Off Menu with Ed Gamble and James Acaster - Ep 50: Joe Thomas

Episode Date: March 18, 2020

Joe Thomas – star of ‘The Inbetweeners’, ‘Taskmaster’ and play ‘What’s in a Name?’ that he does such a great job at promoting – takes a seat in the dream restaurant to order an emotional roller coaster of a meal.Recorded and edited by Ben Williams for Plosive Productions.Artwork by Paul Gilbey (photography and design) and Amy Browne (illustrations).Joe Thomas stars in ‘What’s in a Name?’ which is on tour. Go to whatsinanameplay.com for tour dates and tickets.Follow Off Menu on Twitter and Instagram: @offmenuofficial.And go to our website www.offmenupodcast.co.uk for a list of restaurants recommended on the show.Watch Ed and James's YouTube series 'Just Puddings'. Watch here. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hello, listeners of the Off Menu podcast. It is Ed Gamble here from the Off Menu podcast. I have a very exciting announcement. I have written my first ever book. I am absolutely over the moon to announce this. I'm very, very proud of it. Of course, what else could I write a book about? But food. My book is all about food. My life in food. How greedy I am. What a greedy little boy I was. What a greedy adult I am. I think it's very funny. I'm very proud of it. The book is called Glutton, the multi-course life of a very greedy boy. And it's coming out this October, but it is available to pre-order now, wherever you pre-order books from. And if you like my signature, I've done some signed copies,

which are exclusively available from Waterstones. But go and pre-order your copy of Glutton, the multi-course life of a very greedy boy, now. Please? Hello, it's Ed here. Just before we play out the episode, just wanted to let you know that obviously this was recorded before the coronavirus pandemic. Now, I know a lot of you are tuning into this to get away from hearing anything about that, which is cool. Don't worry. It doesn't get mentioned again, because this was recorded before all of that happened. And we're letting you know, because there's quite a lot of chat in this episode about Joe's play that he's in. He was in to promote a play. And obviously, given the announcement

about avoiding theatres, etc., it's just a bit weird. But to be honest, a lot of this episode is a bit weird for various reasons. It's an absolutely belting episode, Hall of Fame, I'd say. You're really going to enjoy it. And I just want to reassure everyone who's worried that the pandemic is going to affect the podcast. It is not. We are very good boys who do our homework. We have recorded a lot in advance. The pandemic will not affect the dream restaurant. The dream restaurant does not count as a mass gathering or a social situation. So you are welcome anytime. With that, enjoy the episode. It's a great one. And if you're just dashing some humour, and then put that in a bowl, pop a white

tea towel over it, leave that to rise. You've got yourself the beginnings of a lovely podcast. Wonderful, Ed. Are you all right with that? Oh, I like it, Ed. I don't really cook bread. You're looked unsure when you were saying it, but I liked it. I enjoyed it. I'm getting back into the swing of them, James. But hey, the message remained clear throughout that intro. Welcome to Off Menu.

It's like it was yeast. It was like the humour was yeast. Yes. And the podcast was the dough. You're James A. Gamble? Yeah. You're James A. Caster. And then you've got to put the podcast in the oven as well. So I didn't think it through. But welcome. It's food-based, essentially, is what... Yeah, it's food-based. We asked, I guess, their favourite ever starter main course dessert, side dish and drink. It's food-based. Simple as that. We have a special guest every week in the Dream Restaurant. And this week, the special guest is Joe Thomas, a wonderful actor, comedian, writer.

Yes. You may recognise him from the in-between is from Taskmaster, from Fresh Meat, from many, many things. Well, how exciting. But hey, I like it. I'm sure. Listen, if he mentions our secret ingredient, I'm chucking him out of the restaurant. I know you will. Then the rules. So you do it one day. But hopefully not today.

Hopefully not today. But hey, if he mentions kidneys, he's out. Who wants kidneys? We're not in a war. I hate the texture of them. Horrible. Horrible texture. And you know, I like liver. See, liver's got a bad rap. I like liver. Not me.

There's a way of cooking liver nicely. Kidneys, always awful. Sorry. Always awful. And they look like kidneys. Yeah. Why would you want it? No, thank you. Kidneys is out on his lily ass. He is indeed. So let's hear the off-menu menu of...

Joe Thomas. Joe Thomas. Welcome, Joe. Thanks. To the Dream Restaurant. Oh. Thanks. Well, well...

Joe Thomas, welcome to the Dream Restaurant. That's the biggest pause you've left before you've emerged as a genie. I had to let all the fizz settle. There was a lot more fizz that time. Was there? There was a lot of fizz. And I wanted it all to settle before... I didn't know if Joe could hear me over the fizz. Yeah, actually, I couldn't...

It was just a white noise. Yeah, yeah. A lot of fizz and foam, actually. Yeah. There's not normally foam. What's happened? I just... You know... Phone party. Yeah. There's a phone party.

Speaking of the 90s. Yeah, before we started recording, you two were talking about university. Yeah. We got a uni, so I'm like, phone parties, right? Yeah. That's what uni is. That is basically what it was, yeah. I don't think I was too shy to go to a phone party.

A phone party. I wouldn't have got within a mile of a phone party. I mean, really. Yeah, the level of confidence needed to go to that was just mental. Like, I... Why are they a thing? I don't know. I mean...

Is it so people can just, like, all get off with each other in the phone? Yeah. Yeah, news, yeah. I mean, I... The idea that foam would immediately, to me, getting off with someone seems so wild. Yeah. I was like, no.

Absolutely. Absolutely not. Do people get, like, really, like, wet with the foam? Yeah. Like a wet t-shirt covered? I think there's probably... Is that what it is? There's probably a little bit of that as well.

As I say, the 90s. Yeah. Oh, that's funny. Yeah. But, yeah, I know. I didn't even know where you were meant to encounter them at phone parties. I guess they're advertised as phone parties, aren't they? Yeah.

They don't just have it as a real normal party, and then you get there in this phone. How did they... How was it arranged? Where'd you get the phone from? What is it... Yeah, you must find a certain place and go, we need a lot of phone.

We've got, like, this many freshers in, and we need enough foam to, kind of, like, douse them. Is it foam per fresher? Yeah, yeah. Which is 12.50 per head. Yeah. And that gets you this much detergent. If you have too much foam, they drown.

Yeah. Yeah. Or too much water and not enough bubbles. Because bubbles is air. Bubbles is air? Bubbles is air. Bubbles is air. And air is bubbles.

Okay, that's... I did a science degree. Yeah. And if there's one thing I'll really take away from my year at university. My year at university. It's the bubbles is air. That's what they say. Did you encounter Ed Gamble a lot at university?

Well, we were different universities, but very much we were in both in comedy and, you know... The Hutt student sketch scene. Yeah. Ed at Durham. Yeah. The Durham Review. Yeah.

You were at Cambridge. Cambridge. Footlights. Yeah, the footlights. And then the third... Better known. Well... Yeah.

Better known and more highly revered and respected. Well, I mean, not through our work, but possibly. Oh, no. But... Who was your footlights group? Me. Johnny Swede.

Simon Bird. Nick Mohammed. Nick Mohammed. Tom. Now Will. Sharp. Who wrote Flowers. Uh-huh.

