Pints With Aquinas - 160: Bible study with Thomas Aquinas

Episode Date: May 28, 2019

Thanks for listening! Today we'll take a look at that bit at the end of John's gospel where our Lord asks Peter, "Do you love me more than these?" Enjoy! SPONSORS EL Investments: https://www.elinvestments.net/pints Exodus 90: https://exodus90.com/mattfradd/  Hallow: http://hallow.app/mattfradd  STRIVE: https://www.strive21.com/  GIVING Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/mattfradd This show (and all the plans we have in store) wouldn't be possible without you. I can't thank those of you who support me enough. Seriously! Thanks for essentially being a co-producer coproducer of the show. LINKS Website: https://pintswithaquinas.com/ Merch: https://teespring.com/stores/matt-fradd FREE 21 Day Detox From Porn Course: https://www.strive21.com/ SOCIAL Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/mattfradd Twitter: https://twitter.com/mattfradd Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/mattfradd MY BOOKS  Does God Exist: https://www.amazon.com/Does-God-Exist-Socratic-Dialogue-ebook/dp/B081ZGYJW3/ref=sr_1_9?dchild=1&keywords=fradd&qid=1586377974&sr=8-9 Marian Consecration With Aquinas: https://www.amazon.com/Marian-Consecration-Aquinas-Growing-Closer-ebook/dp/B083XRQMTF/ref=sr_1_4?dchild=1&keywords=fradd&qid=1586379026&sr=8-4 The Porn Myth: https://www.ignatius.com/The-Porn-Myth-P1985.aspx CONTACT Book me to speak: https://www.mattfradd.com/speakerrequestform

G'day and welcome to Pints with Aquinas. My name is Matt Fradd. If you could sit down with Thomas Aquinas over a pint of beer and ask him any one question, what would it be? In today's episode, we're going to be doing something of a Bible study with Thomas Aquinas. We're going to get his take on John chapter 21, the bit where Jesus asks Peter three times, do you love me? All right, welcome back to Pints with Aquinas, the show where you and I pull up a barstool next to the angelic doctor to discuss theology and philosophy. Big thank you to all of you who have reviewed Pints with Aquinas on iTunes. Also, a huge thanks to all of you who have begun subscribing to The Matt Fradd Show.

We just had our episode with Eni Hickman come out. Definitely created a lot of controversy or controversy uh we got into some some things yes things that the internet loves to talk about right like black lives matter and the legalization of marijuana and um racism stuff like that um i think it's probably fair to say that any bends more towards the left side, whereas I tend to bend more towards the right. But anyway, even though we got a lot of people really angry with us, I don't care about them. I care about any and I love him and we're good mates and we can ask each other questions and we can disagree about things while still being friends.

So it would be cool if people learned that lesson. I think that'd be cool. Don't you think? I just think that would be cool. Anyway, so that was really fun. So thank you for all of you who've done that on YouTube. And yeah. You know, a while back, I bought some commentaries from Thomas Aquinas.

They've always been available online in one form or another, even if difficult to find, but I thought I'd finally kind of go out and buy them. So this is, let's see here, the Aquinas Institute for the Study of Sacred Doctrine in Wyoming. I guess that's the publisher. And I bought Aquinas' commentaries on John and Matthew, and they come in some beautiful hardcover, dark blue binding, and yeah, I've really enjoyed them. Thomas, for those of you who don't know, and I guess it's pretty obvious by now, wrote commentaries on Matthew and John, as well as other books in the Bible. And they're pretty profound, you know. Sometimes they're a little in the weeds. That's Aquinas for you though. You know, like sometimes we have a view of biblical commentary or an experience of it, and then we go to Aquinas and it's quite different. But today I wanted to read one of my favorite passages in the Gospel of John, and that comes from John 21,

starts with 15. So, here's what I'm going to do. I'm going to read what it says. It's not very long. And then I want to go through Aquinas' reflection on it and just pause as we go through it, just going to draw out some things that are striking me. And then towards the end of the episode, we're going to take some questions from our patrons. And so no doubt we have some pretty provocative and interesting questions there. So please be sure to stick around for that as well. So let's just jump into this. This is John's gospel. As I say, 2115, this is from the Douay-Rheims version. When therefore they had dined, Jesus said to Simon Peter,

Simon, son of John, do you love me more than these? He said to them, Yes, Lord, you know that I love you. He said to him, Feed my lambs. He, oh, you know what? I don't think this is from the Dewey Ramps. Anyway, let's continue. He said to him again, Simon, son of John, do you love me? He said to him, Yes, Lord, you know that I love you.

He said to him, feed my lambs. He said to him the third time, Simon, son of John, do you love me? Peter was grieved because he had said to him the third time, do you love me? And he said to him, Lord, you know all things, you know that I love you. He said to him, feed my sheep. So that's what we want to break down. So here's what Aquinas says. John, the evangelist, just showed what the Lord did for the disciples in general. Here, he shows him dealing with his two especially loved disciples. First, what he did for Peter. Second, how he dealt with John. And he's referencing there John 21 20, where John writes, Peter turning around saw the disciple whom Jesus loved. Aquinas continues.

