On Purpose with Jay Shetty - Nicole Avant ON: Why You Should Let Yourself Cry & Ways to Channel Deep Grief Into Grit and Gratitude

Episode Date: October 20, 2023

Has your perspective on life changed since you lost a loved one? How has forgiveness made a difference in your path to healing? Today, we are joined by Nicole Avant, a producer and political activist who served as the United States Ambassador to the Bahamas. Her new book Think You’ll Be Happy: Moving Through Grief with Grit, Grace and Gratitude takes us on a personal journey of grief and healing.  Nicole opens up about facing unimaginable challenges, including the loss of her beloved mother, Jacqueline Avant, in a tragic incident. Through heartfelt anecdotes and profound insights, Nicole reveals how she found strength in the face of adversity, and the role that resilience played in her healing process. Throughout the conversation, we explore the power of vulnerability, the importance of community, and the beauty of honoring one's emotions. Nicole beautifully discusses the transformative effect of grief and how it can shape our understanding of ourselves and the world around us. Whether you're navigating your own journey of resilience or simply seeking inspiration to overcome life's obstacles, this conversation will touch your heart and leave you with a renewed sense of hope. In this interview, you’ll learn:  How the power of resilience allows us to overcome adversity How grief will transform us  How important community is when we are facing pain  How to turn pain into purpose  How to face life’s obstacles with resilience and determination Think You’ll Be Happy by @nicoleavantofficial is now available wherever books are sold. A moving story that is sure to inspire us all.  With Love and Gratitude,  Jay Shetty  What We discuss: 00:00 Intro 02:53 The Essence Of Showing Up for Others  04:46 Allowing Yourself To Pause And Repair 07:25 Always Pay It Forward 11:18 Leaving a Lasting Impression Through Emotional Memories 12:42 Nicole Recalls the Time She Tragically Lost Her Mother 19:07 The Real Definition of Courage 21:22 Self-Expression as a Form of Healing 24:02 The Best Way to Honor Anyone You’ve Love 29:55 The Power of Choice 34:37 Grief Is Proof That You Loved 39:44 Different Ways We Deal with Tragedy 43:41 The Invisible Threads That Connect Us 47:21 You Must Carry On 51:12 Honoring the Departed by Living Life to Its Fullest 55:22 The Lessons Life Offers 01:00:35 Do You Still Cry? 01:03:10 Nicole Avant on Final Five   Want to be a Jay Shetty Certified Life Coach? Get the Digital Guide and Workbook from Jay Shetty https://jayshettypurpose.com/fb-getting-started-as-a-life-coach-podcast/See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Hey, I'm Womor Madramma, executive producer of the new podcast, Day My Avalita First. Each week, the incredible Vico Ortiz and fabulous Avalita Lillana Montenegro will play matchmaker for a group of hopeful romantics, right Vico? You know it! Listen to Day My Avalita First! Thursdays on the I-Hard Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcasts. And remember, don't do anything I wouldn't do. Just do it better.

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Listen to the therapy for Black Girls podcast on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. Take it care. My husband called, and said, what's going on? He goes, you have to get up, your mother's been shot. But he means she's been shot. Everything that I had known for 53 years, I felt that it was just pulled out from underneath. Filmmaker, activist and former US ambassador, this is her new book. Nicole, I bought it. Thank you. Forgiveness for me was I am casting these burdens of anger and shame

and doubt and disappointment and fury. Before we jump into this episode, I'd like to invite you to join this community to hear more interviews that will help you become happier, healthier and more healed. All I want you to do is click on the subscribe button, I love your support, it's incredible to see all your comments and we're just getting started. I can't wait to go on this journey with you. Thank you so much for subscribing. It means the world to me.

The best selling author and host. The number one health and wellness podcast. One purpose with Jay Shetty. Hey everyone, welcome back to on purpose. The number one health podcast in the world, thanks to each and every one of you who come back every week to become happier, healthier and more healed. And I'm so grateful because on this platform, I get to sit down with people with remarkable stories, incredible experiences, people who've been through challenges and hardships that we can all relate to, and hopefully extract lessons, principles, blessings,

and insights from so that we too can help heal our hearts and lives. Today's guest is a dear friend, someone who I have connected with at really special moments, and someone that I'm really excited to share her story, her love, her work with you today, I'm speaking about Ambassador Nicole Avant, who served as the 13th US Ambassador to the Bahamas after being nominated by President Obama and unanimously confirmed by the US Senate, becoming the youngest, as well as the first African-American woman to hold the position. Today, we're talking about her new book that's out called Think You'll Be Happy, Moving Through Grief with grit, grace and gratitude, and they're called kindly allowed my testimony to be here.

So you know how much I endorse this book. I recommend a lot of books, but this is a book that I've realized I needed more in my life because of how many people I have in my life that are losing people that they love. And I now finally have the book to encourage people to read and receive in their life to know how to honor the people they love. Please welcome to on purpose, Nicole, Nicole. Thank you for being here. Beautiful introduction. I'm very honored. Thank you. It's from the hub.

It's so happy to be here. No, Nicole, I mean what I said, and I was just saying it to you a few moments ago, and I wanted to repeat it for my community. I'm so grateful you wrote this book because honoring the people that we love, remembering what they taught us, what we gained from them, and then passing it on is without a doubt one of the greatest acts of service that we could possibly ever do, not just to that individual, but to humanity. Yeah, that's absolutely.

And I was so touched not only by you sharing this with me earlier when the writing process was happening, but you trusted me to be a part of this journey with you because it's so deeply important to you and it's so deeply intimate and close to you. And so I couldn't be more thankful and grateful. So thank you so much. Well, thank you for taking the time while you were on your book tour. And I'm sending you first drafts. I can jump. Jay, what do you think about this? And you took the time to read it. And again, that is a part of showing up for people,

which I've been talking about about this book of, my mom really, her superpower was really showing up for people. And I think we're all forgetting, I think when we all like things on Instagram and all this, that that's showing up for someone. But that's, you know, the icing of showing up, but the cake of showing up, of really taking the time out for somebody, whether you feel like it or not, whether you have time or not, but it's honoring somebody else's soul. Because not all of us are on

the same soul journey. We're not all going through the same thing at the same time. And so I thank you for giving me the encouragement to keep writing and and to finally get this book done. Absolutely. And it feels great. I know. I'm so glad that we're finally. Yes. I know. And Nicole, I want to take a moment before I dive in. I have so many questions. I want to ask you today and so many questions I'm excited to ask you, but I want to say a big thank you because people show up in our lives in different ways

and towards the early stages of my career, I was wonderfully invited by Jennifer Aniston to her home to give a short presentation. And you were in the audience that day, it was only a small group of people. And we instantly connected, and I remember your enthusiasm for my work and your energy for my work was so reassuring.

You showed up for me without even knowing it maybe, but it was so beautiful to have such a real interaction. You know, you can have people say that was wonderful, that was nice, but when you were sharing your thoughts and your feedback and the energy I felt from your words were so deeply encouraging when I probably needed the most. So I just want to thank you for showing up. I'm happy to hear that. I remember sitting where I remember exactly

I was sitting and then standing and I remember affirming you the whole time, like nodding up and down because that was a small group, but it was an intimidating group of people to be in front of. And you were fantastic. And when I thought in that moment was, finally, somebody is really coming out and talking about the human spirit and the soul and our energy and who we really are as people, as just not what we do, but who we are. And I think that conversation has been missing in society. And I was so happy that it was you. And I thought it was perfect.

