Newcomers: Sports, with Nicole Byer and Lauren Lapkus - Batman Forever (w/ Andy Daly)

Episode Date: January 30, 2024

Lauren and Nicole enter Joel Schumacher's Batman universe with very special guest Andy Daly (Lessons in Chemistry, Eastbound & Down, Harley Quinn) covering 1995’s Batman Forever. Together, they learn all about the on-set feuds (spoiler: there were several), the creative process of designing Batman’s unique costume, and so much more.Next week's movie: Batman & Robin (1997). Follow Andy: Instagram, TwitterLike the show? Rate Newcomers 5 stars on Spotify and Apple Podcasts and leave a review for Nicole and Lauren to read on the pod!Follow the podcast on Letterboxd.Advertise on Newcomers via Gumball.fmSee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

This is a HeadGum Original. Riddle me this, riddle me that. Who's afraid of the Big Black Pat? In an uncertain world, in a chaotic time, the interest of justice wears a mask. Your entrance was good. His was better. Love is a game.

What is it about the wrong kind of man? It's the car, right? Chicks love the car. Power is a machine. Now you've devised a way to read men's minds. By the way, I've seen your mind. Freak. And revenge is a trap.

You're a genius. Riddler and Two-Face can make a pretty lethal combination. Train me, let me be your partner. Who's your tailor? If a bat wants to play, we'll play. Was that over the top? Courage now. Truth always.

Batman forever. Batman forever! Wow. What did he get at that? I like that we have to stare each other in the eyes to be like, okay. And here we go. I'm Lauren Lapkus.

I'm exhausted. I'm Nicole Byer. This season we're covering the Batman movies and this is the fifth episode of the sixth season. Okay, so we're working our way through movies within the Batman universe with the help of fellow newcomers, super fans, and sometimes even people who've contributed. So this season's going to be 13 episodes or 14 episodes?

Yeah, I thought it was 14. 14! 14 episodes culminating in a very exciting live stream! Wow. Yeah, we don't know what's going to happen. We don't know anything to go down. You've got to watch it live, babe! We're going to cover as much as we can to get an overview of the

franchise, but guess what? We're not gonna be able to get to everything. Today we'll be discussing the 1995 film Batman Forever starring Val Kilmer. Now, I just want to throw out there, his mouth, like, very Michael Keaton. Yes. Almost, just coming from watching that movie to this movie, I was like, not too far off. Not too far off. At times, or the first time he was like Val Kilmer, I was like, where's Michael? Yeah, missed Michael a little bit. A little. Missed that little Jerry girl.

We got a lot of thoughts, yep. Well, Val had good hair. It was floppy. Yeah, a full head of hair. It was like that sort of floppy 90s guy. Yeah. Like, yeah, yeah, yeah. Little surfer.

Yeah, surfer vibes. Like, Paul, got to the beach, not a foot crumb. Batman Forever is available with a subscription on Max and Prime Video, and you can also pay to watch it if you're obsessed. Go to Apple TV Plus, Google Play, or Vudu. You've got to give Warner Brothers money. I'm obsessed. I need to pay $3 to watch this now.

And obviously we're going to spoil it. So that's happening. So that's happening. So that's that. We are so excited for our guest today. He's an actor, writer, comedian. You've seen him on his show Review, on Eastbound and Down, Silicon Valley. So many. Ooh, credits.

The Parks and Rec. Pretty much every show you've ever thought was funny, you've seen this person. And you'll be able to see him soon in the Apple limited series, Lessons in Chemistry, which may or may not be out when this episode drops. I don't know. And most importantly to us, he is the voice of Two-Face

in the Harley Quinn animated series. That's juicy. Ooh, juicy juice. Oh, he's part of the franchise. Yeah. Wow. Welcome back, Andy Day. Oh my goodness.

Hello. Thank you for being here. I'm delighted to be here. I can't believe you're Two-Faced, a character I just got to know so well last night. We just got to know Two-Faced. I know, I can't believe it either. Can you believe? You're stepping in the shoes of Tommy Lee Jones.

I know, and this is my first time seeing this movie, seeing Tommy Lee Jones as Two-Faced. Now I'm realizing, oh, I did it all wrong. No, but you've got to make it your own. That's kind of what we're seeing here. I think that's smart. Yeah. What is your relationship to the character of Batman or DC Comics? Are you a fan? Where are you? I have an opinion about Batman that makes people very

angry. Oh, this is the place. Honestly, this is where you could share that. I think it's safe. You think I'm safe? It's a safe space. I mean, we're not going to read the comments, so yeah. Oh, yeah. Okay. Me neither. Yeah.

I believe that the 1966 Batman television series with Adam West is the only time that anyone has gotten the tone right for Batman on screen. Wow. I think it's the eye. Just the fact that he's got little ears on his hat. Yeah. Makes it something. It makes it so stupid. Yeah.

That you just have to goof on it. Yeah. And the Joker should have makeup over his mustache the way Cesar Romero did. We really talked about that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's confusing. Stuff like that is like right down it's perfect it's the tone

it's the correct tone trying to make like a serious psychological dark and meaningful story out of a guy with infinite money who dresses up like a bat to beat up bad guys at night

it's a waste of time. I love that. That's my opinion, and boy, it does make people mad. Yeah, but I think you're still holding up the original, which I feel like is a good opinion. It's like you're saying like... Okay, no, but in the world, people don't really like that. Yeah, they don't like that. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I think you're saying Batman's good. You just prefer it being silly. Yeah, right. Well, this one was silly. It was silly. That's true. This one was silly. Okay, everyone was in a different movie.

I know. This was the most bananas movie. Jim Carrey was in a very different movie than Val Kilmer and Nicole Kidman. And then Tommy Lee Jones was like, I don't actually want to be here. It was truly wild. I know. And Chris O'Donnell. Wow.

Another movie also, I would say. Yeah. I mean, he was like kind of like a Dawson's Creek vibe coming in. And he's like the brooding teen who's got a hard time. I want to ride this motorcycle. My family died right in front of me as I was rolling a bomb into a river. That was wild. Weren't you kind of excited, though, because Paul F. Tompkins had told us that Robin was an acrobat and that's how his origin story started?

