On Purpose with Jay Shetty - LIZZO EXCLUSIVE: “Releasing The Weight Has Affected People” The Real Transformation Story She’s Never Shared Before

Episode Date: April 7, 2025

How would your life change if your healing reshaped not just your body, but your entire way of being? What if the real change wasn’t about losing anything—but about gaining a deeper connection to yourself? In this deeply vulnerable episode, global superstar Lizzo sits down with Jay for an unfiltered conversation about loss, boundaries, transformation, and what it really feels like living in the spotlight. Lizzo shares how her loyalty to friends and her habit of seeing the good in everyone sometimes came at the cost of her own peace. She shares what happened when she finally stopped chasing relationships that no longer served her—and how distance gave her clarity on who was truly in her corner. Lizzo opens up about the pain of letting people go, the reality of feeling isolated, and the music that came out of her lowest moments. Lizzo dives deep into how the recent public scandal impacted her—and why she’s now more intentional than ever with her words, her energy, and her healing. Lizzo opens up about the responsibility of being a public figure, how her weight release journey evolved into a powerful personal transformation, and why she's chosen to let go of toxic energy. In this episode, you’ll learn: How to Let Go of One-Sided Relationships Why Some People Disappear When You Set Boundaries How to Honor Your Emotions Without Editing Them How Your Energy Shapes What You Attract How Love Without Drama Becomes a Flow State What It Means to Grow Apart Without Guilt Why Intentional Healing Starts With Self-Awareness Lizzo’s transformation is a reminder that you can still believe in people—and protect yourself. You can evolve—and still be soft. And you can face the hardest season of your life—and still come back to love. With Love and Gratitude, Jay Shetty Join over 750,000 people to receive my most transformative wisdom directly in your inbox every single week with my free newsletter. Subscribe here.  Join Jay for his first ever, On Purpose Live Tour! Tickets are on sale now. Hope to see you there!  What We Discuss: 00:00 Introduction 02:31 Sound Healing 07:40 Astrology Changed My Life 15:27 Protecting My Peace 25:29 The Scandal: Aftermath 33:51 Discover Your Voice & Love Yourself 46:50 Setting Boundaries  58:40 Becoming A Better Lover 1:05:50 Growth Feels Like A Loss To Others 1:15:45 Lizzo on Final Five Episode Resources: Lizzo | Website Lizzo | YouTube Lizzo | Instagram  Lizzo | TikTok  Lizzo| XSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Something unexpected happened after Jeremy Scott confessed to killing Michelle Schofield in Bone Valley Season 1. Every time I hear about my dad, it's, oh, he's a killer. He's just straight evil. I was becoming the bridge between Jeremy Scott and the son he'd never known. At the end of the day, I'm literally a son of a killer. Listen to new episodes of Bone Valley Season 2 starting April 9th on the iHeart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. of a killer. In person. Join me in a city near you for meaningful, insightful conversations with surprise guests. It could be a celebrity, top wellness expert, or a CEO or business leader. We'll dive into experiences designed to experience growth, spark learning, and build real connections. I can't wait to meet you.

There are a limited number of VIP experiences for a private Q&A, intimate meditation, and a meet and greet with photos. Tickets are on sale now. Head to jsheddy.me forward slash tour and get yours today. It's not me anymore. Whoever Lizzo is to the world is not really even me. And that disconnect is depressing. The Grammy goes to Lizzo.

What's making you feel like now's the right time and what's giving you the confidence and courage to feel that way? I think what I learned about fame is, even if that's really me, it just becomes kind of like character. It's a brand that now doesn't belong to you anymore. What is your TLA?

Thank you, guys. There was a huge scandal I was dealing with a lot. Some people like the world just don't love me back. I had my first panic attack ever, and I had this thought, I was just like, you wanna die, okay, well just die. Like, nobody would f***ing care. I think it's also hard when the things that you stand for

are the same things that you're being scrutinized for. So when I pop out on a red carpet or when a video suddenly goes viral and my body's different, it appears like it was overnight. The weight that is no longer on me is not just fat or physical. I released so much to get to this point.

And to be honest with you, I don't feel like I've expressed myself fully in the last two years. The number one health and wellness podcast. Jay Shetty. Jay Shetty. The one, the only Jay Shetty. Oh my gosh, Lizzo, it is so great to have you here. I have been wanting to do this for years.

We're such huge fans here. And the last time I saw you, you were performing live at Cannes, Lions. You were on stage for the iHeart Festival. I was out there and I'd been told that I had two front row seats reserved so that I could hear you. Now what happened is I came into the event, I got into a few conversations.

My podcast producer who's in the back right now, was meant to take me to this seat. She's such a big fan that she forgot to take me to this seat. So by the time I wanted to make it to this seat, the whole crowd was covered. She was dancing in the front row. She claims, she claims you said to her

that you were really proud of her dancing skills or shouted something out at her in a really cool way. I'll have to verify what it was. But I didn't get to be front row. So I was sitting at the back enjoying your music from the back. Well, you're in front row now, baby. I know. How lucky am I? Front and center. How lucky am I?

But no, honestly, we're such big fans here. And like I said, we've been looking forward to this. And even the first few seconds, we've just been pow-wowing and going back and forth. It's been awesome. Oh, yeah. We've been chatting it up, honey. I love it. All right, well, I want to ask you. I saw that video on your Instagram.

You were standing in a soundball. I have not been to that class yet. I have not seen that before. So what am I doing wrong? Well, you don't have my mama and my sister because that was a Christmas gift from them. I remember on Christmas day, they got me this, it was like a huge thing that they dragged in that was wrapped.

And I was like, what could y'all have possibly gotten me in this huge? And they were like, we're so excited. And I unwrapped it and I was like, is this like a water bowl? And they're like, no, you, and I saw the footprint, there's feet, like footprint, big footprints in it. And they're like, you stand in it. And I was like, and then what? And it's like, and then you sound bath. And I'm like, this is actually wild. And so I was having like

a really emotional day. I was like, I was very close to crash out. I dragged it outside, took my shoes off, put my feet in the earth for a second, stood in it and just rang it. And I was like, I still don't feel better. I was like, I still don't feel better. And then I hit it, I kept hitting it and I was like, oh, this is kind of fun. And it, yeah, changed my day. I brought out my other bowls and I sat and I just hummed and played them. And it literally changed my day. And I was actually, I was pessimistic about it.

I was like, this is not going to work. And that was the first time you tested it out? It was the first time I tested the, Since Christmas, I tested the big one out. Wow! Yeah, I was shocked. Yeah, because I've never seen one with footprints. Like I've never seen one that you stand in. I've seen ones that you lie down and they play them at your head.

Or sometimes they come and put a crystal on your chest. Yeah. Like I've been in those and I love them. We actually did one with my team. We do a team retreat every year and we did one last year. But we did it outdoors. And we had this amazing sound healer come and lead it. And when we woke up, we all could see like shooting stars.

What is going on? And then we realized it was Neuralink. It was Elon Musk's like, you know, it was just this thing. Yeah, whatever it is. I can't remember what it's called, but we all woke up thinking like we could see something magical, but it is such an amazing experience to have sound heal you and that frequency. Did it finally work when you were standing in it?

Like, yeah, my ankles started itching and I was like, what's going on? I feel like ants were crawling on my ankles and I kept scratching at them. And I was like, oh, that's it's waking. It's awake. It's awakening me. It's so funny because I host these, um, I call them ass rams once a year. So it's like these little retreats that I do for all of the black women in my life that I love and I care about. And it's like an emotional and spiritual reset.

And we do sound baths in the morning and we do sound baths at night. And this one time I was laying there and I like allowed myself to really just like go. And it was so trippy. We all saw the same thing. I was like, cause she was asking everyone, they were like, yeah, I saw like pink and purple. And it was like, yeah, I saw pink and purple. And it was like, and I saw a galaxy and it was like, I saw a galaxy. So we all kind of like, it's real.

Like I have too much proof that there's something else going on out here and it's all kind of guided by vibration. It's all led by vibration. Absolutely. And on a very, very base level, if someone hasn't tried it out, A, they should try it out. And B, it's like we all know that sound makes us feel a certain way. There's songs from your past that make you feel nostalgic.

There's music that can make you cry instantly. There's sounds that make you feel thoughtful and reflective. We all now work to lo-fi beats or whatever it is on YouTube playlists. And there's a sense that sound and frequency has an impact on us. And this is just taking it to another level. So... The way I like to describe it, because I'm very like science in woo-woo. Yes.

