Rob Beckett and Josh Widdicombe's Parenting Hell - S04 EP24: Kate Ferdinand

Episode Date: April 15, 2022

S04 EP24: Kate Ferdinand Joining us this episode to discuss the highs and lows of parenting (and life) is Kate Ferdinand. Kate's brilliant new podcast 'Blended' is available now. Thanks - Rob and Josh xxxWe're going on tour!! Fancy seeing the podcast live in some of the best venues in the UK?Of course you do, you're not made of stone! Tickets available now on the dates and at the venues below. We can't wait to see you there...ON SALE NOW 14th April 2023 - Manchester AO Arena19th April 2023 - Nottingham20th April 2023 - Cardiff 21st April 2023 - London (The O2)23rd April 2023 - London (Wembley)28th April 2023 - Birmingham Utilita Arena If you want to get in touch with the show here's how:EMAIL: [e-mail]: @parenting_hellINSTAGRAM: @parentinghellA 'Keep It Light Media' Production Sales, advertising, and general enquiries: [e-mail] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hello, I'm Rob Beckett. And I'm Josh Willicombe. Welcome to Parenting Hell, the show in which Josh and I discuss what it's really like to be a parent, which I would say can be a little tricky. So, to make ourselves, and hopefully you, feel better about the trials and tribulations of modern day parenting, each week we'll be chatting to a famous parent about how they're coping. Or hopefully how they're not coping. And we'll also be hearing from you, the listener, with your tips, advice and, of course, tales of parenting woe.

Because, let's be honest, there are plenty of times when none of us know what we're doing. Hello, you're listening to Parenting Hell with... Say Rob. Beckett. And can you say Josh? Whittaker. Good girl. Wales.

There we go yes Swansea Swansea Swansea bud this is Arabella who's 17 months great night love the podcast got me through the hardest of lockdown days and even more so now we're all stuck

in with the vid and a teething toddler oh no saw Josh and Swansea last weekend. Loved the show. Hope to see you both in Cardiff next year, as it's on my 30th birthday. Woo-hoo. I'm doing Swansea this year. Why are you coming to that?

Go to Swansea this year. They're stuck inside with the vid, mate. Which venue did you do? Because there's a new one. I'm doing the arena. Yeah, I know. I saw your face when I got off the... It's so new, Rob.

It wasn't even open when I got off the train. Really? Yeah. Wow. Yeah. So new. Yeah, it's a new one. I'm doing the... It's so new, Rob. It wasn't even open when I got off the train. Really? Yeah. Wow. Yeah. So new. Yeah, it's a new one. I'm doing Swansea.

Swansea Grand, is that what it's called? Yes. Anyway, there was a picture of you and Catherine Ryan when I got off the train. What were we doing? It was like, Swansea Arena, coming soon to Swansea. Oh, right. But not us together?

No, no, no. It's just this long lens picture of you and Catherine. Getting off in the park. Big media scoop. I reckon she'd be up for that, Catherine, as like a sort of PR stunt. We could pretend to have an affair just for, and then actually we just go, no, not really, but our shows are on sale. And that, do you reckon that would work?

Exactly. Yeah, exactly. We'll be making a big announcement about our relationship at Swansea Arena when it opens. Yeah, exactly. Big ceremony. You're all invited. When are you doing Swansea, Rob? May time.

May time. Sometime in May. Sometime in May. You'll be one of the first people ever to play it. Well, yeah, it's sort of the last few of my tour that's been rescheduled. I started about nine years ago. Swansea the 12th of May. How are you, Rob?

How is Disneyland? You don't know yet because we're just recording this is the last one before you go to Disneyland yeah the last one last pre record I'm just gonna go and pack now how far off getting in the car to go are you at this moment at the moment it's 20 to 11 and what we're doing is because we're flying early Sunday morning this is Saturday we've booked like a little room at Premier Inn so we're going we're getting picked up at 4 30 today i haven't packed yet we should be done here about 12 30 so i've got a couple of hours to pack but

i couldn't bring myself to pack because i wouldn't enjoy it until i had the test done so a little bit behind sketch but i couldn't bear to pack and get start to get overexcited about it so what's your what's your hotel room set up in the u.s of states two double beds one room in a hotel and so does that mean when your children go to sleep you can go to sleep you have to go to sleep yes so basically but what our experience from disney last time is you're knackered right at the end of the day 8 30 yeah we're not going to want it but the good thing is because we have another couple the plan is that when one of us is tired and one of us wants a drink, then we can take turns in going out.

I'll go out with Steve and Lugau, Jess, and vice versa. Because I'm planning on going to the basketball. I'm going to go to an Orlando Magic game. Oh, that's fun. Yeah, that'll be fun. It's only half an hour away from Disney, so we're going to go to that as well. So that's the plan. So either when you're in with the kids, you sleep.

I think it'd actually be quite good, though, to go to bed early. That's a good way of not having to try and do the full nine hour change as well or whatever is six hour difference is that if you're going to bed at 8 30 and getting up at five it's not the end of the world no exactly so yeah that's that's the plan but i'll let you know that didn't work out at all when i get back yeah of course when what happened happens but yeah we're look we're off we're off in a few hours. I'm excited now. But I've got to focus. I'm getting into holiday mode.

I'm going to start drinking beer and not do my job, Josh. When are you going to have your first drink? I've never been so excited about a pint of lager at a Premier Inn before. Are both couples doing Premier Inn? Yes, we're doing Premier Inn the night before the flight leaves Gatwick tomorrow. But I'm very much looking forward to a pint and, no offence, but some terrible food at the Premier Inn. Yeah, fair enough. I don't think anyone's going to take offence at that offense, but some terrible food at the premier in. Yeah. Fair enough.

I don't think that anyone's going to take offense to that. I think that's accepted by the premier. Yeah. Even when, uh, you know, Lenny Henry did the adverts. He didn't mention dinner.

Are you a flight drinker? I'm not really a flight drinker at all on my own, like for work. Absolutely. Um, yeah, I love getting smashed on a plane. What on your own?