Tierney Gosh. Who? I was just merely establishing that it was a lady, because until then I was like, what a sausage fest. Tierney is a lady. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

A sausage fest. Yeah, it was a bit of a sausage fest. And it was a bit of a shame, really. I mean, Ed's one was just like him and Nish, I think. Tom Neenan. Tom Neenan was there. Yeah. Jez.

Jez Sharp. No, you can't imagine us being cool, can you, James? No. But I remember... They were cool. Tom Williams, who was in Footlights, told me that the first time he saw all of us arrive, because we all had long hair and ripped jeans on,

he said it looked like we were in a band. Fucking hell. What? That is cool. Not the three of you. I've seen folks with the three of you, and you know how I constantly talk about what you, Nish and Tom, used to look like at university?

The three farmers from Fantastic Mr. Fox. So, imagine how do we be the Footlights' word, if we looked like we were in a band. We were very, very uncle, I think. There was a look. There was a way that people dressed that came, because I was like, this is so bad. Like, it was fleece and jeans.

Right. I was like, come on, guys. Come on. Blazer with everything as well. That was the other thing. Like, Blazer was somehow becoming in a sort of weird way. But like, I used to wear... Increasingly, my friend is now telling me

how poorly I was, how poorly I dressed at university. Here's one. A hoodie with a blazer over the top. That was a kind of... What? Oh, I remember that. You remember that? Just really bad.

None of this is big on the Ketrin scene. No. I mean, so, I mean, we were starting from a very lowly place in terms of, like, what's cool. But to be honest, I thought they were cool. We were the bad boys of the scenes. Yeah, we were the bad boys, yeah. And then the third group was Dublin, right?

Yeah, that was... I think that was just before I started the Dublin crew. But that was... Ashlyn B was in the Dublin sketch crew. And their thing was called H-Bam. H-Bam, yeah. Which stood for how babies are made. Correct.

But I don't know what that means, really, as a thing. Like, I don't... You don't need to do it. Why have they approached it? That's a very funny name. Well done. I like it. How are the footlights made?

I sketch comedy? I don't know. That's what they're implying. They're like, well, we're a sketch comedy group. We want to put it another way. The method by which babies are made. I really don't know... Like, it doesn't appear to be referential in any way

to the fact that they're a group. What's your footlights about? What's that name from? Well, that's from the 1890s or something. But I mean, the footlights are a type of light that you have at the front of the stage. Right. And it looks back on.

Hilarious. I'm not saying it's hilarious. The fucking light job. I don't want things to be funny. I want them to make sense. That's what I'm saying. I'm not. As long as they could be called any.

They could be called, like, the potatoes. That's fine. What? Oh, well, maybe not. But, like, you know, sometimes you get... What's that? You scan the stand-up nights that are called things like... What's the name of a stand-up night?

Like, um... Yeah. Surprisingly cheap? Is that one? Yeah, that's the... See, that's the self-referential. It's funny. It's like...

Here's our stand-up night. Or as I called it, it's surprisingly cheap. Funny. Here's the sketch night. Or as I called it, how babies are made. Just... I just don't know all that. And also they've turned it into a kind of...

Acronym as well. So it's like an even further level of, like... That's even better. Because people have to go, what's H-Band stand for? They'd be told, it's thanks to how babies are made. And then they're like,

What? Yeah, it's a funny reveal. It's funny. It's a bit funny. It's funny in the way... It's funny in the way that the band Biffy Cairo are funny. Because they used to have a band pen. That had Cliff Richard on it.

Which was known as the Cliffy Cairo. Yeah. And then they started calling it the Biffy Cairo. Yes. And so it's kind of like... Good fun. I didn't know that. That is funny.

I'd say it's... Cliffy Cairo. I'd say it's like... It's diverting. I mean, I'm not... You know, I'm not going to go out. H-Band. Well, it sounds like you're having a go.

I'm not sure they're going to go out. I'm not sure they're going concerned. I think you could... You could have been one of them. Yeah, well, I see what I've observed. I'm still living in... Moving and moved on. If you want to know your students' sketch copy,

then moved on and turned into a group called Los Albatros. Oh, okay. See, that's... You prefer that? Yeah, that's okay. You prefer it? I prefer that. Doesn't have anything to do with what they're doing, though.

It doesn't... I can't remember what that stands for, but it's a really long thing. There's something... A really long thing about... About how babies are made implies that it does have something to do with something. Whereas Los Albatros, obviously, is just a name that's been put across in a creative way, like it can be...

I think if you had... But then how babies are made is sex. So they're making out like what they're doing is akin to sex. That's how good their comedy is. I just thought I always assumed how babies are made, sex. That's funny. I think yes. I suppose sex is funny.

But... They could be doing it at a phone party. Yeah. Well, exactly. I suppose if you had a PR agency and it was called Los Albatros, I'd be like, yeah, okay, I get that. Like, who's doing your advertising campaign? These new cool kids.

Los Albatros. Fine. Who's your advertising company? How babies are made? Yes, whatever. It just isn't really... It's just not the name of anything. It's just...

What is changing what they are? That doesn't make a point. I'm just trying to... I'm trying to get a handle on... I'm just trying to get a handle on why it's irritating. I'm... The people that you guys all thought were cool weren't how babies are made. It was the Durham Review.

The Durham Review. It's a boring name. It is a bit... It's a cool... Apparently, you were cool. I thought they were. To the Hoodie Blazer Brigade. Yeah, we were cool.

The years before us, they were a bit disgusting, the Durham Review. Okay. They used to pride themselves on being disgusting. Disgusting. They used to play a game called... That's the food podcast we can talk about this. They used to play a game that are very proud of, called Upi Upi Tomato Tomato.

I don't know if you ever witnessed that happen. No. Upi Upi Tomato Tomato. Yeah, so... Is that jumping tomatoes at your arse? I mean, not far off, just pop round the front. What they do is they... One person would take a bite of a tomato

and rub it on their testicles. And then they throw it in the air and shout Upi Upi Tomato Tomato. And the next person had to catch it, take a bite and rub it on their balls and then throw it in the air. I'm sorry. I don't get...

I don't get the point of that game. But Joe absolutely loves it. Oh, I love it. Absolutely. He's gone from this... Oh, that sounds fantastic. He demands logic and sense in the world. Upi Upi Tomato Tomato.

And being absolutely in his element. Who's handling your PR this season? Upi Upi Tomato Tomato. Fine. But that's the PR again. Not all PR companies joke. Does it work as the name of PR company? If it does, it can be the name of something else.

Then you're right. If it doesn't, it can't be the name of anything. Okay, good. Fair enough. So if you had a PR company called The Beatles, would that be fine? That's so interesting. Okay.

Well, The Beatles is, yeah, I mean, actually, when you think about it, a appalling name. I mean, really, really appalling. It's because all the bands at that time were doing puns on the word beat. They were calling things on the Mersey Beats. And it took me... This doesn't matter.

But it took me realize... What? It took me years... to realize that it was a pun. What is... How do you... How do you win Upi Upi Tomato Tomato? I don't get it.

There's no winners. The longer it goes on, the more you'll eat it. Yeah, I think so. Oh, my God. So that's your start, are you covered? That's it. Upi Upi Tomato Tomato. Oh, yeah, you are.

All right. Now. In the footlights. Still spanking the planks? Still treading the boards? Very much so. And in other news, not only am I treading the boards,

but I'm also in a play. Oh! That's... Yes. Upi Upi Tomato Tomato? It's Upi Upi Tomato Tomato. It's funny. We've been talking a lot about how you don't like the names of all these things.

