebody was saying you're, you're being asked to say in your own house where there's food and everything you like, you're not being asked to move to some government facility. You're not being asked very much. So fucking do it. To fight a war or anything. Yeah.

This is not a sacrifice. You're being asked to stay inside where you usually are. Just fucking do it. And that's the best thing you can do for this. That's like the number one top priority is to stay. I, you know who, you know who is a fucking who not surprisingly is being a leader at this time. Cardi B.

Cardi B. Cardi B. Cardi B. Cardi B. Cardi fucking B. Of course she is. With the live Instagrams. Yeah.

The weird. I love her. She's a survivor. Well, also, I retweeted a thing. There's like an amazing guy who is an amazing piano player. There's a guy that plays the piano along. So when Cardi B does her speech about coronavirus, coronavirus, and it's like she's singing, she's kind of preaching, but there's a guy that, yeah, I sent it to you.

He plays the piano along with her perfectly as if it's, she's singing, she's performing the libretto in an operetta. It is the most amazing thing. And then when it ends, the video of her disappears and he turns to camera and then it just says wash your hands. It's the most genius video. Oh, you know, another thing too, if there's people who don't believe you, you got to send them Matthew McConaughey's video from Instagram of him fucking just completely talking you

through what you need to do, Matthew McConaughey style, and it's just, it's golden. You know, there are people that I think the thing I keep trying to remind myself is this, this is such a scary situation that some people, when they get scared, their reaction needs to be, fuck you, you can't tell me what to do. It's like, cause you're, you're basically pinning both their arms and saying you have to stay in and you can't know what's going to happen next and you can't, there's nothing you can do. So you can't just do what you want.

And that triggers people and pushes their buttons and shit and make some cray cray. And there's, yeah, there's a lot of people who can't deal. And so as infuriating as it is, when we see people going to like, you know, last week going to the beach in Florida or whatever, well, there's already, there's like, there's a handful of spring breakers who have, who have it. Like it's, it's, this is, there's nothing not real about this, it's happening all around us. There's a child died in Los Angeles today, the youngest coronavirus victim so far in

America died in Los Angeles. So it's like, I don't know what more, yeah, if you're one of those kind of people that needs to say it's a hoax because you're so scared, you're freaking out, you know, then you need to look at it from the comfort, to do it from the comfort of your own home. Yeah, for real. Do it behind some sneeze guard because what you're doing is just giving it to everybody else. Whether you believe in it or not.

People who are going to die from it. The virus believes in itself. It doesn't need you to believe in it. It's those fucking 22 year olds that are like, I, I'm not sick and if I'm sick, I'll get over it. It's like, not about you, 22 year old. Right. And it's, but it's also the, the, the 55 year olds that, that have this very strange

kind of like, I decide what reality is thing that is also a fantasy. I mean, there's lots of us that live in fantasy. Hey, look, listen, we, we all have to adjust. People are going to do it at different times. Speaking of adjusting, can I tell you what I've been watching? Sure. What Vince and I have been binge watching to keep ourselves occupied for your adjustment. We started, yeah, we started true detective season one again.

Nice. I highly recommend just thinking of that. I forgot everything apparently that had happened. Apparently it was very high for the first time I watched it. I don't remember any of it. It's so good. And then I'm watching Detroiters, which is a really funny show. Tim Robinson and Sam, Sam, oh, it's Sam Richardson, Sam Richardson, the funniest.

I love that show. They're insane. It's so good. Have you seen Tiger King? Oh, Tiger King we have to talk about. Yeah. So we started watching it. We were a little like, oh, this guy kind of sucks and stopped.

And now people can't talk, stop talking about it. So I think we need to go back to it. I did the same thing only. The reason I turned it, it was probably four days ago and people keep on tweeting me about it of like, you have to, I must know. And I turned it on and it was just like, it wasn't a good time where after the third person spoke to camera, I was like, I can't, I cannot spend time with these people. Like I can't do this right now.

Yeah. That's exactly what it was. I like, I want to hear the story, but these people are really bumming me out about how horrible they are to Tigers. It's just like, how am I supposed to hang out? All of it. Yeah, exactly. I need things that are a little less impactful at the moment.

So what have I been watching? Yeah, it's, I, of course, I'm just going deep into like a corn TV and Brit box or whatever where it's like some truly like a British procedural from the nineties that I can barely understand what anyone's saying. That's the only thing that's really giving me any kind of peace of mind right now. Comforting. But you know, here's what I think is a beautiful, maybe not a coincidence. Brené Brown's podcast finally came out unlocking us and I haven't listened to it yet because

I'm in the middle of a book on tape, but I'm so excited because I feel like her voice, her everything about the trailer for that podcast, like she's such a presence, calming a scientific yet self-help kind of mind is like, I would probably not be wrong to highly recommend a podcast. I've never listened to it before just because definitely it's our friend, Brené Brown. Are you doing phone therapy sessions? I just did one this morning. Oh, I did for the first time.

It was fine. My obsession now is first of all, I had to talk about being a workaholic, which really bothered me because I was like, I didn't really have anything else to talk about because I've just been in my house and then I was like, can I say this? My therapist that I've been having phone calls with said to me when I was like, I don't know what to talk about the first day, she was like, in these times when there's like a singular focus instead of the day-to-day life to talk about, that's when you can actually get really deep into some shit because you're not being distracted by like, I'm mad at this person

and I have to do this work and I'm stressed. It's like you can now go deeper. Yes. That's basically what happened where I was kind of like, yeah, I mean, I guess it's okay. I like chaos and all this shit that I normally say or whatever and then it kind of tumbled out of my mouth where I was just like, yeah, it's a problem because if I'm a workaholic, then I can't really, I can't do anything nor can anyone else that uses work to distract themselves from the difficulty and big feelings of life.

And I was just like, sorry, I'm going to have to hold on that one for a second and really sit in it. Come back to me. Yeah. It was crazy. Or like the whole thing where like you use work as a way, as a barometer to how good you are, what a good person you are because you get work done and because you're so busy and like the busier you are, the more important you are and that's the only way you can tell

if you're important or not. Yeah. That shit. I'm not a workaholic. I don't know how you and I pair it up. We are, you know where we paired up at the opposite party and that's how we do it and that's where the magic happens. Back to back.

Exactly. We got back to back. We got back to back. You know what's funny though? It's like, I almost said to my therapist, it's like that thing where I'm like, I don't know, like I, it was great to talk to her and I'm going to do it again tomorrow, but there's this part of me that's kind of, it's almost like I get the feeling of like, don't go in there because I think we are also, it's almost like we're waiting to find out what

we're scared about or something. You know what I mean? We're waiting for the first big wave to hit or something like that. And I think the important thing in it, in a time like this, because she said this to me, she said it before, but she reminded me this morning. It feels like we're in a free fall, but the key, the key is remembering that there's no bottom to hit. We're never going to hit ground.

So yes, we're free falling and the whole trick of life is to become comfortable with the free fall. Understanding it's always like that. You're never, even when we have these kind of pretend things of like, well, if I get my work done here, then I'm good here and blah, blah, blah. Like that's all fake too. It's all fake. So.

Well, it's almost like you, I couldn't understand though, not wanting to like have an open wound when you're about to go through some fucking other traumatic shit that has nothing to do with that wound. Of course. It's like, like, I don't want to get deep into my childhood and fucking sad and depressed over it when I can't then go have a drink with my girlfriend and fucking talk to her about it. Right.

Right. But I can still call her on the phone. So. Yeah. That's good. Well, also long conversation the other day. We had a great, we had a great, you know, it's funny, when we got off that call, I was like, we were laughing so fucking hard during that call and I'm like, we never do that to

each other because that's what we do for a living. We never do that. Save it. Save it for the podcast. We always save it for the podcast. Then you texted me, hey, want to chat? And I was like, I was scraping my mind like, what could she want to talk about? And then I'm like, I think she just wants to talk because all we have been having is

like stressful conversations about our entire fucking business. Yes. And it's really fucking stressful. Sure. So I was like, before we have to record this podcast, let's have a nice conversation. Yes, exactly. Oh, firetruck just went by. Firetruck just went by with friends.

Oh. Oh, so sorry. Is another house on fire? I don't know. I think they just went to check stuff. Oh, God. I just pointed at a firetruck like a child as it went by the front of my house. Oh, firetruck.

Oh, look a firetruck. Sorry. Right as you were trying to say something nice about us being friends. Well, that's why we're friends. No. That's it. There you go. No.

It was great though. And it also was just funny because as opposite as we are, there's almost some things I don't have to talk to you about because I know we feel the exact same way about them. And those are, I think it's good for us to remind each other of how alike we are because we always just are noticing the differences because we have to do something about it. But the ways we are like are very comforting to me. Oh, that's so nice. It is like we're sisters at this point, for sure.

It is. It's true. You know what I was thinking about when this was all going down and who am I going to call and this and that? It's like, you know who the best friends, like the best friends in your life are the one who you have in your phone, their sister's phone number or their mom's phone, like just in case you can get a hold of their, a relative of theirs. Yeah.

Those are like the best friends you have, I think. I could text your sister immediately or your dad and be like, get in your room. Oh, he would love it if you texted him. I love this. I think adult friendships where you have a connection like that relates to really quickly because everyone in exactly right is doing cool shit right now. Yes, they are. Despite the panic that everyone's feeling.

This network, well, people are using it and actually podcasting cool stuff. I'm so proud. So Murder Squad, Billy and Paul are discussing domestic abuse resources to support people who are in quarantine with their abusers right now, which is so fucking incredible. Yeah. Amazing. That episode dropped yesterday, I'm sorry, that episode dropped Monday, the 23rd. So that's up now.

