Ologies with Alie Ward - Puffinology (PUFFINS) with Jill Taylor

Episode Date: June 27, 2024

What exactly IS a puffin? Who are they related to? Are they disco birds? WHY are they so cute? Should you kiss one? Throw one? Are they in danger?  Get up in a blanket burrow and listen to field researcher and legit Puffinologist, Jillian Taylor, give us all the details on who eats them, if they are neat freaks or not, their surprising life expectancy, and how they make their long marriages work. Also: the toilets with the best views, Star Wars trivia, a cereal lore, and who should NOT become a puffinologist.Follow Jill on Instagram and TikTokA donation was made to CPAWS Newfoundland and LabradorMore episode sources and linksSmologies (short, classroom-safe) episodesOther episodes you may enjoy: Ornithology (BIRDS), Penguinology (PENGUINS), Oceanology (OCEANS), Oology (EGGS), Pelicanology (PELICANS), Island Ecology (ISLANDS), Ophthalmology (EYES), Lutrinology (OTTERS)Sponsors of OlogiesTranscripts and bleeped episodesBecome a patron of Ologies for as little as a buck a monthOlogiesMerch.com has hats, shirts, hoodies, totes!Follow @Ologies on Instagram and XFollow @AlieWard on Instagram and XEditing by Mercedes Maitland of Maitland Audio Productions and Jacob ChaffeeManaging Director: Susan HaleScheduling Producer: Noel DilworthTranscripts by Aveline Malek Website by Kelly R. DwyerTheme song by Nick Thorburn

Oh, hey, it's your girlfriend who never leaves the house without a cardigan. Allie Ward. And I guess, speaking of cold, let's hit the blustery shore and get pooped on. It's puffins. And people, it's a good time. So the year was this one. And many dozens of you tagged me in an Instagram post with a certified puffinologist. And I took that as a calling from the universe and from you to ask this bird person to please

spend some time with me electronically so I can ask about her whole life. And that I did. So first off, is puffinology a real word? Would we be here if it weren't? That's questionable. But yes, puffinology, it's well established in news articles and ornithology circles. So it is game on. Now puffins, what are they? They are black and

white orange-billed seabirds and their name derives from the word poufón, which is thought to come from the look of this swollen salted meat, but of a completely different seabird, something called a Manx shearwater bird. Doesn't even look like a puffin, it's a small gray seagull looking thing, but it's named scientifically puffinus puffinus. However, that manx seabird is not a puffin. Puffinus puffinus, not a puffin. What is a puffin? The genus Fratercula is all puffins and it comes from Frater for a monk dressed in a dark cloak with its back. So what the fuck? So puffins in the scientific terms are not puffins, but puffins aren't named puffins.

It's confusing. Fraternology is not a word, and puffinology is. So we're doing that. We're talking puffins. Now hold onto your butts, because boy howdy, it only gets more revealing and cuter, and by the end, you'll wish that you could give birth to a puffin and love it forever. But before we get there quick thanks to patrons at patreon.com slash ologies who submitted

their fine questions for this episode. You also can join for about 25 cents an episode you don't have to feel left out. And if you would like to entertain your small kiddos we have this new show called Smallogies and it has its own feed, it's its own show, it's linked in the show notes, we just launched it. It's all classroom safe episodes of Ologies. We also have Ologies merch at Ologiesmerch.com. It's a good way to find other Ologites out there. And thank you to everyone who leaves reviews. And yeah, I do read them all. They make my day, such as yesterday. I read them at an airport and I cried, partly because my plane was delayed nine hours in Utah, but partly because your reviews were so nice.

And as proof, thank you to Classic RKR, who wrote, absolutely in love with this podcast. It's everything I would want from a science educator. Classic RKR also noted that they have a little chupacabra dog named Gremlin, like I do, and they call their dog Grammy, like I do. Classic RKR, uncanny. Tell Grammy that Grammy said,KR, uncanny. Tell Grammy that

Grammy said, boof, boof. Also, Witchcraft Wand, thank you for listening since you were nine. Sorry for all the swears. Again, we now have Smologies if anyone needs them. Okay, Puffinology. Nesologist, absolutely delightful and knowledgeable. Busted so much. Puffin, flim flam. They got their bachelor's in biology at St. Mary's University in Nova Scotia, and they're now a master's student at the Memorial University of Newfoundland, and they are currently studying the world's most charismatic seabird, the Atlantic puffin. So get in a blanket burrow, stare at some lapping waves, and open your ears to learn whether you should kiss one.

Who eats them? If they're neat freaks or not? Their surprising life expectancy, the journey puffins go on before they settle down? How monogamous they are? Why they are disco birds? How they make their marriages work so well? The toilets with the best views? Why someone would toss a puffin? Star Wars trivia? Serial lore? And who should not become a puffinologist? And so much more with ornithologist, field researcher, and legit popinologist, Jillian Taylor. Hi, my name is Jill Taylor and my pronouns are she, they. And puffinologist, correct?

Yeah, has a nice ring to it, doesn't it? I got tagged so many times on an Instagram post of yours about puffinology. So I please, like please from so many people, did you start calling yourself a puffinologist? Tell me a little bit about the background of the word. And also, would you be called in academic circles a fratricolologist or is it just straight up puffinologist? Anything goes. The Latin names are, yeah, I can't even say it properly. Fratercula artica is the Atlantic puffin scientific name and that sounds horrible. So puffinologist is way better. It's official.

When did I start calling myself a puffinologist? Probably after spending two complete summers, the entire of those summers, watching puffins for eight hours a day. I don't know if that's official qualifications, but... Yes. Yes. That qualifies you as a puffinologist. Anyone who studies something is anologist. So I think you count as someone who's expert level puffinologist because that's more time than anyone listening has probably spent watching puffins. Almost too much time, arguably, I guess. Many hours in the field.

There's never. So many people were so excited because puffins, they're so cute. They are the cutest. How much of it is just marveling at how cute they are and how much is like, I got to take notes on this. You just implode inwarding at how cute they are and how much is like, I got to take notes on this. You just implode inwardly at how cute they are. Their cuteness doesn't wear off. As tired and wet and soggy and sleep deprived you might be in the field, the puffins cuteness stays the exact same throughout. I can believe that.

