Small Town Murder - #435 - Laughing, Torture & Lies - Gans, Oklahoma

Episode Date: November 2, 2023

This week, in Gans , Oklahoma, a woman, with a strange past, decides to take matters into her own hands when she believes that her son's ex girlfriend is setting him up to be busted by the cops, or even killed, so a series of events is set in motion that includes as bad as a murder as you can imagine. Torture, mixed laughing, and unspeakable cruelty makes up the basis of this ever so cold blooded murder!!Along the way, we find out that festivals can be very dangerous, that when someone tells you not to get in a car, maybe you should listen to them, and that you shouldn't trust your ex to keep your murder secrets!! Hosted by James Pietragallo and Jimmie WhismanNew episodes every Thursday!Donate at: patreon.com/crimeinsports or go to paypal.com and use our email: [e-mail] to shutupandgivememurder.com for all things Small Town Murder & Crime In Sports!Follow us on...twitter.com/@murdersmallfacebook.com/smalltownpodinstagram.com/smalltownmurderAlso, check out James & Jimmie's other show, Crime In Sports! On Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Amazon Music, Wondery, Wondery+, Stitcher, or wherever you listen to podcasts!See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

You're listening early and ad-free on Wondery Plus. What if you married the love of your life and then stood by them as they developed 21 new identities? What would you do? This Is Actually Happening is a weekly podcast that features extraordinary true stories of life-changing events told by the people who lived them. Listen to the newest season of This Is Actually Happening on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. This week in Gans, Oklahoma, it's a family affair when a threatening quickly turns into a kidnapping, which then turns into a very cruel torture and murder session with very unlikely participants.

Welcome to Small Town Murder. Yay! Oh, wow, Jimmy jumping in there. Thank you very much for joining us. My name is James Petrigallo. I'm here with my co-host. I'm Jimmy Wissman. Very excited, Jimmy, today. Jumping the yay, and I love it.

I love the enthusiasm, and I understand why, because we have a wild story for you today. This is like a blow-by-blow of a terrible, terrible, just an awful group of people. This is like a Coen Brothers movie, these people. It's disturbing. It's really... I always mix those guys up with the Farrelly brothers. Yeah, very different movies.

I mean, Raising Arizona, funny. Stuck on me. Funny, but different funnies. Stuck on you, too? I don't know. Imagine if the Farrelly brothers made Blood Simple or Fargo, though. That would be...

Much different movie. Now we're talking something very weird that I don't know if I want to see but anyway thanks again for joining us you definitely definitely want to get if you have not done it yet head over to shut up and give me murder.com slash virtual live and get your tickets to the virtual live show it's october 26th so if you're listening to this early it's still it's coming out you're it's available for a week yeah after that so you can order it at any time you can watch it a hundred times anywhere on earth with an internet connection i was gonna say wi-fi but i guess if you wanted to go old school and plug that motherfucker plug it right to the wall you can do that too i don't know whatever i don't

know how that setup works anymore but do it and come see us it's our halloween special we have everything a weird show and weird story and costumes and the whole deal so definitely do that shut up and give me murder.com slash virtual live and as well you want to head over there to shut up and give me murder.com get tickets to december the 2nd oh boy in dallas big show in dallas we cannot wait come out there represent yourselves well i guess southwest they say texas is always southwest but it's pretty south central it's pretty well right in the fucking middle in the middle that's it's always i think just because it's deserty and it takes up like a third of that area anywhere that looks like arizona they say southwest i think there's a lot

of dust it's uh pretty southwest dusty here right southwesty here, right? Southwest. We're going southwest. Your eyes are squinted. Mine are too. Southwest. Sunny. Unforgiving. Definitely. Definitely do that. You also definitely certainly want Patreon.

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And then in addition to that, new episodes every other week, including this week, which you're going to get is for Crime and Sports, which you have access to. We're going to talk about another part of

Athletes Who Pay for Sex. We did that part of the series a few months ago. We're going to get is for crime and sports which you have access to we're going to talk about it's another part of athletes who pay for sex we did that as part of the series a few months ago we're going to continue it and they're very funny guys getting caught for that then for small town murder we're going to go back a few weeks to manhattan montana and that serial killer the guy who was the first fbi profile and everything else the david meyerhofer yeah we're going to delve deep into his confession his words about it. He spilled his guts completely, said what he did, and then went and hung himself. So there you go. Don't worry, I'll take care of it.

That's it. So we'll talk all about that. Patreon.com slash Crime and Sports is where you get all that. And you should listen to Crime and Sports as well anyway. And also your stupid opinions. Oh, shit. Which is absolutely hilarious. Yeah.

Not to toot our own horns, but toot, goddamn toot. It's funny. Beep, beep. So check it out. Do that. And keep coming back and seeing us. Quick disclaimer. Yeah?

This is a comedy show. We're comedians. Terrible murder is going to happen. Oh, yeah. And also jokes are going to happen. Absolutely. But we're going to do it tastefully. That's how you do it.

Yeah. We go out of our way not to make fun of the victims yeah or the victims families why james because we're assholes but we're not scumbags that's how it works so if you think true crime and comedy though should never ever go together you might not like the show yeah you might though that's the thing you don't know about it but either way no complaining afterwards because we warned you yeah that said everybody i think it's time sure to sit back clear the old lungs and let's all shout shut up and give me murder let's do this how about that for everybody that bitches that were never on time yeah we did that on purpose because normally we just don't care we have fun with it

and the other thing is there's a bunch of other people out there that do that's what we do you're never gonna be on time with both of us we do it yeah we kind of we a long time ago we were like let's do it like jazz where we're just like you will go free form and you never know how it comes out this time we're like we're gonna do it together and people can stop talking. So there you go, everybody. So that said, let's get into this. Let's go on a trip, everybody, to Oklahoma. Oh, boy. And this is far eastern Oklahoma, right near Arkansas.

Does it touch it? Yeah, Oklahoma and Arkansas abut each other here. Yikes. And that's quite the gauntlet to run. That's a bizarre Mary. When you drive the 40, that's where you go. You go from Arkansas, through Oklahoma, then through the panhandle of Texas. It's that close. It's right there. All the stuff to do here, a lot of it's in Arkansas. People will go out to dinner and let's go to Arkansas for dinner. This is about two and a half hours to Oklahoma City, so way far away. An hour and a half to Tulsa, and two hours to McLeod, which was our last Oklahoma episode,

which was the atomic wedgie killer. Oh, jeez. Which no one can forget that episode. I had no idea you could die like that. He died from an atomic wedgie. This is in Sequoia County, area code 539. The motto here, small small town yeah big great people oh i really wanted to be small people great town this is just a town of little people that would be amazing they're king small people great town that's what i would say

anytime i'm in a town of small people there's a thing when you come into town that says you can't be. You must be this high. You can't be this high to enter this town. Only shorter. That would have been very interesting. A lot of tilt-a-whirl signs all over the place. Unfortunately, that's not the town. So it was originally within the little history, the Sequoia District of the Cherokee Nation.

At this point, though, it was just a dispersed rural area. It still is. within the little history, the Sequoia district of the Cherokee nation. The, uh, then at this point though, it was just a dispersed rural area. It still is. There's nothing here. That's the other thing. But back then it was called,

Oh boy. This is the best town name ever. Jacktown. Yeah. Jerk it. Bill. Yeah. Yanktown.

Yeah. Spankberg USA. Tugsville. Let's get. Yeah. Spankberg, USA. Tugsville. Let's get after it. Holy shit. Then it became known as GAN, G-A-N-N. Now it's G-A-N-S, but then it was G-A-N-N after the brothers who were Charlie, Tom, and Swimmer. First name Swimmer.

A grown man named Swimmer. Swimmer GAN. Swimmer GAN. That was a real person that existed in time gross then they made the town dad swimmer this one's a swimmer here that's right i had a lot of whiskey in me didn't think i could put one in her but i had a couple of swimmers in me and one of of them got through. Somebody told me to name him after myself. So I just named him after my jizz. I named him after the one that got through. The one that busted through the line for a 20-yard pickup.

How can you do that to your kid? Charlie Swimmer and Tom Gann. Unbelievable. And then it became Gann's for some reason. I guess there was two places named Gann. Okay. This happens so often. They never did any checking.

Yeah. There had to be a book back then that said all the town post offices. There should have been a list. Oh, there's already one of those. No one bothered. They just called the town whatever they felt like. So then they decided to switch it there. The post office established in 1896 was renamed.

Then it was called Gann's. So that's how that happened. The growth in the early 19th century, agriculture. Yeah. That's it. In Oklahoma. They're growing shit there. And yeah, this was till the Dust Bowl.

Right. They grew shit. And then the wheat market got huge and everyone would speculate on wheat. And they were selling off everything to wheat. And then they had no ground cover. There's nothing else. And then the dust blew and that was what happened there and that's how you create an ecological disaster oh shit we ruined everything for like a long time as history has shown that

was bad stuff yeah so uh either way uh the it was big through there and the railroad came through so they could take all their shit out of there in, the population stood at a stout 136 people. Jesus. Mm-hmm. So that's something. In 1931? 1900. Oh, okay.

Yeah. 136. Wow. But by 1911, it's booming. They got a bank, a couple of cotton gins. Yeah. A sawmill. Yeah.

Six general stores. Oh, there's a gristmill around here somewhere. Three doctors, two drugstores, two blacksmiths, and a restaurant. And how many people? 136. For three doctors? 1911, I think they had a few more than 136, but not a ton more here. Three doctors.

They had a little newspaper there and all that kind of thing. By 1957, in January, a terrible, devastating tornado came through, which is going to happen every once in a while there that's the thing anything you're doing in oklahoma is temporary it's all temporary at some point it's all coming down and you know it we don't know when it wasn't around to ride that tornado out of town it's happening and jj watt's not going to come save you it's going to be a problem so they came through it killed eight people injured 11 and inflicted $100,000 worth of damage, which in 1957 is a lot of money. So by 1980, the population was up a lot, Jimmy. 346 now.

Yeah. 80 years to get 200 people? That's right. By 1990, the school district had 250 people in it. Shit. Oh, that's what I'm saying here. Now, one guy is from here, famous person, Bryant Big Country Reeves. Is that right?

As you might remember from being a huge disappointment in the NBA, just a big. Big Country was from here. Big white center with a flat top there. Yeah, for the Grizzlies. Did he play for Utah, too? He might have. He bounced around. He was a big man that bounced around at the end there.

But he and Greg Ostertag oftentimes, I mix them up. Yeah, he's the lighter-haired version of Greg Ostertag there. I think he was better big country than Ostertag. He was tough, man. He could score a little bit. He was tough as shit. Ostertag could not score for shit. He was awful.

He was a big stiff. So he had gone to Oklahoma State University. He made a lot of money he donated a city hall building in 2002 after he retired and returned to live in gans get the fuck out of here back to this little town and said i'll give you all a building be nice to me now he's a king there then oh he is the well jesus christ think about it everyone there is what under four foot eight and then he's 7'2", number one. So, I mean, they're going to look up to him anyway.

And his name was Bryant with a T. What a weird name. Yeah, like Bryant Gumbel. Right. Bizarre. By 2000, a hearty 208 people here, and everybody would commute out of here because there's really nowhere to work in town. And they had a kindergarten through high school school they should just make the nba

yeah why i mean jesus be seven foot one what's wrong with you lazy bastards grow lazy i tell my kid all the time to grow and he just sits there he just don't do it stubborn ass stretch out boy come on let's. And my son never listened to me. So reviews of this town. There's only one review because there's really nobody here. And I'm sure this is one where you pass through and go, is that a town? Does it say All Hail Bryant Reeves? They're naming it Reevesville after this.

So five stars is the one review. Everyone know each other. Oh, boy. Everyone is vert friendly with a t vert oh vert friendly and ready to help each other out if they are in need there is the correct there they got it they got it they can't get everyone knows each other no they don't understand the plurals and singulars get mixed up sometimes wow and all that sort of thing s is and. And our town is very small. We don't have any restaurants, but it's home to many good people. Okay. So there you go.

