SERIALously - 159: 7M TikTok Cult Exposed? Netflix: Dancing for the Devil: The 7M TikTok Cult

Episode Date: May 27, 2024

Sister Duo, Miranda and Melanie Wilking, started gaining a massive following through their joint TikTok account, the Wilking Sisters where they made viral dance videos. Eventually, they both moved to Los Angeles in hopes of new opportunities and finally making their dreams come true. But when they did…. things drastically changed; and according to Melanie, her family is now living a full blown nightmare. Hello Fresh Go to https://www.HelloFresh.com/aesweet for FREE dessert for life! ZocDoc Go to https://www.Zocdoc.com/ANNIEELISE and download the Zocdoc app for FREE. Then find and book a top-rated doctor today. Fum Head to https://www.tryfum.com and use code SERIAL to get a free gift with your order today.  Athena Club Head over to https://www.AthenaClub.com to get 20% off your purchase with code AE at checkout.  Beam: Head to https://www.shopbeam.com/ANNIEELISE and use code ANNIEELISE for an additional 40% off. Don’t forget supplies are limited and you can only shop it through my link. Shop the Merch: www.annieelise.com Follow the podcast on TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@serialouslypodcast Follow the podcast on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/serialouslypod/      Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/annieelise    All Social Media Links: https://www.flowcode.com/page/annieelise_    SERIALously FB Page: https://www.facebook.com/SERIALouslyAnnieElise/    About Me: https://annieelise.com/   For Business Inquiries: [e-mail]  Sources: Rolling Stone Magazine Melanie Wilking https://www.instagram.com/melaniewilking/  https://www.youtube.com/@MelanieWilkingOfficial  Menina Fortunato https://www.instagram.com/meninafortunato/ NOT THE GOOD GIRL https://www.youtube.com/@notthegoodgirl SPILL https://www.youtube.com/@SpillTea Audio Credits: https://www.instagram.com/melaniewilking/  https://www.youtube.com/@MelanieWilkingOfficial  https://www.instagram.com/meninafortunato/ https://www.youtube.com/@notthegoodgirl https://www.youtube.com/@SpillTea

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Welcome back to an all new episode of Serialously with me, Annie Elise. I hope you guys are all having a good day today and that you are ready for like the mother load of deep dives because, whoo, the case or the situation I should say that we're talking about today, it is a doozy. So basically, recently I saw this trailer on Netflix for this upcoming project that they're releasing and it's about a story that I actually heard about quite a few years ago but at the time when I heard about it, I didn't know if it was true. I didn't know if it was all just speculation or rumors.

So I really never gave it a second thought. But then after seeing this trailer, of course my curiosity had peaked and I was like, okay, I need to do like a full deep dive. I need to figure out these updates. I need to figure out what the truth is, what's going on. And guys, what I found was so far more disturbing than what I ever imagined that it truly blew my mind. Almost took my breath away, I'll actually say. So because of that,

you know, I had to do a full deep dive and that I had to come on here and share this with you, because it is truly an insane story. So with that, we're going to get right into it. But before we do, I do want to say everything in this video is alleged or cited from other sources. Anything else is my opinion only, and as always, please remember to do your own research and form your own opinions. Now with that, let's get right into it. So do you guys remember back in 2020 when TikTok first came on the scene? It was like booming. Everybody was at home because of quarantine, so nobody really had anything to do. They were posting videos, doing dances to popular songs,

and it seemed like a lot of people on that app kinda just like blew up overnight. Now TikTok started primarily more with dances, if you remember. Now it's kind of a hodgepodge of everything on TikTok, from like cooking to true crime, that's actually where I started, all different things. But it really started with these dances

where like one mega TikToker would create a dance and then everybody would basically mimic that dance and do their own version of it. So while this was happening, a lot of people who actually had a background in dance took this very seriously. While other people were just at home bored with the quarantine and they were just kind of doing it

to kill time having fun with the app. Other people were taking it far more seriously, almost using their TikTok account as like a digital portfolio of sorts. Then when certain people who did have a background in dance, such as Charli D'Amelio, Addison Rae, when these people started blowing up overnight and we had spin-offs of like Hype House, which was like a TikTokker house and all of these things, it kind of just made other viewers aspire to have that even more. So they took it even more seriously, kept posting,

kept doubling down on all of it. And it was kind of interesting because just like that, many of these quote unquote influencers were born overnight. So today's case is centered around a 27 year old girl named Miranda Wilking-Daric. She's a very well known dancer, choreographer, and also a social media influencer. Now her sister Melanie also shared interests in dance ever since she was young and she is extremely talented.

So the two of them together made a joint TikTok account where they would both dance, they would both share dances, all sorts of things like that. Hey Wilkings and Queens, we're the Wilking Sisters. And welcome back to another episode of What's Next. ["What's Next?" by The Wilkings and Queens playing in background.] Have you ever wanted to make your own TikTok dance? We're going to teach you some moves that are trending on TikTok right now so that you can do just that.

Let's get started. The first move is the whoa. We toss it up and whoa. Wilking sisters are probably some of the most exciting dancers that you have on TikTok. Right meow. Miranda, Melanie, how are you guys doing this morning? Great, how are you doing?

I'm good. I can't complain. I like the denim thing we got going on right now. I know, we totally planned this. I'm sorry. That's why I'm in the middle. It's like a denim sandwich. We're information.

And because of how talented they were, it's really no surprise that their account, which was called the Wilking Sisters, came and reached a popularity of over 2 million followers at one point. Now, if you're thinking, okay, Annie, is this just going to be an episode that's like a puff piece about these two dancers and TikTok? No, not even in the slightest. I'm just giving you a little bit of a backstory. But this episode is actually going to be focusing on how certain influencers became of what some people believe is a full-blown cult. Again, allegedly. And you may have heard people refer to it as the 7M TikTok cult. But before we go into all of that, we do

need to talk about Miranda first. As mentioned, everything that we're gonna be talking about has either been sourced from Rolling Stone magazine, other articles, court documents, interviews, but anything else is just alleged or my opinion only. So again, do your own research. But Miranda grew up in Michigan with her younger sister Melanie, as I mentioned, and Miranda's early love for dance led her to attend all sorts of local dance schools. She also participated in numerous competitions. However, her big break really came when she competed in the 12th season of that show, So You Think You Can Dance.