So yeah, go listen to that. And then they also cover how first responders might respond to a call when someone is in imminent danger, despite the fact there's a fucking pandemic going on because people are still going through some shit whether or not this is happening. So they cover that and I just, it's important. Yeah. They're thinking about elements of this that are really important and I think not that often discussed.

And I think, yeah, it's very cool that those guys did that. It hit me really hard when I saw some meme that was like, you know, there's so many people and children who escape, who use their day to day jobs and school to get away from their abusers that don't have that resource now. And so here's some phone numbers. And it, I felt so privileged and like, what's the word, lucky, but also like, oh, I hadn't even considered that that was an issue for people. I'm so lucky that I don't have to, almost like people who are blissfully ignorant of

stuff like that. Ignorant. Yeah. Very ignorant. Yeah. So I'm glad they're covering it. It's kind of good too. Cause then it just, it gives a kind of needed perspective.

If you're really freaking out, like how bad things are for you. Yeah. You don't care about stuff like that or think about it or just look into what other people might need. I think it also helps that. Yeah. It helps. Yeah.

Call everyone. You don't know what people are going through right now. Yeah. This podcast will kill you. These amazing women released a six part bonus series with updates on COVID-19. They did a special six part fucking episode about this. They interview experts and cover topics from the origin of the virus to ways of maintaining your mental health during a self quarantine.

So that's coming out starting Monday, March 23rd. Yeah. And I think they said all six Monday, all six episodes are available. So they're, yeah, I believe they're, they release them all at once. I don't know, Steven, if you know, if I'm right about that, but I believe that's the case. Cause there's basically, so you can basically binge all of them and get all your info at one time.

That's correct. Yeah. It's all so you can get your binge on and listen to all six Steven, please don't say get your binge on. It's a pandemic. I apologize. There's no need, there's no need to go to such a dark place. Erase one of those, erase one of those points we gave him on the whiteboard for everything

you said. Really? Just cause you keep us between 18 and 12 all our lives doesn't mean you can say get your binge on. It's crazy. Speaking of which, the per cast, Sarah and Steven this week, which dropped yesterday, they have, of course, are recording from home talking about the pandemic, how the quarantines affecting them and their cats and their relationships.

It's a very special, a very special, the per cast this week, right, Steven? The fall line is still doing, is now doing part two of Carolina girls. It's, it concludes the story on the North Carolina, Brittany Locklear, who was kidnapped and murdered in 1998 and it discusses the disappearance of another girl, whose case at one point tied to Henry Lee Lucas, that fucking liar. So that's coming out on Wednesday yesterday. So listen to that. Yeah.

The fall line is such an amazing show. Those guys just, they're just, they're the real deal. It's, I'm so impressed by that. And I'm also impressed by, do you need a ride? These two young upstarts in comedy, me and Chris driver ones. Fresh faces. We're fresh faces for Aspen. We got the Aspen Fresh Faces Showcase.

That's a comedy festival that hasn't existed in 22 years. We made timely, timely, right? Right at the, right the height of the true, worry and fear weekend of the new pandemic. I made Steven get into the car with me and Chris and we drove around for, I think three hours and just recorded. I can't believe you guys did that. Two back to back Q and A episodes. And the funny thing was, so, you know, everyone knows it's, of course, you can't drive in

Los Angeles ever. It's, it's so awful. The traffic is terrible. If you listen to, do you need a ride? I complain about it constantly as if it's interesting. We are, we are sailing around the streets. There's no one out. We'd go anywhere we want.

It's also very strange and there's not very many people out. And then we find this just, you know, spoiler alert. We find a drive through Starbucks that's open, which I think is a miracle. Yeah. Yeah. I love it. I want to know that. And it was pouring rain too.

That day, right? It was pouring rain. It's going to be great. Everyone was scared. It was, yeah, it was pretty crazy. And also this round of Q and A questions in the beginning, it was like, would you rather be one huge hot dog or three small hot dogs or whatever where you're like, okay, I don't know the answer to this.

That's an amazing question. No, I just made that up. Oh, I love it. But I mean, that's just a fun party version. But this time people got kind of into, they got, they asked some very interesting questions. Sorry. That's all I'm trying to say. Extestential.

Extestential driving. Yeah. And then of course, then exactly writes newest podcast. I said no gifts with Bridger Weinegger is out now. We're so fucking excited about it. And the third episode comes out this week today, Thursday, March 26th, with the guest this week is Andy Richter, which is incredible. This is such a good podcast.

If you guys have been following along, thank you so much. Make sure you subscribe wherever you listen to podcasts. It really helps the podcast out when you do that and when you comment and give them five stars. And review. Yeah. And review. It's really helps on the charts, which is awesome.

Yeah. And it really is such a delightful. Yeah. I think these days, I know personally, I'm definitely turning to podcasts more and more just puttering around the house as I'm getting really into cleaning, which is surprising to me. But it just really like listening to other people talk is so such a nice kind of pseudo socializing.

I think it does all the same things to your brain that regular socializing does. So if you want a good, hilarious chat show hosted by very intelligent and very like fun to listen to people, Bridger Weinegers, I said, no gifts is the podcast for you. And it's positive. So if you're feeling down and you just need to like tune the fuck out, something positive, this is a really great way. It was all, it was all recorded before this happened too. So you're not even gonna.

Yeah. He was, he was recording this months ago, but it's about gifts. It's who doesn't want to think about presents and why you give gifts and what you get and what the worst and best have been. Come on. I love what you did for your housewarming party where you just don't say gifts are unnecessary. You just don't even mention them on the invite and then people bring them. I did.

Brilliant. And I, I swear to you and you didn't, oh, you told me you did it on purpose. You didn't. I did not. No, no, no. I did not. I was joking to you because you were like, you didn't, you didn't put no gifts. And then I was like, of course I didn't, but I actually, I did not think about it.

I didn't think about it. Well, you, you seem to be like delighted by it. So it didn't seem like an insult, but I didn't think about it. And I wouldn't, I don't think I would bring someone to be like, no, if you just bought your own house, get your own goddamn gift. Like go to hell. Can't afford your own fucking candle. You shouldn't have bought a fucking house.

Yeah. You should be saving for candle money. Don't invest in real estate. Not now. Not now. Okay. So this is moment. I'm kind of excited to talk about this because this is one of those things.

So we get, um, we get given gifts when we go on tour all the time and people will hand us stuff in the, in the line, um, in the meet and greet line. And they'll say, they'll tell us a little story, hand us something. We'll say, thank you. We put it in a pile. We ship it back to the office. And then sometimes three months later we go through the box and then we're like, ooh, remember this and whatever.

And so we have a bookshelf at the office that has all the books we've been given or, you know, there's just different stuff all around. So this book ended up on my nightstand, um, that I started reading, I would say two weeks ago and it's called, um, The Forest City Killer by Vanessa Brown. And it is, it is about, um, in London, Ontario, Canada, um, in the sixties, there was a serial killer and nobody put it together that there was a serial killer in this tiny town. And this, Vanessa Brown, the author gave it to us herself. This, this one is to me, I'm sure there's one to you.

Um, and I read the whole book. It's really fascinating. It's really heartbreaking, um, you know, of course it's goes into like how the families deal with it and it's, you know, the victims or teenage girls. And then the end, I read every page because it was that good. And I still, you know, by the end it's not satisfying because it's very realistic. But you know, it's just as much about her doing the research and trying to get this, the truth out as anything else.

And then at the very end, I'm reading, I'm just kind of scanning the acknowledgments page and at the very bottom, yeah, it says, it's of, you know, it's listing people and then it says Karen and Georgia who have no idea how important they are to the rest of us. We got it. We're right in the middle. We got it. Almost at the end.

I'm sweating. I hope it's not her parents. And then. Oh my God. And then it says, uh, and the last thing says, and to my partner, the only person who really matters, Jason Dixon. And then it says, SSDGM, VB. Amazing.

I was like, the book is great. Vanessa. Highly recommend. But then what world do we live in? We're kind of in the book. I don't do. I was, can I say, I was just, I'm listening to a book right now and I put it on and everyone's been listening to it and saying how great it is.

It's called, hold on, let me make sure it's called The Sundown Motel by Simone St. James. And it's like, you know, this woman goes missing in the 70s and her, you know, her niece goes to find out what happened. It's like one of those like true crime fiction books. And in the beginning, it's like, you know, the thank yous, and I'm listening on Audible. So it's that. And it says, and to all the murderinos. And I was just like, what the fuck is my life?

Yeah. This is insane. It's amazing. That's just like the same thing happened in Maureen Johnson's book that she, she dedicated it to all the murderinos. I know it's very cool. So good. Thanks for being here.

Read books. Thanks for being here. Books are now becoming a big part of what I do. It's how I put myself to bed at night because I know I'll just fall asleep on the couch watching TV. So I'm like. Mine is, mine's White Castle. Oh no, wait, sorry.

Mine's White Claw. Mine's White Claw. Both are good answers. Both are acceptable answers. What about White Castle? What about three White Castle burgers and then a whole, and then you slam a White Claw. And then you tell the truth. Oh my God.

Then you tell everybody what you really think about their outfit. I haven't been outside in about three days. Then since I need to go for a walk. Yeah. I keep watching people walk by my house and I'm like, yeah, that looks like, that looks like a great idea. But I'm not, I don't do it. Looking for a better cooking routine?

