Rotten Mango - #51: The Architect’s Almost Perfect Murder (Case Elaine O'Hara)

Episode Date: March 31, 2021

Two friends go fishing - instead of fish they catch: BDSM leather masks, ropes, handcuffs, knives, and bondage equipment. Could this be the aftermath of a really crazy party? OR was it something more sinister? A case filled with intimate text messages between the killer and victim, bloodlust, and a raging psychopath. Source Notes: rottenmangopodcast.com To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Rambles. Whether you're doing a dance to your favorite artist in the office parking lot, or being guided into Warrior I in the break room before your shift, whether you're running on your Peloton tread at your mom's house while she watches the baby, or counting your breaths on the subway. Peloton is for all of us, wherever we are, whenever we need it. Download the free Peloton is for all of us. Wherever we are, whenever we need it. Download the free Peloton app today. Peloton app available through free tier or pay to description starting at 12.99 per month. Butterbing Butter Boom.

Butterbing Butter Boom. This is going to be a story where just when you thought, you little thought I'm kidding, just when you thought you understood the story, something weird happens and then it gets even weirder and then we read a bunch of text messages which makes this feel so. Everything is just gonna be confusing. We're talking about kinks, BDSM, and murder, all in one, and I just need to put a quick disclaimer real quick. BDSM has nothing to do with crime, has nothing to do with predators, has nothing to do with psychopaths, with evil people. No, it is just a place where two consenting adults do things to each other that they both nothing to do with psychopaths with evil people. No, it is just a place where two consenting adults do things to each other that they both want to do, both enjoy, and as long

as they do it within the legal boundaries and in the privacy of their own home and not, you know, target aisle four, it doesn't bother me, okay. I love the BDS community, I think most of the people apart of it are really, really chill. I don't know every single one that's a part of it But I know most of them I'm kidding So this has nothing to do with that but because we're combining BDSM and it's heavily prevalent in this murder case I just need to put that out there. Let's talk about Elaine O'Hara This has been a requested case on my YouTube channel and there is just no way that I could have told you The things I'm about

to tell you on YouTube without that video being deleted in point two seconds by the platform because it gets really intense. So Elena Hara, her childhood, this is where we have to start because it's so important to the entirety of this story. She was born into an upper middle class family and she lived in Ireland by the way. So she lived in the affluent suburbs near Dublin she attended this private school and her entire family life was really happy she was really close with her mom in particular who was a teacher and she had always wanted to be like her mom I mean that's the

one thing with a lane that's really important she loves children she loves children so much and she wanted to be a teacher when she grows up now when she's young she gets diagnosed with a couple of different things. She gets diagnosed with dyslexia, asthma, diabetes, and she had a lot of self-esteem issues from this. She got bullied at school. They were like, oh my god. Look at her carrying around an inhaler.

Kids are freaking rude. And then almost soon after this, she lost a best friend to a car accident, so then she was dealing with a lot of anxiety, a lot of depression, and by the time that Elaine was 16 years old, she started self-harming. So she had a suicide attempt by 16 and she had cut her wrist. So over the next, the rest of her life, really, she will be kind of in and out of these mental institutions as a patient.

She will continually go to her therapist and that's the one thing with Elaine. Like no matter what she will literally stay months in a hospital as an inpatient and then get out and just give life a go again. Like she has never defeated she's like no I'm gonna I'm gonna try it again this time she will literally keep on keep on and keep on trying So she had multiple diagnosis over the years But I'm the main one that comes into question was her borderline personality disorder that she was dealing with She had a lot of suicidal ideologies. She was incredibly depressed

And this is all really pertinent to the story But like I said she would get out of that hospital and she would try again She tried joining clubs. She picked up on hobbies. She did squash sailing and none of them really stuck But I think it's so admirable that she kept trying outside of that She was just a super loving caring person one of her siblings had a daughter Which is her niece and her she also her goddaughter and she loved her so much This was like one of the most important people to her life She had always wanted children

But she knew that she was not in a place to be a mom like that's how amazing this person is She's like I know that this kid's not gonna get the best of the world if I am having these types of thoughts So she starts working really hard. She was a classroom assistant She was part-time working at a new agency studying at night to become a teacher just like her mom So you're thinking okay life's getting on track and then in 2002 Elaine's mom passes away So she is just devastated. She starts self-harming again And she is admitted into another hospital and her doctor that was treating her for most of this he passes away So it was just like incident after incident,

and so she gets this new psychiatrist, and around this time is when she starts disclosing to this psychiatrist that she really just has this crazy fantasy, and she wants to be tied up. She just wants to be tied up and held captive. She wants someone to just tire up, not letter out, make every decision for her. She hates making decisions

And this seemed to be like a direct reflection of what Elaine hated in life Like she every little decision that she had to make was very anxiety inducing she would second-guess herself She was that confident when she's saying it as that's her sexual fantasy or yeah, okay, but she I mean it definitely wasn't like Oh, I'm just gonna go call up some kidnappers in the local area She was just saying I I found this new outlet for these types of things like I just want to I want to do this in my sexual life And her fantasy or her therapist started taking note of that now August 2012 She had just recently gotten Discharged from a hospital. She was there for another attempted suicide and

She was really in good spirits her doctor another attempted suicide and she was really in good spirits. Her doctor let her out because she was actually that good in spirits. Like she was jumping up and down, she was like, I can't wait. I actually want to go do this festival thing that I got planned. It's called the Tall Ships Festival. I looked it up because I was like, is this some sort of BDS? I'm festival that I don't know about, like, Tall Ships. What does that mean?

Looked into it, dead ass just about ships ships has nothing to do with that type of ship. If you know what I mean. So she's like, yeah, I really want to go to this festival. I can take time off of work. I can volunteer like I can help with one of these stands at this festival. It's gonna be so much fun. Oh my gosh, I'm excited. So her doctor was like, you seem to be doing really well. So I'm gonna let you out. We're still gonna talk all the time. So have fun. Go do your thing. So she gets discharged August 2012. Now the day before the festival, she calls her dad. And she's like, Hey, dad, what are you doing tonight? Let's go to mom's grave. So he's like, Oh, yeah, that sounds good. And so he meets

her at the grave. And the cemetery that we're talking about is really important to the story later. But it's, um, it's a really beautiful place. So it's a cemetery that's on top of a cliff side. So there's a lot of cliffs nearby that just kind of drop down into these rocky waters, very beautiful scenery, there's some parks where a lot of people will drive there just to jog around. I mean absolutely beautiful. So they go there together and again her dad says, wow she's anirits. I mean she's just so happy. She keeps talking about this tall ship's festival and the dad's girlfriend had actually arranged to drive a lane tomorrow morning So she's like okay dad like your girlfriend. She loves she's gonna drop me off right and he's like yeah She's so excited to see you tomorrow. So they go place fresh flowers on the mom's grave and the only complaint That Elaine's dad had because the rest of it went so well. I mean she seemed happy, healthy, she was excited.

It's the fact that she was kind of on her phone a little bit, like she was texting someone, she was a little distracted, he's like alright let's put that phone away Elaine, like get on your phone when you get home, we're here to spend some time together, like take in the scenery, look at that, look at the water, come on Elaine, let's enjoy this. That was his only complaint. They get a little ice cream together and she's like, I gotta go home.

It's like 5 p.m. I need to go and get a sleep early because tomorrow your girlfriend's picking me up and I'm going to the tall ship fest. I'm excited. So he drops her off at her apartment, which by the way, her girlfriend lived in the same apartment block.

So she, her name's Sheila, but I don't know if that's important. The father's girlfriend in the same like apartment block. So she her name Sheila but I don't know if that's important. The father's girlfriend living the same apartment block. Yeah yeah yeah yeah. And so that night you know Sheila she's driving home and she sees that Elaine's lights are off. This is the dad's girlfriend and she's like oh well she's probably sleeping in so that she can wake up tomorrow for the tall ship's festival and she texted Elaine that night when she got off work saying hey we're still on for 7.15ips festival and she texted Elaine that night when she got off work saying, hey, we're still on for 7.15 am, right? And she didn't get a response, which she didn't think anything weird of, because, you know, she's sleeping her lights are off. Why wouldn't she?

The following morning, she's supposed to meet her at Sheila's car, because they live in the same apartment block, but she just doesn't show up. So she left, she's like, all right, she probably slept and she's, you know, passed out. Let me go up to her apartment. So she starts knocking on the door. No answer. She starts calling her. No answer. OK, well, I mean, Sheila's got to go to work. Her plan was to drop her off at the festival

and then head to work. So I mean, what do I do? She calls Elaine's dad and says, hey babe, I don't know what to do. Elaine's not coming down. Should I just go back to work? Like, what do I do? She says, yeah, it's fine. I'm sure if she really wants, she can get another ride. Maybe she can

get like a taxi situation. I mean, she's 36 years old. Come on. It's going to be okay. So Sheila goes to work and everything is just resolved for the day. Nobody really tries to contact her. They just kind of think that she made her way to the tall ship festival. Now at night, the dad comes home and he starts calling her texting her and even text her, are you alive? Like hello, come on, text me back. And the next morning, he's still hadn't gotten a response to any of that. So it's okay because, you know, the whole day, he's expecting her to be at the festival somehow.

