Rob Beckett and Josh Widdicombe's Parenting Hell - S7 EP20: Carol Vorderman

Episode Date: September 29, 2023

Joining us this episode to discuss the highs and lows of parenting (and life) is the brilliant - Carol Vorderman. Carol's new quiz book 'Perfect Ten' is available now HERE And the dyslexia information discussed on the podcast can be found here; https://tll.gse.harvard.edu/dyslexia-simulator Parenting Hell is a Spotify Podcast, available everywhere every Tuesday and Friday. Please leave a rating and review you filthy street dogs... xx If you want to get in touch with the show here's how: EMAIL: [e-mail] INSTAGRAM: @parentinghell MAILING LIST: parentinghellpodcast.mailchimpsites.com  A 'Keep It Light Media' Production  Sales, advertising, and general enquiries: [e-mail] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hello I'm Rob Beckett and I'm Josh Willickham. Welcome to Parenting Hell the show in which Josh and I discuss what it's really like to be a parent which I would say can be a little tricky. So to make ourselves and hopefully you feel better about the trials and tribulations of modern-day parenting each week we'll

be chatting to a famous parent about how they're coping or hopefully how they're not coping and we'll also be hearing from you the listener with your tips advice and of course tales of parenting woe because let's be honest there are plenty of times when none of us know what we're doing hello you're listening to parenting hell with iris can you say rob beckett and can you say j Beckett? Rob Beckett. And can you say Josh Widdicombe? Josh Widdicombe. Well done.

Well done. Lovely one there, Josh. Yeah, shall I read it out? Go for it. Hi, you sexy, relatable fools. Here is my 21-month-old Iris saying your name. My partner and I love your podcast. I've been listening since Iris was born, November 2021mber 2021 since then we've had another daughter ada 19 months younger than iris

so we're now struggling through the madness of two under two listening to you always lightens the load and makes us laugh jess i'm from birmingham but we now live in stratford-upon-avon oh it's a strange bit of information i'm from birmingham now live in stratford-upon-avon quite close aren't they those things yeah it's sort of like it's not too far is it that's a strange bit of information. I'm from Birmingham now, live in Stratford-upon-Avon. Quite close, aren't they, those things? Yeah, it's sort of like, it's not too far, is it? It's a bit fancier, isn't it? But is it, or is it just a tourist destination? I don't know. I imagine on the outskirts,

it's got some absolutely bog-standard terrace three-bedroom housing that looks like it could be anywhere in the country. However, if you Google it, it looks so bloody Shakespeare. Yeah, so bloody Shakespeare. I went on an open-top tour of stratford-upon-avon yeah who made you do that matt ford when we was at gigging and we ended up getting off at the industrial state and having a pizza hut or you can eat buffet it's what the bard would have wanted rob it's what the bard so did you see the pizza hut and you were like,

fuck it, let's get off? Yeah, and to be honest, that was the only thing we saw because Stratford, I'd say, is big enough to wander around and get what you want from it. It doesn't... It's not Valencia. No, no. It doesn't need a sightseeing bus. No.

I had a bus incident this week, Rob. Go on. So Tuesday, I was looking after my son. I was like, I'll take him to the cinema, because he likes to go and... There's like, the Hackney Picture House put on toddler cinema, which is generally just a few episodes of CBeebies. And it's a bit sort of

carnage in there. It doesn't matter, because they're all young kids. It's not like you're ruining anyone's... Well, last time I went, it was just him on his own. But yeah. Sure. I got him all hyped for the cinema, and then the cinema wasn't on they weren't showing it that day but then i realized you've got a telly no the the bit he likes about the cinema is getting the bus to the cinema rob right okay so i thought well i'll just get the bus yeah okay so i said i'll get him the bus to park. And he didn't want to go to the park. So basically...

He's bored of the park. Yeah, I just got the bus to the end of the line and then got the bus back. And he liked it? He had the fucking time of his life, mate. My daughters keep saying, when can we go on a double-decker bus again? Yeah, we went upstairs on the double-decker bus.

Yeah. He looked out the window. We went all the way to the end of the 277 yeah got off there was a park he then wanted to go to which was fucking rough mate it was like it's like you know when you see someone who's like in a film or something who's got off the wrong stop in new york and you're like you're a fucking goner. Everyone's staring, yeah. Yeah. And there was a park with two blokes that I presumed were doing a drug deal in it. Sure, absolutely.

But actually, when we got up closer, one of them was trying to convert the other one to Christianity. It was quite a weird morning, all things considered. So we went to this park. Yeah. One guy was trying to convert another to Christianity. Absolutely. On the swings? And then we got on the swings,

and then we got back on the bus, and we just went all the way home. And it's honestly, he had the fucking time of his life, Rob. So my kids want to go on a double-decker bus, but because we live in the countryside, there's one single-decker bus that comes like twice a day, so I'll have to drive into town. Maybe you should live in zone two, Rob.

Yeah, but I'm going to have to drive into town. I'm going to say that your son and my children getting on a double-decker bus will lose its fun at some point. I don't know, Rob. There's a lot of use on those buses. There's a lot of teenagers enjoying those buses, mate. So you're suggesting teenagers love buses more than it's the only way they can get about?

And it's free travel. It's not free, but yeah. For kids it is. Oh, is it? Up to a certain age. But I just found out, basically, once you get to five or something, they've got to reply for their own Oyster card. But the Oyster card is free, but they have to have it.

Because I used to just go, oh, let them through. But you're not supposed to do that once they get to a certain age. They're supposed to have their own. So my girls have got their own Oyster card, which they absolutely love. Yeah. I tell you what is bullshit, right? Yeah. Is every year you have to pay £10 to tell Transport for London your car's electric.

Do you? And then you have to pay £10 for the admin fee to go, it's electric. Even though their cameras can tell if your car's EULA's or not, it can't tell if it's electric. There's a bit of green on the number plate, mate. That's how everyone knows. This is... Anyway, it's turned into LBC again. Yeah, yeah.

Sorry. You know, that's the problem as you get older, though. You just become miserable old men. That's the danger of this podcast, Josh. I'm trying not to be a miserable old man. Do you know how I'm trying that, Rob? Well, do you know what? Try harder.

I was just saying I had a lovely time on the bus there and back. You're a happy old man. I'm a happy old... Do you know what I'm being, Rob? What? I'm trying to be more Carol Vorderman. Oh, lovely link that. That's what we've got now.