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Download the app today. Who's first, Steven? You are Georgia. All right. Georgia's sitting, guys, just so you know, I'm looking at Georgia on Skype and she's sitting in her closet with clothes around her shoulders like you have long hair of material. I'm surrounded by vintage. I bet it's very comforting.

It is. Actually, I've been, this whole time, been accidentally touching my late grandmother's bathrobe that like means so much to me and it's nice. What's that material? It's silk and it's like an old kind of old timey bathrobe. Yeah. Oh nice. I just love it.

Just hold it, Georgia. Oh, sorry. Before you start, Nick Terry did an MFM animation of the cocaine, cocaine hogs. Yeah. It's so great. It's on everywhere, but I didn't realize this and I finally saw it in his link. Nick Terry has a Patreon that we should all join. Yeah.

So go to patreon.com slash forward slash MFM underscore animated. And you can join Nick Terry's Patreon and make it so that he can just do that for a living. That'd be cool. And he makes merch from that stuff too. That's really cool. I've only seen some rad t-shirts and stuff. Yes.

My friend Patty Riley has his shirt with all the characters, all the Nick Terry characters across the front. And she told me she's been stopped a couple times by murderinos who are like, oh my God. It's such a good shirt. Yeah. The new one is excellent. It's necessary watching. For whomever.

Okay. How am I going to fucking do this? I have. Can you see? No. Yeah, I can see. The light's okay. Okay.

I've got my hands. So let's do it this way. Let's start with this one. Fuck it. It's the global pandemic. I'm doing the mysterious death of Natalie Wood. Oh shit, girl. I went there.

You did. I thought you were going to say like the black plague or something. Oh no. This is a fuck it. One of us eventually has to do it story. Yes. It's that's so true. Wow.

Yes. Are you ready for this? Let me tip back in my chair. The problem with this one is like you could do it six different ways. Like there's six different ways to do it and options and thoughts and stories to read about it. Yeah. It's complicated.

So I'm doing kind of the, you know, not bare bones, but the, some basics. Right. Because there's just a lot of theory, right? Because there's no, no one really knows the truth. Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. All right.

So I got a bunch of information from a Vanity Fair article by Sam Keschner, another Vanity Fair article by Suzanne Finstad and all that's interesting article by Marco Margueritov, a biography article by Tim Ott, Wikipedia. There's a 48 hours episode about it called Death in Dark Water. Did you watch that? No, but I will after this. And then there's a New York Times article by Katherine Rossman. I mean, there is just a million articles you could read about this and videos too.

Natalie Wood is born on July 28th, 1938. Her real name was Natalia Zaharinki. Did you know that? Natalia was her real name because she was born from Russian immigrant parents. Oh, wow. And her mom pushes her into acting, oh, they were born in San Francisco, they were from San Francisco. Yeah.

So her mom pushed, yeah, girl, at the age of four, her mom pushes her into acting and she appears in a couple of films by the times she's seven studio executives at RKO Pictures. They changed her name to Natalie Wood because they wanted to sound more American. Sure. Yeah. At eight years old, she gets cast in the role of Susan Walker, the girl who doesn't believe in Santa Claus in everyone's favorite Christmas movie, Miracle on 34th Street. She's the little girl.

That's a huge fucking role. It's a huge role and she is so great and watchable and charming and real. It's amazing. Yeah. It's amazing. Yeah. I really love that everyone right now is putting up Christmas trees and Christmas lights and pretending it's Christmas.

I think that's a brilliant idea. Oh, I forgot about that. I should get my old, my white Christmas tree back out. Yeah. It took me so long to take that thing apart though. God damn it. She should have just left it at the whole time. I know.

After a series of smaller roles, Natalie Wood ends up playing the teen ingenue opposite James Dean, of course, and Rebel had a cause. We all remember that. We don't remember it, but we know about it. Hey, that's a great, let's just bookmark some of these as a movie for your quarantine. Rebel Without A Cause was so ahead of its time. That movie is not like a 50s movie. When you watch it, you will not believe.

It's just incredible. It's so cool. It's like, it's suddenly these teenagers and what's happening in reality, which is these baby boomers, their children are all, wait, no, that's not right. All these parents from World War II are having children who are rebelling and everyone wants something different now. Yeah. And it's just kind of shocking.

It's a great movie. Incredible. Yeah. It's a role that earns her best supporting actress nomination at fucking 16 years old. Yeah. In her 20s, she's cast in the musical adaptation of West Side Story, another incredible movie, and the movie Gypsy. And by the time she's 25, she's one of the youngest people to have been nominated for

three Oscars. She's one of the fucking biggest stars of her time. The public had watched her grow up through the movies. So they're, of course, emotionally attached to her and they're completely enamored by her. She has these big, huge, soulful, dark brown eyes, but also this girl next door, Charm. So she's just, she's Americana and everyone loves her. In 1956, on her 18th birthday, the studio heads from 20th Century Fox set her up with

26-year-old Robert Wagner. He's known to his friends as RJ, that's his, like, that's what everyone calls him. And the studio heads were thinking their relationship would get great publicity for Wagner's up-and-coming acting career. They always did. They set people up all the time. Yeah. That was the thing.

And just another, I'm going to bookmark this for the quarantine watch, if you've never watched Heart to Heart and you ever wondered what the early 80s was like in Los Angeles, I'm telling you, the show Heart to Heart, H-A-R-T to H-A-R-T is some cheesy, amazing, it's a rich husband and wife that solve crimes for reasons you cannot figure out. Like they're constantly embroiled in crime and murder, even though they're rich and they live in, like, Beverly Hills or something. And it's, but the background, the outfits, the hair, it's so good. It's on par with Colombo and I think it's easier to get a hold of, yeah.

Even Robert Wagner is the main character. We've been watching Colombo ever since you fucking reminded me. And it's just as good as you, it's exactly what you said it is. It's so beautiful. It's so good. It's so unbelievable. So they fall fucking, like, madly in love with each other in a way that I think only happened in the 50s and with beautiful actors, like, of course, you feel madly in love with

each other. They get married a year later, 1957, and they become Hollywood's, like, royal couple. Everyone's obsessed with them. Media scrutiny, of course, puts a strain on their marriage. And five, after five years of, you know, a rocky, I'm sure, alcohol-fueled relationship, they divorce after rumors of an alleged affair between Natalie Wood and her co-star at the time, Warren Beatty, and they were in Splendor and the Grass Together, which is another great movie to watch.

Yeah. Yeah. So there's rumors of that and everyone, and so they divorce, but it's rumored that the real reason they split is that Natalie Wood actually walked in on Robert Wagner having an intimate moment with another man. Oh. That's the rumor. Okay.

And in a lawsuit she files against him at the time, she charges him with mental cruelties. Oh. So Suzanne Finstead wrote a 2001 biography about Natalie Wood, and she alleges that she was, that Natalie and her sister confirmed, Natalie Wood's sister Lana confirms this, that she was raped by a powerful actor when she was just 16 years old at the Chateau Marmont. She had gone in to like interview with an actor about a position and came out fucking just in tears and, you know, having just been sexually assaulted by, and they say who

it is, who the rumored person is, I'm not going to fucking say it, obviously, but you can find it online. You know, just to say sidebar you, but it is like the other day the news report came out that Harvey Weinstein not only got sent, actually got sent to jail, which I think a lot of people in Los Angeles kind of can't believe, but then on top of that now he has coronavirus because he's in jail. And he really is this symbol and hopefully it's like the end of, of not just an era, but a tradition in Hollywood where people with power, they just break other people because

they can and no one does anything because no one else wants to get in their way. And Lana Wood, the sister, says that to a New York Times reporter that after the rape, their mother instructed Natalie to keep it a secret in order to protect her career, of course. And so her mother was kind of the stage mom who was like anything for your career, suck it up kind of a person. And also at 16 years old, while she was filming Rebel Without a Cause, she had an affair with the movie's 41-year-old director, Nicholas Ray.

She's fucking bananas on its own, right? You know? Yeah. Yes. So during her first marriage to Robert Wagner, Natalie Wood is insecure. She's 18. She's suspicious of everyone. She has terrible insomnia and can't figure out why she's so unhappy.

She starts taking sleeping pills and then she finally starts going to a psychiatrist and spends every lunch hour for the next eight years talking with the psychiatrist. She turns down roles so she can like be close to him and talk to him. It's pretty amazing. Every lunch hour every day? Yeah, but you know, movie lunch hour, so it's probably 15 minutes and every three days. So after that, she has a brief relationship with Warren Beatty. He leaves her to date.

A coat check girl is the rumor. And so Natalie attempts suicide by swallowing a bunch of pills. She goes to Cedar Sinai and they save her in time. Her biographer writes that Natalie was always on the precipice of a crisis and her greatest fear. And there's a video of her saying this to interviewers. Her greatest fear is dark water and that she would drown in dark water. It's her biggest fear.

After their divorce, both Natalie and RJ, Robert Wagner, Mary, other people, they have children. They both move on with their lives for nine fucking years or like later days to each other. But Natalie Wood ends up leaving her second husband in 1971, not long after the birth of her daughter, Natasha. And within three months of her second divorce, RJ and Natalie are back together and even more in love than ever, apparently. Her sister Lana does say when she was like, what the fuck to Natalie, she was like, something

like the devil you know is better than the devil you don't know or one of those along those lines. Yeah. But it does seem like they were super fucking in love with each other and obsessed. So Natalie's fear of water, as I said, it's been famously documented. As a child, Natalie's mom takes her to a fortune teller and the fortune teller is like, she'll be a great beauty, but she should also be aware of dark water. No.

