Red Scare - I'll Be Missinger

Episode Date: December 8, 2023

The ladies discuss Henry Kissinger's legacy, Ridley Scott's Napoleon, and Stuart Seldowitz's Islamophobic harassment campaign.

Music We're back. We're back. Another eventful week in the news. There has been a lot of eventful stuff that we're not going to cover. Yeah. Like the stuff in Ireland and the DeSantis Newsome debate, neither of which I particularly care about. I didn't watch the debate. Don't care. Ireland can't understand what anyone's saying. So...

Was like trying to follow that and then I was like, what do I do? I don't even follow their migrants are a foot. Yeah, always. Yeah. Whatever. Yeah. We're going to talk about Henry Kissinger. He did us a solid by dying.

Yeah, and giving us a good docket item. I guess the theme of this week's pod is a great, yeah, misunderstood man who walk alone. Napoleon, Kissinger, Stewart, what's his name? Seldowitz. Seldowitz, yeah. But a great question mark. He's listening to find out. Well, I mean great in the purely technical sense, not in. Well, what it's all the words really do, he was nothing. He harassed the whole other. Yeah.

He's not great. He's like a minor footnote. But Napoleon and Kissinger are both ethnic and cultural outsider manlets, short kings, who overcame adversity to achieve greatness. Yep. And they did it for pussy. Yep. One, what hey, you're telling me for the first time. What can you say? He let an incredible life. And I'm glad we're gonna address him first. While we are still sober. Yeah. Because I do have a lot to say. Good. I, and we can end on the high note of one of our highly anticipated movie reviews.

I, yeah, I took an ad or all to watch some YouTube videos. So I've been studying hard all day. But it's true yet he had a remarkable life. Oh, before. Yeah. But it's true yet he had a remarkable life before yeah, I'd also I don't know if you know RIP Reddit user ghost hardware What

Who ran the black scare? Wait, what so I brought it Wait for real. I still I yeah How do you know that? Someone else someone who knows him in real life Wait for real. Pasta way. Yeah. How do you know that? Someone else, someone who knows him in real life posted on one of the threads. That's Sabs now defunct because he ran. Oh my God.

I'm like, I'm shaking. Yeah. I know. That's so horrible. I know. I don't know how he passed or I don't know the details but I did I like searched in my in my notes for his screen and I had like actually a lot of screenshots. Yeah he was one of our fairest critics, I would say.

Well I found, um, and we met him in Toronto. Wait, we did? Yeah, he was there. He, I guess I won't dox his name or appearance, but he was like a very sweet and enthusiastic young man who said like, I hope Dalsha goes on to have a great film career and I hope you write a book and you girls should keep at it and he was like really nice and encouraging. Yeah, I found a post of his where he said, this is super sad. He said, I'm right or die for the girls. Unfortunately, I pray for their success, mental spiritual, because if they can make it, then I can make it.

And we all can make it. That's so sad. I-P goes to Hardware. I know. Fuck. Shout out. So good luck pirating the page. I was just, no.

No, I'm just kidding. He was doing a good service. It's like the ring, the next person who takes on that role who will also mysteriously die at an early age and just gets passed down. Oh fuck. Sad. Well, I hope he to let a remarkable life gone too soon. Just like Henry. Fuck, I'm really like Shook.

Sorry, I thought you knew. No, no, no. Sorry. No, it's okay. Seems like, yeah. OK, well, Henry Kissinger. Henry Kissinger. He led a remarkable life.

What can you say? His family fled the Nazis, and he was a teenager. He served in the US Army during World War II. He served as a consultant to various government agencies and think tanks before assuming his role as Secretary of State under the Nixon and Ford administrations His undergrad thesis the meaning of history reflections on Spangler toin B&Conn to his doctoral thesis piece in legitimacy and equilibrium Bengler, Toine, Biancaunt, his doctoral thesis, peace and legitimacy and equilibrium. A study of the statesmanship of Castlerog and Meternick. I bet you can guess what a sign is. Leo?

Gemini. Oh, yeah. Interesting. Yeah. I didn't, I, yeah. He was, I didn't like to look into it. He was back before there was back Writing tracks on philosophy and speaking in a fake ass accent

Right his book nuclear weapons and foreign policy. We all know and love it. Of course Definitely read that one formative tax I definitely I mean, I, you know, it's been so long of people like wishing death on him that now that it actually happened, I was like, I googled, what's the worst thing Kissinger did? Yeah, I mean, we'll get into that. Cause I was like, actually, what did he, I mean, he did do some not great thing. Yeah, I mean, I have a whole lot of takes on this.

Okay. I really was asidious in my quest for fact finding on this one. Nick was in. This is, Nick was in. on this one. Nick was in. Nick was in. Nick was in. Nick was in. Nick was in. Nick was in.

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um... under his his desk in the oboe office but because uh... of where they were placed uh... a lot of the audio has like rattling of like coffee cups over there like dam he's a red-skinned president for free.

He had bad audio quality and everything. And they were just throwing around those racial slurs. Do you think you're the Nixon or the Kissinger? I mean, I guess I'm the marginally Jewish one and shorter. Yeah. And I'm paranoid. And Yeah, and I'm paranoid. Yeah, and more all American. But Christian, Quaylor.

And yes, yeah. But can I use your lighter? I do find Kissinger to be a broadly sympathetic and relatable figure that's not just a contrarian posture I'm taking to own the lips and the leftists like I've always felt a weird affinity for him even before I knew what leftism and leftists were and like I literally would not be surprised if we're related because he do be having a pronounced filtrum. He do. And he looks, they are so photopony, he was young, he looked like a young and frank.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. He does have an intelligent face. I stand by that. I wasn't just doing contrarianism. Yeah, and the way that like gold in my ear also has an intelligent face or like, metal and all bright, you know, Jewish. Yeah. Yeah. What I might, I definitely, in a very uninformed way, I never had passionate hate for Kissinger, but I did kind of swallow the party line. Yeah.

I was kind of like, yeah, fuck that guy. So many people say he's pure evil, so he must have done something really bad. But I really take umbridge with the amount of people whenever someone like Kissinger, but especially in Kissinger's case, people love to throw around the phrase burning in hell. All of a sudden people become dogmatic theologians and think they can opine about eternal punishments inside. And that to me is super annoying because it's like, why do you think you're not going to have a... I know, I know what makes you think that you're not also, yeah.

Like, at least he was a prominent and successful statesman in diplomat. You're go weird, cum or in your basement with a pair of huge fake tits. No, no one believes in hell until like someone they don't like die. Yeah. They're like, sees on the opportunity to like, invoke it, but it's like, guess what? What do you think, Helen? Hell awaits us all.

That's the philosophy of Henry Kissinger, by the way. This is from Wikipedia. His approach to diplomacy took it for granted that as long as the decision makers in major states were willing to accept the international order, then it is quote legitimate with questions of public opinion and morality dismissed as a relevant. I don't know if he took it for granted or just factored it into the calculus and granted I'm boldly ignorant of basic history but I read the Wikipedia

and I still really fail to see what it is that earned him the role of America's top or criminal according to Anthony Bourdain. I think that while Christopher really fail to see what it is that earned him the role of like America's top war criminal according to Anthony Bourdain. I think that well Christopher the Christopher Hitchens wrote the whole book about how he's a war criminal which will not read Christopher Hitchens by the way also by that standard going to hell yeah as a the way I have a soft spot for him too. Proud Athea, you know, like if Kissinger's and Halle's courtesy Hitchens.

Yeah. All of finely squashed their beef. The big thing is the Cambodia. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And so I want, I would like to get to that. But like, I mean, with all due respect, I think the man was a foreign policy realist, real politics.

Yeah, which is like not to say that I think that he's some like, infallible genius who's above being motivated by ideology and doesn't have blood on his hands. I think that that's the reputation that he wanted to cultivate for himself, minus that last part. If I were to psychoanalyze it,

he, I think it has to do with his formative early childhood experience under Nazi Germany, which he was notoriously tight-lipped about and claimed didn't influence his worldview or policies in any way shape or form. He sat in this interview with the D. W. some German company that made the documentary, he said that he as a youth took was like being like pummeled by Hitler youths in the soccer stadium. And then when he enlisted in the army

in World War II, that he didn't have any sense of vengeance, he thought it was like categorically wrong to treat the Jews as like a group in the same way it was wrong to treat like the Germans as like a group. Yeah, I think he did. Well, I think that he didn't want to seem weak or like he was playing the victim card. He's a pick me. Yeah. But for Jewish identity, he's not like the other Jews. Yeah. But anyone who claims they're not trying to be popular, anyone who leads with

that formation as he sometimes did is obviously lying. I mean, this was a man with great ambition who was certainly like very self-conscious, I think. Like he'd clearly thought through all this stuff. Many people describe him as anxious and self-conscious. Yeah, and melancholic. And I'm like, I know that like, I was doing some pro-kiss content on the TL, but I'm like really not trying to suck off his corpse like an IDF widow. That's not my intention here.