He does two things with the first, namely Peter. First, he lays on Peter the pastoral office. Second, he predicts that he will be martyred. Amen, amen, I say to you, when you were younger. So here, Aquinas says, he, that is Christ, imposes the pastoral office on Peter only after an examination. Thus, those who are to be raised to this office are first examined. In 1 Timothy 5.22, we read, So that part, you know, in John 21, 18, where he says, when you were younger, you would go where you wanted to go. But I tell you later on, someone will tie a belt around you and lead you where you would rather not go. Aquinas says here that this is a prophecy of Peter's eventual

martyrdom. And so it is. But I see another insight here that I found interesting. You know, growing up is difficult. And when we're kids, we kind of get to do whatever we want. When we're teenagers, perhaps more so. And sometimes that can carry over into our early 20s, where we're essentially doing whatever we want to do and going wherever we want to go. But of course, if we follow the Lord to our vocation, be it priesthood or marriage, there is a sense in which that ends. And so, whereas he's talking about specifically perhaps his eventual martyrdom, there is a sense in which we have to sacrifice for the vocation the Lord is calling us to. And I think sometimes people get into marriage or maybe even into religious life,

I couldn't speak to that specifically, thinking that they will finally be fulfilled and be able to do all that they've wanted to do. And you see this kind of like on movies, right? Where marriage is romanticized. But the truth is when you get older and you get married, sometimes it feels like someone has put a belt around you and now you're doing what you would rather not do and going where you would rather not go. Case in point, I had to wake up six o'clock this morning because I had to get my kids off somewhere. And it was messy and the kids were exhausted and I didn't want to do it. I would much rather sleep.

And we found out that the dog kind of crapped everywhere. That's what I woke up to. That was fun. And it crapped on my daughter's clothes that she had laid out the night before. Now, you have to understand, I don't just have a dog. I have a bear that looks like a dog. So its poop is the size of a small kitten. It's not fun. So that's what I woke up to. Everyone exhausted, no one wanted to get up. I didn't want to be up. Dog had pooped on the clothes. Now I'm vacuuming the carpet while I'm getting the kids up while

we're making breakfast. It wasn wasn't fun, you know? Now, thankfully it's not always that crazy, but a lot of the time it is. And I think sometimes we kind of wake up and we're like, I don't want to be here. Like, this isn't what I want to do. I want to be like on a beach in Hawaii drinking margaritas or something like that. But the vocation our Lord is calling us to sometimes does feel like it's restrictive, like he's calling us to suffer for him and for the good of others. So, but the point here that Aquinas is making is that, you know, before Peter is commissioned, you know, to sort of be the head of the apostles here, he's being questioned, he's being interrogated, right? He's being examined and Aquinas points out that that's what ought to happen to those who are going to become priests. Aquinas continues that these three parts are obvious. In the first

part, we first see our Lord's question. Second, we see Peter's answer. Yes, Lord, you know that I love you. And third, we see the imposition of the office. He said to him, feed my lambs. Looking at the first, we can consider three things, the time of the examination, the tenor of the conversation, and on what Peter was examined. The order of this event is given as when therefore they had dined. This signifies, says Aquinas, the spiritual meal by which the soul is refreshed with spiritual gifts, even when it is united to the body. And then we have here Aquinas quoting Revelation 3.20. I will come into him and eat with him. Therefore, it is appropriate that

one who is raised to this office be already refreshed with the joyous meal. Otherwise, how could he refresh the hungry ones that come to him? And from Jeremiah, I will feast the soul of the priests with abundance. Jeremiah 31.14, with the abundance important to point out, right, that Aquinas is drawing here a spiritual interpretation of the text. You know, another, I think, just as legitimate and more prima facie interpretation is just that they sat down and had a meal and they were hungry. And that's a really cool thing. Like we pointed this out last week in my chat with Father Ryan Mann, right? That what is received is received according to the mode of the receiver. And so sometimes when we read these texts, we can be tempted to think that they're rather simple. But the fact is they're only being related to us in this way

because we are simpletons. And the depths of scripture are, in a sense, unfathomable. They keep going. So they can be understood, but kind of infinitely understood. It's like you'll never get to the bottom of them. And so that's why we see here Aquinas drawing out a spiritual interpretation. Now, regarding the tenor of the conversation that's seen between Jesus and Peter, Aquinas says three things are given here, which are necessary for a prelate, that is a priest. First, obedience. When he says Simon, which means obedient, I didn't know that. I knew Peter meant rock. I didn't know Simon meant obedient. There you are.

A prelate needs to be obedient because one who does not know how to obey superiors does not know how to govern inferiors. An obedient man will speak of victory. Proverbs 21, 28. I used to work in net ministries, and we would always have a batch of young men and young women who were bright-eyed and bushy-tailed and excited to mission for a year throughout Canada. That's where I used to work. Net Ministries, I've talked about this recently, national evangelization team. And it's very easy to nod sagely when you read stuff like this from

Aquinas, like you have to be obedient. And we all kind of say, yeah, I have to die to self. But it's amazing how many people, unfortunately, throw in the towel and just say, I'm done, you know, not just on net, but in all sorts of ministries, like they've committed to a year or two years or something like that. And even in marriage, you might see this as well. But then when the rubber hits the road, rather than seeing their own impotence and repenting of it and choosing to obedient, sometimes people just give up. Like they flat out give up. And whenever we give up, it's always easier to blame something else than us, isn't it? You know, like, yeah, I know there's a bunch of people who are doing Exodus 90 right now,

which is amazing. And if you give up, why don't you just say, I give up because I'm weak and I don't want to do this anymore because it's too tough. That's a better thing to do than to start griping and moaning about how unrealistic Exodus 90 is. I mean, you knew what it was getting into it. So what's the problem? It's not like they surprised you with all the things you would have to give up. like they surprised you with all the things you would have to give up. And the same thing is true with net ministries or with any kind of vocation, that we are being called to a certain obedience and humility.