She's very positive, Carol Vorderman. She said she likes young people and she is inspired by them and she's not afraid of them or resentful of them. Yeah. And that's what we've got to be, Rob. True. Yeah, I agree.

I agree with that. Yeah. Yeah. What are you trying to do? The link to get into Carol Vorderman now? I've got a boomer story I was going to read out. I don't know what to do. I've gone too early.

Yeah, I'd say you've gone too early with trying to get it into the guest. Yeah, that was an error of judgment. Let me do these boomers, then we'll get into Carol Vorderman, yeah? Morning, Josh and Rob. Having listened to your recent episode about slipping parenting standards, as you have more children, I have a story about my dad. My dad had a game he used to enjoy when bored while carrying me as a baby. In a crowded area, he would shout,

catch, and rugby pass me to another unsuspecting dad. No, no, no. Of course. Fuck off, Fuck off. Although I argued a baby's very different to a tennis ball, safe to say my older siblings were never used as sporting equipment. In his defence, his screening process must have merit as I was never dropped all the best mats. Even if it was like Ben Stokes,

I don't want to throw my baby to them. Do you know what I mean? No. Even David Seaman, I wouldn't launch my child. Do you know who I would launch my child to, Rob? Carol Vorderman? Carol Vorderman. Carol Vorderman.ol and on the subject of carol vorderman i was gonna do a parenting hack though did you not want that yeah on the subject of carol vorderman she loves a parenting hack hello rob and josh i've got a nice parenting hack for you and carol vorderman oh that's very forceful me and my husband have a special movie night TV in our bedroom,

which we use to treat our two daughters, four and six, to a late night movie at the weekend. Oh, lovely. When actually what happens is we do their dinner an hour earlier, send them up to watch their movie, and then get them into bed around the same time as they would be anyway. They think they're getting a special treat by staying up later, and we get an extra hour's peace in the evening while they're cozy up in our bed watching a movie of their choice

i'm dreading the day they learn to tell time much love leila from portsmouth oh good enjoy it you got a tv in your room rob we do and i absolutely fucking love it yeah i not even for bedtime it's got sky on it josh and i go up there to watch football when I pretend I'm doing something else. Oh, my word, Rob. And the other day I just laid up there and I watched Bournemouth play Chelsea. Lou went, what are you doing? I went, just a few things. I wasn't doing anything.

Not one thing. Do you know who loves doing things? Who? Carol Vorderman. I genuinely didn't know where that was going. That's how thick I am. Fucking hell. I wouldn't stick you on the fucking numbers and letters, mate.

Here we are. Carol Vorderman. We love Carol Vorderman. She's a really good episode. She's brilliant. What a woman. Enjoy Carol Vorderman. Right. Thanks so much for doing this, Carol Vorderman. Right.

Thanks so much for doing this, Carol. We're very excited. Do you know what? I'm going to use the words we occasionally throw around, Rob. National treasure. Do you know what? Absolutely. Yeah.

The second person ever on Channel 4, Carol Vorderman. Hello. Boom. There we go. Is that true? Is that a real fact well richard introduced it as one countdown to a new channel ends so a new countdown begins what a line i know it was hell of a line then the next line was two from the top yeah yeah and then when channel five

was opening up because he was very proud he was the first man on channel four as he should be and then he tried to persuade the then boss dawn airy who's wonderful if he could also be the first person on channel five well i don't see why not darling i don't see why not yeah but you're on channel four every afternoon with me, Richard. Well, yes, but wouldn't it be lovely if I could also be the first person on Channel 5? Amazing. It would be so weird if he was just on Channel 5 for the first bit

and then just went back to Channel 4 every week, like, for no reason. Also, like, it's quite a funny thing to sort of say out loud. Like, imagine if I did that, but to actually pursue it is madness, isn't it? But that was him, wasn't it? Yeah, yeah. did you ever meet him either of you no what was he like i was amazing honestly i could do you an hour about richard whitely but it was like um you'd have loved him because he's a one-off yeah you know he's a completely one-off and when They won off. And when we started, which was 41 years ago, I was like 21, and he would have been something like late 30s then. And he'd been on the local news program, which was called Calendar, for years and years and years.

And he'd worked his way up to, he was like Mr. Yorkshire, you know. And he used to host the Calendar show. So he was a really good political journalist and he was very much a Tory back in the Margaret Thatcher fan, you know. So he was quite pompous when we started in 1982. And it took about six years to like burst the bubble. But once we pricked his pomposity, or rather I had, that was when it just started to flow yeah it was like

come on white as you know and the stuff we got up to was was just wonderful it was just and and funny proper funny you know you're like you too when you just you break down laughing and you just kind of then you go what the hell were we laughing at and of that we were like that all the time i miss that i miss that a lot yeah i do it must be the longest you work with anyone right well yes it would have been 23 years yeah 23 years yeah yeah do you still watch it and do the maths well no i mean a lot of people ask me that oh sorry carol question sorry about it, Carol. It's a natural question.

No, I don't know because it's 15 years since I was on it and it's not anything to do with Countdown. It's just like life moves on, doesn't it? Yeah, of course. And you will find

when your children get older, you'll go, life moves on doesn't it yeah of course as you will find when your children get older you'll go life moves on yeah you will yeah yeah so how old are your children carol mine are 26 that's cameron and 31 katie so they are proper sort of grown-ups gone through well would you define that as a grown-up? I mean, I can only ask you to. Are you now grown-ups? I'd say yes. I think, yeah, I think I am, yeah. I'm a grown-up. Do you, Josh? Yeah, I do. I'm 40. No. Yeah. Yeah. Bloody hell. Yeah.

What happened there? Is that a panicking you, Carol? What happened there? It is, really. Because I think of Josh as like, oh, like, baby-faced Josh, you know, like that. No. Oh, baby-faced. No, he's that. It's like, oh, baby face. No, he's rotten. He's like a raisin now. He's falling apart.

How old are you, Rob? I'm 37. Oh, so you're a baby. Yeah. Yeah. So much younger. It is. Three years. Yeah.

But is it? Well, I think being a grown up is responsibilities. So a grown up is when you have responsibilities. So it depends on what point in your life you have them. So if you've got two kids and a career you're really into, like 22, you have to be a grown-up is when you have responsibilities so it depends on what point in your life you have them so if you've got two kids and a career you're really into like 22 you have to be a grown-up from then yeah essentially yeah you do so it's responsibilities do you think it's the having the children yeah or someone to be responsible for i think it's responsibilities and then that normally comes kids are the biggest responsibility you can have. They are a lifetime.

