Rob Beckett and Josh Widdicombe's Parenting Hell - S7 EP16: Richard Osman

Episode Date: September 15, 2023

 Joining us this episode to discuss the highs and lows of parenting (and life) is the brilliant presenter, producer, and novelist - Richard Osman. Richard's new book 'The Last Devil To Die' is available now. Parenting Hell is a Spotify Podcast, available everywhere every Tuesday and Friday. Please leave a rating and review you filthy street dogs... xx If you want to get in touch with the show here's how: EMAIL: [e-mail] INSTAGRAM: @parentinghell MAILING LIST: parentinghellpodcast.mailchimpsites.com  A 'Keep It Light Media' Production  Sales, advertising, and general enquiries: [e-mail] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hello I'm Rob Beckett and I'm Josh Willickham. Welcome to Parenting Hell the show in which Josh and I discuss what it's really like to be a parent which I would say can be a little tricky. So to make ourselves and hopefully you feel better about the trials and tribulations of modern-day parenting each week we'll

be chatting to a famous parent about how they're coping or hopefully how they're not coping and we'll also be hearing from you the listener with your tips advice and of course tales of parenting woe because let's be honest there are plenty of times where none of us know what we're doing hello you're listening to parenting hell with margo can you say rob what okay can you say Rob? What? Beckett. Beckett. Can you say Josh? Um, car. What?

Car? No. Can you say Josh? Yes. Go on then. Say Josh. Josh. Where do you come from?

Okay. There we go. Hi, Rob and Josh. This is my almost three-year-old daughter, Margot, having a go at saying your names. She's from Essex or East London? Uh, not far Josh. This is my almost three-year-old daughter, Margot, having a go at saying your names. She's from Essex or East London. Not far off. Kent. Warpington stroke Bromley.

Margot. Yeah, your neck of the woods. It sounded like Rise of the Foot Soldier. They live in Dunstable, but they're originally from Warpington stroke Bromley. Yeah. We've used your names as practice for some time now to help a mild speech delay.

I'd say she's done all right. Love the podcast. Thank you for taking the pressure off. Having to be a perfect parent. All the best, Amy and Margot from Dunstable. Base, aka, you two are shit at it. Makes me feel better. Josh, how are you?

I feel like, have you been busy? I'm so tired. I'm fine. I've been busy. It's that thing of, and you'll know this, Rob, when you're working away, you come back and you want parents and see your children that's what you come back yeah and so you just don't get a break because you just get back either working or looking after the kids i've got this afternoon

off rob okay and then the next time i've got off uh just to myself uh is 18 days time yeah I think you know that that's just called being a parent I think I know and I think that's what I think that the issue you're having is you're assuming there will be days off but there just aren't well I thought when they went back to school Rob you know what I've done I've accepted my fate now and I've learned to relax when I'm with them. Yeah, no, me too. Chilling out. Chilling out. It's 18 days until I'm alone.

It's not. It's the call. I have two, mate. Yeah, absolutely. I am chilled out when I'm with them. It's when I'm not with them. It's when the lack of chill comes in. Right.

Okay. But then you're moaning about being with, as soon as you come back from work. I'm not moaning. I'm not moaning. I'm just, I'm just telling you this. I'm just telling you why I'm tired.

Oh, that's why you're tired. Also, it's not you're not enjoying it. You're just saying you're tired. This is the misconception about this podcast. We're not moaning about our kids. We're moaning about the fact we're really trying and it's difficult also as well you i'd say your son's at a very labor intensive age because i can tell you what

happened to me this morning josh it was 6 30 a.m about the time i get up and i heard my seven-year-old from downstairs saying don't worry dad i've let the dogs out for a wee and I thought you know what I fucking made it I can smell the finish don't you give me fucking that's parenting you're always on mate don't you fucking give me that what are you doing this afternoon because last week you sent me a picture of yourself in a hammock that's because I live in zone six baby no yeah i'm not i'm not having to go at your hammock no i'm just saying like move out baby a bit more space chill out it wouldn't help i'm working or parents if any more space your son my issue isn't that i haven't got room for a hammock until 18 days time you can afford a a bigger garden. It's not about the hammer.

You can choose to be a bus journey away from a tube, where you are, in the hubbub of a cosmopolitan city. I'm not talking about where I live, Rob. That's neither here nor there. That wasn't a reference to your ability to source a hammer. I'd finish work and come home. Lou took the girl somewhere that didn't involve me and I'd come home and she was just gone. So I was just laying in a hammock i'd finish work and come home lou was lou took the girl somewhere that didn't involve me and i come home and she was just gone so i was a i was just laying in a hammock and just

thought this is living yeah i know fair play what it is the reason is i've done summer holiday yes yeah which i'd say was a 50 success yes and then we've gone straight from summer holiday to the one month of the year which is absolutely obscene for the amount of work i'm doing right okay so this is a peak period so this is actually podcast gold we're heading into now this is yeah this is this is a real this is a real test of your new mental attitude the way you're dealing with stress and workload well the problem is you can you can kind of in our job go i'm just going to cut down on work i'm just going to do these things but things get

scheduled so that you have groups you're either do you know what i mean yeah filming you can't go excuse me channel four can you change your tv schedule because i want to look after my mental health a little bit so i'm only going to do 20 hours a week it comes in groups do you know what i mean yeah that's the way the work comes in so when does it come down for you is it because we're doing a big thing in october no but that's all right that's okay so september's the busy time september's the busy time see i don't know if this is the beginning of a new career for me or the end of my career josh but we uh we're doing we're doing a show and i've got two weeks i've got two weeks off in the middle and I just booked that off ages ago for some family stuff

and just booked two weeks off and the TV people said so in that time, because it's right in the middle of the whole filming schedule but in that time if we send you emails will you be able to read them and report back and I just went, no yeah but like if we sent you

I was like, no and i was like because i've got i've got to protect that time where i will go mad but now the proof will be in the pudding if i just i'm not invited back so in about six months i'll be able to let you know if this new approach to work's a good idea yeah or it really does impact the financials yeah guys i'm prioritizing my mental health but i'm also um not prioritizing income yeah so that you know i'll let you know i'll get on but that's my new yeah i'll let you know um but you're you're all right though apart from that you've just been busy josh yeah it's been fine uh back at school etc which was it was i was sat because i was away filming for the first day and

that felt really i didn't like that at all well yeah it wasn't her first it was her she's already she's done her first year so it wasn't yeah i don't think you can miss the first reception but yeah i was like that i i was supposed to be working well i was working but i just went in half an hour late so i could take him in because be working. Well, I was working, but I just went in half an hour late so I could take them in because I just sort of forgot that was the day. But it does feel like, oh, you should take them in. But they're only like year one and year three now. So it doesn't really matter.

But it does feel a bit like it would be nice to take them in. Yeah, I know what you mean. It's weird, isn't it? Because you feel like there's a big – like I haven't met a new teacher yet properly. Do you know what I mean? It's that kind of – you feel a bit like you're like, oh, God, am I a bad dad? Do they do like curriculum evenings where they invite you in and they sort of tell you? Oh, no, I'm dropping off tomorrow.

