Planetary Radio: Space Exploration, Astronomy and Science - A Cosmic Concert: Singer/Songwriter Peter Mayer on Planetary Radio Live

Episode Date: June 24, 2013

Join us at the intersection of science, nature, music and wonder for a very special Planetary Radio Live with the great Peter Mayer. Bill Nye is with host Mat Kaplan on stage in this unique episode, the longest we've ever presented. You'll hear eight of Pete's beautiful songs, including one that will be on his new CD.Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoicesSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Greetings podcast listeners, so glad that you are joining us once again for Planetary Radio, and this time, not just Planetary Radio Live, but the longest episode we've ever presented on the web. I hope not too long, you'll have to let me know. But this one is completely different from anything we've ever done. You know, when we've done the live show in the past, we've had music. show in the past we've had music, but this time it's all about the music. And it is a guy that I just think so highly of that, as you'll hear me say, from the first time I heard him, I wanted to put him on the radio. So you're going to hear about eight songs from Peter Mayer as he joins me and Bill Nye and other people, a big crowd, a full house, in fact, at the Crawford Family Forum in Pasadena, California. They're at the studios of KPCC, Southern California Public Radio, our hosts. I hope you enjoy it. I think the conversation is also terrific.

You're going to hear Emily up front, but I want to warn you that Emily is doing a slideshow. I think that even those of you who will not be able to see her images will still get a lot out of what she has to say. But if you want to see Emily and her beautiful pictures of the solar system, and Peter Mayer, and Bill Nye, and Bruce Betts, and me, we're going to give you that link. The complete video of the show is posted at the show page. You can get there from planetary.org slash radio. So please do check that out i i think you'll enjoy uh seeing the pretty pictures that emily picked out for us with that let's go ahead

into this it's about an hour and 25 minutes if you can believe that and certainly hope that you enjoy the music of peter mayer from southern california public radio's Crawford Family Forum in Pasadena, California, this is Planetary Radio Live. Here's our host, the Planetary Society's Matt Kaplan. Welcome to a very special Planetary Radio Live, unlike anything we've done before. Now, sure, we've had live music on the show, but this time, the music, and you're hearing a little sample of it right now, will be at the galactic center of our attention when Bill Nye and I welcome folk singer Peter Mayer to the stage. Later, I'll be joined by Bruce Betts for yet another edition of What's Up with a live version of the Space Trivia Contest. First, though, something to put us in the mood

for songs about the passion, beauty, and joy of the universe. Please welcome Planetary Society Senior Editor and Planetary Evangelist, Emily Lakdawalla. Emily, welcome. Thank you very much, Matt Before you get into it, these are some of your favorite images You always ask me to show favorite images And asking me to show favorite images is like asking me for my favorite children I can't do that, but I can show you images that I really like a lot Because we have to apologize to our radio and podcast audience

Because they're not going to get to our radio and podcast audience, because they're not going to get to sort of see them as we play along with the game. But there are places they can find this. How can they see these images and many more? Well, if you're watching live right now, my most recent tweet contains a link to a spot on the website where you can find all of the images and more that I'm about to talk about. And then I will also post this link on the blog when we post the show. Okay, go ahead and get started with this, then I will also post this link on the blog when we post the show. Okay, go ahead and get started with this because I think it's going to be the perfect intro

to the rest of our evening. Well, Matt asked me to show some favorite space images. Like I said, this is a hard thing to do, so I decided to pick a theme. My theme is going to be the theme of many worlds, and I just wanted to show you really quick the most wonderful thing about our new website is this spot where I get to post all of my favorite space images from all of the missions

exploring our solar system and now with Voyager Beyond. And so we're going to talk about the theme of many worlds. What I mean by many worlds is fortunate images that manage to catch more than one world in the frame at the same time. Now, we can see more than one world from Earth at the same time during certain very fortunate times when we managed to catch several planets in the sky. Here's a view from Cumbria in Wales shot by Stuart Atkinson showing Mercury, which you can only barely see at the bottom here, and then Venus and Saturn and the Moon.

So plus Earth, you have five worlds in one shot. We can also see multiple worlds from the surface of the Earth during such wonderful things as solar eclipses when we happen to catch the amazing coincidence that our moon and the sun appear to be very similar size in the sky, revealing wonderful features like the corona of the sun. But once you start getting off of our planet, you can see some really unexpected and strange and alien views.

Just a little bit off the planet, unfortunately, it's caught in the sun's glare here, but you can see the moon rising from beyond the curved limb of the Earth, and you really get a sense of how thin Earth's atmosphere is, and you catch wonderful views from space shot by the astronauts as the moon rises from beyond Earth's limb. You get a little further away, and you get to a class of some of my very favorite photos taken by spacecraft, and these are taken by spacecraft that are on the way to other planets as they depart our double planet, and when you see pictures like this of Earth and

the moon together, you realize just how large the moon is by comparison to Earth. It's really quite unique in the solar system. This series of images was captured by Galileo during one of its Earth flybys. Here's an even more amazing view, I think. It's shot in color. It was taken from much farther away by deep impact. And it was actually part of an experiment. You can see here the moon actually transits Earth's disk. That was trying to explore Earth as though it were an exoplanet. This was at a time during Deep Impact's mission when it was trying to study other planets

around other stars recently discovered. This is actually an entire day's worth of images. You get to see Earth go through one complete rotation. It's pretty cool. You get a little bit farther away. you get to see Earth go through one complete rotation. That's pretty cool. You get a little bit farther away. You get to other planets. And you notice things like the fact that other planets don't enjoy that amazing coincidence that I pointed out of Earth's moon and the sun being the same apparent size in the sky. What you're seeing here is a transit of Deimos across the sun's disk as shot from the surface of Mars by the Curiosity rover. And if you look very closely at the Sun as it repeats,

you can actually see a sunspot on the surface of the Sun as this transit is happening. It's pretty cool. When you're above Mars, you can see Mars's moons transiting the disk of Mars. Here's a view of Phobos shot by the Russian spacecraft Phobos 2, which was on its way to Phobos in a mission that sadly failed before it managed to land there, but it got some amazing photos of its target on

the way in. Here's another view of Phobos shot by a Mars orbiting spacecraft, Mars Express. It's a European spacecraft, but what's that in the background? Anybody got a guess? It's Jupiter. It's an amazing happenstance. Of course, it wasn't by accident. They knew that Jupiter was going to be there as they were shooting their series of images of Phobos. You can even see, if you really stretch the bejesus out of the image, you can see the other, you can see the moons of Jupiter in this image, which is absolutely incredible. All right, well, let's go to Jupiter, as Cassini did when it was on its way to Saturn. And here, again, we have this theme of many worlds. Jupiter, of course, has a lot of moons, all of them roughly the same size as our moon.