Yeah, I don't think career is that much of a responsibility. Even a mortgage ends at some point. Yeah. You know what I mean? Well, probably not at the moment, but it's supposed to. I tell you what I just watched, just talking about kids, is the Tyson Fury, At Home With The Furies on Netflix. That was mad.

It's amazing. It's crazy, isn't it? Six kids. Have you seen it,osh no is it unbelievable if you haven't they're remarkable i just fallen in love with them i'd be quite happy to watch one of those shows like every week you know forever just seeing the kids grow up well the mad thing is though there's like six kids and they keep moaning about how mental and busy it all is and that the house is crazy. And then they go, yeah, when they get to 30 and we don't send them to school anymore, I'm like, well, fuck it, send them to school.

It's a lot of trouble of tradition. But if it's really annoying you, there's literally a school open all day. Just send them there. Or stop having kids. Six kids. Six. And I believe that Paris Fury, who's amazing,

is now pregnant with a seventh. Bloody hell. And they believe that Paris Fury, who's amazing, is now pregnant with a seventh. Bloody hell. And they're only young. We've had her on, haven't we? We've had her on here. I think they want 10 kids. They want 10 kids. That's the aim, yeah.

Josh, your voice just went back to pre-13. His voice matched his face then. Do you consider your kids grown up? Yeah, they kids grown up? Yeah, they are grown up now, yeah. So Cameron and I still live in Bristol, which is where I am now, together. And Katie, she was living in Cambridge for about 10 years. So she's a research scientist. She's in London briefly at the moment.

So I can't see unless and until she's a lot older with kids, her coming back to Bristol. Yeah. Oh, that's what you want though, her to come back? Well, yeah, I miss my Katie, but, you know, life is what life is, isn't it really? It's difficult, isn't it? So there's no grandkids at the moment?

Katie and Cameron got no kids? No, no grandkids at the moment. No. Okay. And is that something you're excited for? Not really. Are you done yet, I'm? okay and is that something you're excited for not really it still happened when it happened yeah yeah no if she'd come home and said she obviously would be excited but oh god yeah if she said right i'm pregnant with twins i'm moving back to bristol yeah because the easiest way for me to crack on is if i can just use you for four days a

week child care yeah if that conversation happens how do you feel uh i'd feel all right about that Because the easiest way for me to crack on is if I can just use you for four days a week childcare. Yeah. If that conversation happens, how do you feel? I'd feel all right about that. Yeah? Yeah, I would, yeah, because my mum, my mum was a single parent. They divorced my parents when I was a baby. So mum had three kids, my much older brother and sister and me to bring up by herself. So I was born in 1960 and, you know, we were proper poor,

like proper, proper poor. Hang on, you was born in 1960? Yeah, 1960. You're 63? You're not 63. You're 63. 63 in December, yeah. You're not 63, Carol Vorderman.

You're fucking Benjamin Barn. You look younger now than you did when you was 21. I don't understand how it works, Carol. Botox. Fair enough. You're close. Okay, okay medical intervention i get it that makes sense but it's good it looks good well that's very kind but do you think that those photos of you when you're like 21 on countdown though obviously because it's like the style and the grainy images and the clothes back then and the shoulders you look older there than you do now i know i think a lot

that's the style though isn't it yeah and the hairstyles and stuff so you were 23 when you started countdown 21 i was 21 yeah 21 yeah oh my word anyway sorry it's probably 1960 we got sidetracked by the botox 1960 so so anyway so then my mum remarried my stepfather when I was about nine. So I grew up in North Wales. She says pointing towards North Wales, which means nothing to anybody watching. So then when I graduated about three weeks after I graduated, mum said, right, we're leaving Gabrielle, my stepfather, who I adored. Oh, are we again? And then she didn't let me go and see him again. So we moved to England at that point so I've got my Cambridge degree and all of that and then I just worried about my mum so much that

we moved to Leeds I got the job on countdown as soon as I was able to employ her I was 25 yeah and so I employed my mum and therein after she worked for me and lived with us all through my marriage and everything until she died many years later so we're used to like my kids are used to Nana being around right so it's a real strong impact on their life yeah it's a normal thing yeah when you say you employed her was that off screen with a calculator giving the answers in your ears? Not my mother, no. No. Running the office.

So she used to run my office for me, yeah. Oh, nice. Oh, wow, that's nice. Yeah. That's so nice. Were you a fun mum? I think I was. Although, so I was, how old was I?

31 and 36 when I had the kids and married, very happily married. And at that time, my career, you've got to put it in context really, because women my age were sort of the bow wave of, you had to take all the crap, basically all the shit that everybody had to throw at you in order to sort of break through again and break through again so you had to work you had to like commit that that was your priority for want of a better word so in my 30s I worked all the hours god sent you know and it paid off literally it paid off but because mum lived with us I didn't have to worry about the kids they were always at home. They weren't going else. Yeah. Well, going else, not that that's a bad thing, but it was just that. But they don't feel like they're being looked after by anyone else.

It's sort of all in-house. It's extended family. And I had a nanny as well because mum was in the office too. So, but the nanny would come to our house. So there were plenty of people around. But I think in those days, you know, like the thought of going to the park. Oh, my God. I did it about three times with the kids.

Push. Hey! Push. Hey! Push. Welcome to my life. I hate the park. I hate the park.

I hate the park. I hate the park. I hate the park. But back then, back in the 1990s, you weren't allowed to say anything other than you were a bloody Stepford wife, you know, and sort of apologise for having to go to work and all that. Right, yeah. And things have changed so rapidly now. It's like... Yeah, so did you feel like, did you get a lot of stick for being a career woman then and having a nanny and going to work? Yeah, quite a bit. And how did that manifest? How did it make you feel like, did you get a lot of stick for being a career woman then and having a nanny and going to work?

Yeah, quite a bit. And how did that manifest and how did it make you feel? Well, now I'm just really happy for younger women because they can go, no, I really want, like my daughter, it's going to sound a bit weird, but she's a research scientist. So she's a post-doctorate PhD in nanotechnology. God, the apple doesn't fall far from the tree there. That's the kind of job presumably you were headed to before Countdown.