So I mean, it's not that alarming, but the next morning, there's still no response. So he gets his spare key into Elaine's apartment and opens the door and everything is completely normal. There are no signs of a break in, there's no blood, there's nothing. And I, okay, side note, I can't even imagine the fear he was feeling, especially with Elaine having these attempted suicides, just going through the rooms of her apartment, just like, like my, yeah, my heart's getting all bunched up right now, just thinking about it. But thankfully, there was no signs of a break in,

no signs of blood, but there was no signs of a lane. And what made it even more alarming was that her iPhone was charging on the table, her phone, the same phone that she just like wouldn't get off of the other day at the grave, she's just on the table. Why would she leave without it? This doesn't make any sense.

So he starts freaking out. He calls the tall ship's festival. And he asks, have you guys seen my daughter? Have you guys seen my daughter? She was volunteering. She was working this stand. She talked to me about it all day. And they're like, oh, she didn't show up.

She was a no-show. He's like, what? She didn't cut, she didn't, okay. So she wasn't at the festival all day. So he immediately calls the psychiatric hospital. Maybe she had turned herself in, what? She didn't cut, she didn't, okay, so she wasn't at the festival all day. So he immediately calls the psychiatric hospital. Maybe she had turned herself in, right? Well, admitted to herself, I guess. And they said, no, we haven't heard anything.

And she didn't have an appointment. So yeah, nothing was weird here. So he immediately goes to the police station and reports her missing. And they start searching her place immediately. They find a couple of strange items. So like I said, there was no signs of a break in, no signs of a third party trying to get into our place, but they did find some BDSM stuff. They found this rubber outfit that was like head to toe rubber, commonly associated with BDSM, lots of

lubricants, chains, printouts of hunting knives, a notebook of websites that were her logins to really, really extreme BDSM websites, like incredibly extreme ones. And the police, they take in her iPhone, they take in her two laptops, and they find some super hardcore messages from a man by the name of Sirge SIR. And it's talking about bloodletting, which is the withdrawal of blood from someone, stabbing like a stabbing king like knife play. There was, I mean, it's really serious stuff. I think most of the BDSM community aren't even into this extremes. I also wonder what are like the legal ramifications of being into knife play. Like, let's say if both people are into it, this is like the cannibal situation, right?

Right. Like, like, you're talking about like, hey, please eat me. Yeah, but I mean, I get that, like, that one's a little different. Okay, so let's say you're talking about like, hey, please eat me. Yeah, but I mean, I get that, like that one's a little different. Okay, so let's say you're a cannibal and you eat a chunk of my thigh. I'm not hospitalized. I don't press charges. Could you still be arrested for that? I wonder, because technically it is assault, but if I consent, it's like punch me in the face.

I don't know, it's complex. So she was really into knife play. And the conversation that she had with this specific person, which is, you know, the police, they're going off of anything they can. They're just trying to find any suspects. What happened to Elaine? Did she run off with someone? And these conversations of knife play ended months before she went missing. So it didn't seem like she was talking to anyone right now. So that's not the person that she was texting? Yeah, it didn't seem like it.

They weren't texting for like months. So they couldn't find out who was she talking to. Is she talking to anyone? Is there someone who would know where she is other than her dad? So they start going to her workplace. They start asking her friends, her coworkers. And they all said that, yeah, I mean,

she was really into BDSM. She would tell them that she's having this affair with a married man and she would show off these cuts on her body. And she would like lift up her shirt and she had these knife markings on her stomach and when I say knife markings, they weren't like paper cuts I'm talking like they were serious wounds that would leave scars. Like these are damaging wounds. And she said that this married man that she's having an affair with inflicted

them on her. And it was super consensual. She's just like really into this extreme BDSM scene. And that's what they were saying. That's considered legal. That's what I'm saying. I don't know. And she would also mention that he likes to time me up and masturbate over me. And it was just kind of really shocking stuff. Now, side note, part of her mental illness, something that her family was very open about with the investigators, was that she would do a lot of shocking things. She would do things in the middle of fights where she will blurt out random, very off the bar, off the topic, crazy things.

And people always thought, maybe their lies, maybe she's doing this to end this conversation. Like to say something so incredibly shocking that the person that she's doing this to end this conversation, like to say something so incredibly shocking that the person that she's having this argument with will just have no idea how to respond. Like she had mentioned to her dad that she likes to be tied up and like all of these things in the middle of like a regular conversation, like an argument a couple years ago.

So the dad doesn't know that this is actually happening. Yeah, so he's like, I mean, I don't know. She mentioned this, but she didn't mention it in a way that was like, hey, dad, let's just talk. It was out of nowhere in the middle of a fight with heightened emotions. And sometimes, you know, some of the things she would say weren't necessarily true.

So she would say these outrageous comments. So the police are like, all right, well, let's just look at the CCTV from the apartment building. They get it. She arrives home from the the cemetery the day that her dad dropped off her dad is seen at her door Then he leaves and then almost immediately after Elaine is seen leaving out of the apartment elevator as well She was wearing this navy blue tracksuit bottoms this blue hoodie and then they start pulling all the street cameras Which like by the way Ireland amazing what the heck? I don't understand.

In America, we have one situation and the CCTV footage is filmed off of a potato and recorded it over in 0.2 seconds and you'll never get that footage back. But Ireland, they're like, yeah, we've got it all. So they start searching all of the street cameras and they see her driving in her car, leaving by herself of her own free will. But when they zoom into that picture, she has a phone in her hand. But it's not her phone. Because her phone's at home.

So what is this phone that nobody knows about her dad's like, no, she didn't have two phones, she's got one phone. Why would she have two phones? She's not like an FBI agent. What's going on? Why did she have two phones? They don't know where that phone is now, and they don't know why she has a second phone. So they start searching, okay, well, if she went in this direction,

where do you think she could have gone? We need to try to find her car. We need to try to find her phone because her car is not here. We need to do all of that. So they start looking looking and they head back to the gravesite, the cemetery, and they find her car there. Now, her car was unlocked. Inside Inside they found her cigarettes, her lighter, a charger for a phone that wasn't her iPhone. So they think, okay, like this is probably the phone that she was using in the car. And it looked like it was like a Nokia phone, like a Nokia.

And this is where people started really getting panicked when they found her car at the cemetery, because this is where her mother is buried. And there's a lot of cliffs. There are so many cliffs and it's steep rocky waters nearby. And so people start thinking, I mean the investigators are thinking, did she take her life? Is that what happened? Did people think that she was okay, but maybe something triggered her? Maybe something set her off within that couple of hours, and this is what she decided to do. So they start interviewing anyone that was at this park because like I said, it's a beautiful place. There's a park nearby, joggers are here, and there was a guy who was jogging who saw a picture of her and was like, oh my god, yes, no, I remember her. I saw her that day,

and she stopped and asked me for directions to a bridge somewhere and so I told her, oh, it's that way through that trail, you'll get to the bridge, it's like overlooking the lake, okay, and when I did a circle, I did a circle, I did a lap, and when I was jogging back, I saw her again, but this time she seemed really distracted. She seemed really like distant. She didn't even notice me pass by after we had just had a conversation not too long ago, and she just seemed like she was in a different head space, and he was the last person to see her alive. So now they're thinking, oh my god, okay, this kind of lines up, she left her car, she's in this headspace where she's, you know, thinking into deep thoughts,

maybe she did commit suicide. So they start sending these helicopters, they had search teams, search teams, the coast card gets involved, and they search for so long and they cannot find her body anywhere. And the medical records, I mean, they painted this picture of someone who was incredibly troubled. She had attempted to take her life on three different occasions. She was hospitalized over 14 times, sometimes for months at a time, and she had always struggled with mental health. And it was kind of widely accepted by not only her family members, but also with the investigators

that maybe she did commit suicide. There was no evidence to suggest otherwise. There was no break in. There was no ransom note. There was nothing. But there was also no evidence to suggest it was a suicide. So if she had fallen into the waters, you would think that eventually, I mean, something would float, something would drift ashore, maybe not her, but maybe a shirt, maybe some

pants, something, but they didn't find anything. They didn't necessarily close the case, but it just wasn't the top priority anymore. And I don't think the family, they too, they were just trying to come to terms with, was there something I could have done to not, you know, to have helped her that day. I thought she was happy.

Maybe I shouldn't have thought that. Maybe I should have stayed longer. I mean, I'm sure there was, with any case of suicide, I'm sure there was a lot of blame and grief with the family members themselves. So it just kind of settled for the next year. Nobody was really like, oh my god, we need to find her right now. It was just a lot of emotions with the family. The investigators there, doing their own thing with all these other cases that were homicides. And then a year later, everything comes crashing down. Like all at once, which is, which is the weird thing about

this case, because you would think that the past year, if there was any evidence to be found, maybe you'd find a little bit here, a little bit within a couple months, and then maybe a little bit there, but you have two separate case opening mind-boggling discoveries at the same time by two different police teams. I know that feeling all too well. The one where someone cracks the best joke ever and you want to smile. You want to laugh. You want to show them all of your teeth to tell them, hey, I like your joke. But then you stop yourself.