Yeah. So what'd you do? Just sit and drink alone? No, no, I ring my mates to get them to meet me halfway. Fancy one just over the Atlantic, do you? See you in half an hour. No, but I'm not getting like boot, I'll have a few beers and try the little drinks

while I'm watching a film or whatever. Yeah, yeah. It's nice, isn't it? Not absolutely hammered but i want my kids and normally when you but we're getting picked up in a cab so i'll have a couple of drinks i'll probably have a bloody mary because it's an early flight so if it's an early flight i'll have a bloody mary maybe then a couple of little like cheeky drinks a couple of beers or whatever but on a night flight i'll probably have a glass of red wine with whatever food they give

you and then try and sleep yeah yeah fair enough do you think i can't sleep i can sleep upright i'm fine can you i can sleep anywhere how can you sleep upright it's meant i got in the back of am uh i was going doing on tour and the tour manager has got this like people carrier thing and it's a big uh thing it's almost a bit like a minibus the seats don't it's not really like you can't really like lay back in it you sort of you're quite upright like a minibus and i literally sat sat in it, put my head down, and I woke up on the M4, which is about an hour and a half from my house. Jeez. I literally woke up, and I was in Bracknell.

It was the closest I've ever been to teleportation. Was this pre- or post-kits? Is it just that you're exhausted now? Yes, pretty much, because I'm exhausted now. And just learning to sleep when you can. Because, you know know our diaries when you do our job you sort of awake a long time so you could be doing office work or meetings in the day but then gigging late at night 10 or 11 and then you're driving home till 2 3 in the morning

so i'm very good at sleeping when i need to in the day if i get even if i've got 20 minutes i'll do breathing and listen to something calming just to try and have a little almost like a conscious power nap right and that to try and just calm down and breathe kind of thing but actually i got so good at being calm and breathing i've been going on stage too relaxed and it was actually worse than being too stressed you can't go on stage relaxed rob no one wants that no no but like not relaxed but like too when you're not nervous that's when you are shittest as a comedian not you i mean one true when you're not nervous or you're not nervous, that's when you are shittest as a comedian. Not you. I mean, one. True.

When you're not nervous or you're too nervous. So it's a balancing act of you want to be calm before you do something that's stressful. But when you're doing that thing, you want to engage in that, either being like, I'm on this, I'm focused, or I'm excited about this. And then it lifts your energy up, I find. Yes. Why do I keep starting these so seriously? We talk about someone fucking falling over or something

or doing a shit somewhere. Yeah. Do you do you want some emails yeah come on okay let me find it yes large shoes i'll talk about bill gates access to computer and the impact that had on his career fuck off yeah but we soon turned it around to talking about his plan demic rob get our point across yeah yeah exactly fair enough fair enough yeah have you got a couple of emails yes do you know what i haven't read this one but it starts my missus will kill me for telling you this. So shall we go with it? Oh, yeah. But down to running

on absolute empty when my daughter was only a few months old. Here you go, some sleep. Middle of the night, she's screaming and needs a bottle. So I run in to save the day.

What felt like a good few minutes of feeding had passed and suddenly she erupted again. Unsure of why, I turned the light up to help me see, only to find I'd filled her entire ear with

formula. Oh, I've done the ear before. Watching the football. Yeah, watching the England game. She was sat in a high chair and I didn't realise it was in the ear. He did a whole bottle in the ear. He did three minutes in the ear, Rob. That's mental. Get this. I put so much in, it was coming out the other ear.

That's bollocks. No, yeah. I've added that bit myself I believed you I was like that is bollocks don't ring up with shit don't lie to us ring up

email him whatever it is you've done send a message that is from Mitch oh god Rob the England game I'm now worrying again about Lapland on the day England play Wales, Scotland or the Ukraine.

You've got enough months to sort it out, mate. Just ring Lapland and try and move the date. Yeah, I bet I won't be the first. And then I'll go, why? And I'll go, I can't tell you the reason. Well, yeah, if it's a night game, you might be fine. How long is Lapland? It's not the time to get into it.

Okay. Lapland might put a screen up. That'd be fun. I don't want to watch it with Father fucking Christmas, mate. He must be quite stressed watching the World Cup draw. It's like a job sheet. Oh, I've got to go there again. Hi, Rob and Josh.

Just to further Rob's anxiety about rides, I have one word to save your life. Go on. YouTube. Right. My 12-year-old daughter is exactly the same and now watches the rides on YouTube prior to a visit and then knows that she'll be safe on and what she still doesn't fancy.

Okay, that's a good... So there's no anxiety because you know what turns are coming. Yeah. This would have helped with a Disneyland Paris visit when aged five, okay that's a good so then there's no anxiety you know what turns are coming yeah this would have helped with a disneyland paris visit when age five when she insisted she wanted to ride the finding nemo themed crushes coaster i desperately wanted to go on it but didn't think it would be suitable for her my husband however pushed forward and i was left with a two-year-old imagine my horror when 15 minutes later part of the ride runs outside and i just

saw her terrified face being thrashed around at 50 miles an hour, traveling backwards. I can still see a traumatized face coming out of their ride, howling loudly, basically on her hands and knees. Dot, dot, dot. Hilarious exclamation mark. I think with rides, there's no point rushing them. Yeah.

Anyway, genuinely, YouTube may help you. Okay, I'll try youtube um brilliant well um should we introduce our guests then josh yes and then yeah next one the next episode i'll be able to discuss disney um for everyone who's interested if you're not don't listen to it but um it'll be good to have a little rundown i think i'm planning no anecdotes fair enough um are you doing anything on our little easter or are you just with the kids well I've cancelled my birthday

because it's too cold oh yeah that's sad isn't it what's your birthday I was going to have birthday drinks in my garden with the pizza oven Rob

yes oh yes your message is oh is that going to be today yeah because that's when you saw it is your birthday today when it was snowing

on Thursday I thought I'm not sure this is the week for it sorry is it your birthday today when it was when it was snowing on thursday i thought i'm not sure this is the week for it um sorry is it happy birthday today no it's next week oh okay yeah i knew that yeah happy birthday for next week josh thanks mate and then i'm going on a stag and then i'm doing some tour shows could i say something about birthdays when you're a man with kids or like or as a bloke i just don't give a shit about birthdays mine or anyone else's is that may it mean rose asked me what i wanted and i thought i really just don't give a shit about birthdays of mine or anyone else's. Is that what it means? Rose asked me what I wanted and I thought, really?

I don't know. Do you know what I want? Everyone's a fuck off and leave me alone. You, the kid. No, I don't want to go for lunch with you and the kids. I want you all just to fuck off for a bit and let me sit here for an hour. I don't think it would be nice if she took the day off nursery on my birthday. I don't think it would be nice if she took the day off nursery on my birthday. I don't think that's... This is Kate Ferdinand.