I just don't think that he gets fair billing on the left at all. No, he's just, he's vilified and they like take the ugly and they're over socialized and suffer from resent amount and he is a cause of like narcissistic injury for them. That's what it feels like to me, but they let things, they're like, well, I'd in carpet bomb Cambodia. Well, yeah, because they have absolutely no idea what it means to actually be in power and make a decision.

Compromising moral decisions, yeah. But it seems like he really supported intervention only when he felt it was necessary and only for reasons that advanced US interests. The other thing is like he really did never cave to all the human rights moral fagging. Which seems like a nice thing in theory, but unlocks, untold, and unspeakable evils in practice. I mean, we talked about this with the Gerard

episode. The human rights framework, as I see it, is really like the anti-Christ. It appears on this earth pretending to be something that it's not. It's like Damien from the Omen. I think he was acutely aware of that and overcompensated in the other direction in a way that makes him seem much more monstrous and demonic than he really was. I think he really leaned into that role of the villain at some point. Yes, but in his hey in like, his heyday, he was after he got the Nobel Peace Prize, he was pretty like, pop, he did like acquire

a kind of celebrity and was famously quite the latest way of the golden age. And also it was pretty highly effective. Which does nothing to refute the rumors that he was a homosexual. I the rumors that he was a homosexual. I don't think he was a home. I know, but there were all these rumors flying that he like, consorted with like, ramp boys and cabana boys at some hotel and

did it. There was a famous like segment that was circulating on Twitter recently of Pat Buchanan like chimping about these allegations. Here's the anecdote. So when the Republican ambassador to Buenos Aires became very concerned about the desparacitos, who were people who were disappeared in Argentina by the US-supported military regime there, Kissinger said that the notion of this guy as like a passionate

human rights advocate was news to him and his associates. I think he had a good bullshit detector for people who use like empathy and compassion to drive through their own moral and political imperatives. And he was really deeply suspicious of that as a Jew, but an outsider among the Jews. Yeah. And yeah, I mean, I guess the Secretary of State under Nixon, he basically normalized relations with China and he negotiated peace in Vietnam in the Middle East. And obviously he had some blunders, Cambodia, Bangladesh, Chile, Argentina, but I think also the

objective at the time was curbing the influence of like the USSR and communism. So all those decisions stem from the war. And we had an ideological foe. Yeah, and people on the world say, like he personally started the Vietnam War and that he personally genocide at all those bingolies. Yeah. Not that he doesn't have blood on his hands. Yeah, no one's disputing that, but anyone at that level, power, he doesn't. Yeah, exactly.

Probably the isolationists have the best and most legitimate arguments against him. But then again, you can't really be an isolationist if your main adversary is not an isolationist. Well, that's the thing. Yeah, it'd be amazing if we could all like, I just posted a, I reposted another UN post that said we need peace And yeah, it'd be great like if we could all agree to disagree and we could all we could all say we need peace Like that's a really it's really easy to say we need peace But it's not so easy in practice. Yeah, he was willing for better worse to make like tough moral choices that most people are neither willing

or able to make. I want to read a passage by Steve Saylor here. Scott seems to bring only two opinions that distaste for the French and a distaste for war. The title card at the end tallies up the death toll from the Napoleonic Wars at 3 million. On the other hand, was Napoleon's role in all this tumultrally egregious, or did he simply play the game of thrones by the rules of his time better than anyone else did? That's obviously from his review of Napoleon, but I think that it applies just as well to the life and deeds of Henry Kissinger. Well, as Tolstoy also says about Napoleon and Warren P's that leaders are the slaves of history. Yeah, there are the ones that take the hit that take the fall.

It's not really an enviable place to be in. No. It's not really an enviable place to be in. No. I mean, the history of mankind is one group vanquishing another group through violent or fair and conquest, burning down their villages, raping their women, killing their children, and so on and so on. But like, back in the day, there were no like, media watchdogs or human rights commissions to monitor all this activity.

So most people simply accepted it or they didn't and they retaliated. He said in this 2008 interview, which I'm sure he had said prior, his justification of the secret bombing of Cambodia was that he was, you know, was, did it, was prepared to do it, thought that there would be protests, either from Cambodians or North Vietnamese or Americans, that there would be, or North Vietnamese or Americans that there would be, he thought that there, I don't actually think this is true, but he says that he was like prepared for it to go to like a UN

council and that they would, you know, pay the price for whatever like damages they incurred and that was like something that he factored into his decision, but when Operation Menu did take place, no one did protest, and so then it became kind of secret, but of course it was all the idea was always that it would be secret. Yeah, but that was sort of his justification was that he was anticipating that there would be an investigation that he was ready to like answer to. But that did not take place and then there was like a New York Times smoking gun. He's that like started the whole like surveillance apparatus of the Nixon administration as like a breach of security. But basically he was saying like it's easy to ask for forgiveness and permission.

He's just a he's a real Machiavellian MF. Yeah and he's justified the mean. Yeah he's sneaky and shady and like all jamanize a flip flper, which I think primed him for being a top negotiator because he could change his mind on the drop of a dime. But yeah, and in that way he is the opposite of somebody like Norm Finglestiner Larry Kramer because he appears to be like devoid of empathy, whereas they're like dripping with it. And it's because he never really permitted any emotionalism

to enter into his public or like semi-public decisions. Yeah, on like Nixon. Yeah, but I mean, I think that that's also naturally viewed as, with its viewed with suspicion as being untrustworthy. Well, it is untrustworthy. And condescending. But I think that it is. But it is, he is unscrupulous.

He is. He is unscrupulous. And he is, I mean, he coined the term constructive ambiguity. Yeah. Which is a very Jewish way of saying lying. Yeah, I see that. I'm like obscuring lying. Or like just omitting.

Yeah, like lying by omitting. I'm under the guise of like diplomatic dealings. Yeah, and again, I think if you were gonna psychoanalyze it, it all comes down to his... That is treacherous. Yeah. No, no, no, it is for sure. But I think that in the realm of geopolitics and foreign policy, it is the correct position to take because if you don't take that position, you make yourself vulnerable to these empathy mongers and emotional terrorists who will again like attempt to counter you with their own no less shadowy imperatives

but claiming like a moral high ground on the basis of like humanitarianism which I think is far more evil. I think it's in the grand scheme of things. But both are disingenuous. Yeah, but one is more so. Yeah, I like his way of doing things better. Hitchens, I watched it and interviewed with him, talking about his book where he said that Kissinger was responsible for needless deaths

in the service of his own vanity Which I don't think was Really the case I think it even could be the case I think though he did become like very popular eventually He was not initially definitely not within the next administration Mm-hmm and many aids and stuff like resigned around the time the Vietnam war and there was a lot of like he was not initially definitely not within the next administration and many aides and stuff like resigned around the time of the Vietnam War and there was a lot of like he was vilified and pretty unpopular definitely seemed like at least the people who knew him like no one liked him

yeah and I think they respected him yeah which flattered his vanity maybe by the Hollywood Illuminati and like a beautiful and famous actresses and models loved him, which I think play. Well, he played his power. Yeah, for a decent. Yeah. They let you do it. I would have let him hit me too. He's a hard one for me. Hard one. I sat on Twitter that he had an intelligent face in spite of being frankly

medically short and not that handsome, but I actually do think he's handsome in a Peter Sellers kind of way, which is funny that Peter Sellers basically per plays the Kissinger character. Yeah, and yeah, when he was younger and even into his middle age was like very handsome. And yeah, power simply is an effort. I'm just, I'm, I'm a competent man. It's a try. Yeah, I'm just peaked, but who, you know,

triumphs in spite of himself and his shortcomings, but I'm just very peaked by his psychology and his personality. This is from the inevitability of tragedy, Henry Kissinger, and his world by Barry Gowin. Kissinger lived the opposite contradiction, appreciation of the virtues of the middle American common man, but skepticism about democracy. He may have seen naive to his academic colleagues because of his love of his country, but to him they were the naive ones because they lack the imagination to understand how badly things could turn out. Liberty and free elections notwithstanding. Democracy was admirable when the conditions were right, but it was no security blanket, no all-purpose

panacea. Even when he was employed by the Council on Foreign Relations in the 1950s and 1960s, working with some of the finest minds in the foreign policy establishment, Kissinger felt a European superiority to the optimistic Americans who tended to believe that peace was the normal state of affairs in the world, that the United States represented a universal prototype that every problem had a solution and that the solution was always the same democracy and then more democracy. I mean, I think that's a vision that we, RedScare podcast, can fundamentally vibe with. Yeah.

It just seems like, you know, it's like a very burn-him-esque version of events. And I really, I love all of his comments on Jewishness. The ADL recently tried to pin him as quote, unapologetic about his heritage. But again, he famously downplayed the influence of living in and fleeing Nazi Germany on his outlook later on in life. He was very much a quote, self-loathing Jew. He famously said, if it were not for the accident of my birth, I would be anti-Semitic. Any people who has been persecuted for 2000 years must be doing something wrong.