So from then on, I know to, yeah, fortune teller, can you not scare a four-year-old please or whatever. But also what fortune teller? Because she knew what she was talking about. So there's all these examples of her filming movies where they just get in the water and she's freaked out and so she's just terrified of it. Okay. Well, you believe me for fuck's sake, everyone.

You all believe me. I don't have to give you details. Okay. Despite her fear of water, Natalie would enjoys boating and sailing frequently. I think Catalina at the time, you know, that little island 22 miles away from us in LA here is like where the fucking rich and famous go to like, you know, yacht and hang out with a yacht and boat. Yeah, and like, you know, hang out without being, without the plebes bugging them.

She even remarries our Jayana Yacht and they go on a cruise to Catalina for their second honeymoon in 1975, a couple years later, they buy their own yacht. It's called the Challenger, but they rename it Splendor, even though it's considered a bad luck to rename a boat, which I didn't know. I didn't either. For shadowing. All the rich people that listen are like, I knew because of your yacht, yacht, yacht. Because here in your yacht bullshit, you and your yacht with a helicopter pad on it and

shit. Fuck off. They, so they hire this dude to help them bring the boat from where they bought it, Florida to California. And they end up hiring him to be their captain. He's this lean hot kind of hot dude, but there's no, you know, that he's just a friend of theirs and he becomes a really good friend of theirs. And they like having him on board and they kind of, it's almost like, you know, their

friend on board with them. So that's good. And his name is Dennis Davern. So by 1981, now 43 year old Natalie Wood, her career is waning, her parts are of course going to younger actresses. And meanwhile, you know, RJ is becoming that hot, grizzled detective, cigarette smoking looking guy and he is getting a bunch of television shows and because television star with his hit heart to heart, Aaron loves, which I genuinely do love.

But I have to say again, that's that thing where Natalie Wood is easily one of the most beautiful Hollywood actresses there has ever been. And her expiration date was, what are you saying? She's in her early late thirties, when she, yeah, 43, she's 40, 40. So young. Yeah. And it is incredible. And then meanwhile, it's just like, dudes get older and somehow the rules are, yeah,

that's great. The more grizzled you are, the better it is. So fucked. Yeah. Exactly. So everything is fair and nothing is wrong. Yeah. Breaking news.

Hollywood sucks. It's unfair. You won't believe it. It's really superficial. Anyway, and their marriage gets a little rocky and Natalie's worried that RJ is drinking too much. So they're just getting famous and there's flirtations on set with the lead actress from heart to heart, whose name you probably know.

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. I knew you'd know that. I knew the answer. I knew the answer. Karen, good girl. Where are your dogs?

And why aren't they barking? Oh, they're locked way the fuck out of here because they would be barking any, if a person walked by, it would be all dogs. So I fed them and then gave them both bully sticks and shut through about three doors so they can't come in. But I'll let them in at the end. Yes, of course. So her career is waning, but she does get a movie opposite Oscar winner, Christopher

Walken, who, God damn it, he was a snack when he was young. Have you seen him? Oh, yeah. Oh my God. And a dancer. A dancer and a snack and a half. Just a cool guy, always. Yeah.

Cool guy. So her last picture is with him called Brainstorm, he had just filmed, he had got an Oscar for Dear Hunter, which is another movie to put on your list. Oh, I would put that down near the bottom though. Dear Hunter. It's not a good time. I actually haven't seen it. I was like, I bet it's good.

It's so heavy. Well, I mean, it's about, it's about Vietnam veterans. So it's as about as heavy as a movie can be. Take it off your list right now. We'll wait. We'll wait. Yeah. Wait till things stabilize a little bit more.

Definitely. I really want to watch 12 Monkeys and Vince is like, why would you want to do that right now? It's a great fucking movie. It's a great movie. I was thinking of this, sorry, well, while you were kind of going through her movies, there's one that I've seen and it's not as well known, but I went through a very strong Steve McQueen phase and there's a movie called Love with the Proper Stranger.

Love with a Proper Stranger. Love with the Proper Stranger. It's from 1963. Yes. I said, yes, so confidently about it for sure. But if you, I would flip Dear Hunter and Love with a Proper Stranger because the vibe of that movie is so lovely and it's like two people that are like not trying not to fall in love and then they have a one night stand.

It's really good. It's very modern. And they're such good actors that it's believable and shit. It almost seems like, like I feel like if you're an actor and you're having a love scene with, you know, with someone else, you kind of have to have those vibes with them or it's going to be a terrible scene, you know. Right. I think that's why it makes sense.

Yeah. That's why actors are the way they are where they're kind of fake, but they actually kind of mean it because they're just like, yeah, life experience it all. And then it's all kind of like rock and roll. And yeah, that's, I'm like sitting in your fucking closet and hide from everything with a white claw. It's my acting skills in a nutshell. I'm like, okay, I'll in love with Steve McQueen, that'll solve it.

That'll do it. Definitely. Okay. So RJ visits the set of a brainstorm and notices the chemistry between Natalie and Walken and is like, he writes in his memoir that at the least they were having an emotional affair. Like there was a fucking connection between the two of them, at least emotional. But on Thanksgiving weekend 1981, Natalie invites Christopher Walken to join her and RJ on the Splendor to go to Catalina, which is like, that sounds like the most awkward

fucking trip I've ever heard. Yeah. I wonder what that was about. Yeah. Christopher Walken should have said he had like hemorrhoids or something and like not gone. Yeah. He was like, oh, my old, my old tap bunions are getting me.

I have to, I've tapped dance too much. I need to get my feet up this, but yeah, sorry. So the yacht's captain, Davern, the dude that they're friends with, immediately doesn't like Walken as soon as he gets on the boat because Natalie Wood and him and Christopher Walken are openly flirting on the boat already. Okay. Okay. So the group of four, the four of them, Natalie Wood, Christopher Walken, Wagner and the

captain, Davern. They leave around noon on Friday and Davern says that he could tell Wagner was jealous of all the attention Wood was giving Walken and it's a gray, cold day, the sea is rough. This is foreshadowing. Oh. I'm really good at it. So Christopher Walken gets seasick on the way over there. He's in his state room.

He probably just was uncomfortable if I'm guessing correctly. And the yacht gets to the harbor in Catalina and there's no moorings available, which I'm guessing is just like the dock on the beach where you can moor your boat. Is that right? I think it means like a parking space in the harbor is where that's my guess also knowing nothing about yachts or boats. I think we're right. I think that means you just like jump on and off when you want to go into town.

But so there isn't one of those. So they have to like put their anchor down a little out of the dock, which means they have to take a dinghy if they want to go to land. So embarrassing. Yeah. And do they know who these people are? Day classic. That's what they're screaming in the dinghy as they have to row across.

Do you know who I am? Who we are. It's me. From heart to heart. So it's a quarter of a mile off of Avalon, which is the like main small town in Catalina. And around 5 p.m. that evening, they all go into town. Davern stays behind to make dinner. They have beers at the restaurant and then they go back on board.

And essentially RJ and Natalie start fighting on board that Friday night because RJ wants to move the boat because of the rough sea conditions because they're so far out, you know, in the water. Natalie wants to spend the night. She wants to go on shore and stay at a fucking hotel because she's terrified of water. And it's all choppy and shit. And he refuses, but he lets her leave with the captain Dennis. And they go spend the night at a hotel together, but nothing happens.

It's like, it's very innocent, but she confides in this guy, Dennis, a lot. And one of the things she says that night is that she's thinking of divorcing him. Oh. Yeah. And so, but the next morning, she was like planning on taking a helicopter back or a boat back to like to Los Angeles, but the next morning she reconsideres and goes back to the boat and they smooth things over. So it's Saturday now.

Okay. So in the afternoon that Saturday, they all go to Ismas Cove, which is an isolated spot on the northern end of the island. It's a really small community that caters to Yatsmen, which means rich people. Natalie Wood and Christopher Walken go alone on the little dinghy to a restaurant and they're sitting there having drinks and everyone saying they're laughing and having the best time. When Robert Wagner shows up and he gets pissed that they're having so much fun, he's really jealous of the two of them, allegedly.

And they go to the only restaurant on the Cove to have dinner. And some of the restaurant staff and other diners there said that everyone was drinking, they were drinking very heavily and there was volatile behavior on Natalie Wood's part. It seems like she got really drunk and mad at Robert Wagner. Supposedly she throws a glass at the wall at some point and then like he has to hide her behind his coat, walking her out because she's stumbling so much. And of course, everyone knows who they are, their fucking royalty. And when they leave the restaurant, the restaurant's manager calls up the harbormaster and he's

like, yo, keep a fucking eye on these drunkies, please, because that's how bad it is. There's something going on here. So they go back to the Splendor at about 10 p.m. and they open another bottle of wine. And this is according to Dennis and Natalie Wood and Christopher Walken, they're all hanging out in the state room and they're openly flirting and like acting like no one else is in the room. And so RJ grabs a bottle of wine and smashes it on the table in front of them and says to Christopher Walken, Jesus Christ, what are you trying to do?