Yeah. But, you know... Wait a minute. What's the name of my play? I would ask you, Thomas. What's in a name? What's in a name? What is in a name?

Well... That's what it's called. That's the name of the play. That's what it's called. It's not my... People go, what's the play called? What's in a name? Well, I don't know.

Why are you being so funny? Can't you just tell me what the play's called? Yeah. Yeah, so it's what's in a name. And... It's... It is really funny. Yeah.

It's about names. It's about what names are called your... To be honest, I would say it is quite like sketch comedy. Like, it is kind of like... It begins as an argument about whether you can call your baby Adolf. Mm-hmm. Which would, you know... You wouldn't be out of place at a little sketch night.

That's a sort of idea for sketch, I don't think. And it kind of carries on from there. I mean, it is genuine. It's quite short. So that's a tic. That's a tic. That's what I'm concerned about. This is Joe.

I know what people think of the theatre. They think, oh, for fuck's sake. I don't want to go and see that. It's so boring. It's the waste of an evening. I can't go for dinner. I'd rather watch television. What I'm saying is this is a bit like television

because it's genuinely funny and a bit like sketch comedy. And it's short. Yeah. And it's got people in it who have been on the television. So you can be a bit like it is a bit like television after all. Who's the rest of the cast? Okay, two of them are dropped out. Yeah.

Yeah. Great. Okay. Should we do them? Yeah. He's dropped out. Laura Patch, she's in Afterlife. It's really funny.

Yeah, yeah. Bit of a plug for that. Yeah. Still in Afterlife. No longer in my play. Yeah. Summer's Shallown. Yeah.

Still a big West End star. No longer in my play. Yeah. Yeah. Bo Porre in Miranda. Okay. Still in the play. Well done, Bo.

Joe Thomas. That's you. In-betweeners, etc. Yeah. Still in the play. Yes. Why are you in the in-betweeners? Don't mind a bit of it, mate.

Pretty cool. Yeah. Would you encourage people? You probably rarely get people shouting catchphrases to you from the show. Hardly ever. Hardly ever. Hardly ever. Is that what you'd like?

That's what I'd like. Yeah. Pre and during and after the show? That's what I'd like. And if they could never call me Joe. Yeah. Never call me Joe. Only call me Simon.

I wanted to lose my sense of who I am. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Congrats. That's, that's, I doesn't, you know, it doesn't matter. Yeah. It doesn't matter what they call you. No, I have this idea of who I was. Sorry.

It doesn't matter. I'm someone else now in everyone else's eyes. Yeah. So just go with that. Cool. And where's the play on, Joe? I was going to, and I was going to say Alex Gomond, who again, Big West 10 Stars. Alex and Summer, Big West 10 Stars.

As I say, some are not in it anymore. Yeah. Sure. Me, Beau, Laura, three big TV stars. Laura not in it anymore. Yeah. It is honestly really funny. And I know, I just want to say that because I know that a lot of people think the plays

are shit and they're not funny. Sure. And this play actually, not everyone thinks that. And in a way it's weird that I should suggest that that is a prevailing opinion. I've never heard a promo contain the word honestly so many times before. So it's short, not shit, and has got the remnants of a really excellent cast. So you've done 60. 60 performances already.

Already. At what point did the two people drop out? They dropped out after 60. 60, yeah. So yeah, that's fine. So you don't know... Yeah. I mean, it's a recasting.

It's an extension of a tour. Yes. Because it was successful. This is going to need some editing, to be honest. Still on sparkling water, Joe? Sparkling. Sparkling water. Pop it up to our bread!

Pop it up to our bread, Joe! Pop it up to our bread! Bread, please. Why? It's more versatile. I haven't made Indian choices. So I just... I understand about...

Pop it up. They already know. I mean, do you want to say, oh, lovely. But I just think it's a bit bonkers having at the beginning of a meal that isn't, you know, an Indian meal. So I... I... Much as I am with you on, you know, always offering them, I would say.

I would say, pop bread. What? Oh, bread. What type of bread, Joe? I quite like... Almost like quite sweet, cakey bread. Okay. Like that really dark bread.

There's almost maybe got a bit of mulch in it or something. That's really nice. Like a dark rye bread or something. A rye bread, but with a bit of... Almost with a bit of sweetness in it as well. And the other one I love is a chia batter. Just that one with all the oil. That's like salty.

That's lovely. And also, I have to say, I genuinely... This is... I've for a long time said of these two things. My favorite food is butter. And my favorite taste is salt. Yes. And I think there was a Netflix show recently called Salt Fat Acid Heat.

Which is basically saying that I'm right on two of those things. And the only reason I'm not right on the other two is because I haven't bothered to turn my mind to those other two categories yet. Yeah. Salt. Fat. Bosh. So I was right. And that was one of the few things that I left university being like, I know that.

That's something I know. That you like butter. I love butter. So with bread, the reason I would say bread is really an opportunity to eat a lot of butter. Sure. And I think that I don't think we'll ever see butter disappear completely. Because I just think it's just too good. It's too damn nice.

Yeah. Do you feel the same about other sort of dairy products? Do you think butter is the king of the dairy? Because I think... More vegan. I think milk's on the way out. I think milk is on the way out. Also, I know quite a lot of vegetarians are quite vegan.

I drank a pint of milk last night. Did you? Yeah. Oh, just a pint of milk for me then. I remember it was in the fridge. Men's all night. I'd forgotten it was in the fridge. That is a lot of pint of milk.

Yeah. Yeah. Drank the whole thing. Well, in one go. You're down now. Well, here's the thing. It was actually a two-pinter and it was half full. That's how I know.

Okay. And I thought I'd polish this off. I don't know. Yeah, I think milk is on the way out. I also think... I know quite a lot of vegetarians and vegans. And I'm still a completely like unenlightened carnivore, basically. But me, I've started eating a lot less meat.

I got that Otolenghi book. Yeah. That he uses yoga all the time, eggs. I just don't miss it. I can see me not having meat. I really can see me not having meat. Cheese, I think, is a problem area. I know vegan cheese has got a lot better.

Probably butter is the king of dairy. I do that because you can't... It's the base for other things. You don't... Why is ground wood egg so nice? Butter. Yeah. Why even something random snails?

Why is snail so nice? Butter, basically. Why is roast chicken nice? Because you put that fucking butter under the breast, didn't you? Yeah. Didn't you... Joe? Is that to you?

You said that to yourself. That's best of me. Yeah. Fiddly self-hating attitude. So when you're cooking a roast chicken, you say... I know. You'll say, why is that so nice? Yeah, I go.

Because you put butter under the breast, didn't you, Joe? Yeah, I go. Why did you say that? I mean, what was... I go, I see you. Yes. Don't try and seduce me. Yes.

Is that you've seen yourself in the oven door there? I saw myself in the oven door. Wait, when you said, why is that chicken tail size? Because you put a bunch of butter under the breast, didn't you? Yeah. I think, who's the addressing? Yeah. And then you seem to think...

There was a look in your face, it was like, oh, no. I've not done this properly. I think it's the third party addressing me. I think that's the truth. It's somebody... It's some kind of... So you're playing a character. Pure, puritan, somebody saying, you little fucker.

You little fucker. Like, disgusting little worm. Disgusting little fucker. Eating just butter, is it? Yeah. Yeah. That'll be good for you. Your regret tomorrow?