People always bandy about this quote at face value, but obviously he's making a joke and it's the best kind of joke because it seems so mean and insulting on the surface, but it's actually so self-deprecating. And he, I heard in this talk after his second marriage that the Jewish community was, quote, scandalized because not only did he marry a Gentile, he married her on a Saturday. Which he did on purpose. He's a messy bitch who lives for drama. He also famously called the Jews self-serving. This was in response to the American Jews law being the Nixon administration on behalf

of their Soviet co-ethnic. He called the play of the Soviet Jews not an American concern, maybe a humanitarian one. Yeah, I think Kissinger and Nixon work together well as a duo. They understood the American Jews quote, put the interests of Israel above everything else and that their control of the media made them dangerous allies. They sought to exclude Jewish Americans from policy making on Israel.

But Kissinger was allied in allied Israel. Yeah, ultimately. He, the Yam Kapoor War. Yeah, again, he just like me for real, except I'm a powerless loser. Decision-making capability. And also an under-chiefer. I mean, RIP notice respect, you know, but all, you know, his, where people do give him credit is his, like,

diplomacy during the Cold War, the day taunts, the ideas around, like, mutually assured destruction and stuff, but I could have come up with them. If it were me. Making verbal agreements. Yeah, that always seemed mad. Among enemy powers, mutually assured. With no channel of communication, you don't say. Easy. Hey, easy. Yeah, I don't think he had a particularly flattering view of his own people, but he was also clearly very protective of them.

Sure. It was like, it's very me against my brother, but my brother and me against the world. Well, I think he did, he was not like, I don't know, like someone like George Soros, I think is actually like a chaos agent. Yeah. And to Kissinger's credit, he like almost autistically believes in like a structural design or a legitimacy. Yeah, or just like a way of like maintaining an equilibrium that he's ultimately invested in that isn't he's not a rabid ideologue and he wants ultimately like

er, wanted. I think that he's way more ideological than people give him credit for because being anti-ideological is also its own type of ideology. Yeah. Well, yeah, and that, yeah, his ideology was a kind of stability. Yeah, I mean, I think it was a contempt for ideologues. Yeah. Because he didn't like tribalism or ethno-narsicism

of any sort. That seems, yeah. Which I fully get his position. But in that way, he's a fundamentally unlikeable and condescending character because he serves everyone there narcissistic injury. Because he is, quote, above it all. And he was, uh,

what that's, yeah, that's the principle of real politics, right? That's the idea is that you have to be ready to do things that you might not want to do. Mm-hmm. In the interest of, uh, maintaining like a status quo.

Well, he said, I think that he believed that there could be a global society that would be governed by interdependence. But that's something that could possibly go wrong. That's a face value statement statement and then underneath that is like someone he understood someone still had to like maintain the power of that style of like governance and security. Yeah, and I think people now try to pin on him that he was kind of like a proto-neocon before that word was even admitted neocon before that word was even admitted because in pressing American interests, he did also call

for a lot of interventionism, but I don't think he's like a neocon in the standard sense because part of their gospel is like, quote, promoting democracy, right? At least rhetorically or symbolically. And he was more honest than that because he was a big hater of democracy. Well, he did, I mean, he did all of a sudden dirty. What did he do? He, in the 70s went to Syria and this is when I can't actually totally grasp the details exactly of what he did, but basically he knew. This isn't even your fault though because it's Middle Eastern politics and that's a wrap so. it's Middle Eastern politics and that's a ratchets. He was doing shuttle diplomacy. He was like bopping all around, doing constructive ambiguity.

He was like, he made a deal. The Assad wanted the Palestinians to return to Palestine. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. He didn't want to absorb them. Well, they were living in Syria and Egypt, but they weren't really integrating into their society. But Assad did have a vision of a unified Middle East, which would have been a threat to American

interests. So Kissinger made some promises to Israel made some promises to each of these promises to Syria swooped in there and played everybody against each other. Yeah. And then all of a sawd said that what Kissinger did would unleash like demons basically in the Middle East. And that sort of has to pass. Like he did through his shuttle diplomacy interventionism, kind of like, but who knows how things would have played out otherwise. Right, exactly, but I think also like the big claim of the left,

which like hates Kissinger with a vengeance, and was sharpening their knives for years for him to die, so they could fire off their takes and memes on the internet, is again, basically third worldest kind of thing about black and brown bodies, bodies getting obliterated and he's like the head war criminal of them all because he again did the carpet bombing camp we have to learn all these new terms like shuttle diplomas yeah I love bombing I was like shuttle diplomas sounds sounds fun but it's it's not like these third world communists weren't also stacking bodies in their own rights. Well, that's on now.

Not to justify what he did at all. I can't. I'm grateful that I never have to be in a position to make these decisions as a lowly podcast stress. But people act like he like randomly bombed Cambodia. They love to say that he bombed Cambodia, which was a neutral state, when actually that's where a ton of like a Vietcong soldiers were stationed. Well then people say that that gave rise to the Khmer Rouge, but if that would have maybe

happened regardless, I would have maybe happened regardless. It would have happened anyway. I mean, like what is every communist movement in the history of man ever done, but billions must die people? What are you talking about? Real communism has never been tried. We should try handing over the reins to Talia Lavon and Hannah Geiss or whatever it means. Anyway, I do want to read off some more quotes on the JQ.

Oh, yeah. Please. HK. Oh, he told Senator Daniel Moynihan who was defending Israel and Zionism. We are conducting foreign policy here. This is an synagogue. That great exchange with Golda Maier. What do you say to Golda Maier? Where he he told her that he considers himself an American first to Secretary of State second and a Jew last, which prompted her to respond

in Israel we read from right to left. Ah! So clever. I know. They just don't make them like they use to. I know. That's the other thing. For as long as like leftists had been like seabing and waiting for them to to die like it's also super Jewishly Spightfully held on forever century yeah, and now that he's dead it is kind of like Damn, like that was a long time ago and it's funny because norm was roasting him on Twitter But they are the same in one respect, which is they cling to immortality. There are more alike than either would probably like to admit. And that's something I love for both of them.

But there is like, the gloating about Kissinger's death almost feels at this point, like gloating about like Napoleon's death. It's literally like, bro, that was so long ago. Oh, he's such a big and abstract figure. And I think you're talking about a guy who's a 100 years old. Yeah, and I feel like the latest generations have left us don't even know why they're mad at him. Exactly.

And sort of like, the urge to take. I'm speaking from experience. I definitely would have, someone was like, what do you mean by Henry Kissinger? Yeah, like, fuck that. Four years ago, I would have been like, he can't. He can't. I I would have been like, he can't. He can't.

I would have done it. I wouldn't have known that. It's not even that. I would have just said like, I think that guy's a workroom. He's a bad man. And he's not a decent fucking person. They're literally just mad because he's an old white man with power and authority who lived to 100

and died surrounded by his relatives in his home in Connecticut. And who was that? It was like the gloating over Donald Rumsfeld. Oh yeah, I forgot. See, I already, I've, yeah, I've such a sherd. I love he also have a crush on Donald Rumsfeld. Oh my God, well, you know, he was a wrestler.

I have these, he was a wrestler. I didn't know that. The polys are some really hot picks of him. He's like, it looks like a giga-chad. He looks like if Clint Eastwood was a politician and not an actor. Yeah. He's so like dashingly handsome in a cowboy way. Oh, and there was also that interview with Orianna Fulaccio, who I don't know much about, but I'm intrigued by, which was like a PR disaster for for Kissinger. Well, even the Neocons, like Grumsfeld, it's like, I wish we had guys like that around now.

I know, I know you watched these old clips of like firing line and even Bill Buckley, who was a damagog and an idealog with gross yellow patinated teeth, issuing spittle. That guy was so much better than any of our current right wing public intellectuals. Yeah. He was a homosexual, but they're faggot. I mean, as I like to say, you really get the face you deserve. And even at his most like ancient and decrepit, I think like Kissinger still kind of had like something.

I don't know. I don't know. There's something like Kissinger still kind of had like something. I don't know. I don't know. There's something like you look at me. You don't really see, I can't really see him as like an evil guy. No, I think that he was, I see him as like a, yeah, like, detrimentally pragmatic realist. It's really hard if not impossible to say whether he did more harm than good.

In a vacuum, anyone who does anything does more harm than good, the goodest thing you can do is nothing. But that's also not true. Yeah, that's also a seat of evil. And that physique. He's like a mottable. He's like a big fluffy mottable. Not an or would as many have pointed out. So true. He held on to his hair almost as much as he held on to like. But yeah, I mean, people throw around war criminal and it's like much like going to hell, not something you get to arbitrary. What do you mean? Like, you don't get to decide if someone's of war criminal or not. Just like, you don't get to decide if someone goes to hell or not. Yeah, there's international tribunals for that. Yeah, there's a process in this world and the next that, you know, decides your fate

in that regard. So while you may like, personally consider someone to have acted unethically or have been a harmful actor, it doesn't make them a quote war criminal. War criminal basically just means someone more powerful and pragmatic than me. I mean, by that metric, like Napoleon is a war criminal. Like well, I mean, it was just someone who, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, mean, I mean, mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, mean, I forgot I was gonna say. Nothing. Um, work on all the Napoleon I forgot.

Also, like imagine if one of these leftoids or gender goblins ever became a true power broker, they would genocide not only you're and my families, but also their family. We'd be up against the wall in a second, yeah. Yeah, I mean, the communists were not good folks. I'm like, I don't see a lot of people talking about how Mao Zhe Dong is burning in hell. Or Stalin. Yeah. Or Stalin.