I said, this is exactly what we need. And I was not surprised by everything that has happened for you. I said, of course, this happened. And even my husband, Ted, when I told him I was coming on the podcast, he said, isn't it phenomenal? Think about it. How you started this journey with Jay before he even put out anything and look at him. I mean, you're all over the world. You're helping heal people. You're helping souls repair, which I think a lot of us forget that our souls on our soul journey

are gonna need to go into repair sometimes. And none of us want to go into repair. But there is no way you're gonna be on the earth and not have to go into repair sometimes. We just, you know, we just do like and I say to people, how are you doing after this? I'm in repair. I'm in repair. I am allowing my friends to heal me, life to heal me, circumstances to heal me, but I am in repair. We have to make it okay to be able to say and own I'm in repair. I'm still gonna show up. But I'm in repair. What a beautifully beautiful way of putting it.

Nicole, I want to dive in and I want to start by asking you, what is your earliest childhood memory or your most memorable experience as a child that you think is defined who you are today? Hmm. Well, there's a couple of things. One, my mom was very open to various scriptures around the world. So it didn't matter if it was a Hindu scripture

or a Buddhist scripture, whatever it was, Christian scripture, she loved the idea of understanding energy, your thoughts, your words, and everything how it helps create and shape your reality. And I remember specifically, there was one time my godfather Quincy gave me a book and it was called Creative Visualization. Now, granted, I was older at this time.

I wasn't a child, but I'm just going to this right now. Sure. It was, everything my mom had said, but I found it on paper and some woman was saying, you know, and then I started doing it. I started saying, oh, okay, if I really say this all the time, this is gonna happen. But I did notice my energy shift,

and I did start to understand how the universe works. No, we can't control every single situation. We are in control of how we respond to it, but I think one of the earliest things that I learned, the most important life lesson was that we are all here to share our blessings. I learned that firsthand as a young child who realized with all these people, yes, they might have been very successful and very famous, but the difference with the group that I had was that it was never about them. It was always about how we're going to move people forward. We have this door that has been open for us.

And our job is to make sure we keep the door open for other people. And the power that I got from that was there is such a power in helping people get to where they want to be, help them on their sole evolution. And that has to do with being unselfish and aware, and focused on progress, moving energy forward and not staying stagnant and not feeling that, oh, if Jake gets this or so and so gets this, then I'm gonna to get nothing. No, the lesson I learned was there is enough to go around for everybody because everybody

is on a different soul path. And everybody has their own mission. No one can take it away from any of us. No one, they can try to come in and steer you off course. But Jay Shetty is Jay Shetty in this lifetime. There is no other J Shetty. There is no other Nicole Lehmont. There's one of all of us and we get to do

what we choose to do. And who we want to be is even more important than what we do, but who we want to be on this planet. Who what do we want people to say? Because believe me, that another thing I've learned now after my parents have gone is, you know, everyone says, you know, you don't take anything with you. We know that, technically, but when you really see it, I have everything. Everything's still there. My parents didn't take one possession with them. But the beauty is, is that everybody, they left their character, they left their stamp on humanity.

People smile when they hear their names. People say thank you. People write me letters about how they change their lives. So all of this comes into the lesson that I learned is that everyone's significant and everyone's energy can help each other move to where we need to be. Yeah, those famous words again, which we've heard many times, but you've experienced this and you feel it. And I want to talk about some of the honourings that you received for your parents, but Maya Angelou said that people will forget what you did, people will forget what you said, but people will never forget how you made them feel.

100%. And we say this, we repeat it, you see on Instagram, but then you've probably experienced that very deeply, that people have not forgotten how your parents made them feel. That's exactly it. How they made them feel. And it's through the small actions, it's the note, it's the phone call,

it's the text, it's the phone call, it's the text, it's the email I'm checking in on you. I want you to know. I love you. I've been thinking about you. These are all things that I've had to relearn of, oh, this is important. It's not just about me and my feelings and what I'm going through. I have people that I'm on my journey with that need check-ins, that I need to say, hey, I'm just thinking about you. I know you're traveling and I know you, you know, things are going well in your life, but I just want you to know I'm thinking about you. Those little things mean everything.

They mean everything because you're not alone. And you want to feel as if you are important to somebody. You want to feel that you're significant. You want to feel that you're significant. You want to feel that you're seen. You know, you want to feel that someone you want to, that feeling of being loved changes everything. That's what we're yearning for. All of us. For everyone who doesn't know, I'd love to give them the backgrounds so we can really go deep into this conversation. You start this book by, and I'm reading from the book, you receive this news.

Love, you've got to get up, get dressed, and get the seat as your mom's been shot. I mean, every time I read that line, as someone who didn't know your family, every time I read that line, I just only could put myself in those shoes to even try to imagine what that would feel like to hear. Don't have, you can't. It's something that you've either been through or you haven't. And so you can't fully empathize, you can't fully understand, you can't, no matter how hard you try,

I cannot imagine how difficult that is. Walk us through that moment so that our audience can come with you on this journey as we extrapolate it after it. So my husband had called me. It was early in the morning, around 2.30. And my phone had been ringing, and I didn't hear it. My brother had been calling. And then, you know, how your intuition gets you up. Something told me to get up, and I just happened to roll over.

I looked at my phone. I see all these missed calls from Alex. And thank God I was looking at my phone because my husband called again. And Teddy said those words love. I'm so sorry. You have to get up. And so what's going on? It goes, you have to get up.

Your mother's been shot. You have to get to see her. So what do you mean she's been shot? What are you talking about? So then I'm thinking, oh, it must be eight o'clock at night. I was so, from that moment, I went into a whole different spirulmos. I just didn't know where I was.

And I said, what are you talking about? Where was she? And I was asking Teddy all these questions. And he said, Nicole, you have to get to the hospital. I don't have any answers. I just got this call. I'll meet you there. And thank God he was in Los Angeles

He was on a work retreat, but he wasn't far Jay, I froze My knees buckle a little bit and then my heart rate just starts going and I'm thinking wait what? And I remember you know our dogs sleep in the room I'm looking at these two sweet souls and then your dogs pick up on everything. So they immediately jump on me, kissing me, looking me, and I just remember getting dressed quickly, getting dog food out, feeding the dogs, leaving the door open for them, going out the back. My life changed. I knew whatever the outcome

was at the hospital that my life had changed forever. That if my mom survived this, which I was praying for, that she was 81 when this happened, that, okay, this is so traumatic, that I don't know if she's going to be able to function emotionally after this or anything. So I'm driving and I'm on my way to the hospital and I'm you know everything's energy to me and I have all green lights. And the last one I remember I was turning right on San Vicente and it started flickering. And I just started for myself. I just started talking. I said, Mom, mom, if you can hear me, I don't know what's happened. I know you've been shot. I don't know by whom. I don't know where. I don't know anything. But I'm on my way. And I don't know how hard you're finding or what happened, but you don't have to come back if you

can't. You know, I just, all these thoughts just, and I, and I remember saying, I'll take, I'll, I'll take care of dad. I'll take care of everything. I think I was saying that Jay because I, she always did that for everybody else. And so there was just this new energy flowing through me. And I don't even know what I was talking about. But it was keeping me sane because I had to, you know, I couldn't, I didn't know where to park. I was in the wrong building. I was so discombobulated.