Yeah, yeah. Of course, we used to do maths every morning when they were young. Really? Because I knew that, particularly as a girl, she'd always be asked, and I was on Countdown, obviously, at that time. I knew as soon as she went to school people would be asking her math sums all the time yeah the daughter of yeah so just like you've got to teach your kids some dad jokes yep because they'll expect them to be

funny yeah don't worry about that yeah i've got one feel free to use it why does a squirrel swim on its back to keep his nuts dry. Job done. Yeah, that's great. That's great stuff. I really like that. A little bit cheeky. Something from your own saying, in fact, isn't it, Robert? Exactly.

I don't mind using all this stuff. But you know what I mean because there's the expectation on the youngsters. Yeah. So Katie was always good at maths and everything. She's brilliant, actually. And so she went to Cambridge and then she did all her degrees there and then she did a PhD there. But point is, she's brilliant actually and so she went to Cambridge and then she did all her degrees there and then she did a PhD there but point is she's 31 now and now I love the fact that she can choose she's just set up a startup company for a factory to be built in space don't that is complicated you really do you don't really understand what she's doing do you Carol

well I do. Oh, you do? It's how to explain it because it's quite good. Fair enough. It's about manufacturing protein crystallisation in space, in low-Earth orbit. So there you go. Absolutely, yeah. If my protein's not crystallised, I'm not happy.

Are you annoyed, Rob, that someone's got there first? Because that was your plan for retirement, wasn't it? I've been thinking about it. I've actually been trying to crystallize carbohydrate pumping out crystallized carb no one wants it can't sell it but what i love is that she can do that and there's no criticism of that now it's something to be admired yeah whereas you know on my life yeah well the response would be who's got the kids then back in the day it'd be like well if you're doing that who's got the kids oh gosh awful awful and also there was no expectation on fathers to do anything with the children other

than do like the good bits you know what i mean so whereas i love it now because where I live in Bristol, in Clifton. Oh, very nice. Very nice. The vibe is just so relaxed and lovely. But there are a lot of couples your sort of age with young kids here now, whereas it used to be older people and children. It's now got this lovely vibe. And what I love is that, you know know when i'm walking around all the time is you see a lot of the young fathers like yourselves with their kids actually

you know happily going and taking them for a walk or pushing the push chair or you know with the old what you call them that i call them papoose papoose papoose is it a papoose yeah yeah it's a lovely word that yeah it is a papoose a papoose and i love to see that because that wouldn't have been done even you know when my kids were young that wasn't a thing i like it i love younger generations because i love their freedom and i love like their attitude to life it's just you know the whole love is love it's like and you know oh my best friend's gay and it's not even a subject matter whereas a lot in my age group it's oh god you've got to judge people you're going to do this you're going to say it's hard it's tiring being judgmental

and yeah god it must be exhausting all those people those like principle you know people go it's a go, don't have principles. It's so much easier. I'm principled. I'm with you there. I'm so with you. Life's too hard work to have too many things that annoy you, isn't it? Isn't it?

Isn't it? And people get weighed down by stressing themselves out. There's that quote, which is, angels fly because they take themselves lightly. Oh, I like that. And if you do that, life's a lot easier, rather than trudging around. They always look like they walk heavy, angry people.

Yeah, they do, don't they? Yeah. I can't be arsed with it. I just can't be arsed. Anyway, so it's lovely now, and I think I'll be a good nana, I think. Yeah. Yeah, I think you'll be great. You've got a zest

for life like so few people Really? Yeah I think so like that it's so rare that someone says I really like younger people It's so rare that you hear that You just hear the next generation are a disaster

they're awful. I've seen that in certain newspapers you know and columnists who really should get out more saying oh it's terrible and they think this i think it's bloody brilliant that they're you know like cameron's age group so in their 20s and they go oh and they're so lazy they're not lazy they've had to work a lot harder for their bloody gcses and a levels than we ever did you know they're not this they're not lazy. They're not lazy. They've had to work a lot harder for their bloody GCSEs and A-levels than we ever did. You know, they're not this. They're not all these things that people say they are.

And also it's like this, oh, and they don't want to work hard because they only want to work five days a week. Hello? That's wise? That's actually wise? Like my, you know, so we were the thatcher generation you know so i was 18 when thatcher came to power and it was all the time do you know the word yuppie yeah of course we're not that young we're not young dell boy in it young young professional something or other

wasn't it higher fire and perspire yeah yeah so we were the generation of being the yuppies, I suppose. So my husband, Paddy, worked in London. It was the first time really that I'd sort of gone down there. And it was the whole, you know, well, I work six days a week, like four hours a day. And others go, well, I work eight days a week. You know, I work like 27 hours a day. Sleep is for losers and all that kind of stuff.

And all that absolute crap. And then when people started to get it, I mean, I, you know, worked hard, probably too hard. And then as we got started getting to like the age of 30, one after one, they were going down like dominoes, you know, to be in hospital for a week with burnout, you know, and all that kind of thing whereas now it's like come on what is life about yeah and that's what i love you know what is it

that would give me the happiest life and where i can help people which apparently is called being woke and is a bad thing according to you know what can i do to help can i ask you about a very progressive part of your life yeah go on which i've talked to you about well not me personally i was there when you talked we were on radio two together you talked to zoe ball about you we were on with zoe weren't we yeah about uh your relationship status and how you run that i think that's brilliant yeah well it's also i mean got partly to do with kids so i i don't want to settle down again at the moment i mean it might be different when i'm 75 i might think actually i can put up with someone but at the moment that's not what i want to do can't get up the stairs it'll be

quite good something to lean on eight o'clock every night that time is to come yeah but it's not for now so what i have done for oh my god well over 10 years is i use a system which i call my special friends sure so they are men i really like really like me and then you know we have an extra bit of whatever, whenever. And everyone's single. That's a key part of it. And everyone's on board with the setup. On board with it. And it's just nice. Yeah.

Because, you know, some I see more often than others. But they're like interesting people who I really like anyway. They'd just be friends. Yeah. Yeah. And you don't have to have an argument about buying a new fridge with. Oh, God, no. It's just a joy.

I think we should get the Zanussi. Oh, fuck off. I forgot you hate Zanussi, Rob. We don't want to get into that. Oh, yeah. Don't get me started on that. That and Smeg. Has he had a problem with his ice cube maker or something?

No, no. I've got no issues with Zanussi. I just picked it because it was a funny word. That was it. Thought it would get a bigger laugh. Funny words are funny though, aren't they? Yeah. Well, yeah, sometimes you pick the funniest one.

