Shawn Ryan Show - #8 Eddie Gallagher - Retired Navy SEAL Tried for Murder

Episode Date: December 23, 2020

Chief Special Operator Eddie Gallagher is without a doubt the most controversial Navy SEALs of modern day history, and quite possibly in the entire history of Naval Special Warfare. Shawn Ryan Show #008 Chief Gallagher explains in depth how teammates under his command at SEAL Team 7 not only accused him of being a war criminal, but relentlessly tried to send him away to life in prison for the alleged murder of an ISIS fighter in Mosul, Iraq. Eddie walks us through his version on what seemed to be the entire Naval Special Warfare community continuously attempting to take his rank, strip him of his SEAL Trident, and ravage his reputation even after proven innocent. His wife Andrea and son Ryan share their first hand accounts of how the NCIS raided their home and strategically wreaked havoc on their family. Keep up to date with Eddie Gallagher's book release date, The Pipe Hitter's Foundation, and Social Media here ⬇️ https://theeddiegallagher.com https://pipehitterfoundation.org Vigilance Elite/Shawn Ryan Links: Website - https://www.shawnryanshow.com Patreon - https://www.patreon.com/VigilanceElite TikTok - https://www.tiktok.com/@shawnryanshow Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/shawnryan762 Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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once again, thank you for the massive influx of patrons we've had come into Patreon. If you're looking for tactical training, if you're new at the game and you're just trying to learn how to use your new piece, that's your spot. We keep the bullshit to a minimum. There's a ton of us over there. It's not all about the bling or the most expensive bullshit that you bought. It's just about how to become proficient With whatever tool you picked so head over to vigilance elite patreon If that's not your thing And you don't mind leave us a little Christmas present head over to iTunes Leave us a one-word review even if it's just one word. It's not that hard.

We'll link it below. That helps us out. Gets the show out. The word needs to go so that everybody can hear it. I mean, the shit that we saw on that deployment, what is some of the shit that you saw? Look, we're trying to wreck you a spot and I look over and they had kids heads, little kids heads on the spikes. There was dead bodies all over the place. We had our turf blown in half. I got pulled into the masher if it trade it and said, hey, you're under investigation.

They went and raided my house. He went to fight, you know, for our country, to prevent people from terrorizing, you know, members of the United States. And then they take him and they lock him up on American soil. And then they lay siege to his home and terrorize his wife and his children. It's pretty sick. My oldest son opens up the door.

They're all screaming at him. They're pointing rifles at my children and they're saying, put your hands up. Eight years old with a gun in your face. Yeah. There's like two other people with rifles. They're like, the lasers are right on us. So you wound up not guilty.

Yep. And what are that? I mean, the courtroom erupted. I've been in the courtroom. I wrapped it. Our next guest is a former Navy SEAL. He was a sniper. He's a medic. He's a preacher.

And he was also tried for murder, only to be found innocent. He's the most controversial Navy SEAL of our times. He's all over the news. He needs no introduction. Without further ado, please welcome 008. Mr. Eddie Gallagher. Mr. Eddie Gallagher, welcome to Tennessee.

Thank you for having me. It's awesome to be here. Yeah, man, it's a pleasure to have you. So just a quick introduction, you know. So you are probably, I would say it's a good chance. You are the most controversial name in the and still team history with actually without a doubt. And, you know, you've been through hell and back. You've had teammates, you know, betray you. You want to court, you know, and wound up not guilty. And, you know, and wound up not guilty.

And, you know, another reason that I think you're still controversial is President Trump stepped in to your case, not once, but twice. And that has not happened since, I think Richard Nixon the melee massacre. Yeah, 1968. And, you know, with the elections cycle and how divided the country is right now, it, it, it puts you in the limelight even more than you probably wanted to be. Yeah. So, but so we're going to talk about all that. But first, it is December, and I give everybody. But first it is December and I give everybody

Yes gift so this is the main reason I came out here. That's what I'm saying, dude. We give some good presents Oh my man. I appreciate it many guesses Okay, could it be squishy soft and squishy guys? It might be. It might be. I don't want to ruin the box. Ed Calderone took the last one. Is the first guest to ever take the present box. Oh, I'm right. This is nice. So we got the updated version.

Oh, sick. Heck yeah. Brand new hat. What's he gonna talk about? So that, you know, you are a sniper, you're a medic, That, you know, you are a sniper, you're a medic, you're a seal, you're a preacher. But if there's one thing you are not, it's a fucking escape artist. So, uh, so I got you a, uh, extra handcuff key, a saw blade that will go through battle and there's also a get out of jail free card in there from an obliacy, you know, you know what my wife will appreciate that for good. You know, you've done it handy, you know, my Navy use it sometime. Never out of the realm of possibility.

Nice. This is this is it right here. That's what I'm saying. This is what I was waiting for. I should have sent you some of those in prison, but I didn't happen yet. But dude, I appreciate that brother. Yeah, my pleasure. Yeah, we rocking this hat today. Sure. So uh, moving on, you just wrote a book. It's not out yet. I think you said it's still under review, but it should be. It should be released in soon.

Man, the man in the arena, from fighting ISIS to fighting for your own freedom. And I can't wait to read it. I want to hit some of the topics. I'm hoping that you'll bring some stuff up that's exclusive this podcast. It's in that book. But when's the release date on that? So right now, like you just said, it's in the DOD review.

It's out of our hands of when they're going to be done with it. They've had it for about two and a half months. I'm being optimistic and saying I'm giving about two more months, so I'm hoping that the release date will sometime be in first quarter of 2021, hopefully March, April, but we'll constantly put updates out. But right now it's it's on pre-order. You can pre-order it and it comes with a pre-order bundle. You can go to eddiegalliverbook.com and with the pre-order bundle you'll get a challenge coin and a note from myself and Andrea and my wife and then you also get the book a month early before it's actually out before everybody else, and it'll be signed by myself and my wife. Awesome.

Yeah, I preordered one and I can't wait to be able to. If you could just tell the people over, you know, the Pentagon or whoever's reviewing it to hurt the fuck up, that would be great. But I'll drop your name over there. I hope it will speed up the process. Right on, man. That would be great. But I'll drop your name over there. Hopefully it'll speed up the process. Right off then. But you know, your career and the Cileteams, to be honest with you, seems like up until the very last

part, like a fucking dream career. I think you did eight deployments, Shuttana combat time, a lot of trigger time. And I don't want to spend too long on your childhood or anything. Actually, I'd rather breeze through that. You have some really good podcasts out there already. So I just want to start off with Seal Team 7, Alpha Platoon, your last deployment. of the Silver Team, Silver Team, Silver Team, Silver Team, Silver Team, Silver Team, Silver

Team, Silver Team, Silver Team, Silver Team, Silver Team, Silver Team, Silver Team, Silver Team, Silver Team, Silver Team, Silver Team, Silver Team, Silver Team, Silver Team, Silver Team, Silver Team, Silver Team, Silver Team, Silver Team, Silver Team, Silver Team, Silver Team, Silver Team, Silver Team, Silver Team, Silver Team, Silver Team, Silver Team, that means combat trigger time, which you were awarded for. You're a sniper, you're a preacher, you're a medic, you get to say, Lord of the Year, which is a very high honor.

You know, that means you're the highest, the best seal at the SEAL team, was that at SEAL team seven? That was, I got to say, Lord of the year for a group. So all the West Coast. Oh, shit. Look one. Yeah. That's a huge deal. Wow. You get your own parking spot. Yeah. I got a funny story about that too, which, well, we can get it to later. Yeah. I definitely got my own parking spot. And honestly, I don't know how I made group one say of the year. But, you know, somehow I got picked for it. I, you know, I don't know how I made group one say of the year, but you know, somehow I got

picked for it. You know, I had, uh, my best friend was my putune chief at the time. Uh, so he, he did a good write up for me, which is how I think it got pushed through the room. But yeah, whatever you got it down, that's cool. And you know, if I'm missing anything, oh oh yeah, you were right at the number one platoon chief team seven. And you took the worst rated platoon and made it into the most effective, best highest rated platoon at team seven and, and what a year, year and a half.

Yeah. So, and you were only able to bring one guy with you. I remember you saying, you know, you wanted to stack the deck and you were trying to bring some friendly's over and to a team that was complaining about weak leadership. And you were told you were only allowed to bring one guy with you. And, and so let's kick it off from there. Seal team seven, alpha, platoon, you're taking platoon chief. Getting ready to lead these men into Mosul. Yeah. And their prior deployment, they were bitching about weak leadership. And now they have you with a magnitude of fucking combat experience. Yeah. So I was just coming off a rotation out at the Cree Crisis Response Elinant, which was

a UAE, I just picked up chief and I was given the opportunity to do a platoon chief for the next rotation. The master chief of the team told me he was going to I was in Charlie platoon at the time and he was going to take me out of Charlie and put me in charge of Alpha Platoon. The word around or everybody knew that Alpha Team didn't do, Alpha Platoon didn't do so hot the last rotation. Nobody really knew why. I mean, I didn't know any of those guys, but that was pretty much just the word that was put out

and it showed, you know, when you saw those guys perform. So once I was giving the opportunity to go over to Alpha, you know, I didn't, I went over there with no preconceived notions. I wasn't going to like, okay, you guys are a bunch of turds or whatever. It was everyone started off on a clean slate because I didn't know anybody. So I took over, I sort of entered that platoon pretty slow, just sort of feeling it out. As you know, like so when you come back from deployment, you're in professional development phase. That's where everybody goes

off to their specialty schools. So the platoon is never really fully together until you start a ULT or work up. But while I while during ProDev, I came up with a training schedule where we we were going to work on the basics two, three times a week. And I didn't care if the whole platoon was there or not. I was like, well,

you know, do it with what we got right now. And then this guy's filtering and come back from schools. I'll just, you know, enter the training. It was nothing sexy about the training. It was all just basic stuff and, you know, patrolling posts, pre-op assault procedures, you know, two formant romentries, starting at basics, going through. Just getting used to each other, building some exact cohesion.

Yeah. Seeing how everybody walks. Yep. And the older, the third platooners at the time, I think, thought that they were too good for, you know, that I was taken up their time by doing this basic training. And there was, I didn't know at the time, but there was definitely a lot of grumbling from these third platooners, which is about, there's probably four of them. So let's just take, let's just take all the, like, stuff that you learned about them afterwards,

and just like first impression impression how to go. Okay. First impression. Actually, one question I do have is you hit a crossroads before you took Platoon Chief and find understand correctly. And you were going to go back to Green Team to screen to go over to become an operator at Dev group. Yeah. Or the other option was to take your platoon chief slot and you chose your platoon chief slot. Did

you know the platoon you were going to take over before you made that decision? No, I had called up my buddies over at development group, you know, told them my situation, what my options were. I still wanted to there was much going on or they weren't doing much at the time. And I had, I was pretty long in the tooth when it came to my years in service. I think I was at 16.5 years at that point. I had been putting off, picking up chief or taking any leadership role, just because I wanted to maintain, just be a shooter, a door kicker, but my time had come and they were like, no, you're going to do, you know, your next stop is a leadership role. So I decided to take that, you know, but the downfall was once you do your platoon chief, you can't screen to go over there. I mean, that's like a hard fast rule. So that was a huge decision for me at that point, but you know, I made

the best one, I think, for, and it was also good. I made a decision for my family as well. I didn't want to, my, you know, Andrew would do whatever I chose to do, but I knew she did not want to move to Virginia Beach. So that was a big factor in there too. Even after you found out what witch platoon you were taking over. Yeah, so I had no qualms like at all about taking on that platoon. You know, I learned early on that I'm not going to listen to rumors or whatever of people's reputations or petitions reputation. I was like, you know what, I'll go in there.

I mean, they're all team guys. And I'll see what I got. Like I said, I've really started off in a clean slate. And honestly, they wore a bunch of good dudes, good operators, after we started training together. And what I came to find out is like, they're last leadership and I'm not talking bad about them at all but not mean I think it was pretty lax. There wasn't a lot of effort put into getting better at your skill craft it was just like go through the motions and we'll go on deployment. Which to me.

That's not. You know we should always be striving to be better. And when you start doing that by working on the basics of your craft and then go from there. So that's like the mentality I came in with. I was like, hey, we're just going to start from the bottom, work our way up. And especially when you have, we had about four new guys, two JOs, and then two and listed new guys. And you know, you're only as good as your slowest guys. So I was like, hey, we gotta bring these guys up to speed as well.

There was only four new guys in the whole town. Yeah, that's the least amount I've had in all my other tunes. What, so why were these guys rated the lowest, or the worst partoon at Team Seven, when you showed up? What they told me, what the platoon told me, after I got to know them a little bit, because I wasn't gonna pick out of me,

like why were you guys rated last, but eventually it started coming out, and a lot of it was, what they told me was due to their leadership, they blamed it on their LPO, their chief, and their OIC saying that none of them got along and that they didn't have good command and control and I went downhill from there, I guess. Were there tactics, Abby? Yeah, I mean, they weren't bad at all. And that's what I came to found out.

I was like, as soon as we started working from ground up, I was like, these guys are good to go. I think they just needed to have somebody there. That's like, this is what our job is. This is what entails and we're going to work at this. And by the time we had started to work up, you know, a big example of it is we started to work up. Our first block was CQC. And usually what trade at the guys who run CQC will say is like, you know, the first platoon to come through from a team is usually

sort of a mess because they haven't, you know, they're sort of figuring it out. Real quick, CQC is close quarters combat. So CQC is when you see a team of operators kick a door and flood a structure. So just for that. Yeah. So yeah, trade at, you know, they usually, and I saw it too, like, you know,

you'll opportunity isn't fully there yet. They're still getting used to working together. I wanted to cut that out by making sure we busted our ass darn pro-deb. When we showed up, we were pretty much a cohesive tight unit at that point. And it showed, you know, trade at told me that you guys look like you've been working together

for, you know, two years like this is the best we've seen in the Platoon come for your first block. Sure, really. Yeah. So you, like, which was awesome. I mean, it's the hardware paid off. And I think the guys, you know,

whether if they were bitching about it or not, finally saw that, they're like, oh, we're actually doing awesome this time, you know, and that continued all the way through ULT. Uh-oh. So how long is ProDev nowadays? ProDev is, if fluctuates, but usually, that's still around the six month, five to six month mark,

from the time you get back from deployment to where ULT starts. So in six months, and ULT or ProDev, the guys aren't even all together. So you took a team who's not even all together until the actual workup started, and they're already fucking going from the worst platoon to getting high rate at the last level at that particular team.

Yeah, they're getting high remarks from Tradeat, which I don't think they were used to from their last, you know, last go. So they were, you know, they were all riding pretty high, I think, and feeling good, which they should, you know, they put in the work. Big thing I did during Pro Dev is I took the new guys, and I had them go watch a team going through CQC, or, and I'd had them come back. And I was like, you guys are putting us through CQC or and I'd have them come back and I was like you guys are putting us to CQC. You're in the rafters and you're going to critique all the older guys as they go through.

You know, I had them take notes of everything that trade it was putting out. And I think that was a huge, huge thing. I mean, some of the older guys didn't like it at first because they were like, you know, why these new guys critique us, but it built confidence in the new guys. I think that's how they they got up to speed real quick. And it also humbled, which you know I told them I was like, you can critique me, you know, the OIC, the chief, everybody down. I was like, there's no no rank here. This is, this is about our craft. So, you know, you see something say something, some we'll fix it. So it humbled everybody, you know, guys that

thought they were, you know, above it all. And then it also brought the newer guys up. Yeah, I mean, talking that's goddamn, that's good. Cool. You just crush the egos. Yeah, and that's a very beginning. And that's way, yeah, I think that's huge is take ego out of the equation and it's a You'll flow better for sure Yeah So yeah, we went through workup worth fine workups about six months And we had no no issues during any of that. I think you know you had your kind of minor bumps I'm one of the JOs or any of that, I think, you had your minor bumps. I'm one of the J.O.'s, got a safety violation and a couple safety violations, which is not out of the norm.

We pushed him on the open training. But I started noticing, he'd get the safety violation and was very like, I'm not signing that, this isn't right. I shouldn't get that that which I've never seen before. You know, usually you get handed something by trade out your like graduate sign at move on. So that was sort of like a first indicator of okay, you know, the attitudes I was dealing with, but you know, I pulled him aside, gave him a talk and tunes like you're signing this and move on. It doesn't this has nothing to do with you as an operator like as long as

you don't make the same mistake, we'll be fine. And so he did reluctantly, but there was definitely a little bit of attitude there, but I, you know, I didn't think anything of it. And we ended up finishing workup. We knew from the get go, I knew from the get go, that I wanted to go deploy the mizzoul. One to the team find out. The end of workup, I believe, is when they officially were like, this is where you're going.

It's pretty designated beforehand. Like this is where, you know, this troop's going to St. Column, this troop's going to Guam, but that can change at any time. So if a troop is messing up or a platoon's messing up and they're like, okay, we're not sending you guys to the hotspot, like we'll send somebody, no, another platoon that's got their shit wire tight. We're gonna send you guys to the hotspot like we'll send somebody no another platoon. That's got their shit wire tight

We're gonna send them there instead. So I mean your place can go at any time. Yeah, it's sort of You know, it's competition-based which I think a way should be yeah, well, I mean That's a pretty fun good spot to go at that time. Yeah, I had done my homework Beforehand I had one of my best friends was actually out there, well, in Missoule at the time from team five. So I was keeping in pretty good comms with him, sort of getting a read on like how it was going to be, you know, but it was going to be our time to deploy. And it was looking good. They hadn't started clearing Missouliya until the very end of their team five's deployment

and they managed to push through the east side. And we were gonna come in and take the whole west side, which was all urban and pretty massive. Yeah. So it was definitely what we were wanting. I mean was the team. I mean pretty far it up about it. The you mean the platoon. Yeah, yeah, the platoon. I mean everybody was on board. And I let that I let that know that was my intention was like, we will go to the hotspot wherever that's at. Like that's my goal.

I plan on being the best platoon here, going to the best spot on the deployment and having a good deployment. And everybody was on board, you know. Yeah, I mean, I would think they'd be pretty fucking stoked to have, you know, they have weak leadership supposedly. And then you come in a shit hot operator with a fucking metric, shit ton of combat experience to take it over. They were ranked to the worst platoon, now they're

the best platoon. And you're going to do exactly what you signed up for, which sounds like, you know, it's another dream deployment. Yeah. So any team guy should be chomping at the bit to go on a deployment like that. So yeah, we got we did we got picked to go. We exactly where we wanted to go, which was awesome. It was our ourselves in another golf platoon, which they were from another truth. They paired us together, and we were going to fall under Marsock, which they were from another truth. They paired us together and we were going to fall under Marsok because they had control at that point. So we were just going to fall under them and operate under Marsok. So we started before we deployed, I started, you know, communicating with the guys over Marsok, just seeing how they were gonna operate and so we just have a good work

In relationship with them and it turned out that the X or the CO That was gonna be out there was actually when I was with the Marines was one of my exo So we knew each other. Oh, yeah, it was a small world. That definitely helped out a big time And he was this guy's an awesome probably one of the best dudes I've ever been around in the military. I mean I I Pretty much idolized him when I was 20 years old, you know with the Marines just stud But yeah, we Ended up getting you know getting to go where we wanted to everything was fine. No

no issues I think you it's a typical issues near the end of, you know, not ULT, but with the next one. Sit. Sit. You know, near the end, I think you get a bunch of guys constantly working together for a year and a half. There's gonna be little gripes here and there. I started noticing some of the guys bitching about on my OIC, you know, that he talks too much during debriefs or like this, just nitpicky little stuff,

which I wish I would have nipped in the butt right there, but I just took it as like, guys just bitching. Yeah. But then we got on deployment and we hit the ground running. We landed in Urbiel and ended up going to, we split a tune split, went to the Mosul damn house and then I forget the we ended up going to this mansion I think it was in Shaicon and that's where team five have been operating

out of their whole deployment but when we landed we found out that we weren't even going to be there like no you guys are going living in Mos zoo out of Fob and operating out of there. Like right in the middle of a zoo. It's right on the outskirts. Yeah. I mean, so we we drove out to that Fob to sort of get get our eyes on it and see what gear we needed to bring. And yeah, it was literally on the outskirts of, I mean, they were getting mortared. You know, you could see the the city you know burn in and getting bombed which you know not too far away

So it was yeah, it was pretty close shitty living conditions they pretty much just took over Some houses and made it into a fob no no real security. I mean there was some but It was it was just, you know, pretty shitty living. I had just, uh, no showers, no, you know, we had two portageons between, you know, three platoons and a whole admin unit out there. Um, but that's, you know, that's what I expected. I was like, that's whatever, this is all we got to live in. Yeah, I mean, that should go to work. Unless you're fucking getting to do what you want to do

and then it doesn't matter. Exactly. Yeah, and it was, I was like, yeah, this is fine. We ended up moving, you know, into the house that we were gonna live in and it was, it was shitty. It was like, it's some squatters that had been living there for, I mean, there was feces everywhere

So we cleaned that out and I could tell Some of the guys were like both the fuck like pissed that we were living in conditions like that But it was like this is this is the way it is, you know and It's not like in conditions that we haven't worked in in the past, you know, doing VSO and all that stuff like that. We definitely hit the ground running, but it was like a huge learning curve. We were doing AAA, which is a Viz assist in the company, which I had never done before in that capacity. We got introduced to our partner force

pretty much the night before we went out. What were they like? They were ERD emergency response division. They were a pretty massive partner force. I don't know, remember the exact number. Iraqis? Yeah, they were Iraqis, but they were not vetted. So there was a mixed mash of Iraqis with a lot of Iranian influence.

Oh, shit. So we were told to keep eyes in the back of your head the whole time. You can't really trust them fully. But honestly, I met their leadership and they, I was fine, you know, it was good to go. They were all about getting after it. They were motivated to go clear, which is wasn't, I wasn't used to seeing that, you know, I think a lot of times your partner forces, you sort of got to work at it to get them to work. These guys were ready

to go. We were told pretty much, you know, you're going to go out with them and advise an assistant, a company. And that was pretty much like it. And you're like, okay. And we were also told we were not going to be allowed within 800 meters of the front line of front line trace. Okay. Where they were. How many of these guys were there? PRD probably. Five, six hundred. Five or six hundred? Mm-hmm. There's how many of you guys are there? Well, just Arplatoon was 24 and then we had two other platoons there. There's how many of you guys are there?

Well, just our platoon is 24. And then we had two other platoons there. You split them in half. Yeah. So each of us, each platoon had their own Iraq Y officer, which whatever rank they wanted to give themselves. But we would coordinate with them. And then they would tell the guys in the front lines, like who were actually the ones clearing houses and pushing through the city of like, hey, this is where you should go or this is what you should be doing.

I was expecting you to say like 20, 30 days. 5 or 600 fucking days. And that's, you know, I could be like strong over estimating that by just by a little bit, but you know, it was hundreds of them. So you weren't really like with the actual guys themselves on the front lines. So you were back with the whatever the AIS on they had with you. And our main mission was to go out there and support them through there. We had, we all carried ATACs on us and we could, you know, we, the ERD, like one out of every five of them had

a beacon on them that we could follow them on, see them on our ATACs and know their positions. You know, so we'd be like, okay, that fire team's there, it's fire teams there. And that, not that that worked all the time. So an ATAC, can you describe that for an ATAC is pretty much just like a handheld device, you know, looks like an iPhone and it pretty much gives you a clear picture of the battlefield and you can have your position, your friendly positions on there and also, you know, the allies or the partner force that you're with, you can track them. So that way, when you're dropping bombs or making movements, you know, you're, you're

a, there's a clear, yeah, it's like real time. Yeah. Real time like drone feed looks like right? Yeah. I didn't have much of what I was on. No, that's, well, that's the first time we, we used it as well. But we were we we bound up on it pretty good before we got out there. So each pretty much each operator had one and a platoon and a tack. So the first, like I said, the first couple of weeks were like a learning curve. We I would brief the CEO Marsauk every each night night like this is where I'm going tomorrow. Um, they would approve it. Um, long as it was like 800 meters behind the front line.

And then we would I would usually pick a secondary and tertiary spot just in case that didn't work out. Um, but the first couple of weeks we went out there and, was a, it was a crazy sight. It reminded me of like something out of Braveheart to where we got out there, the Iraqis hadn't started clearing yet. They were like lined up in the line, vehicles, tanks, and then all, you know, mortars were just like coming in from ISIS, just landing all over the place. And I was like, okay, what's the game plan here?

And they were like, go. And they just started driving into the city. And you know, ID's going off and you're just sort of watching it. Holy shit. And you're just like, okay, this is pretty legit. Yeah. But then what we came to find out is, you know, we would set up in this position.

And at first I had the whole platoon out, you know, so we were going out with six matte v's and we'd all set up in this position and you know there was mortars going off everywhere and ISIS would fly drones over and so they would they flew a drone over your position they would just get your grid and next thing you know mortars are coming in you know down near you so myself and my OICJ Portier we've decided we're like you know what this doesn't make any sense to have a whole platoon out here. We have too much of a big footprint here and somebody's gonna get hit with a mortar one day.

If we just have this, have everybody go out. So we decided to split the platoon up. I would send, I'd sent half the tune back to the mansion and Muscle Damhouse so they could just chill, rest and refit for a week, and then I kept half the tune out with us and they would rotate week on, week off. So that way guys were able to go back and get a break and they don't, we're getting a fresh out of guys every other week that we're ready to go. Real quick, I'll just kind of like pant the picture a little bit. Do you have an estimation of how many ISIS fighters were in Mosul at

that time? Thousands, thousands? I would say, I mean, they were, yeah, I mean it was I so most old was like I don't know three or four times the size of San Diego. Yeah, so I mean they had Years like three or four years to fortify that place Waiting for exactly what was going on which is us trying to come in there So they I mean it was it was pretty crazy to watch they had intricate tunnels Doug all over the city that went for miles. Oh, he should they had Um, I've never seen so many IDs in all my deployments. I mean, I mean they had them everywhere Every part vehicle you might as like it was a v-bit

They had it ready to blow. They had V-Bid staged hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of V-Bid staged all throughout the city. They had it really short. We would push through. And we usually around noon, we called it V-Bid Paloza. They would just start coming out of the woodwork and you just see them blowing up,

left and right. I don't, you know, maybe like 10, 12 a day, you would watch, go off. What were their targeting? So they would target the partner forces. So as the partner forces are clearing through, ISIS has room, you know, it was like drone wars in the air. There was drones all over the place and they would have a guy sitting in the V bed

which he is welded in there. He might have been in there for days, just waiting and then they activate them through columns or like turn your car on. And this guy can't half time, they can't see. You know, everything is, looks like a Mad Max vehicle. They have plates welded onto every piece of the car, and so they're directing them through comms.