My name is Miranda Wilking. Hi, and how old are you Miranda? I am 18 today. And have you been watching So You Think You Can Dance for a while? Oh yes I have. I thought I can't wait till I'm 18 and I go an audition. No idea How cool though you turn 18 on the day that the auditions are I know? Must be meant to be well, let's keep our fingers crossed that it was meant to be and good luck. Here you go

Miranda becomes the youngest member of Team Stage in Vegas. And the day's off to a celebratory start. That was the best birthday by far. Oh my gosh. This was back in 2015, and this significantly boosted her profile in the dance community. She even danced for Katy Perry and the rapper Flowrider

at one point. Hi, guys. I'm Melanie. I'm Miranda and we're the Wilking Sisters. Today we are going to be doing a frequently asked question video. One question that we get asked, I feel like we get asked this every single day. Every single day. But that is, are you guys twins? And we're not twins. We are actually two years apart and I'm older I'm 20 and I'm 18 but most people think I'm older because I'm taller mm-hmm but she's the baby. Another question. So another question is when did we start

Musical.ly? I would say we started Musical.ly probably about a year and a half ago because I heard about it I saw some videos and then I started making like the singy videos and then what we did is we wanted to make it kind of different and because we're dancers we wanted to add some dancing into it so we have a really good friend who kind of inspired us to start doing the tutting and everything so we just started doing that and then we just kept making those. It was fun and it kind of worked. Another question is when do we start dancing? And we started dancing when we were like two years old. We were babies in like baby ballet and stuff. We went to a studio. Yeah. We got to dance back home.

Shout out to Got to Dance. We love you guys so much. So we started going there. We went there all all through our lives and then just continued it when we, 18 years of dancing, that makes me feel so old. Crazy. Crazy, but it's kind of really cool. So as Miranda and Melanie just continued posting on TikTok, started getting all of this notoriety,

as their following grew and grew and grew, it wasn't long until the girls realized that they really wanted to take things further in their careers. And with that, they knew that they probably would have a better chance at that, a better success rate, if they were to move to Los Angeles. So that's exactly what happened. And at first, everything was really great. Tim Hortons is literally the best coffee ever. If you know what it is, comment in the comment section. Cheers. So good. We also have blankets to cover up with. I know we're so cozy. And the Christmas lights begin. Oh my gosh. It is so pretty. Hey guys, what's up? It's one of

the Wilking sisters, I'm Miranda. Hi. I have been without my sister for about a week. She is in Atlanta. I'm going to the airport right now to pick her up. Sisters! Aw! Back in LA.

Back in LA, baby. Where the sun is shining. Both of the girls were loving life. They opened themselves up to so many new, different and exciting opportunities. I mean, it was fantastic for them. They felt like it was a dream come true. They were now on the sunny West coast

and they were pursuing their careers. What could go wrong? But what started is great and super exciting. Then one day it wasn't. So you might be thinking, okay, well what changed? And more than that, what does that have to do with an alleged cult? Well, in came the Seven Mountain Mandate,

better known as 7M. This is a very conservative Christian movement that is known for spreading the word for what they call the Seven Mountain Prophecies, or also known as the Seven Spheres. And the Seven Spheres are family, religion, education, media, entertainment, business, and government. The goal is that by transforming all of those things, you can bring major changes to society.

And some people believe that the seven mountain mandate is the belief that the Christian God wants Christians to be in power and also in control of even the government. Now to better understand the background of 7M, we have to talk about a man named Robert Shin. Robert owns Shekinah Church, where he teaches the Seven Mountain Mandate. And this church is based in Los Angeles, and it was started back in 1994. Seven Mountain Mandate has gained popularity among some charismatic and Pentecostal churches, and was allegedly taught and honored at Shekinah Church

Which is owned and pastored by a man named Robert Shin. But get this according to an old version of his website Robert described himself as a former medical doctor who then changed his life after he heard the voice of God How many times have we heard this guys? I'm not saying it doesn't happen I believe that anything could happen in the world, but how many times do we hear from somebody that they had a prophecy or they heard the voice of God and that this voice told them something. Moreover, told them that they were going to be a leader of some kind.

Now going back to Miranda really quick and how all of this ties in. In 2021, Miranda met some fellow TikTokers and influencers and different dance creators, and they were a part of one particular creator house. Remember how I had mentioned Hype House, different TikTok, spinoff houses, things like that. And a creator house is basically a house and it's shared by influencers.

And in that house, they do what it basically sounds like. All they do is create. They collaborate with each other on videos, they do their own videos and think of it almost as like a sorority or a fraternity, but social media addition. That's really what it is. And usually these houses are ultra extravagant. I mean, they are beautiful. They are luxurious and it kind of makes it the perfect backdrop for creating this content, which is being posted on all social media platforms.

So not only are people witnessing these talented people dancing, but then they see this mega mansion behind them and they're like, I want that. I wanna be invited to the Hype House or the TikTok House, all of these things. And it just kind of glamorizes the whole situation, right? An added bonus in all of that too

is living together with all of these other influencers because it makes it so much easier to collaborate with each other so that you not only are growing your own following, but you're growing your following based on other people's followings. Because if you're posting videos together and it's on another person's profile in addition to yours,

those followers will probably come over and come to yours. And it was just beneficial for everybody who was involved there. Now, what's interesting about these creator houses, such as Hype House and things like that, is many times talent management agencies will pay for this house. They'll be the ones footing the bill and they just allow creators who are under that agency to come in to live at the house or use the house, come in and out, and kind of party. Again, very much like a frat or a sorority. So to many aspiring influencers, getting the chance to be a part of something like this,

a part of a creator house, or better yet, even get picked up by a management agency, I mean, it's exactly the kind of thing that they dream of. And it's exactly the kind of thing that Miranda and her sister were dreaming of when they moved to Los Angeles. So it's not hard to imagine that after Miranda became friends with some of the creators

who lived at a creator house, I mean, she was immediately enthralled by this. And like I said earlier, Miranda was an extremely talented dancer as well, so it definitely was not long until she was invited to join the creator house, and also to be a part of the management company's team. Now part of living at the creator house includes creating content, like I mentioned. And of course, this house isn't exactly free to influencers. Most management companies actually make a percentage of what's then paid to the influencers, which does make sense, right?

It's kind of like a kickback. It's a commission. It seems fair. It sounds normal. However, the management company who owned this particular creator house is known as 7M. Yes, that 7M, the same 7M for the religious piece of it, the principles, the guy who heard God's voice, things like that.