First off, what is a puffin? Is it just an upright penguin? Is it closer to a seagull? I've never seen a puffin in real life, especially in the wild. So start with me there. So puffins are part of the Auk family, which so Alcide. There's four species of puffins. The Atlantic puffin, which I study. The horned puffin, the tufted puffin, and the rhinoceros oculet, which I study, the Horned Puffin, the Tufted Puffin, and the Rhinoceros Auclet, which actually used to be known as the Horned-billed Puffin, but isn't officially a puffin anymore. Okay, side note, the Rhinoceros Auclet is mostly gray, and it has a nose horn during the breeding season, and it also lives for

drama. Rather taxonomous, too, because it's been called not a puffin, and then it turned out it was misnamed, and it's actually genetically the most original puffin but it's not in the fratricula genus but because of that puffinologists can be split on whether to actually include it but in general don't let the name fool you the rhinoceros oculate is a puffin it is not a rhinoceros either isn't it comforting to know how much of history is just built on oopsies? So don't be so hard on yourself, we're all humans and puffins. But the Atlantic puffin holds up the bulk of the world's puffins. The other three species are found at the Pacific side.

You're in LA, right? Mm-hmm. Yeah, yeah. So yes, those are your, that's your corner of the world. And the Ock family includes Smurs, Gilmonds, Puffins, Merlets and Razorbills. And fun fact, there are actually no Ock species in the Southern hemisphere, only in the Northern hemisphere. How is an Ock different from a penguin? Penguins and Puffins are actually not related. I know they look like they are,

but that's only because of convergent evolution. So similar environmental pressures, but they're not related. No. I mean, they're both birds, but that's about it. I figured that of course they were related, that they must be. I had no idea. They're similar coloration though, right? Very similar coloration.

Okay. Let's go back to the panguinology episode with Dr. Tom Hart, where we first learned why these unrelated ocean species get confused at first sight. It's amazing how many species are both black and white and that counter shading, like cormorants, like so many seabirds and also a lot of killer whales and things like that. This counter shading is camouflage. So if you look at them in the water from above, they're dark against a dark background. And if you look at them from underneath, they're light against a light background. So you just

see black and white animals everywhere because that seems to be just a natural way to camouflage yourself in the ocean. I never even thought about that. Orcas and penguins are wearing the same fabulous outfit and just slaying and getting slayed but I want to think about that. So aside from being a snack for whales, what else do they have in common with penguins? Similar diving habits too. They're both very ocean-oriented birds but yes you're not the first person. It's either penguins. Similar diving habits too. They're both very ocean oriented birds. But yes, you're not the first person. It's either penguins or toucans are the two other ones that people are like, oh, puffins, penguins, toucans. These are not the same. More bonkers

facts about the puffins, bright, toucanny bill and a bit hang tight. Were you drawn to ornithology or marine science? How did you become a puffinologist? How did you come to study one of the cutest species of birds? So for full disclosure, I am not a bird person. I beg your pardon? I, yeah, the puffins are the first bird I've actually ever studied. It started with in my undergrad, I was studying black and gold howler

monkeys in Paraguay. And then we were on to American eels. And then it was snapping turtles. So it was primates, fish, reptiles. And then I was like, okay, well, to complete this, I guess I got to do birds and I guess insects next maybe. But I knew it had to be a seabird. And puffins are really good divers. and scuba diving is one of my favorite things in the world. So I find them quite relatable and likable that way. It had to be something next to the ocean. So that's kind of how I just stumbled upon puffins.

It was never a planned thing. I was not raised as an ornithologist from birth, but I've come to appreciate the ocean quite a bit and the puffin also appreciates the ocean. How did you get involved in scuba diving? Did you grow up near the ocean or did you grow up like landlocked and the ocean seemed like something you were drawn to? I grew up in Nova Scotia, in Halifax, Nova Scotia, so right next to the Atlantic Ocean. And yeah, that's where I learned to scuba dive. So I'm going to Memorial University of Newfoundland and Labrador now. So next province over

So if you think that Nova Scotia isn't real like I did for a while like Narnia or Xanadu I regret to inform you that we are living lies Nova Scotia exists and it is this chicken tender shaped piece of seaside land about the size of Sri Lanka but right off the coast of Maine. And yes, Newfoundlands and Labrador Retrievers are named after those places because apparently they descend from really great working dogs for some old school seafaring fishmongers. But yeah, Jill has spent her academic career up and down the eastern seaboard of Canada. But same Atlantic Ocean, a lot of the same species.

The Atlantic Ocean is very near and dear to my heart. How thick is your diving suit? Very, very thick. About the thickest wetsuits they sell. And in the summer, the warmest the ocean temperatures get in Newfoundland, if you're lucky, October, it's around 14 degrees Celsius. I don't know what that is in Fahrenheit. I'm sorry.

Cold. 57.2 degrees Fahrenheit, which for me personally is not like coconut shell bikini season. I'm not having it. Cold. Yes. So it's a two piece seven mil. So 14 millimeters in the core and then seven millimeters everywhere else. Oh my gosh.

You can't move your arms at all. Your little flappy wings. Exactly. So Jill's master's advisor is a visual ecologist, meaning he studies how animals use their sight or their lack thereof to their advantage. And she says puffins are very visual creatures, people. And a spot opened up in her advisor's lab, and she says it just fell into place perfectly. And because of her, now even more people care about puffins.

So it worked out for us too. And you do some outreach too on social media, and people are stoked about your work with puffins. Hi, my name is Jill, and I'm a puffin ecologist. I work on the largest puffin colony in all of North America, second only to Iceland in the world. Come along for a day in the life of a puffinologist on a remote island off the East Coast of Newfoundland.

What is a myth? What is some flim flam that you find yourself busting over and over again? Like what is the biggest lie people believe about puffins that you're constantly correcting? Well, besides thinking that they're penguins, they are, they're so much smaller than everyone thinks that they are. You see these beautiful zoom lens photos, and you think that this bird is going to be like this nice big bill and they're actually really tiny. They're only like 20

centimeters tall. They're really, really small. They only weigh about like a small sack of rice, like 500, 600 grams max. Eight inches tall and around one pound of sweet, cute, stinky birdies. I love them. So yeah, they're much smaller than everyone thinks that they're going to be before they see them in real life. Another misconception that I feel like a lot of people don't know about is that these very conspicuous bright orange bills that they have, they don't have them all year round. This is only a breeding color and they lose those bill plates in the winter. So in the winter they're this fairly drab gray color. And like the first people studying puffins

thought it was a completely different species because it looks so different. And I don't know if I want to use the word ugly, but they're definitely not as pretty. They're much prettier in this every time. What is a bill plate? Is that something that they just shed? Do they shed the whole bill or they just shed like scales off of the bill? Yeah, just the outer bill plate is the best way I can describe it. They keep their bill. It just is this dark gray color. And then they develop these bright orange, red, and yellow bill plates and other eye ornaments. And I looked it up and the eye ornaments that they grow and shed make their little round eyes look kind of triangular. Like if you had a witch hat or a candy corn with an eye

in the middle of it, or like a heavy straight witch hat or a candy corn with an eye in the middle of it, or like a heavy straight eyeliner in the bottom lash and then a black triangle like a clown on the lid. And this was confusing for some early old school puffinologists because after the beak and eye ornamentation is shed and falls off, these birds get the fuck out of dodge on the off season and they don't come back until it's mating time again and they're gussied up ornamentally again. Also, if you were to Google like me puffins plus ornaments, you're gonna find all kinds of holiday tree decorations celebrating these little

birds and not a lot of close-ups of their beaks falling off, unfortunately. Yeah, their bills are quite elaborate. And so how many months out of the year are they flashy like that? Only about four. Their breeding season, they come back to Newfoundland every year from April to August. The other eight months of the year, they're just out at sea cruising. The North Atlantic is very large, so they're just out there chilling for eight months of the year, and then they come back to the same islands every year to breed. How far can they fly before they need to touch down?

