Rotten Mango - #314: 21 Yr Old Student Murdered by a Cop, a Secret Agent, and a Military Son For Bizarre Fantasy

Episode Date: November 20, 2023

Lily’s instructions were clear. She was to wait at the bottom of the mountain in the dark till she saw the light. The flashlight would beam down the mountain, leading her to where she needed to go. She was nervous, but she knew she needed to follow the directions. When she got to the top of the mountain - Lily saw the light led directly into a pre-dug 5-foot grave. Two men jumped out and snapped her neck while recording it. They were going to send the murder video to the special forces team of the military - because Lily was a fake flight attendant. Fake college student. They believed she was really- a secret spy for an enemy nation.   Full Source Notes: rottenmangopodcast.com To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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It was pitch black outside. 21-year-old Lily could hear leaves rustling. The anxiety is starting to kick in. I mean, what is she doing here? In the dark at the bottom of this mountain, in the middle of the night. The whole situation is pretty off-putting. If a few years ago you had asked Lily where she saw herself when she's 21 years old, she would have confidently told

you, oh yeah, I'm going to be a flight attendant on Singapore Airlines. But instead, she is staring into the dark abyss of this mountain in front of her, waiting for a beam of light. She's very confused. The directions were somewhat clear. They were somewhat simple, I should say. Follow the light. The light is going to guide her to where she needs to go on the mountain. She realized she should have asked a few follow-up questions. What kind of light is it a flashlight? Is it a beam of light? Is it a ray of light? Is there a candle? It was unclear. But then she sighed. The light. It looks like more of a commercial flashlight. So maybe one that would require two hands to hold. And it was illuminating a path for her. So it was shining on one part of the mountain where she's standing. And it was moving her upwards, kind of like a trail. So someone at the top of

the mountain is shining down where she needs to walk up. Is there a flashlight, like a trail. So someone at the top of the mountain is shining down where she needs to walk up. Is it a flashlight? Like a giant flashlight? Like a giant flashlight. But it's not strong enough that it's illuminating the whole mountain and she can start seeing around. It's actually just bright enough for her to follow and just bright enough for her to see that in front of her is a step that she can take. Someone's controlling a giant flashlight and she's following that flashlight. Yes. Okay. It's very interesting and Once she gets to the top awaiting her were two men One was a police officer the other was a man with a family with

Generations Generations heavily involved in the Chinese military and with them they had a shovel Night vision goggles and a pre-dub grave. The two men, the police officer and the family military man, they planned to snap Lily's neck with their bare hands and bury her on the side of the mountain. They also planned to record the entire crime and send it to the one that was closest to her,

her beloved boyfriend, who is now going to watch his girlfriend, get murdered in cold blood. We would like to thank today's sponsors who have made it possible for Rottenmingo to support Reign. Reign is the largest anti-sexual violence organization. They've created and operated the National SA Hotline. They actually worked directly with the Department of Defense to provide resources for survivors, as well as bringing perpetrators to justice. This episode's partnerships have also made it possible to support Rotten Mingos growing dedicated team of researchers, translators.

They helped shed light on stories from all over the world, and you guys have also made it possible with your continued support of RM to help us work on our mission to be worthy advocates of these causes. So as always, full show notes are available at rottonminglepodcast.com. And with these international cases, we did have Chinese translators on this, but please let us know if there was anything lost in translation or something that we overlooked.

And with that being said, let's get into it. There's a video game called PubG. It's a battle royale type game. So it starts with 100 people and you battle it out to see who's the last one standing. I guess similar to Fortnite. And it's really interactive. Because while you're trying to kill people, you can also hear them. You can also talk to them, these strangers.

You can even start group messages on PUBG. Talk to your friends on there. And in China, PUBG is huge. But in this group of friends, PUBG was being used for something else entirely. They were using the messaging feature on PUBG to plot and coordinate a real-life murder. Like a messenger? Yeah. Because they thought their text messages and their WeChat were going to be surveilled. So they used PUBG. That is so interesting.

So there's no monitors and no records. It does seem like there are records, but I think that they thought that they could use code names that made it seem like they were talking about the game and shooting people in the game, but they're actually plotting a real-life murder. Wow. Yeah.

Now, Lily, she called her mom every single night before she went to bed. At this point, it had become more of a habit than anything. So between the two, whoever was going to fall asleep first, because they live an hour away from each other, the first person to go to bed would be the one to call and say good night. That night, July 9th of 2020, there was no phone call. Lily was not picking up her mom's call. Lily was not calling.

And this was, this was rare, but it's not inherently the most alarming thing. Lily's 21. She's got her own life. She has her own apartment with her boyfriend. She just graduated college. She's got a part-time job. It's not going to be something that Lily's mom is like, I need to immediately call 911. But July 12th, 2020. three days after the initial miss call,

there is still no word from Lily. So Lily's parents decide we gotta go to her apartment in Nanjing an hour away to figure out what the hell is going on. Hong is Lily's boyfriend. He lives in the apartment in Nanjing with her. And he's also getting involved with the search for Lily because he's like, I have not seen her in three days.

She hasn't been home. So him and the parents, they start working very closely together to try and figure out where could Lily possibly be. Side note, a lot of people who knew Lily, remember the way that Lily and Hong met? It's kind of shared out of a novel. So Lily was on the train. I think this just shows you the kind of relationship

that they have. She was on the subway when this creepy guy starts getting closer and closer and closer to her physically. And he just kept saying that he was visiting from out of the country. He's a foreigner. And he's doing it in a way that's very creepy. It's not in the way that's like, oh, I'm a foreigner.

