Parks and Recollection - The Treaty (S4E7)

Episode Date: May 30, 2023

“We got the freaking Moon!” Jim O’Heir (Jerry Gergich himself) and writer Greg Levine are discussing Season 4, Episode 7 of Parks and Recreation - it’s “The Treaty!” A meeting of the Pawnee Central High School's Model UN club leads to a historic face-off between Leslie and Ben, Ron and Tom interview some terrible job applicants (including Kyle Mooney and the show’s actual accountant!), and Chris seeks dating advice from his co-workers (including, for some reason, his girlfriend’s father). It’s another great episode of Parks - give it a listen and treat yo’ self!

We're getting together to talk about all the things we used to do The laughs, the passions, the little Sebastian's, the pets we fell into And we're putting it on in a podcast, then we'll send it up into the sky We're calling it Parks and Recollection Come on little podcast, spread your wings and fly Okay, hello everybody. Welcome back again to Parks and Recollection. I am one of your hosts, Jim O'Hare, Gary Laird, Jerry Terry, Barry from Parks and Rec, with my better half. That's right. I am your other host.

I am Greg Levine. I am not Jerry Terry Laird. I'm not. Although I get Craig a lot. Yeah. Greg is that kind of word. Yeah. Greg, Craig, Bob.

Yeah. Yeah. It gets to the point that I'll be somewhere and people say, let's say I'm at a party. Let's just say it, Jim. Well, then that goes against everything I've heard. I know. So you do get invited. But I go to loud places on occasion and you meet somebody and they say, what's your name?

And I'll say, Greg. And they'll say, Craig. And I'll say, Greg. And they'll say, oh, Craig. And I'm like, okay, whatever. And I realize I don't need to correct these people. I'm never going to see them again. Why do I care that they know my name is Greg?

So for all of those listening, my family or anybody, it's Greg. It's Greg. And also, I have had a few problems. If I voice text to you, the voice text, Siri, whoever does it, will put the two Gs. G-R-E-G-G. And I know it's the one G. Can I tell you something? I've noticed.

I know. And then I feel bad because I'm like, he's going to think I don't even know how to spell his damn name. But I do. But then you don't have the wherewithal, the desire, the motivation to fix it. None of the above. Okay. I have none of the above, especially to you. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No, no, no. But no, but seriously, welcome everybody. As always,

we're excited to be here because I know I say this all the time, but this is another great episode because it is. It is another. I mean, it is a great episode. It also it's I mean, it's set around something I always wanted to do when I was in high school, which was Model UN. I thought it was really interesting. And now that I see I missed out on perhaps some really crazy drama in the General Assembly, I missed out. I don't even know if my high school had that. I've never heard of it until we did it. Until we did the episode, I'd never heard of it.

You don't even know about the United Nations, do you? Oh, you know what? That's South of Dakota. Okay, you of it. You didn't even know about the United Nations, do you? Oh, you know what? That's South of Dakota. Okay, you got it. You got it. Yeah. My car, I don't know if I could drive there. I don't know.

Move on from there. This is a great episode. This is a great episode. And it is the treaty written by the great Harris Whittles. Harris Whittles. I know you guys have talked about Harris before, but let me just jump in quickly. You know, as listeners mostly know, Harris hasittles. I know you guys have talked about Harris before, but let me just jump in quickly. You know, as listeners mostly know, Harris has passed away, and he was just one of the best.

Funny, so smart, so smart. Also played, you know, he had a recurring role on the show. Yes. Which was hysterical. Yes. Who was the guy he was with? Oh, with Colton Dunn. Colton Dunn, who then he went on to Superstore.

Yeah, yeah. He works all the time. But anyway, Harris Whittles is missing. I'll never forget a moment. We were all at the Emmys, and they were doing the In Memoriam. And it's interesting, those In Memoriams are so hit and miss. Sometimes they don't hit certain people. You're like, how did that person not get mentioned? Or how did this person get whatever and i was it was uh nick was next to me and i think

his wife megan whatever it was and harris's picture came up during the in memoriam and it kind of like i it was kind of a a bit of a slap like a shock, not in a bad way, like a whoa. And I look, Nick's eyes are wet. My eyes are wet. Megan's eyes. I mean, it was just, it was lovely. It was lovely that they did that. He certainly deserved that.

But yeah, anyway, great guy. I just haven't been here when we've done one of his episodes. No, of course. No, he's, I will say this to anyone. I never laughed more by someone's humor than Harris was. I love that.

He's the... And is he the original Humblebrag creator? He invented a word. He invented that. Yeah, he entered the lexicon. It's unbelievable. That is incredible.

I mean, really, Humblebrag will go down forever. Yeah, it's one of the few things from Parks, I think, that also that's entered the zeitgeist in a way that you don't even have to know that Parks and Recreation was a show and you just know of this. Right, we talked about treat yourself. Treat yourself, of course. He talked about it in the room, this idea, the concept of a humble brag, but pretty much that he invented this idea, this word, and this Twitter account that took off and became a book and now is a word that we say. I use it all the time. I've heard you say it on this podcast.