If you want a quiet rural existence, this is a good place for you. Or if you make millions of dollars and want to be a king. If you'd like to go out to eat, this is not the place for you. Population right now, 336. Fucking wow. Not a lot. This is the town that everybody forgot. Yeah, it's just this little, you drive by it like it never happened.

Male, few more males than females, which is not normal. It's 52.5% male. That's way out of whack. Median age is 42.2. A little bit old, but that's all right. A little bit older. Not old, but it's our age but you know in our ballpark we are old i mean not like you know yeah holy shit everyone here 73

not gray balls yet no not yet not yet so 17 it's there's a lot of people here single with children so it's i don't know what's going on here race of this town 54.6% white, 1.8% black, 0% Asian, 21% Native American. Oh, that's awesome. It's usually 0.7%. Is there a reservation nearby? Well, it used to be the Cherokee Nation around here. So, anybody hanging around. And this is where Oklahoma has big pockets where there's a lot of Native Americans.

3.3% Hispanic, 17% two or more races. So, people are mixing up there. That's good. Religion of this town, 37% religious. And there's mostly Baptists, which I wouldn't even know that's a. Yeah. But yeah, well, it's right by Arkansas. So that makes sense.

0.0% Jewish here in this Sequoia county in the last election 19.7 percent of the people voted democrat 78.7 percent republican 1.5 percent independent unemployment rates about average in the country median household income a little bit low though it is 48 701 dollars which is a little bit under the national average here cost of living also less than the national average. 100 is regular. Cost of living here is 78. The housing is a 26. Well, it fucking better be.

$140,800 is the median home cost here. I want to see Big Country's house. I think that's the one that's driving it up to that. Everything else, not worth much. But Big Country's house really takes it over the top. So if we've convinced you, you cannot live anywhere else except Gans. Maybe you're retired from the NBA and you'd like to donate a court building or something. Maybe a new post office. Maybe you love waking up to the sound of tornado sirens.

You know what? Let's put up a nice mayor's house just so everyone can see it. We have for you the Gans, Oklahoma real estate report. The average two-bedroom rental here, 790 bucks a month, which is 500 below the national average. That's pretty low. Here's a four-bedroom, three-bath, 1,870-square70 square foot house so you could put some kids in there and have a family 1.5 acres oh a little bit of room to stretch out it's it's a disaster i'm

not gonna lie it looks like if someone was squatting in there you go is that safe i would sleeping outside might be better you'd be worried about The roof is flaking off. Oh, boy. When you see just pieces of the roof all around the house, that's a problem, I feel like. That's an issue. The carpet looks like it is just of the mildew variety. Oh, no. It's a nice mildew. It's stiff. Not stiff.

It looks like if you stepped on it, it might squish. Oh, don't walk around with that. It could be spongy. I don't like it. Not in your socks. I don't think the roof is holding the moisture out. It's a problem here. But it is $89,000 for that house, though. Roof and floor. You might be in business. You know what I mean? Yeah, you put a new roof on it. It might be something. So when you rip that up, maybe there's something nice under there. There might be hardwood. Even concrete. You don't know. Lay some laminate over it. You're fine.

Even concrete. You don't know. Lay some laminate over it, you're fine. Three-bedroom, two-bath, 1,157 square feet. So a little bit smaller, but it's a trailer. Yeah. A really long trailer. Four bedrooms.

That's enormous. It's like a dachshund of a trailer. Like it's a wiener dog trailer. It's huge. It just keeps going and going. Half of the trailer has windows. Okay. And then the other half has no windows it just looks like they

oh ran out done run out of window budget and it just stops halfway through put more metal up there no more windows we ain't having it looks like half of it's like a storage garage or something on the inside though it looks like a like a nice house really you can't even believe you're inside of a weird long trailer with no windows i got a friend with one of those in idaho that you're shocked that it looks so nice it look the kitchen looks like it's in a beautiful house you're like what's happening in here why did you invest this much money in a trailer did i walk into another house what yeah what kind of weird science experiment that i just go through 115 000 for15,000 for that. And then here is a two-bedroom, two-bath, 1,686 square foot. It's a big cabin. Yeah, it's a big cabin. It looks like a piece

of shit on the outside. Looks like it's a little, it's not going well. Yeah, it looks like it's a little shabby. Maybe a mountaineer lives in there or something. But then inside, it's actually kind of nice. It's, again, are really investing a lot it's got a weird rock thing in there oh not terrible we'll say that um it says here beautiful architects custom home is what they call it it's a special to have land on 30 acres of wildlife paradise oh my god 30 acres all to yourself 479 000 bucks for that what's not bad for 30 acres all to yourself. $479,000 for that. What? It's not bad for 30 acres, but you're living in the middle of nowhere, and those acres are just dusty.

The wildlife is, you know, there's a, I don't know what's in there, honestly. In Oklahoma? That close to Arkansas? There's deer and shit. There's crazy shit. Yeah, there's deer. There's all sorts of shit. You're by the woods, I'm sure.

Things to do here. All right. It's Halloween time, so we'll get a couple of... $400,000 is the highest price. $479,000. That's what we got. Holy shit. 30 acres.

That's it. Yeah, big country's not selling his house right now. No, I wouldn't. I'll keep you updated when his house goes on the market, and I'm sure that'll blow us all away. Things to do. It's Halloween. The Wicked Willow Festival.

Wicked Willow. Wicked Willow. Yeah. it's presented by super fun time sequoia county just reminds me and they have a pumpkin patch super fun time super fun time super fun like an asian like an asian buffet there's ones in phoenix like that they're like super number one usa buffet and you're like usa china buffet you're like okay we get it thank you uh they have a pumpkin patch pumpkins for sale yeah photo scenes oh take your pictures with pumpkins everybody a wicked trail ride quote unquote ride if you dare oh so shit jumps out of the woods. Across 17 acres of wicked trails and spooky scenes.

Oh, boy. That's going to be fun. Oh, what a nightmare. Wicked house of horrors. Explore over 1,000 square feet. It's more like a wicked apartment. Wicked two-bedroom apartment of horrors is what that is. The wicked con.

Yeah, I had a small, yeah, that's super wicked townhouse. Come through the psychotic townhouse. Yeah. Holy shit. The townhouse of terror is coming. Wicked animatronics, decorations, and live actors. Oh, good. You get people who are just dying to get out of this town because they want to act.

It's essentially a square of a spirit Halloween store. Yeah, it's their Super Bowl, though. They're ready. The Jelly Ball Zombie Shooting Gallery. Oh. See if you'd survive a zombie invasion in this interactive zombie apocalypse shooting gallery. Do I get to shoot zombies? I think you get to shoot zombies there.

I want a paintball with some zombies. That sounds like sounds like fun jelly balls probably softer paintballs maybe like airsoft you can't you can't just send dudes out there and be like they're gonna shoot you like a like like kids are gonna empty the whole thing on you like it's gonna be rough i want i'll fucking i'll build it if somebody will do it and go out there and take the paintballs i'll i'll build it all this little scary for you jimmy maybe the townhouse of terror is a little too much for you well try these scare-free bouncers and slides okay for the little ones yeah scare-free inflatable bounce park nobody'll jump out covered in blood with a chainsaw that's it okay then there's also the spooktacular all right the spooktacular is run by the same people, it looks like, and they have the same shit.

A pumpkin patch, jelly ball, bullshit. But this is grab your friends in battle. So this is you shoot each other with jelly balls. And the Haunting of the McPherson House. F-E-A-R. Yeah. There you go. Then there's also the Diamond Days Festival.

D-A-Z-E. Oh, we're getting stoned? This has nothing to do with Halloween. Yeah, this is going to be like Cheech and Chong are making a comeback on this one. It's going to be one of those. It's in Salisaw, which is the town right next door here. Annual outdoor event that brings residents and visitors together for entertainment, food, and fun. Celebrate warmer weather with music from headliner crossroads damn it who the fuck is that

nobody okay i didn't know if that was like the britney spears movie i don't know that's not good they're actually bone thugs they just don't know okay they didn't know the name of the band they just put up the it's the rest of the chicks from the britney spears movie rapping i believe they're doing entire Bone Thugs albums. I believe that's the theme, right? And they call it Crossroads. They call it Crossroads because that's a real crossing of different things. It's super different.

Come on out and see the band Sweet Child O' Mine. No, that's called Guns N' Roses, guys. No, no, no. They don't play Guns N' Roses, though. They don't play Guns N' Roses. Sweet Child O' Mine. that's the name of him, and they just play songs with the word sweet or child in it. It's actually the cast of the Danny DeVito movie, War of the Roses.

Singing Sweet Caroline. And they play the soundtrack from Young Guns. That's what's Guns N' Roses, and that's what it is. And Hot Child in the City. Hot Child in the City. Hot Child in the City. Carnival rides. Holy shit. The event will also feature arts and crafts and children's activities.

There's a 5K, a car show, a barbecue competition. Oh, yeah. Come on. This is amazing. You know what happened this year there? Well, this past May, quote, a high-speed chase could have been deadly saturday but salasaw police captain and an officer drove into the suspect's vehicle before it crashed into a festival crowd what somebody tried to plow into this festival it's terrible the diamond days

festival is held on the first saturday in may with live music food and events many were said to be outside enjoying festivities and in the path of the suspect's vehicle. According to the police chief here and the captain, they were working the festival when they were told the pursuit was headed their way. Quote, Captain Weber and Officer McGirt were the last lines of defense before the suspect vehicle would have entered the Diamond Days event area. Captain Weber at that time decided if they didn't have any other choices

besides disabling the suspect vehicle, so they did. They said they took it out, and just before it crashed into a giant group of people eating like funnel cakes. Crossroads are lucky to be alive. Waiting for Crossroads. Crossroads was doing their sound check, and they're like, what's happening? Jesus.

The hell's going on here? McGirt? Is that what you said? McGirt. Yeah. That's what the officer McGirt. Officer McGirt. Captain Weber and Officer McGirt. Isn't that what you said mcgirt that's what the officer officer mcgirt captain weber and officer mcgirt isn't that wasn't dirt mcgirt uh odb's uh alias dirt that's my motherfucking name yeah that's that's hilarious so crime rate in this town well we're

generally all we love on here is uh property crime slightly above or below average just below just about at the in within the margin of error violent crime though murder rape robbery and of course assault the mount rushmore of crime is about 20 percent under the national average so if you hit that fucking pretty safe festival it would have been way higher that's they could have shot this thing through the roof that would have been in salisaw give them our crime rate it ain't none of our fucking business salasaw that place is crazy it's dangerous see their numbers shit watch crossroads boy it's people gets people amped up take your life in your own hands that said yeah let's talk about some murder shall we all right okay this is uh wow this is a wild one okay we have every once in a while

there's a narrative that goes where you can where they just beat by beat of the entire murder and those are always the most disturbing yeah ones because you know so much yeah when you when someone was watching it and gives a detailed blow by blow it's almost like baraboo where you're like because you're living too much yeah so let's talk about a lady first okay let's talk about lois nadine smith okay now lois she doesn't go by lois she goes by nadine yeah i would too and she earns the nickname in high school of mean nadine oh yeah she's not yeah this is i was waiting for something dirty. No, no, no. Mean Nadine. That's not good. You know, fuck with Nadine.

And her life, she's got a weird life as we talk about her. She was born in 1940. And she's got two brothers. Her father was a plumber slash electrician. So a blue collar guy and a preacher. Oh. Yeah. So he likes to.

He's busy every day. Yeah, he's always. even on sundays he's no days off here mother was a housewife and in like i said in high school they nicknamed her mean nadine which a girl in high school i mean that's the mid 50s for christ's sake you know poodle skirts and shit like that like what could what was what was mean back then? She smoked a cigarette? That could have been anything. Was her name Sasha, the chick from Greece? She told the guy he's not allowed to finger her? Yeah.