Yes. And then when we saw the acrobats, I was like, oh, here's where we get this from. I love that he's from a family of Robins, that they all dress like that. Yeah, yeah. I did not know that. Robin is not a good name for like the sidekick. I feel like it's, but even when he like chose it,

I feel like he was kind of like, Robin. Robin. That's it. It's the R's Robin. It's who I am now. I'm a Robin. Fly around, I'm an acrobat.

Because I saved him like a Robin. Yeah, Robin. I flew in like a Robin. I'm like, so many birds you would put before that. Like an eagle. An eagle, a crow, a sparrow even. Yeah.

Eagle man. Do you remember those commercials, Allie? No. crow, a sparrow, even. Yeah. Eagle Man. Do you remember those commercials, Allie? No. Oh, it was like a local Midwest... Are you from the same place? Yeah. Oh, okay. I was like, wow, we didn't get singled out. We were from the Midwest, and there's this commercial called Eagle Man that was an insurance company,

and my brother and I recreated it and did Raptor Boy, because we had a raptor head but it was basically these two women get in a car crash and their car goes like and they're like oh no

do you have insurance on this car? No. And then they're like there's like this big like boop and they hear this sound and this eagle

huge eagle man lands on the car Yeah I've seen it. You've seen it? Yeah. And then he's like oh I've got something for you. Yes. And then he's like, I've got something for you.

Yes! And then he poops out an egg and then the egg cracks open and it's a little eagle and it has little insurance rates in its mouth. And then they go, look at those low rates. I feel like I've seen this recently. Maybe you have. In Chicago. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I'm sure it's still going. Now it's funny, I feel like. It's very funny. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm sure it's still going. Now it's like funny, I feel like. It's very funny. Yeah, because it was current at the time. It was like they had just made it. Oh, okay. Yeah, yeah. But anyway, Eagle Man could have been a good sidekick.

Well, okay. We're going to jump into all this. We kind of see where we're all... Yes. Where we all stand with this movie. But let's take a quick break and we'll jump back into Batman Forever right after this. We're back. Okay, Batman Forever was released June 16th, 1995,

written by so many people. Lee Batchelor, Janet Scott Batchelor. Ooh, a couple. A couple. Or siblings. You're right, or siblings. Or just a coincidence. Or cousins.

They're both named Batchelor. Boy, oh boy. Akiva Goldsman, directed by Joel Schumacher. And it was produced by the spooky man from... Tim Burton. That threw me off because then it was like, oh, it is a Tim Burton thing. Then I was like, no, it's not.

No. He seemed to have nothing to do. I'm like, really curious. Nothing, nothing, nothing. a Tim Burton thing. Then I was like, no, it's not. No. He seemed to have nothing to do. I'm like, really curious. Yeah, nothing, nothing, nothing. Yeah. I will say, watching this movie, I was like, oh, this is what this is. And it made me appreciate the Tim Burton ones more. Yes.

I was like, oh, those weren't as awful as I thought they were. Because you know what? They're really serious. They stick to a tone. Yes. And they really mean it. And I really like that about this. I feel like this movie is like so, it kind of makes fun of itself.

Yes. But in a way where you're like, so you don't care? Yeah. I know that's what's tricky about being silly. It's like teasing yourself. Yeah. It's very tricky. Although Batman's costume in the beginning has nipples.

Did you notice that? No, I didn't notice that. Oh, yes. Apparently that was the real innovation of this movie. The nipples were added to the Batman costume. And then when he gets his new one that he hadn't tested yet, there was no nipples. But then we got a shot of that butt. And I was like, what is this movie?

Yeah. I mean, Val Kilmer, really hot guy. I think so. Yeah. I do like that floppy hair. Yeah, yeah, yeah. yeah. Really attractive man. Very symmetrical face. I really was like, you could fold it right in on it.

Very perfect. Have you seen his documentary about his current life? It's really interesting. What's going on? A lot. I don't want to get into it. But you should watch it. It's an oddball. But I also learned what an artist he has always been.

I only knew him from things like this and like he's a really interesting guy so that is a cool documentary he's another one where I'm like I know Val Kilmer

I don't know what movies he's been in I can't name one besides this but Tombstone he's so good in Tombstone well that you've got to do

give us another one what give us another Val Kilmer another Val Kilmer well The Doors never seen it you've never seen The Doors. Never seen it. You've never seen The Doors? Fascinating.

What's it about? Wait, what about Heat? The band? Yeah, the band The Doors. Oh, no! And then he just walks through doors? What's that? Is it like sliding doors?

Like that movie? The Heat? Heat. Just Heat. Oh, The Heat is a different movie. Never seen it. Never seen that. Wow, you guys are so good. We could do a Val Kilmer newcomer season. We could do a whole. Top. Just Heat. Oh, The Heat is a different movie. I've never seen it. I've never seen that. Wow, you guys are so good.

We could do a Val Kilmer newcomer season. We could do a whole. Top Gun? Yeah. Never seen it. Never seen it. I tried to watch the new one, and I was like, this is insufferable. Yeah, me too.

Oh, my God. So many people told me it's their favorite. Mary's like, that's my favorite new movie. Really? New Top Gun. She said, you have to watch both. You've got to sit on the big screen. I said, okay, and then I made no effort.

No. I was baffled by that. I tried to watch Top Gun Maverick 2 I was like I heard this was great everyone was saying it was a lot of Tom Cruise

riding a motorcycle and I was like I don't need that okay I'm curious I don't know anything about it but we'll see well we're gonna get into the plot of this movie

and we want to thank the Batman fandom wiki for the assist with this script because they always know what's up. They're never confused. They're never confused. They're always spot on.

The movie opens as Batman Val Kilmer saves a guard from Two-Face, the alter ego of the disfigured former district attorney Harvey Dent, Tommy Lee Jones. They're locked in a safe tied to a helicopter, though Batman unlocks the safe. Dent kills the helicopter's pilot, and both Dent and Batman flee as

the helicopter crashes into the Statue of Liberty. Which is absolutely wild. Right off the bat I was like, this is crazy. Yeah, I was like, this is insane, but I was like, happy it started with some sort of action. Yeah. But it's not the Statue of Liberty. It's the Statue of Gotham. Wow, Batman wiki!

Wow! Let's figure that out. And he's got you there! the statue of Gotham. It is. Wow, Batman Wiki. Wow. Let's figure that out. And he's got you there. Also, I really loved when they showed Two-Face's origin story that somehow a criminal on the stand

had acid. His whole vibe was criminal. So it's really funny when you see that first shot of him, how they think you don't know

that he's Two-Face. I'm like, I can see the second face coming off the side. So that was an interesting reveal. But the look of this movie is really Halloween costumey. Yes. It's sort of like... Very cheap.