I don't know. I have to say, I think I mean skin. Under the skin. On top of the breast. On top of the breast. Under the skin. That's nice. Yeah, not under the breast.

Not under the breast. On the carpet. Yeah, under the breast. That's just... On the bone. That's just, yeah. Over the breast. Butter in the bones.

Under the... Butter the bones? Could you... I tell you what, I wouldn't put it past butter to even improve bones. Yeah. I wouldn't... I think there is a guy who can do anything. For your bread course, do you even want bread?

Or do you just bring out loads of butter? Yeah, frankly, I mean, that's a good question. Have you ever eaten straight butter? No, but I've got to the point where I've had a cheese where I've been like, that's so close to butter. You know, if you'd have said to me, upon bringing out some butter, here's a new cheese,

I would have said, yeah, that's fine, probably. So yeah, I mean, I think... I think just eating butter on its own is, that's getting a little bit too weird. Mm-hmm. There's something prurient and perverse about that. But if it was like... If someone stood ahead in this room now,

it was like, the world's going to end in five minutes. Oh, I see. No, to be honest, I... Would you just eat a lot of butter if we had it? I think what I will do is put an amount of butter onto a crumpet or toast that is just way too high. But I mean, I really don't think there's an upper limit to how much... But I do that.

Like, if behind closed doors... I'm slamming on huge pats of butter. Like, there's no... It's also... I mean, I think if you... To go to a Michelin-starred restaurant, I think a lot of the secret of that is just to put a lot of butter with everything.

Yeah, butter is the key in there. You can see it just everywhere. Just like, why is that meat so nice? Butter. So, I mean, I could go on. Who's saying that to who? Butter. Okay.

Joe. When you said crumpets, then, it made me just think how much I think, for me, my favourite thing to have butter on is crumpets. I think I would rather have crumpets than bread. How do you like that, Ed? I think I... You have your choice.

Fine. But here's why I don't think a crumpet is a good thing to put butter on, because it leeches butter. It does leech butter. It wastes butter. It goes straight through. It goes straight through.

And then you've got to pull the butter on the plate. But I think it's almost a kind of in-built, like, you're never going to kill yourself, because it will get rid of any butter it can't hold. It will reach saturation point. And then the bit beyond that is... Oh, do you think it's like... I think that's why they're designed like that.

I think it's an in-built. So, it's like when, you know, when you have a barocca, and what it does is it puts your calcium levels up to the highest they can be, and then you piss on the rest of it. And your vitamin Cs, yeah. So, if you have a vitamin C tablet, it gives you, like, ten times as much vitamin C as you need. But you just...

And you just piss it all out. Like, you're... So, the crumpet is the kidney. There's a kidney among breads. If I may. You can have a crumpet if you want in the dream restaurant as your bread. To be honest, the problem with this is that I know...

I have, honestly, I've had this conversation many times, my dream meal. And the problem is, it's like, I take... I do take food very seriously. And I've tried to make my choices, you know, diversionally amusing. But the truth is, there is another whole side where I would just take it incredibly seriously.

And be like, well, no, I'm not going to fuck around. Just... And I would just bosh it out. But I mean, I think... Crumpet is one thing that hadn't... I mean, breakfast I over... The point is, you overlook breakfast as well when you say, like, final meal.

I suppose some people might have said, an English breakfast. Have you ever had that? You had breakfast as well? Yeah, Jess Phillips did breakfast for dinner. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So, I mean, within that, I mean, there are, you know... There's a multiplicity of options.

And with a crumpet, another thing I would recommend is that... And I mean, this is something that I discussed with my partner recently where she said, it's just like a big blini, isn't it? And I was like, you know, my God, darling, you're right. And as a result of that... I would argue a blini is a mini crumpet. Yeah, okay.

But a really nice thing to have on a crumpet. And this is something you might like for breakfast anyway. You know, cream cheese and salmon. Yes. Have that on a fucking crumpet, mate. Have that on a fucking crumpet. Yeah, absolutely, yeah, yeah. Jesus Christ.

Yeah. Come on! Yeah, yeah. Have the cream cheese and salmon on a crumpet. Come on! Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I mean, for fuck's sake, do you want me to hold your fucking hand? Yeah, yeah.

Don't shit yourself. Have on a fucking crumpet. Yeah. What are you scared? What is going to fucking happen? Yeah. We need to narrow down this bread course, Joe. So you're having bread?

Chew your batter. Chew your batter. I'll have the batter as well, thanks, despite the oil. Yeah, okay, yeah, fine. I have the dark, multi-rye bread, and I'll have... Why not? A lovely, just a springy, classic white doughy bread. There you go.

All in a little basket with the batter there. All in a little basket, please. So we come to your starter. Okay, so I'm going to sub this in, if I may. I don't know what I'm allowed to. You know, in Italian restaurants, you get premium secondi. I never do that. I don't know.

Okay, what's really... Whenever a British person goes to an Italian restaurant, they never have any of the secondi. They never have a secondo, if I may. And also, at this point, I'd say, I have a friend who... You know, when you go to a cafe in Iro, and you get a panini. What?

Panini's plural, mate. You get a panino. Okay? So that's just for my mate who told me that, and I just think that's never really got enough credit. I don't know. It's not that fucking hard to say. It's not that fucking hard.

If you get a cafe in Iro, do you think they can have a panino? Yeah, I do. You do, you say it. Yeah, and if... A great panino? Yeah. How does that go down? They...

I think they respect me. Yeah. I think so, too. So in an Italian restaurant, a premium secondi, they'd be like starters and then like... No, no, no. Yeah, so exactly. So to Brit, you know, pasta's a meal.

And rightly so. But in Italian restaurants, they always want you to have a pasta first, and then something else. Veal, which no one ever gets. But if this really is my last meal, I mean... No, this is very... We've never implied it's your last meal. Okay.

I think I'm muddling it up with another conversation I had. Sure, sure. That's fine. She's... Is that understandable? Yeah. It is. Yeah.

No, it is. We're not your last meal. And maybe even in that, it wasn't my last meal. Well, let's say that it's my... It's my last meal. And for the purposes of introducing a dish that means something to me, I'm going to go for pasta as a starter pasta. I love it.

And you know, this is boring. This is boring. But I am just going to say, because I've had... If you added together all the times I've had this meal, it would be the same number as every other type of meal I've had added together. The name of that meal... Spaghetti with an Ace. When I left university and I lived with Simon Bird and Johnny Sweet,

happy years of my life, I don't know why that had to end. I don't know why that had to end. Yeah. Yes, they've got wives and children. Why can't we all still live in Lambeth Mill together? I love that. Yeah. I fucking...

I love those. Those two have started the company together? Yeah. Yeah, they're still. Yeah, etc. and so on. Oh, they're still close. Yeah. What happened to the spaghetti with an Ace, boys?

Boys? That gang. Why does anything have to change? Yeah. Why is the 90s four decades ago? Yeah. No, it's not. It's not, is it?

No. Not really. It actually isn't, to be fair. I mean, it's... Yeah. Don't let us disrupt your life. Yeah. Why?

It's not. It's 20 something. You know, it's like it's 20... Within 21 years, in other direction... Well, only in one direction. It's 2020 now. It is, isn't it? Yeah.

So how many years do you have to go back? 20. It's 20, isn't it? Don't help him. Well, that counts also. The year 2000 was a year. It depends what... The year 2000...

