Rotten Mango - Korean Teacher Laughs After Stabbing 8 Yr-Old Student To Death Because “I Want To Die With Someone”

Episode Date: March 30, 2025

2 people are rushed into the emergency room. The doctors and nurses don’t ask questions - they have one objective in mind. Save these people.  Both are suffering from stab wounds. Sadly, only 1 of them will make it. 8 year old, Haneul, is deceased from multiple stab wounds to her neck, back, and chest.  The 48 year old woman however, is alive.  The nurses try to piece together what might have happened with the little information they have. The older woman is a teacher. The 8 year old girl was attacked in her elementary school.  Perhaps, a knife wielding madman snuck into the school and attacked the little girl. Perhaps, the teacher tried to protect her student but was stabbed in the process. It will be difficult to tell the teacher that her student that she presumably tried to protect - did not make it.  But when the teacher wakes up - the nurses don’t know how to handle the situation anymore. Because… she is laughing.  She is giggling.  She killed 8 year old Haneul and she is seemingly happy. Content. Giddy with excitement.      Full show notes at rottenmangopodcast.com

It's not the same as it is in America. I mean, for one, when you step into this building, it's four, sometimes six stories tall, and you turn to your right, the first thing that you see is a line of cubbies, just spanning the entire wall. You have to pick an empty cubby, slip off your shoes, put them in the cubby, and then you have to switch to indoor shoes when you walk in. You can't walk in with socks or barefoot. You need to slip on dedicated indoor shoes that you have to bring. Then it's time for the daily stair walk. You head to the staircase, and then you walk all your way up to the designated room.

Newer buildings have elevators for accessibility, but this one does not. So once you get to the designated floor, you just see one single hallway with rows. On both sides of the hallway are these massive sliding doors that lead into these big rooms with rows and rows and rows and rows of desks lined up. Every single person that you pass is wearing a knee-length plaid skirt or trousers and a blazer. You find your designated spot. You start cleaning. There's no janitors. Everybody is responsible for your own designated area. And once you're done, you look out the giant window and the building is almost in this U-shape that's centered around this courtyard. It sounds like a large, sometimes terrifying building,

but it's not. There's not that many entrances or exits. The halls are usually patrolled by the staff. Welcome to a South Korean elementary school where it is rather difficult to go missing. February 10th of 2025, so not too long ago, eight-year-old Han-e is one of the last kids to be picked up from the school. When the adult comes to sign her out of her aftercare class, Haner is instructed to walk

down a flight of stairs to the front entrance. She's done this Monday through Friday. This is not a new schedule for Haner. The front desk, the academy teacher who's picking her up, waits a minute, then waits two minutes, five minutes, now it's getting weird. But maybe she stopped by the restrooms first before coming downstairs, or maybe she forgot her book in another classroom. The academy teacher waits a full 10 minutes before all hell breaks loose, because an eight-year-old cannot just go missing in the span of 10 minutes inside the school.

How is that even possible? There's barely any entrances or exits that are not patrolled. Even if she had run out, she left her outdoor shoes. So what? She's just running away in her slippers? Additionally, even if she was able to make it out of the school, someone's gonna see her in the courtyard or the parking lot that she has to get through. But nobody's seen her. Teachers and faculty are all alerted that the 8-year-old Haner is missing. They tracked down the teacher that was last with she's so confused I was just with her I mean you guys called her out of the class after care so I sent her downstairs I mean the stairs

are just around the corner she could have gone down the stairs and then she would have been practically face to face with the front desk so what do you mean? so the front desk will call the classroom say hey release not release, not release, like. Yeah, release this one kid. They're here for pickup. Then it's up to the kid to walk from the second floor down the stairs to the first floor

and then get picked up from the main front entrance. Right, but 10 minutes later, she's still not there. No, and now they're checking all the classrooms under the desk, in the teacher's break room, cafeteria, all the restrooms. Hannett is missing, she's gone. But it doesn't make sense. How does she leave the building

without somebody seeing her? By 5.30 PM, the entire area is in lockdown. There are police cars, ambulances surrounding the entire elementary school. Neighbors are standing outside in their big puffer jackets, it's snowing. Their eyes are red from crying. Their hands are red from the cold wind.

They're all huddled together. If one of the neighbors stands there and does a full 360 turn, they're going to see massive apartment buildings surrounding the entire school. That's thousands upon thousands of apartment units that Hanuk could be trapped in. Her phone location shows her in this area. So either she was in the school, That's thousands upon thousands of apartment units that Haner could be trapped in. Her phone location shows her in this area. So either she was in the school, she's lured into an apartment,

she's in a car somewhere. We don't know. There's so many possibilities. Authorities and Haner's family are running around trying to find her. And it's not until 6 p.m. that night that two people are rushed into the emergency room. When was the pickup again, initially?

440pm. So it's been an hour and 20 minutes. Yes. 8 year old Haneul and a 48 year old woman, a school teacher, are rushed into the ER both suffering from stab wounds. The doctors, they're not given a rundown of exactly what happened, they're just here to do their jobs, which is to save these people. Eight-year-old Haner does not make it. She does not survive her injuries. But the 48-year-old schoolteacher, she's alive.

I mean, she's gonna be okay. It's a very grim feeling. Some nurses are likely thinking of all the scenarios in their head. Okay, a knife-wielding madman snuck into the school targeting kids. Maybe they killed eight-year-old Haner and the teacher, in an attempt to try and protect her, was stabbed. Was the attacker after the child, or after the teacher, or after all the children? Regardless, it's going to be very difficult to tell the teacher that the student did not survive. When the teacher wakes up, all those concerns are gone. Because the 48-year-old woman, the school teacher, she sits up in the hospital bed and she starts laughing.

Because she did it. This is what it seems like she wanted. She wanted to kill the eight-year-old girl, and now she seems very content with what she's done. This is the current ongoing case of eight-year-old Hanul in South Korea. We would like to thank today's sponsors who have made it possible for Rotten Mango to support Baby to Baby. They're a nonprofit that provides essential items to more than 1 million children across

the country in multiple different shelters, domestic violence programs, foster care hospitals, and underserved schools. This episode's partnerships have also made it possible to support Rotten Mingle's growing team and we'd also like to thank you guys for your continued support. As always, full show notes are available at rottenminglepodcast.com. Today's case involves themes of unaddressed mental illness and CA resulting in death, so please take some time if that's too overwhelming and we will see you in the next one. This case is pretty recent and is South Korean, so we had our international researchers work on gathering the most updated information.

However, there will still be updates after this episode goes up. We're going to do our best to keep you updated. So with that being said, let's get started. February of 2025, this app starts going viral in South Korea. It feels like every single person and their mother is downloading this app. It's not TikTok. The app is actually quite controversial. People are having full blown debates about the ethical implications of such an app.

Are you really promoting stalking? I mean, since when did stalking and invasion of privacy become a mainstream thing that we just all accept now? The app in question has a few features that's rubbing a lot of people the wrong way. The app not only tracks your live location, but it also tracks every single separate place that your phone has been in the past 24 hours. So after the facts, someone can go in and see at 2 30 p.m. you were at the doctor's office. If you were out running 50 different errands that day, the app is going to track all of that.

Do I see that or somebody else sees that? Somebody else. Now, let's say because you're out running errands all day long, your phone is on silent and you don't hear your best friend or someone you love blowing up your phone, they can just click on an alarm sound and it'll ring an alarm by passing the silencing features on your phone to make sure you and everybody else around you knows, hey, I was trying to reach you, call me back. It also monitors all the different apps that are being used on your phone, how long someone

spends on each app, and the most intriguing thing though is the sound around feature, which sounds innocent enough, but a lot of netizens understandably find it one of the creepiest things an app can do. Think of it as live listening. Let's say I have phone A, you have phone B. I'm the account holder. That means at any given point in my day, I can decide on my phone on phone A to click this little ear button on the app and I can hear whatever your phone picks up. I can't reject it?

No. So no matter if you're a thousand feet from me, a thousand miles from me, if your phone is at a cafe, I can hear as much as the phone's internal microphone can pick up. Obviously if the phone is in your jean pocket, it's gonna be muffled a little bit, but if it's on the table, I could probably hear your conversation

with whoever you're having, and then conversations around the cafe. How is that legal? Like, forget about the personal side. Imagine you're in a private meeting. Yes. Somebody else can just secretly listen in like that? Yes, because parents have all the rights. This is a parenting app.

PhoneA is used by a parent and they can live listen on their children's phones, whether they be at school or at a cafe or an after-school program. I can see why a lot of people call it a stalker app, but parents in South Korea, they start mass downloading this app February of 2025. Hannah's dad already had it installed onto Hannah's phone for a few months by this point. She didn't know it existed. She didn't know it was on her phone, but she's eight.