Cha-cha, yeah. Cha-cha, whatever. Cha-cha McGirt. Yeah, McGirt. Cha-cha McGirt. You remember her. Trying to steal John Travolta, right? Right.

I guess that's essentially what if you look at his history historically the girl that's mean just takes other chicks dudes right i guess but i or is she just running around kicking people in the pussy i think you got yeah i think that she's a pussy kicker from way back from way back. The townhouse of twat terror. That's what they called it. They called her that. She was just pop out and kick pussy all day. Pow, pow. And she goes, ha!

And she runs away. Was that mean, Nadine? She's like, I think it was. I see you in math class, bitch. And she runs. People are like, man, that Nadine is mean as fuck. Yes, she is. Welcome to the small town of Chinook,

where faith runs deep and secrets run deeper. In this new thriller, available exclusively on Wondery+, religion and crime collide when a gruesome murder rocks the isolated Montana community. Everyone is quick to point their fingers at a drug-addicted teenager, but local deputy Ruth Vogel isn't convinced. She suspects connections to a powerful religious group. Enter federal agent V.B. Loro, who has been investigating a local church for possible criminal activity. The pair form an unlikely partnership

to catch the killer, unearthing secrets that leave Ruth torn between her duty to the law, her religious convictions, and her very own family. But something more sinister than murder is afoot, and someone is watching Ruth. With an all-star cast led by Emmy nominee Sanaa Lathan

and Star Wars' Kelly Marie Tran, Chinook is available exclusively and ad-free on Wondery+. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. I understand that anybody who's paid attention to the media would have to come to the conclusion that I killed my wife. Hi, my name is Zach Stewart-Pontier. I'm one of the filmmakers behind The Jinx, and I'm excited to bring you the official Jinx podcast. We'll be revisiting all six episodes of part one and watching along with part two as it airs on Max starting April 21st. Bye bye. and watching along with part two as it airs on Max starting April 21st. Bye-bye. The official Jinx podcast.

Listen on Max or wherever you get your podcasts. We don't know how she got me and Nadine. In high school, though, she must have been doing something. She marries a man, though. She gets married in the late 50s here. She marries a guy named Jim Hork, H-o-r-k yeah hork yeah smith okay he goes by yeah hork really yeah like the sound of a duck i'd rather go by smith yeah out of those three names hork is by far the one you want to you want to bury in the back i would say that one's bad

he's i'm hork nice to meet you he goes by that like a first name? If someone said, how you doing? And you go, my name's Hork. You'd go, what? Hork? You'd make that face and go, Hork? Did you say Hork? Pork? Fork? What's your name?

I've heard other Horks, but. Fork? Fork? Mork for Mork? I don't know. I've heard that. I don't know. Hork.

Because it's not a word you've ever heard before. Right, because H and O together make like a, it's a bizarre, it's not like a natural thing. And then you put an R and a K together. Hork. None of those letters naturally fall out of the face. Is it hunk? Yeah. Are you mistaken when you said your name?

Is it not Hork? Remember back to the beats when he was like, call me Surly. They're like, Shirley? Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. I refuse to accept that your name is hork i can't do hork that doesn't go together so they have two kids together okay and adine ends up having another

kid at some point but they have two me and dean wasn't so mean to one man one guy no well yeah oh she does shoot him at one point oh jesus yeah that's not the murder don't worry maybe it's because she he makes her call him that name. That's just in passing. Well, a man named Hork must be angry, I would say. So he's probably hard to deal with. That's a tough name. They have two kids, James Gregory Smith, and he goes by Greg. So everybody, again, going by their middle name in the story.

Fascinating. Then they have another son named Hork. No. They named him Hork. Oh, boy. So he gave one kid his first name and the other kid his middle name yeah so i'm sorry he tried to double junior up on us that's this ridiculous now the marriage to jim hork smith yeah not a he goes by jim so jim is the dad greg is the son

hork is the other son wow so the marriage with between mean nadine and jim hork over here it didn't it was a tough marriage from the start i mean they were just like a mess jim's a heavy drinker yeah first of all real loves to drink back then in the mid-60s and would beat the shit out of her all the time which obviously is terrible but in the mid-60s too was considered that's part of life like yeah it was considered kind of in a weird it was a oddly societally accepted in a strange way keep your house in line man jesus christ what's wrong with you maybe hit her time or two jesus maybe you say she burned dinner she did what now yeah she walking jesus christ she's still on the

phone i mean hit her with it probably Probably. That'll get her off. I called you twice. Busy signal both times. Don't lack it. This is bullshit. They're paying for call waiting. You better beat that woman. That's it.

You better hit her with that phone. So, no, he's beaten her and he's also mean to the kids. Terrible. That's according to her. And according to him, he fully admits that he was a heavy drinker who would beat her. I don't know if he was mean to the kids or not, but she always had a job. She always had kind of a steady job. She would attend church regularly and that sort of thing.

So she kept an outside, you know, somewhat of an outside facade of everything is fine here. And in the mid-60s, I mean, Christ, that was still a time when guys, people who were born in 1940 would fucking put dress pants on to mow the lawn this is still dress pants mowing the lawn time what a time this is wild yeah well go look at these kids with their long hair now like that's that's what was going on i took a shower to get sweaty jesus i had to take a shower i put cologne on i put aqua velvet on to

come out here came out here and started the grass mow the damn lawn that's what happens so uh jim while they're married they were married about 18 years these two in 1965 mean nadine shot jim hork with a 25 caliber gun yeah while the two of them were sad enough we're drinking and arguing according to them yeah now. Now, this is such a fucked up relationship that Jim goes, I mean, it ain't all her fault. I had it coming. Literally, he said, I did beat the shit out of her during the course of the marriage. In fact, broke her leg on two different occasions. Broke her leg. Separate occasions.

Broke bones. Separate occasions. More than once. Yes. Unbelievable. And there's rumors of a broken. More than once. Yes. Unbelievable. And there's rumors of a broken arm at some point, too. Oh, my God, man. So that's a lot of limbs being broken.

You can break somebody that much. They're bound to shoot you. They're going to shoot you. That's what he said. He was like, I mean, she shot me, but I mean. I can't believe she didn't shoot me when I broke her second leg. He's like, I mean, that's obvious. It's going to happen.

I mean, I expected it one of these days. That's a wild relationship when you're like, I mean, yeah, she shot me, but I mean,'s obvious it's gonna happen i mean i expected it one of these days that's a wild relationship when you're like i mean yeah she shot me but i mean i get it that's that's a lot i shot me too at the time she shot him she had a restraining order against him he should have been there anyway well i don't think it was i think it was she came to him though there is no it's like she has a restraining order she came over but then they argued so she shot him but he said they were like you know wrestling for the gun it wasn't she didn't be like yeah you gotta be a special piece of shit to be like wild she had a restraining order but she came to me and shot me and i still deserve it i kind of still deserved it a bit yeah because the things i

got the restraining order put on me for you you know, that warranted a bullet or two. I'm not going to lie. Special pieces. I ain't going to lie. I mean, you know, broken leg, gunshot wound. Wow. It was a flesh wound. She didn't shoot me in the head or nothing.

I'm ashamed to share a name with you, Jim. You know, sometimes it should have hit me in the leg. I said, watch the arteries, and she'll just flesh wound me. I'm thankful he's going by Hork because he doesn't deserve a gym this is the type of dude who'd be like this is what he'd be into in sex shoot me shoot me give me a flesh wound so i can come shoot me in the pinky toe just do it come on shoot it off jesus i'm engorged she also if getting beaten up and having her leg broken and all this a couple of times isn't enough, Mean Nadine's also involved in a very serious car accident in 1966 that rendered her unconscious for a few days and gave her some brain damage as well.

Shit. She shot the guy before she had brain damage, though. Okay. So this is afterwards. Wow. We already have a lot going on. and now she's a little bit. She's making one car accident or like a two car. Do we know?

It was a one car over medium. I feel like is what happened here. One car sunny side up. Sunny side up. Yeah. So they divorced. Thankfully, these two should definitely not be. No, no.

A long time ago. He's an alcoholic that beats her up, so they shouldn't be together. Yeah. And she's willing to shoot him over it, even when she has restraining. The whole thing's a mess. They got along twice. Their names are James and Horton. That's it.

That's the only time. And that might have just been. And that might not have been. You don't know that. That might have been grudge fucking. Who knows? That might have been just for out of some sort of, to get him back or something. It might have been somebody's birthday.

We don't know. That's, you know what? Yeah. It's fine. It's Christmas. Who knows? Christmas is a big time for fucking. Christmas is the time of year.

Man, that angel on the tree is making me horny. Get over here. Leaving it in, yeah. Leaving it in. It's such a sweet song. It really is. It a nice holiday it's horny it's nice yeah makes me want to make a hork makes me want to make up a hork so they get divorced and they're divorced for a little while now let's catch up with everyone in 1982 okay so everyone's had a she's 42 mean nadine and she's lived quite the life so far. And we've got grown up kids.

Yeah, by now we have kids that are 17. One's 18 years old. Okay. Yes, he's born in 64. Okay. So at this point, he is 18 years old. Yeah. You've got Greg here.

That's 16. No, because it's 82. Oh, 82. 82. Got it. Yeah. So Jim, Jim Hork, dad, is remarried by now. Okay.

He's married to a woman named Robin. Yeah. So Jim and Robin have their own thing going on here. Now Greg has a girlfriend, young Greg. Yeah. He's got a 19-year-old girlfriend named Teresa Baker DeMoss. Okay. Now Teresa, she's down for a little while anyway theresa here she's had she has an

interesting relationship with mean nadine oh also she lived with with her boyfriend for a little while here with greg in mean nadine's house and she was allowed to live in the house but this is the weirdest thing i've ever heard not allowed to eat meals with the family. Like a dog. Yeah. Like you're not allowed. Even that's just weird. That's weird, right?

Yeah, you eat in your room. Yeah, where do I go? Imagine having someone stay in your house, not like a stranger, not like a boarder or something. Your kid's girlfriend. Your kid's girlfriend. She ain't allowed at my table what a weird setup right yeah i can understand leave the door open if you're in the bedroom together but what does she think she's gonna get pregnant at the dinner table i think no i think nate this is just my yeah from the whole story the the macro view of it that i got

here it seems like mean nadine doesn't really want his her son to be close to a girl real oh okay a little overprotective a little jealous a little possessive of that i think that's what it seems like it's a bizarre mother-son relationship yes and it's over overbearing oh it's it's fratelli brothers level weird here coming up it's fucking weird which brothers are they uh why I'm already got the Coens and the other ones

they're the Goonies brothers okay with Mama Fratelli and the bad guys and the Goonies is what we're talking about they're characters

not directors not directors no these are actual movie characters they hang out with the Coens and the Farrelly brothers the bald guy

and the guy that lights the fire and the Zucker brothers too the airplane guys they're there as well they're pretty fucking good they're funny as shit so anyway yeah so this is a weird there's a weird dynamic in that house yeah here and you know that she's willing to shoot a person too so yeah you don't want to cross me and and she's got her egg scrambled so who knows what's going to set her off this is my mom mean nadine my dad done's got her eggs scrambled, so who knows what's going to set her off. This is my mom, mean Nadine. My dad done beat her up, broke her leg a few times, so she shot him. And she don't like you when you're not allowed to eat at the table.

I'd be like, I'll sleep outside, thank you. And she hit a tree. Yeah, and she ain't quite right in the head. So, you know, be careful. Tread lightly. Now, he's got an ex-girlfriend here. Greg? Greg does, who's 20 years old.

Greg is swinging. Greg's doing great for himself over here, which in this town, there's not a lot of people. So I think that helps. Whatever girls are available. It's like that American Hollow documentary where they were like, she's a 16-year-old girl and he's a 16-year-old boy and they live in the same holler. So that's the problem. Might as well be together. So I don't know if that's the case.

