Rotten Mango - #91: Teacher Stalked By Student For 15 Years (Case of Mary & Beth Stauffer)

Episode Date: August 25, 2021

He wasn’t like the other boyfriends and husbands. He treasured every single moment that he spent with her.  When they went grocery shopping he studied her favorite foods and brands. When they went shopping he admired all the clothes that she picked out and watched her try them on.  Sure - she was married but that can’t stop true love. And what if she doesn’t know him yet? Once he kidnaps her - she will fall in love.  Source Notes: rottenmangopodcast.com To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Rambles. Whether you're doing a dance to your favorite artist in the office parking lot, or being guided into Warrior I in the break room before your shift, whether you're running on your Peloton tread at your mom's house while she watches the baby, or counting your breaths on the subway. Peloton is for all of us, wherever we are, whenever we need it. Download the free Peloton is for all of us. Wherever we are, whenever we need it. Download the free Peloton app today. Peloton app available through free tier or pay to description starting at 12.99 per month. But a being but a boob.

Welcome to this week's main episode. I'm just going to drop you right into the middle of the crime. Have you ever been in a relationship? No, that's it. That's the crime. Okay. Have you ever been in a relationship where every little thing that you do together feels like a new moment, feels like you're experiencing something different, and this is the relationship that we're talking about today. Their relationship was special. He enjoyed everything that he did with her. He wasn't like the other boyfriends, he wasn't like the other husbands, he never complained

about spending time with her. In fact, he loved every second of it. He loved going grocery shopping with her. He would even memorize which brands of what she bought so that he could buy it for her next time. He was attentive. He made sure nobody aggressively bumped into her with their cards. He loved going to church with her. He smiled as he watched her sing the Gospels.

He was always so proud to be in a relationship with someone that had a strong faith. Good morals, good values. Sure, she was married, but that wasn't going to stop them. Yes, their love wasn't conventional, but you see the passion that they shared for each other. You would understand him, why he's being a home wrecker. Some might say that her having kids with another man or being much older than him could be a deal breaker But not this guy. No, no, no. He knew it was true love when he felt it The only thing that irked him was the fact that she never really knew that they were going on dates She never acknowledged him when he followed her home in his car to watch her through the windows

Or when he followed her to the grocery store just to sneakly walk behind her with his cart, or when he watched her from the secret confines of his cart while she dropped her kids off at school. She never knew that he was there, but that's okay, because it was their little secret. They had to hide their love from her husband. That's why. We got one of those creepy stalkers! Oh, just to wait. Just when you think that you know this story, you don't even know

the story. Full source notes are available by rottenmangopodcast.com, but there's a really good book on this. It's called Stocking Mary by Eileen Bridgeman Beer Not. I hope that I'm saying that right. She interviewed the Sheriff's Office, retired police officers that work super closely on this case. The police that worked with the families of those involved, even the victims of the crime, told the author that they learned a lot from her book. The victims of the actual crime, about how the back end of the legal proceedings went, the trial, they got a better picture of how the police handled things, the courtroom drama, all of that. This is actually one of the first cases that I got into

when I became obsessed with crime. This is it. So let's start with the man by the name of Ming Shu. His mom was Mei Shu and his dad was Jim Shu. So he spent his early years in Taiwan. Both his parents are actually really well respected, interesting people. His dad is a forestry researcher. He wrote dozens of articles on the conservation of forest. They actually still use his method of monitoring forest resources in many countries.

So this guy's accomplished, right? He was so good at his job that he gets a call. Hey, it's the University of Minnesota. We want to move you, your entire family unit to the United States, and you're gonna be the head of our forestry department. How does that sound? I mean, this is exactly what they've been waiting

their entire lives for. They've always wanted to immigrate to the United States. They wanted a piece of that American dream. So they're excited. May was super successful too. The mom, she was a math teacher in Taiwan. So successful, in fact, that the University of Minnesota offered her a position as a mathematician at their school.

Wow. Yeah. So they all packed their bags. It's just the two parents in Ming. They head for Minnesota They settle in by this nice little house in a safe suburban area They've got a cute little vegetable garden in the back. I mean this is it. This is their goal soon May had to quit her job

She had two more sons Charles and Ron now the brothers had a bit of an age gap You wouldn't expect that much jealousy because they're so far apart in age, but there was a lot Ming hated it. Hated the fact that his brothers were given American Western names. Charles? Ron? Meanwhile, he's getting bullied at school. I mean torn apart because his name is Ming.

I can't relate to that. I can relate too. Not really. My legal name's Stefan. But like, yeah, you you know i understand the struggle my sister experience the struggle all that's the same situation my sister she's a Korean legal name and i have a western legal name yeah but she actually uh... hater english name

really he had to name sentatia wants to be called so you know that's cool so the younger kids they seem to smarter as well than me, and himself. Whether naturally, or they just worked harder, I'm not really sure. This destroyed me.

Because the favorite child in the shoe household was the most successful child at the time. Both parents were academically, financially successful, and they expected nothing less from their kids. In fact, they expected more from their kids than they got. Because they're going to be raised in America. They're going to be learning English. They immigrated here to America where anything is possible.

Because they sacrificed their life. For them. For the kids. So you better do better than the head of Forestry. Come on, dude. So just as quickly as they got the American dream, tragedy just struck them in the face. Ming's dad, the head of the house, he was diagnosed with cancer.

Died two years later, when Ming was only 11 years old. And he was traumatized, especially because everyone kept telling him, you gotta step up now, 11-year-old. You're gonna be the head of the house. You've gotta make sure that your brothers are on school at time. Wait, at school on time. You've gotta make sure that your brothers are on school at time. Wait, at school on time. You've got to make sure that they're eating well. You've got to make sure that your mom isn't too stressed.

And he took the role of the head of the house very seriously, but not in the way that you would imagine. He decided that as head of the house, he should be treated as such. He is the man of the house, right? So he sits his brothers down. Listen, Charles. Listen, Ron. When I walk through that door, it's been a long day in the seventh grade, okay? I need you to carry my books to my room. I will sit here, do none of that.

You will bend and take off my shoes for me, and then my socks. Then for dinner, I want my soup ready with exactly eight crackers. The way that I like it, you give me give me one more you give me one less and I will beat you. I mean eight is a very important number. And he said I want it with a large glass of milk because you know the head of the house is a growing boy you can't forget that. Now the little brothers immediately they run to me mom mom this is like what is going on? This is a dictator. We can't live like this. And she just said he's your brother. He's just looking out for you. He wants the best for you. You have to listen to him. What? Bizarre. And it gets even more bizarre. So if his brothers fail to do these things,

he would actually stick them into the oven. He would place them into the cooking oven, turn it off, turn it on, turn it on and off just back and forth psychologically and physically torturing them. For the smallest things. And then it got weirder. Sometimes you'd go up to the little boy, run. And he'd be like, hey, run. I want you to go into mom's room while she's sleeping and grab her boob. And runs like, wait, what?

And what do you want me to do? You want me to grab mom's boob? I'm not doing that, that's bizarre. This way, mom, she's gonna, what? Maybe I just do it, grab her boob. Thankfully, they didn't listen, but the fact that he wanted them to do that is just strange. So around this time, he starts feeling

what he calls pressures, quote unquote, pressures in his head. It's essentially he's saying that he heard voices. He felt a lot of stress and anxiety, and it was just making his head hurt. And at 14 years old, he gets into the strange habit. He wants to light big things on fire. I'm talking full-sized department complexes, okay? So he goes to one, he tries to light it on fire,

thankfully it was pulled out before damage could be done, and he was arrested. Now the police are confused. You're talking about a well- off kid from a nice family. What's going on? There's no criminal record in any of your family members. What's wrong with you? Why did you do that?

I don't know. I just couldn't control myself. Nobody like dared you? No, I just couldn't control myself. OK, now it's getting weirder. Because maybe teenagers do this on a dare. Maybe they want to impress their other little friends. But just by yourself?