But unlike the combination of Earth's moon and Earth, Jupiter's moons look rather smaller than Jupiter. Here's another view from Cassini as Cassini was getting even closer. You can see stunning details on the surface of Europa. And yet there's this gargantuan planet in the background that's just kind of hogging all the attention. Here's one of my favorite many worlds views from Jupiter. This is a view of Io with a volcano erupting up at the top there, and a very thin crescent of Europa. Europa is actually much smaller than Io, but the two look the same size here because Europa is much closer to New Horizons than Io was. And it so happens that Europa was closer to New Horizons than Jupiter, while Io was farther from New Horizons

than Jupiter. Consequently, Io's night side is lit by reflected Jupiter shine, but we cannot see that on Europa, because Europa is closer to us than Jupiter is. There are other kinds of many worlds pictures. There are serendipitous discoveries of many worlds, as in this shot of asteroid Ida and its surprise moon Dactyl that was discovered in Galileo's flyby. Here's another rather similar view. This is the asteroid Lutetia. And what's in the background here? It's Saturn. Now, this was not an accident. They knew that this alignment was going to happen when they took that photo.

But still, it's pretty freaking cool to see Saturn from so far away when you're at an asteroid. Well, let's go to Saturn, as of course Cassini did. When you view Saturn from very far away, you can easily catch many moons. But Cassini does much better than that, catching many moons at once all the time as it's orbiting Saturn.

I'm afraid I have trouble telling some of Saturn's moons apart. Especially Rhea, Dione, and Tethys look the same, so I'm not going to name them most of the time. Here's a teeny little Mimas. This one is Dione across Saturn's disk. And it's just the white icy balls of these moons against the yellow Saturn.

It just makes for amazing views. Here we get more than one moon. I forget which one this is. And of course, the dark orange hazy LA smog ball of Titan. Here is Mimas peeking out from behind either Tethys or Rhea. I don't remember which one. But you can see, you can actually see the shapes of mountains on the night side of this larger moon blocking the view of Mimas there.

You can get views through Titan's atmosphere where you can see the brown haze blocking parts of views of the other moons. And then you can get more and more moons in one image. This one looks like it has three. It's Dione and Titan and I believe Pandora. But there's also one more moon over there. That one's Pan. Here's another one with four moons, one round one, and three potatoes. This one has five moons, three of the round ones. This is one of the most amazing photos, I think, from Cassini. But I think the most amazing view of many, many worlds

was shot on February 14, 1990, by Voyager 1, as it turned back and looked toward the rest of the solar system. The individual images of the other planets, they look not very much different from that photo that I showed you in the beginning, showing Mercury and Venus and Saturn and the moon as seen from the surface of Earth. They're just little pinpricks of light. But this is practically, this is the entire solar system, all of the planets in one image sequence shot by Voyager.

Well, more recently, we actually repeated this feat, not from Voyager's distance from outside the solar system, but actually from inside the solar system. And this is a series of images shot by MESSENGER from Mercury's orbit, containing all the other planets in the solar system, including Jupiter, the moon, and Earth, and even the Milky Way crossing the image there.

And if you go to the blog, if you go to my Twitter feed, you can find all of these images and more, and many more images of absolutely amazing sites across the solar system. It's my favorite thing about space exploration, the thing that makes me keep coming back to it. So thank you, Matt, for the opportunity to present these photos. And please do check out the blog and my Twitter feed for more of the pictures. That's Emily Lakdawalla.

Emily Lakdawalla with just a sliver, a tiny sample of her favorite images of the solar system. She is available at planetary.org. One of my colleagues in the society, you can read her blog entries at planetary.org. And follow her on Twitter where she is, E. Lakdawalla. That's at E. Lakdawalla.

Emily is the Planetary Society's Senior Editor and Planetary Evangelist. She's also a contributing editor to Sky and Telescope magazine. Now, it's my great pleasure to welcome my friend and boss to the stage. Please help me greet the CEO of the Planetary Society, Bill Nye, the science guy. Thank you. Wow. Thank you, Matt. So thanks for joining us once again up here. Oh, no. It is I who must thank you. So I said the passion, beauty, and joy, which, of course, is a phrase I stole from you.

Let's say make use of. Borrowed. P, B, and J. Passion, beauty, and joy, which, of course, is a phrase I stole from you. Let's say make use of. Borrowed. P, B, and J. Passion, beauty, and joy. How important to science is a sense of wonder? Oh, it's not important at all, Matt. No, I kid because I love. No, I claim that our ancestors who did not have used the term sense of wonder, who did not have curiosity, who did not wonder about their environment, they got out-competed by other tribes of ancestors

that did. I don't think that's really an extraordinary claim, but it's something to think about. If you meet somebody who for some reason does not support space exploration, he or she might say to you, well, we have problems here on Earth. Why do you want to spend time, effort, energy, and especially money on exploring space? Just take a second or a moment and ask that person, what does it say about you if you don't want to look up and out, if you're content to stay home and only solve problems at home, if you don't explore what's beyond your horizon? What does that say about you, that you don't care what's beyond the horizon? You probably do.

I don't think you can find anybody that doesn't care about it at some level. Whatever it says about you, it's not good. anybody that doesn't care about it at some level. Whatever it says about you, it's not good. We have to explore beyond our horizons or we won't make progress as a species. And now it's becoming quite clear in February, Emily made reference to February 14, 1990, which is when Dr. Candace Hansen took those, arranged to take those spectacular pictures of the planets from Voyager. But February 14th of this year, 2013, was when a bolide, a daytime meteor, exploded over Siberia, over Chelyabinsk, Russia.

So there's a practical issue. You don't want to get hit with an asteroid. I mean, no no I mentioned this it's really something to think about I mean we all kind of laugh and I spoke once at a TED you know a TED conference and I mentioned asteroids

and people laughed it's a couple years ago well I can tell you if you had an object maybe not twice as big but let's say three times as big as the object over Chelyabinsk, if it hit Los Angeles, I mean, that's it. You're done. Los Angeles is done. And so in the same way, we just don't want to be hit with the next one.

