Planetary Radio: Space Exploration, Astronomy and Science - Amateur Astronomers Avoiding Armageddon: New Shoemaker NEO Grant Awardees

Episode Date: April 27, 2009

Amateur Astronomers Avoiding Armageddon: New Shoemaker NEO Grant AwardeesLearn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoicesSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Music Amateur astronomers avoiding Armageddon, this week on Planetary Radio. Music Hi everyone, welcome to Public Radio's travel show that takes you to the final frontier. I'm Matt Kaplan of the Planetary Society, which has just awarded its latest batch of Shoemaker Near-Earth Object Grants. We'll talk with planetary scientist Dan Derda, who headed the selection process, and with the first double awardee, Robert Holmes, director of the Astronomical

Research Institute. Bruce Betts will join us from Spain for this week's What's Up View of the Night Sky. Big news awaits you on the Planetary Society website where there's an article about discovery of the smallest exoplanet yet, just twice the size of Earth, and yet another found in the so-called habitable zone. And then there's a story that is just as exciting for some of us. Please welcome to Earth, Sanaya Rose Lakdawalla, born Thursday, April 23rd. Sanaya and her mom, Emily, are doing just fine. And now you know why we'll have a classic Q&A for you later today. Here's Bill Nye.

Hey, Bill Nye, the planetary guy here, vice president of the Planetary Society. And this week I'm all excited about electricity from space. Pacific Gas and Electric, which is a big utility in California. California, as you may know, is a state as big as the eastern seaboard of the United States. So it's made a deal with Solarin Corporation to beam energy from outer space to Fresno County, which is the eastern part of California, gather up this microwave energy from an orbiting station in space and put it on the power lines, make it into electricity for transmission. It'll run your computer and your light bulbs and maybe your radio.

You see, the thing is, this has been around a long time. We'll get energy, which is, if you will, more pure. It's not interfered with by the atmosphere. There's nothing to slow it down. It's not seasonally dependent. We'll get this energy from the sun directly in outer space. We'll convert it to microwaves, beam it down to a big wire grid all over the ground, and then we'll use that to make electricity. It's a fine idea, unless something goes wrong. And I don't mean to be a naysayer, I don't mean to be negative, but there's a lot of things to put in space on a huge area up there that have to be concentrated onto a relatively small area on the ground. I'm not saying it can't

be done. It's going to be expensive. This is going to be more expensive energy than nuclear power, if you can just imagine. It's going to be crazy expensive because of the cost of launching rockets and the cost of station keeping, of keeping the thing lined up. Now, if I am wrong, hey, bring it on. This could be the coolest thing. This could change the world. This could be the next big thing up there, down here. But I'm skeptical. So bring it on, Soler Incorporation. Let's see if you can beam this power down here and make money. Fly, get a fly. Bill Nye, the Planetary Guy. Six previous groups of Shoemaker-Neo grant winners have just been joined by three more awardees.

Created in 1997 as a living memorial to Gene Shoemaker, the great planetary scientist, this Planetary Society program has now enabled more than 30 astronomers to do a better job of finding or tracking near-Earth objects, asteroids that threaten our delicate planet. Dan Derda once again headed the very distinguished selection panel. Dan is a principal scientist in the Southwest Research Institute's Department of Space Studies. Dan, congratulations on selecting another three recipients of these Shoemaker-Neo grants. Oh, thank you, Matt, and congratulations to the selectees. Is this a particularly impressive group? Yeah, it was a great group. We had 12

proposals that came in from eight different countries. Three of those proposals rose pretty much right straight to the top. I think we got a really good batch this particular time. Now, before we have you tell us a little bit about these three, what's the process? What do they have to do to go after one of these grants? Well, it's a relatively easy process, actually. Proposals, the grant opportunity, I should say, is announced by the Society. The Planetary Society places all the information that you need to respond to the grant proposals right on the Society's webpage.

So it's pretty much a brief description of what it is that you can contribute to the search for and the characterization of near-Earth asteroids, these objects that not only are potential impactors on the planet and contribute to the impact hazard, but they're also wonderful opportunities for future exploration. So we'd like to learn a lot more about this particular population. All you need to do is go on the website, basically fill out the short sort of proposal text that describes what it is that you want to contribute to the program, and send it on in. And these are largely amateur astronomers, not exclusively, but largely. And, you know, astronomy is always saluted as this field in science where amateurs make a real contribution.