Now at the time, the 7M house was home to several social media influencers. Some of them included Concrete, B-Dash, Kylie Douglas, Aubrey Fisher, Kaylee Gray, and so many more. So this management company, called 7M Films, is run by Robert Shin and his family, and they have a slew of major sponsors. Also, the dancers under 7M Films are spotted filming in hotspots all around LA. The 7M crew has also shot videos on Broadway, in stunning beach houses all across the US,

and even at the Staples Center in LA. So I mean, a pretty big deal. Something that seems very established, very credible, right? Oh my goodness, so we are at Universal City Walk. We're about to get up on that stage and dance and sing our hearts out. We are in the dressing room. We're just chilling, getting ready for this run through. It's great. We're having a great time.

Are you excited? I am very excited. So in an article, Rolling Stone described 7M's videos and their company as, quote, polished, catchy, and somewhat hypnotic. It's content tailor-made to go viral, and 7M's approach seems to be working. Several of 7M's 11 dancers have millions of followers on TikTok and Instagram.

The dancer's success extends beyond social media too. According to 7M Dancers' videos, some of the company's clients have appeared in national ad campaigns and also have performed in the 2022 Super Bowl halftime show, which was led by Dr. Dre. So by being a part of this management company, rather than going solo, Miranda was set to score

even bigger big gigs and really boost her online presence. So from an outsider's perspective, it really did look like the perfect setup for Miranda so she could grow her personal brand all alongside her close friends while they were doing the same thing. Like-minded people, all with a shared goal, really encouraging and being a support system for one another.

Except in this case, once Miranda joined 7M, her sister Melanie started noticing a major shift in Miranda. Specifically, after Miranda joined the 7M house, she stopped making videos with her sister Melanie, and she also seemed to spend all of her time with all of the other 7M dancers. Her family claimed that Miranda barely talked to them anymore. They first started noticing these changes back in 2021, just a few weeks after she joined 7M. Now around this same time, their grandfather unfortunately passed away, and both sisters had planned to fly back to Michigan for the funeral. However, just 30 minutes before their flight, Miranda called her parents to say

that she wasn't coming. She claimed that she had COVID, that she couldn't make it. Now Melanie was suspicious about all of this because apparently they both already had COVID a month prior. So when Melanie spoke to Miranda about this and asked her what's really going on, we just had COVID, she admitted that she really wasn't sick, but she said that she couldn't come for reasons that she couldn't explain. So this situation, combined with the fact that Miranda had pretty much completely stopped talking to her parents altogether in general at this point, it was extremely concerning. They wondered what was really going on here.

They were unsure about 7M entirely, and they thought that the company was just demanding way too much of Miranda's time. So Miranda's parents eventually flew to California so that they could visit her. And they said that she seemed withdrawn, defensive, almost like a completely different person. Apparently while they were there, Miranda even stormed off and then later just cut off

all contact with her friends and family completely, even blocking her grandmother on social media. She even deleted all of her old Instagram posts, even the ones that she had with her sister Melanie, which was a pretty big deal because if you remember, it's almost like your digital portfolio. It shows how viral you've gone. It shows all of your success, your talents,

but she just wiped it from her feed. She also apparently changed her appearance and her dance style. By April of 2021, just a few months after joining, Miranda ended up posting a video with a whole new look completely. She had short blonde hair, a different dance style featuring older music.

She also changed her name on social media to Miranda Derrick. And then soon after that, she ended up marrying somebody named James Derrick, who also goes by B-Dash, who's another dancer under the 7M umbrella. They got married in a private ceremony that her family wasn't even invited to. So of course this made Miranda's family even more concerned about everything. They were really starting to wonder if maybe something more sinister was happening behind

the scenes here. This wasn't like Miranda, and who was this guy that she married? Was she forced to get married? Was this a publicity stunt for more followers? I mean, she lives in LA after all, we've seen crazier things happen. Miranda's family just really didn't know. Their concerns about Miranda and all of the new activity, the new version of herself, I mean, this continued for almost a full year.

But it was all in private. They kept it to themselves. Until finally, they couldn't keep it to themselves anymore. So in February of 2022, Miranda's family posted a video to social media. They said that they were worried and they believed that Miranda was being controlled and forced to cut ties with them. They even went as far as saying they worried that Miranda was being held captive. Haunting us for over a year now. Yeah, it's definitely been the hardest year of my life. But we wanna answer some of your questions.

Hello, hello, thank you guys for tuning in. Get some tissue already. Yeah. It's been rough. Very rough. So today is my sister's birthday. And we're not, I mean, okay. I don't even know where to start. We're not allowed to contact her.

And it's really sad because we're blocked on absolutely everything. So whenever we try to say anything, like I even just commented on a video today, instantly blocked. So it's just been really hard to deal with and we really don't know why. I mean, we obviously, that is the million dollar question is why and trust me we don't really know.

So I guess we'll start. It was January 18th was the worst day of our lives of last year and basically, um, the worst day of our lives of last year and basically um I don't know do we want to say this was totally on a whim so I don't even really know um so January 18th we were supposed to go home and 30 minutes before we were leaving for the airport Miranda calls my mom and dad and says she's not coming coming home. And it was like, what do you mean? You're not coming home.

She said she had COVID, she did not have COVID. We had had it the month prior. I mean, she was not sick at all. And she even said it, she even admitted that it wasn't because of COVID, she was just making that up. And that she just couldn't come home. And that she just couldn't come home. And that she was sorry and we won't understand. We won't understand but she can't come home.

And so we tried to we tried to then, now we got on the flight came home. The next couple days Kelly and I went and tried to get to see what was going on. Came back here came back here in California and spent a day and a half here. She was here at the condo. We talked to her for a couple hours and she was a very different person. Different person that we've had than when she was home many times. Just-

She was very disconnected. Yes. Like just not herself at all. Right. And she couldn't explain why she wasn't coming home. And kept wanting to leave, wanting to leave. And- And my dad even texted me

because I was in Michigan and they were here. And he said, she keeps saying that she has to go film videos with James Bidash, should I let her go? And I said, well, if you let her go, that'll be the last time you're gonna see her. And it was. And it was.