I don't really know my way around here. It's very much, I'm a foreigner looking for a Chinese girlfriend type of vibe. Just very off-putting. She's kind of pulling away from him. She's clearly, visibly uncomfortable. It's written on her face, her body language, the man is not getting the message. She's trying every excuse to get away from him, but he's just getting closer and closer,

and the train is not empty so it's not like she can just remove herself easily. She's just getting squished in between these people and not when she hears a man behind them. Where have you been? I've been looking for you. Straight out of a romance movie, she had never seen this man before but he is saving her, giving her an out of this uncomfortable situation. So she takes it. They act like they know each other. They start chit-chatting. The foreign man pulls away, walks away. Once the two get out of the subway, she thinks this stranger for helping.

And, you know, because this is the type of meeting that doesn't really happen, maybe it means something. Both of them felt like we might regret it if we don't get each other's contact. So they exchange rechats. And from there, they started officially dating December of 2019. They started moving fast. Hong meets Lily's parents, which is a very big deal in China, especially for people that abide more by the traditions. So traditionally, at St. Nol's to parents, hey, we're looking to get married.

This is a very formal meeting. That's kind of the setting that Lily had brought Hong into Lily moved in with Hong again Traditionally a very serious gesture in China and now July 2020 just six months later Lily is missing Initially Lily's parents were worried, but Hong wasn't He said it's my fault that she's missing and I But Heng wasn't. He said, it's my fault that she's missing and I didn't want to bring it up and I thought

that she would cool down and come back, but they had gotten into a fight on the night of the 8th. She walked out morning of the 9th with all of their cash, like $7,000 in cash that they had in the night's stand drawer. She had taken it, left, and initially he thought, she's going to take some time to cool off. Maybe she's using this as a way to get me worried or stressed because she's out of the house, she's not contacting me. He thought for sure that she's at least talking to her friends and her parents, right?

It's just him that he's icing out. With the minute that the parents show up, he's kind of freaked out. He's like, okay, this is getting weird. Initially, I thought it's fine. I even saw her little red notebook account, which is like the Chinese Pinterest. She had hearted a few cafes and restaurants near different province, the Yunnan province. Re-nan province. So I assumed that she had friends there or someone she was visiting. But now that you're saying, as parents, you haven't been in contact with her,

now it's weird. Now it too much time has passed and this is just not like her. There would be no reason for her to go radio silent on everyone. So together, they keep calling Lily, but her phone isn't even ringing at this point. It's dead, it's turned off. They tried to hack into her Apple iCloud to see if they could use the fine my iPhone feature. None of them knew her password, nor could they guess it correctly. Lily had just vanished, just gone. After a few more days of waiting

and a filed police report later, everyone agrees it just doesn't make sense for Lily to run off after a fight, something must have happened to her. So of course, the next immediate theory was it had something to do with Hong being in the military. Side note, this guy is not just in the military. He was in the People's Army of China

eighth core special operations team. He was part of the special forces. The boyfriend is special force? Yes, so of course the family is thinking, maybe this is a targeted attack for Hong. I mean, maybe it's not a whole government of for an entity being like, we need to single out this one particular

special forces girlfriend, but maybe something had happened. It just seems like this is the only thing that makes sense. Lily is not the type to have enemies. She just graduated college. She's trying to be a flight attendant. She's by all means a very normal girl. So perhaps instead of targeting him, they went after his girlfriend instead. Or perhaps they thought the girlfriend knew something about the army, that Hong wasn't supposed to tell her.

It was a hard theory to consider, since if it turned out to be true, someone took Lily because Hong was special ops. What are they doing to her? What do they want from her? If this were true, Hong would never be able to live with himself, especially because it was one of the things that attracted Lily to Hong in the first place. I mean, not really, but kind of. When they started dating, she didn't really know that he was even part of the special forces. She knew that he was in the military, and that was about it.

But even that, even just being a soldier provided such a layer of comfort. To some people, there's this unspoken sense of security when they're in the presence of uniformed officials. It's like being next to a firefighter. Typically, you might feel maybe a little bit safer. You're like, at least I know if there's an arson attack. I'm kind of in good hands. But now, the theory is that the very thing that attracted Lily to Han could be the thing that got her potentially kidnapped. This theory was quickly squashed when police got involved and

found CCTV footage of Lily leaving their apartment on July 9 on her own free will. But there was something odd about that CCTV footage, and I wonder if you can spot it. The footage is from July 9, 1042 AM. Lily is walking out of her apartment, wearing a face mask, sunglasses, black turtle neck, grey coat carrying a smaller bag and a foldable umbrella. This was the last time that she's seen a live and on camera. What is wrong with this particular moment? What is she wearing?

Black turtle neck and a grey coat. It's cold outside, right? I don't know. What's the... It's July 9th. Oh, it's hot. It's very hot. It's very hot scorching hot weather her clothing choices just don't make any sense where she was potentially headed

Yunnan Reenun is even further down south even harder harder. Yeah, so very odd Yeah, where is she going? It also indicates to authorities and to Lily's loved ones that she left by herself and was not kidnapped. She also did not seem in distress when she left the apartment. At least she wasn't kidnapped from the apartment. We don't know what happened when she stepped out.