I liked when you picked up on Pupus as a good word. Yeah, I love a good word. Gusset is a funny word. That's a good word. Gusset is a good word. It's just a funny word. But there are lovely words. And it is about that, like Zanussi is a funny word, isn't it?

It's just funny. Yeah, if you've got to pick one, Smeg and Zanussi. If you're trying to pick a fridge. Yeah, but I think Smeg's almost too much of a comedy word. Do you know what I mean? Like, Zanussi's a... Yeah, Smeg's too loaded. So Zanussi, if I said, like, a Samsung fridge.

Yeah, it's not as funny. That's not as funny. It's not the same hit as Zanussi. No, we had zero reaction from us. Exactly. Isn't it? Fairness. Actually, you judged me even though I was using it as an example.

I respect that. Do you pass, do you, tell you into words and numbers and stuff, so did you pass a lot of learning onto your kids? Like, were you into that kind of thing? Yeah, I've just got to the point, well, no, I've always been the same actually. I'm interested in the things that I'm interested in. And I'll pursue those literally to the end of the earth. But then there are some things I've just not remotely into. And then over the years, I've thought, right, okay, be civilized about this, Carol, like pursue an interest in classical music. And then I'll do something for like five days and i think nice i'd rather like go and watch loud aircraft because that's what i'd rather do or i'd love to go and see a car race you've got a flying license haven't you yeah so much as where would you go for

loud aircraft by the way sort of just near to the airport and listen no i tell you so like air shows i've been around the world to air shows and it's great because i love screaming i really fucking love screaming right it's something about screaming let's walk through lewisham which is like it's a joy yeah and you can when they're allowed aircraft you can really really go which is why i like going to rugby games, big games, big events. I love that, where you can just let rip and nobody hears you. Yeah, you don't get out of the proms, do you? No, I did go to the Albert Hall.

Again, this isn't like going on classical music for a thing. It just is for me. It's just not your thing. It's just not my thing. So I went once and you know where they finish, oh right, I'm going to trip myself up

with the words here. They finish one bit of what they're performing and then obviously they all have to go. And I'm like, oh, amazing, amazing. And that's the bit

where you're meant to be completely silent. Yeah. The fake endings in songs as well. They build it up like it's done. And I'm on my, and I'm like, oh. Brilliant. fake endings in songs as well they build it up like it's done and i'm on my camera like oh

oh vorderman was in making a show of herself again with a shower oh i know i know being judged yeah so now i just do the things that i like and luckily my kids you know katie particularly i suppose with the science and everything, we like the same things. So that's good. And what does Cameron do? Did he go down an academic route as well? No, because Cam was, well, he did in the end, but Cam was a special educational needs child.

So he was literally off the scale dyslexic, off the scale ADHD. I don't think he's on the spectrum, but he might be. We don't know. And so when he was about six, there wasn't a school that would take him really. So I eventually, yeah, I eventually, because what happens is when they're like that, you know, from when they're young,

that there's something that isn't the same as with the children, with the learning. So I would go through, you know, when they're dead young and you do the phonics. Yeah. So it's like, meh for mummy. It's not M, is it? It's meh, meh, meh, meh.

And I'd get him to write it, you know, like almost 100 times, meh, say it, meh, meh, meh for mummy. And then literally five seconds later, and there would only be one letter on the sheet of paper and they go and what's this letter and he'd look at me and go eh no or ah yeah yeah or yeah or it just wasn't registering and I knew I thought well I can take him out of school and I can homeschool him and give up my work and all of that but then I knew that I didn't have the skills to teach a child

with special educational needs because there's a particular way of teaching him. So in the end, I found a place called Fairleigh House. We lived in central London then for about five years. And he went there. And that changed him. And was that a special educational needs kind of institution? Yeah, but it was a private school. So it's a passion of mine, really, because kids who are in the state system,

and there was a piece out yesterday, you know, 60% of them aren't getting any SEN care now because the budgets have been slashed so much. So he eventually went to another school and I kept them in the private system, but he was bullied. A lot of these kids are bullied, a lot. But eventually he went to, he did his GCSEs, then he did his A-levels. He didn't do brilliantly in them.

But then he went to a local in Bristol now, like a tech, we used to call it a tech. And he went there for two years, got a distinction. With that, he went to University of West of England, UE we call it in Bristol, and got a first in that he went to uh university west of england you recall it in bristol and got a first in animation oh wow yeah and then he went up to dundee and got his masters in video effects so he works in that kind of area amazing oh brilliant but it just takes longer for those children to get through the system because the system is not you know education

is my passion yeah and the system just is not built the system is built for a particular kind of child yeah which is the majority yeah but it's not built for that i was not that child and i went to a state school and it was weird because i'm 10 years older than cameron but there wasn't really a name for it apart from yeah he's not very at reading. And so I'd be taken off for special reading lessons, which is already marks you out as you have to go over there. Yeah. And what I found, even then I found degrading, was the book was so big.

And I was like, I can see the words. I just don't know what they mean. I don't know. Just fucking make them big. I just remember this massive fucking book. You look like, you know, the things you put in car windscreens in spain so they stop getting off yeah it's like that with biff chip and kip written as big as me head and that's all i know that because i know it's biff chip and kip and then all what i used to do is because i couldn't read it i'd make up

the story i'd look at the pictures and make up a story and then they're like no that's not the words and all that and then it just turns into an argument but in the state system there's not really much i think it must have got better but there's not much allowance for that kind of thing yeah because what it is it's I think there's that thing where people say oh because it's like that they're not intelligent but that's not the case it's not the case you can't express it the way you want to because the system designed for the majority of people yeah and then all of a sudden your label is thick and then you tell yourself you're thick even though you're not yeah you just can't express yourself I found a way to express

myself in stand-up and because I couldn't read very well I used to struggle with reading out loud that was my biggest fear and stuff anyway so I wrote a book about class called a class act and I wrote it all myself no ghostwriter and the whole thing's about trying to tell myself I can write it and don't listen to that voice telling you you can't and it went well wrote and i loved it and i went and did the voiceover for it had a complete panic attack because i had to read it out loud but i thought i'd sort of dealt with it but then i got i went away calm myself down and did all my breathing and i can feel myself even now getting triggered by it slightly because it's something that affected me but just by doing that it enabled me to go back in and calm myself and do it but it was a real i was battling against a 35