I didn't know what was happening. And then, you know, I got to the hospital and I was with my family and we waited. And unfortunately, I mean, God bless her. She was 81, you know, somebody had broken into her house and she happened to be up. So she, they encountered each other, completely opposite souls, completely. But she made it to the hospital,

which I love about my mother. Of course she did. Shot in the back, you know, with a rifle and she made 81 and makes it to the hospital and she just didn't make it to surgery. Everything that I had known for 53 years was just, I felt that it was just pulled out from under me. But then I became her.

I decided, okay, I'm, what would Jackie do? You know, and I started delegating. That's how he went into that mode. But the shock and the trauma and the stress and the fear, I mean, I have, there were veins I didn't even know I had because they were all, it's just, it's amazing with the body, how it responds to trauma. And then I just decided that day, okay,

I have to decide who I want to be in this moment versus what I want to do. Because I kept saying, okay, I'm going to do this. I have to do this. I'm going to do this. And then I looked at myself in the mirror when I got home from the hospital and I said, no, no, no, Nicole, who do you want to be in this time, in this trial? Because now here's a trial. And this trial is here. Who do you want to be? And I just looked at myself and I said, okay, I want to be as courageous as possible. I want to be as peaceful as possible. And I want to be as helpful as possible. And I just went downstairs as that woman tended to my father, you know,

the police officers were at the house, detectives are at the house. I was like, out of like a CSI, you know, TV show. Oh my goodness. You know how we all say one day at a time. I tried that. I was like, this is not one day at a time. This is one minute at a time. This is okay Nicole, every five minutes you're gonna check in on yourself. Let's just, and so I knew I can get through one minute

at a time or five minutes at a time. But when I said tomorrow, be better, my whole body was like, no, no, no, no, I'm not gonna, we can't live till tomorrow. Wow. That's how heavy the pain was. Wow. It was too much shock.

It was an energy that I had never experienced before because it was such a cruel energy on such a deep level and a violent energy that I had never experienced it. So I found myself a new territory. I've never heard it put that well in terms of how heavy it can be and this idea that we say one day at a time, I really hope that anyone and everyone is listening right now who is going through their own version, their own path of this sort of pain is able to simplify it to one minute at a time, one moment at a time. So I already deeply appreciate that. How do you think you had this ability,

and I'm assuming or guessing that it also came from your mom that you could go upstairs and say, I'm going to be courageous, I want to be peaceful, I want to be helpful. Like those three words are not accidental. They are very intentional, powerful, special words, courageous, peaceful, and helpful. How did you find that clarity so quickly, which could have taken months or even years? Thank God it was my mom. and months or even years. Thank God it was my mom.

It, she, my mom was a big believer in, in vibration. And she'd always used to say, you know, your, your soul emits energy. And you, you have to think of yourself as a radio tower. And you have to think of yourself as a, you know, as a station on the radio or a channel on the TV. Because, you know, as long as you change the channels you'll get different vibrations. We all see that. So what are you tuning into? You should always say to me, what are you tuning into in your mind?

What are you tuning into? But she thought those those three words are from her. She always wanted to be courageous and helpful and kind and those were always her intentions of how she was going to show up in the world. And it's interesting because she used to say to me, Courage isn't not being afraid. It's being afraid and you do it anyway. You do it anyway. You do the thing you're afraid of while you're afraid. And that's when you're courageous. And it's so true. So I just decided, okay, I have no idea what's happening, and I'm very afraid, but I'm not going to turn my back to it. I'm gonna go through it.

I'm not gonna have necessarily get through this. I never put that pressure, but I am gonna walk through this season. I am going to walk through this challenge with as much grace as possible. To the best of your ability, and thank you so much for recounting that for our audience. And of course, as I've said to everyone, I highly recommend you get this book,

because not only is it, of course, an occult story, I feel what an occult is exceptionally well is, and you can tell already from the way she speaks, and for those of you listening and watching, Nicole, you have this way of bringing us on this journey with you, but also giving us these steps and insights along the way of how to honor people that we love, how to learn from them, how to just what you just said now. Like, I think this idea of becoming and being the people we lose is the most beautiful way for them to continue to live to live on.

We thus and through us and live on. Oh yeah, I listened to part of another healing step for me was listening to her favorite music. Every day I thought, okay, what did mom love? What music did she love? What flowers did she love? Anything that she loved, I put around me if I could so the orchids that she loved the Certain color that she loved I ordered them and made sure I looked at them every day because when I looked at them it reminded me of her and I smiled Mm-hmm, and it helped heal my heart, you know and listening to the music because music was so healing and it is so healing and So I listened to all her, you know, she loved Johnny Mathis and she loved the comedors and the Bee Gees. And she loved really like Gordon Lightfoot. She loved really easy

kind music. And it did help me become more of her. It was really helpful and a lot of rituals, you know, she loved taking baths. And my mom that and my mom was always get the magnesium, get the salt, get whatever it doesn't have to be fancy, get in the water. You know, she was such a pice and I'm born on her birthday. So she was always, you know, take a bath, soak it out, you know, talking and I started doing those things. So at night I would take a bath and I started to talk to her. As if she was there, as if I could hear her, even if I couldn't, I didn't need to hear anything.

And it wasn't even about so much feeling, anything. But I needed to express myself. And it was very healing for me to act as if she was listening and that she could hear me whether she could or not. It was the act of doing it for myself, which was very healing. That's so reassuring to hear. I was speaking to a friend the other day about their loss and they lost a parent very recently. And I recommended your book because I really, really do believe that is my go-to recommendation when people have this experience.

And they were talking to me, they said, you know, if my mom was here right now, she'd laugh at this and she'd do this. And I was like, that's it. I was like, you know, it's wonderful hearing it from you. I was like, that's it. Like you know how you're munged respond to what you would say or what you would do. Like you know that when you love someone so deeply and so that doesn't have to disappear. Never have to go away.

Never have to go away. Never have to go away. Never have to go away. Never have to go away. Never have to go away. Never have to go away. Never have to go away. Never have to go away.

Never have to go away. Never have to go away. Never have to go away. Never have to go away. Never have to go away. Never have to go away. Never have to go away. Never have to go away. Never have to go away. Never have to go away. change is form, but the energy is there. You know, we're spirits in the material world. So for spirits in the material world and everything is everlasting, and the soul never dies, and we all know that if you believe that, then she has a different form, but she's still

around, and her energy is with me. I feel her now stronger than I ever did before. I really do. I really feel her now stronger than I ever did before. I really do. I really feel her presence much stronger. And even writing the book, because she wanted to be a book editor. And there were certain drafts I was doing, and I just put the pen down.

And there was one night, and I had a dream, and I just saw her red nails typing on the typewriter. And I had asked myself, before I went to sleep, I wonder if I should change that paragraph, rewrite it, and move it up. And I took it as a sign, which I did, and I did move the paragraph.