Yes, all the time. I learned an immense amount about writing from Harris, an immense amount about how to be a person from Harris. Yeah, good man. Really great guy. Good man, good man. And a lovely family. I've met a lot of them and, of course, heartbroken for their situation, but they. Really great guy. I'm very excited. And a lovely family. I've met a lot of them. And, of course, heartbroken for their situation.

But they're just lovely people. And God bless Harris Whittles. Wonderful man. Yes. Wonderful man. It feels crazy to now say that this episode was directed by Jorma Taccone. But, like, we're going to – Jorma, we also think you're wonderful. Yes, Jorma. Yes. We don't also think you're wonderful. Yes, you are.

Yes. We love you. Also one of the Lonely Island boys. Oh, yeah. Yeah. And Jim, can you blurb us, tell us a little bit about what this episode's about? Okay. So, hey, everybody, Leslie and Ben are excited about the opportunity to lead a Model UN,

United Nations conference, but their post-dating relationship becomes the major crisis of the event. Andy and April uniquely lend a helping hand at the Model UN. Ron tries to get Tom to take his old job back. Chris enlists advice from Ann, Donna, and a very uneasy Jerry to find out why Millicent, Jerry's daughter, isn't returning his calls. Yeah, you know what you do when you, this person's not returning my calls. I'm going to talk to their dad. Yes, let's get the dad involved. I'm going to talk to dad's friends. And let's get my ex-girlfriend involved.

Everything you wouldn't do is what Chris does. But that's Chris. That's Chris. That's our boy. So we talked about it. We jumped to some of our notes, but this episode was directed by Jorma Tskun, who was one third of the sketch comedy crew of The Lonely Island.

Yes. But what I think is interesting, he was childhood friends with Andy Samberg and Akiva Shaver. I didn't realize that. I don't think I did either. Look at this. Fun fact. Wow.

Nope, notes turned into a fun fact. Fun fact, yes. We have a great moment in this episode. At one point, Leslie emulates Soviet premier Nikita Khrushchev's infamous 1960 shoe-banging incident at the UN. Which is amazing.

But let me, here is a weird coincidence. So I'm prepping for this show because people, believe it or not, when you're listening, I do prep. Yes.

Even though you're thinking he sounds like he walks right in that door, plops down a meal, eats and does this show. No, that's not what happens. Just last night, now depending on when

this airs, I don't know, on Jeopardy, because I do watch Jeopardy. I'm very smart. The question was, this supposedly happened. Really? Yes. I thought that was really interesting. It was a question on Jeopardy. The supposed pounding of the thing. So there's no video of this? Wouldn't you think? Yeah. there's no photographic or video records. Eyewitnesses have said he brandished the shoe, but not banged it. Interesting.

So it was a shoe brandishing. Yeah, yeah. I mean, random, but it's just so weird that we were going to be doing this episode, and then that was the question. That's incredible. So let's jump right into it with our synopsis, and let's start the episode.

Because Leslie has been asked to lead a session of Pawnee Central High's Model UN Club. The only person as excited for this as she is, is Ben. April and Andy are also invited to join. And Leslie is assigned Denmark. Ben is Peru. Andy is Finland. And April is assigned South Africa on the condition that she also be the moon. Ron interviews replacements for Tom's old job, and though Tom claims to have moved on to new ventures,

Ron knows he's actually working retail at Macy's. Which, you know, fine. That's great that people work. He's spraying people with cologne. But that's what he's doing there. That's what he's doing, yeah. He's spraying people with cologne. But that's what he's doing there. That's what he's doing. Chris spirals because Millicent, Jerry's daughter, hasn't returned his phone call.

So he asks Antonia, and I'll repeat it, Millicent's father, Jerry, for their help. Okay, let's jump right in because it's so fun to see something that Leslie and Ben have very much in common. You know, besides just working for the city and their interest in one another. They're both so interested in this. I love the stuff in the beginning. You think they're on... We're setting up a game where you think they're going to be on the same side,

but actually they're going to come to blows over this Model UN. They're going to be on opposite sides of this. Oh, and it gets personal. Yeah, it gets really intense, actually. And I love the fact that Leslie has all of these flags. These aren't something she had to go get. She has all of these flags.

Yes, yes, yes. In fact, I'm going to jump because there's an, in our notes, we have an oops moment. You know I'm uncomfortable when we jump around, Greg. You know me. I like to just go straight, follow the path. I know you do. Okay, this one time, let's do this. Let me do this, Tim. In an

oops one, in the opening shot with all the flags, the flag of Newfoundland and Labrador is seen towards the center of the table. Only, Newfoundland and Labrador is a province of Canada, not a country. You're going to love it.

You're going to love it. You're going to love this. You're going to love this. Those in going to love it. I love it. I'm sorry. Go ahead. You're going to love this. You're going to love this. Those in the car, at home, at the gym, on the driveway, everyone's going to love this

because it's Wow. That kind of reaction. The buildup on this is just a lot. There's a laugh at the gym. It's like, oh yeah,

I guess people at the gym could listen to this. It's flag, Newfoundland and Labrador, its flag was designed by local artist named Christopher Pratt. Well, you spun that around and I'm here to say, yes,

I take back my sleeping. You don't say, Greg, with two G's. Listen to this guy. Boy, is that not a nerdy fact or what? No, but that's really cool. Yeah, thank you. How did you wrap that around? Did you really look into that?

