Newcomers: Scorsese, with Nicole Byer and Lauren Lapkus - Tolkien (w/ Mike Castle)

Episode Date: October 13, 2020

Welp, we were sort of wrong to think there would be a lot of insights into the world of The Lord of the Rings in store for us with the 2019 biopic, Tolkien. But though it was a dry well to draw from, Lauren and Nicole still managed to enjoy some thought-provoking conversations with actor and writer Mike Castle (Brews Brothers, Clipped) around the concepts of separating the art from the artist, whether spoilers for a story are a good or bad thing, and the glamorization and embellishments that biopics often indulge in. The trio even display their most pretentious voices possible to set the record straight on this film with some snooty fact-checking!Like the show? Rate Newcomers 5-Stars on Apple Podcasts and let us know what LOTR media you'd like the series to cover.Sources for this episode:Miniature Hobbiton DisplayFact Check article 1Fact Check article 2Trivia from IMDbAdvertise on Newcomers via Gumball.fmSee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

This is a HeadGum Original. Since childhood, I have been fascinated with language. I've invented my own. You invented an entire language? Yes. I made stories. Legends. Tell me a story in any language you want Tolkien! It's about journeys

The journeys we take to prove ourselves It's about adventures We should form a club, a brotherhood We change the world through the power of art. Music, poetry. And what about Tolkien? I want to write something. It's about magic beyond anything anyone has ever felt before.

What it means to love. To be loved. War! England's at war! The way you follow the rhythms of language, I have to tell you Mr. Torquayman, I've never come across anything like it. This is more than just a friendship. It's an alliance. An invincible alliance. A fellowship. Thank you. Ooh, wow. This is a new episode of Newcomers. Oh, boy.

I'm Nicole Byer. I'm Lauren Lapkus. Oh, boy. This is our ninth episode of our second season, and we're exploring the Lord of the Rings franchise for the first time with the help of nerds and super fans and sometimes people

who've contributed to the movies. We started with the trilogy. Then we did that Hobbit. And then we did some fanfic. I love the fanfic. That was fun. Then now we're doing stuff.

We did the biopic. My God. Oh, God, yeah. We're talking about the 2019 biopic Tolkien, which is available to stream on HBO Max. With the two massive trilogies behind us, now we think it's time to just take a peek inside of the man who started it all,

Mr. Junior R. Tolkien, right before we start diving into the deeper cuts, which I can't imagine that there are deeper cuts than this. This felt like a deep cut. This went so deep that I was like, the well is dry. There's nothing here. Yeah, the well's dry. There's nothing to say. And so we are going to talk about spoilers. If you care about spoilers, go watch the 18 hours of films that we've already covered,

and you will be caught up. But what are your thoughts, Nicole, about just the Hobbit trilogy and where we are right now with this journey? I mean, I think I liked the three Lord of the Rings better than the three Hobbit movies. And I definitely would have loved to watch a three hour Lord of the Ring movie instead of this. Because it was I don't want to be like rude, but it came out last year and I never heard of it. Nobody who lives with me ever heard of it. Nobody's heard of this movie. No one's ever heard of it.

It's random. It feels like it's from like the 90s with just how pointless and boring it is, honestly. But before we get into all of that, I think our guest is going to have a lot to say about this. We are so excited for our guest today because I am married to him. This is my husband, Mike Castle. Now, don't speak yet. Mike is a writer and actor. He's known for playing Adam on Netflix's Bruise Brothers. I certainly know him from that. And he also starred as AJ Salerno on the TBS television series Clipped, which is where we met. And I played Joy. And I don't know if I had a last name. I think I might have. I think you met and i played joy and i don't know if i had a

last name i think i might have i think you did was it simpson i don't know okay well welcome mike hi oh my god i'm so excited to be here we're so excited to talk about tolkien with you yes mike thank you thank you so much for doing this also i learned his name is Tolkien. I was calling him Tolkien, but I didn't know it was Keen, Tolkien. Oh my God. Yeah, that seemed to be one of the most... But I feel like we can't

bully him for that because that was like a plot point that you can't bully him for that for sure. Yes, yeah. Well, Mike, I know from, you know,

knowing you that you are a Lord of the Rings fan. Yeah. Well, wait, hold on. One more thing, though, about... The movie was giving me flashbacks of when my mom made me watch That you are a Lord of the Rings fan. Yeah. Well, wait, hold on. One more thing, though. The movie was giving me flashbacks of when my mom made me watch Black Beauty as a kid,

which was about a horse in World War I or something. I don't know. I hated it so much. And this was very similar to that, in that it was mainly about English war history and basically nothing about anything interesting we are gonna dive really deep into all of that sorry yeah we'd love to hear all about black beauty as well um but how did you become a lord of the rings fan how did that happen to you uh i feel like it's it it just happens to kids like me basically i feel like i was like reading it before i even thought about reading it like wait what do you to kids like me, basically. I feel like I was reading it before I even thought about reading it.

Wait, what do you mean kids like you? What was wrong with you? Like little, like almost, like seemingly normal, but then like weird and don't like any, I didn't like any sports growing up. I didn't like doing anything with other kids, you know? You were an indoor kid. Yes, I was a latchkey kid.

You were on the swim team. Yeah, but yeah, I don't want to get into it. We couldn't quit. I was unable to quit the team and I tried in so many different ways. Family rules. Yeah, but it was just one of those books. I remember reading The Hobbit in fifth grade and then all the Lord of the Rings in sixth and seventh grade and then again in high school and then again in college. And then I did a teacher in fifth grade.

Give it to you. Or did you find it? It we had those. You would have to take these computer tests like book report proficiency kind of tests. And you could pick these books that were all on a list. And Lord of the Rings was on some list. And so it was like, you would just read those because you already, I had older brothers and my dad was a nerd. I read it because my dad liked it as well. So it's one of those ones where you always hear about it.

He was really into sci-fi and fantasy. And so it was kind of one of those ones where I was always just like, oh, I think I have to read that at some point. Yeah. Now you've read it so many times. So obviously your knowledge of the franchise goes much deeper than the two film trilogies that I just got to watch with you. Now, how do you feel

the films compare with the books or with other content? Is there anything that's missing that you feel is really frustrating or anything

that there's too much of? I feel like Gabrus already brought up the character Tom Bombadil, who's just the best. Yeah, it's come up a couple times. Yeah, I think Zach might have brought him up. He's like the spirit of the entire book.

He's like the best thing ever. I feel like then if they're going to make another movie, it needs to be focused on this character because everybody's mentioned him. Honestly, I was thinking something was going to come up with his little group of four British friends in this one where somehow like the kid's name would be Tom

or something and I just. Yeah, I mean, I don't. I guess the thing is, here's what's hard, Nicole, and I bet you'll agree with me. I don't care enough to really learn about Tom Bombadil. However, hearing that

everyone loves him so much, I'm like, oh, he should be a featured player. Yeah. See, I want to know more about Tom Bombadil. But then I'm like, well, if he wasn't in the movies,

I guess he wasn't important. Yes. Right. Sure. But it's like one of those things that wouldn't be in the spark notes, but then you get it wrong on the test and the teacher be like, that's how I know you didn't read it. Oh,

that's a real trap. Yeah. But with Tom Bombadil, and actually I feel like this with the entire franchise of Lord of the Rings, but I don't feel it with any other of these franchises, but I just like the entire thing. I'm like, and even watching The Hobbit with you, I liked it more.

The book is significantly better than that trilogy. It shouldn't be a trilogy. And also the book is, it's just like more fun. There was something, the last movie was unbelievably draining. Do you want to discuss at all how it feels to watch me watch the movies?

I thought I couldn't complain about this. No, you can say whatever you want. Well, I felt like I got sort of like my comeuppance actually when we were watching this because I was like pounding my head like screaming I'm bored. Like I was pacing around. I was like furious.