But as soon as I saw her nails, her fingernails on the keypad, I went, thank you, mom. I'm gonna move that. Thank you for editing. You're still editing in my life. You are still working. And it's just a different form of energy. And my girlfriend wrote me a beautiful letter.

And she said, remember, the best way to honor anyone you've loved, but especially your parents, is to live a full significant life. You owe them a life. That's the only thing you owe them is to live because that is the best way to honor them is if they've taught you great things and given you great lessons and giving you tools, go on and carry the baton. And even for the ones who don't, let's say you don't have parents that were good to you because that happens and you don't have parents that show up for you. You can choose to be different than they were and show up as a completely different type of human being in the world. I've seen it. You've seen it. I've heard about I've heard horrific stories about abuse and trauma

and neglect and these young people have chosen to be very different from what they receive from their parents. And I have such respect for that, because that's hard. It's hard to carry on a memory if your memories are terrible. And when that happens, then your job now is to, I have to create new memories. Yes. Yeah. People by their actions are either showing us how to live or how not to live or how not to live and oh, yeah

I can definitely identify with that with the home I grew up in I was just taking notes my whole life of how not to be a dad how not to be a Husband how not to be a person in the workplace, how not to be a family member. Especially in the workplace. Yeah. I mean, yeah. Yeah, I had people around me all the time where I would say, okay, so when I'm older and I'm working and I have this position, I'm definitely not going to be like that. And then there were certain people where I take notes and I'd say, I want to be just

like Carol. She's great. She's so helpful. She's so patient. She's so patient. She's so, you know, and then serving. I mean, I was a waitress for a long time. My parents had me work, you know, since I was 10 and 13 and just on and on and on.

I sold shoes. I worked at a dry cleaner. I did the, my mom would say, I'm throwing you into these experiences because to your point, people will show you who they are. And you can learn how you want to be. But the only way you do that is when you're in interaction with others. And gosh, you're especially serving people. You see how I saw the best of people and I saw the worst of people. I

was either completely just non-existent or somebody took the time to be really kind and smile at me and ask me how I was. And so you become very sensitive to it. Yeah. You know, Antonia and Sarah, you know, my stepkids were dead. They, they're the same Sarah. I threw her into what you're saying. And she said, my gosh, some people don't even see me. I'm nobody to them. And I said, now, you know, and she's very sensitive as a young adult. When we go to restaurants, did you make sure you tip this? Did you make sure that she looks at the waiters, the waiters, all the time.

She looks at every server. How are you? How was your day? How are you? I mean, she's so engaged, but to your point, because she's experienced the opposite. And she took notes. I don't want to be like that. Yeah. Something about Mary Poppins. She's experienced the opposite. And she took notes. I don't want to be like that.

Yeah. Something about Mary Poppins? Something about Mary Poppins. Exactly. Oh, man. This is fun. I'm AJ Jacobs and I am an author and a journalist and I tend to get obsessed with stuff. And my current obsession is puzzles.

And that has given birth to my new podcast, The Puzzler. Dressing. Dressing. Franch dressing. Exactly. Yeah. Oh, that's good. That's good.

We are living in the golden age of puzzles. And now you can get your daily puzzle nuggets delivered straight to your ears for 10 minutes or less. Every day on the puzzler, short and sweet. I thought to myself, I bet I know what this is and now I definitely know what this is. This is so weird. This is fun.

Let's try this one. Listen to the puzzler every day on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. That's awful, and I should have seen it coming! Listen to comeback stories. I'm Darren Waller. You may know me best as a tie-in for the New York Giants. You may also know me for my story of overcoming addiction and alcoholism. You may have heard a few of my tracks as an artist or a producer. And you may have seen the work that I've done through my foundation. And you may know my friend and co-host Donnie Starkens as well.

He's a mindfulness teacher, a yoga instructor, a life coach, a man fully invested in seeing people reach their fullest potential. And we've come to form this platform of comeback stories to really highlight not only our own adversity but adversity in the lives of well-known guests with amazing stories. Catch us every week on comeback stories, on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. So beautiful. I was reminded as you were talking about, you said this beautiful statement of, you know, with spirits in the material world, having this experience and therefore energy lives on.

And there's this beautiful message that you receive. You say, I'm reading from your book, if you don't mind, if that's okay. So this is page 53 for those who are reading along with us and think you'll be happy. And you say a few days after my mother died, for our Williams called. He's like a brother to me, he's family. And he says, we're gonna celebrate your mom.

He said, we're gonna celebrate her legacy. She's a big deal and we're going to celebrate your mom. He said, we're going to celebrate her legacy. She's a big deal, and we're not going to let anyone forget her. She created a life worth talking about. Do you realize that hundreds of thousands of babies were born around the world the day she passed over? There are 140 million a year all around the world. Life is always continuing. Nicole, and you must continue her life by living yours to the world. Life is always continuing. Nicole and you must continue her life by living

yours to the fullest. And he concluded, God is still the greatest. And you said that for else says this all the time, through good or bad times, and he's right, God is still the greatest. What I find really unique about your journey, Nicole, as well, is that you are able to keep and strengthen your faith in your own spirituality in the way you practice it at a time when it's very natural and I would never judge anyone if it would actually be a good way. Right. And just say no.

No, exactly. What do you mean? What do you mean? Yeah, what do you mean? I've been so good and I've had so much faith and how can this happen? You know, and as I say in the book, it's like, why not us? It tragedies and trials and everything. It happens to, you know, as it says in the script, you know, it rains on the

just and it rains on the unjust. It's everyone kind of gets hammered. But it goes to the power of choice for me and the reason that I grew stronger in my faith as opposed to leaving it is because I really do believe that the universe is kind of laid it all out. Life is laid it out. Very scripture, you know, your Buddhist script, everything is laid it out, which says, here it is. You're on this earth in kind of here. Here's how you play this game. But these things we're not going to lie, these things will show up.

But the power of free will, which my mom always reminded me about, is that, you know, listen, we as human beings do have free will. We have the freedom to choose how we're going to live, choose how we're going to think as opposed to any other animal. You know, they don't have the power of imagination and choice. We do. So to blame the creator for the choices that people make is not something that I wanted to subscribe to. I was like, I'm not even going there. People make choices all the time. I see it every day. We all do. People who've had the worst childhoods make great choices, have great lives.

I've seen people who I grew up with in a very affluent neighborhood make the worst choices. And it had nothing to do with their environment. It was their choice. So I wanted to stay, my faith for me really was believing in something that is so much bigger and greater than me that, you know, the stars come out at night. I'm not in control of that. The earth is spinning. That's not my power. You know, the birds wake up every morning. The sun is up. The sun goes down. That's a power that is, I guess, I'm a part of that and I'm connected to it. But I did, I'm not the creator. And so I just decided to lean in more with that power

and just say, okay, I accept this. I don't understand it. I may never understand it, but I still do love life. And I still do believe in life and the goodness of people and the goodness of life. And I don't want to get bitter. That was my mate, Jay. I was so afraid of becoming a bitter person.