Yeah. And what were they gonna do? But she kept saying that when I said, please come home to Papa's funeral, you're going to regret it. And she said, um, I'll see. I'll see. And I said, well, who do you have to ask? And she's like, oh, I'm afraid I'm gonna make a mistake. I'm just learning. So whatever she's involved in, she's got some kind of control over her that is making her afraid of something. And as anyone that knows our family knows how close we've always been. And prior to her getting involved in this like religious group that she's

involved in, we never ever had a disagreement or an argument, her and I. So here's the thing too, Melanie also was going to this these church things and everything and she realized the... Well we never really addressed that so I guess we're addressing it. Miranda is a part of a religious group and she's not allowed to speak to us. That's the thing. That's the thing that we've realized is Miranda, James, all these people that they're with, they're not in control of their lives. Someone else is controlling their lives

and they're all victims of this. And it's so, it would be so easy to just like forget about, oh, screw her, you know, like she doesn't care about us anymore anymore but we know that's not her. she would never ever block Grammy. no. Grammy and Papa were everything and after Papa died to think that she wasn't attending his funeral and she was like a second father to us it's not like we weren't close. We were so close. You guys talked to Grammy and Papa every single day.

If not more than once a day. So to not go to his funeral, and he was like the number one supporter. Oh my gosh, on his last day, he was showing the nurse our TikTok videos. And he FaceTimed us. It was like, oh. And he was showing that you guys were on the billboard

in New York City. He was so proud. And then Miranda's now blocked Granny from everything. We're blocked from all our socials. We're blocked from everything. It's so hard because we've, this has literally been going on for over a year, but we haven't said anything because we always,

well we always had hope that she was gonna come back. That's why, especially in the first few months. And we didn't wanna embarrass her. We didn't wanna embarrass her because. And this is her second birthday now, we've not been able to spend with her. Because this is so mind blowing. I always tell people when I'll get together with people

that we knew from before, like we'll do videos together or whatever and they're like, what happened? Like where is she? And I'm like, I literally cannot make this up. And I say it and they're literally just like, I don't know what to say right now. And I'm like, I know, I don't either. And that's why it's been so hard to like even now,

I don't even know what we're saying. We probably aren't even making sense because it's- She got married and we don't even know when she got engaged. I don't know where, I don't know who officiated the wedding, I don't know who was in attendance. So when people say, oh, Kelly, congratulations on Miranda's wedding, I don't even know anything about it. And then we'll, and that's why it's like social media

can be such a crazy place because then I'll get messages where it's like, oh you don't support your sister's marriage Are you and I'm like I didn't even know about I didn't know about it and I'm we're blocked So we don't see anything and so it's just It's so hard, but let's let's see some of the and so this has been going on for over a year where we have Constantly tried we've showed up at different places that we know she's going to be at. We've we've gone to everything. We lived. That's another thing throughout all of this, right after she says she wasn't

coming home to the funeral. When we got here two days later, after that phone call and talked to her for a little bit and then she stormed out and she left, we realized we went upstairs and saw that our closet was empty and her doors were empty. And she had moved out in one day. The day after that phone call. She never told us where she moved to. She ended up blocking us and changed her phone number. Dean and I hunted down and did our little private and gave us to Gating to figure out where our daughter was living. And thank you Juju for saying

that she used to take her class way back when she said this does not sound like Miranda and that's exactly it. It's so hard because people that didn't know us together just like oh Miranda must not like you guys. She just chose to leave like deal with it whatever but it's like no. If you knew her character and knew our bond, you would know that this is not like her at all. Just before, like she was home for the quarantine time. So Miranda and Melanie were home in Michigan for seven months. And so that's really right before all of this happened. She was herself.

I mean she would sit there and she would like always, I love my family. Like we would be in the car. I love everyone in this car. She said to me, she's like, well to to all of us, but mainly to Melanie, she was like, can you believe that we're actually living our dream that everything that we've ever hoped for Has come true and that we are sisters that love each other and are working together and everything She never talked about marriage. She never talked about anything like that being any time soon and even something like that and and I think the thing that just makes me so sad is like, I get it, whatever,

even if she wanted to move out, because we live together, she wanted to move out, or she wanted to start her relationship with James, take that further, whatever, like you don't need to cut us off. And life is going on, and there are so many exciting things happening for her too, for all of us, and for her. And We can't share in her joys and share the

asses. That has been really hard. And for a mother I just I haven't heard like she has not called me since January 18th 2021. She has not actually called my phone to talk to me and to reach out to me. So to think like as a mom, I don't know if she's safe. I don't know if she's okay. I wanna just hug her. I just wanna know that she's,

but even if she were to tell me I'm fine, everything's fine, I know it's not fine because nobody goes from the person she was. Anybody that knows her knows the kind of person she was and if you ever ever asked what is the most important thing in life, she would say her family. So to cut everybody off, you have to go back and say if you are willing to cut everybody off, if this is your decision, who altered your thinking for that to be something you would want? Someone asked how does she get involved in this group

and it was again something. These are friends of dreams. But there is also dancers and there's also finding out you have to be invited and this is a religious organization that's- Gated. I personally have been, even on this trip here, I've been to the front of that. I press the button. I see the car's in the parking lot, it's gated. And I say to the ring, my daughter's in there, can you please send Randall?

I'd like to talk to her. I'd like to see my daughter. And nothing, I press it like four times. I sit there for a while, nothing. It's behind a gate. Oh, so sorry, James is her husband, V-. His real name is James, so if we say James, that's who we mean.

But yeah, and thank you, Ricky, for saying that all the dancers that she dances with primarily with, we do see that they have danced with others but the primary group are all victims of this religious organization. Correct. And if you and someone asks about what's the name of the company the management company they're with you could kind of see it on their socials. Yeah. You can see it on their bios. They're all the same.

All the same. It's all the same. Is she in danger, somebody says? I don't know. I don't know. I don't think so physically, but mentally she is not the same person. Well, she's afraid of something. Yeah, exactly. Our daughter would want everything.

She'd want her family, she would want her career in- Her boyfriend, her husband. Her boyfriend, husband. She'd want it all. So the fact that she has to like sacrifice her entire existence before she got involved. Not just the two of us. Her grandmothers, her grandmothers, her cousins, cousins, friends. And everybody. Someone just put, I'm sorry, someone just put on there like, F the drama. And trust me, we've waited a whole freaking year to say one thing because we hate this.