I'm fine. No, no, no. But they do a thing where it's like a curriculum evening where they basically invite you in and go, right, this is what we're going to teach kids this year, basically. And it's a chance for the parents to meet each other and stuff like that. I just said to Lou, I'm not expecting you to go, but I'm not going. So I don't want to put any pressure on you. Like you have to, as if, you know, whatever.

Did you use the word protecting my mental health again? Look, guys, I am just protecting my mental health. Yep. Lovely. The wedding invite looks great, but I am protecting. Of course, I love your child. I want to be at the christening. I'm just protecting.

And my mental health's better if I don't go to your kid's fucking christening and I sit and watch football all day, okay? So why don't you shove that up the fucking chapel? Because I'm protecting my mental health, okay? So why don't you back off? Where's the line between protecting your mental health and doing whatever you want all the time and being quite rude? I know, yeah.

There's got to be a point at which you go, can you take the bins out? I'm so sorry, but I'm protecting my mental health and that will smell. And my brain doesn't like bad smells. No, no, exactly. We've got to look after Numa Uno at the moment, because once I'm happy, everyone else is happy.

That's the way I look at it. Yeah, there is a bit of a balance. In conclusion. Yeah, in conclusion. You can't push it too far. In conclusion, me and Lou have had a conversation where she thinks I might be turning to a sociopath. But I just think that's just a young guy

protecting his mental health. That's all. So it's Lou Govec? Yes. But she's interested in that kind of thing and she likes meeting up with all the parents and stuff. And she was a teacher, so that is a bit more her wheelhouse.

You'll be at home in full protection mode. No, I'm going to get the... In the mental health hazmat suit. Kids, if I cook you dinner tonight, it will have an impact on my mental health just have another bowl of cereal thank you very much i do write in if you've um used the excuse protecting my mental health for the what events have you got out of yeah that's a great one great one. When have you used that, the mental health card,

to get out of something you just didn't want to go to? That made me laugh the other day. My kids went to me. Some of them said to me, well, Daddy, why do they want to have a photo of you? Because they're noticing the photos a lot now. Why do they want to have photos of you? I went, oh, because I do shows.

And they went, oh, do you find it annoying? I went, well, not really. No, it's nice when people are nice. If they're a bit rude, it's not that nice. And I said, but when I'm with you, I prefer to be chatting to you, not chatting to other people. You're at school a lot and stuff. And they went, why do they do it?

I went, oh, because they see my shows. And my daughter went, well, if you don't like it, stop doing the shows. I was like, yeah, fair point, actually. Let me talk you through economics. Okay, we had this chat on holiday, and I went, let me sit you through economics. Okay. We had this chat on holiday and I went, let me sit you down and give you some fucking home truths.

The other thing, I think my daughter said to me the other day, you know, they come and whisper things in your ear sometimes. Do your kids ever do that? Like at the football game? She ran up to me and I was sat on the sofa and she just whispered in my ear, you're so weak. And it was awful. It actually felt like, you know, like the bad voice in your head.

It was like that came alive, and it was my own chaga. What thing does that say to someone's ear? You're so weak. What was it? Do you know why she said it? No. I was just sat down having a drink. I don't know if. I don't know if she's heard it on something or whatever. It's a weird thing to say.

Or maybe you are weak. Well, no, don't start getting in my head now. Maybe that is. Maybe she just kind of looked at you and thought, he's a weak man. He's a pathetic weak man. I'll tell you what. I'll tell you what. I, well, I say I.

My neighbour helped me. I sort of watched him do it. This is pathetic. This is already pathetic. This is fucking lame. I had a wasp's nest in my house, in the roof. In your house? I mean, basically.

Don't go out of your zone, too. It wasn't in the house. It was, like, on the roof. On the house. It was going through a little, yeah, on the house, on the crack. So none of the wasps were in the house, but they were in, like, under the guttering and stuff like that, in a little hole they were going through. And you could see them buzzing around. There was always, like, ten wasps were in the house, but they were under the guttering and stuff. In a little hole they were going through.

And you could see them buzzing around. There was always like 10 wasps around this little hole. And then I rang up Rent-A-Kill. Guess how much for someone to come around and spray? Basically, they spray a bit of killer stuff to go on the wasps and it kills them. I wouldn't even know where to start with that. A couple of hundred beans? Yeah.

I thought maybe tops 200 quid. £350 plus VAT. You pay up front. start with that a couple hundred beans well yeah i thought maybe tops 200 quid 350 pounds plus v80 you pay up front and if they come around your house and they can't reach it it's 100 quid call out oh that's annoying come on mate and i went you know what i think that's a little bit overpriced no thank you and i put the phone down i just thought to myself i've got no idea i'll get rid of this wasters now yeah of course they've got you over a barrel, really. Exactly. So anyway, I was driving back, and I literally saw my neighbour with a massive pole with a little lance thing on the end and a big pump thing.

I went, what's that, mate? He went, oh, there's wasp nest around the back. I'm just getting rid of it. I went, oh, my gosh. Hold on. Yeah, yeah. I'll get him that again, and then they charge a fortune. But all it is, they spray this in it.

I found out what they used. So me and him, pump, pump, pump, done a wasp nest blimey did it work yeah i mean what i say we i held the ladder as he climbed up onto a wall and then he pumped it and is it gone yeah wow um josh i've spoken for too long should we bring on a guest richard osmond the main event josh big guy big dog he's here we've wanted him for ages yeah we've wanted him for ages he refused to do it online because he doesn't have a laptop apparently but he's written about 15 books and we got him in soho in a studio and we spoke to him what a great guy camera's off mike's on oh his book's out mano to mano to mano yeah recorded by mano but it's quite man heavy actually but that was an accident that's just sort of the way it's fallen. Here's Richard Osman.

Hello, Richard Osman. Hello, Josh Riddickham. How are you? I'm very good. How are you? And who is this gentleman? Hi, Rob here. I'm Josh's assistant.

I take notes. Work experience. Pretty much. Yeah, lovely. We're doing it in person, Richard, which is exciting. It's much more fun doing it in person, I think. I don't know.

Because I find it weird. I like it. He doesn't like being in the room with i don't know because i find it weird i find it doesn't like being in the room with us no i know i love being in the room with you but for a podcast tell your face mate i haven't got a face for telling you but i think sometimes not in person yeah i don't even like the camera on really yeah i'm experiencing what the person's saying the same way as the listener so if you listen to this as a punter just as a general listener yeah you don't see each other's faces and what they're doing do you want to close your eyes do you want to just close your eyes how's that for you though because i'm just

sat with my eyes shut my mum warned me about this a basement in soho just slip this mask on and just pop my trousers down rich but we're very excited to have you. Yeah, I've wanted to have you on the podcast for years. Really? I didn't know what you were doing. I should have asked. We did, but you said in person it was lockdown. Oh, okay. At one point I messaged you and you said you didn't have a laptop,

which I just thought was fucking mental. And you said I didn't have a laptop with the internet on or something. No, I think I don't like doing podcasts at home, so I'd always say, oh, I don't have the tech. Yeah, I know, but that's weirder than just annoying. Just say I don't like doing podcasts at home, so I'd always say, oh, I don't have the tech. Yeah, I know, but that's weirder than just saying I don't like... If you said, I don't like doing podcasts at home... No, but people take offence then. I don't.