The argument that some people have is I think these types of parenting apps are a lot more heavily debated once that kid turns into a teenager. Because when you hit your teens, it's a lot more of a need for privacy. Although I do think that even an eight-year-old deserves a heavy amount of privacy. I wouldn't say heavy amount, but a good amount of privacy and not feeling like somebody is listening to them all the time. Wait, that is kind of mind-blowing right now. How is that normal? Okay, I've seen lots of debates. I think as someone who does not have kids, I'm not entirely certain. I did talk to my sister who has two kids, but they're very young and she is, she doesn't

believe in apps like this. She thinks if you've already don't have that level of trust. However, I do see some people in Korea argue differently. They say in Korea it's a little bit different because the kids are a lot more mobile. So in America it's like you drive your kid to school or the bus picks them up. Then you pick them up and then you bring them somewhere. Everything is driven. In Korea you see eight-year-olds taking the subway by themselves. So they're saying it might be more necessary for an eight-year-old. I don't know the ethic and moral concerns of this. it's hard

for me to debate as someone who does not have children. i personally feel like it's an invasion of privacy but again i'm not a parent so i wouldn't know. now the argument here being is that hana is eight. it's likely that she would not have cared too much either way if it was on her phone or not. her parents always knew where she was which was always always at school or after-school program or hagwon or the after-school academy and then home on repeat five days a week. like that's it. except Monday, February 10th 2025. after school is technically at around 2 p.m. so the class ends at 2 p.m. Hanyeol is scheduled to stay in the after-school program until 4 40 p.m. so almost three hours to get ahead on school work get her homework done get prepared for academy lessons

The Academy teacher then goes around and picks up all the kids from the neighboring schools and then brings them to Academy At 4 30 at like 5. Okay, so there's more classes at 5 o'clock. Yes, and this is not just a hunter schedule This is like the typical day of an 8-year-old in South Korea. You're talking heavily competitive job market in South Korea. Like you start preparing when you're 5. So she's waiting for her hagwon teacher to come pick her up and she's in the after-school program at the school. I will say that the three hours that she's waiting after class, it's less of a school and more so a transition class. It's not a free for all, but it's not active teaching. You're not like actively learning,

you're probably doing your homework. That is where she is until 4.40 p.m. She is almost always the last one to be picked up just based on the academy schedule. She is instructed that day, she's in that program that day, Monday, February 10th, she's instructed to make her way downstairs because the hagwon teacher has come to pick her up. But that day she just vanishes. She's gone. The after-school

program teacher sees her walk out of the classroom and then poof she's missing. Ten minutes later everybody's asking her where did Hanyeol go and she's like what are you talking about? She left the classroom. Haner's parents are alerted. They're freaking out. What do you mean she's missing? What do you mean? Haner's grandmother who lives closer to the school, she rushes over there.

And when Haner's dad, Kim, gets to the school, he knows this is not normal. By this point, there's a few officers trying to help out and trying to help Haner. He's firm. This is not normal. This is not something my daughter does. She's not overworked. She's not overstressed. Like, this is not normal. The biggest fear is that she was lured

off the school grounds into one of those thousands of apartment units just surrounding the entire building, but even that doesn't make sense. It doesn't make sense. Someone would have seen something. Kim pulls up the parenting app that he downloaded on Hanner's phone. Hanner's phone location shows that she is in this vicinity of the school, but they can't narrow it down even more. Basically, the app said she's either in the school or one of the 10 apartment buildings surrounding the school. Kim tries calling Hunter. She's not picking up. He goes into the app. He clicks on the

little ear button, the sound around feature, and if Hunter has her phone with her, he's going to be able to hear whatever the phone picks up. He's standing outside in the freezing cold. He's trying to listen as close as he can. He hears something. He's trying to get away from all the people screaming Hunter's name so he can clearly hear the phone. And the first thing he notices, the first thing he tells everyone is,

when I first heard it, I realized the sounds are not coming from the outside. Inside. She's inside somewhere. This phone is inside in a building. It doesn't sound like she's outside. There's no car noise, no wind, no noise pollution whatsoever. So she's inside. But he cannot hear Haner's voice at all. She's not talking.

He hears on the other end, heavy breathing? Labored breathing? There's just heavy breathing on the other end, and it's not coming from Haner. And I don't know if I've ever really given it thought until this point, but based on how little clues there are right now of where Haner is, Kim realizes someone is with Haner. Someone is heavy breathing.

He is certain that this is not Hananner because Hanner is eight years old. Sure, you can say breathing sounds the same. It's just breathing noises. But imagine an eight year old and a 40 year old run a marathon. Both of them are gonna be heavy breathing at the end, trying to catch their breath, but it's going to sound different.

It's because the fact as adults age, the airway muscles, the cartilage becomes less elastic. You're gonna try to catch your breath as an older adult, and the airflow is going to sound more turbulent. There's actually medical reasons, like in your anatomy, why your heavy breathing sounds different depending on your age and depending on your medical conditions. You're not going to be able to as quickly catch your breath as, let's say, an eight-year-old. Maybe there's even guttural throat noises that just cannot come from the vocal cords of an eight year old.

Kim can hear it, but regardless, he is certain whoever is heavy breathing on the other line is not Haner. It sounds like someone middle age just ran 400 feet, is winded. Why would someone be winded near Haner? Where is Haner? Why does this person have her phone? Also, there's these sounds as if someone is opening and closing drawers. Like you have a desk and you're just opening

and closing drawers rapidly in quick succession. Like multiple drawers are being opened and then closed. It's like someone is frantically looking for something. Do we know how long has it been at this point when he started to listen? About 20 minutes since she's gone missing. About 10, 15, 20-ish minutes. So very early on. Like she just went missing.

Yeah. Haner's dad is frozen in the middle of what looks like hell has broken loose. There's police cars, there's officers, there's neighbors and teachers all screaming Hanyar's name and he's just hearing heavy breathing. He brings his phone down and he presses the alarm button. If Hanyar's phone is anywhere nearby, they're all going to be able to hear this loud alarm bell ring. But instead, through the active sound around feature, he can hear someone quote, I could hear the sound of someone forcibly terminating alarms that I kept sending through her phone.

Someone is like opening the zipper of Haner's backpack and like clicking. Like he can hear like someone banging on her phone. So for an hour, Haner's dad is listening to this whilst also actively searching for his daughter. But it's not going to be him that finds his daughter. Haner's not gonna be him that finds his daughter. Haner's grandmother will be the one to find her. Grandma Kim has been searching this entire school building for like the 10th time. She's going up and down every single floor,

checking every single classroom, along with the other faculty members. A lot of police officers don't even think that Haner is in the school building. They don't even think that she's missing. Some of them are like, maybe she's stressed out. Maybe she doesn't like Haegwon. She doesn't wanna go to the afterschool art academy, which it just doesn't make sense

But it also doesn't make sense that she's in this school. There's not that many places that she could be hiding There's barely any hiding spots Grandma Kim doesn't even know what to do She's gone through every single floor But it's not like she can just burst into a random strangers's apartment in all the neighboring apartment buildings being like, do you know where my eight-year-old granddaughter is? So she can just spend her energy going through the second floor again for the tenth time. This is where her granddaughter went missing.

This is where she was last seen. Grandma Kim searches the entire floor again. She's about to take a left onto the stairs that lead her back to the first floor when a small door catches her eye. I mean the door has been there all along. It's the audio video room. Every school has one. It's usually like a soundproofed windowless room. Sometimes there's windows but there's shades, blackout curtains. It's where the kids are taken if they need to watch a presentation on a projector or if they need to watch an educational movie. Instead of those rolling screens or like the projector screens in every single classroom,

you go to the audio video room. It's almost always locked because you know the last thing you want is a troublemaker getting in there, connecting to the speakers, blasting some curse words or music. But there is something about this room. Grandma Kim reaches for the doorknob, turns it, and it pushes open. It's unlocked. She swings open the door and it's dark, the shades are drawn, but the light coming in from the door she just opened from the hallway, she can see that there's nobody in the room. There's nothing amiss. There's no desk that's

overturned. There's nothing. Maybe it's intuition, maybe it's being thorough. She sees another small door inside the audio room, which is probably a storage closet for all the gear. She walks up towards it, opens the door, there's no light switch she can quickly find, so now there's barely any light coming into the closet. The hallway door is open a crock, so there's some light, but barely. Grandma Kim uses the light on her phone, and she just sees legs, like large legs on the floor. There is a woman, a full grown woman, just laying on the floor. She moves her phone up, and the woman's face is covered in blood.

Grandma Kim is terrified. She's about to drop her phone. Every hair on her neck is standing up and is telling her, get out, get out, danger, like you need to leave. But she has to ask. She's trying to remain calm. Have you seen my granddaughter? Her name is Hannah.

No. Or she's conscious. Yes. Grandma Kim runs out of the storage closet, out of the audio room and into the hallway. She's calling Hannah's dad. She's calling the police. She's standing guard because she knows something's going on in that closet. But Hannah's dad already knows when he picks up the phone because he heard his mom's voice. After

an hour of listening to heavy breathing on the other end of the parenting app, he suddenly hears his mom's voice. Have you seen my granddaughter? Her name is Haneul. And a woman responds, no. Grandma Kim stands guard at the audio video room door in the hallway and she's like waiting for the police to arrive. They get there in seconds, minutes. It's like barely any time has passed. Maybe there's an attacker going around the school. She's terrified. Whoever did that to the lady might have done that to Haner. Where the hell are they? Are they attacking more people actively?