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So with Candid, you have the same orthodontist, which I love this part, who creates your plan is with you from start to finish, so you never have to wonder about, is this going the right way? Like, is everything okay? The average Candid treatment is just six months, so you start seeing results way before then,

and it costs thousands less than traditional braces. Right now, you can save $75 on Candid's starter kit. Go to Candid CO.com slash rotten and use code rotten. That's Candid CO.com slash rotten. Code rotten. Take advantage of this limited time offer to save $75 on your starter kit. Candid CO.com slash rotten. Code rotten for the people in the back. So we're going to start with two guys that decided to go fishing. They're not really important to the story. They just happened to live in the nearby area.

They started going fishing near by the bridge off the cemetery. Remember the one overlooking the lake that Elaine was looking for? Well, they decided to go to that bridge. They're like, let's go fishing. So they grabbed their little flushing fishing hooks and they start fishing. And this is September of 2013. It had been a really hot summer. The waters were low. There was no fish. They're getting frustrated. They're like, come on. We were here to catch some game. We're not getting anything. They keep looking over the bridge to see how is there no fish in the water. Like this is kind of insane. And that's when they start seeing some things in the water.

They're like, wait, what is that over there? That looks like, is that rope? Is that like some sort of net or something? And then they see something shiny. And they kind of ignore it, but then they get more curious. I mean, they're bored. They're like drinking their beers. They were here to catch some fish.

And now there's just some random shenanigans in the water. So they start trying to hook those items into the bridge. Like, let's just see what's there. So at first, it's super normal stuff at the beginning. A girl's white shirt, a blue jacket, things that you would think. It's been normal. I mean, I feel like I grew up around creeks and lakes. And you kind of see those things because kids when they're playing, they're like, it's all

let me take off my jacket. And then they just leave their jacket and then their mom is like, that, I just bought you that jacket. So they just got some clothes. Just some clothes, and it wasn't like underwear or anything. It was like just outerwear, maybe you went for a swim, and there was also the next thing they get is a little more alarming.

A yellow rope with handcuffs attached. Okay, a little bit alarming, but I'm not calling the cops yet, and then it gets more intense. Suddenly, they're still pulling up these leg restraints, these leather straps, a leather gag, you know, one of those pieces that you would put over your head. It looks like a belt, but it's super complicated all over your face. And it has this ball gag that you would put into your mouth so that you can't talk.

And it would be, you just have to like control your breath. Wow, do I act, why am I acting like I know what that is? You're picturing it, aren't you? Yeah, like the BDSM. Yes. And then the next thing that they pull up is a little more advanced version of that. It's a full leather mask with no eye holes,

no nose holes, just a zipper to open where the mouth would be. Oh, okay. So very intense. They pull this up and the two dudes are looking at each other just a zipper to open with a mouse with B. Okay. So very intense. They pull this up and the two dudes are looking at each other like, this is kind of crazy, right? I mean, this is insane. And they start kind of laughing and they leave it at the bridge. They decide we're not going to call the police.

We're not going to take these home. It seemed like it was like a stag party. So in America it would be like a bachelor party. They're like, they probably bought all these things. They thought I was like, he-he-ha-ha joke. And then maybe they're drunk. They threw it over the bridge. He-he-ha-ha. Now the two friends, they go home and they don't think about it. They leave everything

on the bridge that they had just fished out of there. And one of those friends, they just couldn't sleep that night. I mean they just keep thinking, none of that stuff seemed like something you would get at party city or even like a sex shop. It seemed really professional almost. It seemed like intense BDSM gear, which doesn't make sense because if you're into BDSM and you do this at home, why would you throw it away? And if you were gonna throw it away,

you would just put it in your trash. Why would you drive to this lake and then throw it over into the water? That doesn't make any sense to him. And so he keeps thinking about it. So the next morning, immediately, he rushes to the police station and he turns and everything to the police He goes to the bridge and brings it to the police station, right and the police officer takes those items in and he goes home that night And he too he can't stop thinking about it. He's like, I mean it is weird

Why didn't they just why would you put them in the reservoir? Why wouldn't you just throw them into your trash can? And these look like pricey items. Like I said, they don't look like they got them off party, party city. Side note, party city is freaking expensive for no reason. So you go what I'm saying. It just doesn't look like cheap stuff. So the next day the officer goes back to the lake and he starts trying to like dig around in the water.

And around the time that he came, the water is no longer clear. The winds had changed. All of that silt at the bottom of the lake had just risen up and it's super murky. He can't see anything. So he doesn't even know what he's looking for, but he's just like sticking his arms in, just he's just trying to find something. So he keeps going back on multiple different occasions. And finally, the third time that he went back, he starts finding some things. Now at the same time, 12 miles away. There's another development happening. So there's this woman.

Her name is Magali, and she's owning this dog walking training business, and she has this setup with the local landowners of the Dublin Mountains that, hey, you can come and walk the dogs on the mountainside, because it's just like a wildlife area. It's not necessarily a farm. it's not necessarily usable space, it's just heavily wooded, like you see deer all the time, it's isolated, it's rural, so they have no problem with her walking all the dogs out there, so she was walking her little dog and she sees that her dog is running back with this bone in her mouth. Just like, okay, well this is like completely normal, my dog does this all the time, so she

takes the bone out of her dog's mouth and it's like an animal bone she thinks and places it on a pile of rocks and just walks back home. So then a few days later, she goes back into the woods with her dog and her dog just runs off into the woods and she's like, oh my god, Millie, you need to stop doing that. So after some time, she starts calling for her dog

like we gotta go home, come on, come on, let's go. Now her dog is who is usually really well trained isn't coming back So she's like with that so she goes into the woods and starts calling for her dog and she starts Millie, Millie and she finds her dog finally and she's like Millie, what are you doing? And she looks down and her dog is chomping on what looks like a leg bone So she's like, cut another bone? I mean, these deer's are out here just killing each other. It's a deer-eat-deer world. So she takes the bone out and as she's trying to toss it onto the ground, she sees a bunch of other bones scattered on the floor. She's like, okay, that's weird. It kind of looks like a vertebrae.

There's a lot of bones. Definitely could be an animal, for sure. You know, that's not abnormal in these dense woods, but for some reason something was creeping around. Like for some reason, she just had this instinct, like the hair on the back of her neck was standing up and she was like, I just, I gotta get out of here. She feels like it's a human. She feels like it's a human. And I think maybe part of the reason is that this is within the Ireland's vanishing triangle,

which is a fascinating case. So within the span of six years, in this 80 mile area, in the Dublin Mountains, so I mean, dense woods, eight women just vanished. Eight women that were in similar age groups, they just vanished while they were doing everyday normal things. One of them went to a bar, she just vanished completely

off the face of the earth. They had large-scale searches, press were all over this, and still it's unsolved. All of their disappearances, all of their potential murders. It's speculated that there was an active serial killer, but it's just, it's weird. So maybe- It sounds like a serial killer, right?

So maybe that's why she was like, oh, maybe it's not. Like maybe it's one of those women. I'm sure she had that instinct of like, I thought this on the news all the time. Like what's going on? So she rushes back to one of the landowners and it's like, hell, hell, like I need help. I think I found a human.

I don't know what it is. It's just really creepy. So he's like, all right, it's probably no big deal calm down. And he walks back to the same spot with her. And this time around, not only do they see just the pile of bones on the ground but they look over and in the distant area they see a woman's tracksuit like clothing and they see a sneaker. Again, okay let's not freak out because sometimes people come into the woods and they

do crazy stuff you know. When you're a teenager maybe you go into the woods and make out with people and take off your tracksuit bottoms. It's not the first time people would you go into the woods and make out with people and take off your tracksuit bottoms It's not the first time people would find clothing in the woods, but they start looking around some more and they freak out when they find the bottom of a human job bone Which is very different from animal job bones Now you would think okay call the police. Well, they don't get self-service So they can't get that I Well, they don't get self service.

So they can't get, I know. So they can't get any signal. So all of them just have to run all the way back to the landowner's house to use the landline to call the police. Now, once the police arrive, they rush them straight back to where they just were with all of the bones. And the police know that they've got their work cut out for them.

I mean, this is going to be a crazy case. They had to handle this crime scene with expert precision because, like I mentioned, the media was going to be in hysterics, which they were because they were thinking the vanishing triangle. What if it's one of these missing girls? Will this super long unsolved mystery finally have some closure? I mean, people, the press, they were going crazy. So they're like we got to make sure that we cross all of our teeth, dot all of our eyes because if we fork up on any of this,

it's just going to be blown all over probably international news. So the actual crime scene itself, the bones were scattered through a large area and the remains were there for what seemed like a long time. I mean they thought maybe over a year year at least. There was no decomposition. It was just straight up the dry bones. They were able to collect over 65% of a full skeleton. So 65% of someone's body. And it seemed like this person was laying on their back when they had died. And they wrapped everything up into evidence bags. They brought them in to be on top seat. And when you have such a...