And this is what Aquinas is saying is necessary for prelates, but of course, not just prelates, but you and me as well. Second, Aquinas says, son of John. Prelates need grace because if they do not have grace, they do not have anything. And we read in 1 Corinthians, by the grace of God, I am what I am. And when they perceived the grace that was given to me, James and Cephas and John, or Cephas, however you pronounce it, who were reputed to be pillars, gave to me and Barnabas the right hand of fellowship, Galatians 2.9. The questions are about love, and Jesus asks, do you love me more than these? This was a suitable question for Peter had previously fallen, and we saw as we saw before,

and it was not appropriate that he be preferred to the others until his sin was forgiven, What's cool is Aquinas actually quotes Peter from 1 Peter 4.8. Love covers a multitude of sins. Love covers all offenses, Proverbs 10.12. I love both of those lines and they really stick out to me as a parent. I'm always aware of how I fail at my kids, whether I'm nagging at them, whether I yell at them, I lose my patience with them, whether they're trying to show me something cool that they've done, and I'm too kind of engrossed in something to really care about it. I'm very aware of those things, and maybe you are too, and I think sometimes that can feel rather

crushing, but it's nice to know that love covers a multitude of those things, and maybe you are too, and I think sometimes that can feel rather crushing. But it's nice to know that love covers a multitude of sins. So even if you haven't been a great parent today or this past week or this past year, just a love on our kids and to show them that we think it's really good that they exist is a good idea. So Aquinas continues, it was fitting that Peter's charity be made known by this questioning, not indeed to him who looks into the depths of our hearts, but to others. So, Christ said, but not as one who did not already know. Do you love me more than these? Now, says Aquinas, we read that perfect love casts out fear in 1 John 4, 18. Thus it was that when our Lord was about to die, Peter was afraid and denied him,

but the risen Lord restored love and banished his fear. So Peter, who before had denied Christ because he was afraid to die, now after our Lord has risen, feared nothing. Why should he be afraid since he now realized that death had died? Isn't that beautiful? I love that in the Byzantine liturgy that we had back in Easter. Christ has risen from the dead. By death, he trampled death. And to those in the tombs, he granted life.

So I love that. Peter was afraid of death, so he denied Christ, but now why should he be afraid since he realized that death had died? Man, that's powerful stuff. This questioning, says Aquinas, was also appropriate for the office since many who assume a pastoral office use it as self-lovers. And we read in 1 Timothy, In the last days there will come times of stress, for men will be lovers of self. One who does not love the Lord is not a fit prelate. Again, by prelate, he's talking about priest. We can extend this to all of our vocations.

One who does not love is not a fit father. One who does not love is not a fit wife and not a fit mother and so forth. A fit prelate is one who does not seek his own advantage, but that of Christ. And he does this through love. The love of Christ impels us. 2 Corinthians 5.14. Love also becomes this office because it benefits others, for it is due to the abundance of love that those who love Jesus will at times give up the quiet of their own contemplation to help their neighbor. Although the apostle said in Romans, I am sure that neither death nor life will be able to separate us from the love of God. He added, for I could wish that I myself were accursed and cut off from Christ for the sake of my brethren. Thus a prelate should be questioned about his love.

So this is important for all of us and this should cause us to pause here. I love that man. Give up the quiet of their own contemplation to help their neighbor. I am an introvert. That might surprise you, but I am definitely an introvert. My wife is an extrovert. So the way we kind of define that is, you know, the reason we came to that conclusion is we think of extrovert and introvert as where one gets their energy from, hey? My wife, big, big, loud extrovert. She thrives on people. I joke, but it's kind of true. If we go to a party,

I feel like Cameron's afraid to leave early because she's not sure how everyone else will have fun without her. And that's like a legit concern of hers. Whereas I like going into the bathroom and locking the door and being alone. And I'm like that at home. I joke with Peter Kreeft on our recent podcast. I guess it's not that recent, but I love just like reading in the bathroom or like locking the door and laying on my bed and reading. I just want to be alone. But love requires us, as Aquinas says, to get up, oh, excuse me, get up and help our neighbor. And as parents, our neighbors might be our actual neighbors, but also like Annie Hickman and me just spoke about on the Matt

Fred show, but also our kids are our neighbors. And so we should be questioned about our love. And for those priests listening, this is all the more poignant since he's speaking about prelates in particular, that, yeah, I mean, if I were a priest, I think I would want to, a lot of the times, go back to my rectory. And in a way, I have it easier because, you know, if I imagine if like my wife and kids lived in a house up the road, there would be so much more temptation for selfishness because I couldn't hide what I'm doing for my kids and my wife. I just be like, oh, I gotta go and hang out. Gotta go do some work at my house. I'll come back at six tonight, you know, something like that. Or I'll see you on the weekend or something. But when they're all around me all the time, it's like this constant,

there's these constant invitations to serve. And I just wonder if I were a priest, being alone in my rectory would be a real temptation for me, just like not to go out and mingle with my spiritual children, you know. Now, why does he say more than these? All right. So, you know, do you love me? He says, but then he adds more than these. Why that? Well, here's what Aquinas says. adds more than these. Why that? Well, here's what Aquinas says. For even as the philosopher says in his politics, it is the natural order of things that the one who cares for and governs others should be better. Thus, he says that just as the soul is to the body that it rules and reason is to our lower powers. So man is related to the irrational animals. And it ought to be a similar relation between prelates and their subjects. Thus, according to Gregory, the life of a pastor should be such that he is related to his subjects as a shepherd to his