Or do they touch down in the water and just take a nap, bobbing up and down? They're bobbing. Most of the time they're just bobbing. Do they tend to hang out in big groups just in case a shark happens to surface and try to scoop a bunch of them up? Are they herders or are they pair kind of birds? I've heard in the winter months that they are a little more isolated and they go off in groups of smaller ones or twos. But at least in the breeding season, which is where I've spent most of my time looking at puffins is they do something called rafting where they'll come together as like

hundreds of birds on the water and just hang out together bobbing. Yeah, it's really, it's really fun. They're just cruising through the waves together. Circe. Do they ever go from the Atlantic coast to say the coast of Europe or the North Sea? Or do they stay kind of out in their islands and then come back to the same coast? Or do they migrate? They do migrate in that they are away for eight months of the year. They've been found throughout the Mediterranean wintering as well as in New York on the west coast of the

North Atlantic. Some of them have been found to travel quite a great deal, but they make it back to their islands every year. And these islands are, some are far out to sea and some are quite close to land. But these islands provide them quite a bit of protection from predators in that there's no foxes or minks to come and bother their chicks. Do they nest in cliffs or are they sand nesters or rock nesters? What are their nests like? So they live in something called a burrow. They like grassy slopes and they dig this really cool maze of tunnels. It's really hard to walk

on. You basically need to make sure you're not going to bust through anyone's roof when you're on the islands. They lay their egg inside this burrow and then they raise that chick in the burrow. And then six weeks after that chick hatches, they're booted out and they're on their own. So when you're studying it, are you hanging out like in a tent on the shore with binoculars? What is it like studying them? What kind of excursions are you up to? Yeah, so all of my field work has happened on Great Island, which is one of the four islands in Witless Bay Ecological Reserve. The island is not the easiest to access on our little zodiac that we take in.

You basically land and then you have to climb up this really steep cliff to get to the top. We do have a cabin on the island. I'm very fortunate to say not everyone's field site has a cabin on it. It's very basic. There's no toilet and then there's one light bulb of electricity if we ever get sunshine from the solar panels. But the actual studying of the puffins, we construct a semi-permanent blind close to the plot that we're studying them from. And that's just so that they can't see us and they're not disturbed. As soon as they see us, they're taken off. They don't like being near humans, which I don't blame them. We're massive compared to them and And they're scared

and understandably. But a lot of the studying of the research looks like sitting in the blind and really early mornings when the puffins get up. And then also in the evenings, they seem to be most active in the mornings and the evenings. And it's binoculars and it's sitting. That's just the observational part, though. There's other parts we're banding them, that always happens at nighttime. Are you taking notes in like a moleskin? Or are you, do you have your laptop and you're noting things? Like, what are you looking for when you're staring at them? No moleskin. And the laptop isn't super rain friendly. So I try not to bring that, but

you're a typical write in the right notebook. But there's two main studies that I was a part of for this research project. There was one that was looking at the social network of the colony. So who interacts with who? We go and ban them and we can monitor how they do in subsequent years, which boroughs have chick success, that sort of thing. But we can also use those bands to identify individuals on the plot to know, okay, that's Bob, and he likes to

hang out with Bruce, and they spend all their time together, and that sort of thing. There's hundreds of thousands of birds on this island, and they have a really complex social colony. Yeah, we're trying to keep track of that. We're trying to map that. And we, this is a side note. This is a part of my project, which is a very strange project in itself, but cool nonetheless in that I actually taxidermied six owl puffins that we found dead, don't worry.

And we presented them to live birds to see how they'd react to a novel individual in that this is a really complex social colony. They're long lived. They see the same neighbors year after year, and we don't know how they recognize each other. And what do they do? Well, I can't tell you quite yet. Oh, fuck you!

I'm presenting those results at a conference next month, so I can't spoil you quite yet. Oh, my God. I'm presenting those results at a conference next month. So I can't spoil too much, but let's just say there were some sex differences, what we saw between males and females. And you mentioned Bob and Bruce hanging out. Do they have same sex friends? Do they sometimes pair up in non-heterosexual pairs? What are their friendships like? When you say a complex

social structure, does that mean people are shit talking, people are having affairs? What's going on? Probably all of the above. I will say anecdotally, this is fun. To give some context, puffins are monogamous. They do mate for life. They live to be about 25 years old. So they're with the same mate for about 25 years. Yeah. Which is impressive in itself. I will maintain that I think that's only possible because they spend eight months of the year apart at sea. But anyway, so they mate for life really low divorce rates. So they're with the same mate every year. So whenever you're doing burrow checks, you're always finding like one male, one female,

and a chick or an egg, depending on what part of the breeding season you're in. But my coworker found a burrow where there was actually two males and one female inside this nest. That potentially we're all raising one chick together. So do what you want with that. But I think that's really sweet. Are they good parents? Do they co parent? Like, do they both go out and get a fish and then barf it into their baby's mouth? Or what kind of parenting roles do they have? They are really good parents. They actually both males and females take turns incubating the egg and fishing for food for the baby puffling. Baby puffins are called pufflings, which is just really cute in itself. And they are literally a ball of fluff. Like think

of the fluffiest thing you've ever seen and then it's fluffier than that. Oh, I can't handle that. Right? Yeah, it is a lot. There's a lot to take in. But yes, they're really good parents. Some studies have found that the males do spend a little more time on burrow maintenance, which is fun. They're getting their architecture business in order. And then the females will, in their activity budget, spend a little bit more time foraging for fish for the puffling. But they both attend to the chick, which is really nice because that can't be said for all species. For lack of a better term, a lot of parents just fuck off. And the puffin parents are attentive. Yeah.