Well, I didn't just make that fact up. Wow. Well, in any way. I feel like I should be doing more. If he's doing stuff like that. Yes, you should be. They have all these flags. It's so cute.

I love the setup of this episode because we're excited to see Leslie and Ben who are figuring out their relationship in a way that they can't be together. You think, oh, they're going to be together here. It's great. And it's very quickly going to go off the rails. And it's quite intense, isn't it? They get personal. Yes. Like when it goes off the rails, it gets personal. Right. Because it's kind of like when Leslie

blows off the Model UN stuff for her campaign work, it almost as if it hurts Ben on not just an emotional level because they're into each other, but on a personal like, but it's about this thing we both like, the Model UN.

It's just, it feels like it's another example for Ben that maybe Leslie's not taking him seriously in this. But it's in a weird spot in their relationship because technically it's so, they're not together. They are not a couple at this point. So his feelings is because he has feelings for her, but she is, I'm kind of team Leslie on the fact that, hey, we got to get other stuff done. Right. You know, they're meant to be together. So it's all good. But I, you know, life happens and you have other things to do.

So I don't know. I think he, for me, I was more like, I get, well, of course she had to step away. She's got a campaign to run. Let's jump from that to just a random Ron fact that we get here, which is so great in that we learned that every three weeks, Ron has to sand down his toenails. As he very proudly says, they're too strong for clippers. You guys, it's the first thing I wrote down about the episode. So I watched this, you know, and it is the first note I took. Is that not the greatest? Yes. And he's so proud.

He's so proud of that. And let's analyze this part, which is another great. When Tom and Ron are in this story together. First of all, Tom and Ron is always a great pairing. It's always funny. Talk about two opposite worlds. Exactly. Oh my gosh.

And they each can poke each other in the right way. So Ron interviews these people to potentially take over for Tom's job, right? Right. And let's call out a few of them because we have some special people. First is the late, great Murray Gershens as Courtney. Hysterical. So funny. Then we have the alive but also still great Kyle Mooney as Keith.

And Kyle kills it in this scene, I think. So Kyle and all of the good neighbor guys cracked us up in the writer's room. We'd watch his stuff. We watched their stuff on YouTube all the time. And Harris was especially a big fan, was especially tickled by Kyle. And so this part was written for him. So I was going to ask that when that happens,

especially if you're the writer of the episode, do you have a little extra power to say, listen, hey, Mike, I was thinking this person for the role or this person for the role? I think you could suggest a friend. I think this person would be good. They should audition or whatever it is. But in this case,

Kyle was already growing a comedy brand. He wasn't on SNL yet, I don't think, but he just was so naturally funny. We watched his YouTube videos, we watched the Good Neighbor YouTube videos, and you know, there was this idea that maybe Kyle, a type like this,

would be a great, and maybe it should be Kyle. And let's have it be Kyle. And what do you think is so funny about the way Kyle does comedy? And let's build that into the character. That's so great. Because I don't know, people often say, well, how do people get on the different shows? The nice thing about Parks was, I mean, one of the many, many, many nice things. Like after a table read, if there was a certain role that we read

and even me, if I had like, oh man, I know someone who might be great for that. You could always pitch that, whether it's to the casting director or to Mike or somebody, which was really great. Didn't mean they get the job because there's so many other factors

that go into why somebody gets a job. Go on all day about that. But I love that. And sometimes, but I will say this, gets a job that go on all day about that but i love that and sometimes that but i will say this they never ever did not bring in my person to at least read you know i mean if i had a recommendation they brought that person they brought that person in yeah which was lovely like so yeah i don't know but even mike you know when especially for big guest spots he'd be like anyone have any great idea?

Right. It's also a sign of the great collaborative nature that is television. When it's done great, there's all hands on deck. Who do we know? In this case, for network comedy at the time, we were making close to 22, 24 episodes a year. You're constantly working on maybe five episodes at a time in various stages. And you can be precious, but you also have to just like, we have to keep going.

Who knows someone who's good for the part? Let's keep going. Yeah. I just love that they were open to that. Oh, yeah. You never felt like you couldn't speak up if you, you know. Well, this is one of the best segues I think we've ever had. Really?

I'll tell you what. Oh, now I'm disappointed. Go ahead. Because there is someone who was perfect for the part, and he's in this episode. Our unbelievable Parks and Recreation, the actual TV show in the human world, our payroll accountant, Gary McGlufkin.

Yes. Is Gary. Yes, he is. Gary McGlufkin is Gary from Gary, Indiana here. And I love when Tom says a fact is not an anecdote, Gary. Exactly. It's hard. Sometimes you just meet a person and you're like, you got to be in this thing.