So comes the next theory. If Lily went to that province with her own free will, maybe she was involved in drug trafficking. I know, the whole basis for this theory is so loose, I am not a fan of this theory at all. The theory is that this province is very close to the border of China. Organized crimes into kids have been known to smuggle drugs in and out of China through this part of the border.

Apparently, Chinese drug rings like to use Myanmar as their export station, and I guess to some people, the fact that she went to this specific town by herself hiding her face with sunglasses and a face mask took her boyfriend $7,000 in cash and then vanished. They thought it sounded like someone who was involved in some sort of shady underground business and now the family and the boyfriend they can't come to terms with that because their beloved Lily is not who they thought she was. I would say anyone who knew Lily did not believe this theory at all. Yes, there is an unpredictable nature on who could be involved with drug trafficking.

Sometimes it's the exact people that you least expect. But there was zero evidence that Lily sold but let alone even did drugs, was involved in some sort of shady organization. She just graduated college a month ago, and the reason that she was in a flight attendant now was because she graduated in 2020. It's the pandemic. There's not a lot of airlines actively hiring right now. She was working odd part-time jobs just so that she could wait until she got a job listing,

and her parents argued, this is the girl that passed the end-to-Japanese proficiency exams. The Japanese language proficiency test measures how fluent foreigners are at the language. There's five levels, N1 through five. N1 is the highest level, meaning not only are you fluent for day-to-day Japanese living, but you're actually able to navigate professional corporate industries within Japan.

It is notoriously difficult to pass. I mean, I imagine if there was a proficiency test like that in English, a lot of locals would fail, a lot of native speakers would fail. I wonder if it's the same with Japanese, but she was N2. So the like the second almost to the top. Yes. And she did this all for her dreams of becoming a flight attendant. Because, you know, Japanese would serve her well. So her parents are arguing, if she's doing all of this for her career as a flight attendant, why would she risk it to get arrested doing some illegal drug trade? I mean, she's dedicated to her career path. It doesn't make any sense. She's also the girl that works so many on jobs that sometimes she would

just go months eating just ramen. Does that sound like Pablo Escobar to you? Because that's what people would make your sound like. A lot of people were briefly entertained with this theory and it just to the parents, they felt like it was a bad theory. It felt like Lily was living a double life and there was zero evidence of her even being involved. Her parents were rightfully upset that their missing daughter was being accused of something like this. Also, because it makes the police feel less sympathetic or motivated to look into her

disappearance. Because they had no other leads to go off of, the parents and Hong thought of printing out missing persons posters and hanging them up near the border town where she had allegedly gone to see if any of the locals had seen her nearby. And of course, there is that nagging suspicion that border towns, it's not just in China and it's not just bordering these countries. I'm talking border towns in any country. There's usually a little bit more activity for drug trafficking and human trafficking because they're border towns, they're bordering countries,

and what gets shipped in and out of countries. Now, I couldn't find statistics of border towns, but there does seem to be a lot of anecdotal evidence that these are major hubs for human trafficking, regardless of which two countries are boarding each other. So there was that theory that maybe Lily had been human trafficked. It is a dangerous theory to toy with, but there was another theory,

and it all comes down to a man named Zau. We're going gonna call him Z Z would die for his country He would die for China and it sounds dramatic But that's what he was taught by his dad who was in the Chinese military and then his grandpa Who is also in the military and then his great grandpa who was also in the military? It had been ingrained into his brain by generations of his family You die for your country, you protect your country,

and that is what great servicemen do. And now in 2020, he realizes there is a spy in China. Oh yeah, spying on some of the top special force agents. She had to be killed and there was just no way around it. She was not going to stop until she took the country down, and even if nobody knew that Zee was the one to do it, took the country down. And even if nobody knew that Z with the one to do it, to take her down to save the country, he would be okay with it. He was fine being an unsung hero. That's what he said.

Even if I get no valor, even if I get no appreciation for taking down an international spy, I'm going to do it. Are you serious? I'm serious. He really thought. Yeah, he really thought. So he looks around his little friend circle and he's like, okay, who do I know that can help me take down an international spy

My good friend see C-A-O it's how? TOW right we're gonna call him C. C is a cop. So Z is like, oh this is perfect if anyone's gonna help me take down an International spy it's to be a police officer. So together, they're going to get rid of a 21 year old spy who's posing as some college grad wannabe flight attendant. But in reality, she's working for enemy countries. They just need to find the perfect plan first. Maybe Lily, if that even is her real name, had to die in a way that her body would be found. So the two of them, they start thinking, maybe we can lure her out into the ocean, have her take a swim, and then we would be underwater waiting

with nets. We would tangle her up in these nets like a fish, wait until she drowns under the nets, remove it, take it back with us so it looks like a natural drowning. But that seems like a lot more physical labor than they wanted, and what if she fought back really hard? What if there were other beachgoers, assuming that they would have to convince Lily to get into the water, how would they convince her to get into the water at 3 a.m.? It's just too much risk. The next method that they almost went with was somehow luring Lily to Thailand, and they

thought that they could laugh and giggle as they watched an international spy get sold into human trafficking. The problem with this plan is, they would need to find human traffickers, and then they would need to make sure that they didn't tell anybody the authorities. Hey, the spy that was sold to us, it was these two, Z&C. And a big concern was, she's a spy. We don't know how good she is at fighting. What if she's like Mr. and Mrs. And a big concern was, she's a spy. We don't know how good she is at fighting. What if she's like Mr. and Mrs. Smith? What if she somehow manages to escape being sex trafficked?