Now, when I was in school, people said that the reason the ancient dinosaurs died out was because they had small brains. And even Mrs. McGonagall, the second grade teacher, knew that that was just, that was nothing. She knew, you know, she had been given a book and she was reading from it, that that was nothing. I mean, if you're, you're telling me that the rabbits ate all the dinosaur food? I mean, if, you know, if you're an allosaurus or sauropod of some, and there's a rabbit, I mean, there's no more rabbit. So even she knew that it was unacceptable. But in my lifetime, after I was graduated from engineering school, after running around making a living and paying taxes, people found this crater off Chicxulub, Mexico, that is almost certainly the crater that was responsible for killing almost all of the ancient dinosaurs.

So the threat is quite real. I mean the dust from that impact went halfway to the moon. The diameter of the cone of the ejected material, the ejecta, was bigger diameter than the Earth. And there's 100,000 of those things crossing the Earth's orbit and we've got to find them. So that right there means you've got to look up and out, let alone the PB&J, the passion, beauty, and joy of exploration. If we find evidence of life on another world in our lifetime, it will absolutely change this world.

It will change the way everybody thinks about everything, be it by Copernicus or Galileo. It will change everything. And it's aicus or Galileo. They change everything. And it's a very exciting thing to be a part of. And everybody, I remind you, the Planetary Society supports this work, but it's the cost of one fancy cup of coffee every 10 years per taxpayer. I mean, this is a worthy endeavor that might change the world. So the sense of wonder is very important for the romance, the passion,

but I claim it's very important for our survival. So that's not a bad combination, passion, beauty, joy, and survival. Oh, yeah, and survival. We're going to mostly focus on the first three of those this evening because of our special guest. And if I had thought of it to ask Emily to include one more image, it might have been that famous image of what Carl Sagan christened the pale blue dot, that image. Well, it was there, Matt.

That image was there in that mosaic. In that mosaic, yeah. Because that is going to be ideal for the context that we're going to be covering this evening with our guests. Let me read to you from Peter Mayer's website, only slightly paraphrased. Peter writes songs for a small planet, songs about interconnectedness and the human journey, about the beauty and the mystery of the world, nature, and the cosmos. Often whimsical, humorous, and profound, his music breaks the boundaries of folk and transcends to a realm beyond the everyday love song,

to a place of wonder at the very fact of life itself. He began playing the guitar and writing songs while in high school. He studied theology and music in college and then spent two years in seminary. After deciding that the priesthood wasn't for him, he took a part-time job as a church music director for eight years, performed at clubs and colleges, wrote lots of music. Eighteen years ago, he quit that job and started touring full-time. Since then, Peter has gained a largely word-of-mouth following, playing shows from Minnesota to Texas, New England to California. He's made nine CDs and has independently sold over 70,000 of them. There's one of them right there, one of my favorites, Heaven Below. I just want to read you one quote.

There are many on his website, what somebody had to say about him. I'm a huge Peter Mayer fan, but only when I don't feel like killing him for being so good. I love Peter's work, though it irritates me that he plays so much better than I do. If I rocked half as hard as Peter does, I'd own the world by now. That was singer-songwriter Janice Ian. Ladies and gentlemen, please welcome Peter Mayer. Thank you. Boy, the pressure's on now, isn't it? I'm standing on a planet Breathing in the atmosphere

Waves vibrating in the air A beating on my ears Invisible forces are holding me down I am spinning faster than the speed of sound Being bombarded by electromagnetic beams Flying through my body Shining red and blue and green A hundred billion signals

Are racing through my brain Guess it must be just another ordinary day. I live in eleven dimensions, seven more than I can see. Where matter equals light and I'm made of energy It's all expanding from one microscopic grain Guess it must be just another ordinary day Another ordinary day For me and Captain Kirk Every fact is so absurd

In this science fiction world An ordinary day In the merry land of Oz The psychedelic mind of God The phantasmic universe There's a giant black hole In the center of the galaxy There's a blueprint of

my bones in every single cell of me And everything with weight is warping time and space Guess it must be just another ordinary day An ordinary day

For mad hatters having tea Oompa Loompas making sweets In this Willy Wonky-ality An ordinary day For alarm clocks I'd beep Shake me from my sleep So I can wake up in this Dream

Just another ordinary day Hey Just another ordinary day Just another ordinary day Just another ordinary day Just another ordinary day Hey, just another ordinary day Thank you.

There's your sense of wonder, Matt. I'll say. I'm not sure that I know of any other song that crams in so many basic principles of physics, biology, and so on. Pete, thanks so much for being here, first of all. It's a great honor, and I'm a little bit nervous because what if some of those facts are wrong? Well, you had 11 dimensions. There's some people that want to go with nine.

Yeah. But it's more than you can sort of get. So that was such a great way to start, and we've got lots more coming, and we'll try and keep the gab here to the minimum so we do keep the focus on the music so many of your songs have within them this theme which is kind of central to that tune which is how easy it is to lose sight of the miracle that is kind of in every atom around us I don't want to sound like I'm stoned here looking at the universe in

my thumbnail but but still I mean that's really what that is about, isn't it? Well, yes, I think so, and I know that for myself, I've been so affected by science and by scientists, and it's interesting, you talked about my background in theology, but I was really after my theological studies that I really set out on this sort of course of reading to try and discover, you know, what is the world about? You know, what is the nature of things? And I just found it incredibly inspiring at a very deep level. And so I'll continue to try and sort of tinker with those ideas as a songwriter and just as a human being, you know. And I'm very grateful to the likes of all of you to help bring that to me and others.

I think it's very important. So I studied theology as a Catholic and was also in seminary. And the Jesuits, actually, and the Pope is a Jesuit. That's the first time I think that's ever happened. And don't they scare the rest of the church because they think too much? Well, yeah, they're very intellectually oriented. And I mean, that's maybe why I quit. To do what we're going to hear more of right now. Can we go on to the... This next tune that I think you're going to play is the first one that I heard by you,

and it was when I thought... When I got up off the floor and my jaw stopped dropping, I said, I've got to get this guy on the radio. Well, thank you, Matt. Yeah, this is really... That was a good way to lead into this song. That's his job. Well, good job.

