PBD Podcast - Trump vs Harris Debate Watch Party | PBD Podcast | Ep. 468

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Starting point is 00:01:10 This is the world I want you to endorse. We can't no value the haters. I ain't running on me. Look what I've become. I'm coming for you. I'm coming for you. All right. All right.

Starting point is 00:01:19 We are live. Yay! With the crowd. Let me tell you. You guys are crazy. We go nonstop. They're here. What's today? It's Tuesday night. It's 8.30. We're probably going to go until around midnight. By the way, my 10-year-old son son Dylan, was negotiating, I'm going tonight. I said, Dylan, you don't even like politics. He says, but I love you.

Starting point is 00:01:48 I said, Dylan, you can come with daddy. So he's somewhere here, wherever Robert is. Robert's doing homework with him right now in the back, shout out to Robert being a great uncle. And apparently something's happening tonight. There's a, isn't today the first time or the second time this one person that's trying to apply for the most important job in the world who doesn't like to talk to people

Starting point is 00:02:11 but her job is to talk to people, today she's gonna be forced to talk to people, right? Today's the ultimate job interview, right? We're gonna see. By the way, have you guys ever applied for a job without doing a lot of interviews? This may be the first person I can pull this off. Can you imagine?

Starting point is 00:02:28 You go to a company, you get a job, you don't do any interviews, right? So now, Tom, I'm going to read a couple things with rules for tonight. In a minute, in 20 minutes, we will watch the debate together, we'll comment during the breaks, and then also we'll comment afterwards. And then some of us here, we're going to go to the back, have some cigars, and have good conversations together. So, debate rules, Rob, if you wanna pull this up. No opening statements.

Starting point is 00:02:52 Closing statements will be two minutes per candidate. Candidates will stand behind podium for the duration of the debate. Props and pre-written notes are not allowed on stage. Okay, Rob, if we, do we know who that is? That's somebody's phone, it's all good. Okay, alright. So candidates will stand behind podium for the duration of the debate.

Starting point is 00:03:11 Props and prewritten notes are not allowed on stage. Props and prewritten notes not allowed on stage. Interesting. No topics or questions will be shared in advance. Candidates will not be permitted to ask questions of each other. Candidates will not be. So you can't say, hey, what do you mean by that? No, no, if you can't say like, hey, why don't you tell everybody out there how the border

Starting point is 00:03:33 is doing since you're the border czar, you can't ask that? You can't. So, okay, what are you going to do? You're going to silence them? So that's going to be, what if the person is doing it, I'm actually curious to know how they handle this one here, because remember, guys, don't forget, the last time then there was the debate with Biden and Trump, you know, none of the moderators at all tried to defend Biden and the feedback I gave at the end was the fact that I think everybody knew, Tapper knew,

Starting point is 00:04:00 Dana knew that he was out and they're just kind of like, listen, this guy's not going to be there, hurry up and wrap it up. If they jump in trying to defend Kamala tonight, guess what? They knew last one he was out and they know tonight that they're trying to help Kamala. Tom, I'm gonna give you guys the polls. We have the great Amy and Tom here. By the way, how many guys watch their show, what they're doing on a weekly basis? If you watch it out there, they've been crushing it, right? The two of them. The decision, 2024, and then we have obviously, so here's a go. Rob, go to the CNN poll if you could. Go to the CNN poll if you could. CNN poll, if you could, it's on your notes

Starting point is 00:04:35 that you got right here. So if you look at the CNN poll, this is New York Times, September 10 today, it has Harris ahead by two points ahead of Trump. Wisconsin has Harris ahead by three, right? Then you got Michigan, 49 to 47 Harris. Carolina, 48, 47 Trump. Penn, 49, 48 Harris. Carolina was Harris as well. Nevada is Harris as well. Georgia is Trump.

Starting point is 00:05:03 Arizona is Trump. Now this is a CNN poll. Tom, when you guys who study all of these polls, how much credibility do you give to this poll here from CNN? Well, the New York Times CNN poll, we don't put a lot of credibility in there. Is it directionally correct? Yes, in terms of direction, but they are off by anywhere from two and a half to four points. And here's why. Not many, number

Starting point is 00:05:27 one they're doing aggregates and or they're doing individual polls where they get 600 likely voters in one poll and that's not enough. You need to look at several polls together, likely polls from good pollsters. But right now what's very interesting leading into the debate. What is this Rob? What is it you just put up? Are you looking at what Rob just put up? Are the is the audience seeing this? Do they see this live? Go ahead. Okay. Okay. Well refer to this in a minute. We're gonna Yeah, just a minute. Right now there have not been a lot of new

Starting point is 00:05:58 polls released over the last week. This has happened three times in the cycle. Why is that happening? Whenever there's been a leveling or a lowering for Biden and Harris since July 15th, all of a sudden the new polls stopped coming out. The reason they start coming out is because they don't match the media narrative. The media narrative was gonna be,

Starting point is 00:06:17 Joe has stepped aside, look at the enthusiasm from Kamala, look at the bounce. And the narrative was that there was gonna be a bounce and they were waiting for the polls to show a bounce but they didn't. They only showed about a 3 to 5 percent shift. Then he said, well there's got to be more bounce at the convention. Well they go to the convention.

Starting point is 00:06:33 It was only about a two point shift. So what we're seeing right now is the polls are actually holding back. There should have been about 11 new polls from credible pollsters that came out over the last week that did not. Nationally, Trump is really up by all of our calculations and some others we'll talk about in a second by about two points, two and a half point. The bias is obvious. Yes, exactly.

Starting point is 00:06:56 The bias is extremely obvious, you guys. For anybody who follows any type of aggregators, 538 is a really common one. And it's funny because 538 is actually owned by the parent company ABC. Now, 538 claimed to be independent, they claimed to be impartial from the parent company, yet somehow the results always match up to a T, right? And so what's also very interesting about 538

Starting point is 00:07:23 is they have removed certain pollsters from their aggregate that may lower the overall polling average. So the example that I wanna give you guys for anyone who follows our show, The Decision, we always reference the Rasmussen polls. Why? Because they've shown to be accurate. They've shown to be accurate during the primaries.

Starting point is 00:07:42 When you look back on historical data, which Rob, we can go ahead and bring up this slide now, you can see that that Rasmussen by comparison to ABC are actually what is that? Tell them what this is. This is the 2020 election and how far were the polls off Pat at the end of the election. When everything was counted. What poll was 6.54 off? Yeah, Quinnipac was dead last. LA Times, third from last. Wow. And then you see ABC's Washington Post in purple.

Starting point is 00:08:14 Where's the 538? Where's the, where's the Sienna poll? Well, 538 is now the ABC News poll. And now you go up to the top, there's Rasmussen. In June of this year, Rasmussen was evicted from the 538 aggregate poll, but look where Rasmussen was. Why did that happen? They claim that they don't like their sampling and they don't like their normalizing.

Starting point is 00:08:37 Okay, so can you do me a favor because we have the debate starting in 15 minutes. Can you tell me what Rasmussen is reporting against the Siena poll? I want to see how the Rasmussen compares to the Siena poll. We can do that right now. Rob, if you want to pull that up, go for it. Because many people claim that Rasmussen is pro-conservative, but they've been accurate in the past. Let's take a look at the electoral map and we're gonna tell you where we are right now, Pat. And this is coming from, we got the map? Yep. There we go. are right now, Pat, and this is coming from, read the map, yep.

Starting point is 00:09:05 There we go. This is from On Point Politics, and this is matching up with Rasmussen, and this is matching up with us. Right now, we believe there's a 72% chance that Trump will be elected based on tonight going into the debate. These guys, yes. And Pat, this organization is in lockstep with Rasmussen and they have normalized out what's called the bias.

Starting point is 00:09:34 Here's the bias. Let's say you and I, Pat, are doing a poll. We get a thousand likely voters. We should have 50 Democrats, 50 Republicans, and then insert 5 to 7 independents. I mean, 5 to 7 for a independent candidate. So normally, you don't get that. Normally, you're going to get about 35 people that say they're independent.

Starting point is 00:09:53 So the point is you balance it out properly. There have been polls that have been going out. Like, Quinnipac had one that was D6. In other words, the number of people in the poll was 6 percentage points favored to the Dems because that's what they could pull for the polling pool at that time. You see what I mean, Pat? So then they come out and say, Hey, Kamala Harris is up by two points. Well, if you normalize out D six, six

Starting point is 00:10:19 percent on two, you end up getting six and two, three point two the way it comes out. So it's actually half a point or a point for Trump. So whenever you see polls that say Kamala Harris neck-and-neck in national poll that usually means Trump's ahead by one. Yeah. Because if she was ahead by one they'd say she's leading. But that is exactly what we're seeing right now. We believe there's a 72% chance. We believe Georgia is almost done and that Arizona and Nevada and Pennsylvania are are in the Trump column at this time

Starting point is 00:10:51 Anything could change and that's what this debate is all about But we believe that that is the reality of what we're seeing a hundred percent and it's not just us that are saying this By the way, obviously we can see that they were saying that true But Ross Monson a really big pondant in this space is Mark Mitchell. If you guys don't follow him on Twitter, you definitely should. He has been preaching the exact same thing as us. And you know what? He's got a nothing but hate for it.

Starting point is 00:11:15 If you guys have seen his Twitter feed, he is being bombarded. He has gotten so much hate. And so that's the question, Pat. Why are people who are actually using quantitative data to analyze these polls, copying so much hate online? Is it because it doesn't match with the narrative that mainstream media is trying to paint? That's my impression. Well, I mean, this is good, though. This is good that this is happening for us to know exactly what happened. Because last time around, when everybody went to sleep, and I'm talking 16, everybody, me and Tom are on the phone till 3.30 in the morning, we're like,'re like yeah I mean this is a slam dunk Hillary's

Starting point is 00:11:46 winning right it's over with everybody told us it's done don't even think about it all this stuff and then boom Comey comes with what he does what's a week before the election and then you're watching everything they said okay Tom is like Pat are you seeing what's going on in New York time you remember that yep are you seeing what's going on are you seeing what's going on voting and then all of a remember that? Yep. Are you seeing what's going on? Are you seeing what's going on there? People starting voting. And then all of a sudden, boom, they announced Trump winner. Trump walks on stage like, babe, you're the first lady officially, just so you know that. I don't know if you guys remember that.

Starting point is 00:12:14 And then 2020 was the complete opposite, the hockey stick. We'll see what they're going to do this year. I want to tell you guys something here on what happened. Very important couple people to get these endorsements. One of the biggest endorsements Kamala Harris got that I think people are undermining. I don't think people are given enough credit for the endorsement Kamala Harris got. And if you guys are not taking this thing seriously, you guys, shame on you, because Vladimir Putin officially endorsed Kamala Harris.

Starting point is 00:12:36 I mean, you guys got to realize, forget about Beyonce, forget about Taylor Swift, forget about any of these guys. Putin endorses you? Are you free? Like that's resume, right? Her next book should say, I was endorsed by Vladimir Putin, right? And also Dick Cheney, very honorable, like you know, the person that we've never made any bad videos about him, bad movies about him. No movie was ever made called, what's it called? Vice? Vice and a wonderful guy, no military industrial complex, nothing. None of that stuff.

Starting point is 00:13:05 A lot of nobility there. And look, they tried so hard to even get Elton John to bash Trump, they couldn't do it. Elton John came out and said, rock it man! He likes it. He loves it. He loves it. So Rob, do we want to start off, why don't we first start off with, we have to give Kamala Harris the credit with Vladimir Putin.

Starting point is 00:13:24 Rob, if you don't mind showing that, let's start off with some respect for us. Go ahead. As I said before, we had a favorite, the incumbent Mr. Biden, but he was yanked from the race. Nevertheless, he recommended that all of his supporters back Ms. Harris. That's what we're going to do. First of all, it's ordained. Infectious laugh. infectious laughs. That shows she's doing well. You know what's funny is I think he wanted to party with her because he said come visit

Starting point is 00:14:12 me in Ukraine, let's get bombed. Tom! No pun intended. Guys, every once in a while I sit there and I worry getting a call from YouTube, who would it be? It's going to end up being Tom, probably, at the end. Listen, Tom made a comment on the podcast today. It's just not appropriate.

Starting point is 00:14:30 Here's Elton John. Go ahead, Rob. Show us Elton John when they asked him, trying to corner him, to say something bad about Trump using Rocketman for Kim Jong-un. And here's what he said. Go ahead and play this. You're not a supporter of Donald Trump's. He loves your music

Starting point is 00:14:45 how did it feel when he took the lyrics to rocket man and he used it as a nickname for kim jong un and then he gave kim jong i love you know that we're going to have a lot of work uh... dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot of mind and he's been to my concerts many many times. So I mean I've always been friendly towards him and I thank him for his support. Yeah when he did that I just thought it was hilarious.

Starting point is 00:15:12 Good for him. He gave Kim one of your CDs and signed it. That was one of the books about him because Kim I guess didn't know the song. He gave Kim Jong Un the signed CD. He already made his point. So anyways, I mean, it's again, very, very important. Obviously, you guys know when these types of endorsements are being made with Dick Cheney, with Putin, you guys have to believe that President Trump

Starting point is 00:15:33 is probably shivering right now, extremely nervous, going into the debate. He's probably worried what's gonna happen. It's troubling, Vinnie, when you think about it, when something like that takes place, right? Now, when we, and by the way, President Bush has no plans to endorse a 2024 presidential candidate. Rob, I think you got a clip of what Trump, for whatever reason, he's always had an issue with the Bush family. Go ahead and play this clip, Rob. Go ahead.

Starting point is 00:15:57 All right. Now, you can take it any way you want. And it took Jeb Bush, if you remember at the beginning of his announcement, when he announced the president, took him five days, he went back. It was a mistake, it was a mistake. Took him five days before his people told him what to say, and he ultimately said it was a mistake. The war in Iraq, we spent $2 trillion, thousands of lives,

Starting point is 00:16:21 we don't even have it, Iran is taking over Iraq with the second largest oil reserves in the world Obviously it was a mistake. So George Bush made a mistake. We can make mistakes, but that one was a beauty We should have never been in Iraq. We have destabilized the Middle East But so you so I mean it's so you still think he should be impeached It's my turn and you do whatever you want. You call it whatever you want. I want to tell you, they lied. They said there were weapons of mass destruction, there were none, and they knew there were none.

Starting point is 00:16:50 There were no weapons of mass destruction. You can pause it right there, Rob. You know what's funny? Those weapons of mass destruction, there's not a bigger name than Dick Cheney. And Dick Cheney endorsed Kamala Harris. Just so you know this. I mean, that's just how you got to realize. Imagine you're going out there and somebody says, let's just say

Starting point is 00:17:12 you're endorsed by Jelaine Maxwell. So imagine somebody says, man, Jelaine Maxwell spoke very highly of you, Vinny. Wow, really? That's not something you want. You don't walk around bragging about that kind of an endorsement. By the way, don't go spreading rumors. That is not a true story. It's a joke. It's a joke on some people. By the way, Rob, can you pull up the issues that people are looking at right now, voters,

Starting point is 00:17:34 Pew Research, what they're really interested in? What are people looking at with Pew Research? If you can pull it up, the chart that we were all looking at earlier in the back, when, yeah, if you can, you know which one I'm talking about? You had it up, Rob. I think you had it up or? The brand? No, you had it up.

Starting point is 00:17:51 Brandon had it on his computer? Okay, anyways, while that's going on, Adam, what do you think is going to happen tonight? Rob, if you can find that, that'd be great. Tonight? What do you think is going to happen tonight? Well, Pat, I just left my white dudes for Harris meeting. Nice. It's been great. We were strategizing. We all menstruated together. Well, Pat, I just left my white dudes for Harris meeting. Nice.

Starting point is 00:18:06 It's been great. We were strategizing. We all menstruated together. It was amazing. By the way, this is actually not a joke. This is true. That's where he just came from. Don't laugh, please.

Starting point is 00:18:15 Well, I went to Chicago. We all got our vasectomies. I came back here. I got pregnant. That's right. It was insane. Yep. Because I didn't fully believe that dudes get pregnant.

Starting point is 00:18:23 Then I got my abortion. Thanks, Kamala. It's amazing What's going on in the Democratic Party today? That was a drive-by at the DNC, right? Yes So I wish I were joking that this was actually what was going on in Chicago at the DNC Yeah, yeah, I wish that they weren't doing the identity politics thing, But this is unfortunately, as we all know, as a registered independent who used to hang out with the Democrats, it's actually a shame to see what the Democratic Party has turned into.

Starting point is 00:18:52 Legit, from MLK days, from the JFK days, from even RFK where he is right now, the not focusing on color, focusing on someone's character, they're so hyper focused on gender, on sex, on race. And it's just so laughable to me. So here they have the DEI candidate going against, this is Trump's seventh time being on the debate stage. This is Kamala's haphazardly first.

Starting point is 00:19:21 So if Trump- Excuse me. Excuse me. Excuse me. I'm speaking. Excuse me. I, excuse me, excuse me, I'm speaking. Excuse me, I'm talking, I'm talking, I'm speaking Adam. But I'm speaking too, Pat. Excuse him. As if. Crack my neck. Yeah. So I think Trump, if I could say anything... You think she's gonna do that tonight? No, she can't. I don't know if she'd like to. She'll get cut off. She's gonna give the answer. I just wanna see one.

Starting point is 00:19:46 Honestly, I wanna see one. There's something about it. So here's the issues. Let's go to this here issue-wise. When you're looking at Pew Research on the debate, here's what American people are worried about. When it comes down to the economy, 93, look at the score, 93% of registered voters say which is important to them.