But Cynthia Lucille Bailey. And Bailey is B-A-I-L-L-I-E. I don't like that. Yeah, that's a strange spelling of that. You'd go, one more time? Yeah. That's Bailey? Jesus Christ.

So Cynthia, Cindy, she goes by she's 20 she has a five-year-old daughter by the way she is how old 20 that's as a five-year-old daughter named brandy jesus i'm not what the fuck man i feel she gave birth when she was 15 when she was 15 that's i mean she could have been pregnant by 14 oh my god my God. Which is just, I mean, rough. And the crazy part is from all accounts, she's a very good mother by 20 somehow. So, I mean, some people can do it. But, I mean, that's obviously not the best path for Cindy's life or success. And just because you have the skills doesn't mean you have the means.

You know what I mean? Exactly. That's fucked. Yeah, that's hard. That's really hard. So it's difficult. So young Brandy is the little girl, five-year-old girl. Now, apparently, they had broken up, Cindy and Greg.

Okay. And there are all of these rumors flying around town. This is a small town to the point of rumors can fly around everywhere. Love it. And there's rumors, and Mean Nadine picks up on these rumors, and Greg tells Mean Nadine about some of them, that Cindy's going to get him back in some way. Going to get Greg back for not being with her anymore, for fucking her over, for banging Teresa. Who knows? Leaving her alone to raise somebody else's kid.

Yeah, whatever the case is. But she's going to get back at him. And there's rumors from me, Nadine, and from Greg that they've heard that Cindy is going to either tell on them for something like drugs, like wait till they have some drugs and then tell on them about that and do like a big rat thing or some other way to get them arrested. a big rat thing or some other way to get them arrested. Or there's also rumors that she has been trying to find someone to have him killed as well. Oh, so that's what they're that's in their mind. OK, not it's not confirmed. This is just rumors flying around a small town.

She said she's going to have you kill. Yeah, but if there's any truth to any of that, that girl is just running. She doesn't have time to work or raise a baby. That's what I mean. That's a lot of things she's just quote unquote saying. Yeah, she's arranging a murder. She's setting the guy up. She's busy. She's Donnie Brasco.

She's an informant. She's fucking. Keep an eye on when somebody's got weed. This is a lot going on here. Have you heard they have drugs? Okay, hold on. Let me contact my. I'm going to call the authorities and my hit man.

Wow, I got to get everybody there. Well, I'll get the hitman first because I want him to do his job before the cops come. All right. That'd be good. So this all comes to a head July 4th. Okay. So 4th of July. Yeah.

That's a party day. Well, yeah. This is the night of the 3rd. So early morning of the 4th. Yeah. Middle of the night. We're not working tomorrow. That's what we're talking about.

Yeah. So middle of the night. Uh-huh. Here're not working tomorrow. That's what we're talking about. Yeah. So middle of the night. Here we go. Okay. Me, Nadine, and her son, Greg, come and pick Teresa up at 5.30 a.m. on July 4th. Yeah. Okay. Now, Nadine said that they were going to, quote, I don't know what this means at 530 in the morning.

Quote, go boogieing. What the fuck? I'm like, okay, does she mean dancing like the 70s? Like we're going to boogie. But at 530 in the morning in a small town, where the fuck are you boogieing? What does that small town shit mean? I don't know. Boogieing.

Yeah. Apparently. It's got to be like hunting. It's got to be something like noodling. I was going to say. You're sticking your arm in a crevice it shouldn't be and trying to pull out an animal, I feel like, right? Whether it's underwater or not doesn't matter. You're pulling dinner out of a hole in the wall, I feel like, right?

That's the goal here. Yank dinner from the earth, I think. That's hillbilly drive-thrus is what that is. Extract lunch from this wall so that was what she said so all groggy eyed here's theresa 5 30 in the morning let's go boogieing all right i guess i'm hungry i suppose we could boogie i need breakfast wow so the three of them drive to gore which is another town g-o-r-e g-o-r-e oh my and they stop where at a motel obviously we're going boogieing and we need a hotel now we're going to a motel certainly not a

hotel let's not go crazy here i believe this is the sequoia motel okay that does not exist anymore is that right no it does not exist anymore there's a days in fucking sequoia that might be the on the lost version of it yeah i don't know what it is here but they're going there and they're going to a motel and they tell her oh it's the tele it's the telequah motel telequah motel t-a-h-l telequah so they're going there and they tell teresa we're going there to pick up cindy bailey okay cindy's there too yeah which is odd that's great why would you pick yeah yeah so hi girlfriend we're going to pick my ex-girlfriend up with my mom right my ex-girlfriend that everyone that yeah the one that she said that i think she's trying to kill me or have me set up

we're gonna pick her up is boogieing when you watch your son have sex with his ex and current girlfriend i think boogieing is watching your son have a threesome i think that's it there's another term for boogieing uh when you do that and diddle yourself that's a totally different thing but if you don't get any sexual pleasure out of it but just enjoy watching it's called boogieing a child's boogieing is when they pick one and wipe it on your cheek yeah yeah maybe that's what they're gonna do we're gonna go booger up this town wipe it on garage sale signs and so they drive to the telequa motel or telequa motel and they say they're going to go pick her up. And Cindy Bailey is in one of the rooms with a guy named Tommy McGowan. Okay.

Okay. Now, all right. They step in, I guess. Teresa and Mean Nadine steps into the hotel room. Right. And asks. Everybody's awake at 530 in the morning, by the way. Why? And not like up and at them, like up from the night before, looking's awake at 5.30 in the morning, by the way. Why?

And not like up and at them, like up from the night before, looking for shit to do. Still ready. Still up. Let's go. She walks in and asks Cindy, hey, you want to come party with us? It's 6 a.m. Does party include like reading the newspaper, having a coffee,

smoking a cigarette while I get the cold out my eyes? Have an orange juice and a bagel. Is that partying? Because that sounds pretty hot shit. Bagels and lox. Let's get after that. I could go for some cream cheese right now here. So do you want to come party with us? Yeah.

Which seems strange. So at one point, while they're in the hotel room, motel room, I'm sorry'm sorry hotels i don't mean to besmirch you never do that cindy bailey asks theresa greg's current girlfriend what's quote what's going down yeah what's going down right now are we gonna boogie or what yeah a lot of people call each other turkeys left and right in this equation i I feel like. A lot of jive turkeys. A lot of 70s shit flying around. A lot of... 1982. 82 was still the 70s, though.

Yeah, and in Oklahoma, it's 71. Oh, it's 70. Yeah, they just got it. Like, you hear Sabbath? That shit's crazy. They just got it. They just got it. Yeah.

That's the middle. It takes... Yeah. From both coasts, it takes a while for culture to seep to the middle. To get to the middle. That new CCR is great. They're like're like man woodstock must have been amazing i heard this war in vietnam's kicking off jesus christ i told i said nixon why didn't he just throw the tapes out like jesus christ they don't know what's going on here they're all mixed up in their time so

yeah what's going down i think yeah definitely a little behind the time so what's going on here. They're all mixed up in their time. So, yeah, what's going down? Yeah, definitely a little behind the time. So what's going down? And Teresa told Bailey, quote, it's not cool for you to get in the car. Okay. Which this all sounds like code. We're going boogieing. What's going down?

It's not cool for you to get in the car. What does all this mean? I'm frightened. I'm frightened. I'm frightened. But apparently, Cindy told her that she can take care of herself. Don't need your advice, little girl. What a fascinating group of people to be around each other at 530 in the morning. That's the thing.

I was going to say, all of this is happening at 6 a.m., which makes it so much weirder. In July, the sun is out. It is bright outside right now. It's blazing. There's no night at all. This is like, you're like, are we getting Egg McMuffins or what? This is real early. So me and Nadine, Greg, and Teresa, they pick her up at the Tahlequah Hotel,

and they get in the car. Like we said, I'll take care of myself. So, all right, fine. They get in there., like we said, I'll take care of myself. So, all right, fine. They get in there. They start driving away. As they're driving, mean Nadine confronts Cindy and says, I heard rumors that you're trying to arrange for Greg to be murdered. Is that true? Yeah.

Is that true? Now, Nadine and Cindy are in the backine and cindy are in the back seat oh and theresa and greg are in the front seat greg's driving it's his car okay so she's in the back seat which is kind of trapped in a trap with this mean nadine right and mean nadine's like so you want to kill my son right which seems very uncomfortable and i'd be flashing back to when the girl said to me uh you know it's not cool to get in the car. Right. Oh, not cool means this lady.

That's what she means. This lady wants to fucking. Scrambled eggs. Yeah. A husband shooter. Yeah. With broken legs and arm is now threatening me. She seems pissed off.

So they're all there. As they start down the road, they're going to head back to Gans. Teresa and Nadine then start asking. Now Teresa jumps in. They start asking Cindy, why did you snitch on Greg's brother, Hork? Okay. Yeah. You told on Hork.

What is happening? You're fucking ratting on the Horkster over here. So you ratted on Hork, and you're, quote, trying to set Greg up. You're setting ratting on the horkster over here. And so you rat it on hork and you're, quote, trying to set Greg up. You're setting Greg up. You're not boogieing at all. How badass is Cindy? You're a jive turkey basically at this point is what they're saying right now. Yeah.

Watch out. So she's saying that and they're like, you know, she's turned around. Teresa going, why'd you do this? And Cindy's turned to her this way and she's, you know, in the back seat. Cindy, going, why'd you do this? And Cindy's turned to her this way, and she's, you know, in the back seat. Cindy's like, none of you are making any sense. This doesn't make, I don't understand. What's going down? Yeah.

What's going down? Right now. This car is very uncool. Uncool, man. It's not chill. So she, Cindy denies making any threats. Didn't say I was going to tell on anybody. Never made any arrangements to kill him.

I swear to God, nobody's on their way to murder him. This is, I don't know who you heard it from, but it's all small town rumor horseshit. Some fascinating stuff that you guys got happening. This is a weird game of telephone. Don't worry about it. So they go, all right, yeah, it's not, it's all a lie. She's like, it's all a lie. Okay, that's fine.

So then Nadine, mean Nadine, opens up her purse. Yeah. What does she produce? Slowly pulls out a pair of black gloves. What the fuck? And puts them on one hand at a time. Yeah. Which, again, this would be a little bit terrifying.

She's not even driving. No. She's not trying to grip the wheel for better performance here. So as she's putting the gloves on nadine turns to cindy and say and says quote you'll never see cherokee county again which normally sounds like thank you awesome i don't wow right thank you you rescued me but in this case yeah is not okay this is uh a terrifying threat yeah while someone's putting gloves on and you're trapped in a car. So she's got the gloves on.

And if you're Cindy, you must be terrified here. And she begins to choke Cindy Bailey with the gloves on. She apparently choked her, according to Teresa, for approximately two to three minutes, which is a long time. But it takes a while, especially if you're not a very very strong person yeah if you have small hands it takes it's going to take four or five minutes to strangle somebody that's just the way it is so i mean in my personal experience of strangling many people no and all the things i've i've heard in medical stuff it takes a while to stop that blood it really is it tries to go so within two or three minutes uh

theresa said cindy's eyes rolled up into her head so she was getting her yeah it was working she's working her over but that's a lot of choking yeah it is to be choking somebody for three minutes is like to not realize this is crazy i'm choking a person yeah and i should stop now yeah is a wild in the middle of it if you don't have some clarification three minutes wash over you yeah this is nuts i could see it being in a blind rage about something i start choking the shit out of somebody but after like 10 seconds you'd be like oh my god i'm really choking this fucking person i should stop and she started with a slow casual you'll never see cherokee oh yeah this isn't like this isn't a rage this This is, in a minute, I'm going to choke you, okay?

I'm building it up. Yeah, I'm really going to. I just put your food in. I'm bringing your steak knives out. There you go. Yeah. That's what that says. The Caesar's being chilled.