Like, it... Me too. I'm a tourist, so you know, I need like the grounding of it. We're constantly vibrating. I think when people hear vibration, they think like, okay, girl, like, oh, we're on a vibe. I'm like, no, you know your heart is beating constantly. Your blood is coursing through your veins

and you're like made mostly of water. So when your heart is beating, it's sending a vibration through your entire body. Like if you sit still enough, you can feel like the vibration. So it's like everything is constantly vibrating and you can vibrate high and you can vibrate low and you actually have the power to control that. And once I learned that, I was like, oh, it's like a cheat code to life, to

existing. So well said. I love that. And did the playing of the sound balls come naturally to you? I can play anything. I found that like, I can like, if I lick my finger and I have a crystal glass, I can make a sound. I think that's just one of my gifts is that like when I was a kid I played recorder and then I

played flute and then I played piccolo and then I can play clarinet and I could play piano and now I play guitar. So I think with sound bowls I think I just am an instrumentalist and it's an instrument. Give me an instrument and I'm gonna make a beautiful sound. Yeah that's impressive because it's not easy to do. It's pretty challenging, so that's awesome. I'm the guy who can't even whistle, so let alone like... Wait, so you can't do the bowls? No, no, no, no, no. It's hard. It's hard.

My wife's a bit better than me. We have a few beautiful ones at home, but it's hard. Oh, I can really make them sing to where your ears start to... It gets like really loud in your ears and you're like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, is somebody in there with like a bowl in my head? That's how it starts to feel sometimes. I need to come to one of your ashrams if I'm allowed. Oh my God, we're going to open up ashrams to everybody very soon.

I love it. That's so fun. And Lizzo, I know you're huge into astrology, right? Like that's something that you're really passionate about. I was wondering, have you ever had a conversation with an astrologist that really changed your life? Something they said that just shifted everything. Yes, Channing Nicholas is my like astrologer. And so like every eclipse season, I'm texting her,

I'm like, hey, happy eclipse season, what's happening? But when I, so I've had a knowledge of my sign ever since I was a little kid. Like, so I was super into crystals and like, oh, I'm a Taurus and like ever since I was a little kid. So I was super into crystals and like, oh, I'm a Taurus and like my dad's a Libra, my mom's a Virgo and like compatibility. But then as I got older, when I met Channing Nicholas,

she taught me about the chart and how like you're more than just your sun sign and how you're big three, but it's like you're more than your big three too. You've got these like asteroids that go through and you've got these like, you've got the rock, you've got everything. Your Venus matters, your Mercury matters.

That really reframed how I think of myself because it kind of opened me up to being like, oh, I'm the universe. Like I contain multitudes. Like if I see a tourist trait that doesn't resonate with me, is there a Gemini trait that resonates with me? Is there a Virgo trait that resonates with me? Is there a Virgo trait that resonates with me? And I think the most impactful thing I learned

from her lately is that we have like house years. And so 2023, I was in a 12th house year. And that's the year of hidden enemies. That's the year of shadow work. And once she told me that, it like really unlocked for me because I was like, oh, that makes sense. And then she was like, you're going into a first house year. So I've been in a first house year since April, 2024.

And now my birthday is coming up in April, 2025. And I have taken advantage of this first house year because I'm a Leo rising and my first house is all about self and how I present. So I was just like, I'm a Leo rising and my first house is all about self and how I present. So I was just like, I'm going to go in. Like everything is routine. Everything is like a practice. I'm just like, I'm so deep into my practice

and like loving on myself and rediscovering and redefining who I am. And now when I move into my second house year, I'm going to take advantage of that too. What's different about the second house here that you move into? So it's going to be Virgo, which is my moon. And actually it's these practices that I've been doing on an external level, how I like make them internal. You know, how I reframe my membrane and rework the nuts and bolts in my brain and like make it like my life.

Like right now it's a routine, but I'm going to make it a lifestyle and I'm going to get really cerebral with my Virgo moon and I'm going to get really meticulous and I'm going to get really into paint, like hard working. Cause that's what that Virgo is. That Virgo allows me to like work my ass off and that's where I really shine and that's where I'm really the most happy. That's what I'm working honestly.'s where I'm really the most happy. It's what I'm working, honestly.

Yeah, I'm a Virgo. So yeah, I was like, oh yeah. We're related a little bit. Yeah, absolutely. I love that. And I love how you're describing it. It sounds like you're a phenomenal astrologer because I feel like there's such a deep way

of knowing how to use it, right? It's not just something that I think for all of us who've been exposed to astrology since we were young, it was like, oh my God, it knows me. It's predicting. It's this, it's compatibility, but it's so much more. It's like, how are you using it for personal growth and self growth? Like, how do you use that as, okay, this is what I'm going to focus on? Well, first of all, I used to be like, oh, it's what I am.

And that's why, but it's not like, oh, I, I am a tourist. It's I have tourists, which I think gives it a little bit more purposefulness and it makes it a tool. So I'm like, how can I use my Leo rising right now? Big hair, big personality, big identity, big bold expression, color, fire. How could I use this fire right now? Because that's what I have right now. And then when I'm in Virgo, how do I use this earth?

How do I use this knowledge? How do I use this quest for knowledge? This hard workingness, this steadfastness? How do I use that? How do I use the private parts of myself and protect the private parts of myself? I think that is how astrology has been very helpful to me because it's not just like what I am. I don't just settle for it.

I'm like, oh, well, that's why, because they are Scorpio. That's why. No, it's like they have Scorpio and that's what they're choosing to do with it. I have Taurus and what I'm choosing to do with it is be ruled by Venus. I want to be all things beauty and love, you know what I mean? With a little bit of sprinkle of hard work. Yeah, yeah. And you know, gluttony.

Little gluttony. I love that. I love the way you're talking about astrology. It's so refreshing because obviously you're so deep into it. And I think that's, and it sounds like that's similar to why you were, last year you said, I'm taking a gap year, I'm going to protect my peace. Yeah. Was that part of it? To know that you're in that house year?

Like that was giving you that sense as well? Man, once I learned what a 12th house year is, it did kind of make sense. You know, because I'll fight against closing up and isolating. I'll fight against it because it was like a toxic trait that I had when I was younger. Like I would get, and mind you, I already told you, I've been crying a lot lately, so if I cry, it's not because I'm sad, I just am real sensitive lately and googly-eyed. But when I was younger, instead of expressing myself,

I would lock up and get really quiet and shut down and just like hold it all in. And I went to a point where I didn't speak for like a whole summer. And when I was younger, I didn't talk to anyone, I didn't speak for like a whole summer and when I was younger, I didn't talk to anyone, I didn't talk out loud. The only time I used my voice was at night and I would sing to myself and that was it. So I thought that that was a really toxic trait and I have been working on expressing myself. So when you see me online, that's a form of expression for me that I've worked to get to. When I talk to the people who I work with that's a form of expression that I

Worked really hard to get when I express myself to my friends and my family and my loved ones I've worked hard for this so to be quiet was like, oh my gosh I'm reverting back to a version of myself that that I worked away from But I think once I learned like hey girl, you don't always need to be you don't always need to be, you don't always need to talk. Sometimes you need to sit back and just be quiet and observe what's in front of you now and be present.

Stop being in the future, stop lamenting in the past. What's in front of you right now? And like, when I said I was on a gap year, I was in the middle of it. And I think people were like, oh, she's about to take a whole year off. I'm like, no, I was just in the middle of it. And I think people were like, oh, she's about to take a whole year off. I'm like, no, I was just in the middle of it. I just hadn't like expressed myself really.

And to be honest with you, I don't feel like I've expressed myself fully in the last two years, like how I want to. I feel like I've been kind of holding my tongue and like staying to myself, but I think that it's for the best. Because you know, running your mouth these days, sometimes it's just unnecessary.

And sometimes it can get you into some stuff you wasn't even trying to get into because people will misinterpret it and run with it. As I found when I was like, I'm taking a gap year, I'm protecting my peace. But like people were like, wait, so what's that supposed to mean? I'm like, oh, oops, I just wanted to let you guys know where I'm at right now.

I'm in Bali and I'm having a good time and I'm just like quiet. Oops, maybe I should have stayed quiet. That's the funny thing, right? Even when you announced that you're going to go quiet and it's like, it's hard. It's, it's, it's hard to figure it out. When, when do you feel, it almost seems like you feel more comfortable now, like being, stepping your toe back in, wanting to show more of yourself, wanting to be that way. What's making you feel like now's the right time and what's giving you the confidence and courage to feel that way? Something unexpected happened after Jeremy Scott confessed to killing Michelle Schofield in Bone Valley season one. I just knew him as a kid. Long silent voices from his past came forward.