2001, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009. So by the end of 2009, that's 10 years since the millennium. By the end of 2019, that's 20 years since the millennium. So yeah, that makes sense, yeah. So now we're now in 20 years. Yeah, so it's... 20 years, plus whatever we've had of this year, a plus. However, far back you want to go into the 90s.

Just one day. You're in the 90s. You're in the 90s. Just one day back. One day back. New Year's Eve. Well, yeah, beginning of New Year's Eve. It's the morning of December 31st, 1999.

Yeah. Is that when you would like the meal to be set? I wouldn't mind the meal. I mean, my food for me is about, you know, specific... Well, actually, is it? No. I mean, well, no, there's two... Obviously.

Like... I've never met you before, Joe. You are. I didn't know you'd not met Joe before. It's an absolute mess. If I'd known you'd not met Joe before, I would have been so excited for this meeting. But I'm so happy watching it all.

I'm not having fun on a very nice time. There was a nostalgia to the period of my life where... I mean, when I lived with Simon and Johnny, we lived in a flat in Lambert North, in London, years which, as I say, I don't believe ever had to win. We would have... So, we'd get Ronay's four nights a week, two nights a week, we'd have to get to Carbonara,

and then on the seventh night, we'd have bangers and mash. And then, in addition to that, we would have, I think, basically, every night, two bottles of red wine for a fiver. I don't know, it was for tenor. It was a fiver. But anyway, it was perfectly serviceable, like Valpolicella, like, plonk.

So, we'd get, like, fairly hammered every night and eat this vast meal of some of Ronay's. And I basically think that was... That was, like, a glorious... It was just a glorious thing. Like, it would just be the whole... It would all be, like, sweating. I mean, the thing where you just go to the point in the meal,

where you're just, like... Kind of can't even really speak anymore. Every night. Pretty much every night. It was, uh... It was, uh... Yeah, like, um... I mean, it was just, you know,

that was... That's how you should eat. It's amazing how the young body can handle pastures. You can just complete... You can just handle it. You just burn to it. I used to eat pans and pans of pasta. I couldn't eat a bowl of pasta now without feeling it

in the next two days. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Fill it straight away. Yeah. So, spaghetti bolognese to start. Made by your unfair hand? I would say probably made by me, yeah. Were you the bolognese king?

I was, yeah. I mean, I would never order a spaghetti bolognese because I know that I can make it to within, like, I don't know, a percentile of... I mean, normally it's worse if I order it. Normally it's worse than what I can do. And even if it's a tiny bit better, I'm like, well, there are many things that, you know,

this chef could do much better than I can do. This is the only thing. You've got him on that. Yeah, I've got him. So, it's the only thing that I... And so, I suppose, like, yeah, I would... I guess I would make... I mean, I should say I like cooking.

So, I suppose if I was to have a dream meal, I might be maybe involved in the cooking as well. Were you the cook out of the three? Oh, very much so. I was the cook. I can't imagine. I was the cook. Did you do the carbonara and the bangers-on-mash as well?

I did all that. The carbonara and the bangers-on-mash, yeah. I did... So, the reason why the menu was just those three things over and over again? It was your decision. It was up to me, yeah. I think the reason they moved out is because, like...

I think Johnny was genuinely worried about, like, heart stuff and, like, sort of... I mean, it was actually like, we can't go on eating like this. We can't... You can't do this. Like, he'd changed physically. He went back to his family.

They were like, you've physically changed. And he was like, it's Joe. I will say this as well. Here's maybe where Johnny was... This might explain some of Johnny's worries. By the end of that period living in the house,

the bolognese also contained as one of his ingredients cream. So... Which I liked because I think... I think I... I think I remember that when I was a kid, we used to have bolognese made for us by, like... An ice cream man. By some friends of our family.

And I think that had cream in it. I just think it did. It turned... It turns it a kind of duskier brown. And it makes it smoother and a bit milder. And actually, tomatoes do have... Tomatoes need a bit of balancing. Quite often in a tomato dish,

it will tell you to add sugar. That's... We mentioned Ottolenghi. There's often a bit of sugar in there, or something sweet. Just tomato... It's quite acidic. It's quite...

It's quite a kind of high acidity flavor. So you do want something sometimes to mellow out a bit. We all know that bolognese often has a tiny bit of sugar in it. Or something sweet. Should it also have cream in? Yes. Yeah. So you would like your starter to be your cream of bolognese?

For Ottolenghi. Obviously a small portion, a primo portion. Primo, primo. Primo, primo, bolognese. Yeah. Weirdly made by me. Made by you. Yeah.

And we're back in... The year is... 99? No, I'm not... I'm not that old. I'm not quite that old. But I guess... 2006, 2007.

I suppose what I'm really referring to is the long 90s. The era that maybe we would say came to an end with the financial... Pre-financial crash. Pre-financial crash. There was still... I feel like there was an era where it was just generally a more hedonistic era. Okay.

Which I think is now definitely fucking over. No one's creaming their bolognese. No one's creaming their bolognese now. They're not even making bolognese. Which is fine, because to be fair, I'm aware that the meat thing is a bit of a disaster. I think, you know, probably stop burning down the Amazon and then blaming it on Leonardo DiCaprio, I guess.

Primo, please. That's also addressed to me. I mean, I guess we're going to ask you what your main course is now. Yeah, probably just for the reasons of time. Yeah, but... I'm enjoying this. I do, I do... To be honest, I don't...

I've just been quite often on my own. So, I mean, it's just nice to see you guys. That's why the main person you addressed is yourself, I don't know. Yeah, it's had a bit of an impact. Yeah. That's why I've seen you have split myself into a sort of interrogator and interrogating. Main course, right. This is another meat option.

This is also a dish that I'm going to prepare. Okay. And it's something that I call 24-hour lamb. 24-hour lamb. And this is a lamb that you cook by burying it with a fire in a hole. Burying it with a fire in a hole. Initially with a fire. So, it's in there with the fire.

Okay. You light a fire. Yep. You put the lamb in. Yes. Okay. Then you bury it. Great.

Okay. Basically, that's how you do it. Now, I did this about 10 years ago. There was one summer where I was living with my parents and I sort of weirdly became really just really genuinely quite good friends with one of the local dads that is in the village. So, he was like my mate's dad. He's called Neil. But it was a bit like that's my mate Neil.

So, I suppose he was about 50. I was about 25. But it was a nice, there was nothing, you know, I wasn't like a toy boy. Yeah. It was a perfectly lovely friendship. Just friends with your mate's dad. Just friends with your mate's dad. And I remain friends with Neil now.

Friends with your mate's dad. Not as weird as being in love with someone. No. No. Which would be quite nice actually. Yeah. Just completely mates with your mate's dad. So, basically, he'd wanted to do this for a while.

And I'd seen, or at least whose idea was it? It was perhaps even my idea. But I remember seeing a program on television. I just started to laugh because I'm just remembering that this story is clearly building towards you and your mate's dad digging a hole in the garden and cooking a lamb in it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It was, as I say, you know, in fact it wasn't the summer, it was Christmas time. Because we went to, it was some sort of romantic time of year.

Yeah. I'd seen a program on television that was called Willy's Perfect Chocolate Christmas. Now, the thing is, in which this lamb thing had been done, now the thing is, it wasn't really a recipe program. What's Willy's Perfect Chocolate Christmas? I'll tell you what it was like. It was like, you know, Kirstie, Kirstie's Christmas, you know, feeling Kirstie, you do all the property stuff.