Oh, absolutely. And, I mean, we really do use the word amateur with big quotations and italics around it and so on, because, quite frankly, again, the quote-unquote amateur community can contribute quite a bit in this particular area. And in some cases, in some ways, they can actually contribute things that the professional community, the professional surveys can't in some circumstances, because either, believe it or not, sometimes the funding is either not available or the ability to rapid respond to objects of opportunity or the ability to simply spend the time it takes to follow up on and better characterize either the orbits or the actual physical properties of particular discovered objects, those opportunities, that time is just not available to the professional surveys. And so this is an area where the amateur community can really shine.

And of course, some of these people are very dedicated. We've talked to them and they're observing every night. Can you tell us just a little thumbnail about each of these three most recent recipients? Sure, absolutely. Russell Durkee in Minnesota, Robert Holmes in Illinois, and Gary Hug in Kansas. Russell Durkee is a pretty well-established observer. He's been focused on asteroid light curves in the past, and he's proposed to basically automate his observatory to let him get more nights

and basically triple the productivity of that particular program he's running. Robert Holmes is our first repeat recipient of a Shoemaker Award, and he's going to be purchasing a new CCD camera to go on one of several telescopes that he's going to be commissioning in 2009. And Gary Hugg also will be purchasing a new CCD camera for a 22-inch telescope that he's going to have online pretty soon. So it's a great set of selections that will help us better characterize these particular objects that the big surveys are out there finding. And we're not just fooling around here.

There have been real results from past recipients of these grants. Oh, absolutely. And even the current selectees, Gary Hug, for instance, has discovered hundreds of main-belt asteroids. He's won an NEO, and he's co-discovered a comet, for instance. Again, we already talked about Russell Durkee's very well-established asteroid light curve program, which tells us things about the shapes and characters of these little objects.

So again, it's a very, very productive group, and they're going to be even more productive now as they implement their Shoemaker Grant Awards. So what do they do? They get the money, they accomplish the upgrade that they proposed. Do they then keep the society informed of their progress? How do they report on their work? Yeah, we do actually ask all awardees in a very short and very informal way,

but we do ask them to keep us appraised of how their progress is going after the grants are awarded, maybe every six months or so, just to report in and tell us what they're producing so we can share with the rest of the society, see how those funds are actually contributing and really, really helping to this very important program. Just to put this in context, you started to address this, I think, but we can take another minute to talk about it. Certainly the search for near-Earth objects, major part of the mission of the Society, and something that is, I think, getting increased recognition as maybe somewhat important to the survival of our species. is maybe somewhat important to the survival of our species.

Oh, indeed. In fact, it was really highlighted just not many months ago when an object discovered by the Catalina Sky Survey, one of the major surveys, 2008 TC3, was discovered on its final plunge inward toward impact in the Sudan. This is, you know, for a long time we've been working on the assumption that our surveys are there for the purpose of providing us decades of warning time. And a new revelation, I guess, really sort of prompted by this discovery of this object, which then plunged right into the atmosphere, is that, in fact, it turns out that the very smallest impactors have a very high chance of being detected on their final plunge. And this is an area where, again, the amateur community can very well help in this particular

area to rapidly respond around the planet to be able to get those final crucial observations that can turn what used to be an astronomical object, a point of light in the sky, potentially contribute information on that object, which then maybe will deliver meteorites to the planet and help us establish and better establish that meteorite-asteroid link. So, again, an area where the amateur community can really help us out. I'm also thinking of the, what is it, a couple of objects just recently that have come a little too close to Earth for comfort, big ones. Yeah, at any given time.

I mean, literally right now, someplace out there between here and the moon is probably a small object the size of your office desk flying through our system undetected. These things come through all the time. Dan, thanks so much. I think we're going to move on now and talk to these recipients, at least one of them. And we really appreciate the work that you've done to help pick these folks out and set them on course for

helping us track the course of these objects that get uncomfortably close to our planet. Thanks, Matt. And thanks also go to our fine review panel as well of scientists from around the planet that helped select those awards. You bet. Dan Derda is a principal scientist with the Southwest Research Institute,

the Department of Space Studies at that renowned institute. He is an artist, a pilot, a cave diver, and, of course, a planetary scientist. And he headed the group that has selected these three new recipients of Shoemaker-Neo grants. And when we come back, we will be talking with at least one of them. This is Planetary Radio. Hey, Bill Nye the Science Guy here. I hope you're enjoying Planetary Radio. We put a lot of work into this show and all our other great Planetary Society projects. I've been a member since the disco era. Now I'm the Society's Vice President. And you may well ask, why do we go to all this

trouble? Simple. We believe in the PB&J, the passion, beauty, and joy of space exploration. You probably do, too, or you wouldn't be listening. Of course, you can do more than just listen. You can become part of the action, helping us fly solar sails, discover new planets, and search for extraterrestrial intelligence and life elsewhere in the universe. Here's how to find out more. You can learn more about the Planetary Society at our website, planetary.org slash radio, or by calling 1-800-9-WORLDS.

Planetary Radio listeners who aren't yet members can join and receive a Planetary Radio t-shirt. Members receive the internationally acclaimed Planetary Report magazine. That's planetary.org slash radio. The Planetary Society, exploring new worlds. Welcome back to Planetary Radio. I'm Matt Kaplan. Dan Durda has just told us about the Shoemaker-Neo grant program and its three brand new awardees. One of the astronomers honored has been through this before. Robert Holmes directs the Astronomical Research Institute in Charleston, Illinois.

He won his first Shoemaker-Neo grant in 2007. Bob runs quite an operation, as I learned from his website and in the conversation we had just a few days ago. Bob, congratulations on the reception of a second Shoemaker-Neo grant from the Planetary Society. That is quite an operation you have there. We'll get to that in a moment. But what

is this second grant going to do for you? It's going to increase our capability as far as CCD imaging is concerned and give us a lot better quantum efficiency on our imaging. So you'll be just that much more sensitive and able to keep an eye on that many more of these NEOs. Right. We can go fainter. And that is really the quest right now for this NASA project and for the Planetary Society is to get as faint as we can and track some really faint stuff. So NASA has given you some money to do essentially the same thing. Yes. They really allow our operations to take place, in particular with the Planetary Society to upgrade our equipment,

just kind of brings us all together. Did I read correctly on your website that you are the number one sort of follow-up agency for newly discovered near-Earth objects? Yes, we're the number one as far as total measures in the past calendar year, and for 2008 as well. We had around 11,500 objects and measures that we made of objects in the past year. Now, this is hardly the only thing you're doing, but it is obviously a big part of the operation. People really need to go and take a look at your website. We will put up a link, but what is the URL? There's two of them. AstroResearch.org shows our facilities, There's two of them. AstroResearch.org shows our facilities, it shows the telescopes, and KillerAsteroidProject.org is the one that actually is our education and public outreach program. And we will put both of those up at Planetary.org slash radio, where we always put relevant links. Again, I really recommend that people take a look. How did you get started with all this? It really began as an education program with the University of Chicago,

Yerkes Observatory, about nine years ago. And that's where we really got our start. So it has grown, I think it's safe to say, enormously since then. I mean, just looking at your facility, you operate a couple of very impressive instruments. And we have a new one that we're going to bring online next year that's a 50-inch telescope. Our website shows 48, but we just found out from the Mirror Casting Company that they're going to add two extra inches to that. And as far as amateur telescopes are concerned, it's definitely cutting-edge equipment. I think you prove something that we frequently say on this show,

that a large number of amateur astronomers are hardly amateur in the sense that that word is applied to many other professions and activities. Well, right. I think you're right in that capacity. Our function is to really support the discovery programs that are out there in near-Earth objects, and we can do that as an amateur group on virtually a professional basis. You also are very involved in education, which I had no idea about your activity in this area. Things going on in something like 13 countries and 80 different schools around the world?

That's correct. We're just getting ready to send out awards to all these schools in the month of May so that these can be handed out at awards day ceremonies. And we're handing out 600 awards to students and teachers around the world. Are these the killer asteroid certificates? Yes, that's correct. That's very entertaining. So what are people doing out at these schools, including high schools?

They're actually helping make the measures of these near-Earth objects for our program, and it also facilitates bringing near-Earth object research to the classroom, so teachers can really make an impact with science and astronomy right there with their students. You have made quite an impact just in terms of the discoveries. There's documentation of several of these on the websites, and one particularly beautiful animation of a comet in motion. What are you most proud of in terms of what you've actually accomplished with observing? Well, really, the main function is follow-up observations.

That's our most important function that we perform. Even though we've made some discoveries, our ability to follow up these near-Earth objects and provide long arcs that make them recoverable in the next several years is a very important part of this program. As far as an independent individual object, I would have to say we discovered a potentially hazardous asteroid on January 30th of this year, and that object was 2009 BD81. That, to date, is our best discovery. Talk about why it's so important to observe these rocks and other objects for an extended amount of time, to make them, as you put it, recoverable.

Well, it's one thing to discover a near-Earth object. If you don't continue to follow up these objects, they get lost. And if they get lost, there's no point to discover them. So our capabilities of discovering objects really is not an important aspect of what we do. Following up these objects and creating long arcs so that you can predict where they're going to be at in the future is paramount. And even beyond that, you have to be able to do this very faint. And we were able to do that into the 23rd magnitude. That is impressive. With all of this stuff going on, I think you probably still put in a lot of observing time. Don, I think you probably still put in a lot of observing time.

How many nights a week are you frequently sitting out there in your very sophisticated facility? I don't know how many nights per week. Last year we worked 187 nights during the year, about half the year. So I guess it would be around three and a half nights a week. Going to keep this up? It's going to be a big part of our future. We're looking to expand on our program for at least the next five years in near-Earth object observations and make this grant that the Planetary Society has given us really pay off for them. Bob, once again, congratulations.

I wish we had more time. Maybe we can talk another time about other things that the Astronomical Research Institute is up to. Good luck as you continue your work on keeping track of these objects that come dangerously close to our planet. Who knows, you might just save us a whole lot of trouble someday. Well, thank you very much. I appreciate that. You bet. Bob Holmes is the director of the Astronomical Research Institute in Illinois. You definitely need to take a look at his website and see some of the work that they are up to. It is a nonprofit organization.

And, Bob, I take it that you probably would not turn away any help that might be offered by people who believe in your mission. We would really enjoy having schools participate. And any schools that would like to participate are welcome to contact me at the Institute by email or by telephone. Good. I'm glad we got that in there as well. Thanks again, Bob. Thank you. And we'll be back to take our own regular look at the night sky. That'll be in this week's edition of What's Up with Dr. Bruce Betts, the Director of Projects for the Planetary Society, after we hear from Emily with this week's Q&A.

Hi, I'm Emily Lakdawalla with questions and answers. A listener asked, what's the long-term plan or destination for the Spirit and Opportunity rovers? Both of the Mars Exploration rovers have now been operating on Mars for more than five years, and they're still doing excellent science. But they're doing it at two extremely different landing sites that have resulted in utterly different personalities to their missions. Opportunity has always been the charmed one. Landing practically within arm's reach of bedrock, she spent the five years

alternating long drives across the generally easy terrain of Meridiani Planum, with long periods spent at impact craters that obligingly dug beautiful cross-sections into the lovely layered rocks beneath her wheels. She's recently embarked on her longest drive yet, striking for a huge crater called Endeavour, 12 kilometers to the south-southwest. It may take a couple of years to get there, but she'll stop at regular intervals along the way to gather measurements on convenient rocks. Spirit, on the other hand, has had to work much harder. She spent her youth hiking up and down mountains, but for the last three Earth years, she's been handicapped by a

stuck right front wheel, severely limiting her mobility. She's also farther south of the equator than Opportunity, so her activities are hampered by the season. Right now it's late spring and Spirit is able to be active again, as the sun is high enough overhead that Spirit's dusty solar panels can provide enough juice for her to work. She's currently heading around to the southern side of the volcanic edifice named Home Plate to study two mounds called Von Braun and Goddard, which might be more vents like Home Plate, or might be something else entirely. We won't know until she gets there. Got a question about the universe? Send it to us at planetaryradio at planetary.org. And now here's Matt with more Planetary Radio. Got a question about the universe? Send it to us at planetaryradio at planetary.org.

And now here's Matt with more Planetary Radio. It is time for What's Up with Bruce Betts, the Director of Projects for the Planetary Society. We have him on Skype, but it's what they call Skype Out, because it was the cheapest way to call him where he is right now. Buenos dias, or I guess I should say, buenos noches. Buenos noches. Tell us, where are you? I'm in Granada, Spain. You may ask yourself, why am I in Granada, Spain?

I did ask myself, but I'd rather ask you. I'm in Granada, Spain because tomorrow starts the Planetary Defense Conference. So we're going to work on defending the planet. It's a conference they hold every two or three years, bringing together all sorts of scientists and engineers who work on the near-Earth object, near-Earth asteroid threat. So it ranges everything from talking about how we discover and track these objects to what would you do if you found one to even a little bit of what are the legal implications. How appropriate, considering that we just talked to Mr. Holmes,

the winner of the Shoemaker-Neo grant, one of the three winners this year, about his work in this area as well. Yes, and I'm actually formally announcing the winners at the conference tomorrow. Tell everybody we say thanks for helping to keep us alive down here. I'll let them know. It's late there, and you're tired, so we should let you go ahead and tell us about the night sky.

Okay. So you checked out the occultation of Venus by the moon? Oh, you saw my tweet. Yeah. I did. You tweeted on Twitter, and I saw it and was so impressed. Let me tell you, talk about impressed. I was just flabbergasted. It was awesome. I was going through the desert, and I look over at the moon, and I literally do a double take in the middle of the desert between here and Las Vegas, which is where I was headed, on business,

the middle of the desert between here and Las Vegas, which is where I was headed, on business. And there was Venus, brilliant, just to the, like, lower left of this thin crescent moon, just a sliver of moon. And within an hour, the moon had swallowed up that big planet. It was completely occluded by about 4.10 a.m. And, of course, you had said that on the morning of the 22nd that this was exactly what would happen. Amazing, isn't it? I think you're psychic. The good news is after swallowing Venus, it spit it out again.

So you can still check out Venus but not being swallowed by the moon, but you can check it out on the pre-dawn with a host of other planets. All of them are over in the east. Jupiter is the highest up to the right, looking like a very bright star. To its lower left is Venus, looking like an even brighter star. And kind of below Venus a little bit is much, much dimmer reddish Mars, which is going to be a little trickier to see. And in the evening sky, we've got Saturn up high in Leo in the early evening, looking kind of yellowish. And we still kind of have Mercury hanging out low in the west shortly after sunset, looking like a bright star.

And that's the sky update. Let us go on to random space fact. I like the rolling R's there. I wasn't expecting much from you. You probably just made my neighbors in the paper-thin hotel walls mad. Sorry. Hey, if you weighed 100 pounds on Earth, which I know is roughly what you do weigh, man,

you'd weigh about 6 pounds on the surface of Pluto. Give or take, yeah. Six pounds? Yeah. Even with a heavy coat? Yeah, and you will need the heavy coat. Good news is you can bring a really heavy one, and it won't feel that way because of that low gravity. That's what I'm talking about. It's not like a long trip to Spain. I guess that would be longer.

Yeah. Let's go on to the trivia contest. We asked you, we were playing once again, where in the solar system, in this case, where in the solar system is Gandvik Patera? How'd we do on that? Everybody got it right. They mentioned that it is an irregular crater on Triton, Neptune's moon, Triton. Several listeners marveled at the fact that we actually have names for features on bodies that are this many miles or kilometers away, and that that's sort of a tribute to this

accomplishment by humankind. That's a good point. But you want to know who won? I do. David Benn. And get this. Forget about where in the world is Gonvig Patera. Where in the world is Klemzig, SA? I didn't recognize SA as South Australia. It looks like Klemzig, where David hails from, is a neighborhood in Adelaide, South Australia.

It is on Neptune's moon, Triton. 28 degrees latitude, 5.5 degrees longitude, approved by the IAU in 1991. David, that was more than enough to win you a Planetary Radio t-shirt, and if you'd like, a rewards card from Oceanside Photo and Telescope. So congratulations. Congratulations. If you'd like to try your hand at winning those fabulous prizes, enter the following contest.

In the spirit of the Planetary Defense Conference, not counting objects that actually hit the Earth, what was the closest pass to Earth of a known near-Earth object in 2009? So far, what's the closest call we had from a near-Earth asteroid, near-Earth object going by the planet that we knew of. Obviously, there's little stuff that we are just blissfully ignorant of. But what we know about in 2009, go to planetary.org slash radio, find out how to enter. Now, are you saying this is the closest ever,

or simply the closest among those that have passed near us this year? The latter, the closest among those that have passed this year. Thank you for the clarification. People will be able to enter by 2 p.m. on Monday, May 4th, May 4th at 2 p.m. Pacific time to get your entry in and secure your opportunity to win a Planetary Radio t-shirt. All right, everybody, go out there, look up at the night sky, and think about all the

different electrical plugs in the world. Thank you. Good night. Having a little challenge there, a little alternating current challenge? My adapter seems to be working. Oh, that's good. Okay. Well, listen, unplug yourself and get some rest there, and have fun at the conference.

Thank you. Bruce Batts is the Director of Projects for the Planetary Society. He joins us every week for What's Up, this time from the plains of Spain. Planetary Radio is produced by the Planetary Society in Pasadena, California. Have a great week. Thank you.