Fuck my wife? That's a fucking quote from Dennis that he says that. So after that, Christopher Walken, that's so crazy, retreats to his room and then Natalie Wood and Robert Wagner start fighting in their room. And Dennis DeVern says that he stayed on the bridge and he can hear them fighting and it's like one of the worst fights he's ever heard between them. He says that stuff was getting thrown around and everyone on the boat could hear it. And then he says the next thing he hears is the ropes being, the ropes from the dingy

being tugged on and the dingy being untied and then it's silence. And then it's about 11 30 PM and everyone's shitfaced at this point, you know, they drink so much alcohol and then he's at 11 30, a sweaty and tousled Robert Wagner comes back up to the bridge and tells Dennis that Natalie is missing and the dingy is gone. But X casual about it and is like, she must have, we got in a fight, she must have wanted to go back to the land and took off on her own in this dingy. But it's this woman who's afraid of water and didn't even know how to operate the dingy. So Dennis of course is like, why don't we turn the searchlight on and try to look for

her? But RJ insists that they like not worry about her at the moment. They open a bottle of scotch, he refuses to call for help. And then more than an hour passes and it's one 30 AM when they finally call for help after two hours of her being missing. And RJ asked the people to look around town first because he apparently thought she had gone back to land and the Coast Guard is called at 3 30 AM and the search goes into high year. So around 8 AM that morning on November 26, someone spots something bobbing on top of

the water about a mile off of Blue Cavern Point, which is a couple of miles from Ifmisk Cove so close by where the boat was. It's Natalie Wood's body floating face down. The only thing she was wearing when she left the boat was a cotton nightgown, a red down jacket and blue wool socks. So no matter how she got on or, you know, in or out of the water, she's not wearing shoes, but she's wearing her jacket and socks. It doesn't seem like something someone would put on to just get in a dingy and leave.

Well, not a sober person, but right, you know, who knows? Yeah. And so, but they find the dingy and it's ignition key is switched off. The gear shift is in neutral and the oars are up in a locked position, which I feel like that to me is the most telling thing because if someone were dry or were trying to get sore and they were drunk and shit, they wouldn't leave it in that position. And like in a, you know, they wouldn't lock the oars and dive into the fucking water. Right.

That just wouldn't happen. Right. I mean, if she didn't know how to work it anyway, because first of all, I thought a dingy, I didn't realize a dingy had a motor. I thought it was just the boat with the oars. So maybe, like, I don't know, I don't know, but I think it's a rich, rich person's dingy. Okay. That makes sense.

So it's like, rich person's dingy is the name of this episode, but it is that thing of when you're super drunk and you're in a fight with someone where you're like, I will storm off this boat where if they're drunk enough to be fighting in public in a restaurant on a, on Catalina Island, which is the smallest place on the planet, then clearly they're, all of them were out of their normal thinking mode. So then it is like, fuck you, I am going to leave and go back or, you know, whatever. And then he's like, fuck you, do it and like, don't worry about her. And she's, you know, yeah.

And let's not call the police because she's just drunk and maybe she'll just end up somewhere and learn her lesson. I mean, because I have to say, I've always heard this story and it's basically the story or the way people have always talked about it is like, you know, Robert Wagner killed Natalie Wood and everyone knows it. And it's like, but I really, I look for that and maybe it's because I love heart to heart, but I'm looking for that. What is the through line where you could be seeing it in a different way where it's like

actually just people making terrible decisions in a boat, which is, it's easy to go wrong, I think. But that makes sense and I feel like if he had killed her, the dinghy wouldn't be involved at all. He would have just thrown her a fucking overboard. You know what I mean? Like, how does the dinghy come into play? Yeah.

Did he put her on it and be like, fuck you, you need to chill out. Not thinking she would die, but let me read you more because there's other little clues that are weird. So the news of Natalie Wood's death spreads across the globe. People fucking like, this is, you know, one of the biggest starts like an Angelina Jolie type of thing that if she died in this manner with Brad Pitt on board, like that's the equivalent of it. It's just insane.

Right. And Dennis Davern, the captain later says that Wagner immediately comes up with a story of the night's events and tells him and Christopher Watkins to stick to this story. He says he regrets going along with it at the time, but at the time he, and for a while longer, this is the story he sticks to, they all tell the detective that they thought Natalie took the dinghy to shore, even though Dennis Davern knew that Natalie was deathly afraid of water and didn't know how to pilot the small rubber boat herself. There's no mention of the fight.

The men say that the shattered wine bottle is from the waves and soon after the discovery of the body, RJ and Christopher Watkins leave the island in a helicopter and leave Davern to identify the body of Catalina. Oh, no. Yeah. I know, right? Yeah. But I wonder if some kind of lawyer didn't step in and start telling everybody what to

do behind the scenes. Yes, totally. Or someone was like, you don't want to see her the way she is. It doesn't make sense to have someone, you know, a step outside of her immediate loved ones identify a body. Also this is basically circling back to like the casting couch thing and the thing I was talking about earlier where this is the kind of thing, and I think it surprises people, but it's like, you know, these are two, these are three major stars.

So the financial impact on the studios that they work for or the TV shows or whatever, there are people, it's just like Michael Clayton, the fixer, you know what I mean? There are people who when you're rich enough, come in and take care of things for you in a way that high powered that no one gets in real life and no one would ever get that kind of help. And it is, it's like borderline, it's like the mafia, you know what I mean? Where it's just like they're protecting their investment, they're protecting these parts of the studio.

It's just like, oh, yeah, I can, I can absolutely imagine there's somebody that no one's ever known the name of that, that, you know, sailed out on a boat and was like, you do this, you go here, you shut your mouth. And it's easy to say it was Robert Wagner because he's, you know, he's the husband, it's the husband always did it. But actually, I would, I would, it's easy to imagine, for me to imagine some kind of like studio head that was like sending a guy out and basically getting a fixer. To deal with it.

And Robert Wagner has been an actor since he was young, he's used to being told what to do by these higher power people. So the autopsy shows that Wood actually has multiple bruises on her arms and an abrasion on her left cheek. And the corner explains her bruises as quote, superficial and quote, probably sustained at the time of drowning in the corner concludes that Natalie had fallen into the water while trying to board the dinghy. But there are also fingernail scratches found on the dinghy's side as if she was trying

to hoist herself up from the water. So maybe she was trying to be like, fuck you, I'm out of here. And the dinghy got, you know, untied and she floated along who know, I mean, it's just a kind of far fetched, but I mean, except for her, if they're, if they're, oh, now a cop car just went by, wait, a cop car just in front of my house. Yeah, really. George has a knife and she's in the street. Um, no, I was just thinking like being so drunk, being as drunk as they were, um, as

you told me they were. Yeah. Yeah. Leaving this yacht and getting on this dinghy, like, can you imagine just right now getting on to a dinghy how scary that would be and weird and if you're all drunk and enraged, I don't know, a boating accident. I don't know. It's easy to picture.

Yeah. No. If you're shit-faced. It's not, it's not far fetched. No. It's a not, it's not a far fetched thing for someone who was drunk and also by the way on, um, motion sickness medication and painkillers found in her system. She had a, um, her, her, what's it called, BMI was 0.14, which is twice the legal limit.

And I'm sure she's a tiny, sorry, what, BMI is body mass index. Thank you. You know what I meant? Yes. You know what I meant was her alcohol level was 0.14. So she's probably a teeny tiny person. Yes. Right.

She's got all of this in her, in her, uh, system. She's almost twice the legal limit. Yeah. I feel like, I feel like not hearing a splash is a, like no, and I know everyone on the boat lied initially, but like people on different boats nearby would have heard a splash. I don't know. Who knows? I mean, um, yeah, I don't know either.

Yeah. Yeah. So the, um, after a two week investigation, the police rule her death and accident. And eventually Dennis, uh, DeVern leaves California for the East Coast and he, in the 90s he starts drunk dialing Lana Wood, Natalie Wood's younger sister, being like, dude, I gotta tell you the fucking truth. Uh-oh. Like what I told, he, he made me tell that story and there's all this crazy shit about

like, you know, after the fact he lived with Robert Wagner and like, where Robert Wagner got him parts on TV and you know, kind of seems like he was grooming him in a way. And then Lana starts to believe it and believes, you know, he tells her about the explosive fight they had and Lana becomes one of RJ's harshest critics and, uh, he, she accuses him of pushing Natalie into the water. So and, um, she's a, she's an actress as well and people accuse her of exploiting Natalie's death for attention, but she says she just wants the truth. And then for years, Robert Wagner tells people he thinks Natalie was trying to retie the

dinghy when she slipped and hit her head and fell in the water. That's like in his biography. That's his, or his autobiography. That's his theory is that, um, she was tightening the ropes and fell in. Um, Christopher Walken hasn't publicly spoken much on the events. He fucking won't talk about it, but he does appear to believe that it was in an accident. And in November, 2011, uh, Dennis Tavern, he had finally come forward at that point and publicly announces that he lied to detectives during the original investigation.

And he, um, his, yeah, his confession gives the LAPD a reason to open the case. So this is when this all comes out, his whole story about what happened that night. And sorry, everyone, what year, what year was it? When he finally came forward. Yeah. 2011. Oh shoot. Okay.

Yeah. So everyone's like, you're trying to get money for, you know, for your, um, to write a book about it. And from the paparazzi, you're just trying to get money, blah, blah, blah. But either way, the case is reopened and during a six year investigation, the new detectives on the case review the autopsy and find that Natalie has head wounds that are troubling and may indicate that she was in a violent fight and was pushed or tossed into the water while unconscious.

And according to one detective, she quote, looks like the victim of an assault and they do the whole thing. And they talk about the, like the way the wounds were, um, you know, delivered is up and not down. And so she didn't fall this way. She fell that way or whatever the fuck. Right. And they discover a key witness, a woman named Marilyn, who was in a boat 80 feet away

that night. And she says that she and her boyfriend heard a woman screaming for help around 11pm. Um, they tried to call the harbormaster, it goes unanswered, but there's a party on a boat nearby. So they're like, Oh, it just must be partying. Oh, wow. I know. And in 2012, the autopsy report is amended to no longer classify Natalie Wood's death

as an accident. And her death certificate is changed to drowning and other undetermined factors. So her death certificate is now not accidental drowning anymore. And in 2018, uh, Robert Wagner is officially named a person of interest in the case. They can't name him a suspect, but he's a person of interest. Is that crazy? Yeah. I mean, of course he's a person of interest.