People go, yeah, but ours, though, ours is quite a fun one. Yeah, yeah, yeah. We've never said that. Yeah, yeah, good. Have we? Or they'll say, all we need you to do is think of 14 things. You have to think of... What's your guilty pleasure? Nothing.

You shouldn't be judged on what you like. Yeah, exactly. And then that sort of kills the mood. What's your perfect Sunday? Not this. Not thinking of this stuff? I'm a zero prep guy. That's my dream. Are you the same? Yeah, I am really. Usually the first thing I say is going to be the best thing

you're going to get out of me. By and large, the more prep I do. So you're a briefing call guy when you do a panel show. Yeah. Last leg or something. If they call you up and briefing call you, you... I'm all right. Do you refuse it? No, I don't refuse it.

Of course not. No. Because it's always good to talk to people. And it calms the producers down. Yeah. Do you know what? That's always the thing. Producers, you know the thing when...

Bloody producers, eh? Now you're on the other side. I always remember when... Yeah, honestly, what is their problem? I always remember whenever a young comic starts getting big, and you boys both went through this, you'll get booked on shows. One of the big things is they send you a car.

Yeah, yeah. And every young comic is like, oh, my God, I've made it. Like, they sent me a car because I'm pretty big time now. And the truth is, a producer doesn't send you a car because you're big time. A producer sends you a car because they need to know where you are.'s essentially like having a bug because they don't

trust you they know you're an idiot they tell you to turn up to the studio two hours early yeah because they know you're always late yeah and they need to know that you're in a car and the person who's driving that car can ring them yeah that's all they need and also they know when you've been picked up and yeah a bit of a backstage from the last leg. For years, Alex Brooker didn't know that. So he was giving his excuses for being late. No. Not knowing.

That the cab driver said he's only got in. They had a record of when he was getting in the car. Sorry, the car didn't show up. Sorry, guys, the car was late. And they're like, oh, Alex. He should know by now, shouldn't he? He does know by now. He certainly knows now. He certainly knows now. That's for sure. He's very good, should know by now shouldn't he he does know about it he certainly knows now he certainly knows now that's right he's very good alex

brooker isn't he he's always great he's my favorite on that show yeah i mean because you need one comedian yeah yeah exactly otherwise there's two journalists yeah yeah like you because it adams like quite a tough job live show yeah yeah together the script like that then you've got the sort of news anchor person what you do and then funnies with brooke i was watching one the other night was that mel b was on it was a new record for you can always tell when alex has got a joke right it's like um but mel b is not used to working with comics maybe she talked so much i think he did six oh it's like when god bless, he's still got it out. Come on, Mel!

I was really counting. I was like, what's Brooker got here? He's got something about the thing that Adam said about two and a half minutes ago now. And it must be good, because it's such a big gap now. Poor old Mel B. I'd say you and Alex Brooker fall into the same pool, which is people that you book not as comedians,

but they're as good as comedians. Yes. So you'd book them on A League of Their Own or Last Leg or something. I've always been lucky like that, because by and large, when people watch you on things, if you boys are on something, they go, go on then, make me laugh, because it's your job. Whereas with me, they're like,

oh, the guy from Pointless is on this show. So as soon as. Whereas with me, they're like, oh, why is it the guy from Pointless is on this show? Yeah. So as soon as you do a joke, they're like, oh my God, this guy. You've seen the guy, he doesn't do jokes, he just did a joke. I bet John Grisham's not this funny. It's like, yeah, all I have to be is funnier than John Grisham, whereas you have to be funnier than Steve Martin.

Yeah, it's hard, isn't it? Hardest job in the world, Rob, isn't it? Toughest job in the world. Toughest job in the world. A doctor, actually actually both nurses and doctors like the bloody hell no comedian then doctor then novelist well that's what I think so you are an author

now yes I am officially a really successful one there's probably a stat backing up as most successful one ever or something more than Donaldson excuse me

who more than Julia Donaldson Julia Donaldson she's got a long back catalogue great answer great answer so she sells pound for pound she's still selling Gruffalo's great answer so she sells pound for pound

she's still selling Gruffalo's you know what I mean no not personally she wrote that a long time ago it's done it's done like years ago

and like every week just the money just keeps running in for Donaldson and the guy who did the pictures Axel Scheffler I do think

that Donaldson like obviously she wrote the Gruffalo but who drew the Gruffalo Axel Scheffler I know but he doesn't get enough respect. I didn't even know his name. He gets the money.

They 50-50 it. Yeah. Fuck. Yeah, that's... That's put me off writing a picture book. Not drawers. No, no. Illustrators.

Illustrators. I shouldn't be the vocab man in the room. Yeah, Scheffler is... Oh, he's raking it in. Don't you worry about Scheffler. Oh, Scheffels. Oh, yeah, if you went to Scheffels' house, you'd take a long time to find a loop.

And Donaldson lives in quite a small house. No, she doesn't. She does. No. Isn't that one of her books? Because... Donaldson lives in a very small house. She opens the door.

There is that story about the house. She opens the window. That's true, isn't it? What's that book? What, Donaldson's book, Room on the Broom? No, not that one. There's one about a house where there's not enough room

in the room or something. Is there? Was it not just an email to her estate agent? Sheffield. She does live in a small house somewhere. No way. Yeah.

Let's talk about your empires, man. What have you got? We've got places... Is that another of your business? We got locked. You're fucking loaded. No, listen, honestly. Listen, we're on a parenting podcast

on my left hand. I don't need the space anymore. Oh, yeah. Yeah, of course. Okay. And that's a producer. Oh, he's back again. That's a fair way. No, no, we're on a parenting podcast. My left hand, I don't need the space anymore. Oh, yeah. Yeah, of course. Okay. And that's a producer. Oh, he's back again. That's a fair way.

No, no, what is this? Someone trying to get evasive about how big their house is. That's what that is. You don't give a fuck about this show. You just want to flog your new book. What's it called? Last Devil to Die. September the 14th.

The fourth in the series. The fourth in the Thursday Murder Club series. People seem to be loving it, which is lovely. You've got two kids. I do how old are they are 25 and 23 just going to 23 how often do you hear from a 25 and a 23 year old i mean i would say enough no it's interesting that because sometimes you think i haven't heard from them in a little while and it's that bad parenting on my part is Or is it bad childrening on their part? And then I think back to when I was 25,

how often I talked to my mum. Maybe like once a month. Yeah, yeah. Because we didn't have email back in those days. And I just thought, that seemed to work out all right. I still love her. She still loves me. It's okay.

So you have to slightly go, oh, it's okay that there'll be a few days go by and you haven't spoken to them or messaged them. But yeah, I hear from them a lot, which is lovely. One of them's just around the corner from us, which is good. But no, honestly, it's great. I love that they're out there in the world. I love that they're self-funding.