And he was just staring at me. And they had secrets of their own to share. Um, Gilbert King, I'm the son of Jeremy Lynn Scott. I was no longer just telling the story. I was part of it. Every time I hear about my dad, it's, oh, he's a killer. He's just straight evil. I was becoming the bridge between a killer and the son he'd never known. If the cops and everything would have done their job properly,

my dad would have been in jail. I would have never existed. I never expected to find myself in this place. Now, I need to tell you how I got here. At the end of the day I'm literally a son of a killer. Bone Valley Season 2. Jeremy. Jeremy I want to tell you something. Listen to new episodes of Bone Valley Season 2 starting April 9th on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. And to hear the entire new season ad free with exclusive content starting April 9th, subscribe to Lava for Good Plus on Apple podcasts.

What I feel like people don't know is when you are a music artist, you are either on cycle or off cycle for an album. I think nowadays there's so much fast turnaround with music and there's like the deluxe of an album is kind of like an industry standard that I think we've forgotten like what it means to be on cycle and off cycle because everyone's always on. I had planned on being off cycle. That means you're not in the media, you're not doing interviews, your album cycle is done, like you're not going to be played on the radio as much because people aren't working your records,

you're not going to be promoting anything because you're working on the next album. So you can be on cycle and you can be back in the media and back in the press and back on tour. And I think, like, the best, most simplest answer as to why I'm back now is because my album's done. Like it really, this is my job, you know. I am a musical artist. I make studio albums. I put them out. I promote them. I tour them. And I do it because I'm really good at music. And I really want to help people with music because I know that music has saved my life. So I know it can save someone else's life. You know what I mean?

And I think that's like the most simple answer, but I think it's loaded this time because at the exact same time I was like, I'm going on a vacation. I'm going to be in Japan. I'm going to go to Kyoto and be in the woods and like disappear. I also had a huge scandal come out. And I think that it looked like I was shut down or silenced or hiding when really it was like, but it's just the end of my album cycle and this was planned.

So I think this album cycle, I'm going to have to do a lot of work that I'm cool with expressing that and explaining that because I don't think people knew or know the difference between me being like, oh, I'm off cycle. I'm in Japan. I'm in the woods and I'm meditating and oh, this scandal just happened. Where's Lizzo? You know what I mean?

So I'm aware of that, cognizant of it, and I'm up for the challenge of explaining this to the people who care about me. Because they deserve to know, honestly. Yeah, I mean, it's... First of all, I think it's always an education, learning about how a business works. And I think if you're not in the business, you don't really get it. And I think that's true for any career whatsoever, especially careers in the public eye, right?

You're like, oh yeah, where did that person go? And it's like, well, the way you launch music is you need time to make music. And it takes so much time. And it's very visible because music is the biggest thing in the world. So you see someone for a few months and then you don't see them again when they're working on it. So you're saying that not only were you meditating, you were traveling, you were actually working on new music.

So when you said, I was protecting my piece, I was taking a break. For the last year, you were working on music. That's what we're hearing now. Baby, when I... The last day of my tour was in Tokyo, I spent a whole month in Tokyo, in Kyoto. It was my first time in Japan. It was my dream place. I always wanted to go south, a little girl watching anime.

I took that time. I stepped foot back into America and I walked into the studio. I've been in the studio since October 2023. And I think I finished my last studio session for Love in Real Life last week when I mastered it. I've been working constantly this whole time. I didn't take no time off. I couldn't, I really honestly couldn't.

I took that little time in Japan that I allowed it for myself and I got in the kitchen. And I rolled my sleeves up. Because I knew I was going to have to do my biggest one. You know? Yeah. And the new music's great. Thank you.

Yeah, it's awesome. And I feel like, I mean, even when you called it Love in Real Life, I feel like how much of that was inspired by what you personally had to go through and the challenges or how much was that was just pulling from other parts of your life. Was it disconnected or was it connected? Everything that I do, I pull from the strife and the grief that happens to me. Because the joy that I find eventually, I think is the helpful part. I've never named an album before writing a song before.

Like, well, cause I love you, I wrote cause I love you. I was like, okay, this, this sounds like the thesis of the album. Okay, we're gonna call this album cause I love you. I wrote special and I was like, this sounds like the heart of the album. I'ma name this album special. When I say I've had the name Love and Real Life

since September, October 2023, and I didn't write the record Love and Real Life until maybe like February 2024. Because I had a very specific experience, and I'd love to share it. I want to talk about it as much as I can. And I never like repeating stories because I just feel like everyone's different.

I'm like, let me give you something different. But this story was so life-changing. I told you like when I was in Japan, I was doing the best I can, but there was a huge scandal I was dealing with a lot. When I touched down in Los Angeles It didn't hit me how deeply affected I was Because I had been trying to be happy for everyone else

I had had my best friend was there with her kids and I was trying to be happy for everybody I was like and I'm in Japan. I should be happy so I like was like be happy I got in LA I had my first panic attack. I was in the car coming home from the airport and I was like, something's wrong with my chest. I was like, okay. And I've dealt with anxiety for years, but this felt different. And I was like, okay, something's going on with my chest.

And I was like, okay, do your anxiety protocol. And anxiety protocol wasn't working. Like breathing and the circular breath. And I was like, no, something is pressing on my chest. And I had this thought, I was just like, everybody hates me. Everybody hates me for something that isn't true, but at the end of the day, because of the position I'm in, everybody hates me and there's nothing you can do about it. And I was like, okay, I got into the house,

I could barely walk and I like collapsed by my bed and was like, oh shit, I couldn't breathe. And I was like, and I was by the bed and I couldn't breathe and something was pressing on my chest. And from then on, I had been in a state of depression because I didn't know how to fix it. I was so, and I'm not trying to make nobody feel bad for me, but man, woo, baby, I was dark and I was scared of people.

I was like, you can't trust anyone, you can't love anyone. I don't want to talk to nobody, you know, because there was like a lot going on where like people were getting weird phone calls from people and it was like weird, like stuff going on that I had never experienced before. Cause I was like, this, this is wild. This is a whole nother level of what I've,

my job that I've never experienced. And so I was scared and I was like, I'm going to go to this concert because I really wanted to go to the scared. And I was like, I'm going to go to this concert because I really wanted to go to the concert. And I was like terrified to go. I was like, I know I'm going to walk out and somebody's going to look at me and be like... And, you know, I was just like,

and there's nothing you can do about it. But I went anyway. And man, when I say it was the opposite, I walked out and I just seen so many people look at me and they were like, Lizzo, they were like, oh my God, they were like, come here, I love you, I love you. And it was just people in a crowd and I was hugging them and they was hugging me. And I'm telling you, like, people were, they were like, yes, yes. They were just like, it felt like me cheering me on being like, you did it. You know, you got over your fear.

You got outside. You can trust people again. You can love people. People do love you. You're okay. And you know what? There's something you can do about it. And you did it.

You stepped outside. And I was like, this is the only thing that's real. You can't get this kind of love on the internet. You can't, you absolutely can't. And I thought I could for years, years, because I built my platform on the validation of sharing myself and being myself with the internet and being embraced and being shown love. And I was like, this is love.

No, love is in real life. And I felt it from not it. I won't even say they're fans of my music, just people. Oh, it was the most life-saving thing. And I was like, I have to name my album Love in Real Life, because I know I'm not the only person. I know I'm not the only person who sits on their phone and creates a version of themself or is told by the world who they are and starts to believe it. Even if it's not really who you are,

you're like, huh, maybe I am not good enough. Maybe I'm not pretty. Maybe I'm not cool. And it's like, no, this is a lie. This may be a reflection of some things and some real things do happen on here. And I love the internet. I'm a child of the internet.

Like I get down with social media. But I also know that if your only sense of self, your only form of validation is coming from social media or coming from your phone or coming from a text back or coming from a dating app, it's not going to fill you up like being in the real world and building community with people. And getting over your fear of it because it is scary.

And so, I've held that title and I was like, I wrote like four love in real life. Until I finally settled on the party stadium version. I said, why is this one so lit? Like I wrote these deep emotional ones and then I wrote this one and was like, well, that's Lizzo. And I think that was when I just realized, oh, this is who I am. I go through this really, really tough shit, man.

And it's fine because I have learned to use my alchemy and turn it into gold and turn it into meaningfulness and like acts of rebellious joy that people can use in the world. And I'm cool with it. That's my mission. Yeah, I love that. I love that. One of the things that I think you talked about there,

which is so powerful is you go through something really difficult. On the other side of it, there's this love in real life. But in between, there's the depression, the darkness, the isolation, the worry, the fear. And we all go through that. We all experience at some point in our life, we were almost feeling like we have to hide. We feel like you said, I don't know who to trust, who to love, will people accept me? How did you go through that? Like, what was that timeline like?