I was like I want to just rip my face off. Honestly, the amount of times you said I'm so bored Like I was pacing around. I was like furious. I was like, I want to just rip my face off. Honestly, the amount of times you said, I'm so bored. I was going, calm down because I'm, I've been through this so many times. Watching something that I hate is so boring.

I'm like, you can't handle this. This is mild in comparison to three hours of being bored. This is so easy to ignore. You have to barely pay attention to get what's going on in this one. True, true.

But that's almost the problem for me is that every time I look up, it's like just like wood and I'm just like, ugh. They did that one shot, Nicole,

where they were like, he kissed the girl and then like, they just zoomed out for like 10 minutes. I was like, that's not cool. And then the conversation about,

I can't even remember the word now. They said the word a hundred times. I don't know. She was like, it's a princess. He's like, he's not a princess. That scene went on for so long. You don't remember that one? No, I wish I did.

It's dumb. So they're like in a restaurant and he's like, I write languages. And she's like, it's dumb so they're like in a restaurant and he's like i write languages and she's like it's the meaning it's not what it's not what it sounds like and he's like but it's not a prince he like throws a fit and then i was just like the fuck is happening and the scene lasted for so long yeah that was pretty much every scene it was just like why is this going on because also everything it would like fade into it from the previous sequence. So you're like, was he dreaming?

Yeah, like at the end of the kiss, he woke up in a bed and I was like, yeah. So did it really happen? It was very, very brutal. Mike, how much did you know about Tolkien's personal life before watching this biopic? Mainly sort of trivia points, you know, where someone would say like, whole thing's like a metaphor for World War I, you know, like that kind of thing. So I was like, I guess he was like in World War I. From doing this podcast, guys love to say

that. Yeah, I'm sure. They love it very much. Truly. But also that was something I found so annoying in watching this movie when they were really showing us like, and then that's how he came up with the ringwraiths. And then they were elves. I'm like, this is that's how he came up with the ring raids. And then they were elves. I'm like,

this is so fucking. It didn't explain enough, like why he cared or why it was this, but why don't we jump into our Shirewire segment here for a second. And before we deep dive into the film, now this is our news segment and Waito Workshop, which is the special effects and prop company behind the two trilogies has built a miniature display of Hobbiton.

Now, I collect miniatures, so this is actually really exciting for me. Wait, do you really? I do. What kind of miniatures do you have? I have a bunch. All kinds. I have lots of little things. You'd probably like my eggplant.

Honestly, going to Japan will start that collection. Because you can go into these places and they give you like this tiny tray and then like little like plier things and you like, or tweezers and you just like grab miniatures out of a pile. Like it's amazing. I've always collected since I was little but I realized recently

that it was a collection. I was like, oh, I have like a ton of this shit. And so now I kind of do it more actively. Nice. Wow. So it's on, I have like a ton of this shit. And so now I kind of do it more actively. Nice. Wow. So it's on like a table, like a train set or like a little town. These are very cute. It's so cute.

It is. It is cute. I am into it. I like little things. Yeah. There's something so sweet about being into doing that. It's the same as like a train set thing where you're like, great. Okay, yeah. So you like that and you just follow it around. Yeah, this is way more intense

than anything I've ever done. I just throw them onto a shelf and I'm like, how cute. They're small. But this looks really fun and I like to imagine like getting really tiny and running around. Yes, that's the downsizing we need. I would love to be small for just a little bit and then be like normal sized again.

Oh my God, that would be so fun. Like honey, I shrunk the kids. I like tiny things, but I also really like big things like things that aren't supposed to be big, like a big pencil makes me laugh. Didn't you go to a restaurant where they gave you like a big spoon or something? Okay, so you have to go. It is called

Barton G. The Restaurant. The food is so overp to go. It is called Barton G. the Restaurant. The food is so overpriced. It's fully disgusting. But when you order a steak, you get a, like, two, three-foot-sized fork in it. And then the popcorn shrimp comes in a popcorn machine. And then they have a funnel cake that comes in a little shooting duck thing. And then when they serve you the food, a server comes over and goes,

give me your phone. And you're like, what? And they're like, give me your phone. And then they take a picture for you. You don't even have to ask. That's hilarious. Give me your phone. Just give it to me.

You'll be glad. Just give it to me. You know you'll want it. And I hit Madeline in the head with that fork by accident. Oh my God, that's so fun. Well, the crew at WADA Workshop has shared a video that features artists Stephen Saunders and Mark Dews creating a custom-made miniature display of Hobbiton from Lord of the Rings and Hobbit films.

So you can see it on YouTube if you're interested. And I'll tell you something. I didn't realize it was called Hobbiton. I thought it was called the Shire. The Shire. It is, it is. It Hobbiton. I thought it was called the Shire. It is. It is. It's like that's like an area of the Shire. They'd say like Hobbiton and they like name it after.

It's people. Yeah. But it's like it's all this shit. It's like every map has like the name of the town and like another name for it and a name for this area and a name for the families who live there. And it's all. He did so much work. To me, I'm like,

put that in the movie. The movie didn't make me feel like that. I kept thinking like, oh, he was like a big linguist. This is going to be crazy. This is going to be so cool.

And then it was like, there's no discussion of any of it except him going like, in this book is my own language. And then they're like, great.

And then you never hear or see it. It was almost like no one cared that he was doing it. And I also felt like he's not, he doesn't seem that weird or interesting. He just seemed like a really hot guy.

Yeah. And that was annoying. Like, I just thought, wait, so this random guy just likes writing this stuff and no one really responds to it or cares. And then that's it. It's like we saw the wrong period of his life. Like, show me when everyone likes the book

and then his life i would love that i felt like someone read a wikipedia page and then wrote a script as opposed to like really understanding the books and understanding the man behind the books and loving it it didn't even feel like it loved it it was as if me and lauren made this movie we're like here's a talking movie yeah i literally it would have been better if we did because this would be, I would never write this script and go, he was a kid and then he was a guy

and then there was a war and then he at the end wrote one sentence. Like, stop. This is nuts. I want to see his rise to fame and like how it messed with his family. Yeah, were there annoying fans then? Yeah.

I think it would have been better if they started with him as an adult. I didn't care about him being a kid. No. Not at all. And then his mom died and he took it so well.

Yes, he did. He handled it so well. I was like, when my mom died, I didn't just hug my dead mother and be like, well, off to grow up. Totally.

It was very weird. I was literally, during that, I was saying out loud, did she die? Same, off to like grow up. Totally. It was very weird. I was literally during that. I was saying out loud, did she die? Same. That's what I said. Because I wasn't sure if that was what was happening.

And then he's like rocking her body back and forth. He wasn't crying. Because when you cut back to the actress, she was like, she's like laying down with her tongue out.

And I guess we're like, it's over. I guess she died. Just to wrap up this Shirewire. So according to crew members, each year our Hobbit Hole collection grows and grows. With so many adorning our shelves, we needed an entirely new space to house the Shire.

So their attention to detail is extreme with Steven Saunders spraying the model with water and wood glue. As he explains, we need to find a way to make every little area interesting. So we're going around and just covering it in PVA glue and chucking all sorts of different flocking over the top and little bits of foam greenery. We want to create beautiful

little areas like this that feel like a real place where the hobbits would hang out. Really, we just want every little bit of this to be interesting and we want little stories to be told in every little part of Hobbiton. That sounds like OCD. He has a favorite word and it's little. But yeah, the full link to the video is in our show notes um but yeah the pictures are very cute and delightful it does look like a little thomas the train engine set yeah i like it i'm i'm this i actually very much really like yeah it would be a cool house piece for you to have actually since it's happening um in the past now we're going to stay in that little Hobbit hole that you sent me on Airbnb. I am so excited.