Then she would remember that we're the ones that lured her. There would be some sort of clues that she could give the authorities and then we would go down. Instead, they lured her into Yunnan Province. She was told to pack light. Don't bring a suitcase or anything like that. The directions for her to follow were book a plane ticket the day off. Fly to Yunnan, get off the flight, go directly to the base of the mountain and wait for the light. I'm going

to tell you how they got her to do this in a second. The light is going to lead her to the top. She didn't know that two men were going to be waiting for her there, behind a few trees, with night vision goggles on, wearing camouflage. Next to them was a five foot grave already dug and when she reached the final beam of light it was shining directly into the pre-dub grave. For a split second it said that Lily was confused but they jumped out before she could run away and one of them held out their phone to record and the other one grabbed her head with his bare hands, and twisted and snapped her neck. They threw her body into the grave,

took off all drooling personal belongings and started covering her up with soil. The video was clear. There was no mistaking that she was dead, and that this was done by what looked to be professionals. Lily, an international spy, posing as a 21-year-old college student, wanna be flight attendant, was eliminated.

She was extinguished and would no longer pose a threat to national security. When you work out with Peloton, you're going to keep coming back for more. And with up to $950 off Peloton purchases, now's the time to bring home a Peloton bike, bike plus or tread, and work out your way. Unleash yourself. Ride, run, box, or freak the hit out. It's your workout, your rules!

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Product availability varies by region. See out for details. by region. See out for details. At first, Lily was frustrated with her new boyfriend, Hong. She just didn't understand why he was so secretive about everything. It was to the point where other girlfriends they might ponder, hey, is my boyfriend seeing someone else on the side? Lily would sit there and wonder, does my boyfriend have a full family on the side that I don't know about, like a secret wife and kids? That's how secretive he was. But once they moved in together, it was just getting to the point where he just couldn't hide it anymore.

He told her, hey, I'm actually not just part of the military. I'm part of the special ops team in the Chinese army. So there are parts of my work that I can't really share with you. And that's why I mean the, the parts that I can, I will, but it's just the drill. I mean, my dad was part of the special ops team. It's just, it's the thing in the family. And it all kind of started to make sense. A lot of HONG's Instagram posts were him in Kama

playing with guns, you know, a group of guys decked out in Kama posing with guns. So these were a lot of his military buddies that he had started out with. And it didn't look weird or like he was this gun loving freak. Okay, kind of did. But he just looked like he was really into the military life. And she's like, okay, maybe I get the fascination. This is his life. And it's been that way for generations and his family. And once you

found out the truth, she felt very sympathetic. To give comparison, it's like dating a Navy SEAL. For example, it would probably give you a feeling of safety, security, that if something were to go down, they would have your back. It's that mixture of capability and real life superhero vibes. It makes you feel protected. Lily was very understanding of Heng's job. Once she found out what he did for a living, that is. Sometimes he would be gone for days at a time. And of course, yeah, she's feeling anxious the whole time wondering,

is he safe? Is he going to make it back? What kind of mission is he on? But she knew that this is his life. This is what he's dedicated to. And all she can do is support him. And sometimes supporting him comes in the form of not asking too many questions. Why put him in a situation where he has to choose between national security and his relationship? She never asked and he never brought it up really until July of 2020, hung asked if she wanted to accompany him, not on a mission, but just on a cute little vacation. That's where he was planning on going. He said that he wanted to meet with her after he had his

little gig and they could spend a day or two in the Yunnan province together, which kind of made sense because the Yunnan province is known to be one of the more beautiful provinces in China. It's filled with touristy spots, a lot of different indigenous ethnic groups there. So it attracts tourists to see the different cultures. There's a lot of colorful temples, beautiful lakes. So it'll be a date. And he's a little bit worried because this is not really what he's supposed to be doing technically. This could get him in trouble with work, but their relationship is evolving. It's getting more serious and maybe it's the right time. So as special ops, there's a couple of rules that he had to follow.

He wasn't allowed to stay in hotel rooms or motel rooms because once you check in, there could be too many people that could get access to those records. The whole point is no one's supposed to know that he's in town. And he was going to use the army's safe house. So the army has safe houses in all these different provinces, all these different towns. And typically they're really hidden away and they're in very, very particular locations. So this one in Yunnan would be on top of a mountain because this area, they wanted to make sure that they could see everything in the distance. If people

were encroaching, if people were coming up the mountain, they would be able to see it from this safe house. But the problem is, she cannot contact him when she gets into Yunnan because people know that they're dating and it's just a whole thing like they can't track both of them. So what she would have to do is get on a plane by herself, fly into Yunnan, go to the mountain that he gave her directions from, and from there he said that he was going to flash a flashlight for her to come up the mountain to the safe house. And from there they could spend two days unplugged, no phones, nothing so that no one contract their location, and then they would fly back home together because once they're leaving, it's much safer.

So he's special up. He wants to go on a vacation with her but can't tell her where to go. He is doing a job in Yunnan. And since he's there, he thought she could fly in and they could spend two days together before he goes away for his next job. Right. So he asked the other two people to flash her? No. He was going to flash the flashlight. He was going to flash it, but it was the other two guys that was flashing it. Exactly. And the other two guys thinks she's an international spy. Exactly.

Does he think she's an international spy too? We'll see. So when the day comes, neither of them would see the house on the hill. Instead, Hong would see a video of Lily's head getting snapped by a man's bare hands and being buried on the side of the mountain. While he watched this video, he was not in the house on the hill. Nor was he even in the Unan province. He was back at home in the apartment that he shared with Lily watching her murder.