Like, what did it look like when you woke up? What did you do that helped? What did you, who did you go through that? Like, what was that timeline like? Like, what did it look like when you woke up? What did you do that helped? What did you, who supported you? How did it look? Man. Because that's hard. I inadvertently set a lot of boundaries at that time. And it was more like defenses because I was so afraid of people that, even the

people that I was close to, I just, I set up these boundaries and I disappeared into myself. I'm not even gonna sit up here and lie and be like, I handled it perfectly, I didn't. I didn't. It was very messy. And I was hurt by people that I loved,

and I hurt people that I loved at the time. This is, and I'm talking about the depression period. I'm not talking about me as a boss. I'm not talking about work. No, I'm talking about October, 2023 to now. And I fought really, really hard for myself. And sometimes when you fight, it get real messy. I was scrapping, I was fighting for my life.

There was times when it was like, you wanna die, okay, we'll just die. Like nobody will care. And I was like, oh, I'm talking to myself like that? When did this happen? I'm like, love yourself. I'm like, stay positive. I'm like, no, you have to live. You have to live for your mommy. You have to live for the... And it was like, no, bitch, you want to die? Die. Like, this is the time to do it. Cause no, everyone will hate you and nobody cares. And I think that defensiveness isolated me really bad, but there's something about isolation that turns into solitude,

that turns into introspection, that turns into I am sitting alone with myself and I can finally see her. I was covered up by so much that I couldn't see myself. I was blinded by all these people in my space telling me who I am. I was blinded by my career standing on stage and 20,000 people saying, I love you, you're amazing. I'm like, okay, thank you.

Like I gotta push through. And I was never alone. I was never alone. Even when I was at home, I'd be like, you wanna come over? Let me throw something. Let me throw a pool party. Let me have people come over and drink wine.

Like maybe it was a fear of being alone with myself. Maybe it was a lack of self-awareness. But in that isolation, where I think my defensiveness had pushed off and pushed away the people I love the most, I pushed them all away. I got to like sit with this person and I saw the things that other people saw sometimes that aren't the coolest or the nicest or that I'm the most proud of.

I'm like, you are, you're moody, you're uncomfortable. You forgot who you are. You forgot why you're here. And I think that during that time, I embraced that part of myself. It's like, okay, you're moody, be in a mood, but what do you need to do to make yourself feel better in that mood? And what can you do to protect yourself in that mood

and protect others? Sit by yourself, bitch, read a book, learn how to finally consistently meditate. Exercise, get some fresh air, get in the sun. And it was like I forced myself to do that shit. That shit is not easy. I didn't want to exercise at first, hell nah. But I got one, got that cardio machine,

and I was like I never regret moving my body. I never regret it. I started, it's an anxiety technique. It's like you focus on your senses. Like, what can I smell? What can I taste? What can I see? What can I feel?

And I started doing that not intentionally. I'm not a genius when it comes to this shit. I just started doing it. I was like, what are you eating? What are you putting in your body? You're putting things in your body that's making you sick. You know, what are you doing on a daily basis? You're bed rotting, and that's fine sometimes,

but also when you're always doing it, your body doesn't move. You know, what are you looking at? What are you watching on TV? I had to throw my phone away. I'm about to throw my phone away. I'm like, oh God, it writes itself. I threw my phone away. I did not look at god, it writes itself. I threw my phone away.

I did not look at it. I told my team, I said, anything I need to post or anything I want to post, you post it for me. I don't want to look at that shit no more. And that was hard too, because I love the internet. But it's doing a lot of things that are hard to finally be like, this is who I am, and I need to become, I need to love her, and I need to make her the best version of myself.

Because guess what? Even after all this shit, even after looking at this aspect of myself that I was like, wow, that's not my favorite part of myself. You know, after all the things I've been through, all the relationships that have come and gone in my life, I still deserve it. I really do. And it's all I have.

And it's all I got. Sorry for cussing. It's all I got. Yeah. Because what are you going to sit up and you're going to beat yourself up for the rest of your life about anything that could have happened or any misunderstanding or any, you know what I'm saying? Well, you're going to have

a miserable life. Do you want a miserable life? I sat and had to ask myself that. I'm like, do you want to be miserable? Do you want to feel bad or do you want to get back to doing what you do? And I was like, damn it, I got to do what I do. I got to. I couldn't be more excited to share something truly special with all you tea lovers out there. And even if you don't love tea, if you love refreshing, rejuvenating, refueling sodas that are good for you, listen to this. Radhe and I poured our hearts into creating

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That's drinkjuni.com and make sure you use the code on purpose. Whatever we've been through, everyone's been through a feeling like that where they've just gone, yeah, I just, I don't think I can do it anymore. I don't think I can do it again. And one thing you said there,

and I know we were talking about Steve Jobs earlier, Steve Jobs always talked about how there's such a need to disconnect from the outer noise to hear your inner voice. And so you can't really hear your inner voice unless the outer noise. And when you're talking about throwing your phone away and disconnecting, and sometimes when we're pushing away the outer noise, we might not do it in the most graceful way because we've realized that tension between like, oh, but I was used to that noise being my voice and now that noise isn't what I want to hear.

And now I actually have to find my voice. Now I actually have to like discover it again. I have to like figure out what it's even saying and what it sounds like. Right? That's, that's where you have to go through that process. That's hard. Because it's such... It can feel so lonely.

And it can feel so isolating, as you said. As you're dealing with that and you're kind of tipping your toe back into doing what you love, and you go out and you have that moment that you said, like, love in real life. And I love the way you explained that. I'm glad you told that story. When I hear you, I feel the same way.

It's like when you go out in the real world, people aren't shouting that stuff that they shout on the internet. No. No one's commenting the thing that you heard in the comment section. You're not hearing that when you're out and about. You're seeing real people have real reactions and there's this look in their eyes that we all feel and the energy. How did it feel after that day?

Was it from that day you were like, alright, now I feel more confident or do you still go back and forth sometimes? Hell no! I'm not even there now. Like, even you being like, oh my gosh, my wife is such a huge fan and we've wanted you on the show for a while. I was like, really? Like, I don't... It's true!

I don't believe it fully and I don't feel it fully. And I don't know what that is I don't feel it fully. And I don't know what that is. Maybe it's from like, you know, I was like a kind of a nerdy kid in high school and I would, or especially middle school. And I was like, you know, teased in middle school real bad. And like, maybe it's that like, I'm not cool mentality

that like never goes away because those are such formative years. So please be nice to people in high school. Because it really shapes your whole life. It made me cool. It made me a diamond. But I still struggle with believing love. And believing I am worthy of love. And believing that I am loved.

I think that those are motifs that are definitely still difficult for me and I can throw little tantrums about, but I need to... But that's on me. I need to sit back, like, honestly, putting it all out here. I'll be on the internet sometimes talking noise, and it's my insecurities. And I own that. I want to be more careful with that because of the position that I'm in now, you know, the responsibility I have now in the state of the internet now.

I can't just be projecting my insecurities on the internet. I think there is a more responsible way to do it to where people understand me more and that people know where I'm coming from and I can make it more of a personal thing instead of these blanket statements. Because it sounds like it's coming from a place of anger, but it's really not.

But it's just coming from these insecure moments that I have sometimes where I feel like, man, I feel like misunderstood. And I feel like people don't get me and I feel like people don't see me. And I'm like, how do I express myself in a way where you get me and you feel me and you see me? And like, I want you to know.

And I'm you to know. And I'm working on it. So before you would say it and now you're reflecting. Um, yes. Before I would say it, and when I say before, I mean like a couple weeks ago. I'm still, I'm, man, I'm human, man. I am. I'm really in this thing.

Human flesh and blood is so wild. But like, I think that I'm also human enough to admit where I could be better. And those are the places where I could be better. I was in that giant sound bowl banging that thing because it kept me from going on Twitch. It kept me from going on Blue Sky or going on, you know what I'm saying, TikTok and just, ah, because that's not the place for it anymore. I think there's enough going on in you know what I'm saying? TikTok and just, RRRRRRRRRRRRRRR I have people who love me. I have people who've never met me,

who love me because of the music that I make. And I get to travel all over the world and connect with those people and touch those people. I can support my family financially. As a fat black woman who was born in Detroit and raised in Houston, Texas, the odds were stacked against me and I beat the odds. And I'm here and I'm surviving and thriving in this world, I am

grateful and I think that my position is to always show that gratitude. I want to live in a constant state of gratitude and I want to emit that, you know, and I want to just really show the world love at all times. They don't need no more darkness. There's enough darkness in the world. It don't need to come from somebody like me. If I get insecure sometimes, call your mama. Call your mama. You know what I'm saying? Like, girl. So that's where I'm growing as a person. And I'm proud of the person I'm becoming.