A really good interview. Kate's brilliant. She doesn't do many podcasts. She's got her own podcast launching, which is great. And she talks about being the step-mum to some children and having her biological child.

She's married to Rhea Ferdinand, who is obviously a very famous footballer, but also, unfortunately, his first wife passed away. And it's quite a bit of a trigger warning for anyone with this. We talk about grief and looking after, you know, being a step-parent and stuff. But he's really interesting, really funny.

But there are moments that if you are dealing with stuff like that, it might be a bit tricky for you. So just a heads up. But here's Kate Ferdinand, and I think she talks brilliantly on what is quite a sensitive subject. Kate Ferdinand welcome to the podcast how are you? Thank you so much I'm really good thanks how are you guys? We're very good very excited to have you on lots of you know what lots of people when I've said we're doing this interview have gone that is that is a good booking that is going to be a good one we've had lots of requests they do know you you're very popular kate you're doing

amazing things for blended families which i've been told about a thousand times when you've been asked people have been asking to get you on okay um but you know we're very excited to have you on and how are you though for people um listening um what's your setup indoors with kids? How many kids in the house? Okay, right. So there's four kids in the house. Yes. I've got three stepchildren. Lorenz is 15.

Tate is 13. Tia is 10. And then I've got my biological son, Cree, who's maybe 14 or 15 months. I can't remember. But 14 or 15 months. That's all right. It's only a month. I thought you were going to go, he's maybe three or 15 months bad i can't remember but 14 or 15 months it's only a month i thought you're gonna go he's mainly maybe three or four years old i can't remember that i've got the years right don't worry so you've got yeah so you're a step-mom to those three uh kids and then you've got your own uh your own son yeah and that must be hard though having that you've got to deal with

your tea the teenagers but then also baby age because it's quite a jump isn't it it's a mad dynamic and we were just talking about this the other day because i think everyone thinks babies are harder but for me the baby doesn't keep you awake well they do sometimes keep you awake at night yeah but i worry a lot more about the teenagers the teenagers give you the sleepless nights the babies just drive you mad all day. Oh, that's not what I want to hear. I thought we were getting through the difficult bit, Rob. Oh, no, Kate, you're on here for hope. This is not ideal. Sorry.

Sorry, guys. I'm starting to disagree with all these people that said this was going to be a good episode. This is going to be the end of me. Everyone thinks they get easier with age, but with the kids, different age, different problems, isn't it? Yeah. And how old were you when you...

Because they're dad Rio. How old were you when you were with Rio? Like, what age did you meet them? OK, so I met Rio, for anyone that doesn't know. His wife passed away a few years before I met him. And I met Rio, I think I was 26. Wow, that is young, isn't it? To be a stepmum, isn't it?

That's intense. It was intense. It was crazy. And I think where I hadn't had children before, I thought, don't worry, I'll breeze it. It's fine. I really underestimated the job ahead. It's hard. But listen, at the end of the day, I wouldn't have it any other way. It's an absolute mental house. If you come round here, it's crazy 24-7. So many personalities, a baby screaming. Oh, it's just it's mad. But it's amazing at seven, so many personalities, a baby screaming, oh, it's just,

it's mad, but it's amazing at the same time. So you said like before that you were kind of, you thought I'll breeze this. What was it like the kind of first, did you, you must have heavily planned the first time you met these kids, right?

Yeah, we met and we met as a friend actually. Right. So I have got a friend in common that they know the kids know um and I just went around their house and um yeah they didn't know that I was talking to their dad at this stage they just thought there was a lovely lady there and she had a chihuahua and they really like dogs so they call me the woman with the dog um and that was my little in I think they like the dog and I just kept turning up everywhere with the dog. Just turn up with more and more dogs every time.

But they got to know me before they knew that I was talking to their dad, if that makes sense. And then they were involved in that process, so Rio said to them, you know, I quite like that girl with the dog. What do you think? Should I ask her out? And then they were involved from the beginning.

Oh, that's lovely. Yeah, so it's a sort of that's really interesting way of doing it because also it must be so difficult because you know something with blended families which is a new term isn't it blended families i've got two stepbrothers and that didn't exist when we were growing up but it must be hard because it wasn't with my mum and dad my dad was married before so it's a sort of bit awkward, sort of a new marriage, but then they're still like suffering with grief, the kids. So it's an even more charged dynamic, isn't it? It's tricky.

And you know what? I always say this is not a rule book. So you're just winging it and just hopefully trying to do what's best. I think you make mistakes along the way. You realise you could have probably done some things differently, but I feel like it's the same as being a biological parent. are going to make mistakes you're learning on the job but you're just

trying to do what's best for the kids really yeah and so then you kind of met them and you're the woman with the dog and then kind of Rio asked um should I go on a date with the lady with the dog and then he found out your name and then um and and so And so when you kind of start becoming Rio's partner, does that put you in a weird position with them where you didn't know how to address them? You must have moved over time into this kind of position of authority almost, but it must be a long journey. Oh, yeah.

You know, at the beginning, I suppose I was just their friend. I was the fun one. Whenever we went out with Dad, we'd do fun stuff and I'd bring sweets around and I was that kind of person. But I always was quite firm from the beginning, actually, just because they're three kids and you've just got to rein them in sometimes, haven't you? They gang up on you after a while.

Yeah, you're outnumbered. Even my two little girls already, they're only little and they started bashing me up and tickling me and I can't stop them. You've got lots more to come because the older they get the smarter they get um they try and outsmart you but yeah i think when i moved into the house was when i kind of maybe moved over to a bit more authority it was hard they they probably thought who is this woman coming and telling us what to do? We've been breezing it before. But at the same time, it helped give them like structure, I think,

and boundaries. And although kids don't know this, I feel like they do thrive off of that and they become more, with their mum, they always had a lot of structure. She'd pick them up from school. It was all very regimented. And I just brought a little bit more of that. So I felt that that made them feel a bit more at ease. I think kids love structure and they love to know like who's picking them up or what when they're

coming home and when they've had that so much you know turmoil and sort of every the whole world got thrown upside down if all of a sudden you know their dad's sort of really happy and then they're meeting the woman with the dog and it's sort of a distraction everything's a bit more fun I think actually that that sort of someone there who's quite solid and is there every day and that regularity I think really helps, doesn't it? Yeah, they need that stability. And it was hard at the beginning. But my main thing was I tried to just get to know the kids.