We hate this. We've never been into drama, nothing. This is why it kills me inside that this is happening because we have been so on the other side of this. I loved that we were the example that like siblings can get along, we can have fun together, we can you know be best friends and the fact that they have taken this from us it doesn't... it kills me and this isn't just drama and that's why

we didn't want to say anything either because we didn't want to be like oh what's the what's the tea with the Wilking sisters what's going on and it's like no this is so real this is it doesn't yeah it's just a lot so it's not trust me we're not trying to get freaking attention from this we just we just want miranda back and don't know what to do i think that's that's why we're doing this is we don't know what else to do now for the record miranda and james slash b- they have completely denied these allegations they have adamantly said We don't know what else to do. Now for the record, Miranda and James slash B dash, they have completely denied these allegations. They have adamantly said that their personal relationship with each other and their marriage with one another

is 100% genuine. They say that the relationship with 7M Films is purely professional, that they are not forcing them to do anything. So take that for what you will. But I will say this, and this is just my personal opinion, never have I seen a cult member who has been under the influence or impression of their leader come out and say that it wasn't their own actions. There wasn't free will of whatever they were doing. So it could very well be true. Maybe they are

happily married. Their relationship has nothing to do with 7M Films, but if it did, we probably wouldn't know otherwise. Just my opinion. So needless to say though, this video that her family posted, it was extremely alarming, and it went absolutely viral. So it definitely wasn't long until other family members and friends of other 7M members started speaking out as well. They started going to social media and sharing eerily similar experiences. And it felt like everything was about to just explode. So we're gonna get into all of these allegations, what else was shared, but first we are gonna take a quick break to hear from the sponsors of today's episode. And thank you guys for understanding that sponsors are what helps keep this podcast absolutely free.

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they're worried that she may even be being held captive, all of these other family members and friends All that Miranda's family has publicly spoken out and they have said what their concerns are. They're worried that she may even be being held captive. All of these other family members and friends of other 7M members are coming to the surface. They're sharing their experiences and they shared similar stories of loved ones just cutting off contact. Even stories of them getting married abruptly. Some even said that their friends had now become very, very religious since joining 7M. And this stirred up a lot of talk on social media, as I'm sure you can imagine, because there was a ton of speculation that 7M was actually a front for a Christian

cult. An old friend of James, Joey Knucklehead-Turman, also noticed a change in James and other krump dancers that were now involved with 7M films. But after watching the Wilkings video, James' behavior looked all too familiar. Joey and James had fallen prey to an alleged cult before. Years ago, when the two were part of a dance group on America's Best Dance Crew called Street Kingdom, they were members of a church in Los Angeles that prophesied they'd win the competition, a prediction that didn't end up coming true. According to Joey, the church required a large dedication of their time and cut them off

from their loved ones. "...when you look back and you just realize all of the years that you were being controlled and manipulated and all the friends that I lost in the process and all of the things that I was not here for, for my family," Joey said in an interview with Rolling Stone. Though they broke away from the religious organization after a few years, it seemed to Joey that James had been sucked into another one. The Wilking family has spoken out. I am about to speak out on my life and just dive deeper into how all this came to be and answer any and all questions.

We have literally lived in the same house together. You know, I know all about his upbringing, the trauma that he's overcame. Same for me. And so we've had like, I want you guys to understand that like I looked at him like a brother. That call was so interesting. It was like, I didn't understand who I was on the phone with. It was like a different person. It was just like conspiracy theory after conspiracy theory and it like really weirded me out because that's that's not B-dash. That's not James. And I'm sitting here shook because and to anybody out there who knows the Wilking family you know how sweet they are. Like they are just so much fun to be around. They're like this, all of them. And his replies were like robotic.

It was like I was talking to a machine who didn't hear anything of the message or any of the emotions. I think his reply was something along the lines of like, there's a lot of people that wanna collaborate with me and there's a lot of people on my list like, I'm down to collab with you. And when I broke down to him how hurt I was about, you know, not being told about the

engagement, not being invited to the wedding, he simply said, I'm married now, things change. That's all I said. Some of these allegations even included arranged marriages within the dancers and the dancers being forced to cut ties with those outside of the organization, even if it was family. Very similar to Scientology, right? And again, these are just accusations and allegations, but we often hear that with Scientology as well that unless your family member or your friend or your partner, your spouse is also a Scientologist, then they should not be near you because they are whatever it's called a suppressed person or they're in the dark, whatever the terminology is. And that's very similar to what allegations were now starting to surface.

And if you remember, it doesn't seem all that far-fetched because 7M Films is run by Robert Shin, who also owns that church. The church that believes in those seven principles of religion, media, business, all the different things. And I hate to keep drawing the parallels here but where else do we see core principles like that? We've seen it in NXIVM, we've seen it in Twin Flames,

we've seen it in Scientology, we have seen it with Warren Jeffs. I mean, it's almost like they rip a page out of the exact same playbook. That is to say, if this is in fact a cult which it has not been proven to be, this is all alleged. I mean, it's almost like they rip a page out of the exact same playbook. That is to say, if this is in fact a cult, which it has not been proven to be, this is all alleged. And guys, the reason I keep saying alleged and throwing that out is because allegedly

they are very, very litigious and like to lock things down. So I'm just trying to be very careful with my words here. I'm trying to use my words carefully and make it very clear that this is all opinion-based. You know where I'm going, okay. Now, former members of the church that Robert owns and runs, they claim that Robert's teachings, specifically the Seven Mountain Mandate,

that they were also promoted within the 7M TikTok group. And some former members even claim that they were encouraged to donate these very large sums of money, not only to the church, but also to Robert Shin himself. In response to all of these allegations, 7M Films, Miranda, her husband, and the church have all denied any wrongdoing. They've said that 7M Films is completely separate from the church entirely, and they also said that Miranda's family's claims are just pure outlandish.

In their statement, they said, Miranda Derrick is a successful businesswoman and a loving wife and daughter. She cares very much about her family. It is pathetic and contemptible to try to turn her private family matter into a tawdry public scandal just for clicks and clout. But is it really that simple? I mean, take a listen to more of what her family has said over the years. We are on that. We're trying to figure things out because I will not give up on my family

and it's not going to happen to me anymore. And I think that's exactly what they want is they want us to just go away. Go away so they can just continue doing what they're doing. They don't know who they're best. They don't know who we've been beforehand. They don't know how close we've been. And it's like, oh, we'll die. I do know a person that came to our house. This person came to our house and sat in our house for over seven weeks during the pandemic. And this is her husband now and said,

you have a very different, weird family. You're way too close. And other people around us know the fact is, we know that. People say that we are too close. We're weird that way, but we have a bond. We have people say that we are too close we're weird that way but we have a bond we have a bond that we wish upon other people that we can talk to each other no matter what and somehow some way something changed our daughter in no way in the world that a religious

organization that we can't control has controlled her now. And it's, I always think I'm like, all growing up, like we never fought about anything. If there were any, like even with my parents, like if there were anything, anything that was coming up, like we could just talk about it. It's like I almost wish like we did fight so that like maybe this wouldn't be so crazy because it's like, we're just cut off so abruptly and without explanation. And mind you, Miranda and I worked together. We had our whole page together.