That's Gary McGlufkin. He's so great. Well, speaking of the opportunity, before we move on to the story, there's a lot more with Chris and Millicent and Jerry to get into. But this opening, this introduction, Chris describes Millicent as Jerry Gurgich's surprisingly hot daughter. Jim, what the fuck? What the fuck? How hurtful is that? I know. Yeah. I want to be in the writers room. Who came up with that? Someone wrote that. Who wrote that line? But this has been Chris. I mean, this is the same Chris who said, no, I'm not going to go to lunch with you, Jerry,

and then sees Millicent like, yes, I'm going to go to lunch with you. Right. Who makes out with Millicent in front of Jerry. Grinds. Grinds. Right. Right. Like as if their plane is going down.

Right. It's so crazy to me. And it works. It works because of how intense he is. And, you know, I also think that Donna is really in her element in this storyline. Oh, this is Donna. You know? This is absolutely Donna's element.

Yes. When she perked up about that whole sex thing, she was in. And then what was it when he—what did he say? Was she—because right as advice is, dude, don't be at her beck and call. You're too available. Yeah. You're too accessible. And of course, Jerry's there hearing this like, huh? Yeah, this is my daughter.

Just tell her how you feel. I know, I know. Yeah, it was tough. Well, let's move on. In our synopsis, the Model UN's task is to solve a food crisis. Leslie and Ben seem to be getting along as friends, but when Leslie leaves a treaty meeting for a photo op for her campaign,

Ben becomes annoyed and passive-aggressive about it. He cuts Denmark, a.k.a. Leslie, out of the treaty and tells her they really can't spend time together as friends and that she's being selfish. Leslie retaliates by declaring war on Peru. Ron interviews a few more candidates to agitate Tom into returning, but it doesn't work. There is so much Ben and Leslie tension. Yeah.

In a way that we rarely do see this version of their relationship, right? Yeah. I mean, at the end of the last episode, it seemed like the drama had been resolved. But they're now struggling with being truly platonic and spending time together at all. It's interesting to get to see them fully nerd out here. Leslie shouts to Ben, the only thing I will be waving is your decapitated head on a stick in front of your weeping mother. How hardcore is that? And then the room silences.

And Ben says, good Lord. Good Lord. And I think, first of all, good Lord. The way he said it always cracked me up. But it worked so well here because, yes, good Lord, man. Good Lord. How did you go to that? So the only thing you'll be waving is, okay, so we have a decapitated head.

Not just your head on a stick, but the head has been decapitated. Where is it? It's on a stick. So that means it's been taken off. It's your head. It's been taken off and it's been put onto a stick. What do you do with it? Is that enough? No. I found your mother. Brought her in. I'm waving it

in front of your mother and I gotta tell you, here's what's happening to your mother. She's weeping. She's weeping. Full out weeping. Yeah, there's a lot going on there. But nobody does a good Lord better than Adam Scott. It's just... I know a lot of priests would probably say, wait a second.

No, just that is such a Ben comeback. Good Lord. Good Lord. Like all the things you could have said. Yeah. Dear God, how did you come up with that? Because Adam and Ben, this incredulousness that they do with their, like, you can also see his look. Like, you know, he'll do it with Andy and April.

Oh, so many Andy and April. When they brought Champion home, like, I gotta say, that dog have three legs before. Like, I just need to, are we living in the same reality right now? So here's Leslie, who's taking it to an extreme. Good Lord. Yeah, that was perfect. Perfect. Should we jump forward?

Sure, jump, jump, jump. So Ron decides to just pointedly ask Tom to come back to his old job, but Tom can't set aside his pride that easily. Meanwhile, Leslie and Ben completely ignore the UN food crisis. I mean, there is a UN food crisis, but the UN food crisis is in our story. And the event spirals out of control, with the UN eventually ejecting Denmark and Peru. Denmark, famously the happiest country in the world.

Anne tells Chris that his overbearing, optimistic personality may be scaring off Millicent, and specifically that Chris tried to change Anne's lifestyle to be more like his, but then became bored with dating someone who is too similar. Really insightful, Anne. Really insightful. Anne, her character, if you really think about where she went to where she is at this point. Anne has become such a stronger woman. Yeah. And I give Leslie a lot of that credit. She really learned because you would think an Anne Perkins in real life is this wonderful

and she's this amazing nurse. And so she's smart and educated and beautiful. Like she has it all. If you look at her, she has it all. But she's kind of a kind of messy inside when it comes to guys. We've seen episodes where she turns herself into what the other guy is. Right, right, right. We've seen all that.

And she's learned it all. I don't know. I think it's really awesome how her character went from, again, not that she should have been, but she was insecure. And what can I do to make this guy like me? To telling him, hey, dude, I fell into that with you. And I, you know, that is not healthy. Yeah, no. I think it's great.

I think it's great. I think the two most important relationships, character relationships on this show, it's Leslie and Ron and Leslie and Anne. Yeah. And I think that Leslie and Ron get a lot of the attention because of the natural comedy, because they work together. And a lot of the comedy would come from like this. I mean, Ron is Leslie's boss for most of the show. You know, Leslie softens Ron. I'd say that's his arc.