Starting point is 00:20:02 They put Trump 93, Harris supporter 68, economy, meaning what's the most important thing to them. Trump supporters, number one is economy, and then Harris are like, nah, 68. Healthcare, Harris supporters, they have the higher score, 76, Trump only 55. Supreme Court appointments, Harris has 73, Trump only 54. By the way, that should be much higher. They want to flip. I know, but Trump's supporters should be higher than 54. Foreign policy, Trump 70, Harris foreign policy 54. You got violent crime, look at Democrats.

Starting point is 00:20:38 They're not really too worried about violence. Trump supporters, they're not so... They're good. ...immigration. Look at the supporters. They're like, now who cares about immigration guys? Look at Trump, 82, gun policy very close, abortion 67 Dems, 35 conservatives, racial and ethnic equality, conservatives are not too worried about it, left heavily,

Starting point is 00:20:59 climate change, the changing of the climate, you got Dems 62 and conservatives 11. Tom, top three issues tonight, what do you think is gonna be? Top three issues tonight. So the top three issues tonight have to be immigration and the economy and women's rights. Those are showing up as top three in states. Take a look at Arizona. Arizona, both, you saw there was a big difference there

Starting point is 00:21:23 where Republicans thought that immigration, 82% of them thought it was very important, only 39% of Democrats in Arizona, 78% of both of them thought it was important. You want to know why? Why? Because both Democrats and Republicans have, you know, undocumented immigrants in the front yard, and they don't feel safe and things are happening around them. And they're seeing the humanity come across. So that is why Arizona doesn't line up on a national level. But I think those are the three most important but they vary from state

Starting point is 00:21:52 to state in terms of who's going to get the touchdowns and field goals in electoral college. But the big ones tonight is going to be immigration, the economy, and women's rights. I believe Kamala Harris will try to make women's rights number one. Trump's going gonna try to make the economy and immigration number one. I think you're way off. I think Trump's number one focus tonight is gonna be cats and ducks. I think that's what his focus is gonna be. Did you guys see, did you see the last picture he posted on Instagram? I love it. This is when you're about to have your first presidential debate, okay, with a candidate that's the

Starting point is 00:22:25 first one with this one. What does Trump put on his Instagram? He posts this. That's two hours ago, folks. He puts it as if he's on the flight with cats and ducks coming in. Anyways. All right, guys. And, Pat, that right there is when he earned my vote with the cats.

Starting point is 00:22:40 Hey, to people that are watching this, we're a minute 45 from this getting started. To everyone in Florida that you're down here, South Florida, I want to give you a quick announcement. This Saturday at 12 o'clock, I will be at the Fort Lauderdale Barnes and Noble signing books of Academy that just came out, first fiction book. I'll be signing your next five moves, and I'll be signing Choose Your Enemies Wisely. Come join us. I'm going to be there. Vinny's going to be there. Tom's going to be there. Your Enemies Wisely. Come join us, I'm gonna be there,

Starting point is 00:23:05 Vinny's gonna be there, Tom's gonna be there, Adam's gonna be there, I'll be signing for two hours. First come first serve, you buy a book, you'll get it signed by me, Four Lauderdale, Barnes and Noble, this Saturday at noon, put it in your calendar, we'll see you there. Having said that, Vinny, final thoughts

Starting point is 00:23:20 before we got watches today? Final thought, let's, how do we get here, okay? It's by God's good grace that Donald Trump didn't get killed that day because if Donald Trump, think about it, Donald Trump gets shot, Joe Biden is still the president, there's no Kamala, Joe Biden wins by a landslide because who are they going to have? Nikki Haley? Whatever. So then guess what?

Starting point is 00:23:40 They invoke the 25th Amendment, he steps down and she wins. And from everything from 2016, from a Russiaussia collusion fake news obama spying Impeachments social media taking them off toward everything look at what this guy has fought to to get to right here I think he stays cool collected just stays on point Adam. We talked about this to Amy He doesn't get personal whatever stick to what you've done. You have a case study of him She has absolutely nothing and Trump's gonna win in a landslide period. End of story. Yep. There you go. The angry Patriots. Perspective of what's gonna happen. Rob, how close are we to this thing going? 30 seconds left. Amy, what do you

Starting point is 00:24:18 think? I think that regardless, unless there is some colossal failure on Kamala's side, the Dems are still going to say that she won. But anybody who's rational, logical, and actually makes their decisions based on data, on policy, they're going to see the truth that we all know going into this thing that Donald Trump is going to crush and he's going to win this debate. Let's go baby. Okay.

Starting point is 00:24:41 It's officially live. Let's go ahead and watch the debate. Go ahead, Rob. If you want to flip it. Historic race for president upended just weeks ago. President Biden withdrawing after his last debate. Donald Trump now up against a new opponent. The candidates separated by the smallest of margins, essentially tied in the polls nationally

Starting point is 00:24:58 and in the key battlegrounds, including right here in Pennsylvania, all still very much in play. The ABC News presidential debate starts right now. This is an ABC News special. The most consequential moment of this campaign. Kamala Harris. Together, we will chart a new way forward. Donald Trump.

Starting point is 00:25:19 We will soon be a great nation again. Face to face, historic. The ABC News presidential debate. Here now, David Muir and Lindsey Davis. Good evening, I'm David Muir and thank you for joining us for tonight's ABC News presidential debate. We want to welcome viewers watching on ABC and around the world tonight.

Starting point is 00:25:43 Vice President Kamala Harris and President Donald Trump are just moments away from taking the stage in this unprecedented race for president. And I'm Lindsay Davis. Tonight's meeting could be the most consequential event of their campaigns with election day now less than two months away. For Vice President Kamala Harris, this is her first debate since President Biden withdrew from the race on July 21st. Of course, that decision followed his debate against President Donald Trump in June.

Starting point is 00:26:08 Since then, this race has taken on an entirely new dynamic. You know, if they're going to get started now. That brings us to the rules of tonight's debate. 90 minutes with two commercial breaks. No topics or questions have been shared with the campaigns. The candidates will have two minutes to answer questions. And this is the clock. That's what they'll be seeing.

Starting point is 00:26:23 Two minutes for rebuttals and one minute for follow-ups clarifications or responses their microphones will only be turned on when it's their turn to speak no pre-written notes allowed there is no audience here tonight in this hall at the National Constitution Center this is an intimate setting for two candidates who have never met President Trump won the coin toss he chose to deliver the final closing statement of the evening Vice President Harris selected the podium to the right. So let's now welcome the candidates to the stage. Vice President Kamala Harris and President Donald Trump.

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Starting point is 00:27:59 It's a good debate. Thank you. He didn't rip it off. Welcome to you both. It's wonderful to have you. It's an honor to have you both here tonight. I think that's the first time we've actually ever met. Good evening.

Starting point is 00:28:07 We are looking forward to a spirited and thoughtful debate. So let's get started. I want to begin tonight with the issue that voters repeatedly say is their number one issue, and that is the economy and the cost of living in this country. Vice President Harris, you and President Trump were elected four years ago, and your opponent on the stage here tonight often asks his supporters, are you better off than you were four years ago? When it comes to the economy, do you believe Americans are better off than they were four years ago?

Starting point is 00:28:33 So I was raised as a middle class kid and I am actually the only person on this stage who has a plan that is about lifting up the middle class and working people of America. I believe in the ambition, the aspirations, the dreams of the American people. And that is why I imagine and have actually a plan to build what I call an opportunity economy. Because here's the thing. We know that we have a shortage of homes and housing. And the cost of housing is too expensive for far too many people. We know that young families need support to raise their children, and I intend on extending a tax cut for those families of $6,000, which is the largest child tax credit that we have given in a long time, so that those young families can afford to buy a crib, buy a car

Starting point is 00:29:23 seat, buy clothes for their children. My passion, one of them, is small businesses. I was actually, my mother raised my sister and me, but there was a woman who helped raise us. We call her our second mother. She was a small business owner. I love our small businesses. My plan is to give a $50,000 tax deduction to start up small businesses, knowing they are part of the backbone of America's economy. My opponent, on the other hand, his plan is to do what he has done before,

Starting point is 00:29:53 which is to provide a tax cut for billionaires and big corporations, which will result in $5 trillion to America's deficit. My opponent has a plan that I call the Trumps' sales tax, which would be a 20% tax on everyday goods that you rely on to get through the month. Economists have said that that Trump sales tax would actually result for middle-class families in about $4,000 more a year because of his policies and his ideas about what should be the backs of middle-class people paying for tax cuts for billionaires?

Starting point is 00:30:31 President Trump? The question was, first of all, I have no sales tax. That's an incorrect statement. She knows that we're doing tariffs on other countries. Other countries are going to finally, after 75 years, pay us back for all that we've done for the world. And the tariff will be substantial in some cases. I took in billions and billions of dollars, as you know, from China. In fact, they never took the tariff off because there was so much money they can't.

Starting point is 00:30:57 It would totally destroy everything that they've set out to do. They're taking in billions of dollars from China and other places. They've left the tariffs on. When I had it, I the tariffs on when I had it I had tariffs and yet I had no inflation Look, we've had a terrible economy because inflation has which is really known as a country buster. It breaks up countries We have inflation like very few people have ever seen before Probably the worst in our nation's history. We were at 21%

Starting point is 00:31:22 the worst in our nation's history. We were at 21 percent, but that's being generous because many things are 50, 60, 70, and 80 percent higher than they were just a few years ago. This has been a disaster for people, for the middle class, but for every class. On top of that, we have millions of people pouring into our country from prisons and jails, from mental institutions and insane asylums. And they're coming in and they're taking jobs that are occupied right now by African Americans and Hispanics,

Starting point is 00:31:50 and also unions. Unions are gonna be affected very soon. And you see what's happening. You see what's happening with towns throughout the United States. You look at Springfield, Ohio. You look at Aurora in Colorado. They are taking over the towns.

Starting point is 00:32:03 They're taking over buildings. They're going in Colorado. They are taking over the towns. They're taking over buildings. They're going in violently. These are the people that she and Biden led into our country and they're destroying our country. They're dangerous. They're at the highest level of criminality and we have to get them out. We have to get them out fast. I created one of the greatest economies in the history of our country. I'll do it again and even better. We are going to get to immigration and border security during this debate, but I would like to let Vice President Harris respond on the economy here. Well, I would love to.

Starting point is 00:32:35 Let's talk about what Donald Trump left us. Donald Trump left us the worst unemployment since the Great Depression. Donald Trump left us the worst public health epidemic in a century. Donald Trump left us the worst attack on our democracy since the Civil War. And what we have done is clean up Donald Trump's mess. What we have done and what I intend to do is build on what we know are the aspirations and the hopes of the American people. But I'm gonna tell y'all in this debate tonight, you're gonna hear from the same old tired playbook,

Starting point is 00:33:15 a bunch of lies, grievances, and name calling. What you're gonna hear tonight is a detailed and dangerous plan called Project 2025 that the former president intends on implementing if he were elected again. I believe very strongly that the American people want a president who understands the importance of bringing us together. No, we have so much more in common than what separates us. And I pledge to you to be a president for all Americans. President Trump will give you I have nothing to do. Everybody knows I'm an open book.

Starting point is 00:33:45 Everybody knows what I'm going to do, cut taxes very substantially and create a great economy. I'm not going to read it. I'm not going to read it. I'm not going to read it. I'm not going to read it. I'm not going to read it. I'm not going to read it.

Starting point is 00:33:53 I'm not going to read it. I'm not going to read it. I'm not going to read it. I'm not going to read it. I'm not going to read it. I'm not going to read it. I'm not going to read it. I'm not going to read it.

Starting point is 00:34:01 I'm not going to read it. I'm not going to read it. I'm not going to read it. I'm not going to read it. I'm not going to read it. I'm not going to read it. I have nothing to do. Everybody knows I'm an open book. Everybody knows what I'm going to do, cut taxes very substantially and create a great economy like I did before. We had the greatest economy. We got hit with a pandemic and the pandemic was not since 1917 where 100 million people died. Has there been anything like it?

Starting point is 00:34:21 We did a phenomenal job with the pandemic. We handed them over a country where the economy and where the stock market was higher than it was before the pandemic came in. Nobody's ever seen anything like it. We made ventilators for the entire world. We got gowns, we got masks, we did things that nobody thought possible. And people give me credit for rebuilding the military.

Starting point is 00:34:42 They give me credit for a lot of things, but not enough credit for the great job we did with the pandemic. But the only jobs they got were bounce back jobs. These were jobs bounce back and it bounced back and it went to their benefit. But I was the one that created them. They know it and so does everybody else. Vice President Harris, I'll let you respond. So Donald Trump has no plan for you.

Starting point is 00:35:05 And when you look at his economic plan, it's all about tax breaks for the richest people. I am offering what I describe as an opportunity economy, and the best economists in our country, if not the world, have reviewed our relative plans for the future of America. What Goldman Sachs has said is that Donald Trump's plan would make the economy worse, mine would strengthen the economy. What the Wharton School has said is Donald Trump's plan would actually explode the deficit. 16 Nobel laureates have described his economic plan as something that would increase inflation and by the middle of next year would invite a recession.

Starting point is 00:35:47 You just have to look at where we are and where we stand on the issues. And I'd invite you to know that Donald Trump actually has no plan for you because he is more interested in defending himself than he is in looking out for you. That's just a sound bite. They gave her that to say. Look, I went to the Wharton School of Finance, and many of those professors, the top professors, think my plan is a brilliant plan.

Starting point is 00:36:11 It's a great plan. It's a plan that's going to bring up our worth, our value as a country. It's going to make people want to be able to go and work and create jobs and create a lot of good, solid money for our country. And just to finish off, she doesn't have a plan. She copied Biden's plan, and it's like four sentences, like run, spot, run.

Starting point is 00:36:35 Four sentences that are just, oh, we'll try and lower taxes. She doesn't have a plan. Take a look at her plan. She doesn't have a plan. Mr. President, I do want to drill down on something you both brought up. The vice president brought up your tariffs. You responded and let's drill down on this because your plan is what she calls is essentially a national sales tax. Your proposal calls for tariffs as you pointed out here on foreign imports across the board. You recently said that you might double your plan imposing tariffs up to 20 percent on goods coming

Starting point is 00:37:03 into this country. As you know, many economists say that with tariffs at that level, costs are then passed on to the consumer. Vice President Harris has argued it'll mean higher prices on gas, food, clothing, medication, arguing it costs the typical family nearly $4,000 a year. Do you believe Americans can afford higher prices because of tariffs? They're not going to have higher prices. What's going to have and who's going to have higher prices what's going to happen who's going to have higher prices is China and all of the countries

Starting point is 00:37:28 that have been ripping us off for years. I charge I was the only president ever China was paying us hundreds of billions of dollars and so were other countries and you know she doesn't like them they should have gone out and they should have immediately cut the tariffs but those tariffs are there 3 and a half years now under their administration. We are going to take in billions of dollars, hundreds of billions of dollars. I had no inflation, virtually no inflation.

Starting point is 00:37:55 They had the highest inflation perhaps in the history of our country because I've never seen a worse period of time. People can't go out and buy cereal or bacon or eggs or anything else. These the people of our country are absolutely dying with what they've done. They've destroyed the economy. And all you have to do is look at a poll. The polls say 80 and 85 and even 90 percent that the Trump economy was great, that their

Starting point is 00:38:20 economy was terrible. Vice President Harris, I do want to ask for your response. And you heard what the president said there, because the Biden administration did keep a number of the Trump tariffs in place. So how do you respond? Well, let's be clear that the Trump administration resulted in a trade deficit,

Starting point is 00:38:36 one of the highest we've ever seen in the history of America. He invited trade wars. You want to talk about his deal with China. What he ended up doing is under Donald Trump's presidency, he ended up selling American chips to China to help them improve and modernize their military, basically sold us out when a policy about China should be in making sure the United States of America wins the competition for the 21st century, which means focusing on the details of what that requires, focusing on relationships

Starting point is 00:39:11 with our allies, focusing on investing in American-based technology so that we win the race on AI and quantum computing, focusing on what we need to do to support America's workforce so that we don't end up having, on the short end of the stick, in terms of workers' rights. But what Donald Trump did, let's talk about this, with COVID, is he actually thanked President Xi for what he did during COVID. Look at his tweet.

Starting point is 00:39:39 Thank you, President Xi! When we know that Xi was responsible for lacking and not giving us transparency about the origins of COVID. President Trump, I'll let you respond. First of all, they bought their chips from Taiwan. We hardly make chips anymore because of philosophies like they have and policies like they have.

Starting point is 00:40:02 I don't say her because she has no policy. Everything that she believed three years ago and four years ago is out the window. She's going to my philosophy now. In fact, I was gonna send her a MAGA hat. She's got to my philosophy. But if she ever got elected, she changed it. And it will be the end of our country.

Starting point is 00:40:20 She's a Marxist. Everybody knows she's a Marxist. Her father's a Marxist professor in economics, and he taught her well. But when you look at what she's done to our country, and when you look at these millions and millions of people that are pouring into our country monthly, where it's, I believe, 21 million people, not the 15 that people say, and I think it's a lot higher than the 21, that's bigger than New York State pouring in. And just look at what they're doing to our country. They're criminals. Many of these people coming in are criminals.

Starting point is 00:40:50 And that's bad for our economy too. You mentioned before, we'll talk about immigration later. Well, bad immigration is the worst thing that can happen to our economy. They have, and she has, destroyed our country with policy that's insane. Almost policy that you'd say they have to hate our country. President Trump, thank you. Lindsay? I want to turn to the issue of abortion. President Trump, you've often touted that you were able to kill Roe v. Wade.