Yeah, yeah. They were like, we have a budget and we got to adhere to it. Yeah. Yeah. Okay, so while this is going on edward enigma that's how you spell enigma no it's edward nigma because he's enigma oh they never they don't do that in the movie they never say but i had the subtitles on which is how i got that so i don't know that i would have ever put that together nope yeah they never say he's an enigma but he is a question

mark so i guess that's wow so this movie wanted me to look at cheap costumes and think? Yeah, exactly. You're asking a lot. So that's played by Jim Carrey, a lowly worker at Wayne Enterprises who's literally insane, has invented an item that manipulates people's brainwaves and channels television programs into people's minds. Like, why? Making it feel like they're inside the show.

Reviewing his work, Bruce Wayne rejects the invention on the crowns that such intrusive technology raises too many questions. Enigma's supervisor fires him. This drives Enigma crazy. He tests the machine on his supervisor, kills him. The way he dies is pretty funny. And makes it look like a suicide. Oh, yeah, that was crazy. It was so wild.

Yeah. Then he leaves a riddle at the scene for Bruce and resigns from his job. Can we talk about... He leaves a riddle at the scene for Bruce and resigns from his job. Can we talk about, I feel like his normal was so crazy that by the time he's the Riddler, he's the saint. Of course. The only thing that changes was the hair. I know, his hair changed like eight times.

I was like, why? I really didn't understand. I know his hair was confusing. But he went so crazy big from the beginning that it felt like the soundtrack had to like kind of justify it in a way. Yeah. The soundtrack had to meet him. Yeah. After the post-production.

But then also, Ed Begley Jr., who never goes big. Yeah. Yeah. Suddenly is because I guess he's reading the room. He's like, I guess I'm this character. Exactly. I've never seen him do anything like that. It's so crazy.

It is absolutely wild. Their interactions like when they're alone are wild because it's just them going like, la, la, la. Jim Carrey's the craziest version of himself and I am a fan. I felt like, I just was like,

this is too silly. It's too silly. I wish he had played Edward a little smaller so when he gets to be the Riddler, it was like, oh, there's a change I feel like that's what happens to every character

when they have an origin story it's different from like what the character they become is so then I was like he needs to like he was being so crazy I was like there's no way

this person works here there's no way everyone listens to him no also Bruce Wayne just like accepting this man being like and being like

maybe contact my secretary. I know. He'd be like, you got to go. Yeah. Are you on your lithium? You got to get out of here. They all seem to be struggling with how to remain stoic and Batman-like in the face of this nonsense.

I want to know what everyone's thoughts were. Wasn't there a Tommy Lee Jones quote? Yeah. He said something about his buffoonery. Yeah. He was like not here for it. It's in our trivia section. Okay, great.

Oh, yeah. He hated him. Which is so funny. I mean, they did have scenes together where you truly see Tommy Lee Jones struggling. There's a scene where they hug. You know something? It's so weird. I went Googling to try and confirm this and I couldn't.

But I remember hearing this a long time ago. That Tommy Lee Jones hated Jim Carrey so much that one thing he wanted to do was deprive him of single shots. And so Tommy Lee Jones like re-blocked the scene so they were always in the lens together. That's really funny. That's really funny. Now the other thing about that though is that it makes your day shorter because you don't have to turn around. You know what I mean? So it could have been that.

He had multiple reasons. Yes, he had multiple reasons. He was like, I don't want him to get his shine and I want to go home. Yeah, but they are truly in the lens together a lot wow the whole movie i think yeah yeah i also think his edward edward nigma character reminded me of his andy kaufman a little bit where he's sort of like he's kind of like doing like a little face like he's kind of like what's going i don't know there was something about it where i was like oh maybe this is like the some element of this was brought to that character i don't know know. No? No, no.

I got a thing about Jim Carrey. So that's why I didn't see this movie and I haven't seen the man on the moon. Oh, you're not a fan? No. Oh, have you seen Liar Liar? No. There's a really funny plane scene.

There is? He also beats himself up and that's funny too. Oh, the bathroom scene is very funny. Also, there's a couple courtroom scenes that are very funny. Yeah, have you seen... There's also an elevator scene

that's very funny. Have you seen an elevator scene that's very funny. Have you seen Truman Show? Yeah. That one's good. Have you seen Sonic 1 and Sonic 2? No. Best work of his career. Really?

You guys have seen literally not one Val Kilmer movie and literally every single Jim Carrey movie. Have you seen Eternal Sunshine? Yeah, that's what I have not. Oh, that's just a great one. You only see the bad ones. Yeah. Listen, Sonic was, I truly think it's the best work of his career. I haven't seen Sonic yet.

Is it a live action movie? I'll wait for my daughter. Yeah, really? Yeah, you don't remember? They came out with the Sonic picture and everyone was like, oh, and they changed it? Yeah, when he had teeth and everyone said no. I was like, so wait, we all just said no and they were like, back to the drawing board. I didn't know we had that much control. I think the response was so like, yeah. And they changed it? Yeah, when he had teeth and everyone said no. I was like, so wait, we all just said no and they were like, back to the drawing board. I didn't know we had that much control.

I think the response was so like, ah! Yeah. Not like, oh, we hate this, it's bad. It was like, this is scary. Yeah, it did look wrong. Yeah, just upsetting. But it got through a lot of channels before everyone weighed in. So meanwhile, Bruce meets psychiatrist Dr. Chase Meridian which is an amazing name

Nicole Kidman who seems to be taken with him right away and invites her to a charity circus event there Two-Face

and his henchmen storm the event in an attempt to discover Batman's secret identity in the process Two-Face kills a family of acrobats

called the Flying Graysons the youngest Grayson named Dick just the way it happens is so funny it's so crazy one is rolling a bomb into a river

and the other is like we can get up and then they fall down and they just fall and the only reason it happened too is because Dick Grayson did a major stunt

where it was like with no net yes and that's why his whole family was able to fall to their deaths so it actually is his fault

he had just not been to show off and let the net be why ever do anything without a net if you're a psychopath why we don't want that no so that's Chris O'Donnell It is his fault. He's just not going to show up and let the net be. Why ever do anything without a net? Why? Why? We don't want that.