And I could feel the root. I could feel I could feel it starting. And I was like, no, no, no, no, I got to get rid of this. And that's where I just went into the forgiveness of not condoning the behavior, not saying, oh, it's okay that this happened or making an excuse. Forgiveness for me was, I am casting this burden, where these burdens of anger and shame and doubt and disappointment and frustration and fury, because I was furious. And I thought, but if I hold on to these feelings,

I'm going to sink myself. And I'm not giving anyone the power to take me out. No, I'm not doing that. So I'm going to stand in my faith. I'm going to believe in what I believe in. I'm going to believe in life. And I am going to, I choose to believe that things will get better. I don't know when and I don't know how.

I didn't care, but I knew that they would and I believe and I'm a big believer in tomorrow. I love tomorrow. I do. I really do. I'm always thinking, okay, because if I don't get it right, I'm like, oh, there's always tomorrow. And it keeps me hopeful. Tomorrow keeps me hopeful.

I don't try to stay out of the present, but I do look for, you know, my mom always used to say, you have to have something to look forward to because otherwise you, if you don't train your mind to, and I'd say, well, I have nothing coming up that I'm looking forward to. And she used to say, make it up. Make it up. Pretend you have some hardening. Pretend you have some, whatever it is, that something that's going to make your heart smile, because we can all fall into despair very quickly. I love that. That is a massive smile to my face. It's so beautiful. How someone's energy in spirit can be so big that it can, you know, truly live on and truly truly be full and shared. It's, yeah, there's this beautiful line that you share

from your friend Penny. He says, grief is the receipt from the universe showing that you loved someone or something and loved them very deeply. It's not the best. When she reminded me of that, I said, okay, wait, say it again, I'll write this down, say it again, that is so good. But she said, baby, that's what it is. It's a receipt and it could be a mother, a father, a sister, a brother, a dog, cat, whatever, something that you love that is no longer there, that has changed form.

Even if it's the most peaceful transition, the grief is proof that you loved. You know, the grief is most of the time and there's a lot of grief also where there's regrets and all that. I understand that. And I respect all forms of grief, but it is, it's a receipt. Yeah, a receipt that you loved and you were loved. And I was loved. Yeah, deeply, deeply.

This one line in the book, you really, I just felt it was perspective shifting in a way that, oh, I just, I just feel like that statement just like, you know, you just embodied and captured everything. And you said that even though your mother's death was shocking, her life was beautiful. So imagine even though the end was so terrible, her life was beautiful and that's what you're celebrating,

that's what you're celebrating. That's what you're putting emphasis and focus and your light on. And I find that's very difficult because when we lose someone, it's so easy and natural again and normal. And that's when it's normal for us to obsess over how we lost someone and how we left them, which is the shortest amount of time we actually experienced them most mostly. But we have all of this time, but the brain and our memory and our mind is so good at just fixating on the end. The end and not the life.

Yeah, it was. Yeah, yeah, and not the life. And I had to get to the end. So I used to say, but, but, but, and then I realized, wait, I can have both. This is shocking and terrible and hurtful. And I'm gonna celebrate her life and I'm gonna think of the good times and I'm gonna try and think of all the great memories

that'll bring a smile to my face. So it was no longer a but. And once I changed but to and. I didn't have to choose which one I was going to do both and move through life with the shock and the trauma and the stress and the beauty of her life, the beauty of how she lived, the energy of what she gave. So I was I was moving with all energies. And it was only until I shifted because I was definitely in that, but this happened. So I don't know how I could ever smile again, but this happened and it was so tragic. And then as soon as I said, this happened and it's tragic.

And I'm going to think positively. I'm going to think constructively. You know, my dad always used to say to me, girl, keep your mind right. Keep your mind right. Crucify your mind every day., girl, keep your mind right, keep your mind right, crucify your mind every day, you got to keep your mind right. And so that really helped me, you know, and that my friend, T.D. Jakes had called me and he said, I understand you're angry.

Of course, it's normal to be angry and all the things you're feeling. But I have a question for you. Do you want your focus to be on her last five minutes or are you gonna focus on the 81 years that she lived and it's your choice and you have to choose every day which one are you gonna focus on? You're gonna give him five minutes, the five minutes, and the trauma or are you gonna focus on the 81 years? And

I remember it through all my tears. I'm like, 81 years, 81 years. And it was, but it was beautiful because he helped me shift. And I had to go to that every day. It wasn't like he said it one day. And then, but every day and every time it was very challenging for me, Jay, and every time I did want to quit. And there were days where I didn't stop all the time, but you need sometimes you have to push pause in life. And there were days where I would lay in the bed and just lay there and be still and think or not think and just lay there. And I, but I still decided to focus on her 81 years and to focus

on what I loved about her and to focus on her contributions to life and society and other people and how she made people feel. So powerful. That shift for me was, you know, I was like, that I can, that's something I'd like to remind myself every day with gift, that gem of advice and insight. Thank you. You know, again, another natural thing is, especially in a circumstance like this, is to focus on how to get justice, on how to make sure that the perpetrator and the person gets what they deserve,

and are found, and like, and that again is a very normal reaction. It makes sense. How did you navigate that at the same time as navigating grief? Like walk me through that because sometimes we lose people naturally. This wasn't that. This was, you know, right. So it's an additional kind of energy direction because here you are dealing with loss, but

then you're also dealing with an individual who's you know acted so recklessly. Yes, and I thought oh my god And my my father broke my heart one day because he said oh boy He could they hadn't caught him yet and he said and Then he was curious about that obviously and like wondering oh my god This person still around and my dad immediately went to other people He wasn't just focused on my mom. He immediately went to, oh my gosh, I hope this person is not hurting somebody else

because he's obviously shown he can do this. He does this. But I still, I had to present on behalf of my mom and the family to the judge, you know, what my intention was. And it really was, listen, you know, whatever the divine justice is gonna be in this, I'm not the divine justice here, but I will say that my intention was,

I wanna make sure that this doesn't happen to another family. I don't want this to happen to anyone else. I don't want other people to feel that. So if I had any little way of just stating that and making a difference, that gave me something to live for actually. Can I try in my little square? Can I hopefully stop this from happening to other people?

And thank God that that he's not on the streets, you know, because there's a lot of reckless people on the streets and a lot of violence today in various different forms. And it's really heavy. And it's so unnecessary. And it's cruel and unkind. And, but I like it. It's reckless. Yeah. It's, I mean, it's horrific. It's horrific. It's horrific. But it happens to so many people in so many different ways. And I don't think people realize, you know, we see the science of what it does to families. When there's a tragedy, it could be a child drowning or a car accident or anything.

And family sometimes fall apart. And I understand why. And Ted and I had to look at each other. And I sat with my dad and I said, listen, you're gonna come live with me. I'm never leaving you. We're gonna be locked up. You're gonna be my road dog.