Okay, let's send them to the mental health unit. He seems a little weird. So the doctor's immediately deemed that he's a danger to others. Needed therapy, needed immensely. So the psychiatrist is like, let me talk to the mom. I need to talk to the mom and see, maybe he's been doing this. Maybe he's been lighting a lot of things on fire. We don't know. Maybe he's never been caught. Hey mom, let's talk about it. This is a rough time. Anything else that's a little bit bizarre or alarming that we need to know about? Well, for the past six months he's been kind of sneaking into my room in the middle of the night. You know, there was this one time I woke up in the middle of the night and he was in my bed. And he had actually cut a hole in my pajamas where my genitals are.

And under the blanket, he was holding up a flashlight, studying my genitals. Oh, my... Okay, I thought it was a little bit strange that she didn't have him admitted. I don't have kids, so I don't really know, but I would imagine if my son did that to me, I'd be like, okay, let's take it to the hospital, cause something's wrong with you, okay? But instead she bought him a book on anatomy so that he could learn in peace. Like what?

She was super casual about it. The doctors are like, okay, yes, curiosity, interests are normal and teenage boys, but that's not really normal. It's a little weird. So if this young 14 year old does not get the treatment now, bad things are going to happen when he gets older. So they write it in their notes, gives it to the social worker at the hospital. Now here's what makes it so bonkers.

The social worker is then supposed to relay this urgent message about me needing to stay in this hospital, right, to the probation officer. Then the probation officer takes that and presents it to the judge. Then the judge makes the decision. But the social worker and the probation officer, they had beef. You have to try this for date night, and I'm not even kidding you, okay? I have done so many of these, and I've even posted about it on my YouTube channel, and I just got another one in to solve with my entire family

If you guys haven't tried you got to check out unsolved case files It's essentially this murder mystery game that lets you become a cold case detective Listen before I started my first one which was like I want to say like a year ago, okay? Before I started and I was thinking I'm obsessed with true crime I'm I've got investigative skills. I do a lot of research. I'm gonna do this in 20 minutes tops and I'm gonna be like wow that was so easy but then it got here It took us hours and it was so fun every single minute of it I mean it comes in this beautiful package you really feel like you're opening a police cold case file

And I thought well am I gonna get into the story? Is there going to be a storyline? It's intense. It's like storytelling. There's so many aspects. There's so many clues and it's not easy. It is not easy at all. The details. Yes, the details. Everyone has a backstory. Everyone's got their own motivations and it's not just in plain writing. You've got to look everywhere for these. Each unsolved case file has three different objectives to solve, and after each one, you get to open a new envelope with bonus evidence. So the way that it flows is just perfect. You check your theories using the online answer key, and you get hints because even the

most savvy detective, listen, I thought I was savvy, but I still got stuck a lot. It's really this unique, exciting experience that you can honestly play by yourself if you want, or a group. Just be warned, there might be some arguing, okay? Fun arguing. And it's a really good date night because I just can't imagine anything more romantic than, you know, looking over all the tops you reports with my fiancee. It's probably one of my funnest date night activities and I was just blown away by the details and the feeling that you get at the end, that aha moment, that you cut

the killer moment, you feel like you deserve a raise. Right now, they currently have eight different cases available and I've already solved, I believe four of them at this point and I cannot wait for the rest. I'm gonna do all eight seriously. It's not one of those subscription boxes where you have to pay for six months to get to the end. You can work the entire case and catch the killer in just one evening. So get 20% off your first case today by going to unsolvedcasefiles.com and using the discount code Rotten.

That's unsolvedcasefiles.com use code Rotten. So they didn't, they barely communicated. They never got the message because of this little beef that they had, Ming was discharged from the hospital and back in school. Never got the treatment that he needed. And that is when he fell in love with an algebra teacher, okay? She was a new teacher, young, beautiful, and Ming was just obsessed, infatuated, and he couldn't help but notice... Well, the teacher is looking at him too.

The teacher, she would just smile at him sometimes. Did she just wink at me? You know what? I love my algebra teacher. But what makes it even better is that she loves me back. It's important to note that the algebra teacher and his mom were also very similar. They were both math teachers that never wore makeup or jewelry. Very proper women. They both had very similar energies. They were both math teachers that never wore makeup or jewelry very proper women. They both had very similar energies

They were nurturing. They were motherly. They were bright. They were warm kind So it seems like he yeah almost had these inappropriate feelings for his mom and he realized well I can't act on them because she's denied it and that's my mom So he chooses the next closest person just a random authority figure that reminded him of his mom, his algebra teacher. So for example, when Ming is in his 20s, he does this weird thing to his mom. He says, Mom, I'm so cold, she's in bed. So she's like, okay honey, come here. So you know how like a mom would kind of like rub the hands together for the little kid.

She's doing that for this 20 year old dude. And he kept saying, Mommy, I'm so cold. And finally, you you know after about an hour of cuddling she said okay well I gotta go to sleep you should probably head to your bed too now it's time to go to bed and he just wouldn't it was like no I want to stay here uh no you should go to bed you're like a you're not a baby you're 26 years old you have to sleep in your own bed okay and he was so mad about it he never showed his mom affection ever again So it seems like he does have some feelings for his mom

So he starts doing really well in school getting all A's winning science projects from the state What's the international science fair one a prize from there graduated top of his class voted most likely to succeed by his classmates This field has already developing narcissistic personality disorder, I mean this guy was on top of the world. He felt like his algebra teacher was just lusting over him. He was getting these crazy grades. I mean, there's nothing that he can't do. He gets into the University of Minnesota. Now, what he didn't realize is that high school is nothing like the real world.

After graduating, he spends most of his time just gambling, gambling and watching porn for hours and hours and hours every single day. Just a lot of porn. And he had the ultimate fantasy. His dream woman were like the ones in the movies. You're picturing it now. Megan Fox, right? No, no, not Megan Fox, but the moms. Not the MILF, either. The sitcom moms. He wanted a woman that was pure, didn't wear makeup

or provocative clothes, just motherly. What? It means strange. Don't get me wrong. This is an undeniably beautiful type of woman, but usually for high school graduates like freshman and colleges They're looking for the Megan Foxes, you know, they're not looking for like 40-year-old woman who Wear no provocative clothes and just snow make up and go to church on Sundays. That's not really like the The stereotypical lusty. Does that make sense? So because he's spending all of his time

Does that make sense? Yeah. Because he's spending all of his time fantasizing about sitcom moms. He ends up dropping out of college. His grades were so bad. He would rather drop out than face the fact that he's not doing well in school. That he's not naturally a genius. That his IQ is just not holding up. He's a narcissist, okay?

The one thing that he really is good at though, is electronics, home video equipment, stereos, all of that stuff. This is in the 80s. So his mom gives him the funds to start his own shop, sound equipment, services, ink. He did really well for himself, was able to create a million dollar business, hired good employees, and they all thought that the boss was a strange guy. Firstly, Ming never really liked a shower, just wasn't his thing. He didn't spend his, he didn't spend a lot of time on grooming, rarely brushed his teeth. His hair was just caked in oil, never washed his clothes, any time he came around he was just stinky. But more than that, they just had no idea who this guy was.

He never shared one ounce of information about his life. Does he have a family? We don't know. Does he have a wife? We don't know. Even the most basic things. They knew nothing. Regardless, he was doing well. So well in fact, that bell and how the leading supplier of electronics at the time was like, hey listen, you want to get a job at our, you know, our research and development team. We've got this huge lab in Illinois.

We're going to give you so much money, more money than you're making with this million dollar business. Come and work for us. But he rejected it. He needed to stay in Minnesota. They never asked why. But we'll find out. So now Ming is 23 years old and May decides it's time to remarry. It's been 12 years since her first husband passed. The kids are grown now.

It's about time. So she moves to Virginia to be with her new husband and offers that Minnesota house for the kids. Pay the property taxes pay the utilities I'll take care of the mortgage You know, Ming would mainly stay there while Charles would go to college and soon you would get married and eventually Ron the youngest would go to college in Minnesota and stay in the basement for a while Now the three brothers they never got along they never recovered from the whole weird dynamic of the eight crackers and the take off my socks Because how do you oh in the oven? How do you recover from the oven, right? So Charles and Ron they were super close

But Ming was not close with anybody really nobody. He didn't have friends. He was weird He just didn't abide by the same social rules as the rest of the world Let's be frank. He was just an asshole like that's what he was. So for Charles' wedding, he's getting married for the first time. Listen, I get it, if it's like the ninth wedding, maybe I understand. But the first time, this is a massive life event. And of course, Ming his older brother was invited. And he never showed up. Waaaah.