sheep. So Christ says more than these, because the more Peter loves, the better he is. Do you see him whom the Lord has chosen? There is none like him among all the peoples. 1 Samuel 10, 24. This is a really good point. I like that point from Aristotle. It's the natural order of things that the one who cares for and governs others should be better. And I think that this is why we just expect that our politicians should be morally virtuous. Like that should be a thing. And maybe our choices are between two rather unvirtuous people, and maybe we have to settle for the lesser of two evils. And maybe we even need to vote for the lesser of two evils if one is drastically evil. But there's a sense, isn't it? Like, I mean, there's a kind of outrage that people shouldn't be immoral, especially when they are governing the rest of us. And Aquinas is

saying here, like, yeah, that should be the case. And I think some people have kind of looked at Hillary Clinton and went, oh my gosh, she's so ghastly. It's no wonder Trump won. And so I think the temptation can be to kind of idolize our politicians and to never criticize them. them, right? Our spiritual, no, sorry, our political leaders, right? They ought to be better. You know, they ought to set an example. So for those who say, whatever, Trump just says it like it is, and it doesn't matter. And it's like, no, like it does matter. And you should definitely criticize him when he says things that are inappropriate, when he does things that are immoral. You should criticize him. Like, I think that's what will enable people on the other side to hear you. It's kind of like the same thing in the church. And gee, why am I talking about politics when it's so prevalent in the church? I was working out the other day and a guy came up to me and he said, hey, I heard about what's going on in the Catholic church. And I was more outraged than him. And I think that's

appropriate. Like we should expect our priests and our bishops to be in a sense better than us. We should expect that. And when they're not, that's not okay. And so I kind of feel like sometimes Catholics fall into this trap of quickly defending the church when it might actually be more helpful to be more upset like dude believe me it's despicable and we need to get to the bottom of this justice needs to be served you know like that because that way like my evangelical friend who i was working out with he's like okay cool But imagine if he had been disappointed in the Catholic church, come to me, brought this up. And I was like, well, you know,

like most priests are good people. And like, when you think about it, like there's people in the public schools who are also abusing people and all of that's true, right? Most priests I know are very good people and are trying to be holy. There is a lot of sexual abuse that takes place in public schools and so forth. But I kind of feel like we rush to that too quickly when what we should be doing is pointing out, yeah, the immorality that is in some of our leadership. We should call that out. And I think in doing that, we kind of gain the respect of those who are on the other side, if you want. Anyway, so this is kind of why Aquinas says that Christ said to Peter do you love me more than these like there's a sense in which you should be better now Aquinas continues but in selecting

someone is it always necessary to choose the one who is unconditionally better even if the laws say that it is enough to choose one who is merely good? To answer this, two distinctions must be made. Some things are sufficient according to human judgment, which are still not sufficient according to the divine judgment. According to human judgment, if a person cannot be reproached for something, this is sufficient for his election to stand. For it is obvious that it would be difficult to have elections if they could be nullified because someone was found who was better than the one actually chosen. So, according to our human judgment, it is sufficient if an election is honest and a suitable person is chosen.

But so far as concerns the divine judgment and our own conscience, it is necessary to choose what is better. It's necessary to choose at least what's better, he says. Now, a person can be better simply, and this is the way a holier person is said to be better. For holiness makes one good. This is why my wife is better than me, like legitimately better than me, at least in the realm of holiness. I'm better looking. I know that, but she's better than me in holiness. She's still married up. Anyway, yet such a person might not be better for the church. For this purpose, that person would be better who is better educated, more competent, more discerning, and chosen more unanimously. But if other things

are equal, such as the benefit and welfare of the church, one would sin if he were to choose a person who was less unconditionally good than another. The reason for this is either the honor of God and the benefit of the church or some private motive. If the motive is the honor of God and the benefit to the church, these goods will be regarded as linked to the one chosen and will make him the better person in these respects. If there is some private motive for the choice, such as carnal love, the expectation of ecclesiastical advancement or temporal advantage, the expectation of ecclesiastical advancement or temporal advantage, the election is a fraud and there has been partiality. It's nice to know, isn't it, that this hobnobbing for ecclesiastical advancement wasn't something unheard of in the days of Aquinas, nor in any part of church history.

Sometimes we can fall into the trap of thinking that the scandals that rack our church are new, and they're new in a sense. There are many heresies, it looks as if, that are believed by priests and even bishops, whereas maybe that wasn't always the case. So I know that there's a different element, but it's not like the church has ever been in an idyllic situation. And yet Christ works through her nonetheless. Now we see Peter answer, right? So Peter, I mean, Christ says, do you love me more than these? And Peter says, yes, Lord, you know that I love you. Aquinas says this is a clear sign that he had retracted his previous denial. And it shows

that if the predestined fall, they are always better after they are corrected. Before his denial, Peter thought that he was better than the other apostles, saying, though they all fall away because of you, I will never fall away. And when Jesus said to him, you will deny me three times, Peter went against this and even boasted that even if he must die, even if I must die with you, I will not deny you. How humbling was that for Peter, eh? Aquinas continues, but now Peter, having been conquered by his own weakness, does not presume to state his love unless it is attested to and confirmed by the Lord. Wow. I'd never thought of that before. By the way, some of you asked me how much prep I do for my shows. I have not read this commentary. I have not read this section. I'm literally reading it with you right now. Sometimes I put a lot of effort into my preparation today, not so much. But yeah,

that's super powerful. So there was a point where Peter's pride led him to say of his fellow disciples and in front of them, no less, if they all fall away, I won't. I'll even die for you. I mean, whoa, Peter, like settle down, Semmer. So, you know, that's pretty cool because there we see in Matthew's gospel in 26, he's offering to Jesus, I love you more than the rest, essentially, right? I will die for you. And now we see this humility on the part of Peter in which Christ is essentially giving him the opportunity to say, do you love me more than the rest? Because you just said you did. So I'm asking you again, but last time he said it without being invited to say it. Now he's being invited to say it and he's too humble, thank God now,

to say, yeah, I do love you more than the rest. That's pretty crazy, you know? So yeah, wow, I've never thought of that before. That just blew me away. Peter, having been conquered by his own weakness, does not presume to state his love unless it is attested to and confirmed by the Lord. He humbles himself before Christ saying, you know that I love you. I love that. Jesus says, do you love me more than the rest? And he says, you know that I love you. Here's what I know. In Job, we read, my witness is in heaven and he that vouches for me is on high.