But also there was something about that woman. Grandma Kim sensed that she didn't seem scared. She didn't ask for help. Were they attacking more people actively? But also there was something about that woman. Grandma Kim sensed that she didn't seem scared. She didn't ask for help. She wasn't like, no, help me, save me, there's a killer. She didn't say any of that. She just said, no, I haven't seen your granddaughter. Why do you ask such a random thing?

Grandma Kim would later say, it didn't look like it was her own blood either. It didn't look like she was bleeding. it looked like she was covered in blood. Within minutes, police and Hanyeol's father are surrounding the second floor audio video room storage closet, and the storage unit door that grandma Kim had just opened and saw the woman on the floor, now locked from the inside. Who the hell is that woman that she just saw? Usually every single school has that one haunted ghost story. There are ghost stories of long ago a student that was pushed off the roof.

Sometimes, most of the times it's not true. And they now haunt the locker rooms or how the school was built on a cemetery and now there's always screams coming from the gym showers because that's where some of the graves were buried over. And then nobody goes after dark. There's always a ghost haunting the grounds. This elementary school in Daegu, South Korea, their ghost story is this one teacher.

When she walks down the halls, everybody gets quiet. You can hear her before you see her. Ksh, ksh, kshh, kshh. It just echoes down the hallway and all the kids, these elementary schoolers, they step to the side because it's creepy. They press their bodies up against the walls to avoid her. She just walks down the center of the hallway with a box cutter in her hand. Kshh. She pushes the blade all the way out and then pushes it back in.

The kid said it was really weird. Like, I mean, it's not threatening. She's not holding the box cutter up to people or wielding it around, but she just keeps fidgeting with it, like pulling the blade out, pulling it in, making the noise nonstop. Is this a story or this is the actual teacher?

This is the actual teacher that these kids in this specific school have said about this teacher She just goes a ghost story. No, it's like she's the ghost haunting the hallway. She has this empty look on her face These are what the kids are saying. She has these dark circles that just come down all the way into our cheek in Schools in South Korea. It's very different from America where if you see other teachers in the hallway, you might be like hi, Mrs Smith, but you don't really do anything more. And sometimes if you don't recognize a teacher, you don't say anything. But in South Korea, you have to insight, like you have to bow to every single teacher. And so a lot of students will bow to her. And she'll just look at you with a blank expression as if she's looking through you like she's a ghost. And then she's using this box cutter,

pulling the blade out, pulling the blade in. And then sometimes she's a ghost. And then she's using this box cutter, pulling the blade out, pulling the blade in, and then sometimes she's just walking around with, you know those painters tape, the blue rolls of tape? Nobody knows what she's doing with that blue tape. She just walks around with a roll of blue tape in her hands. Other students would complain to their parents at home. I mean, she brings in this long stick to the classroom. It's like a long ruler stick that teachers use to point at the words on the board, but she likes to hit her podium with it. It's pretty hard. The parents are trying to reason with their own kids. Yeah, well maybe you kids are crazy and she's trying to get your attention to get you focused. No, she swings it so loudly that we can hear the air whipping. Like it's not normal.

They also tell their parents, I heard she even broke a computer in the teacher's office. Something about her is not normal. And the parents all think, well that's just, that's crazy, that's just a rumor. The weirdest part is, she used to be one of the nicest teachers in the entire school. That is why she's the ghost story of the school. It's like one day she comes to work and she's the ghost story of the school. It's like one day she comes to work and it's someone else inside of her body. She goes from being the nicest teacher, the best teacher, the one that would give you snacks, would never make you feel dumb for asking

stupid questions, one of the most patient teachers, to just being a ghost that's haunting the hallways of the school. One student says, I don't know, she was very well spoken and super kind. I don't know what happened to her. Within minutes, the police and Haner's father arrive in front of the locked storage closet door in the audio video room and the police start kicking in the door 20 times to finally get it open and when they rush in they turn on the light and they see the woman that Grandma Kim was telling them about. Middle-aged 40-something year old woman laying limp on the floor and they see the woman that grandma kim was telling them about. middle-aged 40-something year old woman laying limp on the floor and next to her is a tiny little body covered in blood. hanner. she was placed deeper in the closet so grandma kim could not see her but both hanner

and the teacher are laying on their backs towards each other, heads facing the same direction, laying on their backs towards each other, heads facing the same direction, covered in blood. henre had been stabbed dozens of times in the left part of her neck, arm, and chest area, as well as her back. there were clear defensive stab wounds on her hands. it seems that she was trying to block the knife with her hands, and the teacher has a self-inflicted wound on her neck. both of them are rushed instantly to the hospital where Haner is pronounced dead at 6 35 p.m. This is after one and a half hours since she had got missing. Eight-year-old Haner was stabbed to death by a teacher from her school. Inside the ICU unit, the teacher is laying there on

an oxygen respirator not allowed to have orally, not even allowed to drink water. And the second that they take the tubes out of her when she's stable enough, the teacher starts laughing. That's what the nurses and the doctors have reported. Every single doctor and nurse in that room goes still because what the hell is she laughing about? So they all knew what happened at this point. Yeah. The police are guarding the hospital room and when they hear her laughter, they rush in to question her. None of this makes sense. I mean, they clearly know what happened, but nothing else makes any sense whatsoever. The teacher is a second grade teacher at the elementary school. She's not even Haner's teacher. She's not even the after school program teacher that Haner was with.

It doesn't appear like this teacher even had any sort of interactions with Hanner of a deeper length. Why did she kill her? No connection whatsoever. No, it's not like Hanner was, not that it would be called for or not saying it's an excuse of, oh, she was the troublemaker in the class, but no, like truly. And again, that's not an excuse. That's not a reason behind it. but it's even more bizarre considering the fact that there is truly no connection there. They don't even really interact with each other at all. The teacher tells authorities when she's calmed down from her supposed laughing fit,

it doesn't matter which child, it didn't matter to me, I just wanted to die with someone. So I told the child leaving the care classroom after school program classroom, I'll give you a book, you need to read this book. And I told the child leaving the care classroom after school program classroom, I'll give you a book, you need to read this book. And then I got them in the audio video classroom. That's why I strangled her and stabbed her with a knife. It didn't matter which kid I took with me.

I just didn't want to die alone. What? Within hours of these cases everywhere, it is one of the biggest cases in the news cycle in South Korea, but also international headlines. news outlets like BBC, teacher fatally stabs eight-year-old in South Korea, CBS News teacher stabs eight-year-old student to death at elementary school in South Korea CNN, teacher accused of killing first-grader as school stabbing shocked

South Korea but nobody not even in Korea nobody knows who the teacher is. they just know her to be a 48 year old teacher from the school. That's it. Her identity has not been released Understandably netizens start demanding for it. The public should have the right to know who the perpetrator is People in Korea are commenting personal information must be disclosed on this case. The identity should not be kept hidden Which I will mention in the very beginning before it was confirmed by authorities that the teacher did wake up and did admit to the stabbing. Again, she hasn't been on trial so we can't say that she is guilty of first-degree murder, but she did state that she did do it. But there was brief confusion prior to that online about whether or not there was like a third

party involved because people could just not wrap their heads around the idea that a Teacher would stab an eight-year-old student so they thought maybe there's like a knife Wielding madman inside the school that hasn't been caught so why release the teachers identity? We don't know for sure But once the teacher more or less confirmed that she stabbed hunter whether she'll take it back or not We don't know but people start demanding for the release of her identity. netizens argue, and it's not like the public aren't guessing, they're saying we're actually doing more harm than good by not releasing her identity. people are pulling out random teachers names being like maybe it's this one, this one looks 48, this one said she's 48, this one used to work in that school, just pointing the

finger at any other teacher. but the law in Korea works in a way that a seven person deliberation committee has to go through the case, take into account all the aggravating factors, and finally they decide we're gonna release the identity. But the process is not over. They have to now alert the teacher. They say you can appeal our decision or you can say go ahead and we're gonna release the identity, to which she immediately consents. She consents? Yeah. to which she immediately consents. She consents? Yeah. And a full month after the murder, the teacher's identity is revealed to be a 48-year-old teacher, Choi Wan-myung. Mrs. Myung. There are two photos of her released. Her professional headshot for school and her mug shots.

Her headshot, she appears to be a very normal, if even a bit conventionally attractive teacher. She looks younger than her age in the headshot at least, with a bob cut to her chin and side bangs. She's got a pleasant insung, which means, I guess, facial composition that Koreans tend to gravitate towards. It's like she doesn't have really angry eyebrows or very suspicious eyes. I don't know these are all very arbitrary stupid judgmental things that some people go by in Korean standards but generally her insung seems approachable. she seems really nice which shocked a lot of netizens. some netizens were commenting if they saw her on the street asking for help they would help her let alone if she was the teacher at

their school they would go with her into the audio video room. A little back context for Korean Incheon, right? If I'm correct, it's big in Korean culture. Like when you meet someone, you take in like their first impression, their aura, their energy, their facial vibes, and then you kind of, you know, give a little vibe towards this person, either it's good or bad. Yeah, so okay. First impression, I feel like in American standards, and I'm not promoting like the South Korean Inseong, it's just something that I always hear my parents say, or like Koreans

talk about frequently. In American standards, when you meet someone, their first impression is usually based off of the conversation that you have, or what they talk about or what they're interested in. In Korean standards, it's a mixture of that plus their facial composition and then just the energy and even the way that they're dressed. So the insang is not just good or bad. It can be like, oh, she gives me a very soft girl impression or she gives me a very cool girl impression. Like she seems headstrong. It's not like good or bad.

