Patriots Dynasty Podcast - 2003 Week 8: Patriots vs Browns

Episode Date: December 29, 2020

In a long list of Patriots wins, this one probably falls under the "don't bother rewatching" category. But that's why you listen to the podcast; we watch these games so you don't have to!Highlights:If you want to watch the game, or see the highlights, here's the Game LinkList of all starting Browns QBsAndy goes on a Doug Pederson deep dive.The video of Brandon Weeden gets trapped under the American flag.Here's the Kenyatta Jones article about his Jackass stunt gone wrong.Tell us how we're doing! Text [phone] or leave us a review at https://ratethispodcast.com/patspodSupport this show http://supporter.acast.com/patriots-dynasty-podcast. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

This is Christine Brown, and while I have to listen to this podcast as my motherly duty, you have the choice not to. My sons sometimes say some naughty things when they're trying to be funny. But really, they're just being stupid. You still want to listen? Go right ahead. I am not your mother. Welcome back to the Page of Dynasty podcast.

We've made it to week eight of the 2003 season. Patrons are hosting the new renew Cleveland Browns, because they're new, but they're still the same old Cleveland Browns that they always were. And they're hosting them at Gillette Stadium in, I believe they said this was Halloween, but I didn't actually look up the date on this. They mentioned Halloween and there's a bunch of like pumpkins kicking around. But yeah, that doesn't make a lot of sense. As you can tell, if you haven't joined us before, this is a very well researched podcast.

Sunday, October 26, 2003. So it was a Halloween weekend. There you go. Week of Halloween, because it's a Sunday. We're also really good at telling dates and stuff. But I am your host, Andy Brown. With me today is Steve Brown. How are you doing, Steve?

I'm doing great. Yeah. You're quarantining currently for preparation for the holiday season. Quarantining is easy. Quarantining for you is easy. Quarantining with you, it sounds like. No. Yeah.

Quarantining with me is probably hell, but for me, it's easy. You drink a lot of beer and watch a lot of stuff on TV. It's just. It doesn't sound like much has changed for you. Yeah, right. And watch football games from 2003. Yeah. So, you know, the use.

What do you want to do tonight? I have to watch this nine to three Cleveland Browns New England Patriots game from 2003. It's going to take a couple of hours. Yeah. I was not particularly there. There are some games in this that I'm like, I can't wait to watch this and I'll watch it like a few days before I'm ready, you know, and I'll like maybe watch it a couple of times. This ain't that this was one of the least exciting Patriots wins we've we've witnessed

so far, I would say. Yeah. It was it was definitely a snoozer. A watchability score. You want to go there? Yeah. So I think we've talked about this before about how are out of six long bodies that we give this game in terms of a watchability score.

It's usually an inverse of how many punts there were, right? We've kind of loosely based that we've we've noticed a trend. So I'm just going to read you the drive charts on this and how they ended. Punt field goal, punt, punt, punt, punt, punt, punt, miss field goal, field goal, and that's the first half. So with that being said, nine to three, those three three at the half three three. So this game ending nine to three, I will give this one one body out of six from a Browns fan perspective is though, because like they're probably used to that.

That's just another day at the office. At least they're not losing 48, nothing. They lost by less than the touchdowns. This is got to be the whole game was in debt and in play the whole time. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I would say play from the combination, Kelly, Kelly Holcomb, Tim Couch, right back on top, maybe the two headed monster.

Yes. Kelly Holcomb, Tim Couch. Yeah. I would say out of zero long bodies, they would probably give this a zero. I would say out of zero zero long bodies, they would probably give all Brown the games a zero. I give it an AFC championship game just because the first time you see the Browns and I have a soft spot for the Browns.

We've seen them. I thought we saw them in 2001. Maybe not have been on that game, but maybe not. That game was only memorable because of how many shots the Browns quarterback took and how vicious they were and the fact that he lasted the whole game was impressive. Let's see. Let's go to the Patriots' Dynasty of Info and see you're right, Cleveland Browns, 1627. Yeah.

Also not a hugely entertaining game. I think there's a lot of missed opportunities by the Patriots in that and I think you could say the same in this game. The Patriots were the better team, but not by about nine to three, they were a better team. Let me give you the halftime stats here. The Patriots were moving the ball a bit. They had 166 total yards to the Browns 120, of which 50 of those Browns yards came on

their last drive, so not great. But on third down conversions, they were a combined, I wrote this down somewhere, they were a combined three for 15 on third down. I mean, but let's be real, 45 of the Patriots' first half yards came on the first play they had the ball. Correct. So that's what kind of game we're talking about here. But before we get too deep into that, let's talk about these Cleveland Browns back in

2003. Like most of the time, these are kind of like these interesting snapshots of these teams that we do. You know, we look at the lines like, oh, this is cool, it's Joey Harrington. But this Cleveland Browns team could be any Cleveland Browns team from the past 20 years. It's true. I mean, you always look for the names, right? There was one team where there was no names on it and I didn't know anybody on the team

except for a couple. Was that the Giants game a couple weeks ago maybe? Yeah, that's what it was. Yeah. It was like Tiki Barber, Kerry Collins, and like, that's it, nobody else. But yeah, let me give you some names from this. This is probably worse. The running back, the leading running back was William Green, who finished the season

season with 559 yards and one whole touchdown. Not good. And the top wide receiver, Dennis Northcutt, who I will say I did recognize. I recognize the names, but I couldn't picture any highlights from any of them in my head. Quincy Morgan. I really remember the name. Yeah. I may have had his football card, but those were the guys that like you got the football

card and you're like, yeah, I recognize him. But you know, it's not worth anything. They're like the filler cards when you're looking for the Drew Bledsoe's and the Drew Breezes and the Brett Fars. Dennis Northcutt finished with 729 yards and two whole touchdowns, leading receiver on the team. It's because you're spreading the ball around, Andy. No, it's because they're offense was hot garbage.

Kelly Holcomb, as we talked about, was technically the quote unquote leading quarterback of this team. But he split his time with Tim Couch. I think they both had injury issues because I remember they were I think I got them confused. But I think Tim Couch maybe started the season and then didn't play well. So they put Kelly Holcomb in and he played no, I think less bad than he got hurt. Yeah. And then Tim Couch came back in and then right before this, they'd had the Tim Couch crying

game. Right. Which we'll get into. But they both they both played eight games. Kelly Holcomb went two and six. Tim Couch went three and five. In your face, Kelly Holcomb. Kelly Holcomb went for 1700 yards, 10 touchdowns, 12 interceptions.

Tim Couch, 1300 yards, seven touchdowns, six interceptions. So Tim Couch was the less worse quarterback because he won an extra game and been playing since 99. Yeah. So let's let's do it. I wanted to get into because I think we've all seen that picture of the Browns quarterback jersey with all the names taped on the back and how many there were. Yeah.

I just kind of wanted to dig into that a little bit when we talked about these Browns because we use, I think the term factory of sadness in this podcast, maybe a little too much and we kind of throw it around flippantly because we don't understand what it means because we're Patriots fans. But this, there's literally a Wikipedia page for a list of Cleveland Browns starting quarterbacks because there's so many of them. And I just looked at it starting in 2002. Let's put this in perspective.

I was talking to a coworker from the Cleveland area the other day and he made note that Baker last year was the first quarterback to start all 16 games since our buddy Tim Couch in 2001. Correct. That's exactly what I was going to say. If you look at this list, the list is by season. And yes, the only since 2000 when, you know, Belichick took over the Patriots, there has been one other season where only one quarterback played for the Cleveland Browns.