It wasn't just about me and Rio. It was about having my relationship with the children as well and finding out about them, doing things that they loved and ganging up on their dad. Sometimes they find that quite funny. Yeah. Yeah. Just just getting to know them, really. And that's how we formed our relationship, I suppose. Was you a bit worried about, you know, having when you had Cree, like bringing in another sort of like a sibling and child and into the family would you ever concerned about that or were their kids just straight away excited and buzzing for it they were really excited the kids but I was really really worried I was thinking you know Cree's

gonna call me mum I haven't really been mum in this house I'm always Kate and that works well but now I'm gonna be mummy and how they're gonna cope with that and what do I do like it was more me that was worried the kids weren't really showing me those signs yeah um but I just bought loads of books you know like for Tia when I'm gonna be a big sister and she was part of everything she bought his first outfit to come home in so that's nice again I just made them part of the whole process it's not like mine and Rio's thing. It's our family thing. Yeah, of course. Did you feel, though, when the baby came there,

you obviously you can't give the older kids as much attention because they're off going to school and things like that. And you've got that baby in front of you. Was you a bit worried that you might be sort of like spread a bit too thin? Oh, my God. Thin? Seriously? Spread so bloody thin.

Oh, my gosh. I remember it was like I think i was in the hospital for five days and then it was maybe like three days before christmas i came out now i'm normally like dancing around the house singing christmas songs i'm a bit crazy and i just remember i had an emergency c-section i don't want to be graphic but it wasn't ideal we love all details here this is the place for it if you're gonna be graphic about your c-section this is the podcast and i don't say that lightly that's what we built this podcast for right josh that's the only reason we're doing it mate so yeah it wasn't great i was in a lot of pain and i had this baby i couldn't really pick him up or do too much with him because i was in a bit of

a bad way um and i just felt so guilty on the kids I just felt tremendous guilt I felt like I couldn't be who I needed to be for all of them but I think I put that pressure on myself like I always put pressure on myself to be perfect and the best and it's just impossible to keep up with we talk a lot about like you know what you do for the kids or how you make them kind of feel comfortable with it but there's this whole other side of it obviously which is that you're someone who's in her kind of mid to late 20s and you're taking on these three kids like and taking on this whole kind of family this kind of ready-made family and that's a huge pressure on you and that's a huge thing to suddenly go oh I've gone from being single to this whole thing and that must have been quite tough for you to deal with as well, right?

Yeah, when I look back, it was hard. It was hard. But I've got this mentality that, you know, I love Rio. And if I love Rio, then this has to work because I want to be part of everything. I wouldn't want to be like a half-hearted step-mum. If I love him, I love the kids. I just need to be part of everything and do what's best for them

so it was hard and god this is still up and down sometimes because the children have been through so much but that's just my life now I suppose and I'm just so happy and grateful to have them do you talk to them about their mum and stuff like that is that a really that must be a really difficult thing to kind of know how to broach and deal with you know what their mum is a massive part of our lives and always will be. I would never want the children to think that I'm taking the role of their mum. I am like a maternal figure to them. In a way, I'm like a mother figure to them, but their mum's their mum. And so she is part of our life all the time. And we talk about her all the time. I've spoke about this before.

It's really weird, but I kind of feel like I know her because for me to be the best parent to my three stepchildren, I feel like I need to know her and know what she would do and be able to speak to the children about her. So, yeah, I embrace all of that. Yeah. And is Mother's Day a difficult day for you and the family? Oh, God.

My first podcast, just so you know, is based around Mother's Day a difficult day for you and the family? Oh, God. My first podcast, just so you know, is based around Mother's Day and it's a really emotional episode where I speak about my struggles and we hear from lots of other women that struggle. Okay, so normally I find it really hard because Rio's lost his mum and the kids have lost their mum. And it was hard for me when I wasn't a biological parent. But last year was my first Mother's Day with Cree and I thought, bloody hell, it was hard for me when I wasn't a biological parent but last year was my first Mother's Day with Cree and I thought bloody hell it was the hardest one yet because I kind of

felt this feeling of oh my god I'm it's my first like official kind of thing Mother's Day with Cree and I want to be celebrated and well but at the same time oh my god everyone in my house had such a big loss and yeah I just couldn't balance it i was an emotional wreck last month's day um really really bad but i think it's more just you know i worry about everyone because you feel guilty and you shouldn't feel guilty because you you which you're allowed you should be allowed to be excited about that with your your baby and stuff but it's just it must be difficult in the in the house yeah it's just a balance to find but but actually this month's day i've never said this ever i'm actually quite looking forward to it because um we're just going to have all the family around and i think the more you add pressure on the day that it's mother's day

it's mother's day it just reminds you of everything that everyone's lost so we're just going to have a day with the family and just enjoy it that way and hopefully it'll be okay your podcast called blended which is where you interview other people that are in similar kind of situation or different kind of blended family situations and when did you think this kind of became a thing that you wanted to really not just throw yourself into in the family but feel like this is something that I need to talk about publicly and this is something I kind of want to bring to people's attention basically when I met Rio and the kids it was like a really unique situation

and I just did not know where to turn I felt like I was just oh I just didn't know what I was doing I'd be googling things like what do you do on this day or what do you do and I just I didn't know anyone in a similar situation basically so I couldn couldn't relate to anyone. And as much as I spoke to my friends and other people and they tried to help, I just always felt really, really alone in what I was feeling. And I sort of, you know, put a few things on social media at different times. And then we'd done a documentary about becoming a step family. And I was just overwhelmed with the amount of people in similar situations and who felt like they needed help, but didn't know where to turn. And, yeah, so I started Blended.