When you just have a skeleton, you're not going to find the cause of death, you're not really going to find much. Just using the bones, they were able to determine that this was a female aged 27 to 40. So you don't have any flesh, you don't have a face, you don't have anything, and she was in the mountains for at least a year. That's all they really have. So the police immediately, they start going through the database. They're like, we need to look for any women who went missing in the last year or two years and they're not

closed cases that need to be around 27 to 40 years old. And they get a hit. They can't stop thinking about her. Elaine O'Hara. She went missing when she was 36 years old. She went missing last year, and she was presumed to have committed suicide and probably drowned is what they thought, right? The police and her family thought that she had taken her own lives. So they pull her dental records and they give it to the technicians, and it was a match to the remains. Now, this suddenly does not look like a suicide. This looks like a homicide. I mean, she was stripped of her clothing.

This was a 12-mile drive from the cemetery. It doesn't make sense. Her car is left at the cemetery. I mean, what? So the police are like, okay, we need to open this case again. What the forks going on. They're updating the case files. They're doing all of that, Jazz.

Now, at the same time, the, they're updating the case files, they're doing all of that jazz. Now at the same time, the police officer who's going into the lake, he has no idea that any of this is happening. I mean, maybe he's heard about it with his colleagues, but he has no idea that he's about to get involved. So he starts sticking his hands in to the murky waters and he starts pulling out more stuff and he finds two more gags, handcuffs, a key, another leather mask, two different knives, an inhaler, a rallying nazasma, a chain with a ring on it, and he also digs out a Dunstor loyalty

card. So it's like a huge chain in Ireland. Someone's going to get mad because I don't know for sure, but I would say maybe it's like a target, so they sell food, clothes, and home goods, and it's huge. And it was attached to this key ring so he calls up the store. He's like, hey, I've got this loyalty card number. Can I give it to you? Do you know who it's registered under? And they say, oh yeah, that belongs to Alain O'Hara. Oh my god. So he's like, what? He looks her up in the system, turns out she went missing over a year ago. And as he's trying to update the notes of like I found her loyalty card at this lake, he starts looking and he's like, wait a minute, they just,

a different police force just found her body around 12 miles away. This is bizarre. And like this is what I'm saying, like people were saying this is a lane trying to do something. And I'm not a really paranormal person, but just like this crazy coincidence

if it all happens at once, it means it's intense. So now all of the police officers believe that Elaine's death is a homicide and not a suicide. So they go back and try to get more evidence. It had been over a year. I mean, things are not looking in their favor, but again, everything starts matching up. Elaine's apartment hadn't been sold and the

family left it completely the way it was before. I mean, they're like, until it gets sold, like, we don't really want to pack up her stuff. So it's kind of like a time capsule. The police, they start going through her house again. And her bed in particular, they pulled back the covers, they pulled back the bed sheet, and her mattress has stab marks and blood stains on it, that they did not see the first time around because again, they were looking at it through a different lens. They weren't looking for a crime scene, there was no signs of a break in in her apartment. I mean, her bed was made.

Why would it be a crime scene? So it just looked like someone had stabbed her, there was blood stains, they replaced her new bed sheet so that you couldn't see it, made up the comfort or put the pillows there. So they bring in this mattress to do DNA testing on the blood stains. There was also some semen stains, so they were hoping to pull some DNA off of that. They go back to the lake and they find more stuff. Now all of these people who had found Elaine's body, like there was a bunch of different police forces working on this, they go back to the lake, they bring in divers, they bring in all of these crazy people, they find another collar inside of a bag with insulation tape, and

they find two Nokia phones. So this is getting weird. How is that crazy, you find all of that in the lake? In a lake! And people were saying it also has to do with the whole summer thing I mean the water was really really low during that time And it just I mean it's so when they probably discarded it was not yeah, yeah Obviously and they thought no one's gonna find this. It's gonna be crazy

They also send teams into the mountains where her body was found So we've got the scene where all of her stuff was found and then we've got where her actual body was found. And they start looking and nearby they find hacksaw blades, fishing line, cable ties, harness equipment, equipment, bondage gear. So it's very clear and evident that something sinister happened here. But they don't know what happened and they don't know by who. So they start begging the media for leads like anybody who knows anything about you know her life, her personal life, when she's seeing someone what was happening during this time, please reach out to us. And a woman by the name of Edna Lilis reaches

out and she knew Elaine from being in a psychiatric unit with her. So she was also an inpatient and they bonded a lot. And Elaine opened up to her. Elaine told Edna that she's having this affair with an married man. And Edna is like, no. And she says, yeah, you know, it's kind of strange because he really likes to cut me while we have sex. Like, with the knife, he likes to stab me. And Edna really was not about it. She was like, listen, I'm all about kinks, I'm all about pdsm, but no, you're playing with fire. This is a dangerous game and you need to get out while you can and she was like Yeah, yeah, yeah, sure Edna and Rosetta another woman comes forward her name is Rosetta and she was a nurse She'd been like a nurse for like decades at the hospital that Elaine would go to and she said listen

I was bound by patient confidentiality so I could never tell this to the police But now that I know that something has happened I can't? And she said that Elaine kept telling me about this man who keeps forcing her to play bondage games and that she didn't want to do it anymore. She didn't want to be cut anymore and she lifted up her shirt and I saw all of these wounds on her stomach and I told her, no, like please,

you have to go to the police with this. This is not normal. This is not a king. This is not just BDSM. This is too much. Especially because Rosetta the nurse, she knows that she has a history of self-harm. So this is just you are playing such a dangerous game. Please Elaine, you have to do something. And Elaine says, I can't even if I wanted to because he's married and he has kids. And if I go to the police, the kids are gonna find out

what their dad does and the kids, their lives are never gonna be the same. And I don't wanna damage the kids relationship with the dad. That's her reason. This is how much she loves kids. Crazy. Like she refuses to hurt a kid. Like that's her one thing.

She loves kids. So Elaine showed pictures to the nurse and to Edna about of these whips and handcuffs and these chains and they both just kept telling her at least keep a record, keep a note of every time you see him, keep a note of everything he tells you, keep pictures of text messages, keep them receipts, you know, that's what they were telling her. This is going to be super important to the investigation. I don't know if she took their advice per se, or if she genuinely felt like something was going to happen

because she kept a log of everything. What do you mean, like a journal? She kept a diary, but she also backed up her phone on her laptop, and that's going to become pivotal. So the police, with this information, they also start searching through the CCTV footage of Elaine's apartment and workplace. They actually combed through

the 1,300 hours of footage of 10 different cameras. This is why I'm saying Ireland has got it down because if you're talking a year ago, this would never happen if this crime happened in America. You're like talking tomorrow and they're like, sorry, the footage has been taped over. It's been 12 hours. We've got new footage. Our SD card is 32k. How many times have you heard this? Oh my god.

How many cases? It's almost as much as the, she lit up a room when she walked in. It's like, all right, we get it. And the security footage was taped over. And it's potato quality if you have it. And so, yeah, they had all of these cameras to work with. Now nothing's guaranteed. Again it's still kind of iffy because like I said it was a year ago but at least they have a lot of footage so they start going through

it and there was just one guy that kept standing out to them because every time he was in front of the elevator CCTV he would deliberately cover his face. Not even like a wearing a hat type of situation but like straight up put his hand on the side of his face So this is the CCTV footage wouldn't get it when he walks into the elevator There's not necessarily a camera inside the elevator, but from the outside camera You can kind of see what button they press right, but he would cover it He would cover with his one of his other hands so that whatever button he presses They can't even tell it is it on the third line is it on the fourth line they don't know guilty guilty why are

you doing that guilty so between January and August 2012 which is when Elaine goes missing he was at least 10 times and he was just as suspicious every single freaking time so they're trying to figure out his height his general weight his general build is there like anything unique about him that we can ID? They try to even matching that when he would come into the apartment with the street cameras to see what kind of car is he driving? Like is there a consistent car that we see every single time? Wow, they're so advanced. If there is anything that the past year and a half has taught me is that if there is something in my life that I can make it simple, I can make it

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application. So go to upstart.com slash rotten. Now, as they're doing that, the police, they get the DNA work off the mattress. Five patches of semen and blood, Elena Haras blood and an unidentified man's semen. He was in the system. So they got CCTV. They got like a whole team dedicated to that. They got the DNA team and they also have the digital forensics team. And they're just looking through our computers because now that they know that this is a homicide

The first time I mean they went into her computers. They saw some messages some BDSM messages some relationship messages But they didn't they didn't go that deep because once they found her car at the cemetery witnesses saw her there People assumed her was suicide and it just felt weird for them to dig so deep into someone's personal life especially when She had these struggles that she was dealing with they just they just didn't do it She just felt weird for them to dig so deep into someone's personal life, especially when she had these struggles that she was dealing with. They just didn't do it. Now they're looking for a killer.

So they're going through every little piece of that computer and there was a lot. They find a lot of pictures of her with clothes on and naked and the pictures were framed in a way as if they were trying to take pictures of her scars. Not, they're trying to take sexy nude. Oh, like evidence. Kind of evidence, but also, or the photographer really likes her scars.

Oh, man. And so there was a lot of that. There were pictures downloaded from the internet of mutilated bodies on her computer. Whether they were sent to her or downloaded to herself, we don't really know. There was a map to Killikki, which is where her body was found to the mountain. There was a folder of photos of women. Some of them were naked, abused, and some of them had been murdered.