Wherever I go, you're in the car with me. Whatever my life is, we're just gonna merge. But I had to sit with Ted and I had to say to him, we had to look at each other in the eyes. I said, listen, this is horrible. But I had to sit with Ted and I had to say to him, we had to look at each other in the eyes. I said, listen, this is horrible. And both of us are grieving in very different ways. But we have to make a decision and look at each other in the eyes right now and make

a commitment to each other that we are going to walk through this and no matter how hard this gets and no matter if any of us want to bail, I'd understand. But we're not going to. We're going to stick this gets. And no matter if any of us want to bail, I'd understand, but we're not going to. We're gonna stick this out. I've got your back. You've got my back. We're gonna be here, take care of my father and my intention was, we're gonna give him a space

where he feels loved and honored and safe and seen. And if we can do that, then we've done our job. But we have to have a commitment because the pain is so deep, Jay, and I see it now. I used to read articles like, why would they they had a baby? And I understand this tragedy, but why would they divorce after that? Why would they? Oh, I get it. Until you go through it, I get it because the shock is so insane. It's your brain isn't the same. Your heart's not the same. Your brain's not the same. Yeah, and that's another reminder to us all, where it's like, if we haven't been through a experience, how not to judge, how to take a step back, how to be compassionate. But when I hear you

being able to take a step back to the point of view of saying, I want to look at this from the point of view of how this will not happen to someone else. That's like model behavior. I mean, that is that is such an elevated spiritual space to come from that you're not going, I think this person deserves this because of what happened to this. Which would be fair. That would be totally fair. There'd be nothing wrong if you fell that way. But the fact that you could come from a place to say, actually, I just want to make sure it doesn't happen to anyone else again. And I believe actually after the unfortunate event of your home, he went off and did more that same day, like 40 minutes later. So you were very right to actually have that feeling. Yes, that news was crazy.

And so one of my friends, Amy, who's in the book, she's the one who went to the house and got my mom's things for me and got the Bible, found the Christmas card, all these things. Amy shows up at the house that afternoon. And she says, I am so sorry, I'm late. I heard about your mom this morning, but we were woken up last night by helicopters and sirens. Right next door to my house, there was a home invasion.

And it was craziness and the guys shot himself and there was madness and blah, blah, blah. We were all out in the streets. She's going on, on, on. And I said, really, she was, can you believe in the same night it happened to your mom. She comes over 24 hours later, why does it ghost eyes wide open? And I said, what's going on? She said, uh, remember I told you that there was a home invasion next door to me? And I said, yes, she said, that was the same person. That was the same person that left your mom and showed up right next door to a best friend. Just that out of all places. LA is pretty big, out of all things, but the energy and the connection and interesting love, I had this huge crystal that I bought from myself,

and I couldn't figure out the right place to put it and it happened to be Amy's birthday coming up and I was on the phone with my mom this was months before she died maybe six months before she died and I said I don't know what to do with this crystal it's so gorgeous but I don't have the right room and Ted's like what are you doing with that big thing and she said well didn't she say you didn't know what to get Amy for her birthday why don't you give that to Amy I said oh, oh, I absolutely will. And of course, she had put it right in her backyard on the fence line of where all this so,

and Amy just felt my mom everywhere. It just, but again, of how we're all connected. And you don't even realize that out of all places, but yeah, he did this to someone else, and that family was traumatized. It was a young girl in the house. So I think that also helped me knowing that story, knowing that there was a teenage girl in the house, and she was petrified, and all this, and thank God, nothing happened to them. But that it is about other people too, that this didn't just happen to us. That's why I went to the place of, okay, there's so much trauma here.

My prayer is that it doesn't go any further. You know, I'm listening to you, and obviously I read the book, and I'm hearing just, it's almost like your mind, you allowed your mind to naturally go to all of the, the bots. But then you've found like that tiny crack of light and that that breakthrough and you've kind of found your way there. And for everyone who's listening, I can see Nicole nodding and it's like that feeling that we often have is like the amount of light that shining through is so small,

like the tinier, right? Like the tiny, the little nail, like a little head of a, oh yeah. It's not because it just looks dark. And you know, one of the biggest ones that I think a lot of people again naturally feel are, why me? I could have done this.

I should have been there. Like that can just, you know, I've heard that like destroy people inside. I was just gonna use that word. It will destroy you. Yeah. It will destroy you. And I felt it.

You could feel the destruction in your figure. What did you do with that emotion? I immediately said, you know, why not me? First, I was like, okay, we're human. We're in a human experience. And bad things happen around the world to really good people all the time. Bad things happen to bad people.

It's everybody, right? You know, it's my mom used to, she loved the theater. She loved stories. She loved film, television, and song also, because her point was each of these mediums most of them especially film and television is showing you the hero's journey. You are the hero of your story. But you don't go to the movie because you know the ending. We all go and we pretty much know the ending in the trailer. But we go because we want to see

the middle which is the challenge which is the butt which is what do I we go because we want to see the middle, which is the challenge, which is the butt, which is what do I do? Am I going to survive? The decision, the turning point, the pivot. So the pivot for me was everything because I thought, right, mom, tell me this, like things happen. People make decisions every day. You know, you've got laws on the books now, you know, mothers against drunk driving, all these things. But that happened. Those good things came from a very tragic place. And it is looking for the light at the end of the tunnel. It's really grasping for that light, looking even if it's teeny. I was looking around, like, it's gotta be there somewhere. And some days I didn't see any light. I have to be honest. There were some days there was no light.

I felt it, but I didn't see it. But there were some days where I just was sitting in darkness. And sitting, I felt like I was sitting in mud and just or quick sand. And it just was heavy. And those were the days that I thought, okay, I've got to now purposely look for a little light and I would go outside and I'd sit in my yard and I would stare at the flower. I would sit in nature and I would look at the trees and I would watch the birds and I would watch life. I would watch the sunsets every day. I never looked at them every day.

I took advantage. I took that for granted. Oh, there's a sunset. I'll, you know, a couple of times a year. Oh, every day since my mom, I would watch the sun go down. I would make sure to watch that sun go down because it reminded you there is a cycle of life. And the sun's going to rise again. And if I knew the sun was going to rise again, then I knew I was going to rise again. You know, the more disconnected we've become from nature, the harder it is to acknowledge the natural transitions

and the natural rejuvenations, the seasons, the the ability for things to wither and then yeah and then come back come back and my mom died you know in the it was winter it was December 1st and I remember I just trimmed back everything and pruned everything and everything was barren. And then I remember in April, everything that I had cut back, everything was re-blooming, showing up again, gorgeous. And it had pushed through that, it was that harvest time. There's seed time and there's harvest time.

And there's this growing time. And I understood growing pains. That's what I was like, oh, this is what growing pains, oh, this is what this means. Okay. But nature helped because the seasons helped me. As I guess it was rainy and it was dark when she passed.

And then a few months later, the sun was coming out, the weather had changed, the flowers were out, the hummingbirds were around, and it was a reminder of this too shall pat, like things will continue and you have to go on with life. And of course, while you were writing this book, I believe it was when it went to print, you also lost your father at that time and he knew you were writing the book, he was reading it was he.

Yes, he was into it. He was great. He was pushing me to write because he knew it would be cathartic for me. And I said, daddy, I've been writing this book, but Mommy's died, so I'm gonna put this away. It goes, no, no, no, I want you to write about Jackie. I want you to write about life. I want you to write, Nicole.

And he was so, I was so happy to have his presence in my home because yes, I was taking care of him, but he was really taking care of me to and Ted like you would just acknowledge He had just lost his father so to have a patriarch back in the house when Ted is grieving the loss of his own father To have my father's energy was great and my dad was a real doer I mean he was always moving and shaking and and getting things done. He never really sat down, never really relaxed. And he said to me, you have things to say in this book and you'll help people hopefully, you know, and he, what I love to do is I get this, this book is about being an offering.