year narrative of you're thick that's not for you yeah which is not true it's just something your brain tells you and you've been told as a kid so i think talking about it more now and like you say with cameron he's managed to go off and if you luckily you know for you guys and also you're a great parent he got access to different education but potentially if he'd been born into different family he may not have had that access to those things to enable him to get to where he's got which is you know finding something he's passionate about and being really good at it and excelling but yeah there's definitely a gap between different school systems and the support they offer massively there is it's something you know in 2010 i built an online school called the maths factor it's still running now so it's for primary school kids and it works it just works so they have like an anti-carol video and then it's all very

colorful and all this they have like little avatars and then they have to do their practice and blah. But I found, so in the first lockdown, you know, when the schools were fundamentally closed, weren't they? And we went free. So we used to be two pounds a week. We're now one pound a week, but we went free to everybody. And we had half a million children registered with us during those like four or five months. with us during those like four or five months and the number of special educational needs children who just came alive to maths because of it made me realize that i'd put a lot of what i'd learned about teaching cameron yeah into it so don't miss out a single step yeah you know don't assume that

kids know what you're doing point it out and the visual learning is key i think for kids with sen so it did get better rob because i've done a lot with various governments over the years with education and it got better and now it's a lot worse because of funding yeah a lot worse now yeah yeah And it's hard for parents. You know, sometimes these kids are waiting up to two years just for, you know, an analysis to say they need extra lessons. Was it difficult as well for you? Because obviously you've got one child who's naturally into it and away and it's your eldest child.

And then for poor Cameron, he's not only having to deal with this, he's looking at a sort of a 1% kind of academic individual who goes off to Cambridge, you know, that sort of elite. It's quite a jump, isn't it? And difficult for confidence when you're seeing that happen in a house. Yeah, and I think it's difficult for parents. You know, that is a parenting hell. You know, I was a kid who just went to school

and it just all went in super bright and went off, you know, a year early and all of that. And Katie was similar. So it was like, and Paddy, their father, my husband, is super bright. So it was like, well, I don't understand. I didn't understand. Obviously over the years I've learned an awful lot and it's a bit of a passion now because I understand just how difficult

it is and that is a parenting hell when you have no experience and you have no help with it because you love this child so much you know you want to swap places with them you know you want to go through the hell for them yeah of course you don't want them to suffer in any way but but you can't yeah and you don't know what to do and some of some of the parents themselves had the same problems yeah so they wouldn't know how to help because they didn't get it sorted themselves my dad didn't read a book till he was like 38 my mum gave him the book of adrian mole you know so like it was sort of like you know he still writes in capital letters you know i mean like and stuff like that so it's sort of it's difficult so is it genetic or is it random these special educational needs it's partly genetic yeah partly i think dyslexia they say but you know they go oh well you know

whatever the percentages of the day are dyslexic but there's a huge range of it rob as you know from people who might reverse a b and a it rob as you know of course from people who might reverse a b and a d for instance you know because they look similar but it changes on the paper and to someone who just the letters are just dancing in front of them and there was um so cam it's really interesting because he goes online now and there are all sorts and he came up with and showed it to me i'll try and send it to you actually, a link to something. And it was somebody explaining what it's like to be dyslexic. So it says, here is, and it's just like a little video.

Here's a paragraph. And I can't remember the subject, but let's say it was, oh, I went to town to do some shopping, blah, blah, blah. It's pretty simple. And it was about three sentences. And then it just said, and this is what I see. And the letters were jumping around, literally. And the words were reversing.

They were all in the same sequence, if you know what I mean. But they were like, Jesus. Whoa. And Cam said, yeah, that's what I see. Wow. That is what I see. So what does he do now to read? Does he still see that?

Or has he learned techniques to stop it? It's always about strategies. Everything is about strategies, even with ADHD. He forgets people's names, right? He can't remember people's names, which I know is relatively common. But as an example, so he has a whole technique, if he sees someone in the street, of what he asks them to get clues as to who they are and how he would remember them but it's strategy strategy strategy and he's really brilliant at it i think he's going to put

some online actually because they're just simple but you must have that rob the strategies yeah so if i meet someone i'll be you're incredible with names rob like when we did live shows you knew everyone's name in the audience at the moment you come back to someone you knew all of them so i can't take instruction at all so if someone sits me down and explains this is what we're doing today i'm looking at and i'm trying so hard but it just sort of flies through my head and out yeah whereas if you show me if you physically show me or there's an image of it yeah I can take it from that so yeah if I meet someone I'll add something so if I met Josh today I'd be like Josh red and white stripe Josh red and white stripe Josh so that what I've done is put in the image of Josh not the name of Josh so when I think of

Josh I think of a man in that red and blue top there, sat there. And I'm like, oh, that's Josh because I've attached it to something. So for you now, I just think of Carol books and all the books because there's all those Britannia books behind you. It's quite a striking image. So that when I'm thinking of your name or I see you again, I'll see you, but then I'll see the books come behind you, as it were, in my mind when I meet you again and stuff. Yeah, I understand.

So yeah, if I try and understand anything, I create a visual image of it, which I think has helped me in stand-up because to try and make a joke get over the line, you're painting a picture of what you're doing and how you're doing it and stuff. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's really interesting.

So I paint a lot of pictures. So when I'm doing crowd work, I'll see someone and I'll get their name and I'll remember what they said and what they're wearing and where they're sat. So in a gig, it's great because they don't move. Yeah.

I know where they are, you know, and stuff like that. So a lot of mine is just coping strategies. I didn't realize I was doing that is basically winging it. So like, you know, I don't really,

if I was too much of a script, when I first started in award ceremonies and I had all the auto cue, that was hard. But then I'd sometimes just talk really quick or if I couldn't say a name properly I'd say it quick and put a joke in at the end quickly and stuff like that so a lot of it was sort of charming my way out of it as opposed to directly dealing with it but yeah so you just have lots of different strategies and stuff but there's so many different types of it it's not just B&Ds getting swapped around or letters missing it's sort of yeah the way you take in information and process it and stuff.