So this didn't look like she had murdered them, but like I said, you know, downloading from the internet or someone had sent her crime scene photos of women when they were found after a murder. This is no longer just BDSM. I mean, this was full on. There was a lot of illegal stuff that it seemed like it was leaning towards. Elaine also wrote fantasy stories about women who were kidnapped

and just restrained and she had this huge sexual desire and this fantasy life at first. She had this full contract for slavery. So the police say immediately bring in BDSM experts because they have no idea what's fantasy, they have no idea what's real. What is real evidence that we need to follow this lead and what's just role play? Like what messages are role play in this? And they said that contracts are not that common. It's common because of 50 shades of gray. It's common because of the movie. He like makes her sign a contract. But in the real BDSM world, it's more theatrical to get someone in that mind space. You're like, hey, sign this contract to be my slave and you can never not be my slave, right? But

legally, it's not binding. I mean, it's just literally role play. So it's just not use that often because it's just role play. So they're like, okay, it's just literally role play. So it's just not used that often because it's just role play. So they're like, okay, that's interesting. We also found this, which is called the Gorean lifestyle. Women's right is slave. So it's this huge article and kind of like rules of how a woman should be a slave. And this is how it starts just to give you some idea. What is your name and identity? If you're a woman practicing a Goryan lifestyle, you don't have one. Your identity is a slave and you serve a master

who orders you to do whatever he pleases. You have no rights. You never address yourself as I or me. Instead, you are master's slave. Refuse all to do this results in punishment, usually a whipping. So the whole philosophy of this is that men have a natural drive to dominate women and women have a strong desire to submit to men and give up their rights. I don't historically or personally agree with this, but whatever.

Now women are also either free or enslaved, but the Gory and Lifestyles says that free women can be enslaved at any time. And slaves are human animals. But isn't this just a BDSM goal? So when they talk to the experts, the BDSM experts who have been in the community for a really long time, a lot of them are practicing doms, so they actually have a clientele of semisives, and they said it's not widely practiced. It's actually looked down upon in the BDSM community,

this gory and lifestyle aspect, because it's incredibly outdated and misogynistic. So the way that most people practice BDSM is that it's empowering for both parties involved, and this one is very like in-sell culture, just weird vibes, right? So is this not just for the bedroom? I mean, it seems like it's more extreme. Okay. Okay. Yeah.

Which again, it's still legal. So I'm not judging her for it. But I need you to be in that headspace because it's pertinent later. And it said that slaves are human animals. Masters make the decision for them. They lose their rights to even have a name. Like the master will like give you a name. And your only purpose in life is to bring pleasure and comfort to the master.

There's also a side note that said, women fall into two categories. So you're free or you're a slave to a master, and you always have the right to refuse slavery. But if you do, you're going to be killed. So I guess you don't really have the right to refuse it. So that's just weird. She had a downloaded PDF of serial killers, like a compilation of just talking about the psychology of serial killers, a ton of documents about pecorism, which is when someone has a sexual interest in picking someone's skin, penetrating another person's skin. Not like sex, not like penetrative sex, but like a needle, sometimes a knife,

like literally skin, not. Like poke on your, poke through your skin? Yes, so it could be poking with a needle, it could be stabbing. You know, I can, I'm sure with like a needle, maybe it's a kink, but I don't know where the knife falls. I don't know. So what does she have a PDF file about that?

Yeah, just about people talking about it. And Elaine's diary was also found and it was documenting her emotional state. I mean, she was depressed. She, she had this issue with wanting to self harm. She was incredibly lonely. She wants a family and her one thing in life is she tried really hard, but she just wanted to be loved. That was it. She just wanted someone to love her and she wanted to have a kid with someone one day and just live a happy normal life. A reoccurring theme is she was always confused at how

she felt like she had to try 10 times harder to meet the baseline of happiness that everyone around her was at. Everyone just easily found a partner, everyone easily started a family and was so outgoing at work and made friends naturally. And she just, she would always get in her own way. She'd be so self-conscious that she couldn't do these things. And then she would get frustrated with herself and it was like this vicious cycle, right?

And so she's using BDSM, like a lot of people do, as a way of exploring a world where you're looking for something in the real world and you find it in the BDSM world. She doesn't want to have all of these small decisions because they give her anxiety in real life. So she's looking for a world where she gives up control. So she starts opening up these different user names,

a different BDSM website. So she had three different profiles. So one of them was sub or slave for you. Another one was just submissive and then there was one called Help Me Learn. And one of her profiles was viewed more than 10,000 times on the website. So there was a lot of interest. These were opened up early in 2006. They started tracking whoever was in contact with her on any of these websites since 2006 to 2012. Did she need anyone in person? Did she start a relationship? They tracked down eight different men and they start

questioning the shit out of all of them. They all willingly give up their DNA and only two of them had actually met up with Elaine in person. The other ones were like, oh, we're just an online thing. And they checked all of their alibis, they checked their stories, all the men were eliminated. Most of the men mentioned that they didn't really meet up with her or didn't work out because her interests were even too extreme for them. So they just weren't interested in being that aggressive of a DOM. And you know, they just didn't want to do it. So they had this huge problem with these websites or any of these other websites is that like even YouTube or podcasts, any website, anything that involves the internet, there's gonna be a ton of people who are always incredibly vulnerable on these websites.

And if someone evil comes along and sniffs out their vulnerability and uses it against them, I mean, the internet is a scary place. Another thing that made it a problem is that Elaine was new to the BDSM scene, so she didn't have a ton of friends that were already established that said, hey, this is the process. This is what you do. This is how you say that you're comfortable. So if someone had told her what BDSM is and what relationships were in this situation,

it might have been better because at this point when Elaine's putting her profiles up on the internet, BDSM is whatever this person could tell her it is. Someone could just meet her up on the internet and say, no, this is how everyone does it here. And she would probably believe it. So they start recovering text messages. A lot of them had been deleted. A lot of them had just somehow gotten wiped off her computer.

They recovered 4,000 text messages. And 2,500 of them were from the same guy by the name of David. And I had this dilemma about if I wanted to read some of these text messages Because I just I read this book that it's in my source notes, but they list they left all the text messages in there This one is by Paul Williams. It's called almost the perfect murder They left all of the text messages and and it's it's like so depressing to read these text messages. And I didn't know if I was going to read them in the podcast because it also felt weird reading someone's text messages, especially with the BDSM involved, but it's important. Without this, you don't know how evil this person is. So I'm going to limit the verbatim text messages ofaine's part, because I don't think it's really necessary. But from what David says,

I'm gonna try to keep it verbatim. And it was really alarming stuff. He would text her things like, I'll take off your clothes, stab you, and bury you. I'm gonna leave your clothes in the car by the sea and make it look like you drowned. Like, he would text her these fantasies about how he wanted to stab her and kill her.

Oh, so there is a murder intent? Yeah, so March 25th of 2011, she receives her first text messages from David, but the police immediately know that this is not their first time talking because he's like, hey, do you remember me? Is this still your number? Like, it's David. So she had actually had a BDSM relationship with him in 2006 2007-ish. She broke things off in 2008 because she just wasn't into blood. She wasn't into stabbing, less extreme BDSM of wanting to be tied up and spanked and all of these things, right?

And treated like a slave like roleplaying, but she wasn't into actual blood like she wasn't into being punched and having these massive bruises and scars all over her body, that's not something that she liked. So out of nowhere, three years later, he tries to rekindle this relationship, and it works. So they decide to meet the next day, but Elaine keeps telling him through the text messages, I'm still the same person, like I'm still not trying to get into blood play, I'm still not trying to get stabbed, like I just don't want to do do this and he kept texting her, did you ever think about me? Did you miss me?" And she even said and I quote, yes, but then I would remember all of the blood.

So we find out through these text messages that in 2008 she was going through an incredibly tough time and she had actually made a very shocking request to David. She asked David to kill her. She was depressed. She was incredibly suicide a lot the time and she didn't know how to take her own life. She just was scared. She thought maybe this would be an enjoyable way to do it if it's in this consensual relationship

and I don't know. Like she just kind of threw it out there. I don't think she was thinking things through to be honest and he didn't do it because that's the legal moral ethical human thing to do, right? But now years later he's coming back and he's blaming her through these text messages He says it's your fault that I want to kill people now and you won't let me stab you So he's saying years ago when you mentioned that I should kill you because you're depressed you brought out this monster in me and now what now what it's your fault that you brought this monster

out in me and she even texted him back like I never thought me wanting to die with Lee Tany of this. She's like what? I mean, and he kept over the next months non-stop every day, tried to lead her to suicide. He texted her things, hope you are feeling better today. I have thought a lot about your situation and I can adjust my kind offer to hang you in your apartment. So she didn't want to be stabbed to death because she wanted her family to be able to bury her. She wanted to be buried next to her mom. And she thought if she stabbed, then it's gonna be a murder investigation.