It's just like everybody has a different aura. Like she seems opinionated but in a fun way. Like it's kind of that. And Koreans believe that sometimes your facial composition could add to that. And it's actually very big in the culture. Yes. Like very big. So it's for them to give a what is it? In-tang. In-tang of someone and then they see that this is the person who did this crime. Now that's a conversation. Yes. So I think what a lot of people were expecting

was a headshot of a teacher who just looks like an evil, mean, vile, like you just see her in the hallways and she looks like she came to work hating children. I think that's the picture that everybody was expecting. And she is that. It's just that her headshot did not feel that way. So I think that just adds to the fact that netizens are even more scared in Korea, because they're saying, of course, eight year old Han-ae went with her. First of all, she's an authority figure and she's in the school. This is a safe zone, typically. Obviously in America it's different right now, but also in

South Korea things are changing. But it's typically supposed to be a safe zone for students, especially to trust their own teachers. And then she looks so kind and friendly. People are saying, if I saw her on the street I would have gone with her. But others who just look at her mugshot say, oh, it's different. If you just look at her mugshot, she looks scary. And then others comment, well, people say she looks scary, but she only looks scary because she did something scary.

If ordinary people took a photo using their back camera right after waking up without washing their face, that's what her mugshot looks like. To which others point out how ironic society is. So aside from her pictures, they were just saying like, we got her identity and all we wanna do is judge her looks. ["The Last Supper"] Aside from her pictures, we know a few things about Myung.

She has a son that is taking the college entrance exam this year. It's likely that she has recently divorced. And that's about it. That is all we know about her. I think that there is this natural yearning to know more about her, that netizens feel like there's gotta be something in her digital footprint, or something that indicates that she's this sick, twisted, nasty little seed that has been left behind.

Like we got to find something. But all people could find was her thesis when she's getting her master's degree. In it, she writes about switching to a level-based curriculum to break away from the homogenized curriculum to help students pursue self-directed individual learning. She also writes, there is a quote, there is a saying, the quality of education cannot surpass the level of the teacher. So she fundamentally agrees with that saying, that the quality of the education

cannot surpass the level of the teacher. So teachers need to rise up and do more and be at the forefront of making sure the kids are receiving quality education and it falls on them. Which maybe she felt that genuinely years ago, but clearly not now. That's all people were able to dig up on Myung and that, in a few days before allegedly killing Hunter, she choked a colleague of hers. Four days before the murder, at around 5 15 p.m.

this is a random Thursday, one of the teachers at the school, let's call them Mrs. A, she's springing out of the classroom, one hand on her throat, the other hand grabbing the walls in front of her. She's running. She's stopping to cough. I mean, it's not even a small cough. It's like she's choking on a grape. She runs to the teacher's offices.

Thankfully, none of the teachers have gone home after class. They're working on lessons plans. Her face is entirely red and she's like Mrs. Myeong, Mrs. Myeong. And they're like, what happened? What happened? Mrs. A explains, I. Myeong. And they're like, what happened? What happened? Mrs. A explains, I was on the way out when I saw her sitting in the dark of a random classroom, just like in the middle of the classroom, crouching down.

I noticed that she hadn't really been herself recently, so I slid open the door. I walked in and she's sitting there motionless and it was kind of creepy. So I stepped getting in a little bit closer. Mrs. Myung, are you okay? Suddenly she reaches up, grabs Mrs. A's left arm, twists it behind her and backs so she's like pinning her like a pro wrestling move. Suddenly Mrs. A's arm is behind her in a very painful way. She's getting dragged onto the ground. Myung starts grabbing the back of Mrs. A's puffer jacket, choking her on her own collar, and she starts freaking out. She's coughing, trying to scream. She's being strangled, and this is unprompted out of nowhere. Mrs. A has one arm to try and scratch Myung's arms off

her neck. Mrs. A, she's trying to think quick. She's not trying to piss off Ms. Myung. She tries to reason with her. Can you tell me what's going on? What's going on? Can you talk to me? Are you okay? In a blank voice, she claims Myung just tells her, why, why do only I have to be unhappy? What about all of you? Like this is a attempt at murder. And then suddenly a vibrating noise.

Mrs. A looks down, Myung's phone is vibrating on the table and she's trying to signal, And then suddenly, a vibrating noise. Mrs. A looks down. Myung's phone is vibrating on the table. And she's trying to signal, don't you need to pick that up? Your phone could be your husband. Please, don't you need to answer it? Husband? We're divorced. When I go home, nobody's there. I'm all alone. The teacher immediately reports it to the administration and the school.

This is on Thursday. They deliberate and they decide to talk to Mrs. Myeong on Monday about it. And it is clear that Mrs. Myeong is not ready to come back to the school. She was actually supposed to be on a six month medical leave and came back after just 20 days. Prior to the incident of trying to strangle

and kill her colleague, Mrs. Myeong was known to have been one of the nicest teachers, in the sense that normally she had a lot more patience with the kids. She's been a teacher for the past 20 years. She knows what to expect. She knows how to manage her emotions. In fact, throughout her 10-year teaching, she's consistently won awards of commendation and never had any complaints about her work from colleagues, parents, or students. According to medical records, Mrs. Myung this whole time had been struggling with depression severely for the past five years. December of 2024, it was agreed upon by the school and the administration that Mrs. Myung would take sick leave for six months. She

would focus on treating her depression. That's the plan everybody agreed on, especially because Myung's doctors wrote that it's gonna take about six months of heavy intensive treatment. They wrote to Ms. Myung's boss, the patient is currently suffering from severe depression and lethargy, requiring at least six months of stable care. But 20 days later, right before winter break, Ms. Myung just shows back up, just kind of startling everyone, especially because they had already filled her spot and she said 6 months is adequate time and now she's, what, back in not even 15 business days? How do you go from needing 6 months to suddenly feeling better in 20 days? Myeong argued that her depression symptoms improved enough in

the past 20 days that she can resume daily life again. And here's a letter from the doctor. I find that that's quite alarming. So after she comes back, there is winter break in Korea. So winter break is around mid to end December until late January in South Korea. This is happening February 6. She's assaulting her colleagues. So this is like right after winter break. So that week or two after winter break, students are saying, I don't know what happened to the teacher, she used to be the nicest, kind of sweet teacher.

And now she's walking around with a box cutter. Now she's walking around with a blue tape. She wasn't acting like this before her medical leave and then before winter break. She just comes back and she does not seem normal. So there are signs that the students were noticing. Yes, but it's not, she's not threatening anyone. She's not snapping. She's not screaming at people.

She just seems mentally, I wouldn't even say it's unstable. It's hard to say, because it's very easy for people to look at kids and be like, you're overthinking it. Not that I think kids are overthinking it, but sometimes adults have that reaction. But she did choke someone out. Yes. February 6th, Thursday, she chokes out her colleague. Nothing happens on Friday, Saturday, Sunday.

Monday the 10th, the administrators tell Myung, and very nicely, considering she just tried to strangle her colleague, they very nicely tell her that she should probably take the rest of her sick leave. Instead of leaving the school or going to the doctor, Myung goes on to kill Hanul that afternoon. If that happens in the school, right? A teacher literally tried to attempt murder another teacher. Yes.

I mean, I feel like there's gotta be some pretty serious consequences follows right away, right? That's why a lot of people are upset with this case. There were so many warning signs. After school on Monday the 10th, Haner is sent to the aftercare classroom on the second floor. This is again, not a new schedule for her. She waits from 2 p.m. to about 4.40 p.m.

to be picked up by her academy teacher, where she's gonna take the hagwon bus that goes around picking up all the kids from the other different schools, takes them to the hagwon, and then after that, she's gonna be picked up by her parents at the end of the night. Hagwon is... It's like a... So after school program is at the school, they just kind of take care of you.

Hagwon is like another teaching academy. So you go there to actively learn. It's like second school. Most kids will attend hagwon these days, even at eight years old. In between that time, Hanyeol's grandma thought, it would be a nice surprise to go pick up her little granddaughter, take her home, get some snacks in her, and then just personally drop her off at the academy for her night studies. But Hanyeol said, it's fine, I don't want to be a burden.

She's texting her grandma. Besides, all the teachers here are super nice. Eventually, Hanyeol tells her grandma that it's just her and the aftercare classroom teacher. All the other kids have left. But again, it's fine because she's about to leave soon. And just to clarify, the afterschool program teacher is not Myung. It's a different teacher. It's not until 4.40pm the academy teacher comes to pick up Haner. She can't just text Haner. She has to check in with the front desk. Then the after-school program teacher will release Haneul out of the classroom, where she's going to walk down a flight of stairs to the front desk.