She does programs at Christmas where it's like, it's a bit of cookery, but it's not really like, it's not really a cookery, they're not that specific about the recipes. It's more like tips and at the same time it's like, her just like making a house look nice and like making decorations. Decorations. So, it was, the recipe was at sort of that level of distance from like, specifically what he was actually doing. And also I kind of, it was one of those programs that you kind of like catch where I was like,

oh yeah, I think he, I think he was doing something like, and sort of this is me, so Neil now. Yeah. He dug a pit, he put a fire in it, and then he got a load of hay that he'd kind of, kind of made a bit damp. Yeah. And he put that on top of the fire, so the fire wasn't too harsh. Then he put the lamb, which I think he'd seasoned or something, I remember them putting

some herbs and stuff in. Again, I'd sort of seen it. I was like, I don't, what's that? It could be rosemary. It could be anything. Yeah. And in a way, it's not really, I bet it's about Willie's family, really. Yeah.

So, who's Willie? Well, okay. So, this is the thing. So, having watched this program, I really identified with Willie. Yeah. And for some reason I was like, I think I'm, I'm a sort of Willie. Yeah, you're a Willie type. I'm a Willie figure.

Yeah. Yeah. Like, I'm, I'm, I'm a guy like that. I'm a guy. Who is he? I'm an affable guy. Yeah. Okay.

He was a guy who I think this might be totally wrong. I think he might have been a sort of chocolate entrepreneur. I think he might have owned, you know, he might. So, will you please Google Willie's perfect chocolate? Willie's perfect chocolate. I think what you'll find is that he set up. Kick this out, sir. He set up.

The point is, he was a nice guy. Yeah. And he was having a big party for his friends and family. And also, does it even exist? Willie hardcore coups. Yeah. There you go. Here it is.

It's about the show. Chocolate enthusiast Willie hardcore coups is back to show everyone that when it comes to chocolate, consumers deserve the best. Yeah. And doesn't say anything about lamb here. Well, and when it comes to lamb, some people deserve a standard of lamb. Anyway, so basically firing the whole down pay lamb seasoned in a Hessian sack on top of that.

Fill it in. Everyone basically. In fact, so we actually, that is done the night before the next day, 24 hours later, people are starting to arrive. There's a lot of anticipation. And Willie, who's like an eccentric, but like, he's like, Oh, what's he done now? This is, um, yeah, this is mental. And his wife was like, Oh, there was a bit.

So the neighbors call the police because they're like, I was disposing of a body. So I was like, that's cool. So he's like a cookie, cookie, cookie call guy. Yeah. And, um, yeah. And then the neighbors came around and basically the lamb was dug up. It was quite sort of triumphant. Um, and it was, um, I'm almost certain the phrase falling off the bone would have been

used and this, like it was fucking nice. Basically it was fucking nice. It looked nice. It looked nice. It looked nice. Was it actually nice? No way of knowing. Was that the focus of the show?

No. Did he really tell you how to do it? No. Had I briefly caught part of that show? Yes. Did I know Neil? Yes. Did Neil's sister live on a farm and could get us a lamb?

Yes. Did we drive to the farm? Yes. Was it snow when we drove to the farm? Yes. It was that night. It was about 2009. Uh-huh.

2009. Yeah. Three decades ago, if we're using that fucking football podcast, Brute Brick. Yeah. I mean, don't get too excited about it. You're the one who introduced that. Well, I just think it's bollocks. I mean, I just, it's not, the nineties is not four decades ago.

It's just over two decades ago. Yeah. We'll start with that. It's just it's stupid. It's like it's a stupid tricksy thing to go. It's like somebody going to be like next year, your turn 38. You don't need to say that. Okay.

I know it's true. That's not the fact. I'm 36 now. Sure. Okay. So you're basically, you're just getting another year. Yeah. Yeah.

And then you can enter. You're using a year and a different price. Yeah. Yes. Exactly. Yes. Exactly. Thank you.

You're using a year as a marker rather than a password. Exactly. You're saying, yeah. There's a point of the year that comes after this one, numerically, where you'll actually be two years older. People might think you're two years older than you are now. Even that isn't true. Sure.

Okay. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, decades and time and age doesn't matter. You can have it with a 50 year old man. Yeah. Yeah. Well, as I say, the point is, as I say, are you, you know, are you 50?

Yes. Good. Do I know your son? Yes. Do you want to be mates with the son? No. Only mates with you. How was your son?

My age? Yeah. I still would choose you. You chose him. I chose him. I didn't know it was a choice situation. Yeah. Place and advert.

I didn't. He's genuinely, like, genuinely a good man. A good man. Yeah. And basically, anyway, so we drove. So it was, it was, it was, it was this snowstorm. It was like, you know, it was a year, it was probably 2009. It was snowing so badly that the rate we were moving at, this was the year where I don't

remember, like people were having to like overnight in their cars because they were getting stuck even on quite big roads like the M2. Yeah. For example. For example. It's the biggest road I can think of. Yeah. Can't think of one bigger than that.

If you don't know what a big road is and me saying like the M2 also hasn't helped you, I'm just going to, just going to have to not understand that. Sure. Okay. Fine. We were driving to Neil's sister's farm. Just you. The way we would go.

So it was just you. There was me, Neil. And also a 50 year old man. I was like, he's, I think, I think his daughter. Yeah. And also maybe her mate. How many of the people in the car have been briefed and told about Willie's perfect chocolate dress?

Neil. One Neil. Yeah. Neil, Neil. The other two hadn't had that in place. Yeah. The other two were, I think they're both there. Anyway.

So you got the lamb as well? We got the lamb. So this was a fucking mission. So basically we were moving at the speed that, because it was so snowy. We were moving at the speed that like Henry VIII moves out in Wolf Hall when he's like on horseback. So like we got from Essex to Milton Keynes in about like five or six hours. Like it was a day's, it was like a day's ride.

Yeah. But you know, Wolf Hall where it's like after a hard day's riding, they made it from Kent up to London. I don't know what you're on about. I don't know what Wolf Hall is. Oh, not interested in the Booker Prize. Okay. Your reference points are all over the place, Joe.

We've had the Premier League, Wolf Hall and Willie's perfect chocolate Christmas. But also as I've established, I'm only addressing myself. Yeah. So I know, I know. So basically we were going at kind of medieval pace, the pace where you'd have to stop to like get fresh horses. Yeah. So that added an element to it that for me made it better.

You love that. Time with Neil basically. Yeah. More time with Neil. Time with your best mate. Yeah. Your best friend. Got there.

Got the lamb. Point is about lamb is that, it's not really a lamb, it's a massive dead young sheep. Yes. Okay. It's in the back of the car. Did it smell? Yes. What did it smell of?

Blood. Yeah. Did it kick up a bit? Yes. I can't remember whether it was... We overnighted. I'm going to keep using the verb overnight. We overnighted at his sister's farm.

Then we drove back the next day. I think it was probably a bit of an easier journey back. Now it came to bury the lamb. The garden we chose to bury it in was not my parents' back garden. Garden? We buried it in a garden. In a garden. I thought you were doing it on the farm.

No, no. Because the point is about Willie, he's a village character. So we had to come back to our village so we could invite... Well, you had to be like Willie. Yes. You couldn't just eat the lamb. You wanted the party like Willie. I mainly wanted to be like Willie.