Yeah. These guys are bullsh- Bullsh- Bullsh- Heroes of quote tankies, which is a term I still don't understand what that means. Just means someone who larps up being like a man who wears a helmet. He had autism helmet. Look, when you, as of 800, elo chess, play master, like, yeah, like, you just got to, you know, I'm basically a military genius in my own. You're a spiritual war criminal. You're like a symbolic worker, but

a symbolic or whatever. What did Robert write? You should see the damage I'm doing on the to Indian men online. On the board. I'm making all sorts of unsound sacrifices which shout out to my chest duder. Oh, it was a lesson I completely misunderstood. And thought was something you should be doing. And still I'm kind of doing. Do my gambling centric approach. I was looking through. Sometimes it works out in your favor. Picks of Kissinger, schmoozing with the ladies. I was like Kate Moss, Kate Moss, Jane Fonda, Rakell Welch, Elizabeth Taylor, like all

the top faghags, they done away. They done away. There's a picture of them like basically kissing. They're like, hang out. Hugs they done away they done away there's a picture of them like basically The ladies loved them and you know, we're no different really true. Yeah, I watched um Because the dog I watched was pretty was neutral. It definitely it like, because it was German, there was like a really boring bit about his dealings with like the German Chancellor or whatever brand. But it was basically like pretty even keeled and then then I watched a young Turks clip. That was like, the caption was like,

monster kiss and your dead. Click here for detail, whatever. And that was so intensely just shrill and unwatchable and gay and made me empathize with them more. Yeah, and you know, in a sad turn of events, Kissinger did lose in one way through perhaps no fault of his own, because the female slash Jewish slave morality did win out. Well, the point, the, the, the, I might have to redact that.

The point they were making on the young Turks was that, um, that we all decent fucking people understand what a monster he was, but yet the establishment still basically like unilaterally revires him. And that's like a testament to his like lasting influence. But he was very moderate on slash like basically isolationist on Ukraine. Well, later on, I mean in that last interview he gave before his death, he was like, it was a mistake to let all these foreigners and muskies are Western democracy's those were his parting words so lucid I To quote friend of the pod Alec his last words were subscribe to compact Yeah, and in the young Turks clip, they focused on the coup in Chile and the Cambodian. It is very disingenuous to pretend that it was a random war crime that he perpetrated for no reason.

For his vanity and narcissism solely, without any other broad geopolitical conversations. And I think like the leftists are always focused. They got in over their head in Vietnam on these countries that are overwhelmingly like third-world countries when they're merely proxies We're drinking a wine called Rouge Lee Capitaleezma Rouge I'm looking at my notes Then he went to China China they were loving that. When next time went to China.

Yeah. He met another. He was rock-skinned, mouse-a-dong. Kissinger was tall in China. He was he that short in his, because people struggle though. They shrink when they, I mean, he was clearly quite small for the last few decades, but I bet he was much like Napoleon normal-ish-sized. No, I feel like he was probably like 4-11. No, dude, he was not. He was way... Hold on, it says that he's... Okay, Wikipedia lists his highest 5-8, but at 5.4 I felt taller, which emboldened me. This is from the progressive, Jarrel Kraus. I would have put him around 5.5. 5.4.

Yeah. So that means his chick's a wife was quite tall. Tower. Mm-hmm. Yeah. She didn't mind. It's hard to say. It's like um, Scorsese and Rosalini.

Like how tall is Scorsese because Rosselini seems tall but she's not like gigantic. Right and Scorsese seems small. Yeah yeah it's hard to say with these power couples. He was short but he definitely got smaller in his old age as they do. It turns out that the best lifestyle for longevity is being a war criminal. You don't have to take supplements or like inject stem cells or drink your sun's blood. Take many soul. I mean, that board, the famous board Dane quote I think you just want to strangle him to death or ever.

He says once you go to Cambodia you will want to beat Kissinger to death with your bare hands for what he did. Which is like, I mean, time marches aren't like history. Time has been a cruel mistress because with time I really realized what annoying Lachromos loser, Anthony Bourdain, peace be upon him was. Peace me upon him. I still feel a kind of affinity for him. Me too. I mean, like I said, I've said it before and I'll say it again, there are certain personalities who are just likable in spite of themselves. Yeah.

Lake Bourdain, Lake Bernie, like Norm Fink, they're on a mission and you have to accept that about them and that's what makes them like formidable personalities. They're valid. Even if they're wrong. And yeah, I mean, not to harp again on this, but like yeah, what do you think Bourdain did when he was a junkie?

What are all these people, oh, Pining about who's going to hell? Yeah. Are they like patient, compassionate? Like, they don't seem like it. They seem like they're hellbound just like the rest of us. Yeah, their lives just take place on a more sorted and squalid scale,

which makes them feel like they have some also moral high ground that they don't. Yeah. for sure. How many abortions did Bourdain pay for? He's probably done worse than that. He's probably, you know, who knows? And like, yeah, these people who think they're like, Yeah, these people who think they're like, not going to hell because they listen to chabotrap. Like, are they like kind to the people in their lie? Like, yeah, okay, you didn't carpet bomb Cambodia.

Good for you, but like, I bet Henry, because there was a certain husband and a good dad. Good grandpa and even. Probably. Probably decent. I mean, I don't know. Yeah, I bet he was serviceable. Unfit for you. Judging by like What his colleagues kind of had to say about him. He did seem sort of unlikeable

But I bet in his personal dealings he seem sort of unlikable, but I bet in his personal dealings, he like all people, you know, had tenderness and love. Yeah, I mean, I think he probably understood that empathy, empathy as a value can only exist if it's a matter of degree. He definitely did not seem like perturbed. He seemed at peace. I don't know of course. No one can know what's in someone's heart.

We need to read the major biographies. I won't. I'm going to forget. I'm going to forget. I want to, but I also, who am I kidding? I'm also not I'm gonna forget I want to but I also who am I kidding? I'm also not gonna do it Nixon really was a guy who seemed like tormented and his like life was a living hell Yeah, but but like attracts like

But I but Kissinger I think seemed you know He did see like even up until his death he seemed very like lucid. I mean, he was judging by that last sound by my friends. Lesson are the weak who think they're good because they have no claws. What's that? That's Spinoza. Yeah, like good for you, that you get to feel like you're such a good fucking person

because you've never had to do anything or no one's ever like counted on you to make a difficult decision. Yeah, because you've never had any responsibility or power. And you don't know what that looks like and you think that it's like a cakewalk The meek shell and her at the earth which I Think

Jesus, yeah, but I But he meant it in a positive way, but I've always read it negatively as the slave morality shell and her at the earth No, Anna. I know, I know, I know. Meekness is not the same as weakness. Meekness is a kind of, it's an appropriate humility and weakness is frowned upon, but they're different. I think the most, No, no, I get it. I'm just interested.

I'm just interested. Because that is the just, I do believe ultimately in like a kind of cosmic justice. Right. Jesus meant the just shall inherit the earth. Yes. And the meek are just because they're high-volt. But I think that quote is in the correct way they're oriented. Yeah, it's misinterpreted.

No, I know, but I think the misinterpretation is very valuable because it speaks volumes. Yeah. And there is like an alternate interpretation to that quote, about the way that the teachings of Jesus have been used and abused. Well, people, I mean, there's I mean, there's um... Oh, I'm sorry. The retarded shell and her are there. They will. I think the retarded are still... I think that that's my biggest pain in the reaction to Kissinger's death.

I have leftists in my mentions for days being more like kissing guys, pee-pee-poop-poop, like that image of the pig with poop on its balls. Yeah, they love that one. Oh, CS Lewis. Mm-hmm. He wrote about called Lai or Lunatic or Lord, which is about the idea that like if you're not like the way that people love to appropriate Christ's teachings. Yeah.

Like Christ was just so amazing. He was like a yogi. He was such a... He came and he spread this message of like peace and love. And it's like, that's not what Jesus said. Like Jesus had a lot of things. He did say love one another. And it's like, that's not what Jesus said. Like Jesus had a lot of things. He did say love one another.

That was like a bad rock. But yeah, if you're not a Christian, or even if you are, even if you like, yeah, like kind of conveniently appropriate, like certain things like Christ said. He also said the kingdom of heaven suffers violence and the violent take it by force. He also said like you're going to hell if you're not Christian. He's like also said, you know, like,

at some point he was a complicated guy, much like Henry Kissinger. A scapegoat. I mean, that's my real issue with all of this this is like like what makes me really depressed at the end of the day Is not how mean or callous people are it's how stupid they are like that the whole era of statesman like Kissinger is Long gone and at best you're dealing with like Ron de Santas and Nick Fuentes Yeah, it's like his hysterics. And the feeble-minded. Yeah, and meme.

The meme, memeable-minded. Yeah, the meme pucks. Yeah, and so like, I include it, because I don't also am fucking- I know, I know we are, but pimples on his ass. Yeah. And that whole era, which ended with the me-tuing of Charlie Rose, I mourn that era because now everything comes down to people

making memes out of themselves, which is contemptible enough, but even worse are the sheep who stand by and not only tolerate it, but celebrate it, and we're all very complicit in this. They know not what they do. And I hate it and it makes me laugh and cry at the same time. It does. I know, I know. It's really sad.