So at one point, Greg told Cindy to hand him her purse. Give me your purse. While he's driving. While he's driving. Give me your purse. While he's driving. While he's driving. Give me your purse here. I think at this point they might have pulled over. Yeah. So she does.

She's being choked, for Christ's sake. I think at this point she's open to suggestion. Yeah. He ends up looking through her purse and pulls out a small paring knife. Like Italian grandma's apple knife, basically. a small paring knife. Like Italian grandma's apple knife, basically. A little paring knife. Yeah. Cut the limes out.

And a lot of women would carry little weapons. I remember all my aunts always had those little razor blades in the keychain. Yeah. Any woman who goes out and does things, you need something to protect yourself. A small stiletto or some mace yeah they're to

hold their keys between their hands or just punch in the throat or whatever the fuck it is so he removes this paring night knife holds it up holds it up and says see mom she was gonna kill you with this she was gonna stab you with this i think she would have gotten it if she was gonna yeah these this is a super weird norman bates yeah see mom look what she was gonna do like no wonder why the girl's not allowed to eat at the table theresa this is their weird relationship so yeah she was gonna hurt you with this knife so nadine takes the knife and says were you gonna use this to stab me she had no idea cindy had no idea she was going to see these people.

She was in a fucking motel room at 6 o'clock in the morning. You guys showed up to me. Yeah. She did not expect these three lunatics to show up at the door and be like, you want a boogie? Yeah. Like, that's weird. So it's not like she was, like, you know,

planning and arming herself for a confrontation. She had no idea they were going to be there. This is obviously ridiculous. No plot happening. Nothing. So then she takes the knife that Cindy has, and she stabs Cindy in the neck with it. Oh, God.

Sticks it in. Oh, my God. Her neck. Yeah. Twists it around. Oh, my God. This is nothing. Twists it around twice, and then pulls it back out.

Luckily, it's a small little purse knife. But that could have but shoot some shit up in there it's not good bleeding yeah she's now bleeding like crazy obviously stabbed in the neck she's just been choked to the point of near unconsciousness a minute before that now she's stabbed in the neck trying to keep them you're stabbed in the neck you can't even look at it so So you're just trying to cover it, hoping you don't know if there's blood shooting out. I don't know what you hit in there. Who knows? Yeah. So it's at this point that Greg ups the ante a bit, and he pulls a gun out from under his leg.

Why the knife if you've got a gun? He was sick of it. That's mean Nadine was mad at her. You were going to hurt me with this knife. Take that. Literally twists it around and takes it out. Yeah.'s that's torture that's disturbing is what that is and so cindy's you know hurt but she's still conscious and she's talking to them and aware of what's going on and uh greg pulls a gun out from under his left leg yeah and he's all mad and he says

cindy if you would hurt my mom i would have shot you in a second and not thought anything about it. Okay. Cindy had no, she was being choked and didn't stab this woman. If she was ever going to stab Nadine, that would have been the time. When I'm almost unconscious from choking, hey, let me get my purse knife quick and stab this fucking bitch. But she didn't. You guys might get me in a rush, but not before I saw mom's head yeah exactly not before i canoe the both of you yeah get me get me so that's that's that's what's going on here so this is all obviously crazy paranoia you're gonna kill my

son and you brought this knife to kill me and this is all and greg's amping it up and they're feeding into each other and teresa's in the front seat like these people are fucking crazy yeah man greg i got myself in greg must have a magical penis is all i have to say our kid just a magical penis 18 years old 18 years old my god it must be amazing just down swinging got two women yeah unbelievable this is weird what cindy was i guess done with him but i guess i don't know she still't going to go hang out with him. But he's had two serious girlfriends. Yeah, he's had multiple serious girlfriends here. So, yeah, I would have not thought a thing about shooting you.

Shows her the gun. So the car drives where? To the hospital? No. Oh. No, no, no, no, no. Where do you think they're going to go? No, that's what I thought.

No. They're going to Jim Hork's house. Dad's house. Dad's house. They're going to show up at dad's house, who is the ex-husband, obviously, and are remarried. Yeah. So that's- And he's going to bring a-

How would you like it if your ex-wife showed up with a bleeding woman that she stabbed in the neck and was like, hey- I don't want to talk about it. I'd be on the phone so fast. Yeah, you come get this person hey babe call police my ex is here and it's crazy yeah it's the reason i divorced her guns and knives i see a young girl bleeding from the neck yeah this is um par for her course well shit well also i beat the shit out of her is another reason why of course she showed up and with the reasons that i used to hit her there it is all of it oh jesus at least what i told myself how i made it okay i did deserve to be shot did i ever tell you that story anyway hold on i should get back to

this in may of 1980 near anaheim california dorothy jane scott noticed her friend had an inflamed red wound on his arm and seemed unwell she insisted on driving him to the local hospital to get treatment. While he waited for his prescription, Dorothy went to grab her car to pick him up at the exit, but would never be seen alive again. Leaving us to wonder, decades later, what really happened to Dorothy Jane Scott? From Wondery, Generation Y is a podcast that covers notable true crime cases like this one and many more. Every week, hosts Aaron and Justin sit down to discuss a new case, covering every angle and theory, walking through the forensic evidence, and interviewing those close to the case to try to discover what happened. And with over 450 episodes, there's a case for every true crime listener.

Follow the Generation Y podcast on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to Generation Y ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus. It's all a lighthearted nightmare on our podcast, Morbid. We're your hosts. I'm Alina Urquhart. And I'm Ash Kelly. And our show is part true crime, part spooky, and part comedy. The stories we cover are well-researched.

He claimed and confessed to officially killing up to 28 people. With a touch of humor. I'd just like to go ahead and say that if there's no band called Malevolent Deity, that is pretty great. A dash of sarcasm and just garnished a bit with a little bit of cursing. This mother****er lied. Like a liar. Like a liar. Like a liar. And if you're a weirdo like us and love to cozy up to a creepy tale of the paranormal,

or you love to hop in the Wayback Machine and dissect the details of some of history's most notorious crimes, you should tune in to our podcast, Morbid. Follow Morbid on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to episodes early and ad-free by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. It's all a lighthearted nightmare on our podcast, Morbid. We're your hosts.

I'm Alina Urquhart. And I'm Ash Kelly. And our show is part true crime, part spooky, and part comedy. The stories we cover are well-researched. He claimed and confessed to officially killing up to 28 people. With a touch of humor.

I'd just like to go ahead and say that if there's no band called Malevolent Deity, that is pretty great. A dash of sarcasm and just garnished a bit with a little bit of cursing. This mother f***er lied. Like a liar. Like a liar. And if you're a weirdo like us and love to cozy up to a creepy tale of the paranormal. Or you love to hop in the Wayback Machine and dissect the details of some of history's most notorious crimes.

You should tune in to our podcast, Morbid. Follow Morbid on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to episodes early and ad-free by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. So the car traveling here to Jim Smith's house. This is in Gans, Oklahoma. At the house are Jim and his wife. It's fucking 7 a.m.

6.30 in the morning. There's some Folgers and some cops. Yeah, they're talking about where we're going to see the fireworks tonight. We're going to barbecue his house. We're going to barbecue it. They arrive the four of them at the house. Jesus Christ. They get in. They walk barbecue his house. We're going to barbecue it. Get in there and flip that bacon. They arrive, the four of them, at the house. Jesus Christ. They get in.

They walk into the house. Oh, boy. And first of all, I'm not even opening the door for this menagerie of fucking insanity outside. I don't care if my kid's in there or not. You've got a bleeding woman with you. You're not coming to my house. So they go in. They order.

Well, we would say, I guess, Nadine orders Cindy to go take a shower. My neck is cut. Why a shower? Get that blood off. Don't fuck up my ex's carpet. I don't know what the weak point is. The shower makes no sense. Clean up your neck.

But a shower? I guess she's got to be bloody. I don't know. So Robin, the new one,im hork's new wife here she says that when cindy went into the bathroom at that point when she was going to the bathroom to take a shower she started begging robin and jim to help her help me these fucking people they took me from my motel they stabbed me in the neck and they held a gun in the fucking she's crazy she put gloves on and holy christ what's robin do she shot a guy one time oh that was you jesus christ see you know she's crazy scrambled eggs i didn't know anything about this i didn't know she had an omelet in there fuck it's a real denver yeah so that's

what's happening she says quote uh nadine was behind cindy when she came in the bathroom okay nadine said quote you can say anything you want to me my ex-husband or his wife and it won't do you any good it's gone too far what it's gone too far what's gone too far this whole thing yeah you just made it go too far she acted like one thing led to another nothing led to anything you this is all of your own volition unforced error you pick this brought up you put her in a fucking car yeah accused her of crazy shit stabbed her in the neck for no reason choked her and we're in too deep and now you told her to take a shower which is the weirdest thing you've done so far for some reason anytime you're like now now get nude it's like, okay, now we've taken it to another level now.

I don't think I like this anymore. I never did out here. So it's gone too far. So then Nadine orders, I guess after the shower, I suppose, orders Cindy to sit in a recliner in the living room. You sit in that recliner. Is she bandaged up? She's just holding her neck oh my god

it's it's a it's a it's bleeding pretty good she hasn't like hit an artery or anything but it's not gushing but it's it's bleeding it's leaking she's been stabbed in the neck for christ's sake i mean you think about what that would be like and twist it around so it's not even like it was a small stab she made it worse she made it worse. So she's doing that. She tells her, sit down. Mean Nadine also orders Jim, Jim Hork, the husband, to sit in the chair with her. You sit there with her. Yeah.

Okay, sure. She's already shot me once. I mean, I know she means business. She does. So at that point, she guess starts uh robin said that cindy is sitting there begging them for help even with nadine she's going please help look at her she's holding the fuck what the fuck help me jesus what are we doing here you people must not be as crazy as the rest of these people right right i hope you're not as crazy turns out they're i mean they're not crazy

as crazy but they're they're on the team i think that no i think they're afraid of nadine oh i think is the problem and greg at this point too because he's fucking the only person they're not afraid of is cindy and theresa i think these wow so nadine at that point asks jim her ex-husband to quote to take the uh the 60 acres to kill Cindy. Okay. Take to the 60 acres. So let's go out on the 60-acre property to kill her, which is just right in front of Cindy they're talking about.

Where should we kill her? I don't know. Wow. Jim said, we can't. We can't get to the property. The creek is up. Sorry, creek's up. Yeah.

Remember how it rained last weekend? Can't get across the creek. Creek's up. Sorry. Oh how it rained last weekend can't get across creek creeks up sorry oh thank god yeah i would have the creek is always going to be up in this situation for me creeks up i don't know i'm going to say that whenever anybody asks me to do something i don't want to do the creeks up creeks up anytime we go out of town someone you guys want to go to dinner i can't the creeks up creeks that's so weird that they wouldn't even question it they go oh okay right and then you walk away and then a minute later like the fucking creeks up what are they talking about but it

kind of almost sounds like they should know it and they don't so they won't say anything i think try that out everybody just anything you don't want to do can't creeks up some wild animal season yeah it's yeah i can't it's it's quail season i can't bear season you know it has creeks up what do you want from me dude the creeks up jesus the salmon are feeding i don't know i don't know what to do so nadine also talked to jim her ex-husband come along with us to to kill this girl you should come along we'll kill her we'll dump her in the woods maybe we'll dump her in the creek it's up it'll do she'll take her right away remember when we got a divorce that was the last day i wanted to see you jim said quote i don't want to be involved in this okay i was at my house with

my new wife fucking house new wife 7 a.m on a holiday and you show up with a bleeding woman like this is insanity skipping uh all the all the creeks and seasons he's just going straight to i don't even want to do it i don't want any part of this so robin the his wife said then uh said that nadine said quote the girl is gonna have to die slowly oh my god that's what he she says she just announced that to the room well Well, this girl is going to have to die slowly. Okay. So this is I feel so bad. Somebody's mom.