No. So that's Chris O'Donnell. He survives and throws Two-Face's bomb into the river. Assuming responsibility for Dick, Bruce allows him to stay at Wayne Manor. Before long, Dick accidentally stumbles across the Batcave and discovers Bruce's secret identity. Which is wild. You don't lock it up so fast. They really do.

Everyone's like, you're Batman. So many people know. He tries to admit it at the circus. Remember, that was a big moment for Batman. Well, he waited until everyone started

screaming to go, I'm Batman. I'm Batman. I'm Batman. Yeah. And he only said it once. I know. They did a bunch.

That felt like a little jokey. I don't know. Dick pleads to let Bruce train him as a partner so he can get revenge on Two-Face, but Bruce refuses, feeling he cannot drag Dick into his crime-stopping world. Is this around when

we get to see how incredible Robin is at doing his laundry? I believe so. That was an incredible scene. That was incredible. I've never seen anybody do laundry like that. Me either. Man. He was like, people don't take care of me. He doesn't seen anybody do laundry like that. Me either. Man. He was like, people don't take care of me.

I don't know what I'm up to. He doesn't need to be taken care of. No. Yeah. I guess that's how acrobats do their laundry. Yeah, I guess so. It's something. He's trained.

You gotta flip, flip around. Yeah. And I always want to call him Winston, Alfred. I don't know why I keep doing that. Well, did we skip that part? Well, they have that little moment where he's like, I'll keep your outfit right over here over here like that little I don't know if that's here or if we're getting ahead of ourselves but oh Robin also calls him Al right up that's how you know he's like a troubled

he's like a bad boy he's like a rebel and he's really handsome in a very like of that moment ethereal way it's the sideburns that tell you what year this is it's those 90210 sideburns totally meanwhile Nygma inspired and sideburns that tell you what year this is. Sideburns. That's totally what it is. It's those 90210 sideburns. Totally. Meanwhile, Nygma, inspired and delighted by watching Two-Face's raid

at the circus, decides to become a villain himself. The Riddler. Just decides? He's like, this is for me. He heads to Two-Face's, but also I was like the scene with his supervisor or whatever, didn't that do something to his brain? I felt like he was messed up and then he goes into his little, but he already had that little lair

that had the Joker or the Riddler thingy. He goes in there and he has all those it looks like a psycho killer's little hidden closet space. I don't know. I just thought he was a crazy person. Did you see when he's trying

outfits on the statue of David that it has no genitals? Wow. Very interesting moment. I didn't clock that. I didn't clock that either, but it feels like something we would have clocked. Two very horny ladies. Yeah, we like to know about the pee pee.

I was curious. I was like, yeah, it just seems like something that happened when they're deciding what to rate the movie. Right, right. They're like, well, if we show this famous statue that millions have seen, people trek to. If a kid sees that. Oh, God. I guess it's PG-13. So we head to Two-Face's lair where we also meet two of Two-Face's henchwomen, Sugar, Drew Barrymore. That was fun.

Which was a nice surprise. And Spice, Debbie Mazur. Who I love, too. Another nice surprise. Their enigma shows Two who i love a nice surprise their enigma shows two faces invention which becomes hugely popular that confused me it also has the side effect of allowing enigma to access its users brainwaves and discover all of their secrets which is also like why do you want that which enhances his own intelligence and knowledge in the process the two villains make a deal if two face helps him steal enough priceless goods and

money to fund his project the riddler will use his invention the box also terrible name to learn batman's true identity the two begin their rampage robbing museums collecting diamonds and money can we talk about the part where it's it's back but when um when nigma first takes ed begley jr's brain or whatever and he they let jim carrey do like every style of that that he wanted to. He was like, I'm taking the cortex and this area. And then he was like. He did every single thing that you could do. And they used them all. I'll give you a bunch of choices.

We'll take them all. No. He's supposed to, by the way, I think he's supposed to get. He's supposed to absorb the intelligence and knowledge of everybody. Which would make him like a super genius. But that never seems to occur. No. He never gets smarter. No, he never gets smarter.

He just gets more annoying. He gets goofier and goofier. And his hair gets weirder. But the outfits get so good. Well, yeah, it looks like he could wear it to the Beyonce concert. Yes. It's like full on like, see, almost for Beyonce. Yeah.

At a business party for his new company, Nygma Tech, Nygma unveils his new- Also, how do you have time to create a new company? Are you just saying you have a new company? How much time is passing? Yes. He unveils his new brand scanning, brand scanning,

brain scanning technology. Bruce doesn't want to use it, knowing it can extract people's thoughts, but Sugar tricks him into stepping into the box that he thinks has been switched off. Which is so dumb. Why would you get in it, even if it was switched off? Yeah, no. Bruce, come on. I didn't catch that he was tricked into doing it. Which is so dumb. Why would you get in it even if it was switched off?

Yeah, no. Bruce, come on. I didn't catch that he was tricked into doing it. I just saw him sit down in front of this thing and getting a beam shot up in the forehead. And I was like, why are you doing that? She took the little tube out and she's like, it's off. And then he went in and she shoved it back in.

And I was like, yeah, I did it. It was wild. I was like, what? Drew Barrymore has had so much fun, I feel like, in her career. So many random things. Soon, Two-Face and Spice arrive and begin robbing the guests, hoping to lure Batman to the scene.

Bruce leaves, changes, and comes back to the party, crashing in through the ceiling. When Batman falls into a trap laid for him by the villains, Dick comes to his rescue. Still, back at the Batcave, Bruce again refuses to let Dick

become his partner. Back as Batman, he heads to Chase's apartment where she reveals that though she loves Batman, she has fallen in love with someone else. He smiles. This smile was so funny. He smiles as he turns away knowing Chase has fallen in love with him. Boy, oh boy.

Did I laugh. They like kiss and she's like, no, I like someone else. And then he was like. He's like, that's me too. It's me. It's me. You've kissed me twice. I'm tricking you.

First she tells Bruce, like, I'm not interested in you because I have fallen in love with someone else. Who we know is Batman. Yes. And then he's all bummed because he's like, she'll never like me, Bruce Wayne. She only likes Batman. Yeah. And then Batman goes to kiss her and she says, I'm sorry, I've fallen for someone else. It's Bruce.