And Lily's parents never really liked Hong. The first time that they met for dinner, this is the time that Hong is supposed to impress Lily's parents, but instead he just seemed very elusive if not just downright agitated when the parents asked questions about his life, which is very

strange. And I know it might not make as much sense in Western culture, and I'm sure in different Chinese families, it's different as well. Like our family is a little bit different, but when you bring home a partner in traditional Chinese culture, it's very common, I think, even in Korea, for parents to ask a little bit more details about that partner's job, potentially even how much they earn. Like, money is not as taboo like it is in Western culture. Yeah, because for them, you have to know what...

Their potential. Yeah, not even that. It's like you're getting married. It's a way for them to gauge your level of income, education, and ultimately your ability to provide, which is what they care about. Now, it goes both ways. It's not just for the men, it's also for the women. Like, they're just a little bit more blunt with these types of life questions. Yeah, it's more transparent.

In their culture, it's like sense of merging of two families, so it's important to know where you stand. I mean, I can see like the downsides of it, but I also see the upsides of it. I think knowing what your partner is doing and their life goals and ambitions and everyone's on the same page is very good So hung refuse to answer these questions and they didn't like that They're like why would he refuse to answer these questions if something weird isn't going on

So he didn't tell them he's special off. No, he didn't even tell them he was in the military Eventually hung let Lily open up to her parents and he said you can tell them I'm in the military But please can we just leave it at that like I can't just go on telling everyone I'm on the special ops team. He's not like a secret spy. He's not out there infiltrating other countries. He's like a Navy SEAL. And I guess his special ops team, they had a little bit more secrecy than Navy SEALs do

in terms of who you can tell you're a Navy SEAL or not. So he's like, you know, I just, it's not the worst thing if people find out I'm special ops, but it's not the best thing. So just tell them I'm in the military. And his dad also worked in the government. So the parents, Lily's parents, they kind of came around. They actually started joking that Lily was dating above her league, meaning Heng's parents, their background is very, very good. Government jobs, incredible. And him being in the military, another government position, this is a good

on-paper marriage. But they still didn't really like the guy. There was nothing in particular that they hated. There was no strong incident that they could point back to him, be like, that was the day that I chose to despise him. He was just purely unlikable. He's just not someone that we love is there to arrive. Just the personality, maybe we're nitpicky because it's our only kid, it's our only daughter, there's nothing inherently wrong with him. In the beginning it was, he was very elusive, didn't answer questions, and then once they found out about his job, they actually liked the fact that his parents and his whole family came from a very respectable background, but they still couldn't really embrace him with

open arms because he just didn't really have a likable personality. There was no strong incident that was raising any red flags or anything like that. They didn't feel like he was abusive or anything. He just wasn't likable. So the parents, they actually start suspecting hung of being something more than unlikable when they get that same feeling from Lily's disappearance.

The feeling that they can't quite put their finger on, but it feels like he's evading their questions. When the parents found out that Lily had gone to Yunnan, the first thing that they did was call Hong to talk to him about it. And in passing, because the parents, they have plans to go to Yunnan to look for their daughter, they ask him casually, have you been before?

Maybe it would have been nice for him to come along, or it may be give them the lay of the land if he had visited. But instantly he gets very agitated and they said that he announced in a very serious, almost snappy tone, I've never been. But a few days later, when the parents mentioned in passing to the police that they're going to go look for their daughter in Yunnan, the police asked if Hong is going since record show that he had been there before, just two months ago. record show that he had been there before, just two months ago. So Lily's parents, they never liked Hong, but never in a million years did they suspect that he would be involved in her disappearance because how could he be?

How could he be when he's sitting there every day staring them in the eye, crying about how much he misses Lily? But the more they think about it, the more suspicious everything is, like the fact that out of everyone, Hong seemed really into the idea that Lily went to that border town to deal drugs Even though he could not back up his theory with any evidence They lived together and you don't even have an ounce of evidence that she's interested in drugs that she's doing drugs That she's making money from drugs nothing just feelings and vibes Because he's saying that she went to the old drugs.

He really liked that theory. He kept telling the parents, I think this is a good theory. Like we should look into this theory. This seems the most plausible. I believe this theory. This makes so much sense to me. And they're like, how does that make sense to you? Because everybody else that knows Lili

is like never in a million years. It just didn't make sense. The only thing that you could really base this theory off of is she went to a border town. Yeah, yeah. That somewhat has a legal activity, but so does every other town in the whole world. Yeah, I mean, that makes him instantly suspicious. Yes. Like, if your loved one is missing the last thing you're going to do is paint them into a criminal so that people are caring less about your loved one.