It's somebody's mom. It's just a human being sitting in this fucking chair who her life's just being bandied about. Right. Talked about like, what are we going to do? Do you want McDonald's or Jack in the Box? Like, it's a fucking crazy conversation. It's torturous to do this to somebody, even if you're not going to kill them. You're making them think you're going to kill them. This is like some serious mental torture.

It's hard to feel any worse for somebody than to be in this situation and have people tell them stuff like this. To the point where Cindy Robbins said, quote,y said she wanted to die fast oh my god she now she's making plans for herself she's yeah just kill me fast please don't she she's resigned to the fact that they're going to kill her right and she's not even trying to talk him out of it anymore she's just like please don't torture me first that 25 you shot him with yeah please so she said that she was going to have a baby she said telling him she's pregnant now oh my and we never confirm whether she was pregnant or not or just saying this to try to garner some which would be a smart move right i'm not you know to try to garner a

little sympathy and she said she was concerned about the baby please don't torture me you're torturing a baby too that's what that's what she was trying to get through to them so while uh sitting in the recliner jim is sitting in the recliner next to her right robin said that he got sick from this whole thing and ran into the bathroom to throw up yeah because because this is crazy this is crazy this is absolute and even a fucking wife beating lunatic. Yeah. This is too much for him. This is too much for. This is what you do. Like if, you know, you fuck the mob over and they took you into like a social club's basement in the fucking Bronx in 1983 or something. This is weird.

Puke all over the wall. Yeah. This broad could be a great hit man. This being Nadine because she is cruel. Mean is fucking. They nailed it. Yeah. Oh, it gets worse.

Oh, God. They think this. They nailed it. Yeah. Oh, it gets worse. Oh, God. They think she's mean now. So Jim runs off to throw up. Cindy is sitting in the recliner by herself. At this point, Robin leaves the house. She said she had to return a borrowed car. So she took off. Any excuse.

I got to return a weather vane it was in the thing and i've gotta bring it back videotapes i gotta yeah i gotta jesus christ i got a film strip i gotta bring to the elementary school uh about susan b anthony i gotta go right now holy shit i'm getting any excuse possible over the library boy i gotta get out of here my grandmother's pancreas just exploded it i don't i felt it in my heart. I got to go right now. I'm out of this fucking place. So Robin said here, when she's getting ready to leave, walking toward the door, Nadine said to her, quote, it's been nice not seeing you.

I haven't been down here. You haven't seen me. In other words, as you're leaving, make sure you know that none of this happen yeah don't go out there telling people that this shit happened it's been nice not seeing but nice not seeing you i haven't been down here you haven't seen me bye wow still used you trust your ex-husband's new wife to not fucking flip on your murder don't you dare snitch on me she's not involved in this right they just showed up at her house and they're not happy about it and they're just letting her leave telling her don't tell anybody you saw me that is bonkers man so robin goes to the ringgold residence a family

that lives down the street just out of view of the house enough to get that people they knew they get down there and she immediately says there's no car she has to return she just goes holy shit they're at my fucking house these people came over they got this girl she stabbed her fucking neck they're saying they're gonna kill her slowly my husband's throwing up this shit is bonkers yeah so they're like oh fuck so larry ringgold and another guy this is now this is some small town shit right here rather than what would you do in this situation well three words my schedule yeah call the cops that's the words call the cops yeah all of them yeah this guy instead larry ringgold and another guy who was hanging around they just

walk down the street or get in their car and drive to the police chief's house to tell him about it. Oh, go to his house. Call the cops. Yeah. Call a number. The call's faster than the drive. Call, and then more than one cop will come, too. Then you can go meet the police chief, tell him all you want to tell him.

They go to police chief Vernon Barnes' house. That's Gann's chief of police here. So, wow. At this moment, now back to the house. That's Gann's chief of police here. So, wow. At this moment, now back to the house. She's over there. The police chief is being notified. Back at the ranch over here. Oh, boy.

Teresa said that when Robin left, at some point, you know, Cindy is now she's like alone with. With lunatics. She's alone with now Teresa and and and mean nadine is here and i don't know where greg is he's doing something in the house somewhere around with his dad i don't know what's going on but nadine tells theresa watch her for a minute or you're going to be next like wow this is okay i thought it was. He wouldn't let me eat with you, but this is even fucking weirder. So she tells her that and watch her. So when Nadine and Greg returned to the room now, Nadine told Cindy to put her sandals on because we're leaving.

Put your shoes on. We're fucking we're getting going now. All right. Now, she said, Teresa saysindy got up from the recliner and then shook her head back and forth no didn't say anything but shook her head back and forth and sat back down in the chair okay i think she said i'm probably safest in this house of the people who don't want me murdered here the man who just threw up at the thought of that yeah stay here and a woman just left she didn't seem to into this maybe she's getting help yeah so i think teresa's thinking this is probably

my safest yeah this is the last place that somebody that just left knows i don't want to be here she knows where i am i'm going to stay here they're talking about properties and creeks and where we're going to kill her and stuff if i get in that car with you i'm fucked i'm done at that point outdoors i don't want to be there. I got a chance in this house. So I think that's what she's thinking. So she sits back down in the chair. So Nadine then says to Teresa, or says to Cindy, and then to Teresa, quote, All right, bitch, if that's the way you want it.

And then turns to Teresa and says, Hand me a pillow. Okay. This is wild. What, is she going to put it behind her head and get her cozy? Yeah, we're going to get you nice and comfortable. I'm sorry. We've been dicks. Fine.

You don't want to die? Have some soup and a pillow. Here, here, fine. If I made it homemade. Chicken noodle. Put the pillow under her feet. Make her real nice. She'll be nice and comfortable.

So she does that, and then Nadine throws the pillow at Cindy. Cindy has now turned her attention away from Nadine, is now crying and begging Greg to help her. They were together as her ex-boyfriend. I mean, maybe there's some form of, you know, I'm a human being. We've had a connection at some point. You know, maybe you're a person and not a monster like your mother to which greg responds quote don't beg me bitch what which is the most evil thing he could say don't beg me bitch is the worst yeah strange family this is a third dude this is a horror movie family weird people yeah the mother's

involved this is like a weird texas chainsaw massacre family like this is fucking strange family from true detective oh god so making flowers on them that's what i'm saying it's some creepy this is like what they do yeah so theresa says quote nadine started teasing cindy with a gun she pointed at her head and when cindy would move the pillow up to her face nadine would point it at her stomach so she's like like a little kid would do with a rubber band you're gonna shoot at somebody but with a fucking gun she's doing this point and at her going haha yes indigo yeah this is evil is what this is this is torture for nothing nothing she didn't do anything she this nadine and greg got it in their heads that this is this was going on gassed themselves up all night and then said let's go get her created a scenario wow so theresa um said she got up to leave the room and walk away she said it was

too crazy for her and she couldn't deal with it because you know if you're a normal person this is beyond the realm of what you can deal with the scope wise so she walks down the hallway she said she heard a shot fired oh when she walked down the hallway, she turned around and heard Greg ask Nadine, did you shoot Cindy? And Nadine said, no, I didn't. I just I just scared her. So she fired a weapon in her ex-husband's house. She fired it into the recliner next to Cindy's head to fucking scare her on purpose. Now my chair has a hole in it.

Yep. Chair has a fucking hole in it. Shot next to her to scare this poor girl so now this girl's been tortured completely including having a gun shot at her fucking head to scare her she then again continues to threaten to kill cindy with the gun well maybe i'll shoot you in the head this time you saw it goes right next to you know it's loaded yeah then keeps taunting her with it jim now jim hork he comes out of the bathroom from being sick and nadine points the gun at him and says get back in the bathroom and stay out of it okay so he backs back down the hallway and goes in the bathroom in my house in my own

fucking house while you're shooting up my furniture this This is my house. You're shooting up my house. Lillian cannot go outside. This is my house. This is my house. I don't care if this motherfucker burning to the ground. This is my house. I show up. I say to the fireman, how did you know

my house is on fire? They say, your wife called us. I'm going to beat your motherfucking ass, Lillian. Did you know my house is on fire? They say your wife called us. I'm going to beat your motherfucking ass, Lillian. That's an Eddie Murphy joke. I always mix up Lillian and Vivian. God damn it. Lillian cannot go outside.

It's my house. It's my house. So backs him down the hallway. You're not allowed. Go back in the bathroom. Go back in the bathroom. back in the bathroom so he backs down and in his own house he's probably like you know what great this is the best place i can fucking be probably so yeah um she he goes back down the bathroom and stays out of it crazy soon

after because theresa's down the hallway just kind of hanging out. She heard three more shots, and she said she turned to see Cindy's head bobble back and forth and saw Cindy fall to the floor. She said Nadine was standing over her with a pistol. Okay. Now, at this point, mean Nadine tells her son, reload the gun. Oh, my God. More. Yeah. tells her son reload the gun oh my god more yeah while greg is reloading the gun nadine stands on cindy's neck and jumps up and down on it what the hell for she called it

the theresa said she bounced on it while laughing the whole time oh my gosh she was lunatic laughing while she has shot cindy twice already and she's laughing while jumping on her neck going yeah come on reload the gun ha ha ha ha this is this is like wow crazy cuckoo bananas fucking that's why you don't fuck with your mom this is that's why he doesn't talk back because this is what she does this is she's capable of anything so oh wow theresa said greg handed the gun to nadine and nadine got behind cindy's body and fired two shots into the back of cindy's head greg told her to finish the shots in the gun empty Empty it. Now your turn. No, no, no. This was Nadine doing it. Uh-huh. Greg said, just empty it.

Shoot the rest of the bullets. I put seven in there. Empty it. She does. She fires six. She fires four more shots into Cindy's chest now. In somebody else's house. In her ex-husband's house. Wow. I don't want to ever hear you complain about your ex-wife again. I'm going to with you she's awful she does has never showed up with a bleeding

woman held you at gunpoint in your own bathroom and then tortured and murdered her in your fucking living room that's never happened i think i'd rather at least then i could call the police and get rid of that's true that's true you wouldn't have to pay anybody anything for that but still yeah never again jimmy honestly this is unless she does this then by all means complain i'll be honest i like nadine better nadine she's certainly a party she'll boogie with you she'll boogie anyway she's done oh man if she did that made my son into what that boy is dude holy hell and if you're jim yeah you're probably throwing up from what a fucking pussy your son is turned into jesus christ shit

she turned my kid into gum bag um so i wow um i don't even know what to say about this right now um so she's been cindy she was shot five times in the chest and twice in the head and once in the back. Oh, my God. That's eight shots. That's too much. Poor fucking girl for no reason. They say later on, five of these shots would have been fatal. Yeah.

Five fatal shots. And the knife wound, if left untreated, was potentially fatal. Yeah, she's bleeding. In addition to that, there's also contusions of her neck and chin where she jumped on her fucking head for no reason. So this is a mess. The dismount now. How do you get out of this? What do you do?

First of all, a witness has left the house who's not like someone on your team. It's your ex-husband's wife. She's upset at you. She's upset. What about the ex-boyfriend or the boyfriend of Cindy who was at the motel, too? Yeah, that's what I mean. He knows that they went with the... This is not planned well at all.

This is messy. This is a giant mess. You'd have to kill at least three more people to make this fucking... To make it go away. To make it go away. And now you've got to kill Ringgold and the guy who went and told the police chief. You've got to kill the police chief. You've got to kill the police chief.