I know. It's crazy. It's wild. She needs to get her stuff together. She really does. Yeah, I'm worried about her. She's a mental health professional. I know. It's crazy. She needs to get her stuff together. She really does. I'm worried about her. She's a mental health professional. I know.

She's not okay. She's too confused. Also, does every Batman have a blonde woman that he is in love with? Oh, okay. I mean, I don't know, but I'm saying it feels that way. I think that's what it feels like. So far. We had a redhead.

Oh, we did. In the cartoon. Okay, so maybe they just didn't color correct it and she was supposed to be blonde. Bruce tells Dick that he will retire as Batman, which is wild, now that he has found happiness with Chase. You're going to stop fighting crime because of a woman?

Why are you stopping? Don't you have a mission in life? To avenge your dead parents? Which angers Dick and prompts him to run away. Bruce invites Chase to Wayne Manor, where through a kiss, she realizes his secret identity is Batman.

Yeah, she's like, it's the same lips. Same lips, same chin, same eyes, same person. Just then, the Riddler and Two-Face break into the home

and I was like, you live in a mansion, you don't have cameras, like you don't have good security. Alfred just got clocked on the head with the question mark cane

and this is where they hugged right before they go in they're like, happy Halloween or something, I don't know what it is. Oh, it's Halloween. They hug each other and I was like, it's Halloween because there. I don't know what it is. And then they hug each other.

Yeah, it's Halloween because there was trick-or-treaters. Thinking about Tommy Lee Jones hating this and hugging him. Maybe that was the day he decided to not give him singles. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He's like, I'll have fun here. Yeah, so they pretend to be trick-or-treaters and Alfred falls for it. They destroy the Batcave, kidnap Chase, and leave behind a fourth riddle while Bruce and Alfred are unconscious

when he wakes Bruce solves the riddle so fast and uses all four riddles to discover the Riddler's true identity as Nygma he locates Nygma's lair on an island

outside of Gotham when did he have time to build this as Batman he debates on his mode of transportation the bat wing or the bat boat a voice calls for both

and Dick steps out of the shadows as Robin, revealing that Alfred helped him with his transfer. Like, is Alfred a super seamstress? He's a mechanic. I was surprised to hear that. He can fix a motorcycle.

A mechanic, a seamstress. It's wild. This time, Batman accepts Robin as his partner and the two rush off to rescue Chase. Hmm. Yeah. Okay, did you try to solve the riddles before they solved them?

Yeah, a little. Like a little. I was going like, it has a face like this and a face like that and then they're like clock. I was insulted by that riddle. That's a little too easy.

Because that one, that was kind of like, I did. Just that one. We've heard the face thing before, but then the other ones, I was stumped. I was impressed that they got it.

And realize that all four, the answers to all four riddles when you put them together mean something? Yeah, I didn't even consider that going to be a thing. Never for a minute. I would have thrown them all out and been like, someone creepy keeps writing. Someone creepy took my girlfriend and keeps writing me shit. Better clean up the Wayne Manor.

But A is one, B is two, that thing? A little too simple. What was the solution to that? That's what it was. It was like each one of these letters corresponds to the number that they are in the alphabet. But if you put these two together... Yeah.

Upon reaching the island, Batman and Robin are both shot down and they crash. They split up when the island, Batman and Robin are both shot down and they crash. They split up when the island begins to slide into pieces. Robin locates Two-Face and kicks him over the edge of a cliff

but hesitates in killing him and instead helps him back up. Two-Face turns on him capturing Robin. I know that was so dumb. I was like, just kill him. You're so new at this, man.

Kill him. Let him fucking go. He had a gun in his face. I was like, it's over. The way he put the gun in Robin's face and then we get this time

where we see Batman successfully infiltrate the tower he sees Robin and Chaser being tied up in a giant glass contraption there was such an easy moment for Robin to be killed yes

like it would have happened right then if Two-Face actually cared and that's the part I didn't get I was like he has a gun to his head there's no protection on it just kill him

well maybe one part of him wanted to and the other didn't. You know what I mean? He's got to flip a coin. You do know the inner workings of two faces. Side play. Yeah. Oh, I forgot about that. Have you seen No Country for Old Men, by the way?

No. I have. Okay. Remember, there's a coin flip to whether you're going to kill somebody or not. And Tommy Lee Jones is in it. Slightly interesting. He was like, I remember this. to whether you're gonna kill somebody or not, and Tommy Lee Jones is in it. Slightly interesting. Okay, interesting. He was like, I remember this from when I did that thing.

The Riddler tells Batman that he can only save one hostage, but Batman stalls the Riddler with a riddle of his own, using the distraction to destroy the brainwave collecting device. It was so easy to break it. Reversing its effect on the Riddler. It didn't reverse him. It sizzled him up. It also made him really weird looking. Why did he look like that? He looked melted

and strange. His face was bigger and it looked old. He looked like Jimmy Neutron. Yeah, he had a big head. Huge and misshapen. It was so weird. I really was looking at it going like, is this an effect? Or what am I i looking at or does jim carrey actually can he look like that is he okay was a rubber-faced comedian jim carrey and puff his forehead out

and sending him into a mental breakdown in the process batman rescues robin and chase before they fall to their deaths only to find Two-Face holding them at gunpoint Batman tricks Two-Face into using his coin this is wild but tosses a handful of silver dollars as he flips it mid-air

which confuses the villain he's like he has so many coins he's like ah which one's mine and then he fell trying to get them which Chase told him earlier

she's like that coin is important to him you can defeat him yeah okay well he falls to his death and the Riddler is sent to Arkham Asylum

and Chase is asked to consult on his case and the Riddler is sent to Arkham Asylum and Chase is asked to consult on his case so this is like this is so funny Hannibal Lecter situation the Riddler offers to reveal the identity

of Batman to her trying to convince her that he himself is Batman Chase tells Bruce his safe what did she was like she was like

he's a certified weirdo or something I know he's a wacko he's a wacko they repeated that line like it was so amazing yeah he's a wacko. He's a wacko. They repeated that line like it was so amazing. He's a wacko.