They're not like looking at the book charts going, Dad, come on. Yeah, come on, mate. Come on, mate. Do us a favour. You're saying what Julia Donaldson's kids are driving around. Yeah. I say, yeah, you've seen the house she lives in, though.

Come on, mate. No, it's great. You know, yeah, you've seen the house she lives in, though. Come on, mate. No, it's great. You know, I did your live show, and the one thing I felt I could pass along to that audience, because they look knackered. Yeah. Oh, my God. I mean, listen, they were making noise, but a lot of it was sort of, you know what? Huh?

Yeah. It's a tough gig, because everyone in that room wants to go to bed. Oh, they're steeped down. I tell you, Manford is the only person I've seen start his show with, just so you know, we'll be done by 9.45. Do you know what? And he's right to do it because TV shows, you always know when they're finished.

Yes, yeah. But you go and see live shows like theatre sometimes. Oh, I hate it. You have to look it up and just go, three hours? Oh, my God. That's why I've never go to Bruce Springsteen. Oh, no, I never would. No, no, thank you.

It's too long. Yeah. Do 45 minutes. Oh, and we'd love it, wouldn't we? why I've never go to Bruce Springsteen oh no I never would no thank you it's too long do 45 minutes and we'd love it wouldn't we I'd never go over 10pm with my shows my tour shows

it's too much you start at 9.30 don't you quarter to 10 sometimes 15 minutes of gold if I'm going home that's why I love

Edinburgh because it's an hour and that's about the amount of time you should watch someone yes I agree I think maybe a little interval or something.

But yeah, where do we get onto this? You were talking to the crowd. Obviously, they had younger kids, a lot of the audience, apparently, in Hell Live. But yeah, some of your advice was quite good. Yeah, no, I was saying that, because it's hard with young kids, and it really is hard. So people are feeling bad about themselves.

Really don't. There's very few harder things psychologically, emotionally, and just physically than bringing up kids especially if you've got a few of them or if you're doing it by yourself but people always say never ends though honestly it never ends once you've got them that's it forever it's just listen it changes but it's always as hard and that's absolute bullshit it gets so much easier and pretty much every turn you know when you go to school, it gets a bit easier. But then you've got, oh, I've got to do nativity plays. Yeah.

There's a bit of admin and they've got swimming, picking up. Book day and all of that kind of stuff. But yeah, as soon as they're old and they just hang out with their mates, and you're like, oh. But even school is easy. Like, you're going, all right, so I've got to do a school run and then I'm up against it and then maybe I'll have to work this evening. But then when they go to sleep tonight,

they're asleep. Yeah. Why do they wake up every two hours? Yeah, that is so tough. That makes it so tough at the moment with babies. Because it gets to the point where your kids start waking up at midday because they're teenagers. Or they get up at like 2pm.

And there's a certain type of parent, of course, who's like, no, no, we must wake them up because we've got to go hiking. But if you're not that sort of parent, and I am not, you look at your watch you go it's 2 p.m i've watched the saturday lunchtime football game already and he's not even awake yet you know it makes me feel better about myself if someone's still asleep but i'm like i'm getting stuff done yeah and also you're the protector of the house yeah you know people are sleeping upstairs someone would have burst

in you're there yeah unless it's a really good bit know, people are sleeping upstairs. If someone were to burst in, you're there. Yeah, unless it's a really good bit of football. Oh yeah, then it's, sorry, he's upstairs. Yeah. But yeah,

and then they leave. And of course, that has some sadnesses to it. But also, I'm struggling to think of one. But, you still love them. Do you cry when you drop them at uni?

They still love you. That's a very, very good question. Yeah, uni's an interesting one because that's the first time you... It's like a soft launch. Yeah.

You know, like when a restaurant has a soft launch and it's cheaper. You sort of get to get over some of that stuff. But when they're at uni and then you remember you're at uni or starting your first job and you think that's life. They're finding life.

They're enjoying life. They're meeting people. They're doing interesting things. And learning. You can only learn from doing it yourself. Yeah, exactly. Because you think, don't do that or where that will go there.

But they have to learn themselves. I mean, if you're a parent who micromanages, then I guess it would be an issue. But you mustn't micromanage kids because they're going to end up doing the thing that they want to do. I have quite a laid-back attitude to kids and that with screen time and stuff like that. I've taken this with me since we did the live show.

Oh, have you? That's good. People go, honestly, they're on their iPads all day. You think, good. That's fine. The money that's been spent on entertainment for those kids and everything on the internet, the entire knowledge of the entire world is there.

When I grew up, we had three TV channels and that was brilliant. Yeah. But they got everything. Of course, let kids watch stuff. I grew up watching telly and that's what my job was in the end.

So long as they're actively watching, so long as they're interested, so long as they're asking questions. You don't put the child in a high chair with the telly on, and it can't... When they're older, and they actively can choose it. Yeah, if they want to watch Peppa Pig, great. What a great thing to watch. It seems fun.

Zandra Armstrong does one of the voices, doesn't he? Of course he does. Of course he does. He'll go hiking. Get up, kids. No, he wouldn't go hiking. Doesn't he go hiking? If he goes hiking, it would be for a Channel 5 documentary. Of course he does. Of course he does. He'll go hiking. Get up, kids. No, he wouldn't go hiking. Doesn't he go hiking? If he goes hiking, it would be for a Channel 5 documentary.

Of course, yes. Absolutely. He wouldn't go hiking without getting paid for hiking. Monetising hobbies, as I say. There's never an addition of... When we used to film Pointless, he would always have to wish about 100 kids happy birthday in the Daddy Dog voice.

Someone was going, I'm really sorry, I couldn't possibly impose. And you know they were going to ask him to do daddy dog. And he loves it, he turns it on. Daddy dog from Peppa Pig? Because he also does Hey Dougie. Yes, he does Hey Dougie as well. But the dog from Peppa Pig, he gets that more.

Oh, I don't know, he does Hey Dougie. It's after my time. I was Teletubbies and Tweenies when my kids were... But the Teletubbies had kids. You said the Teletubbies had kids, are you asking? Yeah, they have. No, they haven't. So in the new series, it's still on telly tubbies had kids you said the telly tubbies had kids are you asking yeah they have no they haven't so in the new series

it's still on telly that's what was in their tummy yeah basically what so there's little tubbies yeah there's little the ones that we used to watch yeah

Poe, La La yeah I've got little ones in the house in the weird little mound house are you kidding me in my life yeah like little babies

what are they called they're well cute what are they called I don't know I've not been watching it If your parents had called you Tinky Winky What would you call your kids

That's the question isn't it Because it can't be fun Going through life And call Tinky Winky What are the Tilly Tubby's Babies called Here we go The Tiddly Tubby's

Oh yeah It's like Asperg Juniors Isn't it Yeah so one's called Frankie Bridge One's called Una Healy Una Healy Yeah

They're all married to footballers. So the Tiddly Tubbies are baby Teletubbies appearing in the revival series. Their names are Mimi, Dada, Bar, Ping, Ruru, Nin, Duggledee and Umbi Pumbi. That's a lot of kids. Do we know who are the parents who impregnated them? Wow. Yeah, well I suppose they might breed in a different

way. I suppose so. I mean, looking back, they shouldn't have done them as kids to start with. They're way cuter. Yeah, that is cuter. Would you ever, I mean, Would I ever have sex with a Teletubby? It's not that kind of podcast. There are podcasts where that would be.