I wanted the party like... I would act like it's 1999. But I'm Willie and it's 1999. Yeah. You don't just want to eat this. You see it go on the farm. It's not really about the food. It's not really about...

It turns out I'm more interested in preparing food for other people, actually, if we... It's about the display. It's about the display. It's about me having friends near. So whose garden did you bury it in? We buried it in the... So as I say, not my back garden, not the back garden house that Neil, he was literally a homeowner, lived in, but just the back garden of one of the other local mums who was like

known to be a bit of a soft touch. Like she was the mum where whenever there was a party with like... When we were at school where it was just like 20 adolescent boys, no girls, which was the only party I ever went to. It was always at her house because it was like... You don't even need to make a comparison. I think we all know the old phrase. Yeah.

You know her. She'd let you bury a lamb in her back garden. Yeah. Exactly. Exactly. So I'm a 50 year old man and his child friend buried a lamb in her back garden because they saw Willie's perfect child at Christmas. So basically we...

I could see... I mean, when we arrived with the lamb, I think we were basically late with the lamb because of the snow. We got there. My brother was there. Giles was there. Giles is the son of the woman who was like... His mum was like...

Soft touch. Soft touch. Soft touch. He was... Yeah. Soft touch. Yeah. So they're there ready to help you bury the lamb.

So Greg and Giles is there and we arrive and the fire's lit. The pit is ready. So they've done quite a lot of that for you. They've done quite a lot. They've dug the pit for us. They've dug the pit for us. Willie would dig his own pit. I was a bit too honest.

I wasn't great. I was pissed off. I wanted to dig the pit as well. I wanted to... I was... Because we were late backwards from the snow and everything. And like... They dug the pit.

They lit the fire and then they were putting that hay on. It seemed a bit wet, but there was a steam coming up. But as they put that in, then we put the lamb in. Buried it. In a sack? I think we did have a hessie and sack. I think we genuinely had a hessie and sack. And it...

You know, we put bits of rosemary in it and all the rest of it. Garlic. Yeah. I mean... Just definitely would have done. Yeah. Um... Fucking definitely.

Yeah. Um... Buried it. Came out the next day. Uh... So now there's, um... Giles' mum. Soft touch.

Soft touch is there. Soft touch is there. Soft touch lamb lovie. Yeah. Um... My mum's there. Neil's wife is there. Probably thinking Neil's spending a bit too much time with...

Yeah. With these young friends. With these young friends. Um... My dad's there. You're jealous of Neil's wife, of course. Yeah. I'm like, what the fuck is she doing here?

Why aren't you standing next to me? I thought this was a pass. Yeah. Why are you standing next to her? Why are you standing next to her at the lamb funeral? Yeah. Sorry. What's this conversation about?

Yeah. Sorry. No, I don't mean to butt in. Just what you're talking about. Yeah. Um... Veg has been prepared. Roasted veg.

Yeah. A lot of anticipation. I am basically like, I'm Willy. And we go. I can't see, like, obvious smoke or steam. But, like, it's fine. We dig it up. Peel about the Hessian sacking.

It's exactly the same. It's exactly... It's just raw. I mean, it's exactly the fucking same. It's just, like, hasn't changed. It hasn't changed. So anyway, we, um... We...

We get it out. Neil is in pieces. Neil's just literally, like, we get it back into Elaine's kitchen. We're... Sorry, Elaine is soft touch. Soft touch, yeah. Yeah. So I come in a way.

I was like, I won't use a name. But then in a way, we just start calling her soft touch. Anyway, I think Elaine won't mind. So, like, weirdly, Elaine's also a vet, which is odd. So it was weird having this thing on the table. Yeah, yeah. This dead animal. What I would say is that what's the difference between the lamb we got from the farm and the

lamb that we now dug up? I'll tell you the difference. Bits of the lamb we've now dug up literally stink of shit. That is the difference between the lamb. So basically, in hindsight, there's three things I would suggest. First of all, when they put the hay on, I was like, that hay isn't damp. That's, like, what you'd put on a fire to put it out. It was just sweat hay.

So you just put the fire out. Essentially, dug a fire, put it out. Essentially, it was like, how do you raise the chicken? Turn the oven on. Heat up the oven to 200. Actually, it'd probably 180. Turn the oven off, put the chicken in. That was basically what had happened.

Fire put out, lamb buried. Two other facts. Soft touch. Told us that either the night before or maybe the following morning, quite a lot of the local squirrels and local pigeons had been just on the area immediately above the lamb being like, there's something going on here. What is it? There's something near that we're interested in.

What is it? There's food somewhere. What is it? And then the third fact, I'd say, is that when we dug it up, one of Neil's sons said, it smells like museums. Which, I assume, means it smells like a mummy. It smells bad. It smells bad.

Does Neil also then say, Dad, please come home? Dad, please come home. Have you finished hanging out with the Thomas boy now? He said, first of all, Dad, I'm glad you're still alive. Can you just, we just want to know that you're safe. So is that your main course? That's the main course. A better version of that.

Is there a version of that that worked? Made by Willie? Well, surely Willie's one. OK, Willie's making it. Willie's making it. You saw Willie's one. You know what? We can't have your lamb zombie as well.

No, we can't. You can't have something that literally stinks of shit, probably. Yeah. So, main course, roast lamb. 24 hour lamb. Long story short, you want a roast lamb? Make sure. Side dish.

Ideally, in three to four words. I did have some problems with this, but I'm just going to say this because I think this is an und... I don't understand why people don't cook this for themselves more. It's really nice. Celeriac mash or cream celeriac. Why don't people make that for themselves? OK.

It's fucking nice. Yeah. It's not you can't get celeriac. It's right there. Yeah. I think it's a very ugly vegetable and people find it quite threatening. Yeah, it is a bit ugly.

But, I mean... I took in a soup, the other day, I made a celeriac and parsnip soup. I think it's bloody nice. And also, celery, to which it's sort of distantly related, is a good seasoning, famously in your kind of... What's the base of Italian sauces

where you have carrot, et cetera? Onion. What's the five? The five thing. Onion, leek. Garlic, celery, carrot. Is that it? I think that's it.

That tends to make up the... It's a frito. I think that's what I mean. Sometimes it's three. Sometimes it's five. Celery is always in there. I think people overlook it. Celery, salt as well.

Why are we putting this with salt if it's not an interesting flavour? Answer. Because it is an interesting flavour. Joe. Joe. Joe. Joe.

Yeah. Celery, an opportunity to get basically a vegetable that's already got its own interesting seasoning. You probably would silver some butter with it and some salt. As we know from that Netflix series, fat and salt are often at the cornerstone of almost anything.

Mm-hmm. But yeah, that's all I'd say. I'm sorry, it's less imaginative. No, no, no, no, no, no, no. Is it made by yourself? It's made by... I'm not gonna... When actually, I've insisted that people should make them

So I would make it myself, yeah, so I'm making it all myself. I'm not making the bread. No, Willie's making the lamb. Willie's making the lamb. So he's bread first butter, I'm making Spag Bowl, Willie's making the lamb. You're making the slag, man. I'm making the slag, man.