We had brand collaborations at the time. She walked out on everything. And so I was, I had hoped that she was gonna come back. So I was like, I don't know what to do. So everything was put on hold for me as well and it was just with no explanation. That's why I still, we have not, we don't know. She walked away from every obligation.

She bought a car that she just left. She was, she even left your management company through an email. There was nobody ever talked to her. Her Nobody ever talked to her. Her manager never talked to her. She walked out on every single thing without speaking to anybody. She cut off all ties. I don't know anybody that has spoken to her from before. The only people that I think speak to her are whoever is involved in this religious organization.

Questions came up why do we unfollow her at all. We never unfollowed her. Are you kidding me? We've been blocked. We've been blocked. I was just blocked today. Because we tried to make comments. We only wished her a happy birthday today and James blocked her. So we have tried. And then blocked me and I didn't say anything. So that's the way it's been going all along. Grammy invited her to Thanksgiving. She got blocked. We've had nephews and now someone got married, invited them to the wedding, nothing.

No response. We had a birthday party for my mother-in-law. We invited them. Baby, it's birthday. There's no response because we can't, we send it. Not even wishing her Grammy a happy birthday. I've sent messages to James that her grandma's in the hospital is bleeding internally and that we don't know what's wrong. We don't know what's gonna happen. No response.

And but this isn't to say that Miranda's this terrible person. We know that. James is a terrible person. It's the fact that. They aren't in control of their lives and they can't respond to us and they find What I find so crazy too is we're such a threat that she needs to they need to block us out completely because they know how close we are well, they don't know because I'm sure they thought we would go away by now, but Well, they don't know because I'm sure they thought we would go away by now, but No, we will not give up on our family and we will do whatever it takes. And let me go back to the whole James thing James has always been very kind when I know before he was kind. He was respectful. He was not

Like this to not respond when I say that grandma's in the hospital. So it's like, what is happening? And then for Miranda, to not wish her Grammy a happy 80th birthday, to not be part of our family, and like I said, the only, the only disagreement we ever had was the fact that I was trying to warn her because I felt like this religious organization was expecting a lot of time that it just seemed like it was very controlling and I was concerned and then when Melanie saw those warning signs herself and she left it it just snowballed and everything just escalated and I

remember one time saying to Melanie can you please talk to her I feel like I'm losing her and she said I think it's too late yeah so I don't know what towards the end it just things got weird Miranda was gone all the time she wouldn't tell me where she was we shared a car She would take the car and I'm like, what's going on? It just was not like her together and so Yeah, it was right before the change of character and then um Yeah

Are there is man running her own social media? I don't know. We don't know. We don't know. Swear I never thought she would turn into, no. Shoot, this is the thing. It's so unbelievable. I feel like I wake up every day

hoping that I'm waking up from this nightmare. True. It's not, it doesn't feel like it should be real. And I just feel like we're constantly in this loop. I'm angry and then I feel bad and sad and just heartbroken and then I feel desperate. Like I have to do something. I can't just let this continue like this. We're her family and something is very very wrong. And the best way I describe it to people is like I feel like she died. Like I feel like she died from our family yet she's still like around. So there's still hope that

she'll come around but she's gone. So it's like this weird, like you can't come to terms with it because she's still out there and you can't just forget about it. Or I don't know, heal from it. You can't truly heal because she's still there. It's like we are living in constant trauma.

It's like if something happens to you then you have to like okay you deal with it and you try to recover and you you try to move on. But this is constant trauma that is on our minds all day and all night. Yeah. Somebody asked you to explain what it was like when you were there. They tried to get me involved. I did go. I did like it at first and then I realized there were numerous red flags that I could not ignore and knew that it was not something I wanted to be involved in and then as soon as I was telling Miranda you know these concerns that I had she would just you oh, you don't understand, blah, blah, blah.

And if you guys know, we never fought. Miranda and I were very strange. We were attached at the hip. We didn't fight about anything. And then towards the end, as soon as I decided to lead this organization and Miranda decided to stay, we were fighting constantly about this because I was like, Miranda, they're taking you.

They're gonna try to separate us. They're gonna blah, blah, blah. Every single thing I said was gonna happen and my parents said was gonna happen, happened. And the thing is that B- was involved and he also, we believe, is a victim of this. Yes, exactly. They both were lured in and now they think

that's the only way is that, the way they live. Someone said, does she speak to anyone in your family? No. No friends, no family. to anyone in your family? No. No. No friends, no family. No happy birthday, no my happy mother's day, father's day, no Merry Christmas. Right. Everybody she's cut ties with.

We've constantly, and friends, we have constantly tried, she changed her phone number. We have constantly tried to reach her in any way we can. And we don't know if things go through. We kind of got a hold of her new number through somebody. We also contact B- because we still had his and nothing doesn't respond back. So we don't know if it gets through or not. So we just, we're living in, first of all, the fear.

And also that we have, we're going every day saying, we just don't know what's happening. We don't know what to expect, how to happen. Someone said, have you contacted the authorities? We have and what's so sad is churches are, which I guess is good in most cases but not this, churches are very protected in the state of California and they're all adults and they're doing everything on their free will we can't find anything illegal happening besides complete brainwashing which you can't really prove so unfortunately because they're all adults there's nothing anyone can do. No we've contacted pretty high up there. We've tried. Trust me when people say like oh have you done this

this it we have literally tried absolutely everything. And when people say life is short, reach out, congratulate, I can't. Like, I have tried, I have tried. I've sent her cards, we've sent her gifts, we've, we've gone through the door. And people know, go back, that we are, the people that we are and our family has been,

that our family is the closest we can be. We love them so much, and there's just some evil that has come over our family that we just don't know how to address or appropriately work through it. We're trying, we're seeing what we can do, but there's someone asked what can we do to help. I don't know. I guess the fact is that some people do show us some of her videos and she's on Hollywood Boulevard, things like that. Maybe a message saying hey Miranda your family misses you they love you very much. I mean we don't even know if she's getting that. At one point we thought maybe she'd even have her phone anymore

because there were things that that we weren't getting again across back and forth. So those are things that are happening that we are over a year now. It was fun. That's why I liked it at first because we didn't grow up religious at all. So going to this was just something new. You could relate it to life and there was music there. Of course, there's a bunch of dancers at it. So, of course, we're having fun. But then there were just be red flags where they like wanted control of a lot of your time.