Didn't tell Charles, didn't have an excuse. It wasn't like a destination wedding. It was literally right there. Didn't send a gift. Just didn't go. And the it wasn't like a destination wedding, it was literally right there, didn't send a gift, just didn't go. And the next time they saw each other, it was very casual, didn't even bring up the wedding. Then Charles had a kid, and Ming never went to see the child. Charles says, I don't think my brother has seen my kid, not even once.

We're brothers, we live in the same state. He's literally never seen my child. How does that make sense? Ron, he's staying in the basement and Ming would yell at him for taking long showers. He's like, I'm the one paying the utilities. He would purposely turn off the hot water fuse for Ron's bathroom. He would purposely clog his shower and so Ron confronts him about it. Stop doing that. Seriously, what's your deal?

Like, I get it, you pay the utilities, but you have such a successful business. Yeah, what's what's the matter? Yeah, what happened is so much for her head of the house. What's wrong with you and Ming just loses it, lunges at him, pulls into the ground, tries to punch him straight in the face. So from then on, even though Ron lived in the basement, he would use the upstairs kitchen from time to time, they just never really talked. It made it so for content. So now Ming truly really has nobody in his life. His mom is gone. His brother's hate him.

No friends. Not close with his employees by himself. So he's got all of this time. What does he do with it? He starts writing in his journals. There were typically fictional stories of his sex life. Mind you, this guy doesn't have a real sex life. He's a speculated virgin in his, you know, 20s.

Just one of his imagination, where he was a sex god, irresistible, and all these stay-at-home moms wanted him. They couldn't resist him. They wanted to be taken to bed by him. He was James Bond, and these housewives were jealous in his hands. He doesn't even know where the G-Spot is. But the housewives, they're just dying to leave their boring, non-sex god husbands for Ming.

For just one night with Ming, they would only wear, because this is, I don't know why, they would only wear white bras and undies in this story and they all collectively wanted Ming's babies. They just wanted to be impregnated by Ming. So he literally writes these down. And they were always written in third person. I believe the court has 1,200 pages of his sexual fantasies written in third person. The storylines went something like this. Housewife is bored at home with boring non-sex god husband. She would run errands

casually bumps into Ming. Sex God. Wow, but they're married. She's married. What does she do? Good woman would never cheat, so Ming would rape them. For some to have sex with him. And instead of having a true realistic response to rape these housewives would have fallen love with me. They'd be like, oh my god, while you're so well endowed, your weeby is huge. While you're so experienced, I've never had an orgasm before. I've never felt like that before. And it would awaken this thirst inside of these housewives and they would beg him to

take them to bed again. Please, let me have your child. That was, yeah. So this guy in his 30s, at this point, he starts making list of all the actresses that he wants to sleep with. I mean, this is really weird 30 year old behavior. Right, maybe this is like 12 year old behavior.

Okay, no, like 15 year old behavior. Well, who's the actress? Sit calm moms. Like they, they may list out the names. No, she did, he did. Oh, okay. Of all the sit calm moms Like they did it they're in list out the names no she did he did okay of all the sitcom moms during that time Oh, okay, it's fascinating. No loved woman in their mid 30s wholesome Never wore makeup just very motherly people the only non celebrity on his list really was like his algebra teacher from like 15 years ago And he was obsessed with this one movie called The Teacher, where a high school teacher is so bored

by her mundane husband who's traveling all the time. Oh, what a snore that guy, right? She crosses paths with a former student of hers. Sparks five. Oh my God, the muscles. So large. So many muscles. Where did you get them?

Do they sell them somewhere? They start this wild affair, right? A lot of soft core porn in this movie, okay? allegedly the teacher goes from being a very quiet character to being sexually liberally liberated just free by a former student and he would watch it over and over and over again alone in his room while he wrote Fanfic about it. So this is his fanfic So it is poetic story. Ming is a popular football player who is willing to get

turquled on the field to secure the win for the team. Every time he gets tackled, everyone, in shock, the cheerleaders cry out, no, Ming. And they just want to rush over him to tend to his bruises. But nevertheless, Ming gets up with his pure brute strength and goes on to win the game. He starts dating a cheerleader named Lori. Takes her to the dance.

You want some drinks? Let's go to the fruit punch table. He's like in his 30s, so why is he writing about high school, okay? Like, this could have been a cool office romance, I don't know. Weird. So at the drink table, he's pouring some punch and Mrs. Thompson is the one serving drinks. She starts, Ming, we're so proud of you today.

You did so well on the field and she looks at Lori with jealousy, just raging in her eyes. And Ming and Lori walk away and Lori's worried. Are you sure you're not hurt, meeing? Your muscular bod got tackled so many times today. And he'd say, listen, Lori, I wish you wouldn't worry about me so much. Injury is part of the game. And if I get hurt, what's supposed to happen?

So don't worry about me. I'm just so frustrated with this. I know, but I love you Ming. I can't help but worry. And then she asks the burning question, I mean, how is this a conversation flow? Ming, do you want us to have premarital sex? Look, Lori, we've gone over this already. You're a respectable nice girl and I don't want to hurt you with this big wee wee of mine.

But I love you, Ming. You know, literally it goes like this, okay? That's like... You know, if I would have told my mom that I am acting out fanfics of a really nasty person in my future, she would have been so disappointed. She probably is so disappointed right now. Now Ming says, you and Mrs. Thompson have some sort of secret, right? Is it about me? And he says, yeah, I can't deny it. She's attracted to you and she's jealous of our

relationship. No, that can't be true. She's my teacher, and I'm her student. But it is true Ming, she wants you and so do I. So then the story ends with he's torn between this hot cheerleader and his hot teacher, what a football sex god this one, okay? So suddenly, Laurie is hit with a stomach flu rushes to the bathroom. Mrs. Thompson conveniently comes over and asks for his muscular help, loading furniture into our house. And after he does that testosterone pumping, they're sitting on the couch and they have an

affair. They do it. While they're doing it, she tells him, my husband sucks and I'm so glad to have found you, Ming. You're the best, Ming. So in all of his stories, he is the recipient of pure love, admiration, jealousy, power, stud, muffin, the best chat that ever existed, the chatiest of all chads. But in real life, his life was the complete opposite. Couldn't be further from the truth.

He did run into some trouble with the police for a killing that happened in a store. There were a lot of break ins that as electronic store in Ming was sick of it, so he decides to sleep in his shop with an arsenal of licensed guns, and when two people break in one night, he happened to be there. He grabs a gun and shoots both of them. One of them dies on the spot, the others take into the hospital, and then to prison. He was never charged with any killings. So he starts stalking woman. He's bored, he's got free time. His journals aren't cutting it.

And all of the women that he is kind of attracted to is very similar to his mom. There are teachers of some sort or there are all, you know, authority figures, motherly in their 40s. And he starts, you know, becoming obsessed with this one woman. He would break into her mother-in-law's house, hold her mother-in-laws at gunpoint demanding to know where the young couple is, so that he could stalk the wife. He finds the victim's house. The first time he tries to break in, he tries melting off the locks on her patio door, with a butane torch, right?

But it didn't work. So two weeks later, he tries again. He breaks the window open, and she's just standing there debating, do I go in? Do I not go in? But she starts screaming. She heard the window open and he's just standing there debating do I go in? Do I not go in? But she starts screaming she heard the commotion. She runs straight upstairs to get her husband and he's like okay well you know my thing has been shot. I gotta try again. He was never caught for his third attempt but he found himself in the basement of her utility room of the apartment building where her unit was right on top. Cut a hole in the ceiling right under their bed.

Wait wait wait what did he do? So, okay, they had moved into an apartment where there was a utility room right underneath their bedroom. Uh-huh. And he found a way into that utility room, caught a hole in the ceiling, which would be their floor. He's doing a lot.

This is not a stocking. No. This is aggressively breaking into your house. And he would stick his head so just his head would be right underneath their bed and he could listen to her. That's so scary. The length that he's going for to stock this stranger. If I asked you to remember a million little things right now, could you do it? Probably not, okay, I don't care how smart you are, that's really difficult to do.