You're now up to like six, seven people you have to kill you gotta get the whole town pretty much you gotta wipe everybody out pray for a tornado everybody come on f5 wipe this place from the face of the fucking earth while i hang on my belt like twister off a fucking plumbing oh big country manhandles shack and makes everybody forget about this for a little bit please jesus christ so it's at this point that james hork here jim hork he comes out of the bedroom at the same time that gans police chief vernon barnes pulls up to the house yeah yes so jim goes out may dean says you better go fucking get rid of him go talk to the cops go talk to that guy because he's like i know him it's vernon blah blah he goes well you better

go fucking get rid of him so he goes out there and goes no everything's all right what everything's fine you had your chance um what you talking about get in the back of the cop car and say go in there and handle that shit everything's fine the door no it's good in there and vernon says well your wife came over said people were being tortured to death possible potential murder situation robin and he went that ain't right no no i'm just inside everything's fine i was watching the ball game we were boogieing and we were beating some raccoons to death that's what it was i boogied my ball i hit a raccoon with another raccoon it was ugly she got scared that my balls off. I hit a raccoon with another raccoon. It was ugly.

She got scared. That's called a boogie in these parts, by the way. I tell you, when you hunt raccoons, you hunt animals with that animal. With animals. With that same animal. It'd be like going fishing and throwing a fish at a fish when it jumps out of the water, taking them out. Same fish, though.

I don't get a minnow to get a trout. I take a trout and then when another trout jumps i'll pound that motherfucker i prefer a large mouth bass because you can really hold them by the lip and your thumb and really you flip them like a like a frisbee you could really bash that some bash that bass so that he says no everything's fine and then jim and vernon everything's fine but I'd like to come with you. Oh? And then they get in the car and drive away.

Jim said, let's go for a ride. Yes. No, everything's fine. Weather's so nice. Roll them down. Shit. Where are you going? I'll take a ride with you.

Okay. It's 1982. I got this new CCR tape. Pop it in. Let's go. Brand new. You heard Green River? It's pretty good.

Fortunate son. It's a banger. Pretty good. Pretty good. Fortunate son. It's true, too. That war needs to end soon. It does.

I can't wait. I'll tell you what. So I just, I'll just go. And Vernon, as a chief of police nothing suspicious here nothing weird a woman came from this house talking about terrible things this guy comes out says everything's fine but i'd love to leave now and he goes all right let's have a ride along wow the intuition on this cop what a what a gut feeling he's got got a real hunch you got a real hunch guy here real hunch there's a special down at mary's

diner let's head on down jesus christ what a detective what a master detective he is huh real perry mason oh jesus christ he's a lawyer wasn't he sorry very man you're looking for colombo there he is kojak colombo bingo 70s guys in trench coats yeah there you go so then nadine yeah drag cindy's body into a bedroom of the house oh boy and puts the gun in cindy's hand oh like suicide suicide shot myself eight times once in the back yeah by the way twice in the back of the head once in the back sound mad at me i was five in the chest i have had it with myself i really have it's had it so yeah then the three of them greg nadine and theresa drive back to gore where they first picked up at the motel cindy yeah and they pick up tommy mcgowan tommy hop in hop in tommy where's cindy don't worry about, hop in. Hop in, Tommy. Where's Cindy? Don't worry about it.

Hop in. We'll show you. I think they're starting their cleanup at this point. But the problem is that Jim, once they gets away from the house and Robin's there and all that, he goes, yeah, they fucking killed a woman in my goddamn house. Jesus Christ. She got shot. And all.

You know, that is very apropos of a man that hits woman. What a pussy. What a pussy. What a coward. He couldn't say anything while. While she was nearby. Not even there, just nearby. There's a cop in the fucking driveway.

Vernon, get your gun. Yeah. Because my ex-wife has one. She's armed. You may as well be. You may as well be. And go in my house and take care of this you have several give me one i'll go with you how dumb are the three of them in the fucking house

going yeah it's cool he just got in a car with the chief of police and drove away i'm sure that's fine he's gonna go watch it over yeah he's gonna he's gonna make sure it's all he's gonna get him away from here he's gonna bribe him with an a and w wow that is fucking they're dumb intense so they go in they find cindy's body in the bedroom of the house um they her heart and lungs are all torn up by the bullets it's part of the autopsy as well the um one of the they found one gunshot wound in her back two in her head like we said one just above the right ear they said could definitely have been fatal it was like a hitman shot she was shot before the cop got there yeah wow but she was dead already in there yeah he was very well aware if that cop if the door got open

he would have smelled gun smoke coming out at him i mean it's eight shots in a fucking oh house in a small house what a chicken shit cow yeah he's a small house. What a chicken shit coward. Yeah. He's a chicken shit. Unbelievable. He is an absolute chicken shit. That's a, yeah. He's a guy who. That's who hits women. Who breaks his wife's fucking leg. So they thought initially, the medical examiner thought the neck wound was a gunshot wound at first.

Because it was so big. It was big. Yeah. But then after getting some, hearing from the witnesses, they rechecked it and went, it is a fucking knife wound. Holy shit. They just looked at it and went, there's another gunshot. Just categorizing with everything. Yeah, just holes.

They said that it could have been caused by a screwdriver, ice pick, or knife. Probably the knife. And we know it's a knife from the witness here. There's another witness here, Larry Ringgold. That's the guy that went to get the chief of police he said that he saw greg nadine and theresa um at the residence on the day of the shooting because he was with vernon as well apparently he went over there also i'm gonna go see if there's a murder come with me so robin just sent some guys and then stayed in that house

yeah she stayed over there she just sent which i mean I mean, hey, good job, I guess. I mean, she's- I sent for help. Y'all got any tea? She started the whole thing going. Yeah, are we eating or what are we doing? Lunchtime? Breakfast?

Some barbecue and tinfoil in the fridge? Something. July 4th, 1982, noon. So 12 o'clock noon after this is all going on here an oklahoma highway patrol trooper uh pulls over these fucking three idiots in a car and fucking arrest them wow they received a dispatch saying keep an eye out for these morons and they arrested all three of these idiots tell you what we're gonna do we're gonna murder somebody today and seven hours later we'll be in police custody because we're not going to

cover our tracks at all wow we're going to do it in front of several non-participating witnesses which is the best people to murder in front of people who don't have anything to lose in all the situations essentially they got caught in the middle of it for christ's sake they didn't they just came to their house right we'll use your dad's house as a place to kill this chick what a fucking crazy idea and then just left her there left just put her in a bedroom and left with a gun in her hand with a gun in her hand and then went to pick up the other yeah i think she shot herself and then went to pick up the other guy because i assume they're gonna kill him too right so that's the start they do that so they bind them over they're bound over for murder here. It's obvious, pretty obvious.

There's a lot of witnesses here. It's Nadine and Greg have been charged with first degree murder. Teresa immediately tells everything she knows, flips on them, says she'll testify against them. Yeah, because I didn't touch anybody. Granted full immunity, the whole deal. I don't like that, but I like that. What the hell is she going to do? They would have killed her.

She said, you'll be next. I would have said, have said okay and she did say don't get in the car she did tell her not to get in the car i mean and she i just i don't think if mean nadine is on the war path i think you're yeah she saved herself you're in the way at that point i mean that's just not great so they're charged with first degree murder and um the they came to the court and they get bound over and um here we go they say that uh they they greg is a quote aider and a better and is the principal in the case it's as if he pulled the trigger himself he's just as guilty as his mother of the murder in the first degree absolutely says yeah he said without him she can't shoot her more and

everything like that he loaded the gun yeah everything like that um the defense asked that the charges be dismissed against nadine i guess that's the job but that's i mean fucking insane dismiss them obviously because the officers made an illegal arrest okay they didn't have a warrant for okay so the defense attorney and this is again some small town shit here the defense attorney here is is nadine says i'd like you to represent both me and my son not at the same time by the way they're gonna have separate trials but same do i'd like you to do that and he said well he said that is that's a conflict of interest i can't huge conflict of interest because i might have to yeah if i was his lawyer i'd blame you and if i was your lawyer i'd

blame him so ethically i can't do that and they went no it's okay he said but it is a he said potential conflict of interest he discussed the possibility of other counsel gave recommendations and she said nope we want you because nadine said i trust you oh nadine she is i'm gonna blame him greg stopped taking advice yeah from her by the way just separate yourself from his mother here um nadine said that she had shot cindy told tells the lawyer that and says that greg was in another part of the. Her story to the lawyer is, I shot Cindy. Greg was in another part of the house with Teresa when it occurred. He wasn't even around. So she's trying to take the rap for him. She's trying to take the rap for him. She's trying to protect him because it's a real weird relationship here. Yeah. Well, the problem is they both got charges. So what do you want me to do, Ma? Yeah. So Strout is the name

of the attorney. He quote, he stressed when he said quote to both smith and her son that in the event of either of their stories changing they should contact him immediately because the another counsel would have to take over the state of the case he advised nadine that her and her son that if any change occurred or if any third party information surfaced which altered their version of events, he would more than likely not be able to represent either of them now because he's all fucking tainted with everything. So he said that she signed a thing saying she understood a potential conflict of interest

and understood the potential risks and was okay with it. Okay. So among the items collected, a blue steel handgun with ivory grips. Wow. They were able to trace the gun to a pawn shop in Talaqua where forms had shown that Cindy purchased the gun. Cindy's gun. Oh, she bought. Probably bought it for Greg.

Right. Think about it. I mean, they were together. Do we know the caliber of it? I think it's a.22's a 22 okay um so that wow that's crazy so she purchased the gun so their defense is it was her gun so we shot her in self-defense okay but they know that's the gun that shot her so she had the gun you took it shot her with it then gave it back to her. That's what that says, which doesn't make any fucking logical sense, obviously, here. They also question big time.

One of the defense's big things is they question about the bagging of her hands, of Cindy's hands, which they do. They put paper bags over to preserve DNA evidence in there and shit like that. there and shit like that so they said that um also did they uh did they test her for any evidence of gunpowder residue yeah and they said well it's often hard to determine after a few hours and they didn't arrive at the scene till afternoon so it was also there's eight shots i doubt she fired them yeah and two of them are in the back of her fucking head and one is in her back. So they wanted to know all of that. They said that they found a number of prescription bottles containing pills and a bag of pills were found in the car that they were driving. The three of them, the trio, the murder trio.

They said that one of the prescription bottles had Nadine Smith's name on it, that they do know. So they also said they after all this the defense attorney says yeah definitely motion for dismissal here obviously um this is silly to even keep her so they said well actually we're going to keep both of them on no bond as a matter of fact because they're fucking crazy here so nadine's trial comes up now um theresa is going to testify she saw nadine fire shots from a 22 caliber pistol into cindy opening statements yeah here defense attorney says that uh now she says listen or he says listen here's what happened the woman on trial here this is really a travesty of justice. She's extremely innocent.

And you know who did this? That damn state star witness, Teresa. She's the culprit. She did all of this. Who had more to gain? She's the new girlfriend. She was jealous of the ex-girlfriend. She did all of this to her.

She's got immunity. It's all Teresa. That's what it is. So, duh. This is a, by the way, one-man, 11-woman jury. She's got immunity. attorney told the jury in his opening statement that no nadine emptied the gun handed it to her son then shot her some more yeah jumped up and down on her throat laughed yeah you know all that psychotic murder shit tortured her told her what was going to happen you know basically made her dig her own grave the psychological equivalent of that thorough danger to society kind of behavior bad stuff yeah now the trial as it gets going and it's by the

time the fifth day of proceedings comes around it's a huge deal that it's too expensive this trial this is a small county we ran out of budget these small counties are not set up for long murder trials at all they don't have this budget for them to for experts for forensics for all this type of shit so the uh they said that um the guy who was the clerk of the court for the last 24 years said, this trial is the most expensive one since he's been in office in 24 years. Okay. If completed this week, he said the trial will have cost the courts $15,000, which is nothing for a trial.

But to them, that's a huge budget. They say a jury trial never costs more than $3,000 or $4,000 there. This is $15,000. And that's if it ends quickly. Wow. So they're really. We can either buy the town a Ford F-150 or we can try this murder. We can get a murderer off this.