And they tried to, I had plans to pick up someone from the airport and it was conflicting with a service, so I couldn't go. It was just, I had already had this plan for a while, blah, blah, blah. And then it's like, they were calling me, calling me, trying to get me to come in, try to get me to cancel the plans. try and I was like this is weird, like why like it's gonna be okay, I just can't go

to one and then oh I wasn't invited to the next one because I missed the other one, so then it's this whole, they're brainwashing you, this mind game where it's like oh then I did something wrong so now I have to give all my time type thing and I was like this is not healthy and this is not normal if and then What I was telling Miranda to is I was like if you want to go to this cool Like and we were saying we won't we don't have to talk about it We don't have to do anything if you want to go awesome, but like Let's like we can still be okay. Just you do that, and I just won't. And nope, that wasn't okay I guess,

because they had to go. But I understand why they like it. And I understand, like I feel like their structure. And especially now with the careers. Yeah. Like everything is growing. They're so talented and they're growing and it's amazing. So now you can just see how they would stay even more.

So it's like, it's this whole thing. But my mom just asked me yesterday, she was like, do you ever think that like, if you stayed, you would like be more popular? I was like, never in a million years. I don't care about any of that. I have you guys, I have my family, I have friends. And she never, that's the thing, they're like oh she's chasing fame. Well I

don't know maybe because she had a whole personality change but before she didn't care about any of that. She just wanted to make dance videos and have fun and be with her family. So and yeah if anyone has any information or has any insight or a similar situation that we could try a new avenue, we would greatly appreciate it because we are completely desperate. So I've been seeing the Athena Club razor all over my TikTok feed, but I feel like I knew about it before it was trendy because I have been using it for over a year now and it's truly the easiest, smoothest shave ever. This razor truly is worth all of the hype, and if you haven't tried it, you really need

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But remember, the supplies is very, very limited, so grab it now before it is gone forever. On her social media, Miranda has explained that joining 7M and the church was a personal choice. She described her shift as a spiritual awakening, claiming that now she's happier and she's living a better life. Miranda said that her family's portrayal of events is not accurate, and that she decided to cut ties with them all on her own.

She also mentioned that she wanted more control over her joint venture with her sister, that she wanted more time to spend with her husband, and that she wanted more time to study the Bible. Now, as I'm sure you can imagine, a lot of people believe that Miranda was forced to make these videos, or that maybe had somebody beside her telling her what to say, what to do, what exactly, what image she needed to really portray on these videos, what message she needed to get across. Although I do want to be clear this is just speculation. Hi guys, we are, we are live. We're in Detroit, Michigan. This is my husband James. This is my husband James.

This is my mom Kelly and my dad Dean. Since they wanted to make our lives public, we're going to go live. Do you guys have anything to say to the live stream? I love you Miranda and I miss you. Love you, we're excited to see you in person. I want to video document our meeting with Miranda's parents. It is March 9th on the Wednesday, 2022. And the reason why, because we just want to shut down all the lies, talk about we don't

talk to our families. Not true. But we just don't like talking to Miranda's parents or the relatives because the harassment and the hate. But there are communications here and there. I've been seeing a lot of things being talked about as facts here on social media and a lot of people who I'm not going to mention any names but have created this narrative of my life just to make money off of me. And like I've said before, I really don't want to make these things public

and share these things on social media, but I'm being forced to speak my truth. So let's go. She completely ignored everything I said. She decided to schedule us for more brand deals without letting me know. She said that I left her stranded with other brand deals that we did. I didn't get paid for the brand deals that we did when we were together. And honestly, that's the reason why

I was just overworking together as Wilkins Sisters. Hey you guys, I just wanted to hop on really quick and address the date, January 21st. It just keeps popping up. I know my mom has been stuck on January 21st and a lot of you have been saying that I cut off all communication completely with my family. I just wanna say that that is a complete lie. Has there been

less communication? Yes, because we are going through a lot. But to say that I cut off complete communication is a lie. I have proof that we have spoken since that date. I have text messages, I have DMs, I have proof of phone calls, I have voice memos proving that we have talked. I wanted to continue moving forward with Wilking Sisters. I wanted to continue that relationship with Melanie. But I just asked if she could give me a couple weeks just to collect my thoughts and kind of figure out how I could continue Wilking Sisters, but on new terms.

Because I also wanted to pursue, I was going into singing a little bit more. I also just moved in with James. So just figuring that out. And she was cool with it. She asked if it was okay to post a statement on TikTok. And I agreed, that sounded great. She posted it just telling all of our fans that Miranda's gonna be taking a little bit of time off.

But yeah, I wanted to get it back together and post as usual. But I just wanted to, I have some notes of dates, exact dates that I communicated with my family. So last year I met my mom in person with James on July 1st, 2021. Her and I met just her and I, August 3rd, 2021. Melanie and I met in person in West Hollywood.

We had a Christmas show and Melanie came to the Christmas show, so we saw each other in person then. I FaceTimed Mel a couple weeks ago, asking to meet up in person, just her and I and James. James and I just flew to Michigan and talked to them March 9th and also my family is coming to LA on April 1st and I would love to get together with them then. So yes there's a lot that my family and I need to work through, but I'm excited to just move past all of this. I just want to address that saying that we haven't

communicated within the past year is a lie. We have communicated and I believe that my family wants to move forward too. So yeah, just wanted to give you guys that update. Thank you for all the support for James and I. Love you guys. Thank you. Now let's talk about Robert and the church for just a minute here. Back in a 2010 deposition, it was revealed that the church had 70 members and they had donated a total of $4.7 million over eight years, which let me just do that math real quick guys. Let me get my calculator out because I'm definitely not a mathematician, this is not a math podcast, this is not a finance podcast, but if we have 4.7 million dollars divided by 70 people, that's approximately about 67 thousand, $143,000.