Aquinas says, Peter also humbles himself in respect to the apostles, for he does not say that he loves Jesus more than they do, but simply, I love you. This teaches us not to rank ourselves before others, but others before ourselves. And that's why we read in Philippians, in humility, count others better than yourself. How hard is that to do? Can we just admit that? How hard is it to count others better than ourselves? It is so easy to look at people around us and think, just to be critical of them and judgmental of them. And not even in serious spiritual matters, but like show of hands, I know I can't actually see your hands, but I'm going to say anyway, show of hands how many of you are critical of the smallest things in people.

Like I was at a meal recently and this guy who I was talking to drank his water and then he had the nerve to drink his ice cubes and crunch them, chew on them in front of me. And I wanted to punch him in the face because nobody should be allowed to chew on ice cubes and live. I mean, it's just, stop doing it. If you do it, like, it's okay if you like want to go into your room that's at least soundproofed, lock the door, then you can chew on ice cubes. Don't be chewing on ice cubes in front of people. That's gross. No one wants to hear that. Do you have any idea how disgusting that is? Anyway, so I was thinking all of this and it occurred to me, I'm like, how many things do I do that just annoy everybody around

me? My wife could write a list as long as her arm, no doubt. My children are like, dad's too much like this. But I fail to see that. I fail to see how I'm annoying. I get why everybody else is annoying, but I'm essentially like Jim from The Office. I'm the normal one. Everybody else in my life is weird. And that's how you think about yourself as well. But you're totally wrong. You're super annoying. You annoy people all the time and you don't even know how you annoy them. And yet you criticize other people for being annoying. You internally judge them, you know? Oh my gosh. But anyway, man, we do this. I do this and it's not super cool. It's best to kind of judge other people in humility. Yeah. As it says in Philippians, better than ourselves. Because you know you, like you're a disgrace. So stop, you know,

I need to do that too. I'm talking to me, not just you. I'm not judging you. I'm saying I suck. Okay. Continuing. Aquinas says, we can also notice as Augustine points out that when our Lord asks, do you love me? Peter does not answer with the same word, but says, I love you. Okay. That's interesting. So the wording in, what is this? Latin is different. Diligis, amo. So no doubt. I mean, I'm not a scripture scholar. I don't know. I've heard that the Greek differs here too. So when the Lord says, do you diligence me? Peter responds, I ammo you. So that's a different word there, although both mean love, but in different senses. So Aquinas says, as if they were the same, right? And they are the same in reality, but there is some difference in meaning. Love, amor, is a movement of our appetitive power. And if this is regulated by our reason,

it is the will's act of love, which is called direction, dilexio, because it presupposes an act of election or choice, elixio. This is why the brute animals are not said to love, diligere, for if the appetitive movement is not regulated by reason, it is called amor. Interesting. All right, so the take here that Aquinas is reading from Augustine is essentially like, is that Jesus is saying, do you love me? And by love, he is meaning a love directed by reason, you know, like a higher type of love. And that Peter responds with a lower kind of love. Ooh, that's powerful. Yeah. Wow. Isn't that amazing? After this examination, Christ assigns Peter his office saying, feed my lambs, that is my faithful, which I, the lamb, call lambs. We read in John 1 29, behold the lamb of God, behold him who takes away the sins of the world. Thus, one should not be called a Christian who says he is not under the care of that shepherd, that is Peter.

They will all have one shepherd, we read in Ezekiel 37, 24. They will appoint for themselves one head. It was appropriate that the office be assigned to Peter, the others being passed over. Because according to Chrysostom, he was the extraordinary apostle, the voice of the disciples and the head of the group. Now is the second examination. In order to avoid repetition, note that Christ says three times, feed my lambs. Because Peter ought to feed them three ways. to feed them three ways. First, they are to be fed by being taught, and I will give you shepherds after my own heart who will feed you with knowledge and understanding, Jeremiah 3.15.

Second, they are to be fed by example. Set the believers an example in speech and conduct, in love, in faith, in purity, 1 Timothy 4.12. Upon the mountain heights of Israel, that is, in the excellence of great men will be their pasture. Ezekiel 34, 14. Third, they are to be fed by being offered temporal help. Woe shepherds of Israel who have been feeding yourselves should not shepherds feed the sheep. Ezekiel 34, 2. All right. So that's cool. So Aquinas is saying that Peter and priests in general, but I suppose bishops especially, ought to feed the faithful in three ways, by teaching them, by leading them by example, and by offering help with temporary needs. The third time Christ says to him, feed my sheep. This is because there are three types

of people in the church. Oh, I always love when Aquinas does this. Three things. Number one, beginners, those who have made some progress, and the perfect. I thought you just said there were three types of people. There are three types of people in the church. Oh, there are. Okay. So there are beginners, then there are those who have made some progress,