And Ron, I think, toughens Leslie, right? Yeah. She gets better at being her confidence. Yeah. But I think— You can set her on course if she veers to a weird place. Right. But Leslie and Anne, I think, is

perhaps the best relationship for me, just because, I mean, Anne instigates this series, right? She comes to this public forum and says, there's this hole in the back of my house, and can someone just do something about it, right? That's how it begins. and what i love is that

that the show is is such a show about friendship it's such a show about female friendship specifically yeah and i love that these people these two women these people have each other's back in this way i love the fact that leslie can tease and joke about ann all the time and say that she's a beautiful you know slippery fish or whatever she'll say. Tropical fish or any kind of fish. And sometimes Anne just loves it. Sometimes Anne's a little weirded out by it. But ultimately they just have each other's back.

I also love that Anne will both support Leslie in anything Leslie needs, but also can call her out on her shit. Absolutely. She sprays her with water I think at some point. And she says, Leslie, you've got to go to the hospital. They take care of each other.

They are girlfriends. In the truest sense of the word, they are girlfriends. And that's why I feel like when you're talking about this, and not to get too deep about it again, but I think that Anne is able to be this person with Chris right now

because of her relationship with Leslie, because of the growth between the two of them. Yes. They have helped each other grow to be better people. Yes. And this is a huge development. I mean, I'm so happy for Anne at this point because you realize,

oh, she ain't going to be shit on anymore. Right. Because she shouldn't be. She has so much to offer. Right. And again, down the road, other things happen and whatever. But I just loved this. I really did love this.

Well, what's great about this also, besides this beautiful sentiment, is that Anne gets some closure with her relationship with Chris finally. I mean, I think back to the episode earlier this season when they're shooting the PSAs and she's like, I can't believe I dated this guy. I dated that guy. But what's also great is that, so the scene is fun. Jerry obviously hates what's going on here. Donna loves it, but we learn a great,

every so often we get great facts. So we learn about Ron's toenails. We learn in this one also that on a lover's vacation to Eagleton, which is wonderful, Chris and Anne's jacuzzi broke. Oh, boy. But Chris did wind up eating food off of her body and that they went to a tantric workshop.

And it's just funny. And I don't mean to, I feel like you're going to pick up on this because I know what I know about you. But it's funny because clearly Chris and Anne got freaky. Oh, yeah. You know?

And it's like, you meet these characters and you have this lovely relationship with these characters. But like, you know, they all, they all pair up and they all have sex.

They all, it's the unspoken thing. Right? It's like, there's this, you know, I think sometimes like at the end of every day, like Brad Pitt brushes his teeth, right? And washes his face, like gets into bed and just is like, goes to sleep and says, I guess

I'm surrendering to being asleep. We all are humans. And so they're in this relationship. And what we're learning and we're not saying it is that Chris and Ann got freaky. Totally got freaky. Let's call out a few fun moments because I know we have, I'm looking and we're not saying it is that Chris and Anne got freaky. Totally got freaky. Let's call out a few fun moments because I know I'm looking and we have so much still to talk about, but I

love April refusing to conform to the Model UN the entire time, saying the moon will join your coalition. And then Liz is like, yeah, we got the freaking moon. What are you going to do without tides, Peru? An amazing Andy joke

that's not in the script I don't know if it's a Pratt improv I don't know if it's a Harris joke it sounds equally like a Pratt improv and a Harris joke so I think we'll award points to both of them in the world where we award points on this show but Andy says if you arrange the letters of Peru

you can spell Europe right and it's arrange the letters of Peru, you can spell Europe. Right? And it's so, what's great about it is that in a way you can because those four letters are in the word Europe,

but that's not what he means. Oh my God, I cracked up. I forgot about that joke. It made me laugh so much. And of course, the greatest there, and I wrote it down, but I know you have it here in the notes. So one of the other great Andy moments is, you know, they're trying to fit a flag for him. And she says, Andy, will you be Iceland? He's like, the bad guys from Mighty Ducks 2? No, I don't think so.

She goes, how about Japan? The bad guys from Karate Kid 2? Even worse. And then he has a great idea. He says, well, how about Germany? They've never been the bad guys from Karate Kid 2? Even worse. And then he has a great idea. He says, well, how about Germany? They've never been the bad guys. Brilliant. It's great. It's great. Okay. Well, back in our story, back in our synopsis, April arranges, back in our synopsis, April arranges for Ben and Leslie to talk out their problems, and Ben suggests they simply avoid each other from now on.

Leslie wants to keep Ben in her life still so the two compromise and agree to have a fun conversation at work for five minutes a day. Now, Ron pretends to beg Tom to take his position back in front of everyone, and despite this, Tom still says no, angering Ron. Tom then has to beg Ron for his job back in front of everyone. And despite this, Tom still says no, angering Ron. Tom then has to beg Ron for his job back in front of the group. And Ben and Leslie apologized to the kids and the model UN by organizing a special session that will be held at Pawnee city hall in a few months. Great wrap up.