Starting point is 00:41:17 Last year, you said that you were proud to be the most pro-life president in American history. Then last month, you said that your administration would be great for women and their reproductive rights. In your home state of Florida, you surprised many with regard to your six-week abortion ban because you initially had said that it was too short. And you said, quote, I'm going to be voting that we need more than six weeks. But then the very next day you reversed course and said you would vote to support the six-week ban. Vice President Harris says that women shouldn't trust you on the issue of abortion because you've changed your position so many times. Therefore, why should they trust you?

Starting point is 00:41:54 Well, the reason I'm doing that vote is because the plan is, as you know, the vote is they have abortion in the ninth month. They even have, and you can look at the governor of West Virginia, the previous governor of West Virginia, not the current governor, is doing an excellent job. But the governor before, in other words, will execute the baby. And that's why I did that, because that predominates, because they're radical. The Democrats are radical in that. And her vice presidential pick, which I think was a horrible pick, by the way, for our country, because he is really out of it.

Starting point is 00:42:28 But her vice presidential pick says abortion in the ninth month is absolutely fine. He also says execution after birth, it's execution, no longer abortion because the baby is born is okay. And that's not okay with me.

Starting point is 00:42:44 Hence the vote. But what I did is something for 52 years, they've been trying to get Roe v. Wade into the states. And through the genius and heart and strength of six Supreme Court justices, we were able to do that. Now, I believe in the exceptions for rape incest and life of the mother. I believe strongly in it.

Starting point is 00:43:09 Ronald Reagan did also, 85% of Republicans do. Exceptions, very important. But we were able to get it, and now states are voting on it. And for the first time, you're gonna see, look, this is an issue that's torn our country apart for 52 years. Every legal scholar, every Democrat, every Republican, liberal, conservative, they all wanted this issue to be brought back to the states where the people could vote. And that's what happened.

Starting point is 00:43:37 Happened. Now, Ohio, the vote was somewhat liberal. Kansas, the vote was somewhat liberal, Much more liberal than people would have thought. But each individual state is voting. It's the vote of the people now. It's not tied up in the federal government. I did a great service in doing it. It took courage to do it.

Starting point is 00:43:55 And the Supreme Court had great courage in doing it. And I give tremendous credit to those six justices. There is no state in this country where it is legal to kill a baby after it's born. Madam Vice President, I want to get your response to President Trump. Well, as I said, you're going to hear a bunch of lies, and that's not actually a surprising fact. Let's understand how we got here. Donald Trump hand selected three members of the United States Supreme Court with the intention

Starting point is 00:44:22 that they would undo the protections of Roe v v Wade. And they did exactly as he intended. And now in over 20 states there are trump abortion bans which make it criminal for a doctor or nurse to provide health care in one state. It provides prison for life trump abortion bans that make no exception even for rape and incest, which understand what that means. A survivor of a crime, a violation to their body does not have the right to make a decision about what happens to their body next. That is immoral.

Starting point is 00:44:59 And one does not have to abandon their faith or deeply held beliefs to agree. The government and Donald Trump certainly should not be telling a woman what to do with her body. I have talked with women around our country. You want to talk about this is what people wanted? Pregnant women who want to carry a pregnancy to term, suffering from a miscarriage, being denied care in an emergency room because the healthcare providers are afraid they might go to jail and she's bleeding out in a car in the parking lot. She didn't want that.

Starting point is 00:45:34 Her husband didn't want that. A 12 or 13 year old survivor of incest being forced to carry a pregnancy to term. They don't want that. And I pledge to you, when Congress passes a bill to put back in place the protections of Roe v. Wade as President of the United States, I will proudly sign it into law. But understand, if Donald Trump were to be reelected, he will sign a national abortion ban. Understand, in his project 2025, He will sign a national abortion ban. Understand in his project 2025, there would be a national abortion monitor that would be monitoring your pregnancies, your miscarriages. I think the American people believe that certain freedoms, in particular,

Starting point is 00:46:17 the freedom to make decisions about one's own body should not be made by the government. Thank you, Vice President Harris. Well, there she goes again. It's a lie. I'm not signing a ban and there's no reason to sign a ban because we've gotten what everybody wanted Democrats, Republicans and everybody else and every legal scholar wanted it to be brought back into the states and the states are voting. And it may take a little time, but for 52 years, this issue has torn our country apart. And they've wanted it back in the states. And I did something that nobody thought was possible.

Starting point is 00:46:55 The states are now voting. What she says is an absolute lie. And as far as the abortion ban, no, I'm not in favor of abortion ban, but it doesn't matter because this issue has now been taken over by the states. Would you veto a national abortion ban if you can't do this? Well, I won't have to because again, two things. Number one, she said she'll go back to Congress, she'll never get the vote.

Starting point is 00:47:16 It's impossible for her to get the vote, especially now with the 50-50 and essentially 50-50 in both Senate and the House. She's not going to get the vote. She can't get the vote. She won't even come close to it. So it's just talk. You know what it reminds me of when they said they're going to get student loans terminated and it ended up being a total

Starting point is 00:47:34 catastrophe, the student loans. And then her, I think probably her boss, if you call him a boss, he spends all his time on the beach. Her boss went out and said, we'll do it again. We'll do it a different way. And he went out, got rejected again by the Supreme Court. So all these students got taunted with this whole thing about this whole idea

Starting point is 00:47:55 and how unfair that would have been, part of the reason they lost to the millions and millions of people that had to pay off their student loans. They didn't get it for free, but they were saying, it's the same way that they talked about that, that they talk about abortion. But if I could just get a yes or no, because you're running me, Janet JD Vance has said that you would veto if you did come to your desk.

Starting point is 00:48:15 Well, I didn't discuss it with JD in all fairness. JD and I don't mind if he has a certain view, but I think he was speaking for me, but I really didn't. Look, we don't have to discuss it because she'd never be able to get it, just like she couldn't get student loans, they couldn't get student loans. They didn't even come close to getting student loans.

Starting point is 00:48:34 They taunted young people and a lot of other people that had loans. They can never get this approved. So it doesn't matter what she says about going to Congress. We're wonderful, let's go to Congress, do it. But the fact is that for years, they wanted to Congress. We're wonderful. Let's go to Congress. Do it. But the fact is that for years they wanted to get it out of Congress and out of the federal government.

Starting point is 00:48:49 And we did something that everybody said couldn't be done. And now you have a vote of the people on abortion. Vice President Harris, I want to give you your time to respond. But I do want to ask, would you support any restrictions on a woman's right to an abortion? I absolutely support reinstating the protections of Roe v. Wade. And as you rightly mentioned, nowhere in America is a woman carrying a pregnancy to term and asking for an abortion. That is not happening.

Starting point is 00:49:19 It's insulting to the women of America. And understand what has been happening under Donald Trump's abortion bans. Couples who pray and dream of having a family are being denied IVF treatments. What is happening in our country? Working people, working women who are working one or two jobs jobs who can barely afford childcare as it is have to travel to another state to get on a plane sitting next to strangers to go and get the healthcare she needs. Barely can afford to do it and what you are putting her through is unconscionable and the people of America have not, the majority of Americans believe in a woman's right to

Starting point is 00:50:06 make decisions about her own body. And that is why in every state where this issue has been on the ballot in red and blue states both, the people of America have voted for freedom. Vice President, I have to respond. Another lie. It's another lie. I have been a leader on IVF, which is fertilization. The IVF, I have been a leader on IVF, which is fertilization. The IVF, I have been a leader.

Starting point is 00:50:27 In fact, when they got a very negative decision on IVF from the Alabama courts, I saw the people of Alabama and the legislature two days later voted it in. I've been a leader on it. They know that and everybody else knows it. I have been a leader on fertilization IVF. And the other thing, they, you should ask, will she allow abortion in the eighth month, ninth month, seventh month? Come on. Okay. Would you do that? Why don't you ask that question? Why don't you answer the question? Would you veto? Because under Roe v. Wade, you could do

Starting point is 00:51:03 abortions in the seventh month, the eighth month, the ninth month, and probably after birth. Just look at the governor, former governor of Virginia. The governor of Virginia said we put the baby aside and then we determine what we want to do with the baby. President Trump, thank you. We're going to turn now to immigration and border security. We know it's an issue that's important to Republicans, Democrats, voters across the board in this country. Vice President Harris, you were tasked by President

Starting point is 00:51:29 Biden with getting to the root causes of migration from Central America. We know that illegal border crossings reached a record high in the Biden administration. This past June, President Biden imposed tough new asylum restrictions. We know the numbers since then have dropped significantly. But my question to you tonight is why did the administration wait until six months before the election to act? And would you have done anything differently from president Biden on this? So I'm the only person on this stage who has prosecuted transnational criminal organizations for the trafficking of guns, drugs, and human beings.

Starting point is 00:52:02 And let me say that the United States Congress, including some of the most conservative members of the United States Senate, came up with a border security bill, which I supported. And that bill would have put 1,500 more border agents on the border to help those folks who are working there right now over time trying to do their job. It would have allowed us to stem the flow of fentanyl coming into the United States. I know there are so many families watching tonight who have been personally affected

Starting point is 00:52:33 by the surge of fentanyl in our country. That bill would have put more resources to allow us to prosecute transnational criminal organizations for trafficking in guns, drugs, and human beings. But you know what happened to that bill? Donald Trump got on the phone, called up some folks in Congress and said, kill the bill. And you know why? Because he preferred to run on a problem instead of fixing a problem. And understand, this comes at a time where the people of our country actually need a I think that's a very important point. I think that's a very important point.

Starting point is 00:53:06 I think that's a very important point. I think that's a very important point. I think that's a very important point. I think that's a very important point. I think that's a very important point. I think that's a very important point. I think it's a really interesting thing to watch.

Starting point is 00:53:31 You will see during the course of his rallies, he talks about fictional characters like Hannibal Lecter. He will talk about windmills cause cancer. And what you will also notice is that people start leaving his rallies early out of exhaustion and boredom. And I will tell you, the one thing you will not hear him talk about is you. You will not hear him talk about your needs, your dreams, and your desires. And I'll tell you, I believe you deserve a president who actually puts you first. And I pledge to you that I will.

Starting point is 00:54:01 Vice President Harris, thank you. President Trump, on that point, I want to get your response. Well, I would like to respond to that. Let me just ask, though, why did you try to kill that bill, and successfully so, that would have put thousands of additional agents and officers on the border? First, let me respond to the rallies. She said people start leaving. People don't go to her rallies.

Starting point is 00:54:16 There's no reason to go. There's no reason to go. And the people that go, she's busting them in and paying them to be there, and then showing them in a different light So she can't talk about that people don't leave my rallies We have the biggest rallies the most incredible rallies in the history of politics. That's because oh This is ABC by the way, it's not us. This is happening nationally

Starting point is 00:54:36 Rob just were a failing nation and it happened three and a half years ago and What what's going on here? You're gonna to end up in World War III, just to go into another subject, what they have done to our country by allowing these millions and millions of people to come into our country and look at what's happening to the towns all over the United States. And a lot of towns don't want to talk, it's not going to be Aurora or Springfield. A lot of towns don't want to talk about it because they're so embarrassed by it. In Springfield, they're eating the dogs, the people that came in.

Starting point is 00:55:08 They're eating the cats. They're eating the pets of the people that live there. And this is what's happening in our country, and it's a shame. As far as rallies are concerned, as far as the reason they go is they like what I say. They want to bring our country back. They want to make America great again. It's a very simple phrase, make America great again. She's destroying this country.

Starting point is 00:55:34 And if she becomes president, this country doesn't have a chance of success. Not only success, we'll end up being Venezuela on steroids. Yes. I just want to clarify here. You rigged up Springfield, Ohio, and ABC News did reach out to the city manager there. He told us there had been no credible reports of specific claims of pets being harmed, injured,

Starting point is 00:55:54 or abused by individuals within the immigrant community. Third correction. Last seen people on television. Let me just say here, this is the- The people on television say my dog was taken and used for food, So maybe he said that and maybe that's a good thing to say for a city manager. I'm not taking this from television. I'm taking it from the city manager. The people on television say the dog was eaten by the

Starting point is 00:56:12 people that went there. Again, the Springfield city manager says there's no evidence of that. We'll find out. I'll let you respond to the rest of what you've heard. You talk about extreme. Oh God. You know, this is I think one of the reasons why in this election I actually have the endorsement of 200 Republicans who have formally worked with President Bush, Mitt Romney and John McCain, including the endorsement of former Vice President Dick Cheney and Congress member Liz Cheney. And if you want to really know the inside track on who the former president is, if he didn't make it clear already, just ask people who have worked with him.

Starting point is 00:56:55 His former Chief of Staff of Four Star General has said he has contempt for the Constitution of the United States. His former National Security Advisor has said he is dangerous and unfit. His former secretary of defense has said the nation, the republic, would never survive another Trump term. And when we listen to this kind of rhetoric, when the issues that affect the American people are not being addressed, I think the choice is clear in this election. President Trump will give you a quick minute to respond.

Starting point is 00:57:29 Thank you, because when I hear that, see I'm a different kind of a person. I fired most of those people, not so graciously. They did bad things or a bad job. I fired them. They never fired one person. They didn't fire anybody having to do with Afghanistan and the Taliban and the 13 people who were just killed, viciously and violently killed. And I got to know the parents and the family. They didn't fire. They should have fired all those generals, all those top people, because that was one of the most incompetently handled situations anybody has ever seen. So when somebody does a bad job, I fire them.

Starting point is 00:58:08 And you take a guy like Esper, he was no good, I fired him. So he writes a book. Another one writes a book because with me they can write books with nobody else can they? But they have done such a poor job and they never fire anybody. Look at the economy. Look at the inflation. They didn't fire any of their

Starting point is 00:58:25 economists. They have the same people. That's a good way not to have books written about you. But just to finish, I got more votes than any Republican in history by far. In fact, I got more votes than any president, sitting president in history by far. Let me continue on immigration. It was what you wanted to talk about earlier. So let's get back to your deportation proposal that the vice president has reacted to as well. President Trump, you call this the largest domestic deportation operation in the history of our country. You say you would use the National Guard. You say if things get out of control

Starting point is 00:59:00 you'd have no problem using the US military. You also said you would use local police. How would you deport 11 million undocumented immigrants? I know you believe that number is much higher. Take us through this. What does this look like? Will authorities be going door to door in this country? Yeah.

Starting point is 00:59:17 It is much higher because of them. They allowed criminals, many, many millions of criminals. They allowed terrorists. They allowed common of criminals. They allowed terrorists, they allowed common street criminals, they allowed people to come in drug dealers to come into our country and they're now in the United States and told by their countries like Venezuela don't ever come back or we're going to kill you. Do you know the crime in Venezuela and crime in countries all over the world is way down. You know why?

Starting point is 00:59:46 Because they've taken their criminals off the street and they've given them to her to put into our country. And this will be one of the greatest mistakes in history for them to allow, and I think they probably did it because they think they're going to get votes, but it's not worth it because they're destroying the fabric of our country by what they've done. There's never been anything done like this at all. They've destroyed the fabric of our country. Millions of people let in.

Starting point is 01:00:12 And all over the world, crime is down, all over the world except here. Crime here is up and through the roof, despite their fraudulent statements that they made. Crime in this country is through the roof. And we have a new form of crime, it's called migrant crime. And it's happening at levels that nobody thought possible. President Trump, as you know, the FBI says overall violent crime is actually coming down in this country. But Vice President- Excuse me, the FBI defrauding, they were defrauding statements.

Starting point is 01:00:38 They didn't include the worst cities. They didn't include the cities with the worst crime. It was a fraud. Five times. Five corrections fraud just like their number of Jobs that they said they created turned out to be a fraud president Trump. Thank you. I'll let you respond vice president Well, I think this is so rich Coming from someone who has been prosecuted for

Starting point is 01:00:59 national security crimes economic crimes election interference Has been found liable for sexual assault and his next big court appearance is in November at his own criminal sentencing. And let's be clear, where each person stands on the issue of what is important about respect for the rule of law and respect for law enforcement. The former vice president called for defunding federal law enforcement, 45,000 agents, get this, on the day after he was arraigned on 34 felony counts.

Starting point is 01:01:36 So let's talk about what is important in this race. It is important that we move forward, that we turn the page on this same old tired rhetoric and address the needs of the American people, address what we need to do about the housing shortage, which I have a plan for, address what we must do to support our small businesses, address bringing down the price of groceries. But frankly, the American people are exhausted with this same old tired playbook. Vice President Harris, thank you. Excuse me. Every one of those cases was started by them against their political opponent.

Starting point is 01:02:14 Yes. And I'm winning most of them and I will win the rest on appeal. And you saw that with the decision that came down just recently from the Supreme Court. I'm winning most of them. But those are cases, it's called weaponization. Never happened in this country. They weaponized the Justice Department. Every one of those cases was involved with the DOJ, from Atlanta and Fonny Willis

Starting point is 01:02:36 to the Attorney General of New York and the DA in New York. Every one of those cases. And then they say, oh, he's a criminal. They're the ones that made them go after me. By the way, Joe Biden was found essentially guilty on the documents case. Now, what happened in my documents case? They said, oh, that's the toughest of them all.