It's kind of like therapy for me because I'm meeting people in similar situations. I'm like, you know, getting everything off my chest. But it's helping so many other people as well. And to be honest, for the first time in a really long time with work, I feel really satisfied and like I was meant to do this. So out of all this crazy situation that is gone on, I felt like some good has come out of it and that I can help other people. I'd say as well, Kate,

cause I, you know, I used to watch TOWIE, I still do. And you were on TOWIE and, and then you left TOWIE. And it's like all this got like, you know,

you became like, basically became like getting with and marrying like one of the most famous sports people in the country. It was a step family, all the, you know, you became like basically became like getting with and marrying like one of the most famous sports people in the country. It was a step family. All the stuff about that. Rio's first wife was in the papers. It was a huge, big thing. But then and you had to be a step mom now, a biological mom to Cree. And you must have lost yourself a bit in that because you were all these labels apart from just Kate and her job. And it's quite interesting to see where you went from reality TV to where you are now where do you think if you hadn't met Rio where do you think your life would have gone you know what how you put that is absolutely how I felt um like before I was on TOWIE I had like a normal job I worked in the bank I organized events and then when I

went on TOWIE I felt like I kind of lost myself a little bit I had like a very I had a breakup on bloody national tv which is never ideal um don't always show your best side when you're doing that no um it was a great episode though good tv okay got the views I just looked a bit mental yeah and yeah I feel like I lost myself I lost myself in that whole process in everything it's like I completely got was overwhelmed with with you know the kids and Rio and one thing about going out of Rio who in this house is made to feel like a very normal man let me tell you but outside everyone thinks he is a legend and you kind of get lost in that because I've always had my own compared to Manchester United's current defense though isn't it what I mean? That's something I would say. Listen, I try to get involved in the football, but I don't know everything.

Yeah, yeah. They're not the best at the moment, Man United. It's brilliant. It's so much fun. And going out with someone so famous, you can lose your identity anyway, because everywhere you go, everyone goes, how's Rio? How's Rio? And in the end, I go, bloody hell, I'm fed up.

I love him, but I don't want to talk about him everywhere I go. So, yeah, I lost it a little bit. And this blended and has really helped me, you know, figure out, I feel like I was just meant to do this. I've always felt like I was meant to help people, but there was a lot of judgment from being on a reality TV show and things like that. But, you know, I feel like I'm where I'm meant to be.

Kate, you seem totally different to the people that are on there now like with you're quite private with your kids like you know you don't put the kids faces on up much and you know you're not really putting them front and center on social media and stuff like that whereas a lot of people in reality tv still do that is that a conscious decision to do that I mean when I when I met Rio, he'd already, him and Rebecca had already made that decision. But I do agree with it because I feel the children have been through a lot and they're entitled to just be kids and, you know, not have everyone know who they are and just have a normal life.

They've been through enough. I just don't think their faces need to be plastered everywhere. Yeah, I agree. Totally, totally understand. Is there people you've spoken to on the podcast? Obviously, every situation is so different, but there must be other people that you've learned really, like, interesting things off.

And as you say, it's like, it's in a way quite a small community of people, but is it really useful to be talking to people like that? You know what? It's actually, I think one in four families are blended now so I didn't realize how many people are in this kind of world yeah and I learned so much like I've spoke to some like professionals and just everyday people it's not just about celebrities because you know everyone's going for it and yeah I feel like I'm learning so much. I come home with discussions at the dinner table with the kids.

Yeah, I've learned loads, really. What have you learned from this podcast, Rob? What have I learned from this podcast? You can't broadcast hungover. That's what I've learned. You fall apart, Josh. And we're not very good at finding out who's asking the next question. We've never been good at that.

I don't think that'll ever change, though. That's just who we are. That's the reason Michael's there, isn't it? To make us look professional. And how's it going? We did it again. Oh, you go, then. Go on, Josh.

Well, go on, you go. I'm just saying, you asked the last one. Normally it's one each, but if you want to do two in a row... I'll be honest with you, I didn't have anything to say, Rob. I felt there was a pause. I thought I needed to say something,

and then you started. I interrupted you. It was a disaster. What I wanted to ask is, how And then you started. I interrupted you. It was a disaster. What I wanted to ask, how's it going with Cree now? He's getting a little bit older because he's sort of not the baby, baby stage anymore. He's becoming a bit of a toddler. Are you taking him to classes and things like that? And is he getting into stuff?

Yeah, we go to classes. He's at nursery now because I've started working sooner than expected. And he's at nursery. He's loving it. He rules the roost in this house. He's like, God, he started with those, you know, the head swings, the tantrums. Yeah.

He's bashing his head on everything. But he's full of life. He's so loud. I think everyone in this house fights for attention. So he's like the loudest out of the lot, which is saying a lot because it's a loud house. And, yeah, he's a happy little thing and what's the school run looking like for you who's in who's in charge of school

run obviously how do you split the parenting with rio is it dependent on workload and stuff or do you have defined roles with school runs and stuff like that no do you know what the big kids have started getting the bus to school now the bus to school which is unbelievable let me just say the school run oh my god i can't stand the school run it really stresses me out do you guys feel like that well my daughter's a nursery so it's only the nursery run but luckily they don't have like a deadline for nursery yeah and so i'm not and i'm like this is a bit late though isn't it And so I'm not, and I'm like, this is stressful now. Quarter past three is a bit late though, isn't it? Yeah.

You get there at half three. But you know the good thing, Rob, is that I can combine drop off and pick up if I drop her late enough. If I drop her at quarter past three, I can just hang around 15 minutes and take her home. No, but my main school run thing is I'm like, this is stressful now. But when there's a 9am deadline, I am in big trouble here. When the school run was at its worst, Kate, when it was at its

peak, when they were too young to get the bus, what were we doing? Two or three different drops or were they all at the same school? How bad was it? They're all at the same school. It goes from like primary all the way up to secondary so it's not too bad. It's just the getting out of the house on time and then when Cree come along and I

couldn't drive, no, we just changed it to the bus. They get on the bus. They quite enjoy that. Like it's a school bus. It's not a red bus. And then I just take Cree to nursery. But going back to Rio and I, he works quite a lot.

I've started working quite a lot, to be honest. But when we're both here, we share the role. It's quite equal, to be fair. He's really good. Really, really good with the kids. And the holidays and stuff like that, obviously it's been COVID and things like that. Is it hard keeping a young... Because of the gap, isn't it?

The big gap, age gap. What's the age gap between Korea and the next one? Ten years, nine years. Ten years. So do you find yourself, if you do go away anywhere or go out for the day trip, one of you is off with, like, you know, the older ones and then ones with the babies.

Is that difficult finding stuff to do that they're all happy? Yeah, it's impossible. But we all stay together and at one stage, some of you are going to be bored. That's just how we do it because it's impossible. The kids, the big kids, what we kind of do is we can entertain Cree for an hour and then get on with what the big kids want to do. Or I just try and do stuff in my days off in the week with Cree they're a bit more babyish and then at the weekend do more with the big kids but he gets bored they get bored what can you do

you've just got to get on with it it's really I mean I've got a difference between a four and a half year old and a and a nearly one year. And the difference there is stark enough that you go, you can't entertain them together. The thought of where you would take a 15 year old and a one year old to have a great Saturday. There's your business idea, Rob. I don't know what it would be. Yeah.