It's like, what? Even if you have an inkling or a suspicion, you wouldn't do that. Yeah. It's like a guest, Even if you have an inkling or a suspicion, you wouldn't do that. It's like a guest here, but it's interesting. And then there's no evidence, yeah, obviously. It makes no sense. So the authorities, they get heavily involved later on, and they're able to track down the least last known whereabouts in Yunnan, along with two men

that they believed were the main suspects in her potential disappearance, potential murder. Z and C. One was a cop. The other one was an unemployed wannabe military man. Neither of them are hung. So they bring in Z and C. And immediately when confronted about everything, they start opening up. They're like, yeah, she's dead. The two looked calm, proud even. They smirked and they're telling the officers along the lines of, look, we really didn't want to. we had to though

And I I think it's above your pay grade But it's operation Irene if you call the military the special upstream. They'll know what we're talking about No freaking way the police did call the military There was no operation Irene and Z and Z are saying yeah, it's just super secret We're dealing with national security here This is an international spy. We're talking about you deal with traffic tickets. We deal with threats to our country They both wholeheartedly believed military officials would march down into the police station and back them up and thank them shake their hand for taking down a spy

They would be freed and recruited into the military. Wait, so is she a spy? No. She's not a spy? No. The police told them, wake up, Z&C. She's not a spy. No military official is going to walk down into this police

station and save you. No one, Operation Irene, is in your head. But they wholeheartedly believe that. Yes, and they have evidence. They say here, we can give you the guy that commissioned the operation, call him up and he can clear things up. So we'll give you the military man. They show the police their group chat along with the guy's Instagram. It is filled with videos of him training with guns, running running around doing drills And they're like see this guy is special forces. He's in the military

The police don't even know how to respond They didn't know if this was a really bad attempt from Z&C at lying or if they were being serious because they looked down at the Instagram that was presented to them These were not military drills. They were videos of men playing paintball. Or have you heard of real life counterstrike? Counterstrike is a shooter game and it combines it with real life sports like paintball. So you pretend like you're playing counterstrike but in real life using paintball guns. Like a laser tag place basically. Shut the front door. Anyone? Well in China at least, usually once you're of a legal age,

you can most likely go and play real life counter strike. You don't need any sort of knowledge or military background or guns like a regular civilian can go. Sometimes militaries do go as practice, but this is a role-playing game at the end of the day. You're like those celebrities, they play like reality TV show like those, right? It's real life counter strike. So whoever this was was not part of the military,

let alone a special forces agent. Also, he's not even part of the military, let alone a special forces agent. Also, he's not even part of the military. Yeah, and that Instagram was HONGS. HONG was not special ops. He was not part of the military. He was an unemployed college dropout that just had a thing for wearing camo. It was basically his uniform. He was practically invisible. He would wear camo to the grocery store to run errands.

He loved camo. Sometimes he would wear full combat gear, combat boots, combat knee guards, pants. He made it his whole personality. He would have a concept, a whole life story around it. Camo, military, special forces, secrets, fire. He was never ever, not even wants part of the military, but he would convince people, including a police officer.

He convinced a real police officer and another individual that had generations inside of his family that were involved in the military, that he was special ops. So those two are actual police officers? These are not like random civilians, like 15-year-olds that got swept up in an online catfish scenario. No, these are adults. One of them is a police officer. The other one has three generations of military background in his family.

And the girlfriend and the parents. So everyone believed him. Yes, but I think for the girlfriend and the parents, it's, I would believe him. If someone tells me they're a Navy SEAL, I'm not gonna be like, no, you're not. You're totally not, right? Especially if there's so many things

that kind of give me that confirmation bias. I'm like, oh yeah, okay, that's a Navy SEAL. That's not that crazy. There's a lot of Navy SEALs out there. But for the police officer, and for the guy with the military background, I don't know how they were convinced. He would convince them with so much certainty that these two, the cop and the military guy,

would commit murder. That is crazy. I think a lot of netizens were very confused on the fact that he managed to convince these people. He didn't seem particularly convincing of a liar if you knew anything about the special forces You know like I said for Lily and her parents and everybody else. It's a little bit different I mean, what do we really know about the special ops like not much? It's so much easier for me to get tricked into thinking that someone is a CIA agent versus a real FBI agent being fooled by someone posing as a CIA agent

Hong's favorite topics included camouflage? No, really. He talked about camouflage, wearing camouflage. There's a conversation starter for him. Military weapons, military equipment, hand-to-hand combat, boxing guns. I would imagine that this is the type of man that likes to narrate how he would take someone down. Where he's like, then you grab them by the neck, then you throw them down, karate kick them from behind, then you swing your left arm,

and then you punch them square in the jaw, to give you further context to back up that. When he was in college, he wanted to show his friends how to do hand-to-hand combat. And instead of practicing hand-to-hand combat with his friends that he's trying to teach in college, he ends up breaking three school doors because he's like, I'm gonna to hand to hand combat these doors.

He was temporarily suspended. He spent most of his time during suspension, browsing Tau Bao for military goods. That is like browsing Amazon for military gear. Yeah. It was after college he gets introduced to Z and C, and they both thought, this guy knows what he's doing. In their eyes, he was a national hero.

He's mysterious, strong leadership qualities agile. He was probably employee of the month of the Special Ops. That's how these two felt. They would beg him to introduce them to the Special Forces so that they too could become special agents. But Heng said they had to prove themselves first. If Heng called them, the two would rush at the crack of dawn to meet with him on the tracks. Run 10 miles. They would do it. They never questioned the orders. This was

their way of becoming a special agent, which they felt like was a god-given opportunity. This is so silly. These are adults too, yeah. Yeah, they're playing some sort of role-playing game. Yeah. Initially, I would believe this story a lot more if they were like 15-year-olds. Yeah. They're like special forces, and this old adult is like special forces. But they're all adults.