And to even make it to do this with a million little things, a million little moments that you have to really put an emphasis on, it's just nearly impossible. And for me, that's what planning a wedding feels like. It's just a million little things I gotta do, right? How am I gonna keep track of all of it? What am I doing? Where's my brain? Am I gonna even enjoy it at that point? Well now with Zola, you don't even have to worry about that, okay? Because Zola, whatever kind of wedding that you're planning, Zola.com is the one place to start. They've got your back for all of your wedding needs. That's why over a million

couples have planned their weddings with Zola. So whether you're looking for a wedding venue, Zola's going to give you personalized recommendations, which is amazing because, you know, the both of us, we've recently moved to a completely different city, so it'd be nice to see, well, what's out there? What's in this town? Where can we rent a venue? One, an amazing gift, registry, you don't even have to look that far. You'll find everything you need from classic cookware to cash funds. Zola can even help you create stunning, save the dates, invites, and a matching wedding website. Weddings can be super expensive, but planning with Zola never really is.

So all their planning tools are completely free to use. Like a free wedding website, which is insane, you can actually have your gift registry on that website, which by the way comes with free shipping and returns and it's not just free, it's risk free. So you get free personalized samples of your invites so you can try them out before you buy and of course free envelopes and guest addressing, which is that's insane. Those are typically very, very pricey. So whatever your style or budget, Zola has you covered. So you can think less about the million things you gotta do and more about the million

little happy moments you're gonna always remember. So if you gotta do and more about the million little happy moments You're gonna always remember so if you're planning your wedding here's a tip start with Zola go to Zola dot com Slash rotten today and use promo code save 50 for 50% off your save the dates Zola is the one place to start for your wedding date that's Zola dot com slash rotten use code save 50 10. Use code save 50. So let's talk about who this stranger was. Why was he so fascinated by her? Mary was born in Minnesota and she had a really pleasant upbringing. Her parents were religious, she was raised really well, didn't have a bad bone in her

body. Graduated college, met her future husband Irving Stoffer, and while they were both volunteering for church. So they're super religious. They bond over religion. Their personalities were imagined. They just fall for each other. Hard. They get married. Start their beautiful family. And at this point in time, Irving is a reverent. So like they're seriously religious. He was only 40 years old. She's 39 and they've got two beautiful children, Elizabeth or Beth, whose eight and Stephen whose four. They live in Arden Hills, really save suburbs, it's quaint, and in this big town they go to the Baptist General Conference, this huge ministry where they essentially do a lot of missionary work, this church.

So the couple, they would fly the whole family to the Philippines, stay there for about four years, and then they would come back to Minnesota to this church, which is considered their home base. So they stay for two years, telling people about their missionary work, you know, getting other recruiting other missionaries, then they would go back. So right now, they were in their like two year furlough in Minnesota, waiting to go back to the Philippines. And Mary had no idea that I church. Someone would be behind her, trying to inch closer, pretending to drop his, you know, his, we can't say Bible, because I grew up in a church and it's really like traumatic when you drop your Bible, you feel like you're going to be struck down and just instantly go

to hell, at least in my church, okay? So let the, he dropped his car keys, he would pick it up but inch closer and closer so that he could smell her hair. Accidentally bump into her after church wanted to feel the fabric of her soft dress. Would follow her to Beth's bus stop. Watch from his car while Mary fakes Beth's shirt, okay, well have a good day and would kiss her daughter goodbye. Then he would follow her to run errands, that the grocery store would grab a cart, slowly keep his eyes on her, pretending to be picking up the same item of pasta so that he could

accidentally brush in to her again. Through all of this, Mary had no idea that she was being followed. Mary doesn't even know who he is. Yeah, no idea. So he's sitting behind her in these church pews one day, when Reverend Irv tells the that she was being followed. Mary doesn't even know who he is. Yeah, no idea. So he's sitting behind her in these church pews one day when Reverend Irv tells the congregation, Mary and I, with our children, will be leaving

for the Philippines soon. We will be gone for four years to do God's work and we will miss you all so very much. And Ming froze. What the fork did they just say? Four years? No, this can't be right. He can't be taking my marry and his head starts ringing.

All he wanted to do was stand up, pick Mary up and run out of that church screaming. This can't be happening. So he rushes home after service. He's like, no, no, no, no, this, no, this isn't real. So he's like, I need to, I need to let out this energy. He starts trying to masturbate to his thoughts about Mary. Yeah, bizarre dude, okay? But it wasn't working.

This in his head is as as a sign. The masturbation's not working. It's because she's leaving. Then it dawned on him. I'll just go to the Philippines. No big deal. What the heck? I have money. I can't- I can just start fresh. I'll follow her there. We can continue our church dates, our grocery store dates. No, but my shop. What if she sees me? our church dates, our grocery store dates. No, but my shop. What if she sees me? No, but that's just it, isn't it?

Mary wants to see me. She wants to be with me. She doesn't actually want to go to the Philippines. She has no choice. Herb is making her. Maybe that's why she wanted him to announce it to the church, because she knew that I would be there, and I'd'd be listening and she wants me to do something about it. She wants me to rescue her.

But I have to do it before she leaves. She leaves on Wednesday. So he starts scribbling in his journal. A whole story about how Mary is demanding sex from me. Okay, she can't resist him. She wants to bear his children. He starts prepping his house. Mainly his closet. Takes out all the furniture, the rods for hanging clothes, puts in chains, locks,

Make sure that the doors are secured so that she can't break it open. The screws of the hinges are on tight, then he gets a blanket and a pillow. Now for the food, he goes to the grocery store and buys all her favorites. He knows that once Mary is with him, their lives are gonna change. She's gonna realize that she's madly in love with him and because he's more than she's gonna want him more than he wants her. They're gonna be married. They're gonna have children together live happily ever after.

Meanwhile the staffer's life was pure chaos hectic. They had to pack all their things. Make sure their kids are ready for the trip. They're taking a four year old and eight year old to do missionary work. This is going to be insane. Not to mention all the strange break-ins that they had recently. But they can't stop working. On their huge list of errands, Beth needed a haircut before Wednesday.

So around 3.45 p.m. Mary and Beth get into the car's girse car, head to the salon. It was just the two of them in their car, but they weren't alone. They were being followed by me. He parked at a nearby park a few blocks away, hazel not park, wearing this thick leather jacket. Hot summer. Rian from the park to the hair salon starts hiding behind some bushes to get a good view

of the salon, right? He's trying to see how many people are there. Where are they going to come out? There were so many people who saw him that day. They all thought it was strange. It's so hot. Why is he wearing leather jacket? Why is he crouching there?

It looks like he's hiding or something. But none of them saw that he had a gun. And that's when he saw it. The perfect opportunity for his disgusting crime. The parking lot was relatively empty. Not many people around. Marion, Beth, they're walking out to their car. And he jumps up in front of them, puts the gun straight to the daughter, get in the car,

I need a ride. So he forces Marion to the driver's seat while he's with Beth, still pointing the gun at her, drive. Get on the freeway ramp, 135 west. Mary's trying her best to stay calm, I mean things are complicated, one thing if she were alone, right? But her daughter is there. She has to do the absolute best she can't to ensure her daughter's safety and she keeps trying to reason with him. Is something wrong? Are you in trouble? Listen, we're Christians. If you have a problem, we have a lot of people who can try to help. We have a whole community of people. We were supposed to be home soon. I'm having dinner with my sister. She's coming over and my husband is expecting me home.

They're gonna be worried. But he's not listening to a single word, okay? He's freaking the fork out. He didn't want to kidnap this kid, you know? He's like, I just wanted Mary. Who cares about this kid? They were gonna have their own kids anyway. You know, and she keeps bringing up her dang husband.

Just keep driving. And finally, he instructs her to take an exit at a deserted area, turn off the car, and from his jacket, he takes out rope, tape ties their hands behind them, forces them into the trunk of their own car! And closes it, starts driving. Mary's just trying to comfort Beth. It's okay, things are gonna be okay. She starts praying for her daughter. Then the brakes would slam, the car would stop. Ming didn't like it. Stop praying. Would duct tape their mouth shut. They had no idea if this guy is driving in circles. If he's driving to another state.