I think I've come closest to having sex with a telly tubby. Oh, really? Yeah, because when me and Lou started dating, Lou went to a fancy dress party as a telly tubby. No. And then came back to mine that night. Oh, wow. But the uniform came off.

But you didn't continue. I didn't keep the head on. You didn't have sex until you got married. Oh, yeah, of course, as well. But the green one. What was the green one? Tipsy. Would you ever, successful TV producer, successful writer,

would you ever go into children's television or writing no I don't think that I would you get an awful lot of people who go I just used to tell

this story to my kid and I just thought it's absolute nonsense as well either A it's a lie which is fine you've got to sell books

or B if you're any sort of performer the second you start saying to your kid there was a land far away, the Noggin Noggs and the Biggin Biggs were fighting each other, they know from second one, they think,

there's something in this. The kids go, but Daddy, what happened? No, shh, shh, shh, I'm just writing this down. You barf them. Yeah, yeah. You're literally fixing their agent. They're kind of going, and the Noggin Noggs were so afraid because the custard monster

was coming oh yeah custard monster just google custard monster to see if there's one already so I've got a great idea

exactly no I don't think that's for me no you know I don't think so listen one day

I might do but do your kids have they read your books one of them has one of them hasn't one of them never will because he is

no interest in ever reading any book ever unless it's like a guide to Legend of Zelda. The other one has read them so that's nice. It keeps me grounded. She hates them. But she's read them.

Did you give them the books with a lovely message? Yeah the first one is dedicated to them. Which is nice to the two of them. I still think it has to be but what does it mean really? Basically it's worse if you don't. But if you do it's sort of like yeah, that stands. I mean, I did it in our books

you sort of just have to. Yeah, well I'm on book four now and you quickly run out of people. Well, we're sat here. What about to the loyal reader? To the loyal reader. Oh, that's cool. Can you imagine?

I mean, literally people are heuping before they'd even decide to read it. Yeah. They go, you know what? Don't dedicate it to me. Let's give me some of the royalties. This book's dedicated to your ex-girlfriend. angry. Yeah. They go, you know what? Don't dedicate it to me. Give me some of the royalties. This book's dedicated to your ex-girlfriend.

Excellent. Lovely. Did you ever consider doing the voice for the audiobook? Oh, my God, no. My book's the sort of main narrator is an 80-year-old woman. Yeah. I'm not sure I have the range. Did you try the voice?

Of course not, because Leslie Manville said yes. Yeah. And Leslie Manville's one of the greatest actors ever. Yeah, but did you figure that maybe? And now Fiona Shaw does it. Yeah. No, of yeah no of course i mean well i'll tell you what are you not at home did you not when they've messaged about it do you think i could probably give it a go no it feels to me like no you practice the voice if i had insisted yeah they probably would have had to say yes yeah but you know whenever authors say yeah i'm doing my audio but you think why would you do that?

That must take so long. It's like reading a book, but out loud, and they're really, really long, in like a tiny studio somewhere, and you've got to do all the accents, and you like... That Caribbean character. That was a mistake. You know what? It was OK to write, but not to read. And also, you've not to read and also

you've got to read your stuff and at that point it's done you can't change anything so you do a sentence where you go oh that's clumsy

so I cannot understand given that they will employ someone to do it for you yes did you pop your head in literally Fiona Shaw

has just finished doing the fourth one and I'm filming something with her tomorrow oh nice a little extra and we're recording a little audio thing for the end of the book as well and she's great and she rings up something with her tomorrow a little extra and we're recording a

little audio thing for the end of the book as well and she's great and she rings up and goes I have a question about this oh this is lovely oh no it's very seriously and she does it brilliantly yeah you don't need me going it was a sunny day come on did your children because your children would have been early teenagers when you came on TV? They were a little bit younger than that, so I started on TV probably 2010, something like that, so they were kind of 10 and 12, yeah, so not many miles off that. If people don't know, you were...

I've never heard this from you, actually. OK. The story of Pointless is that you sat into the run-through. Yes. And they were going to get someone else to do it. And then the people said, no, get this guy. As you know, like quizzes and things like that, you can't set them off a bit of paper

because you start explaining the rules to any quiz and immediately it sounds incomprehensible. Yeah. If you just start explaining the weakest link, within two seconds everyone goes, I'm not listening. Apart from Romesh who goes, I'll do it. Exactly. But you two seconds everyone goes, I'm not listening. Apart from Romesh, he goes, I'll do it. Exactly. But you know what?

Nice to see him. But you think Robbie's... Well, yeah, I think maybe he could take his foot off the pedal on some of the shows that I'm not on. But if anything

affects me financially, he should carry on. He does do a lot though. He's sort of got a touch of the Zandra about him. A touch of the Zandra. Yeah, I think it's strange because they've got very different backgrounds. But yeah, pointless.

So we literally did a run-through for the BBC and I always make the producers play the presenters because some companies hire in presenters to do run-throughs. But the producers know if there's any hidden little problem with a show or they know if a certain thing happens, the run-through's going to be great, then they can make that happen. So I played me.

A guy called Tom Blakeson, who now does The Wheel, with Michael McIntyre, played Xander. Was there someone who was in your head to be in this role? No, there wasn't, actually, which was the interesting thing. So they liked it. They said, listen, let's do it. And then Tom Blakeson himself came up to my desk and just said, the BBC have said,

we're looking for someone like you. Would you be interested in doing it? It's been such a weird moment in your life. Well, it kind of was. And it was. It was lovely. And I thought, I've never, ever wanted to be on telly. Ever, ever.

It just wasn't. I really loved my job. And I loved being behind the scenes. I loved being in the gallery. Yeah. Because there's always miniature heroes and celebrations being passed around. People make you a cup of tea. Oh, sorry.

I thought you were genuinely meaning that. Like, the director's a miniature hero. Yeah, but everyone's a miniature hero. You're a script supervisor. Every hero's miniature. hero. Yeah, but everyone's a miniature hero. The script supervisor's a miniature hero. Every hero's miniature. Legitimate, yeah. I felt like Alex Brooker of MLB there. Yeah, yeah, great, Josh,

but I've got a really good miniature hero joke. You've got one. Shit, come on. Let's not let that slip. But we can edit into that. Thanks. You're going to be like Lee Maxpeed. Oh, come on.