I forgot about the Spag Bowl. I know it's because it was about four hours ago. Your drink. Okay, again, unimaginative, but I think probably just a big, gouty red wine. Yeah. A gouty red wine. Something where out of the people would go,

that's a bit much that. Like that tastes like blood. That's what I want. I want the red wine that a vampire would drink. You want the red wine to taste like the lamb's melt in the boot. Yes, exactly, exactly. I want to get, though I want to drink the red wine

that a vampire would drink if he was having like blood with drool symptoms and just needed something to stop him twitching. So like a very, like a heavy, high alcohol. Yeah, 15% even. Yeah, like a Barolo or something, a heavy Italian wine. Yeah, like a heavy Italian would be great, something like that.

In fact, a Barolo is often a medium body, but I mean, I almost, I actually think, I probably, I might go for a Bordeaux to be honest, but basically just something that tastes like blood, basically. So is anyone else just replaying the lamb story in their head? I'm imagining.

So I was thinking about some, even though you gave us so many details and so much I don't understand. Yeah, yeah. For some reason in my head now, the whole meal's being cooked underground. Yeah. The spaghetti bolognese is under there.

Is it the wine underground? The wine could be underground, yeah. So, it's been an emotional journey. We now arrive at your dessert. Yeah. Are you big on desserts, big on sweets? Okay, I have to say, I'm actually not massively into desserts.

Yes. And I know that this is a prickly area. To me, you're hungriest when you have the starter. I'm not sure you've heard all this. You're hungriest when you have the starter. Hunger is the best sauce, as I have heard someone say recently. Sauce about how?

S. Oh, interesting. Because it could be the best sauce. They mean SA, UCE. Sauce. But it could be the best sauce. The best sauce of pleasure. The best pleasure we've ever had.

Obviously, you're hungriest when you have a starter. So, for me, the dessert is almost just like... Also, I've eaten so much in this world already. So, I'm probably just gonna go for something like a lemon sorbet. Okay. And the reason for that is that I always used to want that when we were on holiday.

This is just not funny anymore. When I was... So, you might reply. What do you mean anymore? I always wanted those little coupes of lemon sorbet. I know exactly what you mean. At a French cafe outside on a hot day. They always seemed to be elegant ladies having them.

And we couldn't have them as kids because it was too extravagant. And it just looked so nice in there. There was nothing else in there, but somehow, because you saw it through the glass, it made it look like there was something in there other than the sorbet. It was just beautifully presented.

And I just can't think of anything more refreshing. And I always remember just really wanting that. And it's nice when there's something that you couldn't have before. You're gonna need to be refreshed because you're gonna need to be sweaty, knackered, maybe hands are covered in mud from digging up the lamb. Yeah, yeah.

I've eaten a huge portion of spag bowl. Yeah, we've creamed it. We've creamed it. Then I've had presumably quite a lot of that lamb. Well, yeah. You're the only one here, the whole lamb. With a piece of salaria at mash for sore, for as far as I can tell.

Sort of sociological reasons. And, you know, I think you'd be lucky to get anything more into me at all. Sorbet is a good choice in that situation. It's just a great choice. Yeah, nothing wrong with a bit of sorbet, especially from France. Yeah, and I'm sorry there's not more narrative

to go along with that. Oh, no, that's fine. But, you know, there's... I think we're good for narrative. You're probably good for narrative. A lot happened around the main course of this podcast. And I think that everyone, I first meet myself and Ed and Benito and the listeners,

that we just needed to cool down afterwards. And the sorbet does that, literally. Roll the car into the garage. I'm genuinely quite, sort of, tired, actually. Yeah, you've really, you know... I'll read you all the back to you, see how you feel about it. And make sure we know who's doing all of it.

Yeah, who's cooking all of it? Yes, absolutely. Spartan water, to begin with. You would like bread with lots of butter. King of... King butter. King butter. Chew butter. Chew butter.

Chew butter. Gio butter. Dark gruy, bread, classic white bread, all in the thing. Starter. Primo, cremos, spaghetti bolognese, homemade. 2006 to 2007. Yeah, if that may be it was made then and frozen. Two decades ago. Main course. Don't say that.

Willy's 24-hour long. Well, we want Willy to come round and cook you a 24-hour lamb. If he's still alive. Yeah. Side salivate mash, made by yourself. Yes, please. Drink a big gouty red wine. Yeah. French café, lemon sorbet.

Yeah. Feel good? I'm very happy with that. It's, um... It surprised myself, really. It's not really what I want, but thank you. Thanks very much for coming in, Gio. Thank you, Gio. It was a pleasure to meet you.

Thank you. Well, there we are. What a journey we went on. Wow, wow, wow. Never met Gio before and what an experience it was. I wish I'd known that you'd never met him before. I would have been much more excited for this first meeting. I loved it, loved the stories and loved the fact that he didn't mention the secret ingredient as well. No kidneys. Thank you, Gio.

Thank you, Gio. Although he did have sort of dug up lamb. A full lamb. Yeah. Which I guess would have kidneys in it, but... Yeah. Well, he'd probably leave them in by accident. Yeah, yeah.

Hopefully he'd take the kidneys out of the lamb, but yeah. Hey, thank you, Gio. Brilliant. Thank you, Gio, and good luck on your play. What's In A Name? And you can find out more about What's In A Name on What'sInANamePlay.com. Lovely.

That's how easy it is to promote that play. So easy to promote it. Well, hey Ed, have we been sending you free stuff lately? Always, baby. We got sent some Ruby's Rubble, Ketchup and Mayo. Oh, I love the name. Haven't tasted it yet, but Ruby's Rubble is a good name. It is, indeed.

Good names are hard to come by. We got sent some Neil's Yard, dairy, cheeses. Neil's Yard? Neil's Yard. They have wonderful cheeses at Neil's Yard. Absolutely incredible. I'll tell you what you'd find in Neil's Yard. A lamb buried in a hole.

I mean, I'm so annoyed I didn't spot that. And the Small Beer Brew Company, who I'd noticed on the shelves of my local supermarket before, and I was intrigued. And it was lovely to try. It's very low ABV beer. Oh, yeah? We're talking 1%. 1%?

And it was very nice. It's like lemonade. Yeah, but lemonade with a little something cheeky. A little cheeky lemonade. A little cheeky lemonade. But it was delicious. So thank you very much for sending us those things. Go on the Off Menu website,

which is offmenupodcast.co.uk. There's a restaurant list on there. Every single restaurant that has ever been mentioned on the Off Menu podcast is on our website. Don't ask us. It's on the website offmenupodcast.co.uk. Check out the Instagram. Check out the Twitter.

We love you. Goodbye. If you forget that email, if you forget that website address, just ask the new coach. Hello. It's me, Amy Gladhill. You might remember me from the best ever episode of Off Menu, where I spoke to my mum and asked her about seaweed

on mashed potato, and our relationship's never been the same since. And I am joined by... Me, Ian Smith. I would probably go bread. I'm not going to spoil it in case... Get him on, James and Ed. But we're here sneaking in to your podcast experience

to tell you about a new podcast that we're doing. It's called Northern News. It's about all the new stories that we've missed out from the North, because, look, we're two Northerners. Sure, but we've been living in London for a long time. The new stories are funny. Quite a lot of them crimes.

It's all kicking off. And that's a new podcast called Northern News we'd love you to listen to. Maybe we'll get my mum on. Get Glittle's mum on every episode. That's Northern News. When's it out, Ian? It's already out now, Amy!

Is it? Yeah, get listening. There's probably a backlog. You've left it so late.