You know, back up, go forward, take a right, you know, they're going slow, and then they'd be like, okay, put your foot on the gas, and now pull yourself up. pull your foot on the gas and now blow yourself up. And they, you know, target, you know, they'd be guiding them into wherever the partner forces were or us, if they saw us, we became pretty close to one. I don't want to go off about 20 yards from once. Yeah, which is just got pretty high tech. Yeah, yeah. It was definitely a new environment for me because it was definitely like a 360 and you're

looking up in the air and not only down to the ground for IEDs, but you're now you're looking up in the air for drones because as soon as a drone flies over, you're like, okay, here come the mortars or they have our position. So it was different. Yeah, but it you know, it was something that we just adapted to along the way and that's when After about two weeks of Doing the rigmarole of going out there picking a spot getting ordered, you know, drone fly over We would take mortars until we're like, okay, this isn't safe anymore. We're going back

we would take mortars until we're like, okay, this isn't safe anymore, we're going back. It became pretty frustrating because it didn't feel like we were making that big of a dent or having that big of an impact at that time. All we were doing was just launching a Puma and reporting enemy movement. So me and the OIC talked and I was like, hey, I'm pretty frustrated with the way things

are going. He was too. I was like, let's take more of an offensive posture here. I was like, this is what? Let's split the group up and go out. I was like, we'll go pick our spot. And then we'll go wreck a good building that we can get into and that we were able to engage from.

And so he was like, yep, that sounds like a good idea. How were you reckon? Were you? So we would go out to our spot, designated spot, and then I would take myself, probably three other dudes from the platoon, along with maybe three or four partner, four skies that I thought were good to go.

And we would go on a little patrol not too far from the spot where we're at. We'd probably two, 300 meters on foot. Yeah, you guys warmed up like the locals. Or are you there was no, no, we were kidded out patrol and just like, you know, you're in the open, it was daylight. But we were pretty far like behind the front lines. So we're still 800 meters. So it's not, we weren't going into enemy

territory, but you always, there's always that chance. Yeah. Because the front lines would fluctuate, you know, yeah, ISIS might take a huge step forward one night and we show up the next day and be like holy shit, we just lost all this ground overnight. Yeah, so you said there's fucking thousands of them throughout the city, so it would be nothing for, you know, so yeah, fucking skate by. Exactly. I mean, that's the other thing is when we drove in every day, there was, I mean, hordes, hordes of women and children and men leaving, fleeing the city. So we're literally driving through hundreds and hundreds of people, you know, and you don't know which one, who's ISIS and who's not.

Yeah. It was, it was chaos. But yeah, so we started splitting up the element, like, the elements. So I would take a wreck, the element up up pick a good spot That had good advantage point of the battlefield Come back grab all the weapons Gustav javelins what I also needed and then we would just send set up an op in there for the day And it ended up working out really well We started seeing really good effects good effects From doing that. The partner forces were loving it because we were actually engaging with them with our organic weapons

and not just the air. And what I came to realize is the partner forces would clear to a certain point until, and if they were taking gunfire, then they would just stop. And they're like, we're not moving. Until something, they would just blow this whole block up, drop bombs on it, which we're not doing that. But they're like, well, we're not moving. And so, what I found out is I'd go up, like, okay, where are you taking sniper fire from? They're like, oh, that building, you know. Okay, cool. Look at it and go, all right, third level,

like yeah, shoot a javelin at it. We javelin, and they would all start cheering and start clearing. Right on. So javelins, it's a misalanchor for those of you that don't know. So you're a partner for us, your men are getting engaged, they're getting shot out, they're getting fucking blown up. They're asking you to blow up a city block and you say no.

Which, so you're showing restraint there. Oh, yeah, somebody that's accused you know, cues to be in a merciless killer. Your guys are getting fucking killed and you're telling them that you can't, you can't do what they want you to do because innocent people are going to fucking die. Exactly. Yeah. So yeah. But once we were able to engage with the Javlins, which are pretty precise and accurate,

they loved it and they would just start moving forward. So that's how we sort of kept them going every day. And the command, Marsal command was like loving it. And we'd come back and they're like, did you guys are kicking ass? Like, this is great. And the fact that we were requesting to go out, not requesting, but we were like, we're going out every day.

We could have taken, so we had three platoons and we could have worked in shifts to where you'd have, we'll go out one day, two days off, but me and my OAC were like, no, we want to go out every day. This is the golden egg of an appointment. I want to get every little bit out of it we can. So you were tight with my OIC? Oh, yeah.

Yeah, I mean, I had a really, really good relationship. Just an awesome dude. Really good officer, but also he was not how to say this politely. Not like every other O where he thinks, you know, like I'm the officer and I'm in charge. Like he really like we bounce stuff off each other and he listened to me and a lot of things and was like, okay, you know, he's receptive. Yes, big time. And so yeah, we that was that was thank God, me and him got along. And I think that's what really like helped us move forward to that deployment because we were on the same page the whole time. So we started implementing those tactics, breaking up and doing the wrecky piece,

and we started getting deeper into the city, and it got a little more area area the deeper we got in. The front line, like I talked about earlier, started really getting skewed a lot because the closer we got to Old Mosul, which is the little city inside of Mosul, which is like the oldest city there is there. It's for biblical times.

They had that place locked down like that was their ISIS is like called like the Beehive, you know, then. And so we started bumping up against that. That's when the partner forces are like, we're getting, I mean, they were getting swacked left and right. Um, so it, and it got a little hairy for us sometimes too. We had our, uh, we had our turp was, um, blown in half or, uh, by a, some kind of rocket

that was shot at us. Um, and, uh, it just got, it started getting a little too dangerous, I guess. And we made the command, made the call, Marslaugher's like, okay, we're going to switch fobs, and we're gonna go all the way to the North End of Mizzle and start cleaning from that way, because either like the partner forces aren't gonna, they're not going any farther.

Yeah. because either like the partner forces aren't gonna, they're not going any farther. Yeah. So was it just, was it just team seven alpha platoon and it was Marsock, element and team seven golf platoon? So that's what, maybe like 50 fucking people. Well, you also have, and that's that you also had other partner forces out there.

It was it was a it was a hodgepodge of so yet ERD which we were partnered up with. You had, I forget the name of the other one. It was like, yeah, I forget their name, but they were actually a vetted group, which NSW was in charge of. So there was another platoon, a brow platoon, but they were working under a whole different, they were working under NSW.

So they were taking a whole different section of Mosul. So you got to think like, you know, there's the whole West side of Mosul. I mean, it's massive. So you had brow platoon working with their partner force here, us's the whole West Side of Mosul. I mean, it's massive. So you had Brawlable Tune working with their partner force here, us on the other side working with ours. And then you had a contingent of like other random Iraqi forces like Fedpole, which is their police unit, I guess. They're also clearing.

So what ended up happening is we're clearing through and we just started convering on each other. Um, and I think I'm getting it. It was good. Like with Bravo, we, we would, you know, talk to them. I were out there and I'm like, Hey, this is, you know, this is where we are. Is where you guys are cool. There was never any problem between American forces now with the partner forces like Fed FedPole, ERD, and whoever Bravo was with, I forget their name, that got super hairy. Our golf platoon got lit up pretty bad by FedPole, just driving in one day, the whole other home

V started getting shot at. You know, we'd have green on blues almost every other day, like not actual green on black. They weren't shooting us, but they would shoot at us. Because it was just, it was hard. You could try to mitigate it as much you can, but eventually, you know, once we started conversing on each other, they got real. Pretty hairy. So that's, I think the decision to move to the north was a good one because it sort of opened it back up again. So we packed up within 48 hours and moved to the north side of

a Mosul and started clearing from there. That is actually the first day, the first day we started clearing from there is the day of the incident that became so famous. We, you know, it was SOP, we had a pre-designated spot. We went out and we were actually a lot closer that day to the enemy than we had been. It was probably probably like 300, 300, 400 yards from them, from this village that they were, there was this little village,

where we're a town or whatever you want to call it, right before you get into the main urban part of the Mosul that we had to go through and we were told that the ISIS was, you know, they've been using that village and they were all in there. And sure enough, we showed up that morning probably around 6.37 in the morning, picked a pretty good spot behind some walls where the map V's that the turrets could see right over the wall. were the Matveys that the turrets could see right over the wall. And yeah, it was like a turkey shoot. They were, I mean, they were all out in the open, just walking back and forth between huts. Oh, sure.

Yeah. We waited. We sat there and watched them probably for about 10, 15 minutes, waiting for the our partner force to start actually clearing through, which, you know, typical Iraqi fashion, they were just taking their time. 10, 15 minutes waiting for the our partner force to start actually clearing through, which, you know, typical Iraqi fashion, they were just taking their time. So we decided like, all right, we're just going to start engaging. And we probably engage these guys for an hour. I mean, it was, it was awesome. Everybody, you know, 50s are going off snipers, chaps And we pretty much decimated most of the most of the guys in there that village before ERD started clearing No, sure. Yeah, how many like how many guys does either were in there in that village total probably

60 60 guys and how many of you? Oh, at the time Probably like 13 or 14 unless and the partner force was part of all a gagging ass around Yeah, they were just back there waiting, you know as we're engaging. How much do you think you thinned them out before they got there? Oh big time we thinned out most of them before they even started clearing and we let them know I think that's what they're waiting for. You know, we finally were like, can you guys do all the dirty work? Yeah. Which is fine. Really like, yeah, fuckable. Yeah.

That's as, uh, thanks. Yeah. Yeah. But they, they started clearing through, really had no issues because everybody was pretty much dead. really had no issues because everybody was pretty much dead. I mean, do you think you guys killed what? 75% of them, 80%? 50%? I price 80% or even higher, maybe 90% of them. Cause they really had no. They went through that village pretty quick.

We had a hell fired a couple buildings. And actually the war, one of the buildings that we hell fired is where they dragged this ISIS fighter out of the partner force as they cleared the room, dragged him out, and brought him back to us. That's where the whole debacle happened. I know I said we weren't going to talk about the controversy, but you know, I don't understand.

I watched this documentary called The Gallagher Effect and put out by somebody on the New York Times and they basically paint this fucking nicest fighter like some little innocent, little fucking kid. Yeah. innocent little fucking kid. Yeah, and you know one thing I just don't understand how Half of the nation can be so up in arms Even if you did stab the fucking kid, you know to death. I mean Here's a journalist Ripon you apart when

2014 they've got journalists on getting their heads, like, literally sought off on fucking television. And then they paint this fucking kid like you some little innocent, the poor little lysis kid. Yeah, it's pretty disgusting. They put people in cages and burn them alive. Oh, yeah, you know, I mean the shit that we saw on that deployment too not to like Riverside track, but I do that I Haven't seen anything like that and any any my other deployments You know you always see like the atrocities of war and Stuff, you know innocent people get killed. It's just that's war, you know,

it's a failure in casualties on both sides. What is some of the shit that you saw that these guys were doing? I think one of the first things I saw going through, we ended up pushing into this neighborhood and we were driving through. And they had like a playground in the middle of these like apartments and they had like these fence going around it. And I remember getting out and like walking up, we're trying to wreck the spot and I look over and they had kids heads, little kids heads on the spikes, just sit there, and I'm waving to, there was dead bodies all over the place. So I don't like, it's hard to even put you like I tell people that and I know yeah, but like no they nobody was cleaning up the dead as we were pushing through.

So there was you're just like walking over either piles of bodies that they just pile up or they were just scattered through the streets. So they were cutting little kids heads off and sticking them on a fucking pole. Yeah. And then at certain points, we would be in certain areas where there was like a field or some kind of open space between us and ISIS, you know, and it'd. And they would send hordes of women and kids running over the through the field towards us. And then just mow them down half way because they were trying to draw us out or our partner force out to the open to come help them, which a couple times they succeeded, you know, the partner forces, they would try and run out and help these women and kids,

and then they don't get in smoke too. But yeah, again, you held restraint. Yeah, it's well, there's nothing I mean. No. And it's one thing to talk about it, or I see, it's funny to see like reports on the Zool Now or they do like these documentaries and they do like, oh, there was horrific stuff that happened, but they don't go into detail about like what actual horrific things they

were doing. And it's another thing to actually be there and see it going on. And that's tough, man. I mean, it does. It's emotion gets involved. You know, you're just like, how can people be doing this to? And you can't fucking do any of that. Yeah, you can't use to sit there and you're like, okay, well,

we'll wait until we can push forward. They would also, they were using our, our always against us. They would chain civilians into buildings, you know, chain them along the walls inside and they would put civil wets on the roof of like with weapons. So then I saw I would see it and be like, oh, there's two dudes down there and we'd end up dropping on the building and then they would come out and use that as propaganda against us. Like, oh, you see what they just did. You know, there's one big like evil game they were playing.

That's hard to do, man, to watch people get mowed down. I mean, yeah, it sucks. Yeah. So, yeah, it's crazy to think, you know, after this whole thing, like, how much the media, half the media, most of it, tried to empathize with this ISIS fighter. And, you know, I think NPR just recently went, they sent a team out to Iraq and they interviewed this ISIS fighter's family. They found them and they were like, you know, trying to be sympathetic.

And even the Isis Fighter's dad in the interview, which I was watching, and was like, yeah, he joined Isis. I told him not to. Like, that's it, you know. It's pretty black and light. Yeah. But yeah, the... But yeah, to see like you were talking about, to see the media just trying to twist it. Well, I'm just trying to show like you want to talk about fucking restraint. You know, that's hard to watch. And I mean, I can relate to one of my biggest regrets is I was sitting in a sniper hide and we were supposed to be killing anybody

that blew up a fucking convoy and it was in front of me, I was set up in front of a school with my partner and we were all gillied up and these kids fucking came down and got out of school. They were probably about 10, 12 fucking years old and pulled out a cell phone and you know, pulled out a cell phone and, you know, we fucking call it in. And they're like, don't fucking do anything. And you know, that sounds weird. Like, oh, who gives a shit? They had a cell phone. We'll back in 0405.

Nobody had fucking cell phones. Unless they were getting ready to call something that was going to detonate a bomb. And sure shit, you know, I saw a fun convoy get blown up and do anything about it. And that's, that's why I don't think people get is like they think, civilians maybe think war is black and white. Yeah, it's gray. It's all gray. That's where you have to live. And you had to make decisions in that gray. That's where you have to live.

And you had to make decisions in that gray. It's nothing. You see guys on this deployment or even Afghanistan guys with Icom or in that's considered a weapon because they're communicating. But then it's on you as a shooter to make that choice. Like, okay, is this guy actually doing something on the outcome or is he just somebody else and sometimes that decision? Yeah, it can be right around, but as long as you can live with it,

I think you can do a better night knowing that you did the right thing. And you should be fine. Yeah. So yeah, the going back to this, they brought the ISIS fighter in. They brought him to you or you went to him. No, they brought him to us. Okay. And it was very like confusing and chaotic when they brought him back. I was actually in another spot. So I had moved, once they had cleared to that village, I had moved my vehicle and another one to the flank, sort of set up like in a knell

to cover them as they went through. So I was probably like 400 yards away from the main element and it came over the radio that, hey, I think they have an ISIS fighter here. I was like, all right, check. I was like, well, they're done clearing. I was like, we'll come back there. Went back and walked up. There's a crowd around them. A lot of guys from my platoon and a lot of Iraqis were around this guy. I walked up and he looked like he was on death door. Just out of it. Man, I was like, hey, get the med bag. And we'll start treating this dude. And I wasn't

to be clear, like, I didn't give a shit whether this guy lived or died. Yeah. It was more of like, this guy's here. What are we doing? I can't just execute this guy. That's not the right. I mean, I would have, it wouldn't have mattered to me, but I was like, get the med bag and we'll work on him until he dies. That's pretty much it.

Did you come over comms and say, everybody's stand off, he's mine? No. You didn't. No. I said something to the effect of like, yeah, just keeping there. And we'll come back. Okay. The, yeah, that whole thing they baked somehow coordinated to three of them and came up with that same line. But then it was just whatever their ridiculous. The it was like two or three of the guys in trial said, you know, like, oh, he said this. But then even their buddies were like, I didn't hear him say that. So it's it's all convoluted. But I did say, you know, hold him there or come back because I wanted to see what we had. The guy was pretty much on a death door.

So, I got it in my bag, walked up, and I started assessing him. The Iraqi general was actually putting him back on the day, brought him in on a hood of a Humvee, and they were throwing him back on the hood of the humvee Just like willing to I was like hey, we'll we'll treat him. We'll take care of him. He's like okay Left him there. I assessed him he had been Like he had a either a shrapnel or gunshot wound to the left leg and he definitely wasn't breathing properly so I did a cryic. Cryctin, cryic had no issues.

Got misting the tube. And by that point, two or the other medics and my fortune had come over and started assisting. Real quick, just for the audience and the listeners, a cryic is when you got a hole in somebody's neck so that they can breathe. Yeah. And when I was kind of doing my research and they said that you'd stabbed this kid to death, this poor little ISIS, young boy, they said you stabbed him to death.

And then I found out that you cracked him and I was wondering if they spun that because it would technically, you know, they didn't use that. No, they legitimately, Craig Miller, who was my LPO, lied and said, I legitimately took my knife out and started just going to town on this guy's neck. And found everybody, which is a complete lie. I cracked them and then the two other medics were there. I got up and we at that point, a Iraqi partner force was like all circled around us. And I looked up and they had phones.

So I went out of the general and I was like, hey, back these guys up and get them out of here and tell them stop taking pictures of us because they were infamous for, they would take pictures of everything over there and we were like, hey, we don't want, we didn't want to be any of the pictures. So he did so, he was like, you know, back off, clear everybody out.

I went back and at that point, they had already done two chest tubes on them. One was jacked up on the right side. They messed that one up, but on the left they got a chest tube in them. And They just started doing other procedures on them. So at this point, he was pretty much like a live tissue lab. Yeah, and so guys were who were interested and become a medic. One when the new guys came up and were like, I go ahead and do an IO. Like, it's pretty much like a pig lab at this point. I know there's no issues. I'm what was going on. Like

nobody was like, Hey, this is, you know, I'm bothered by this. Everyone was on board. And the one of the new guys started giving him a interosseous in the chest plate to try and get some fluids in them. They tried to give an IV. He had no veins, so they went IO. And at that point, I had walked away again, went and talked to the OIC. He was just like, what's going on with that guy?

I'm like, he's done. You know, he'll be dead here or he is dead already. He's like, okay, um He was, you know, busy talking to the JTAC At that point and there was nothing going on at this point. So I think that's another thing There was no firefight. It was pretty much they cleared to that village and it was they were done for the day So I had walked back and for the day. So I had walked back and Corey Scott, who was at the head of the patient or the ISIS fighter, not the patient, but he was like, yeah, he's done. He's dead. I was like, okay, are you sure? He's like, yeah. I was like, okay, I got in my knees. I flipped him in the eye,

no response. I gave him like a strontal or a side rub, nothing. And then this is where the story becomes what it became. His eye took my knife out. I just like poked him in the side, didn't break any skin, jabbed him, no response, put it back. And that was it. So the reason he's doing that for the listeners is, it's just you're just confirming that he's dead.

Yeah, you know, that's the... That's the... That's the... Somebody's gonna move an eye tap. You're gonna see a fucking derived all move, you know, and say, well, the knife, you're gonna get some kind of... Yeah, some kind of response. So yeah, I did, you know, three different things

and I just wanted to make sure this dude was dead and we're not like leaving this guy barely, barely breathing. So yeah, he was done. And that was pretty much it. We, you know, all got up and I requested, we actually requested to go back to base because we were sitting around doing nothing. We were told to stay out there for the remainder to like a couple more hours just to see if the partner force would clear anymore. But we knew the partner force enough by then and we were like, they're not moving. They're still the day they're done. But we stayed out there. And that's when board team guys were all sitting around.

They started messing with the body. Which was, I mean, it was nobody was thinking anything over at the time. No. My OIC came up and was like, hey, since we have time and I do anything, do you want to reenlist? Because I was planning on reenlisting that deployment at some point. I'd just like other deployments I've been on. I'd reenlist, I'd reenlist it out in the field. I was like, yeah, let's, we do it now, we

get time. So we did a short little reenlistment ceremony, not over the body, not like the body, body wasn't even part of it. It was in the vicinity along with three other bodies that were off to the left. We were at, I mean, that sounds like there was fucking bodies everywhere on the entire city. So we're a hell of even gonna have Ryan Lust out there whether it's not a fucking body. Yeah, it wasn't like, yeah, the body wasn't even

an issue or a thought. No, realisman thing. So I re-enlisted and got down with that and guys started coming down and they were taking pictures, they're doing stupid pictures with the body. You know, ones, he twosies coming down, just pretty much fucking off. Yeah. You know, didn't think anything of it at the time. And then I even went over there and took pictures with them just fucking around.

And the, started, a couple of guys started flying the drone. They were playing games like, you know, well, they get, you know, the drone to the body and bounce it up and down. And all this saying it right now sounds pretty fucked up, but at the time, it's like, nobody, you know, we were just like,

whatever, we're just waiting here. I think what people don't fucking understand is no human is supposed to experience this kind of shit. Yeah. And when that shit becomes the fucking daily norm, yeah, you don't think anything of it. You know, it's hard to explain to people like you're in a completely different mindset over there, you know, well, what people don't understand too, is the fucking comedy. Like, yeah, and I'm, you know, that's how go to a firehouse,

That's how go to a firehouse, go to a police station, go to a fucking steel team, go to a marine base. And when humans deal with tragedy on a regular basis, the only fucking coping mechanism that you have is humor. Yeah. And that humor gets fucking dark. But the important thing is you're finding something, you know, to me, and to kind of keep your fucking mind going. Exactly.

Yeah, if you can't laugh about it then, you know, have fun while you're in chaos, then you're going to be pretty miserable. Yeah. So yeah, guys were fucking off. And then it was time to go home. You know, we went back to base. I went, came back debriefed the day. The body wasn't brought up in a debrief, you know.

Then it went, got to work out, did a little workout and after the workout, I walked into a meeting that was going on with the LPO and everybody below. I got real quiet when I walked in and I was like, it's going on, what's up? Nothing was said, everyone's dispersed. Well then Corey Scott came up to me after I'd walked out and he was like, hey, there's guys have some issues with the pictures that we're all taking today. And I was like, okay, what's the problem? They're like, well, some of the guys are scared that they're going to get in trouble for

taking pictures or that they're going to be out there. And I was like, all right, well, then just delete them. It's a pretty simple solution. He was like, all right, well, then just delete them. Like, it's a pretty simple solution. Uh-huh. He was like, all right. So he he walked off and Craig Miller, my uphill came to a room and pretty much emphasize the same thing to me. Like, hey, some of the guys or have issues with the pictures. And I was like, all right, I was like, bring all the senior E6s in. I brought them in.

And I was like, what's the issue here? Same thing was brought up by the pictures and there was a TC burn who was one of the medics how the helmet came on, you know, they're an old thing. And I was like, okay, so I don't understand what you guys are stressing about. And I was like, don't show the pictures

anywhere or delete them. We came to agreement and it was like, don't show the pictures anywhere or delete them. We came to agreement and it was like just delete, you know, it was like, you guys have issues then delete it, delete everything. And we'll move on. And like nothing was done wrong, but like you guys think you're gonna get in trouble or stressing about it, then delete everything.

They're like, okay, the problem is some of the other guys didn't want to delete them. They were like, I don't have a problem with this at all. But I thought the issue was resolved. It was everyone's like, went on their merry way and I'm like, okay, it wasn't brought up ever again. Did you think anything, anything of it? No. With the team cohesion or these guys didn't like you or?

I already knew at that point I was pretty well aware that two or these guys didn't like you or I already knew at that point I was pretty well aware that two of the guys didn't like me, Dylan DeLay and Dalton Toberte, they I could just tell from body language in the way they like, you know, interacted with me that they didn't like me for but you know and all honestly I didn't really like them too much but it was this was a job I'm like you know we a job to do. I'm not going to let a Personal things get in the way here. But I could tell you that they didn't there's something about me that didn't like, you know, you could just, you know, you walk into a room. You're like, all right, what's going on here. But I think at that point, because I don't know if that that was what fractured

or whatever, but the pictures or any of that was never brought up again, you know, the rest of the appointment. I think what was what started happening is, you know, the week kept working and it got busier. You know, we were going out all the time and I had one of the guys in my platoon come up to me and was like, hey, I think we're working too much. You know, we're tired and I was like, okay. What's having another meeting and I want to hear it, you know,

and the I pulled the seniors sixes again and the complaints I heard from that meeting were I don't have time to work out You know the work loads too much you know heard it was Sort of petty complaints to me, where I'm like, through the word, this is a deployment. And not only that, I have you guys on a week on week off rotation. I'm like, you're getting a whole week back, or an hour. I'm like, myself, the OIC, I've been, are staying here the whole time. And we're not complaining or whatever.

I'm like the workload's not going to change. I just let them know that. It's like we're going to be going out. Like you guys have a week to go back and rest and refit and come back out. There should be no excuses. They didn't take that. I don't think too well. Didn't say anything to my face, but I could tell they were like,

okay, you know, our complaints didn't get us anywhere. Dalton Tolbert was screening to go to green team. When we got back, so he came up to me and was like, I'm pissed because I don't have time to work out to get ready for green team. I was like, okay, I literally was like, I will, I understand, because I completely understood. I was like, okay, I literally was like, I will, I understand,

because I can pretty understood. I was like, you know, that's a big thing. I was like, I'll take you off some of the the ops so you have time. He's like, okay, so I took him off, you know, the next two days of ops. I was just like, hey, you can chill and work out. And I came back the next day. And then he was pissed that I took him off the ops and work out. And I came back the next day and then he was pissed that I took him off the ops and that I was saying, I was punishing him. At that point, I didn't know what to say to him. I'm like, dude, you just told me that you didn't want

to go out, I'm trying to help you out to go work out. And now you're saying I'm punishing you. I was like, I can't. Where's the, you know, where are you gonna be going to be content, you know, like, that's just the kind of attitude I was sort of trying to deal with. And honestly, like, as a leader, I was having a hard time with it as far as I've never been around guys who were complaining about going out into combat or like actually getting to do the job. So I mean, I don't know if I dealt with it in the right way. I didn't I didn't know how to deal with it. I was just like this. We're going to

keep going. The admission first, you know, and I mean, what the fuck are you supposed to do? Tell the United States of America, hey, we're not going to take Mosul because because we need to find more guys. Yeah,. Yeah, my butt's starting to sag a little bit. Yeah, fuck. But honestly, that was like the dilemma I was in, to where I didn't know what to do as far as, I had called my S.E.A. And like, dude, these guys are fucking bitching about this.

And he was just telling me to stop being a bunch of pussies. I was like, all right, exactly. So I'm doing the right thing then. But yeah, I think from that meeting on, it just started fracturing. Like I think guys were, these guys that were saying they were tired and didn't wanna go out, they started really being a toxic group and started trying to get the rest of the tune, you know, to go against me.

But it was all done behind the scenes. I had no idea like any of this was really going on until after the fact. How early was this and little deployment. Um, now this was probably four months in. Well, was it a six month deployment? Seven. Seven months. It was six months of straight work. And then the last month we had nothing,

because Missoula was clear. So which was good. It was like, to me, I took that as a month of like decompression before you go home, which I told the guys, I'm like, dude, this take this month to like work on yourself, get ready to go home, which I told the guys, I'm like, dude, this take this month to like, work on yourself, get ready to go home. It was a busy deployment. But yeah, it was six months of straight work.

So around the fourth month, I think, is when the guys really started not the hope of tune. I'm talking about picking it up. Yeah, these four guys were really working to. You know turn the platoon against me. Well, they all in the same team. You said you're broken the team up and so these guys were all in the same same team, same group. All lived together in the same room. So they had plenty of time to conspire. Commiserate, you know, you know, you know, you're in the field, where it goes on.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And it was probably around the fifth month is when I really, the end of the fifth month is when I really like found out just how bad it had gotten. I was living with, so my, I roomed with the OIC and one of the JOs. I asked to use the JOs phone one day to call back to the Shake On House to have them bring up some gear

whatever one they came and rotated out. He was like, through me his phone. And I looked at it, you know, pulled up who I was gonna call and a text thread came up and I saw my name like all through it. So naturally, I was like, what's this? Started reading it and this guy was like, we're fucking sick of working for Eddie. He's going to get one of us killed.