Yeah. Well, Liz, I was going to say, I think it's your music, but it's also because you mean something to people. You know, like you've done, like when I think about my wife and what I was sharing with you earlier, it's because you mean something to her. When I was talking about Helena, my producer, it's because you mean something to her. Yeah. I think you mean something to people.

It's beyond just, they love your music for sure. But you mean something to people. And I think that that's why, like you said, when we were at school, it was all about whether you were cool, on whether you were trendy and whether you were, you know, the it girl or guy or whatever it was. But it's almost like it's even beyond that. When you mean something, it's beyond being cool and relevant. a lot of my points of depression were coming from because I had been so fearlessly myself for years. The person that you saw was the person that you got. That was really me and that is really me.

The issues that I spoke about, I really care about. The issues I stood up for, I really want to see change in. It really matters to me. The platforms that I give people, that's real. All of that is real. And I think what I learned about fame is even if that's really me, it just becomes kind of like a fictional story that you it's a character, it's a brand, it's a thing that now doesn't belong to you anymore. And when it got changed, that was what really my sense of self because I was like, well, now the person that you know, the world is saying I am, that's not even me. And that's shadow work.

I was like, that's like some shadow self that was created out of me not being precautious and careful and protecting myself. But I think that it really depresses me to feel like it's not me anymore. Whoever Lizzo is to the world is not really even me. And that disconnect is depressing. And I think the only remedy to that is continuing to be myself.

That's the only time. I just have to continue to be me and people will see me for who I am. But I think for a long time, I was really depressed about like, oh damn, like now there's this like fake character now. There's like this like, and you know, I can't blame or judge people for believing it, for believing that's who I am. I can't because I will be in the same position, you know? So I take the fact that I mean something to people

very seriously. I take it to heart. And it's why I have moved the way that I have moved my entire career. And it's why I, when things happened, I would speak on it, I would take accountability. It's why I did those things, because I know that. And I think when it was out of my control and someone else

could tell a story about me that wasn't true and people believed it, it crushed me because I know that I mean something to people. And it's why I'm careful to this day. I'm never going to stop being careful. If anything, I'm more careful now. I can't just let any author into my life who can make me a villain. I can't do that anymore because I am the author. And I'm taking back my narrative by continuing to tell my story from me. And thank you for giving me the opportunity to do that.

No, of course. I think everyone deserves that. You know, everyone needs that. And I think it's also hard when the things that you stand for are the same things that you're being scrutinized for, right? It's like that's what's so hard about it. It's like when you stand for inclusivity and empowerment, being questioned for those same things is like so painful and it kind of like dismantles your whole identity

even for yourself. Yeah. So I can imagine that's really hard. And that's why I think everyone needs an opportunity and a platform to be able to do that. But it feels like strangely like, it's this thing now where it's like, okay, if I stand up for inclusivity, it's invalidated. If I stand up for black women, it's this thing now where it's like, okay, if I stand up for inclusivity, it's

invalidated. If I stand up for black women, it's invalidated. If I stand up for body positivity and fatness and stand up against fatphobia, it's invalidated because of that. And I was like, wow, that's convenient. Like these are things I truly believe in. I'm not about to just pick up some new causes because it's the thing to do. I was a political and very vocal activist artist

before it was the trend, before teams were telling artists to speak up. Like, I was just doing it because I wanted to. It's an uncomfortable position to be in right now because I also know I have a responsibility to, like I said, only bring love. And I think me speaking on certain things, or even if I feel like I have a responsibility to, like I said, only bring love. And I think me speaking on certain things or even if I feel like I'm advocating for something, it's kind of creating more hate and chaos than what I intended.

So it's just like sometimes you just got to shut the f*** up. And that's hard too because you really care about it, right? Like I think that's the challenge. It's like you keep doing something because you really care about it, right? Like I think that's the challenge. It's like you keep doing something because you really care about it. That's why you started in the first place. But then sometimes you're like, well maybe it would be smarter for me to not comment on it. Because it's safer.

And not just safer for me, but like safer for the public. You know, I don't want to create divisiveness. I really don't. There's enough discourse. There's enough division. And I think that like me doing something that I thought was like, you know, for a good cause or like from the goodness of my heart, if it's taken and creates negative discourse where people are going back and forth, I won't say nothing.

I won't say nothing at all. Don't worry about me. You don't got to worry about me at all. Don't you worry, honey. And before you would have, that wouldn't have been your reaction, right? Before? No, because I feel like there was no opposition. I feel like when I spoke up,

the only opposition was the opposition to the cause. I think now when I speak up for something, there's opposition to me. It's like, ah, bad messenger, write message, bad messenger. And I'm like, oh, you know what? Valid, absolutely valid. As a famous person or a celebrity right now, this is what I signed up for.

And I'm like, so I'm not complaining. I can't complain. I'm do it. Like, I'ma just be quiet because I understand that it's creating more confusion than solution. And I only, I'm a solutionary. I'm a solutionary. I like to bring solutions.

I like to only speak up if I know it's going to help in some way. And if it ain't helping, zip it. Zip it. Something unexpected happened after Jeremy Scott confessed to killing Michelle Schofield in Bone Valley Season One. I just knew him as a kid. Long, silent voices from his past came forward.

And he was just staring at me. And they had secrets of their own to share. Um, Gilbert King, I'm the son of Jeremy Lynn Scott. I was no longer just telling the story. I was part of it. Every time I hear about my dad is, oh, he's a killer. He's just straight

evil. I was becoming the bridge between a killer and the son he'd never known. If the cops and everything would have done their job properly, my dad would have been in jail. I would have never existed. I never expected to find myself in this place. Now, I need to tell you how I got here.

At the end of the day, I'm literally a son of a killer. Bone Valley Season 2. Jeremy. Jeremy, I want to tell you something. Listen to new episodes of Bone Valley Season 2 starting April 9th on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. And to hear the entire new season ad-free with exclusive content starting April 9th, subscribe to Lava for Good Plus on Apple Podcasts.

I like that. Solutionary. Yeah. Solutions not confusion. That is definitely, I like that. And that's a great way for all of us to thinkolutionary. Yeah. Solutions not confusion. That is definitely... I like that. And that's a great way for all of us to think about stuff. Yeah. In our own personal life, whether it's public or not. It's like, is me speaking creating more confusion? Or is it actually getting us more clarity?

Is it actually pushing us in the right direction? Have you felt, you were saying like obviously, when you go through something like this, you've got to become more careful about... You were saying you don't want someone else to become an author of your journey. Yeah. It's like picking the people that are close to you becomes harder and harder and harder. Has that been like a real focus for you in surrounding yourself

with the right frequency and vibration? And how do you do that? I don't have any new people in my life anymore. And I'm very careful about... And honestly, a lot of relationships that I had are gone. Like, and it's not like bad, it's just like, I just, I stopped chasing. Because I, how do I say this? How do I say this?

I see the good in everyone. And I have seen the good in some really kind of like broken people who have done harmful things, but I always see the potential. I always see the good. And it's like that inner child in me that's like, oh my gosh, I can help them, but they are good. And I think that when they would do harmful things to me, I had a sense of forgiveness

and understanding and I would be like, I know that's not you. And so I would chase and pursue that relationship. And I'm not talking about romance. I'm talking about people I worked with, talking about friends who were also people I worked with. I was like, I was hiring my best friends, you know? And I would kind of see past it. And meanwhile, I was allowing something potentially nefarious or not good for me into my space.

Right? So I realized, and I think people all over the world, if when you put up a boundary that protects yourself and you stop chasing the people who continually hurt you, you'll find that pretty soon they'll be gone. And you'll be like, wait a minute, I was keeping this afloat the whole time? It was me? And so when I isolated, a lot of people just sailed away. And I opened my eyes and was like, who's left? And the people that are left are my best friend,

who I've known since like fourth grade. You know what I'm saying? And I love her and I cherish her. My boyfriend, you know? And I'm just like, wow. This is cool. I don't need to pursue anything or anyone anymore. I'm full. And I think that comes from that isolation.

And I think it comes from appreciating the people that you have. And from like a business perspective, when you're friends with somebody and you hire them, it's just like it gets the power dynamic. It's up the relationship. It's up the social structure of the relationship. And it's something that, you know, I wanted to do when I was younger. I was like, yeah, it puts money in my friend's pockets. Like, let's go, let's turn up, let's see the world. And it was, you know, something I loved.

But then I also realized it's not fair to them to be their boss and their friend. And that will help keep things just clean. Yeah. I just want, and like I said, simple solutions. I don't want no more confusion ever again. I want my friends to be my friends and I want my employees to be my employees. Yeah.