I find it fascinating. Just you describing that is really fascinating because your powers of visual memory are probably a damn sight higher than Josh's than mine. I'm awful at names, but like in a gig situation. Yeah. So when we were doing the parenting hell gigs but you're just not using a strategy but i had to use a strategy because i'd know no one's name because i'm not listening most of the time yeah well so we do the parenting hell gigs and rob

would bring up someone for the first half of like well you would say that mary and i'd be like fuck i can't remember that person was called mary for love no money but then that's helped me in stand-up because a lot of people go how can you go go out there without a script? I've never had a script because I never wrote it down and I don't write it down. Do you write anything down? No, nothing. So you're about to do a new show

in, say, a year or two. Yeah, so I've got notes in my phone of things that may be... For example, I took my cats to the vets and I'm going to give him this injection. I said, what is it? He went, it's leukaemia. And I was like, why giving it leukaemia?

No, it's a vaccination against leukaemia. If I give it to the cat he won't have leukemia i was like oh how much is that it was like 80 quid i went can i have it you know just in case just in my work you know so i'll literally have a bit of paper cat leukemia and i'll go out and just tell that story and then over time i'll add to it but it's all in my brain i'll never write all of that out you know i've got routines five six seven minute routines and once I start it and I'm in the rhythm of doing it I can just remember it all but that's because I couldn't read it off very well so I've learned to remember it and deliver it so when I go on stage now I went on the gig for nine months I had some stuff written on a bit of paper but the gig went south as soon as I got the paper out I'm better off in the moment

going off the energy and just trying to connect with people and stuff and it's obviously it's not a fully formed routine but it's getting away little moments that i think are funny and then i remember them so i don't have any paper but that's because for me holding paper in front of people and talking is my worst nightmare i'd rather walk out with nothing if you said to me i can sit in a hotel room for five hours now and write out a 10 minute stand-up set or i can stand up walk through a door there's a room full of people and i do that 10 minutes now i'll take that option yeah fascinating i'll go mad after five hours in a hotel that would be my hell yeah i'd say please please i'd beg them

to go on now and do it rather than wait that five hours. And is that what's going on in the hotel room? What, like... Yeah, just masturbating. After seven weeks, she's got no energy for the gig. No, yeah, so writing something, I feel like I've got to do something. So I feel like I need to write all that out or think about what to say. But I find that I'll just overthink it.

I'll get anxious. I'll get stressed. I'll worry about it. And I do think as well, what I'm trying to achieve is a verbal medium. You know, I'm talking. So why would I write something down that I'm eventually going to say out loud? It never needs to hit the paper. The closest I can get it from my brain to my mouth, that's the link.

Because it's a conversation with the audience that they don't reply to. So for me, it feels odd to write something down that's going to be said eventually. You're adding a written element to something that's verbal. And actually, I deliver stuff better and create better stuff when I'm excited and feel like it's fun to do. But sitting for five hours waiting will just take all my energy away. And yeah, that's how I work, but everyone's different, you know. And are your kids, how old are your kids, Rob? Mine are seven and five, nearly eight and six in a couple of months.

Have they shown any signs of dyslexia or anything like that? Not really. They seem to be fine. My eldest is slightly a bit more anxious and not super confident, but once she gets her confidence up all with the right people, she's full of beans so i've noticed that slightly but no not really and the youngest has only just started reception so we've not seen it fully yet but um no not really they sort of seem to be on it at the moment there's nothing that's striking in that sense but my youngest has definitely got an energy

problem that i've got where she's just like has to, where my eldest has fun and messes about. But like you, I think we might have a similar thing where I'd quite like to go to an air show so I could just scream as a jet went over, just as a release. It's fascinating though, like what I find with schools, so the education system,

have written various reports about maths education and everything comes from the university. So they go, right, if you're going to study study chemistry you're going to study maths obviously or engineering or whatever the university decides what those kids need to have studied for a level so that's how the kind of the a level is set so then they go oh the a level right in order to do the a level this is what they must study at gcse including all the stuff that most kids never need trigonometry a lot of simultaneous equations i mean of course you need all that if you're going to uni but you don't need it if you're going up to age 16 and so on so everything sort of tracks back yeah from there and that i think is fundamentally wrong you know because kids

are forced into doing stuff which actually is you know people say to me all the time why do i need to know you know the tangent to a circle is perpendicular to the radius you don't i agree with you i don't that's something i found So I was really good at maths, like in my head. Yeah. That was something I could do. I could still do that sums really easily in my head. And I remember getting to GCSE and thinking that it just doesn't relate to my life at all anymore. Do you know what I mean?

Yeah, I do. Despite them making it the side of a cake that I'm measuring with these two triangles this doesn't make any sense in my life anymore so that's when i i moved into kind of artsy areas anyway like english and stuff but that was when i became quite kind of disinterested in it i think yeah and i think that's a lot you know with parents i mean talking about parenting hell a lot of parenting hell comes from having to teach your kids maths and using different sort of algorithms, really, different processes to find the same answer, you know, for subtraction, for instance.

So, you know, ours used to be carry one, pay one back, we used to say, which meant one ten, you know, if you're doing like a long subtraction. Whereas now there is decomposition so they take the top number and they put a line through it and eight tens will split those into seven tens and 110 and all that and parents go eight maths anyway but now i don't even know what they're doing and the child always goes we don't get it like that anymore you know and it becomes i know this because like thousands and thousands of parents over the years have told me this it becomes a hell yeah well luckily for me lose

a history teacher and i just tap out i go you're a teacher you are literally you've only done history secondary school right yeah i know but then you're surely you're closer to it than me you know come on take this i'm out yeah yeah I mean, I love that you two are doing this show. I love it. I mean, and it's funny. And if we see all the things you go, oh, my God, I had to go to the park. Oh, my God, I had to do that. But it is a thing.

And particularly, like you just said, Rob, you know, your wife had a career. Josh, the same. You know, it's like women have careers. People have houses and kids and everything. And both parents are largely full-time working now which is you're the first generation where that's happening yeah that wasn't the case in my generation so it's like all these things to learn you know new things i was gonna ask as well like you've got such a sort of positive outlook and sort of like not only like positive about stuff

but you're like you move with the times and very modern thinking rather than like no this is the way we should do it and stuff like that. And I feel like you were treated quite badly by the press. Like when you moved on from Cowgirl and stuff like that, it almost felt like because you were the first sort of one of the first sort of famous women on telly to sort of be on telly and be famous and have a proper skill. Yeah. Rather than just being that classic like here's the lady that brings on the part. You were doing something that needed an expert brain to do. And was almost like the press was a little bit suspicious and annoyed with you for that and then when you moved on it was like they sort of were like ah now we've got her almost like now she's gone and someone else is coming in and I always strike me as very quite graceful and

gracious in that moment and like you say you you cracked on your brother stuff you do loads of telly you've got your maths courses and things like that and have continued to have a brilliant career for the last 15 years since you've not been on it. Like, how did you find that? Especially as like, you know, like as a career woman and they were sort of jumping on you and stuff. Like, did that affect you?