I know. It's really sad. I know. Like yeah, our time in... I know, as I was prepping for this show, I was like, damn, I'm such a lazy useless loser. I know, look at that. And I wish I did read a fucking book. I wish I was better informed

and could have some. And the people who are so reminded pragmatic intellectuals are basically relegated to the sidelines, they're dinosaurs. and even nakes, they don't hail in comparison, you know, because even like our, you know, I saw the brightest minds of my generation lost to like the T.L. Yeah, it's horrible. It's sad. But there isn't like space for that kind of, I know, I know. And it's been a long day to climb the walls.

And many people, I think, have tried to revive that model through like media companies and podcasting networks and so on, but it doesn't work. It's like a marriage or religious faith. It's one of those things that feels now more like a lorp than a reality. Well, they've been like, I mean, the young Turks, which I obviously don't watch but everything about it was so like a assaulting and it's like a cerebral and hysterical and it made me feel really dumb and bad. I know and then made me feel even worse that people watch it and feel some kind of like moral indignation, or like confirmed in some worldview that they've been memed into having.

Yeah, and they're literally too stupid and ignorant to understand what we've lost, what they took from us. They took from us? Yeah, I know. And I'm not, not by virtue of being smarter or more morally superior, but just by the circumstance of being old and being like one of the last people who lived to see that era. I missed it, basically. It's tragic.

Yeah. In part, my sympathy for Kissinger has nothing to do with him as a person or a statesman. It has to do with like a loss of like greater intellectualism in American public life. Like that clip that was being circulated of him being interviewed by Buckley, that was being circulated of him being interviewed by Buckley, where he mentioned Spanglers to climb the west on like mainstream TV, which would never occur today. No. Anyway.

Well, we could all, yeah, I think we should all try harder. Yeah, but we'll see all three of us. And be better. Be better. It's like long off and touch grass. And we know none of us are going to do that. Like none of us are going to sit down and read a book. I mean, I did read a weird book or part of a,

I do, I mean, I read books. They're all just kind of like niche and useless. I mean, that read books, they're all just kind of like, niche and useless. I mean, that's not true. Not, yeah, that's not totally true, but I mean, I will circle back to a book I read. Because I have a very interesting idea about Napoleon that I was made privy to. Okay. I do have one more quote from Sailor that's pertinent to both Kissinger and Napoleon.

Okay. It would have been admirable if Bonaparte had foregone his tactical advantage to devote himself to peace, but the current European aversion to aggression only became a consensus after the Great War a century later. So true king. Yeah, I have a, I wanted to read the kind of extended tollstice quote about Napoleon. Okay. That also flies to Kissinger, but is a good segue and emerge these two. We're doing great work.

Every time that we record this podcast, I'm like, we're doing so great. We're doing an amazing job. And then I listen back and I'm just like, we're like, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh. Oh. Oh. Oh. Oh. Oh. Well, per the leaders being the slave of history, he says the war referring to the Napoleonic Wars, but the war was bound to happen simply because it was bound to happen. Leaders are about the labels that serve to give a name

To an end and like labels they have the least possible connection with the event The greater the leader the more conspicuous the inevitability and predestination of every act he commits Mm-hmm, and that sort of was are my basically my feelings about Kissinger is kind of like Yeah, he what can you say he let it amazing But he did it's a double-edged sword it goes both ways much like Kissinger himself predestined to do yeah And be he had to be and he had to be also scapegoated as this like monster or criminal of our era. And now we can more in the loss of that.

And move on to worse things. Both painful and flattering for him. I don't know. I think he enjoyed so much. I mean, he had his big 100th birthday gala. And I think that's Auburn House. That's Auburn House. Yeahala and I think that's all Bernhaus. I think that satisfied him. He got to pass on.

Yeah, but I mean... It's the next realm. Everyone that I've spoken to, IRL is very sad about the death of Kissinger, even though it's not very sad, but they're mourning the loss of something that transcends his life as such. Yeah, it's the end of an era of something that they say. Yeah, as they say. But yeah, it's the death of something that no longer exists. Which is like an at least rhetorical commitment

to neutrality and objectivity. That has completely given way to the worst kind of tribalism. Then it gave way to kind of like Neocon Jingoism. And even that we have nostalgia for now, because now it's even more in coherent and chaotic and evil than it's ever been. Somebody said to riceably, well, now these right wingers are gonna try to rehabilitate

the reputation of Paul Wolfowitz or whatever. And it's like, you know what, they might, and they probably won't be the worst thing ever. It's just the bar like, I mean, remember like George Bush was such a laughing style. I know. And now we're like, that was a good president. I know, I know.

I'm like, I missed that guy. He's like, practically no-m-chalmsky now. Yeah. One of our finest minds when he does would be like, yeah, a formidable man. Mm-hmm. Yeah, that. Could be our debited and he's like a genius.

That like, dad behind the eyes, like, low IQ, Hassan Piker, squint. Actually contained multitudes and he was a painter in the style of the Nabi or whatever. These are David Hawking. David Hawking. David Hawking. Son of Paulian. Paulian. How about that guy, huh? Uh, so you saw it in theaters.

I did. So it's fresher in your mind, actually, because I thought about a week ago. I saw it in the comfort of my own home. A very giant, cute, douchey leg. How does she do it? How do you do it? How do you do it? How do you do it?

How do you do it? How do you do it? How do you do it? How do you do it? How do you do it? How do you do it? How do you do it? How do you do it? How do you do it? And Spanish subtitles? Was it like someone filming it in a theater? No, no, no, it was some bizarre. It was wrapped from somewhere, but it was the torrent belong to somebody called Godic.

So I'm assuming Russian, but all the title cards and the subtitles were in Spanish. At some point, I tried to turn the subtitles on because the sound quality was so low, and they weren't Spanish, and they were speaking English. It was just like, so I had a really psychedelic experience and plus just the image quality was very,

like the resolution was very low. So it felt like a late career goya. It's all like blurring of the new color. It's all like blurring of the new color. It's like this looks amazing. It's probably better. Yeah. I thought like Napoleon like ranting in Spanish, like a ministerio, I think this looks amazing. Probably better. Yeah. And it was just like, I'm at.

Napoleon like, ranting in Spanish, like, El Ministerio de LGBT+. Afuera! Afuera! Wait, you saw it in I'm actually. I saw it in I'm acts. With the Kib-Spe, and Fee. And so I got a nice crisp look at how shitty walking be looks.

I mean, just in general, I thought the movie looked pretty bad. Okay, see, Dasha, I thought it looked good, but like you can't take my word for it because again, you saw like a boy. Yeah, yeah. I don't know how you made it through a boy. I don't either. I was so drunk. It has I was like, oh, it has a chiaroscuro aesthetic that pays homage to

Jacques Louis David, the neoclassical painter, Parex Lunds, like death of Marat, whatever, and the draperies and fineries, they're so on-grh. That sounds nice, yeah. I think the depiction of men was very devide, and the depiction of women was very on-grh. I don't know how to pronounce that name, but Ridley Scott clearly looked at a lot of like neoclassical paint. I mean, there's a lot of art historical references to Soros with Napoleon and Josephine. Sure. I thought the color grade basically was just very bad. I can't speak on that, but... Which people were... I really wanted to like Napoleon.

We all did, yeah. Because I had a real like Contrarian impulse to all of the like preemptive Right-wing guys being like this movie's just gonna be about what a cock-and-roll in was and I was like, yeah, good and The trailer you know a trailer is always The trailer, you know, a trailer is always basically better than a movie. The trailer had like a, like they all do now, it has like a slowed down version of like a popular song, it had like a slowed down black Sabbath song. And like it seemed kind of epic and cool and I would eat it off.

I was like on board to like enjoy it and it was like you know, it seemed like I love the magic of the movies I love like a cinematic event. I'm not a big Ridley Scott fan To be honest, I'm trying to think if I'm a big Ridley Scott fan probably not I mean he did alien and he did gladiator and Most importantly he did blade runner. I am a big Blade Runner fan. I know there's a lot of them. He's had some heads, he's had some misses, but in general, as like... He's 86 years old, I did not know that. He's practically Henry Kissinger's age.

Yeah. Yeah. I didn't, yeah. I didn't like yeah, I didn't like it. I was. Yeah, Napoleon, he's like portrayed as a somewhat pathetic and humorless character. I didn't need like a heroic epic. I didn't, I'm not a stickler for historical accuracy.

That was a big, you know, a lot of people were. Yeah, it was a big point for historical accuracy. That was a big, you know, a lot of people were. Yeah, it was a big point of contention. Yeah, we can get into that because I have a lot to say about that too. Because what people call historical inaccuracy can also just be described as dramatization. Exactly. And like, we were like, he didn't shoot at the pyramids. And I was like, yeah, okay.