and then there are the perfect. The first two types are the lambs, since they are still imperfect. The others, since they are perfect, are called sheep. The mountains, that is the perfect, skipped like rams and the hills, the others like lambs, Psalm 114. And so all prelates ought to guard their charge as Christ's sheep and not their own. But alas, as Augustine says in his Easter sermon, we witness the appearance of certain unfaithful servants who have abandoned Christ's flock and by their thefts have made gold their flock. You hear them say, these are my sheep. What do you want with my sheep? I will not let you come to my sheep. But if we say my sheep and others talk about their sheep, then Christ has lost his own sheep. Yes, that's interesting. I mean, this kind of goes back

to what we were saying a moment ago, you know, like there's nothing new under the sun and this is Augustine writing in what the fourth and fifth centuries of the church where there were like prelates who didn't love the sheep and didn't love the shepherd, but love their own gain. And yet Christ works through his church. Finally, and this is how Aquinas wraps up this commentary on John 15 through 17. So you've done very well to stick with me this far. I'm finding this massively interesting. I don't know about you. But Aquinas says, note also that just as Peter was assigned his office three times, so he was examined three times, this was because he had denied Christ three times. As Augustine says, a threefold profession was required so that Peter's tongue might show as much love as it had shown of fear and that life gained would rest more words than the threat of death.

Life gained would rest more words than the threat of death. Life gained would rest more words than the threat of death. Another reason for this was because Peter was obligated to love Christ for three things. Here we go again. I love the dot points. First, because his sin was forgiven. Many sins are forgiven her because she was loved much. Second, because he was promised a great honor on this rock, I'll build my church. Matthew 16, 18. Third, because of the office entrusted to him. As here, when Christ says, feed and entrust the care of the church to him, you shall love the Lord your God with all your heart,

so that you will direct your entire intention to God and with all your soul, so that your entire will might rest in God through God and with all your soul so that your entire will might rest in God through love and with all your might, Deuteronomy 6, 5, so that the performance of all your actions will serve God. Peter, because asked three times, became sad. As was seen, he was rebuked by our Lord before the passion when he so quickly asserted that he loved him. Now, seeing that he has questioned so many times about his love, he is afraid he will be rebuked again and become sad. Thus he says, Lord, you know all things. You know that I love you.

He is saying, in effect, I do love you. At least I think I do. But you know all things and perhaps you know of something love you. He is saying in effect, I do love you. At least I think I do, but you know all things and perhaps you know of something else that will happen. And so the final commitment of the church is given to the humbled Peter. According to one of the Greek doctors, this is also the reason why catechumens are questioned three times during their baptism. And that concludes the commentary on that part of John's gospel. That is so beautiful. Oh man, Peter is humbled, hey, and he's sad. And I just love the humility that Peter said. This reminds me of that other

line in the gospel, the one who said to our Lord who wanted to be healed, Lord, I believe, help my unbelief. That's such a great prayer. Lord, I believe, I know I do, but help my unbelief. And that sort of same humility is being shown here in Peter. I want to read just that last two lines again, because I feel like we can say this to our Lord. Like we could use that as a prayer. I do love you, Jesus. At least I think I do. But you know all things, and perhaps you know of something else that will happen. We could say that. That's like a prayer from Aquinas. Isn't that beautiful? In your prayer time, imagine saying, Jesus, I love you, at least I think I do, but you know all things.

That's lovely. If I don't love you as I ought to love you, make me love you as I ought to love you. That's lovely. I hope you learnt a little bit more about the threefold questions that Christ gave to Simon Peter there in John 21, 15 through 17. All right, let's take some of your questions. All right, time to take some questions from our patrons. If you believe in the work that I'm doing and would like to support me, I would like you very much to start doing that. Go to patreon.com slash mattfradd. Give me five bucks a month, 10 bucks a month. You get access to an exclusive community forum. I'll send you a signed copy of my book. You can get this amazing beer stein that's literally handmade and hand-painted and looks amazing. Yeah. All sorts of other free

things that you get. I do these weekly videos for my patrons where I basically sit on the porch and just chat with you. It's fun, man. And I just can't thank you enough. Obviously, I get more than you get, but then I'm able to give more. I can do Pints with Aquinas. I can do the Matt Fradd show. Yeah. And it just means a ton. I don't have a boss. I don't have like a big donor funding all these projects. They're coming from the amazing folks who listen to the show, who believe in what I'm doing and want to see it spread. So go to pintswithaquinas.com slash donate. If you want to give to me directly, that is if you don't like Patreon and just want to, you're not that interested in the stuff Patreon gives. I mean, you'll still get the

beer stein and stuff, but you know what I mean? You might not like Patreon. If you like Patreon, I think it's a great platform until they start kicking me off. We'll see what happens. Go to patreon.com slash Matt Fradd and you can support me there. That'd be great. All right, but let's take some of the questions that we've got. Wow. A lot of questions have come in and all of these questions are super cool. So let's have a look here. Um, does Aquinas say anything about faithful Christians and faithful people of other religions and what happens to them after death? Yeah, he does. Uh, definitely. Um, but I don't know if I want to dive into that too much because I'm not sure

what Aquinas says versus like what the church knows, you know? And of course, at the end of the Summa Theologiae, Aquinas basically said, I'm a servant of the church. And if I've said anything, you know, that's out of touch or out of step with what the church teaches, then I'm wrong. So he definitely got the Immaculate Con conception wrong, as well as some other things. But the church teaches that people who are not baptized can still have the possibility of salvation if they're ignorance of Christ and the truths of the church, if they're invincibly ignorant to those truths. That is to say, not just ignorant, but not responsible for their ignorance. You can be ignorant and responsible for that ignorance. You can also be ignorant and not responsible for that ignorance. And so,