There's four people on the boat, like, yeah, but they're not naming Christopher Walken as a person of interest. Just Robert. No. They changed. I think the fact that they changed, um, her death from accidental drowning, which means no one is a person of interest to drowning and other undetermined factors, meaning there has to be, you know, there should be a person of interest if this is an accident.

Right. Yeah. It's, Christopher Walken isn't involved. Yeah. I can't imagine. Yeah. Also, what a terrible situation for him. Like, what if he, I mean, he really did like, was in love with her, had a huge crush on

her, was like, he was there because he was in love with her and thought, maybe I'm going to win her over from her husband or whatever idea. And then he's there. Oh my God. He was married at the time too. But it's also like, maybe, maybe they were just friends and he definitely heard them fighting that night. But what he wants is to be a huge fucking actor.

He wants to be an actor so he can never speak of this again. Right. You know? Right. This will tarnish his entire reputation. Right. Natalie Wood's death remains one of Hollywood's biggest mysteries. No one knows how she got into the water.

We say they're not going to close the case and that the case is now undeniably a, quote, suspicious death. Wow. And then her daughter, Natasha Gregson Wagner, who we've talked about on the podcast before, and she was partially raised by her stepfather, who was RJ. She believes solely that her mother's drowning was an accident. And she says the little details don't really matter to her, quote, the result is the same. She died and she left when I was 11 and my sister was seven and we needed her.

Oh no. Oh no. And she said she was, she was hilarious. She was always so funny. She would walk into our house and everything would be better. If she walked into a room and it was sepia, it suddenly became bright colors. And Natalie would be, would be 82 years old and a grandmother if she were still alive today.

And that is a mysterious death of Natalie Wood. Heartbreaking. It's heartbreaking. Sad. This woman, this poor woman who just wanted some kind of normalcy in her life, which there's a podcast called Fatal Voyage. And the first season is about the mysterious death of Natalie Wood. And so they, her sister talks in it, it goes really deep.

And there's a lot of information there. So check that out if you want to know more. That's very cool. Yeah. Because I would love to know the detail, I mean, to really hear about what the details of the autopsy were and like the, because there's, it is so fascinating when, um, coroners can go over stuff and, and basically be like the way this wound, the direction of this indicates this.

Like when that kind of stuff gets like sussed out and in court by coroners, I always find that to be the most fascinating because it is, it really does tell so much more. And yeah, who knows. I mean, and what if Robert Wagner's, you know, theory is true that he was saying that, um, the dinghy kept banging against the side of the boat. And so a couple, you know, a couple of times in the past, he's had to go out and tighten it because she couldn't sleep with the banging noise. So what if that night after they got in a fight and he went back up to drink with Dennis,

she went down to try and tighten it, which under, which makes sense that she had no shoes on and just her coat and she fell in. Yeah, and she was like, like in a bad mood because of all the fighting and all the drinking and she's still a little drunk and she was like, fuck everybody and I'm just going to go fix this. I mean, that, that's actually incredibly tragic. There's so many elements of tragedy to this, but the idea that this whole time everybody thinks he killed her one, actually it was just a terrible accident.

And it makes me think as well of like those times, so many parties I've been to where people get, my friends get so drunk and then they're like, I drive home and you fight with them for hours to get the keys out of their hand. And there's so many times you just go, fine, drive yourself home. You asshole. Like I used to have, my friend used to get who I loved, but he gets so drunk. And finally my ex would go out and just D he would just unbasically make it so his car wouldn't run.

So he's like, here, take the keys and he would like go take off the whatever caps or the, you know what I mean, unplug the battery or whatever, some kind of thing that he knew how to do cause he knows cars and then he just like, he would just go pass out in his car. But it's like, there is that point when people are drunk and you're in a fight and everything is bad, you know what I mean? Where you just go, fine, like get away from me. Oh yeah. I've gotten in a fight with a boyfriend at a bar and been like, I'm walking home and

then like walked home in the middle of fucking the lower hate in San Francisco. And like, and then I've gone into dive bars, like fuck him, I'm going to go have a drink by myself and this diet, you know, it's just unsafe fucking things because you're not thinking clearly. Yeah. And as the person that's like, it's like he was just as drunk sounds like, you know, from all those stories. It's like, he's, you know, it's, or he threw in the fucking water, but who knows.

I mean, it's interesting since we've all heard that theory, it's very interesting to hear kind of the details. I mean, I never knew any of that other stuff. It's amazing. Yeah. Wow. Great job. Thank you.

You're welcome. Okay. Well, it's my turn. And so this week I'm going to do one. I don't know if you've heard of this, the boxcar killer. No. No. Give it to me.

This is a hobo based true crime story. Okay. Yeah. And is this the one that you read the book about where he was going from city to city to city? No. The train. The best.

Right. And that. Yes. If you haven't read the man on a train and you're looking for quarantine entertainment, I know I've recommended it a hundred times, but it is a beautifully written book. You haven't? I swear you'll love it. No.

I'm going to, I'm going to do it. I'm smelling my clothes. It's written by Bill James and Rachel McCarthy James, who I believe listens to this show. Yeah. Because when I recommended it and she said, thank you, but maybe someone just told her anyway. Yeah. Amazing.

I'm going to tell myself that she listens anyway. Yeah. That, that book's amazing. No, this is a little bit different. Okay. It's really crazy. Okay. So it was suggested by Kim B. She wrote into the, to our Gmail.

So thank you, Kim B, for suggesting this story. Our sources are the Spokane Spokesman review, the East Bay Times, The Guardian, and always my one true love, Murderpedia. Okay. And we were just going to talk about this really quick because this came up once before long ago. The term hobo is not a problematic term. Right.

The term hobo is not a reason for you to get upset. The term hobo comes from a time after the civil war when a lot of men who are out of work and looking for basically migrant farming jobs, looking to go anywhere they, so they would jump on the railroad and they would travel all around the country to get farming jobs anywhere that there were farming jobs based on what was growing and being farmed. And they would bring their own hos with them. So the nickname used to be hoboy, H-O-E. And then after time, you know, as time passed, it got shortened down to hobo.

And that's what hobo, that's what hobos call each other. So if you think it's problematic, you can call your local hobo and bring it up with them. But, but there's also a modern term for hobo, which is train riders. So we can also use that terminology as well. And we need to take the stigma off hobo because there's no, there's not a problem with it. As far as hobos are concerned. So here's, it starts in 1995 in December of 1995, 39 year olds, a train rider, we'll

call him William Pettit Jr. He finds himself a spot to sleep in the boxcar on the train that he is riding illegally. Of course, that's how all of it, all of, all of this is hobos and train riders, people that jump on to moving trains and hitch rides. It's illegal. There's security guards that they're actually called by hobos and train riders. They're called bulls and security guards often look for them to kick them off. They're not supposed to be doing it.

It's very unsafe to do anyway. And then on top of that, there's a lot of danger with the other people that, that are on the train. So William Pettit Jr. found a boxcar. He found a spot to sleep. The train was passing through Northwest Oregon. He's in a sleeping bag. He covers his head with an old baseball hat and he snuggles in.

It's really cold. He falls asleep. And sometime during the night, another train rider sneaks into that car and beats Pettit Jr. to death with a blunt object. Oh my God. The murderer then takes all of Pettit's belongings, including the clothes he's wearing and leaves behind his nude body in the bloodied sleeping bag. So when the train.

Oh my God. Yeah. He goes to the station in Millersburg, Oregon, one of the railroad security guards, the bull who's working the train yard that night. He does the routine check of all the boxcars on the train. And he finds William Pettit Jr.'s body and calls the police. So when the autopsy is conducted, it's deduced that Pettit was killed as the train passed through Salem, Oregon, which is roughly 20 miles north of where the train stopped.

And so Salem was where the authorities were contacted. So Diana Moffat is the prosecutor at the time in Salem, Oregon. And she gets the case. She knows the odds of solving a murder that took place on a moving train and the murder of a transient. The odds of being able to track that down and solve that case are very low. And so she didn't have a lot of hope. But then just two days later, she learns that the body of train rider Michael Kleitz has

been found bludgeoned to death in a boxcar in a Portland rail yard. And the scene is very similar to William Pettit Jr.'s murder. He'd been bludgeoned violently about the head and all his stuff had been stolen. So Diana Moffat calls Portland, because obviously the Portland's the big city in Oregon and she wants someone that's actually going to investigate this case and someone who knows what they're doing. So she calls Detective Mike Quackenbush to help with the investigation. I'm going to have to say his name a bunch of times.

It's one of those things. It's unfortunate. It's simply... Yeah, it's an unfortunate name. It's goofy. But... Yeah, but... So is Kilgariff.

We respect you. We respect the job. So as Detective Mike Quackenbush begins to dig into these murders, he discovers that these two murders are not isolated incidents. In fact, there are hundreds of transient murders on trains. And it's assumed that they just somehow got into violent fights with each other and wound up dead. Right.

But all of these cases are neglected by the police because of the victims' quote, unquote, high-risk, transient lifestyle. And the detective sees in these cases that he starts to find this secret police code written on many of them, NHI, which stands for No Humans Involved, which is what they found the LAPD wrote on a lot of the Grimm sleeper's victims when the police decide that if you have a high-risk lifestyle, if you're a sex worker, especially if you're a person of color or you're a transient, that's the nickname. And it's disgusting.