And that was 2001 with Tim Couch. And then before that, 1991, Bernie Kosar, yeah, which was that was kind of around the time of Belichick being the coach of the Cleveland Browns, too. So I think it was actually right before 30 some odd years, they've had three 16 game seasons out of a quarterback. Yeah. And I'd like you can keep going back and like none of these are good. The longest starting quarterback in terms of like years, if you don't count Otto Graham

being the starting quarterback from 46 to 55, because I mean, even our parents weren't born back then. That's where I'm kicking 40s door down from 37 is from 1978 to 1981 by himself. And then he played some more games in a two and 83 was Brian Sype. I don't even pronounce that right because I've never heard of this dude, but he made the Pro Bowl in 1980 for a team all pro second team all pro is an NFL MVP in 1980. Apparently. What through for 4000 yards and 30 touchdowns again, this is before either of us are born

Andy just barely. I mean, I was born in 83. So he was still playing your negatives three at that point. This is correct. But all right. So let's start in 2000 because this is the time frame. We know this time frame we're talking about 2000 Tim Couch who had been playing since 1999. I think he was like their big draft pick when they came back as a team in 1999 was Tim

Couch who split time with Ty Detmer the year before. Tim Couch started seven games, Spurgeon when fucking great name started one game. And then I don't know if you recognize his name, but Doug Peterson started eight games for the Cleveland Browns 2000. So I went down a little bit of a rabbit hole with this. Yeah. How did Doug Peterson do as a quarterback? I didn't even more of a shot.

So well, here's the thing. Doug Peterson had been a journeyman up until this, right? He played for, I think he was drafted by the dolphins, I want to say, oh, he's a rookie free. He wasn't even drafted. He was signed with the Dolphins since rookie year that he did just with the Packers, then with the Eagles didn't play a lot, I don't think with any of those teams. And then according to Wikipedia, Peterson considered retirement after being released

by the Eagles, but instead signed a two-year contract with the Cleveland Browns on September 2nd, 2000, not a good decision, I feel. I mean, I think Doug Peterson in today's age as a head coach of an NFL team, especially right now with the whole Carson Winston going on is being criticized for his bad decision-making. I think there's some red flags back in 2000 when he decided, you know what, no, I still don't want to play that Cleveland Brown job. That looks like a good idea. What did he do?

How did he go as a Cleveland Brown quarterback? Let's take a look real quick. Cleveland Browns, the Browns back up Tiedepmer suffered a seasoned injury and the Browns needed a quarterback to start Tim Couch. This is the second time in Peterson's career that he was signed to replace injured Tiedepmer. I'm guessing back in the Eagles. Peterson started as the third quarterback behind Couch and Spurge and Wynn until Couch suffered a season and then ending injury in week seven.

Peterson started the next six games. How do you think he went in those six games? How do you think the Browns did record-wise? It's terrible. Oh, it's six. One in five. In week 13, game against the Ravens, he was knocked out of the game with Bruce Ribs and replaced with Wynn.

Wynn started the next week against the Jacksonville Jaguars, but he suffered a season and an injury and Peterson replaced him. He returned for the final two games of the season losing both, including a 35-24 loss was four between the Eagles and 24-0 shut up to the Tennessee Titans. Peterson was released after the season on February 22, 2001. And then he went on to play for the Packers again before retiring officially in 2005. So that's only 2000. We have those three.

And that was just like, you know, Tim Couch's season ended injury. So they bring in, they bring in Doug Peterson, who gets hurt. And so they bring in Spurgeon Wynn. He suffers a season ended injury and then they have to put Doug Peterson back in for them to go one in five while he's there. Yeah. Tim Couch is number five on the all-time game started Cleveland Browns quarterback list. Back on that, Andy.

Where does he stand on the list of season ending injuries? But he's got to be, he's got to be towards the top of that list, too. Because he seems like Greg, Greg talked about this earlier. You got to be bad enough to keep your job. Played 59 games and a 373 winning percentage. That's impressive. He started 16 games, one of those seasons. He also had the last playoff start in Brown's history.

Tim Couch. Yes, no, that can't be right. They didn't Derek Anderson take him to the playoffs in like those 7-0-8? Oh, no, Kelly Holcomb. You're just making shit up now, aren't you? That's what Wikipedia is telling me, Andy. Postseason 2002, Kelly Holcomb, 0-1. Greg, can we fact check this, please?

Nice to see you, by the way. Sure can. Hey, guys. Good evening, Steven. Nice to see you. Good evening. You look like an alien. I like your hair, Greg.

Thanks. Oh, wait, let me give you the intro you deserve. That's wrong button, sorry. Ooh, you got a... No applause. That's new, huh? That's new, yeah. I got a new toy.

What else you got on there? That's the right intro. Yeah. And there's another one I'll save for later. One more. But you'll have to earn. I feel like the trombone one is very appropriate for the Cleveland Browns episode.

We got one of those... That's what we need. Yackety sacks, is that what that's called? Yes, it is. We'll see if I can find some yakety sacks. Yeah, we need a yakety sacks sound bite. So, since you're just joining us, we are talking about

the list of Cleveland Browns starting quarterbacks. In 2000 onwards. And this list, like I was saying, Steve, we throw around the term factory of sadness kind of a little loosely because we don't really understand what it means

because we're Patriots fans. But this list is kind of a glimpse into what that actually means. Because as Steve pointed out, or his co-worker from the Cleveland area pointed out, before 2019, when Baker Mayfield started all 16 games,

the last time Brown starting quarterbacks started every game of a season was 2001 with Tim Couch. All right, I just looked it up. 2002 playoffs, Steelers Browns.

Browns in the snow. Kelly Holcomb. 429 yards. Three touchdowns in an interception. Remember I wore the Holcomb jersey on that podcast right by the playoffs? Because that was his best game ever.

And they gave 22 points in the fourth quarter to lose 36-33. It's a crazy game. It was snowing, too. I thought they made the playoffs in like 2007. Did they just not make it but they had a winning season?

Am I confusing the two? Let's see, quarterbacks in 2007. Derek Anderson, 15. Charlie Frye won. Didn't Derek Anderson have a one little stretch there where he was legit? Yeah, I think that's that season, that 2007 season,

where they were leading the division for a while. Because I think it wasn't Derek Anderson and some big wide receiver, too, and they were putting up obscene numbers. Like them and the Browns put up like a 54 to 50 game. That was before his time.

It was like Braille and Edwards. Yeah, it might be Braille and Edwards. Oh, Braille and Edwards. Yeah, apparently they had a winning record in 2007, but I don't think they made the playoffs. Then the year after, they got nine games from Derek Anderson, three games from Brady Quinn,

three games from Ken Dorsey, and one game from Bruce Gadikowski. Yeah, the wheels fell off. I think that's probably, that seems to be the most quarterbacks they did it back in 88 with Bernie Kosar, Mike Pagle, Gary Danielson,

Don Strock, but 2008 just seems sadder. I'm going to read out the names who I have no idea who they are on this list. Because even like Spurgeon Wynn, I sort of remember him just because his name is hilarious. Yeah, he's one of the Brady Seven.

Right. Yeah, that's right. He was drafted 16 spots ahead of Tom Brady. So who is Seneca Wallace? Seneca Wallace was Iowa State. He was like a speedy, quick guy. I think he might have been like a converted, he ended up converting

to wide receiver at some point. I feel like he was supposed to be what Russell Wilson turned into. He wasn't very big. He was kind of like a bulky kind of, but he could move and he could throw on the run. Yeah, like Greg was saying, he's run first quarter.

Yeah, pretty sure he ended up playing wide receiver in the NFL. Ken Dorsey. Ken Dorsey was legit in college too. He went to Miami. Oh, that's right. What about Connor Shaw? No, I don't know who that is. Austin Davis?

He's sucked. He's recent. Who? Kevin Hogan. Isn't he the wide receiver? He's fairly recent too, I think. 2017. I think I've seen Kevin Hogan play live.

Is that the game where Brady came back from the suspension? Is that that game really? I think he was starting for the Browns. 2017? Yeah, that would make sense. Yeah. The one game to Sean Kaiser didn't start that season.

I remember him, he was a high pick. Cody Kessler was a high pick. I remember Cody Kessler. RG3, Johnny Manziel, Josh McCown. Brian Hoyer on here. Yeah, Brandon Whedon was a high pick. Thad Lewis.

Wasn't Brandon Whedon the oldest draft pick? Yes, yeah. He was like 24 when he got drafted or something, or like 28 when he got drafted. I think he played baseball for a few years. Yeah, he did, yeah.

But apparently he wasn't good enough, so he kind of, he got drafted. I did a quick Wikipedia search on him, and he wasn't getting any playing times. Like, I'll try football, and then go drafted by the Browns in like the first round. Yeah, well, he lit it up at Oklahoma State. Well, I'm pretty sure it wasn't

like a Heisman finalist, too. But everybody was like, nah, he's too old, except for the Browns. They were like, fuck yeah. Where's the round pick, baby? Yeah. Well, everybody was like, you know, Manziel, he's not really mature,

and he's kind of small, but not the Browns. They were like, fuck it. I mean, Colt McCoy played 21 games as their starter. He's still around, didn't he? He just started a game for the Giants. Oh, that's right, yeah.

That's 2010, 2011. He won a game for the Giants. Yeah, because there was somebody else playing that week, too, who also won that shouldn't have. I'm sure it was Luke McCown and Josh McCown. I think I could cave McCown in there.

They got a full hat trick. The McCown hat trick. You're missing Jeff Garcia and Trent Dilfer, though. I mean, I know Jeff Garcia, the old nine years guy. Trent Dilfer, the old everything guy.

Yeah, Bucks, and he he's the one that everybody Oh, no, no. I'm thinking of something else. Charlie Fry. Quinn. Was Brandon Weedon the one that got caught underneath the flag?

The huge American flag? I don't remember that. Oh, do you? Oh, Brandon. I got some stats on this. Want me to give you some of those? I found a website that's like specifically about this. OK.

People getting trapped underneath giant American flags. No. The Browns quarterbacks. All right. Hang on. Let me just show you this video and we'll post on the show notes, too. Because this is the Weedon. It is Brandon Weedon.

I'm excited. He was warming up before the game and pulling the big American flag out. Oh, I remember this. See, I was telling you about that maturity and that confidence, but he still is a rookie. Hopefully he'll come out of that

and help him get out of the game. Of course, it'll be a while first because the Eagles will get the ball first. There he is. Now he's out. It's like that game used to play as a kid. Yeah, with the with the parachute.

Yes. That game used to scare the shit out of me. I love that game. I hated it. So what do we have? Stats on here. This is an article from 2016. So it might be slightly dated. But

so the Browns have started more than one quarterback in 15 consecutive seasons and they've started 26 different quarterbacks since 2000. So that's 16 years. Only six of those quarterbacks have started at least 16 games

in their Browns career. Tim Couch is the only one to start a full season, like he said. The median number of games started is eight. Seven quarterbacks have been drafted in the first round.

That's the hardest one. Oh, my God. That's a thing. Here's a question. Here's a good one. Only three of its starting quarterbacks, Tim Couch, Derek Anderson, and Brian Hoare have won more than six games as a Brown.

Their average QBR is 66.0. Here is probably a good for Baker, because it's a wide open for him to be the best Browns quarterback ever. Maybe he has an autograph.

Well, no, I mean, they had some good Bernie Kozar. I think before they came, whatever they call it, is it an expansion? Reexpansion? Reintroduction?

A reintroduction, maybe? Yeah. Yeah. But didn't they... There's two games over 500. Well, you know, it's 51%, and Baker Mayfield is 51.2%,

winning percentage. I'm just saying, the bar is real low. Yeah, for sure. Yeah, so of those names you mentioned, Greg, that won more than six games, only Brian Hoyer has a winning record. He's 10-6.

Oh, Brian. Love it. Oh, actually, that's something funny too. I saw a website that has... It was 538. Hmm. And they're talking about... They have this stat.

It's called Yards Above Backup Quarterback. Oh. And it takes it, and it says, what your average backup quarterback would be, and how many more yards

is your starter outputting? So this is since 1999. This is written in 2018, so it's like 20 years of data. Okay. So first on the list, can you guess? Tom Brady. Tom Brady and the New England Patriots.

How do they figure that out when his backups never play? And what an average backup quarterback. Oh, okay. So yeah. So there's 21,000 yards more than an average backup. Colts are second, because of manning.

Saints are third, breeze. All the people you expect, Packers, Steelers. Right. And then, you get down to Dead Last. And their average yards above a backup quarterback,

negative 2,805. Average? Average 2,000 yards less. Well, that's your cumulative, right? Oh, over 12. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. I just summed up the records for the Sean Kaiser. Cody Kessler. And Josh McCown. A total of 34 games.

They went one in 33. Whoa. And they weren't even like that far apart when they were playing either, you know. Right. They're all within five years of each other. I believe I

think I'll find it over. Yeah, there was a so the Browns from 2009 to 2017 over nine seasons, nine seasons, almost a decade won 34 games.

This 2003 and 2004 season, the Patriots will win 34 games. You know. So in two seasons, in the 2003-2004 seasons, yeah, okay.

The Patriots will win 34 games in those two seasons if you count the playoffs, right? Which is the same amount of wins the Browns had between 2009 and 2017, almost an entire decade. Yikes. That's the difference we're talking about.

So factor, so like I said, we throw a factory of sadness around that doesn't begin to explain it. I just feel that people in New England need this sort of perspective right now. Mm-hmm. Oh, yeah, it's kind of ironic that we're discussing this now that

the Patriots are all but eliminated from the playoffs. And this is officially the first season the Patriots will not have at least tied for the best record in the AOC East since 2000.

2000, the last time that happened. It's more ironic, tonight, the Cleveland Browns, that nine and three play the Ravens, who we need the Browns to win to keep our playoffs alive. Exactly. So this feels serendipitous, if you will.

So what a fucking weird year, huh? If that's not a 2020, then I don't know what is. That's what I'm saying, yeah. The Bills and the Cleveland Browns are both nine and three, or the Bills ten and three now, right?

And the Cleveland Browns may also be ten and three after tonight. That's 2020. At least we can trust Jackson, Bill. It feels nice. Yeah, there's some light. There's a rock in this ocean of uncertainty.

Uncertainty, exactly, yes. Speaking of uncertainty, the 2003 Cleveland Browns all over the fucking map. When I was doing my research for this, I found

a fun little anecdote that just, I think, sums up the Cleveland Browns, not just necessarily in 2003, but generally. In week two, before the game, the Browns were playing the Ravens and the Browns linebacker Andre Andra Davis and DRA Davis,

who was the leading tackler for this Cleveland Browns team with 138 combined tackles, 98 solo, which is kind of a lot. But he telephoned the Ravens running back

before the game and stated he wanted Lewis to carry the ball at least 30 times in their upcoming matchup. If that happens, it's going to be a career day, Lewis replied. And then Lewis erupted for 295 rushing yards, breaking the previous the record previously held by Cory Dillon

as the Browns fell 30 I remember that. I remember that game. He ran for almost 300 yards. But not only that, the Browns defense called him up and be like, yo, carry the fuck ahead. This is like, okay. Dude, I dare you.

That was week two. And this was actually like for the Browns, not their worst season. They went 5-11. They won 16, didn't they? They won five games. That's not bad. They did the Browns. No, I don't think they did, right? Not this year.

They did in like 27. Yeah, well, they won 15. And then next year, they went on 16. He won one game over two seasons. But right in 2003, they were coached by Butch Davis

who the Patriots were 2-0 against Butch Davis. That's his real name. I didn't check I'm on pro football reference. They called him Butch Davis, but my guess is probably not. Paul Hilton Butch

Davis Jr. From Oklahoma. Dude, Butch is such a kick-ass nickname. Is it though? Yeah. From Oklahoma and go to college in our, I feel like

if you're from Oklahoma, like everybody's nickname is Butch. And I think that that's just like for the guys who are overweight in middle school, you know, you're just called Butch now. You know what my favorite nickname is? Fast Willie Parker.

It's just the dumbest nickname. Yeah, it's not great. It's just describing Willie Parker. He's fast. You don't like Air Vins Will Fork? No one called him that. He called him that.

They had the t-shirts when he blocked the field goal. Oh yeah, I remember that. We have Butch Davis Davis. He was the Cowboys defensive coordinator for two years before taking over the Cleveland Browns in 2001.

And he kind of had a bit of a flash in the pain in 2002 when they went nine and seven. That's when they went to that playoff game, right? And Kelly Hulkin had his career game. But then he would go five and 11 this year, three and eight

the year after that and would not coach as a head coach in NFL again. Some other good names in this coaching tree were Todd Boles who was the secondary coach of the Nickel Package

which I don't know how that's a so specific coaching position, right? Yeah, but he was one of the many failed head coaches. Just call him what he is. He's an unpaid intern, okay? Even better.

Where are we going with this, Andy? Well, no, because he gets even better because his, I guess, boss the secondary coach Chuck Pagano who I think Todd Boles learned a lot on this Cleveland Browns team on what not to do

from Chuck Pagano. Although I never really saw Todd Boles run any horrifically planned swinging gate punt formations, so he wasn't listening a lot. But yeah, Chuck Pagano best known for ruining prime Andrew Luck.

Are they going to say horrifically planned teams? Yeah, no, he figured that out all by himself. Doesn't take a lot. But for some reason the way they were talking about this Browns team was that

they were actually kind of good. Which surprised me because they were fine. Andy. So the further the literally the first shot of this YouTube video is the heads of Dickenburg and Dan Deardorf and my first notes on

this game were oh no. Just oh no. How many games do you think they've done and how many most of the pages came? This is what I'm telling you that we're going to have a lot. I like it. Of Dan Deardorf.

I know you want more food talk Steve. They ate in the last fucking six weeks of games like oh well last week we're doing the Packers game. So they fed us bratwurst in this week. It was lobster rolls because it's new

England and they were hand delivered by Robert Crown. I don't fucking care. Holy shit. This game was boring enough already. You got to sit here and listen to what Dan Deardorf ate. Let's get into this. Tell me how you really feel. You started this so we're going to get into this.

Andy what did you have for dinner? I just hate my anger. But Dan Deardorf my problem with him is he tries to be an unusual concept in this game so far. Someone threatening the goal line. For those of you that forgot in the first half

that's called a touchdown when they get across the goal line. It's funny because there's no touchdowns Andy. It's not funny. It's like that guy at work who's like who wants to be the funny guy but has to try really hard and it just doesn't come off as funny.

And I think that's what bothers me the most about him. He's trying really hard but none of it lands. That's true it is a very workplace appropriate humor which is the worst kind of humor. Exactly. I mean you get football not football

and Brent Jones being a fucking goober and that I can deal with you know it's like alright he's whatever you know or Joe Thysman like walking that line of yeah this is born line appropriate. I want to kiss you Suzy. I think

we might actually get to that game soon. But is that a Patriots game? That wasn't Joe Thysman that was um that was Broadway Joe. Yeah. He was ship based. Yeah. Yeah so

damn fucking dear dwarf. I'm surprised they don't say more like well I don't know you guys have to tell me do they say like problematic stuff because a lot of like humor has you watch movies from this time Aaron

you're like whoa baby you're getting away with that today. Yeah it's not that bad but there's a lot of like like poor Bonnie Bernstein in this they call her B squared which I think is actually kind of a cool nickname. Yeah. But they just kind of like

talk down to her the entire time every time they throw it down to her they just kind of like talk down like she had this cool hat on and so they cut to her and like she says something actually interesting and meaningful and then they cut back to the booth and the guys look oh dandy was like oh yeah I think that hat

will look good on me and Dick Emmer is like no drop it like this isn't funny like just leave this alone and he just wouldn't like it because it's fucking he's a fucking meathead yeah thanks Andy white knight and for B squared over here. Ah B squared can handle our own

but like fucking something else is shit on dandy. But she's a broad dandy you know they don't that's exactly what dandy would call her you call her a broad he would know because he knows she knows football it's a man's game

yeah so fuck dandy it off so that was the fuck dandy it off segment of this podcast hmm yeah there you go a brief applause oh you want to longer yeah

fuck fuck that guy yo he's a pig that's what dandy did on the fucking soundtrack meathead um I did since we're since we're gonna there's really

nothing to talk about in this game because like I already said it went punt field goal punt punt punt punt punt punt punt um and then the Patriots move the ball Brady got sacked on third down Adam kicked the field goal but it was a fall start

they moved him five hours back and he missed it Cleveland kick a field goal and that's the first half three three so there's like nothing else to talk about there's one other player I can think of well they're missing their best player who is Cleveland

Willie Green they weren't he's a pc product no I don't remember him at all was he really? he was I recognize the name but I should be hyped on William Green that might be why I remember him

because I remember you hyping up yeah yeah he was uh he was a first team All-American at BC he was uh he was pretty good and uh remember that that scrapbook thing I have

I actually was doing it for the Patriots and Boston College at the time that's right that's right a brief fandom of Boston College until I realized it wasn't worth it and I was a big Willie Green stan because I was like I wonder if a lot of uh brown scrapbooks on that way too

yeah fuck this but he was a good player at least in college he was yeah he only played in seven games this season due to injury but he still

had the team in Russian with five hundred and fifty nine yards but he didn't I mean uh he had the misfortune of being drafted by Cleveland right so yeah his first round pick in 2002 his sixteenth overall

played four seasons with him wearing for about five hundred yards a season give or take twenty one hundred yards per yeah so not great I wonder it just makes me wonder like

would any of these players drafted to these factories of sadness would they have been like the next phenom if they had been put in a different position definitely like if Willie Green got

drafted by the Chiefs instead and ended up sitting a couple years behind Priest Holmes and Priest Holmes goes down and now all of a sudden it's Willie Green's turn does he run for a thousand yards does he run for sixteen hundred yards this season I mean we talked about the Broncos and put anybody

back there and they'd be successful right yeah you can't you can't draft seven quarterbacks in the first round in like 14 years and say every single one of those players is the problem at some point it's not players yeah but it's interesting that none of

them really went anywhere else and did anything good it's almost like once you're ruined in the NFL you're ruined 100% yeah I think confidence probably plays a big factor in it I think running backs especially too just because their their careers are so

short in that position like you're getting four years tops maybe right and then you've run ragged it's not like you're not playing so it's not like you can save yourself for a different team who is like he bucks that trend who's the quarterback that was highly

touted sucked went somewhere else and then was super good Drew Brees did he suck though yeah he was not great in San Diego I mean they they literally got rid of him for what's the other Phillip Rivers and just let him

walk I would like more recently Jared Goff I mean he didn't change teams they had a new coaching staff for that first year I was ready to call him a bus I was like this dude blows and then you know the day comes in and he really turned his career around

that's valid that one really surprised me I was like well I didn't say it coming I know it is Sam Darnell goes to the Patriots leads us to like three more Super Bowls next time that would be classic Jets that would be amazing because they're the same type of organization right now

where they're just just chewing people up and they're sitting here being like oh Trevor Lawrence he's gonna fix everything and it's like you know what you might have deeper problems than just where one quarterback away from it you know yeah I think but even there are transcendent

quarterbacks can do it though well Ryan Leep was supposed to be transcendent you know yeah but like Joe Barrow did it this year with Cincinnati he kept them in games yeah but Andrew Luck did it he was he went on to a one in 15 Colts team and the next year they're like

in the playoffs good point I feel like even the Colts had a little bit more like they had more stuff around them yeah because they had already built that system around Peyton Manning and they basically just like suck for year and then plugged Andrew Luck into that that's my point of like the Jets organization

as a culture is what the Browns I mean Browns have actually sort of pulled themselves out of it a little bit finally but yeah you can say the same about the Lions too like the Lions do the same shit all the time as well because it is a bit of a culture of losing not that we know what that's about no idea

speaking of losers head referee in this Bernie Kukar not a loser no you didn't think I was going there did you no no you didn't but I was very excited about how much effort

he put into his hand gestures for calling penalties and especially when he called Choplox he called it twice called Choplox twice which I haven't seen like ever but Choplox is where you kind of like cut your arms down to your thighs

and he was wailing on his thighs like he did the first time like I actually wrote down like but he's got bruised on his thighs from that Choplox call then he had to do it again I'm like boys gonna have to ice those thighs because he's such a fucking hard-o calling god damn Choplox he was giving it his

all he's like I don't care if this is a nine to three Patriots fucking Brown slugfest I'm gonna be the star of this show I'm gonna put my all into it and he showed up for all four quarters 60 minutes had himself a game he's just making sure that people in

the upper decks know what's going on Oh they knew they could they could hear the thigh slaps of the of the the calls that could only be a chop block yeah I can't quite see what he's saying but I heard the slap so they must have called Choplox it wasn't a slap

block it was a chop block oh he was chopping away at them thighs hmm I can't wait till we get to replacement ref season that was the best oh that's good pretty best see that's what people don't understand

is these guys are the best in the world at their job but they're part-time at it though yeah but they're still the best in the world these guys are like legit they're like lawyers they're all they're not dummies they're better than you or I could ever do in a million years

they're not getting paid like 15 bucks an hour either at part-time that's true they're getting compensated pretty well yeah but they're not doing a lot like this isn't their full-time job they're not like watching film in their off days you know they're just like showing up and they need to watch them as they see it

but they're they're as good as you can get I bet there's some college refs that are better they just don't get the chance because of seniority you know what I mean I bet there's some guys that like would do it full-time I mean these guys like that there's one thing

Steve Brown of Yo-Yo's there's definitely some guy out there was like I fucking practice refereeing in my free time and I'm not working at whatever the fuck my job is where I'm watching film and seeing what calls the referees missed terrible analogy because Steve Brown's job is Yo-Yo

Steve Brown is like the grandmaster of Yo-Yo Yo-Yo is life that's what I'm saying and from my final point those good college refs did make in the NFL you'd still hate them Andy yep I don't I don't hate this guy you're just saying that

I don't hate Bernie Kukar it's not gonna fool me and Greg we know you damn yeah I hate I hate one of these things that's my issue you got a little handy when it smells like dog shit everywhere you go

maybe you should try looking under your own shoe okay or your nose I don't know next you can be like well you know he's not that bad he's trying his best you know he's just commentating as good as he can he's in the whole fame

no no absolutely not I will admit that Dan Dior sucks at his job he's so bad maybe he was better before 2000

I don't know when he started maybe this was like his senile days you know what I mean I mean who's Dan Fouts at the end too everybody hates Dan Fouts at the end because he fell the fuck off and

you could even make an argument I'm not going to make it but I've heard some people say the same thing about like Gil Santos and Gino Capoletti at the end they were kind of like playing plays and things like that but I think

Dan Dior is a whole another level of suck yeah he's just it's not even his commentating it's just his personality I think you're right about his commentating is bad on top of that

yeah but there's a ton of guys that are bad that you're like whatever you know it's like but he's just because it's like you know you're watching like middle of the road teams that are getting the

the JV team I'll just kind of tune you out more than anything and the problem with this is that it was always Dan Dior for the Patriots games for some reason and so you just heard him so much and he was so bad every time

that's where the hatred comes from it wasn't just like an on off switch it was like a rock that's been ground down they used to be my heart and it's just it's slowly calcified over the years that's spot for Dan Diordorf we

I think we need to get you into therapy Andy what do you think this is? this is my therapy we'll have a discussion at the NFL Hall of Fame where you can go to Dan Diordor's bust and just yell at him just slap it around a bit

well which Hall of Fame? he's in a bunch of Hall of Fames shut the fuck up god damn it but speaking of bizarre incidents I'm pretty sure we brought that up at some point they made a mention of Kenyatta Jones

before we move on sorry to bring you back to Dan Diordor Andy it's a 2008 recipient of the Pro Football Hall of Fame's Pete Roselle Radio Television Award the award given annually recognizes long-time exceptional

contributions in radio and television in professional football you know who gives that out? people who don't listen to the fucking commentation of the games over the past 8 years who gives it out then Andy? that's what I'm saying people who don't listen to the fucking games obviously I'm extremely

flattered on many levels first of all because my close relationship with the Hall of Fame because he's a big Hall of Fame but he's in the Hall of Fame and then he continues on also I knew Pete Roselle I just need to google real quick how to kick somebody out of a zoom meeting

because this is getting out of hand he actually grew up near the Hall of Fame that's why he has such a such a what? fitting in with that it's better he has worked on radio or television with six previous winners

Jack Buck, Dick Enberg your buddy Frank Gifford, Lindsay Nielsen Ray Scott and Leslie Vistler Leslie Nielsen from Nielsen ratings so do they have like different wings of this commentation Hall of Fame

I think Dick Enberg would be in there for most called players by number or misrecognized players by number they don't get stats on that Andy you know what maybe we'll start

a new website tell you what Andy if it makes you feel any better he's from Canton Ohio which is where the Hall of Fame is and it's an inside job it's home cooking it's home cooking

he's a Browns fan from Canton you got to be a Browns fan he's one of those assholes like I'm a football fan because I'm from Canton so I'm all about the Hall of Fame I'm just in it for the good players and the good plays he's that asshole 27 years

calling games see so maybe he was at the end of his his rope there maybe the first 20 were fine and we were getting the last no he says 10 more years I got another 87 to 2013

you're not going to talk me off of this hill I will die on this hill actually let's explore that a little bit because there is a hospital named after Dan Tierdorff a hospital I guarantee all the signs in that are pointing in the wrong direction

that are mislabeled everything's mislabeled he's in the college football Hall of Fame pro football Hall of Fame Michigan Sports Hall of Fame St. Louis Walk of Fame and Arizona Cardinals Ring of Honor

Andy what do you got on your resume I'm in the Dan Tierdorff Hater Hall of Fame how about that that's true you are speaking of assholes other than my brothers they were talking about

how he was in this game I looked this up so did I they released him after a quote-unquote bizarre incident according to B-squared and so what happens is it's kind of

weird and it's not like I did some Googling there wasn't a ton of information about it is it more bizarre than Chandler Jones showing up naked to the station in the Washington Post article because the Redskins

in classic Redskins move said wait if you were on Super Bowl Championship I know your name even though you just had surgery on two knees wait let me read this first and then you can go into your Redskins rant because you're dead on

but so this is I think maybe the same article that you found but it says this quote we did no contest to one account of a salt and battery with a dangerous weapon and was issued a continued without a finding

ruling in April after he threw hot water on roommate Mark Paul if Jones does not violate his one-year probation in the case of U.S. Miss Paul who suffered second and third degree burns was sitting on the toilet when he was hit by the water Jones described the incident as a prank gone awry

and said he thinks Paul exaggerated the nature of the altercation for possible potential gain I was tormented because of a friend and it was a lesson learned a hard lesson learned but hey we all have to learn Jones said and basically I got one more quote

I'm glad it happened the way it happened because I could have been a more wealthy guy he could have went for more than what he went for no great it was he threw tea on his roommate who was sitting on the toilet and it burned him

it was a prank gone awry then the prank was I'm throwing tea on you while you take a fat dump this has got to be around the time when jackass came out right and then oh probably yeah jack was like 2001

yeah so to see his point yeah the Redskins looked at that and thought yes that guy let's dump a fat sack of cash to him it's Johnny Knoxville he hadn't actually played any games for the pages because he was yeah he was recovering from knee surgery

yeah so I mean I think you both remember my jackass days where we me and Milo stole mom and dad's video camera in film list doing stupid shit but it was never like throwing scalding hot

tea at each other while we're on the toilet though what did you do can you do remember them um the one that I do remember was uh actually you guys were in it when we had the that huge snowstorm and we had the snow banks piled up wicked high

and so we rode our bikes as fast as we could into the snow banks and hit them and flipped forward over into the snow remember that jackass right but that all the thing is we were so wild we recorded that right and then I used the camera to record

a um a school project on the same tape because it was tape back then so you had to like reuse the tape and it just worked out so that like we recorded the project and the next then it cut to us doing that

and so I finished my project and you know we play it I didn't realize that so I just played it and then like I didn't stop it in time so all of a sudden like those is like serious project of us doing I don't know Spanish project or whatever and all of a sudden it cuts the three of us riding our bikes full speed into

snow banks flipping over and giggling to ourselves hysterically you did it on purpose I wish I did that would have been great I think you did it on purpose maybe even subconsciously you don't think I would you don't think I would like claim that I did that on purpose that would have been

that would have been too perfect you've been like you were like oh man this is so sick this jackass video I'm so badass whole class class love this yo and then get the mops out because chicks are gonna be so wet we're bringing extra towels

to what class a day Spanish somebody give the janitor a heads up yeah we're showing the bike flipping video bring them up and bucket boys every every kid like our age

did homemade jackass videos and honestly I can almost sort of understand kenny out of jones while you can sit here and be like that's really fucking stupid so is a lot of shit that jackass did and even like today's day and age is so much really

dumb shit that yeah tide pods is that any worse than throwing tea on your buddy yeah usually you're ingesting tide pods yourself you do that to yourself but like hot tea people like especially I just don't want to say it like it was supposed to be funny though

like how is that funny there might be more to it maybe he had like here's what I think alright he had peed in the tea mug put boiling hot water in it and then splashed

right in the guy's face made tea out of poop I feel like that would have come out in the corporate seatings yeah I feel like it would have met you a higher charge well and to be fair his wikipedia says

in 2008 jones was arrested outside a tampa nightclub after attempting urinate on the dance floor and then shoving the off-duty police officer who threw jones out of the establishment well I mean everyone's been there threw him out the club oh yeah I mean we've all tried to pee on the dance floor right

yeah because I mean you're dancing and you've been drinking so you have to pee you don't want to stop dancing because that there's no point in that you're already out there so I mean they'll just let her loose I get that and who's this fucking jerk off trying to kick me out of here right

oh yeah I know you're a cop I'm a cop too we're all cops show me your badge dick ed you know where I bet that happens all the time my badge you just pee on the guy they mentioned in this game the world's largest cocktail party oh yeah where was that

I don't remember it is the Florida Georgia game that happens in Jacksonville we're pretty sure every year you have to prepare you have to get a running start or something three days before

it's just apparently like I think college football is known for not selling booze in the stadium I found outside a couple years ago actually they don't sell booze inside college football stadiums right the majority of them the vast majority so everyone just

blacks out in the parking lot jail gates are supposed to be pretty crazy and this is that on like the biggest scale because not only can you do it but it's hosted off-site at the Jaguar stadium I think oh is allowed and therefore it's got

two of like the biggest party colleges in the south and they just get together and everyone just gets super duper bamboozled and they literally market it as the world's largest cocktail party not only like still today yeah not for long you know what they do at NC State

is they don't well they just started selling beer this year but they would let you leave at half time and then get you you had reentry into the stadium because so many while it's even less dangerous if you don't do that because so many people

were blacking out going into the game because they're like I just got a drink enough to last me these four hours that they just have tons of blackout kids so they're like hey blackout at half time and then just don't come back yeah and I bet

a ton of people don't come back too right I bet that's what it is yeah yeah they're like we're getting blown out let's get out of here this stadium is a given shit because I don't have to deal with that and they already bought their tickets so fuck it right right exactly yeah so ridiculous money's in the bank yep

speaking of ridiculous there was a not necessarily a quote but they were talking about butch Davis and why the why he thought the Browns were better on the road because they were actually seven and one in their last eight road games coming into this game so I think that's why the spread was

only passed by four and a half so basically like plus one and a half over the home field advantage right right and it was because they don't get booed as much on the road yeah well Tim couch remember we said he'd got booed

for we were saying he was crying they booed his head injury yeah yeah so and the title of this story is angry couch fires back at fans pissed off sofa

haha wow this time it's not the couch getting caught on fire it's the couch giving fire I mean honestly I can definitely get Tim couch fuck that shit oh yeah you wanna hear his quote yeah I've been in this city four years now and I've laid

it I've laid it all on the line for them to turn on me and boo me it's a joke it's the fucking joke I'm lying in the end zone hurt and they're cheering that's bullshit that's fair yeah that's cool fair having said that um they

made a comment about how Tim couch had a black eye in this game and it was because a couple weeks before actually is the week before um and I had to like I just want to put this out there a fuck the sun journal

sunjournal.com for making me have to hack their site just to read the shitty article from 2000 dude that makes me more mad than these fucking sites that so you go there and it shows you the article first and it puts a pop-up

it's like oh you have pop-up blockers on so you turn that off so we can make our money on ads I turn it on like fine whatever great so I turn it off and then it pops up another one after that saying uh subscribers to our to our newspaper can read articles like this for