But instead of getting there, the audio-video room door opens. Myeong asks her if she wants a book that she needs to read this book. Haneul gets lured in, and is stabbed, strangled and stabbed to death. The knife that Myeong uses, she had actually gone to buy it that day. She told her other colleagues that she was gonna stop by the restroom, but instead she walked out to the parking lot, got in her car, drove about a mile to a kitchen supply store where she's seen on CCTV camera just leisurely walking into the store purchasing a knife, a 6.5 inch blade, 11 inch knife. She was even seen asking the clerks at the kitchen

supply store if this is a good one, if the performance is good. Then she stabs Haner to death. It is believed that by the time that grandma Kim came into the audio storage room, Haner was dead but she had not stabbed herself. So Myung was covered in Hanyeol's blood. What? Yeah. She's covered in Hanyeol's blood and a lot of people actually take that to believe she did not want to self-exit, which we'll get into in a second, but there is a lot of premeditation here. A few days prior to Hannah's murder, it was seen on forensic analysis of her digital devices that she had been searching up things about murder weapons, tools to be used against other people,

tools to use for assaults, things of that nature. She later does state to the authorities, I was just irritated just three days that the vice principal prevented me from teaching. After she got back from winter break, the teachers just didn't want her to teach. The vice principal didn't want her to teach children either. They were asking her to do other, probably paperwork around the building, but I'm assuming they didn't feel necessarily that comfortable quite yet with her having students when she's supposed to be on a six-month medical leave leave but she comes back within like 20 days. And now that Hanye is dead, Mrs. Myong is in the hospital and she claims,

this was my depression that led me to this. One expert states, such extreme aggression is very difficult to manifest in depression, stating that it's likely, you know, sure she could have depression, but there's something more. It's not the main cause to her actions. Like she's trying to play it off as it is. With one official explaining, the suspect experienced conflict in the home and at work. She had a deep-seated resentment. Her anger was redirected outward. As for why specifically Han-Ri was chosen, Myung said, I didn't really have any interaction with her. I was just choosing the easiest target.

She was going to be the last one in the school to come out of the aftercare classroom. And that's on the second floor. I could unlock the audio video room that nobody really goes into. So she's saying it did not matter to her which student it was. One expert believes that she tried to commit this whole thing with a colleague four days prior that she was trying to kill her colleague and then self-exit, but it was impossible to do because there was no way that she could have done it to her colleague. The expert describes it as, this is the type of person that subconsciously or consciously

does not want to be harmed by another person. So regardless of if she had intention to self-exit or not, which a lot of people don't even know for sure, it just seems like she doesn't want to pick someone her own size basically. They're saying if this was happening in a high school, it's likely that she wouldn't have been able to go after a student. The criminologist continues, such perpetrators do not choose strong opponents, they just are worried that they themselves might be harmed if they attack someone strong. Another expert states, the depression that she suffered for the past seven years is not directly

related to the crime. Depression is not linked and does not manifest in the form of murder. It is worth mentioning that there are speculations that Myoung didn't even plan on murder with attempted self-exit. Some netizens speculate that she might have gone on to harm more people in the school or other students or colleagues, but it might have been the parenting app that prevented her because the parenting app kept sending alerts, which Han-na's dad could hear Myoung on the other end forcibly opening Han-er's front zipper off her backpack to turn off the alerts, and then the heavy breathing continued for about another hour.

Furthermore, when Grandma Kim opened the door to the storage closet, it didn't appear that Myeong was injured, and even after that, she had the energy to lock the door. It seems like she tried to self-exit after she was found by grandma kim. adding to that theory is the fact that her injuries were not life-threatening, but could be- i mean, they could be used as evidence that she is mentally unsound, but they were not actually life-threatening. really? so it was like a- i mean, it's hard to say, because the intent could be there, but human

self-preservation, self-survival could kick in. It's hard to argue, but one other aspect of this theory is that according to Haner's autopsy, none of her wounds showed any signs of hesitation. So a lot of the times with sometimes stabbing victims, you'll see shallower stab wounds, and then it progressively leads into deeper stab wounds, so you'll see like a varying level of depth of the wounds, but they were all incredibly deep. Many experts don't believe that fits the theory that she was so depressed that she harmed Han-e and then wanted to self-exit. They more or less argue that if that were the case, there would have been

some sort of hesitation marks. Another criminologist interviewed on this case focuses on the fact that when Grandma Kim opened the door and asked Myoung where Han-er was, she just straight up lied to her face. There was nothing to indicate that she was panicked or nervous. It's not only terrifying that she was able to maintain this calm demeanor, but also it's just a flat out lie of someone trying to cover their tracks. Not someone who had plans to self-exit soon. Soon after this crime takes all over the mainstream media news, Koreans not just from the Daegu

area but Koreans that have traveled hours, they'd come to drop off chrysanthemum flowers and snacks at the school gates for hanar. they had these little yellow umbrellas stuck onto the picket fence of the school so that all of the dolls left for hanar would not get wet. a local florist even gave out 100 chrysanthemum flowers, just hoping to raise more awareness and hoping more locals would go and pay their respects. the flowers, the dolls, they're all left up for like an entire block around the school for Han-rae. this was, this is even to this day, a very big

case in South Korea. I know in America we have lots of incidents and it's still very big cases but it almost feels like certain people, not saying you or I, but certain people have almost come to expect that a school is not a safe place in America which is so dangerous and so vile and so depressing on its own. But in Korea, there really was not as many instances of this level of violence. You hear a lot of stories of school bullies and there's that kind of inter-pure violence, which is still not okay, but to have an eight-year-old killed on school premises was really shocking, and even so to international audiences.

The first day of mourning for the funeral, Haner's family received condolence wreaths from major businesses, local and national soccer teams. They all sent condolence wreaths for Haner. According to someone at the funeral proceedings, there were a lot of members of Parliament in the front paying their respects to Haneul, including even the acting president of South Korea attended to pay his respects. Wait, President Yume was there? No, he is the suspended president. So there is the acting president of South Korea who attended to pay his respects. Now I will say this is where a lot of people just thought,

the case is now going to progress into the trial. But for some reason, this case ends up just taking very bizarre turns, and spiraling into something more than what happened, and raising awareness so that this never happens again. I was really even debating with the idea of not even including a lot of this in this episode, or really condensing it down, but the feeling that I kept getting while going through the online discourse and how the topic changed from Haneul to gaming forums to just about everything that has happened

in between, I mean the overwhelming feeling is that we are still living in a world where a victim needs to be perfect, or at least near perfect in order to deserve sympathy. it's a sick prerequisite society has, and this case i think is such a clear example of that. in this case, it's not the netizens are finding fault with 8-year-old haner. that would be even for the internet a new level of low, but it's the fact that some netizens, which are internet users, are going after haner's father. haner's dad used to be a frequent user of a gaming forum, which was known to be frequented predominantly by men, where maybe 50% of the posts are fun and

about games, and the other 50% are jokes probably a lot of women would not find funny. netizens dug up old posts and comments left behind by hannah's father, who we will refer to as Kim. For example, one person would post a picture writing, A cup weighs the same as a mandarin, B cup weighs persimmons, C cups are apples, D cups are grapefruit, E cups are giant Asian pears. Clearly talking about breast size and how much they weigh. Hane's father comments, my girlfriend is a grapefruit then. If I knew that's how my boyfriend was talking about me on these forums, he would not be my boyfriend anymore. And while it's a rather derogatory comment that's just kind of uncomfortable, it has nothing to

do with Haner nor her murder because in any event an eight-year-old was killed for no reason. What does her father's post from 2015 have anything to do with it? A lot of netizens came out, a lot of Korean netizens came out, started to defend Kim about it saying, that's a full 10 years ago and yeah, it's sexist. He should probably reflect on that post, but it's not the most insane thing we've ever read. On top of that, even if the post was even more sexist, should we really be bringing it up now? Like, do we need to dig into everybody's past digital history?

So every person, victim's father, victim, do we need to go down and find every single thing that they wrote from 2015? Yeah, that's so bizarre. It just became a huge discourse of how we handle, like, a lot of the digital footprints of people. And I do think it's very interesting that a lot of society and a lot of cultures still have this prerequisite

that a victim's family has to be absolutely perfect in order to deserve sympathy. Because these aren't even the same level. Like, what does that even mean? Now, this is not a great bar to set, but regardless, a more recent post was made in 2019 on a thread asking about contraceptions. hanner's father comments, use contraception well, if you're not careful,

you're going to end up with two kids like me. netizens felt this comment was clearly harder to overlook. it's recent, it has to do with his two kids, it sounds like he doesn't want kids, it sounds like he doesn't love his kids. That's what a lot of Korean netizens were trying to hint at. Then another post pops up with a new allegation against Kim, an anonymous post with an accusation. Hanyeol's father borrowed $2,500 from an acquaintance of mine to donate to a female streamer, and he never paid it back.