So... That's awful. Hey, everybody. How about you protect and serve? And know that absolutely there's humans involved if it's a murder case anyway. So Mike Quackenbush sees this, and he's like, you can't just kill people just because they're transients. This is unacceptable.

And he's like digging in. So he learns all he can about hobos and train rider life. He checks out all the switching yards, and he interviews the bulls, the railway workers, and the riders themselves to get a feel for the culture and who the big players are in the community. But among the most important pieces of information that he discovers is that there's a well-known gang that rides the rails, and they're called the FTRA. So the FTRA stands for freight train riders of America, although there are those who would

argue it originally stood for fuck the Reagan administration. Amen, sister. And so my mom is a posthumously belongs to that train riders association. Pat Kilgarov, vice president. Love it. The FTRA was founded in the early 80s by a bunch of Vietnam veterans who'd come back from the war, found they couldn't fit back into quote unquote normal society, and they wanted to live their own way by riding the rails, fending for themselves, and traveling

all across America. And I watched this documentary, and it was called Mugshot. It was like a docu-series that I'd never heard of before. It might have been Canadian because it's just familiar enough to be like, what's this? I would have known this, but it was really good, and they had so much footage of people just standing on train cars as they go through this most beautiful scenery. I could really see the appeal of doing this. And I mean, I'm fascinated by transient lifestyle and how you cope and how you, not cope, but

like how you thrive and how you survive and how you, how that, you know, why that life is so appealing to certain people. It's fascinating. It really is. And like what it actually takes, you know, there's all kinds of rules. You can't just get on any old train car, you know, it's obviously very territorial. There's lots of things to look out for. It's fascinating.

You know, there was a, now I can't remember if it was, I think it was season two. Yeah. It was season two of baskets. And yes. Oh my God. I was just thinking about that and I couldn't remember where it was from, but it's from fucking baskets. Chip baskets start season two by hopping the rails and trying to become a train ride or

a hobo and essentially ends up in jail. It's, yeah, it was my favorite. It's a great season, great show. Watch basket. Okay, you can binge baskets, there's four seasons. I find it to be very quality writing. It's a gorgeous show. Okay, so, Erin Gilgarath.

So according to a long time hobo named Jerry the Frog Fortin, and there's so many amazing, amazing names of these hobos who speak in this, in the mugshot and they speak, they play songs, you know, it's a whole culture. It's fascinating. It almost reminds me a little like prison culture where it's like, here's what you have to do to get by. Yes, totally. Everyone knows what to do, you know.

And the driving force in this culture is like the freedom. It's like, it's like, you don't need to like, you can do without having money, how can you get by and how can you all stick together and help each other? How do you live off the grid? Yeah, exactly. So Jerry the Frog Fortin, who was named 1997 National Hobos Association's King of the Hobos. I mean, he's, this guy's legit. High up.

He's up there. He says that the vets who formed the FTA were just quote, a bunch of guys who wanted to ride together. Other people say, and obviously Jerry clearly is an expert and knows, but there are other people who, who say that it was always a violent gang and some say it was always a violent gang of white supremacists who banded together to steal from other hobos. Either way, it's now a network of criminals known for assaulting and even murdering their fellow drifters.

So in many cases, they assume they will attack someone, kill them, assume in their identity and then commit, you know, fraud, like welfare fraud, stealing, you know, getting food stamps under other people's names, other forms of theft. So and the thing is, because they're living a transient lifestyle, they can just commit a crime, board a train, they're out of town. There's no record of the travel. There's no actual identification. It's very difficult to track.

Okay. So as Detective Quackenbush questions the train riders, he starts hearing about a very dangerous hobo who goes by the name of sidetrack and he meets a hobo. He's actually able to meet a hobo who's able to describe what sidetrack looks like and that hobo's name, if you will believe me, is Chewch Johnson. Amen. Chewch. Chewch.

Chewch Johnson. The Chewch. Okay. So Quackenbush basically, so the way he gets into this investigation is he finds out the train that Michael Klyte's body was found on and then he follows the route of that train and he just visits every train, every rail yard that that train stopped at and all the encampments that surround those trail yards and basically he traveled all across the Pacific Northwest showing these victims photos to anybody who would talk to them, would talk

to him and who might know them. So finally on his way back, he's in Eugene, Oregon. He finds a rail rider who says he saw Klyte's wander off in search for meth with another man who went by the name sidetrack. So while he's investigating this and on this kind of scavenger hunt all across the Pacific Northwest following these train tracks, he gets calls from three different police officers, one in Utah, one in Kansas, another one in Montana. They're all working on their own transient murder cases, which took place in the past

eight months involving the victim being bludgeoned to death. Holy shit. Yeah. Like a transient serial killer, pretty much. Exactly. And in a way that if it wasn't, you know, like they're one offs in these other cities, right? But just by chance in Oregon, there were two in a row.

So they were like, oh, this isn't just, there's, this isn't just like train ride or justice or whatever. It's like some argument that, you know, can't be rationalized. So Quackenbush asks those policemen have they heard of a man named sidetrack? They have not, but they have all heard of someone named Robert Silvera. So now Quackenbush believes he's looking, he's possibly looking for two people sidetrack and then this guy, Robert Silvera. So he chases both of them for another year before he finally gets this really crucial

break. It's an afternoon of Saturday, March 2nd, 1996, and he gets a phone call from a security guard, a train yard security guard, a bull in Roseville, California, that bull tells the detective he was running a routine check in the Roseville train yard and came across a man with an outstanding warrant for probation violation. And this man is 37 year old Robert Silvera. So Quackenbush travels down to the Placer City Jail in Roseville to meet Silvera face to face.

But he's nothing like the violent intimidating gang member that Quackenbush has that people have been describing to him. Instead, this man's calm, polite, soft-spoken, but when Quackenbush asks Silvera if he goes by any other names when he rides the rails, Silvera says, yeah, they call me sidetrack. So now he knows the two are actually one man. And then Silvera starts spilling it. Okay. So he openly admits that he is a member of the FTRA and that he's a heron addict who's

stole from other hobos to get drug money, basically. Then he immediately confesses to the murders of William Petty Jr. and Michael Kleitz. What? Yeah. Just immediately says it. And as he does, he seems relieved and he tells Quackenbush that he just wants to get it all off his chest and that he's, quote, glad he got caught because he would have continued to kill.

And then he immediately confesses to six more killings. What the... I wonder if he, like, wanted to be in prison, like one of those guys who just, like, wants to be in prison. I mean, it seems to me because he clearly was a very bad heroin addict. And I bet you he was so strung out and like the way he was living was so crazy. I mean, you know, it sounds like, it sounds like he wasn't a psychopath or a sociopath. Like he was doing, in his mind, he was justifying what he's doing to, like, get by.

But it really was affecting him. And the drugs weren't, like, making all that hideous, you know, guilt go away. And that's all... That's completely editorializing on my part. Conjecture. Your honor. Allegedly. So, as Silveris...

Allegedly. As Silveris spills his guts, he mentions to the police that he killed someone in Albany, California, which is in the East Bay. This prompts the police to contact another officer who's named William Palmini, who's in Albany. And he'd been investigating the murder of a homeless Vietnam that 15-year-old James McLean, and that had taken place near train tracks in Albany in 1995. So the timeline that Silvera gives Palmini when Palmini interviews him matches up to

this murder of James McLean. And as Palmini continues to talk to Silvera and, like, get stuff out of him, the soft-spoken man admits that in the last 14 years, he's killed dozens of people across 28 states. Oh, my God. Yeah. So, Robert Silvera is indicted for the murders of William Petta Jr. and Michael Kleitz in March 1996 in Salem, Oregon. And in January of 1998, he pleads guilty to both murders, avoiding trial and potential...

The potential for receiving the death penalty. He's given two life sentences without the possibility of parole. And then in February of 1998, Silvera is extradited to Kansas, where he pleads guilty to a third murder that of a railwriter Charles Randall Boyd. And in Kansas, he gets a 25-year sentence. And then in May of 1998, he's extradited to Florida, where he pleads guilty to the murder of railwriter Willie Clark. Silvera continues to serve his life sentences in Oregon, where he will remain for the rest

of his life. Yeah. And so, basically, they've gotten him on the murders that they investigated and that there were cops that were paying attention to and that were chasing down. Amazing. But there's tons more that just no one would have ever known about if he didn't say it himself. And that detective, William Palmini from Albany, he actually partnered up with a writer named

Tanya Chalupa, and they wrote a book called Murder on the Rails. And it's all about the details about the FTRA and the other crimes that Silvera committed during all of his years on writing the rails as a hobo all across America. And that is the story of the boxcar killer. Fuck, dude. Yeah. Isn't that nuts? That's such a world that you can't even fathom from your home.

You're sitting in your home and that this is what life is, and it's just unfathomable. And then someone going around on top of all of it fucking killing people, and they wouldn't have known if he hadn't confessed. It would have all been unsolved if he hadn't confessed. Right. Well, and I think that it's the idea of when you think about hobos, it's so positive and up and like, oh, they like to do that. They're happy to be where they are, which is what is a part of it, I think, is like,

it's the choice to be away from normal society and being like, I'm going away from that and doing this. But this is the dark side of that. This is the, you know, when you go off the grid, it's not the, you know, you don't belong to this fraternity of other, you know. Right, there's a whole faction of people off the grid who are doing so, who don't want to follow any of society's rules that are put in place to keep you safe. And being strung out on drugs makes you do things you ordinarily would never do.