Starting point is 01:02:58 A complete and total victory. Two months ago, it was thrown out. It's weaponization, and they they used it and it's never happened in this country. They used it to try and win an election. They're fake cases. President Trump thank you. A really quick response here Vice President Harris on this notion of weaponization of the Justice Department. Well let's talk about extreme and understand the context in which this election in 2024 is taking place. The United States Supreme Court recently ruled that the former president would essentially be immune from any misconduct if he were to

Starting point is 01:03:31 enter the White House again. Understand this is someone who has openly said he would terminate, I'm quoting terminate the constitution of the United States, that he would weaponize the Department of Justice against his political enemies. Would you correct her? Someone who has openly expressed disdain for members of our military, understand what it would mean if Donald Trump were back in the White House with no guardrails, because certainly we know now the court won't stop him.

Starting point is 01:04:02 We know JD Vance is not going to stop him. It's up to the American people to stop him. Thank you. Lindsey. Vice President Harris, in your last run for president. This is the one that weaponized, not me. She weaponized. I probably took a bullet to the head

Starting point is 01:04:18 because of the things that they say about me. Yes. They talk about democracy. I'm a threat to democracy. They're the threat to democracy. President Trump. With a fake Russia, Russia, Russia investigation. We do have a lot to get to. That went nowhere.

Starting point is 01:04:31 We have a lot to get to. Lindsay? Vice President Harris, in your last run for president, you said you wanted to ban fracking. Now you don't. You wanted mandatory government buyback programs for assault weapons. Now your campaign says you don't.

Starting point is 01:04:43 You supported decriminalizing border crossings. Now you're taking a harder line. I know you say that your values have not changed. Then why have so many of your policy positions changed? My values have not changed. I'm going to discuss at least every point that you've made. In particular, let's talk about fracking because we're here in Pennsylvania. I made that very clear in 2020. I will not ban fracking. I have not banned fracking as Vice President of the United States. And in fact, I was the tie breaking vote on the Inflation Reduction Act, which opened new leases for fracking. My position is that we have got to invest in diverse sources of energy so we reduce our reliance on foreign oil. We have had the largest increase in domestic oil production in history because of an approach that recognizes

Starting point is 01:05:35 that we cannot over rely on foreign oil. As it relates to my values, let me tell you, I grew up a middle class kid raised by a hard working mother who worked and saved and was able to buy our first home when I was a teenager. The values I bring to the importance of home ownership knowing not everybody got handed $400 million on a silver platter and then filed bankruptcy six times is a value that I bring to my work to say we are going to work with the private sector and home builders to increase 3 million homes increased by 3 million homes by the end of my first term my work that is related to Having a friend when I was in high school who was sexually assaulted by her stepfather and my focus then on

Starting point is 01:06:20 Protecting women and children from violent crime is based on a value that is deeply grounded in the importance of standing up for those who are most vulnerable. My work that is about protecting Social Security and Medicare is based on long-standing work that I have done, protecting seniors from scams. My values have not changed. And what is important is that there is a president who actually brings values and a perspective that is about lifting people up and not beating people down and name calling. The true measure of the leader is the leader who actually understands the strength is not in beating people down, it's in lifting people up.

Starting point is 01:07:04 I intend to be that president. President Trump, your response? Well, first of all, I wasn't given $400 million. I wish I was. My father was a Brooklyn builder, Brooklyn, Queens, and a great father, and I learned a lot from him. But I was given a fraction of that, a tiny fraction, and I built it into many, many billions of dollars, many, many billions.

Starting point is 01:07:23 And when people see it, they are even surprised. So we don't have to talk about that. Fracking, she's been against it for 12 years. Defund the police, she's been against that forever. She gave all that stuff up very wrongly, very horribly, and everybody's laughing at it, okay? They're all laughing at it. She gave up at least 12 and probably

Starting point is 01:07:45 14 or 15 different policies. Like, she was big on defund the police. In Minnesota, she went out. Wait a minute, I'm talking now. You don't mind, please. Does that sound familiar? She went out. She went out in Minnesota and wanted to let criminals that killed people that burned down Minneapolis. She went out and raised money to get them out of jail. She did things that nobody would ever think of. Now she wants to do transgender operations on illegal aliens that are in prison. This is a radical left liberal that would do this. She wants to confiscate your guns and she will never

Starting point is 01:08:25 allow fracking in Pennsylvania. If she won the election, fracking in Pennsylvania will end on day one. Just to finish one thing, so important in my opinion. So I got the oil business going like nobody has ever done before. They took, when they took over, they got rid of it, started getting rid of it and the prices were going up the roof. They immediately let these guys go to where they were. I would have been five times, four times, five times higher, because you're talking about three and a half years ago. They got it up to where I was because they had no choice, because the prices of energy

Starting point is 01:09:03 were quadrupling and doubling. You saw what happened to gasoline. So they said, let's go back to Trump. But if she won the election, the day after that election, they'll go back to destroying our country and oil will be dead. Fossil fuel will be dead. We'll go back to windmills and we'll go back to solar where they need a whole desert to

Starting point is 01:09:21 get some energy to come out. You ever see a solar plant? By the way, I'm a big fan of solar. But they take 400, 500 acres of desert soil. These are not good things for the environment as she understands. Thank you. Lindsay, thank you. We have an election in just 56 days.

Starting point is 01:09:39 And I wanna talk about the peaceful transfer of power, which of course we all know is a cornerstone of our democracy and the role of a president in a moment of crisis. Mr President, on January six, you told your supporters to march to the Capitol. You said you would be right there with them. The country and the world saw what played out of the capital that day. The officers coming under attack. AIDS in the West Wing say you watched it unfold on television off the Oval Office. You did send out tweets, but it was more than two hours

Starting point is 01:10:04 before you send out that video message telling your supporters to go home. Is there anything you regret about what you did on that day? You just said a thing that isn't covered. Peacefully and patriotically, I said during my speech, not later on. Peacefully and patriotically. And nobody on the other side was killed.

Starting point is 01:10:26 Ashley Babbitt was shot by an out of control police officer that should have never ever shot her. It's a disgrace. But we didn't do this group of people that have been treated so badly. I ask what about all the people that are pouring into our country and killing people that she allowed to port it? She was the border czar remember that yes. She was the border czar She doesn't want to be called the borders are because she's embarrassed by the border effects. She said at the beginning

Starting point is 01:10:52 Well, I'm surprised you're not talking about the border yet. That's because she knows what a bad job. They've done. What about those people? What's what are they gonna be prosecuted? When are these people from countries all over the world, not just South America, they're coming in from all over the world, David, all over the world, and crime rates are down all over the world because of it. But let me just ask you- David, when are those people going to be prosecuted?

Starting point is 01:11:17 When are the people that burned down Minneapolis going to be prosecuted? Or in Seattle? They went into Seattle, they took over a big percentage of the city of Seattle. When are those people going to be prosecuted? But let me just ask you might ask her that question. You were the president. You were watching an unfold on television. It's a very simple question. As we move forward toward another election, is there anything you regret about what you did on that day? Yes, sir. I had nothing to do with that other than they asked me to make a

Starting point is 01:11:43 speech. I showed up for a speech. I said, I think it's going to be big. I had nothing to do with that other than they asked me to make a speech. I showed up for a speech I said, I think it's gonna be big I went to Nancy Pelosi and the mayor of Washington DC and the mayor put it back in writing as you know I said, you know, this is gonna be a very big rally or whatever you want to call it And again, it wasn't done by me. It was done by others I said I'd like to give you 10,000 National Guard or soldiers. They rejected me. Nancy Pelosi rejected me. It was just two weeks ago, her daughter has a tape of her saying she is fully responsible for what happened. They want to get rid of

Starting point is 01:12:15 that tape. It would have never happened if Nancy Pelosi and the mayor of Washington did their jobs. I wasn't responsible for security. Nancy Pelosi was responsible. She didn't do her job. The question was about you as president, not about former speaker Pelosi, but I do want Vice President Harris to respond here. I was at the Capitol on January 6th. I was the vice president-elect. I was also an acting senator. I was there. And on that day, the President of the United States incited a violent mob to attack our nation's capital, to desecrate our nation's capital. On that day, 140 law enforcement officers were injured and some died.

Starting point is 01:13:00 No, they didn't. And understand. Liar. The former president has been indicted and impeached for exactly that reason. But this is not an isolated situation. Let's remember Charlottesville, where there was a mob of people carrying tiki torches. They know that she's about to lie, so they're pausing it. Come on.

Starting point is 01:13:29 Come on. So this is going on on ABCs? This is ABC. Because we're watching it on the back of what? When it came to the Proud Boys, a militia. The president said, the former president said, stand back and stand by. So for everyone watching who remembers what January 6th was, I say we don't have to go back.

Starting point is 01:13:49 Let's not go back. We're not going back. It's time to turn the page. And if that was a bridge too far for you, well, there is a place in our campaign for you to stand for country, to stand for our democracy, to stand for rule of law, and to end the chaos, and to end the approach that is about attacking the foundations of our democracy because you don't like the outcome. And be clear on that point.

Starting point is 01:14:22 Donald Trump, the candidate, has said in this election, there will be a bloodbath. Oh, God. If this and the outcome of this election is not to his liking, let's turn the page on this. Let's not go back. Let's chart a course for the future and not go backwards to the past. Let me just follow up here.

Starting point is 01:14:43 It was a different term and it was a term that related to energy because they have destroyed our energy business. That was where bloodbath was. Also on Charlottesville, that story has been, as you would say, debunked. Laura Ingram, Sean Hannity, Jesse, all of these people, they covered it. If they go an extra sentence, they will see it was perfect. It was debunked in almost every newspaper, but they still bring it up just like they bring 2025 up they bring all of this stuff up. I ask you this you talk about the Capitol

Starting point is 01:15:15 Why are we allowing these millions of people to come through on the southern border? How come she's not doing anything and I'll tell you what I would do and I would be very proud to do it I would say we would both leave this debate right now. I'd like to see her go down to Washington, D.C. during this debate because we're wasting a lot of time. Go down to, because she's been so bad, it's so ridiculous, go down to Washington, D.C. and let her sign a bill to close up the border because they have the right to do it. They don't need bills. They have the right to do it. They don't need bills. They have the right to do it.

Starting point is 01:15:46 The President of the United States, you'll get them out of bed, you'll wake them up before you get to the afternoon, you'll say, come on, come on down to the office, let's sign a bill. If he signs a bill that the border is closed, all he has to do is say it to the border patrol, who are phenomenal. If they do that, the border is closed. Those people are killing many people, unlike J6. We talked immigration here tonight.

Starting point is 01:16:08 I do want to focus on this next issue to both of you, because it really brings us this into focus, truth in these times that we're living in. Mr. President, for three and a half years after you lost the 2020 election, you repeatedly falsely claimed that you won, many times saying you won in a landslide. In the past couple of weeks leading up to this debate, you have said, quote, you lost

Starting point is 01:16:28 by a whisker, that you, quote, didn't quite make it, that you came up a little bit short. I said that? Are you now acknowledging that you lost in 2020? No, I don't acknowledge that at all. But you did say that. I said that sarcastically, you know that. And we said, oh, we lost by a whisker. That was said sarcastically.

Starting point is 01:16:43 Look, there's so much proof. All you have to do is look at it and they should have sent it back to the legislatures for approval. I got almost 75 million votes, the most votes any sitting president has ever gotten. I was told if I got 63, which was what I... Her face is so funny. Looking for a path to accelerate your career? Clear direction for next level success? In a place that is innovative and practical? A path to stay current and connected to industry?

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Starting point is 01:17:43 bets in a same-game parlay for a shot at an even bigger payout. Plus, with super simple live betting, lightning fast bet settlement, and instant withdrawals, FanDuel makes betting on the NFL easier than ever before. So make the most of this football season and download FanDuel today. 19 plus and physically located in Ontario. Gambling Palm, call 1-866-531-2600 or visit connectsontario.ca How is this happening? And we have to have good elections. Our elections are bad.

Starting point is 01:18:12 And a lot of these illegal immigrants coming in, they're trying to get them to vote. They can't even speak English. They don't even know what country they're in practically. And these people are trying to get them to vote. And that's why they're allowing them to come into our country. I did watch all of these pieces of video. I didn't detect the sarcasm lost by Whiskers.

Starting point is 01:18:29 We didn't quite make it. And we should just point out here as clarification, and you know this, you and your allies, 60 cases in front of many judges, many of them Republicans. No judge looked at it. And said there was no widespread fraud. They said we didn't have standing. That's the other thing. They said we didn't have standing, a technicality.

Starting point is 01:18:44 Can you imagine a system where a person in an election doesn't have standing? The president of the United States doesn't have standing. That's how we lost. If you look at the facts, and I'd love to have you do a special on it, I'll show you Georgia, and I'll show you Wisconsin, and I'll show you Pennsylvania, and I'll show you. We have so many facts and statistics. But you know what? That doesn't matter because we have to solve the problem that we have right now. That's old news. And the problem that we

Starting point is 01:19:12 have right now is we have a nation in decline and they have put it into decline. We have a nation that is dying. David, Mr President. Thank you. Vice President Harris. You heard the president there tonight. He said he didn't say that he lost by whisker. So he still believes he did not lose the election that was won by President Biden and yourself. But I do want to ask you about something that's come up in the last couple of days.

Starting point is 01:19:37 This was a post from President Trump about this upcoming election just weeks away. He said, when I win, those people who cheated, and then he lists donors, voters, election officials, he says will be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law, which will include long-term prison sentences. One of your campaigns top lawyers responded saying, we won't let Donald Trump intimidate us, we won't let him suppress the vote. Is that what you believe he's trying to do here? Donald Trump was fired by 81 million people. So let's be clear about that.

Starting point is 01:20:07 And clearly, he is having a very difficult time processing that. But we cannot afford to have a president of the United States who attempts, as he did in the past, to upend the will of the voters in a free and fair election. And I'm gonna tell you that I have traveled the world as vice president of the United States, and world leaders are laughing at Donald Trump. I have talked with military leaders,

Starting point is 01:20:36 some of whom worked with you, and they say you're a disgrace. And when you then talk in this way, in a presidential debate and deny what over and over again are court cases you have lost because you did in fact lose that election, it leads one to believe that perhaps we do not have in the candidate to my right the temperament or the ability to not be confused about fact what that's deeply troubling and the American people deserve better. I'll give you one minute to respond. Let me just say about world leaders, Victor Orban, one of the most respected men, they call him a strong man.

Starting point is 01:21:18 He's a tough person, smart. Prime Minister of Hungary, they said, why is the whole world blowing up? Three years ago it wasn't. Why is it blowing up? He said, because you need Trump back as president. They were afraid of him. China was afraid, and I don't like to use the word afraid, but I'm just quoting him. China was afraid of him.

Starting point is 01:21:40 North Korea was afraid of him. Look at what's going on with North Korea, by the way. He said Russia was afraid of him. Look at what's going on with North Korea, by the way. He said Russia was afraid of him. I ended the Nord Stream 2 pipeline, and Biden put it back on day one, but he ended the XL pipeline. The XL pipeline in our country, he ended that. But he let the Russians build a pipeline

Starting point is 01:21:59 going all over Europe and heading into Germany, the biggest pipeline in the world. Look, Viktor Orban said it. He said the most respected, most feared person is Donald Trump. We had no problems when Trump was president. But when this weak, pathetic man that you saw at a debate just a few months ago, that if he weren't in that debate, he'd be running on set of her, she got no votes. He got 14 million votes. What you did, you talk about a threat to

Starting point is 01:22:27 democracy. He got 14 million votes and they threw him out of office. And you know what? I'll give you a little secret. He hates her. He can't stand her. He got 14 million votes. They threw him out. So do we. Zero votes. And when she ran, she was the first one to leave because she failed and now she's running I don't understand it, but I'm okay with it because your time is I think we're gonna do very well We've got a lot more to get Israel Hamas war and the hostages who are still being held Americans among them vice president Harris in December You said quote Israel has a right to defend itself, but you added quote it matters

Starting point is 01:23:03 How saying international humanitarian law must be respected Israel must a right to defend itself. But you added, quote, it matters how. Saying international humanitarian law must be respected. Israel must do more to protect innocent civilians. You said that nine months ago. Now an estimated 40,000 Palestinians are dead. Nearly 100 hostages remain. Just last week, Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu said there's not a deal in the making.

Starting point is 01:23:23 President Biden has not been able to break through the stalemate. How would you do it? Well, let's understand how we got here. On October 7, Hamas, a terrorist organization, slaughtered 1,200 Israelis, many of them young people who were simply attending a concert. Women were horribly raped. And so absolutely, I said then, I say now, Israel has a right to defend itself. We would.

Starting point is 01:23:53 And how it does so matters. Because it is also true, far too many innocent Palestinians have been killed. Children, mothers. What we know is that this war must end. It must when and immediately. And the way it will end is we need a ceasefire deal and we need the hostages out. And so we will continue to work around the clock on that work around the clock. Also understanding that we must chart a course for a two-state solution. And in that solution, there must be security for the Israeli people and Israel and an equal measure for the Palestinians.

Starting point is 01:24:35 But the one thing I will assure you always, I will always give Israel the ability to defend itself, in particular as it relates to Iran and any threat that Iran and its proxies pose to Israel. But we must have a two-state solution where we can rebuild Gaza, where the Palestinians have security, self-determination, and the dignity they so rightly deserve. President Trump, how would you negotiate with Netanyahu and also Hamas in order to get the hostages out and prevent the killing of more innocent civilians in Gaza? If I were president, it would have never started. If I were president, Russia would have never, ever, I know Putin very well, he would have never, and there was no threat of it either, by the way, for four years, have gone into Ukraine and killed millions of people when you ended up. Far worse than people understand what's going on over there.

Starting point is 01:25:30 But when she mentions about Israel, all of a sudden, she hates Israel. She wouldn't even meet with Netanyahu when he went to Congress to make a very important speech. She refused to be there because she was at a sorority party of hers. She wanted to go to the sorority party She hates Israel if she's president I believe that Israel will not exist within two years from now and I've been pretty good at predictions and I hope I'm wrong About that one. She hates Israel at the same time in her own way. She hates the Arab population Because the whole place is going to get blown up. Arabs, Jewish people, Israel, Israel will be gone.

Starting point is 01:26:11 It would have never happened. Iran was broke under Donald Trump. Now Iran has $300 billion because they took off all the sanctions that I had. Iran had no money for Hamas or Hezbollah or any of the 28 different spheres of terror. And they are spheres of terror, horrible terror. They had no money. It was a big story and you know it. You covered it very well, actually. They had no money for terror. They were broke. Now they're a rich nation. And now what they're doing is they're spreading that money around Look at what's happening with the Houthis and Yemen. Look at what's going on in the Middle East. This would have never happened

Starting point is 01:26:53 I will get that settled and fast and I'll get the war with Ukraine and Russia ended if I'm president-elect I'll get it done before even becoming president Harris he says you hate Israel. That's absolutely not true. I have my entire career and life supported Israel and the Israeli people. He knows that he's trying to again divide and distract from the reality, which is it is very well known that Donald Trump is weak and wrong on national security and foreign policy. It is well known that he admires dictators, wants to be a dictator

Starting point is 01:27:33 on day one according to himself. It is well known that he said of Putin that he can do whatever the hell he wants and go into Ukraine. It is well known that he said when Russia went into Ukraine, it was brilliant. It is well known he exchanged love letters with Kim Jong-un. And it is absolutely well known that these dictators and autocrats are rooting for you to be president again because they're so clear they can manipulate you with flattery and favors and that is why so many

Starting point is 01:28:13 military leaders who you have worked with have told me you are a disgrace that is why we understand that we have to have a president who is not consistently weak and wrong on national security, including the importance of upholding and respecting in highest regard our military. Vice President Harris, thank you. They're the ones, and she's the one that caused it, that's weak on national security by allowing every nation last month for the year, 168 different countries sending people

Starting point is 01:28:46 into our country. Their crime weights are way down. Putin endorsed her last week. Yes. Said, I hope she wins. And I think he meant it because what he's gotten away with is absolutely incredible. It wouldn't have happened with me. The leaders of other countries think that they're weak and incompetent.

Starting point is 01:29:04 And they are. They're grossly incompetent and I just ask one question why does Biden go in and kill the Keystone pipeline and approve the single biggest deal that Russia's ever made Nord stream to the biggest pipeline anywhere in the world going to Germany and all over Europe because they're weak and they're ineffective and Biden by the way a lot of money. Thank you we have a lot of issues to get to.

Starting point is 01:29:27 We'll be right back with much more of this historic ABC News presidential debate from the National Constitution Center right here in Philadelphia. By the way I did a poll on Twitter, I did a poll on Twitter right before it got started. You can pull up Twitter Rob and you can mute the TV, yeah if you can go. Here's a poll I ran right before it started. How many times will ABC moderators interrupt Correct Trump tonight to help Kamala? I said zero, one, two, three, four, to six, seven. A lot of people commented, they said it's going to be zero, no one's going to say anything.

Starting point is 01:29:54 He's been interrupted now eight times so far. Eight times so far. Tom, how do you think he's doing? How do you think she's doing? She's doing better than I thought. She's memorized the responses. She's doing OK answering questions. She's not the word salad I thought she would be on some of this stuff.

Starting point is 01:30:14 But I think Trump is doing a very noble job making the point. And they are deliberately poking him. Everything that she's saying about Project 25 and things like this, she's deliberately throwing lies at him because the strategy here is to piss him off and to get him really irrationally angry But he's coming back and he's staying within himself And I think his responses have been very very strong far as that and she's just she is repeating lies I went down this and I'm really shocked at the level of lies have been repeated and I'm not saying this from a partisan Point of view. I'm just going down here and looking at the thing Charlottesville things that have been debunked

Starting point is 01:30:50 They're bringing them back up in front of the American people as is the fact She's gaslighting in the middle of her of her answers trying to piss him off and he's not biting Adam Well, look, let's not get a twist They're they're debating for the most powerful job on Earth. And you're going to use every trick, every line, every talking point that you possibly can. I've been sort of scoring this like a boxing match. I have Trump on the different topics. They went economy tariffs, abortion, immigration, fracking, January 6, 2020 election, and Israel-Gaza. I have Trump up 6-2 right now. Of course, she's winning on abortion. This is all they got, y'all. They got abortion.

Starting point is 01:31:38 And if it's the election comes down to abortion is the number one issue, then welcome to the President of the United States Kamala Harris. Ridiculous. Anything else, it's Trump. I mean, she's obviously, like Tom said, she's had how many weeks to practice and memorize all the talking points. I wouldn't be shocked if she knew ahead what the hell's been going on. He's debating three people right now. He's not debating one person. He's debating them. I hope the people aren't dumb enough. Pat Pat, you know this, what she's saying, the bloodbath, the this, the line, the January 6th, the people at home, they're not fact checking. Average Americans that are sitting there, not like us, the awake people, they're like, wow, he said this, he

Starting point is 01:32:18 said that. I still don't think it's enough to get the average person to flip on Trump. I still think he's kicking butt. Well it's interesting to see that pretty much the entire line of questioning is all favoring Kamala, right? But I will give them credit for the one point where they asked her about flip-flopping on some of her policies. At least they did that. But were you guys satisfied with that response?

Starting point is 01:32:40 Personally, I don't feel I'm burdened by what has been. I don't know about the rest of you. I definitely don't feel like I'm burdened by what has been. I don't know about the rest of you. I definitely don't feel like I'm burdened by what has been. I think she's doing, you know, like Tom said, better than most of us expected. At least it's not a word salad, but when you look into the substance of what's being said, Donald Trump is winning by miles. Miles. How do you got it scored right now, Pat? Oh, no, no. I'm breaking on my tweet. You know, every time there's debates, I write a long tweet that's gonna go out. Yeah, I mean, I'm breaking on my tweet. You know, every time there's debates, I write a long ass tweet that's going to go out.

Starting point is 01:33:06 Yeah, I mean, I'm watching his highlights, her highlights. She did the abortion thing so eloquently. She was so good. She looked at the camera. She looked at him. If you guys noticed, this is where Trump's looking. Not one time has she gone like this. This is how she is the entire time.

Starting point is 01:33:23 He's like this. One of the most basic things to be thinking about for those, does anybody get headaches when you hear weird voices? Who gets headaches? I swear to God, if we have to listen to that voice for four years of her speaking the way she speaks, like she's lecturing you the entire time. You know how you have an aunt or somebody you date that's just lecturing you, and you're at dinner, your mind, like she's lecturing you, you're like, dude, I mean, I've been done with you for two minutes. I'm just waiting to get the hell out of you. You have to have a little bit of fun and we are done.

Starting point is 01:33:54 You want me to listen to this for four years? That voice, that sound, somebody talking like that? It's tough. But, however, Trump is not as agitated as I thought he was going to be. I thought he was going to be more when they tried it because she poked a lot. So we'll see what's going to happen. What do we have left Rob? 20 minutes?

Starting point is 01:34:13 30 minutes? Is this the end of it where they say what do you like most about Trump and what do you like most about Kamala? Let's get started. Let's go ahead and go to it. National Constitution Center in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania Here again David Muir and Lindsey Davis. Welcome back to this historic ABC News presidential debate tonight We're gonna continue here and I want to turn to the war in Ukraine. We're now two and a half years into this conflict

Starting point is 01:34:39 Mr. President It has been the position of the Biden administration that we must defend Ukraine from Russia, from Vladimir Putin, to defend their sovereignty, their democracy, that it's in America's best interest to do so, arguing that if Putin wins, he may be emboldened to move even further into other countries. You have said you would solve this war in 24 hours. You said so just before the break tonight. How exactly would you do that? And I want to ask you a very simple question tonight.

Starting point is 01:35:03 Do you want Ukraine to win this war? I want the war to stop. I want to save lives that are being uselessly people being killed by the millions. It's the millions. It's so much worse than the numbers that you're getting, which are fake numbers. Look, we're in for 250 billion or more because they don't ask Europe, which is a much bigger beneficiary to getting this thing done than we are. They're in for $150 billion less because Biden and you don't have the courage to ask Europe

Starting point is 01:35:38 like I did with NATO. They paid billions and billions, hundreds of billions of dollars when I said either you pay up or we're not going to protect you anymore. So that's maybe one of the reasons they don't like me as much as they like weak people. But you take a look at what's happening. We're in for 250 to 275 billion. They're into 100 to 150. They should be forced to equalize.

Starting point is 01:36:03 With that being said, I want to get the war settled. I know Zelensky very well and I know Putin very well. I have a good relationship and they respect your president. Okay, they respect me. They don't respect Biden. How would you respect him? Why? For what reason?

Starting point is 01:36:19 He hasn't even made a phone call in two years to Putin, hasn't spoken to anybody. They don't even try and get it. That is a war that's dying to be settled I will get it settled before I even become president if I win when I'm president elect and what I'll do is I'll speak to one I'll speak to the other I'll get them together that war would have never happened and in fact when I saw Putin after I left unfortunately left because our country has gone to hell but after I left when I saw Putin after I left, unfortunately left because our country has gone to hell. But after I left, when I saw him building up soldiers, he did it after I left.

Starting point is 01:36:50 I said, oh, he must be negotiating. It must be a good strong point of negotiation. Well it wasn't because Biden had no idea how to talk to him. He had no idea how to stop it. And now you have millions of people dead and it's only getting worse and it could lead to World War III. Don't kid yourself, David. We're playing with World War III

Starting point is 01:37:10 and we have a president that we don't even know if he's, where is our president? We don't even know if he's a president. And just to clarify here. They threw him out of a campaign like a dog. We don't even know, is he our president? But we have a president Mr. President.

Starting point is 01:37:23 That doesn't know he's alive. Your time is up. Just to clarify the question, do you believe it's in the U.S. best interest for Ukraine to win this war, yes or no? I think it's the U.S. best interest to get this war finished and just get it done. Negotiate a deal, because we have to stop all of these human lives from being destroyed. I want to take this to Vice President Harris. I want to get your thoughts on support for Ukraine in this moment, but also as commander

Starting point is 01:37:49 in chief, if elected, how would you deal with Vladimir Putin? And would it be any different from what we're seeing from President Biden? Well, first of all, it's important to remind the former president you're not running against Joe Biden, you're running against me. Oh, I believe the reason that Donald Trump says that this war would be over within 24 hours is because he would just give it up. And that's not who we are as Americans. Let's understand what happened here. I actually met with Zelensky a few days before Russia invaded, tried through force to change territorial boundaries, to defy one of the most important

Starting point is 01:38:27 international rules and norms, which is the importance of sovereignty and territorial integrity. And I met with President Zelensky. I shared with him American intelligence about how he could defend himself. Days later, I went to NATO's eastern flank, to Poland and Romania. And through the work that I and others did, we brought 50 countries together to support Ukraine in its righteous defense. And because of our support, because of the air defense, the ammunition, the artillery, the javelins, the Abrams tanks that we have provided, Ukraine stands as an independent and free country.

Starting point is 01:39:05 If Donald Trump were president, Putin would be sitting in Kiev right now. And understand what that would mean, because Putin's agenda is not just about Ukraine. Understand why the European allies and our NATO allies are so thankful that you are no longer president and that we understand the importance of the greatest military alliance the world has ever known, which is NATO, and what we have done to preserve the ability of Zelensky and the Ukrainians to fight for their independence. Otherwise Putin would be sitting in Kiev with his eyes on the rest of Europe, starting with Poland and why don't you tell the 800,000 Polish Americans right here in Pennsylvania how quickly

Starting point is 01:39:49 you would give up for the sake of favor and what you think is a friendship with what is known to be a dictator who would eat you for lunch. Vice President Harris, thank you. We've heard from both of you on Ukraine tonight. Afghanistan came up in the last hour. I wanted her to respond to something you said earlier. And now, please, I'll give you a minute here. Putin would be sitting in Moscow and he wouldn't have lost 300,000 men and women, but he would

Starting point is 01:40:18 have been sitting in Moscow. Quiet, please. He would have been sitting in Moscow much happier than he is right now. But eventually, you know, he's got a thing that other people don't have. He's got nuclear weapons. They don't ever talk about that. He's got nuclear weapons. Nobody ever thinks about that. And eventually, maybe he'll use them and maybe he hasn't been that threatening. But he does have that. Something we don't even like to talk about. Nobody likes to talk about it. But just so you understand, they sent her to negotiate peace before this war started.

Starting point is 01:40:51 Three days later, he went in and he started the war. Because everything they said was weak and stupid. They said the wrong things. That war should have never started. She was the emissary. They sent her in to negotiate with Zelensky and Putin. And she did. And the war started three days later. And that's the kind of talent we have with her. She's worse than Biden, in my opinion. I think he's the worst president

Starting point is 01:41:16 in the history of our country. She goes down as the worst vice president in the history of our country. But let me tell you something. She is a horrible negotiator. They sent her in to negotiate. As soon as they left, Putin did the invasion. President Trump, thank you. You did bring up something. You said she went to negotiate with Vladimir Putin. Vice President Harris, have you ever met Vladimir Putin?

Starting point is 01:41:36 Can you clarify tonight? Yet again, I said it at the beginning of this debate. You're going to hear a bunch of lies coming from this. Nine times. And that is another one. When I went to meet with President Zelensky, I've now met with him over five times. The reality is it has been about standing as America always should. Did she answer the question about Putin?

Starting point is 01:41:54 As a leader upholding international rules and norms, as a leader who shows strength understanding that the alliances we have around the world are dependent on our ability to look out for our friends and not favor our enemies because you adore strongmen instead of caring about democracy. And that is very much what is at stake here. The President of the United States is commander in chief and the American people have a right to rely on a president who understands the significance of America's role and responsibility in terms of ensuring that there is stability and ensuring we stand

Starting point is 01:42:39 up for our principles and not sell them for the benefit of personal flattery. We've talked about Ukraine and Vladimir Putin. I do want to talk about Afghanistan. It came up in the first hour of this debate. Didn't even answer the question. I want to move on to Afghanistan. President Trump said Trump did the most amazing thing I've ever seen. He got these countries, the 28 countries at the time, to pay up.

Starting point is 01:43:02 He said, I've never seen, he's the head of NATO, he said I've never seen. For years we were paying almost all of NATO. We were being ripped off by European nations both on trade and on NATO. I got them to pay up by saying one of the statements you made before, if you don't pay we're not going to protect you otherwise we would have never gotten it. He said it was one of the most incredible jobs that he's ever seen done. Thank you. I want to turn to Afghanistan. It came up in the first hour of the debate and we witnessed a poignant moment today on Capitol Hill honoring the soldiers who died in the chaotic withdrawal from Afghanistan. I do want to ask the Vice President, do you

Starting point is 01:43:38 believe you bear any responsibility in the way that withdrawal played out? Well I will tell you I agreed with President Biden's decision to pull out of Afghanistan. Four presidents said they would, and Joe Biden did. And as a result, America's taxpayers are not paying the $300 million a day. We were paying for that endless war. What?

Starting point is 01:43:59 And as of today, there is not one member of the United States military who is in active duty in a combat zone, in any war zone around the world, the first time this century. But let's understand how we got to where we are. Donald Trump, when he was president, negotiated one of the weakest deals you can imagine. He calls himself a deal maker. Even his national security advisor said it was a weak, terrible deal. And here's how it went down.

Starting point is 01:44:28 He bypassed the Afghan government. He negotiated directly with a terrorist organization called the Taliban. The negotiation involved the Taliban getting 5,000 terrorists, Taliban terrorists, released. And get this, no, get this. And the president at the time invited the Taliban to Camp David, a place of storied significance for us as Americans, a place where we honor the importance of American diplomacy, where we invite and receive respected world leaders.

Starting point is 01:45:12 And this former president, as president, invited them to Camp David because he does not again appreciate the role and responsibility of the president of the United States to be commander in chief with a level of respect and this gets back to the point of how he has consistently disparaged and demeaned members of our military fallen soldiers and the work that we must do to uphold the strength and the respect of the United States of America around the world. Vice President Harris thank thank you. President Trump, your response to her saying that you began the negotiation with the Taliban. So if you take a look at that period of time, the Taliban was killing our soldiers,

Starting point is 01:45:54 a lot of them, with snipers. And I got involved with the Taliban because the Taliban was doing the killing. That's the fighting force within within Afghanistan They don't bother doing that because you know, they deal with the wrong people all the time, but I got involved and Abdul is the head of the Taliban. He is still the head of the Taliban and I told Abdul don't do it anymore You do it anymore. You're gonna have problems and he said why do you send me a picture of my house? I said you're gonna have to figure that out, Abdul. And for 18 months, we had nobody killed. We did have an agreement negotiated by Mike Pompeo. It was a very good agreement. The reason it was good, it was we were getting out.

Starting point is 01:46:35 We would have been out faster than them, but we wouldn't have lost the soldiers. We wouldn't have left many Americans behind. And we wouldn't have left. We wouldn't have left $ billion dollars worth of brand new beautiful military equipment behind. And just to finish, they blew it. The agreement said you have to do this, this, this, this, this. And they didn't do it.

Starting point is 01:46:56 They didn't do it. The agreement was terminated by us because they didn't do what they were supposed to do. I want to move on. And these people did the worst withdrawal and in my opinion the most embarrassing moment in the history of our country. And by the way, that's why Russia attacked Ukraine because they saw how incompetent she and her boss are. President Trump, thank you.

Starting point is 01:47:21 Look at her face. I want to move on now to race and politics in this country. Mr. President, you recently said of Vice President Harris, quote, I didn't know she was black until a number of years ago when she happened to turn black and now she wants to be known as black. I want to ask a bigger picture question here tonight. Why do you believe it's appropriate to weigh in on the racial identity of your opponent? I don't and I don't care. I don't care what she is. I don't care. You make a big deal out of something. I don't and I don't care. I don't care what she is. I don't care. You make a big deal out of something. I couldn't care less. Whatever she wants to be is okay with

Starting point is 01:47:50 me. But those were your words. I don't know. I don't know. I mean, all I can say is I read where she was not black that she put out and I'll say that. And then I read that she was black and that's okay. Either one was okay with me. That's up to her. That's up to her. Vice President Harris, your thoughts on this? I think it's, I mean honestly, I think it's a tragedy that we have someone who wants to be president who has consistently over the course of his career attempted to use race to divide the American people. You know, I do believe that the vast majority of us know

Starting point is 01:48:28 that we have so much more in common than what separates us, and we don't want this kind of approach that is just constantly trying to divide us, and especially by race. And let's remember how Donald Trump started. He was a... land, he owned land, he owned buildings, and he was investigated because he refused to rent property to black families. Let's remember, this is the same

Starting point is 01:48:56 individual who took out a full page ad in the New York Times calling for the execution of five young black and Latino boys who were innocent, the Central Park Five, took out a full page ad calling for their execution. This is the same individual who spread birther lies about the first black president of the United States. and i think the american people better than that what better than this once someone who understands as i do i travel our country we see in each other

Starting point is 01:49:38 a friend we are the only any time and they asked the question we don't know what a leader who was constantly trying to have Americans point their fingers at each other. I need the people all the time who tell me, can we please just have discourse about how we're going to invest in the aspirations and the ambitions and the dreams of the American people. Knowing that regardless of people's color or the language their grandmother speaks, we all have the same dreams and aspirations and want a president who invest in those,

Starting point is 01:50:12 not in hate and division. Vice President Pence, thank you. Lindsey? President Trump, this is now your third time. This is the most divisive presidency in the history of our country. There's never been anything like it. They're destroying our country, and they come up with things like what she just said.

Starting point is 01:50:33 Going back many, many years, when a lot of people, including Mayor Bloomberg, agreed with me on the Central Park Five, they admitted, they said, they pled guilty. And I said, well, if they pled guilty, they badly hurt a person, killed a person ultimately. And if they pled guilty, then they pled we're not guilty. But this is a person that has to stretch back years, 40, 50 years ago, because there's nothing now. I built one of the greatest economies in the history of the world.

Starting point is 01:51:02 And I'm going to build it again. It's going to be bigger, better, and stronger. But they're destroying our economy. They have no idea what a good economy is. Their oil policies, every single policy. And remember this, she is Biden. You know, she's trying to get away from Biden. I don't know the gentleman.

Starting point is 01:51:19 She can't shake her head. She is Biden. It's losing. The worst inflation we've ever had. She cannot shake her head. A horrible economy because inflation has made it so bad. She has to stay solid. And she can't get away with that.

Starting point is 01:51:30 Did you see it? Yeah. Time's up. I want to respond to that, though. That's right. Thanks, Len. That was a Tulsi Gabbard response. Clearly, I am not Joe Biden, and I am certainly not Donald Trump.

Starting point is 01:51:41 And what I do offer is a new generation of leadership for our country. One who believes in what is possible, one who brings a sense of optimism about what we can do instead of always disparaging the American people. I believe in what we can do to strengthen our small businesses, which is why I have a plan. Let's talk about our plans and let's compare the plans. I have a plan to give startup businesses $50,000 tax deduction, to pursue their ambitions, their innovation, their ideas, their hard work.

Starting point is 01:52:21 I have a plan, $6,000 for young families for the first year of your child's life to help you in that most critical stage of your child's development. I have a plan that is about allowing people to be able to pursue what has been fleeting in terms of the American dream by offering a help with down payment of $25,000 down payment assistance for first time home buyers. That's the kind of conversation I believe David, that people really want tonight, as opposed to a conversation that is constantly about belittling and name calling. Let's turn the page and move forward. Vice President Harris, thank you. Let's turn to policy. President Trump, we have to move on. President Trump. Let's turn to policy. President Trump, we have to move on.

Starting point is 01:53:05 President Trump. Let's turn to policy, please. She has a plan to defund the police. She has a plan to confiscate everybody's gun. President Trump, we do have to move on to other issues. She has a plan to not allow fracking in Pennsylvania or anywhere else. Okay. Thank you, Mr. President.

Starting point is 01:53:20 You don't need to do this. I just need to respond to what he has said multiple times. President Trump. The former president has said something twice. I need to respond to it. You're ahead. I'm sorry. We're going to move on, Vice President Harris. I just need to respond to it. President Trump, President Trump. The former president has said something twice I need to respond to. I'm sorry, we're going to move on, Vice President Harris. President Trump, this is now your third time running for president. You have long vowed to repeal and replace the Affordable Care Act, also known as Obamacare.

Starting point is 01:53:37 You have failed to accomplish that. You now say you're going to keep Obamacare, quote, unless we can do something much better. Last month you said, quote, we're working on it. So tonight, nine years after you first started running, do you have a plan, and can you tell us what it is? Obamacare was lousy health care. Always was. It's not very good today.

Starting point is 01:53:57 And what I said, that if we come up with something and we are working on things, we're going to do it and we're going to replace it. But remember this, I inherited Obamacare because Democrats wouldn't change it. They wouldn't vote for it. They were unanimous. They wouldn't vote to change it. If they would have done that, we would have had a much better plan than Obamacare.

Starting point is 01:54:16 But the Democrats came up, they wouldn't vote for it. I had a choice to make when I was president. Do I save it and make it as good as it can be? Never going to be great. Or do I let it rot? And I felt I had an obligation, even though politically it would have been good to just let it rot and let it go away. I decided and I told my people, the top people, and they're very good people. I have a lot of good people in this, that administration. We read about the bad ones. We had some real bad ones too. And so do they. They have really bad ones. The difference is they don't get rid of them. But let me

Starting point is 01:54:47 just explain. I had a choice to make. Do I save it and make it as good as it can be or do I let it rot? And I saved it. I did the right thing. But it's still never going to be great and it's too expensive for people. And what we will do is we're looking at different plans. If we can come up with a plan that's gonna cost our people, our population less money and be better healthcare than Obamacare, then I would absolutely do it. But until then, I'd run it as good as it can be run. So just a yes or no, you still do not have a plan.

Starting point is 01:55:21 I have concepts of a plan. I'm not president right now. But if we come up with something, I would only change it if we come up with something that's better and less expensive. And there are concepts and options we have to do that. And you'll be hearing about it in the not too distant future. Vice President Harris, in 2017,

Starting point is 01:55:42 you supported Bernie Sanders' proposal to do away with private insurance and create a government-run health care system. Two years later you proposed a plan that included a private insurance option. What is your plan today? Well, first of all, I absolutely support, and over the last four years as Vice President, private health care options. But what we need to do is maintain and grow the Affordable Care Act. But I'll get to that, Lindsay.

Starting point is 01:56:04 I just need to respond to a previous point that the former president has made. I've made very clear my position on fracking and then this business about taking everyone's guns away. Tim Walz and I are both gun owners. We're not taking anybody's guns away. So stop with the continuous lying about this stuff. As it relates to the Affordable Care Act, understand, let's just look at the history to know where people stand.

Starting point is 01:56:25 When Donald Trump was president, 60 times he tried to get rid of the Affordable Care Act. 60 times. I was a senator at the time when I will never forget the early morning hours when it was up for a vote in the United States Senate and the late great John McCain who you have disparaged as being a, you don't like him you said at the time because he got caught, he was an American hero, the late great John McCain I will never forget that night, walked onto the Senate floor and said no you don't, no you don't. No you don't get rid of the Affordable Care Act.

Starting point is 01:57:06 You have no plan. And what the Affordable Care Act has done is eliminate the ability of insurance companies to deny people with pre-existing conditions. I don't have to tell the people watching tonight, you remember what that was like? Remember when an insurance company could deny if a child had asthma, if someone was a breast cancer survivor, if a grandparent had diabetes. And thankfully, as I've been vice president and we over the last four years have strengthened the Affordable Care Act, we have allowed for the first time Medicare to negotiate drug prices on behalf of you, the American people. Donald Trump said he was going to allow Medicare to negotiate drug prices.

Starting point is 01:57:46 He never did, we did. And now we have capped the cost of insulin at $35 a month. Since I've been vice president, we have capped the cost of prescription medication for seniors at $2,000 a year. And when I am president, we will do that for all people, understanding that the value I bring to this is that access to health care should be a

Starting point is 01:58:06 right and not just a privilege of those who can afford it. And the plan has to be to strengthen the Affordable Care Act, not get rid of it, pass this pro-lock in terms of where Donald Trump stands on that. I want to move to an issue that's important for a lot of... She made a mistake. Number one, John McCain fought Obamacare for 10 years. But it wasn't only him. It were all of the Democrats that kept it going.

Starting point is 01:58:32 And you know what? We can do much better than Obamacare, much less money. But she won't improve private insurance for people, private medical insurance. That's another thing she doesn't want to get. People are paying privately for insurance that have worked hard and made money and they want to have private. She wants everybody to be on government insurance where you wait six months for an operation that you need immediately.

Starting point is 01:58:57 President Trump, thank you. We have another issue that we'd like to get to that's important for a number of Americans, in particular younger voters, and that's climate change. President Trump, with regard to the environment, you say that we have to have clean air and clean water. Vice President Harris, you call climate change an existential threat. The question to you both tonight is what would you do to fight climate change? And Vice President Harris, we'll start with you, one minute for you each.

Starting point is 01:59:21 Well, the former president had said that climate change is a hoax. And what we know is that it is very real. You ask anyone who lives in a state who has experienced these extreme weather occurrences, who now is either being denied home insurance or is being jacked up, you ask anybody who has been the victim of what that means in terms of losing their home, having nowhere to go. We know that we can actually deal with this issue.

Starting point is 01:59:48 The young people of America care deeply about this issue. And I am proud that as vice president over the last four years, we have invested a trillion dollars in a clean energy economy while we have also increased domestic gas production to historic levels. We have created over 800,000 new manufacturing jobs. While I have been vice president, we have invested in clean energy to the point that we are opening up factories around the world.

Starting point is 02:00:16 Donald Trump said he was going to create manufacturing jobs. He lost manufacturing jobs. And I'm also proud to have the endorsement of the United Auto Workers and Sean Fain, who also know that part of building a clean energy economy includes investing in American made products, American automobiles. It includes growing what we can do around American manufacturing and opening up auto plants, not closing them like happened under Donald Trump. Vice President Harris, thank you. closing them like happened under Donald Trump. Vice President Harris, thank you.

Starting point is 02:00:46 It didn't happen under Donald Trump. Let me just tell you, they lost 10,000 manufacturing jobs this last month. It's going, they're all leaving. They're building big auto plants in Mexico, in many cases owned by China. They're building these massive plants and they think they're going to sell their cars into the United States because of these people. What they have given to China is unbelievable. But we're not going to let that.

Starting point is 02:01:11 We'll put tariffs on those cars so they can't come into our country because they will kill the United auto workers and any auto worker, whether it's in Detroit or South Carolina or any other place. What they've done to business and manufacturing in this country is horrible. We have nothing because they refuse. You know, Biden doesn't go after people because supposedly China paid him millions of dollars.

Starting point is 02:01:36 He's afraid to do it between him and his son. They get all this money from Ukraine. They get all this money from all of these different countries. And then you wonder, why is he so loyal to this one, that one Ukraine, China? Why is he? Why did he get $3.5 million from the mayor of Moscow's wife? Why did he get? Why did she pay him $3.5 million? This is a crooked administration and they're selling our country down the tubes. President Trump, thank you.

Starting point is 02:02:04 Thank you. We'll be right back with closing statements from both of our candidates. and they're selling our country down the tubes. President Trump, thank you. Thank you. We'll be right back with closing statements from both of our candidates. An historic night, this ABC News presidential debate from Philadelphia back. Okay, this was interesting. Tom.

Starting point is 02:02:16 So what's interesting that I've been watching is that she came in tonight, she needed to survive the debate. And I think she's done that. She has not collapsed the way Joe Biden did. But she's not convincing. She's merely, and she's, I feel like I'm being lectured by my aunt, is how I feel. I do not feel warmth.

Starting point is 02:02:41 I do not feel leadership. I feel she's doing the best she can with the tools that she has and the way she was coached for this moment. But I'm not feeling leadership saying, I trust that leader to go negotiate around the world. I don't trust that leader to go negotiate with Congress. That's not what I'm feeling.

Starting point is 02:02:58 And once again, he's getting poked at him and he is staying short of full fury. And I think he's doing a very good job, you know, responding and reminding us with the truth of what was happening. Vinnie? If you had to guess, who do you think is winning? Like, what do you feel that the American people right now are feeling? The Ameri- that's not how I'm looking at it. I'm looking at independence.

Starting point is 02:03:20 If I'm thinking independence, 70-30 to have Trump ahead. I don't care about the American people left or the right. MAGA is not changing and the progressive left is not changing. The independence 70-30, they're with Trump right now. Okay, and then Adam, you were talking about the women with the abortion. Yeah, not the men. No, what I'm saying is- Just the women.

Starting point is 02:03:40 What I'm saying is, do you think that's shifting at all? Are any of those women gonna vote for Trump What's what are you asking? I'm that like from tonight from listening to where you going? What are you thinking? What's up? What's up? I don't know. I'm just thinking I just feel like the way that she's performing right now Everybody could everybody tomorrow from the build Mars and every they're gonna put her on a pedestal and make her seem like she's the she's the second Come and she's gonna be the Savior. I'm telling you you right now that's I'm getting messages right now like oh my god our boys not doing good oh my god he's failing like I got four messages in a row saying that Trump is losing the debate okay Adam really so serious I got another one you're

Starting point is 02:04:16 okay I think there's only one time that Trump kind of lost his cool and that's what I was sort of saying can Trump just keep it cool bro you saw with Biden I mean Biden is literally this isn't the same fight though there's two different fighting styles make fights yes this is a different style of a fight you can't have to do anything the one the other one the guy was not just like Tyson fights six seconds it was over with this is going she's going ninth round 10th round 11th round it's going there is no knockout yet right he's not gonna knock her out she's doing okay this is coming back right here uh there was only one time he lost his cool when

Starting point is 02:04:56 he's like you're gonna take the guns and you're gonna all that kind of stuff like that you even were like uh chill out bro uh she's a she's a viable, but she's not a viable candidate, if that makes sense. She's not likeable. She's not that smart. She's just doing talking lines. She's a DEI candidate. Respect. I get it. This is what the Democratic party is at this point. And she could beat Trump. Where I'm at with Trump right now is he is so much more qualified than he was eight years ago. I understand why people, dude, eight years ago, it's crazy. No way Trump, he knows what he's doing at this point. He's going to have people around him at this point. Are there things that she's doing better at, namely the abortion issue and a couple other issues? Yes. She has the democratic machine behind

Starting point is 02:05:40 her and she also has mainstream media behind her. How many times has the moderators interrupted her? It's Trump against the world at this point. And you know, she's saying that he's a disgrace and he's saying that she's destroying America and the voters and the independents are going to basically determine what is true. But it's been Trump against the world since he announced that he was going to go. And think about it, in 2020, they had a global pandemic that came from China that still has no accountability, and everybody had to vote for home, and Joe Biden did that overnight leap right now.

Starting point is 02:06:10 This is what I'm worried about this election is, is the 20, let's say what the number, the realistic number, 20 million people, Pat, and you said the stat when we had the debate with Candace and Chris Cuomo, how many of the states, 20 million people are going to be here, how many of the states that we have that you don't have to show photo ID or any proof of citizenship? 16? Amy, 10 seconds. They're coming back. 10 seconds. I mean they talk about vibes, joy, you know, she's a candidate of joy. The vibe I'm getting is disingenuous and we could go through every single point that she made and find where it was disingenuous and where she just used word salad to get out of the segment basically. Rob, bring us back. Tell us, show us. Is this still in commercials? Okay. Amy, if you had any other thoughts?