And then, you know, her body should never be found because all of that. And she just didn't want that. She didn't want that for her family. And he said, I can just hang you in your apartment instead. This is my kind offer. So that you can be found and buried properly, less covering up for me to do as well, and I could take the cuffs off after. I would prefer

the other way, of course, stabbing you, but just something to think about. And she tried to fight back. And she would talk about, I don't think I'm ready yet. I'm still looking for someone to, I just want to meet someone one day. And you're making it hard, because with all these scars that I had gotten over the years, I feel like no one really wants me anymore. And I wanna have kids one day, at least one. Like I don't wanna die right now. I mean, I just wanna have a kid at least once.

And he would taunt her. And he would say, but that's not really gonna happen. Cause you're 36, you're old, you're fat, you're a smoker. And no one's gonna give you a kid. And so she would say, well, no, I think it's because like when I tried dating, someone didn't like my wounds and my scars. And he said, no, it's not that.

It's because you're fat and ugly. Like he was evil. But at this point, police knows this guy. No. They don't know who it is. No, they couldn't trace the phone. They know David, that's it. Yeah, and that's not even his real name.

Oh. And so he said, if I can't kill you, you have to help me kill someone else. And she's like, no, no, no, no, like I'm not doing that. And he would just keep texting her things like, I have a reoccurring dream where you text me and say you've got a present for me and I come to your place and when I get there it's a naked girl gagged and bound and tied to a chair and you have all my favorite knives laid out. And she would even text him back that's not happening and when she would text him she would always call him sir.

So you can kind of tell that she's definitely not in the mindset of like, no, fuck you, like this, there's already an establishment of power here. They were already in a relationship where he was the master, she was the submissive, there's no breaking out of it. And she tries, she tries to tell him no in a way that she can bring up the courage to, but he just won't let her go, like he keeps just bombarding her.

And she would pretty much tell him her dreams of, I mean, I guess I can kind of relate, like I have dreams of just finding someone who likes to time me up and not do like all this blood stuff, right? And she said, but I guess we're just all doing our best, you know, that's life. And he said, yep, life is short, especially for you. Ha ha. So then almost immediately, he starts introducing knife play back into their relationship, and she tried really hard to fight it off through the text messages you can see. But um, he would say things like, I can't wait to see all that blood. I want to stick my knife in flesh when I'm sexually aroused. Blood turns me on. I'd like to stab a girl to death one day. And so she would repeatedly tell him, like, please stop. I don't want to listen to this.

I don't want to talk about it. It makes me uncomfortable. So how long is this like for months? So they're kind of dating-ish? Yeah. And then he's like constantly manipulating her and trying to do nasty... Just non-stop. He even paid, he even offered to pay her. He was like, I'll pay you to let me stab you. And she straight up was like, no, like I'm scared.

I don't want that anymore. And he tried everything. And then eventually he slowly threw manipulation and predatory tactics. He introduced knife play back into their relationship. And he forced her, at first it was through pictures. He said, take the largest kitchen knife and place it as far up your CUNT as possible.

Don't cut yourself, try to impress me. Use ketchup if you think it would be a more exciting picture. So I don't know if maybe it was a fake knife that she used, I don't know. But this is just showing you that this was a very slow, deliberate, manipulative way of eventually stabbing her again. And then after she would send pictures with some knife play that she would do to herself,

but she wasn't like stabbing herself, you know? Very easier stuff than he would be like, oh, that's perfect. And then he would always end it with like, don't you wanna make me happy? And Elaine's thing is she just wanted to be loved. Like in life, that's it, that's all she wanted, she just wanted to be loved. So she would say, yes, I want to make you happy, I just don't want to play with knives. And he would say, well, this makes me happy, and he would push her a little bit more.

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to convince her again. He would say things like, when will you be ready for it? And she said, I don't know, uh, hopefully never. And he said, I can't see you as an old lady somehow. If you decide one day, you have to promise that I'm gonna be the one that sends you off. And she said, I suppose, but will you tell me so I can prepare myself for it? And he said, really really tell you before I do it before I kill you against your will. And she said, oh, no, you're never going to kill me up against my will. Like, you've left too much evidence in my place and I'm not going to cleaning any text in her back, but I am though. Like what?

She's legit just bag basically saying, don't kill me because I've had evidence. Yeah. And he said, no, I'm going to kill you. Yeah. If you have like social anxiety and you don't kill me because I have evidence. And he said, no, I'm gonna kill you. Yeah, if you have social anxiety and you don't know how to tell people now, and I relate to Lane so hard on this, this is her saying, no, the fuck you're not. It's pretty blunt, no, that's not even like, exactly. Like, maybe not.

She was like, I got evidence. Yeah, there's evidence, so. And he was just an incredibly calculated, disgusting, cruel person. And the thing that makes all of this worse and the thing that's gonna make you more emotional, is that David Newilane's history was self-harm, and her suicidal ideologies. So, introducing, cutting back into her life, but with him administering it as like a fetish thing. I mean, this is disgusting.

BDSM experts who were weighed in on this, because listen, it's not my place to talk about the BDSM community, but they said, this is not a kink this is not a finish this is straight up using someone's trauma as a weapon this is disgusting no one in the BDS community would be okay with this nobody so i mean to the police though this is a really great area like they know that this person is a psychopath is someone who is willing to kill wants to kill has this blood less Like this is straight up blood less like he wants to see blood. I mean, it's crazy But it's a gray area because he's not saying straight up. I want to kill you He's straight up saying like oh like let me help you in your suicide

I can't wait to help you so they kind of had this weird gray area that they were working with But also the fact that is this role play we don't really know is how they were phrasing it. And it just, it was a lot. I mean, he just kept blaming her. He kept saying it's your fault. How do you bring this up? Get me obsessed and excited with killing and stabbing someone and then take it away from me.

Like, you had this coming. This is your fault. And he would say things like, I have everything ready if it all becomes too much. Like if life becomes too much, I've got everything if it all becomes too much. Like if life becomes too much, I've got everything ready and all your worries will be gone. And she texted him back right now, I'm not that bad. Like imagine. And so eventually he starts bargaining with her. He says, nobody wants to give you a child because you're fat and ugly and old.

But I can. I'll give you a kid. Yeah, whatever, I already have kids with my own. I'll give you a kid, as long as I will never be in that kid's life. I don't want the kid to even know I'm their dad. I'm not paying for child support. Don't even act like this is my kid. I'll just give you a kid though. But he said, and I quote, a life for a life.

So you have to help me kill someone and I'll get you pregnant. Holy shit, this guy's. And so he starts talking about how he wants to get a remote house like a Call of Real Estate agent and he picked one out and had her name and her address and her real estate company written down and said, we're gonna call her, ask her to, we're gonna pretend to be a couple,

ask to see a house in a remote area and then you're gonna tie her up and we're gonna stab her. And she would always put it off. And I mean, the police are reading this like, wait a minute, are we looking for like a full-on serial killer? Because this guy is insanely homicidal. I mean, he's not just trying to stab a consenting adult, but he's straight up trying to kill innocent people,

like not even people who know about it. Like, he's trying to kill a random real estate agent. Where does this, where, what are we doing right now? So they start tracking down the phone number and it was a prepaid phone purchased in 2011 with the intention of texting Elaine. How do we know this? Because that phone was activated

and almost immediately he texted Elaine and that was the only phone number that contacted Elaine. How do we know this? Because that phone was activated and almost immediately he texted Elaine and that was the only phone number that contacted Elaine. Like that's it. He didn't use that phone to call anybody else, text anybody else. That's it. Only talk to Elaine. Now the name was registered to someone by the name of Garoon and their date of birth was 1992, which the police don't believe because they would have been like 20 at the time of this took place. They were like, no, that's definitely not what's happening. They see that most of the text were BDSM related, but there were some small details in the conversation that could lead the police to this mystery man because they looked up Karoon and they look up the whole name and they couldn't find any. They couldn't find any variation of Gordon, Garrett,

like they tried everything. There was no one in the system. There was no one that lived in Dublin with that name that had bought this phone and all of that. They analyzed his phone where he was texting it from because even though it's a prepaid phone, it's still being pinging off of cell towers. And it kept pinging from a certain area in Dublin, it's South County Dublin. So this led the police to believe

that this person lived and worked in South County Dublin. So they start analyzing their text messages. One time he texted her that he saw a dead sheep body near his like flight club, flying club. And he couldn't wait to nighttime so that he could go to that dead sheep and sink his knife into it. Which like, okay, you're thinking gross, but they're thinking flying club, sheep carcass.

Like we're gonna look for a flying club. They look for some registered pilots in South County, Dublin, nothing came out of that. And he actually gave specific dates on flying, like he would say, oh, like I can't meet you today, I'm flying today. And then he would text her one time to be like, oh, I came in fifth in this flying competition.

So they're like, wait a minute, airplane competitions are not that common. Like, it's not like a golf tournament. Like we need to figure this out. So they search for anything that has to do with flying. They look up straight up flying airplanes, fishing, because there's fly fishing, right? They do everything kite club.

They're like, maybe he likes to fly kites. They look up everything. They couldn't find anything. They couldn't find any competition, who someone came in fifth, and the specific dates that had happened. Until one of the police that was working in the South Dublin area, he was like, you know what?