Like he's making us go out too much. He's too aggressive. Like just a list of complaints. This guy was, you know, and just talking shit. So I read that and I was like, what the fuck is this? I mean, it sort of took me by surprise. I pulled the J.O. in. I was like, dude, what is this? And he, you know, pretty much got white. It's like, I don't want to, I don't have anything to do with it. And I was like, well, obviously, they're texting you these things. So you knew this was like, there's anything to do with it. And I was like, well, obviously they're texting you

these things. And like, so you knew this was like, there's some discontent going on. I'm like, why don't you just bring it to me? And he, he can play the, you know, I don't want anything to do with it. So I decided to, I didn't know what to do.

I was pretty pissed. So I, you know, went and worked out and thought about it. And I was like, you know what? I'll just remove this guy, send him to another platoon. And, you know, rotate him out with another guy that wants to be here. And I had guys the whole deployment and calling me knocking on the door, trying to get, you know, augment us. Because we were doing the most work. So I called back and let him know I'm like, hey, man, pack your shit.

You know, I'm going to send you over to Delta. I'm going to get somebody else over here. Take your spot. That didn't go over well. That turned it ended up being like he was pissed. So I had one final meeting with the E6s the day, the next day, my OIC calmy down was like, dude, I know you're pissed. Just let's all go talk and hash us out, which was the right call. So we drove, we

actually called off an op or like going out so we could settle this drama. And I drove up to the Sheikhan house. And I pull up there and it's all the accusers. So it's Craig Meller, Delay, Dalton, Cory Scott, and this other guy, I won't mention because he's still after duty and he actually did the right thing. I went and talked to him. I walked in the house. They were all standing there looking at me and I was like, call the guy into a room and sat him down and was like, hey, what's

the table or try and I was like, let's just talk and hatch us out. What's going on? Like, I don't understand why your complaints or what the issue is here. And we had a good conversation for about 10, 15 minutes and what it came down to was, you know, the guys were, what he was telling me is the guys were rotating back for a rest and refit for a week. And then they were commiserating and creating this hate circle and it was all, you know, everything was my fault.

Was all directed at you? Yeah. Which I completely understood. I was like, dude, that's not my first rodeo. I make usually guys get tired or whatever leadership gets blamed for something. You know, they want to point the finger a bitch about something, which is completely normal. So I, you know, we talked about it and he came, you know, he was like, dude, I, I realize what, you know, we're working, we're working ourselves up here. And, you know, I explained some tactical things I was doing to him and he was like, no, that does make sense. I'm like, this is why we're doing this. He was like, no, I got it. And that was the end of it. I was like, let's just finish this deployment out. I did tell him I was like, dude, you're

arguing and like do some shit duty for a week because you're texting the J.O. here, talk shit about your chief. I was like, so I had him doing like supply runs for a week, but that was it. Were they pissed at the OIC at all? So while I was in this meeting with this guy, the OIC was out with the rest of the guys, and I guess they were all trying to get him to turn on me.

They were like, you know, he's, they told him I was manipulating him, uh, that I, he's not really in charge that I am. I mean, this is coming from E5, E6, it's two, you know, an officer. The all Jake immediately chewed all of them out, told them, you know, shut the fuck up, that, you know, he had, we had a good verfen relationship, that I, you know,

that he was pretty pissed that they were pulling this, like, euthanous type crap on his, he put them in their place. I didn't, I wasn't there to witness it, but I heard about it, which is, I mean, I respect Jake for doing that, you know, for standing up. And so I came out after that, after that meeting and pretty much pulled the rest of the guys in. I told him to go ahead and get everything out. I was like, get it off your chest. I was like, what else? I'm like, why are you guys so fucking angry? And then it came out. Delay was like, we heard you called us a bunch of pussies and you called us cowards. And I was like, yeah, I did say that they're like, yeah, well, we're fucking pissed

about it. And this is where they told me they're like, we've all been together for three, this is our third platoon, you're the new guy, like whatever we like were together, they said that straight to my face. So as like as a chief, I was like, I was pretty worn out by this point, dealing with a drama, dealing with this petty shit that I didn't think I'd have to deal with on unemployment. I just looked at it and I was like, you know what, man? I was like, I apologize. I'm like, I apologize for calling you guys, put these encounters, all right? I was like, let's just get over this crap. And move, I was like, if that's what you guys are really mad about,

then let's just move on. And finish this deployment, how strong, you know, we've had a good deployment. We're being very successful. I was like, this is, all this is doing is just dragging us down. This little petty thing we got going on. They all agreed.

They were like, yeah, you're right. Okay, we shook hands. I'm like, all right, we'll move on. They all agreed. They're like, yeah, you're right. Okay, we shook hands. Like, all right, we'll move on. Unfortunately, I moved on or tried to and they kept their little circle going, which culminated to when we came back from deployment. And that's when I found out that they were still spreading little rumors about me. that they were still spreading little rumors about me. I had gone home on the first flight on deployment as well, which wasn't an easy call. You usually rotate out three different flights and then usually the chief is supposed to stay to the end to turn over and go out in the last flight. I had some personal problems at

home with my kids. Andrea was having a rough time and to be honest, I was fucking over being around some of these guys. So she has, Andrea had never asked me to come home once early from an appointment, no matter what was going on, but she was like, I'd really appreciated it if you got home, you know, quicker or sooner. And so I made the call. I called my mass chief and was like, dude, this is what's going on. He was like, yeah, no worries, go home on the first flight. He's, you know, everything's good to go. So when I left on that first flight, these guys really turned it on because I was no longer there and started going to the OIC and really trying to hammer home like dude, fuck him. You know, he's manipulating you the whole time.

The whole thing all over again. No. How did you find that out? My OIC told me. He came back on the third flight and he was like, hey man, and he pulled me aside, or we just talked, and he was like, this is what these guys were doing.

He was like, they were even, so my wife had taken a picture of, I mean, my kids, like, you know, deployment reuniting, whatever, you know, hugging each other, and she posted it, I mean, they were using those pictures, pictures like look at he's home with his family and we're not like He shouldn't be home like using all this crap To start things up Luckily my OIC he told me he was like I they had me going for a second. Uh-oh, but he's like this isn't right, you know This none of this it's all bullshit

So that's when and I also heard This isn't right, none of this, it's all bullshit. So that's when, and I also heard, I got back on the first flight and nobody was really back at the team just yet. You know, guys are still coming in from everywhere they were deployed. So there was like handfuls of guys back and I had a couple guys come up to me and they were like, hey man,

like there was a couple of dudes in your platoon who were saying some shit about you. And I was like, what are they saying? And he's like, well, they said that you're tactically unsound, you're too aggressive, that you're dangerous. And all that, I was like, okay. Yeah, I heard that. You've already been I was like, okay, you know. Yeah, I've heard that.

You've already been fucking proven time and time again. Yeah, but then they were like, they all said you're a thief. And that's when I was like, what? And I was like, oh yeah, they said you were stealing from everybody. That set me off to where I was like, I've never been called a thief before,

in order to steal from anybody. I was like, so this needs to be addressed. And I'd heard it from probably two or three people, different people at that point. So once the whole platoon was back, I called them in for a meeting. And myself, oh, I see everybody. I was like, dude, came in.

And you gotta think like, more than half a platoon has no clue that this any of this drama is going on. Maybe if they do, they don't think it's as bad as it is. So, you know, if the whole platoon is in there, sort of like, what's this meeting about? I was like, hey, ranks are off. I was like, I want to know like, what's going on here? Like, what? I was like, I've been called, you know, told him everything that I'd heard. I was like, I'd be called a thief. I was like, I want to know right now what I stole from somebody.

I was like, because I've never stolen anything from anybody. And I was like, so if I somehow did, I want to either fix it or if it's rumors that you guys are starting, I want to squash it. Nobody said a word for about two minutes. I told them I was like, listen, I've already heard it enough times. Let's just get it out.

Dalton Tolbert. He's like, okay, will you stole a Red Bull out of a refrigerator six months ago? And I looked at him and I was like, what? He's like, yeah, you stole somebody's red bull in six months ago. A red bull? Yeah. I was like out of the platoon fridge. And I didn't know what to say to that. I was like, dude, I don't know if I took somebody's red bull or not six months ago out of the platoon fridge

where everybody goes in and just grabs whatever. But I was like, tell me that's not why you guys are calling me a thief. He's like, well, that calls a huge issue. I was like, okay. Well, I was like, I can't either confirm no deny if I took a redboard or not. I don't remember.

I was like, please tell me there's something else. You have something more concrete that you guys are calling me a thief on. The, what was the atomic neo who was the J.O. that I live with the whole deployment. He didn't say anything, but Dalton told her again, was like, you didn't pay somebody for a haircut. You got it. Didn't pay somebody back for a haircut that they paid for. I got one hair, one haircut that deployment in the end, and Tom McNeil paid for it, because meeting him went together. So I looked at Tom, and I was like, hey, he's right,

I didn't pay back for the haircut. I was like, I'll go get the money at the ATM. I was like, hey, he's right. I didn't pay back for the haircut. I was like, I'll go get the money out of the ATM. Tom's like, no, no, no, it's not a big deal. I don't care. I was like, well, obviously you do if this guy's talking for you, you know, this has been talked about before, it must be an issue. I was like, tell me there's something else

and there was nothing. Craig Miller said he stated that I stole sunglasses and I was like, I don't have them. And he's like, well, I have them back now. So I was like, well, how did I steal them? And he's like, well, I wrote it on the board that somebody stole them and all of a sudden they appeared the next day. I was like, so you're putting that on me. And he was like, yeah. I was like, well, I didn't steal them, man. You know, and that was pretty much the end of that meeting where I was like,, I didn't steal a man, you know, and That was pretty much the end of that meeting where I was like dude you guys need to cut this shit out like Stop spreading this hair. I was like, I don't know what's gotten into you and I told them I was like you guys need to decompress

Like it was a heck of deployment. You guys need to go chill out take whatever this two weeks of leave block leave you have and just You know, I just, you know, I was like, you need to talk to somebody, talk to somebody, but I was like, this isn't going to, this isn't going to help anybody. You guys keep spreading this hate. They all were like, you know, the rest of the platoon, I think, was confused. Don't want what was going on. They were just like, fuck, but these guys, you know, some of them nodded their head, like, okay, we get it, but Dalton Tober, he was like staring daggers at me when I said this, and so I looked at him and I was like,

or I was like, we can go to the fight room, which is that trade at, and I was like, and let's just fight it out. I was like, if you guys, you guys don't like me, I don't fucking like you personally. I was like, ranks are off, I'm like, you guys don't like me. I don't fucking like you personally. I was like, ranks are off. I was like, we just go get it out that way and then go on a merry way. If that's what you guys want to go. I was like, I'll fight every one of you one after the other and I was like, and you'll kick my ass. But I was like, I think it'll, we'll feel better

at the end. Nobody said a word, you know, don't just like look down at the ground. I was like, all right, then I don't want to hear shit. And I was like, I'm still your chief. And if you guys need help with anything. And I did help them while within the next duty stations, you know, it's like I'm not holding anything personal here. I was like, but I did tell Craig and then when I was like, dude, I'm not like your buddy. It was like especially after this you guys accuse me of All the shit and spread lies about me like we're not hanging out or anything, but I will help you out and you're really if you need help going to your next station or assignment That

They went from that meeting and went to the command and told them like Dalton and Craig that I had threatened to assault them. I was threatening their lives because I invited them to go to the fight room and settle it that way. And that's where, I mean, they started from there, and then the escalation of allegations started. I mean, it went from, but I was too dangerous, you know, followed by all the other crap with the tactics, then he's a a thief and then it escalated to now he's like trying to come after us, which wasn't far from the truth. I wasn't even thinking about them. The command actually, when Craig and them came up to them and started giving them these complaints,

they were like, hey, he's too dangerous. His tactics are this and this. So the command is like, okay, well, give me some of the tactics he was doing. I think this was my TU commander. I was like, I want to, all right, what was he doing? That was so dangerous. Give me an example. They're like, oh, he used his bait. He was trying to get us killed.

So like, I think I was like, okay, well, then give me an example. And this is the example, the example they gave them, like, well, we were on a roof, getting shot at by a sniper and he had one of us put our helmet on a stick and put it, you know, up at a, over the wall. So we could see where the fire was coming from. And they're like, yeah, that's been a tactic that's been used. No, forever. Like, do they make you put your own grape up there? Like your own head, head and he's like, no, he was like, yeah, that's been a tactic that's been used forever. Do they make you put your own grape up there?

Like your own head and he's like, no, he was like, well, what's the issue? So they really had no, like they were coming with these complaints with no, nothing to back them up. They were just, I mean, the more they tried to explain it, the dumber they sounded. And the command just told them the same thing I didn't like, it sounds like you guys need to go decompress. Like it And like, it sounds like you guys need to go decompress.

Like, it sounds like, you know, you guys need to go chill. They were like, well, he's a thief. And then, like, to you, commanders, like, what was he stealing? And they're like, oh, he took power powers out of a care package that wasn't his. And I think my two commanders, like, the results seems pretty petty. And if you

take that up with the chiefs, then I could view, you know, which they never did because it was all BS. But they came back three different times to my team commander with the same complaints. And I think my team commander got fed up and was like, listen, is there something valid here? Why do you guys keep coming back and saying stuff? Like, did this, did he do any low-ac violations or anything like that? No, they denied it three different times. They're like, no, nothing like that. And he's like, well, then if there's nothing like that, then go fucking decompress. Like, he got number one chief out of the team. He's, you know, doing Marsok had nothing but good things to say about him. Like we don't understand what you guys are

coming with this BS unless there's something valid. And they got pretty frustrated at that, I guess. And they about four months later is when they came back and they're like, oh, we have something. Like four fucking months. Yeah. And they, and what we came to find out is, you know, afterwards they were conspiring over text messages, like figuring out a plan. Like, I mean, you could see it in other text messages, like, we need to make sure our stories water tights, no one could poke holes in it. Like this and this. They're having little meetings, you know. And that's when, yeah, four, about four months later, Craig Miller went to the TU commander again,

who is now, he was at a different command. So everybody was probably scattered around by the rules of the party. Yeah, scattered off, you know, it's different commands. And that's when, yeah, he came to them and was like, okay, we have something. And he was like, what is it? And he's like, oh to them and was like, okay, we have something. And he was like, what is it? And he's like, oh, he stabbed a prisoner. And my two commander was like, okay, well, we're going to round this up.

And you sure, you know, I like, yeah. And that's where it, I mean, it's skyrocketed from there. It's like they, they went and reported it to, these guys went and reported it to NCIS, called NCIS themselves and told them that I have murdered a nicest prisoner and that's when it just went off the rails. NCIS got involved.

This guy, Agent Warpinski, who was the lead agent, you couldn't have put a worse actor in this whole situation. I mean, he pretty much came just to give you an example of context, the first interview he did. Like hadn't even done, started investigating the case. He brings in Craig Miller. And the first thing he says is, this is a black and white open and shut case. We already know we got him.

So go ahead and say whatever. And you guys aren't gonna get in trouble or anything that you did. So it was like, gave these guys car blanche to just spew out whatever they wanted. Oh, shit. So basically what Wapinski did is he formed a prosecution and then did the investigation. You know, did it completely backwards.

Before we go on with that, just heading back, you, when you took that platoon over, you had one guy that you brought in, which sounded like he was your boy, your right-hand man, your LPO, and he got transferred to another cartoon because that chief got shot in the chest for us. Yes. Did he live? He did. Yeah.

Dude, like I said, an animal that got shot in the chest. Yeah, big old Indian. Is that when you started to see maybe the real stuff? Actually, that's a good point man. I'm glad you brought that up. So I did have Craig Miller was not my OPO during workup or any of that. I had a this other guy who was my right hand man. Awesome, awesome guy, awesome operator.

And he picked up chief right before we deployed. But he, you know, the team or the command was like, he's gonna stay with your Batoon because usually like if someone picks up Chief, they're not gonna have two Chiefs in the same Batoon, they'll move him somewhere else. At least that's the way they did it. On the West Coast for a little bit.

But they were like, yeah, he's going to stay as your IPO, the whole deployment, which I was thankful for. I mean, that guy, he was an awesome IPO. Just had a good read on the dudes, and he would also come to me if there was anything like, right away, like, hey, man, guys are bitching about this or they're

wondering about this and then we would address it. But yeah, about a month and a half into deployment. Bravo platoon. Yeah, their chief got shot in the chest. And they were deep in a chief. So I sent my IPO over there to the end of the Mosul too. Yeah. I'm a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a little bit more than a all the other senior E6s, and I think he found it difficult to detach himself as an LPO, and not just like a front-prear, you know. So the guys were coming to him with complaints, or whether they were petty or not, and he was instead of coming to me and being like,

hey, he was keeping it to himself and sort of just encouraging it, you know. And all that was, you know, after the fact, obviously that I found most of this outer, I had, you know, an idea some of what was going on, but not to the external confirmation. No. No, I wasn't really worried about digging into it. I was focused on just going out.

I mean, I think that's, that's the one, one of the downfalls I'll say, like, that I, that happened to me. My OIC both admitted it to the platoon. Like, you know, we were too focused, mission focused and just like worried about going out every day. And we apologize if we didn't, we're unlike focused on how you guys were doing, I guess. You know, it was, you could have done a better job at that. But that's yeah, that's just my, where my mindset was at the time. So we're getting ready to take a break before we head into the NCIS investigation and in the courts and everything. But I do have two questions. And one is,

but I do have two questions. And one is, do you get personal satisfaction out of killing the enemy? And two, do you respect the enemy? I respect the enemy, for sure. I mean, I respect the enemy for sure. I mean, I respect. They, especially ISIS going through, I mean, they were, I mean, the, I respect their will, I respect their will to fight. I respect how they're, you want to talk about loyalty. Yeah. That's a fucking loyal bunch right there. And they're willing to die for their ideology. How how we're fucked up it is. It's to me, it's impressive to watch

guys blow themselves up on a daily basis. Off an idea. You know, yeah. Do I get personal satisfaction? do I get personal satisfaction? I don't know how to answer that without sounding like a psychopath, or however I was painted, because now I find it hard nowadays to answer questions like that, because of just how I was painted, but yes, I get personal satisfaction of taking evil off this earth.

I would say that's a valid answer. Yeah, I do. I don't know anybody that I've worked with or myself that doesn't. Yeah. And, you know, I respect the shit out of them too. I hate them. I fucking hate them. But, you know, when you get down to it, it's fucking another man that's standing up for

what he fucking believes in, which, to be be honest with you is more than you can say about 99% of the people who live in this fucking country. That's the truth right there. Yeah, and that's That's where that level of respect comes in for them You know, because at least they're standing up for something Yeah, I might be on the wrong side at least they're doing it And you know if if you would ask me that question before all this mess, I would have probably been like, fuck yeah, like I get complete satisfaction out of it, which I do.

But I think just because of the rig and the role of everything I went through, now it's like, now you have to be political. Yeah, not even like political, but also like, just the judgment, you know, like I was or I've been painted as this war criminal psychopath. So therefore I'm always like, well, if I answer it truthfully, then people would be like, oh, you are a fucking crazy bastard.

We're just like, I'm not, yeah, I do get personal satisfaction. I've taken the evil officer and killing the enemy. Just like a firefighter gets personal satisfaction about putting out fires, you know. It's my job. Well, thanks for the honesty. On that note, let's take a fucking break.

All right. Well My fire is kind of suck But my yummy bear is down Head over to VigilanceLeat.com. Buy yourself a bag of gummy bears. And if you're fire sucked too, get yourself a Vigilance Leap Beanie. Keep those grapes warm enjoy the show all right so we're back from the break break and she just had a hellacious deployment and you're

task unit commander told the boys to get a hold of NCIS. So just rewind him real quick. This shit is just blowing my mind that from the era that I was in and every other guy that sat in that fucking chair across from me, this would have been a dream deployment. So it's, you know, for whatever it's worth, I would have loved to have been in a fucking platoon like that, doing that mission, and everyone that I know from what you're saying in your account would have given anything to been a part of that. I mean, that was some shit, man. Yeah, it was an awesome deployment. Probably one of my better ones, for sure like, just action wise and work wise.

And you know, that's what I had told these guys, you know, that same anywhere, speech, I was like, you know, guys will give their right and not right now to be where you're at. You know, and you guys are sitting here bitching and complaining about going out too much. Yeah. That's ridiculous. complaining about going out too much. Yeah. That's ridiculous.

That's is that is that still team wide now? Is that like how the community is? No. Okay. No. No. Well, that's good to know. No. And that's why I want, you know, I made sure I, I tried to get that point across, like

the first interview I did, um, like the actions of these four to five individuals do not in any way, like replicate what the feelings are in the community as a whole. I mean, most of the guys that are out there, just like you and I would were banging down the door trying to get on that deployment. Everybody wants to get in the fight. Everyone wants to go on the hot deployment. So the good ones, I just think these four individuals, you know, they're just, it's just a different, different breed of, uh, I don't know, and it's, and I'll tell you this, like, I've tried to wrap my head around it. Like how did these guys like get to this point and how, why did they go to this, you know,

level to like come at me? And I'll never be able to figure it out. Honestly, like, I I can come up with try and come up with as many excuses as possible for them are like, oh maybe it's because they were tired or they were this or that. And everything that they did nothing justifies our actions at all. And it's not it's not in my DNA or I'm sure it's not in your DNA to ever pull some shit like this where you're like, oh, I don't like this person. So therefore, I'm just going to do stuff to take him down and possibly send him away for life, especially another teammate. Well, moving on, what happens when they tell the boys contact NCIS? So they were pulled, I think they were pulled into a little meeting and they were pretty much told like if you guys want to move forward with this, here's a number

to NCIS. And so these guys contacted NCIS. My TU commander went and reported it up the chain of command that this was told to him. They, the headshed above him, which was a group one, I think it was a group one Jag, told him, is there anybody willing to come forward and say they saw this? He said, yeah, I don't know. Went back and he was like, are you guys willing to come forward? And at that time, not all of them were,

they weren't all on board Craig Miller, was like, all come forward and say it. But they were like, we need, if this really happened, we need more people to come forward. They got, I think. So at that same time, when the command jag was telling them to come forward they were already talking to NCIS as well So it was like this discombobulated Who reported what you know, and I think that became a whole another piece of drama later on

Which they tried to charge my to you commander with obstruction of justice or hiding it, whatever, not reporting it, which is what he did. But once they, they called NCIS themselves and were like, you know, we have this case or whatever, that's when it started, it went off the rails. I was pulled in around that time and told that I was under investigation officially. I came out on the command, whatever you call it, the blotter, whatever it goes out to all of NSW, and it said that I was being investigated for laws of armed conflict. Is that how you found out? I was pulled into the master chief's office. This is actually, I got pulled into the master chief at trade at, he, he's out now, but he,

he pulled me in and said, Hey, you're under investigation for low act violations. I asked him what, what is it like, what's the low-acviolation he's like he told me he couldn't tell me. He couldn't talk to me about it. He's like I'm not going to talk to you about it. I asked him what I should do. I was like I've never been in a situation like this and he was like, I can't tell you anything, which was pretty disappointing. But then one thing I'll remember, he said to me before I left his office is he looked me straight in the eye and he said, if you did what they're saying, you did, you need to come out and fess up to it now and own up to it. And I was like, I don't even know

what you're saying. I did. He's like, you know what it is. And you need to fess up to it. And that's when I shut the door to his office and told him I was like, dude, I'd been on, I knew this mass or chief. I'd been on off with them before. I've seen him pull some sway-lay shit. And I was like, you know, I've never judged you or anybody else for their actions. And I appreciate if you didn't judge me, especially when I don't even know what's going on right now. And I'd appreciate some help, you know.

But if you don't have anything helpful to say then just shut the fuck up. Like don't talk to me then. You know. So I walked out of there and that's when I went to my buddy, another other operator and asked him what I should do and he gave me the name of his lawyer who I contacted. He told me I should contact him just in case this thing went off the rails, which it did. But yeah, I called him and just sort of had them set up on the side, waiting to see if anything happened. Yeah. Yeah. The one side. So once I got told I was put under investigation, I was immediately started. I got pulled out of, I was the S.E.A., senior and listed advisor over at SOUC, Urban Combat Trade at, I got pulled from that position, thrown into an office with no job, no responsibility, just told the

come report each day. That lasted for about a month, and they pulled me from there and sent me to supply across the street where there's no seals. There's one seal master chief in charge, but the rest are, you know, support and that being guys. And that's when I, I mean, I already know and it was like this isn't going well, but then once you sort of get pulled away from the teams in general and thrown in a supply,

you're like, okay, this is, this is what they said in the shipbirds. So from there, I went to talk to the group on Master Chief. I want, I want to know what was going on, which was Steve Ward at the time. They, he refused to talk to me, but I went over there on my own, and sort of forced a meeting with him. I was like, hey, he said the same, same line to me, I'm not going to talk to you about anything. You know, don't bring up anything to me. And all I told him was like, the stuff that's being said

isn't true, that I suggest they did some internal investigation of their own before they fuzz with this. And I told him this will be the biggest black guy in the community if he keeps progressing this way. Are these guys, did you have personal relationships with all these guys? I knew, so I knew, you jump out the master chiefs. Yeah.

I knew them. Yeah, I hadn't done platoons with them or anything, but small community, like you know, the main who I was to. It was nothing personal like where they would have something against me or I had something against them, like nothing I know of anyways. But it was definitely weird the way that everybody sort of, you know, hands off, like you're on your own.

I got told by a mountain, other master chief that I was pretty much, I had to look at it as, I was on an island all by myself and I had to swim my way back if I wanted to come back. No one was going to help me. After I heard that, that was like the honest truth. And I was like, okay. And I was like, I'll swim my way back then. Damn. Yeah.

So it was pretty disheartening. You knew it was at NCIS at this point? Oh, I dealt with NCIS in the past. I mean, and this is what's funny is like, I was brought up in the teams. Obviously it was like day one shit, like don't trust NCIS. They're, you know, they're always out to bag a seal.

They're always trying to find something to take a seal down. And they actually, my first platoon, I was a new guy, they took my my platoon chief, offered a appointment, just came up swooped on halfway through and he was gone. For some, I don't even know, some BS that didn't even happen. But I had dealt with them like very minimally, just like in that case, and then this, nothing like this though. And so what I knew, they were involved. I didn't know, I had no idea just how fucked up those guys were, like, what a clown show.

They were, you know, and I pretty much, you know, got first hand experience, just seeing how they operated. And when they, well, I'll get to the point where they they they rated my house, but yeah, they they pretty much they started the investigation. I think in late April of 2018. And I had no idea just how extensive they were investigated. Like, all I was told I was a investigation. No one had ever come and talked to me. This is like, so this is like a year after the actual, yeah, after the, after the deployment.