But like, that looks cool. Yeah, it looks cool Yeah, it's epic. He's like trying to like concisely convey information to you in a visual media That's what do you you fucking Autist like that's what a movie is Yeah, people were watching documentary about Napoleon if he wanted to talk accuracy That's none of my issues with that. I have nothing to do with yeah Like some of the historical inaccuracies like him witnessing the execution of Maria Twina or him bombing the pyramids or him saluting the Duke of Wellington,

those just seemed like devices to make the story cooler. Yeah. Like that's not really a bone to pick with a fictional adaptation of the story and myth of Napoleon. The bone to pick is that there are more interesting, I mean... Well yeah, you could have... I'm not obviously I'm pro dramatization, but there are other things in the life of Napoleon, that like, it just, there were things that really dragged, I thought the pacing was pretty bad. It reminded me a lot of Priscilla

and that they were going kind of like, shot by shot event by event, like kind of linear narrative. Yeah, like Napoleon kidnapped the Pope. They didn't know that. He kidnapped Pope Pius VII. Again, my understanding of basic history is very flimsy. He's very much portrayed as this like kind of unintentionally

funny little man. I guess it's true that he's, the portrayal is of a guy who's basically an in-sell in a cock. And so they went with Joaquin Phoenix owing as much to his vague resemblance as to the fact that he's known for playing these like maladjusted damaged characters most recently with Joker.

I think Christian Bale could have done a good job. Jacob Allority could have played the role on his knees to the pleasure of bags everywhere. I would have loved to see a younger Napoleon for sure. That was that was one of sailors big issues that walking Phoenix is 49 and Napoleon was like 26 Yeah, in his first campaign 46 at his last campaign like he was a young guy. Yeah, yeah I would have loved to see Yeah, him be like

Not that walking Phoenix wasn't bloated, but yeah, like a young bloated weird. Like I actually liked that he... I thought walking Phoenix did okay. He's okay. I don't know. I liked the like, he was obviously Napoleon was like some kind of Autist. So I liked that it was true. I don't know. He was also known for being very socially charismatic and intellectually duffed.

Sailor makes this point. I was very verbose and Joaquin plays it very like stilted and quiet. But I like that he was like kind of like me. Yeah. He was so funny. I thought for a very long time I was a big Joaquin fan, because when he was young, he was really hot, and I love that Glenn Lutford for product campaign.

For product campaign. Yeah, but in retrospect, I think this movie really made me see that he's not. You can't judge him on this. No, no, I mean, I seen many walking movies, but like, you know, I said this on Twitter like the thing about being typecast as like a weird, maljusted, and damaged freak is that people automatically assume you're good. Yeah, but...

So you don't actually have to be. But I will say a lot of young actors now can't even do that. I think walkiness, like the watershed figure for a lot of these young actors, whether they know they're referencing him or not, because he is a very like manored actor. I don't think he's untalented. I think he has, he does have range.

I mean, he played Johnny Cash very well, who wasn't like a in-self freak. It's something he's like taken to his last few, like notable performances have been kind of type of that type. But he has, he does do different things. But I think... Well, here's a quote. But even though Joaquin Phoenix looks vaguely like Bonaparte, he has some sort of upper lip

birth defect. He denies it's a hair lip that appears to impede his articulation. Hence, while he's wonderful at depicting deeply defective individuals such as comidus and gladiator, the PTSD victim vet and the master and the operatically damaged title character and Joker, he has utterly the wrong affect for Napoleon, the most charismatic hero in continental European history. He is depicted as this kind of, I guess, if you want to be charitable, charitable about it, like, sensitive young man figure. I mean, he, the story, which I

guess is like, fairly true to life, is that he marries Josephine who is a paramount appausal widow who's hit the wall. I can't bear him a male heir. I think she's like 33. Yeah, yeah, of course, but. Yeah, this all occurs also over the duration of 20 years. So by the time he divorces her, I think they're both nearing 50. He's like Derek Chauvan before he knelt, he stepped up.

I think she was actually a young girl when they, I don't think she actually was quite, but he became, um, but for whatever reason they did not, yeah, procreate. He took on her children from a previous marriage and her, a rancelon I read, some piece of trivia was actually like Napoleon III third through her preview like Somehow in her lineage because she was aristocratic prior to the revolution in the post-Nipoli era and aristocrat to you He's like nope mental He's like you look like Anna from RedScare in 2014. I thought, I thought Vanessa Kirby was kind of good.

She was good, yeah. And like, I liked her. A scene stealer, you know, and I thought I found her kind of captivating. I agree with that, yeah. And I liked when she was like serving in the court with her palm or any serving comment. She's like, yes, girl.

I like the scene where they're meeting for the second or third time. And she hikes her skirts up. Yes. And opens her legs. And she's wearing thigh hives. And those little court shoes that I love. And she says, once you see it, you always wanted.

Arm and White in his very escaping review said that that was kind of a heavy-handed metaphor for like a quest for world domination. Like that was a absolve, you know. Yeah, it was like that famous Thomas Finland drawing of the gig I fucking the globe. Exactly, but for heterosexual relations. But I found like arguably the most interesting part

of the film was their dynamic. And even that, I thought was once he catches news of her cucking him while he's in Egypt, and then he returns to France. And then all of his advisors who weren't against it because it might look like he's disordering his army. Which none of that is like fleshed out or come to the barren state of Africa.

Because in reality, apparently the army just ran out of supplies and had to retreat. But then they have this kind of like blowout fight and she does, she's like the BP does the BPDRO thing, which she's like don't leave me. Yeah. Well, she tells him that he's nothing without her. Well, first he makes hers. That's, that was, that was where I really was like, what the fuck is it's like the in terms of pacing. He makes her say she's nothing without him and literally in the next scene like Some time has passed and it makes clear and then she makes him say it back and I was like definitely some Ted like this recall could have like hit better

Yeah, it's a very reddit movie. I mean Scott clearly has like contempt for Napoleon. Yeah, I mean, a lot of people were also mad that the film was very pro-British and anti-French, which is also as fine, is not what's bad about the movie. I mean, it could make good anti-French movies. I mean, it's not surprising, given Ridley Scott's background right but I wouldn't mind an anti-hero epic I don't I didn't need some kind of like a bit glossy like and he was a great man he was a sensitive young man he was amazing and he had Bronze Age mindset and he accomplished great things and like the like I didn't need to see like a- No I know but I think that the big people were saying like, oh like a friend of mine pointed out that like Napoleon was known as a genius of artillery. So all the cavalry scenes were historically inaccurate, poorly informed.

They used like the wrong breed of horse, like all these details that would grind the gears of a person who's really invested and kind of a spurg. But I don't think that that's really a problem for me so much. I have like a more basic criticism of the film, which is like, it doesn't know what it wants to be. Is it historical epic or is it bourgeoisico drama? Tingeed with elements of dark comedy, like you see in the Marie Antoinette execution scene or in the Robespierre, like, botched suicide scene.

Well, not even bourgeois, like... A aristocratic melodrama. Yeah, I think that's, yeah. It doesn't know what it wants to be, and also, even more to the point, it's just like a film for all of its like epic bells and whistles and frankly like beautiful and well done costumes and set design It's boring and it drags on it's I found myself like literally just like losing the plot the fight sequences were just

maybe to historically and how like, dredging and boring they were and I also was like as someone who's not a history buff kind of found myself, there were things there like I had too much information and not enough as just like a movie goer. Exactly. And in lots of the fight scenes, I found myself being like, okay, like, like guys like, they're running around.

So we're going for like max or run visual aspect. Like in the Battle of Osterlets, where they're like fighting above the frozen lake and people's bodies and horses bodies are being plunged in the water. Oh yeah, where was the force casualty count by the way? Because that is the one thing that Napoleon did make me reflect on. Well, I did make Cosmeter reflect on a few things, but I was like,

damn, a lot of horses used to die. They did, yeah. Well, his horse. Yeah. I really fucks around and finds out early on. But yeah, there's mad. There was a lot of unnecessary misplaced gore, which was a little too show don't tell for me. Like it was a little bit too unsuddle and too on the nose. Ditto for the sacks, honestly. And frankly, the guillotine scene.

I like the suicide scene where he misses and gets the guillotine anyway. Yeah. Oh, oh, oh, oh. I mean, the French peasants did seem, I was like, ew. Yeah, I was like, these people are disgusting. I was like, these Yeah, these people are disgusting. I was like these Masonic psychopaths.

And it's hard to say whether portraying Napoleon as like an insult and a cock is a product of pro-British anti-French animus or an attempt to capitalize on like a reddit's like heist. I don't think Ridley Scott has enough. I don't think he's tapped in enough. No, he's not tapped in, but like, you know, making a movie as you know is a production and there are people who have like their feelers out.

And I think even if you don't, it's just like inevitable that you absorb certain influences from the ether. Yeah, no, that's true. There's an alchemy there. I don't think it was necessarily intentional or calculated. It feels like a very late career film. Like a boy from a man who chose a subject that he clearly feels a lot of like sort of in different sort of in

different slash like I'm scorned for and is I the like, very on the nose metaphor is like filmmaking is kind of like, you know, a director is like a dictator. Yeah, I mean, Sailor makes this point that many have tried and failed to make the Napoleon biopic famously Stanley Kubrick quit, and then use the research toward Barry Lyndon. Then Steven Spielberg took the Kubrick screenplay and has been promising for 10 years to adapt it into a television series. Yeah.