It's not about business right now. This is an offering, Nicole, write your book, finish your book. Your mother would want you to finish your book. Your mother would want you to finish the book. And I said, I know, but I don't know how to pivot this because you'll figure it out. You could throw Jackie in there. But he did read it and he read five chapters for sure. And then he said he flipped through a lot. But he was so proud, Jay, because he knew his legacy and my mom's legacy were not going to be lost. And he was a big believer in history and legacy.

And he said, every generation has the responsibility to honor the generation before them of all races, of all religions, everybody who sacrificed. The greatest way to say thank you to the people that you will never have met, you can't say thank you to, is to honor them by taking the baton that they've given you and live your life. That's why my dad's big thing to me growing up was you better use your freedom wisely. I didn't have the freedom that you have. We're living in the same lifetime right now. Yeah. I didn't have what you have. I couldn't go to school.

I wanted to go to and go to the hospitals. I wanted to go to couldn't get healthcare. Nothing. I didn't have your rights, but I did not stop because you are the promise. And you, Jay, are the promise. Like all our generation, everybody is the promise. You think of all these wars that have been fought

and all around the world. Then it's for a freedom that the Western world has and war is not pretty. It's ugly. It's unfair. All of it's on. It's all nothing great. But the truth is it has happened from the beginning of time. So I think I love that my father reminded me, use your freedom wisely and remember your ancestry. Remember the people who came before you and remember that you are the promise. You are the promise. So show up. You're parents of phenomenal. They're just unbelievable. They're so it's so funny because they were so obvious that I told somebody today. My

dad was Archie Bunker from all the family and my mom was Queen Cleopatra. But their energy has got together, and they made magic. And they were complete opposites. But I just love how clear they were in their communication with you. Yeah. That today their ideas are so clear for you, and they're so coherent for you, not just that you can repeat them.

You know, when you can repeat them. You know, when children can repeat smart things, we get impressed. But when we become adults, we don't get impressed by repetition. We get impressed if someone can actually live and apply the ideas and to be living and applying the ideas in this much at a time of such horrendous pain, that speaks volumes to just how deeply your parents taught you these incredible. Yeah, they really wanted to make sure I never forgot a trick advantage or took for granted what I had, you know, and the blessings that I had. Yeah, there was one line in here about the blessings

that I loved because you have an area called the Blessings of Our Ancestors. But no, actually, there's this, there's this that I wanted to pick out. This is for anyone who's gonna be reading the book as well, this is on page 99. I know now that my parents, my mother, especially, truly were preparing me for a terrible day like this.

The lesson was this. It's not about the loss and the death, it's about the life. The dash between the dates, as my dad would say, that there is truly the art of living. The fact that you believe that your parents were preparing you for something hard and difficult. Yeah. It was a subconscious knowing, but I would always say to them, does everything have to be a lesson? Why is everything going to be a lesson?

I felt like every day I came home, I got it. Can we just, can I just go to soccer practice and come home and eat dinner and go to bed? And there was always a lesson, but my dad would say, you come with a number and you end with a number, what are you going to do with your dash? And it was all the time. And because they had seen so much tragedy. And my dad, I mean, he's born in 1931, segregated America.

He has seen his fair share of tragedy. So he didn't want me to be ignorant to the ills of people. He had already grown up with it. He had seen it. He was taught, don't do not look up in the sky because you might see someone that you know who's lynched. That was the world he grew up in. But the beauty of him is that he still found a way

to look at the great things of life. He still felt, I have something to do in this life. He still felt, I'm significant. He still felt, I'm gonna go out and fight for my rights and fight for the rights of other people. And so he wanted to make sure that I didn't become complacent. And so I think a lot of their lessons have reminded me of my history. There was so much pain or history in general of all people, of all races, because my mother loved, you know, we all say now the cultural appropriation. She's like, it's appreciation, it's appreciation,

because she believed that you have brothers and sisters all around the world that you're connected energetically. They're gonna be different races, different religions, different genders, doesn't matter. You're still connected. And they were really big on that, which I love love but with that came the history of a lot of people And so that's why I think they were preparing me because I saw With all the great history of every culture

There is also so much pain and trauma that got them to the Promised Land Yes, and so my mom that's what I meant by that, that they had prepared me because they gave me this appreciation of every culture that has been through something horrific. And yet they still chose to live. And they chose to still be good. And my mom's prescription always was,

be good, do good. Be good, do good. That's a start there. You know, she always say, I'm going to start there. What do I do with good, do good. Be good, do good. That's a start there. She always say, I'm gonna start there. What do I do with this? Be good and do good. Even right after she passed away, I went to a restaurant and the hostess was really rude

and I was still fresh in my trauma and she said something to somebody. And I remember I pointed my finger at her, I go, no, hey, wait, stop that. And she said, oh, I'm so sorry, I'm so sorry. But even though I was quote, in the right, I walked in and I could feel my mother inside of me saying, you don't ever put your finger in somebody's face. Don't you ever put some of your finger in someone's face.

So I remember walking over to the owner of the restaurant. I said, I'm really sorry. I just wanted to take ownership of this. I did do this. I am very sorry. I just wanted to take ownership of this. I did do this. I am very sorry. I have apologized to her. It was rude. And it doesn't matter that just, I just want to own this.

And he thought, you don't have to. You really, I go, no, I really do, because I can feel my mother. And I, and I, you don't want to be haunted by her. But I, I could just hear her saying, doesn't matter how, if an eye for an eye doesn't work. So just because she was rude, doesn't mean that you have to go and be rude.

You know, and that's what I had done. She was rude, so I said, I'm gonna get you back and I'm waving my finger, and my mommy's gonna say, an eye for an eye does not work. We all know that, it's proof it doesn't work. The karma doesn't settle, you just create more karma. Yeah. You just create more karma. Yeah's proof it doesn't work. The karma doesn't settle. You just create more karma. You just create more karma.

Yeah, so it doesn't work. It doesn't cancel it out. We think it's going to cancel the karma. All it does is make more karma to get over. Yeah, it's really fascinating how I'm so glad you and I feel like we're so convinced that if someone does something bad, then we can react. However we want, we're justified, but not realizing that it just creates more negative energy. It doesn't prepare you at, yeah, it creates more chaos. Yeah, there's nothing positive that comes out of an eye for an eye.

We think that there is, but it doesn't. I'd disturb this interview, Nicole. You said you're in repair. I love that word. I think we're all at the workshop. Yeah. I like that. We are at the workshop.

Yes, we are. Getting repaired on and, you know, being renewed and refueled in so many different ways. And I, do you still cry? Yes. A lot. Just the other day, I saw something, and it reminded me just right there,

it was this drag, all a bunch of dragonflies It was like a beehive and I've never seen that before and my mom love dragonflies and I when I tell you I burst Into tears, but deep cry like belly cry and I do cry a lot But it's helpful for me because I've noticed the times where I want to stop crying like oh Nicole It's been 20 months stop crying. No, it's and and it and it does release. It's a release. And that's why I think that the creator gave us the ability to cry. To to move that emotion to get that emotion out into to honor the emotion to look at it for what it is. Because until I cry, I don't really know how I feel about things until I do cry. And then I realize,

oh, that really did make me feel this way, or it did hurt me. I didn't realize how much that hurt me until the tears come. I'm so ready to say that. Yeah, the crying is important. And I actually will play music sometimes that I know will make me cry.