The kid. Yeah, the kid. It was May of 2017. Correct. So this is about a year later. You know, I obviously was told I was under investigation, but no one was saying a word to me. And I was sitting in supply for however long a month,

month and a half, no job. Now, you know, I show up and there's nothing for me to do. So I took it upon myself at that point. I was like, okay, well, I'll just start prepping for retirement. Or like, maybe I'll get out, I don't know. So I started taking classes on a transition. I went to the Honor Foundation, which is like a transition type program to just see what's like out there in the civilian world and prep you. I started

putting in for Intrepid Spear, which is like a branch off a NICO for TBI and everything else like that. I had been recommended to go after that deployment. I've been, you know, taking enough blasts at that point that they were like, hey, you know, just get checked out. And that's pretty much protocol now, like before your retire. It's like I'm gonna go get checked out and not, you know, getting like a full head to body scan or head to toe scan because as we know, during our career, I don't report anything.

I didn't, you know, you suck everything up and my medical record was pretty thin. So I started all that process while I was in supply and it was still nobody, you know, nobody was blocking me from doing that, but nobody was saying to me either. And around June, I get a phone call at home from somebody at supply, one of the chiefs that were there and he had told me that the exo wanted to speak to me the next following morning. Exo was a seal and that I hadn't met with him yet and he just wanted to have a face-to-face with me since I was attached there which made sense to me. I was like, okay, you know,

whatever got up the next morning went there, showed up, you know, his office 15 minutes prior in uniform, and knocked on his door, and he cracked it open, looked at me, told me to wait a second, shut the door, and then about a minute later he opened it, and there was probably five to six NCIS agents in there. to six NCIS agents in there. I walked in and they were, you know, flashed their badge, told me that they were going to take me to first and interrogation, question me. And they started pulling everything out of my pockets. At the time, I didn't, you know, I played it cool. I was just like, you know, I was pretty pissed, but I knew if I had reacted in any negative way, it wasn't gonna look good. So I was like, okay, just like compliant,

but what pissed me off is they handcuffed me for not, and I was like, why do I need to be handcuffed? I'm going, they're like, oh, what's protocol? It's not protocol, you know, they handcuffed me and paraded me around in front of the whole supply command. Yeah. You know, for a shame factor, because when somebody sees you and handcuffs, they're like, oh, this guy did something.

Did you've done any research on what you should be doing to prepare for what might happen. All the investigation. All I knew was, I mean, what I had been told since day one, like I want my lawyer, you know, I'm like, I'm not talking to him one bit, but other than that, no, I hadn't done anything else. You know, the lawyers that I had on standby, there was nothing, like nothing was being told to me at the time.

So there was really nothing to go on. It was like, I just know I'm under investigation and they were like, okay, we'll just see where this leads. It could go nowhere or you know, it could go the way it went. And once they pulled me, they drove me across the 32nd street, which is another Navy base there across the Bay in Coronado, which is where the Nnd Street, which is another Navy base there across the Bay in Coronado, which is where the NCIS little headquarters is. And they brought me in there and put me in there.

That's the major base in San Diego, right? Yeah. They put me in the interrogation room, just like something you see out of the movies. You know, I had the little see through a glass thing there. They sat me down, tried to be all buddy-body with me, like, hey, man, we're just, we furs some things. And you're being, just a cute, this was the first time I heard you're being accused of murder. And I knew better than to, I wasn't even

gonna start having a conversation with them. I just was, and I was polite to them. I wasn't a dick. I was like, hey, I even said that. I was like, I don't want to be a dick to you guys, but I want my lawyer like before I say anything. And they're like, oh, okay. And I was like, you know, can I call them?

You know, can I call them? They had my phone. They're like, yeah, just give us, give us this number. And we I call them? Can I call them? They had my phone. They're like, yeah, I just give us this number. And we'll call them. I gave it to them. They both walked out, shut the door, and that was it for seven hours. No one came back.

I think twice somebody knocked, oh, cracked it open to see if I needed a piss. But seven hours? Seven hours from, well, I say like, 8.30 in the morning till four or five in the afternoon. I can't remember exactly when they let me out. And they told you you were being charged for murder. They didn't tell me I was being charged with anything.

They just said that I had been accused. Accused of murder. Yeah, of murder. For, did you have any idea what for? They said it was on the prior deployment that knows what deployment. And that's it. That's all they really said to me.

And then once I told them I wanted I lower, they left. When they told you that, and they told you it was the last deployment, did you have, I mean, it sounds like you guys got a shit down a trigger time. Yeah. Is there any specific? No, that's a lot of scary part of it was, you know, I think you

kill enough individuals, you know, unemployment, you can be like, well, this could be any one thing. You're not saying that we murdered anybody, but, you know, you don't know. You don't know what's being said. I had heard enough rumors up to that point. And I heard some correct. I mean, the teams is like one big selling circle. So I had guys obviously come up to me like, oh, these guys are, we heard this. I mean, I heard they heard I was stomping babies out.

It was like, it went from like the most craziest rumors to the most like mundane. I mean, that's why, you know, Andrea coined the term. I think it was like from red bulls to work rhymes, you know, it was, it was everything, that and everything in between. And so I had no real concept of like, or idea what they were actually saying I did, you know, or what scenario that I was supposedly involved in. So once they locked me in that, they kept me in that room. I had no idea what was going on.

But while I was in that room, they went and raided my house. They raided my cage, my car, which was at the team. They went everything. They also sent a 20 to 30't even, 20 to 30 man, SWAT team to my house. And the crazy, this is the crazy thing is when they were taking me over to that interrogation room. I asked them, I was in the back of the car handcuffed

and like, how long is this gonna take? And they were like, why? And like, because my wife's not home, she's at lunch, we're like a brunch with a friend and I was like, my oldest son is leaving and I need to be back by, I think it was like one o'clock, because my youngest son's there.

I specifically remember this is those two who look at each other like, and they're like, oh no, yeah, we'll get you out. You'll be done by them. I was like, okay. Well, as I'm being, you know, I'm in that office with no phone, wondering like what my kids are gonna do. They were actually writing my house during that time.

They, my youngest son was downstairs watching TV. My oldest was still in bed. Hold, he had just turned 18. And your youngest eight years old at the time. The way they both like have described me what happened is, you know, my youngest was watching TV. We have a big window that looks out into the street in our living room. You looked out the window and saw guys with automatic weapons coming up to the house in it like a train, you know. He had said he saw a guy in the window, I think, with a gun which he's eight years old.

He ran upstairs, got my oldest son woke him up and it was like there's guys with guns outside. My oldest son told me to get the fuck out of his him up and was like there's guys with guns outside. My oldest son don't get the fuck out of his room or you know it was like whatever you thought it was just being kooky and he started crying and was like no there's guys with guns that you can go look. So my oldest son walked downstairs and he said he could see somebody out of the window and when he opened the door there was a Guy on his knees with a gun to him pointed at him and then two guys with her guns pointed at his head

The eight-year-old. No, this is my 18-year-old and my eight-year-old standing behind him crying They're yelling at my oldest son to get his hands up, which he did. And then they were like, when you had to come outside now, this is all my oldest son is like, doesn't know what's going on. And he calmly was like,

well, can I put my hands down to open the door? And they didn't know what to do. They said they just sat there, like trying to figure out how to, how to actually conduct a fucking raid or, um, so these guys, uh, Oh, they were, this is the first house they ever read. Yeah, you know, and the crazy part is, is they, these are all NCIS agents. They had an FBI agent somewhere in the mix because they wouldn't, they would not be able to conduct that raid without an adult there, present.

So that's what they used. Like, they had an FBI guy there like being like, oh, I'm overseeing this. But that's, I mean, that goes to show you anything. These guys can't even conduct a raise without an adult presence. So they don't do anything stupid. They ended up pulling my kids out in the middle of the street, in their underwear. By this time, the neighbors, you know, are all looking out,

seeing this go on. They have my whole street, every avenue to my street barricaded off. You know, it looked like I was a cartel member. So they yanked an eight-year-old kid out of your house at gunpoint and threw his ass in the front yard and his underwear for everybody to see. Yeah, and left him there for a while. And they just started to lay siege to my house. Now, my wife is Andrea. She's down the street, probably like two miles at a breakfast place, having brunch with a friend.

She gets a phone call from my daughter, who my daughter was in Ohio at the time with her biological dad. And one of the neighbors had called my daughter a girl that was our neighbor and was like, your brothers are outside with guns pointed at their heads and their underwear. Like, and there's people all over the street with guns. Holy shit. So my daughter was like, calls my wife. And she's like, I just got a call from someone. So this is what's going on.

And you know, all this is probably like crazy. You're just like, what? And so my wife gets up and she's like, I gotta go. Races, try to, races home. And she said that she tried to pull up in her neighborhood. Everything was blocked off. She somehow got a call from one of the NCIS agents. And she was like, I'm coming home and they opened it up and let her through. She parked and then they immediately started interrogating my

wife. It brought her into a van, I think, and just started asking her all sorts of questions. You know, and you had no idea this show was going on. No idea. Any of this was going on. My, I think it was my youngest son, asked one of the NCIS agents why they were there. And they pretty much said, he's your dad's a murderer or he's been told the kids that I'm being charged with murders. Pretty much telling my kids I'm a murderer, which is insane to me why you would tell somebody's kids that when you don't have anything, you know, at that point. And then, you know, my wife pretty much told him to screw off in some form

of fashion. It was just like, I have nothing to say to you. And then she went in and watched them pretty much take everything out of my house. You know, took all my kids electronic equipment, took anything they could. They found going through my garage, just like any other team guys garage I have all my kit bags and shit in there. So they were pulling out, I, you know, magazines that are high capacity magazines for California and pretty much being like, oh, got them on this. I had a, this is actually pretty funny. I had a, um, uh, dummy grenade or the blue body and one of my kit bags. You know, they called EOD and said I had a live grenade in my house. So EOD, I guess, rolls

up to my house and come to find out it's literally a dummy grenade and they're like this. It's you know just to give you an idea how incompetent these fucking guys are. You know, the best thing I think I heard my wife say is when they were, you know, they'd been there for hours and she's just like watching them go through all of our shit and take it. And she told me she's like, they all look like I've just a bunch of beta male, like dudes, like just, you could tell, like these fucking guys have no idea what they're doing. And one of them came up to her and I don't know if they put his hand on her shoulder, like this summer was like, this must be really hard for you.

What's going on right now? And I guess she told me she looked at him. She's like, you have no fucking clue what we go through in this community. She's like, you think this is fucking hard? She's like, you're out of your mind. Like, get the fuck, hurry, get your shit, get the fuck out. Yeah. So they, you know, dispersed, I have no clue that this is going on. I get, they come back in the interrogation room finally, and they're like, hey, all right, you can go. At this point, I'm like, just fucking

more and out just from sitting there for so long. I wonder what's going on. I come out. They had my phone, and they're like, we're keeping your phone. I was like, all right. And they're like, do you, as I say, can I call my lawyer? All right, I think it's either my lawyer or my wife. And they're like, oh, yeah, I gave my phone.

I put the code in and then I yanked it out of my hand. And they're like, you can't have it. And that's how they got into my phone. And right before I left the NCIS office, one of the agents, this little turd, Brian Frank, he actually testified at my trial. He's in there all kidded up and it looks like he's like this little kid playing airsoft. He looks right at me and he's like, hey, I'm walking and he's like, I saw your wife today. And I turned and looked at him and he's like, yeah, I saw her. And I was like, okay, like the fuck are you talking about?

I just walked out, like little did I know, you know, until I got home that they had pretty much laid siege to my house. So fucking taunting you. Yeah, everything they did was to taunt me and try and get me to do something so they could be like, we caught him. I mean, it was, at that point, I had no idea, but it became more evident as this whole nightmare went on. But I got home and that's when, you know, my wife and kids were

in the living room just like, what the fuck? And, yeah,'s when it we knew I was like, do this has gotten real, you know, like what is going on? I went into the command the next day, furious, went demanded to talk to the group on mass chief again. Usually we take phone calls on the show, but uh, this time we happen to have your son, Andrew wife here. And so I'm going to bring him on and we're going to get there first and to count of the raid.

So Ryan, yeah, do you remember when the police came to your house? I did. It was, I forgot what day it was. It was in a weekend, it was like a Saturday. And he was gone, my dad was gone at work and my mom was at a photo shoot and my sister was in Ohio, I was with my brother and I was watching TV and I heard a pounding on the door and someone was like yelling, get out. So I opened that curtain and there's a pounding on the door and someone was like yelling get out. So I opened that curtain and there's a ton of people with guns outside. How many people? There was about 15 people. 15 people? And there was like cars blocking the entrance to the

like because it was a through-street and they were blocking the entrance. Like it was our house. That was blocked. Like we couldn't get out and I went upstairs and I was telling my brother that I was crying that there's people outside of the guns And it's funny because he was like if it's your friends with nerve guns. I'm gonna hit you so hard So he goes outside and we're both in our underwear and there's guys that with guns and How old were you I was and I was eight or seven and so I walk outside and there's people like this a guy camped with a shotgun like by the side and then there's like two other people with rifles and they're like the lasers are right on us. They have their lasers shining on you and they were like decked out with armor and stuff and there's

like a guy with a thing like to knock down our door. And we, these people made us go on a car, and we waited for like 30 minutes in our house, like taking everything, and there's people everywhere. What do they do when you open the door? Are they open the door? My brother did. And what happened when the door opened? There was like five, like, all everyone's everyone's yelling like, get out the house, get

out the house, and yeah. Were they pointing their guns? Yes. At you. Mm-hmm. Were they pointing? To see behind the cars and stuff. What about the guys in the door?

Um, they were like, less than a foot away and like the gun was like right at my head. So it was really close. So you're eight years old and you had a whole team point and gun at your face in your underwear? Yes. And then made you go outside in your underwear. Yeah. Did they hold a gun on you while you were in the front yard in your underwear? There was a couple people in that were, but most of them went inside to go and inspect the house and like move, they're moving at all the furniture and like didn't, it was dumb. Were they asking you questions? No, they're, I think they're asking my brother questions. And then like, yeah, we sat in the car for about 30 minutes. And since my sister was in Ohio, my, her friend, she was calling her and calling her in Texan

there, like, there's a SWAT team at my house, like, in a car. And my mom didn't know what was going on. He, my dad, he was, like, he was somewhere, and he wasn't able to contact us or anything. So... Like, like, he was somewhere and he wasn't able to contact us or anything. So. Do you think they knew that your dad wasn't home?

No, they knew. They did know. Yeah. They knew that they like, I don't know what was happening. But all I knew was they knew he wasn't home and they were trying to scare us. And they wanted him to do something. I don't know. But did they scare you?

Yeah, I was scared. I'll bet. Eight years old with a gun in your face. Yeah. And your underwear. Well, thanks for sharing, Ryan. I appreciate it. Mm-hmm.

Well, thanks for coming on, Andrew. I appreciate it. Thanks for having me. So we just got your son's account of the NCIS raid and I just wanted to get kind of where you were, what it felt like, what it was like when you showed up at home to see your eight-year-old son and your 18-year-old son in the front lawn with their underwear on at gunpoint by the NCIS. Yeah. So it was June 20th, 2018.

And unbeknownst to us, our house had been being cased for weeks by NCIS. And we actually had a neighbor that was working in tandem with NCIS. I think he thought he was some type of Matt Damon, informant type character from the movie. So he had started to report our movements and report different things. And he had also informed them that we are going to be moving.

So NCIS had been watching us, watching our movements, and so that day, I left the house. I was leaving to go to meetings and I had work, work meetings, Eddie had already left to go to work, and it just seemed like a normal day. We left the boys at home. Travin was still asleep, who was our 18 or not at the time. Ryan would have been eight. And so he was at home, he was up, he was just like watching cartoons. And I went to my first meeting,

and it was actually with a girlfriend. Since we were leaving, we were kind of having one last little get-together. And I was at the table, and my daughter had called me, but my daughter was not home. My daughter was actually in Ohio. And she called me asking where I was. And I was like, I'm with my friend, like what's going on. And she sounded very worried.

And she's like, mom, she's like, the neighbor girl just called me. There's police everywhere. And the boys are outside of the house, like they're in their underwear. And I'm like, what are you talking about? So I just like got up, left the table, jumped in my car, and as I'm driving, I'm trying to like call my neighbor, and it just kept on going to voicemail

and voicemail and voicemail. And finally by the fourth time I think I called, she picked up the phone screaming. And so my neighbor, my, and voice, smell, and voice, smell. And finally, by the fourth time I think I called, she picked up the phone screaming. And so my neighbor, my next door neighbor, is on the phone screaming. And she's like, they've got your kids, they've got your dogs, they're everywhere. And I'm like, who is this?

Who is it? Yeah. And she's like screaming on the phone, saying, this is their mother, this is their mother. And I'm hearing someone screaming back at her, saying, get off the phone, get off the phone, get back in your house. So I'm in full, like, what is going on?

Freaking out. What did you think? Do you have any idea? No, I had no idea. It was what it was, or? Well, we lived in Point Loma, which is kind of like Point Loma military housing. We lived at the village in T.C.,

so it's kind of like a thoroughfare between like Rose Cran, there's a very busy street and also harbor, and we have a lot of homeless, so in my mind, I'm like, is there like a homeless person or a bum like in my, you know, garage or something, like what are they doing? I didn't know it was even NCIS, I had no clue. Once I found out what was going on,

I got another call from a blocked number and the woman was like, we are from NCIS, we're at your home, tell us what kind of car you're driving. They had the streets barricaded. They had the streets barricaded. They had people in full militia riot gear. They had people staged and set up like they're going to war.

And so when I come through There's like seven to eight black, you know armored vehicles in front of my home and There's people just like spurting out everywhere out of my garage out of my front door and my son had only turned 18 Two to three weeks prior which they also. And so they took advantage of the fact that Eddie was gone. I was not there and they gained entry through an 18 year old that just woke up. So when I got to the home,

they actually pulled me into a vehicle and started a question me. But what I found out later was, Eddie had already been apprehended. He was at work, they came, they got him, and they threw him in a room for seven hours, they denied him legal counsel. So there was no Navy's silk threat there.

So you didn't need to lay siege to my house with two children in it in that fashion. What do you think they showed so much force for a day to terrorize us and intimidate us and to convince people that, you you know we did something wrong. And that's exactly what happened. That's it worked because you don't go to that level and then people just were like, oh my gosh, it has, you got, you guys had to have done something. And so it worked. So they had Eddie, he did not know the whole day what was going on. He did not know that our home was being raided.

So if you think of the psychological warfare that they started at that moment to entrap him in an office building, and then basically did not tell him all day what they were doing, it was just a form of psychological warfare on him, because he went to fight for our country to prevent people from terrorizing members of the United States.

And then they take him and they lock him up on American soil and then they lay siege to his home and terrorize his wife and his children on his own land. I mean, it's pretty sick what they did. So that was Eddie's story, what was happening to him, all this was happening to us. But what I found out later from the boys was that Ryan was actually sitting kind of in a chair like this watching TV and looks out the window and sees people with guns and like battering rams,

lining up at our door. And you can imagine an eight-year-old, he starts freaking out, he runs upstairs, he tells my son who's in bed, asleep at our door. And you can imagine an eight year old. He starts freaking out. He runs up stairs. He tells my son who's in bed, asleep at this point, that there's people with guns at the door. And so my oldest is just like, dude, what are you talking about? He's thinking it's maybe neighborhood kids with nerf guns or something and Ryan's being Ryan. But then Ryan starts to break down and tears. And so my son but then Ryan starts to break down in tears. And so my son gets up obviously and is like, okay, they walk downstairs. My oldest son opens up the door.

And so there's a main door and there's a screen door. And they're all screaming at him. They're pointing rifles at my children and they're saying put your hands up. And they're all so simultaneously saying open up the door. So if you can imagine the level of Bush League that this operation is, so my son's like, do you want me to put my hands up

or do you want me to open the door? And they're like, do you give us permission to enter, put your hands up? And so he basically gets pulled out into the street along with my son and their underwear and they're just paraded right into the, you know, middle of our housing complex. And then they all just rush in and that was the start of a seven hour raid on our home.

I just want to, you know, I'm sorry that you and your family had to go through that. And I just want to tell you, you are a strong, motivated, effective and just amazing human being. And I mean, the campaign that you started from scratch and what it turned into, I mean, if it wasn't, you know, for you, then you'd still be in there. So, I mean, one example you've said and tell of a job. So yeah, thank you for coming on. I appreciate it. All right, so you're going to talk to the master chief at the command after your house just got ready up. So I went in, demand to talk to him.

He came over to supply, sat down with me and another master chief that was in charge of supply. And I was like, you know, I was pissed. I was like, my house just got rated. My kids were pulled out of gunpoint yesterday. What the hell's going on? Why aren't you guys like at this point, I was beyond, I think I was beyond frustrated. Because nobody had been talking to me at this point. Now my family was getting, they involved my family

and started, you know, to put my family to shit, which I don't, I have a line, not every note. I'm not going to be able family to shit which I don't I have a line. I have every nose. Yeah You can mess with me all you want like, you know, I might fight back on my non-no But you mess with my family like that's it, you know, and that was pretty much well known Through everybody that knew me in the community. Like that's when my family's what mattered to me the most.

So I was, I was definitely beyond pissed off. The group on Massachusetts, Steve Ward told me that, uh, he's like, denied knowing anything about it, which is bullshit. And, uh, then he told me that if I had any issues with it, that I should go talk to a chaplain. And that was the only thing advice. He was like, that's what you have to say to me right now, is that I can go talk to a chaplain about what's going on.

He was like, yeah, and he's like, oh, one more thing. And he slid a piece of paper across the table. I had picked up E8. We got selected for E8. And he was like, you're not going to pick up E8. We're going to hold it off until this whole investigation is over with. And they're like, he had me sign it. And at that, I wish at this point, I didn't't sign that but I didn't give a shit at that point

I was like I don't care. I was like here. Yeah And that was it he left And I think you know as you can expect that Braid spread like wildfires through the community. Oh, yeah, you know And of course the the dummy, they found my garage got spread into they found five hand grenades and blah blah blah like just escalates as the telephone game passes through the teams. Did you have any friends at this point? Yeah, I mean I had I had my my brother's my teammates that I was talking to but it's very hard.

my brothers and my teammates that I was talking to, but it's very hard. You know, what can they do? Yeah, they're, they're almost like, do this as fucked up. And there anybody that I talked to that I was, what I was going through, automatically got scared themselves. And they were like, dude, what are they going to do to me? You know, if I, you know, step in and say something, it's, um, that's how they drive fear into you, especially with rating your house like that. I mean, that what that does is there's no reason they could,

they could easily walked up knocked on the door and got the, the same job done. They did it for that reason because they want to put shame onto you. They want, and it worked. The neighbors are neighbors were like, because we went and asked them afterwards, like, hey, did you happen to videotape any of that? Or, and they're like, we're not like, they don't come and do that to you unless you did something.

Yeah. And so it worked. And then, uh, it also, what they do it to drive your family apart too. They hope that, you know, they cause enough stress onto your wife or onto yourself that you guys start going at each other. And then one of you flips on each other starts, you know, doesn't help out, but obviously that didn't work with us.

But that's, I've seen that happen enough, heard enough stories that happen enough times when I was in the break that, I mean, it's all for a purpose of why they do those things. But yeah, at that point, I had talked to my buddies about it and they were all just, like, dude, they had no advice or anything, they were just like, dude, this is fucked up. Just like, we were thinking. But that was pretty much the deciding point for me that I was getting out. I'm like, I'm getting out. You know, I felt that point betrayed, just sort of just left hung out to dry.

I had a couple of buddies that were master chiefs at that point that were told me the exact thing, they're like, they'll railroad you. Like, this is what's happening. They're just hanging you out to try. Why do you think they're, I think it was to protect what it comes down to is they're protecting the institution, right, the NSW. Anything that's brought out in the public arena

or in the media that is bad against NSW, they would rather just dispose of whatever that problem is, then I actually put up with it and fight back, you know, because they don't want any stains at all. And that's, I mean, that's due to the fact of how big NSW has gotten over the years with all the success that we've had. I think they, you know, a lot with success comes with, comes a public scrutiny. So any little thing that happens, you know, anything that says seal on it gets pointed back to NSW and they're like, oh, what's this? So obviously, if there's a murder, they're like, we're just gonna fucking hang this guy out to dry instead of actually looking into this because this looks bad on the institution. Yeah. And that's a sad part. I mean, it's a sad reality of what I found out.

You know, there's a difference between expendable and disposable. I know I'm expendable. Like, that's part of the job, but I'm not fucking disposable. Like, you just don't, you can't just throw me away because you feel like This might look bad on you or your career picking up three stars. So I think that was a big driving force of why the headshed Like group one or the admiral

Really didn't look like never they never talked to me once Still haven't Never talked to those guys and why they came down on me so hard. You know, they were just like we're just going to make an example out of this guy. And that's it. At that point, I was getting, you know, I decided to get out. We had already bought a place, a house in Florida. So I moved my family down down there. We had already bought a place, a house in Florida.

So I moved my family down there. I think like two weeks after the raid, drove across country, moved them in, and then the plan was, I was gonna come back to San Diego and Geobatch until my retirement date, and just fly back and forth and just finish out my career. They waited, NCIS waited until I came back from Florida. It's got back to San Diego and I got accepted into the TBI Treatment Center, which is an

trepid spear. Started going to that. I was in about the beginning of September and was going through that. Daltham was being said to me still, um, just doing my thing and then on September 11th. The my old S.E.A. Brian Alzawi and two M.A.'s showed up to the Intrepid Center and told me that I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out of the car and I was out I'm agreeing to come to Rose Bloom, just signed off on it and they want to take you there. At that point, I remember looking at, I was in the room with three of them and I did think first I was like, I'm about to start fighting right now. Like this is, I was going through all sorts of scenarios in my head, but I decided again to remain calm. It was like, doing anything stupid is not going to help situation. I let them handcuff me and put me in a van.

And the two MAs drove me to the brig. I had no idea where the brig was. I thought it was something on a ship still. I was like, where are you guys taking me? It was to Miramar Marine Corps Air Station. They had a pretty, those two guys had a pretty good idea of, well, they were what they were telling me was, they're like, oh, you'll be out in a week.

You'll be out of the break in a week. And I was like, well, how am I gonna get out in a week? I was like, oh, you'll be out in a week. You'll be out of the break in a week. And I was like, well, how does this, how am I going to get out in a week? I was like, oh, they have a hearing for everybody that goes in there their first week. And they that decides whether or not you should stay in there or be let out. And I was like, okay, either way, I was I was like, I was like in survival mode at that point. I was like, I don't know what the fuck's going on. They took me first before we went to the break. We went to a medical place on Miramar to make sure I was healthy enough to get put in the break. They did a full checkup on me. So I'm sitting in handcuffs in the medical place with families and staring at me.

And they did the full checkup and then took me to the brig. And as soon as I got in the brig as when I was like, dude, what the fuck? Like there was probably 8 to 10 guards who met me, just me for intake. They all treated me like I was Jason born. Each of them were like posted up like every time I moved like I was about to do something. The first thing I got I was getting checked in, they asked you, do you know what you're in for, in here for what you're here? And at the time, I was like, sort of jokingly, I was like killing ISIS. And they were like, yeah.

And I was like, okay, like I was joking, but I was like, no, that's why you're here. And that was all that was said to me. I got told, the CEO of the break came down, told me that, you know, it doesn't, she saw my service record or whatever and she's like, it doesn't matter in here. You were not technically a prisoner, but you will be treated of how you, you will be treated as good as you treat the guards. I'm like, okay, now, you know, I told her, I was like, ma'am, I'm not here to cause any trouble.