He's on welfare. He sent Hanyeol to the after-school program with the government benefits, and all he does— He doesn't even work! He goes and he spends all of his time in PC rooms watching female streamers playing games. He was even recently sued for harassing a PC room employee. Pay back the money you owe to my acquaintance, Hunter's father. Netizens were really confused on how to feel about this random accusation because there's no proof provided. But also, someone truly, like you would have to be so morally corrupt to even bring this up and

make these accusations at this point in time. Some netizens were saying, if you said this a year later, but it's so fresh after the murder and you're writing these online, it's just weird. Like, what are you trying to gain from this? Is this going to make him pay it back? Are you trying to capitalize off of the attention that Hanyul's case is getting? Because then, you're sick for doing it for the wrong reasons. Right now, an eight-year-old has died. Does the acquaintance's borrowed money

that he consented to borrow to a friend? Does that have anything to do with the story right now? So why do you think all these people are kind of, like, attacking or coming up with these stories against him? I think not to psychoanalyze a whole group of people's reactions online because maybe we're reading too deep into it, maybe we're not. But my Korean researchers were talking to me and we had these discussions about sometimes it appears that when a case is pointing out an issue that is too big, force these people to even grasp or understand, or it feels like as a citizen of the country,

this feels like too big of an issue for me to even make an impact, then we might as well just find fault in the people bringing up the issue. It's kind of the feeling or I would hope that Koreans are not... I mean, this is a small group of Koreans bringing this up by the way. Like most Korean netizens are like, hey, you people are insane for even talking about stuff like this. Like why are you bringing this up? Why are you going and digging into his old gaming forums? But that small group of people, I don't know what their problem is. I don't know. So if you're wondering how the social discourse went from anger towards the perpetrator to

people digging up old posts from the victim's dad and people almost seemingly trying to find dirt on him, I was also really confused. But this case really is frustrating in the sense that when you look for discourse in Korea about this case, you see it go from all when you look for discourse in Korea about this case You see it go from all about Haneul and how to prevent this from happening in another school to lots of online messy allegations and opinions about the victim's father If you go on American like English sources of this case, you're not gonna find any of that you go to Korean sources You're gonna find at least half the comments are bringing up Haner's father

In some videos, it's like 90% of the comments are talking about Haner's father And I was talking to my Korean researchers and they said again most Koreans are on Haner and Haner's father's side It's just that like the small handful the small group of people that hate her father for whatever sick reason They're so loud, they're so vocal. so most of this seems to stem from a series of interviews that hanner's father does after hanner's death. hanner's father does a series of press interviews, which makes sense considering this is one of the more talked about cases in the news cycle at this point. some netizens decided to find fault with some of the things that he says or more so the way he says those

things in the interviews. For full transparency, I do see how there are moments where his tone or his words he chooses might come off strange if you're not being sympathetic. But I think a lot of Korean netizens have lost the plot. I think they're trying to twist his words and find some way to find fault in him. And I don't know what they get out of doing that. Maybe it's easier to blame her dad rather than thinking about how the education system can be fixed for both teachers and students because that feels like too big of a problem. Also who knows? Nobody knows anyone's true intentions

but given what we have, the interviews of the dad, I don't know how people are painting this insane picture of him being one of the most evil people in the world. People are making it seem like he's worse than the perpetrator. See, that's crazy, right? Yeah, every little thing he says has been picked apart and yes, again, I can see how some of them come off strange when you don't really factor in the nuance and the context of the situation, but keep in mind, this is a man that has never been on the news. He was just plopped into mainstream media in the span of 48 hours, and all the major

news networks are shoving cameras in his face demanding him to make a statement at the same time that the most horrific incident of his life has just happened. He has had no time to process his grief, to consolidate his emotions, he's just trying to share with the world his experience so that this never happens to another kid. He asks in the first interview, please just take 10 seconds to pray so that Hannah is happy in heaven.

Thank you so much. He bows almost 90 degrees to the reporters, but a lot of netizens, some netizens, okay, I don't wanna say a lot, but it sounds like a lot, cause all the comments. Some netizens, some netizens, okay, I don't want to say a lot, but it sounds like a lot because all the comments. Some netizens are upset and they're saying that he keeps asking people for things. He keeps demanding, we give 10 seconds of silence.

He then also asks journalists at the end of their articles to write, Haner, who became a star, we love you. Let's create Haner's law. So he's trying to create a law and we're're gonna get into that because that's also controversial. But in another part, he states, I sincerely ask government officials please create Haner's law so that there won't be a second Haner. As I asked yesterday,

I would appreciate if journalists would include the phrase, Haner, adults are sorry, we love you at the end of your videos or articles. Now, I think that this is more done in American news outlets. You don't really see this being done in Korean news outlets. Citizens being like, hey, journalists, could you please include this at the end of your article? And I think the way that he's bringing it up is very to the point, which a small group of Korean netizens felt very upset at his quote-unquote

demands. They're saying he's demanding too much, like why is he going around demanding 10 seconds of silence? i think the feeling that they were trying to convey, i don't know, is that we were gonna give 10 seconds of silence but because you demanded it we don't want to give it anymore, which is just such a strange sentiment to have, but they're very upset by it. and they're also commenting things like, the schools and teachers should feel sorry, but why do all the adults in Korea need to apologize? We're not the ones who did this. Other netizens get quite harsh with their comments, writing, what is this?

The dad almost seems excited. And why are the adults of Korea sorry? We're not the ones that forced you to send your kid to aftercare class. So now they're shaming him for sending his kid to aftercare class programs, after school, because most parents are double working parents, like they're dual income parents. They don't have the time to just watch their kids. Like most people in Korea send their kids to after school programs. Other comments, don't generalize the actions of one insane evil teacher and her crimes to the entire adult population of the nation We feel bad. We feel grief and heartache. But why do I have to apologize?

Which is so bizarre, it's like not that personal but it's I mean again I don't I was debating on whether to even include this in the episode But because it's such a prevalent conversation in South Korea, and it's happening in all the Korean articles They're like fighting in the comments in every single article about Hannah I think it's a great time to try to understand why stuff like this happens They also point to another moment where he tells the journalists to write how near we love you How near we're sorry and in their articles, I guess the next day they hadn't included that So he asks again in a press conference,

why doesn't anyone write it? among from what I've seen, there was nothing written. so a lot of people are upset that he's reading the articles and calling out the journalists for not including what he requested. then there's another moment where he says, the biggest issue in South Korea right now is the case of Han-e. I don't know why it had to be my daughter and why this is happening. Then he excuses himself to calm down before he continues in the interview.

So he notices he's like, okay, I need to calm down. Could I just get a moment? I think his words are completely understandable. He is a parent who just lost his child. And this case is massive in South Korea. But some South Korean netizens recently, I mean, they just didn't like what he said. Han-e is the biggest case,

is like the only big issue in Korea right now because they're saying recently their president was impeached. So there was a lot going on in the political world that impacts all the nation's citizens. Some netizens got really offended by his words, which I just think is, have some nuance and your life would be easier. Someone comments, I thought it was a police official giving a briefing the way that he's

saying this is the biggest issue and we should care about it. Others are even speculating, is this really the biological father? He seems like he's not commemorating Hunter, but rather fulfilling his own selfish desires. Like desire of what? Some people, okay, I'm trying to also see why certain things are happening to try and maybe give a perspective. Clearly, I don't know what it's like to be in that situation, but I do think that there are moments where I have been in front of a camera and I felt really uncomfortable to the point where I don't know why my face is not matching certain words I'm saying.

I think it's like, I'm nervous, I'm like shaking, I just don't know how to feel, like the adrenaline. And I think at certain points in his press conference, his voice is fast paced, he doesn't seem sad emotional, and there's almost like an inflection in his tone that's alert and hyper. And people are taking that as he's so happy to be in front of cameras. Yeah. Wow.

Others point out a different moment when Hanner's dad is just talking about what it must've been like for his little daughter in her final moments. He says, the sound of me triggering the alarm on the parenting app. How much pain must Hanner have been in? She was stabbed dozens of times. If someone had just listened for that sound, my Haner would have been in a lot of pain, but she wouldn't have become a star now." He's saying if someone had heard it,

maybe she would be alive. Yes, she would have been in pain because she would still have to heal from the stab wounds, but she also wouldn't become a star. So the way he's saying it is like, it's like very complicated. Like obviously he doesn't want his daughter to have passed on, but then also the idea of her trying to heal from those stab wounds would have been a lot,

but people are just taking the part where he says she wouldn't have become a star as like, oh my God, he wants fame. He wants his daughter to be famous. He also continues, now this adds context. The crime could have happened to anyone, but Han-ae became a star first for her friends, for the elementary school students

who will live in Korea in the future. That is how I will think about it. That's a huge part that has been taken out of the context by some of these Korean netizens. One sentiment that Han-ae's father has held since the beginning of all of this is that had it not been Han-ae that day, it would have been another kid. That teacher was not going to stop until she killed a kid. That is his belief. That's a lot of people's beliefs.