I went into the mountains the other day, and I saw these weirdos who were just flying these like, model airplanes, and I was like, God, they're gonna hurt someone with that. Like a toy plane? Yes, they have competitions. You know, they have like the boat competitions with their boats? Like the boat ones, yeah, but they have it for airplanes too. so he's talking about it and all the police they're like wait a minute

Wait a minute. Wait a wait a wait a minute So they look into it and there was a competition the same day and They find who came in fifth and his name was Graham Dwyer and they knew this man. Because she had his name in her phone book and wrote about him by name in her diary a couple of times. So it's not like a completely random name where they're like, whoa, we have no connection to this. And so they start searching up his history.

And the only police document that they could find with Graham Dwyer was that he had reported his bike stolen from his architectural firm. He's an architect where he worked, where he lived, all of that was in the police file, and that is exactly the area where the phone was peeing off of him, that like general area, and he looked so similar to the CCTV footage. So they start cross-round fencing everything. They don't want to tip him off, you know, because they don't have enough evidence at this

point. And Ireland's really crazy, like in order to get a murder conviction, it needs, it seems more strict than America. And so they just wanted more. So they start cross-arm, if it's saying, whenever he told Elaine that he got a pay cut, they find out through work that he got a pay cut. He would tell Elaine that his car is in the shop, they would go to some local car shops, and sure enough, that day there is a receipt for him being in the car shop. Like all of these small references that he never thought would come to buy it in the

butt, I mean, these are solid evidence. So they put a secret surveillance on him. He has no idea that he's being watched, nobody knows, and they start looking at who the fork is Graham Dwyer. He is the least likely person ever. He's five feet, five inches tall. He's a stalky dude. And everyone just describes him as just fucking plain looking.

Like he just looks super plain. He's an architect. His wife, Gemma, is also an architect. They have two kids together, tons of friends, tons of colleagues. They had a very busy social life. They all had a busy work life. So they're the type that like they go to work.

They drop their kids off. They have nannies. They have daycare. Then they would go out with their friends. They would go to dinner. I mean this is a highly skilled killer. He is highly in control. He's able to compartmentalize his life, which is what serial killers do. They like BTK. He's got his family life in one head. And then he goes and breaks and kills and tortures people and he can just separate it it's scary and So they're watching him and at this point. I mean news of the lane is everywhere her body had been found and he's chill

He's chillin. There's not one sense of worry. There's not one sense and he's being secretly watching You know, so it's he doesn't even know people are watching him right now Nothing just going to work, family activity, just chilling, doesn't seem based. So they start looking for more evidence and they are mainly looking at the Nokia phones, which they call it in police files, the master and slave phones,

because once they had been in the water for like 13 months, but they had this friend's ex-teams who could actually get it to work. I don't know how. For the Nokia's, man, those blicks. Those blicks. Always work. I know.

And so you know how months before her murder, they stopped contact. And so when they thought that she had committed suicide, they were like, oh, well, she was in a relationship with anyone because the last person she was texting about BDSM, they stopped talking for months. Remember that in the beginning of the investigation when they first reported her missing? Well, it turns out it's because they started talking through months. Remember that in the beginning of the investigation when they first reported her missing?

Well, it turns out it's because they started talking through this Nokia phone. So he had bought it for her, and they start primarily texting through there. There was only one contact in one of the phones that was master. The other phone only had slave, and they were bought at the same time.

They only contact each other, and the day that Elaine went missing, all contacts stopped, and the phones were turned off and thrown into the river. So they track those phones and they cross-reference it with Graham's personal phone. And the Nokia phone and Graham's personal phone were always in the same area. So they're like, I mean, he's got to be having those two phones on him, right? And leading up to Elaine's murder, they were at the same place all the time until the day

that she does. And then suddenly the Nokia phone goes off the grid. So really, like what's going on, they also cross reference out with his car's movement. So he has this blue Audi TT and they start tracing that shit everywhere. I don't know how they get this information list in Ireland. It's crazy. They got CCTV everywhere. You can't do shit in Ireland. Except I guess the vanishing triangle, I don't know, okay, but it seems like in this case you can't do shit in Ireland Except I guess the vanishing triangle. I don't know okay, but it seems like in this case you couldn't do shit

And there were a bunch of toll booths and the phone even pinged at Elaine's place matched up with the CTC CTV matched up with his car. I mean this is Graham's phone. Come on Now the text messages were saying things like if anything happened to you who knows about me and she said he's asking Yeah, and she said I didn't who knows about me?" And she said, He's asking. Yeah. And she said, I didn't tell anyone about you. Good. Keep it that way.

So the days before her murder, he said, you will be bound and gagged and tied to a tree. Deep in the forest, I have a spot picked out. And she said, I am not leaving my apartment. You have to drag me out. And he said, you will do what you're fucking told. I want outdoor play or I'll double punish me and hang you. So he told her that he needed to punish her because they couldn't do anything because she she remember she went into a psychiatric ward and she was released the day before her murder or the day of her murder.

So the day that she goes missing, I mean, he was just saying like you were in the psychiatric hospital, now I need you to be punished because you weren't supposed to go there. So he straight up punishing her for getting admitted because she wanted help. He decided to kill her because she was seeking help. Yes, but he did it in a way that was like, oh, I'm just going to punish you to try to draw her out into the woods because like I said, when she got out of the hospital, everyone, her doctor, her family, her friends, they said that she was in really good spirits, she was so excited for the festival the next day.

So he kept saying, I'm just gonna like punish you in the woods, that's it. And she kept saying like, no, you're gonna have to drag me out of the apartment. So the last 24 hours, she said that she didn't want to be naked in the forest and he told her that she had to because he didn't want blood on her clothes. And she said, wait, now I'm terrified. And he told her, no, you have to be punished for trying to kill yourself without me and for being unavailable for so long because she was in the hospital. And so she asked him to not mention killing for a while so that she could settle back into life

because she had just gotten released. Was this text released to public? Yes. And he said, but tonight's punishment will be like me pretending to do someone for real, okay? So he's saying, yeah, I'll stop talking about killing you. If you pretend, role play that I'm killing you tonight. And so he gave her the directions, told her to meet him

at the cemetery at 5.30, leave your iPhone at home, just bring your slave phone and keys, and you will get further instructions from there. And she said, no offense, sir, but do we have to do it in the rain? It's cold. And he said, empty yourself and become nothing. You are a property and a piece of slave meat. Your only job is to serve.

And so he gave her directions, across the bridge, head for the opposite end of the park near the steps to the sea. And the last message that was ever sent to her was go down to the shore and wait. And then the phones were turned on and never turned on again. So we can assume from that point with his car locations, he drove her to the mountain, left her car at the cemetery, took her up into the woods, tied her to the tree, and eventually murdered her. Is just the evidence from the site, you know, remember in the mountains I told you they found bondage, they found equipment, they found rope, and he drove to the reservoir, he disposed of his killing kid, he disposed of some of the BDSM stuff and drove home and just had a regular evening with his wife and kids. Now he left her body in the woods just out in the open because he revisited the scene multiple times. Yeah. He revisited.

Yes. To do what? I don't know if there was necrophilia involved, but it seemed like he got gratification from seeing her dead. Oh yeah, wow. And so this was enough for the police to get in a rest warm. Warren, so October 17th, 2013, 7am, they had three different teams. One to search his office, one to search his house, and one to arrest him. And everyone was shocked.

His co-workers, his wife and kids, I mean they had no idea she was heartbroken I mean I I feel for her because she didn't try to defend him or anything. She was like what? I mean she didn't know that she was sleeping next to a disgusting monster like a killer First of all, it's one thing to know that he's cheating on you and then it's another thing to be like he Wants to do what to these women like as a woman to woman, you're like, what? Like, forget the fact that this is my husband, but what? This is insane.

So he gets arrested, and he's super cocky. He's like, listen, I know you guys can only hold me for 24 hours, and I don't know what you're talking about. That he didn't think that Elaine had a backed up her phone to the laptop. He thought that he had wiped her iPhone. had backed up her phone to the laptop. He thought that he had wiped her iPhone, he thought everything was gonna be okay, he got rid of the Nokia phones, no one was ever gonna find those and even if they did, it's been in water for

13 months how are they gonna get the evidence of that? It's crazy! So he's just sitting there and they interview him five times over the course of 24 hours and each interview is a completely different vibe because each interview, he's getting closer and closer to the reality that he's fucked. So the first interview, he's like, I don't even know Elaine, I only saw her on the news, isn't that the girl that you guys found in the mountains? Yeah, that's so sad, I saw that on the news.

And he was like, man, the first interview, most of it, he talked about how pissed he was. Because he's like, the journalist, I can't wait for those freaking articles. Architect arrested for murder, I can already see that. I mean, that's going to ruin my career. So he was super cocky. Yeah, and just thinking about himself, and they're like, what? This is crazy. But the police, they play into it. So they start just having an innocent conversation with him. Like, you're an architect, that's cool.

You must be busy with work. Like, how do you blow off some steam? Like, do you do any crazy BDSM stuff? And he's like, no, I just fly some airplanes, like, really into airplane flying. And they're like, is that so? You're into airplane. What?