Good job, Matt. Thank you. I'm bad at tuning, and here I am trying to transition smoothly into this. I do what I can to make certain that my dog does not have fleas. Thank you. Thank you for covering for me there, Bill. I was just offering my limited. Yeah, no, that worked.

I think that's all the time I needed. But my dog has fleas. Isn't that what all the time I needed. But my dog has fleas. Isn't that what we're driving at? Sure. When you tune it. That's a uke. I'm working with it here. Yeah, I think it did work.

A stringed instrument thing. Okay. Here we go. The sun once went around the earth According to the Holy Church Which helped to reassure people that they were The center of the universe One day His Holiness the Pope Met a man with a telescope

And said, hey Mr. Galilee What does your spyglass say? And the scientist spoke. He said, it's really quite amazing. Entirely life-changing. So let me ask before I show you Do you really want to know? Oh, do you really want to know?

Oh Emma read the Bible for direction She said she was a child of heaven And that the human race came from a higher place from the angels descended she wound up marrying her cousin he was a

thinker of a husband lost in thought she'd find him say Charlie what you writing Darwin looked up and said it's really quite amazing. Entirely life changing. So let me ask before I show you.

Do you really want to know? Oh, do you really want to know? Oh, do you really want to know? Oh, do you really want to Let knowledge like a breeze In through the door of your belief Blow through the rooms and the corridors Knock cherished heirlooms to the floor That wind can raise the roof sometimes

And leave you blinking at the sky So if you stare into this glass Beware that there's no going back You'll say sunrise, but it will refuse Instead the earth itself will move And spin you round from dawn to dawn Into the wonder of it. Oh, oh, really want to know? A song about that age-old challenge.

Do you really want to know what I've discovered? Because if I tell you, you'll probably want to burn me at the stake. What brought me to my own sort of place with my relationship to knowledge, I guess you might say scientific knowledge, was largely, I largely learned it through the Catholic Church and through Catholics who were trying, you know, in a very serious way to bring in science into their own spiritual worldview and practice. And so it's an interesting strain of, you know, this effort to bridge science and religion that's happening in the Catholic Church and in other religious traditions as well. You know, even irrespective of its history, the Catholic Church now seems to kind of embrace science, certainly embraces science compared to, oh, some Congress people that we've heard of.

That's right. That's right. It is troubling. So, you know, I just remind everybody that the reason we all trust calendars is because the Catholic, the Vatican still has an observatory. The Catholic astronomers were so diligent in making sure, in counting the number of days of the year and the number of minutes beyond, the number of minutes extra you get when you add too many leap years.

And it was all worked out in 1572, and we all take it for granted. But they had practical problems of trying to get their movable feasts, celebrations that fell on a Sunday regardless of the week, of the day of the month. That just shows you how much, really, religion contributed to our understanding of our place in space. And lest we forget, the church did say it's sorry to Mr. Galileo. They got right on that. Yeah. I mean, sorry, I don't mean to bust their chops, but it's a long time. I mean, you know, we all chuckle, but it's a long time to hold somebody responsible for being right.

Demonstrably right. This next one that you've got, I think it was kind of an anthem, although that could actually describe many of your songs. This is an old hymn tune that you may recognize if you grew up singing in church, which I did. The hymn tune is called Heiferdahl, and it was written back in the 1800s by a man named Roland Pritchard. And so I have put yet another text to his great old hymn. And I have to say, it's actually in a hymnal. This song is in a hymnal in the Unitarian Universalist hymnal.

And I'm very proud of that and excited that, gee, people are singing this in some churches anyway. So this is called Blue Boat Home. Though below me I feel no motion Standing on these mountains and plains far away from the rolling ocean still my dry land heart

can say I've been sailing all my life now. Never harbor or port have I known. The wide universe is the ocean I travel. And the earth is my blue boat home. Son, my sail and moon, my rudder As I ply the starry sea

Leaning over the edge in wonder Casting questions into the deep Drifting here with my ship's companions All we kindred pilgrim souls Making our way by the lights of the heavens In our beautiful blue boat home I give thanks to the waves upholding me. Hail the great winds urging me on. Lead the infinite sea before me. Sing the sky my sailor's song I was born upon

The fathoms Never harbor or port Have I known The wide universe Is the ocean I travel And the earth is my blue boat. The wide universe is the ocean I travel. And the earth is my blue boat

Home Home Ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, Thank you. Wow. So with apologies to Buckminster Fuller, I think I like the idea of a boat or an ark even better than spaceship Earth, although either one applies. It's a vessel. A vessel, definitely.

No, but seriously, it holds something. And a delicate vessel like that. We're going to try and squeeze one more in here, I think, before we take a quick break, if that's okay. So where are we going next in our blue boat? Well, this next song is called All the World is One, and I guess it's a rather self-explanatory title. This world. Well, this world, and also I guess I think of all things. Well, you can decide. I'll just play the song. You can

interpret as you like. But I was reading Bill Bryson's book. Is it A Brief History of Nearly Everything? Yeah, which of course I loved. And at one point he said, one thing is clear that science tells us, all life is one. And I think that you can cast that larger and say all, all is one. Thank you. guitar solo You can say that you stand apart

Put a fence around your yard You can build a tall rampart Guard it with a gun You can dig yourself a moat Burn the bridge, burn the boat Won't matter that much, you know Cause all the world is one All the world is one All the world is one You can march in a big parade

Every Independence Day You can raise up your own flakes Sing your own anthem It'll ring out in the air with the other anthems there till the winds of the earth declare all the world is one. All the world is one. Go and ask Buddha when sitting under the tree. Go ask Walt Whitman when he's looking out at the sea. Go ask Walt Whitman when he's looking out at the sea Ask Alan Shepard when he's standing up on the moon Staring at that pearl of blue

Asking Adam in the breath you take Ask the water by the river bank Ask a strand of DNA that's written in your blood One life running in your veins. One life from one big bang. You can't try and separate it. But all the world is one. All the world is one.

Go and ask Buddha When he's sitting under the tree Ask Annie Dillard When she's up on Tinker Creek Ask Alan Shepard When he's standing up on the moon Staring at that pearl of blue Oh Pearl of blue You can take an outbound train

Try to make a getaway You can ride off like John Wayne Into the setting sun But earthlings don't leave town They just go round and round Till they figure out all the world is one All the world is one All the world is one Thank you.

That's our special guest, singer-songwriter Peter Mayer. I'll be right back with Peter and Bill Nye, the science guy. This is Planetary Radio Live. Hey, hey, Bill Nye here, CEO of the Planetary Society, speaking to you from PlanetFest 2012, the celebration of the Mars Science Laboratory rover Curiosity landing on the surface of Mars. This is taking us our next steps in

following the water in the search for life, to understand those two deep questions. Where did we come from? And are we alone? This is the most exciting thing that people do. And together we can advocate for planetary science and dare I say it, change the worlds. Emily Lakdawalla Hi, this is Emily Lakdawalla of the Planetary Change the worlds! guests. And as the world becomes more social, we are too, giving you the opportunity to join in through Facebook, Google+, Twitter, and much more. It's all at planetary.org. I hope you'll check it out. Welcome back to Planetary Radio Live. I'm Matt Kaplan of the Planetary Society. We're on stage at the Crawford Family Forum in Pasadena, California, home of Southern California Public Radio.

We've still got Bruce Betts and what's up ahead of us, but first we're going to hear more from our special guest, singer-songwriter Peter Mayer. Joining Peter and me is the CEO of the Planetary Society, Bill Nye the Science Guy. Greetings, greetings. Bill Nye the Science Guy. Greetings, greetings. All right, Peter, we've heard something, a hymn, a sort of hymn. And I think the next one certainly fits that description.

Yeah, well, and we were just talking about religion and my growing up Catholic. And this definitely comes out of that as well. It's pretty self-explanatory. I'll just play the song. This is called Holy Now. Holy Now When I was a boy each week Sunday we would go to church Pay attention to the priest

He would read the holy word Consecrate the holy bread And everyone would kneel and bow Today the only difference is Everything is holy now Everything, everything Everything is holy now guitar solo When I was in Sunday school

We would learn about the time Moses split the sea in two Jesus made the water wine I remember feeling sad Miracles don't happen still But now I can't keep track Cause everything's a miracle Everything, everything

Everything's a miracle Why? Wine from water is not so small But an even better magic trick Is that anything is here at all So the challenging thing becomes Not to look for miracles but finding where there isn't one

when holy water was rare at best it barely wet my fingertips but now I have to hold my breath. Like I'm swimming in a sea of it. It used to be a world half there. Heaven's second rate hand me down.

But I walk it with irreverent air. Because everything is holy now. Everything. Everything. Cause everything is holy now Everything, everything Everything is holy now Read A questioning child's face Say it's not a testament That'd be very hard to say

See, see another new morning come Say it's not a sacrament Tell you that it can't be done. This morning outside I stood, saw a little red winged bird shining like a burning bush, singing like a scripture verse. It made me want to bow my head I remember when church let out How things have changed since then

Everything is holy now Used to be a world half there Heaven's second-rate hand-me-down but I walk it with a reverent air cuz everything is holy now now Wow. Wow. Not bad. Not bad.

Pretty good, Peter. Wow. Man. I wish I could do that. You've got something new for us. I've seen the lyrics, and they're great. I think I even told you in email, boy, this is in a file folder full of anthems.

This one could really be an anthem for humanity. And is this something you're preparing to put into a new CD? Yeah, yeah, this will go on the next record. This is called Human You. And I think it's worth mentioning that I was very inspired by Carl Sagan. Years ago, I read through the book Cosmos, which was the companion, I guess, to his series, and was just so, you know and I'm so grateful to him. And one of the things I remember him saying was something to the effect

that we are star stuff contemplating the stars. And I love this dimension that science has told me about, this idea that human beings are this conscious agent of the earth and of the universe, and really the only one, even though we hope we will find someday others like us, but the only ones we know of right now really that has a capacity to discover and celebrate the universe. And I think this is a profound and beautiful role that we have. This is a song that comes out of that way of thinking. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay.

Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay.

Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay.

Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. In all of the thousand, thousand, thousand years that have passed Days that have gone by And the countless astonishing things that have happened Like the first star to turn on a light in the sky Or like the sun being born Or the earth being formed Or the first twitch of life in the depths of the sea

or the very first flower to brighten the world or the very first he, the very first she. There was no one to see it or say, oh my God, no one to laugh or to weep. And now only one can uncover the story and search through the clues It is you Human, you

Human, you Of all the things made of atoms, the children of matter, the comets and quasars, the oceans and the stones and the millions of creatures who have lived on this planet, who have walked through the ages and floated and flown There was never among them a poser of questions A painter of sunsets, a keeper of dreams Who could measure the days and the nights as they're passing And seek understanding, ask what life means It's as if all of time were a song that has finally found ears Or as if the whole world for four billion years

Has been lying unconscious And is now coming to In you Human you Human you human you. So in all of your hurries and your preoccupied worries about when your next meal or next paycheck will come,

in your hopes and ambitions, your quest for possessions, your search for self- hopes and ambitions Your quest for possessions Your search for self-worth And for sex and for love Just remember that there Is a deeper dimension A wider communion Of which you're a part

There's a whole universe That's evolving, unfolding And you are its consciousness You are its heart Human, you are a mountain that now has just opened its eyes You're the wandering earth, you're the awakening sky You're a galaxy laughing and whistling a tune That is you

Human, you Human, you Human, you Oh, you are a mountain That now has just opened its eyes You're the wandering earth You're the awakening sky You're a galaxy laughing Whistling a tune.

You, human. You, human. You. You. You. You You Bill makes me proud to be part of our species. It's amazing.

It's terrific. You've captured. Peter is fantastic. As Carl Sagan said, we are one way that the universe knows itself. And if that doesn't fill you with joy, it's just a wonderful thing. And it was discovered, I claim, by the process of science. And I reflect on a song you played earlier, you referred to Galileo and Charles Darwin. But in my father's lifetime was Albert Einstein. And now everybody's running around trying to figure out why. I say running around.

and now everybody's running around trying to figure out why I say running around. People are working to discover why the universe is not just expanding, it's accelerating. And people have this idea of dark matter and dark energy, but it's really not explained. But it's quite reasonable that in just the next decade or two decades, people will figure that out and it will change the world again. And we will find out yet more about the cosmos and our place in it and what I like to call our place in space. Peter, this is really inspiring music. Thank you for coming. You got a song in you about dark energy?

Listen, I want to open it up to the audience here for at least a couple of questions. So if you do have a question for Peter, just keep it very brief. And raise your hand now. Somebody will race over with a microphone. Peter already got one question from somebody in the audience, and that was about your guitar. Can you tell us something about this? Sure, yeah.

This is called a Rain Song. That's a brand of guitar. And it's actually made of carbon fiber. So there's not a lick of wood on the guitar. And, you know, it's a very strong material, and it's impervious to heat and cold and humidity changes, and it's lightweight. It's just a really practical instrument for a traveling musician. And I mean, I left it in the trunk of my car, you know, in the sunlight today and I didn't

care. I didn't care. And I check it in luggage and I have just a cheap case, you know, and I asked the owner of the company, should I buy a good case for the guitar? And he said, no. But this guy, what about an interaction? Do you know El Caban? God, you're dating us.

You know, are you talking about whacking the guitar? Yeah, it's El Caban. Yeah, I won't do that with my own guitar, but it can be done. I mean, sometimes the carbon fiber guys will do that as a demonstration, or they'll have you put it in between two chairs and stand on the guitar. Strangely strong.

And yet, you know, gee, I mean, it does a pretty good job with the musical end of things, too. Furthermore, we would not have graphite carbon fiber without the space program. A perfect tie-in. Coincidence? Thank you.

We got a question right here. Hi, sir. What's your name? Hello, my name is Clark. And my question is, as most people, I think it was Chris who went to ISS and has the music video. But if you could do something like that of going to space and play any song on guitar, which song would it be and why? By the way, Clark, love your new

movie. If I could go into space and play any song? Yes. You're on the space station, minding your own business. She'd give you a little free time. I think I'd have to try to write one.

Now that I know that I've been asked the question, that's a really good question. I mean, it'd have to be something like, here we are all together, you know, or something like that, and isn't it beautiful?

Well, would you like to go? Well, I probably... And come back. And come back. Because we have... Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Oh, and come... Okay, okay. That does change things a we have... Yeah. Yeah, yeah.

Oh, and come... Oh, okay, okay. That does change things a bit. We have friends in high places, and I do mean high. Yeah, that does change things a bit. If I could get some guarantees from you, Bill, on the return trip... Sure. Well, not really for me.

I'd get somebody working in the business. I think I'd be more apt to... You know, I have a two-year-old and a six-year-old at home, and, you know... I'd be a little bit nervous. They say everybody who flies in space, they're changed by it. Everybody says when they look at the Earth. I'd hate to think that in your case you would change back into somebody who doesn't recognize all of this beauty and passion and joy. That would be awful.

Doubtful. It could have detrimental effects. Why is it so dark in that direction? Anybody else out here? Over this way. Hi, my name is Sabrina Hodge and I wanted to ask Peter, what do you feel is the main component of the bridge that

connects or will connect religion and science? Wow. I think that what they both have in common is an interest in the nature of things, in discovery of the nature of things. I think there's an interest in what is the greater context of our lives, you know, and what are some of the hidden or perhaps sort of not so obvious aspects of the larger context of our lives. And I think that's what science is continuing to try to discover. But I think a lot of it boils down for me to just, you know,

awe and wonder. It gets back to those just basic, the need for us to feel connected. And you know, religion, I mean, you can correct me if I'm wrong, because I'm not a terribly smart person about this stuff. You just went to seminary. Yeah, well, not long enough. I learned a lot from Bill today about religion, actually. No, that was the history of astronomy. But the word religion means something like to reconnect. To reconnect. And I think it's about us. Seriously, it's from the same root as ligament, right? Okay, yes, I believe so.

Connection, tie. Yeah, connection. And so I think we all want to feel connected to that which is larger than ourselves. I think that there are similarities between the quest for truth and knowledge and discovery and to make meaning out of it all. And you know what? I'm just blathering on. I don't really know if I'm answering your question.

Well, where did we come from? Are we alone? Those, to me, are the deep questions. And I've always felt that religion seeks to explain nature, or often seeks to explain the natural world. And what I believe religion gives so many people is a community. I feel that we're living in an extraordinary time where science is, if I may, lack of a better term, cool. And it's engaging people and people around the world are appreciating.

Says the guy who helped make it so. Well, I mean, that was just a mission in life. Like, just a reason to do everything. But I feel strongly that, Peter, you're part of this engagement of making a community of people who are appreciating our place in space. And this is, I would claim, the reason Carl Sagan did so much of what he did and the reason that we have the Planetary Society and ultimately Planetary Radio. and that we have the Planetary Society and ultimately Planetary Radio. And may I offer one more thought? I think what a lot of people yearn for is sort of what religion has, has always had, it seems to me, is sort of a language of reverence. You learn all this stuff about the world, and yet sometimes you don't know how to embrace it in a reverential way and in a way that calls it holy, that calls it a sacred place, that the ground that we're walking on is sacred.

It's the ground of our birth. It sustains us every day. This world sustains us every day. And the cosmos, it's all related. It is all one. related. It is all one. And I think that people are still struggling to come to that kind of vocabulary, find that vocabulary of reverence for the things that we are learning intellectually, but don't always reach us at the heart level in an explicit way. Gentlemen, we're running short of time. Peter, I want to try and squeeze in two more tunes here.

So please take us someplace else. Well, this is an interesting song to go into from this conversation because I seem to not be able to get away from religious language, even though I'm no longer Catholic, but I'm still affected by that language. And I feel that there's value in some of those words and concepts. And this is one of those songs inspired by hearing one time a quote saying that there are, and gee whiz, I mean, we only just discovered that there was another galaxy in the universe, right, in the last hundred years, right? That we just thought the Milky Way

was pretty much it. And then all of a sudden we began to discover, my gosh, there are other Milky Ways in the universe, other vast clusters of stars. Billions and billions. Right. Yes, exactly. Well, literally. Yes. And now we know that there are vast numbers of galaxies.