Apparently directors really identify with emperors from Alexander the great to Napoleon Bonaparte. Yeah. Yeah. But in this case, yeah, like Ridley Scott's not old. He cast an old actor. He made this very old movie. Yeah, the whole thing kind of feels like the end of Napoleon's life,

and it feels like the end of Ridley Scott's career. His last movie should be a biopic of Henry Kiss. In a chair. Ha. Starting like Benedict Crumper bunch. Ha. But it doesn't feel epic. No, for how it really feels very like flat and depressing. Yeah.

And I think that that is more of reflects more on the psychology of Ridley Scott than the Polans. Yeah, but I have to be honest, that's how Priscilla felt to me too, all movies now that are of mid-career to late career directors feel very flat and unepic and just boring. And it's really sad and kind of a disservice because this is a very interesting and ambitious subject matter.

I couldn't even get excited when Napoleon threw a glass at Josephine at that dinner because she couldn't produce a male heir when he slapped her in the mouth during their annulment ceremony. I like that. Yeah, he's okay. She refused to sign the documents. Say it for France. That I liked that scene though it was again a little like redundant. I like the the final scene where he's like schooling a bunch of kids about how he's never made any mistakes personally and he has to like, like, we heard you did say it.

And he has to like, deal with managing other people's mistakes, but you have to like, rise to greatness or whatever. Well, I have kind of, yeah, I mean, I'm not, I'm of, I'd say I'm a casual Napoleon head fan, whatever. Well, the iconography was good. Yeah, I do have, I love, I love laurels, which he really put on the map. And I like coronation scene a lot. I have a lot of like Napoleonic of Femma in my house, do the taking ambient and going,

let's see. But what was I saying? Oh, yeah, I like basically like Napoleon don't know too much about him, though, after seeing the movie, I also took a list of his major battles. I texted Mystery Grove and said how many, because I was trying to find out exactly the breakdown of how many battles he had won and lost, and there's like, there is some dispute amongst historians like what counts as a battle. Yeah, basically. Yeah, sorry, go ahead.

Basically he had a 10 to 1 ratio. He thought either 50 or 60 battles and he lost 5 or 7 of those. So like, yeah, I mean, he was by all accounts like the incredible genius. God. Yeah, but I kind of went into it being like, I mean, how hard can I be to have like, I really wanted to be enlightened about how hard it is to have a lot of military victories. Well, back in the day, it was very hard because they didn't have like drones or like high-tech imaging.

Yeah, but like someone wins a war every time. And like if I- But the same guy. Think about it as like an NFL or NBA game with the same team just won all the time. Once again, like if I had an army, like, I don't know, like I bet I could do it. I bet I could have a ton of military victories.

But I wanted the movie to kind of enlighten me and disprove this. And it just poured and confused you. Yeah. I wanted to be like, oh, damn Napoleon really was that MF. Like he really, you know, I was like, but instead I kind of was like, oh, I guess. Another point of contention among the Spurgs is that the movie ignored a lot of the non-military victories

in Napoleon had such as implementing the Napoleonic Code, which was massively influential. I mean, that really was his most amazing. It's still operative today in many countries outside of France, but also, how do you portray a massive bureaucratic overhaul of the legal system in a movie without making it totally boring and annoying? Super boring, yeah.

I watched, again, took some out, or I'll watch some YouTube videos, after seeing the movie about Napoleon, to like get a little more context. So I did learn about the Napoleonic code and this and that and I came away from that experience kind of being like, I said to Matthew, I said, I don't know how I feel about all of this. Like I feel kind of neither. Much like Kissinger, I'm kind of like, this point it's been so long. I kind of don't feel any type of way. I like it might kind of have like very hazy and decent like admiration for his accomplishments.

But at the same time, like right place, right time, vehicle of history kind of like, you know, well, I think even if hypothetically his accomplishments were pure myth, which they're not, they would still be admirable and aspirational and like a worthy symbol. Also like a revisionist narrative of Napoleon would be well taken.

Yeah, but Ridley Scott manages to accomplish neither, which maybe we can't really take him to task core because he really is so old and he managed to pull off a big budget major theatrical release, I don't know. He's really scotty, can do it every once. Yeah, but how's that? I mean, it's, yeah, he's a work, so I read it and every with him in the New Yorker. That was, I can't, I don't have any more. Where Isaac Ch Chote and I was like but how do you really feel about the

what about the children died yeah no it was look kind of just about his approach which is fairly mundane and he has some interesting like aesthetic preoccupations throughout his oove for certain textures and colors. He's a big fan of matte blacks. And I forget what point I was trying to make. He's a virtuoso of the craft. But I would have, yeah, but that it's not that like he can kind of he's at it is a At a point where he can do whatever he wants and he could have done something

I but I think like actually at the end of the day Barry linden is the film that Napoleon could have and should have been it's already been made. I wish Cooper could have made his of his His Napoleon movie. I'm sure that would have absolutely slapped and If it had been even more like pro-British That's the thing that's what you were saying. It's like it doesn't know what it wants like He can't really quite commit to like a lot of French people were really mad that it was Yeah, and I'm trying to find this got said they don't even like themselves. Yeah, which is pretty good Yeah, but but the the image, like the portrayal of Napoleon

that we got at the end of the day is, well, he was a cock, okay, that is historically accurate. Sure, but is that Josephine was mid and he was a cock. Hahaha. And the image that comes across is of like, could kind of stick in the mud, self-serious guy, a well-becky and bureaucrat, or like a washed up windbag revolutionary

out of that motherland novel that I recently read chaos a night. I guess my beef with that is go bigger, go home, and if Ridley Scott really wanted to push a pro-British anti-French revisionist narrative, he should have gone whole-hog, but he didn't seem particularly invested at the end of the day. Exactly.

And of course the French people, because there are also like athnoneursceses to stir up in arms about it. But they're actually giving him too much credit in a way. A lot of pull. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, my favorite footnote in all of this was the thing that you and multiple other people sent me of like, sailor pushing his race realism. Yeah, sailor was like, there's a ballado in the movie.

I didn't notice that, but I'm glad I can count on sailor to bring it home. Perhaps the under-illitness of the movie is a way to get around British film industry diversity quotas that require more blacks be wedged into period pieces. Maybe that's Sir Ridley's compromise with the recent diversity demands. In my extreme old age, I'll count out

to the BAFTA quota myster's, but I'll turn down the lights. So my humiliation is less evident. Yeah, he notices, he notes that, he notices Freudians like that Josephine's mulada servant Lucille is inserted into the party scenes. Did not. If she were a guest rather than a maid to lend a Bridgerton aspect to the proceedings, the prominence of Alexander Dumas, half Aristocrat, half Black father, a French general, though weirdly Steve for all of his notice.

I noticed that. He doesn't point out that this father of Dumas is portrayed as a fully Black dark skin individual, even though he was actually mixed. Quote, there also appear to be quite a few Black extras and plausibly sprinkled into the bravera Australocic segment. But it's hard to tell since everything is so merciless.

Yeah, it's all murky is a good nail that's seen with murky. It is both visually and like spiritually. A bigger problem than historical accuracy is the movie's lack of an opinion on the world historical events it's strenuously depicts. Scott seems to bring only two opinions, a distaste for the French and a distaste for war, the title card at the end tallies the death toll from the Napoleonic wars that three million. I mean I think that also seems to be like a similar situation to him exploiting the low lighting to get around diversity quotas.

That seems a little far-fetched. He inserts immoralizing anti-war message at the end to get ahead of any accusations that he's like glorifying war, a K white male greatness. But I don't think he's really beholden to that message. Yeah, and I don't think he even feels beholden to it. Yeah, he's just doing it to cover his bases. I'm unsure. That was really... I don't know that it's necessarily like ideologically motivated.

Yeah, I don't think it is. I think it's just... I don't know. I don't know. I didn't get it. I didn't not... It didn't land. I wasn't, yeah, I didn't come, yeah, I didn't, if that was the point, he was, if that was like... And also, I was just a wrap it up. I was like, that was not coming across. Also, the number that they give in the movie is 3 million lives. Mm-hmm. But I've read that it's anywhere the movie is 3 million lives.

But I've read that it's anywhere from three to six million. So if they were really trying to make a kind of heavy handed ideological point, they would have gone with the six, a Michael Tracy 5.5 million loss in the Napoleonic Wars. But it was a, yeah, Richard Hanonia as Napoleon Bonaparte. But it was a yeah Richard Hanonia as Napoleon Bonaparte It was a tough time, you know

Oh, well part of the reason I have this notion this delusional notion that it isn't so hard to agree with military victories is because of my favorite military genius slash retard, Joan of Arc. I was gonna say because of the army of simps that we're on the internet command. We're all little Napoleon's here. But Joan in her very short life, shorter than Napoleon's whole military career, burned at the stake, as you might know, and she was 19.

She led 13 battles and won nine of them. It's a pretty good stuff. And she couldn't even read. She looked just... Well, sometimes it takes a retard. All the time. She was doing God's will on earth and it was like a hundred year war. You know, she won France.