Do they ever see their chicks again or after six weeks is like, see? Or does that chick disperse to a totally different colony or is it like they might be in that city of a hundred thousand puffins? They piece out. Once they're at six weeks, it's like, you're on your own, learn how to fish. It must be a really steep learning curve. Your whole life has been darkness in this beautifully muddy burrow for your entire existence. And then you're thrust into the world and you have to go fish for yourself as a harsh reality. So puffins take about four to five years to sexually mature. They will return to the islands

that they were born on. So they'll come back, but they need a little bit of time before they're ready. What are they eating? I'm going to guess fish, fish, fish, fish, fish, fish, fish. You got it right on the head. Yeah. Kaplan, sand lance, Herring, fish are their favorite, but if those aren't available, they will eat krill or other crustaceans like copepods, but no, fish is their main buffet. When it comes to their appearance, why are they so cute? Why do you think they look the way they do? You said that they're visual.

They have a lot of visual attributes. Do they have big eyes to take that in, especially if they're in the burrows a lot? How are they well suited to their evolution? Yeah, that's a great question. Their colorization, I think, is a part of why they're so cute, like this bright red, orange bill only coming through in the breeding season to signal, Hey, I'm ready to breed. There's also very intricate individual differences in bill morphology. So they're quite elaborate and they have these intricate ridges and they have a

rosette patch, which is like a fleshy yellow patch where their bill meets their face. They have eye ornaments as well. And they are considered a fairly developed visual animal. Like other birds, like songbirds have very unique vocalizations and can recognize each other from their unique songs. But puffins don't, they do make sounds, but they're very, they're very different than what you'd think. And I think the best way I could describe it is it sounds like an angry chainsaw. You'll have to look it up what it sounds like. It's a very unique sound.

When it comes to making that bill color, is it expensive to make? Where are they getting the fuel to make those colors? Yeah. So a lot of the bill coloration in puffins is definitely partially due to the carotenoids in their diet. So capelin are fish that have a fairly high level of carotenoids, same with krill and crustaceans, the other food sources that I mentioned. So they're able to use that to display this beautiful bill that is very, very recognizable. You mentioned earlier that you're behind a blind.

Yes. And I'm trying to figure out what that looks like. Is it a scrim? Is it like a ghillie suit? Does it look like moss and rocks, but you have peepholes? Like what does it look like? We don't need to be that incognito. It is just a little wooden shack for lack of a better term.

And we've cut out, it is a peephole. So we have a glass opening that we can look through and then we put it's like camouflage burlap I guess is more of a peephole than I first thought you weren't too far off There's two openings of the burlap so we can see through so they can't really see us which is nice because I can't imagine Going about your everyday life on a busy puffin colony and you look over and you see these two naked primates just staring at you. It would be a little unnerving. And I know you're naked metaphorically as an ape, but how are you staying warm in a

shack on an island looking at seabirds? Are you in so many parkas? Do you have a thermos of hot chocolate? What's happening? Yeah. May in Newfoundland is very chilly, very foggy, very rainy. Yeah, these islands are quite cold, but many, many layers, more layers than you think you're going to need. But then it's hard because then come the dead of July, you can get some really hot days where you're just this blind is baking in the sun. And so we have in our blind... You know those, you can get them at the dollar store. They're little spray bottles with water in the fan and you can go, and it gives you a little reprieve of

coolness. So it's hot, cold, all the extremes in between. And then are you typically sleeping in that cabin? Are you taking the Zodiac back every night or are you in the cabin for like a week? We're in the cabin for like a week. Yeah. There's no running water on the island, so we have to bring in all our water with us. And we thankfully, at the end of the week, get a boat ride back so we can shower, do some laundry, and then head back out. Which doesn't sound like too much time. Like five days on the island, you're like, oh, that's a thing. Like I could go on a camping trip for five days. But when you're in a remote island, and there's not

really great cell service, and it's just, yeah, it's very remote. You got to really like your coworkers. I was going to say, is it typically two of you and is it the same person? So you kind of know each other's rhythms or is it like you might be paired with Zach one week and Melanie the next and you just kind of, where you see what happens? No, you're typically with the same person, at least for the field season, and you get to know that person very well. I'm sure. A little too well.

And no toilets. So if you're hydrating, you got to get used to getting through your layers and going off and peeing somewhere, right? Yep. Many, many, many pee breaks. Peeing is not so much an issue, but I will say for anything else, we do have a makeshift toilet in the bushes, which is nice. It's basically a bucket we've sawed off and nailed on a toilet seat lid. So at least it's a little comfortable, but there's

no covering. So it's a little wet if it's raining, but you do get to see whales while you're on the shitter. So I don't know. that's a pretty good view. You can't beat that view. What kind of whales are you seeing? Mostly humpbacks and minkees. Just casual. Just casual. Another day in the office. Yeah. When you're banding them at night, why are you doing it at night? Are they more chill at night so it's easier to grab them and put an anklet on them?

It is an anklet. That is exactly what it is. It's a little piece of jewelry. We go at night for two reasons. One, we want to be as least disruptive to them as possible, so we don't want to disturb their daily habits. They're out fishing, they're out socializing, they're coming back and feeding their chick. And yeah, we want to keep that rhythm as normal as possible. And almost, it'd be almost as if we're not there. The second thing is that it's least disruptive, but it's also so we can find them because we, if they're just out and about, they could be out rafting on the other side of the island. They could be out wheeling in the air, which is also a cool behavior they do. They find a circular pattern. Just a PS, I found out on Cornell's All About Birds website that quote, non-breeders at

the colony often form flocks and they spend hours flying in wide circular or figure eight paths over the colony cliffs, a behavior called wheeling, which is I guess like if all your single friends just gathered to do donuts in a Walmart parking lot for hours a day for months out of the year, just like screw it, Katie, let's go and have some fun. But back to their nocturnal habits and why Jill is kind of skulking around the island at night, giving out puffin friendship anklets.

Anyways, they're in their burrows, it's easier to find them. And then we can map out where their burrows are and which banded birds are in which burrow. It's just easier to track them as more data points. Very few people on this earth have gotten to embrace a puffin. You're one of them. Are they cuddly? When you have to handle them with permits, are they soft and cuddly? They're very soft. They're not cuddly in the slightest. They may be small, but they can pack a really mean bite. Oh, really?