They said that meeting Hong felt like the best blessing to them. Not everyone gets an opportunity like this. Even though Z had three generations of military history in his family, even though Z was a cop, none of them knew anyone in the special forces. And now they could be in the special forces. They felt this was the best thing that ever happened to them. But it's also the thing that's going to get them killed. If Hong told them to do 50 push-ups, they would do 70 trying to impress him. Hong created a group chat for them called the People's Army 8th Corps Special Operations

team. Everyone had to have nicknames in the WeChat because they can't let anyone know their real identities. Hong chose the very inconspicuous name of Boss, very subtle, very non-suspicious. And it was in this group chat that they start hatching up their plan to murder Lily. And this is the part of the case that goes viral because now we're breaking down the case. Hong is not special ops. These two, honestly, like these two parents, they keep trying to argue publicly.

The brainwashing must have been good because my son is a cop and my cops are a very alert of these types of scams and stuff. So Hong must be incredibly intelligent. So they're saying the two people are fully manipulated rather than they're responsible. But a lot of noses don't really believe it because everything from Hong's demeanor and the way that he's carried everything out, it doesn't seem convincing. Doesn't seem that intelligent. No.

Okay. It seems like these two just really wanted to be in the special ops and they just kind of ran with this. It's like they wanted it so bad they allowed to believe it. You're on it. Allow themselves to believe it. There was no critical thinking skills applied on this. Yeah, I don't think they're the victim of a scam. Exactly. Okay, because their parents kind of make it seem like their victims of a scam. They literally brutally snapped a woman's neck. So we're breaking it seem like their victims of a scam. They literally brutally Snapped a woman's neck. So we're breaking it down. Hong is not special forces. These two are killers. So is Hong Why if she's not a spy? Why would she have to die? That's the part that all the netizens were like wait a minute. We still have so many questions

I mean these three guys sound like they're badly written fictional characters But what about Lily like genuinely what is the motive here? There's no motive. Amused New Year's Day kiss in 20 minutes is the motive. Let me explain. Hong was quickly arrested, so we're Z&C, so all of them are sitting in the interrogation room, separate interrogation rooms, and when Hong was asked, why would you even want them to kill your girlfriend? That to us doesn't make sense. Like, why would you want something like this? He said the plan started New Year's Day 2020. He had been dating Lily for about a month

and it was New Year's Day. Lily and some of Hong's friends came over to his place. This is before they're living together. But for some strange inexplicable reason, without explanation, Lily left the room right before the New Year's Day countdown. So it's like, you know, to midnight, it's like, five, four, three, that really pissed him off. Whether he was expecting some before the New Year's Day countdown. So it's like, you know, to midnight, it's like, five, four, three.

That really pissed him off. Whether he was expecting some sort of New Year's kiss or he felt embarrassed in front of his runs or it hurt his feelings, I don't know. But this was the moment that he felt like this girl kind of deserves to die. That's just out of this world. I... I tried to research the psychology of something like this. I don't know.

Maybe it's like he feels disrespected like one of those. Yes. The only thing that I can see is he felt emasculated by this that she didn't either alert him or get his permission to leave. And you know what? I think a lot of the fact that he wants to be a special op with these two minions is he wants the sense of being power respected look up to just the fact that she left really that's the reason yeah wow like yeah Yeah, what is this? I mean the only thing that we can think of because this man goes out of his way now

To not even just cut her off to continue dating her when he already wants to kill her, he has her move in, dates her for many, many more months, just so he can kill her. Netizens commented on his motive and they just commented, question mark, question mark, because none of it makes sense. It doesn't even make sense. That's dangerous. Psychologically, like that kind of motive is so dangerous, right? This reminds me of the Pooh San Rantau's kick. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But this one's even worse because he waits five months. And gets closer together. Getting to know

her more, seeing more the human side of her, you would imagine that more connection is being built. He has five months to not do this, but he planned out this for five months. An all-new original series. You grew up in crime scenes and you think this is one, too. It's not. Storing of a gory, Rhythm Ireland, and Clive Owen. I think the cover is a damn here. Why is it wherever you go? Death follows. FX's, her murder at the end of the world. Streaming November 14th, only on Disney+. Sign up today for 799 a month with ads.

Now streaming on Paramount Plus. Hey baby, I hear the blues. It's calling, toss salads and scrambled eggs. You all know how this goes. And maybe I seem a bit confused. Yeah, maybe. But I got you picked. But I don't know what to do with those tall salads and scrambled eggs.

Kelsey Grammer returns in Frazier. Life's calling again. New series now streaming on Paramount Plus. Well, there's another thing, okay? I don't know if he mentioned it, but it was kind of interpreted by a lot of people that once they moved in, he was on and off about, do I kill her or do I not kill her? Until April 2020, another incident takes place. Lily asked her if he could pick her up from work at the end of her shift. He agreed, but when he showed up, she wasn't downstairs waiting for him,

and so he texted her and she let him know it's going to take another five minutes because work isn't letting her go, which is very understandable. He felt like it's very annoying, but it's fine But she doesn't come down for another 25 minutes 25 minutes He believed that she had done something vile during those 25 minutes like maybe go and sleep with her boss or something All the while he's just waiting downstairs for her, like a stupid boyfriend. It was after this incident that he immediately went home to text the eighth core of the Special Forces team and stated that he discovered his girlfriend Lily was a secret agent from

an enemy country. That she was in here tasked with infiltrating his life because he's a Special Ops Force agent, stealing national secrets and bezzling public funds from China and endangering national security. She had to be eliminated. The three of them started referring to Lily as Fox, the one that they needed to kill and the operation for the murder was named Operation Irene. Hong would lure out the Fox to the mountains of Yunnan, where ZNC would be waiting for her. He would stay back in Nanjing

because he was the one with the connection to Lily. So he's making it seem like, you know, I still can't be seen in that town because I can't get arrested. The cops and the special officers, they run different circles. The cops, they be fighting regular criminals. Special officers, they're killing agents and no one even knows.