And this is almost like the most extreme version of that where it's like, you just have to get that next fix. So you'll just steal whatever from whoever and you kind of rationalize it. Awful. Crazy. Good job. Thank you. Oh, thanks.

Let's do some fucking arrays. I think we all need them right now, right? Yeah. Send us your fucking arrays of people or you doing positive things in the world. It's really helpful. All right. You want to start? Sure.

Let's see. First one here is from 2amtalker and they said, my fucking hooray is that I just got my first ever article accepted by a national newspaper here in New Zealand. I'm a supermarket worker and I wrote the article about the effect of bulk and panic buying as seen through the eyes of a checkout operator. Oh my God. Amazing. That is the cool.

That's so amazing. You know what? That's really important point. Like this is a very stressful time and this is a very crazy time, but it's also something that no one's ever gone through before. If you even have the slightest interest in writing, you should absolutely be keeping a journal, be keeping a diary, write every single day, write all your feelings, write what happens, what you see, you should absolutely be doing it.

I feel like there's so many people that I say to them, I want to fucking hear you. I want to read your memoir. It's those kinds of people who are like, tell me everything. What is your fucking life like? That's incredible. But especially people who are working in grocery stores. They are really, my friend Jason, hi Jason who listens to everything we do. He is on the front lines.

He works in a grocery store in Portland and he is just like, I never, he's like, I just wanted to work in a grocery store. I never thought it was going to be like an emergency personnel and he's like, but it's actually fine because people are, he's like, first of all, if you are old or know people who are old, almost every grocery store has Instacart and you should get old people to learn how to use Instacart and have their groceries delivered. Almost every grocery store has that. Jim and Marty.

Jim, God damn it. Stay home and let them deliver it to you. God damn it. Yeah. That's amazing. I have a similar one. This is from Ali Mac 30 from Instagram. My fucking hooray is my dad.

He's not in healthcare but works in a grocery store and to be honest is no spring chicken. But he's been taking every opportunity he has to work and restock shelves as fast as possible for those that need supplies during the shutdowns. Our healthcare workers definitely deserve a ton of appreciation and applause, but so do those who are working in essential areas to keep people cared for during the pandemic. That's exactly right. Yeah. I walked into the grocery store this morning.

I hadn't been for two weeks and I needed to get some stuff. And right as I walked in, somebody got on the loudspeaker and was like, just like to thank all of our hardworking employees and like the manager or whatever made a little speech and then everybody stopped and clapped in the store. And I went, I went just because I got into it and the lady behind the deli counter started laughing so hard. I was just like, this is all people, this is what people need. People need to understand that other people get what they're sacrificing.

We need to, I need to cheer for the people on the front lines, the healthcare, the fucking doctors, the nurses, the, you know, administration. We need, we need to celebrate them right now because it's so terrifying. Hi. Hey y'all. Today, day 10 of self isolation quarantine, I got a phone call that I was accepted into medical school. I was literally laying in bed when I got it and it's the best call I've ever received

in my life. Sorry family. This was my second round applying the fourth school I'd interviewed at initially my fourth wait list and finally my first acceptance. I've wanted to be a doctor since I was 12 years old and it's finally happening for me. Hope y'all are having a good day, Dorothy. Congratulations Dorothy. Hurry up.

Thank you. Congratulations. This is incredible. This is from Nikki does stuff. My fucking hooray. I work in an animal shelter and pre quarantine and during, if we're being honest, we were placing animals into foster homes. We now officially have to close our doors to the public for now, but we managed to get

over 325 out of our shelter this past week. Most of those having been in the past three days, SSDGM and rescue animals. Okay. Wow. And it's true, you guys, they're closing shelters, but these animals are still coming in. This isn't stopping. If you've ever thought about adopting a cat, a kitten or dogs or whatever the fuck now

isn't amazing time to do it, even if she's in a foster during the quarantine, it's badly needed right now. Yes. For sure. Oh, this is good. This starts huge fucking hooray. I'm a FedEx driver and with businesses closing, we are running out of places to wash our hands and use the toilet.

Residents in my area have been renting portable toilets for us drivers because they know our predicament and how insanely busy we are currently. PS, I've only peed my pants once in the last three years. And that's from Alex. That's incredible. People are getting together to rent port-a-potties for drivers. We have a chance right now to be humanitarians and are we going to take it or are we going to be selfish pieces of shit who buy all the bread and purell and you can decide which

way you want to be. Watch your life like it's a movie and figure out what you want this part to look like because you absolutely are in charge of it. And I tell you what, you get out there and you give of yourself and you give for other people an amazing thing comes back to you. Wait, I'm not drunk, am I? There's also a lesson to be learned about being kind to yourself right now and also caretaking and you don't, you know, I'm in the mood of like, what do I have to accomplish

something during this or else I'm a loser and it's like, you don't have to just take care of yourself and this one is about that. Is it my turn? Yep. Okay. So, this is from Merginini. This is from Merginini. My fucking ray is that I'm super lactose intolerant and typically avoid dairy altogether.

But now that I'm not going anywhere and won't be around people for the next few weeks, I'm living my best lactose filled life. God, I miss cheese. So take care of yourself too. You can't help other people if you're a fucking mess. You know what I mean? Yes. That's...

You can help people when you've got your shit together. Right. You have to put your own oxygen mask on first and for me, for me today, you know, that involved cracking open one of those tubes of grand biscuits and baking up biscuits. And then I just ate a biscuit with some jelly on it and drank tea. And I was like, and do you know how I got the idea because April Richardson came to visit and when she lives in London now, she lives in England now and when she went to fly back, she flew back with like 12 tubes of biscuits because they don't have them over

there. Oh my God. And I texted her, I texted her a picture of the baked biscuits and I'm like, this is your fault. And I'm like, why am I eating this? And she's like, every day's Thanksgiving during a pandemic. It's true. It's true.

All bets are off. All bets are off. It's fucking, I mean, drink a shake every now and then, the green shake, but otherwise... Yeah. Take your vitamins. Take your vitamins. Take your vitamins. Take your vitamins.

Especially vitamin D. Oh yeah, vitamin D. I was thinking about how I'm going to come out of this pandemic with incredible skin because I'm not going in the sun, but I'm going to be severely depressed because I'm not getting enough sun. Yeah, you got to get that vitamin D. You can take it in pill form. Yeah, totally. Echinacea, take all your things that build up immunity, please.

Vitamin B, take some turmeric. And you know, it's all important. How about some fish oil? Okay. Fish oil. Let's start naming vitamins back and forth for the next full hour. Why don't you like our podcast? What's the problem with it?

Let's start a podcast where we just name vitamins. Okay. Well, I'll go ahead and say vitamin A. Hello, pets and friends. As many of you know, there's a serious mask shortage in healthcare right now. In fact, I am allowed one mask per day that I wear the entire shift. I'm getting bruises and scarves from wearing wear masking that don't fit and just spending 16 hours in them. So that's, I don't know if you've seen that, but there's pictures of Italian doctors and

they have really bad bruising and scars in a mask shape and the goggle shape because they don't fit, but they just have to put them on their face anyway. Okay. So this is my job and I'm happy to do it and I love caring for people. Most of the people I'm caring for aren't even here for corona, just sick. Just as I was getting desperate enough to think about buying a pack on eBay of the properly fitting masks. My parents church ended up finding 16,000 masks on, on pallets like off a truck from

a grocery store that they were, um, they were buying, trying to get non-perishables to people without jobs, but they found 16,000 masks and selected my hospital to be one of the receivers. So it might not be the biggest fucking hooray, but you know what? Fucking hooray. Healthcare workers need light, encouragement and community. And this made me sob uncontrollably. We found and donated 16,000 masks.

Thanks for all you do. Stay sexy and wash your hands. Monica. Oh my God. Yeah. People are, people are being fucking heroic right now. Yeah. They're doing, they're doing lots of good, lots of good.

Yeah. I'm so impressed and moved and touched and this is incredible. It's beautiful. And it's, this is unprecedented the time we're at. Can I close it up now? Yes. This is unprecedented time. It's an unprecedented time.

It's a time we're going to tell our grandchildren about if they'll listen to us and, uh, yeah. Yeah. What do you think? It's great. I mean, it's, yeah, we just under, just stay in reality, stay in the here and now and know that everybody is scared. We're all together in this dress and fear and, uh, unknowing. Um, that's the thing that's going to get us through it is that we're all together and

there's people out there buying porta-potties for truck drivers because they understand and care. There's people who really care and there's more people who care than people who need to hoard shit because they're not working their stuff out correctly. So remember that. And this is a time, this isn't a time to ignore your depression or to ignore your issues, continue to talk on the phone with your therapist. You can still find one right now if you need to.

There's therapists. This isn't a time to pause that. No. Um, not at all. I'm sure a lot of people who have eating disorders are going through some shit right now too. It's not a time to ignore that. So, you know, keep working on that.

Be kind to yourself. That's, that's the whole idea is like, look, it's the one thing it's also helping with is perspective because all the things that we thought used to matter, they really don't. What matters now is staying alive, staying healthy and listening to doctors and experts, people who know what they're talking about and treated treating this thing like the scary thing that it is and not pretending that it's not, it's not going to help anybody. Keep other people healthy by staying home 100% and we'll be here for you every, every week. All right.

Well, then stay sexy and don't get murdered. Goodbye. Elvis, do you want a cookie? Yeah, I'll just go ahead and eat. Okay. All right. Okay. Okay.

I'm going to eat. All right. Okay. Let's do this. Okay. I'm going to eat. Okay. Okay.

I'm going to eat. Okay. Okay. Okay, okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay.

Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay.