Planetary Radio: Space Exploration, Astronomy and Science - Pluto and Titan and Iran, Oh My!

Episode Date: November 15, 2016

Back to the annual meeting of the AAS Division for Planetary Sciences this week, where Mat Kaplan visited with experts on worlds of ice including Titan and Pluto, with a side trip to the dunes of Iran.Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoicesSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Pluto and Titan and Iran, oh my! This week on Planetary Radio. I'm Matt Kaplan of the Planetary Society with more of the human adventure across our solar system and beyond. I left out Pasadena. That's where I talked to so many of the scientists attending the AAS Division for Planetary Sciences meeting last month. We'll hear exciting stories from four of them, along with a post-election space exploration outlook provided by Bill Nye. The Lord of the Rings will dominate this week's What's Up segment with Bruce Betts. Emily Lakdawalla is the Planetary Society's senior editor. I caught her this time on a minor road trip. Emily, you're not too far from my new hometown of San Diego. What brings you down this way? Well, I'm here for a team meeting

of the Mastcam-Z team, which is the camera that's going to be on the next rover. And it's just a step that everybody has to go through in order to be able to safely get on a mission to Mars. to go through in order to be able to safely get on a mission to Mars. And remind us, MassCam-Z, that's the camera that's going to reveal Mars as never before from the surface, right? I sure hope so. We also have, it's not that it's never been seen before, but it is certainly a terrific view of Jupiter that you posted to the blog on November 10th. Yes, it's really gorgeous. This is a rotating image of Jupiter. It's actually made of data acquired over four separate days. And so it's a static image of Jupiter, but it's rotating over and over and over again

in beautiful animated GIF form. Never seen anything like it. Who did this work? This was by an amateur astrophotographer named Damien Peach, who is one of the greatest photographers of planets here on the surface of our Earth. And he's doing what many of the great amateurs do, which is to document Jupiter in all of its amazing beauty in ways that professional astronomers can't do. It is amazing what a so-called amateur can do nowadays.

They have amazing equipment, and most importantly, they have a lot of time that the professionals don't get on the really great telescopes. Before we leave you, just say a word about this other image that Damien created and you posted in this November 10th blog entry. It's actually the same image, just presented in a different way. One of them is a map that shows all of Jupiter stretched out on a rectangle. The other one is just the same map stretched onto a spheroid, the shape of Jupiter and rotating in front of you. All right, Emily, we'll let you get back to things there, talking about Mastcam-Z. What is your role, by the way? I am the blogger, so eventually I will be writing about how the process works to get a camera built and sent to another planet. How appropriate.

Thanks, Emily. Keep up the good work. I will. She is the senior editor for the Planetary Society, our planetary evangelist, and contributing editor to Sky and Telescope magazine. And the Planetary Society, of course, is the education and public outreach partner for the Mastcam-Z camera. Bill Nye, the CEO of the Planetary Society, is up next. Bill, no matter how one may feel about the momentous decision that was made in the United States last week, exploration will, I certainly hope, continue.

Well, yes, as near as we can tell, the Trump administration will be very pro-space because NASA is the best brand. NASA is the best brand the United States has. And spending money on space means spending money on Earth, which means jobs. And so as far as we can tell, the Trump administration will be advancing space science, especially human spaceflight, which could be good for planetary science because we want to get that space launch system and other bigger rockets like the Falcon Heavy flying so that the cadence of these big rocket flights will increase, which will then enable planetary exploration to places like Europa, Titan, Enceladus, where we'll make discoveries that I believe will change the course of human

history. And there is reason to believe, as we discussed on the most recent edition of the Space Policy edition of this show with Jason Callahan and Casey Dreyer, that the Trump administration will probably be pushing big time for a greater commercial development of space, private development of space. Could be a fine thing for space exploration, no matter what else is going on. So it's just an amazing thing, Matt. You know, we have these old processes in the United States and we picked a leader and here we are. We're going to explore the solar system and getting human spaceflight where the United States is sending astronauts to the International Space Station on United States built rockets is something I think that a lot of people want. It's going to bring a lot of people together. And so maybe we'll get that last little bit of funding to get this done and have rockets leaving

from Cape Canaveral to go to the space station with humans on board. As with so many other policies, it's sort of wait and see, Bill. And I guess this is a good place to start that journey. Thank you so much. Thank you, Matt. To the stars. That's Bill Nye. He's the CEO of the Planetary Society who joins us most weeks here on the show.

In a moment, we'll go back to the 2016 meeting of the American Astronomical Society's Division for Planetary Sciences, held in Pasadena one month ago. Joining me now at the table here in the fairly quiet exhibit hall, I guess because sessions are underway, are a couple of old friends of Planetary Radio, Rosalie Lopez and Mike Malaska from JPL. Welcome to both of you. Thank you. Hi, Matt. Rosalie, let me start with you because you're a past chair of DPS.

Tell me why this is such an important event for the planetary science community. The DPS is the largest gathering of planetary scientists in the world. It's not just American, although we are part of the American Astronomical Society, but we have people from all over the world. And this year is especially important because it's joined with the European Plantary Science Conference. So we have a lot of people and a lot of interesting results. And this is the first time that it's been a combined meeting? No, actually we have combined meetings every few years.

We have had them in Europe and we have had them in the States. Is this your first one? It's not, is it, Mike? No, I've done several of these conferences. What are the highlights that the two of you are hoping to see here? And then we'll talk about what the two of you have in common. Rosalie? I'm particularly interested in the newest Pluto results. We just had a plenary by Alan Stern, and Pluto just keeps being more and more and more exciting.

He says that Pluto is the Mars of the outer solar system, or the new Mars, and I say that Pluto is actually the new Titan. Ah, very interesting. So you must have been excited. I'm sure you'd seen it before, but he had that gorgeous image of what he said appears to be a cryovolcano. Yes, there are a couple of features on Pluto that, at least in terms of morphology, could be cryovolcanoes. And it's very funny because the main person actually proposing this on the team is my old friend Jeff Moore, who really argued against me when I proposed that some

features on Titan were cryovolcanoes. So last year he started his talk by saying, Rosalie must be laughing, but I'm going to propose that these features on Pluto are cryovolcanoes. I'm sure you were far too polite to be laughing, except maybe inside. Mike, what are the highlights you're here to look for? So for me, it's going to be also the Pluto images and data and information. And also a really nice presentation was given this morning at the plenary session by Matt Taylor on the Rosetta spacecraft. And that was really a very comprehensive look at comets from close up and learning how they operate, how the chemistry behaves, and their physical properties.

And that was just a really neat, comprehensive story about some very ancient, original material in the solar system. Sure are exciting times in planetary science. Very exciting. And talking about ancient material, New Horizons got extended and is going to go to a Kuiper Belt object, apparently an ancient one. Yeah. So, you know, I'm really looking forward to that. As people hear this, we will have already had Alan Stern as a special guest on a previous edition of the show. So hopefully he'll bring us up to date on some of that. Okay. You already mentioned Titan, which is what unites the two of you, right?

Right. So what's happening? Well, we are both giving presentations about the geology of Titan, and Titan is a very amazing world. It has a dense atmosphere, and so there is a lot of interaction between the surface and the atmosphere. and so there is a lot of interaction between the surface and the atmosphere. This also happens on Pluto, as Alan Stern was telling us,

but Titan has huge fields of dunes, Titan has, I think, cryovolcanoes, Titan has all the geologic, the major geologic processes that we see on Earth. Erosion, volcanism, tectonism, and impact craters, although there are not many impact craters, is a very young surface. So the more that we're learning about Titan, the more we're learning that it's a very sophisticated world. We definitely need to go back for multiple missions to try to tease out the secrets.

I knew we'd be getting to that, yeah. But it's got a lot going on. It's very interesting from both a physical geological processes and then also the chemical processes. It's a very big organic factory making all sorts of neat molecules in the atmosphere. And then those eventually rain down on the surface and they do all sorts of funky things that we don't quite understand yet. But we're now starting to do the laboratory work that figures out how some of those processes work. What do you think of those big liquid-filled canyons? Well, only recently we had some work by an Italian colleague

that actually showed that the canyons really are filled with liquid. We thought they were because we see this in radar that it's a very dark, smooth surface. But now we know that like the lakes and seas, they're filled with liquid. So Titan is a world where erosion is still happening. Those canyons are still being carved. A lot of stuff is still going on. It's a very dynamic world.

So like you said, we need to go back. With what? With a boat? A boat, an airplane, a lander. I think there's lots of different ways that you can explore Titan, and all of them will be able to give a different answer on one of the many facets of Titan. And if NASA gives us enough money, we'll be able to do all of them. It's always a matter of how much money are you willing to spend. Yeah, I'm sure it wouldn't be cheap, but the science available from a mission like that,

and also, I think, the inspiration of putting a great camera down on that fascinating world, which, as you know, many people now say, in many ways is more similar to our own than a world like Mars. I mean, what do you think of that? Right. Well, Titan is more dynamic than Mars at present time because we have these liquids flowing on the surface and it's the only other place in the solar system where we actually have seas and lakes and rivers filled with fluid. Only it's not water, it's liquid methane. So as Mike said, Titan is really weird. And what we find is that although there are so many huge differences, like in temperature, Titan is so cold that methane can be liquid.

Titan is so far away from the sun. And there are a number of differences. But the geology is actually very similar to the Earth's. So that, to me, is very interesting. So one of the weird things, though, is that the geology is very similar to the Earth's. So that, to me, is very interesting. So one of the weird things, though, is that the geology is very similar, but we don't actually know exactly what the materials are yet. That's still one of the big outstanding mysteries of Titan science. We all saw that beautiful image that Huygens-Lander took

of those real rounded cobbles sitting in a plane of some type of dark material sand, but we actually don't know what the composition of that is. Maybe it's water ice, or maybe it's some organic material, maybe it's a bunch of different types of organic materials. We actually don't know. That's interesting. The atmosphere that makes Titan so interesting,

because of all the interaction between surface and atmosphere, because of all the interaction between surface and atmosphere, also makes it very difficult from orbit to get composition of materials on the surface. So we're getting there with some steps, but it's very hard. I think we need landers, maybe a balloon would be very exciting. We need a new mission. A comprehensive mission, it sounds like. And we haven't even talked about, it doesn't seem fair that Titan has a whole hydrological system, although it's not water on the surface.

But now, apparently, a water ocean, maybe, underneath that surface? Yes, Titan is an ocean world. Like Europa. Yes. And maybe that material, that water material is coming to the surface or has come to the surface in the relatively recent past in the form of cryovolcanism. Or another option is maybe some of those organics have found a way to get down into the ocean. So now you have a subsurface ocean and you have all these organic materials somehow getting folded and dropped down into the deep ocean, then you have ocean water and organics, and you have a really nice

potential for some exciting stuff to happen. Yes. I think the two of you need to come out with a bumper sticker pushing a Titan mission. I'll put one on my car, and then we'll get it in the decadal survey, and that'll take care of it. Excellent. I sure hope that happens. Just the first day of DPS, so much more going on here today. Have a wonderful time visiting with your colleagues. And it's great to talk to both of you, and I know we'll do it again. Yes. Great to talk to you.

Thank you. Jet Propulsion Lab researchers Rosalie Lopez and Mike Malaska talking to me in the exhibit hall at last month's Division for Planetary Sciences meeting in Pasadena. In a minute, yet another conversation at my little table amongst the planets. This is Planetary Radio. Hello, I'm Robert Picardo, Planetary Society board member and now the host of the Society's Planetary Post video newsletter. There's a new edition every month. We've already gone behind the scenes at JPL, partied at Yuri's Night,

and visited with CEO Bill Nye. We've also got the month's top headlines from around the solar system. You can sign up at planetary.org forward slash connect. When you do, you'll be among the first to see each new show. I hope you'll join us.

Hi, I'm Kate. And I'm Whitney. We've been building a youth education program here at the Planetary Society. We want to get space science in all classrooms to engage young people around the world in science learning. But Kate, are you a science teacher?

No. Are you? Nope. We're going to need help. We want to involve teachers and education experts from the beginning to make sure that what we produce is useful in your classroom. As a first step, we're building the STEAM team.

That's science, technology, engineering, arts, and mathematics. So teachers, to learn more about how you can help guide this effort, check out planetary.org slash STEAM team. That's planetary.org slash STEAM team. And help us spread the word. Thanks. Bye. Bye. Welcome back to Planetary Radio. That's planetary.org slash steam team and help us spread the word. Thanks. Bye. Bye.

Welcome back to Planetary Radio. I'm Matt Kaplan bringing you more of the conversations with scientists. I recorded at the 48th gathering of the American Astronomical Union's Division for Planetary Sciences, which was also the 11th meeting of the European Planetary Sciences Congress. Janie Radabaugh is a planetary scientist and professor of geological sciences at Brigham Young University. In a few minutes, Janie will introduce yet another of the many researchers who attended DPS, someone with whom she now has a special bond. You're still jet lagged. You only just got back from a very unexpected place to go and do science. But maybe it shouldn't be unexpected.

Right. Exactly. I'm just still kind of reeling from being so amazed at this trip we just did this past week. We went to the deserts of Iran. You know, I never would have expected myself to be brave enough to try this and to go to a place so distant and so different in every way from what we think about as what we're used to in the West. And yet I just found myself drawn to that place because of the remarkable geology. With what in mind? Because it was an analog to geology, let's say, on Titan? Exactly. I study lots of features that are made by wind. Sand dunes. I study sand dunes all across the surface of Titan from Cassini. And something else that we found are wind-carved ridges. They're called yardangs. It's a Turkmenish word. And it's because there are many of these found in China and some of them found in Argentina. And I've been there to study these features in both China and Argentina, along with

Laura Kerber, who came with me, another scientist. And yet the world-class features really are found in Iran. And they're in the Lut Desert, which is in the southeast corner. It's the hottest desert on the face of the earth. They often record temperatures above 130 degrees Fahrenheit. Yes, it's very low and very dry. It's hyper arid desert and there are vast fields of yardangs there over 100 kilometers long, 50 kilometers wide, massive deposit of wind carved ridges. And we've been looking at them from space for a long time and just have, I've been drawn to them and trying to understand them and have been anxious to go there. So take that, Atacama. That's right. Did it prove to be as valuable as you hoped?

Absolutely. We, you know, we've, so we've been to these other locations, but we're trying to find a theme, you know, something that will help us understand how they form and evolve. Because we find them on Mars in great abundance, because Mars is dominated by wind at this point in its history. And we also think we see them on Titan, the moon of Saturn, also a windy planet. And if we can understand how they form and change, then we understand something about the materials that they're made into. And we may not understand that any other way for Titan especially. Going here, we started to find some commonalities. There's lots of sand in between the yardangs. There's gravel. They are really tall, but some of them are modified by water later on. That won't be true on Mars or Titan, we don't

think, unless it's modified by methane rainfall on Titan. But at the very least, we're finding things that help us understand them. And not only that, they were spectacularly beautiful. So great science, but it's also the cultural side of this trip that you've just made. And that's why we've got your colleague and friend sitting here. Would you introduce her, please? Yes, this is my friend Sana Hussaini, and she works at JPL, and she is from Iran. And I've known that for a while, and I've been so excited to come back and tell her about this trip and share these experiences. And Sana, you came here when you were two, you were telling me, but you went back to Iran for your undergraduate work. Yes, my parents and I, we moved back to Iran when I was 10 years old. would work? Yes, my parents and I, we moved back to Iran when I was 10 years old. But we went back to Iran when I was completely captured by the secrets of astronomy. I already had fallen in

love with astronomy by visiting NASA Houston Center. So when we went back to Iran, I was on my track to go and, you know, build my own small telescope when I was in junior high in Iran. And unfortunately, Iran had a huge astronomy community, amateur astronomy community. So some of the places that Jenny showed me the picture we've been to, Daesh Duluth and the deserts and mountains as well. There are a lot of mountains in Iran and but for complete different reasons. We took our telescopes there and we went there stargazing. I wasn't paying much attention to the rocks under our feet. And I was telling you, we have listeners in Iran. I know at least one fellow that I have

corresponded with who is part of an amateur astronomy club in the country. The astronomy in Iran has a huge base and it has a huge respect for the normal people. Everybody loves astronomy in Iran. Either it is culturally or the history that they have with astronomy. But it's something of a respect to everyone. I know people that they decided to buy a cheaper car or not buy a car to be able to buy telescopes for their kids. Wow. That's amazing. for their kids. Wow. So a lot of Americans hearing this may be quite surprised that you, Janie, were

able to go there and do science. And you, Sana, actually went back to do your studies there. And we're talking, of course, well after the revolution. After all, this is a culture with a very long history in science. It is. Well, we had just a discussion about that. And I think the news outlets, Iran has serious problems. It's not like it doesn't have the serious problems. But the news outlets in Western countries, in U.S. and Europe, they just portray a wrong set of problems. And the problems that they they portray most of them and it's not a real

problem in iran it's a problem around the countries of iran but let's say on geology there are uh you know people they go there's not really a good infrastructure for geology research studies laboratories or archaeology studies laboratories the infrastructure to find them, preserve them, and research and study them. That infrastructure is not there. So when people get these, you know, archaeologists' items, it instantly goes to black market and it comes out of Iran, which is devastating for Iranians, but at the same time, at least someone is preserving them. It is a very sad and serious problem for scientists.

Iran has the highest brain drain rate in the world for the last 18 consecutive or 20 consecutive years. These are the real problems that Iran has. So I'm a scientist. I am an astronomer, but I study comets and planetary atmospheres. And I design instruments to study comets. So when we're talking with Janie, and she is studying a geology aspect of what's in Iran,

these are the real problems on Iran. Is it more, you talk about the brain drain, is that more because of economics, because of the troubled economy in Iran, or is it more the politics? What is the regime's attitude toward science? For the science in Iran, and to this day, I consider myself an American Iranian. I was raised in Iran, and in here, more in Iran to the States than in Iran.

I see science among people has a huge respect. On that part, you would never, never ever have a problem on getting more taxes or more money for science because people always support it. But it's politics, but also infrastructure. After the revolution, Iran was in an eight-year war. And an eight-year war that it just sucked the entire juices of the community for that war. And that's the war with Iraq, of course. That's the war with Iraq. And they had to do that solely based on whatever they had from the Shah era. And when that type of an eight-year, it's a long time. It's a very long time. So the community

lost its sense of infrastructure. The schools were closed, the colleges were closed. You see like the generation of tinkers, scientists, engineers. And after that, there were huge sanctions against Iran. It just made it worse. And it unfortunately planted a platform for extremists. You know, when people are hopeless and angry, it's the worst combination. It is the worst combination. And you add, and you put more sanctions and you make them uneducated.

That's the worst dynamite in the world. You don't want to, you never want to combine these factors together. In any nation, of course. In any nation, in any nation. You know, Iranians or Canadians or Australians or Americans, they're all humans. You add uneducated people to ignorance and anger and hopelessness that it's going to just turn out any platform. But the science in Iran,

it's very exciting. And it's just the infrastructure is not there. They don't have a good platform for these things to come become a science. Janie, what was your sense from the people that you interacted with? You know, I had a very flat perception of Iran before I went. I didn't know what to expect. And I think I expected just a kind of gray, oppressive regime and just a difficult place. And when I arrived, I mean, it just absolutely became just three-dimensional and beautiful and just unfolded in front of my eyes.

And everything was so much more rich than I ever imagined. The culture, the history, and especially the people. People were just very warm and embracing of us as Americans to a person. I mean, everyone was very excited that we were from America and wanted to make sure that we felt warmly welcomed. Did you see a lot of curiosity about the work that you were there to do? Yes. We ran into a lot of people who were interested in why we would want to spend so much time in the desert and go through the hardship of camping down there, which of course we loved every minute of, but they wondered about that.

And we actually had a musician with us, a professional musician, and so we explored a lot of the musical heritage of the country, and that was just absolutely beautiful and wonderful. Were there any Iranian geologists or other scientists who joined you on this effort? This time we went as tourists. We were kind of doing a reconnaissance trip and trying to understand what we would be able to find. And now that we know the richness of the country and the landscape, I want to go back and collaborate with people there. So you do plan to go back? Absolutely. We only saw a tiny corner of the Yardang Field and of the Lut Desert,

and there's just so much more to explore all across Iran. So we will go back. How about you, Sona? I would love to go back. My parents go back every year. I would love to go back. It's just been lots of working and studying. You know, U.S. has this reputation that the rest of the world knows.

We get very little vacation time in here. People in Iran and Europe, they have a lot more vacation time. So I definitely would love to go back and do science over there, yes. I wish both of you the best of luck and that you hope to make that trip. And boy, I would love to join you. But regardless, I hope again, Janie, that you get to do some terrific science when you go back. And Sona, the same for you. And I've got to look for the name of that fellow I told you about who has the Amateur Astronomy Club. Definitely. And thanks very much for joining us for a few minutes here.

And have a great time at DPS. Thank you for having us. Janie Radabaugh of BYU and Sona Hosseini of JPL, talking with me at the 2016 meeting of the American Astronomical Union's Division for Planetary Sciences. In the coming weeks, you'll hear more of the great conversations I recorded there. Time for What's Up on Planetary Radio. We are therefore joined by the Director of Science and Technology for the Planetary Society. That's Bruce Betts. Welcome back. Thank you, Matt. It's good to be back. How are you? You don't sound very cheerful. I'm fine.

I will. Don't worry. Okay. I'm counting on it. Maybe when you tell us about the night sky. Oh my gosh, Matt. The night sky is so cool. That's more like it. Thank you. Venus, early evening. Check it out. Low in the west, looking super bright. To its upper left, Mars getting dimmer and dimmer, but still looking like a fairly bright reddish star. And in the pre-dawn east, we got Jupiter looking super bright, and the bright star Spica is below it, though not nearly as bright as Jupiter.

What about that super moon that some people were getting excited about and others were saying, meh? Gosh, Matt, let's come back to that in just a minute or so. Thank you. This week in space history, 1969 Apollo 12 mission happened, and second humans to go to the surface of the moon and play with moon rocks. We move on to space land. That's the dueling banjos edition.

So, yes, this super moon, super moon being a colloquial term that's basically been accepted now of when the full moon occurs near perigee, so closest point to the Earth in the moon's orbit. So it's a little bit bigger, a little bit brighter because the moon does have an elliptical orbit. Basically you get a closer, so brighter moon, particularly on a cycle of about every 14 months. So on November 14th, the moon was technically closer than any other full moon since 1948. Wow. Okay. But this is, this is the, so philosophically this is really cool. Practically, observationally, it was only about 80 kilometers out of 356,000 kilometers closer than it will be next time around on January 2nd, 2018. So the next part of this 14 month cycle. second 2018 so the next part of this 14 month cycle and this full moon was only one tenth of less than one tenth of one percent brighter than that full moon in january of 2018 and only about 1.3 percent brighter than last month's full moon so pretty much observationally impossible to

distinguish although it is uh it is possible to tell between, say, a perigee moon, a supermoon, and an apogee moon, then it's about 14% bigger in diameter and about 30% brighter. So full moons do vary, but it did not swallow the Earth, as you may have noticed. All right, so it sounds like the mehs, meh, mehs, would have it. But, you know, any reason to go out and take a look at the moon and a beautiful night sky is a good reason. So, fine, we hope you did. On to the contest.

We were playing one of my favorite games that we invented. Where in the solar system is Gandalf Kallis? Where in the solar system is Gandalf Kallis? How'd we do, Matt? Big, big reaction to this because I think there are so many Lord of the Rings fans out there. Almost every entry we got

made some L-O-T-R reference, although we did have Emma Jackson in Feldefing, Germany, point out that there are also features on this body named after characters from Isaac Asimov's Foundation series and Frank Herbert's Dune series. But we're worried about Gandalf right now, and we should worry because he gets himself in trouble. Where is it? Where is Gandalf Kallus? Saturn's large moon Titan. Kallus meaning hills. So they're sets of hills and they're named after Lord of the Rings characters on Saturn's moon Titan.

Well, you've made especially Tim Hastings very happy with that because that's the answer he gave us. He's in King of Prussia, Pennsylvania, and he is, because he was chosen by Random.org, going to get the Planetary Radio t-shirt, a Planetary Society rubber asteroid, and a 200-point itelescope.net astronomy account, that worldwide network, non-profit network of telescopes, which you can do some really cool stuff with. Take a picture of the supermoon. And we're going to give it away again next time. But first, a couple more of these from Anne Grunseff in Green Bay, Wisconsin.

Future astronauts are wise to beware the Barrow Whites because they may be lurking in the hills there on Titan. They are, after all, not that far from Angmar Montes. Deep, deep L-O-T-R here. I got it. I got it.

And not just one, but two poems this week the first from our poet laureate Dave Fairchild hills on Titan have been given names from middle earth Arwen Bilbo Gandalf Collis have all been given birth why you asked was Tolkien used these features names to call

cause Titan circles Saturn with the rings to rule them all and this for Mark Schindler regular listener though I don't remember getting a poem from him before it makes some sense for Saturn spots to be named for Middle Earth on Titan though warm hobbit holes there seems to be a dearth Its smoggy skies make seeing bad. It's hardly clear as glass, so Gandalf can stand up and shout, Light, you shall not pass! You like my Gandalf?

Were those smoggy-sized skies? Oh, the Tolkien humor. Oh, Gollum. Get us ready for next time. All right. On to something precious. I'll bite. On what date will be the next full moon that is closer,

by just a little bit, than the one that occurred on November 14th, 2016? What date? Go to planetary.org slash radio contest. Wow. All right. I'm sure you can find this and go for that prize package, but you got to get it to us by 8 a.m. on Tuesday, November 22nd. That's 8 a.m. Tuesday, November 22nd. And we'll put your name in the hopper. We're done. All right, everybody, go out there, look up at the night sky, and think about trying something new while I try to avoid it.

Thank you, and good night. Have it with the anchovies. You might be surprised at how much you like it. Ah. That's Bruce Betts. He's the Director of Science and Technology for the Planetary Society, and he joins us each week here for What's Up. Planetary Radio is produced by the Planetary Society in Pasadena, California,

and is made possible by its worldwide members. Daniel Gunn is our associate producer. Josh Doyle composed our theme, which was arranged and performed by Peter Schlosser. I'm Matt Kaplan. Clear skies.