Is that the clinical term? Yeah, it's such a cute flirt. So funny. They kiss before chase departs. The film, this is the only part of the movie I genuinely liked. The film ends

with Batman and Robin running towards the camera with the bat signal in the background. It looked really cool. It looked so cool. It did look cool and it got me a little excited

about the next one. Yes. But yeah, no, the ending. It looked really cool. It looked so cool. It did look cool and it got me a little excited about the next one. Yes. But yeah, no, the ending, so like Jim Carrey's in the insane asylum and he's like, they're like, he keeps saying he knows who Batman is. And so then we're like, oh no, he's gonna say it's Bruce, but like who cares if he's

saying it? He did know, right? He's crazy. Yeah, but yeah, then he goes, I know who Batman is and he's like, I'm Batman. I am Batman. And he's like waving his like straight jacket around where I was like, you're not really locked up in that. It was like black and white stripe. Yeah. He looked like he was in jail and not a mental institution.

Yeah. It was really kooky. And she's like, he doesn't know. He thinks it's him. That's some wacko. Does she know at that point who Batman is? Yeah. Because she kissed both of them and she was like, I know those lips.

So she's scared he's going to say, yeah. It's all safe. Also, I was like, this mental institution has no parking? We just got to be by the gate? She came through a door and then he was waiting out there. It was very, very like Transylvania sort of.

Yes. Alright, well that's the movie. I mean, it's truly It was very Transylvania. Yes. All right. Well, that's the movie. I mean, it's truly... Oh, and one part I wanted to mention was when Jim Carrey, his whole, when the Riddler's whole thing blows up, when he throws the bat thing and it explodes,

and he's like, bummer. And I was like, bummer. Bummer? Bummer. Bummer. The I was like, bummer. Bummer? Bummer. Bummer. The stakes were low. I will say, the stakes were higher in this Batman than any other Batman. So I kind of appreciated that.

I liked that it started with a little bit of action. I did not like that the director wasn't like, hey guys, let's all make one movie. But I did long for the, what's his name, Mrton tim timber the tim burton movies i liked when mr burton made the film yeah no it's true because i really liked how um i liked how this one looked like the city looked kind of cool it was a little brighter and like less it wasn't all black like tim burton style but um yeah i just felt like it was all over the place um just too silly actually like i like silliness but I just feel like it was all over the place and just too silly actually like I like silliness but I just felt like it

it took away from the story like it just was kind of distracting yeah I don't know it didn't feel like

everyone agreed to the same tone yeah and that's hard there was no tone meeting yeah yeah do you know if Batman

did he kill the people who killed his parents do you know what i'm saying yeah he did i don't we i don't know one thing the joker killed his parents yeah right that was in the cartoon yeah but so that was just one version where they said the story was like he pieces together the guy who shot his parents was actually the Joker. But I don't think that's true most of the time. I don't think that's true most of the time. I think it's just like a criminal. A couple of thugs.

Tim Burton decided that Jack Nicholson's Joker is like there's that flashback where he realizes that he does kill him. But I think it does change. That little part of the story changes. Yeah. Because then that's two, two though where it's the Joker who did it yeah because in this movie

there's a major theme of revenge yeah and that Batman's whole thing is about getting revenge on the thugs that killed his parents yeah

and now Dick Grayson is in the same position and Two-Face is trying to get revenge against Batman for perfectly putting a perfect line down the middle of his face

on that note I love that Batman was in full costume in a courtroom. Yeah. Like in the daylight. That was very funny. And everyone's always just like happy to see him.

Like there he is. We're not trying to guess who he is. It's rude to try to guess. Yeah, he's just here. He's just here at court like everybody else. That's his prerogative. God, it was so funny. And I was like, how did Batman think he was going to stop acid from being thrown?

It's in the air. It's about to land. Yeah, that's one you don't have a tool for. No, and I did love that he put newspaper on his face. Yeah, the vanilla folder made a perfect line down the middle of his face. It was truly wild. Yeah. middle of his face. Yeah.

It was truly wild. Yeah. So this movie grossed 52.8 million in its opening weekend beating Jurassic Park for the highest opening weekend total of all time.

It was surpassed two years later by the Jurassic Park sequel. That's pretty crazy though. Yeah. All right. Well, it currently holds a 39% rating

on Rotten Tomatoes. I get it. Batman Forever was nominated for three Oscars? Wait, for cinematography? Sound? Okay, for cinematography? Sound?

Okay, it had good sound. And sound effects editing. One song from the movie, Hold Me, Thrill Me, Kiss Me, Kill Me by U2. I don't know that song. It was nominated for a Golden Globe. I don't know that song. That comes on right at the end of the movie. Right when the credits. How's it go?

I don't really feel like singing it. Okay, I won't make you. I won't make you. I won't make you. Can you perform it? But it's a good song. It actually is a really good song. They also had a Flaming Lips song that I used to like as a kid. It was very 90s feeling.

But yeah, we were talking about how Kiss from a Rose wasn't in the movie. Yeah, I was looking for it. I know that from this. That played in the credits after the entirety of Hold Me, Thrill Me, Kiss Me, Kill Me. Wow. Wow. That's crazy. Wow. Wow. That's crazy.

Wow. I stayed till the end of the credits. I really appreciate that. I did not. The second end, I was like, bye. Sleep time. We don't have after credit scenes, right? No. That's just a Marvel thing.

Which is rude. Sometimes I lose the remote. Oh, I see. I see. I know that life. Also, Hold Me Thrill Me Kiss Me

Kill Me was nominated for worst original song by the Razzies I'm like the worst song yeah I mean okay

I didn't think it was that terrible and it won an MTV movie award for Seal's Kiss From A Rose it's a great song I can't believe it wasn't in the movie that's a great song I didn't realize

they were giving awards for the songs with the movies. I think MTV just does whatever they want. They're like, we like this song, let's pick a couple other ones.

Yeah. And then it's like Hottest Kiss and it's whatever. I feel like, yeah, Nicole Kidman and Val Kilmer were up for Hottest Kiss.

Sounds familiar to me. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I did like their chemistry. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Me too. She was so horny for anybody. She was so horny. And I was like, to be that pretty and be like, any person, a bat,. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Me too. She was so horny for anybody.

She was so horny. And I was like, to be that pretty and be like, any person. I know. A man, whatever. She was really not. She was not discriminating about who she wanted to fuck. No. Trivia. Here's our trivia.