Lots going on there. So Leslie and Ben's combo, right? Yeah. The problem is clearly not over between them, but it's being so Leslie and Ben's convo right yeah the problem is clearly not over between them but it's being worked on and it's tough

where do they go from here like obviously we know you and I know where we go from here we do some people have watched the show already know where we go from here

and we're gonna go there pretty soon yeah but yeah it's it's just this I think it's sweet they're gonna try to do this we're gonna have a fun

conversational work every day for a few minutes but you know that not a fix. I think they both realized at this point, okay, we can't have this relationship, but I can't not have you in my life. Right. Even though Ben was going to try, it felt like Ben was trying to maybe head that direction. Like maybe I just cut this out, but they can't. So, okay, we'll have a great friendship. And I have been down the road where you have great friendships with people that are amazing, but I've never been in a relationship that turned into that. That would be, I can't imagine what that is. Especially then if you're a great friendship, you start talking about dating other people and everything.

Imagine where that would go. I don't know. Well, I also, I remember conversations in the writer's room that, you know, for a few episodes, and it's going to bleed into the next one too, you know, Leslie and Ben have decided they can't be together and they're going to keep testing. How is this going to work? Right. And in End of the World, in the previous episode, it's kind of the conversations are more about, you know, is dating, like has Ben interested in Sean the Mallway tweet, right? How do we go from here on the topic of relationship? In this sense, it's how do we go from here? This one's kind of not really about work. Work instigates the model

you're in, but where do we go from here when we're just talking about the stuff that interests us, right? Our interests, our passions, our pursuits. And the next episode, T's is going to be about work specifically. Where do we go from here when it comes to work? And I think the attempt was, if I remember correctly, was let's see them try and fail a few times. Let's see them try and test how do we find a path forward? Because we may need to make a real tough decision. Do we go for it or do we say goodbye forever? And we just can't. Was there talk, was there like when people are pitching in the room, was there ever talk of maybe they don't end up together or that was just always a foregone

conclusion? I think there's always talk. I think in this sense, there was a knowledge that they would end up together. But how you get there, I think especially you think about how long is it going to take for people to get together? Right. And how long after they get together, do we break them up?

I remember I would watch shows when I was a kid or in high school and college, whatever it was, and you'd wait for these two people to get together and it would take like two, three seasons. You're like, please get together. And then they would get together and three, four, five episodes later, they break up. And I hated it. Me too.

I felt like, no, I've invested in this. At least let me invest in the relationship for a while. I mean, there was talk, I remember reading about this and hearing about it from the office that there was talk about should Jim and Pam break up in the last season? Are they meant to be together forever? Is there a story where they don't stay together, but they now have these kids and they're bonded forever and that? Oh, that would have been awful. It would have been awful. And so here's the thing. And so the conversation, I think we knew they were going to be together. But how quickly

do they get together? And then do they stick? How long do they stay together after that? And I think, as just a viewer, because I'm with you, these ones that would play it out season after season, they're just about to get together and then something happens and they don't. I think they played

this one perfectly. I think the time it took to get them together, and then I and they don't. Right. I think they played this one perfectly. I think the time it took to get them together. And then I know we don't want to jump too far forward, but you know, it's all, you know, it's a good thing. It's good stuff. It's a good stuff. It's a good relationship for them. And I do remember on The Office near the end, there was, you could see, they did put a couple of tense episodes with Pam and Jim that you could have seen where, wow, would they ever consider breaking them up?

Yeah. I mean, there was a storyline about, you know, Jim and Pam with the boom mic operator. Yes, the dude. People hated it. Yes. People reacted. People hated it. People were so, no, these are the people.

Yes. Let me have, I think people are like, you know, life is tough. Exactly. 50% of marriages end in divorce and all this stuff. Let me have, I think people are like, you know, life is tough. Exactly. 50% of marriages end in divorce and all this stuff. Let me have Jim and Pam. That's all I need. Jim and Pam.

Let us just have this. From Ross and Rachel to Jim and Pam. Yes. Let me have it. We need to be able to root. We need an example that it will work. Yeah. I love it. But I also love that with Parks, once they were together, it wasn't back and forth and back and forth and back and forth.

They're in love. Right. Yeah, I love that. So, you know, I think the stuff with Tom and Ron is so funny at the end and that Tom can't just help. Yeah, I know. But I have to I have to point something out. Please. It made me a little uncomfortable. Was it Ron like to do the fake welcoming back because i'm thinking oh i don't

see ron doing that but it led up to such brilliant comedy stuff after that him leaving him angry him fast walking him getting time to go oh dude is that how this shit's going down i don't know i just i don't know i hear you saying i do think that every so often on the show, Ron very begrudgingly agrees to do something that is out of his comfort zone for somebody that matters to him. Well, if you've learned nothing else about this show, this is another perfect example.

And Ron is Ron. He's hardcore. He's a man's man. He also has a heart of gold. And these people mean the world to him. Whether he can say that out loud every day, no, that isn't going to happen. I mean, Ron carried Tom out of the library from Tammy 2's clutches, right? Like, I think that there is a soft spot for Tom's character specifically. Yeah. I do see what you're saying. It doesn't feel like the guy we know

would give in to doing this thing, would be willing to fake look weak. Yeah, because basically, Ron comes out and goes, I don't know exactly what he said. It was very much pandering to what Tom wanted him to say, and it was a whole thing.