Which can leave scars. And I don't blame them. This is their only line of defense, so we can't fault them for that. But they have a really strong bill, and they really are good at clamping down when they want to take a chunk out of you. Why is that bill so bulky if they're just eating small fish? They get that quite a few fish inside too. So two things, social behavior wise, they use their bills for a behavior called billing, which is when they take two birds come together and basically rub their bills and tap them back and forth. They do this as a pair bonding behavior with their mates, but they also do this with neighbors as well sometimes. It's very fun to watch two mates that are clearly in a little billing fest and then you have

a third individual kind of trying to nudge its way and it's like, hello, I'd like some attention too. This looks fun. And then as well, the strength of it, I would argue, is also likely due to they have to fight each other for space. This is a cool, complex social colony, which has some fun friendly behaviors, but it also means you're fighting for resources and space and you want to make sure that someone's not coming in to steal your mate or try to take your burrow that you work so hard to dig out. Actually, when they fight, it's very fun to watch. It's very entertaining. They will do this thing. You can tell a puffin's getting angry at another puffin. They'll basically look at the other bird and open up their bill and

raise their tongue slightly. And they just pause in this position and you're like, Oh, something bad's about to happen. And then, and then if it escalates, they will escalate to a fight where they actually interlock bills. And they fight so aggressively that they actually will interlock bills, hold on to each other and rumble tumble together all the way down a slope. They do not give up. Is that how they land a mate? Do they have to do anything like bring a pebble or fight their neighbor in order to get a lady? There's no pebbles, but I imagine the first season there's a little bit more of a scramble to try to find a mate. But once they've established that partnership, that's pretty secure.

So they're not squabbles of the heart, but they're like neighbors getting pissy over fence lines and parking spots. I'd say burrows are more of a hot commodity to make sure that someone hasn't gotten there sooner and you have to fight someone for your burrow that you lived in last year. And you're like, that was a really nice house. I'd like to live there again this year. And what if one dies? Do they get a new mate and inherit the same borough? Do people, do people, do puffins ever use a borough that's been abandoned?

First part, if a mate dies, they will repartner with somebody else, which is a sad outcome to think about, but also you're away for eight months. Who knows? I guess it's a waiting game to see if they're back when you get back in the summer. Okay, so from late summer until early spring, puffin pairs take a break. They part ways, and some of them have similar flying locations and routes, but some kind of bug off and they take a completely

different path. And popinologists aren't quite sure how they relocate their same crush year after year, but the location of their summertime breeding season, Pieta Terre, likely helps out a bunch. Studies have actually found that they will stay within a two meter radius of where they last lived. So they're staying really close to where they lived last year. So sometimes that might mean the same borough and then sometimes that might be someone else has gotten there faster and they have to find a new spot. But they're sticking really close to where they've been living. Can I ask you some questions from

listeners? Sure, yeah. OK. OK. But before she does, let's toss some money into the sea for research as she selected the Canadian Parks and Wilderness Society in Newfoundland and Labrador, which has rescued thousands of Atlantic puffins and leeches

storm petrel chicks, two species who are globally listed as vulnerable. And more on that program in a bit, and thanks to sponsors of Ologies who make these weekly donations possible. Okay, questions. Many of you, including Spexal, Sylvia Trevario, Clark Bennett, Olivia Lester, and Lisa Mangelsdorf, first-time question asker, wanted to know how human puffin diplomacy is going. Are they dangerous?

Are we dangerous? Are puffins enriching uranium? Hi, Allie. This is Vanessa in Colton, California. Two years ago, I was fortunate to visit Lunga Island, part of the Treshnish Islands of Scotland. I was able to visit a colony of the adorable puffins. And one interesting thing that I noticed was the birds would come out of their little holes when people were around, they were pretty active, they seem habituated to the humans, and they would go back into their little holes and hide when there were less people walking around. And I was just wondering if becoming

more habituated to the humans visiting their islands while they're breeding is beneficial or detrimental for their colonies? Thank you. No, that's a really good question. And yeah, there's two lenses from a research standpoint and also a tourist perspective. So on these islands and this reserve, they're protected areas, so not anyone can just walk on. You have to have a scientific permit. So the only tourists these puffins are seeing are from boats that come up and come near, but they're not stepping foot. Boat traffic is inevitable and if it's located to one place on a side where there's not, yeah, you're not harming the puffins that way.

But being habituated is definitely a good point. There are other colonies on the island of Newfoundland that have become more habituated. There's a spot called Elliston and the puffins there are more used to humans. Absolutely. As for the research lens, like if we're in the blind or in the cabin, we're not bothering any birds. And then yeah, at the end of that, it just is weighing us researching them and monitoring them and making sure that their populations are okay. There's a good portion of that for a small piece of disturbance. Let's leave them be, take your photos,

get your Zoom lens and admire from a distance. So in general, the Atlantic puffins in Newfoundland are doing okay, but elsewhere. So in general, the Atlantic puffins in Newfoundland are doing okay, but elsewhere, like in Iceland, puffin populations have dropped by 70% since 1995, with warming seas killing their food sources as a big factor. Puffin hunting in Iceland was once considered sustainable, but now scientists say it is absolutely not, and it contributes still to 10% of the puffin population decline. So Icelandic puffins, kind of in some deep shit, they're now marked as critically endangered. Other species like the horned puffin and the rhinoceros oculid, they're listed as of least

concern as is the tufted puffin of Alaska, but that does not tell the tufted puffins whole story. Carly and Tanner, first time question askers, wanted to know why are tufted puffin populations declining on the West Coast, especially when populations seem to be doing so well in Alaska? Good question, yes. So according to 2021 estimates,

there are 553 lonely tufted puffins in Oregon, down from 5,000 in the late 1990s. Why are these tufted puffins kicking ass in Alaska but succumbing on the West Coast? Oh, people. So bummers like a decrease in fish populations. We got fish in nets, we got oil slicks, ocean trash, and the seas warming.

There's part of it. And then our species, more specifically colonizers, we introduced some predators like Arctic foxes and bears to tufted puffin island habitats. They're like, what is this? Who are these guys? Why are they eating my babies? So yeah, it's us. It's usually us.

And the Oregon Conservation Strategy website says that you can try to help tufted puffins by not introducing any nest predators. So don't bring any bears to any islands. Also do your best to prevent oil spills in case you drive a tanker to work because there's nothing better than actual living puffins. On that note, I'm shocked that only two people had this question. Susan Majrak and Doug Pace wanted to know any thoughts on the fact that the Porgs from Star Wars

were only created because there were so many puffins on Skellig Michael during the filming of episode seven. Doug says, trying to fit a fun fact into a question. But when I think of Puffins, I think of Porgs. Is this lore among other Puffinologists? I have not heard this lore, but I'm also not super familiar with Porgs. I need to look up what they look like, actually.

If you need to look it up right now, I do not follow you. So apparently, the story goes that they were filming and there were so many freaking puffins that they were like, we can't CGI these out of here. So instead we're just going to create a character that looks like a puffin that way they just look like they're so cute. They have such big mouths. So porgs have that characteristic seabird dark back and white chest and some burnt umber colors around their eyes, but they are beakless with only kind of the wisp of a nose. So these fictional

creatures, they kind of look like a puffin, but with the face of an otter pup. I mean, 10 out of 10 would foster fail an orphaned porg. Give me it. Really big eyes too. And how close is that to puffin eyes? Puffin eyes are not that big. I feel like it's like those really cute little like baby animals you see with the really, really big googly eyes. Very, very cute. I'd say the feet look like puffins, but that's maybe about it. Props to the CGI team that we're like, let's make this into our story.