five bucks a month like no I you show in the article so I had to go fucking hack and copy and put in a word doc so fuck them but the the title of it is another black eye for browns comma couch browns quarterback Tim couch had a nasty black eye on Monday

the San Diego Chargers left a much deeper mark couch's right eye was still swollen shade and he was a black blue and purple the result of a pregame collision he said happened with an unidentified teammate on Sunday so he uh but even before the game started he ran to

his own teammate and gave him some black eye and then came out and um put up a 30.2 quarterback rating answer charges the third most of his career um and so that's why uh with Holcomb

improving getting healthier he wasn't sure he was even going to start and apparently butch Davis did wasn't sure that he was going to start until they made the decision at like noon on game time an hour before the game started not great

um but tim couch did get the start um didn't play well uh but he was taking a lot of hits like a lot of hits browns quarterback I feel like always take a lot of hits this was no different because they said something about how the

offensive line only the right tackle had started double digit number of games and everybody I feel that's how the browns have gotten out of their current they're the funk with bakers I don't think baker is significantly better than those other guys but

they like finally figured out that we need to get in more than build an offensive line yeah oh like we got Joe Thomas we're getting the online yeah yeah so yeah and against this page's defense these guys were getting eaten for lunch rabble had three sacks couple of strip sacks

Richard big Richard had this like the og gronk spike after that fumble fumble recovery yeah he did big but then Tim couch actually got hurt halfway through yes first half uh the brown he had done anything

and then Kelly Holcomb came in and immediately led them down the field on the last drive of the first half and uh the kicker field all the tide at three but the one other play that I think was worth talking about

in the first half was in the first quarter on the aforementioned strip sack that uh rabble had that turned out to be another example of the tuck rule going against the patriots because it was and and

the the um tv crew had this like queued up immediately coming back from commercial where every single Patriots game they should queued up yeah it's like oh remember this play Patriots fans like your fucking course for you I thought like I in my head

they outlawed it immediately after the next season but that's what I thought too just popped up again but how yeah how long did the tuck rule actually last before I'm gonna stat check it yeah like before I got over because it was definitely happening

2003 because they called it and they literally called it the tuck rule you've been challenged you've been called it your d-dorf is like that's a tuck rule 2013 2013 it got turned off wow no way the tuck rule was abolished

on March 20th 2013 by 29 to 1 vote of current teams who voted against that now fucking Dave is probably like now fuck it Steelers voted against and the Patriots and Redskins abstained well of course the Patriots kind of have to

abstain don't they yeah yeah came with the raiders didn't either that's funny now the raiders definitely voted against it remember we played that clip the lap like in 2002 about Davis being like that's a bullshit everybody knows that wasn't the right

call in that big sheet of leather yeah the handbag the sentient handbag but yeah so that plays also on on page sciencey.info and at some point I'm gonna create a a clip

of all the the tuck rules that we come across so whatever assaulte raiders fans come comes up we can we can present them with all the other I can't believe it but we're up to three so far we're only two to three still

they didn't lose a playoff game because of the tuck rule that's fine but let's not pretend we're like the ones being like marginalized we're the grieved party here no but a lot of raiders fans especially

we had a fucking script sack on this Greg we're really young at that time instead we have a super bowl they had they had more than that chance to stop us it wasn't that play that ended it for them yeah but that play would have ended it but it yeah but they had

play over the time we've had this argument a few times you guys know where I stand I know where you stay we're in the one raiders game original championship episode where we discuss this in depth that's right

TLDR Greg hates Bill Belichick and the rest of us recognize his genius and he hates the rest if I recognize his genius he means slob on his knob then yes I agree you guys love

his genius in and around your mouth but I can't believe that it wasn't abolished until 2013 that's a long time plus years after that raiders game because regardless of what you think of the call it's a bad rule to have

it's a right call bad rule I can't believe that rule stuck around until 2013 that's insane alright speaking of bad let's throw some desson worse out alright actually before that I just want to bring up one last thing

and it doesn't really have to do this game because it has to do with touchdown celebrations and there weren't any in this but they showed the highlights of other games you know they throw it to New York and whatever and one of the touchdowns

was finished with a goal post dunk which I think got outlawed as a celebration can't do it anymore but that I think to me was one of my favorite touchdown celebrations I want to know where that where that stands on your list of

touchdown celebrations like not the preplanned ones like not the choreographed things because I think those are but just in terms of like you know spontaneous touchdown celebrations that's my favorite

no the lambo leap is that but better lambo leap is pretty good like silly dances like victor cruises salsa that was always my favorite I'll give you that, yeah and there's a lot of players that do funny dances

when they score and I like Justin Jeffersons I like his a lot there's that little toe tap thing I like seeing him dance because they're all good dancers too it's true seeing Gronk dance it's even better when they're bad dancers

you just watch these professional athletes just be horrific at dance but Gronk has the Gronk spike which is also epic yeah it's pretty sweet, it's on brand for sure, it's definitely on brand but it's just like

you know which one I sneaky liked he's gonna come out of that field the Shane Varine kicked the door down oh it wasn't Shane Ridley Ridley Randy Moss opened the coverage

is that what that was, open the coverage? it was from the first Randy Moss I know what you're talking about but I didn't know that's what it meant to be when he splits the coverage he just throws it for everybody I remember when there was that dude in the stands

that kind of looked like him but not really and they showed him on the jumbo tron and the two of them were going back and forth doing it oh it's wicked funny it's absolutely legendary and Randy Moss is giggling on the sideline

Randy Moss has had himself a good time playing football he's one of those guys I love it so now we can do best and worst I saw that and thought that's one of my favorites I was curious what your favorites were

all right um Greg you want to go first? sure I have two bests this week one from each team player of the game for New England I'm going with Ty Law

we didn't touch on that I kind of left that for you back from injury well still injured he didn't practice all week they said and they decided an hour before game time yeah he's good to go this is so Ty Law

fuck I can do this, it's the Browns and then all he does is go out there and get the game ceiling interception 51 seconds left literally the play after the play after the Browns converted 4th and 15th to keep it going and um

here I have the sound for this too because this is your boy fucking actually I don't even think it was Dierdorf it was I'm watching that video oh the it's great isn't it

he's just the most lovable human ever he is but this was the call on the interception too between Law and the receiver Kevin Johnson no flag and Law hands the bell

so immediately goes to this contact from Ty Law which is Ty Law oh it's a great game oh they love it here in Foxboro but Butch Davis and all of those watching in Ohio

have to wonder who wasn't that excessive contact both sides Kevin Johnson had a hold of Ty Law's jersey as well but I think that it was literally the wide receiver grabbing Ty Law between the two and the four

and trying to drag him to the ground and Ty Law just caught the ball anyway just one handed like across his body picking unbelievable ball skills oh incredible yeah on a bad leg by the way

no practice you can't do that that sealed the game they held the Browns to 203 total yards not a great game but the Browns defense also played pretty well

I think the Browns defense was there their strength on this team yeah I had something I didn't know if this was the best or worst it was just like a big old question mark to me I would note here Ben Taylor with 13 tackles 30 minutes left in the third

that was just my other best Ben Taylor with 18 tackles 16 unassisted who's Ben Taylor I don't know that's a fucking crazy stat line yeah he was all over the place

that's a lot you know you put Ben Taylor on this defense and then some guy Kevin Bentley had 15 tackles Jesus ridiculous how many tackles were they tackling