Are you finding your relationship with the older kids changing slightly now they're teenagers and there's hormones involved? Has it changed at all? Is it still pretty good? You know teenagers grunt don't they they're just going you're going more than they're going that's how they talk to you but they find me annoying probably um because all i do is moan at them because they just leave all their stuff on the floor but it's really good because where they're getting older i don't know it's like a

how do you explain it it's a it's a really deep relationship we talk about in- older, I don't know, it's like a, how do you explain it? It's a really deep relationship. We talk about in-depth things. I don't know, I'm loving it, probably the best it's been so far. Oh, good. You know, we all have our deep night chats every night. They come in my room, we have a chat and, yeah, it's a good place. But, you know, they're 13 and 15, they think they're 20, they think they're really grown up.

It is funny. And is there stuff, do you think, in a way, it makes it easier to talk to you because you're kind of... Because you're Kate and you're not, you know, their blood relative. Is there a way where you've got that way where you're slightly an easier confidant in them for that situation? That's a good question. I don't really know.

They do confide in me with a lot of things and I've never really thought about, is it because, you know, I'm Kate and not their mum. I don't really know. They do confide in me with a lot of things and I've never really thought about, is it because, you know, I'm Kate and not their mum? I don't know. I think maybe we've just built that bond where I'm really open. I think being in this situation, you have to be really open and we share everything with each other and we've just created that, like, space for communication.

So I don't know, really, the answer to that one, but whatever it is, it works. Oh, that's good. I'm worried about being a confidante to a teenager. I don't know, really, the answer to that one. But whatever it is, it works. Oh, that's good. I'm worried about being a confidant to a teenager. I don't know. You're worried about everything, Josh. I am worried about everything, Rob, yeah. Maybe they'll need to be my confidant.

Every night, I'll go and sit in their room and I'll tell them about my worries. That's not going to mess them up at all, is it? Dad's crying at the end of the bed again because he doesn't know what bin it is for the recycling day the thing is though you'd prefer to know than not know that's what i say to him like whatever you're going to tell me i prefer to know than you know find out another way would they ever say i'm going to tell you this but you can't pass this on to my dad yes and have you ever passed it

on children if you're listening i'm really sorry sometimes i do depend on what it is but sometimes it's just not worth it i just think whatever i'll deal with it myself and as a step parent what's what is it with like you know rules for the kids you know like screen time or going out late or coming back or stuff they do like do you feel like you can sort of tell them off or give these ground rules or or is it something that you sort of you need you feel like you should be running past their dad before or after a while once you're all sort of settled in does it becomes more relaxed but they must be quite awkward at the beginning if you think their behavior is not suitable it's hard to sort of say. You know what? Every family is different.

But for our family, from the beginning, Rio said, you know, their mum was strict and she disciplined them and you can do the same. So from the beginning, I've been firm but fair. And I do, I'm moaning at them constantly. I'm like a mother figure to them. Like, as you see a mum would, that's exactly what I do. I love them. I cook for them. I moan at them. I hug them as you see a mum would that's exactly what I do I love them I cook for them I moan at them

I hug them everything that a mum does I do and I am strict and I think yeah I've said it but I drive them mental because they just leave their stuff everywhere and all I do is moan

but yeah it's just normal to a normal parent I suppose and do you do do you have any sort of they're too old for that now but do they do that do you have little jobs for pocket money or we have a pom-pom jar for the little ones where it's like if you're good do good listening you get a pom-pom then it fills the jar and you get a i suppose you can't really get that past a 15 year old but is there like i love the

way you said for the little ones as if we were worried it was going to be for your wife we've got a pom-pom yeah no we have jobs in the house so we have like a chart on the wall it gets very political at times right and they get pocket money and they have to do between washing up surfaces and what's the other one clearing the table and make their beds and they all share the washing up surfaces and clearing the table so you haven't got a dishwasher rob if you see the amount these kids eat they're teenage boys they're eating like double the amount of a man the amount of food i have to cook yeah it's crazy so it doesn't all fit in the dishwasher unfortunately i'm just now thinking when i've

got a teenager my job amount is going to go down i'm the surfaces guy i'm the dishwasher guy they probably can't stand me they wipe the surface they don't do it properly i, we're going to keep coming back and doing this until it's done properly. And sometimes we do it three times a night. Really? Well, I suppose because you and Rio both came back from fairly humble beginnings and then obviously your lives have changed massively. So the kids are having very different lifestyles to you guys. So is that something that you and Rio sort of are aware of

and want to try and keep them grounded? You know what? We're so fortunate. Rio's worked hard and we do live a lovely life. And it's hard when you, you know, we live in quite a big house and we go on lovely holidays to keep the kids grounded. So the way we do that is by, you know, they've got to have jobs. They've got to clean up after themselves. They've got to make the beds. They've got to do things. You know, we don't get them everything they want. Absolutely not. We try and keep them grounded in that sense yeah of course it's difficult though isn't it because you know you you want them to be like you need to take this you know you shouldn't take this for granted but then when you were growing up like you know

there's it's always it's all relative basically isn't there where you may not have had a bigger house growing up but there's always food on the table and stuff like that no one's going to you you're taking that for granted eating you know i, but there's always food on the table and stuff like that. No one's going to you. You're taking that for granted, Ian. You know what I mean? Where there's some people that that's a struggle. So I think it's all relative, really, as long as they're sort of polite and, you know, they do do some jobs and don't take the piss too much. Because that's the worst fear, isn't it?

A horrible little kid and you're just like sport brat. Yeah, and they're so well-mannered. They're so polite. But, yeah, they don't know any different, do they? This is the life they've lived in, so we can't blame them for that. But we just need to teach them how to live without us, I suppose, so that when they do grow up, they know how to do everything. And do you...

This is a big question. Do you know what? I was going to wait, but I need to ask it. I did Crystal Maze with Rio Ferdinand, and we won the main thing. How often does he mention that, and how big is it in his trophy cabinet? Do you know what? I can sing it right now. I hope so.

I knew it would be a big deal for him. No, I'm in the back room. I'm joking. Great acoustics in the toilet, so that's where I record from. Yeah, I heard that you've done that, to be honest, and it's sitting on the side and that's it, I'm sorry.