Would puffins even be on cliffs? Would they use those slopes to burrow into? They love hanging out on cliffs. There's things called party rocks. So puffins will come and congregate on these rocks together and just socialize during the day. They burrow in the grassy areas, but these islands in the North Atlantic have really, really steep cliffs and are very rocky. So they're definitely hanging out on the cliffs. Party rock in the house tonight. That's amazing. Exactly. Rebecca Rawlings wants to know, what are those bright orange patches you mentioned to the side of their beaks?

Sensory organs perhaps, or are they just mac and cheese colored decor? Mac and cheese colored decor. That's funny. I agree. The little fleshy bit I mentioned earlier is called a rosette, and that's just part of their visual display. Oh, it is just- It's ornamental.

Fancy. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Fluorescence. Nick Worth, Dorit, and Jen Skrull-Alvarez wanted to know, in Jen's words, what's the purpose of having rave beaks? They glow in UV light? What?

Yeah, yeah. Puffins can see in the ultraviolet, so this is something that they can see. A lot of what we study in the visual ecology lab is trying to, and it's really hard, but to place ourselves in another animal's perspective to be like, okay, well, what sort of things and what cues do they need from their environment? I know in other bird species,

ultraviolet colorization is sometimes used in like nighttime foraging so they can see other birds. Like they're not always in their burrows at night. And also when they're underwater, they spend a great deal of time. They're really good divers. Puffins can dive up to, I think it's around like 50 meters deep,

which is really deep. And this probably allows them to see other puffins. There's definitely some sort of communication going on there, but definitely more studies need to be done on that. Okay, so birds have four cones in their eyes. And for more on eyes and cones, you can see the ophthalmology episode. But we have three, which sucks for us.

So birds have a totally different experience of color and light, and they live in this hidden world of glow stick visuals that would just dazzle your friends on drugs. So why is this happening? According to the 2019 paper, photoluminescence in the bill of the Atlantic puffin, researchers note that photoluminescent properties serve a number of important roles in nature, such

as deterring predators, lowering underwater prey, and signaling between individuals and that the photoluminescent parts of the bill are shed during the non-breeding season, which leads scientists to infer that these glowing ultraviolet colors make other birds down to get it on, or they scare away competition, or they help puffins catch food for the babies. Now wait, how did we come to know that they have glowing beaks? Who figured this out? So I tracked down the author of this study,

one Dr. Jamie Dunning, who is a bird flu expert at Imperial College of London. And one day in 2018, he just casually tweeted a photo of this day glow blue neon beaked puffin under blacklight with a caption, birds have additional color cones in their retina that are sensitive to ultraviolet range. I exposed some of my specimens to UV light. The puffin's bow was pretty cool. I wonder if it's related to signaling.

Just like with a shrug. I mean, he went on to write a whole paper about it, but he was just like, cool. I have tweeted more dramatic statements about parking and a sale at Macy's. So pop-inologist, I hope you know just how impressed we all are with you. I hope you know. In terms of behavior, Michael Bratt wants to know what happens in the summer. Do their eating and sleeping cycles change with like the extreme daylight? So we noticed there's definitely some sort of pattern here where there's like this cyclical

pattern of colony attendance. So there's some days you'll go out and we're in our blind looking for the birds and there's no one, they're all gone. And you're like, where did everyone go? And then other days you're out and you can't write fast enough in your notebook to collect all your data because the slope is completely covered in birds and it's really hard to keep track of them all. There's work on that being done looking into what the cyclical pattern is, if it's related to weather or if it's moon cycle related. But as for like the actual daylight, they're up when the sun is up and they they're up when the sun is up. And they go to bed when the sun is down. Unlike me. What about their intelligence? Earl of Gramelkin,

Elizabeth Mina and Olivia Lester want to know how smart are they? Do they have a bird brain is what they want to know. Yes. Earl asked, are they puff for brains or puffing geniuses? Well, okay. Animal intelligence is one of those things where it really depends on what ruler you're using to measure that. Humans love to think of ourselves on the top of this hierarchy, but we're also I'd say they're fairly intelligent in that they have to interact with many individuals. There's normally a correlation generally of the higher sociality an animal has, the higher intelligence, if you will.

I don't even know if intelligence is the right word to use. I'd say they're fairly intelligent. Their brains get them to do what they need to do for their little puffin lives. They're such long lives. I can't believe that they're around for 25 years. 25. That's a good chunk of time.

I would have guessed that they were alive for like two, three years, but they don't mature until they're even five years old. Yeah. So they take a little while to mature and then they have about 20 years of breeding. Yeah. Are they just sort of like dicking around, flying around at sea, getting to know each other, learning to fish?

Yeah. Yeah. They're taking that time to figure themselves out. This is more of a spiritual journey. They typically don't return back to those colonies until they're ready to breed, but there have been a few exceptions to that, but there's always an exception to everything.

Well, I know that we love them, but a few people, Katie Hammond, Erin, Celeste Constantinou, Elios, want to know in Erin's words, someone told me at some point that puffins are kind of cranky. Is that true or was whoever told them that a jerk? No, they're definitely cranky. Oh, really? They look so nice. They are very cute. I think it's hard to distinguish that in that they're always cranky when they're around us, but that makes sense. We're these little blob, white light aliens coming in

at night and taking them from their homes, putting an anklet on them and then returning them back. So I'd be cranky too. I'd be pissed. Are you kidding? And then some jewelry you can't take off yourself? Exactly. Do wildlife biologists ever have to worry like, oh, now that we put this anklet on them, they're being treated differently or do puffins just not care?

No, definitely thought is put into that of just how big, well, first of all, we don't want to bother the actual birds. Like we want the bands to fit on their ankle away from any joints so that they're not even going to notice them and that it's not going to hinder their movement or they're walking and they're flying. But do they get hazed? Just if they're like, oh, Bruce got a...

Oh, I don't like this. Yeah. Oh, do they treat each other differently? Not much attention is given to each other's legs. All the social information is really in the eyes and the bill area. So I don't think they're not checking out each other's ankles. That's good. News to me, but a ton of questions from a ton of listeners.