And I'm thinking, oh God, that does not seem Ron-like. And it was a whole thing. And I'm thinking, oh, God, that just, that does not seem Ron-like. And then, of course, Tom comes in and totally screws up everything that he just said. Yeah, yeah. And then the real comedy kicks in. Well, the good news is, welcome back, Tom.

You're back in the office. We have you. Yay, Tom, thank you. Love that, love that. Can I tell one other little anecdote that maybe we can't, I don't know. You know what? I need a nap. Go ahead. Okay. Well, love that. Can I tell one other little anecdote that maybe we can't, I don't know. You know what? I need a nap.

Go ahead. Okay. Well, buckle up. Get that pillow and blanket out, Jim. So Andy, Andy has a joke about having his own personal Camp David. Yes. I remember this talking head being a big source of discussion in the writer's room. In one sense, it's a funny joke.

It's such a funny joke. But some people thought that it wasn't an Andy joke. Or more specifically, that it was too smart for Andy. He doesn't know what Camp David is, right? Not a clue. So the question was, is this even a joke to Andy? Like, he was just genuinely calling it Camp David. So the joke is that we know that there's a Camp David.

Yes. So anyway, for Andy, he's saying no subtext, no hidden meaning. So I remember some people, I remember even I think Dan Gore was one of the people. Like we're just this debate is like, is this does. So what wound up happening is there's a line that falls. It says, how do you know about Camp David? And I'm pretty confident that that was added as a compromise of sorts in the room to kind of spell it out a little more. It's because it couldn't just live in the space.

Do you know what I mean? I think they made the right call. Andy would have no clue about Camp David, but his explanation of what he thought was Camp David makes perfect sense. Yes, yes, yes. So anyway, little fact, how the sausage got made in that joke. Love those behind the scenes.

BTS people, that's what it's called. Yes. Well, Jim. Oh, that was my radio voice. BTS people, that's what it's called. What have you been doing. Oh, that was my radio voice. BTS people, that's what it's called. What have you been doing this whole time? Good morning, everybody. Jim O'Hare on the air in Rensselaer. That was my first radio job, people. I was a DJ in Rensselaer, Indiana.

Really? Good morning. I did pig reports. Bring us back. Bring us back. Bring us back. Good morning. Jim O'Hare on the air in Rensselaer.

Whoa, we got a rainy day today in Rensselaer. But don't worry, because the John Deere tractor company, whoever they're there, have not paid their bills. So we're not going to be able to stay on the air much longer. Stuff like that happened. Truly, it was the craziest thing ever. And you've been sitting on this the whole time? I've been sitting on that little Jim. Oh, my God.

No, I shouldn't say it wasn't John Deere, but there were companies in this town. And the guy who ran the station, I'm not going to give out names, he would, you know, certainly in the old days, I don't know how it works now, he would trade out ads for things. So he would be driving a Cadillac because he traded ads with the Cadillac dealer. Well, that meant no income was coming in because he's trading shit out. He'd have a snowmobile. He'd have this. He'd have that. And we would have checks that would bounce at the local grocery store.

Really? Yes. And one week, speaking of what Chris said about Jerry's daughter being so beautiful, I had just moved there with, again, this little town rental there in Indiana. And I get my first paycheck, and It's like $120 for the week. The whole thing was just a nightmare. But, um, and I go, he said, yeah, you can cash out at the food market or whatever. So I go there and the woman looks at it and she goes, oh, you're Jim O'Hare from the radio. I go, yeah. Feeling like, yeah, Jim O I'm Jim and I are from the radio. You lucky, lucky gal.

And she goes, oh, I didn't think you'd look like that. Oh. She literally said that. Wasn't that nice? What a lovely time to be alive. What a welcoming, welcome to our little community, Jim. I'm sorry. No, it's okay.

That hit hard. That hit hard. This is the energy we want to kind of wrap up the episode with. Jim, do you have any crap we didn't get to? Oh, my God. You know I do. I love there's, after everything blows up in the model you went and they cut to April, she goes, I just wanted to say that I thought it was really cool how everything fell apart in there.

Because, of course, she loves anything that falls apart uh so that was one of them also at some point ben looks at one of the kids and just screams shut up bulgaria it was so like ben bring it down dude you are very intense with that i don't know why this caught me super funny after ben and and Leslie are just fighting back and forth, back and forth, he takes this white, you weren't sure what it was, but obviously it was going to be a white flag. And he says to Leslie, you might want to borrow this. She'll need it. And April goes, no one wants your dirty underwear, Ben.