So I didn't, you know, it wasn't something I was interested in, but I thought I'll do it because most shows fail. You do stuff and you put it out there, and I like the show, but I didn't think it know it wasn't something I was interested in but I thought I'll do it because most shows fail you do stuff and you put it out there and I liked the show but I didn't think it was anything

like unbelievable and then they got Zander to do it as well but I thought yeah I'll do a series of it and yeah 12 years later I was sort of still doing it

but yeah I didn't seek it out and what did your kids think when you said I'm going to be on TV I think they sort of thought again because it was quite low impact

it was on like BBC 2 at sort of 2.30 in the afternoon or something, the first series. It's weird that daytime TV, because if that's the only thing you do, you're massively known to a very small percentage, and then obviously moved schedules and later on. But the interesting thing is now, because terrestrial TV,

as we know, is in a fairly terminal decline, but the ratings of daytime TV is not in a terminal decline. So actually, daytime TV is getting bigger and bigger and bigger as is sport in comparison to normal entertainment shows. Suddenly, you know, daytime TV is sort of this behemoth. You're okay, you didn't podcast. I think I'll be all right.

You've already pivoted away from terrestrial TV, which is what people have to do. And so then Pointless kind of blew up. It kind of blew up around the same time we were getting on TV. Yeah. We were on a lot of the same kind of panel shows and stuff. Because I remember you coming to Edinburgh with your kids and stuff. Yeah, you brought your son to see me.

Yeah, yeah. About 15 or something. Yeah, yeah, yeah. They saw all sorts, which was great. Did you get to take them to loads of... Do you get lots of perks from that kind of stuff? No, not really. Well, the interesting thing was,

I always took the kids to Edinburgh from when they were kind of seven of seven or eight yeah and if you've got kids at home other than the expense it's much more expensive now but there's so much good stuff there and you suddenly realize oh that's what the street theater is for as well yeah because you're sort of trying to walk up and down you know the royal mile and the kids are going right i'm so sorry but there's somebody on a unicycle and they're juggling fire dad i think this might be the best thing i've ever seen in my entire life oh and he's saying stuff to the crowd he just pulled a guy out of the crowd and he has put a lit torch in the guy's mouth i have listen all i've seen in my life is telly tubbies I'm now seeing this my mind is blown

anyway we'd always take them like we went one year and my son must have been six or seven and we went to see the amazing Bubble Man and he got my son up on stage

and he put my son inside a bubble you know good luck David O'Doherty beating that but anyway so I take them every year and then as they get a bit older

there's certain comics you can take them to see which is certain comics you can take them to see, which is certain comics you know are going to be a little bit cleaner. Yeah, Chubby Brown. And then, yeah, as they got sort of 15 or so, they could go and see anyone. The fame thing wasn't good. But having been a producer for so many years and knowing loads of the comics,

you know they're not going to pick on you. Yeah, of course. That's the best thing. You know if you turn up a tiny bit late and you sit on the end, no one's going to mind. So that's the lovely thing. So they've always been quite involved in the comedy community and they know people. No, it's great. And another great thing about kids getting old is you watch better stuff, right?

Yeah. There's better TV, better films and you can just go and see great comics with your kids. And that's, my kids are both, neither of them love sport. Oh really? That must be weird for you. But they both love comedy. Yeah, you go one way or the other. I take that, yeah.

That'll do me. So, yeah, we've always had fun. I've been to see both of you boys in their teenage years. Do they have a favourite? Oh, no. No, I don't know. And that man is the bubble man. They still love him.

I feel like you're quite a cool dad in that sense. I mean, cool would be pushing it, but okay. He's coming from Josh Winnicombe, though. Oh, yeah, that's true. you live in london is that right i can't believe it i've seen him he's got a car of this guy i've seen him driving down the road you know what it's good you didn't do the voices for your book yeah i'm not cool no no do you like go to them you should watch this, or you... Yeah, it was great to sort of introduce them to things,

but I never sort of introduced them in that way of saying, oh, this is, like, some of the comedy canon, you must watch this because it's really important. What I did was thinking, this is a great opportunity for me to be able to watch something that I like. Yeah, yeah. I always remember the show

that was absolutely in the sweet spot as they were getting a little bit older was TV Burp. Oh, yeah, so good. And you were just thinking, I'm watching brilliant comedy. was absolutely in the sweet spot as they were getting a little bit older was tv burp oh yeah so good and you were just thinking i'm watching brilliant comedy genuinely brilliantly crafted comedy they are absolutely loving it yeah it's rare that that comes at the moment steven mulhern's in for a penny oh i bet it's on itv that's so good he basically hangs around like piers or shops or busy high streets and gets random people in the street and goes, like,

right, if you do this challenge, I'll give you a tenner or 20 quid. And it'll be, like, trying to stack up one piece on your arm and catch them, silly little games like that. And then he absolutely mugs them off. Like, he'd just come over and go, you all right? You been on holiday? And then someone's, like, fake turned up and just ruins them. He's actually quite mean, but he's so charming.

He's good, yeah, he's very charming. He's really good, and the kids love that. I was going to gonna say but that's the thing if you can watch something your kids are laughing as well you think harry hill god bless you thank you so much harry's one of the best thank you for everything that you did well your kids getting old and stuff like that i know you said like it gets easier because you're not as much i mean personally if my seven-year-old could drive i don't think i'd ever see her she's absolutely fine on her own she'll just give you lifts as well yeah exactly but as i've got older i've had to come to you with like for like advice but like grown-up life advice as opposed to like teenage stuff because i and i want to ask you about this as well but like you're very

measured and present and it feels like you maybe got your head right before any tv or fame came yeah and you knew exactly who you were and exactly how you operate under most stresses before you had any sort of attention. I think I'm quite good at work advice because I knew how to build a career. And my daughter, who's slightly older and slightly further advanced in her career, and she's going through interesting things. She was negotiating a pay rise. She was like, I feel like maybe I should ask, but I don't know how. So that to me is great. I sat down for half an hour and said, this is how you ask the easiest thing in the world

how do you do that by the way? how do you ask for a pay rise? who's your agent remind me? well they've done it for me I just thought like if you worked at a normal job and had to go to your boss to ask for a pay rise I was terrible at when I was doing 10 minute spots and people would go

you do the 10 minute spot you smash it that bit obviously that was fine And then you ask for 20 minutes. I would never be able to ask for the 20. I'd never go, get me back and I'll open this. I'd go, yeah, I'll do another 10 minute. Yeah. In six months time. Great. It's tricky. But money, I always thought, and again, it's something I wasn't born with, but you learn the first time I really worked to that. Firstly, I wanted to leave the company I was with. It's a terrible, terrible place, but at the same time, I didn't want to, but you learn. The first time I really worked it out, firstly, I wanted to leave the company I was with. It's a terrible, terrible place.

But at the same time, I didn't want to upset them. Yeah. So I had an offer from Hattrick, which is one of the big comedy companies. And let's say the offer was 25 grand or whatever it was at the time. So I had to leave this company. I said, here's the problem.

Hattrick have offered me 40 grand, so I want to stay, but I can't. I have to go. And they went, I will give you 40 grand. You know, I thought, oh, will you? Oh, you know what, you get that quiet. Yeah. But when you're talking to someone from HR or wherever it is,

essentially they're going to leave that room with the money or you are. Yeah, yeah. Right, that's all. If you want an extra £1,000 a year, either you're going to walk out of the room with that £1,000 a year or they're going to walk out with that £1,000 a year. And they only have one job, which is to walk out with that £1,000 a year, right?