And this is an incredible thing that we've discovered, and I heard somebody say once that there are as many galaxies in the known universe as there are snowflakes in a snowstorm, and I think this is a beautiful and haunting image for me, and you're always going for the metaphor as a songwriter, you know, you're always kind of affected by the metaphor and hopefully weaving that into your music. So this is a little meditation inspired by that. This is called My Soul. My Soul

There are a hundred billion snowflakes swirling In the cosmic storm And each one is a galaxy A billion stars or more And each star is a million Earths A giant fiery sun High up in some sky maybe shining on someone Deep inside a snowflake I am floating quietly I am infinitesimal, impossible to see

Sitting in my tiny kitchen, in my tiny home Staring out my window, in the universe of snow. But my soul is so much bigger than the very tiny me It reaches out into the snowstorm like a net into the sea Out to all the lovely places where my body cannot go I touch that beauty and embrace it in the bosom of my soul. And so brief and fleeting is this tiny life of mine. Like a single quarter note in the march of time.

But my soul is like the music. It goes back to ancient days back before it wore a human face long before it bore my name guitar solo because my soul is so much older

Than the evanescent me It can describe the dawn of time Like a childhood memory It is a spark that was begotten Of the darkness long ago. What my body has forgotten, I remember in my soul. guitar solo So we lived this life together My giant soul and tiny me

One resembling forever One like smoke upon the breeze One the deep abiding ocean One a sudden flashing wave And counting galaxies like snowflakes I would swear we were the same Oh, my soul belongs to beauty Takes me up to lofty heights

Teaches sacred stories too Sanctifies my tiny life Plays a bridge across the ages Melts the boundaries of my bones Paints a bold eternal face On this passing moment Oh my soul soul Thank you. Peter Mayer.

You know, you could have simply been a great singer and fine guitarist and not taken on the great issues and questions and beauty of the universe, but I'm glad you did. Well, there's always just writing love songs. I could have done that. Yeah. Well, if you catch a wave, you're sitting on top of the world. We're on bonus time,

and I want to make sure you get in this one last tune that we've talked about you sharing with us before we go on to a break and then to What's Up with Bruce Betts. But, Bill, did you want to add anything before this last tune? Well, it's just, it's quite moving. And I'm delighted that you're taking this on because I say all the time, the more you learn about space and our place in it, I use this word continually. I'm filled with reverence that we can understand it. It's quite remarkable. Einstein said that we can understand the universe

is the most incredible thing of, I paraphrase, is the most incredible aspect of the whole thing. Your music celebrates that, and I hope it fills a few of our listeners with reverence. Please. All right, Pete. Nine CDs so far. Tenth one on the way.

How do people find out more? Where do they go? I suppose the easiest is to remember Blue Boat. Blue Boat, as in Blue Boat Home. Blueboat.net is my website. Yeah, you can find out all you need to know there. And I'm on iTunes and Amazon, or you can order through my website or downloads, all that stuff. And you just might catch him touring around the country, as we were able to catch him here between a couple of dates in Southern California,

and we were very fortunate to have done so. And thank you so much for having me. I'm just truly beyond honored to be here. So thanks, everybody. I'll leave you with this song after I tune up. While you tune up, I just want to say it's a shame that we don't have the bagpipes on stage that you have in the

recording. Yeah, yeah. If you buy the record, you will get the bagpipes. Not the actual bagpipes. No. I'm just sensing that moment. I'm looking at the audience. Really? We have a box of bagpipes. No. I'm just sensing that moment. I'm looking at the audience. Really? Is it carbon fiber? We have a box of bagpipes.

Yes. Five easy lessons. It might be more than that. I'm a little bit of a problem tuner. I have a problem tuning on the one hand. But on the other hand, I'm changing tuning. So this is in a different tuning than the last song. Oh, so we should have the roadies bringing you a different

guitar for each tune. Exactly. Running out on stage. Matt? Yes. That's right. So you're changing guitars between tunes. Well, in effect, yes. You know, changing the tuning. So there's been four or five different tunings that I've used tonight.

Carry on. So leave me alone, Bill. Just leave me alone. Although that was perfect filler because I was tuning. So it worked out. You guys should get an act. I should get an act. This is sort of written as a, I guess, a New Year's song. A song to celebrate the new year and the fact that the year is one trip around the sun for us.

trip around the sun for us. We have been weighed down by sadness like a stone We have yearned We have yearned We have sometimes felt so utterly alone While we turn While we turn We've been stricken by the wonder of it all Stricken down

Stricken down stricken down we have sometimes felt so faint we want to fall overcome but all in all I'd say this year in flight together has been fun what say

we make one more circle around the sun we have raised our fists in anger And we've tried To work it out Work it out That we need each other We cannot deny.

There is no doubt. There is no doubt. So let us weave another dream in outer space. While we're turning. While we're turning While we're turning On this planet home That holds our human race We still are learning

All in all I say this year in flight together Has been fun What say we make one more circle around the sun Say this year in flight together has been a good, good one What say we make one more circle? One more circle. One more circle around.

The sun. The sun. Thank you. Peter Mayer, singer-songwriter. And Bill Nye, the CEO of the Planetary Society. Here is the Planetary Society's Director of Projects, Bruce Betts. Welcome. Hi, Matt. Good to be here. I hope you had a good time. Great music. I have. It's been very nice. I don't know if this is what's moved you, if this is what turned you into an astronomer and a planetary scientist, but you probably just did it for the money.

It's the fame. Well, you're getting there. It was the hope that someday I'd be on a stage with Matt Kaplan. It's like a dream come true, man. I can't. I love you, man. All right, what's up?

So in the night sky, you can check it out this evening if we get out of here fairly soon. You can check out Venus low in the west looking like a super bright star, and that will be up for the next couple months looking fabulous. We've got Saturn up in the evening sky high in the south and looking yellowish and that'll also be up for for the coming months so it'll be good. We move on to this week in space history. We reflect somberly back 1971 the crew of Soyuz 11 perished during re-entry. But on a happier note we move on to something I'd like help from the audience. As always, those of you who have been here before know the trick.

I want you to help me say, random space fact. So on the count of three. One, two, three. Random space fact. Excellent. Thank you so much. Very nice. On Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter, the camera is a telescope.

It is a half-meter diameter telescope, the largest ever sent to another planet, and takes those spy satellite-type pictures of the surface of Mars. It's very cool. Quite a scope. And, in fact, we talked about it in last week's show with Matt Golombek and how incredibly helpful it was in getting all those landers,

all those rovers and other things down onto the surface. It's getting both easier and more complicated as we go along. There's better data, which means there's better data and more choices. I'm sure it'll be fine there. No, actually it won't. All right, we move on to the trivia contest.