We're going tomorrow. I want so many pictures. It looks so cute. It really does. It looks so cute. I'm so excited. And it's right by the beach. So hopefully the air won't be smoke.

Yeah. Yeah. That's like another shitty thing about, you know, trying to get away. It's like, will the air be OK? I know. I know. It's horrible. Can we before we go to break, can we talk about egg cups?

Yes. John Millhiser makes. So I say them wrong. They're not called egg cups. What it sits in is an egg cup, but it's a soft boiled egg that English people call dippies. And then the bread that you put in it, they call soldiers and you're not supposed to put butter on them. I like or no, you're supposed to put butter, no jam. I like jam on them. And everyone's like jam and eggs. And I'm like, yes. Is that that's is that weird? Am I weird? I don't think that's

that weird. Like you would have a piece of toast with jam on it next to your eggs breakfast. That's what I thought. It's one of those things that you naturally would mix anyway if you were having that kind of breakfast. But people are like, but you can't choose to put those pieces together. It does feel like a very like Hobbity slash British meal

that you've been enjoying a lot of lately. It does seem like that. Yeah. I think it is like a part of like a British breakfast or whatever. Have you ever had a soft-boiled? I had never had a soft-boiled egg until this year. I like soft-boiled eggs,

but we, and I actually have gotten into medium-boiled eggs this year, which has been like my thing. She's being modest. She's gotten really. So if you wanted to do this. Wait, what is a medium-boiled egg medium boiled a medium is like some people call it a jammy egg i've heard that so it's kind of like it's kind of like gooey in the center not so

maybe i'm eating no i think you're eating soft from what i've seen i think they're soft because it's really it's like it's goo it might be so So what I would do for a jammy egg is you boil the water, then you put the eggs in for exactly six and a half minutes, then you put the eggs into the sink with ice around them, and then you eat them. Is that what you're doing? No. So what we're doing is, well, John always makes them for me.

I'm like a child. I'm like, I want my egg cup. And then 15 minutes later, I get my egg cup. And you're calling it that. Basically, you're b're binky yeah it's like calling it the wrong thing and i refuse to call it the right thing that holds the egg but he cooks them for exactly five minutes and then oh yeah doesn't cool them off he immediately puts it in in the little, I call it the little holder, which is, it's just the egg cup. And then he even cracks it open for me.

Okay, well, actually, I was going to ask you about that because that part seems hard. You put it in the egg cup, then how do you get the top off without losing half of the egg? So the top part of it, or like the outside of the egg,

is like almost hard-boiled, but not really. It's still like you can like poke down on it. So he just like dings it a little bit, makes a little hole and then peels it. So then I can get into it. Oh, he's doing a lot for you. Oh, he does a lot. Yes.

I'm very well taken care of. I'm obsessed with John. I when he did that Emmy's red carpet for you, I was like, this is the nicest, most thoughtful, and like creatively executed thing I've ever seen.

He is very, very good to me. It's like, we're more than roommates at this point. Like, we're common law. We've lived together for like seven years.

You can never not live together. I don't like the idea. I don't know what I'll do. It truly brings me joy to know that you're together. I feel safe. You're not the first person to say that. Sometimes I'll start to get nervous, and then I'll remember you guys live together,

and I'm like, okay. Something's right. That's good. Yeah, he's the best. Like, it feels really safe. It feels like really like you have this fun household all the time, which like feels so nice. It's just great. It is nice. It's just great.

It is nice. It's a lot of yelling. And I'm sometimes worried that my neighbors are like, what happens in there? A lot of fun and a lot of egg cups. Okay, well, let's take a quick break and we'll be right back to really get into this really boring movie. If you're wondering what a Nord VPN is, I'll tell you. VPN stands for Virtual Private Network, a service that protects your internet connection

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30-day money-back guarantee. Link is in the episode description. Oh, boy, we're back. We're back. Well, let's get into it. Oh, man. So this was directed by Dom Caracosko.

That's not how you say it. Dom. Dom, right? Dome. I don't know. Dome Karakoski. Karakoski. Karakoski.

Yeah. Dom. No. You did bad. Wait, what about the writer? Who wrote it? Yeah, who wrote this? That's what I need to know.

Because we got to yell at them. But it did have that feeling in the direction that made it feel just so stiff. It was truly so dramatic in a way that was like really unnecessary. And then random, like that long shot down that corridor was just random.

It was written by David Gleason who is Irish. That was the only fact I got. And then Stephen Beresford who's English. Only info I'm giving anyone about this. These two, they did bad. I just feel like my question really is

when you're pitching to do a Tolkien biopic, why not give me the highlights? I want like, and if that was the most interesting stuff in his life, he doesn't get a movie. Yeah. Yes. Because also,

they weren't really giving much info to the, like, I feel that someone would be like, well, it's very important that he was in war and all that stuff. But then the war stuff, I was like, what is his role there? What is he doing? How long is he there? Like, it didn't feel like the war was the point either so it's like every scene i was

like what is the point of this there was there was no stakes i was like did maybe have pushback from an editor did maybe he have to find a publisher did was it was it just smooth sailing i was like that's what i care about yeah i agree. So the quick synopsis of this movie is, as a young student, J.R.R. Tolkien finds love, friendship, and artistic inspiration among a group of fellow outcasts. Their brotherhood soon strengthens as Tolkien weathers the storm of a tumultuous courtship with Edith Bratt and the outbreak of World War I.

These early life experiences later inspire the budding author to write the classic fantasy novels The Hobbit and Lord of the Rings. Like, wait, how did he get inspired? Like, I don't even get that. I wouldn't call that a

tumultuous relationship. No, it seemed really great. It was fine. It was like, we love each other. We can't be together, but now we're back together. Yeah.

And they had kids and everything. It's like, that's not really tumultuous. It was real nice. Yeah, it was pretty relaxing. Wait, should we read the in-depth one? Yeah, and they had kids and everything. It's like, that's not really tumultuous. It was real nice. Yeah, it was pretty relaxing. Wait, should we read the in-depth one? Yeah, we should.

I mean, the in-depth one is truly just two more paragraphs than that. Oh, thank God. I thought you were gonna keep scrolling. I got so scared. No, okay, so you started off and we'll switch off. As young children being raised by a single mother, J.R.R. Tolkien and his brother receive help from a local priest,

Father Francis, who must relocate them from their home to small apartments in, is that Birmingham? There's a Birmingham in England? I guess. Hmm. I would say Birmingham. Mike is like, yes, there's Birmingham's everywhere. Honestly, it was as they were saying it in the movie last night. I was like, oh, it's a Birmingham.

Due to financial hardships, their mother is supportive and loving, filling their minds with stories of adventure and mystery, which she recites by the fireplace at night. That scared me because it was like a cowboy shot from low up on her face as she was telling a story. I was like, is she going to

hit them? But then she didn't because nothing happens in this movie. She becomes ill. However, one day upon returning home from school Tolkien finds her

slumped in a chair dead. And he don't give a fuck. He hugs her and moves on. Father Francis becomes the boy's legal guardian and eventually finds a kindly rich woman

who agrees to take them in providing them with room and board while they continue their childhood education. They are Tolkien meets Edith Bratt, a woman,

uh, the woman's only other ward. Tolkien is impressed with Edith, who's piano playing. He admires that you become friends. Yeah. She's also stunning beauty played by Lily Collins. It's like,

I think it's a piano playing. I can't. Is that Phil Collins's daughter? Yes. I thought John's a piano playing. I can't. Is that Phil Collins's daughter? Yes. I thought John was lying to me. No. What a medium level prank that would be. At school,

Tolkien immediately shows talent with languages, earning rough treatment from a rival classmate, Robert. I'm good at languages too. Rival classmate, Robert. When the two boys get into a fight, the headmaster, Robert's father, orders that they spend all of their time together for the remainder of the term. While both initially resent the assignment, Tolkien is soon accepted into Robert's small circle of friends and the four, J.R.R., Robert,

Jeffrey, and Christopher form a close friendship which grows with the years, even as they attend separate universities. Meanwhile, Tolkien continues his friendship with Edith, falling in love with her. Father Francis finds out about their relationship and recognizes that it is affecting Tolkien's grades, and so forbids him from pursuing her while under his guardianship. Tolkien is distraught, not wanting to lose the priest's financial support of his schooling. He relates the conversation to Edith, promising they will be able to be together when he reaches 21 the age of majority but she instead ends their relationship which is so crazy imagine fucking so much you can't study tolkien struggles at oxford but it tracks the attention of professor joseph wright a prominent uh-oh phil philologist philologist. Philologist? Yeah, philologist.