I should be getting out of here in like three days. This is a big mistake. Like, whatever's going on here, they threw me a solitary confinement right off the bat for three days. Why? Just just to get in your fucking head. Yeah. Put me in there. I wasn't allowed out of that cell for three days. Not even I think they let me shower once. But the every time they move me at that point, they shackled my arms and legs. So it was like, you know, even from my solitary cell to the shower was probably 10 feet, and they'd have to

shackle me on, like, take me down there, put me in there. It was still. Yeah, and that's all what it came down to. I finally got that little hearing that they were talking about about six days in and that's when I knew that I was fucked. Because I really had no, at this point, I have no clue what's going on. I'm just sort of trying to figure it out as I go. I'm just sort of trying to figure it out as I go. They have this hearing, my lawyer, the lawyer that I had on standby showed up. And that's when I first saw the prosecution and they had the NCIS agent come,

Warpinski. And literally I went in there and the pro they have a it's not a judge. They just appoint some officer on base to come in and act as the judge. And he just decides whether you stay or it can get out. The prosecution got up and pretty much let loose a flurry of just crazy allegations for about 10 minutes. They called me, they called me everything from murderer, a drug mule. I said I beat my wife that I'm a danger to my kids. I'm a fake Christian.

A fake Christian, you know, they said that, oh, he goes to church, but he really doesn't practice what he, like making crazy statements like that. Like, that's, and I'm telling you, I sat there listening to this. How the fuck is that even relevant? They brought up all sorts of like shit, because all they were trying to do was like,

taint my, who I am as a person, I guess, which it would that was probably one of the craziest moments, just hearing them say this shit, and I can't like, not a lot of saying anything back. The lawyer that I had at the time wasn't stopping them from saying it. It was just like, it's like he'd heard this all before. Then the NCAS agent got up and said his whole piece. It was like pretty much just regurgitated whatever this prosecution said.

Said that I murdered you know, murdered, you know, this ISIS fighter. They had the picture at that time. Like here it is. Look at him, you know. And then the main reason why they kept me in is because the second prosecutor got up and pretty much went over every qualification I had, every school that I'd been to, everything I'd done in my career, but used it as like it's a bat like against me. It's a bad thing and that was why they could not and could conscious let me out because at any moment I could do anything.

You know, I could escape to somewhere and disappear. It would point to danger of finding out that you were in prison. Uh, probably the second day, or maybe that night, I, I, I year allowed one five-minute phone call, which they weren't even going to give me, but I, uh, luckily I remembered it in my cell and I was like, hey, I want to call, uh, I call my lawyer, um, told him what happened and I told him to call my cell and I was like, hey, I want to call. I called my lawyer, told him what happened, and I told him to call my wife and let her know. So I think they killed, they might have called her that first night,

the second day. But my lawyer told me right off the bat, he was like, there's no bail system in the uniform and code of military justice. So he's like, you're not unless they let you out, you're not getting out. And that's pretty much after that hearing that we had, they deemed that I was too dangerous to let out. Oh, and one other thing, this is, so one of the guys in my platoon, Josh Brins, one of the accusers was my neighbor. He lived four houses down for me.

Had no idea this guy was even like really involved with the other accusers in my platoon. He was, I didn't even give him any thought, you know, and I even saw him all the time, and just give him like a head nod, like, what's up? Uh-uh. He was staking my house out for NCIS the whole time. For NCIS? Yes. So he was pretty much a volunteer NCIS agent.

So he was feeding them information, letting them know my whereabouts, you know, when I worked out, when I did what. And he also, so they got him to write a letter, which they read off at that hearing, saying that I was stalking him, that I walked my dogs past his house every day and was scaring his family. So that was like a huge factor. They were like, oh, and he's stalking one of the guys in this platoon, which was complete. Like I, when I read that letter, whenever we were in that hearing, I'm like, that was like another punch in the face, like what? Like this dude, I'm stalking him. Like, I had no idea this guy was involved. But yeah, that was, that was it. I'm like, you're not,

you're not leaving until your court date, which was, which was on determine at the time. I hadn't even been charged anything yet. So I just sat, I sat in the brig for about two months at that point. Not so you, when you're in the brig, you can't, all the phone calls are recorded. There's, they have two prison phones there that you split between 60 people. You're not allowed on the phones until after 5 p.m. to like, 9 p.m. If you want to use a phone, it costs a button of money. It's some ridiculous, like every minute,

some ridiculous charge. And all the phone calls are recorded. And NCIS comes in weekly and takes all my calls. They were more aware of their investigating and listens to them. So, you know, I was told right away, don't say anything over the phone. When you talk to your family, don't talk about the case because they'll just pick apart any little thing you say and try to use it. So I mean, phone calls were pretty rough,

like back and forth just because at that point, there's only so much you could talk about without it, like coming back to like the nightmare. So it was tough to be able to sort of communicate what was going on because Andrea started fighting back right when they threw me in there is when she. Pretty much was like fuck this and she started the grassroots campaign to like. Put the truth out about what was going on yeah she wrote a letter to the community.

Asking for help from everybody that you get any. She did she go all behind the scenes at like, people that were like, dude, we want to help, but when it came down to like help from foundations, nothing. They were like, nope. How were people helping? People, I mean, it was all my voice that I'd, you know, from private pretenders, whatever reached in their like to well-right character witness whatever you need. Carried when a statement to this and this, what else can I do? But at that point, I mean, there's not, there wasn't a lot guys could do except right character witness statement or, but she or, you know, go around and try to advocate in some way, which is difficult to do, but she was just more calling it out.

There's like, they threw him away in prison for not like he wasn't doing anything, which is the truth. I wasn't a threat to anybody. She was just like, let him out so he can be with his family and defend himself against this. And they just ignored her completely, the commanded. So she started, she started the grassroots campaign on her own, decided that she has, she has a background in marketing and business and stuff and doing stuff with helping spouses get businesses off the ground. And she just took the tools of what she knew from that and was like I'm applying it to this

and pretty much started a day. You know, she started an Instagram page and all that to like get the word out, but what was going on and throughout the process, I mean, she gained quite a following. I know. A lot of people, which is, it was amazing to see. But I had no real idea that all that was going on

You know, like I knew she was doing certain things but Certain things couldn't be set over the phone Yeah, I guess you know, I remember when that was all going on and Damn to think that you had no fucking clue and there you know Yeah, how big it had gotten on all the news stories and everything. I mean, yeah, it was, uh, it was a shock when I got out. Like I had seen, I knew she was going, she went on the news eventually.

Uh, and we had one TV in there in the, uh, in the pod. And you're only allowed to watch CNN in there I think they do that for like torture purposes, but it's if you had a cool guard what you could get him to change the channel So I think once I you know, I knew she was gonna be on so like I begged one of the guards and like dude So he turned it, you know, and I got to watch her on Fox news But I had no role idea Like I don't think I could grasp how big he had a gotten until I got out. Yeah, and I was like holy shit She did a whole the job. Yeah, dude. She's a hell of a job

Yeah, she's the hero her my brother both my brothers also Another one that's to he Both of them the dynamic duo, the two heroes in my book. They dropped everything and just worked their asses off to get the truth out. But yeah, like so when I was about two months in is when I finally got the charges. the charges. So these are your charges right here, the first three of them. Specification, premeditated murder, and that chief special warfare operator Edward R. Gallagher, US Navy, Naval special warfare group one on active duty, did add or near Mozilla Iraq on about three May 2017 with premeditation, murdered a wounded male under the care of the said SOC Gallagher by means of stabbing

him in the neck and body with a knife. When you showed up and that ISIS fighter was laying there, that, did you have any fucking idea that shit was gonna come out like this? No, not a million years. Not one bit. And then basically it goes on to, you murdered an old man, you murdered a young girl. And but these there was one that was in Afghanistan, I remember correctly. That wasn't a charge. That was they were looking to charge me with throw that on there. But

they again, that was all on hearsay from the accusers who weren't even in the teams at the time that went down. Well, yeah. And then there's actually I think eight pages of this and everything from murder to a little bottle of a terminal that they found. But yeah, they throw so pretty much the way it works for which we found out the military judicial system is they have the main charge which which is premeditated murder. And then they can get just a laundry list of other charges. And it's like spaghetti. They just throw it all at the wall and those will see what sticks. None of it has to have any merit. They'll just charge you with it.

And they'll say, okay, we'll see which ones we can get them. So the more charges they have on you, then when you go to court, the more likely they already get you on something. Did all the charges come at once? Or did they just keep adding more and more? They added the two murder charges, the extra ones, the old man and the little girl at my article 32. So to explain that, the article 32 is like a civilian equivalent of a grand jury just with the military. So you go up there, the prosecution presents their case or what they have at the time and then the judge rules whether to proceed with those to court martial or not, or some other form of punishment or whatever else. While at that Article 32,

they were presenting all the other charges or trying to get them to go to court martial, they had the NSA agent take the stand again and just regurgitate and everything. We requested that the accusers come and take the stand-in hour, Article 32, because we're like, we want to hear it from them. Because as I said then, I said the whole time I'm like, these guys are lying.

Did you know how many people? At that point, yeah. I knew who the, I had already read. I got a binder full of evidence. So I got to read all their NCIS interviews. I got to watch their NCIS videos. I knew everything that they had said. And I was like, they're, I knew I was like, they're fucking lying.

And they have lied. You could tell that they had tried to like get a story together, but then once they got separated into the little interrogation when it was NCIS, they couldn't keep their stories the same. So there were so many discrepancies and big ones that that's why I was like, I want them to take the stand right now, which the judge and the prosecution denied. They're like, oh, there's no need for them to come up here and say anything.

The NCIS agent is just regurgitating what they said. So that's good enough. Interesting. Going back to the old man in the girl. So is that just hearsay? Because I couldn't find a whole lot of. Yeah. So this is information. This is what happened to the old man's girl. And you got to like bear with me on this because it sounds as stupid as it sounds. Josh Friends during his NCIS interview, told Agent Warpinski that he had seen a little girl get shot, which we also, you know, kids get shot at that deployment, but he thought

ISIS had done it, but now he thinks that I did it. And so Agent Warpinski was like, what did you see him do it? He's like, no, I wasn't in the same building as him. But so and so, another guy in my platoon told me he saw Eddie do it. And so they called that person in. And that person's like, I have no idea what you're talking about. I never said that once, and I never saw Eddie shoot any little kids. So what they did is they took so-and-so's testimony and just hit it. They were like, just gave them Josh Brenzes. Straight up, just straight up hit it. Didn't fit the agenda. Nope. And they did. That's the common theme throughout my whole

thing is they had, they hid every piece of evidence that would have been like, this is all bullshit. They just, if it didn't fit their agenda or the prosecution, they just tried to bury it somewhere. So that little girl got thrown on. Oh, this is the other thing that's just going to blow your mind. So the old man has actually, has some truth to it, but look, a guy from my platoon came and testified at my trial. I was like, I was with him and that was an actual shithead that he shot, not an old man. And it was a justified shooting.

And he even said he had an argument afterwards with one of the accusers that day when that accuser tried to be like, oh, I think that guy was unarmed and he was like, no, he was armed. I was there with him, you know, watched the whole thing and that's, you know, got pretty much thrown out. But the judge at my article 32 ruled that the two murder charges, the little girl and the old man should not go to court martial. He was like, and he even said he's like, there's not enough evidence here. This is all off here, say.

Little did I know that that judge really has no control of what goes to court martial. The command, common or Rosenblum, overturned the judges ruling. It was like, no, you keep those charges on there. Holy shit. So my own command was like, even though there's no evidence here, just keep them on there. And so that's how I went to court martial with those three murder charges. Now are these videos of these guys, their interviews with NCIS, are these the same ones that the New York Times got their hands on? Yeah, but they spliced them up. How did they get their hands on those?

Because it sounds like it's such a sensitive investigation. So who the fuck released that to the New York Times? The prosecution and more come. Why did they do that? To paint me in a bad light, to went to help win over. I mean, for exactly the reason that we're here talking about it. So this doesn't fucking make sense to me because you have what sounds like almost an entire fucking community saying that you're guilty of murdering an ISIS fighter, which makes no fucking sense to me. And a little girl and an old man and then a whole list of you know there's a misdemeanor bullshit charges it sounds like

I don't understand the in you say that they were coming at you hard because they you know they wanted to protect the institution. Yeah. So they wanted to protect the institution. We get the leak, the fucking videos to the New York Times, because now the entire fucking world knows. Yeah. Because at that time, so they didn't leak all that information out at first. It wasn't until my wife started really fighting back and getting a bunch of people behind us that now I think the command felt like, okay, we're losing this battle.

Let's pull this number right here. And the prosecution was leaking stuff to the media from the gecko. We tried to call them out on it two to three times during our motions hearings. Like it was so blatant and so bad that the media was putting out evidence or like before we even got it. So yeah. So we would be like, how is it that this is being printed in the newspaper last night and we haven't gotten this evidence yet?

And this is how they investigate things in the judicial system there with the military. The judge will be like, okay, yeah, that is disheartening to hear that this is happening. Prosecution, we want you to look into this and see who's doing it. Prosecution comes back the next day, like we looked into it. We don't know who's doing. It's not us.

And that's it. That's it. Move on. Yeah. And so that that was happening over and over. They, you know, they leaked everything to do exactly what was done. So slander me in the media because it'll drive, when they go to the court marshal, the jury will be tainted already. Yeah. I was going to have a preconceived notion that I'm guilty and that just helps them

win their case. So yeah, I mean, that was going on pretty much the whole time, but I had, again, I'm locked up. I'm not seeing any of these crazy articles that are coming out. I'm just hearing about them from my brother, my wife over the phone, or like people that came to visit me would say, you know, there's pretty shitty articles coming out about you and it's, it's not good. Yeah. I had no idea what really was being said. But yeah, you got to think too, man. Like, they added those, so they didn't have those old man and the woman on there at first. Okay.

But they had the, they had the, and see the NCS interviews were all that shit was said. They added those two on because they were getting the same reaction on of everybody that you just gave. Like he murdered a nicest fighter. Like who fucking cares? Yeah. They're like, okay, we're not winning people over like that. What is the two most, you know, controversial things we can get him.

He murdered an old man and this is the best thing. I ever I murdered an old man on Father's Day. That's what they were putting out. It was Father's Day when I murdered this old man. And then I murdered a little girl. That right there drives in the motion. I mean, even if I heard like somebody kill a little kid, I'd be like, too, but the fuck, you know, that's messed up. So they knew like that would drive people to be like, this dude is a monster. This dude is crazy. And you know, it just went from there. And they just continue to smear me. You know, every chance they got, and it was all just like false misinformation that was being put out. You know, I try to explain it to people like my case is sort of like

a, almost like a false rape case to where it's like a girl comes in and is like, oh, I got raped last night. But when really she just had sex with the dude that made a mistake, it does that dude is screwed no matter what. Just that one allegation is like, even if he's found innocent at the end. It just sounds like throughout NSW, throughout the entire community, I've heard you say that they were, they were counseling guys for wearing the free every shirt anybody that talked about it. Oh, it's gonna get counseled. I mean, there was an active campaign big time like straight up legitimate active campaign the Commodore.

Oh, here's this is another story. My mom and dad flew from Maryland out to see me to Visamy, and when I was locked up, I think like the first month I was in there. Okay, man, I saw me had visitation on the weekend. They didn't know what to do. They were like, distraught. My dad is a retired lieutenant colonel. He was like, well, I want to go talk to your command and find out what the fuck's going

on. I was like, yeah, go, you know, go ahead. They went to group one, waited there for, you know, they got their sixth in the morning, waited until the Commodore came in. The Commodore refused to speak to them and a mass chief ward and the command Jag talked to them. This is the exact words that were told to them. They told my mom and dad, if you knew what we knew about your son, you'd want him locked up for life. And they just left him with that. Didn't tell him anything else. Like, who the fuck would say that to somebody's parents, you know, even if,

even if you had all the evidence and you knew like, he's guilty, why would you put somebody's parent, like say a statement like that to somebody's parents, you know, it's, but they had nothing. And they were just actively trying to screw me. This is where this is the other crazy thing is the Commodore was going around, went around to each team while I was locked up and had all calls with every seal at each command. And I was told this, but through multiple seals from each team, the same speech he gave that I was guilty, that nobody should better support me, nobody should support me. And this is the worst, this is the kicker that he'd seen the video

of me doing said act. And that I was, it showed I was guilty. No, he said that to each command. So now you got to think, man, like, I mean, that's not only is that unlawful command influence, but you are straight line to everybody. And, you know, there was that this video, the rumor of the video was what really turned, you know, made everybody question like, Oh, is there a video like does it show it? No, there was no. This is the video where where I come up and I just want that value over that's it.

Like that's the only video, but he lied. So that video was not allowed to be shown to anybody at the time because it was part of evidence. Right. There was, I forget what the word anybody at the time because it was part of evidence, right? There was I forget what the word is for it where you can't show the evidence Did the video really shut off? Did you ever see in that video? I saw it was part of TC burns helmet cam I mean I saw the video once the evidence was presented to me. You never saw before then No, not really I never paid really any attention to it. I knew TC had a helmet came on and that was like the big discussion. Whereas like, hey, just if it bothers you deleted or whatever, you know, the pictures,

but this is what's funny is there is a full length video of everything that happened that whole day. I mean, he had his helmet came on the whole day. It just so happened to show just me coming up and then shutting off. It doesn't show anybody else. Now, TC's one, he was one of the, if you like, got in with the accusers and he pretty much gave up everything to NCI. It's like, oh, here's, here's everything right here. So they either spliced it up or cut it off. At certain points, we didn't show anybody else, you know, doing any medical treatment or a thing like that. I mean, it's, and that's the big question. Everyone's like, well, why does a video shut off? Or stop?

I'm like, ask the accusers that. Ask NCIS that. I wish it would show the whole thing. Like they would vindicate me even more, but they deleted it. And there is deleted actual deleted files of that video, which we brought up and trial. Like, why are these, I mean, they're there,

but why are they gone? Why can't we watch them? And they, what did happen after you were there, you know, obviously, because you're in the video, what happened after that camera shut off? Is that when you cracked them? Yeah, I was certain too. So that camera shut off right when I was doing my initial assessment of him, and then I

pretty much cracked them after that. And then all the other treatments that were done, which TC did the chest tube and everything else. That was done to him. And then all the other treatments that were done, which TC did the chest tube and everything else, that was done to him. It would have just shown that we pretty much medically treated into death. There are some pretty controversial texts that you sent, and I'm just gonna read them.

I've got a cool story for you. When I get back, I got my knife skills on. And then another text thread that says, good story behind this, got him with my hunting knife. Now, I did listen to, you say that those were, there was a whole another thread that they basically cherry picked a couple of things out. What else was in that thread? So the knife skills and just the knife thing. So the one was like, got a cool story behind this guy, my honey knife. That was to one of my best friends, another team guy. He would, you know, text, we could text back and forth while we're on deployment

the whole time. And he would, you know, check in periodically, like high house deployment going, what's going on there is it, you know, and I was like, do this deployment. It's awesome, like giving them updates. Just like this is a pretty epic one. And that day was, I don't know if I figure it was like two or three days after the incident. My dog guy who was an opportune sent me, he sent me that picture of me posing with the body and the knife as like, I'm talking to my best friend and I was like, oh shit. And that's why I just sent him that cool story behind this one, got him on like a joke and he was like, it like a joke and he was like Robb. It's a joke and thing which to the type of that is the that right there was the worst and best piece of evidence the prosecution had.

Really? It was obviously the worst because it doesn't look good. It's like well here it is right here, but if you go ahead and zoom in and really inspect that picture, there's no blood anywhere on me. There's no blood on the knife. They did a DNA test, everything on that knife. Nothing came back except that it had been touched at some Iraqi, it had been touched by an Iraqi at some point,

which is like it was mere an Iraq for seven months. Yeah. So like when it came down to it, they were like, dude, there's, you know, yeah, that text was stupid to send. They they tested the shit out of the knife. Oh, dude, nonstop. And they came up. There's nothing.

Why was the knife out? Did you cut his clothes off or? That was the one I jabbed him with to see if he had any stimuli left in him or was alive. It was just a stu- I posed for a stupid picture, you know. It was like just being whatever. The person you sent that to, did they bring him in? No. Didn't even talk to him once.

They didn't even talk to him? No. Never called him. Never. I mean, that's because they knew like if you follow the, am I, one of my lawyers went through this in the trial, like if you go ahead and look at the rest of the text thread, like it's not, there's no admitting to a murder here or being like, oh, it's just a series of bullshit jokes. You know, I'm just dark humor. I get it. We talked about it earlier. Yeah. But, uh, and you don't have to answer this, but who'd you send the text to? Always. Active duty. Roger that. Yeah. Okay.

Yeah, okay. Well, so that shit got thrown out then. Yeah, the which ones the detects. It got rambling. They got right in my trial. Yeah, it was, I mean, it's all, I mean, it's definitely doesn't look good. It doesn't make me look good. So yeah, they kept that and they kept, I mean, they would keep reading those in the trial. And like, you know, look what he said. Yeah. Um, but it's like I said, I mean, I think you could go through, you take any team, guys phone, all the text messages that and you can pick, you can charge anybody with,

you know, with anything. You know, not making excuses for you can take a picture of his fucking phone in the whole world and they'll find something to charge you. Exactly. So yeah, those, I mean, like I said, those were the best and worst piece of evidence that the prosecution had the time. And believe me, I was shit in my pants. I was like, dude, I was like, why did I sit and like, if I could just go back in time and just not, you know, do that, but it happened. Yeah. Yeah.

You know, it actually ended up being good for us because it was like, dude, look at the picture. And this is where Craig Miller's lies, like, got the best of them is he turned his NCIS interviews had said that I had, you know, stabbed him, uh, bite, he was either by the collarbone or the neck, um, maybe like once or twice, uh, never mentioned seeing any blood or anything like that, which is like, oh, he just stabbed him. Well, Never mentioned seeing any blood or anything like that was just like, oh, he just stabbed him. Well, when he gets to trial, he goes on the stand and completely changes. Like, he's like, no, I saw him. He knelt over him, started jamming the knife into his neck and knife started pumping out of the prisoner's blood or prisoner's neck like he called it baby vomit.

He prisoners of blood or prisoners neck like he called it baby vomit. It looked like baby vomit coming out of his neck. When he said that, and I was just sitting there listening to him, I was like, you're done. Like, you just fucked yourself because not only is that not true, but now that that, I mean, you can go ahead and look at my clothes on the pictures. Like, if it was really pumping out and I'm sitting there, I'd have blood all over me. Yeah. And, you know, because I already, you know, none of that was true. I was, I think that really he fucked himself pretty good on that one.

But he went, you know, that's what those guys, they got up there, a lot of them got up there and tried to either overemphasize their story or change it up a little bit, you know. And it just... Did the fighter even have that much blood on him? He had a pool of blood like over his right shoulder. And that's what they were saying is that came from the neck wound or whatever, but in reality, if you look at it it the messed up chest tube that was done You can see I

Think this is what I think where it came from is that it was bleeding out and was just going to his armpit and pulling up there Oh Because they had a failed attempt. Yeah, okay. Yeah, so they Went to the other side. Yeah, right because wasn't, that blood is not there from the crack. That was a clean crack. No. So that's the only way I can see that blood being pulled up there. But of course, you know, they were trying to say it was from, it's going to be stabbing them in the neck. But this is

the other thing. So there's three guys that only said they saw me stab them at first. So one said I stabbed him in the neck one said I stabbed him in the ribs and then the other one said I stabbed him both like but they all had different versions of where I had stabbed him or not and in the end only One of those Craig Miller's only when we went up there and the other two were like, no, we were, this isn't true. And they refused to testify.

Jesus. I had one of the guys when I was in prison came and visited me. One of the guys when I was in prison came to visit me. One of the accusers and I sat down with him and he straight up told me, it was like this is all a lie. This got out of our hands. We don't know what to do and I'm sorry this happened to you. One of the accusers came to visit you in prison and fucking told you that this was all a lie Mm-hmm, and he was sorry. Yeah, man. What I mean what what the fuck was your reaction to that?

At that point I Looked at him was like I I mean, I was like, dude, I appreciate you. At that point, I was like, dude, I appreciate you coming in here and letting you know, being a man and letting you tell him the truth. I was like, but he straight up told me he was like, dude, the NCAS is now hasn't trapped everybody that's involved.

And like, well, if you go back on your story, we're going to throw you in prison. So he was like, I don't know what to do. I told him, I was like, dude, I can't tell you what to do because I'm in here, but I was like, you know, I'm going to be going away for life. If it was like, this is fucked up, but I stood up and I looked at him and I was like, I forgive you. And I hugged him and went back to my cell and then he left. And then about you hugged him. Mm-hmm.

Yeah. I didn't know like I was, you got to think man like at that point I already knew these guys were, you know, relying and I had sort of, I had a moment when I was in the braving go over to where I just got levity and like, I was good. But after he came in, you know, I hugged him for, you know, it was like I forgive you. And then about two and a half weeks later, another one showed up. Same. Like, I don't know what to do. This is all gotten out of hand. The same thing, man. Just like dude.

I hugged him and I was like dude, I forgive you guys, man, but I told him I was like just think about my family. What they're going through. They were like, we're going gonna try and make this right. But I was like, that point was like, don't tell me any. Like, I don't wanna hear what you're gonna do or not do. I was like, I'm already enough shit as it is. I don't need to hear anything.

What you guys are doing with, you guys started this mess. So, but that was, I mean, that those were two crucial moments for me, because I mean, I was like, fuck, I mean, did that feel, did it feel good? It did. Uh, you know, it's so when I was, when I was locked up, man, like I first, probably two months, I was fucking having, it was bad. I was just losing my mind. I mean, I wasn't like out in the open, losing my mind, so everybody could see it.

I would sit in my cell and just like, I was like in my own head, freaking out. I couldn't control the situation. Just like any operator, you want to be able to have control and be able to fix any problem or deal with it. There is nothing I could do man, like I was literally helpless. I wasn't in control of anything and then I had a pretty eye opening conversation with my wife on the phone, where at that point, I still thought, I still thought there was some hope that the command was like going to come through for me, you know, like, do this is how brainwashed

I was, or you can call it, you know, loyalty to a fault where I was like, there's no fucking way they're doing this to me. Like I couldn't process it. And my wife, she was like, I want you to listen to me real closely. She's like, I sat there and waited for you the past. How many years were you deployed over and over? You left us over and over. You constantly told us you were doing a righteous thing. And we believed in you. And that's why we stuck around a way to free you every time to come back. We put up with everything the team says thrown at us because you told us it was the right thing to do and we believe in you. She's like, no, I want you to listen to me. She's like, the command is against you. She's like, no one's coming to

get you. You don't have any control. You are, you know, you're on all you have is me, your brother, and whoever, you know, a couple of people that are here fighting for you. She's like, you need to get that out of your head right now that anybody's coming to help you from the command. After that conversation, I like, it was hard to hear, you know, and I went back to myself and sat there for a little bit and I got down to my hands and knees, man. And I talked to God out loud and just like take this from me. Like, I can't deal with it. I just like, you're in control. And whatever happens happens.