Well, also I saw a lot of people complaining that they made him look like a crude and rude corsican when he was actually quite alerted and intellectual man. But also that, to me, doesn't seem that unflattering because it could be just a portrayal of a typical underdog who triumphs against all odds. Yeah, I didn't have that total takeaway. But I, let's face it, we're too stupid and historically ignorant to understand the implications of all the signaling they're doing in this movie.

But I did come across a book in my, which I acquired, which I bought impulsively when I was like, I bought a bunch of weird books about Joan of Arc, one of which was called Ailing Aging and Addictive. And it was written by a neuroscientist named Bertie Park. It was the follow-up to another book he wrote called The Impact of Illness on World Leaders, which is kind of like a survey of, he makes the case in this book about Joan Hitler and Paul the Apostle that they had temporal lobe epilepsy, which he backs up with all sorts of like interest. He's a, it's called bio-historian. And he- Nice name for eugenics, you got there. It's actually very distinct from eugenics and he actually speaks very ill of like, fornology and stuff in it

because he's very interested specifically in like mental ailments and the way that like, diseases motivate a lot of people that we consider to be, you know, great leaders, toxoplasmosis. Soxoplasmosis. But he, in that, in that acquired a parasite. He had a parasitic disease called schistosmiasis, which is worms basically, and he famously had like urinary tract issues and he really wasn't in so. Some bio historians make the case that he had hemorrhoids at Waterloo.

Well I assume all French people just have hemorrhoids. But he especially from all the horseback riding and Waterloo specifically he had a particularly bad flare-up of the roids. And that was why he was like kind of like distracted and like uncharacteristically undecisive and then like his characteristically undecisive and then like his final indecisive loss was due to his like medical condition. But this is like real fringe bio history stuff, but it was the schistosmiasis really that like made him behave in this way that he did

and gave him the kind of both like the confidence and unpleasantness of his like personality. You were all kind of attributed to this sickness that he had that he like got in Egypt. He was just physically irritate. He had food poisoning. He had food poisoning her decade for like a mad long time. But other... This guy doesn't subscribe to these theories, he kind of outlines them in the chapter on Napoleon. Some people think that he was like a pituitary case.

say more that he had like a hormonal imbalance. Okay. That gave him thinning hair and chubby hands and made him kind of like cushion disease, grotesque and not like a full eunuch, but essentially he had kind of like a pituitary condition. I mean, how about that movie, huh? I mean, I can buy it.

I feel like the whole like French ruling class was disgusting and decrepit, which is what makes all the sex so much more erotic. But he wasn't like an in-bred aristocrat in the same way that it. Yeah, but he was eating and drinking the they same food. Mm-hmm. Yeah. He was gross. Mm-hmm. He was a gross weird guy. Ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha. I don't know if I should go down this road, but I watched that he had a thyroid problem.

He's just like us for real. Well, I watched the G.C.L.S. documentary about the George Floyd Derek Chauvin situation that led to the racial reckoning and the big smoking gun in George Floyd's autopsy result for me was not the advanced coronary artery disease or the fatal levels of fentanyl but the fact that he possibly had a Kremagali. What's a Kremagali? It is the same disorder that celebrity makeup artist Kevin Aquan had.

Oh my God. Which is just like when you just keep growing throughout your life. Kevin Aquan? That's what he died of. He died of a Kremagali. I thought he killed himself. Or maybe he did, but he had severe Kremagali, which may have precipitated a suicide. I don't actually know the

fact that he killed himself. I know, because that's why I specifically favor his makeup. Okay, it's a it's a pituitary gland disorder where the pituitary gland produces too much growth hormone. A cremagalli is caused by non-cancerous tumor. Middle-aged adults are most commonly affected. The symptoms include abnormally large hands and feet. Large prominent facial features such as the nose and the lips and an enlarged tongue skin changes such as thick horse oily skin skin tags are sweating too much. Deepening of the voice is a result of enlarge sinuses and vocal cords, joint pain. I can go on, but I can also start.

Okay. Tired of doing this bluish vision. We're pituitary pelled. You heard it here, first folks. Napoleon and George Floyd. So pituitary disorders make people do crazy things. So pituitary disorders make people do crazy things Yeah, conquer the world and resistor us Yeah Like try and use a counterfeit Yeah, I can go either way But you know this but in the end it always leads to greatness

No, I was about to say. But this is not, you know, to detract because there's lots of people who are aging, ailing and addicted who do not become George Floyd. If he hadn't died at such a young and healthy age, could have been the next Napoleon. He could have been a huge. I didn't know Kevin O'Koin had that. Yeah, I think like you're right, he did die by suicide, but I think he died because his

illness became so unsustainable and grueling. Oh, and that's why he was living in a world of pania. Yeah, that's sad. That's why he was so good at giving women the fantasy of the illusion. What? Beauty and hope. Because he himself was suffering inside. And that's sad.

I had, I've a, a childhood memory of having one of those, my parents had one of those Kevin O'Coin books where he makes celebrities like other celebrities and he made, I think we know in a writer like Madonna and he like takes you through like how he does their make up to look, it's, it's awesome. Great guy. He was awesome product. I noticed years ago that you had that little pot foundation that you're supposed to mix with other like creams or serums because it's so thick. It's a it's like a

really good like spot concealer. Okay good to know. I've been like trying to buy that thing for years and never have but I think I'm just gonna gonna cough now. You really just should because it lasts forever I love to Use my makeup past the expiration date because I think those are fake and gay. I kind of create And I'm a hoarder Not gonna get rid of it I'm not gonna get rid of it. We're almost at the two hour mark. We can wrap it up.

I don't really want to talk about former Obama a Stewart All-Stirlitz. I'll just say that guy also seems like he has some kind of brain parasite. Is that what's making him behave in a really... I actually went into those videos kind of like you went into Napoleon, like hoping for the best, and thinking it would be based, but he actually sucks in his loser. No, he's so repulsive. He's so unpleasant.

He's so creepy and he's got this look in his eye, but I do think he's like, I mean, clearly very sick. He's like a guy who would die and then they wouldn't, like a quote, natural causes in his own home on the upper west side and they wouldn't find his body for two months. He has, oh, so for those who don't know, the man's doer. He has, oh, so for those who don't know, this man Stewart.

I don't know, remember his name. Stewart Salinger. Stewart Kissinger. Stewart Kissinger. Saldoitz. Saldoitz. There was a video that surfaced of him harassing a halal vendor and going on like a Islamophobic rant Not that we should even be talking about Islamophobic Rants, but

Yeah, he's behaving in a really like a Creepy and anti-social way. Yeah, and I was like, oh, there's a video. No, there's three videos Yeah, he like was doing it compulsively and I think prior he was harassing like Russian diplomat just like me for real and like asking him if they were like prostitutes and like tormenting them with weird questions. Like tooth and and then some brain therapy walking around UN, harassing diplomats and whole all vendors. He has the same phenotype as Soros and Allbright. Yeah.

The weird like wise old Alice. He seems sick. He seems possessed. Like someone needs to, I'm glad they locked him up, but like he needs to get checked out by like a team of psychiatrists and like a medical specialist because there's something like really, something ain't really right with that white boy.

That's right. That white boy ain't right. That's white boy winter up in here. He, he's unhinged. He's not sympathetic at all. And he really put the kai bha sh-on-my Islam. I know. I was hyperally because that guy that he was harassing handled it was such grace and class.

He was like, I don't speak English. You kill kids. Yeah. Um, and I heard, I don't know if this specific whole all vendor, um, but that a lot of whole all vendors in New York are actually like, cop, dick, Christians. Oh, didn't know that. And that they are unizing. Much like they're getting big fake tits. Much like a lot of filling in their club. Ukrainian restaurant tours were opening Russian restaurants because it had more name recognition. Yeah. They start kind of like whole all cards because it's like a, you know, a business that's like the time. Yeah.

No one's trying to go to like the cop dick, Christian, Traffood Jack. They're like leveraging the white guilt of post 9-11 liberals. People just understand what that is. So I think it's possible that the, not that it matters, but the guy that sold it was harassing,

like, was not even a Muslim. Wait, really? Possibly. Yeah. Damn. That's what I heard. Not that it mattered. Either way, he's like, we're positive and in the wrong, but like, he's just like randomly

talking about. I know. Like, anybody knows that you keep your racism casual and abstract. You don't target individuals. Start a pod. Let me introduce you to my friend Ron on. Who might like to hear what you have to say, but leave this like falafel guy out of it. Is Taki's a guy? Delicious Taki's?

Good question. I think it's a guy right? I know I know it's like an Afro Caribbean brand of like hot chip. Yeah. Which makes the whole thing even more ironic. I wonder. It'll be funny if Steve Saler was like a lobbyist for Dominican hot chips. Yep. Guess what? Taki's magazine is published by Greek Paleo-Conservative

Taki Theodora, copulus. What's a paleo conservative? I think that's like Papi canon. Oh. Like an isolationist versus a neocon? I don't know. Um. Eee. versus the Neocon? I don't know.

Okay, yeah. Yep. They're like isolationists. Correct. Nice. Taki, Fia, do you open my mind to let me? Anyway, that's the show, y'all. See you and how it's a pity both sides can't lose. I think they are. you