I mean, sometimes the road would be smooth. Sometimes it'd be bumpy. Sometimes they would hear, you know, honking. And then sometimes it sounded like they were driving on gravel. They had no idea. And it was so hot. There was so much dust going into the trunk they could barely breathe. And Beth was able to wiggle out of her hand restraints, starts helping her mom, on tire hands. But then the car stops, Ming comes back to check up on them.

And he had parked in what he thought was the quiet area of Hazel not Park, just a couple blocks away from the hair salon. So he'd been driving in circles. What? Seize that they're trying to break free. Super pissed. Look what you've done.

Places a giant spare tire on them. This should do. Now they really can't move or escape. And right now, she's about to close the trunk. A little kid comes up to me and says, hi. Sees the two bodies in the trunk. What? And before he can say anything, Ming grabs him.

Forcedfully puts his hand around the kid's mouth, throws him he can say anything, Ming grabs him, forcefully puts his hand around the kid's mouth, throws him, man handles him, slams him into the trunk with Mary and Beth, rushes to the driver's seat, slams the gas out of there. This is absolutely bizarre. Who was that kid? It was six year old Jason Wilkman. So let's talk about Jason's mom Sandra. She decided that day she was gonna go meet her friend And Jason was like, please mom can I come right? The the friend is Timmy. I want to play with Timmy. They live near a park. He's on a park It's practically in Timmy's backyard. Please can I go? They had sandboxes jungle gyms best park ever the slides

They're amazing the weather's nice, right? So the mom's like, okay, okay, let's go Jason So they make their way over and almost immediately the boys are like, can we go to the park please? Please please please please please Okay, be careful stay together. Okay. They zoom out. They're playing for a while when they see this car stop near them Timmy's near the front of the car watching the driver get out Meanwhile Jason was kind of running around and he was near the back of the car and he just happened to be there Ming didn't see him and he said hi to the man Then he sees the car and he just happened to be there. Ming didn't see him and he said hi to the man. Then he sees the body and says, what?

Now Ming leaves with Jason, but he did not see Timmy standing nearby in shock. He saw the whole thing. How old are they? Six. So he starts booking at home, screaming the whole way. How about, right? And he runs straight to his mom, please, please help. A man took Jason and drove off. He threw Jason into his car.

He stole Jason. They're like, what, what did you just say? And he just keeps screaming. He stole Jason. He stole Jason. So they run to the park, start looking for Jason. And like neighbors and other parkgoers, they start helping. They knew it was serious.

Sandra's voice, her screams. This is a mom in distress. This is not like a kid just fell. So they called the police, they show up within minutes, this is not a runaway. There are witnesses that a strange man stole a six year old, this is a kidnapping, a child abduction. The police start asking parkgoers, will we all solve this older green for just get out of the parking lot? The man had black hair with wearing these really big sunglasses and a brown leather jacket.

This happened not too long ago, so that means the kidnapper is at least within 30 miles from here at most in whatever direction, so they get all the cops to drop everything. This is top priority. Every second counts, this child needs to be found safe. Meanwhile in the trunk Mary is trying to comfort this young boy that she had never met. What's your name, sweetie? Well, this is Beth, she's 8, and I'm Mary. Are you religious?

Yes? Well, Jesus is watching over us, and we don't know why this is happening, okay? But God's going to protect us. And Jesus calming him down, and they were together for about 15 minutes, then all of a sudden the car stops. They hear footsteps. Being open as a trunk, holding a tire iron. Grab Jason closes the trunk again.

Not long after the car starts, they're back on the road and they will never see Jason again. No. Hours go by. I mean, they're panicked, exhausted exhausted the tires bruising them crushing their bodies It's hot that thirsty. They need a pee bet this crying. Where's Jason? Mary's trying her best to keep it together if she loses it bet that sure they're gonna lose it too, right? Has to be strong for her daughter finally 10 p.m

Ming blindfolds them transfers them to his van. He left his van near the hair salon So he's still fricking there. Yeah, for hours just driving around, getting them disoriented, so they have no idea where they are. Because he lives really close to them. They're only about a mile from the staffer home, but they have no idea. So he forces them into the cardboard boxes inside his van, starts driving again. Then it comes to a stop.

They're arrived at Ming's house, kept blindfolded, let them straight into the closet, chain them up. Beth is crying, Mary's head is ringing, and she keeps thinking, wait, I could have sworn. I could have sworn. He knows me. Have I seen this guy somewhere? Wait, what? This doesn't make sense. Maybe I heard it wrong. And then he says, just get in the closet, Mary. What? How do you know me? Who are you? You know me. How do you know me? Who are you? I want to know. Just get in the closet. And he pushes her in and closes the door. How would she know that they actually did know each other from 15 years ago when she was his algebra teacher? No way!

Oh my god! 15 years ago. Oh my god and she doesn't know. No. So she starts banging on the door. Who are you? Tell me who you are. Why are you doing this? Why did you bring me in here? And this is when she kind of loses it a tiny bit for the first time. Because she starts feeling pure terror. I mean, this is not going to end anytime soon. This is not a random ransom abduction where he just wants money. anytime soon. This is not a random, ransom, abduction where he just wants money. He knew her. He has a plan. And there's probably not much she can do to stop it, whatever his plan is.

She wants to freak out, right? But she looks at her daughter crying, and so she sits down and starts praying. Now, it's all hands-on deck for Finding Jason. The police are out there. Meanwhile, Mary's husband, Irv, is starting to panic just a tiny bit. They should be home by now. Why are they home? He waits, even Mary's sister shows up for dinner, and so finally, 730 rolls around. They should have been home three hours ago. He calls the cops. 911. And they're just not really having it.

Listen, we've got a child abduction. Your wife being late from the hair salon for three hours? Not really a priority, dude. Call back when it's an emergency and hangs up on him essentially. They're like, maybe she went to the mall. Maybe she's running last-minute errands. So then he calls back again at 9.30

and they say the same thing. Then at 10.45, he calls back and saying, please, help. We've had break-ins recently. I don't know if that has anything to do with it. She was last seen at this hair salon. And that's when the dispatch, as they're taking the Missing Persons report, they look at a fellow dispatch officer.

Wait, the hair salon? Isn't that like a couple blocks from his own that park? Okay, that's so strange. So mother and daughter, the daughters are on the same age as Jason. Go missing just a few blocks away from the park. They tell the police immediately they're intrigued. They show up at the stopper house, and they're thinking maybe there's a connection between the the park. They tell the police immediately they're intrigued. They show up at the Stoffer House,

and they're thinking maybe there's a connection between the two families. They're both religious. That's what we're finding out, right? The police ask, er, the usual questions, what kind of car does she drive? An older green Ford? And they try not to show it, but the police were panicked.

The two families, they don't know each other. And Jason was last seen being kidnapped what sounds like Mary Stoffer's car But by a man, what is going on here? Meanwhile at Ming's house the first day of captivity So next day he brings them some breakfast and he drags just Mary into the living room where he ties her to the couch and starts His video recording. He wants to record the whole process and starts his video recording. He wants to record the whole process. So he sits down and says, do you remember anyone when you were teaching high school algebra? I don't know who should I be remembering. I had a lot of students, I just can't remember. I taught there two years, it was a long time ago, like what, 16 years ago? Keep going. You're smart, You're getting warmer. Put two and two together.

Do you remember anyone from algebra class? Class. I only remember one student. Bob. Who's Bob? He was just this kid that made so much trouble for me. So you only remember the troublemakers. You don't remember good students with potential from class?

I just had so many of them. I enjoyed teaching there. Oh yeah yeah yeah but you only remember the troublemakers. Come on try again concentrate. So my cousin's wife just got pregnant recently and she was talking to me because we just moved back into town and she's like well I need to buy some more clothes and you know maternity clothes are so expensive. Like, I don't understand the reasons why I have to buy this. And then am I ever going to wear it again? Or are they even that cute and I told her, listen, don't even, I got you.