Like, this is in your hands. You know, I'm pretty much just like that's it. And I'll tell you what man, like I got up parked out of myself and I felt like the way the world was off my shoulders. I was like, and it that's not to say it was like on easy street the rest of the time, but like that right there, I mean, you know, and I would talk to God every night and just be like, dude, help me to get through tomorrow, you know. And he did. It was, it's like, I physically felt it. It was, it was pretty insane. So I think by the time those guys had come, and like, and I think that was God, you know, they came and they were like straight up like we lied. that was God, you know, they came and they were like straight off like we lied. At that point, I was like, dude, I can't like sit here and get angry. You know, I was fucking wore out, but I was like, dude, thank God. Yeah, they've come to their senses, you know.

You were in prison for nine months, all right? What did you, I mean, I'm assuming you told your attorneys or you told Andrea, you know, that you had two of the accusers come up and, you know, come clean. What did the attorneys say? My, I had, I think I had my old attorneys at that point and they were like, well, they were like, you shouldn't trust them. This is how I was being told that they were still working for NCIS and they were just

really just trying to get stuff out of me, which I didn't believe. I was like, that doesn't, I just didn't believe that that's what they were doing, but that's what my old set of lawyers were trying to tell me. But then once my new set of lawyers came on, they were like, what the fuck? Okay, and they ended up talking to them, talking to those two and one of them, what's Corey Scott who went and fasted up to the murder? So, if I remember correctly, you did say that a lot of the prison guards were kind of What's Cory Scott who went and fasted up to the murder?

If I remember correctly, you did say that a lot of the prison guards were kind of coached by NCIS to to Try to get you to snap What kind of shit were they doing? So Yeah, they were told So it was I didn't know it was happening at first, but like Yeah, they were told. So I didn't know what was happening at first, but like anytime somebody visited me, anytime I had like any kind of interaction where I had to speak through somebody through a glass

or wherever I would get strip searched, like button naked, you know, lift up your nuts, act, do all this crap. And I thought that was like, you know, okay, your nuts act, do all this crap. And I thought that was like, okay, they don't do that to everybody. That's so they were doing that to me, a bunch at first, and then they would randomly, I'd be sitting down, they just randomly like get up, search me, then go toss myself. They're constantly fucking with me me with my visitation. They would, they wouldn't let me have visitation sometimes or tell me like certain people weren't allowed to visit me.

And it became pretty evident like the other prisoners were actually like, dude, they are, we haven't seen this, Like they're messing with you. And I was like, all right, well, one of the guards finally came up to me. There's a couple cool, there was, there were some cool guards in there that were definitely like, this is bullshit that you're in here. But they're like, Hey, man, your NCIS, they were like, somebody, some listed guy from your command. It was in here and they're telling, they're having me, every, guards have a meeting every morning

before they go on shift and they're like, make him snap today. Like keep fucking with them until he does something. And once he told me that, I was like, I mean, there's nothing, nothing in that break is scary. I mean, there's bunch of fucking putz e5, you know, kids. So I was like, dude, all right. And I just treated it as a game. I was like, every time they do something, you know, I had this one time,

this gunny sergeant who was an MA. He like stripped me naked and then was having me do stupid shit. Like pick up your boots, now do this, now bend over into this as I'm naked. And I'm looking at him like, bro, like what's, I know what you're doing man. Like let's just give it a rest. And he was like, you know, you got all up in my face. Like, fuck you me when I'm doing and like what you getting smart. And I was like, dude, I just smile, I was just like,

hey man, thanks for your service bud, you know. Great job on the volunteer, your contribution, then just walked out. So that's all you can really do, just keep it to yourself, because that's what they wanted. They wanted me to do something. They even had the prosecution was

getting other prisoners to try and befriend me or get me to say stuff that to take lesser sentences for them. So if you get Eddie to say something, it will cut your sentence in half or we'll do this. I mean, it was pretty rampant. And the other prisoners were come up and telling me these things. And all of it is like, you would think like this shit's illegal. Yeah. No, I mean, I brought it up to my lawyers, my lawyers brought it up in court. And it's like, yeah, okay, move on.

How did you want to get in the new lawyers? That's not like active God is, you know, Bernie Kerrick. Yeah. So Bernie Kerrick, who I didn't know, read one of those smear articles about me and literally was like something doesn't seem right here. He made some phone calls down to, I think the Pentagon, some seals that were working there and was like, what do you know about this guy, Eddie? What's going on with this?

And they told him that they didn't, hadn't worked me personally, but that I had a very good reputation from what they've heard and that this doesn't seem right either. And that there's something fishy going on. Like they just, like, there's something's not right about this. So he ended up connecting with my wife, reached out, and was like, if there's anything you need,

let me know. And he started asking questions about the legal team that we had at the time. And he was like, what are they doing for you? Tell me what they're, you know, what's their plan of action, which they had none. And it wasn't probably until a couple months down the road when Bernie initially had contact my wife that we were fun. My, my, our Andrea was like, we got to get rid of these guys.

And Bernie's like I have My lawyer standing by ready like help you guys out Tim parlatory and that's who That this is it's so nutty because I didn't Didn't know Tim no At that point all I was doing was just listening to Andrea She's like if she was like this is the best route, and then do it done. You know?

So she's like, I talked to this guy Tim. He seems like a legit lawyer. She's like, I think we should hire him. It's like, okay. I talked to the guy, talked to him on the phone for five minutes and he was like, I'm coming up there to see you. He's from New York. I, after I had fired Phil, or no, I fired Colby first

and I kept Phil Stackhouse on. Just for some continuity because he had already been on the case. Tim flew out and first time I saw him, it was definitely not what I was expecting. He was, you know, you're a New York lawyer, like, you know, expecting like, this hot, you know, high power suit,

high power tie walking in, but Tim is like just this big old, looks like a football player, just massive dude. You used to be in the Navy, he was an officer in the Navy. And that was it, man. What he, it was like a 180, like as soon as he took over, it was, did he knew more about the case after taking it from 48 hours

than my two other lawyers did and they'd been on it for five months. He was holy shit. It was insane to watch. Then to go to the courtroom with him. Like the first courtroom appearance I had with him was like, holy shit. I have a lawyer. Like, he was fighting back, like calling the prosecution out and everything. Uh-uh.

I mean, it was awesome. You know, you, it's, uh, that was definitely like some divine intervention. And then, um, Mark M. Casey was my Another lawyer I had and that he was Wanted to he is one of the president Trump's lawyers, but he had nothing to do with anything. He knew Bernie Karek You know, I grew up knowing Bernie and was just talking to him one night and was like, dude, I saw this, what's up with this Navy seal thing? Like this doesn't just look fucked up and Bernie's like, dude, I'm helping them.

And he said he's like, we'll tell them I'll offer my services like if they need help because this is jacked up. And of course, once that was like told to me, like, hey, this guy, Mark E. Casey said he'd help you and he's one of Trump's lawyers. I'm like, oh, yeah, like why wouldn't I want that? So ended up hiring him as well. And dude, it was, it was definitely like an awesome

dream team that I had. But what pointed Trump get involved for the first time? The first time he got involved was when I was locked up. My wife and brother had hooked up with Congressman Duncan Hunter and Congressman Ralph Norman. Obviously my wife had been on Fox and friends a couple of times at that point and she knew that that's the president watches that religiously every day. So she was pretty much got on there and was like, this is what's going on. I think that got as attention. He didn't do anything at first, but then we got over 50 congressmen to sign a petition or whatever saying to let me out

of pre-trial confinement, so I could properly defend myself. Well goddamn, I'm glad he didn't label that portion fake news. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, so like all he did is, which that was a crazy day. Like I got told, and by this point, we had a lot of people promise stuff that just didn't where it wasn't coming through.

You know, it was definitely an emotional roller coaster of like, oh, this is, this person's getting involved. You know, we've been told the presence was getting involved like four times at that point. You know, it was, it was always like a crap shooter. And I wasn't putting, you know, I knew my wife was doing a lot of work, but I, I wasn't getting my hopes up to just be like the president of the United States as you're bad. Yeah. Yeah.

Simpspore bitch. Yeah. And so like I walk, I was walking to walking to uh chow lunch and one of the guards the female guards walked by I mean she was like give me a weird look and I was like what's up and she's like are you you're getting out today and I was like no and she's like what the president just tweeted about you on tv and said that you're leaving. And I was like, what are you serious? She's like, yeah, so by the end of that day, man, they, they fucking came in. They were like, prisoner Gallagher stand up. Like, you're out of here. And I, so this is

the, this is the crazy part. All he tweeted was to get me out, he's like, get him out of confinement so he can properly defend himself for trial. Didn't say like, he's guilt here and not guilty. He just said because of his prior service, you know, he has the right to a fair trial. The command, Rosenblum, I get led out of the brig, like, not even let out. I I'm like checking out. They sent an MA down there. And pretty much took me from the brig and then threw me in a barracks room with like restriction on steroids. I wasn't allowed out of the room. I wasn't allowed a TV. I wasn't, I wasn't not anything. I was like, I was still in the brig. Still had to be in the same uniform. And I had to get escorted if I wanted to go eat cuffed and everything.

No, no cuffs. That was the one like I just, but I just sat, you know, sat in that room for an extra month and a half. So it was nine months in prison. It was no, it was I seven and a half months in prison. And then a month and a half. So it was nine months in prison. It was now it was I seven and a half months in prison and then a month and a half in this room, but the judge ended up adding that on to my computer. He was like, you guys, he pretty much told the command. He was like, what you guys are doing to him is confinement, just like the break. So he just added that on to my, he's like, he's pretty much served nine months in the break

from because it was ridiculous. I mean, the command my, my family would try and come visit me. This is when I was in the barracks. They would command would deny them like my wife and kids. I'm like, no, you can't see him unless we, we say you can during these hours. So it was pretty much like I was still locked up. Uh, just now it was almost, I don't want to say worse, but it was like I was by myself in a room. Now I wasn't seeing anybody, you know, um, they had a guard on post outside my

door at all times. Yeah, it was stupid. It was just stupid. Talk about the phone call from the president. No, they brought you a phone to make a call that had no service. Oh yeah. So we threw, we had to throw, we had to put together a complaint

when we back a court saying that what the Commodore and the Admiral were doing to me was tan amount to confinement and that I still, I basically they weren't following the president's orders. I still wasn't allowed to talk to my legal team. I still, I had no communication with anybody, so therefore, how could I properly defend myself? So the judge told the prosecution like he said, I'm not ordering you to do this because I can't, but I suggest you guys get him a phone so he can contact his lawyers. And so the command shows up about a week later, not took their time.

And they're like, here's your phone. It was like some, you know, 1994, like Samsung that had no service, they locked. I could only call my lawyer and my wife and I think my brother, you know, I wasn't gonna die on anything else out, but it just didn't matter because the phone had no service. So they gave that to the command jack, gave that to me,

and then they gave me a laptop with no internet, no nothing, and they're like, you can't have this laptop in your room. We're gonna, they locked it in another room in the barracks. So if I wanted to go use it to go look at any evidence, I had to have a whoever they had from the command watching me standing over me watching or like watching me do this, which is a violation in itself, you know, I'm looking at my own trial stuff like no. We brought that up to them after they gave me the phone. I brought it up to the command. Actually the the Jag that gave it to me. I was like, Hey, my phone doesn't have any service.

And she just looked at me and she's like, too bad and walked off. I mean, they knew what they were doing. Yeah. They were just I mean, they were blocking me from being able to defend myself at every turn. And it wasn't until the prosecution finally got caught. So cheating and spying is where I was led out of confinement. That was the judge's remedy. So the, the, the soon as Tim and Mark and all them got together as a legal team, the prosecution

sent them an email. This is a Chaz Black, was a prosecutor, and on that email, it was just some random email too. It wasn't nothing of significant importance, but on there was a tracking beacon at the bottom. It was like an embedded virus. And luckily my 10, my lawyer caught it because he had a case two cases ago that dealt with the same thing. And he saw it, and he emailed back and was like, tell me this isn't what I think it is. And got no response from the prosecutor. He was like, dude, they looked into it, found out it was spy, like, they sent them spyware.

So that became a whole other, like, side issue of my trial. So then we had to bring that up. Like, this is violating, I don't know, how many of my rights? Was that, was it, so that beacon, was that an attempted breach? Or did they breach? No, they didn't. So if he would have clicked on that beacon, it would have been a full breach.

What did the beacon look like? It was the symbol for the RSL. The command that the prosecution falls under, if they're single, but there's something like about it that Tim was like, this isn't right. And yeah, it turned out they prosecutors sent that beacon to my whole legal team, including all my civilian lawyers. My whole legal team, including all my civilian lawyers. The lawyers that were representing my OIC the Navy times because the Navy times had just started writing articles that were actually looking good for me because that the Navy times was

His name is Carl Prine. It was right now the articles, he started doing some digging of his own into what was going on and started finding out the truth. Like these dudes are fucking lying and he started writing articles that, you know, insinuating or saying like, hey, man, this is maybe this isn't what we think it is and the prosecution didn't like that. So they sent them a track and beacon as well. So that's to the media. Now we're violating the media's rights. So it became a real big deal. And we thought that, I mean, it was a good chance that cases are going to be thrown out over that because in the civilian

court, it would have been thrown out hands down. But their remedy was they, and this was a complete surprise. This was pretty much an awesome day. We went in just to talk about the spying, capping and all that stuff. At the end of the day, the judge, like so nonchalantly, was just like, all right, you know, due to the fact that I think you violated some of his rights, I'm just, I'm letting Eddie Gallagher go for your out of confinement. And it was like, I couldn't, I was like, what the fuck? And my wife was like, and that she like jumped up scream and like,

you know, and that was it. I got to go be with my family until trial, which trial was like, I think at that point a month off But that was that was a big day like just to be able to go see my wife and kids I went to fluke home, you know for like two days and then came back and all we did was prep for trial from that point on So you go to trial and you need to Explain to all of America how an entire fucking seal team Actually an entire seal community is turned against you and you need to prove your innocence. I mean

We're ready to do that But that point were you confident that? Yeah. I mean, I had confidence in my legal team. You know, I knew, I knew what they had. They had done their due diligence. I mean, they worked their asses off all the way up to trial for pairing for it. And I like, I knew the, I had the truth on my side. I mean, that's what I was like, dude, I have God in the truth on my side. And I'm going into it with that mindset. And because

at that point, so much corruption had happened, I was like, I definitely wasn't putting any faith in the justice system. Or like, that that's they were gonna do right by me. So I just had to have faith, you know, and God that it was gonna work out and then I trusted my legal team. I had full trust in them. And so we went into it with that attitude. I mean, it was like we were every day I went to trial

was like going into like an almost like an op. You know how many days was the trial? Oh, it was like two and a half weeks. Two and a half weeks every day? Yeah. It was nuts. You know, it's not like anything you see out of a few good men or rules and engagement, like the courtroom's not made a rich mahogany would

and like it's a piece of shit courtroom, like shitty carpeting, like nothing. There's barely any room for people in the back and they fill those seats with media. Those are the first people that fled in and then any supporters I had were told to wait outside, or they put an extra room for them somewhere else. I mean, I barely thank God they let my mom and dad

and wife in there, and my brother. But it's a circus. You know, the media was there. It was, I'd pull in every morning with Andrea and my brother, and that's their like little vultures, man, they're waiting and they come up to the car and are all around you. And you just got to like open the door and I just would walk in the courtroom. You know, there's shout-nots with the questions, eh, eh, but once, you know, once you're in the courtroom, it's like game on. And I just kept a straight face the whole time.

I wouldn't look at the jury. The jury so, we started off the first day with jury selection, which is a whole process. I had no idea how intricate it was. They have 20 jurors showed up at first. So in the military justice system, there's no like not everybody has to vote the same. Like in this and going world, everyone has to be not guilty or guilty. It's not that way in the military justice system. It can be not guilty or guilty. It's not that way in the military justice system. It can be like, you know, five people voted guilty, four people voted not guilty. Therefore, he's guilty.

Yeah. There was a seal on the jury. Yeah. Did you know him? Yeah. That's, um, yeah. He, uh, so he was one of the jurors. So it was one of the, so his three seals originally on the jury. But one of them who I knew it was smart enough to be like, can't be the fuck out of here. He came over to some excuse and, you know, I'm doing something classified. So he got off the other two were from Warcom. One of them said right away, like they had to fill out answers on a paper that he thought I was guilty. And that's what he would find me. So they were like, all

right, you're gone. Straight up, lied. They asked him if he knew me He said nope He'd been to my house five times. I know I know him. I know his wife or his ex-wife And he lied and said that he had never Talked to me. He said he I think he said that he saw me in the gym one time or whatever and that was it Is this is this fucking? Yeah, I mean, the dude's been at my house, it was crazy. He like straight up lied and was like,

no, I don't know. So when he did that, we had to go back. And so we had to deliberate on who to pick, you know, like who we're gonna kick off. And that was like a big point of contention because I went back and like, dude, it's fucking lying. But then they were like, oh, is he lying to like help you? And I was like, it doesn't matter. And we came up with the, it doesn't matter.

Like, we have to have integrity. And we got to kick him off. But the problem was, we went back and the number of the jurors that we wanted was seven. That's like, my lawyers are like, we have to have seven jurors. It's whatever lawyer math they have. And we started kicking. So I kicked all the officers off. I was like, get rid of them, except that we kept one Navy officer. And by the time we got down to like, we were at seven jurors. And my legal team was like, just leave him on. And we were like, dude, what the fuck? And they're like, we're not going to six.

Like, he's staying. So we left him and then come to find out. He was actively trying to find, like, get everybody to find me guilty. So that I had six Marines on the jury. And they were all like, this is all bullshit they because I guess after the trial my my lawyers and the prosecution go back there and talk to the jury to think to get like what were you guys thinking and The Marines were just like dude everybody was lying like there's no way and

It's like now like I play and it was like, no, like, I think he's, you know, he said something to my lawyers, like, dude, I think that guy tried to find you guilty. And I didn't believe it at first. Either I was like, no fucking way until this idiot did a whole post on Facebook the next day, like a fucking rant on Facebook about how I was really guilty, but this and this and this, and posted it on... Yep, posted that shit on that right there. I was like, first off, dude, like you have to be a complete fucking moron

to you're on the jury and now you're posting shit on social media, like, you have to be a complete fucking moron to you're on the jury and now you're post-inship on social media, like, and second, I'm like, dude, you lied. And I didn't, you know, I didn't say anything about it, but now I'm like, dude, and there's enough, I've had enough people talk to him after the fact. And there, I mean, I've had two guys who were like, good buddies with them, and they're like, do fuck that guy. Like after I talked to him, he's completely, he was that warcom and he'd been tainted. I mean, they were like, he's guilty. They were, you know, they were telling everybody that. And, God damn.

Yeah. Dude, it gets, it's nasty. It's like, and that's the crazy part. Yeah. And some, holy shit. So, uh, God damn, that's that's wow. Yeah, it's, it's wild. It gets the level of like corruption and like, just nasty stuff that people that were tainted, you know It's I would never believe it unless

Bucking amen, so what what was the turning point in court? I mean, I know it but yeah I think you know the turning point court for the media and everybody else was, you know, obviously Corey Scott, who was the one of the prosecutors, main witnesses that, you know, he was going to get up there. And, you know, what the prosecution thought was like, he's going to get up there and be like, oh, you know, he stabbed him. He got up there and completely was like, no, I'm the one who killed him. But that was like the big O-shit moment that everybody talks about.

But to me, the whole trial was a turning point for me. What I mean, you didn't know it was gonna do that. No. I mean, I would love to see your facial expression when he gets on the stand and says, I'm the one that fucking killed him. I can tell you, it looked just like this. You didn't make a freaking move because I at that point, there have been so much shit that had gone on in this case, like, ups and downs and twists and like, to me, when he said that, I mean, I was like, oh shit, but I was like, here's another monkey wrench. Like, where's this going to go, you know?

And it went exactly the way I thought, like like they didn't care that he said that, they were like, we're still charging him with pretty, like it was like, yep, we'll just dismiss him. You know, after he got it, when he said that, the prosecution got up and just straight attacked him. And was like, you're a liar, you lied to him. And then they would, all they did was attack him with every other witness like,

oh, he's got to it's a liar. And so it's like, dude dude that was your main witness. Yeah. You know I definitely was a turning point in the case for the prosecution and I'm sure the jury there probably like to these prosecutors are so fucked up but to me it was like watching every, every one of those dudes get up on the stand was, it couldn't have gone any better. Yeah. I mean, I knew they were fucked up. Like, I knew they had told so many lies, but did I, it was even worse than I thought,

watch them get up there. Craig Miller was pro, Craig Miller to me was a big turning point. He wasn't, he just complete more on. Got like, like we, I talked about before, changed the whole story about blood spurting out. Then he was making up lies that didn't even happen. Like it was not about that day. He was talking about blowing down a wall,

which that never had, like, didn't even exist. He even said that he had put hands on the ISIS dude and like was kicking them down, that never happened. I mean, it was really odd, the shit that they were like lying about, they really had no relevance to charging me. But I think they had told so many lies at that point that they, either they thought some of it was the truth or they just couldn't keep up. And it showed, I mean, even the media,

they were sitting in the back, like, especially when Craig Miller was testifying and they were first off there, like, how was this guy in ABC? Like, he's an idiot. they're like how do they prosecutors even call this guy up? It's it was that bad. Well, he got flustered. Finally, my lawyer was asking him enough questions. He then he all said and got the case of him. He got a case of amnesia and then I'll sit and couldn't remember anything. You know, and it's the same with every other dude, you know, Delay and Tolbert. There are two stories about shooting the old man. They didn't match up at all. They were talking about the same guy, but they was like one guy fired, you know,

said they fired warning shots, one said they didn't. You know, it was just this disconvagulated mess. On your many documentary that your buddy at the New York Times made. He said, well, for starters, was Andrea and Ryan and your other sons, they go every day to court? No. They did. Did they really just show up the one day? Was that just a coincidence? That was, yeah. And that's's yeah, I mean, I'll give it to the New York Times and then for trying to put that together. But yeah, we might. So I had all three of my kids were there at the Airbnb that we were using as one of the

trial went on. And you know, we were coming back every day. And of course, that's all that was being talked about, in fact, my family was staying there. And so my two older kids, Trevor and Ava, they were like, hey, can we go? And I was like, no problem with you going, you know, me and Andrew, both like, if you guys wanna go.

So that's how they showed up that day. Like, had nothing to do with Corey Scott or what was said that day. It just happened to fall on that day. But I mean, that's the first question the media asked when we came out of walking out of court that day. Andy Dyer from the union, 10 year union tribune. Instead of like the big bombshell that somebody else just submitted to the murder, his question was, how could we in good conscience

take our two kids to a trial that shows dead bodies? Like, there's pictures of dead bodies in there and you're gonna let your kids watch that. And I wasn't allowed to talk, you know, but we do it in Andrea, let him up, like it was awesome. So you're just like, you know, we don't hide our kids from evil.

We don't hide them from what their dad does. And, you know, that's the question you have. Yeah. They were trying to pick at anything, trying to demonize you. Yeah, I'm trying Demonize you. So you wound up not guilty. Yeah, and and what what are that? I mean that You still have the stone cold stare when you heard that No, I think well You that I it's hard to explain that moment

Because it would it was just it was crazy. Yeah, you know they We closed our case You know prosecution went close our case defense went close our case and they were like all right, you know Jerry's going to deliberate. I'm I took them about a day and a half. That was a crazy day and like just waiting for them to come back and Yeah, when they finally did it was It was like hey, the Jerry's got their decision. It was you know real quick got into the courtroom

They really didn't yeah, I didn't hit me until I was like sitting there waiting for them to come out. I was like, this is it, you know, like, oh shit. Yeah, oh, bad man, fuck. Yeah, they called him in and then you stand up at attention as they come in, I'm just staring straight ahead. And it's like no time wasted, They're like, read them off. And the crazy part is they don't read,

they weren't reading the charges like, you know, prepromeditated murder for this. It was like charge one specification too. So I had no idea like which ones they were talking about. So they were like, not guilty, not guilty, not guilty, not guilty. So there was that one. And I remember like, as I read them off,

I wasn't even here in it. I mean, my heart was like, felt like it was coming out of my chest and it was just like, you know, ringing in my ears. And once they got done reading them, I was like, fuck, like, which one was like guilty of and my Tim, my lawyer grabbed me and he was like, it's the picture, you know, and like hug me.

And dude, it was like, bro, the courtroom erupted. I mean, everybody was crying. It was pretty nuts. It was, I mean, you saw a team get, I mean, team guys flowing in, just bawling, like grabbing me. It was pretty epic. Like, I was, I think I was just like in shock, you know? People just like grabbed me, like hugging me

and you know, my wife was crying. Everybody was bawling. My lawyers, all my lawyers are crying. Just, I think everybody was so happy, you know? Cause like, everybody had put so much, like time and effort and just, you know, because like everybody had put so much like time and effort and just, you know, people believed in that case. Like, it meant a lot to them. Yeah. So yeah, it was, it was nuts. Yeah, I went right from there when got sleeved up, I went right, I drove right

to the tattoo parlor. It was, and of course the media turned that one into a heyday. Said something like Navy SEO gets acquitted and goes right to get an alcohol and tattoos or something. It was like some crazy article they wrote, but what'd you get? I had, so I had no tattoos. Got all through my whole career. So the first one I got was well actually First one I got you know Mike Martin. Yeah, so he you know he passed away

During my whole thing, but he snuck in When I was in the barracks room that we. He came in on a Saturday and snuck in with a silencer tattoo gun and tattooed the bone frog on my back and then my wife's name right there and then after my trial. Oh, shit. Yeah. Let's fucking that out. Oh, yeah. It was, he's such an awesome guy. And yeah, after the tattoo, I was the first thing I got was my wife's eyes with like the flag wrapped around it.

And then pretty much this whole arm was dedicated to my wife and then my kids. That's awesome. Yeah, it was, you know, I never like thought about getting tattoos or like, it was always, I was like, there's gotta be something, you know, that has to have like

Real meaning behind it and that was it for me. I'm like to this if this isn't it then So yeah when did that? You know, I had the I had to go back for my sentencing for the picture Which they threw the book at me big time. I think I'm the first person ever to get sentenced to a court martial for taking a picture. But yeah, they pretty much turned that into, you know, they tried to turn that into a war crime,

which it's not, you know, it's not, I don't think it's in good taste, but it's not a war crime. Whether that, if that's the case, then there's been tons of war criminals in the military since the beginning of the picture, you know, camera. Yeah. You know, it's, but whatever, you know, they wanted to get their pound of flesh out of me. I think the Navy was definitely, they were pissed, embarrassed. And then they came at you again. Then did not stop. Yeah. After the trial, I went back to work thinking like, just like I talked about that mass chief had said, he'd swim me way back. And I thought

that's what I had done. I went through the gauntlet. It was like, I'm back, showed up. I was like, I'm ready to go back to work. They were like, you're banned. They banned me from all the teams, the bases and they stuck me in supply down another base again. And they said, you know, it was the same deal like a report there every morning.