Ooh, I got it right on the second try. The study of language in oral and written historical sources. Tolkien realizes language is his true passion and enrolls in rights class. When the First World War breaks out, he and his friends enlist in the British Army. Before Tolkien leaves, Edith returns and the two declare their love for each other. At the Battle of the Somi, Tolkien suffers from trench fever, baby, and goes to look for Geoffrey. I got trench fever.

He got trench fever. He's convinced that he's calling him, but he's unable to find him and collapses unconscious. He wakes in the hospital weeks later with Edith by his side to find out that Jeffrey and Robert were killed. Christopher survived, but he was traumatized. Years later, Tolkien and Edith are married

with several children, and Tolkien is now a professor at Oxford himself. I would have liked to see how that happened. The film ends with him inspired to write the famous opening of The Hobbit. Oh. I mean, give me the story of the author. Like,

literally. As you just read that, I thought, whoa, so we actually didn't miss anything. Like, no,

we saw everything. And when you think about the war inspiring those books, here's what I need. Him writing the books, everything that happens when he writes them and how they get successful

or when they get successful, if he's alive to see that, and some flashbacks to war. Yes. Yes, yes or when they get successful, if he's alive to see that, and some flashbacks to war. Yes. Two flashbacks where he's like, no, go without me. And then you're like, that's how he came up with Salmon photo. Right, right. Whatever. Like, I mean, you know, fudge it

a little bit. Who cares? Yeah, I agree. Like, the back end of this, not even the back, yeah, I guess the back end of the movie, I was like, this is where it should start. I don't understand why we're seeing anything as a child like nothing from his childhood seems to have influenced his books no they're like the mom did because she was a storyteller that was as close as i could get to there being any point to that i feel like you could just say that in a sentence oh my mom was mom was a storyteller. Right. One time she died

in a chair and I kept moving her back and forth. Because I'm like, that's a story. That's fascinating. You found her dead. That's terrifying. I mean, it would have been more fascinating if he like moved around like Weekend at Bernie's and was like, my mom's still alive. It's like Weekend at Frodo's. My mom's a habit. Everyone's like, dude,

he lost it. Oh my God. That really got me. We see this Frodo's. My mom's a hobbit. Oh, boy. I don't think the books would have done well if that was the premise. Mike, so now that you've learned more about Tolkien from watching this film,

did it leave you more or less interested in middle earth like did it mess with your perception of what you love so much it is it's totally unrelated it's just a totally different thing you could tell me at the end of that that and then he wrote dune and i'd be like oh yeah i see how that could be like dune yeah it's not related at all i truly truly agree. I feel like in a way, I sort of like the movies more because they were more interesting than this. So I'm just like glad that happened.

Also, he had some throwaway line where he was like, and when I was making up my language, I thought, what if there was an old civilization? It's like the worst idea I've ever heard. And then he's like, and then that becomes this book you love. It made me like it all less. What about you,

Nicole? What are your feelings? I mean, I guess it may, I guess how I feel is like Tolkien was a very, an uninteresting person whose head was filled with interesting things. But then I was like, is it that interesting

that he can describe a tree in 10 pages so I just I'm not I don't know I I don't know if he is for me the genre is for me well no it's not Lord of the Rings is for me this movie definitely was not for me I can't even say the acting was good. Yeah, I don't feel like I'm, you know, a fantasy head now or anything like that. But I do feel like I have gained an appreciation or understanding of why people love this stuff. But this movie,

I feel like, does a disservice to Tolkien because you just have to assume, even if I wouldn't want to talk to him and he's obsessed with talking about stuff like this or languages and I would find it boring, I still feel like they didn't delve into what made him unique or special

or worth writing about, worth watching a movie about. And that's on them. I feel like a lot of times these types of movies aren't always exactly 100% accurate. Sometimes they heighten things to make the story more interesting and they didn't even do that on any part of this. Well, I want to retract saying it made me like it all,

the world less. I think I want to more say it feels unrelated to all of it. Where I just go like, it's not canon for me. That movie is not canon. I don't think it's canon for anybody because I think the budget was 20 million. Oh yeah, the budget was 20 million and it grossed only 9 million so this movie was for no one it's not part of anyone's canon but like his friendship with these boys one i was like oh are they gonna get gay and they didn't but i thought that as well we're all probably thinking

the the poetry boy his name was something close to Samwise Gamgee. Oh yeah, his last name was like Wiseman, right? Yeah, Christopher Wiseman. Who I'm talking about is Jeffrey Box Smith.

Oh, that wasn't the same one. That's why I thought something was going to happen. But when Wiseman came in, I thought, is that what Samwise is supposed to be?

Well, that's what I mean. Like, they could have fudged that to be like, his friends inspired the camaraderie. Is that a word? Camaraderie? Close enough. that's what I mean. Like they could have fudged that to be like his friends inspired the Kermit.

Commodory. Is that a word? Camaraderie. Close enough. You know, buddy, buddy shit. But you know,

like even at the end when they kind of gave like the, like the little credits where they were like, he later named his son after his friend. I'm like, show me that. Give me some of those things were more interesting than everything that was in the whole movie. It's almost like they cast

Nicholas Holt first and then we're like, well, he's gotta be in this age range. Yeah, we can only do the war stuff. And I think I would've preferred him older

and then talking about his friends or like telling his kids his life story. Like the movie with Bilbo remembering his journey. Wait, literally, if you are a fan of this shit

why would you not map it over the movies that exist and like tell the story through that lens of his the characters that he created

you know that these like British and Irish writers were like that would actually be too straightforward so we're going to do something a little different

and then it's like they just they're like we'll just make it all we're going to translate the Wikipedia it's truly so so well here's a question just generally does knowing an author make any difference to your enjoyment of their art i feel like we're all facing this right now with jk

rolling because yeah it's like knowing her tweets we're like this does color what we think about these books or a lot of people but i didn't like like the book. So it was like fine with me. Oh, you didn't like the book? I mean, I was like, oh, she seems like sucky. No, I never liked them. There were ones where my mom was like really into them and into us reading them and stuff. And I just did not care for them at all.

I liked the books when I was a kid, but I only read one through four. And then I saw a bunch of the movies, I think. But have you read them all, Nicole? I read them all. I saw the movie first and I was like wow what a magical world I saw my junior year of high school and I was like yes and then I went and bought I think it was up to book five I read through four thought they were good I read five and I was like, you know, this is not I don't like this.

And then six was bad for I didn't like six, but I did read it. Yeah, I mean, I feel like knowing an author, I'm thinking about other people where I'm like that does sometimes later make you think, oh, did I even like that book? Like I used to love J.D. Salinger a lot when I was a teenager. Did I even like that book? Like I used to love J.D. Salinger a lot when I was a teenager. And I one thing I actually thought was cool about him was that he like dated a really young woman. I was like, I'm a young woman. I like that.