I don't know. Caught me funny. Yeah. Caught me funny. It got me, as they say, in the giggles. Giggle factory. There you go. Anyway, and again, I wrote down the interview

with Courtney. It was just so funny because he basically said he did one thing and he goes, and then I was in jail for a spell. That brings us up to date. The man is like 90. How long was he in jail? Pretty recently for a while. Yeah, pretty pretty recently for a while yeah pretty recently and for a while

yeah I love your crap and it does I wrote down here Jerry got fucked over at the end what happened why did I write that down

well isn't that just the way of the world for you I feel like did something specific happen at the end with Jerry because I have

Jerry fucked over at the end he's mad about the copy machine when Tom gets the new job. Yes, yes, yes. And actually, that fucked Jim O'Hare over. Let's talk about this, people. So this is when there was a major shift in the office

because now I was moved. When I first started, I was right behind, next to Ron. I was right there. Then I got moved to kind of where Tom's desk is right outside there. Now, because Leslie feels she needs Andy as cause he's her assistant, which of course that's crazy. That's crazy. They moved me to in front of the copier, which is where I sat. Now, the reason this kind of

screwed Jim O'Hare over, but not really, because I loved being there. I loved being there. I didn't like my days off because I had so much fun on set. But I ended up on set more because whenever they did a conference room scene. You're in the background. I'm in the background. Really? So I have to be there.

So it really changed like, whoa, I'm here a lot more. But again, I didn't care because— Were you happy with what you wished for? Because that's a wish of yours, to be there more often. To be there more often, yeah. And I really did. And I know some people, like, oh, you know, they look at their day of days. It's the sheet you get telling you what's coming up.

And they're like, oh, thank God I'm off this day. I'd be like, oh, I'm off on Thursday. That's too bad. Just because, again, the cast, of course, I love the cast, but the crew and just everybody. It was a special place. It was truly a family and so many laughs and so many behind the scene stupid bits with the camera guys and girls. Anyway, so yeah, that really changed a lot for jerry but also jim o'hare because i needed to be there more yeah but what a gift for the audience to see you more what a gift well listen jim do you have final thoughts on the episode well as always and people are sick of me

saying this i feel each episode gets stronger and stronger and I... We'll peak soon enough. I'm sorry, I'll argue that. I don't think we peak. And I have some of my favorite shows. Ebb and Flow. I love that show. Yes, it's my favorite too.

Jason Ebb is a hardened detective. But when there was trouble, it came flow. He had diarrhea. Yes. Final thoughts. Great episode. Lots of laughs.

He's mocking me, me people just so you know it's very hurtful no again another great Harris Whittles episode I know we miss Harris it's great it's so fun I gotta say for me I'll jump right into an episode of MVP

as part of my final thoughts I think that it's Leslie. I know it's sometimes we go to the person who maybe you had the, one of the craziest moment, but Leslie and Ben, but Leslie brings it. And I feel so,

I feel so many emotions for their relationship in this episode and end of the world before it. I'm going to feel it coming up next week with smalls park. I just feel it. And I think that she conveys it so well. So for me, this is Leslie. She's in a particularly tough place where her dream is coming

true, running for city council. Her dream is also on hold, which is this guy who she's like, I think you're my person. I like you so much. And so and Amy just killed it when it came to getting all of those thoughts, feelings, and emotions out. Totally agree.

I actually had a number of them, but I listed them in order. Leslie was my number one. And Ben is number two. I just think he also was matching up with what was going on with her, but Leslie would be number one. And I just, because anytime I get to see Donna, I don't know. I know. And she wasn't in much in this episode, but just her,

her, even her one-liners about wanting to be involved in what's going on, the sex talk. I don't know. It just kills me every time. And then of course, I think there's something, I think Ron could get a few points. Everybody's scoring.

Everyone's scoring. But yeah, I agree with Leslie. But the thing about Ron is we see once again that no matter how tough the exterior is, he's got his boys back. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Boys and girls back. Jim, there's a lot happening for Leslie and Ben clearly in this episode. We've teased it.

There's big stuff coming in the next one and a few coming up after it. So it's been a blast talking about this episode with you today. And thank you all for listening, wherever you listen, however you listen, whoever you are listening. Thank you. Text this episode to your group chat. Start a group chat. Do people still group chat?

I think they should. I don't know if that's a thing. Oh, I'm being told Joe is a yes. People are saying people do group chat still. And clearly you and I are just not cool enough to be in them. Give us five star reviews wherever you're listening. Thank you to our producer. Give us five stars even if you hate us.

Because you know you can like. You know how people can anger things. You know when you're mad. Yeah. They're so awful. I'm just going to give them five stars. You know what? Maybe.

Especially if you're angry. Use that anger, oh, they're so awful. I'm just going to give them five stars. You know what? Maybe, especially if you're angry, use that anger. Use that anger. Yes, yes. And just be like, I got to give them five stars. Let's talk about Sean, though. Okay? Yeah, he's good. I know you were cutting him off.

Sean, is it Sean or Sian or what is your name again? I always forget. I try not to get too close to the... I know. Physically, too, he's very far away from Sean right now. As it should be. There's a bit of a restraining issue. Restraining order.

No, thank you, Sean. Thank you, Joe. You guys are awesome. Cannot do it without you, as we all know. Truly can't do it without you. So from all of us here at Parks and Recollection, goodbye from Pawnee. Bye.

This has been a Team Coco production.