No Wayne. No Wayne, dude. So Jim Carrey has said that Tommy Lee Jones couldn't stand on his own. Oh, Jim Carrey has said it. Okay, couldn't stand myself oh Jim Carrey has said it okay that's interesting supposedly telling him I cannot sanction your buffoonery that is the funniest sentence any humans uttered about something funny it's funny to go up to someone and say that I cannot sanction your buffoonery imagine it in Tommy Lee Jones's voice and I think that would just light a fire under Jim Carrey yeah Joel Schumacher apparently also

didn't get along with Val Kilmer, calling him childish and impossible. Whoa! According to Schumacher, Kilmer refused to talk to him for two weeks. During shooting? God, that's exhausting. Yeah. Does everyone just do it?

Yeah, just make the movie. I heard he also said that Val Kilmer put out his cigarette on a cameraman's face. What? Okay, well, I guess I'd have a hard time working with that person, too. Wait, that's absolutely unhinged. I know. That's what, yeah, Joel Schumacher somewhere else called him psychotic. He said Val Kilmer was psychotic.

Putting a cigarette in someone's face, I would not describe as not psychotic. I would never dream of that. I don't even know how you get to that point. No. I wouldn't dream of being rude, really. No. I'm like, thank you so much for having me here. I'm so excited I got to do whatever this is.

Thank you so much. I would put out the cigarette. You're going to throw pudding on me? Thank you. I'd put the cigarette out in somebody's face, but I would not be rude. Yeah, yeah. I just can't find anywhere to put it. I can't put it right on you.

According to costume designer Jose Fernandez, Schumacher insisted on the nipples of Batman and Robin's costumes wanting them to be more anatomical. Fernandez says Schumacher loved the nipples so he said let's showcase them. He wanted them sharpened like with points.

This is so funny. It's obsessive. They were also circled both outer and inner. It was all made to feature into a feature of the Batsuit. I didn't want to do it, but he was the boss. So we sharpened them, circled them, and it all became kind of ridiculous. That's really funny.

That's incredible. This movie sounds like a nightmare. I think it's funny how people speak openly about negative things that happened with people they worked with. I'm like, you just said it was crazy and you didn't want to do it and you did. I think it happens later, like 10 years after. What was it like

working on that movie? It was insane. Yeah, you're probably right. The Batmobile was usually driven by stunt drivers, but Chris O'Donnell insisted on driving it himself in the Joyride scene.

He crashed into a curb and dented a fender. Of course he did. Yeah. He did it when he was driving it, he did a funny little Latino accent. Yeah, actually, in the subtitles it said Chicano

accent, and then he said the thing. Wait, I really missed that. When he's rolling up on the fluorescent party. Wow. Will Shorts, puzzle master on NPR and editor of the New York Times crossword puzzle, created the Riddler's Riddles. Okay.

Okay. That's actually interesting to me because I feel like when you're writing something like that, how would you come up with a riddle that all pieces together in the end? That sounds hard if you're not someone who creates puzzles. Good for him. Well, let's take a quick break and we'll be back with a little more batman after this we're back holy batman batman and this new segment will rate uh val kilmer on a definitive newcomer's batman scale we'll use our phones to rank this batman across five unique characteristics preparedness how prepared is this Batman? Does he get to use his little gadgets and tools?

Detective ability. Does this Batman get to be a little detective? Is he good at mystery solving? Voice gravelliness. How gravelly is Batman's voice? Sadness. Sadness. How lonely, brooding emo is this Batman?

And finally, hotness. Ooh. How hot is this Batman? And then, Andy, get your phone out. We got a QR code. Oh, shit. It's interactive, baby. It's pretty high tech.

Oh, my God. I was wondering what this was. I thought it was a coaster. Yeah. All right. Okay, so do your rankings, and then we'll check in with what we all put. Oh, this is my favorite image on it. Oh.

Now I can use this as a coaster? Mm-hmm. Are we all in? Yes. Okay. Okay, so we ranked this Batman a 61% on the preparedness scale. I feel like he wasn't exceedingly prepared. No, I felt like he was only prepared at the end

when it seemed like he was only prepared at the end. Yeah. When it seemed like he shouldn't have had a plan because everything was like, you know, like sporadic. Yeah. But he like magically knew how to do everything. It was like had coins and shit. Yeah. But leading up to that, not prepared at all. And he went into battle in an experimental suit with sonar or something like that.

Yeah. I was like. No, man. But did the sonar save the day somehow didn't it i think it might have i don't know at the end he couldn't see don't ask me a question oh yeah it was like his night vision happened but then it didn't it wasn't black it wasn't like pitch black no i know it was a little confusing yes okay detective ability 77.5 percent he yeah he got those riddles.

He kind of did them with his girlfriend a little bit. I feel like that was pretty good. Voice gravelliness, 75%. It was a little gravelly. A little, but not super. Yeah, we've seen gravelly. Yeah, we have. Sadness, 92.5%.

Very sad. He was really sad. I didn't think he was that sad. Oh, see, I think above all he was sad. I feel like he was just kind of like, he was really one note. He was kind of like, just kind of melancholy. He was getting through it, you know? He was lonely and brooding.

That's because he was like, I don't want to film this. I want to put my cigarettes out in people's faces. I know. Knowing that was going on behind the scenes is interesting. Bruce Wayne should move to a happier house. Yeah. It's very dour. It is.

It is. It's a weird castle. Like, get. That's very dour. It is. It is. It's a weird castle. Like, get a comfy couch and some sunlight. It is. Open the curtains. Hotness and horniness, 74%. I mean, someone gave him pretty low. Was that me?

Maybe. It was an Andy. You know, I did not particularly think he was all that horny. I didn't think he was horny. I feel like he, I was at first thinking really hot and horny and then I was like, well, nothing really happened sexually. They kind of like kissed but it wasn't like...

It wasn't like Michael Keaton on that couch with Lady on Top. Who was that lady? Michelle Pfeiffer. Jesus Christ. I know. We've watched a lot. He's seeking companionship more than sex. Yeah, yeah. It really... He wanted to go on a date with her like like i don't know i i didn't feel like he was oozing sex appeal actually he was an

attractive man he can't help it but yeah wasn't going above and beyond so that's where we're at in this one that's it love it and this is the only one with val kilmer right yeah why is that i don't know why it is because he's awful. Oh, right. Nobody wanted to work with him again? I guess they didn't want to work with him again. We were surprised, though, to hear that it jumps around

to new people every time. That's just interesting. I'm curious. So who's next? I think it is Mr. Clooney. Is that right? Okay, I like him. I'm excited.