Yeah, I did find it hard. But again, it's like, you know, the ageism for want of a nicer word. But it's rife in my generation. It's still rife in my generation. But what we have now, so when I was 39, I talk about this, actually, in the year 2000, as an example. So in this century, the year 2000, I was age 39, and I went to the BAFTAs, and I wore a short blue dress,

and it was all over front pages everywhere oh my god oh my god and it went on for about a year the BBC made a special Kilroy about it Daily Mail obviously you can imagine the question was not should somebody wear a blue dress question was it was quite wasn't that short but it was a you know the question was, it wasn't that short, but it was, you know, the question was, should a woman of 39 wear a dress above the knee? Bloody hell. Oh, my God. That's in the year 2000. That's mad.

That's not like my mother. Because you were so famous, though. You were just used as anything. Oh, women are doing something different now. And you were used as the poster woman of it because you were there. Yeah. So all of that. And then, oh, all sorts of nonsense headlines

that they just make up oh my god it's just a blue dress it's not even yeah it was above the knee so it was like and oh i know so what i found now in the last like talking about special friends for instance if i'd done that five or ten years ago i i mean i still am called all sorts but i would have been called in the headlines you know like cuckoo crazy oh well worse far worse far far worse but what i love now is you know being in my 60s is that there are generations below now you go oh yeah you know let her do what she wants whereas when i was, those generations didn't. That was a middle finger for a Valdeman to the listeners, just so they know.

Yeah. Because they can't see it. It was a very aggressive middle finger. It was very impressive. With a fully painted nail. So what I love now is that younger generations like your own go, why not? Yeah.

Yeah. You're not harming anyone, but that didn't exist. That generational thought didn't exist when I was younger. So that's why I, I mean, you know, from my fifties onwards,

I love it because I've got people in the world now who think like I mean, you know, from my fifties onwards, I love it because I've got people in the world now who think like I do rather than always being a bit, you know, my, my ambition was to be an RAF fighter pilot. That was all I ever wanted to be, but women weren't allowed to be, you know, until I was well in my thirties and obviously too old by then, but it was how it was. And that's what's so joyful about it now which is one of the reasons now why i'm forever in the gym i've still got my gym kit on now and i'm really into like health and one of the reasons is that i enjoy like the company i have now more than i did back then and i've always had a good time but I feel freer now than I've ever ever felt oh it's amazing yeah which I love thanks so much Carol it's been a joy I genuinely speak so brilliantly and we've had such a good conversation this is the first time we've ever not seamlessly put in

the plug oh yeah which is your own fault for being too good a conversation, Karen. Your new quiz book, Perfect Ten. Just tell us about that. Perfect Ten. Before I tell you about that, just one thing. Going back to you, Rob, and dyslexia. Did you know there's a very famous Sunday Times journalist called A.A. Gill? Yes.

Oh, yes. Yeah. So A.A. Gill was, you know, known as a sort of superlative critic, wasn't he? And I mean, he slagged us off all the time, but he did it using such wonderful language, he kind of didn't mind. I met him years and years and years later, and he sort of took one step back as soon as he saw me,

because he thought I was going to hit him for all of the bad stuff he'd written about. Quite the opposite. And he said, oh, I read about your son. This was years and years ago. I went, oh, yeah. He said, I'm dyslexic. I'm hugely dyslexic. And we used to talk on the phone.

A.A. Gill couldn't write. He physically couldn't write. He used to phone through his copy to someone, didn't write. He used to phone through his copy to someone, didn't he? He used to phone his copy through. He said, I've had the same PA for over 20 years. I phone the copy through. I've never met her. I phone the copy through.

She types it up and that's what I send. And that was A.A. Gill. Wow. Yeah, that's incredible. Quite amazing. That's amazing. i never knew that once again you've managed to stop your book being plugged here carol yes it's a book that you can't see come on quiz book perfect ed talk us through it vaulders okay so um in january i began a new podcast which i spent about a year with our little team putting together because it wasn't a big quiz podcast.

And we thought, oh, pub quizzes and general knowledge and all of that. Anyway, we tried a few different pilots last year and I was going, no, no, it's not right. It's not right. So we came up with perfect 10. It's 10 different kinds of questions. So one of the rounds is a memory round where you listen to about 30 seconds of stuff. And I ask you a question. One's a riddle.

One's like audio clips. And you've got to get the well-known phrase or saying from that. All of that kind of thing, right? Or karaoke, which is you hear a little bit of a song. And then I'll ask you a question about the next line in the song. So it's not general knowledge. It's not like The Chase will be and all those other huge shows. So the podcast came out. And it's now, i'm told number one in leisure number one in games there we go

nice and number two in mental health oh oh i know all the other ones are fucking droning on though this one's a bit of fun what's the podcast called perfect 10 it's called perfect 10 10 questions 10 perfect answers all done in 10 minutes oh yes please that's my kind of podcast but beckett's on board exactly and it's a different one monday to friday i'm on there i'll have that and walk in the dog i'll smash her away on that walk so the book which is out in september is that basically there's lots and lots of quizzes and it gives you a few bits of detail after. But it's a hardback and I think a lot of people want to buy it as Christmas presents and so on.

Do you know what that is? Stop listening now, Teresa Watts. That's what you're getting for Christmas. That is absolutely nailed on. She'll love that. She loves a good quiz. Yeah, it's a good quiz. Carol, it's been an absolute joy to talk to you oh thanks carol so much thank you so much for doing it oh i'm you too thank you it was a pleasure brilliant thank you so much carol good luck with the book thank you so much

thank you lots of love carol vorderman there what a woman right i love all this i knew i loved her before but now i'm in love. Oh, just a great, great human being. Love her. Yeah, she's great. She's good value as well. She's so carefree and chilled out. Great value.

Got a bit serious in the middle though, which I think is good sometimes, isn't it? I loved it. I loved it. Genuinely, Rob, it was brilliant hearing you chat like that. And I always thought it would take Carol Vorderman to pull that out of you. That was great though. Thank you very much for listening guys and we'll see you next time get yourself perfect 10 perfect 10 see you then oh it rhymed all right bye