This feels like you're pitching one of your daytime TV shows. No, no, no. So, right, OK. I've got it, yeah. We've got 14 boxes. And so the key thing to remember is it's never anything personal. If you ask for too much, you will see a look in their eyes that says, oh, maybe I shouldn't have asked for that.

But essentially, their job is to not give it to you but there's nothing personal but at the same time if you just say well then i might have to look elsewhere yeah and then look in their eyes and just check that that's okay of course they're allowed to give you it yeah they can't give it to everybody that's the point if everyone walked in and did the same thing you wouldn't get the pay rise but if it's just you yeah you know i bet you've got such a good phone contract i bet you're one of those people i don't know maybe i find it's a slight mystery to me yeah you know that's always i always make it their problem that's how to get a pay rise it also is where

your career you've almost had like three careers essentially because you had the pointless years it sounds like you're just drinking we had can i just do a sidebar there's a lovely wardrobe woman I work with called Sharon and Sharon had someone to stay in her spare room and the person

who was staying in Sharon's spare room for like a month went up to another friend and said is Sharon okay and they're like yeah I think she's okay

I think she's alright and they're going well why she said well I'm in her spare room and on her daily planner like six days a week it just says pointless

and and the other day it says total wipe out I'm in a spare room and on her daily planner like six days a week it just says pointless and and the other day it says total wipeout oh that's good oh that is good but yeah sorry yeah so

this is what I love about you I'm bigging him up but you're still putting a great funny joke in the middle you did pointless those sort of ten years of that. Then you finished Pointless

and then the books have taken off like insanely. But actually more interesting really, I think is the beginnings of you. You went from sort of very sort of humble, working class beginnings to get yourself into Cambridge. And then you studied at Cambridge, then left Cambridge and you didn't just have a couple of TV producer jobs.

You worked up to be one of the head honchos at Endemol, which is a huge worldwide company. Your story before Pointless and the books was pretty remarkable and how you got there. Remarkable is one of the companies. That is one of the companies, yeah. That is one of the companies. Yeah, I sort of felt that by the age of 40,

that's the bit of my career I'm proudest of in some ways because I built this thing and I sort of thought that was my life's work. So everything afterwards, it's been a weird sort of series of twists afterwards but yeah I love telly and so it's one of those things where I walked into an industry where not a huge amount of people did love telly there was lots of sort of public school kids who've got jobs because they knew people and they didn't really watch what normal people watch and I did always did do and so it was sort of I mean easy is not the right word but I was pushing an open door yeah because I knew what I love to watch I love thinking of ideas I

sort of roughly know what people will like to watch because if I like it then other people do and I had lots and lots and lots of failures of course but it was a great career and those were the glory days of independent tv as well the 90s and the 2000s where there was money sloshing about everything was sort of well funded if you had a big hit show around the world, you could really, really make money. You know, Millionaire and Big Brother and Weakest Link and these shows could really, really make money, which is not the case anymore. So, yeah, I think I was lucky to be interested in something that was really monetizable and just I never had to sort of go, no, I'm going to do an extra two hours because I really

want to make money. I did another two hours because you're sitting in a recording studio, right? And it's fun to make telly. And what stage of your career when your kids arrive? Because obviously that is a big, stressful, busy job. And then, boom, there's two kids, two under two almost. Yeah, exactly. Funny enough, I was at Hat Trick.

I had a panel show called If I Ruled the World, Clive Anderson. And I'd just done a sitcom called Boys Unlimited with James Corden. So I'd just had those two things at the same time. And so I was starting to make money for the first time ever so the kids arrived just then so really financially the pressure sort of happened at quite a good time and tv was probably you didn't have to work quite as hard you got that extra grand you was on 12 grand a year yeah i was on 12 grand 12 and a half because i'm negotiating so yeah it was one of those things I'd never, ever, ever had money. But also, you could buy a house back in those days. Yeah.

I mean, that's the thing. We bought our first house for 140 grand, and it was a nice two-bed kind of... But it was like, you could buy it, you know? I have no idea how people are buying houses anymore. Yeah. I certainly couldn't have done. But, yeah, so they came along at... I was, like was like 27 so none

of my friends were having kids yeah what was that like socially yeah i would rather my friends were having kids at the same time yeah i would say that because this sort of shares the burden but that's why people encourage you to have kids yeah if anyone's out there thinking i don't know if i should have kids and all their friends go do you know what i think it would really complete you you'd make a great dad you know know, what they're essentially saying is, Do you know what your life needs? My life is hell. Yeah, come and join me.

Come and join me on the lifeboat. All I need is company. I need people in the trenches with me. Exactly. I need someone I can drop my kid off every now and again just because they've gotten so well, don't they, our kids? Not really. Not as well as us, but we have to put up with it

because we're mates. We went to see Barbie the other day and you know when you see someone's facial expression, it brings everything back. So we go to see Barbie and this woman with her daughter. And this dad comes along with his daughter. And the daughters know each other and they go, hey, hey, hey. And the guy's going, so yeah, I'll come back in, what, two and a half hours or something. She's going, oh, I'll take them for lunch afterwards as well.

And he's going, oh, great. So maybe I'll come back at like fourish or something, pick them up. And the mum's going, yeah, yeah. And the dad's going, oh, I'll take them for lunch afterwards as well. And he's going, oh, great, so maybe I'll come back at like four-ish or something, pick them up. And the mum's going, yeah, yeah. And the dad's going, okay. But the look on his face was like, sweet freedom. Oh, my God. Four o'clock, yeah, 4.30, five-ish. Oh, yeah.

Well, actually, weirdly enough, I've got her overnight back if she wasn't asleep, I bet. But I remember that feeling so well. Oh, you're going to take charge oh great you take responsibility for my kids for a little bit oh my god

have a sleep we're at the stage now and Josh is a little bit behind because he's got the younger ones but they're becoming like sleepovers friends coming over

and then also the oh she said this he did that all that stuff it's like complete bollocks but it means a lot to them at that point. How did you, because you're very matter-of-fact and very chilled and stuff like that, did you just sort of ignore it and let them get on with it, or was you... No, you have to, it's so important to them.

It's their whole world. What someone said at school, it's like if you've just done a show and someone was horrible to you. Yeah. It's like, it's really... Hang on, let me try. Yeah. I think I've done it.

Say one was just bullying you. Yeah, yeah, yeah, okay. But, you know, it's incredibly important. Your hang on let me try yeah i think i think i've done it say one wish is bullying you yeah yeah but you know it's incredibly important your career is important yes if you're thinking oh we've got to do this tour but actually i want to do these venues not these venues and actually if there's any way we can get the prices and it's a huge thing for you and you're ringing an agent and you're talking to your mates i mean that's meaningless as well yeah it's just you are you in this moment and they are them in that moment and so the thing that just happened at school is incredibly powerful yeah yeah so you just have to listen yeah that's all we have to do and very rarely give advice because you know can't solve it for you can never solve it also the answer is it doesn't matter yeah almost always because the answer to any of your

problems is it doesn't matter usually and when there is a big problem then you know it's a big problem you deal with it together but yeah most of things things that happen to all of us are just we're obsessed with our own lives right and kids are just massive narcissists yeah because they don't know you better and that's the only thing that's going on is they're like they haven't got anything else to plan or worry about all people are sort of ruled by their own ego of like well they said that and they shouldn't say that to me yeah even grown-ups hear them and go which is principal of it the principal but it's like if you know when you're your age and you're going i can't believe that deckton rice did this and you know i don't know why he's playing at the center of the midfield he should be doing that and that's because you

know who deckton rice is but they all they know are their teachers yeah and the other kids in their class and i'm like occasionally there'll be like kid in the year above, and they'll be like, oh, my God. There's a kid who was literally the most famous person in the world to your kid. Yeah. I remember when we was going on holiday, there was a guy, oh, my God, it's so-and-so from year six, and then year three and one.