If I'm feeling stuck and I know that as soon as I get this out, it's going to create a space for new energy to come in. But you know, it's once you have that hard stagnant energy, and if you don't move it, new energy doesn't get to come in. Nicole, you've been so generous by sharing your journey with us today. And I'm really just appreciate how you've been down every normal natural path that anyone would mentally and emotionally and spiritually after this. And you found the end at the end of every path.

You know, when we get to the end of every path and it feels like there's nothing beyond it. And then you found the end, which is that extension that we all need to find. And I genuinely, genuinely, genuinely believe that if anyone has someone they love, this book is a toolkit, it's a guide to give someone the transformation that we know is possible. But I am an awe of how you've responded and been able to channel your parents in this very difficult time. It's so easy to say it and share it with you to use it at this time. It's beautiful. And I pray and I meditate that anyone who reads this book receives the courage that you have, the peace that you have gained and the helpfulness

for others to pass on what they've gained as well. Thank you. I appreciate that. Nicole, we end every on-purpose episode with a final five. These are questions that have to be answered in one word, one sentence maximum. And I believe it will be a really useful exercise because I think we'll even discover further. So Nicole, Evan, these are your final five. Oh boy.

The first is, what is the best grief or advice you've received during grief? Love. Love matters. That game changer for grief, healing balm. And what would you say is the worst grief advice or words to hear during times of grief? I know how you feel. I've said it so many times to people. I mean, I had to learn, I was going through my own thing going, oh my God, I've said all the wrong things

and done all the wrong things, but it's just a reaction that we all say. Yeah, it's because when we say we know we actually limit the other person's ability to share. Yeah, so it's over. I know how you feel. Oh, well, I can't even tell you how I feel. I can't even call on you to come and sit and talk with you and talk this out because you already know. Yeah, there's no chance for me to feel understood or seen or loved because I heard any of it. Yeah, because you already know. Thank you. That's really beautiful. I want to ask you these three words. You said eloquently chose third question for you. Walk me through

when you needed grit, when you required grace, and when you chose gratitude, it's gonna be one for each. So the grit showed up for me on this journey right when I got the news. I had to pivot and I had to, you know, grit for me is a hustle. It's a pivot. It's an action. And I had to have grit to move through these terrible times where I just wanted to sit down and do nothing. And I had to, I had to be present and on and figure this out. The grace was choosing to forgive, choosing

to give up the anger and the frustration and the pain and giving it up to a higher power and not letting it poison me. So that was the grace. And the gratitude was being so grateful that I had two parents who paid attention to me and supported me throughout my life. And I didn't understand a lot of things when I was younger. They were a little more strict than the parents and a little more disciplined and all this,

but thank God that I had parents who who did show up for me even in disagreements, even in hard times. I never once thought they weren't going to be there for me. And that's what I was the most grateful for that I had. I that I had them and my friends and my friends that showed up for me, I'm grateful that that's when I went into the gratitude of, my gosh, people are showing up for me. And people are taking care of me. Thank you.

So beautiful question number four, two left. Question number four, what was your most frequented prayer? I would say over and over again, my grant, it was my grandmother's prayer, which is today is the day the Lord has made and I choose to be glad and rejoiceful. And I just, I choose to be glad and rejoice in it. Sorry, that's it.

And I'd look at her like, okay, grandma, whatever. She says, sing the song and she'd be cooking her food. And I found that because it was repeated over and over again and I overheard her when I spent time with her and I and it was that word choice and I choose to be glad and rejoicing it So I just thought okay, I can do that too. I don't feel like it and Nothing is showing me that I should be joyful or glad, but I choose to be joyous and choose to be glad.

And then I found things to be glad about. That's how you found it. That's how I, yeah, that's how I, that's how I found it. I really was, and then my big mantra was, you know, I'm just standing in my faith. I'm standing in my faith. I would say that over and over and over again, even though I didn't really

believe that I was, I just set it over and over again because I needed to create some solid platform under me. Otherwise, it felt like quicksand. Fifth and final question, Nicole. We asked this to every guest who's ever been on the show. If you could create one law that everyone in the world had to follow, what would it be? The Golden Rule. Nicole, again, so grateful to you for coming on on purpose. For everyone who's been listening or watching the book is called, think you'll be happy. I want you to find out why it's called that when you read the book.

That's why I did not ask the question. It's a beautiful reason why it's called, think you'll be happy. The book is full of so many more stories, deep texture of explanations, behind things Nicole shared with us today. Please go and grab a copy, share it with the loved one, share it with someone who's lost one when you don't know the right thing to say or the right thing to text. If you feel the person is ready offer this to them. Like I said, I'll be offering it to,

and have already been offering it to friends. I wrote here as part of my testimony that this book should be required reading for anyone wanting to understand how to trust in the light even at the darkest times. And I truly mean that. The book by Nicole Avent, please, of course, clip and cut as you always do,

TikToks, Instagram, Reels that resonate with you, that connect with you, share them across, spread them because I hope you felt the energy that I felt by sitting here, I want you all to feel it and I want you all to share it because, even if we're not going through something like this right now, I know this energy will be extremely healing for those who are. So please pass it on and call them so grateful.

Thank you. Thank you. I'm so grateful to you. Thank you so much. Thank you. Thank you. If you love this episode, you'll love my interview with Dr. Gabel Mateh on understanding your trauma and how to heal emotional wounds to start moving on from the past.

Everything in nature grows only where it's vulnerable. So a tree doesn't grow where it's hard and thick. Does it? It goes where it's soft and only with vulnerable. So a tree doesn't grow over its heart and thick. Does it? It goes with soft and green and vulnerable. Regardless of the progress you've made in life, I believe we could all benefit from wisdom on handling common problems, making life seem more manageable, now more than ever. I'm Eric Zimmer, host of the One-Dee Feed Podcast, where I interview thought-provoking guests who offer practical wisdom that you can use to create the life you want.

25 years ago, I was homeless and addicted to heroin. I've made my way through addiction recovery, learned to navigate my clinical depression, and figured out how to build a fulfilling life. The one you feed has over 30 million downloads and was named one of the best podcasts by Apple Podcasts. Oprah Magazine named this as one of 22 podcasts to help you live your best life. You always have the chance to begin again and feed the best of yourself. The trap is the person often thinks they'll act once they feel better. It's actually the other way around. I have had over 500 conversations with world-renowned experts and yet I'm still striving to be better. Join me on this

journey. Listen to the one you feed on the iHeart Radio app Apple Podcast or wherever you get your podcasts. Our 20s are often seen as this golden decade. Our time to be carefree, make mistakes and figure out our lives. But what can psychology teach us about this time? I'm Jemma Speg, the host of the Psychology of Your 20s. Each week we take a deep dive into a unique aspect of our 20s, from career anxiety, mental health, heartbreak, money, and much more to explore the science behind our experiences. The Psychology

of Your 20s hosted by me, Gemma Speg. Listen now on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcasts. Gemma Speg, listen now on the iHotRadio app Apple Podcast or wherever you get your podcasts.