Starting point is 02:06:56 I mean, I took some notes here on some of the things I thought were extremely disingenuous. She talks about the fact that Donald Trump left the economy and the job market in a terrible state, admitted the fact that it was when the pandemic started and literally nobody could work. How is she going to omit that from that very what she thought was an impactful point that she made? But we could go through list by list. There's so many points. Here we go. Let's roll. David Muir and Lindsay Davis. Oh yeah. Welcome back tonight. The time has come for closing statements and Vice President Harris. We begin with you So I think you've heard tonight two very different visions for our country One that is focused on the future and the other that is focused on the past and an attempt to take us backward

Starting point is 02:07:47 But we're not going back and I do believe that the American people know we all have so much more in common than what separates us. And we can chart a new way forward. And a vision of that includes having a plan, understanding the aspirations, the dreams, the hopes, the ambition of the American people, which is why I intend to create an opportunity economy, investing in small businesses, in new families, in what we can do around protecting seniors, what we can do that is about giving hardworking folks a break and bringing down the cost of living. I believe in what we can do together that is about sustaining America's standing in

Starting point is 02:08:26 the world and ensuring that we have the respect that we so rightly deserve, including respecting our military and ensuring we have the most lethal fighting force in the world. I will be a president that will protect our fundamental rights and freedoms, including the right of a woman to make decisions about her own body and not have her government tell her what to do. I'll tell you, I started my career as a prosecutor. I was the DA, I was an attorney general, a United States Senator, and now Vice President. I've only had one client, the people. And I'll tell you, as a prosecutor, I never asked a victim or a witness, are you a Republican or a

Starting point is 02:09:05 Democrat? The only thing I ever asked them, are you okay? And that's the kind of president we need right now. Someone who cares about you and is not putting themselves first. I intend to be a president for all Americans and focus on what we can do over the next 10 and 20 years to build back up our country by investing right now in you the American people. Vice President Harris thank you. President Trump? So she just started by saying she's going to do this, she's going to do that, she's going to do all these wonderful things. Why hasn't she done it? She's been there

Starting point is 02:09:44 for three and a half years, they there for three and a half years. They've had three and a half years to fix the border. They've had three and a half years to create jobs and all the things we talked about. Why hasn't she done it? She should leave right now, go down to that beautiful White House, go to the Capitol, get everyone together and do the things you want to do. But you haven't done it and you won't do it because you believe in things that the American people don't believe in. You believe in things like we're not going to frack, we're not going to take fossil fuel, we're not going to do things that are going to make this country strong, whether

Starting point is 02:10:18 you like it or not. Germany tried that and within one year they were back to building normal energy plants. We're not ready for it. We can't sacrifice our country for the sake of bad vision. But I just ask one simple question. Why didn't she do it? We're a failing nation. We're a nation that's in serious decline.

Starting point is 02:10:42 We're being laughed at all over the world. All over the world they're laughing. I know the leaders very well. They're coming to see me. They call me. We're laughed at all over the world. They don't understand what happened to us as a nation. We're not a leader.

Starting point is 02:10:55 We don't have any idea what's going on. We have wars going on in the Middle East. We have wars going on with Russia and Ukraine. We're going to end up in a third world war and it'll be a war like no other because of nuclear weapons, the power of weaponry. I rebuilt our entire military. She gave a lot of it away to the Taliban.

Starting point is 02:11:17 She gave it to Afghanistan. What these people have done to our country and maybe toughest of all is allowing millions of people to come into our country, and maybe toughest of all, is allowing millions of people to come into our country. Many of them are criminals, and they're destroying our country. The worst president, the worst vice president in the history of our country. President Trump, thank you. And that is our ABC News presidential debate from here in Philadelphia, the National Constitution

Starting point is 02:11:43 Center. I'm Lindsay Davis. And I'm David Muir. Thank you for watching here in the US and all over the world and from all of us here at ABC News. Good night. Done? OK, all right.

Starting point is 02:11:56 Now that it's done, Tom, go give your full analysis on what you got. So my full depth analysis goes like this. She was very well coached. I don't think we've seen her this way, but I don't think the independents really saw something in her tonight. The independent voters is what's here. This isn't about the 43 or what we look at.

Starting point is 02:12:19 This isn't about the 44 and the 45 that are locked in. It's not about that. This is about the Kennedy voters that have not made up their minds yet. This is about the independent voters that are in the middle. And I don't think the independent voters are gonna be swayed by what they saw if they look at it objectively.

Starting point is 02:12:38 She had a lot of emotion going. I think she scored well on the abortion question. She spent more of her time, I think, being defensive in her answers the way she went. And I think they got him irritated, but he didn't go over the cliff. And I think overall, you know, you know, I scored this thing really close. I scored probably, you know, 65 35, like one third, two third is probably is probably how I end up. That's really close

Starting point is 02:13:09 No, I know I'm said that's closer. I thought it was gonna be I mean I see So you thought it was gonna be a blowout your initial thoughts was this was gonna be a blowout But looking at the historical performance in the presence of her which is all the data we have and we saw her in California quite a bit Where she would really make a speech and when she did is looking like oh my god they're they're back I'm not gonna lie she she she surprised the hell out of me. She remember whoever was coaching her? It was a low bar. Yeah, yeah, exactly. It was freaking the bar was in the seventh ring of hell when it came to it. Okay. Yeah, yeah, it was horrible. But I mean, like, listen, is this is this gonna sway the vote? The vote is not so what November? I don't know. I think like you said, Tom, the independence of people in the middle, I hope they really, really see through all the BS Trump as a proven track record. She's done absolutely nothing. And I know some people are like, well, she hasn't been the president. No, she's sitting right next to the guy. She has

Starting point is 02:14:12 say in a lot of things. If the border is her number one job and she failed, I don't trust her to do anything else. Period. Hands down. So there was a couple different things like sort of nuance in there. I have some interesting stats. So she mentioned Bernie Sanders. things like sort of nuance in there. I have some interesting stats. So she mentioned Bernie Sanders, they talked about how she supported Medicare for All. Did you catch one you guys when she talked about Sean Fain UAW United Auto Workers, anyone catch that? This is a full on socialist, who basically came out during the

Starting point is 02:14:39 strike and was like, yo, I straight up don't believe in the concept of billionaires. Remember that? Now here you have Trump, who is an avid capitalist, and who is a billionaire. So there's a fundamental difference. Like, you know, something that I've learned being around Pat all this time is like cut through all the clutter and the personality and really go to policy. And what's going to happen is the following. She's going to implement more Marxist socialist communist like policies. I'm not saying that she's a communist, but

Starting point is 02:15:11 she's definitely a collectivist. California, Commie Fornia. We see what's going on there, Gavin Newsom. We see what's going on there, Nancy Pelosi. Like we have eyes and here you have Trump, whether you like him or not, whether he's too much to deal with, or whether he's just exactly what you want. He believes in the old adage, peace through strength. He's a capitalist, and he's going to protect small businesses. The fact that she, of all people is like small businesses. Yeah, nobody's buying that, bro. Who's thinking that she's there for small businesses?

Starting point is 02:15:45 I will say again and again and again. She crushed it on the abortion thing It is a deeply emotional issue Gentlemen out there who have women in your life sisters in your life girlfriends in your life do yourself a favor have nice soothing conversations with the women and say really what is the most important to you? And make sure it's democracy in America. It's a little weird. You got a little weird.

Starting point is 02:16:10 Yeah. No, not weird. We're both talking about abortion. Not weird at all. If you want, you don't have to put on Luther Bandros or Barry White. Are you open to an abortion? Sounded like a script, maybe.

Starting point is 02:16:17 But Trump did have the funniest line of the debate. You ready? You have the funniest line? I have a lot of lines. He has a freeze-bred writing writing. He goes this one right here wants to have transgender operations to illegal aliens in prison. It's true. Okay. It's true. So I was like damn like he's hitting illegal aliens, immigration, prison reform, transgender, all in one. Boom. And the government's paying for it. Take that. So I got by the way very good commentary

Starting point is 02:16:46 Amy I'll give you the last one. I got a few things. I want to share with you guys go forward Yeah, so I'll just go through a couple of the other notes I had so far is like disingenuous comments Sorry, did anybody else notice when she was talking about the border bill and talking about how Donald Trump shut that down specifically? What? Bipartisan border bill they call it bipartisan, what conservative actually supports X amount of illegal immigrants still crossing the border? What conservative supports providing, what was it, hundreds of

Starting point is 02:17:14 millions of dollars in aid to Ukraine to fund these international wars as well? Again, completely disingenuous when she said that. She brought up comments that Donald Trump made about armed forces, which number one, cannot be substantiated, while literally less than a week ago, she created an entire media frenzy about his patriotic Arlington visit. Like this woman is literally so hypocritical. It's just absolutely beyond me. I don't understand. And then finally, she talks about having a plan. She talks about having a plan. And yet, like Adam so clearly stated, that plan is inching America in the direction of, if not communism, definitely socialism. Okay, I come from a country that is, it's not socialist, but it does have a little bit

Starting point is 02:17:59 of a mixed economy. And I see the way that that affects the mindset of the people. And we do not have a constitution there to protect us from some of the terrifying things that they're bringing upon the Australian people in other Western countries around the world so thank God for that constitution that we have but if somebody like Kamala Harris does get elected as the president she's gonna do everything possible to undermine that and to bring these socialist and communist policies to the United States. Okay so I got a very good commentary from all of you guys. I got a question

Starting point is 02:18:31 for you guys. So here let's go through this. Go to 2020 Joe Biden against Trump okay. Let's take 2020 Joe Biden against Trump, that person, and he debates today's trained Kamala in a primary. There's nobody else on stage. So take every Cory, Booker off stage, take everybody off stage. It's this Kamala versus, so there is no Elizabeth Warren, there is no Bernie Sanders. It's this Kamala Harris, trained the way way she was today versus the Joe Biden of 2020 in the primary who wins. Oh, I think that would be a lot closer. I think that she would actually

Starting point is 02:19:10 I think probably win in that in that 2020. Okay, so that's the point. Yeah, that's the point. Wait a minute. This is a very important point you just made. So, so if that Biden, important point you just made. So if that Biden who beats Trump goes against this Kamala, you're saying this Kamala beats that Biden? Based on policy and performance, she'd stand a chance. Let me ask you guys a question. What do you say? Let me ask a question. I want you to make noise. It's pretty tough to make noise for this, but how about we do hands instead of making noise, right? How many guys say that 2020 Biden beats the 2024 Kamala of today's performance? Raise your hand. Okay, how many guys, by the way, look at that. It's not a lot of you. How many of you say tonight's Kamala performance? Guys, this is kind of like the 2006 Michael Jordan against,

Starting point is 02:20:03 you understand, when you're putting players against players, does Kamala Harris, today's Kamala Harris, does she beat 2020 Biden? Put your hands up. That's formidable. That's the part you have to pay attention to, okay? What just happened there. Now, we don't even need to ask the question, does today's Kamala beat the Trump-Biden debate that just took place, whatever, two months ago?

Starting point is 02:20:23 The answer's gonna be what? It's not even a question, right? You know, it shouldn't be a lot. So let me share with you a couple of thoughts that I have. Here's what happened here. So to me, if I can read this tweet, Tom, you're, Rob, I don't know if you can get on this screen. Okay, there you go.

Starting point is 02:20:35 So tonight's commentary versus Biden-Trump debate, Tapper Dana Bash interrupted Trump zero times. I remember I counted exactly how many times, not one time. Tonight, we counted it 11 times. It was a 3 to 1 debate. Kamala did her best to agitate and try to get under Trump's skin, which by the way, she did. She did multiple times. She brought up Project 2025. Even though Dana, and moderator never corrected, she claimed he and he was terminated constitution. Moderator never corrected. Misusing bloodbath Charlottesville j6 he wants to be a dictator on day one Donald Trump left us the worst unemployment the worst pandemic These are very good lines to get under his skin very effective Trump followed through to do the same thing She said they left the tariffs that Trump left on China for three and a half years meaning you followed my lead

Starting point is 02:21:23 She hates Israel. He said that even though Dems have 71% of Jews are voting for Democrats, just so you know it's a very small percentage of Jews voting Republican. She doesn't have a plan. It's like four sentences, okay? I was going to send her a MAGA hat. Her father's a Marxist. He taught her well.

Starting point is 02:21:42 These are very good lines. Her vice president pick abortion in the ninth month. Her boss, Tom, can't read it. He spends most of his time at the beach. These are great lines. They didn't fire anyone. That's the most important point for me as an executive. How the hell do you not fire anybody? All this stuff that's happened in the last four years, you've never fired anybody? That's like the first thing the person should say. That's a good point. You have the toughest job, you don't want to fire anyone. Then it continues. I'm sorry, I'm talking now. So he did to her what she does. She is Joe Biden. You know, this is crooked, right? And then it goes to her

Starting point is 02:22:16 highlight of the evening, abortion topics. I thought she crushed it. The economy. When you listen to her with the economy, honestly, you know what it's sounding like? How many guys don't like math? Raise your hand if you can't stand math. Raise your hand if you're not a math person. How many people know what happens when a math person is in a math conversation and math comes up and the economy comes? I mean, you're kind of like, please don't ask me a question, bro.

Starting point is 02:22:37 I swear to God, I'm begging you, don't. I still don't know what a four, don't ask me what a four or three B is, 457. Don't ask me unrealized gains, please let's skip this topic. She knew nothing about the economy. Maybe I thought for that moment when she claimed she smoked weed, she did in the economy class. That's what I realized. Maybe she did.

Starting point is 02:22:58 I think she was telling the truth then. His highlights, economy, Robby Fekin, go a little higher. His track record with No War When He Was president, he challenged her to leave the debate stage and go to D.C. to sign a bill to say the border is closed. His downfall, eating dogs. That part I think his team could have done a better job. And also getting a little bit agitated at the end and trying to overself-think in his behind showed a little bit of weakness at the end.

Starting point is 02:23:22 So biggest marketing mistake of the night to me was Kamala when she said, I invite you to go to one of Trump's rallies. Please leave the rally, people leave the rally early. Trump's marketing team is going to use us, even Kamala Harris wants you to come to the rallies, right? Even though he doesn't need that. Trump's marketing team can run with that last observation about the debate. Kamala kept looking at him.

Starting point is 02:23:42 He looked straight. He was focused. When they asked about the moderators, when they asked if Kamala has met Putin, they never once followed up on the question. They never once followed up. Why do you not follow up on the question? They followed up on Trump three times on the question. Why? The people want to know, by the way, what do you think the answer is if she's ever met Putin? If the answer was yes, what does she say within a first second? She said, I've met, who did she say she met five times? Zelensky five times.

Starting point is 02:24:06 I've met Zelensky five times. Meeting Zelensky five times doesn't equate meeting Putin one time. Say yes or no, we still don't know the answer to the question. That was a bad thing for moderators, even though they interrupted Trump consistently, they did better than expected. I thought David Meir, believe it or not, I actually liked this guy on the way he did it. I thought he was good.

Starting point is 02:24:27 I know a couple of times when Trump wanted to get the minute and they were trying to digress to a different topic or change to a different topic, David gave him the minute. I liked that. He didn't seem like an asshole. That's my read. I liked him. Lindsay Davis asked one of the toughest questions of the night of Kamala. Even though you can tell she does not like Trump I give her a seven for whatever

Starting point is 02:24:46 reason it seemed like she was gone for 20 to 30 minutes I don't know if that was an ABC thing or not but that was definitely weird so again Kamala sounded like a condescending aunt lecturing kids he sounded like an angry patriot defending his nation either way I think this was a much better debate performance wise than the Biden Trump for entertainment purposes, for fight for all this other stuff. I thought it was good. But to go back to it, to go back to it. So somebody may say, well, Pat, the question you're asking about, will the 2020 Biden beat

Starting point is 02:25:19 today's Kamala? The answer resounding is what? No. No, no, no. Hang on, Adam. Will the 2020 Biden beat today's Kamala? No. No, no, no. Hang on, Adam. Will the 2020 Biden be today's Kamala? All of you said no. Okay.

Starting point is 02:25:30 So then the next question is, is 2024, because it's games, it's opponents, styles, all that stuff, right? Then it's markets and conditions. Is today's market conditions the same as it was in 2020. Meaning at that time, everybody was saying, man, I know what Trump's going to do, but I have no clue what Biden's going to do. Maybe he's going to be nicer. Maybe America's going to be more peaceful.

Starting point is 02:26:01 Maybe we're going to have less protesting riots, right? The difference here that is nothing close to 2020 and the argument of whether Biden or Kamala beats who, is irrelevant. We have four years almost of Biden and Kamala. That is the biggest difference. And you put four to four, it is not even close. The four to four of results with a resume, you have two people applying for a job. Okay? What are some side, Tom, if you're interviewing, we interview hundreds of people per year, right? Yep. Executive, people that were hiring for $200,000 salaries, $300,000 salaries, 100K, 50K, 80K, you got two finalists as candidates. Resume, resume. What things do you look for and you're

Starting point is 02:26:42 like, nah, this is not for us? What do we look for? I just look at effectiveness and results. You have some people's resumes said I was part of this team I was part of that team the of other people turn in resumes. I raised I raised the growth of the company by 6% I raised profit by 15% I found 22 new customers go like that if you put them side by side in the economy You know Biden doesn't want the numbers and they have to shade because those are bounce-back jobs those were bounce-back jobs so if you look Trump on the economy and inflation inflation job creation job creation the foreign policy where the wars weren't and what they spent and you went down by that you would say can ask you a different

Starting point is 02:27:19 question though Tom this is the strongest guy let me ask you a different question by the way just so everybody, outside of ABC's YouTube channel being live tonight, we're officially the biggest live in the world tonight on YouTube. Just so you guys know that. Alright, just so you guys know that. There's hovering between 145,000 lives watching tonight concurrent is what we've got right now. Thank you. But by the way, let me go to this. Watch this. Question to the by the way, let me go to this. Watch this. Question to the listeners and the viewers and all of you guys sitting here.

Starting point is 02:27:47 You ready? Very simple question. You have two employees. Say we are Goldman Sachs. We're about to hire two financial advisors, two bankers. Both bankers have been at Morgan Stanley for four years. And both bankers, we have very good relationships with HR and their bosses. We look at the resume of one, Biden, Kamala.