Hello patrons, Jamie, Malia, Associ, Michelle Smith, Laura McLean, Lexi Cable, Peyton Henderson, and Erica Koontz and Dana Sprouse, first time question askers. Asked in Erica's words, why do people throw pufflings off cliffs? How can I help do this? Dana asks, are the Icelanders really helping them by throwing them off cliffs? What? What's happening? What's with all these viral videos of people throwing baby puffins off cliffs? So yeah, I've seen those videos too of the Icelandic puffin. I'm assuming it's similar to a puffin patrol here. So when it's time for puffin chicks to fledge, some of them go the wrong way and make it into cities that are close to these islands where they're at risk of being eaten by cats or foxes or colliding with buildings. And in general, they just

don't have a food source there. And so we want to take those strandings and get them back out to sea. So yeah, the puffin and Petrol Patrol here does that. They go around at night, find stranded pufflings and then release them back into the ocean. These fledglings have left the islands, so they do know how to fly. So throwing them up in the air is just giving them a little boost. Puffins are really bad at flying. They're really good at diving and they're really comfortable in and around the water. They're really bad at walking on land. So they have to flap their wings really, really fast to be able to stay afloat in the air. And so anytime they even take off from the colony, they're basically walking up the slope to find a

taller spot like a steep cliff or something. And then they'll just basically jump off and help use gravity to help them start flying. So throwing them up in the air is, is helping them. Yeah. Who gets to do that? Well, Ali, if you come to Newfoundland, we can take you on the puffin and petrol patrol. You too could throw puffins if you wanted. Patrol. You too could throw puffins if you wanted. Oh my God. I would do that so bad. Yeah. It's a really cool program. Anyone can sign up. Lots of people go with their families too, so their kids get to see puffin strandlings and help return them back to sea. I had no idea that was even a possibility. I'm going to put it on your list now. I got to put that on my list. Let's get right down to business.

Michaela Marshall wants to know, why are they the smelliest animals at the zoo? And Autumn Knoll wanted to know, why do they poopie so ellipses violently? Anna Thompson wants to know, if a puffin colony stinks, so does Erin Christie. What kind of smells are you dealing with? Very stinky. You're going to smell them before you see them. It's a mixture of their fishing and the discarded parts of the fish that they're not eating are left to rot in the sun. They're using the rocks as their toilets and kitchen all at once. So yes, they're very stinky. Anyone who's worked on a seabird colony knows

that that smell will be forever permanently ingrained in their brain. When you get home, do you just take... You jump in the shower. Yeah, I was going to say like, just Dr. Bronner. Yeah, right into the laundry machine, you're in the shower. Things are being washed immediately. Yes. Do they poo in their burrows or no? The chicks will. So they often have like a little toilet space for the chick. Their burrows

are very tidy. A lot of the times the adults will do their business out on the slope. I will say this is anecdotal, but I'd say almost like nine out of 10 times, the first thing they do in the morning is they waddle out of their burrows, the adults, and they'll step out onto their foyer and then lift their little butts up in the air and take their morning poo and then go on their way. And if that's not relatable, I don't know what is. They have a tiny, tiny cup of coffee and then they're like, whoop, ready to go. Got to go.

Yeah. Is it violent? Would you say that the velocity of it is violent? There is a proportion. Well, that's a hard word to say. It's all liquid. So it is, I feel like liquid travel a little further faster than it's always to.

I know this is a terrible segue, but let's get to eating. Bjorn Fredberg wanted to know, are they tasty? Did Charles Darwin eat any and write about it? He was part of some kind of society that wanted to try and eat every kind of animal. That sounds like Darwin. It sounds, he's like, gotta get him in my mouth. Kelly do want to know what's up with those dogs

bred for puffin hunting? Hannah Gore, Naomi Jayme, and elders Amora all wanted to know, like, are they taste, do they taste kind of fishy? You mentioned that they've got to really work to fly. I imagine they're probably all dark meat. I don't know. Eating puffins, eating puffin eggs, what's the scoop? The scoop is you can't do that in Canada. So I have not tried puffin. I've gotten lots of comments on all my videos being like, puffins are so tasty.

Like, okay, thanks for sharing. They used to be hunted and the eggs were collected. But yeah, that hasn't happened for a while now. And they are protected species. No one, at least on the side of the Atlantic, no one is eating puffins. Or at least you shouldn't be. And if you are, I'm going to come find you and you'll be in trouble. But I have no idea what they taste like. So according to reports of puffin eaters, the meat is dark and gamey and salty and like a pastrami made out of liver. Those are the tasting notes.

So honestly, some people are like, no thanks, I'm good. But it's still legal to hunt puffins in parts of northern Iceland, where older generations also like to root out the heart and eat it raw as a delicacy. And then we'll typically smoke the meat kind of like a jerky. So if you absolutely have to eat puffin, you can hit up Iceland before it's entirely illegal, because it's really not good news up there. Otherwise, you know what? Just settle for like some dried

smoky mushrooms or eat some cat food. But don't kill any puffins in Shil's territory. You could be on a puffinologist shit list. You're like, I don't think so. You guys are not catching one and roasting it in your seaside cabin. That's not happening. Don't you dare. Yeah. Can you imagine? Well, speaking of eating though, a ton of people, including Li Wang, Lizzie Martinez, Lauren Siebert, so many people wanted to know what's the story with Barbara's puffin cereals. Also, do you have a favorite?

There is a puffin cereal that's available here. Yeah, slaps. What do you think of it though? Not to influence you, but it's pretty good, right? I've only, yeah, yeah, a little add in here for Barbara's puffin cereal. You owe me. I've only tried the maple flavor and it was good. I will say I'm a mini-weights fan though. I'm not switching ships, but yeah. The idea that puffinologists only eat puffins for breakfast, it's a little presumptuous to be honest. We're multifaceted, okay guys?

Maybe Barbara just loves puffins, who knows? So according to Lore, it wasn't Barb who loved puffins, but an employee who 30 years ago saw some puffins in Alaska and rightfully became obsessed. And this employee just began seeing all objects only in terms of their relations to puffins. So a puffed corn cereal, puff, puffins. Also if you were to go to Alaska, maybe you have a cereal to name, you would see tufted puffins, which have these blonde bangs that curl behind their ears, kind of like ram's horns, or the

horned puffin, which has over its eyes, upright spikes during the breeding season. Spikes over its eyes. Horny decor for horny birds. And patron, Duane Tollef's Rudd asked, would puffins be as endearing if they had a different name, like the horned squat or the Atlantic muck bus? And Dwayne, I think you should apply for a job at Barbara because you have a knack for naming. Those are great. I'd be curious to know. What about pop culture? Is there any representation of puffins in the media,

good or bad, that either make like, you're so excited about your cringe? Yes. So there is a puffin in Elf, the Christmas movie, in that scene where he's with the Narwhal and the Narwhal's like, bye buddy, hope you find your dad. There's a puffin in that scene and he's really cute. Hey buddy, wanna fix your snowberries? Not now Arctic puffin!