And then as I got older, I thought that was more odd. And I also just, you know, read another book about him that his daughter wrote where he comes off more like an asshole. And then like he's a hermit and whatever. And there's all this stuff about him that his daughter wrote where he comes off more like an asshole and then like he's a hermit and whatever and there's all this stuff about him and you're like so wait were those books

just like a fleeting moment of your personality or was that more of who you are like it's like you can be a genius at one thing and not at anything else

you can be great at writing and be a piece of shit and I sort of think that's okay like I sort of think like I just try and avoid my answer to that is I just avoid ever learning about writers.

Usually I don't like any movies about writers. It's like, why is this? Well, I do sort of think this is like an internet problem. Like that. We know so much about people. You have too much access to people.

I, one of my favorite authors is Augustine Burroughs, who doesn't seem to be the best person and has fabricated a lot of things. But that being said, it doesn't taint the books for me. Like Running With Scissors is such a fun time. The movie is not so great, but like the book is so much fun. Dry is an incredible book. True or not.

Like I was sobbing through a lot of it. So are they supposed to be like memoirs? Yeah. But like everything that happens are crazy. Remember when that happened with James? Oh, James Fry. Right. Fry or whatever it was.

Yeah. A million little pieces. Yes. That's what it was. Yeah. A great book. But like, also, I'm like, if it's made up, OK, we just don't say that it's true. Yeah, right.

It's great. It's like what an imagination you had. Like and I'm sure it's happened to other people. But like, yeah, just don't say it's true. It's great. It's like, what an imagination you had. and I'm sure it's happened to other people, but like, yeah, just don't say it's yours. Same with,

who wrote American Psycho? He's not, Bret Easton Ellis. Bret Easton Ellis. He's not the best. Yeah, so that always happens to me

with Tim. Everyone's always like, if you say you like one of his things, I'm like, well, you know, he's like kind of an abuser,

right? And you go like, I mean, I guess I could have assumed that. And I'm like, well, you know, he's like kind of an abuser, right? And you go like, I mean, I guess I could have assumed that. And I'm like, it shows in the books. He keeps writing about murderers. Yeah.

Kills women. I do feel like the same thing happens with musicians when you find out something bad about someone. Like, it sucks because there are certain people where, I mean, I don't even want to name people.

I'm literally not naming any of the writers I'm thinking of because I'm like, I don't want to ruin them for someone. No, and I think like there's people where you mean I don't even want to name people I'm literally not naming any of the writers I'm thinking of yeah I'm like I don't want to ruin them for no and I think like there's people where you hear a story and it's first of all you heard a story I mean I believe most things I hear if it's about someone being a bad person I'm gonna trust that it's easy to believe but it still like sucks when you're like oh I love this song and then you think oh yeah he's a bad person like oh but I still like this song and then it's like you can't even enjoy the song anymore. And I like, yeah, well, Michael Jackson is a strong example. But like, I feel like you think about the documentary.

You know, it's like I don't want to be thinking about this. Yeah, it just sucks because things become intertwined so easily. Yeah, it's almost better to me if the person is dead. Well, that's kind of why I chose him as a person because I was like, I'm not saying anything that people haven't been saying. Right. But I want to know who you guys are talking about. Boy!

There was this writer that I really loved in, like, from when I was a teenager through college, and I was always like, this guy is the best. And then basically everyone I know who's ever interacted with him is like, he is literally the worst misogynistic, alcoholic piece of shit ever. And I'm just like,

and then he had a book come out like two years ago and I was like, can't read it. I don't like it. But you can. I know, but the whole time

because the character feels like it's him, I'm like, I don't know. So, okay. I try not to support bad people, so I'll buy things secondhand. Oh, that's smart. I wanted to read Faye Resnick's book

about Nicole Brown Simpson, which is salacious and not nice, but I bought it from eBay because I was like, oh, that's just from a person, whatever. And let me tell you, it was worth it. She a bad person. See, but then that's good

because you're helping someone get their money back for the book. True. So it's kind of like a good nice closure to that it's a kind of charity yeah i yeah i like that idea of buying something used that you don't want to support i mean i what i've done what i did this once uh there was someone's book that i didn't want to buy but i i did want to know some things from it so i every time i was at the airport i read parts of it and then i truly read like most of it because i was traveling a lot of the time. And I was like, every time I went in, I just found it in the bookstore and just read like a new part. And I was like, I'd stand there for like 30 minutes. And they're like, I did that too with someone's

book that I didn't want to give them money. I want to know who it is. Oh, I'll tell you after. Yeah, we can talk after. That's hilarious. Okay. Well okay well okay are there any aspects or you know any themes or characters of the other six films you've seen so far that now make more sense because of this biopic i would say absolutely not well i guess he has like he like is in the woods talking about trees and shit at the end so i was like i guess he loves Yeah, no. It's like any of the things are just universal aspects. The only thing I can think of is like war and his mom telling him stories. But I go like, that's nothing. But nothing happened during the war that would lead you to believe he was inspired to write this book.

He wears a skinny scarf and that's about it. And he puts on a mask to avoid mustard gas. And I kept thinking, what is that supposed to be like? Nothing. I don't know. Yeah, they didn't explain it. Well, so I was mentioning that sometimes biopics will embellish, and we are going to get into some fact-checking.

So maybe they did embellish some things here. But before we do that, let's talk about the reception of the film. So the film received mixed reviews from critics and was a box office bomb grossing $9 million against a $20 million budget. That's wild. The film holds a 51% critic rating

on Rotten Tomatoes and 71% for the audience score. That's actually really high. Yeah. It feels like, you know, 50% of that 71% didn't see it. The website's critical consensus reads, Tolkien has the period trappings and strong performances of a worthy biopic,

but lacks the imagination required to truly do its subject justice. Well, that's really accurate. Yeah, I agree with that because it looked so beautiful. And John the whole time was watching it. He was like, I should like this. This is my aesthetic. It looks like something I would like. It's the time time period i love british people but this is so boring picture john dressed for war at that time oh my god god that would look so right for him i love that john

in a war would be very funny everyone's like down in a trench and he's like what if we sing yeah can you make a video of being like the fun guy in the foxhole I will tell him I'll give him something to do just picture him in that outfit it works it's so good anything you would do would be very funny I'm sure he owns something that would work John's gonna be so excited when I tell him

we just talked about him throughout this whole episode Wendy I-D I-D? I-D, I get all the hard words from the Observer gave it two out of five stars commenting,

a decades long drudge through Middle Earth would seem like a carefree skip through the park compared to this slog of a literary biopic. Wow,

she's literally on our same page. Yeah, she's great. Yeah, I truly said that. I was like, I would rather watch

three hours than this movie ever again. Writing for the plane dealer, Chuck Yarbrough recreated it, A, calling it a wonderful piece of art and a magical film worthy of the wizardry of Gandalf himself. What are you talking about?

This is not worthy of Gandhi. He didn't watch it. He wrote it before he saw it. Yes, exactly. That's a review before you watch it kind of thing. Yeah, I'm not here for Chuck. No. Okay, so fact checking.

Now, I am kind of excited about this. Just kind of. Yeah. Nobody's going to. Now, the question is, did Tolkien rekindle his relationship with Bratt after returning from war? So, in the film, Tolkien his name is to me is Tolkien and I really hated that scene

where he's like Keen it's Keen not in he's Keen it made me so angry so Tolkien that also seems like

a weird point to like have in the movie like him caressing someone I'm like yeah and then also like the headmaster being like now I'm mad at you

yeah like he would just cut to day two where they already know how to say it like whatever but also I was like if we're day two where they already know how to say it. But also I was like, if we're in the theater, we all know how to say the man's name. Not one person was like, Tolkien?