there is the possibility that they will be saved. Not the guarantee, but the possibility. Gregory Warner says, a few months back, you mentioned you were investing your time in a few specific friends. How did you pick those people to invest in? Any tips for someone trying to find friendships of virtue? That's a great question, Gregory. Yeah, so I got a couple of mates. Shout out to John Henry Spann and Andrew Putish. I love these guys, and there's nothing they can do about it. We like to get together, go watch a movie, go have a drink, go have a cigar. It's difficult because we all have families and we're all busy, but we're constantly kind of texting each other

and trying to meet up to have a drink and things like that. And I just love it. How did I choose them? It's like, I mean, how do you choose your best friend, your best mates? You can't really say that. I don't think it just sort of happens. But you know, I mean, how do you choose your best friend, your best mates? You can't really say that, I don't think. It just sort of happens. But I think in the beginning too, we can have this list of virtues or attributes that we want our friends to have, but it's just kind of like choosing a spouse. If you were to be like, okay, she needs to be like this and this and this, she's not going to have all those things, just like you won't have those things that your spouse is looking for necessarily. But you get to know people and even their quote-unquote vices, so not in the sense that they're being vicious, but the things that annoy

you, you just learn to live with. So I would say whoever you kind of feel sort of close to right now, you kind of enjoy being around them, just pursue them. Even if it's one dude, you know, just try and get together for a beer and don't force it, man. Just hang out, you know, just hang out. And I did. So I got to say, um, let's see. Okay. Shiloh says, I was listening to your podcast on Marian dogmas. I am fairly new convert to Catholicism. Technically, how is Mary sinless? Is it through works of her own or God's anointing? Thanks, Shiloh, and welcome to the Catholic faith. Everything is on fire here. It's good to have you. We need you. Yeah. So, the reason Mary is sinless is because the grace

won for the entire human race by Christ through his death and resurrection was applied in a singular and unique way to Mary at the moment of her conception, which prevented her from kind of, if you want to say, contracting original sin, for lack of a better word, perhaps. And then she did not sin her entire life because of the grace of God. And so, you know, it's important to point out like that being fully human doesn't mean sinning. So sometimes people say, well, that's not normal. It's not natural. And in a sense, it's actually really natural because, you know, Adam and Eve didn't sin until they did, but they were in a state of original innocence. In heaven, people are fully alive, though they do not sin. And so Mary was sinless because she

was preserved from sin and sustained in grace and virtue by the Holy Spirit, by God's grace. Kathleen Miraz says, have you ever considered trying out CrossFit? And do you think that pushing yourself through something difficult and sometimes excruciating for the sake of strengthening and fortifying your body, the one and only one God has given you, has its moral benefits? Well, not only have I considered it, but I know you can't tell from my incredibly chiseled physique, Kathleen, but I actually do attend CrossFit. I have been sick and in bed because of surgery over the last couple of months. I'm just kind of getting back into it, but I love going to CrossFit. I think it's super fun and it really

works for me. I love the community aspect of CrossFit, kind of meeting people every morning and looking at the board and seeing what you got to do that day and all enduring it together. I love doing that. And to me, it's a lot better than going to the gym on my own. If I go to the gym on my own, you know, I might work out really well or I might not. It really helps having people look at me and kind of encourage me. And so that's why I do it. Certainly it has benefits. The scripture talks about this somewhere. Here it is. eight. For physical training is of some value, but godliness has value for all things, holding promise for both present life and life to come. I think sometimes we read this and we say, look, the Bible is disparaging

physical training. What it's saying is the most important thing is the spiritual life, godliness. And it is saying that. It's at least saying that godliness is more valuable, but it's not disparaging physical training. In fact, right there in 1 Timothy 4.8, it says, for physical training is of some value. So it has value. So I definitely do think it's good because you grow in perseverance. If you're like me and you go to CrossFit, you definitely grow in humility because I'm the worst one there. You think I'm joking, but I'm not. That would be false humility. I'm definitely the worst one there. But to answer your question, yes. Okay. Christopher Beckett, g'day Christopher, says,

any advice for starting theology on tap? I'm starting it at my parish. So I would, yeah, so I guess a couple of bits of advice. You may have already thought of this, but I would say, first of all, get a great place. Meet at a great place, like a cool pub that has a gathering space that people want to congregate in. That would be my first word of advice. I think my next word of advice would be if you could find somebody that is a bit of a draw that people actually want to come and listen to, that will help. And so if you're kickstarting a theology on tap, you know, you might have to kind of put some funds together to fly out somebody to come and speak. Scott Hahn or, you know, someone like Father Gregory Pine, I'm sure, would do it or Trent Horn from Catholic Answers.

Like somebody who people have heard of and they want to hear them speak. And the cool thing about that is if you're going to, it might be a bit of money, you're going to fly them out, you're going to pay them, right? Because they're leaving their families and stuff. But if people are excited, they'll come out and then who knows, you'll get like 20 or 30 people, maybe more. And then you have the next guest and that way you can advertise it there. And so I think that that's what I would recommend. Have a cool environment, get a good speaker. You don't have to pay a lot of money every time and maybe get a local guy or girl every other talk. But that's what I'd recommend. Let's see here. Paul Binner says,