He finds comfort in the fact that he could try to see it as his daughter saved another child. She became a star and the reason he uses star is not like she became famous. Hanhae's name means sky in Korean. like she became famous. Hanyeol's name means sky in Korean. So it's like okay so a lot of people are saying she's now in the sky and then she's a star in the sky so he's saying it in that sense and not fame and it's very clear like everybody knows the word sky in Korea like if these netizens can type out their hateful comments they know what the word means they know what her name means so clearly the context is there but they decide to just bypass it. And they're like, he's obsessed with becoming famous. So it sounds like clearly there's a lot of like crazy people, but also a lot of

these sounds like they feel like his reaction doesn't match with what they think a victim's father should act like or say in these type of situations and now they are having a moment of like casting their own whatever on this father. Meanwhile, like I'm always sitting here thinking about I could never imagine what I will be doing if I'm in that shoes. Like I have no clue what I will say, how I will act. It's one of those situations where I feel it's very easy for people to say things like people respond to shock and grief in different ways,

but then when they see it play out, they don't like it. I think I would be a little bit more understanding of some tiny bit of netizens if there were a lot of suspicious elements of the case where it feels like maybe the father had involvement But it's like so cut and dry like why are we even doing this right now? It doesn't even make sense Some netizens have painted this narrative that he is someone that loves Being famous and loves being on TV writing. He seems so excited now that he's getting attention. Or no matter how I look at it, he doesn't seem sad.

He just seems like someone who's enjoying this situation and wants to look good to reporters and entertain them. It is sufficiently bizarre. And quote, the father was unique from the beginning of the situation. Rather than feeling sad about losing a child, he's specifically demanding certain words be used at the end of articles, demanding the nation give 10 seconds of silence. It's bizarre. Rather than taking care of his wife and his other daughter, he's just doing all these disturbing interviews. Now, one thing to note is that he says that the police were barely telling him updates on this case. He was finding out about it online. I mean, it seems very natural then that

he would constantly be reading articles, waiting to see if the police are going to release more information. That's why I'm saying it's not that strange that he noticed that the reporters didn't include that at the end of the articles. He straight up says, I haven't been told anything about the investigation process by the police. I asked the detective supervisor

and the news articles like this are coming out. I said, detective supervisor, what are these news articles? Please tell me the investigation status and they won't. Another thing to add to all of this is some netizens said that he's been very demanding. He's demanding idols, politicians, police officers show up and pay respects to Hanner. He's demanding nations pray for 10 seconds. I think these are all requests. They're not demands. But most netizens, they can see how angry he is with the police. The reason that he's, quote, demanding them to show up at

Hunters funeral and maybe this can enlighten those nasty netizens that hate the father for no reason. He says quote the police officers investigating Hunter the prosecutor who came to see Hunter not a single one of them came to pay respects on top of the fact that nobody's telling him information about this case. He's saying it's just confusing. You know many ordinary people.

I don't even know have come from all across the country. Citizens of Korea have come to pay respects to Han-na. And I think, side note, pay respects maybe to some people sounds demanding, but that's like what you do at a funeral. You pay respects. But he's saying like, you know, they came to say hi to Han-na. They came to show their respect and send her off. Like he's using these types of terms. Three police officers unrelated to the case they came they hugged me and they cried with me they said they were sorry that they couldn't protect hannah there are people like that but how can those in

charge of the case not come to pay their respects someone should be stationed here to inform me in real time as I'm the one who needs to know the news the fastest but why do I have to learn all about the investigation through news articles? Of course, I don't know if the articles are true or not. All citizens will know about it through the news articles and I don't even know if it's true. So, another thing to note, there have been lots of fake news spread by some journalists saying that Heiner's father had mentioned he wanted to meet with the perpetrator one

day, how he wanted to meet with the perpetrator's family one day, to which he all put those rumors to rest. But that's why he's even more frustrated. He has to learn about his own daughter's investigation through media outlets, and some of them are reporting false news about him that he knows is false. So now everything that comes out about Haner, he's like, I don't know if that's even true. And the police won't talk to me.

Not only that, they won't even pay their respects to the eight-year-old girl who was killed. Like, this is crazy. He's like expressing frustration. But some netizens have complained saying he's asking to be treated like a VIP. They're saying most officers do not attend victims' funerals. It's just not in protocol.

And some say his tone comes off very entitled, writing, rather than being angry at the perpetrator, he's angry at all Koreans that did not come to pay condolences that anger is stronger for the father it is very bizarre or another comment that reads the dad is unusual he is counting condolences rather than focusing on getting justice others argue that it's reasonable to be upset I mean learning updates through the media, the fake news, it makes sense, and even if it doesn't make sense, he's a grieving father. One big part that Korean netizens have also been ripping to shreds into Hunter's father

is at the end of one press conference, he tells the reporters, I should wrap this up. I won't be taking any more questions. There's really nothing else to film right now. I've done all the interviews. I'll conclude for now Reporters, please go upstairs. We prepared meals for you. Go upstairs and eat His tone sounds from what netizens say it sounds very light Now side context in another interview inside the funeral home He says reporters the serving staff are coming out a bit late, but you really don't need to give monetary gifts Please put down your cameras and pray for Haner put down your cameras go greet her help

her go beautifully and please make sure to eat I'm sure everybody's having a hard time right now when the serving staff come please eat before you go this is the last meal our daughter Haner is treating you guys to the reporters right she's like your niece right eat your niece's last meal and head home. thank you everyone. some netizens comment, are there any other questions? like quoting him? are there any questions? i'll conclude for now. reporters, please go find food upstairs. it feels like he's a third party rather than a bereaved family member. others comment, he excitedly tells his heroic tales and then he says he prepared meals for reporters. it's like a press conference with a celebrities

manager. maybe i like to overthink someone's emotional state, but it feels okay. Again, I don't know. I can't read minds, but from what I can gather, one thing to note culturally is in Korea, when you go to a funeral, there typically is food served and you're supposed to eat. It's like one last meal. And then you do give monetary gifts when you walk in to pay condolences to the family. So it's like you lost a family member, you're probably taking off work, you probably had to pay for this funeral. Let me help in any way that I can monetary-wise. Perhaps he saw reporters crying because this is an emotional case that a lot of Koreans were affected by. I'm sure a lot of these reporters have young kids. Maybe he saw some of them emotional when the cameras were off.

It's not like they're recording each other. Maybe he saw them all trying to donate and he's like, no, please don't donate. Truly. I didn't ask you to come here to donate. I just wanted you to send Hunter off. I just wanted people to draw attention to this case, so it never happens again.

And then maybe he's trying to lift up spirits because the reporters are also emotional. Like even him saying, you know, she's like your niece, right? Like this is one last meal from your niece. It almost sounds like he's trying to be like, it's okay, everyone, we're all going to get through it. But the fact that a lot of netizens, they just end up taking it such a weird way.

It's just very complicated. and I just don't think that we know anything about it and it just feels like if we're not seeing the perfect picture of the perfect victims family, a lot of people are losing sympathy which I find to be really disturbing. He also says in another interview, I don't know politics. I want the highest officials in our country to come see Hanner. I want them to listen to my story directly. I want to receive that promise. That is why I requested it.

I think he is justified in his anger. I mean, you could argue that he's very smart about trying to get action and laws passed immediately. He knows if he requests and pressures politicians to show up and listen to his story, they can't just ignore him, act like they didn't see it, but I think the way that he words it, I guess rubbed some netizens the wrong way. They just did not like it.

The acting president did attend. Now, which leads me to the next point of contention in this case, the proposed Hanner Law. Hanner's father is working on a law being passed that would make it so that teachers with mental health issues will receive necessary treatment and need to be cleared in order to continue teaching. The newly proposed Hanner's law would change teachers' psychological tests the way that they're evaluated and would force mandatory leave if there are any signs that a teacher is mentally unfit.

In order for Myung to come back to school 20 days into her sick leave, she had to have a doctor's note. So they wrote, yes, she's good. She's good after 20 days. That is kind of strange. People are saying that is very strange. Additionally, children in after school programs would be required to have hand-to-hand pickups. So instead of letting her go out of the classroom, walk all the way down to the first floor, a teacher would have to escort her from the classroom and hand-to-hand pass her off to whoever is picking her up. That is what the bill is so far proposing. In concept, the law would create a system in which teachers will be allowed mandatory leave

when struggling with their mental health, protecting teachers, protecting students, and even the deputy prime minister has gotten behind the proposal of the law saying we will establish measures to make it mandatory to confirm the possibility of normal work upon reinstatement with most netizens agreeing that something needs to be done like clearly something needs to be done and for this case specifically they think this happened on school grounds she choked out a colleague four days prior she was on medical leave, they knew about her depression, like clearly something needs to be done, hanner's family probably needs to be compensated as well financially for everything that they've lost. but it's just for this specific case, yes, something needs to be done. however, the hanner law is highly controversial.