This is so real and I appreciate how like real you're being about it and how direct it is because I do think that it's A, it's glorified to be like, we should be like a family and everything should be really close. And I think that's like idealized, it's glorified. Like that's what people talk about. And I think recently, a lot of people have been talking about how teams should not actually operate as families.

They should operate as teams, like teams, like a sports team. There's a coach, there's players. The way they operate is like there's camaraderie, there's collaboration, but there's an energy of like, no, we're playing here to win. That's the goal of a team is to win. The goal of a family is not to win. The goal of a family is to just be safe.

And wait a minute, but we're a work to win and do stuff. We have results and targets. Families don't have targets. Families don't have results. Families don't have goals. The goal of a family is just to stay together. And you can see how it plays on our minds. And I've had that too.

Like, I used to think that teams should be family too. And there's a family energy. And I'm like, that's great. But it's like, there's just a different value system to a team and a family. And I think there's so much to be said for this that you only learn by going through it. You don't for this that you only learn by going through it. Yeah. You don't know this when you start. Like I think about how much I've had to learn

moving into this space for myself, doing this for the last 10 years. It's like, I didn't know. I've never built a team before. And just because I'm good at one thing doesn't mean I know everything about everything. And I think there's a lot of pressure on artists, creators, musicians to know about everything

when your talent is kind of like here, right? Yes. It's like your talent is music and creation, artistry and storytelling. And so you make everything music and creation and artistry and you're like, oh, this should be a creative space and this should be lax. And everyone's like, no, man, this is a well-oiled machine. If Lizzo is the brand that's the company, you know what I mean? It's like everybody has their role and it's just like, know your role and stay in your lane.

That's something that I've learned. I don't know. I'm not out of it, man. I'm still learning what's coming next, but I'm so grateful to God because this experience, and I'm not just talking about the scandal, I'm talking about the last two years of my life, the last, all of this, it has prepared me for, I think, something so incredible that I needed to be ready for, that I needed to be this way for. You know what I mean?

Because I was holding on to a lot of toxicity. I really was because that's just the kind of... And I'm not even talking about toxicity within myself. I mean, like, toxic systems and structures and people. I held on to them because I was just like, I'm a Taurus, you know, I'm very loyal. I'm just like, till the wheels fall off. And it's like, man, let go and flow. And I think that I had to learn that like guy tried to show me this so many ways. It was like, knock me over the head. I was like,

yeah, but that person was just mean. Knock me over the head. I was like, yeah, but that person was just mean. Knock me over the head, yeah, but that was just a misunderstanding. Knock me over the head. It was like, yeah, wake up. Wake up, let go. You know, when you can't let go, you hold on to things that weigh you down.

And I'm not even trying to talk bad about nobody because I feel like people needed to let me go too. Honestly, there are some relationships and dynamics that I know that like I was keeping them back from greatness. Do you know what I mean? Or not even, let's f*** greatness. Keeping them back from just like living. You know what I mean?

Living for themselves. And it's not my job to think about that. But I will say it's not just a, it's not a one-way street. I'm not sitting up here being the victim and being like, I had to do this for me. It's like, no man, it's mutual. There's somebody out there whose story is like, yeah, I had to let go and now I'm flowing and things are coming to me that are meant for me. You know, I'm not just holding on to this situation that's starting to whoop my ass.

You know, I'm aware of that. Yeah. So it sounds like this was the headspace from which the music was created. Absolutely. Like all of this. Yeah. I was so angry. I was like so, like, I was so angry from like October to January.

I just have a lot of angry songs. And I was like, get it out. Talk your shit. I had some songs that were very like, that are very dark, you know, and I left them on the album because I was like, I just think that people deserve to know. And like, it's songs about loss. Like I lost my dog, Puka, 20 years, you know, she was like a grandma to me, you know?

And that was really hard. I wrote a song for her and I have like songs about like just friendships that ended that really hurt me. And I was like, leave it. You know, I had this one song I wrote and like I hadn't slept in like 48 hours and it was like during one of the worst like mental breakdowns I've ever had in my life. Like I had the studio scheduled the next day and I hadn't slept and I was like tear stained face and like musty clothes. I was like I'm gonna go to the studio

I'm gonna go and I went and I wrote this incredible song and I'm like leave it Leave it, you know you you owe yourself that you don't always have to write perfect polished pop hits You can have songs about your real experience that you didn't go in and edit on this album. But then I wrote Love and Real Life in like February, and I was like, huh. I was like, this feels good. This feels familiar. And I started to realize my purpose.

My purpose, like I said, is to turn this pain into champagne and help other people through it. I can't just sit and be sad for 12, 15 songs. I got to give people something to step to, something to march to, something to perk themselves back up. I didn't do it because I forced myself to.

I did it because that was just the place I was at now. I had written so many sad songs, so many mad songs, so many wrong songs, that like I could finally focus on what's right and what feeds my soul. And so some of those songs made it onto the album, some of them didn't, some of them were just... A lot of them didn't. A lot of them I'm like,

ooh ooh, like you'll never hear this one. Never hear the light of day. But you still had to make it to let go of that emotion, that feeling. There was a part of it that allowed you to shed certain things you were carrying. And that's one thing I will tell any artist. It's like, make the song. It's not like once you record it, it's going to go on the radio tomorrow. It's not going to be on DSPs at midnight.

Write the song, say the lyrics, say the weird thing. People desperately want to hear the weird thing. And then write another song. And if you, you know what I'm saying? Like, that's part of the, how do I describe this? I always say like, there's some sort of stream of creation going always, and ideas like are coming out like fish. It's so wild.

And so you're always kind of like, when you sit down and cast your net to create, whether it's painting, whether it's writing, whether it's music, whatever, dance, you cast that line and whatever that fish is, you catch that fish, you pull it out, and that's it. You got to pull the fish out. You can't be like, I caught the fish, but I can't say that.

Or I caught the fish, but I don't like this genre of music. I can't make a classical twerk song. Yes, you can. Make the classical twerk song, pull the fish out, and go fishing again. Cast your line again. You know what I'm saying? What did they say? It's full of plenty of fish in the sea.

I love what you said about how creativity is a stream. And that's why the word stream is actually so beautiful because you're right that we're all pulling from the universe of moments of creativity and mixed with our experience. It's almost like one layer is the stream of creativity in the universe. And the other is the experience of real life of what we're going through. And great art is made when those two things

are moving in parallel. And you're able to like connect the dots between the two. And it seems like that's what you've been trying to stream and channel and put it together. How has your view on love changed through this process? Like when you look at the word love now. I'm such a better lover now. I worked really hard and I can't remember,

it was like 2017, I was really deep in it and I had like candles and I was reading books and I was trying to understand what it means to be an unconditional lover because love with conditions hurt really bad, really bad. And I was like, please I want to learn how to be an unconditional lover. And once I had all the crystals and all the candles and all the prayer and all the reading, and I was like, I get it. I get

unconditional love. I realized that like like, actually, as a human being, I'm incapable of unconditional love. We are. I think on a spirit level, vibrationally, we are unconditional love. And I think that is why it's hard to try to be an unconditional lover, because it's not something that you can actively do. You just are.

But when you tap back into your flesh, that's when the conditions come right back in. And I found that when I choose to love and flow, that is the most unconditional part. When I love on a material level, that's when the conditions start to come in, and it gets painful, and it gets petty, and it gets weird. But every time I forget, because we're going to forget, we are human beings, we step back into the flesh every morning when we wake up, I have to go back to the flow. And I remind myself, I'm like, well, how would you feel if they did

that to you? You know, how would you feel? What would you think? And I go, oh, and I empathize and I understand and it's so much easier for me now to accept. Because I think love is acceptance. You know what I mean? Like, one of my favorite phrases to tell myself and others is like, I love and accept you for who you are. I love and accept you for who you are. And sometimes when people piss me off, I go, I love and accept them for who they are. I love and accept you for who you are. And sometimes when people piss me off, I go, I love and accept them for who they are. I love and accept them. I have to remind myself that I do. On a very soul level, on a vibrational level,

I love them and accept them for who they are. Once I get into the material level, ah, you f***ed up my day, or why would you say that to me? Or why would you do this to me? It starts to get real conditional and painful and pain body and hateful and drama and mess. I don't want no drama and I don't want no mess. I really don't anymore.

And honestly, I was addicted to it for a long time. Oh my God, I love reality TV. I loved hearing gossip about other, I would be like, oh my God, so what's the tea? What happened? But what happened? Oh my God, like I was very spunky. You know what I mean?

And I realized, oh, that's like, you know, I see something online. I'm like, I go down the rabbit hole. I'm like, but what happened? I wanna know that drama. And it's like, girl, that is lowering your vibration. And like, I hate to even say lowering vibration because people gonna think it's woo woo.