There's this thing called the James Webb Space Telescope coming in a few years. Who was James Webb? Well, Bruce, I'll be happy to answer that for you as we drop out of our live show for just a moment. It was Jeff Kupp of Kirkwood, Missouri, who got the nod from Random.org this week. Jeff correctly told us that James E. Webb was NASA's second administrator and ran the agency during much of the Apollo moon program. Congratulations, Jeff.

You've won the last of the classic Planetary Radio t-shirts we'll be giving away on the show as we stock the shelves with the new design. Back now to Planetary Radio Live, where Bruce is about to give us the new space trivia question for you listeners at home. Don't shout out the answer to this one. This is for the next contest. People enter on the web, I'll tell you how. Kind of relevant, I would say, to today's show. Got me thinking, when did the first guitar go into space and on what spaceship? Go to planetary.org slash radio contest. Find out how to enter. And you have until Monday, July 1 at 2 p.m. Pacific time to get us that answer. And was it a carbon fiber guitar?

Probably not. time to get us that answer. And was it a carbon fiber guitar? Probably not. It did not have to be a carbon fiber guitar to qualify for this question. All right. Now the thing that everybody has stuck around for, and that is the live version of the Space Trivia Contest. So first, Matt, tell us, what are we giving away for those people? Oh, we are giving away the brand new, the second edition. This is the Planetary Radio T-shirt 2.0. So if you have a whole closet full of these from your past wins of the space trivia contest, now's the time to get back into the contest. Of course, it is beta testing, so. A couple have exploded, but no more than a couple.

It'll be fine. Just reboot. All right, we go on to questions for the audience, and I will attempt to throw T-shirts to the people who successfully answer. So just a very few days ago, we celebrated the 50th anniversary of the first woman in space. Who was that woman? I think we're going right up here.

Hi, sir, what's your name? I am Jeff McKibbin. And who was that woman? That was Sally Ride. That up here. Hi, sir. What's your name? I am Jeff McKibbin. And who was that woman? That was Sally Ride. That is incorrect. Incorrect. We're going to have to give somebody else a chance here. First American woman. There's your clue. That was Sally Ride. Sally Ride was first American. We're coming right up

over here. Hi, sir. It's been 30th anniversary. It was a Russian lady. I don't remember exactly her name. It was like Salvatana something. She was put into one of those treatment capsules. She wasn't really exactly an astronaut, but she flew up and became

world famous in Russia. Close enough? No. Not if we can get a name. Hi, right back there, miss. The name is Valentina Tereskova. That is correct. Congratulations. Congratulations. All right, get ready for the shirt toss.

Nicely done. Like a parachute opening on reentry. Yeah, I planned it that way. What is the second largest moon in the solar system? Shout it out loud. Titan. That is correct. Nice. You're really far in the solar system? Shout it out loud. Titan. That is correct. Nice.

You're really far in the back, aren't you? You can't make it all the way back there, can you? Yes, I can. Here he goes. I can see him. Watch out for the mic. Oh, thank you. That's very helpful.

Very close. The row in front. Thank you for the assist. Sorry. Sorry. Keep your heads down. Got a couple more? I do. I always have more. Ignoring Pluto. Not that you should the assist. Sorry. Sorry. Keep your heads down. Got a couple more? I do.

I always have more. Ignoring Pluto. Not that you should in general. What planet has the most elliptical orbit, so the least circular, the most squished out? Which of the planets? In our solar system. Eight. Let me be clear.

Mercury? That is correct. Mercury. Nice work. Nice work. All right. I can do this. I can do this. No, I can't do this. I almost killed someone. Check afterwards. All right. We talk galaxies. What's the closest large galaxy, by which I mean comparable in size to the Milky Way? What is closest besides the Milky Way? I want to see half the hands go up. Come on, Peter.

Even if you don't know the answer, raise your hand and make the man happy. Yes, I'm going to guess Andromeda. That is correct. The Andromeda Galaxy. The Andromeda Galaxy. Getting closer every day. We're going to meet up someday.

Hold your breath. There it is. All right. Good catch. Thank you. One more, maybe? Sure, one more. What is the only spacecraft to have ever visited the planet Neptune?

Only spacecraft? And I need the full name of the spacecraft. Middle name. Christening name. No, but I need the number. Social security number? Preferably. Not required. Way over on the side there. Hi. Is it Voyager 2? That is correct. Voyager 2. Very nice. Bravo.

I don't know. Not your best night. The questions are good. Listen, you still get a prize. Because last week... I get a prize? Well, remember I went to JPL to talk to Matt Golombek, right? And what do I do when I go to JPL? You buy me presents.

I buy you generally something junky, right? Something silly, a little tchotchke. I was trying to be nice. I got you something good. Yay! You ready? Describe it. Ooh, cool, it's a Hot Wheels Curiosity Rover. Ooh, ooh, it comes with an

actual radioactive source. That's right. Thanks, Matt. That must cost extra. Just don't hold it by its rear end end because that's the hot part, okay? I'm just going to leave that. We're done. All right, everybody. Go out there, look up at the night sky, and think about spacecraft.

And, yeah, just think about spacecraft. Thank you, and good night. We do all the time. He's Bruce Betts, the Director of Projects for the Planetary Society, who joins me each and every week for What's Up. And that's our show. Thanks once again to Emily Lakdawalla, Bill Nye the Science Guy, and our very special guest, Peter Mayer, who is going to play us out here in a moment.

Thanks also to our terrific audience here in Pasadena. And to all of you who joined us around the world on the live webcast. I'm Matt Kaplan, hoping that you'll be back next week for our next celebration of science and the cosmos. Clear skies, everyone. Peter, please play us out. Thank you, everyone. Peter, please play us out. Thank you, everybody. Planetary Radio is produced by the Planetary Society in Pasadena, California, and is made possible by a grant from the Kenneth T. and Eileen L. Norris Foundation

and by the members of the Planetary Society. We thank Southern California Public Radio for hosting us in the Crawford Family Forum. We had production support from SCPR's Janet Wachke-Hurst, Jason Georges, David McKeever, and Jenny Smith. SCPR's Executive Coordinator of Community Events and the Crawford Family Forum is John Cohn I'm Adrienne Kaplan