Go to threadup.com, Sasha Rotten. Because threadup is one of the world's largest online thrift stores. And it makes thrifting easy and convenient with up to 90% of estimated retail prices. You can shop from over 35,000 brands for women's kids clothing, handbags, shoes, and more for a whole lot less. You can get these insane deals like I'm talking Zara for $6, made well in J-Cruf for $9, Nike for $6, and it's the convenience of online shopping because she's pregnant.

She's not really trying to go out and try on all these clothes right now. She wants to stay on her couch and munch. And it's never been easier. With ThreadUp, you can customize your search by your size, style, and budget so that you can find the best deals instantly. And you're gonna get these high quality condition clothes

and some of them even have their tags still delivered right to your door. So she's already ordering a ton of stuff to her house and she's so excited because I mean she thought that she would have to spend an arm and a leg for maternity clothes and she has to worry about buying clothes for the baby. With threat up it makes it a whole lot less stressful, not only on you and your wallet, but also the planet. Because thrifting keeps clothes in circulation and out of landfills.

So you can feel really, really good about it. And here's the best part. They also have an easy return policy, so it makes it completely worry-free. It doesn't have to stress about really anything. So you can get the styles that you love at a fraction of the price. Whether you're looking for maternity clothes, maybe kids' clothes. Maybe you're just looking for a fresh summer wardrobe. You'll look and feel good with threat up.

And for Rotten Mangle listeners, here's an exclusive offer just for you. Get an extra 30% off your first order at ThreadUp.com slash Rotten. That's THREDUP.com slash Rotten for 30% off your first order. ThreadUp.com slash Rotten for an extra 30% off today, terms apply. And Ming is progressively getting more and more frustrated and angry. How could it be that the woman that he'd been stalking for the past like decade? First of all, isn't in love with him and doesn't even remember him. So he starts feeding her lies. You flunked me in math class.

And it's time I get my revenge because of you. I didn't get a scholarship and instead of college I went to the Vietnam War and I became a prisoner of war This is not true at all You ruined my life Mrs. Duffer, but that's not all Mary Do you remember passing me ones in the hallway at the University of Minnesota? I said hello to you regardless of you flanking me and you smiled and walked past me and I'm thinking What's this? I'm her former student and she just passes by me. She's like I'm sorry. I'm sorry I probably I don't even wait here. It was this I can't even imagine a reason that I was at the university

But if I was I probably had too much on my mind and I didn't notice you and I'm sorry if you were hurt Well sorry doesn't cut it. These things burn in my mind for all these years. And it's crystal clear to me why my life is hell. You, you ignored me. And he says that before they do anything else he needs to take his revenge. So there are transcripts that are provided inside the book that's really good stalking Mary, but the whole transcript reads strangely and I kept rereading it and I was like why why does this not make sense to me?

Okay, am I an idiot? What's going on? And I think it has to do with the fact that he's not trying to psychologically torture her This is not him sitting her down trying to get her scared trying to be like, oh, I am gonna seek revenge, right? But essentially he's not even really communicating with her. The flow of the conversation is just bizarre. And I realized, or this is my own opinion, is that he's following his own flow. It feels like he's almost sending up a scene for a movie. Like, you know, when you are trying to feed direct the interview questions at a job interview so that you can talk about something great

that you did at your previous job. It's kind of like that feeling. It's not a natural flow. It's almost like he had something that he wanted to say. So he's just trying to work it into the conversation, or at least that's my personal opinion. Make it very James Bond. And he'd say things like, I can make things tough

or easy on you. The power is still with you. That's the irony of all of this. But if you want to make things rough on both of us, I can be just as tough. If I had to break into your house and take you by force, I would have. That's how extreme I would have gone. You don't realize who you're dealing with. Someone who is determined. And then he lets us her know that his idea of revenge is to rape her. And she keeps saying, I'd rather you hit me than rape me. And he said, well, I prefer that I don't leave any marks on you.

You'll probably have emotional scars, but that's the beauty of things. You'll have the feeling that I had. And he proceeds to brutally rape her on camera. And afterwards, she asks, what do you want with me? You raped me, humiliated me, what more do you want? And he says, are you kidding? I haven't even gotten started. Do you think 10 minutes is going to solve a couple of years? You think that's going to be that? I waited all these 15 years. And he goes on to tell Mary what he wants. That his

brother Charles has a happy wife and a happy family and he wants that too. And Mary's straight up tells him, yeah no, that's not gonna happen. You say you're loving me, but I'm saying that you're raping me. And he kept saying, why do you reject me? I mean, just so bizarre. So he continues to rape her every single day for the next 50 days of her captivity. And he would record a lot of these sessions. She would ask about it and he said, well, I'm recording it because if I'm ever angry at you again, I'll just watch it because I'm going to release you one day.

That's what he told her. I'm going to release you eventually and I'm going to re-watch these instead of raping you again. Besides, you're a Christian. So because I have these tapes, you're never going to go to the cops. Imagine I leak these tapes. Do you think they want a missionary? Doing all these, you know, on the internet.

So she would be thrown back into the damp, tiny, airless closet where they would be forced to pee and poo in a bucket. So imagine how toxic this just dark space is. And every time she would come back from these brutal assaults, Beth would ask her, Mom, why are you crying? And she would say, oh, I just, I just miss your dad. That's all. And they would start praying. To make matters worse, Ming could not perform.

So his delusions that Mary would leave her husband after he rapes her were shattered. So instead of facing the reality, he blamed it on her. He was like, if you show me affection, then it'd be easier for me to climax. And she refused. So at one point you get so angry that he asked her, have you ever seen anybody die from suffocation? It takes about four to five minutes. Grab the plastic bag, drags Mary to the closet, and puts the plastic bag on Beth's head. So she's okay, okay, okay, you're right, you're right. So she kisses him on the cheek and he screams, not good enough.

So then she kisses him on the lips and he takes the bag off of Beth and at that point forward from then she was forced into cooperation. I mean, she did it all mechanically, but he would even force her to like lay in bed with him afterwards. So the news of the kidnapping starts spreading and memes starts freaking out of it, so he decides he's gonna calm the press and the police, throw them off his scent by having Mary write a letter to her husband. Saying things like, listen, things are just moving too fast, keep our flight plans,

maybe I'll show up, we're at a hotel, love you, it's not a kidnapping. And what do they think? So Irv immediately sends it to the FBI and they don't believe the letter. They're like, okay, well, it's a kidnapping. We know it's a kidnapping. So we're not gonna leak this in case the kidnapper gets pissed.

So even the FBI, they only had a couple agents that knew that Irv got a letter. They were keeping it under wraps. So Wednesday comes and passes and the tour never released. And they start forming this routine, you know. They're allowed to bathe, they're finally, you know, allowed to shower. Mary convinces Ming that Beth needs nutrition. So she starts cooking for them in the kitchen.

While they're chained up, the blinds are drawn, and Ming's holding a gun, making sure that nobody tries to run. They would all sit there sharing a meal together, I mean, it was sick and twisted. Mary's birthday would come around, Ming brings home a cake, and birthday cards. They all sing happy birthday. In his head, he's thinking we're moving in the right direction. This is a perfect family. And Beth is really mature for her age. She never tried to question or anger Ming, understood their situation, tried to keep up morale for her mom, but she started developing a stress response where she would pull out hair one by one and roll it into a ball and they found

a slip with Ming's address on it so they memorized it together through the baguette so that he would never see that they knew and the strangest thing is they could hear someone, that it like someone was living in the basement. So they start trying to pound on the floor to get, get whatever that person is to hear them, but Ron never heard them. He knew that others were home. He thought that Ming finally got a girlfriend,

and he would actually mention to his friends who the hell would be in their right mind to date my brother. Like I poor woman, right? But the kitchen was always so clean since she started dating Ming and Brahm was just never close enough to ask these questions anyway so he genuinely thought that Ming had a girlfriend. Mary and Beth thought about writing a note leaving it in the kitchen for Ron but what if Ming found it first. So they never wrote that note. But guess who's still writing his little creepy stories Ming? About Mary where he kidnaps her and it's a result, where she begs for him to have more sex with her because he's so good in bed, a sex god, a stud. So

meanwhile, the press is still going crazy, so he has Mary right two more letters, one more to her husband and one to her parents. So meanwhile, Mary and Beth were held captive for the past 24 days, and he decides that they've got to go on a work trip to Chicago. Rent an RV, drives across state lines, and has them in this RV for like four days. So here's a crazy thing, you're thinking, well why didn't they tell someone? First of all, he had them chained, he took Mary's glasses so that she couldn't see well, he never slept really deeply, and he would constantly tell Mary that he has nothing to lose. If you yell for help, not only will I kill your daughter, I will kill anybody that's near me, and that blood is on your hands.