That's an interesting hobby. I've never heard of that. Fighting it down, matching cross. Yes. Matching to the evidence. Yes, exactly. And he had no idea, no idea. And so the second interview, they

start showing him little bits of evidence. You know, he's like, I don't even know Elaine. They show him the CCTV footage of him at a Lane's apartment. And then he kept saying, OK, well, I didn't even know Elaine. They show him the CCTV footage of him at Elaine's apartment. And then he kept saying, OK, well, I didn't kill anyone. OK, so I know a girl, but does that mean I killed her? No, I know a lot of girls. Very confident. The third interview.

They're like, hey, so her phone was backed up on a computer. And they start reading out some text messages. And he's like, my private life, yeah, I'm into BDSM, yeah, we did have sex, mm-hmm, consensual though. So then the fourth interview, they're like, so the no-care phone, you want to talk about that? And he's like, what? The no-care phone, what are you talking about? And they start reading the text messages from the no-care phone. he starts freaking out now and then finally they interview him and they say listen your semen was a match like your DNA was a match to the semen found on her mattress

and no-caphone I mean all of this all of this isn't looking good and he said okay I'm not an innocent man but I am innocent of murder you know I'm what I'm not an innocent man, but I am innocent of murder, you know? I'm what? I'm not an innocent man, I'm a bad man. But am I guilty of murder? Am I guilty of cheating on my wife? Yes. Yeah.

Am I guilty of running a red light twice? Yes. Killers love doing this. What is that? You admit to certain crimes, but not the ultimate crime. I hate that so much. Because you can just lie all the way, I guess, at that point. And it's just like, okay, really?

And then you're just like, I'm not the man that I want to be. You know, I can do better. I'm not the best person out there. Am I guilty of that? No. I hate people. Okay, I just hate people. Then they also bring up the fact that they questioned his old girlfriend, his ex girlfriend,

who was also the mother of his first child. They had dated 20 years ago, and the police reached out to her to get an ID, so they didn't know if his wife was going to cooperate in all of this, so she IDed him in the CCTV footage. So they were like, okay, you're like the mother of one of his children. This is a very credible person to get an ID from. Perfect. She also mentioned that 20 years ago they broke up because he wanted to do knife play in the bedroom

and she didn't want that. So they broke up. So it seems like this guy had tried it in a relationship, broke up and now he just separated it from his relationship and his personal life completely and started seeking relationships where it didn't matter if the person Wanted and are not does that make sense like it was just so nasty and so

That point he knows he screwed and you know the night before his arrest They find that Graham was watching a movie on his computer because they had search teams in his house while they're interviewing him And they find that through his computer he was watching a movie the night before they arrested him. And it was a snuff film of people dying, real people dying. A snuff film is like where people die. And they asked him about it. Like the police officer came in during the interrogation

and was like, hey, we found this. And he was like, well, that's art. That's like a horror movie genre art. They're like, well, no, that's art. That's like a horror movie genre art. They're like, well, no, it's not. It's illegal. They said, well, my private life is my private life. What? Well, that's my friend.

That's not how your last word came from it. Private killing is still killing. Yeah. So he's like, that's my private life. And so they officially charge him with Elaine's murder. And this was going to be a controversial trial because you're talking about a guy who's an architect, family man, he's got wife and kids, and just the nature of the BDSM, the nature of all of this, plus the fact that there wasn't even an official cause of death. I mean, this is

going to be, they're like, what's going gonna happen? So the trial takes place January 22nd of 2015 and Graham is just sitting there and his family was also there the whole time But it didn't seem like they were there in support during the trial though his true color start showing because he didn't even seem nervous He's like chatting and laughing with his lawyers. He's joking He's you know taking these little scribbly notes just as if he's watching something happen It seems like he's not even in the trial himself. It's like he's watching someone else's trial and it's not even a trial about murder. It's like a parking ticket trial. Like that's how casual he seemed. Spectators were more serious,

you know? Then he was. He just was so cocky. His wife even testified when she got up there. There had to be a police officer between her and her husband where he was sitting with his lawyers and her on the stand because she was terrified of him. She never once looked at him, she never wanted to be near him. I mean, she just was scared and she had no knowledge. This is a situation where it's like, yep, she definitely didn't know. And they had a TV rolled into the courthouse and there was an American woman on the television. And the jury was introduced to a woman by the name of Darcy, who lives in America, and she was with an American police officer recording her statement.

So Darcy met Graham on a website, a fetish website, and he confessed to her through emails that he wanted to stab someone, and he wanted to stab Darcy. He was willing to fly to America just to stab her. And he was talking about these fantasies, but then he told her specifically, but you have to wait for me to stab you because I have to kill this other girl first. He was talking about Elaine. He also sent Darcy a PDF file called Killing Darcy, where he detailed a very horrific way in which he wanted to kill her. It was graphic. He would rape her and then slit her throat and then he would stab her watching

the blood like leak out of her body. He photoshopped her face onto a naked body who had their intestines like being pulled out. I don't know where he got this picture. There was stab wounds all over this body. It seemed like they were trying to mention that it was like a real body and he photoshopped her face on it. Another crucial piece of evidence was that before the trial, he sent her a Christmas card. So the trial takes place January, like years after the murder, right? But that Christmas, while he was in prison, he like sent her a Christmas card while waiting for trial And he said that if I ever go to the U.S. I can't wait to meet you. So in Technicality it's like not a threatening card But it was because she never gave him her address

She's like how a fork does he know my address and that made her want to testify more because he was like she's like This is a dangerous man like we need to keep him in prison. They also got his computer evidence Graham had crazy videos got his computer evidence. Graham had crazy videos on his computer. Woman being tortured, raped, murdered. I mean, there were so many snuff films. 11 videos were shown to the jury. And I mean, this was a huge fight from both sides

because the defense did not want these videos shown. But he had his own home videos where he would practice chloroforming himself to test how strong it is to test the feelings. Because chloroform, he's trying to chloroform future victims it seems like. He would have violent sex with him and other women and film it. Videos of him having interactions with Elaine and stabbing her. So it wasn't the actual murder but having sex with Elaine. And there were parts of the stabbing and people were running out of that

courtroom. They described it as Elaine making visceral sounds. She was in so much pain. I mean, it was horrific. They said that people would just start burst out crying. They had to leave the room because I mean, it's like a human thing. Like when you hear another human in so much pain, I, I, I, watching movies where people get tortured because I'm like, I can't like when I hear people screaming and that that's like acting. But and at the end of that after hearing her scream, after hearing all the pain she went through, he said, now that wasn't too bad, was it?

And he had no emotion. It almost seemed like he was excited that the jury would watch. He's typical syrup killer behavior, right? It's insane! He wrote a novel on his computer where he was going to be like the next BTK. He didn't mention BTK by name, but he would say that he would pick these random women, and he would watch these women go into their house, pretend to be a maintenance man, and get access to their house and then kill them. Now, their entire defense was, well, there's no cause of death.

There's no physical linking to him at the crime scene. There's no evidence. She was a heavily suicidal woman. She was troubled. That's it. The rest was just consensual sex and BDSM. That was their whole defense. So the jury deliberates for nine hours

and yeah, everyone rushed to the court to hear this verdict. He told the police officer while they're walking in to hear the jury's verdict that he can't wait because he's gonna enjoy a nice steak and wine this evening. He was that cocky. That's just, he's gonna get out. Yeah.

Wow. And he sat down and the jury found him guilty And he was sentenced to life in prison and he is currently appealing his sentence What's up with the ira and like what's up with these zero killers? Yeah, I mean, okay We talked about this. They all think they're the smartest person in the world. That's why and So Frank who is Elaine's dad, he gave a statement for the prosecutors to read at the I'm sentencing.

And I think the worst part of all of this is what everyone says is, like, all she wanted was love. And he knew that. He took advantage of it. I mean, there was never a moment of peace. He never even gave her a moment to get better or to try to live life, to try to find someone, to try to find happiness. Like, he never even cared about her.

He knew exactly what he was doing. I mean, this is evil. I, for me for some reason, this feels more evil than randomly killing someone. It's just such, you know this person's trauma. You know what they went through. Ah, so annoying. Anyways, so Frankstad, his statement was, we will never really know what they went through. Ah! So annoying. Anyways, so Frank's dad, his statement was, we will never really know what happened in the mountains,

but we have a number of questions and we want answers. When did she know that it wasn't a game anymore? When did she know that her life was actually in danger? Did she cry out? Was she able to? And did she die alone up there? I can't imagine what the family went through to think that your daughter took her own life and then to find out a year later

that it was a murder and then to get to this point where it was like what? And it wasn't just a murder that happened. Yeah. It was years of torture. Yeah. Manipulation and oh. So like I said, this has nothing to do with the BDSM community and whole. I don't want this to be like a satanic panic, BDSM panic. It's not

like that, but I think he's just an evil person. Some people speculate that he has more victims. I don't know. I feel like he would have told Elaine about it though. He seems like the type of guy. He would have like bragged about it or said, oh, well, it wasn't that bad for her. She enjoyed it. You know, so I do think he was a serial killer in the making for sure, but let me know what are your thoughts and I hope you guys enjoyed. Bye