I'm glad it's on display. That'll make Joshua better. Look at that, Rob. Champions League trophy, Crystal Maze with Josh Riddick and Sarah Cox, another Champions League trophy. That's how it works.

What's the social media rules for the kids? Because they're teenagers now, so they're obviously aware of it and probably want to have it. Is it something you've spoke to them about and things like that? They got they've got social media but just private accounts yeah you know like kids i think as a generation we're bloody obsessed with

socials aren't we we all just can't i can't you just end up going on it all the time um but yeah they're on it all the time apart from they have to put their phones outside their room at bedtime oh do they oh so on the landing are sat? I've got a big charging pack and it charges like everyone's phones and it's on the landing and they hate it. But otherwise they end up staying up all night on it. So they have to put it outside on charge at a certain time. And have you ever snuck a look at their phone while it's on the charging pack? Yes.

A hundred percent. I do. I look at their phone sometimes. Listen, with kids, you don't know what's going on. Yeah. So every now and then I have a little look. They know I do because I'll tell them. I'll say, I looked at your phone and I saw this.

But you've got to keep an eye on them, especially with social media. You don't know what's going on. You don't know who they're talking to. So, yeah, I do have a little nose every now and then. But that's difficult, though, because as they get older, what age are they allowed in their rooms? Do you know what's going on you don't know who they're talking to so yeah i do have a little nose every now and then but that's difficult though because as they get older so then like you know what age are they allowed it in their rooms i mean because really the truth is kids or adults we shouldn't have our phones next to our beds or be scrolling in bed i do it obviously like everyone but it's not good for you so is there a temptation to put your phone out there as well with theirs to carry it on for longer yeah but when my alarm goes off it's going to

wake up the whole house how does your alarm go off if your phone's outside the room? Two words, alarm clock. There are other ways. Oh, my God, I'm crazy. No, Rob, she's got you there. There's no way of having an alarm without your phone being next to you. There's no way Kate Fernandes is waking up without a phone. There's no way.

How did people wake up before 1993? Oh, my God. What is wrong with me? I said that in that statement. Get a cock roll. Get a cock roll and wake her up. You said it so cocky. Like, how do you think I'm going to wake up, Rob?

Thank you. Good night. Checkmate. Oh, my God. Shit. I'll get an alarm clock. Well, I was thinking about getting one because I go on my phone and before I know it, I've looked at it for an hour when I'm supposed to be going to sleep.

So I was tempted to get an alarm clock and leave my phone on the landing. I've done it. Have you? I've got an alarm clock next to my bed that I've used once when I did it for one day. And now I've just got my phone set as an alarm. I mean, I'll be honest with you. In the last four years since having children, I haven't even set my alarm once. That's the other problem.

Yeah. In the last four years since having children, I haven't even set my alarm once. That's the other problem. Yeah. Well, what time do they wake up? How's Cree sleeping at the moment? Is he all right?

Last night was horrific. Like, he sleeps so well, but he's a bit ill today. And last night he was up every half an hour, which is so unlike him. Oh, my God. But he sleeps normally from 7pm. He goes to bed and he sleeps to 5 36 6 30 ish depending on what day it is so you don't need an alarm really do you if he's getting up then no but i have to get the big kids up early and i like to go to the gym early as well

sometimes so what time do you normally get up i get up at six every day right okay and then yeah if he slipped in a bit um so and then the kids the kids are up at what time day. Right, OK. And then, yeah, if he slipped in a bit. Yeah. And then the kids are up at... What time do they have to be up and out? It's really early. 20 past six they wake up. Whoa. I know.

What are they doing, hosting a breakfast radio show? That is early for a teenager, isn't it? They're slow. They're very slow. They leave the house at 11. It takes them an hour to get out of the so they leave we leave early in this house the school's a little bit further away they're quite slow in the mornings they're really fast around and every time they go to leave it's like hurry up if you could hear me get down the stairs what are you doing where's your pee kit that's all we

do i'm shouting for five minutes oh god i dreading it. I'm dreading it a little because my daughter's six and she's already coming home and going like, oh, I don't want to. She used to love school. She still does, but she's been going,

oh, I don't want to go and I don't like doing my handwriting because they all get a bit conscious about certain things. Some, you know, because anyone, you're good at some things, you're not so good at other things

and they get a bit anxious about stuff like that. So it is hard because they're not very good at communicating straight away. That's what I try and tell my daughter just let me know just let me know where you can you can notice their behavior they're not happy about something but you've got to try and pinpoint it it must be so hard when you've got there's four kids in the house yeah

it's it's hard but you know i always start by going i don't feel good about this today like is there anything you don't feel good about and normally they end up telling me you know with kids you always know when there's something wrong with them. It just sometimes takes it a while for them to actually tell you, doesn't it? But do you think taking all this on at 26, it was a bit like, it was better you did it then than at like 36, just because it's almost like ignorance is bliss, like the naivety of youth.

You were just like, oh yeah, and took it in your stride, where I think maybe if you're a bit older, you might have gone, God, that's a lot to take on. Yeah, I was very naive very naive and it's a good job I did do it early um because now it's it's not a walk in the park but it's I don't know anything different whereas if I'd had my own children before I think it would have been a lot more difficult did you make any sort of like mistakes early doors when you're still trying to work out what worked best for the family oh my god it's the same even with Curry like he's one and i make mistakes i make mistakes loads of mistakes probably it's weird when you know you're moving into a house and you you do know the people but

you haven't lived with them but it's not just a partner it's three kids as well so everything's like up and down how did you uh approach sort of moving in to the house i mean is it a different house now tell me if it's too much like? I mean, is it a different house now? Tell me if it's too much, like it's too personal. Is it a different house to the one that they lived in with their mum or is it the same house? No, it's the same house. And that was hard because obviously it's their family home. They've got lots of memories and there was lots of Rebecca stuff everywhere.

But I had to think of the kids. Obviously, I really didn't want to move in this particular house my dream probably would be to get a house somewhere else and we start again yeah but it's not about me it's like the children have lost their mum and if they've got memories here I just didn't think it'd be fair to like uproot them and they've already been through enough yeah of course yeah it was it was mad it was crazy at beginning. We just have to make sure that everything's right for everyone. And do you feel like you've reached a stage now where you know what you're doing with it

and everyone feels like they know what's happening? Or is it a constantly kind of developing relationship and dealing with everything that's happened? Is that just an ongoing kind of changing thing? I mean, the grief is ongoing because it changes at different times you know depending on what they're going through and stuff like that but in regards to like my relationship with the kids and Rio and where we're at as a family I think we're really secure and we all know where we're at and how it works for us and it works well we've got that to a good point

it's amazing when you kind of dig down into it how much there is to think about, do you know what I mean? And how it dominates just your day-to-day life. It's just that you suddenly think about, oh, there's this and there's this and there's school sports day and how they must be thinking at that point about their mum and all this kind of stuff.