I wasn't allowed to put in my retirement because the punishment for my court martial hadn't like been officially gone through yet. They had to wait for like some abnormal signature, which they said could take months. So I just had to, you know, show up and not do anything. And so all I did at that point, I was like, I had so much leave. I never took it. So I was like, I'm just going on. I would go back to Florida, spend time with my family, then come back every two weeks, come back and be like, okay, what's going on? It was, they were completely blocking me

from getting anything done. I wasn't allowed to go to, I was still, I still belonged to trade at, but I wasn't allowed to go there. So all of my paperwork, everything I needed was there, and but I wasn't allowed to access it. So it was just a stupid game that they were playing with me. The command would toy with me like group on mass shave would be like, oh, we need to you to move all your stuff out of your cage into this context box. And then next week, oh,

move out of that context box over here. Like it was just stupid stuff. And I was pissed, but my lawyer and a couple of people who advised me, they're like, do not do anything. If they're fucking with you, just let them fuck with you. Don't give them any reason to come after you anymore. So I played it cool the whole time. And then that's when I got the phone call from the president. I was coming back from Florida, back to San Diego and I landed in San Diego and I got a call from my lawyer saying, hey, if there's a weird

phone number that comes up, pick it up. And it's like, why? And he's like, just do it. And it's like, all right. And sure enough, it was one of the things I said it was from Egypt. And so I picked it up. And yeah, it was the President of the United States and the Vice President on the phone. And they, he called and was like, listen, I'm calling to tell you that you're,

I'm going to let you retire or you're going to retire as a chief with everything that you've earned over the past 20 years. Because the punishment they had tried to give me is I was going to retire as a E1. In E1? Yeah, and that's why I don't think anybody really knows is because they had thrown the book at me and they sentenced me to four months in the brig, which I'd already served. I'm most triple that over twice that. But because you get that four months, that's automatic reduction that you won. And so I would have, I've been like 20 years never existed. So he was like, that's not happening. I'm letting you retire as a chief

and with everything that you've earned, you know, and then he talked to me about, I mean, he knew more about my case than, I think most people, like he knew all the intricacies of everything that had happened, all the crap the prosecution had pulled. I mean, he was disgusted by it. And he was like, you know, he's like, we don't treat our war fighters like this.

He's like, this is not, not only on President, you know, he's like, we don't treat our war fighters like this. He's like, this is not not one president, you know, he's like, you know, throw away our war fighters. And he's like, so I'm, you know, thank you for your service. And I'm going to let you out with or let you get out with everything that you learned. Then he, you know, really made a bunch of remarks about my wife, how amazing she is. And that's why she's the reason that he was even involved. That he was like she's a remarkable person to watch, fight. You know, he's like, I forget what he said. He said, you know, she stands, she's a good salesman, she stands

by her product and she's like that product as you, you know, and so talk to him and both the vice president just I I was you know in shock when you know what are you gonna say about the phone I just sat there and listened to them and thank them over and over and yeah so they were gonna pull your seal try to do that so after I get off the phone with them I go into work the next day and I go right to trade it where I'm banned from. I drive right on, I'm like, dude, fuck this. I walk in and I'm like, hey, I want my paper, like all I wanted was my paperwork to put

my retirement in, which they were not giving me. I go up to the third deck, walk into the admin and you would have thought I walked in with a shotgun. I mean, it was all admin people in there would have thought I walked in with a shotgun. I mean, it was all the admin people in there, and they all like stop what they're doing. And we're like, oh my gosh, and I literally was like, hey, I just need this, this, and this. And I'll be out of here, you know, and they're like, oh, you know, they're all helpful. They're like, definitely. And the mass chief of trade it comes walking out, sees me and it was so awkward.

He was like, oh, what's up? I was like, hey, how's it going? He's like, oh, and then he walks back in his office and shuts the door. And I'm like, okay, comes out about 30 seconds later, Okay, comes out about 30 seconds later, completely different demeanor, like bowed up, gets in my face, and is like, who gave you authority to even come in here? Like, you're not, like, just being a complete douchebag. And he's like, you're not allowed in here. I don't know what you think, you know, what makes you think you can walk up in here. And I just turned and looked at him, was like, you know, he, because he said, who gave you the authority to come here?

And I looked at him and was like, the president of the United States when he called me yesterday. I was like, get the fuck out of my face. He looked, his face was like, hey, you like walk back into his office and I like, I had it at that point. I was like, dude, the fuck you,

fuck all of you guys. I was like, in my Yeah, fuck you. I fuck all of you guys. I was like, you know, my paperwork. I mean, the, the having people were cool. I didn't know problems with them, but just him and then the CEO of trade-it comes walking out. This is literally this happened. I turned, he comes walking out of his office, looks at me and then goes back in his office and shut the door. Like these are grown ass Navy SEALs that we're talking about here.

Yeah, I'm like, dude, are we like really, you know, but either way, I left there, I didn't go back. I just got everything I needed. And I go back to supply to put in for retirement and I get notified by group one. They call me, you're like, oh, yeah, you're not. You can't put that in because now we're going to take in for retirement and I get notified by group one. They call me, you're like, oh, well, yeah, you're not, you can't put that in because now we're going to take you to try and review board and we're pulling your bird. Um, and they just wouldn't find a lot of you. You could make, you couldn't make it up.

I literally sat down with the group one master chief and had to have, like, I tried to have like this heart to heart talk with them like dude I get it you guys are coming after me like I'm public any number one I was like but do you know what this looks like like the president just said I could retire and just let me go and now you're coming after me again I was like this looks like you're giving the middle finger to the president of the United States. And I was like, you do understand that. And he was like, no, no, no, that's not what we're doing. I was like, okay, I'm like, that's what it's going to look like.

But I welcomed, they were like, you're going to go to the Trident Review Board, and I welcomed it. I was like, fine. I was like, I'll go. I was like, because that is the first and only time you guys have ever offered to hear my side of the story. And if it has to be in front of a try to review board, and I'm able to talk to a bunch of senior enlisted and give my side, I welcome it. I was like, even though I already know there's a predetermined outcome

that you guys are going to pull my bird. But if that's what it takes, you know, and I went and reviewed, so when you have a trial and review board, you can go review the evidence beforehand to see what they're gonna bring up and I was going to trial all over again. I mean, it literally was like I had never been a trial. They were just like all the charges again, which I was like I had never been a trial. They were just like, all the charges again,

which I was like, okay. But literally the next day, the president steps in again and tweets, I wake up to a tweet that said, you will not be taken as tried and get back to work. Like, I mean, and so I walk into work the next day and I'm like, you know, what are you going to do now, you know, what's and they told me they were like, oh no, we're still

pulling you tried it. And I was like, okay, you know, I don't know where this is going, but it's like it's not gonna end. I mean, you're going up against the president, which that's on you, you know, but they never ended up doing it. They tried. And we ended up fighting back pretty hard to where they, they were going to take my trident, my two U commanders tried in my OIC's tried in. Anybody that testified on my behalf, they're just going to pull their tridents. But they ended it all ended up getting dropped. Well, yeah, but it was like that to the very last day.

My retirement ID just constant trying to like target me in some way. And that is fucking sad, dude. Yeah, it was super sad. Um, and the sad part is like watching the guys in the community, um, who were not, you know, they were all coming out to me like to this bullshit, you know, like they were all on my, but they it was a very like looking over your shoulder type of Yeah, and It's Yeah, it was pretty bad spending admigreen. He's gone. I don't out of that seat now, but dude, he I mean They the Alberta of the secretary of the Navy over this. Yeah.

Well, that was, uh, that was another. So I think I got hammered pretty good, um, because I spoke out against abnormal green, right? When I was on activity, people were like, I mean, even other seals like, oh, you shouldn't have done that. That's whatever, I don't know what they conduct on becoming or you know but at that point I had I mean they had done so much stuff to me yeah I was like dude I don't give a fuck anymore and Fox News was like I asked me to come out I was like done and I flew out over the weekend flew in on like a Saturday and I was fired up. I was like ready to start

putting people on blast and my lawyer was like don't do it, don't mention anybody's name because you're still in active duty and they could still charge you. But when I went in there, I had evidence, I had evidence. I had already evidence that the secretary of the Navy was meddling in my case. I had an email that somebody gave me that he personally was reached out to organizations and told them not to support me,

which why is the secretary of Navy reaching that low into something? Wow, but I put it, I went on Fox News and I put that on blast. I was like, this, this and this, I put out my greasiname on blast. I was like, dude, I don't care. And then within three hours after the interview, the section area is relieved, which I'm not saying it was because I went on there, but I think, you know, maybe it might have had a little something to do with it. Yeah. So I mean, and then he got caught going behind the secretary of defense is back. Yeah. So, well, we're doing so funny favors.

Before we, you know, close the book on this, this chapter. I do have one question and you were going to get a silver star for that deployment. Do you know what that was for? Yeah. I mean, I saw all the, so the way it was explained to me, and this is, I didn't know I was being put in for it, silver star will silver star for those of the don't know is the third. The third from the top. Yeah, I was to combat awards you can get it's it's a. Yeah, it's a I mean it's a big deal for guys that you know, yeah, I mean, and I had no idea that I was being put in for one until we got back from that deployment and the only way I found out was because one of these junior

junior guys said it, they're like, oh, well, you got put in for a silver store and I was like, what? Yeah, and so I went and talked to my OIC and Teak Manor like, yeah, we ran it, that we recommended you for one. And it was for the first day was for multiple acts because they changed. And I can't keep up with the award system, but they changed it from doing one act, valorous act to multiple acts, and then now they changed it back to just one act again. The write up I got for it was, you know, we were in a position and we started getting shot at pretty good, shot up. We had taken PKM and all sorts of fire. And I had requested

the the map views to pull up on this bridge and light up where we were getting shot from. They didn't they wouldn't do it because they were, it's, you know, we're taking fire. So I ran, I ran down, I was at a third story of a building, but it was like open, I was running down through bullet, fire, whatever, sprinted across the field, which this is, I'm just getting this from the right up at all. You know, to me, I'm like, I don't, uh, that sound is crazy, but like, uh, yeah, I jumped across, right across the field, jumped in the Mavie, pulled it up onto the bridge, hammered down on that building that was where we were taking fire from, and then, uh, got out, ran across the field again,

taken fire, grabbed the javelin, went up, uh, ran up to the third deck again, and then engaged and smashed to the enemy position, and the fire subsided or whatever. It all watered itself. Yeah, only. But it did. It sounds like it's believe it. To be it wasn't that crazy you know it was like but that was like the one right up they did it for and whatever it when I got my

that was the funny thing when I got my award finally when I could retire I I was like you know processing it through with the admin guys and the admin guys like dude I have never seen this before and I was like what he's like come look at this they had White it out this over star And wrote bronze with me and pen I still have it I'm like at that point I was like dude. I don't even care like I don't care like I think You know wars are here and are there, man. I think there's people that get them that don't deserve them. And I think there's people that don't get them that

do deserve them. And it's a cross in between. So I don't put any, like whatever. Well, just for reference, I think it's metal, vana, navy, cross, and silver star. Yeah. So So we're a star. Yeah, so pretty big fucking deal man, but you know, well, let's take a break. Yeah There's a lot of people looking for land these days As we continue to lose our freedoms. So we're on our way to look at a piece of property out the middle of nowhere and this particular piece only sits on an acre All right, Eddie, we just got back from the break and I just wanted to bring up. We were talking about the book on the break and that QR code thing you were talking about, I think.

Yeah, it is amazing. I've never seen that in a book. And if you don't mind, just in a brief description, like give everybody a rundown of what that's going to be like in the book. Yeah. So the way I wrote the book is obviously it's from my point of view of everything that happened. I have chapters in there from my wife, my brother, and I think my lawyers have a chapter in there and there's a couple other people that were involved. But obviously the book is from my point of view. I wrote it in such a way that the reader can see everything that my family went through

and then everything that happened at the trial. But it's going to be, it's up on the reader. You know, I wanted to write it in such a fashion that the reader can make his decision at the end whether they think I'm guilty or not or what decision they would make if they were the jury. So the only way I could do that is I put, you know, to do it honestly and not just from my side, I put QR codes in the book. So as you're reading it, like if you're reading about the trial and you're like,

okay, you don't believe certain things I'm putting in there or you wanna know more, you can click on the QR code and you can listen to all the trial audio. You can listen to or watch all the NCIS videos. And you can see it all like not hiding anything. It's you know, put everything out there and so by the end of the book you can make your decision what you would find me as a jury member. That's amazing. Yeah, I tried to write it in that fashion. I can't wait to get my hands on it and the like the cute, the fact that you put the original court audio in there and and and

by just by scanning the QR code. So it's like, oh, if you don't believe me then. Yeah, I want to be as transparent as possible. Yeah, there was enough, you know, during my whole trial and everything else, I mean, the media put out enough stuff that was completely bias against me. And they spliced, you know, certain things to make me look evil. And I'm like, I'm not going to do that. I mean, yeah, there's going to be things in the QR code that don't make me look good because they, you know, they dug through my life. But I, you know, I'm not going to hide. I don't have anything to hide, you know, I'm not an angel. You know, I'm trying to be a good person, but I'll just put everything out in the open. Yeah. Well, moving forward, this will be the last segment. I just want to talk about,

a bit less segment. I just want to talk about kind of your transition, which, uh, holy shit, man, I can't even fucking imagine what that was like. You know, most guys just have to, you know, not just have to, but, you know, dealing with the post-traumatic stress and trying to figure out what the fuck you're gonna do and not being able to feed the addiction to the adrenaline and all that shit coming into play on top of what you were dealing with. It's a miracle that you got through and that you're still sitting here. And then after that, we'll talk about what you're doing now with the PyPitter Foundation,

which I think is fucking amazing. But yeah. So you did eight deployments and just your last deployment, you saw more shit than most people will ever see in a lifetime. And even more than a lot of other operators and one deployment and kind of talking with the online, you had brought up that there were other deployments that were you, there was more action.

You saw a lot of death. You saw a lot of traumatic shit. I'm sure you've lost more friends than you can count. And you have killed a lot of bad guys. So what about guys that you've saved from being a medic? Yeah, I mean, we just, I mean, just this last appointment appointment the one I was on our EOD guy got shot You know, he was up on the rooftop setting up some charges for some loopholes and you know one random shot right out Tagged him in the leg and we managed to pull him down Myself and another medic worked on him.

He's actually back operating now. Just good dude, but yeah, we ended up working on him and having to buddy carry him back to the rally point, which we had pre-staged. But I mean, that's on other prior deployments, you work on guys or partner forces all the time, whether they're shot or I mean, most time I've worked on a lot of partner force guys that have been blown up or shout out pretty good. It just comes with a job of being a medic and that's just one of the qualifications. How many guys do you think, how many men do

you think are still alive because of the fact that you patched them up. Um, counting team guys are in all of our important for the human life that you would say, probably like 20 to 25, maybe, just that's what I can think of the top of my head. You got your thinking, you know, we also take care of, you know, when we're doing VSO, uh, those stability operations on Afghanistan, you're taking care of the villagers nearby. Would you like medcaps and bring them in? And you know, they don't have the stable environment we have here so that you know,

they're bringing you these kids that are, you know, got dragged. I remember this one kid got dragged by a horse, you know. He had to be like five or six years old and they brought him in. And I mean, his whole scalp was gone, peeled off. We worked on him and it ended up metabac and him, and saving him.

And just there's a, that's, you know, that's the one part of going over there, you know, taking the war aspect out of it. When you start helping the actual civilians over there, and they're stuck in a war zone that they're not taking part in it, but they're just stuck there and helping them out definitely gives you a feeling of satisfaction or gratification. You're actually doing some good. Amidst all the violence and everything else, being able to take care of some female or even pregnant women

over there, they came and saw us and we'd helped them out. But just being able to take care of them and send them on their way, you know, do as best you can. It makes you feel good. Yeah. Like you're doing something good in the world. Have you ever thought about the fucking magnitude of the fact that there's, you just estimated 20, 20 guys that you saved and it's more than And it's more than that because you just brought up a med cap. But in combat, there's 20 human beings walking on this fucking earth that wouldn't be here if it wasn't for you being there. That's pretty like amazing shit.

Yeah, it's, I mean, you never think of it like that. You're just, you're just doing your job. You know, that's part of what being a medic is just helping other people out. But yeah, you take this step back like you just did and look at it in the big picture. It's pretty awesome feeling, you know? Yeah, it was pretty fun, amazing, dude.

Yeah, but was pretty fun. Amazing dude. Yeah, but well Did you did you even have time to I mean deal with no post-traumatic stress No, all the ship was going on and and cordon with the NCIS or not at all and It's it was pretty crazy because I you crazy because I was at that TBI clinic trying to get intrepid spear getting worked on. I had multiple, I've had multiple concussions throughout my career.

And when I got there, I hadn't reported a lot of them or some of them were just half-ass reported. And so when they really started digging deep into everything that was going on, it was pretty eye-opening, like, oh shit, you know, this is what I've done to my brain. And then they bring back the scan and show you, like,, this, this is what's, you know, part of your brain looks like from all of the blasts. It's, uh, it's pretty eye-opening, but, you know, I didn't have any, I got pulled out of that clinic and thrown in prison. So I didn't have any, uh, real time to like treat myself or take care of myself. And, um, I remember going, you know, while I was locked up, I had buddies visiting me and other team guys, and they, they were constantly, you know, while I was locked up, I had buddies visiting me and other team guys and they were constantly, you know, checking up on me and being like, are you okay?

And I'd, you know, like any typical team guy, I'm like, I'm fucking fine, you know, I'm good. And I was good at the time because I was in fight mode. You know, during that whole process, I think my, I was just focused on like fighting, you know, for my freedom and getting out. I really wasn't worried about any other other ramifications. And it really didn't hit me until I got out, you know, even the last day, I think I was telling you about it at dinner last night. You know, I hadn't, during that whole last night, you know, I hadn't.

During that whole time, I didn't, I hadn't processed everything that was going on. It was just every day was a fight. And the day that I went and got my retire, my ID, my retired ID, you know, as by myself, it was very just like went in. They were like, here it is. And you're gone, you gone, thanks for coming out. I went back to my truck, I just sat there, and I let it, I mean, I just started born by myself and my truck, it was like everything,

just started dumping out of me. It was more of a bittersweet, because I didn't, I didn't wanna get out, you know, that I had that job, I love that job. I mean, it was my religion for 20 years and to leave like that was not the way that I had ever pictured it or planned it. But it was also like I was glad it was over, you know, I was glad I was going back to my family.

I started a new chapter, but once I got home, I was good for a couple months, I think, you know, just sort of selling. It's like the, I guess the honeymoon phase of getting out. like the, I guess the honeymoon phase of getting out. But once I started writing the book, everything sort of came crashing down on me. I went into some pretty dark spaces, just going rehashing everything that had gone on. I hadn't taken the time to unravel everything that had happened to me and my family. So once I started rehashing everything and having to go into the details, everything that happened, and it was so much that I couldn't even remember half the shit. Went on, but I was, I got angry. I think that's the only emotion I had for a while, which is like anger and frustration.

You know, my Andrea saw, my wife saw, my kids saw it. You know, I'd come down from working on the book and I'd just be in a dark space, wouldn't talk to anybody. And you know, thank God I have, I'm telling you the only reason I'm halfway like good now is because my wife, you know, she's my rock and she's like, she told me she's like, you know, you need to deal with whatever's going on and she's like, it's not just with the book or what happened. It's like your career, you know, everything that's, you know, you've been through. And because I think when you're going through, you know, and I try to explain

to people how it is, you know, in the teams or it's like you're on a train going 120 miles an hour all the time. And any traumatic event that happens, whether you lose, you know, a teammate or you know, something else you see, some atrocities, it just goes in the caboose. You don't even, you're like, yep, throw it back there and just keep going. Once that 120 mile train stops, guess what that caboose is coming? It's going to come crashing right into India. So that ended up happening. So I went, you know, Andrew and I talked and, you know,

I focused on the focus was just doing the book, but it was also taken this year to like get treatment and really fix myself and make myself a better person to be around and just, you know, and that's, that's the right thing to do. It's, you know, and that's, that's the right thing to do. It's, you know, she sent us a, Andrew sent us a list of the treatments that you went through and that is a, that's a pretty fucking extensive long list.

Yeah, I mean, I feel, I feel blessed that I even got to go to those treatments, you know, and it was through the, you know, seal future foundation. Those guys reached out to me right away, to go to those treatments, you know, and it was through the, you know, the SEAL Future Foundation. Those guys reached out to me right away and they were like, listen, whatever you need, hit us up. I went, got all my blood worked on right off the bat. And that was a pretty, another eye opening thing when they came back and told me, you know, everything that I was low in, my body is, you know, they're like, yeah, your, if your brain's not working properly, the rest of your body's going to

pay for it. And so I was low in a lot of stuff. They hooked me up with a lot of like supplements, got me on TRT, which of my testosterone was low. And then I went and did HBOT treatment, which is the, I forget the, what HBOT stands for, but pretty much you go into a, it's like going down a depth, you're going into the dive chamber. The hypervirate chamber.

Yeah, hypervirate chamber. They take you down and I did about 65 treatments of that. Did you find that effective? I did. You know, it's not the end all be all, but I definitely felt better afterwards. I wasn't feeling the effects during it. I was sort of frustrated but about two weeks after it felt like a fog had been lifted a little bit. So the science behind that struck me if if I'm wrong, is they take you down to depth. And it, because the blasts have kind of loosened up the membrane on your brain, correct? Yep.

And so basically when they go down to depth and the hyperbaric chamber, it's compressing that all back together. I think that's kind of like and dummy terms, scientific as we're going to get. And dummy terms, I can't explain it any better than that either. It's pretty much helps you. It's supposed to heal your brain. They've been doing it for years with NFL players. And they're just now seeing that this treatment is doing wonders for guys that are coming out of our profession who've taken multiple concussions

or like they call them, little mini concussions over and over. And they're seeing a lot of good effects from it. I recently just got, actually my dad is a retired lieutenant colonel. He was a desert stolen man. I actually got him to go down and do it and see in, I mean the big change when he got down with it as well. I mean, you can see the they had the positive changes and the effects that it has on people. So I definitely got a lot out of that. And then, dealing with, I still had this, like,

weight on me. It felt like, you know, where I would still go into these dark, you know, just places or just angry. And I couldn't figure out, you know, I knew it was going on. places are just angry. And I couldn't figure out, you know, I knew it was going on. And I'll tell you like that's having podcasts like this or any other seals are doing podcasts. They when they have their guests on and the guys talk about the stuff they go through

and they're vulnerable and able to be like, hey, this is what I went through. And it helps like, it helped me a lot to be able to listen to those guys because I'm like, okay, I'm not the only one feeling like this and then it just gave me this self awareness. I need to do something about it and I'm just not going to sit here and be angry and miserable. I want to change, you know, I want to be different. So I went, I did this pretty, not invasive,

but it was different, plant medicine. It's called I Begain. Is this, is this when you went to Mexico? Yeah. So it's through the vet program, and it's Amber and Marcus Capone run it and they flew me out to Mexico and you take this Ivy game. It's just a pretty powerful loosenogenic kind of like Ayahuasca. Is this like, is this still a siren? No. So this, I began, comes from like a tree bark.

It's, I think, and I don't want to mess this, I think if they said South America, which, you know, certain tribes use it as like a right of passage when they're, you know, they take it to become a man or like to find your, your purpose. But they've come to find out that this medicine is like, they also used it to treat addicts.

So they use it for heroin addiction, any kind of addiction, they were using treat patients and they were finding that it was working. And then they started to now treat vets, you know, guys who have massive, you know, TBI's or PTSD, or in which also we know comes long addition problems, you know, alcohol, abuse, pills, everything else. And they're, I mean, they're finding out like it's doing wonders. It's almost like a game changer for a lot of guys. So I had talked to a couple of buddies that had already done it.

They sort of explained it to me, but even when you haven't done it and you have people explaining to you, I was still, I was nervous about it. But Andrew and I talked about it and we, she was on board. And so I went down there and yeah, it was, it was a game changer for me. It, it, what's the process like down there? So they, you go down there, you just go to this house

and they have doctors on, you know, there, they have like this nurse or, and she's also a shaman. She prepares the medicine. They, you know, everything is done with like reverence. They, they're very professional about it. They have people watching you 24, 7 while you're on it. They hook you up with EKGs just so they can monitor you. How do you take it? It's in capsule form. How long does it last? 10 hours. 10 hours? Yeah, instant tense. It's in capsule form. How long does it last? 10 hours. 10 hours?

Yeah, instant tense. It's super intense. So what you did is, and actually it was on your last podcast, he sort of taught it pretty much exactly how he said it. You go in there, you write your intentions of what you want to get out of it. So I wrote down like, I just want to be happy again. I want to feel like innocent again. Like, you know, sort of, I look at my kid, Ryan, who's, you know, he's just an awesome kid, laugh him, and just happy. I was like, dude, I want to feel like that again, you know, and not have this

burden or whatever you want to call this weight on me. Um, and I wrote it down with a piece of paper. Uh, and then you throw it in the fire and then you take them out of some and they lead you upstairs to a room with beds. You just lay down on the bed. You put a one of those eye-covering sleep masks on and you just wait until it kicks in and how long does it take? It might took a while to kick in so I was there with the other guys. Are you guys all in the same room? Yeah, so they're all on beds and everyone's in their sort of monitoring us. They play like, you know, real chill music. And I mean, everything is like to make you comfortable. But those guys, I can see if I can hear that they kicked in like something like throwing up

because that's sometimes what happens. So I was getting pretty frustrated. I was like, dude, you know, did I get a bad dose or what's going on, but then, yeah, all of a sudden, it's like ringing or buzzing, started happening. And it's when I can feel it come up the back of my spine and like, it feels like the back of your brain is just explodes. And you are, it was like 10 hours of, like, I got, went into space. You know, I was like, actually like in space or I can see the stars and you actually feel like you're there,

you know, it's like this is actually going on. But what's crazy about the medicine is, you're, I could literally, if I wanted to take my, I mask off, I'd know, or I'd be conscious, be like, okay, I'm in this room, you know, but then I'd go back to it. I'm back to, you know, in space, but, you know, it was, it really started off super intense at first. I felt like the bed was trying to like, buck me off and like, it was flying all over the room, But I just remained calm and like worked on my breathing just to like chill. And then pretty much I watched a whole real of my life. I watched myself being born, watched myself as a child growing up all the way, you know, I forget how far it went, but what it did for me is, you know,

it just made me really appreciate, you know, what I had, which was my family. And just, I mean, stuff that I think I was like overlooking, you know, because of the everything that had happened and it just, you know, because of the everything that had happened. And it just, you know, I came out of it like that's what this like weight off me. And just like a feeling of peace. And it just gave me like a foundation to, you know, if I'm start feeling a certain way, I can bring myself back to that place a lot easier than I could have before the medicine. Yeah.

When did that, so you're basically you were accessing memories that you had in access for it. Oh yeah. It was insane. And then this will trip you out like this is hard to explain to people. So I mean, it sounds crazy, but I was watching. So you're watching, it's almost like an old film of yourself. And then at some point during it, I started, I was watching, so you're watching, it's almost like an old film of yourself. And then at some point during it, I started, I was watching my dad as a little child and

like him growing up and then how, you know, him with his dad. And it was, I mean, but it was like actually, you're like, dude, this is actual footed, like real shit. I mean, but it was like actually, you're like, dude, this is actual foot. It like, but it was like I was accessing my dad's memories, which sounds insane. And I know like, you know, people listening like, what the freak? But I mean, it was nuts. Well, you know, I did some research on this shit. And we're not shit, but this stuff is like still siphon in particular. And I can't remember the exact percentages,

but I think they say you can only access 10% of your brain or human beings can only access 10 or 20% of their brain. It's a small amount. And when the psilocybin or hallucinogenic takes effect, it like literally unlocks the rest of your brain, which gives you access to all these memories. And there's the way I kind of understood it. But yeah, that's pretty much how it felt like it just, like the rest of your brain has woken up and it just starts bringing back where you start seeing all these memories that you don't even

know you had. I mean, stuff when I was little, I mean, they were actual memories, but like, you know, when I was four years old, like walking into the store with my mom, like holding her hand, or it was actual, like I was watching that go on. It was, it was pretty crazy. Was it first person or was it like you were watching?