Who's that? Let me buy a fucking ticket. So Tolkien and Bratt encounter each other again just before Tolkien is set to join the fighting on the Western Front. When he returns, waking up in a hospital in England, he finds Bratt waiting for him. The real story played out a bit differently. Wait, go really condescending with this. According to the Tolkien Society, the young Tolkien actually wrote to Bratt on his 21st birthday when he was still studying at Oxford and they became engaged soon after.

By the time Tolkien was fighting in the Battle of the Somme, he and Bratt were already married. I don't know why they changed it. Yeah. No. Now, did he ever get so drunk that he woke his tutors with his outbursts? Give me a really sarcastic response. No! This is an entertaining scene in the movie,

but there is no evidence that it actually happened in real life. Okay, Mike, you're going to read the next answer. Oh, okay. Did J.R.R. Tolkien

and Edith Bryant really toss sugar cubes at fancy diners or fancy, is that dinners? Oh, whoops, at dinners in the Birmingham tea house. This is based on a real life incident. Tolkien and Edith did toss sugar cubes into people's hats. However, in real life, they sat on a balcony at the tea house and tossed cubes into the hats of people walking by on the pavement down below.

Okay. Geez. Wow. I mean, what fucking nerds? Who's just tossing sugar cubes at people? That's how they had fun back then. It was so not charming, that sequence. It wasn't anything.

Oh my God. Mike, read me this question. Did Junior R. Tolkien readily accept the call to fight for his country? No. The movie implies Tolkien and his friends went straight to war. However, in real life, okay, Tolkien delayed joining the military long enough to draw criticism, especially from relatives. In those days, chaps joined up or were scorned publicly, he said years later in a letter to his

son Michael. It was a nasty cleft to be in for a young man with too much imagination and little physical courage. Tolkien delayed enlistment until he completed his degree in July 1915, almost a year after Britain entered the First World War. Now put that in the movie.

That's more interesting. Put that in the movie. Show me the moment where Tolkien goes, I have too much of imagination to go in the movie. That's more interesting. Put that in the movie. Show me the moment where Tolkien goes, I have too much of imagination to go to the war. I actually thought it was crazy when he just went. I was like, wow,

I guess he was really brave. Yeah. I, I, I mean, I would rather watch someone deal with the criticism around them for looking like,

I'm going to finish my degree and it's like, you fucking nerd. Like, I want to see that. And it also, then you would see how that ripples through the books and stuff where he writes about these really valorous dudes and all this. Right. It would be so it's like because then you go, oh, I like how you really glorify war, but you didn't want to go, man. Mm hmm.

All right. Well, Nicole, when did the when did Tolkien write The Hobbit and what inspired him to write it? Well, after returning from the war, Tolkien eventually became a professor at Oxford, where he gave lectures on philosophy. And at the end of the movie, the professor sits down to begin writing what would be his signature fantasy series. Tolkien actually did write The Hobbit while a professor at Oxford,

though his real impetus for beginning the project may have been as much pure boredom as artistic inspiration. The author has said that the first memorable line of The Hobbit came to him while he was grading a stack of exam papers. Ooh, and this is a quote from him. I remember picking up a paper and nearly giving it an extra mark or extra five marks. Actually, because one page on this particular paper was left blank. Tolkien told the BBC in 1968, glorious, nothing to read.

Wait, so he didn't like reading? Crazy. So I scribbled on it. I can't think why. In a hell in the ground there lived a hobbit. So it was truly just, he was just barely paying attention to grades and then just wrote some doodles down.

And he's like, I'll make this a thousand pages or more. This is why it's not interesting to make things about writers, I think. Because that is just what it is most of the time. They're like, well, I guess I have some free time. And then you just get addicted to the thing you start writing. And then that's all it is. It's not like, he was so brave. He went to war.

And then he made another war on the page. It's like, none of that is true. It's all it is. It's not like he was so brave. He went to war and then he made another war on the page. It's like none of that is true. It's all just boring. Is there a documentary about him? I'm sure you guys will find out. I know. Oh, boy. I don't like.

Have you ever seen the cartoon? Yes. I loved the cartoon as a kid. It looked absolutely. It was great. I loved how that whole. Everyone likes the cartoon. Oh, have you not seen that?

No, that's coming up. No, I think I have seen it because I vaguely recognize the images, but... I'm kind of ready to be disappointed. Like, you know when you revisit something from your childhood and then you're like, this is what it looked like? I thought it was like the most amazing thing ever

when he was invisible. I just went through that with Big Mama's House. Not as funny as I remember. No. It was like, really, I bought it. I was so excited to watch Big Mama's House the first.

Watching, I was like, hmm. Yeah, it didn't really hold up for me. I was really depressed. Is Martin's partner in that, Paul Giamatti?

Sure is. Wow. It sure is. That's pretty shocking. Yeah. I wouldn't have remembered it that way. Huh. Yeah,

I also didn't remember Paul Giamatti in it and then Nia Long is also in it and she just they wrote her character so dumb like she doesn't remember what her aunt looks like and her aunt is like big mama and she's like big mama

what's different about you I don't know and you're just like what the fuck is happening? You have to be completely crazy to miss that this is now who that is. Yeah. Imagine someone dressed up as your fat aunt. And you not getting it.

And you're like, I think, no, yeah, that's her. That's her. Haven't seen her in a while. I guess last time I saw her was two years ago. I guess I'll stay in her house. That's so funny. Well, Mike, since we have to go forward and do,

we're halfway through our season almost. Okay. But I'm assuming some reading is going to come into play at some point, which I'm not excited about. And maybe it won't. And we don't have to put that out there in the universe. Sure, okay. But if we were to read something, and I don't say a whole book but like bummer

what would you say is like like read the first 10 pages honestly just the first the first like two chapters of the hobbit okay it's so it's honestly like the most relaxing thing i've ever read like it's just it's just it's basically just that miniature. Okay. Interesting. And is that what keeps you reading those books over and over again every five years? Yeah. Yeah. It's, it's. Wait, you read them every five years? Kind of happens like that. I tend to revisit random books, you know, on, on random schedules. Lauren, is there a book that you keep rereading? No, I almost never reread. I actually can't. I think most, most of the time, even if I'm like, that's my most favorite book in the whole world. I've never read it twice. It's like,

I just, I don't really like to watch movies multiple times either. That's true. And I don't relate to that at all. But I've started to do it more in quarantine because I feel like I need comfort. Yeah. That's why I read the same things. And that's why I watch the same things because I know it's going to happen. And I like revisiting the story because it feels like home. Yep. Yeah. Especially with something like, you know, you're reading when you're going to bed, but you know what happens.

So you're sort of just like, oh, you know what? I'm going to get to the tree stuff. And then when he's coming out, then I'll read that tomorrow night. That's interesting. It makes me think I might want to reread a book that I liked recently and see what i felt now i highly recommend it very fun you also catch new things oh absolutely that's why whenever someone says like no spoilers i'm like give me the spoilers i don't care i want to try and catch the things right from the jump i like spoilers yeah i don't care at all i'm just like that's fine that'll make it if anything it'll help me appreciate the writing. See, I really hate if I know one thing that's going to happen in a movie or a book.

I'm like so frustrated. I read this book that I loved so much called Nothing to See Here. I think you should read that, Nicole. I think you would really like this book. Okay, I'm going to write it down because I'm going to the bookstore tomorrow. But then I would say if you like spoilers, read the summary because maybe you will like to know. But the summary in the thing, in the the book cover tells this big plot twist and i found it so frustrating because i didn't know until after i didn't i didn't read it and then i opened it i go

why would you want to know that that when you get to that point in the book and it turns it's like so crazy but if you already knew it was coming it's not interesting but no no but then you can be sitting there knowing it's coming and going oh oh, so that's how this is setting up. It's like you're just it's almost like you're studying the book as much as you're reading it. That's interesting. And it's fun to see how they build up to like that twist. And you're like, oh, will it come here? You're like, oh, no.