Starting point is 02:28:17 We look at the resume of the other one, Trump. All the numbers of performance is here. That is the difference between voting for a president today versus 2020. You actually have all of their performance of what they've done in four years, in their four years of being in office. This one has raised, let's just say, whatever, $1.8 billion. This one's raised $2.1 billion, whatever. This one has had so many write-ups. This one's done this. This person's done this. You can look at every single thing and say, yeah, based on resumes and what's happened,

Starting point is 02:28:48 this one may be a little bit more, you know, cocky about himself, and this one may be a little bit more like elitist, like when she's coming in because I went to the right schools or whatever. You're going to sit there and say, yeah, based on this, we're hiring this guy. Now, that is assuming independents are going to do their part. That is assuming this goes the way it does. If Trump kind of plays the poised game, I think he has an edge. If Trump keeps getting upset and agitated the way they were doing them at the end, I think they're going to play up that all over TV, all over news, and they're

Starting point is 02:29:20 going to say, oh, he lost control. He lost his emotions. Adam. Yeah, I love the analogy of like, if if if Trump didn't have those first four years and Biden have these first four years then we would actually not know. I don't think I think it's the first time that two former presidents are running against each other since like Grover Cleveland in 1900 or something like that but it's weird because I'm gonna go Bill Nye the science guy here if you guys ever watch that back in the day. And talking about the scientific method, you have the control and you have the variable group. So Trump was the control. He was the guy. He was there 2016 to 2020. And what we basically realized in 2020, we're like, yeah,

Starting point is 02:30:00 we do not want this guy anymore. There was a resolute decision from the country basically saying we do not want this guy anymore. There was a resolute decision from the country basically saying chaos candidate, we don't need this. The COVID thing cemented that in and then enters the variable, sleepy Joe Biden. And we're like, all right, let's give this 50 year politician a chance. Maybe he can kind of do something here.

Starting point is 02:30:20 But what he didn't realize, and these are terms that I never even knew of five plus years ago, the progressive woke left, DEI, leftist, Marxist, intersectional, decolonialization, war on the west agenda took over. And instead of Easter, it's happy transgender day of visibility, y'all. It's like, what just happened here? And just everyday Americans are sort of waking up. So to use the scientific method

Starting point is 02:30:45 here, you had the control, which is Trump, and insert this variable. And at this point, you have to look back and be like, Yeah, I'll just go take those mean tweets again. And just that's fine. I'll take a little chaos. It's all good. Let's strike some fear into some countries that we should probably strike fear into. Let's maybe make NATO pay a little bit. How about we put up that wall that we thought was racist? Turns out it wasn't really that racist. And you know, women will have the babies and the men will kind of do their job and play their part.

Starting point is 02:31:12 And I think of all people, Trump, of all people, is sort of returning America to traditional Judeo-Christian values. And that is not something you would have thought of Trump in 2016. So that's why I'm with him this time. I mean, I'm going to be with him. I mean, my socks even, I don't know if you guys could see my socks have the Trump. Okay, my hair. But here's the thing, Pat. Like, let's not forget, the Democrats' plan is so far working, okay? No matter what anybody wants to say, let's think about their plan, okay?

Starting point is 02:31:34 They wheeled out Joe Biden, they let him debate. And what did you say earlier, Pat, about the moderators? They were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were, they were about their plan, okay. They wheeled out Joe Biden, they let him debate, and what did you say earlier, Pat, about the moderators? They weren't treating him like this. They let Biden go. They let him go and make a fool out of himself because they know he was up late, they pushed the debate early, Biden was out there, he got ruined, okay. Then what do they do? They do the little coup, they get him out, they push Kamala in and now what's what's

Starting point is 02:32:06 he going up against? He's going up against the woman of color. All she's going to do is use race, talk crap, bring up his past. He doesn't really have anything because every everything that he's going up against. He's saying it's you you you it's that wasn't her technically. It's it's Joe Biden. Correct? I think that's what they're going to use. But at the end of the day, after tonight, when's the next polls come Biden, correct? I think that's what they're gonna use. But at the end of the day, after tonight, when's the next polls come out, Tom?

Starting point is 02:32:27 The polls will be dropped, well, that's a complicated answer, but the polls have been taken over the past week. They're not gonna wanna roll those because those are more moderated. It'll probably take a good, you'll get snap polls in four days. You'll get overnight polls that are weak,

Starting point is 02:32:44 that the news media pop up but the real polls will take about eight days and and no more debates PBD that's it is that it's gonna be a third debate I thought I thought she didn't she didn't agree to any debates any more debate I don't know from what you're saying once the polls come out then I would like to see what type of game that they're gonna play because what if we see the polls and she's this debate proves that the American people have, you know, have woken up. The independents are going towards Trump.

Starting point is 02:33:10 The RFK vote, Tommy, is actually pushing them towards Trump. Then what? I, I, I. Then they're not going to drop the polls, Vinny, exactly like we've seen in recent times, we're not going to see the proper number of polls come out because again, it's not going to align with this narrative that they want to push. A quick note on what you guys were mentioning, this whole conversation around temperament and Trump's temperament really frustrates me, you know, that added mean tweets, world peace. I think any of us who are logical and actually look into the policy would be down for that

Starting point is 02:33:42 any day. But it's so frustrating that we need to cater to people in a way, and need to tell Trump to guard his temperament or censor him in a way, just to make him more palatable for something that should be so obvious as soon as somebody does just more than two seconds of research. So what I just really hope comes from this

Starting point is 02:34:00 is that those independent voters, the people who would have gone for RFK or anybody else, I just hope that they look point by point into every single question that was asked, look at the policies. They won't do that. They won't do that. You're living in a logical world. We're not in a... Let me just read you this. Okay, this is from New York Post. Trump surges 14 points with independence. Latinos shift 19 points in Trump's favor. Okay, Rob, if you want to pull this up. Trump's gained momentum among key voters, groups surging 14 points with independence, leading Harris 49 to 46, still close, and 19 points with Latino voters leading now 51

Starting point is 02:34:40 to 47, reversing his prior deficits in the demographics. These gains followed RFK Jr.'s endorsement of Trump and Harris's warning post-nomination boost. The poll shows a close national raise with Harris edging Trump 49 to 48 in a multi-candidate contest. However, Trump leads on key issues like immigration, economy, Middle East. Harris dominates on abortion favored by voters seeking change. Voter perception remained divided, with Harris leading Trump by 15 points among women and Trump ahead 12 points with men. So this is, I don't know, I think, here's what's going to happen. So she leaves. When do you think is the next time she's going

Starting point is 02:35:19 to do a town hall or a debate or podcast? what do you think she's going to do? Like between now and election day, actually, how many interviews, town halls and podcasts you think she's going to do, Tom? Between now and November 5th? I don't think it's zero, but what do you think it is? I think it's zero. I think they're going to keep running her out to these rallies. You think it's going to be to hold a wire on her ears.

Starting point is 02:35:45 I'm so busy, I'm so talking to my investors and I'm talking to all these world leaders around the world. Look, she did okay tonight, as far as they're concerned. They don't wanna screw that up. So why put her in front of the media to get a performance like you've seen in the past? Why put her out till you have a word salad

Starting point is 02:36:01 that she's done in the past or say something dumb? You're gonna run her out at all these rallies and just keep her on the road, doing the rallies like this, avoiding people. She's not gonna sit down for an adversary interview. If she does, it's only because they gain confidence tonight that they could prep her to the point that she can get through it.

Starting point is 02:36:19 But I don't think that's the case. If I was managing her and I'm thinking like them, I would be like, hey, we got through tonight. Don't screw this up. What do you think? I think they're going to take that strategy. I think they are. But here's, if you notice the media, even on the left, lost their cool and their frustration when they're like, she doesn't want to talk to anybody. New York Times is very frustrating. I don't know. I don't know.

Starting point is 02:36:49 Like when she said, she said don't go to his rallies. You think he's going to, she's going to do any rallies between now and the end of the year? You think she's going to do any rallies between November 5th? Is the strategy just going to be after here, go on vacation, relax, don't show your face, do nothing? No, go to the go to the small rallies and read off the teleprompters but don't sit for a

Starting point is 02:37:09 dynamic adversarial interview with the media and change your accent based on the city here's my question the old if I can go to 5th Avenue and shoot someone I won't lose a vote what are the chances that Trump could literally do anything to lose someone who's already gonna vote for him vote? I don't think that there's a very, like how many guys are actually voting for Trump in this room right here? Okay.

Starting point is 02:37:36 All right, and then how many of you are actually gonna raise your hand for Kamala and get beat up here? Who's gonna? Okay, all right, here we go. I don't think Trump's gonna lose any MAGA votes. He has it, it's in the bag. So what's my point? He's got to take a different strategy for the last 60 days

Starting point is 02:37:52 Go only talk to women go to What's the place that does all the the abortion places Go to Planned Parenthood and hug with like do something drastically blue ocean strategy different. You already have MAGA's vote. Why continue to do the exact same rallies to your actual base? You're preaching to the converted. Go find more people to convert to Trump has his base. He's got it. Go find people who are like, I don't know about this guy. Go talk to them. Will he do it? We'll see. Well, what are the chances that Trump's losing

Starting point is 02:38:29 your vote? No, absolutely not. Exactly. So why does he need to still talk to you? I call go talk to someone else. I said this a couple days ago. PBD on the unusual suspects. Ask anybody that was on the cast that's here. About 10 minutes ago, Taylor Swift just endorsed Kamala Harris. That, that right there, that vote, that independent, and it's on her Instagram, I'll just send it to Rob. Taylor Swift said, like many of you, I watched the debate tonight, but I can respond by somebody else. If you haven't already, now is a great time to do your research on the issues at

Starting point is 02:38:59 hand and the stances that these candidates take on the topics that matter to you the most. Okay, as a voter, I make sure to watch read the information that I have and that I read the information that I have and that I read the information that I have and that I read the information that I have and that I read the information that I have and that I read the information that I have and that I read the information that I have and that I

Starting point is 02:39:24 read the information that I have and that I read the information that I have conclusion that I need to be very transparent about my actual plans for this election as a voter. The simplest way to combat misinformation is with the truth. I will be casting my vote for Kamala Harris and Tim Walz in 2024 presidential election. I'm voting for Kamala Harris because she fights for the rights and the causes I believe need a warrior to champion them. Now we're talking about the independent, those people in the middle, how many Swifties follow her? How many? And think about this, finish it. I want to read the whole tweet. I think she is a steady-handed, gifted leader and I believe we can accomplish so much more in the country if we are led by common, not chaos. I was so heartened and impressed by your selection of running mate Tim Walz, who has been standing up for LGBTQIVF and a women's rights to own her own body for decades.

Starting point is 02:40:06 I've now done my research, I've made my choice. Your research is all yours and your choice is your make. I also wanna say, especially to my first time voters, remember that in order to vote, you have to be registered. I also find it's much easier to vote early. I'll link where to register and find early voting dates and info in my story. They timed this perfectly. With love, let's go back. Taylor Swift, childless cat lady.

Starting point is 02:40:32 I told you about the Democrats what a fantastic tactical move we were talking about those middle the people in the middle those girls the Swifties she earlier this year did she say something to go out and register to vote? It was earlier this year. This is a major, buddy, who do you think wrote that? That was planned, it was timed perfect, the moment the debate was finished,

Starting point is 02:40:54 and now this is what I'm talking about, how tactical these people are. What a gangster, gangster move. You wanna talk about swaying a vote? How many followers does she have? How many followers, hold on. 28 wanna talk about swaying a vote? How many followers does she have? How many followers, hold on. 283 million.

Starting point is 02:41:07 283 million. How many do you think are gonna go and register to vote right now because Swifty told them to? Mm-hmm. Well, that's what I'm saying, guys. So they're playing a whole different, they're playing a whole different game, so. Yeah, I mean. That's huge.

Starting point is 02:41:21 I, I mean, listen, honestly, I would have kept this for a week out. I would have kept this week out. Right now it's what, seven weeks out? How many weeks out are we? Seven weeks out, elections, something like that. I would have kept it for a week out, two weeks out. This is pretty big. It doesn't get bigger than like, who's going to come into like, Kardashian?

Starting point is 02:41:43 Who's going to come in and do something? Like, who's going to get that? this is their number one draft for Hollywood. I actually think it was a stupid move to do it on the exact same day that everyone was talking about. Waste of a card. Yeah like you want to do that boom when nobody's talking about anything else everyone's talking about the debate no one's talking about this. It's a PS. It should have been done Friday or Sunday like boom before the weekend after the weekend. Major story actually think was a horrible decision. So but I mean, she's saying look at the bottom vote early, go do it now and register you we can say in a week by the time people register and do all that type of stuff.

Starting point is 02:42:22 I think it's I think it's a perfect time and leave it up to the Democrats to do something like that, which is, listen, they got her. She's in the bag. It's way too early. It is way too early. How many adults what? I mean, by the way, have you seen her concerts? Her concerts are full of dudes. By the way, by the way, by the way, why don't we do this?

Starting point is 02:42:39 Let's play the game. Okay, hang on. Let's play that game and see how many adults. Let's go through it. 283. How many are in America? For followers? Out of the 283 million followers, how many think it's in America?

Starting point is 02:42:49 20%? Fine, let's go 20%. You guys want to do 20%? I would say 40%, 30%. Let's say 30%. Let's say 30%, that's 80 million. Out of the 80 million, how many are under 18 years old? Half?

Starting point is 02:43:02 I don't know, guys. You guys want to say half? Say half. That's 40 million. Of the 40 million above 18 years old, how many were already going to vote for Kamala anyways? The majority of them, yeah. Okay. So of the 40 million that were already going to vote for Kamala, give me a percentage. It's not all of them. What's a percentage?

Starting point is 02:43:21 75%. So there's 10 million left. Of the 10 million that were not going to vote for Kamala, how many are just following them because they're a Trump fan and their kids follow Taylor Swift, so they follow them, they like the music. How many of the 10 million are Trump guys and there's no way they're going to do anything? Half? I think maybe a little bit.

Starting point is 02:43:39 Let's say half. What's left? 5 million. Of the 5 million, how many can be swayed to actually get up and go to work and vote and do their thing? How many of the five million? I think it's so much less, guys. I think it's so much. I think it's like 5%, to be honest with you, 250,000. And Pat, if I can add this, she doesn't need... Really, that's the number. If you really break down the numbers all the way down to seeing that, put a 10%, 500,000. Okay, cool. And the reality is, Pat, she doesn't need a million or a half a million.

Starting point is 02:44:09 She needs 10,000 in Georgia. That's what I'm saying. You know, 5,000 in Nevada. You know, there's the seven states. But by the way, that even makes it worse. That's my point. That even makes it worse and less relevant. So meaning a big name in a battleground state saying something is more valuable than a Taylor Swift

Starting point is 02:44:26 If you know what this would have been most important You know what would have been very strategic if her writer if the writer would have said I'm willing to do you know, whatever specifically if you're in the following states I'm doing a concert and just these six states Just these six states if they really want to get strategic, like look how RFK did it. RFK did what? Kept them on the ballot for 40 states, took them off the ballot for 10 states.

Starting point is 02:44:54 That's super strategic. They wasted this Taylor Swift hit. This was actually very dumb. Very dumb the way they did it. They could have done a better job than this. I'm curious on how much they paid her. That's a lot of, you gotta pay a lot for one, so people have to be-

Starting point is 02:45:07 Well, Kelsey got paid 20 million by Pfizer to endorse the vaccine. Of course. These two are beauties. John Legend's out there. They're both beauties. But I mean, think about, I think Kim Kardashian gets, I wanna say five to 10 million per, what kind of money are you getting to promote Kamala Harris on the night of the debate right when it's over? By the way, Rolling Stone, look at this. Trump melts down, lies about migrants, eating cats after Harris trolls him. This is what they're saying. ABC, Taylor Swift. So they're spinning. The spin job is officially here.

Starting point is 02:45:39 So there's moderate David Mir, there's no Trump coverage. yeah. So anyways, we're gonna see. But I think this is early. I thought this was good for America, for them to see exactly where people are at. Everybody needs to go do their own due diligence. Amy, you are right. People should go do their own research and kind of see what's going on. Unfortunately, they're not gonna be doing that. The closest thing they're gonna be doing is Instagram stories to see exactly what's going

Starting point is 02:46:02 on rather than going down through the policy. But at the end of the day, Trump's going to get up and work and do his part between now and then. The other side is going to try to play the games. We're going to see who's going to come up winning on November 5th. I will tell you guys one thing. In about a week and a half, I may make an announcement that we may have one of the biggest election night parties in the world. And I'm just telling you, and I'm talking outside of two parties that people will be hosting,

Starting point is 02:46:31 I think we will be hosting the biggest election night with thousands of people being with us. It's contingent one thing being done that won the biggest. Something crazy happened today. I don't want to say anything. We have to wait about seven days to find that I will tell you once it's finalized because that thing needs to be there's this thing called the John Hancock once that thing is finalized and I make the announcement everyone's gonna lose their shit when I tell you what we're doing November 5th but stay tuned we're gonna have a lot of fun it's gonna be it's gonna be a lot of fun for us to everybody that joined us to the millions of people that joined us on the live tonight, you're amazing.

Starting point is 02:47:06 Again, Saturday, Fort Lauderdale, book signing, come on down, the Academy Book, first fiction book I've ever written in my life, just officially being shipped out today. Rob, if you can put the link, if you support our podcast, go place the order, read the book. It is the one. I've written this book 13 and a half years. It's officially out today's the date. Go support us.

Starting point is 02:47:29 Go to Amazon. Order the book. And I'll be signing books on Saturday, 12 o'clock at Barnes & Noble. God bless everybody. Take care everyone. Bye bye, bye bye.

PBD Podcast - Trump vs Harris Debate Watch Party | PBD Podcast | Ep. 468

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