And it must be, there's not much time you go through where it feels like it isn't present in some sense i imagine yeah and i i overthink everything um because you're always worrying like teenagers are moody um they just are i don't know they're just moody they're hormones but then you'll overthink it you'll overthink like oh my god is it because of this is because of this and you start overdoing everything when really they might just be being a moody teenager for the day. So it's hard because you do question absolutely everything. And like their mum's their mum. She was an amazing woman.

And it's a big loss for them. So they'll feel it a lot at different stages, I suppose. Especially as they grow into adults as well. Like, you know, if they graduate from uni, it's the thing where your parents are normally there or when you get married and things like that. So there's always little, you know, I think Mother's Day is a good example of that, because every year at that time, you're sort of reminded of everyone sort of thinks about their mother. And then as you go through life, those moments of when you have your own kids, you think about your parents and stuff. So there's always little reminders here, there and everywhere. Yeah, it's hard and we worry about their journey ahead.

And, you know, it's always going to be hard and it's it's it's just tough to know that you just can't make this better for them like I love them dearly like they're my life I can't imagine life without them and all I want to do is make it better but I can't and that's a really hard thing being a parent and not being able to make it better for your kids. OK, honestly, I think this podcast can be amazing because, you know, we get so many requests to speak to people with blended families and things like that. And we always try and get as many people on as we can. But sometimes it isn't the easiest thing to talk about, especially something, you know, if there's people being remarried and all sorts of different things stopping that. But I think this podcast can be amazing. You've got some great guests on here. sorts of different things stopping that but i think this podcast could be amazing you've got some great guests on us here we're talking about adoption fostering finding love after loss and and

julia samuel mbe believing that every family has a story all these brilliant guests that can um you know touch on different aspects of a blended family i hope it's good i think if you're if you're open and honest it will be. Because that's the most important thing, really. I think especially people in the public eye, it can always look all sort of super rosy. But I think if you're honest about stuff, it really helps people listening. Because you did a great documentary about it as well,

which I thought was brilliant. Thank you. So should we get back to the crystal mate? You're really proud of him, aren't you? Why did he leave Leeds? Is that what this episode's going to be called? Crystal Maze? Crystal Maze and some other stuff, it's called.

And it's with dog woman. Crystal Maze and the one with the dog. Josh, do you want to ask the final question? Yeah, because it really... I think people will be excited to hear about Rio Ferdinand's worst habit that you haven't spoken to him about. What one thing does he do that annoys you a lot, but you haven't discussed it yet, but say he was to listen to this, maybe because he thought, I wonder whether I mentioned the crystal maze, that kind of thing.

Does Josh Whitacombe still remember me? Does he still remember me? By the way, we ask everyone this question, not specifically about Rio, but about their partner, so don't feel that way. We don't ask what thing about Rio Ferdinand. What thing about your partner, and it's been asked in a more clear way before than it has today,

I'll be honest with you. What thing about your partner that you haven't discussed annoys you about their parenting? Now, this is, I tell him everything. There's nothing that annoys me that he doesn't know, just so you know. I think your noise would get on. Can we have some of them building up,

just some of the things you've told him recently? You should meet up with Emma Rose. I'm probably out of order because I say everything. I just can't keep it in. It's like verbal diarrhoea. What really bugs me is when, like, the other day, I say, right, I'm just going to... We might be going out. I'm just going out, babe. We're going upstairs to just sort myself out.

Will you just look after the kids? And I come downstairs and he's asleep on the sofa. And I'm like, you're meant to be looking after them. You're asleep. And he goes, oh, just rest in my eyes. And I go, babe, Cree's running riot and no-one else is going. I'm meant to be looking after him. What kind of time of day

is he falling asleep on the sofa they called him ferdy nap ferdy nap because he loves a nap seriously he could fall asleep at any time of the day okay that's a good skill zone actually that's a good skill to have though that's just sleeping whenever you can but not when you're supposed to be looking after your kids okay thank you so much and good. It's been so nice to talk to you. It's brilliant. Yeah, good luck with the podcast, Blended. Yeah, really good luck with it, Kate. I think it's brilliant what you're doing. Thank you so much for talking to us.

Thanks, guys. Thank you. Bye. Kate Ferdinand. Incredible, incredible interview. Not by us. I mean, interviewee, should I say. I went quite stiff neck on that interview.

Yeah, I know. I was trying to loosen it up by bringing up the crystal maze and you weren't going with it rob i was like what what's going on here which one of us is which yeah i know yeah i think i think it's because we've had so many people that wanted uh kate um fernand and rio talking about the sort of blended family thing on it i was sort of trying to get a lot out of it. But yeah, maybe I went a bit too stiff. But yeah, I thought it was great though. She's so open and honest, didn't she? With 26 she was when she took on sort of three step kids.

What were you doing at 26, Rob? Did you start a stand up? Yes, I was three years in. I think I was in Australia doing The Jungle. Oh, there we go. See, that's the kind of thing I expect you to talk about. Yeah, well, I can't go, oh, you took on three stepkids at 26 and then just do anecdotes of Lamar from Kajagoogoo eating fish eyes.

No, exactly. It's a bit odd, isn't it? That's why we save it for this outro. What was he like? But, Rob, speaking, you know, as the loose neck for the day, I've got to ask. Yeah, yeah. You're so loose.

You're getting drunk now. A few weeks ago, you was off your face. Now you're just asking Kate Ferdinand questions about the crystal maze when she's trying to talk about the impacts of a blended family and dealing with grief. And you're talking about the Aztec zone. I was trying to find light and shade, Rob.

Okay, fair enough. I just felt, you know when a player runs forward out of position? You were a player who'd run out of position. I was having to cover for you. So when you'd run into that position you're in, I was like, well, someone's got to offer the Crystal Maze questions here.

Someone's got to talk about quiz shows. Thank you very much, Kate. And we'll see you on Tuesday. See you on Tuesday.