When will it come? Like I read the plot synopsis of this book, Kindred, which is Octavia Butler. And it's like a time traveling slave book. And it's like a tough read. But like I knew what was going to happen. And I knew that she like has this like really horrific thing happen. And I knew when it was. I didn't know when it was going to happen, but I knew it was going to happen.

And then the build up like I really I had a lot of fun reading. Oh, that's interesting. But it did take me about four months to read it. Yeah, it's a real argument. You have to or not like it's you really got to go like, no, no, no. Here's, that's interesting. But it did take me about four months to read it. Yeah, it's a real argument you have to, or not, like, you really gotta go like, no, no, no,

here's why it's nice. No, I actually feel like I understand that more. I've never, I've never really, like, I feel like when you and I watch a movie and then you're like,

well, what? She'll go like, oh, I know what happens next and I'll go like, oh, what is it? And she's like, I can't tell you. I'm like,

I want to know. Why would you say that if I can't, I want to know. Well, it's cool. We'll just see it play out. It's fun to see what happens. No, that's cool, though.

Oh, yeah. And that book is by Kevin Wilson, if you do want to go by it. But it's really it's a really fun read. Wait, something I was going to say at the very beginning, which was that I don't remember what I was going to say about this. But basically, like, I don't get affected at all by you not liking it. Like, I don't I feel like you might get people who are like, oh, it's you don't like affected at all by you not liking it. Like, I don't. I feel like you might get people who are like, oh, it's you don't like it. It's the best thing ever.

But I'm like, I think it's the best thing ever. If you don't like it, that's fine. Yeah. Yeah, I guess. I feel a personal, like, responsibility when I recommend something. If somebody doesn't like it, I feel that sucks. Yeah. Well, I mean, I get sad.

I'm like, why didn't you like it? Maybe I'm stupid for liking it well it feels crazy though when we were watching lord of the rings which i love so much and i would watch i've seen just more than i've seen anything uh and you would do other things and i'd be like well you should be watching you shouldn't ever look away from the screen yeah but then it's like i free you of that where i go like this isn't her thing but you do it to marrying millions you're like you you didn't see what you just did marrying millions is different it's all basically like old old men dating young women it's so creepy i it's it's the most fascinating show i've ever seen have you seen this show i don't think no i haven't seen it i think i've seen clips of it you it is it is so nasty it's sick it's there's i posted this thing on instagram recently

the guy's like he's like 68 and he's like he's like rubbing sun lotion or uh sunscreen sunscreen on this 23 year old who he's dating in front of her mom who is younger than him okay yeah that's not that's not good i I don't like it. It's so gross. And they're both acting like it's awesome. And I'm like, I wouldn't want my mom

to watch anyone rub sunscreen on me, let alone some old man. Here's the, he's rich though, right? Yes. Yes. So they see the end goal.

I, now I'm okay with it because the mom is like, I support you getting paid. So whatever we have to do to get paid is what we'll do. And I'll supervise it so he doesn't take advantage of you. Yeah, it's true. It's true.

It's sick though. I would say that's my only plug personally. Well, actually, you've let us right to the moment where we ask you if you have anything to plug. But I would say you have to plug Bruise Brothers. Bruise Brothers on Netflix. It's the best. I had so much fun making it. They canceled it immediately. It got canceled?

Yeah, so quickly after it came out. I was like, alright. And then Guest House is on a bunch of streaming things. It's a movie. It's funny. You should watch Guest House. It's a movie starring Mike and Pauly Shore. I watched it. It's very fun. It was truly such a good time.

You're super, super, super good in it. Oh, thank you so much. I appreciate that. It's a really fun movie and it's just a wild,

wild ride and a lot of tits in that film. Yes. Yeah, a lot of tits. This one day, they filmed like a lot of,

everything that had tits, I feel like all happened on like one night and they were just like, it was moving all over to all this stuff. And it was like one of, one of like four night shoots. And then I remember getting home at like 4.00 AM and Lauren being like,

how was it? I was like, you know, I don't know. He's just like, you don't want to even begin to explain. Like, I don't fucking know.

And I was all, I felt uncomfortable for the last nine hours. Just acting is so weird in that way. like you could just like go have the weirdest night that most people would say in their life and they're like good night like it's just nothing well there's something that didn't make it into the actual movie that was truly one of the most can I do we have time for me just say one thing uh one of the most bizarre and embarrassing sort of moments of my career just in terms of you know when you start to do something especially on a set and then you you zoom out and you just think about what it

looks like that you used to be a little kid that you you know just want to do comedy like kind of all these thoughts come to your mind and like in this it was they like put on this giant steel like cod piece all right that had a huge fake dick coming out of it okay and then i had to pull my pants up over that okay but it also had like an electrical wire coming out of the back so it was motorized and so then this is also while they're doing all of these people who are topless and like acting like they're having a good time you know all in this backyard it's like 3 a.m i have to pull these pants up everyone keeps, I don't think that thing's going to fucking work.

Like everyone's like freaked out about this, but I can't get my pants up all the way. So I kind of got to like hobble back and forth with this long wire coming out of the back,

this fake dick in the front. And then the stunt is that I like put a bunch of fireworks on it and I shoot it off while the motorized dick is spinning around. And I had to do this

like six times while I was screaming out all this insane shit. It is in the movie, but it's on somebody's cell phone while they're watching it later. It was like the whole time I was doing it, I was like, unbelievable. This is dark.

But that's so funny that it's such a big bit for like someone to be watching on a teeny tiny phone. It was literally, as we were setting up to watch it, I was like, oh God, that one fucking thing's gonna happen. It's gonna be crazy. And then it was so tiny, I was like, oh, God, that one fucking thing's going to happen. It's going to be crazy.

And then it was so tiny. I was like, oh, great. God, that was embarrassing. But I was just thinking, Nicole, for when he was saying like when you zoom out and you think about your whole life and everything. The thing that I just thought of for you is when, which is like the funniest picture I've ever seen from that thing you did for Quibi where you're like in the floor. Just what? That would feel so insane. Because it just would feel crazy when you're

doing it like you're yeah i was on a gurney that they like jacked up to the floor because we were all like on this raised thing and they're everyone kept being like are you okay and i was like yeah man i'm i'm under a floor yeah it felt truly insane but But then like seeing it, I was like, oh, worth it. How silly. No, she's like flat. It's so funny. Lauren, what's yours? Oh, I have so many. I feel like I'm just like things that are sick that I've done. I want to say blended.

Oh, that one was really hard. I feel like you told me that story when we first met. Oh my God. I had a small role in the movie Blended. And I was a babysitter who in the movie, the kid shoots a fire extinguisher into my face and it was whipped or shaving cream. Or no, it was whipped cream.

It was whipped cream. And it was filling this huge fake fire extinguisher, a real one, I don't know. And it was blown into my face. It was so intense. And it went into every crevice, my nostrils and my ears. And I couldn't breathe.

And full force. And I couldn't see. And it was, I suddenly couldn't breathe or see. It was up my nose and I was like panicking. It's all in my mouth, everywhere.

It's like, it's so much. And I couldn't breathe at all. And then I got it out. I mean, I really have to make that clear because it was actually really scary. And then I got it out of my nose enough.

Then I had to shower and like do it again like you know all within moments like over and over again and when i got back to my hotel i it took forever to get the whipped cream all out of everywhere and then like a week later i like dug in my ear and it was like sour whipped cream and so you have to zoom out again and see your whole life. Wait, my favorite part of the story is, oh, you told me this when we very first started dating. I dug sour whipped cream out of my ear. Will you marry me?