There's that one moment where both his eyes are on the same side of his head, which anatomically is not correct, but it's also a clay puffin, so I can't fault them too much with that. The other reference that a lot of people mentioned to me is there's a kids TV show called Puffin Rock. I have one gripe with

it in that it follows this puffin family and they have two children, which is not accurate. They only raise one chick per year. And on top of that, the youngest little one is pure white, which is not true of puffins. Puffin chicks are almost fully blacked down and they have like a little white belly but they're definitely like 90% black in color and not white. But I get it. For the storytelling, it's okay. They should send you a written apology though. Just saying. I wouldn't say no. Last listener question. Autumn Knoll, Jennifer Frow, Denny, a lot of people, including Susan Gottlieb, Natasha Garrison, Hazel, Marlee Moss, Nova Q, RJ Deutch, Lauren N. Sarah King,

Nikki Jervits, and Jacqueline Church, who asked and then pleaded, why are they so adorable and please don't let them be awful like otters? Still not over that reveal. So you can see the lute-tranology episode on otters to break your heart. But yeah, puffins. In Denny's words, why are they so cute? Can I give them a little kiss on their heads? Autumn wants to know, do we know that they love them? Jennifer Fray wants to know why do I love them so much? Anything sociologically? Why do I love them? Why do we love them so much? I think the bright colors are the contrast of the black

and white. Like they're really small. They're wearing a black and white tuxedo and they have bright orange booties and this beautiful bell. I mean, what is not to love about that? I thought she meant orange butts and then I realized she meant small boots, which is fine. And Denny, without a permit, cannot give them a little kiss on their heads. That's not legal. Yeah, sorry, Denny. Sorry, Denny. They also would not like that at all.

They wouldn't like them. You would maybe get a little chunk of your nose bitten off. That's not good. Autumn Knoll, do they know that we love them? I don't think they care. It sounds like they're pretty grumpy and they don't wanna see you.

Pretty much. You've summed it up. They don't like you. This is a parasocial relationship. This is like... Okay. So, worst thing about the job, you've described shitting alfresco. You've described coming home and having to take a radioactive shower and also declining populations.

What's the hardest thing about your job, about being a puffinologist? Something's got to suck. I am someone who really likes getting eight hours of sleep a night. And the sleep schedule we have is we never get to sleep eight hours in a row. You sleep for four hours, you get up and you do four hours and you go back and take a little nap and then you do another four hours and you just kind of repeat through this cycle. So in the summer months, it is a privilege to be on these islands studying this animal, but I will say a small part of my feeble humanness is that I just want a full night's sleep sometimes.

The other eight months out of the year, are you just 12 hours a day? I'm packing the sleep in. Nine hours if I'm lucky, yeah. What's the best? I feel like it's so cliche to say. I can't pick one. There are several. I think it's really cool to be so removed from civilization and get to be in such a wild space that you're just away from humans, which is really nice. And you get to see an ecosystem that is just thriving on its own and

doing its own thing that goes hand-in-hand with the fact that not many people have gotten to experience these islands in the ways that the small amount of researchers have and I really try not to take that for granted. They're beautiful islands. They're absolutely gorgeous. It's a bit of a culture shock going from so much isolation and puffins, puffins, puffins to them back into the real world with cars and human interactions. And yeah, you kind of got to switch part of your brain on and off. What a great excuse though if you didn't get back to someone in time. Just be like, I'm so sorry I was on a remote island. Sorry I was on an island. I have used that before. Shamelessly. Oh, sorry, I was on a

remote island sending puffins. Sorry, I didn't see your email. Dude, I would be sending that from my couch at home on days that I didn't want to go out. Well, they don't know which days I was in the field and which days I wasn't. Perfect excuse. Just a burrow of one's own. Any advice for anyone that wants to become a puffinologist? You really got to be okay with strong smells, but also just existing with bird shit on you. You're getting pooped up. You're getting fired on from the skies. It's constant. The air traffic is constantly above you. So you're getting it from that angle. And then if you're doing

any kind of burrow checks, their burrows are tidy, like they they're so civilized. But there's still a little hoop piles in there and the mud is sludgy and it all kind of just melds together on your arm and this lovely little paste of God knows what. So yeah, you have to be comfortable being dirty. And some people have quite a phobia and I can understand why of like things flying above you in large numbers. If you do not like birds, then do not become a puffinologist. That's pretty obvious though. There's a puffinologist. That's pretty, that's pretty obvious though. There's a lot of birds. A lot of birds in the job, yeah.

This is amazing. You're the only puffinologist I know. You're also my favorite one. Thank you, Ali. I gotta throw some babies off some cliffs. So ask adventurous people ignorant questions because sometimes the answers are not so simple. Do follow Jill Taylor on Instagram and TikTok. We have linked her pages right in the show notes and she's wonderful on both platforms. We are at Ologies on Instagram and X. I'm at Alley Ward on both. Alley has just one L.

Smology's again are shorter kid-friendly versions and they have peeled off to become their own show. So that's linked in the show notes. So please tell your friends with kiddos or anyone who needs shorter clean versions. We're super happy to launch. We hope more people know about them. Thank you to Erin Talbert who adminns the Alludy's podcast Facebook group and congrats to my bonus little brother, her actual brother Tom, on tying the knot this week. I've known him since he was a two-year-old. Avalyn Malik and The Wordery makes our professional

transcripts. Kelly Ardweier does the website, Noel DeWaard schedules the shit out of interviews as our scheduling producer, Susan Hale, manages and directs the whole thing as managing director. Jake Chafee is our new additional editor and lead editor who would never throw any babies off a cliff unless it was a puffin. It is Mercedes Maitland of Maitland Audio. Nick Thorburn wrote the theme music and if you stick around until the end of the episode, I'll tell you a secret.

And while I was trapped in the Salt Lake City Airport for nine hours yesterday, waiting for my connecting flight to Chicago, which was so late, I was sitting in this giant open space, smack in the middle of the airport, surrounded by a bunch of people on their phones and laptops, a lot of heavy size, tired business laptops, a lot of heavy-sized, tired

business travelers, and this abandoned piano behind me. Suddenly I hear someone sit down and bust out really melancholic classical music. No sheet music, just from memory, just tinkering around while I'm sitting there in an oversized blazer crying. So to the lovely girl who braved a terminal full of strangers to go tinker on those keys, made my whole day. If you see an empty piano somewhere and you know how to play it, please do.

Cause you'd never know if there's a lady drinking a warm soda saying, hey man, I needed that. Okay, bye bye. Hacodermatology, homology, cryptozoology, lithology, nanotechnology, meteorology, nephrology, nephology, cryptozoology, lithology, nanotechnology, meteorology, nephrology, seriology, pseudonyms. That's the last time I'm kissing a fucking puffin.

Ha ha ha!