what purpose will our reproductive organs serve in heaven if we're not reproducing? says, what purpose will our reproductive organs serve in heaven if we're not reproducing? That's a great question. And I think Thomas Aquinas' answer is that they will not have any service in heaven. So that's my stab at it. Let's see. Is there any other questions that I've missed here? Thank you to everybody who's been sending them in. Michael O'Donnell says, who was first to understand Elijah and Enoch are the witnesses in Revelation 11 and what did Aquinas have to say on them? Guys, I'm reading this on the spot. So I have no idea about that question. I apologize that I can't be more help. John Henry says, what is the difference between what a Hindu is doing when praying to Hanuman, idolatry, and what I'm

doing when I pray to Mary, hyperdulia? Well, I don't know much about Hinduism. I actually know next to nothing about it. So I'm not sure what Hanuman is, if this is a person that you're praying to. I guess the difference would be, we don't have any good reason to think that this person is saved and is in heaven. And so, when we're praying to Mary, we know that Mary is in heaven. And so, that would be the difference. But then you might say, well, what about my auntie and my uncle and my grandfather who died? Like, can't I pray to them? And I think the answer is, yeah, you could have a private devotion to your grandfather if you have moral certainty that they're in heaven, but you're also kind of recognizing that they may not be. But I don't think there's anything specifically wrong with that. But this is why the church gives us the

saints, because we have this great degree of certainty, especially with Mary, we know that she's in heaven, that we can pray to the saints and that they will pray for us. So I'd say that's the difference. Also, I don't know enough again about Hinduism and I'm not sure what they mean by pray, right? So like what the Catholic means by pray when he's referring to the saints is request. But when the Hindu means pray, I don't know what they mean. So there might be that as well. So, all right. Michael Massack, by the way, Michael, hey, it was great to meet you and your friends the other day. We did a meetup at a coffee shop and I just want to say you and your friends are super dope and I'm glad y'all exist. You give me hope for the church. So good to meet you. You say, if the Byzantine Catholic church is under the authority of the Pope, then why can Byzantine

Catholics not receive the Eucharist at a Roman liturgy and vice versa? No, you can. Yeah, you can receive that. So maybe you've misunderstood. Byzantine Catholics can receive Eucharist at a Roman church and Roman Catholics can receive Eucharist at a Byzantine Catholic church. So I just, I think you've misunderstood that. All right, let's do one last question. This comes from Paul May, who says, not really a fun one, but this is something I've needed some guidance on. Okay, well, here we go. First time I'm reading it, I might be of no use, but let's see. A very good friend of mine is same-sex attracted and originally raised Catholic and fell away. At my wedding, he was my best man. Since we went way back, and I hope that the Lord might speak to him as we prepared for the

wedding. Now he's engaged with another man. He hasn't asked me to be in his wedding party, but of course I can't take any part in a same-sex wedding. So I know a hard conversation is coming. Do you have any tips for trying to explain my position to him and show I'm not against his happiness nor hate him. Oftentimes, the fact one wouldn't come translates to you don't want to be happy or the like. Okay. Yeah. Awesome question. Thank you so much, Paul. It sounds just by the way you're phrasing this question, it sounds like you already know kind of what to do. And I have no doubt that you will do it tactfully and with love and gentleness, whether or not it'll be received well, might not be up to you, right? So keep that in mind. So first of all, I applaud you. You should not attend a so-called same-sex wedding because if you were to do that, especially in an official capacity,

like a groomsman, you would be bearing false witness and therefore sinning. Because you would be saying by your presence that you agree that this is what everybody else at this reception thinks it is. And it isn't. It's not a marriage. And so for that reason, you should not attend. And so good for you for not attending, but then how do you share with your friend? Like, I love you. I like, I love you. And I kind of want you to be part of my life and your, you know, partner, I'd love to get to know him too, maybe, you know? Well, one way you could do this, Paul, is to write a letter to him, you know, and, him, you know, and maybe just get it all out front. Like, hey, I love you so much. I know that your wedding is coming up. And I just want to say, like, I can't attend because of my Catholic faith, but I want you to know that I love you and want you to be a part of my life. Like, even if you got everything in that first two sentences and then kind of unpacked it. So, because if you, if, if, if, if for the first half of the letters,

like, Hey, I love you. I think you're great. You know, he's like, okay, when's the other foot going to fall? I mean, that's just, that's just me thinking, you know, like I would like everything to be said kind of upfront. Hey, I know that you're getting married. I can't attend because of what the church teaches, but I want you to know that I love you and your partner, and that's why I'm writing you this letter. So that's what I would do. Nice thing about a letter is you get to think things through. You don't get to say things and then regret them like you might do in a heated conversation where someone might be getting emotional. You have to say it. And you can say, I'd love to have you over. I might like to have you and your partner over, depending on your

circumstances. Maybe if you have small children, you might not want to expose them to that. I'm not going to make a judgment on that, but if you're a single man, maybe you're okay with that, or maybe you want to go out for a meal with them and things like that. Eat with them and show them that you love them. But yeah, I mean, you could also point out in the letter that you're not just doing this because of same-sex attraction. Like if your friend got a divorce and wasn't annulled and then got quote unquote married again, you wouldn't attend that either. So that this is more than just, can you hear my kids crying downstairs? We just spoke about attending to people in love, so I probably should do that. But okay, so that would be my answer, Paul. God bless you and God bless your courage and God bless

your affection and love for your friend. And I'm sure that will come out in your letter if you choose to write a letter or in person if you choose to do that in person. Guys, thank you so very bloody much for listening to Pints with Aquinas. If you would, please review us on iTunes. I really want to get a bunch of reviews on iTunes so that more people can see Pints with Aquinas. If you would, please review us on iTunes. I really want to get a bunch of reviews on iTunes so that more people can see Pints with Aquinas and therefore be exposed to Him and to Christ, to carry you. My whole life