Ben Taylor was the right outside linebacker and Kevin Bentley was their middle linebacker so well and I think to be fair the Patriots were towards especially like most of the fourth quarter just running as much clock as possible

they're just like fuck this game trying to get out and so I think one of their drives was just like a shit ton of runs it took like four or five minutes off the clock which I'll go next because that in this game it felt like longer it felt like 20

but on that note I think my player of the game would be Kevin Falk I had K-Falk for MVP I had that note too Andy K-Falk for MVP the lead back again running really well inside the tackles I think he had over 100

total yards he had like 60 yards rushing 50 yards receiving something like that it's a bold move picking an offensive player as MVP in a 9-3 game yeah well you know what we were talking about having a season long MVP conversation

you fucking idiot I'm gonna do it again ready watch this Daniel Graham, Co-MVP of this game Co-MVP Graham had a couple good plays yeah he had a second best game of his career in this game and he had some fucking snags

this was 1010 receiving yards not bad for a tight end and like they were not easy catches either yeah the one player where he was dragging like a bunch of dudes yep so he had one there where he looked like

an old bank codes out there just like caught a pass in the flat across the middle and ran through like four or five guys he got the first down they had a couple like down the scene that Brady found him and he just made some nice snags over the top of guys hell of a game

and he was basically the only tight end left on this team because Fourier went down he kept like coming in and going out again because he was hurt so he was kind of like the only receiving option in this game really none of the wide receivers did anything even Troy Brown didn't have a great game

except for the one play which might be Steve's best so I'll leave that so that was great there's and it's on the website Troy Brown the page is getting tricky in the fourth quarters like I think it was the driver trying to run the clock out it was third and two

just inside the Cleveland half of the field and Brady's in the shotgun and he's you know like calling out his like calling to his receivers calling out different whatever audibles that turns out to be bullshit because Tyler goes in motion and as you go into motion just jumps under center

grabs a snap and then runs around left end for four yards for the first down so reaching those bag of tricks so even when he's not having a good day receiving yards and things he's still contributing in big ways put your big ways four yard game

yeah he took a snap under center that makes him a quarterback right now he's played quarterback in an NFL game so add that to the list quarterback check wide receiver check punt returner check kick returner check

running back he's taking a handoff on that draw play that got blown up check and we'll see him play defense what else you want him to do Greg huh what you want him taking field goals to I want him to be the account I just watched a highlight video from a budget for a touchdown

check check I have a picture here of a Johnny Manziel Jersey and it just says instead of Manziel it says man we suck

I like that check check that's more of that I might get some use real legitimate operation now that we have the sad trombone

noise oh yeah wait till we get a yakity sacks this podcast is going on the stratosphere oh fuck yeah right so and I think my worst I just had here was probably

Bethel Johnson is a wide receiver he showed why he didn't last very long as a wide receiver on this team because it didn't seem like he had a clue what was going on there's a couple where I think he was supposed to run a certain route and Brady like threw it out pattern and then you just see

Bethel Johnson standing there with his arms up like would multiple times which is kind of I think why a couple of drives stalled out and then this probably isn't a war it's actually probably a best is I'm going to show you

this picture and we will put it in the show notes of the last time or yeah Bill Belichick when he was a coach of the Browns and his favorite moment was beating the New England Patriots in the playoffs

but this is the picture they showed and the date on that picture January 1st 1995 and the outfits are phenomenal for those who can't see them I'll explain they're both wearing khakis because as you do

you know business casual it looks like they both have collared shirts underneath he's doing that collared shirt over this brown sweater but the collar itself the bottom of the collar is still tucked into the sweater yeah it's not quite executed

and it's this it's like those old-school starter jackets that are the pull like Belichick has the pullover and this nice brown has like the word brown in script and then Parcells has the one that I think

I used to have something very similar to that like the zip-up version the big puffy one that was the starter jacket that almost looks like the Zubaz the Zubaz pants that the the bills would wear and the haircut on Belichick too

is just top notch so we'll share that too that's it that's a browns last playoff win 95 pretty good Bill Belichick as their kind coach still the last time they won a playoff game so alright Steve what do you got

give me some best and worst I just thought of a worst is we signed Josh Gordon and I have a bunch of browns fans that I work with in the level of like they don't like Josh Gordon it's pretty high really yeah yeah they're very anti-Josh Gordon

I don't know it's like unfulfilled potential but the same kind of thing as Boone Tim Caltrony's concuss you know it may be a little too passionate on sometimes

I think Bill's fans maybe walk that line a little better browns fans as well maybe just get a little over their skis sometimes I still love them keep that inside I like that little brother who's just not very good at anything

but he's still my brother he's fun to keep around wait which little brother you decide we'll let the listeners decide we'll talk about it only two people on this call have little brothers that's true

Valid point maybe we're all just talking about different brothers who knows the best was actually inspired by the commentators and good commentator which I'm sure you're happy to hear Andy

Teddy Briskey got like just made a tackle and cut the wind knocked out of him and they saw it and they commented like well I think Briskey's kind of hurt he's like he's definitely feeling it right before the snap they cut real close to Briskey's face

and let's out the you can see him he's like holy shit that hurts they're like right before the snap he's just like oh he shakes his head like a half shake it was really great commentating camera work just to capture that

emotion of Briskey being like jeez that's very typical Briskey too and then the worst by far they showed the stat and I kind of updated it throughout the game this season the Patriots are 8 for 22 in the red zone

yeah not good that's fucking terrible it's not good more evidence of like this team is not about the team is about to rip off the longest win streak in NFL history like that's biz-ball

however there were two other stats that they showed as well 36 was that they still haven't allowed a defensive touchdown in the first quarter since week one and they had won before this they had won their last 20 games

with the league going into the fourth quarter so now 21 games so defensively their grave diggers a shining example so if they take a lead on you going into the fourth quarter you're kind of shit out of luck

yeah but every single red zone possession only 36% turn in the touchdowns yeah that's not great that's really bad again this is the team I thought they practiced that well we've always said I think Belchak stresses red zone

and situation football especially heavily you can't kick field goals and beat Tom Brady because they don't have a lot of their starters on offense right now when you're starting Bethel Johnson who's running the wrong routes

that ends some drives prematurely and as great as Troy Brown and Kevin Folgar all those shifty slot guys get less effective in the red zone yeah they don't have that finishing back too which again to Steve's point earlier is in the season is

why they probably go after a guy like Corey Dillon probably because of these issues that they have in the red zone I'm excited for the Corey Dillon years yeah well coming up soon but I think that about does this game justice

I mean we'll use the term game that might be a little strong for what this was I should one more for Andy give it to me me and Greg were shitting on you and you were like oh the high voices and the commentators

on certain levels I heard it on this game was on the promos all of a sudden Dick Eddenberg's voice exactly he gets a little toy aroma wish just a little bit but now that I pointed out you notice it you're right I'll give you that

I can admit when I'm wrong it's back oh and one last thing I had the Patriots the last time New England was unbeaten in October before this season

1978 October's not been kind to this pager's team but I think they'll do it again this year so good for them nice but as we go into November of 2003 Monday November 3rd Monday night game baby

heading to Invesco field at Mile High Stadium to play Mike Sharahan and the five and three Denver Broncos it's pretty house of horrors prime time matchup baby

it's trouble it's trouble but this is the Patriots in 2003 don't give it away Andy so we'll see what happens next week on the Pages to Odyssey podcast see you later see you later

I didn't even give up the phone number oh well bye