And you know, once the police get involved, then the military is going to be upset because now it's become messier. It can be public and everything we do is not public and please don't know how to shut their mouths, right? So that's why I got to stay back and nunging you guys have to go kill Lily. And because Lily believed he was special ops, she did not call him. She waited for his instructions which was to follow the light up the mountain to the safe house.

And then she was murdered. Lily's dad has a very interesting request for the trial. He wanted it to be live-streamed. Lily's dad said, I don't want a clothes trial. I want this to be broadcasted to the country. He was worried about potential of bribery and corruption. He wanted to make sure that everyone could see every single part of the trial to see where it went wrong if it did. Which I think it's the first

time we've talked about a case in China that the family's victims specifically requested the case to be live streamed, but it does make a lot of sense. So one thing that Hong did not lie about is that his dad does work for the government. He held a high position in the judicial bureau of Nanjing and he did try to intervene to help his son get off easier. He went ahead, called Lily's dad directly to see if they could find some common ground. Father to father.

He said, hello, Mr. Li Shang, I'm Heng's father. This matter has been going on for quite some time, and as parents, we are not happy about it either. We're also not clear about what really happened. Recently, we've gathered some new funds from a few sources. We're not sure if you can accept it, as a parent myself, I just want to talk to you about it. Basically saying, we will provide compensation.

Do you want to take it? Lily's dad said, I don't think that's necessary. Oh, sure, well, let's talk about it. Anyway, the weather's hot again, and there's still the pandemic going on. Working and nudging right now, the work pressure must be quite high for you guys. I'm just about to finish work and leave my office

and I'm thinking, this is something, right? I checked your account in the group, and I see that you guys are all anxious over there. Actually, if we put ourselves in each other's shoes, we could empathize with each other. I understand how you feel and I just want to talk to you about it. However, for me, I'm still willing to do something and to try and communicate with you, whether it's expressing remorse, trying to make amends, or whatever. After all, the incident has already happened and we can't change that.

We're all feeling quite uneasy about it. So about this matter, I hope you can give me a chance to meet and chat with you. I guess that's the idea of my phone call. Lily's dad said we'll see. He was just annoyed, like the whole tone of Hong's dad's voice was he's trying to close some sort of business here. Like wrap up some loose ends,

he talked about the murder as if it's just an inconvenience I could be self with money. He did not have any remorse in his voice at all. In the end, Lily's dad was offered $1,000,000, which is around $140,000. And yes, it's a lot of money, it's life-changing money, but it's really not. Like it's really not. Lily is gone. Lily's dad is a regular corporate employee.

Her mom worked at a kindergarten. They didn't have much, and all they had was Lily. She was the only child, and they spent every second of their lives talking about, thinking about, wondering how to be good parents so that Lily can grow up to be a good person. Lots of people said that she was very spoiled, but not in the way that you think. She was spoiled with a lot of attention and care. And people said that was the reason that she grew up to be a very responsible kind woman.

I mean, just look at what she's accomplished for her career already without even starting as a flight attendant. She went to college in Nanjing an hour away from her hometown, but she would come back every major holiday if her grandparents, if her uncle, aunt got sick, she is on the first train back. She would sit there and clip her grandparents' toenails for them because they can't do it

on their own. She wasn't doing well financially. She just graduated college. It's the pandemic. She doesn't have a job, but she's working all these random part-time jobs. She never came home empty-handed. Her arms filled with fruits, teas, clothes, and Lily's parents felt insulted at home

and his parents that even thinking that money right now was gonna make up for Lily being gone, and they knew the annoying thing is, they knew in cases like this, if they take any form of compensation from the perpetrators, the judge goes easier on their sentencing. So even when they spent $30,000 of money that they do not have,

just to get through and travel back and forth from the town that the trial was being held at, hotel costs, attorney costs, back and forth investigations, they refused to take a single cent from the killers. They just wanted justice. Honestly, they just wanted Hong to die. They were quite vocal about pushing for the death penalty for Hong and the two others. Lily's dad said, I hope Hong will be sentenced to death. I will never give up on this.

If we can achieve this goal, I will continue to fight, and I have the confidence to keep fighting no matter how long it takes. Yeah. You know, I'm sure we all have our own opinions about the death penalty, but I think we can all at least try and see where he's coming from. Like, it's just the pain of that. This is how he feels he will get closure

and justice. Finally, July 2022, two years after the murder, Hong was sentenced to death. And the other two defendants, Z and C, were given suspended death sentencesis. May 7th, 2023, Hong was executed after multiple attempts to appeal his desensis, and the other two are now currently awaiting on death row. Lily was given a proper burial, and her dad said, I shouldn't have been the one to choose her grave site. How can that be something apparent to sites? We should never have to make that choice for our kids. He went on to say, I just want to say to my daughter, as her parents, these two years have not been wasted. It may not sound pleasant, but we haven't let our daughter down for the 22 years that she was with us.

And that afternoon, the parents went to go visit the mountain where Lily was last alive. They brought her flowers and a bucket of KFC because that was her favorite. And that is the story of Lily and the very bizarre psychology of three killers. What are your thoughts? Do you think that Z&C also deserve the death penalty? Do you think that they're just as guilty? Do you think it's easy for them to be convinced? Let me know in the comments. Please stay safe and I will see you guys on Wednesday for the main episode. Bye.