I do like George Clooney. I don't know if I see him as Batman. I can see it. Clear as day. I can see it. Clear as day. I can see it. I can see the whole thing. I already have seen it.

I wrote the movie. I can see it. Yeah, it's perfect. Time for our segment called Five Kapows. This is our listener review segment where we talk about who loves our podcast. We got five stars from Hillbilly Bajingo Wash. That's a funny name. The title was

Giving Me Life. Thank you, Nicole and Lauren. Your suffering for art is appreciated and will be rewarded in the afterlife, I'm sure. Great show. Very funny.

Please never stop making Newcomers. Thank you so much. Yes, thank you. And then, okay, once again, in addition to Apple Reviews of Newcomers,

we'll also be reading reviews from Letterboxd and then giving each film a one-sentence review ourselves and a star rating. If you don't know, Letterboxd is a social each film a one sentence review ourselves and a star rating. If you don't know, Letterboxd is a social media platform where any old person can write a review of a movie and you can follow the show on Letterboxd

at Newcomers. Are you on Letterboxd? I'm not on Letterboxd. My daughter is. I've heard a lot about it. Oh, cool. This first review, so think about what your sentence might be, but this first review is from Lobchonsky. There's a part where Batman shows up

and a guy in the crowd starts pointing and screaming, Batman, it's Batman, and I simply must agree. See? That's all you gotta say. And we got three and a half stars from Coffee.

Joel Schumacher and Tim Burton were the only motherfuckers that understood the best way to make a Batman movie is to make everybody want to have sex with each other. We need more fetish superhero movies and nerds should be

held responsible for the fact we haven't gotten any since Batman and Robin that makes any goddamn sense. Wow. Look, this person

sounds like you but about all the other ones. They're like, the other ones are how to make this movie. How strange. Yeah, I don't know. It's very strange.

So what's your one sentence review and how many stars do you give this film? Oh, out of a how many stars? Five. Interesting.

What an interesting number of stars. I can't remember what I gave Batman Returns. I think I said four? Oh, you gave it four. I'm going to give this one four too. Maybe three and a half because I like them.

I don't know. Here's the thing. You came into this being like I have to remember that I probably won't like these and like rate it in a way. I'm trying to make it make sense. My ratings make sense with my other ratings on the movies. Like if I give this a four that means that if I really like something I only

have room to go up to a five. Yes. Relative to all other movies or relative only to all other Batman movies? That's what I don't, that's why I get confused with my own ratings and then I just, I kind of just throw away the system as a whole thing. This doesn't make any sense.

Okay. Looking back, I liked Batman Returns more than this. So I think, even though I spoke pretty poorly of it, I think I'm gonna give this five, no, not five, sorry. Whoa.

Three and a half stars. That's still five sorry whoa three and a half stars still really high three and a half stick with what you believe in i'm just saying it's i think my review is good lord not one person was in the same movie but it was interesting and i like the riddler costumes okay i'm gonna give it two and a half stars. Okay. I love silly movies, but this movie was too silly. Silly in all the wrong ways. I think relative to other Batman movies, it's a four. Relative to all other movies, it's a two.

Yeah. And I would say Tommy Lee Jones is pretty good. That might be my one sentence. Yeah. I mean, I like a lot of the actors. But yeah, it just wasn't for me.

There was just like, I think if they had gotten Jim Carrey in some like takes where he wasn't at an 11, that would have helped. If he played it like, like a regular guy.

Yes. For the first part. Like an unassuming guy where you're just like, he just seems crushed that he doesn't want to invest or like go with his research

or whatever. Yeah. That would have been more interesting. And I also like, he's so good at doing the over-the-top thing that by the time

he gets to become the Riddler, then he can just have a field day. Would it have made a difference if the Riddler had been played by Robin Williams,

who I know they were trying to get? Oh, I would have liked that. Oh, I think I would have loved that. Yeah, I think so too. Yeah. Wow. Everyone out there, please review our podcast on Apple Podcasts. We'll be picking one to read on the next episode. Also, please rate us on Spotify.

It's very easy. You just pick the stars and we want five. You just pick the stars and we want five. Andy, thank you for being here thank you is there anything you would like to plug well patreon.com slash Andy Daly

is where you can hear my podcasting efforts and they're so funny thank you and I guess people should watch Harley Quinn I suppose yeah they can see you as Two-Face it's really good I feel bad that I said that the 1966 Batman is the only time somebody got the tone right

because there's also the show that I'm on. Yeah, but technically not Batman. That's a different universe. Well, not universe, but you know what I'm saying. Okay, we'll be back next week with Batman and Robin. Okay, here's the thing. I know they didn't run off set into the next movie, but that's what I feel like they're doing, and I'm excited. It kind of looks

like that, and I got a little excited too. I felt like it was kind of like setting up the next one. I mean, I don't know. I'm curious. That one has a lot of people we like. Alicia Silverstone. Mr. Freeze. Arnold Schwarzenegger. Schwarzenegger. And I don't know who else. And George Clooney. I don't know. I guess we'll find out

the rest. And Chris O'Donnell. And Chris O'Donnell. Oh, yes. And Chris O'Donnell is back. Oh, yeah. So he's just with a different Batman now. That's weird. That is weird.

They didn't run into the next movie because they switched out the guy. He pushed him over and was like, come on, George. That's really strange. Yeah. That must have been an interesting experience for him. And there must have been a moment where they said, well, maybe we should take this opportunity to replace Robin as well. Yeah.

I think they should have. But I wonder if he signed on to do two movies because it felt kind of like. Val Kilmer probably would have had to sign on to do two movies. Do we know why Val Kilmer was replaced? Will it be in our trivia? I'll try to find out before the next one. Okay. But I do wonder.

I mean, that cigarette thing. Yeah. That's kind of it. It's wild. It's got to be it. That's like enough of a reason. Yeah. And he didn't get along with Schumacher, we learned. And it's the same guy who did the next one.

Alright, well, can't wait to watch that I think, and we'll see you then! Bye! Newcomers is a production of HeadGum Studios. Our producer is Ali Khan. Our executive producer is Anya Kanovskaya. The show is edited, mixed, and mastered by Faris Manji, who also composed our theme song.

Follow us on Letterboxd, at Newcomers, and leave us a review on Apple Podcasts. We might just read it on the next show. Na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na-bye! That was a Hiddem Original.