It's like, I'm literally lowering my waking state by doing that. You're lowering yourself and then you start to attract drama. Oh my God. When you inject, when you are what you eat, when you eat drama, you attract mother-fucking drama. So awesome. I was so addicted to it. And I think like now I'm a better lover. And what I understand about love is love is like,

there's no drama. It's like calm water. It's like peaceful water because love is a flow state. You're at your best. You love at your best when you're just flowing. Don't try to understand it. Don't try to make it make sense and don't try to like find problems with it.

Just like love them, you know, and be loved. Don't try to make it make sense and don't try to like find problems with it. Just like love them. You know, and be loved. Something unexpected happened after Jeremy Scott confessed to killing Michelle Schofield in Bone Valley Season 1. I just knew him as a kid. Long silent voices from his past came forward. And he was just staring at me.

And they had secrets of their own to share. Um, Gilbert King? I'm the son of Jeremy Lynn Scott. I was no longer just telling the story. I was part of it. Every time I hear about my dad, it's, oh, he's a killer. He's just straight evil. I was becoming the bridge between a killer

and the son he'd never known. If the cops and everything would have done their job properly, my dad would have been in jail. I would have never existed. I never expected to find myself in this place. Now, I need to tell you how I got here. At the end of the day, I'm literally a son of a killer. Bone Valley, season two. Jeremy. day, I'm literally a son of a killer. Bone Valley Season 2.

Jeremy. Jeremy, I want to tell you something. Listen to new episodes of Bone Valley Season 2 starting April 9th on the iHeart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. And to hear the entire new season ad free with exclusive content starting April 9th, subscribe to Lava for Good Plus on Apple Podcasts. Yeah, I love that flesh to flow. That's really good because it's so good.

I love what you're saying because I think about this often where we're all like, be kinder to everyone. And then the next thing you need is someone's comment section, which is like, why does our voice sound like that? What's up with our hair today? Like, what's up with his, you know? And I'm like, wait a minute, didn't we all just say we needed to be kinder to us, each other and kinder to ourselves?

And we'll be like, oh no, mental health is the most important thing in society right now. You look at a comment section, all of a sudden someone's mental health is being absolutely destroyed for things they can't even control. Things that you don't even know why their voice sounds like that, or why their weight's like that, or why their health's like that. Like, you just have no context. And it's so fascinating to me that you see this complete quarrel

and hypocrisy of constant like just... Everything we're saying, we're finding it hard to live. Like it's hard to see in real life. Like what you just said, like we all love reading about gossip about someone else's life, someone else's dating scenario. But then if your friends are gossiping about your life, you're like, can you believe it? They're spreading rumors about me.

And it's so interesting, right? It's like, it's... And I think about it all the time because as soon as you think you're free of it, if you're like, oh no, I never gossip about anyone or whatever, then you just got to take a beat and take a look at how you spoke about someone yesterday. And so we're cons... Like you said, we're all human. We're constantly trying to propagate and preach the right thing to do. But we're all struggling in reality with actually doing it when it's hard. We are as kind to others as we are to ourselves.

I'm learning that. I'm learning the people who say the meanest things to me and about me are going through it. They struggling too. How are you going to be nice to me and say something nice about me when you talk down about yourself? And I don't even mean like people who have low self-esteem.

I'm talking like, ah, stupid. Why did I do that? I'm so stupid. Or like, oh, I look bad. Like, I don't like how I look. Like, oh, I hate myself. Like, it's little like how I look. Like, ugh, I hate myself. Like, it's little things like that that you say over and over and over and over

and your body's like, bet. You know? And that's why I'm so, man, I'm telling you, self-love can save the world. Because it starts with you. Self-love could make this world a better loving place. Because when you're kind, you notice the people who are kind to themselves and love themselves, they just, you're like, ooh, I like being around.

You're so kind. You're so nice. Like, why are you so nice to me? It's like, because I'm nice to me. You know what I mean? Yeah, that's real. But when I'm hard on myself and when I'm striving for perfection and when I'm striving for perfection, and when I'm beating myself up, and when I'm doing the most, I can't control how I treat other people,

or how I look at other people, or what I think about other people. When I'm in the trenches, the trenches, the trenches are surrounding me. Now that I'm kinder to myself, and that doesn't even mean like, ooh, I put on lotion every day, and self-care. I mean like, man, like the way I look at the world,

the way I view the world, the way I view myself through the lens of the world is kinder, you know what I'm saying? And I think if everyone was a little kinder to themselves, I think we'd have less and less of the negativity in the world. I agree. I think that's a beautiful way to put it.

It's that projection of our own insecurity and pain and the conversation that's happening in our mind is, is going outward as well. And I feel like it's harder, like we were talking about earlier, when you mean something to people, because I feel like when you then change, people feel like they're losing a friend. Right? It's like when you transform, then people feel like, oh, but you used to be the

girl that watched the reality TV and talked about it. Now you don't, like I'm losing you. Oh, you used to be the person who didn't do that and didn't do that. Now you are like, I feel like I'm losing you. Have you ever felt that way before? Like as you're transforming, as you're growing, as you're becoming the person you want to be that

people can often also feel like you're leaving them behind. People feel like they're grieving a friend. Yes. Yes. I would say we could talk about my personal life because on a personal level, I do feel like there's just people who like, our relationship just grew apart

because we just don't even relate on the same things anymore. You know? I know a lot of people be like, oh, I grew out of that. It's like, it's not really you grew out of it. You just grew apart from it. And that's fine. But I would say on like my public relationship,

I'm very careful about what's happening with me right now. Like I have been on an intentional weight release journey and I put it on the internet. I posted about it like maybe a year and a half ago and I was like very clear that this time it's intentional. I've always been very like work athletic online. I work out. You know I'm always like you know eating and showing how I eat and like always trying to like eat healthy. And I remember once I started becoming famous like 2018-2019 I was and I was like a big girl. And I was like, it's going to be on me to show the world that big girls can also be healthy.

Big girls can also have stamina. Big girls can also be loved. Big girls can also be sexy, etc., etc. All the things that I, you know, stood for. And I told people that I was going on an intentional weight release journey because I wanted to be transparent in that way. Because I do feel like I have a relationship with the public where it's like, I am their friend and it is relatable.

You know what I mean? It is relatable to struggle with your body. So I put it out there. And I think over the last year and a half, as I've been doing it, my body has been changing very slowly. But I don't think people were paying attention. I would show different things like, oh, I showed my workouts,

or I'd show what I eat in a day. Or I would say, I started off the year by being like, hey, new year, new me trends don't have to be toxic. Please be careful when you're posting about your January fitness goals, because it can be very fat phobic. Like I was still very like anti-fat phobia on this entire journey.

But I think that, you know, we got to remember everybody not seeing your shit all the time. Everybody not seeing every video you post. Everybody's not privy to what you're going through. They're not with you every day. So when I pop out on a red carpet or when a video suddenly goes viral and my body's different, it appears like it was overnight. It appears sudden. And I think that was shocking to a lot of people because now the headline is

Lizzo Skinny, which is a far cry from the truth because I'm not. I'm not. And even in my original video, I was like, when I reached my weight release goal, I'm not going to be considered thin by any means, by any metric, by any BMI. I will still get trolled and talked about and the fat jokes will still be there, but I'll be happy. And I said that because I meant it. And here I am. And I was like, how did y'all, how are y'all, how, where's the disconnect? But I think the disconnect is communication.

Yeah, yeah, that's such a good point. I've been so transparent. So if anyone wanted to look at my paper trail, it's there. But I also know that they're not going to. And my responsibility as someone who has this relationship with the public and they have it with me is to continue. I'm not going to stop and get defensive and be like, God, I did for a second. I was like, I'm not skinny.

Why are y'all saying that? You know, and that kind of baffled me because it's just like, if y'all knew how much I weighed, if y'all knew what my body really looked like. And I was like, oh, just show them what your body looks like. Just be real about it. Just be real about the body dysmorphia that you're experiencing, you know, now, that you have released some weight that's kind of new to you, like, you know, that is also like, it's strangely inverse. Like, show them, just show them your journey more.

Just continue to do it. Instead of being angry and defensive about it, be real about it, because that's what your friend loves about you. And that's what you love about your friend, that you can be real. You know, I'm still in it because this is all very new. Like I think it's now just starting to be like a point of conversation and discourse. And I think my responsibility with that is to make sure that it's still me. That's beautiful.

That's beautiful the way you explained that. I love... First of all, I really appreciate the empathy that you have in the fact that everyone's not seeing everything. So it feels like overnight. It feels like a shock. And the fact that you even have the foresight to even think through that shows just how aware you are. But at the same time, I really appreciate how you're using the word weight release and not loss.