And I was like, oh, and I go, well, go and say hello. They're like, I can't say hello. They're older. I know. But it was like Brad Pitt's just walked in. You'd still be a bit, oh, I can't go and say yeah. But it's like that for kids, isn't it? Their idea of fame.

Yeah, it's mad, isn't it? You're a fan of McFly, aren't you? Yeah, very much so. And McBusted. Was that through your kids? No. It's the truth. Okay.

No, I think they are genuinely brilliant songwriters. I think they're very talented boys. Which both of them are McFly? McFly and Busted. James Bourne from Busted. James Bourne, who was a brilliant songwriter. Matt Willis, Charlie Simpson. They were all great songwriters.

Like all those boys, whenever they do a reality show, Tom Fletcher, Harry Judd, Dougie, Danny, they always turn up and do it properly. Right? They are class acts, all of them. Their music is great. I think it always has been that now how to write songs yeah i love mcfly i want to take the kids to see mcfly up in leicester square

there was a saturday morning show called tmi yeah and it was sam and mark and lovely caroline flack who i knew and i'd been working with so she invited us along and mcfly were on and you can still hear i saw a clip of it years ago they play play, and then I think it's Dougie Pointer drops his trousers to show his boxer shorts, and all you hear is my boy, who's about six years old, going, oh, my goodness. And they got to be on telly, actually. There was a game they used to play.

Oh, really? Yeah, so they got to be on telly. So, you know, that sort of thing is fun. No, I love McFly, but certainly that comes from me, not from them. That's your special power as you said with tv is that there's loads of people in these industries that have a kind of disregard for popular tv popular music and a sniffy and they'll maybe go i'll make this show that these other people will enjoy. But you've got popular taste in television and in books as well.

And when you start your pop punk band in music, do you think that is one of the things that's helped with your success? Yeah, because you can't ever do anything cynically, is the truth. One of the lovely things about being a stand-up, by and large, when you really, really make it is when you've got your voice, right? And Rob and you had yours very very early on you came almost fully formed which is interesting josh i saw less of your very early work but when you really go oh no hold on i'm being myself but also i'm coming at

an angle and suddenly the material flows right yeah because it comes from a place of truth you're not having to go oh but what would be a joke about that yeah funny i could say about that if you just go this is something that I think. On Not The Week, for example, I literally didn't really know much or care. As you get older, you get more into politics and I was talking about austerity and all that

and I genuinely thought he was a French politician and that was a joke on it and stuff, but I thought what gave me an angle was I was just brutally being, well, this is what I think of this, but sometimes you're under pressure to go, oh God, maybe I should have an opinion on it like the other guys have. I vividly remember one where it was small ads oh right i don't

remember what my one was but i remember thinking i have to get down first because everyone's gonna do this and i remember you were on it and i remember racing down to do the first one it being met with silence like you've never heard it. Like floating through space. And then I just remember walking back and I vividly remember looking at you and you just pissing yourself laughing. And now look at you both. That's the only round on that show I could do

because that's a writer's round. Yeah. And a performer's like, Hugh, what they expect you to do. Hugh could do a one man play for one line and then... I've got nothing. I'm like you doing your audio book.

But yeah, you could do that show on both sides easily. They asked me on What The Week actually, but that to me is a performer show. That isn't a show where you can just come on as a civilian, which is what I am. Thank you so much for coming on, Richard. Pleasure. Good luck with your next book. 14th of September. Yes, 14th of September, The Last Devil To Die.

I think it's good Thursday Murder Club where would you rank it in the Thursday Murder Clubs chronologically I'd rank it 4th yeah as traditionalists people by and large

like them more and more as they go on but I think sometimes that's because they like the characters it's like the TV shows you go oh it really hit its stride

in series 3 no you're just you're working out they trust the characters now so you just set up or get on with it I don't know whether you're allowed to say are you going to keep doing them how does it work yeah I'm doing a new series now so let's set up we'll get on with it I don't know whether you're allowed to say

are you going to keep doing them how does it work yeah I'm doing a new series now so I've just started a brand new one totally different to these totally different about a wizard's child

going to school exactly I think you're going to like it yeah a little hairy beast that lives in the woods exactly no it's about

Julia Donaldson's tiny house so I've got a brand new series, but I'm going to do some more Thursday Murder Clubs as well. They're not finished, but I'm having a year doing something else. Lovely. Nice. What point with the Thursday Murder Club,

what point did you go, oh my God, this is something else now? It started big, which was good, but I slightly think, oh, maybe it will because I'm on telly over here. But it started bigger than we thought. It did well for about four or five weeks and then it started going even further up which was amazing and then it got to christmas and it went absolutely bananas i mean mental which was really lovely and you know from the world i'm from i know what a hit is and i know what a flop is because i've had both. And so that's when I thought, oh, okay, this is...

We're in it. There's something... We're in it. Yeah, and it's selling in America and Germany and all these... So I thought, oh, okay, which is obviously they don't know who I am.

So almost, I mean, within a month, I thought, oh, okay, this is going to be a fun ride. There is a final question we end on. Yes. But it's more about...

Because you're separated from the mother of your kids. Yes. But the question's normally about the best things they do parenting and the worst, but I don't know if you're open for that, Chad. It doesn't seem appropriate. Fair enough.

Thank you very much, Richard. Best ending we've ever had in a while. That was Richard Osman. See you Tuesday. Do you not want to talk about Richard Osman and what a great... I love Richard Osman, but Rob,. Do you not want to talk about Richard Osman and what a great chef he was? I love Richard Osman, but Rob, I'll be honest with you. Yeah.

I'm doing the 16-8 and I'm 25 minutes from being able to eat again. That's why you're so grouchy. I'm not grouchy. You are. You're not right. I knew it was something. You're doing 16. You don't need to lose weight.

There's nothing wrong with that. No, it's a health thing as well. It's a health thing as well. What? Well, I'll tell you. Do you know what, Rob? Yeah? I'll tell you about this on Tuesday.

Tell me about your health thing on Tuesday. And let's just say, go and buy Richard Osman's bloody book. Because he bloody needs it. He needs it. Actually, tell you what, let's do reverse promo. Don't buy his book. Everyone's buying it. Buy ours.

A class act, in hell and neighbors twice a day buy them do it and why not da vinci code yeah fuck it's a good one isn't it right see you later bye