And Mary literally being just the kind soul she is. She could not put anyone else in danger. They would even go into seers and came out together, or they would buy groceries, I mean, she was terrified. So then when they come back, they're back in the closet. He actually even took them to see Fourth of July fireworks, where there were hundreds of people gathered at Komalake. Again, she was terrified.

So when his brother Ron decides to go to Taiwan for more schooling, he decides to upgrade Mary and Beth to the larger closet. Now, this was another crushing day for Mary. Yes, it's a bigger closet, but Ming seemed stressed. He was on the phone a lot, and he said that the owners of the house were coming in August. So they needed to leave. He wanted to get an RV, a long-term rental for them to stay in. And she said that was the day she realized he is never letting us go.

So the owner of the house is. Mom. Yeah. So one day when he is at work, she starts working on getting herself free, Mary. She does undo the hinges of the closet door because he didn't reinforce them on this one. He was getting comfortable.

He thought all these times that they went out together and she didn't say anything was not because of fear. Well, it was because she wanted to be with him. So finally, she finds the phone in the kitchen. 9-1-1. This is Mary Stoffer. You've been looking for me and my daughter. Please help.

Give some the address. The owner is Ming Shu. He's not home right now, but he could be anytime. He has weapons. He told us that he will kill anyone that comes too close or before letting us escape. So they decide to wait for the police in a bush nearby instead of staying inside. They did not know that the police were already there. What?

So the police are staking out the place trying to find a way to get in and that's when they realize, okay, that's Mary and Beth, right? So they rush him into the car and they start driving to the station. And on the way the officer says, is Jason Wilkman in the house? Huh? Jason? Youman in the house? Huh? Jason? You didn't find him? Ming said that he let him go at a place

where he could be found. We haven't seen Jason since the first night Ming took us. And that's when every single adult, the two cops and Mary in the car knew what had happened. But Beth kept saying, Mommy, what happened to Jason? Didn't Ming take him home? And they were just quiet.

So when they get to the police station, they start reading Mary, her rights. She's like, what? Why? Because we don't know whether you are not, you were complicit in your own disappearance yet. So she's read her rights, she's rushed to the hospital, all of their injuries are looked at. For the past seven weeks, close to two months, Mary had lost close to 20 pounds during her captivity. Meanwhile, the police were successfully able to arrest Ming at work without

incident, and the press are just going nuts over it. Now, on behalf of police planning, Ming and Mary actually bump into each other outside the courthouse. On the parking ramp, I mean obviously they're escorted by FBI agents by the police, but he just starts screaming, why did you go? Why did you run? Why today? He genuinely didn't understand why Mary left it, just didn't make sense to him. So the first trial was the kidnapping of Mary and Beth Stoffer.

They were not even allowed to discuss Jason Wilkman or even talk about how he was part of the crime that he was in the trunk with them. That would be another trial. They had to find Jason's body first. Ming refused to tell them. So Mei, Ming's mom, gets a top notch criminal defense attorney for him, moved back to Minnesota to support her son and she was upset at the situation. Even through all the strange things that happened between them, she stood by him the whole time.

Even when he tried to escape prison and tried to pay another inmate $50,000 to his help him escape and kill Mary Stoffer. Did he escape? No. Then the prison guards noticed that he was only eating Kit Katz. He would always buy Kit Katz. But at any time that they would go through the trash, they never found Kit Kat Rappers. He was saving up all the tin foil from the Kit Kat Rappers to try to disable the electronic alarm.

Listen, I don't know how that works. My brain can't even wrap its mind around it. Are you kidding me? Yeah. So after all these attempts, he was placed in maximum security status, okay? He pled not guilty by reason of insanity. He definitely did it, right? He committed those crimes.

But like, you know, he's crazy. That's like what his defense attorney's trying to go after. He even told the psychiatrist in prison that those were the happiest days of his life when he kidnapped and raped Mary Stoffer. What? So they had five psychiatrists just evaluate the crap out of this guy. And of course the prosecutor and the defense psychiatrist couldn't agree with each other. The defense is saying, obviously he's crazy, like he's out of his mind, he was under psychosis.

And the prosecutors were like, what are you talking about? So he said that he heard these voices, right? We asked him. Be specific. What do they sound like? Do they have a deep voice? Is it always the same voice? No, it's not like a voice like you talking to me more just like hearing things. They're like an inner monologue. Most people have that, you know? Not everyone, but most people have that, you know? Not everyone, but most people have that. That's weird, dude. Like you're not hearing voices

just because your brain is like, oh, I'm a little hungry right now. Then you'd say sometimes I would masturbate and I would see, you know, I'd picture these people moving around in my room. They're like, we don't think he's hallucinating. We think that he's having sexual imagination while he's masturbating, which is again, a very healthy, normal brain. There was no test that they could do that could show

that there was brain damage done, and all of the other tests, I mean, they came back that, yeah, he probably had anti-social personality disorder, he had all of, he had narcissistic personality disorder, he had something where, um, fork, I forgot what it's called, but it's a thing where stalkers believe it's a delusional disorder where you believe that the victim is in love with you It's like when you see a celebrity you've never met them. They're married. They might even not be into your gender But you in your heart you're like no that person loves me like those stalker fans, you know and anytime that they release a song You're like no no no this was they're bitterly seeing you about me But we have to be covert because paparazzi.

Yeah, yeah. So he, you know, possibly potentially, definitely, probably have that, but he did not have all of these, you know, he wasn't undergoing psychosis because they're saying if that's the case, if someone has an obsession for decades, they finally act on it. That's not really psychosis, is it?

And just because the crime that you commit is bizarre does not mean you're crazy. You could just be a very sick person. The jury would watch the tapes and he was going out of his way to get the shot. Set up the frame, make sure the lighting was good. The jury was watching? Yeah, that was a huge debate, too, between the prosecutor and the defense attorney. Whether the jury was, and you want to know it's the craziest thing, the press, there were multiple journalists, like a journalistic outlet,

so like let's say newspapers, that actually filed motions in the court, got attorneys involved to try to make those tapes public access. They said that it was for the education of the public. Disgusting. In what world? Disgusting. Why would they want that? Because they wanted to air it. On their channel?

Yeah. On their newspaper outlets and stuff. Oh my God. Imagine you're cycling. You're on a bike, you're cycling, you're pushing it, you're giving it all you got, you're sweating, you're on a bike, you're cycling, you're pushing it, you're giving it all you got, you're sweating, you're out of breath, you're going uphill, but then you just can't ever stop. They say the minute that you stop, bad things happen, so then you just keep going and you

feel like you're gonna fall off your legs, you're gonna fall off, you don't feel motivated anymore. And you know what that feels like to me? That feels like the never ending cycle of debt. Listen, I've been there. I have had this overwhelming sense of like, oh, am I on? If I look at my credit card statements, it's just going to ruin my day. I don't even want to look at it. Maybe if I don't see it, the balance will just go away magically. Yeah, that's how banks work, okay? So with upstart, they can actually help you make that final payment so that you can finally start getting ahead

So many Americans recently have experienced financial hardship in the last year and upstart can help you regain your footing and get things back on track It's a faster and easy way to pay off your debt with a personal loan all online So whether it's paying off those credit cards consolidating high interest debt or funding personal expenses Over half a million people have used Upstart to get one fixed monthly payment. That's amazing. Upstart knows that you're more than just your credit score, and I love the fact that they're expanding access to affordable credit. So unlike other lenders, Upstart considers your income and current employment to find

you a smarter rate on your loan. Here's the cool part. With a five minute online rate check, you can actually see your rate up front for loans between $1,000 to $50,000. And you can actually receive those funds as fast as one business day after accepting your loan. So find out how upstart can lower your monthly payments

today when you go to upstart.com slash rotten. That's upstart.com slash rotten. Don't forget to use our URL because that's a note that we sent you. Lone amounts will be determined based on your credit income and certain other information provided in your loan application. Go to upstart.com slash rotten. Of course, the staff or family they had attorneys that were like, what the fork? The judge was like, what the fork? Like there was no part of this. No part of this that is educational. Of course, the staff or family, they had attorneys that were like, what the fork, the judge was like, what the fork?