She's trying to scare me. It was so sick. Anyway, we've all survived a lot. Yeah. Ugh, well. Oh, wait, real survived a lot. Yeah. Ugh, well. Oh, wait, real quick. We do have trivia. So the Tolkien family estate issued a statement.

They said they did not approve of this film or endorse it. Wow. They did? I love that. Yes. The diegetic music heard in the officer club is Dixieland Jazz Band One Step, one of the earliest jazz tunes recorded in 1917.

This is an anachronism since both Robert Quilter and Jeffrey Batch Smith were killed in 1916 at the Somme. So diegetic means that they can hear it in the movie and anachronism means it's in the wrong sequence of time. Oh. Shut up. No, no. No, I'm glad.

I'm saying like, who wrote this sentence? Oh, yeah. No, thank you. Wait, so we say it again? That didn't make any sense to me, but now I get it. just that the characters are hearing it.

And anachronism means like, no, that happened, that's not right in time. The music hadn't come out yet. Yeah, yeah. Okay. Thank you. We would have just been like,

the die-digidetic and the canissa, and then we would have moved on. Well, that's dumb. I'm glad you had that one because diegetic oh did i say it right yeah anachronism no anachronism yeah lauren said it like it was anachronism i honestly read it like i was a kid who just got a book for the first time i was like the anachronism since both and you're showing off yeah That's how I read mostly everything we have to say on this.

I'm sure listeners are like, Nicole doesn't know how to read. She practices a little bit before recording. So this is Nicholas Holt's second performance as a famous author. He portrayed J.D. Salinger

in Rebel in the Rye, another movie I've never heard of. Wow. Me neither. Lily Collins, who plays Elizabeth, or Edith Bratt,

once auditioned for the role of Toriel that went to actress Evangeline Lilly in Peter Jackson's The Hobbit films. That's an interesting, it's interesting because

in another little fact we had, it said that Evangeline Lilly met Peter Jackson. Peter Jackson wrote that part for her. So this is a story

where the offer was already out and they still auditioned backup people just in case, which is why auditioning sometimes is pointless. Lauren was just complaining about this. Wait, Nicole. What I was complaining about

was about Lily Collins. Oh, that's right. I just before we started recording was complaining because of this exact thing that happens very much in Hollywood where you audition for something and then like someone really famous gets it and you're like, oh, they never cared about my audition. They were always going to cast that person. And I auditioned for this show, Emily in Paris.

I auditioned for the pilot of it. And I just got announced coming to Netflix with Lily Collins as a star. I went, of course, they barely looked at me. Of course, they barely looked at me when I went of course they barely looked at me of course they barely looked at me when I went in and read for that by the way

a year and a half ago or something it was so long ago now it's coming out but like I just was like I'm annoyed I drove to Santa Monica

and you memorize the lines I went through a lot you force all that shit in your head that's the thing that kills me like you'll do the work and then you like

strut it around in front of someone like you could do it it's then you like strutted around in front of someone like you could do it it's actually humiliating I had an early job experience I had was I won't say the show but I was auditioning for a big show and basically I got to like the last round where it's me and one other

person and right before going in basically the director was like I just want to let you know like we love you we think you're so funny but we did write the part for the other guy who's going in. So, like, you're kind of like an unknown. So we wanted to do, like, unknown. And then the guy.

I don't know why they told you this. I honestly appreciated it so much because it was a really intimidating room. And it made me not care. Oh, okay. So maybe it was good. To me, I probably would have been like, okay, so I guess I could go home now. Like, why am I here? Yeah, like, don't make me do this humiliating act.

We tested for a multicam a couple years ago at the same time where it was like, oh, you were the nice white. There was a fat white. That makes it sound like fat people aren't nice. There was a thin white, a fat white, a thin black, a fat black. And then-

I'm trying to remember what it was. You don't have to say, but I can't- It's someone who like always gets. Yeah. I'll tell you after we're done. Yeah. It was just so fun. And then I think there was like an Asian pairing as well.

And I was like, this is so transparent how they've pulled everybody into test for this. I know. I can't. I can't remember that show, but I remember sitting in the hall and you had a whole thing going on on the phone. There was something like your deal wouldn't close. It was the funnest thing in the world because I didn't sign my contracts for the test because I was waiting to see if another thing would close. So then I didn't have to test. Oh, right.

You got to leave. And then they gave me the money I wanted. So then I got to go, good luck, everybody. I have a job. I remember feeling happy for you and also like god damn it like that's that moment of like oh man I keep having to sit here and do this thing right now it's so horrible

the nerves are so crazy during those things being an actor is fun but also let's see abusive yes psychologically very abusive. Yeah. We talk about like what other job is there

where you're going to go into a room and then it's like if you do a good job and you got to do it a couple more times, then you get like the most money that you've touched in years or they just never talk to you again and you feel like a dumbass. The promise of the money is the craziest thing.

It's so disturbing. I didn't know that every time you booked a pilot and it didn't go, and then you book another one, your quote goes up because you got that one pilot. I was like, wait, what? And then my agent was like, yeah, Nicole, but it's theoretical. She's like, you can't count that money until you book it. And I was like, oh.

So it's just like, yeah, you're filled with all this hope and wonder of like, maybe I can pay rent for multiple months. Yeah. And they're like, you didn't get it. And you're like, okay. Good.

Back to what I was doing. Back to my normal bullshit. Totally. It's so rough. And that's part of what makes you so nervous. Cause like only at tests, you have to sign the contract where you see the number written down. You got to keep looking at it on many pages going,

I could get that amount. And they're like, and you'll be locked in for seven years. And like the longer you do it, you see the number written down. Yeah, you gotta keep looking at it on many pages going, I could get that amount. And they're like, and you'll be locked in for seven years and the longer you do it you're scared of that. But at the beginning you're excited about it.

But also as you're reading it you're doing your salary times and you're like, seven years? So I'm now the richest person in America so then with that money it's not gonna happen.

And now we know that no show goes on for seven years anymore. Yeah. Yeah. Good point. Well, on a positive note,

the Battle of the Five Stars segment is where we read your five-star reviews. So if you want to leave a review on your favorite podcast platform, you'll get a chance

for us to read it on air. You could also write to us about your feelings about which characters do you think we should include in our fanfic. You can write anything

you want. It doesn't really have to be like, you know, logical. But this one is called I Blame You by Jackie underscore Snow on Apple Podcasts.

Hold on, it has an exclamation mark. I blame you! There you go. Who could make me utter the phrase I want to watch Lord of the Rings?

Nicole Byer and Lauren Lapkus, that's who. I blame you both for your making me actually want to subject myself to re-watching this series. It took me three long days to make it through

the first movie alone. Though, I also must thank you for the fiery passion in my husband's eyes as I asked him to join me on my journey through Middle Earth.

I blame you. I thank you. I reluctantly join you. Joke aside, I absolutely love this podcast. You ladies are killing the quarantine podcast game. Aw, thanks, Jackie.

That was a really nice sweet message. I'd like to think we saved her marriage. I think so this podcast. You ladies are killing the quarantine podcast game. Aw, thanks, Jackie. That was a really nice sweet message. I'd like to think we saved her marriage. I think so, too. That's what the Battle of the Ring was all about.

I feel like there was more layered writing and storytelling in that review than in Tolkien. This review was beautifully written. I was like, she's married.

They're closer. First she blames us, then she thanks us, and in the end, she joins us. Yeah, I would like then she then she thanks us and in and in the end she joins us yeah I would like if she spanked us well we'll be back

next week with something a lot of you have been clamoring for I'll leave it at that see you then I wonder what it is bye bye

bye Bye. Bye. Bye.