No, it's like you're watching, it's like right in front of you and you're watching like old film. You can see yourself. Yeah. So I'm seeing myself and whoever's with me, through it. And then it was like if you wanted to stay on a certain memory and be like, okay, I want to dive into this and see what you could do that. But it was it was almost like, like if I didn't want to, I was like, oh, I don't need to see that. I could just scroll through my, you know, to the next film. It was, it was crazy. Wow. And then each the film that I was seeing, which was normally, and I didn't think about this

all afterwards, it all had burnt marks. Like, like it had been singed around the end of the film. And I think that was, you know, because part of the intentions, you know, because we threw him the fire and it was like showing me, you know, this is what you wanted to get out of this and this is why we're showing you this. So it's, it's, you know, the way they do it, it's not,

and that's, you know, I think I think people, certain people are like, oh, I don't know about that. They treat that medicine with such reverence, and they do it in such a professional manner. I mean, that's how guys are getting a lot out of it. It's not, guys aren't just going down there to take this and be like, oh, I'm tripping out. It's done for a certain purpose, you know, to help guys heal. And then you, after you take that, you do another drug called 5MEO DMT, which is a, which

is actually pretty crazy. It's poison from a toad. So they have you smoke that. And that is supposed, they call it the handshake. So when you do the IBegame, it pretty much shows you everything that you want to get treated or worked on. Right. So you come out of that like, okay, I just got shown all this stuff and you're trying to process it. Then you when you do the 5AMU DMT, it's like a hands, like you're like, oh my gosh, okay, now I understand. You know, it sort of like releases everything. And I got out of that, like I had a lot of obviously, you know, anger and, you know, I was

holding on to, you know, even the guys that these accusers, you know, that was, you know, I was angry about that. And, you know, it's one thing, just, you know, I was like, I forgive, you know, some of those guys. But, you know, the human nature in me, I was still holding on to some stuff. And it just, it gave me the realization, like I came out of it and I'm like, you know what? Like, there's no reason to be like me being angry at those dudes or like, you know, had this hate. Like all that's doing is hurting me, right? Like, those dudes, I mean, they proved exactly what they were, you know, I had called them cowards on deployment because they had acted like it.

And I think they proved to the world exactly what they were. And I've been asked, like, oh, if you saw one of them, what would you do? And I'm like, there's nothing worse that can be done to those guys than what they did to themselves. So this treatment put you in peace with all that shit? I would say like not, and I'm not gonna say like 100% because if I, depending on what mood I'm in,

and if the sound was brought up, I might start getting a little irritated by it, but it gave me the tools to realize that's happening and be like, you know what, that none of that matters. So when you said you took the second drug and it just released everything, it released what, like the emotion or it just made sense or it's hard to explain. So when you take that, the five MEO DMT, you inhale it in for I think 10 seconds, and hold it for 10 and let it out.

And you, they have you on a bed, and you literally fall back into the bed. But after you take the drug, it's, you don't feel like you don't hit the bed. You just keep falling and you're just going. It's a pretty scary feeling, but they prep you beforehand. I'm like, hey, just trust it. Don't try not to fight it.

They tell you just to let go. I did exactly that. I just let go and you keep falling, but eventually it brings you to this place where it's hard to explain. Like I saw, it was like these pink and blue hues and it was just like you feel nothing but love. Like it's like the most intense love you can feel.

And you're, it's in the way I can explain it because I'm a believer. And I believe in God and Christ like I feel like it brings you closer to God and Christ like you feel like his love and just how much he loves you and everybody else. And you're just like it just helped me come to utilization like dude, all this baggage and all this crap that I'm holding on to or that's bothering me like none of that matters like it's fine, you know, like You're gonna be okay and you have all these people that love you like I have my wife my kids, you know On my teammates my friends like you have all of this so why are you focused on Everything else like be appreciative of everything that you have in front of you. And so that's what it, that's what it did for me, you know, and

I think it for it, for each different person, it does something different, depending on what your intentions are going into it. That's fucking amazing. Yeah, it's, it was, it was a game changer. And then I went to, after that, I was good. And then I went to another retreat, which is almost a similar feeling, but no drugs or anything. It was called operational restored warrior. They take you up to a mountain in Colorado. There's probably, and they don't tell you anything about it before you go.

They're just, again, they're just trusted. So I went up there for four days and you are pretty much at this, you're at a ranch. It's like pretty desolate, nothing around. And it's all very spiritual based. And they, they, you know they have you go over everything. It's all veterans who are not doing too hot. I mean, I felt when I went there, I was like, dude, I'm doing pretty decent compared to

some of these guys I'm doing with. But they pretty much heal guys there spiritually. And it's not what like, they're not like, oh Jesus God is what you know, it's very, it's based around you know God and Jesus, but it's almost like you're in a spiritual battle constantly. And that's like they explain to you the negativity that we have or especially with us when we get out and we feel like these voices in your head that are telling you to get pissed off at certain things. Like that's all whether you wanna call it the devil

or like he's trying to get in your head to he wants you to be in this negative space. Like that's where he wants you and then they give you the tools to be like, you know, that's not where I'm supposed to be. Better than that. And they give you the tools to fight back against that. And, you know, it was, it did a lot. I mean, that was a big, big thing for me too. I came out of there feeling a lot better. And then my wife actually did one for, they do one for a female vets as well and then spouses. So Andrea went just recently and she came

back and the same thing. She was like, it was amazing. Mom, so that was really cool. Do you think it has to do a lot with just checking out? I mean, I'm assuming there's no phones, there's no fucking social media attacks, phone calls, anything from the outside world, which is you and nature that got created without any of those. Oh, that definitely has a lot to do with it. I mean, it's the same thing with the Ive again, too. They take everything away from you, so you have not, like, there's no distractions at all. And I think, I mean, that's both those treatments, that's sort of the hard thing to overcome because you, at the end of them, everybody's feeling like,

I feel awesome, you know, I'm ready to go back into the world and start crushing it. But I think the reality is you've got to know, like, hey, you're going back to pretty much what America, like, they're not America, but you're going back to the world, back to social media, back to, you know, the news, back to all the negative information that's just constantly being pushed at us. And I think you just got to know before you do that, like, hey, you know, these things are out there. And there's some, there's stuff every day that's going to try and take you down. Let's try and get you in a negative mindset. And you just got to be self-aware to be like, okay, I shouldn't be watching this or I shouldn't be reading these comments.

It's not doing anything for me. And, you know, I think that's, that's always going to be a struggle to try and, you know, to fight against, but as long as you, I think, as long as you're self-aware, and you have the tools to be like, okay, this shouldn't be bothering me, or I'm not going to let this bother me right now. That's what those places give you. And I think, I mean, that's, I think a little help tons of guys, if, you know, I think that's what guys should be going through. You know, I'm all about the plant medicine, especially as you know, the VA and the big pharma,

that's, I won't even fucking go to the VA. They just wanna shove pills down your throat and be like, oh, then of course, once that pill starts having bad effects, they just add more pills on to fight those effects. And before you know it, you know, be like, oh, then of course, once that pill starts having bad effects, they just add more pills on to fight those effects and before you know What you know guys are on like 15 different medications? Then they wonder why guys are going their brains out, you know, they're like, oh It's like dude because all that shit. It's all one big money-making process for them

yeah, yeah, and You know these plant medicine if it fits as like invasive as people want to think it is or not invasive, but sort of out of the ordinary. And just, but if it's getting guys off pills, off alcohol, off, you know, helping them out, I'm all about it. I mean, I've seen the positive effects of it on hundreds of guys. So I know it's working. of it on hundreds of guys. So I know it's working. You know, back to the VA, I mean, I hate to go down a negative or we're trying to be positive here, but you know, it just fucking makes sense for them to over Medicaid because the minute a veteran drops dead, guess what? That's more money in USG's fucking bank account. And so it is not

in their best interest to give veterans the care that they fucking need. Nor does, you know, sorry, but I don't think the majority of America gives a fuck, you know, we've defy A's been fucked up forever. Yeah. It will always be fucked up. It's never, it's never, you know, a top discussion in politics. And so I fucking refused to go. Yeah, I went there when I got out,

I went and checked into the one near me, just to register and I'll tell you what, the people that work there, the lady I talked to, nothing against her. I don't like, she's like, super nice and was like, okay, and she, it was a crazy part is a, when she started going through my record, and she stopped and was just like, they're not used to dealing with soft individuals at all. And she was like, oh my gosh, like, I haven't seen something like this in a long time.

And I'm like, to me, I'm like, well, it's me and all my friends are just, you know, that's all where you used to be in a round. So you're like, there's nothing all out of the ordinary. But they don't know how to treat individuals that come out of the soft community. And like what they've seen, or like what they've dealt with. And the first thing they do is just like, oh, take these, you must be depressed. Take these antidepressants. They're like, because you tell them like, well, how you're feeling or like what symptoms.

And it's, you know, it's all because of TBI or stuff like that, but they automatically start treating it for, oh, you must be depressed or you must have this. And that's when I start putting you on these medications. You know, they tried to give me, give me some and I was like, no, I don't want any pills. And they almost, in a way, try and force you like, why don't you want these pills? Like, you should be taking them. You should be on this. I mean, I had to, they were calling me a couple of times. Like, do you want them? Do you want us to send you them? And I'm like, no. No. No. You know, why are you them? Do you want us to send you them? And I'm like, no. No.

Why are you trying to push this on me? And then when they ask you what you're doing, so she was like, what are you doing? If you're not taking pills, what are you doing to help? And I'm like, you know, plant medicine. I was like, I'll smoke some weed, you know, something. And they're completely against all that, you know? they're like, oh, well, you know, that's, uh, but if you're, if you're doing that, then we can't help you. Yeah.

I'm like, okay, well, then that's the why I'm doing it. So you, yeah, I'm telling you, this is helping me and you're fucking telling me it's not helping me and you want to give me, yeah, it's, it's backwards, you know. But yeah, I mean, I'm glad and I think that's why these foundations like Seal Future Foundation, the AV SEALs fund, like just, well, these are the ones that I know because it's coming from the SEAL community. I mean, they have really taken an interest in forming alliance to help, because they're seeing that, you know, guys aren't getting the help they need when they get out. And so that's their main mission is to help guys when they get out and get them back on their feet mentally.

Who? What's the name of that organization? It's the Navy Seal Foundation or not Navy Seal Foundation. Seal Future Foundation. Seal Future Foundation. Yeah, it's run by Johnny Wilson. Okay. Awesome guy.

I want to buzz with him. He's, that's his mission in life is to help guys when they get out and to get them back on their feet mentally and physically and spiritually. And so I mean, I think he started off that foundation to help get guys jobs when they get out, but what he found out is, I mean, you can take, you know, the best operator. And when he gets out, I mean, like, get him a job at Golden Sachs or something, you know, he's still not going to be doing it. You know, nothing, you have to treat, you know, you have to fix yourself before you can start moving on.

Yeah. That's what they're finding out. So it's good. You said you smoke weed sometimes. Yeah. How much does that help? It helps big time. Like, you know, if it's, if I start feeling anxiety, and it's crazy, like the little things that'll set me off or like get my anxiety going, which it's almost frustrating to where I'm like, do why am I feeling like this over, you know, this little thing right now,

like it's working me up. It'll help me, you know, just bring me back down to level. I'd be like, everything's good, you know, and I don't, you know, you're not smoking it. I think there's a big misconception on the whole, you know, marijuana and they've done so much Ford progress on that now. Like they have certain things where you can take it and you're not high. You're not like, oh, you know, but you're just calm and relaxed. And it's, you know, just helps you sort of, you know, even out. Yeah. So yeah, I'm all about it. I'd say the same thing, man. When I started, when I used to live in Florida, and it was legal there, I, it took my doctor

forever, my doctor outside of the VA to talk me into doing it. And, you know, I was like, I'm not doing this shit. This is, you know, I need to fucking stay on task and And then and then I finally tried it and it was like fucking life change for me It's funny like I didn't You know, I started doing it like Andrea. She knew, you know, that I was gonna try it But that's how I knew that it was helping Because she was like,

I noticed a difference like you're more chill, you know, I'm like good than it's working. Yeah, I wish, you know, I'm a conservative, I don't, whatever, but that's one thing I can't fucking stand about, you know, the right side is there're so anti marijuana. And it's like if you fucking assholes would come out of Washington and actually do some research and talk to some of the guys that are doing this and how it's helping them, maybe you would change your fucking mind.

I think yeah, and there's also a big push against it because big farm runs everything. And that's what I don't want to legalize it. They know it'll get people off pills. Yeah. Yeah. Anyways, but, uh, man, it sounds like you were extremely proactive coming out, uh, and getting yourself up to par before, not that you didn't hit a fucking all-time well when you were in prison, but I mean,

the fact that you hit the ground run, and it was like, all right, that's done. I mean, did Andrew push you to start going to these programs? Oh, yeah. She pretty much put the orders down right when I got out, like, you're not doing anything this year. Like I don't, because I, I was already like, all right, what am I going to do next? Like get a job, do you know, whatever. I was going to plan on contracting.

I mean, that's, that was my next go to before like all that mess happened, I was already on my way to, you know, do what you have done. And that was a no-go now because obviously my face has been plastered everywhere. So she was just like, that's it, like you need to chill out. And she knew it was going to be rough for me, you know. She was like, I'll be chewing the carpet after a month of being in the house, which did happen. But we were both on board with like, all right, let's just get treatments done this year. Let's focus on fixing you. And then we can move on to 2021 and be more like what are we going to do, of our ventures? And I'm glad, you know, I'm glad I did it. You know, it was stubborn at times, for sure.

Give her a hard time about it. But, uh, you know, I'll tell you what, man, and like I said before, it was from listening to podcasts, like yours or other guys, when the guys come on and start talking about their issues, like, it gave me, it was almost like I reccured it before I got out. I was like, okay, this is what I should be looking out for. Eventually, I start feeling that way or have the same issues as what these guys are talking about. So I knew right then, I was like, okay, those guys that talked about the dark roads, they

went all the way down to where they had a gun in their mouth. I'm like, I don't want to get to that point. You know, like I could, and it's very easy. Just like I could go to that point real quick if I just, like keep on this, and mindset and just be pissed off. And then, you know, I don't want, you know, I have, look at my kids and my wife and my,

they don't deserve that. They put up with, you know, 20 years of service, me being gone all the time. And, you know, losing friends who are like my kids' uncles, like, you know, watching them get put in the ground, like they've been through enough to where I'm like, they don't need to deal with me when I get out and do my, all the problems that now are happening.

So I was like, I need to fix myself quick, just so I can be a good husband and father and move on. Fuck, man, it looks like it's working. I mean, so far it's going all right. You know, shit, I mean, but it doesn't end. And that's the, I think that's the other thing is like the problems, they don't go away. It's not like you're fixed and our job has consequences and those will be with you for the rest

of your life. But just as long as you find tools how how to deal with them. You know, but they're, they're never going to go away. Yeah. But as long as you can find ways to deal with them and get through it, I think that's, that's the key. Yeah. You know, being with everything you've been through and just the fact that you said, you know, that the fucking job has lifelong consequences. that you said, the fucking job has lifelong consequences.

You have a son who obviously really, really loves his dad and looks up to you a lot. It was just really cool to see. And we kind of talked a little bit and it sounds like he either wants to join the military and kind of go down the path that his dad did or go to space. Yeah. Would you want Ryan joining the military and going down your path?

Yeah, if that's the, I mean, it's not what I want, but if that's what he wanted, I'd be behind him 100%. You know, I treated like my dad treated with me. Like he was never, you know, pushed me to join. But my family has a very deep, like everybody, most of the males have served in the military. And usually they're a careerist. So I think, you know, I ended up joining just, it was whether genetics or whatever like

I just pushed myself towards that path without my dad or anybody. I actually went and did it without telling anyone. With Ryan, you know, he wants to be a seal. That's all he's grown up with since he was a baby, he's been, he hung out of the teams as a child nonstop. I would take him into work all the time. He loved being around the guys. He has definitely definite attitude for it.

Unfortunately. But yeah, he, if he wanted to do that, I'd be behind him. You know, and I told people this, like, you know, I know the consequences of the job, and I'm hoping, you know, maybe by the time he joins, they'll have it figured out, or they can mitigate some of the stuff that we went through, just as far as like the all the blasts you take turn training and all that. But then again, I don't think there's a there's a way around a lot of that. Yeah.

Yeah, I'd be 100% behind him. And if that's what he wanted, I'd rather him go to space though for sure. That's keep him on the astronaut path. But yeah, I have nothing against kids. I mean, I do, I wouldn't give back my 20 years for nothing, you know, despite the last two years, it's like I said before, that was just a few bad, you know, bad actors and the whole big scheme of the military. So, you know, I'm proud of my service. I'm glad I did it. I've got to be around what I think are the greatest individuals I'll ever be at meet on this earth. Just guys that are there's something to be said like to be around guys like that that just you're constantly striving

to be better. You're constantly striving to be as good as a guy next to you. And whether you know or not, he's doing the same thing. He's trying to strive to be as good as you and you're constantly, I mean, it's hard to find that anywhere else. No. It's hard to find anybody that'll just do their fucking job. Exactly. A little bit of a top. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So I mean, it's a... Yeah, the answer question. Yeah.

I have no problems with it joining at all. Right on, man. So what are you doing now? Tell us about the pipe header foundation and how it started where it's at, where it's going. Yep. So we have the, so right now, you know, the book is finished, it's a DOD review. And then the big project we've been working on all year

is the PipePitter Foundation. We got that up and running in April and May. And it was been slow going due to the the vid this year but we decided to start it pretty much near the end. I mean we had talked about like we got to do something because after we saw behind this curtain we didn't know existed which was the you know military justice system if you want to call it that. I saw a bunch of guys when I was locked up who shouldn't be there. Granted, there are guys that belong in there for sure, but there's a

a number of dudes. I mean, a lot larger than people would like to hear about that, just got caught up in the system and are being unjustly incarcerated due to the corruptness of how the system entrapes people. And it's not talked about, you know, it's sort of hidden. Nobody really knows about it. So when I was going through and when I was actually locked up, you know, we came to realization like, okay, this, this happened to us, you know, for a reason. Like we didn't understand what at first until we started seeing, I started seeing other people, these kids in my position that don't have any help. They didn't have the help that I

had. They didn't have an injury Gallagher or Sean Gallagher, my brother, to get behind them or a family to get behind them and fight them. A lot of people don't have that. They're not as lucky or as blessed. And so we're like, you know, we need to, we need to be that for the, you know, these people. So that's the purpose of the foundation is we pretty much raise money and then people can go to our site and fill out a grant application and we tell them to be as thorough as possible about their case, about what they're going through. And I have a awesome board members. I have, you know,

Awesome board board members. I have you know, Rob O'Donnell's a prior law enforcement. Awesome. Mark New Casey's on there. One of my lawyers. I have another team guy on there. Carl Higby, Joni Marquez, and Tommy who worked for Congressman Duncan Hunter. And as a board, we review each case. Once a month, we take all the cases review them and then we you know decide Jay or Nay like we're gonna help these people and once we were like yep we'll do it then we'll we end up you know talking to the individual and seeing what they need and

what we provide is if they need money for their legal defense, you know, fight that, or we know how stressful it is going through something like that. So we provide emergency relief funds for their family, because when you're going through a stressful situation like that, you know, your pain for lawyers, you're also, you know, it causes all this undue stress in the family. So we sort of try and take some of that away, and just they can get through it. And then we also will do advocacy if they want it, you know, some people obviously like, no, I don't want my name anymore. Like, okay, you know, but if people want to be advocated for and like, hey, do you want, do you want us to help get the word out about what's going on with you then we'll do that for them as well

And then we you know we help active duty long-forcement and first responders Shit man. How long have you been doing that? We so we got it our nonprofit approved in like April or May and we've pretty much been helping guys and girls probably for three months now. Holy shit. So we're, are you, how's funding so far? It's been rough, obviously, due to this year, you know, doing some fundraising, but, you

know, it comes in every once in a while. Obviously because of the COVID, you can't go do a lot of fundraising, stuff like that, but we put out mailers and the people are generous, and just the patriots, those countries will donate whatever they can, and every little bit helps. And that money is going directly, I mean, we're helping people out now. So once we see that money, it's going to a family or a service member or an officer right away to help them out. Yeah, we're hoping next year, you know, we'll start being able to build more of a base of funds and start being able to help more people.

That's solid, man. Yeah, it's good. And that's, dude, that's super gratifying. You know, getting the nonprofit started and all that. I had nothing to do with. That was a lot of administrative shit that I can't even handle. So like Andrea, like Andrea and the board, we have Deena Cruden, who's also the executive director.

She's amazing. They pretty much got everything going. Got everything approved. And then once we started actually helping people and having guys call me and being like, dude, I just got whatever $1, whatever thousand dollar grant from you guys. And you have no idea like how much I needed that at this time, like that right there.

I'm like, dude, that's, that's why we're doing this. That's awesome. So it's, yeah, it's good. It's, and it gives us a purpose, you know, it gives me a purpose, which is, I think one of the number one things is hard to find when, once you get out and is trying to find another purpose to like how you can serve. Yeah.

Luckily, we have this. So do you have any idea how many of you guys are out there that are in the middle of a situation like yours? There's off the top of my head right now, I can, you know, I can come up with like eight. Eight. And how do you decipher whether, because potentially you could be, if you made a wrong decision, you could be helping somebody that, you know, is an actual fucking criminal. So, how do you, I mean, you said your lawyer's on there.

Yeah, how do you kind of determine? So that's why we ask people when they fill out the grant to be as thorough as possible, like with everything, and if they fill out a grant, there's, you know, we'll look through it pretty, you know, in detail, and we're like, all right, there's some information missing here, and we'll reach out back and like, hey, you know, we'll look through it pretty in detail. And I'm like, all right, there's some information missing here and we'll reach out back and like, hey, you know, can you fill out some more just because

so we can get sort of an idea. Most of the time, you know, you can tell when someone's getting screwed or someone's getting fucked like, and there is always that chance, you know, you're like, okay, we're going to help this person and maybe they are guilty. But, you know, if we're looking at a person's case, and this is just my, from my point of view, when I'm looking at it, I look at how they're being treated through the process. And if I, you know, start seeing the same things that

was done to me, what I've seen done to other guys. And just the, in the unjust way they do things. I'm like, right away, I'm like, okay, guilty or not guilty, this person's not getting due process. At all. Like, he hasn't even, he or she hasn't even had a chance to like speak out or say their side, that they're just automatically guilty

until proven innocent. You're helping them get the right to a free trial. Yeah, I'm helping them get, and that's the thing, like we, you know, if it ends up being like, okay, we help this person, they go to trial and they're found guilty. Well, okay, you know, but I did my due diligence to help that person and like take the stress off them and their family until that point, you know You know, I'm not a jury member. We're not that's we're not there to like say whether you're guilt or not guilty We're just here to help you through the process and just take as much stress off. He was possible and You know help you actually the only rights that you have during a situation like that are the ones that you can afford

Yeah service members and law enforcement don't make enough money to buy, you know, or hire good attorneys. So that's where we come in. I'm like, hey, we'll help you fund so you can have have a good attorney and actually have a fighting chance. That's fucking awesome, dude. Yeah, it's it a definitely a gap that's missing in, you know, helping or service. I'm glad that we're feeling it. Yeah, I mean, I don't, you know, had it not been for what you went through. I mean, I don't think anybody would know.

No, you know, and that's the other reason we started it to, you know, the amount of people that got behind myself and my family during my little thing, the patriots that got behind us. And I mean, I had people reach not, left and right, like, we're supporting you, whatever we can do. I don't know any of these people.

These have all over the country. I mean, that right there, I'm like, we have to give back. You know, we, we got all this support from all these people, we have to give something back. I mean, we can't just like, okay, yeah, we're done. Like, thanks. It's like, now that's how it works. You pay it forward, you know? So like, I feel, I almost feel like it's our duty to be, to be doing this. Yeah. So on top of the nonprofit, what, what do you see yourself doing in the next five years and what do you hope and do accomplish?

So I recently, I think it was about a month and a half ago, two months ago, I went out with TSI, the shooting institute, Just volunteer to come along and help teach. They did a trip where they went and taught some SWAT guys and I think some I Air Force guys, I'm in Texas. So I tagged along on that, just see how I would like it or see how it would feel. And I loved teaching, I loved teaching those guys.

Tactics, I just felt like I was at home, you know again doing it So I think I'm I'm looking to do something like that next year I want to do it locally where I live and just be able to instruct and shooting and Hopefully tactics, you know, if I can get a killhouse nearby Do some training like that. That's in the embassy stages right now, but that's what I plan on hopefully doing next year. And I also, I hooked up with a company, precision tactical.

They make, you know, all sorts of firearms. And they just awesome individuals, and and they built so they built a gun Around me they let me pick out all the parts, you know, just exactly how I would want to how I'd want to have it and they We're gonna be selling those here soon So we'll see how that goes right on yeah, you got a picture of it Yeah, I do who will post it up top. I appreciate that. Yeah, man. Yeah well Good luck with teaching there is definitely no shortage of people wanting tactical training with the current state of the country right now

I can fucking guarantee you that shit. I'll be picking your brain for sure. So but Well, man, I kind of want to wrap this thing up. It's been a long podcast and it has been a fucking honor having you said across from me and, and, and share your experience and everything. And you've already answered this, but I want to properly ask you, um, even though I already know the answer, but with all the shit that you've been through and the what seemed to be the

entire community trying to ruin your very existence for doing what America asked you to do, would you fucking do it all over again? In a heartbeat. Yeah, I love that job. That was it's hard to... That's all I ever wanted to do. Once I got into the teams, that was it, man. I loved every bit of it, and I don't have...

You say the entire community... It's not the entire community, it wasn't against me. It was just some individuals in the command, like the guys themselves, man, like, you know, they, I knew most of them had my back, you know, they couldn't come out and say it right, right then, but I've had enough phone calls from guys, you know, congratulating me and just that they were supporting me the whole time. And, you know, the teams are made up from the enlisted. The enlisted is what makes the teams. The guys, the shooters, you know, in the platoons, not the headshed,

not the guys in charge of Warcom, you know, they might make the decisions, but they'll never be able to change how the culture, they can try as much as they want, but team guys are team guys, and as long as we have them in the platoons, it'll stay similar to why you and I joined. Yeah, well, I just wanna say, man, once again, it's been a fucking honor having you here,

and I can't fucking imagine what that felt like to go through all that and it's just really awesome to see where you're at now and see you doing well and helping the next guys, helping the next generation coming out and just a solid motherfucker, dude. Dave, I appreciate it. You are too, man. I'm glad I came out here. It's an honor to be out here. And yeah, your podcast is exceptional. And I'm glad I got to be able to.

Thank you. The Bullwork podcast focuses on political analysis and reporting without partisan loyalties. Real sense of day jubu sprinkled on our PTSD. So things are going well, I guess. Every Monday through Friday, Charlie Sykes speaks with guests about the latest stories from inside Washington and around the world. You document in a very compelling way. All of the positive things have come out of this,

but it also feels like we have this massive hangover. No shouting or grandstanding. Principles over partisanship. The Bullwork Podcast. Wherever you listen.