And talk to us about that because I think that's really important. It's such an interesting reframe and such an important reframe. Because the weight that is no longer on me is not just fat or physical. I released so much to get to this point. And I think people can see that. And I don't want to describe anything as loss. You know, I don't want to, I'm not, I'm not experiencing any loss. I've actually gained so much. I've gained like a sense of self. I gained like a lifestyle that I actually

really love. And I'm like, I can maintain this, you know, I've gained new perspectives on like nutrition and, and, and the science behind cardio or weightlifting. Like it's exciting to me. That's that Virgo moon. I'm like, oh, this is interesting. I love science. But yeah, I just think that like people aren't going to understand this right now, but it's the most body positive way to experience what I'm going through. I don't want to use any negative terms. Weight loss is like, girl, I lost weight.

And it's so funny because my man, he's so funny. Like, he was the one who kind of like brought it to my attention at first. I was like, because at first I was like, I was like, oh my gosh, I lost five pounds. He was like, where did it go? I was like, what? And I was mad at him. I was like, why would he say that? But he's like, where did it go? I was like, what? And I was mad at him. I was like, why would he say that? But he's like, where did it go?

You know what I was like, oh, interesting. You know, it's like, I don't think I want to lose anything. I think I want to win. I think I want to gain. And I think that like, I want to be very intentional with the words that come out of my mouth, because there's young people who are watching me

and they're experiencing, you know, what I'm putting into the world and they're applying it to their own experience and their own life, just like I did when I was a kid. You know, I saw how the media treated people who gained and lost weight and how that affected my brain chemistry and how it made me, I'm still not perfect. Like, you know, I'll still mess up when I'm talking about things or I'll still have some toxic, you know, diet culture things that come in my brain. I just swatted away like a fly.

I'm like, no, we're not doing that. We're not doing that. You know what I mean? Like, this is your body. You only get one of these. Enjoy her and let her enjoy you. So I just want to be very careful with my words and intentional. Yeah.

And it's not for me. Because if this was all for me, you know, I take this being a public figure very by heart, but if we were sitting alone and we were drinking tequila, I'd be like, well, but it's like, no, like be careful with your words because it could affect somebody in ways you don't even know. Even me releasing the weight has affected people. And I take that seriously. I take that seriously. I take that responsibility. And so because of that, I want to transmute it into something that makes those people feel comfortable, you know, and feel like, okay, less,

less afraid of it, you know what I mean? And understand it more. Lizzo, it has been an absolute joy talking to you today. Oh my God, it's over! You are like, you're easy to talk to, you're so much fun. I can tell that you've sat with everything you're saying for so long. When I'm listening to you, I can hear the reflection in your voice. I can hear the like, the weight in what you're saying for yourself and for others. And I really respect that because that's actually the hardest part. The hardest part is

That's actually the hardest part. The hardest part is sitting in no man's land or no person's land and just figuring it out. And I can tell that you've spent so much time there. Reflecting, doing the inner work, pushing, healing, questioning, taking responsibility, doing the shadow. Like that's hard and I just want to acknowledge that because I see you for that. I feel it in your words.

I hear it. It's very evident to me that you're someone who's really working on that. That is the hardest work on the planet to do on an individual level. Like don't nobody want to sit around thinking about how they f**ked up. You know, cause then you'll just beat yourself up. But I did it anyways, and I was like, I'm going to beat myself up until I end up becoming the best version of myself. And it was really f***ing hard.

And I only share it because I know that someone else might be going through it. Like, go through it. Don't try to like stop the journey. You know, you do have to sit and reflect. You do have a... You are the only person in control of you. You know what I mean? And you have to take responsibility for that. And I think that like, it feels good.

Because then no one else can control your story. No one else can control your joy. I am the author of my story. I love it. We end every episode with a final five. These questions have to be answered in one word to one sentence maximum each. the author of my story. I love it. We end every episode with a final five. These questions have to be answered in one word to one sentence maximum each. So, Lizzo, these are your final five. I'm very bad at this by the way.

Okay. The first question is, what is the best advice you've ever heard or received? Know who you are and whose you are. Ooh, I love that. I've never heard that before. That's beautiful. All right. Question number two.

What is the worst advice you've ever heard or received? F*** you, bitch. Crash out. Who said that to you? Me. You said it to yourself? Oh my God. That's funny. That's funny.

That's funny. Question number three. This new music, this new album, what is this chapter of your life called? Freedom. I feel very free. And that's what people feel when they listen to Love and Real Life.

I sure hope so, because that's what I put in it. That's beautiful. Question number four, what's the first thing you do every morning and the last thing you do every night? Wow! The first thing I do every morning when I open my eyes is I have a wave of gratitude. It's happened every morning since January 2020.

I woke up and I had a wave of gratitude that almost brings me to tears. I've never cried for like all of my life. And then in 2020, I just start crying all the time. And then the last thing I do, I think this is gonna sound like I'm lying. I'm so corny, but I, and it's only because I have anxiety. I think about every person that I think about my family.

I think about the family members who aren't here. Think about my dog, Puka, my dad, and I send... So corny. I know this doesn't sound real. It sounds like I'm only saying this because I talk to you, but I literally... I send like... There's like these weird color points that come out of me in my mind and they always go to a different person every time.

It's like a different color to a different person. And I think about them. I sent green to my brother, and I sent like orange to my sister, and I sent red to my man, and I sent violet and white to my father, and I sent blue to my mother. And it was just, it was so strange. But I think about them and I say, oh my gosh, I just pray over them real quick. I'm like, I pray... I actually don't even pray that they're okay.

I thank God they're okay. I know you said one word, but I go, thank you. This is a beautiful answer. I'm like, thank you for making sure that my family and all my loved ones are safe and healthy. I swear, because I have to... It's the only way I can go to sleep. That's beautiful.

I believe you. I believe that's very in depth. Too specific to make it up. That's beautiful. I believe you. I believe you. That was very in depth. Too specific to make it up. Yeah, that was way too specific to make it up on the spot. That was amazing. Fifth and final question we ask this to every guest who's ever been on the show. The question is, if you could create one law that everyone in the world had to follow, what would it be?

Whoa. Whoa. Whoa. Whoa. Whoa. Actually, I just heard about this. I forget the name of the law, but it's if you, like, think about the world and you're not in it yet

and you don't know how you're going to be born. You don't know, you know, what color you're going to be born, what country you're going to be born in. You don't... It's a lottery. How would you design that world not knowing how you to be born, what country you're going to be born in. You don't, it's a lottery. How would you design that world, not knowing how you would be born in it, so that everybody can live happily? And that's how, that's how you move through the world.

That is so good. I love that. I've never heard that before. That's it. That's such a good answer. That's the rule. Design this world, build this world, live in this world as if you don't know

what privileges you'll be owed. You don't know how you are going to come into it, what cultures you're going to be a part of. So that everyone can benefit and everyone can live happily and freely. How would you design it? I love that. That is amazing. We never had that answer. That is a brilliant, brilliant answer. And the T is, it's the way God designed it. But you know, we came in here, we added our biases.

We put our biases. We put our biases up in this bitch. Lizzo, you are so much fun. You are such a bright spark and such a brilliant soul. Like honestly, your energy is infectious. Thank you. And I want to thank you for trusting me, which is being so open, so vulnerable,

so thoughtful in everything you shared. And I know that anyone who listens to this episode is going to feel inspired in their own personal journey. Hopefully, they feel a lot more closer to you. And I can't wait for them to listen to this new album. I cannot wait. And love in real life. I hope everyone goes listens.

And still bad is already my favorite. I'm loving it. It's such a good song. Thank you so much for being here. So grateful. Genuinely grateful to have spent this time with you. Thank you so much. I really appreciate you. Thank you for the platform. I don't take any of this for granted. So being here. So grateful. Genuinely grateful to have spent this time with you. Thank you so much. I really appreciate you.

Thank you for the platform. I don't take any of this for granted. So thank you. Me neither. If you love this episode, you'll really enjoy my episode with Selena Gomez on befriending your inner critic and how to speak to yourself with more compassion.

My fears are only going to continue to show me what I'm capable of. The more that I face my fears, the more that I feel I'm gaining strength and gaining wisdom and I just want to keep doing that. Something unexpected happened after Jeremy Scott confessed to killing Michelle Schofield in Bone Valley season one. Every time I hear about my dad, it's, oh, he's a killer. He's just straight evil. I was becoming the bridge between Jeremy Scott and the son he'd never known. At the end of the day, I'm literally a son of a killer.

Listen to new episodes of Bone Valley Season 2 starting April 9th on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.