Like, there is no part of this, no part of this that is educational. Like, we have enough transcripts that are the educational part, like the part where he's having these conversations with her, but the rapes, like, why would you even want that out there? Like, this feels, so this is around the time when it was very rare for crimes to be recorded. So this was like the 80s. Most people didn't even have the technology to like do that at home. Obviously now it's very different. So back then it was like, oh, what do we do? What do we do? There's these tapes. So the news just won the shock about you?

Yeah. So the jury, they did watch these tapes. And I mean, it was just, they were heartbroken. And they deliberated. Now the main problem that the jury was facing was that you know he claims that he loved Mary so much but he kidnapped her at gunpoint, kidnapped her daughter, forces them into a truck, rapes her, just non-stop tries to suffocate her daughter while she watches. That's like not even love, even if you have a messed up brain in no world is this love.

In less than eight hours they came to a, guilty, and he was sentenced to 30 years in prison for the kidnapping. No parole before the 30 years was recommended by the court. Now the second trial, this is where it gets even crazier. He said that if they drop the first degree murder charge and only charge him with kidnapping and second degree murder of Jason Wilkman, he will show them where he left Jason. He said that he left him completely alive, so he leads them to the spot and they find Jason's skeletal remains.

He wasn't buried, he was just thrown there. A little six year old. The idea through his clothes, his dental records, and they knew that he had skull damage, they didn't know if it was a gunshot or blunt force trauma with the tire iron, And they also couldn't definitively say if he died slowly or if it was painless. So at this trial, Mary Stoffer takes the stand again. So this is her second time to talk about Jason's last moments in that trunk and then a scream. An animal-like scream and Ming runs across his table straight towards Mary with the knife

that he smuggled, puts it to her throat, and says, I just want to be with her one more time, I will kill her if anyone comes near us, and starts holding Mary hostage in front of the judge, the courtroom, and the jury. So of course nobody listens, an FBI agent tackles him to the ground, but he is able to slash Mary's face, and she had to be rushed to the hospital to have 62 stitches on her face. The jury was rushed out of the courtroom, they were crying, they were sobbing, they were screaming, they were traumatized, there was blood everywhere. How did that happen? Yeah, I mean, it's so ridiculous, because why was he not ch not chained like you're talking about an obsessive man And you're bringing the victim into the courtroom exactly

And he's not chained After this he would be but like little too late Way to re-traumatize the victim on court. Yeah In front of all these police and law enforcement and here here's the kicker. The defense attorney said to the judge, well, I have no choice but to move for a mistrial. There's just no way. The jury has been exposed to violent behavior. They can't be unbiased now.

And the judge said, we're not granting no stupid mistrial on misbehavior. The misbehavior is the conduct of the defendant. Exactly. If the conduct of the defendant is prejudicing him, it's a matter of his own doing. His attitude, his demeanor, his actions during the trial can be considered by the jury in arriving to their verdict. Mm-hmm.

So the jury went on to deliberate, but the drama kept going. So the jury had been staying in a hotel. They were sequestered. They couldn't read the news. They couldn't, you know, do anything. But two of the jurors fell in love. So it's like, is this a gonflict? What do we do? But they continued with the deliberations. Yeah, there was a lot of drama on this one. And they found him guilty on all counts.

He was sentenced to 40 years concurrent. So that means he can serve the 30 years and the 40 years at the same time. So it's only 40 years. It's not 70 years. It's only 40 years for something like this? For a second degree murder, I guess. Oh, second degree, I see. And Mary and Irv, they went back to the Philippines, did their missionary work again?

Yeah. Finally retired in 2009. Mary said that faith pulled her through the whole ordeal. Even afterwards, she said her ability to forgive helped her heal and move on with life. She said, we pray for me. We hated what he did, but we didn't hate him. I mean, obviously she doesn't want him to be free and re-friend, but they have a lot of good in their souls. And she said, he didn't get to ruin our lives, he only ruined his. And this is, you know, I think this is really important after the last many so that we had, yes, religion is beautiful, okay. It's just the people, right? I mean, this is such a beautiful

display of faith, right? How strong and how beautiful their souls are, right? And Beth Stopper, married, has a family, and during the probation hearings for me, their positions flopped. So Mary was the one protecting Beth, but now Beth was like this protective figure, just protecting her mom throughout all of this. During the trials and all of that, she's just, yeah. And even the doctors alerted the courts, listen,

Ming probably shouldn't be let out. He's highly likely to engage in harmful acts of sexual misconduct, Yeah. And even the doctors alerted the courts, listen. Ming probably shouldn't be let out. He's highly likely to engage in harmful acts of sexual misconduct because he's never really been treated for his delusions. He's a loner with no friends. The only person who he can stay with is his mom, and she's only enabling him. He plays victim, and she believes it. She's all aboard.

She says, oh, the only reason he's serving this much time is because he's Asian! I'm not puncture. And so even after the trial's ended, he filed a motion to get the video tapes back, because they were his property. These included the rapes of Mary. So the court legally agreed, it was his property, so they returned it. No. But when he tried to watch it in prison, he realized that a court employee had gone in and erased every frame by frame and there was nothing in the tapes. And he was pissed.

Smart. So the court said, yeah, legally, but... Yeah, legally you can have the VHS tapes. Yeah. Yeah, legally, but they are corrupted. Yeah, oopsie. We dropped them in water. Happened to all this. Yeah, it's just the thing. He pretends to feel remorse, but not really. He said that him kidnapping Mary wasn't some sick act, but it was a schoolboy crush gone wrong. And here's what he said about the murder of Jason. I never should have killed that little boy. He probably wouldn't have been able to identify me anyway.

Not because he killed a six year old boy. And so in 2010, the judge recommended that he not be released and would spend the rest of his life in prison because he's still an active threat to society. And he was last night parole in 2016. This one is bonkers to me. I mean, the fact that this is his algebra teacher, I feel like there's so many just like plots of like, whether it's a movie, whether it's a porn,

whether it's this, you know, like the hot female teacher and the student, and why is happening? Is this not your biggest nightmare? This is my biggest nightmare. Someone remembering you from years and years ago. And I don't remember them. Exactly.

That's my biggest nightmare. Somebody holds this thing on you for years and years. I am anytime I meet someone, my biggest fear is is meeting because I'm like really not a grudge-filled person But grudge-filled people are terrifying to me or people with like these long memories for these very emotional things No, it's like nice to remember nice things You know, but like what if I bump into someone 10 years ago and they will never let it go Yeah, but usually you you hear about these like in movies. Yeah.

But this person though, it's real. It's real. And the fact that like, they just hit it so well. Like the mom didn't even tell anyone about what he was the weird things that he was doing from the outside he looked completely normal. Yeah, maybe a little loner, but who isn't one these days? And Mary, she was just living her life, getting married, having kids moving on. I mean, she's just such a strong woman. I don't even know what to say. Okay, she's an inspiration. So I hope you guys

enjoyed this week's main episode. Is this a huge fear for you? I mean, it's terrifying. I think every teacher is. Yeah, I think teachers have a scary job, okay? For a lot of reasons. Do you even remember anyone from 15 years ago? Do you remember your teacher from 15 years ago? Do you? No. I only remember one teacher and I loved her. That's why I remember, oh, and another one.

He was so scary. One time I ate cheesets in his class and he yelled at me for like, what felt like an hour straight, but I'm sure it was only like 30 seconds. Well, he doesn't like cheezin'. He says that it causes rats to come into the school. And I'm the reason that there's rats in the school essentially. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So I remember him and I remember one other teacher.

She was amazing. But that's it. I remember one other teacher. She was amazing! But that's it. I would never stalk them. I promise. I hope you guys enjoyed this week's main episode and I'll see you guys on Sunday. Bye!