also, keep in mind, whatever people are saying about the hanner law is not about hanner. she did absolutely nothing wrong, and this portion of the discourse is not even necessarily about her or what happened to her, but rather the discourse of what will happen if this law is put into effect. this is not an excuse, this is not reasoning from myong. she deserves the highest level of punishment, but a lot of people are really worried about this bill being passed. many netizens think it's not well thought out enough, like we're rushing into it. They also believe it's only good in concept. First, they point to the invasion of teachers' privacy. It would create situations in which the law could be easily used against them and

their mental health becomes very intertwined with their working ability, which could actually further exacerbate their mental health. Obviously not Myung. She should not be at work. But for other teachers who are like, okay, I want to seek treatment for my mental health, but I'm scared, the school will find out and then I will be placed on mandatory leave. Also, the law would make it easier that a student could report a teacher for being mentally ill, which many have stated would kind of be inappropriate for a minor student to determine whether a teacher is mentally fit or not to begin with, but they

could also report a teacher for being mentally ill and it would instantly trigger a series of actions that results in the teacher forced out of work and potentially their job being put at risk. Let's be real. The reason that this is concerning is teachers in South Korea, and I'm sure like teachers everywhere, they're underpaid, overworked. In South Korea though, they're not, they're typically the victims of abuse. The teachers. They are typically bullied by students and students' parents. In a Korean classroom, it's safe to assume the student holds the most authority. Because if a student lies and

accuses a teacher of doing anything to them, the parent can file a formal complaint and almost always the school takes the parent's side. One interview on the street, citizens were asked how much authority do teachers have in South Korea. They said, I think absolutely none. Wow. If a teacher tries to do anything in an attempt to teach, a parent doesn't like it, they can get a complaint and it's almost to the point where they can't even actually educate students anymore. The authority of the teachers at this country has hit a rock bottom. I think there's something seriously wrong with the education system. Others state that they have read news stories where female teachers have their own personal Instagrams

that parents will go out of their way to stalk. I mean, nobody asks you to go find your kids' teachers on Instagram. And if the teacher goes on vacation or goes out to dinner with friends on the weekend and the parents don't like what she's wearing They will file a formal complaint and the teacher will be reprimanded At school for what she does off hours and like side note knowing Korean culture I bet it was like a modest dressed with two inches of shoulders showing Another citizen on the street says, it's like the teacher's personal life should not exist.

South Korea right now, because the education system is so competitive, a lot of parents feel that their kids can make no mistakes. It's also my kid first, my kid first. It's very a selfish system where if the kid is not doing well in that class, maybe it's the teacher's fault. Let's move the teacher out of there and get a new teacher in so my kid can do well even if all the other kids are doing great. I don't care because it's about my kid.

So even in China too, right? Like the weight of the education is like everything for East Asian parents. Like they will do anything for their kids to go to the best school or the best kindergarten, or even like, you know, like it's crazy. Cause my aunt is a teacher her whole life. When a parent thinks that their kid is not doing well, they will do whatever it takes, even if it means that let's get this teacher off to get a different teacher. So let's get her fired.

Yeah. So I can totally see that happen because how much weight they put on the education. Yeah. And just last year there were widespread teacher protests. Teachers, parents will accuse teachers of child abuse if they even restrain a violent student. There are videos of students slapping teachers in class, or if a teacher tells a student they're disrupting the class to be quiet, they can be accused of emotional abuse.

One example, a teacher took away reward stickers because the student with the reward stickers tried to attack another student with a pair of scissors. So they took away the reward stickers because you don't get a reward for being violent. And formal complaints were filed by the parents, which then in turn the administration reprimanded the teacher. Teachers are saying they don't even feel safe to teach at this point.

And within a span of a week in 2024, multiple teachers in South Korea self-exited, a few of them on school grounds, drawing attention to the very broken education system, as well as over a hundred teachers have self-exited in the past five years in South Korea. One of the victims who self-exited had been bullied by parents at the school for just trying to teach and discipline the kids. She wrote in her diary that every time she even enters a classroom, she feels, quote, my chest feels too tight.

It feels like I'm going to fall somewhere. I don't even know where I am. The 23-year-old has PTSD, like from entering a classroom because of the bullying she faced from the students' parents. She was found dead in her classroom by her colleagues, which triggered a 200,000 teacher protest in front of the National Assembly. One teacher was commenting on a news report. Look at this, like the teachers are not here

to protest for a raise or for a better system to benefit themselves. we're just asking that the government protect teachers from unfair situations that are brought upon by students and by students parents. we korean teachers only want the right to teach, that's it, without worrying about things that have nothing to do with education. that's all we want. With another comment reading, I worked in a Korean school once and it was so bad. Teachers quit every year and had meltdowns in the bathrooms. Some students would even falsely accused teachers to get them in trouble out of spite. And plus, we talked about a lot like when when you're under 14 or something, like there's literally no consequences for anything. So the kids just go crazy.

Yeah. So people are saying, yes, the teachers, if they're not mentally fit, they should not be around students. And especially for this case, but like future cases, if they're showing any violent tendencies, if anything is happening, yeah, they need to be either let go fired fired, in jail, in a mental ward, something, something needs to happen to them. They're not safe for society. But this law leaves a lot to be open. It's like a further restraint on these teachers. With one comment reading, I hope this act

will be used properly and not abused by some brat-spoiled bully kids who are a menace in their home schools in society. I mean, I hope the kids who should be protected are protected by this act, but you don't know how to make sure of that. There's gonna be people who are gonna use it to their benefit. Also, there are concerns that there might be a lot of stigmatization against mental health if a teacher is out on medical leave because some action triggered her to be forced on a forced medical leave because someone saw her unfit, you really think they're going to let her back? Like these are the types of parents we're dealing with that took away reward stars because

your kid is a violent offender. You think that they're going to let her back? Any of these teachers are going gonna have their jobs back? I'm sure we can put into place a law, but it just seems like conceptually it's great. And nobody is criticizing Hanner's father. He's not a lawmaker. This is not his job.

Something happened and his main focus is making sure this doesn't happen to another kid. It is up to the lawmakers, however, to revise it and word it and to add clauses in a way that it also protects the teachers. But it doesn't seem like they're doing that right now. Also, even the hand-to-hand drop-off, a lot of teachers are kind of upset by this because the fact that these programs were put in place where a lot of parents could pay a—

I think it's like $60 for 11 weeks of the after-school program, which is like no money at all, honestly, when you think about child care and like staying in a program and The government's not hiring more teachers. That's what they promised when they implemented these after-school programs in schools They said we're gonna specifically hire after-school program teachers, but they don't So the teachers that come in at 5 6 in the morning and teach all day They do after-school programs and then after that they have to revise their lesson plans grade homework and then do the like they're working 14 16 hour days and so they're like now you want to add more teachers to do hand-to-hand drop-offs and

pickups and like it's like you want to protect the kids because you don't want the teachers to be mentally unwell but it's also the system that's causing teachers to be mentally unwell so if you's also the system that's causing teachers to be mentally unwell. So if you just fix that, not saying Myeong would have not committed the crime. She I think would have probably committed a crime regardless of her occupation, regardless of where she was working. But still, it's like all the other teachers, it just seems, it seems very complicated. And then this discourse of what happened to Hannah goes off the deep end once more when a far right political commentary cartoonist,

it's a loaded job title, but he posts a whole online article asking, is a child's death an achievement? He writes, they always want to create things like this. Does it make them feel better to have a law named after their child? Is the child's death their only achievement in life? which is an insane thing to even say but it did make this whole situation even worse because now we are one step

further away from Hunter's death and trying to enact change because of his far-right political standing the comment section turned fully into a right versus left fight. And again, it's like we have lost the plot once more. But one netizen does point out, and I do agree with this, again, regardless of how one feels of if the Haner bill is going to help or hurt the system, I do think that there's lots of changes that could be made to it to benefit the teachers and the students and the parents and have a better educational system. But one thing to note is, quote, I admire that Haner's dad wants a law to enact to help educators with mental illnesses,

whether you think it's going to work or not. But the fact that he wants to help them rather than punish them, what he and his family have been through that takes tremendous heart. punish them, what he and his family have been through, that takes tremendous heart. it is really sad to see that hannah's entire life has become overshadowed, first by how she passed and then also by netizens digging into her dad's past and all of these different conversations that are now being had. a lot of hannah's classmates have tried to keep her as she was in her memories. everyone says she was a really bright girl and that even at eight years old This is the age where people started testing boundaries, but Hanye just did everything with a very positive attitude She never complained in school. She never complained about her extracurriculars. She was always excited to take on more. She loved soccer

She joined this local soccer club and she was so enthusiastic. She was actually so good. She would play with people that were older than her and she would call them unni. So when the unnis would tell her, we gotta go to hyesik, which is like after work, dinner, company dinner, which normally adults hate. But she's like, I gotta go. I gotta show up and show them that I support the team." And she was just always so excited to try more and to do new things. And she would just like run full speed in soccer, but also when her parents would pick her up from her after school program, people always remember seeing her run full speed straight towards her parents and just almost tackle them with a hug.

And many of her friends and family have sent her off with well wishes, saying just like your name, play happily in heaven without fear to our haneul, to our sky, who departed on a happy heavenly journey. as for myeong, she's now facing um she's facing murder charges but south korea hasn't technically abolished the death penalty but considering it hasn't been it's been almost like 30 years since their last execution it seems the likelihood of her facing capital punishment is slim but a lot of Korean netizens are calling for it for capital punishment nevertheless she is facing life imprisonment for kidnapping, luring, and murdering a minor under 13 and that is where the case of Haner from South Korea is. I know in a

lot of the English sources and media there wasn't a lot of discourse of everything that was happening afterwards but what are your thoughts? It just seems like it's spiraled into a lot of different things. Let me know, be safe, and I'll see you in the next one. Bye.