So divided that by eight years, that means that each member was donating approximately $8,400 a year to this church. And then in total, each person over the eight years about $67,000. But that's pretty crazy, right? $4.7 million in eight years by only 70 members? You gotta have a lot of pull to kind of get those donations, just my opinion. Now it was also alleged that these members made personal donations to Robert as well, who was considered at this point quote the voice of God. Now documents also show that in October of 2007 alone, that Robert received nearly $300,000 in personal checks, all from the congregation. I'm sorry, you're receiving 300 grand personal checks from your congregation not to the church but to yourself. Something here feels fishy. Something

here smells like what I can't remember his name, the Twin Flames guy, where he was asking for personal donations and then he was like posting all these videos on YouTube of like his Corvettes, his Lamborghinis, his big house. It is so gross. Now, back in 2009, a woman named Lydia Chung tried to sue Robert and also sued the church for $4 million. She allegedly said that they used mind control, that they exerted undue influence, engaged in coercive persuasion, and also other intimidating tactics, trying to really say this is is not right, something is wrong here and really raising the alarm. Lydia also said that he controlled all of her decisions, which were not in her best interest. The judge ended up ruling against her though,

stating that she acted of her own free will as an adult, although he did note that Robert's behavior was coercive. Now, other than that, there's really not that much that's known about Robert, other than the publicly available court filings where he's named. However, Robert allegedly lives a life of full-blown luxury here in California, driving high-end cars, allegedly living in a $2.5 million mansion where all the creators live as well, which, gotta say guys, if you're only listening to the audio and not seeing the video here, I'm rolling my eyes. Why are you living with the creators?

Even if you are the talent manager, I don't live with my agent, something is weird here, something feels off, just my opinion. Whether there's legitimacy to the cult allegations or not, something just feels gross here. So then in 2022, Rolling Stone reported about an ex-member who sued Robert in 7M. And according to this lawsuit, Robert controlled his followers' lives. This included their finances, their daily activities, and he even made some of their healthcare decisions. An even more suspicion about Robert has been fueled by the fact that the 7M creator house is run by his family.

His son Isaiah films most of the videos. His wife Hannah is the CFO, and his ex-wife Shirley is the house attorney. And Daniel Joseph, who directs those 7M videos, he's married to Robert's daughter Chloe. I mean, talk about keeping it in the family. I'm all for nepotism, and I'm all for, I mean, I'm not, but you know what I mean, but like I'm all for keeping it in the family and helping each other out, but like something here just really gives me the ick. Robert is also currently being sued by former dancers

from 7M Films and from the church. They claim that Robert does run a cult, that he is recruiting members through his entertainment empire and then taking advantage of them financially. They also claim that he controlled their finances, took significant cuts from their earnings and also encouraged these hefty donations to the church. One dancer even claimed that Robert applied for COVID relief

funds in his name and took a 20% cut from his earnings. And another dancer said that he was never paid for different construction work that he did for the church, and he also gave 30% of his income in donations. However, current members have posted videos really joking about this controversy. They've also made comments in different comment sections across social media just insisting that they're safe, they're happy, they're successful, that everything is great with 7M. We all know that it's a well-known reality that making it as a celebrity or making it in the entertainment industry in general, it is very, very difficult.

Even dancers who do end up finding work, they typically have an unpaid off season where they have to find other ways to make ends meet, get a side hustle going. Other dancers are freelancers booking just one job at a time. So like I mentioned earlier, it's easy to see why management companies that focus on content creation for social media, they are very appealing. It is easy to be drawn into that, especially right now with social media just like booming. Everybody seems to want to be an influencer or be in the creative aspect of work in some sort of regard, whatever it may be, maybe behind the scenes.

And it doesn't matter what industry you're in, but for dance specifically, it really gives dancers a platform to market themselves, to book jobs, to establish their brand, to earn money, all the different things. Now doing a little be kind rewind for a minute, and let's go back to 2019, Miranda's husband James did an interview with the Washington Post. He talked all about the independence that social media afforded him in his career. And as a side note, this was way before Miranda joined or he even knew her, but I just wanted to share his quote here. He said,

Which, sure, people's perspectives and opinions can change. They can change their outlook on life at any point in one year, two years, three years, ten years. It doesn't matter. But that was in 2019. The majority of all these allegations, the marriage, all of that, that was in 2021. So what was the shift, I wonder, from thinking you don't need a label, you don't need somebody to tell you what to do, you can be completely self-employed, self-reliant to then jumping to where you're living in this creator house. You're letting this person essentially, allegedly run your life. It feels like something's not balanced. Again, opinions change, people change. Maybe it's as easy as that and simple as that, but I don't know. What do you think? So the question still remains in all of this. Is Robert Shinn a successful businessman and a pastor with this very close knit family

who's all willing to work for him? Or is it like some people are speculating that he's actually using religious faith to control people also that he can profit from his followers? And I don't mean social media followers. I mean followers in the church, in the group, people below him. What is the truth here?

And what have you heard about this situation? I know you can definitely go down rabbit hole after rabbit hole, so I am very curious to hear your thoughts on this. And Netflix documentary, which is called Dancing for the Devil, the 7M TikTok cult, that's the title, it's set to be released on May 29th. And I know that I will definitely be watching

and I'm curious to know if you will be as well. If it does prove to be a cult, I hope that these people are pulled away from it, that they're reunited with their family. I hope that Miranda can repair those relationships with her family and with her former best friend, sister Melanie, because we've seen it happen so many times where families are just fractured by these insane groups,

these extreme groups, and it's so hard to get those relationships back. Luckily, not that there hasn't been damage done already, but luckily it has only been a few years, so maybe it will be easier to repair some of that damage. And hopefully it would be easier for Miranda to heal if she is in fact experiencing anything like these allegations have suggested. So let me know what you guys think about this

situation and I will definitely keep you guys posted. Depending on what information comes out we may end up doing a follow-up to this case. It all depends. Like I said I wanted to be a little bit careful in this initial coverage because he is apparently very litigious, but at the same time if things need to be shared I'm happy to share them, but I wanna make sure that we have all of the information when we do that. So let me know what you guys think about this situation,

and I will definitely keep you updated. Thank you guys for tuning in to another episode of Serialistly. And guys, don't forget to check out all of the amazing deals we have from today's sponsors. They are all linked in the show notes. Get them while they last. I am heading to Nashville for CrimeCon this weekend. I hope to meet so many of you guys there. I also will be doing a live

podcast episode directly there on Friday night and it'll be featuring Dr. Leslie Dobson. She was on here a few weeks back when we covered the Ren Eleanor story and we will be doing the episode all covering different ways of how to spot a psychopath. She has like the full-blown assessment for what markers and what traits a psychopath carries She has like the full blown assessment for what markers and what traits a psychopath carries. So we're gonna be breaking down some case studies. I mean, it's gonna be very, very interesting. So I hope to meet so many of you guys there.

And other than that, I will be back on the mic with you mid week for headline highlights, our bonus episodes on Friday that are ad free, and then of course our deep dives on Monday. So I hope you guys have a great week and I will be back on the mic with you very soon. Until then stay safe, be nice, don't kill people, watch your back, all the things. All right guys take care. Bye.