You want to just let her go and have. Let's just put posters up saying, look out for mean Nadine. We can try a murderer for eight days. Oh, shit. This is too expensive. What? He said the trial's averaging $1,000 a day. Twelve jurors and two alternates plus two bailiffs have been sequestered in a motel since it began.

In addition to the room rental, each juror has been fed three meals a day and receives $12.50 a day in compensation. Somewhere somewhere's a 12 grand. So he said it cost 8,000 before the jury was even impaneled. What are we going to do? Raise your taxes. I don't know. Figure it out.

This is how societies take care of things. We have a murderer. Would you like murderers? We need to fucking pay for this. Jesus Christ. Holy shit. So mid-trial, a note comes out. And this is not good for me and Nadine here.

Yes, Oklahoma State Bureau of Investigation agent testifies that a note entered into evidence here. It was written by Nadine Smith. The note is reportedly addressed to Greg Smith, her her son while the two have been in jail and it says don't worry they don't have enough money it's don't worry they've they're too cheap to put us in prison don't worry they're broke they ain't gonna feed us once we're in there they'll just let us go so in this note it says this is while they're in jail it outlines the story the two should tell when they accuse theresa of committing the murder how it plans this whole cover-up and her whole defense this is this is like a bad joke how dumb is she she's i have the notes it's that dumb

um handwriting samples were compared to the handwriting in the note they're the same robin said she found the note in her uh in her husband's drawer so jim was helping jim was going between jim yeah jim is now you coward pussy man she's in jail she killed a girl in your house for christ's sake yeah she he apparently is the go-between got a note from her and is going to bring it to the sun because oh my it's in his drawer he needs her to be in prison for him to be safe but he's helping her maybe get out of what the fuck is happening with this i think if she tells him you're going to do this he does it because he's a pussy yeah um he says he doesn't even remember receiving the note he doesn't know what happened because i received received so many, and I'm a giant pussy. Yep.

Well, here's what he said. Quote, here's what the note said. Read this over and over till you learn what to say. This is for Greg, mind you. Don't let anyone see you with it. Flush down when finished. Throw away. Okay.

Teresa put gun in Cindy's hand. Me and you never touched gun. Teresa pulled Cindy into your dad's bedroom. I did not step on her throat. Teresa did, if we are asked. I mean, she could have just saved all this with blame Teresa. Tell Teresa everything I did. It's now to flip-flop us.

I did Teresa stuff. it's now to flip-flop us i did theresa stuff everything you saw me do theresa did it it was actually teresa unbelievable um quote you have got to say that me and you and your dad was in Hork's room looking for him some clothes to take him. Oh, boy. He was at my house. We heard two or three shots, ran out in the hall. Cindy was in chair holding knife. Teresa was standing beside her with gun. Hey, Bailiff, take this to my ex-husband, please.

Please. And tell him to give it to my co-defendant. Thank you. Your dad said, I am leaving. You went to door with him and said, so, and said, as soon as we get Hork's clothes, we're leaving too. I was in Hork's bedroom. You came back in Hork's room to get his clothes. We heard three or four shots and went into the living room and Cindy was lying, laying in floor on her back.

Teresa was standing up with gun. We did not help clean up blood. Don't know where gun came from. I did not once clean up blood. Don't know where gun came from. I did not once have a gun. Teresa and Cindy were fussing. Teresa had been taking blue pills and drinking beer. Blue pills. Viagra.

Yeah, her dick is rock hard. Cindy wasn't up for fucking. She had a giant clit. Just huge. A red clit. You a huge erect. Red clit. You could see it in her pants. You could see it in her jeans. From across the room.

Holy Christ. Jesus, look at the clit on that one. She could fuck you with it. Oh, man, look at that. Teresa had been taking blue pills and drinking beer. I did not try to choke her coming from gore. Teresa was very jealous of you. I was never fussing with no one.

Teresa asked Cindy to go to Gans with us. Just all the opposite. Just the opposite. Just everything I did, tell her that's what Teresa did. Remember the story, how it happened? Now do it opposite day. Now, I get you want to protect your mom, but this is your girlfriend, and she's flipped on you. She's not your girlfriend anymore.

No. But she didn't fucking do anything. No. This is bonkers. So Teresa said that Nadine killed Bailey because Bailey had planned to snitch on Greg and Hork, but the prosecution didn't discuss in detail what basically they didn't get into any of the details. You don't have to because that's irrelevant. Who cares? What she did is what she did.

So back to the trial here. Star witness Teresa. She takes the stand, obviously. And also a state forensic pathologist corroborated pretty much everything that Teresa said about what the wounds and everything. It all matches up here. um they discovered all the wounds um bailey um cindy had the like we said five gunshot wounds in her left chest all within a five inch diameter really that's good grouping well it's probably just real close close too he attributed those as the main cause of death under cross-exination, the medical examiner said he learned from the assistant district attorney that the wound in the neck could have been a knife wound.

So he said that it's common practice to compare notes with law enforcement when investigating a death, which they do. They do because like in the homicide book, there's a case where this has happened a lot where a guy was a junkie and he fucking died in the bathroom. He fucking passed out and OD'd in the bathroom and where he passed out, his wife couldn't get the door open. Oh, shit. So she had to bash it open. So it looked like he had had his head bashed in. Right. So the medical examiner looked at it initially and said it was a fucking, you know, he's blunt object fucking force and blah, blah, blah. She's really throwing the door into him.

And the cop said, you don't understand. You have to see the scene to understand where the fuck it was. She was trying to get at him and didn't know his head was in the fucking way. It was bashing his head in the wall. So things like that will happen. So, yeah, anyway. But they're talking about all that the uh they have to compare notes so they can decide whether it's a homicide or not that's to classify it so theresa said while en route to the residence in gans nadine stabbed her with a knife that she

took out of her purse she twisted the knife around the wound in the neck by the way was three inches deep and this is fucked up it went all the way into her mouth it went through everything fuck so she had a knife wound in her neck that tracked into her fucking mouth three inches shit she hit her like right at the jawline yep got her there oh my god twisted it so she had that so she's in that kind of pain being tortured the entire fucking time oh my, my God. It's horrible. It's fucking horrible. So, wow. Yeah.

The Gans school superintendent testified earlier that Jim Smith told him he had seen the wound. This is the father. Yeah. Seen the wound and told him it was just a scratch. Dude, it was in her fucking mouth. The knife wound. She came over, girl, a scratch on her neck. Wow. Pouring blood. Blood coming out was in her fucking mouth. Tonight, when she came over, a girl with a scratch on her neck. Wow.

Pouring blood. Blood coming out of her mouth and neck. Teresa testified that Jim Smith was in the bathroom while Cindy was being killed and came out afterwards and asked Nadine, quote, if you had to do it, why'd you have to do it here? This is my house. Well, I understand. Fuck. Fuck you, Jim. Yeah.

You're a bitch. Everyone in this is an house. Well, I understand. Fuck. Fuck you, Jim. Yeah. You're a bitch. Everyone in this is an asshole. Yeah. Outside of Teresa, who her only fucking crime is picking a terrible picker when it comes to guys and families to be with. And as soon as she's not allowed to eat at the table, she should have got away from these fucking people. So the defense attorney, Monty Stout, he's everybody's defense attorney here.

He presents evidence through the testimony of Joyce Smith, who is Nadine's daughter-in-law. She indicates that she talked to Teresa on July 4th after Nadine and Greg were put in jail. Joyce said that Teresa told her that killing Cindy was necessary because Cindy stood in the way of Teresa and Greg's happiness. That's what she says. Another witness, now if she's passing notes to her son to say this, what do you think she's passing notes to other people to say? Another witness, Shirley Johnson, said that Cindy had once called her son to find out where Greg Smith was. And during the conversation, she had told her Cindy had told this woman that Cindy was going to marry Greg Smith someday.

OK. OK. Another guy, Jimmy Dodd here. Everybody's named Jim in this fucking town. Jimmy Dodd testifies that Teresa told him on the night of July 4th that she would not tell anybody who shot Cindy unless she and Greg were allowed to go free. She said, I won't tell unless me and Greg are allowed to go free and be married. No. Don't tell them. That's what they're claiming.

We already know. Nadine testifies. Oh, boy. She testifies here. Nadine testifies. Oh, boy. She testifies here. She said here that she stabbed the woman in the neck during a dispute and fired at her to keep her away from her but never meant to kill her.

Okay. She said that Cindy had threatened to inform on her son the information would have gotten him in legal trouble and that information, by the way, not disclosed during the trial. But, like we said, halfway through it, she testified. Then her defense comes in and changes their entire story. Oh, you can't do that. Halfway through the trial and says, no, no, no, Teresa did it. Oh, boy. Pick one.

Either I didn't mean to do it or Teresa did it, but, you know, not the other thing. I didn't mean to do it and I didn't do it. No, but check it out. Now, closing arguments, the defense tells the jurors that they could stop viewing Nadine Smith as a defendant and start looking at her as a human being, a person, a mother, a victim, a victim. In 65, she was a victim when her husband was beating her up. She's not a victim right now. Wow.

She's a perpetrating lunatic. Yeah. So the verdict comes in here, and it's going to be very hard to get off on this one with these witnesses. You're in a lot of trouble. Yeah. And everybody is, even the fucking ex-husband's playing along with Nadine's shit. You think the daughter-in-law's not going to? Holy crap.

Do this for my mom? Yeah. So this comes in guilty of first degree murder by the way going into sentencing death penalty on the table yeah it's Oklahoma this is a and this is as heinous and atrocious and cruel as it gets yeah so the prosecution alleges the existence of three aggravating factors especially heinous atrocious or cruel and that's literally the legal language i think this is the if you would say what's that you'd explain this murder and you go something like that yeah where you're like mentally and physically torturing them and making them really have a horrible last couple minutes of the robbery they took her purse that's the other thing the existence of a probability that sam that sm Smith would commit acts of violence and would constitute a continuing threat to society.

Nadine's a monster. That's an aggravator? That's an aggravator. She's a continuing threat to society. And that Nadine knowingly created a great risk of death to more than one person. Yeah. She's firing off gunshots in a fucking house. Yeah.

That's dangerous. Oh, man. And she went to go find the other boy.'s the other thing yeah yeah so for mitigating circumstances here what the hell could it be okay a couple people testify in her defense yeah number one is her ex-husband testifies in her mitigation sir he testifies listen to this They said, didn't your wife shoot you in 1965? Like, this is another shooting. Yeah. He says, yeah, but it wasn't her fault.

It went off during a struggle. You understand. There's a restraining order. She had a cast on. There was crutches and everything. See, you guys, you got, look, she has fire pussy. That's what it is. It's pretty good.

Like. Is that what? Even when you hate her you go yeah i miss that fire pussy it's why why my son keeps getting women even though he's a moron he's got a just a magic penis fire dick you play a flute and it rises like a cobra it's wild what why what would she have to do to get you to say anything nice about her? I can't. And she's in jail. It's conviction.

The threat's removed. She's convicted. You go up there and go, she's terrible. Holy shit. She came to my house and freaked me out. My wife ran away. It was fucking nuts. I'm throwing up in the bathroom.

She put me next to her. I'm the recliner next to this guy. While mitigating shit, he just starts saying why she's an asshole. Yeah, that would be amazing. You know, on second thought, your honor, I got nothing mitigating. I got nothing to say positive here. The Sequoia County Sheriff, Sam Lockhart, testifies that Nadine's been a model prisoner since she's been arrested.

Well, yeah, she's being watched. There's no weapons in there. So, yeah. Also, other factors they put in here from the defense, the defendant is a good, loving mother to her children, and it's been left up to her to completely raise and provide for them. So obviously she should torture people. The extent of her education consists of public schools and business college. Oh, what the fuck does that mean? Right. That's.

That's mitigating. That's mitigating. She's had a normal amount of education. Evidently. She went to public school? Evidently. I can murder at will, James. Oh, God. I have a GED.

They just call it a GED. You don't understand, Your Honor. He's got a GED. Impunity. He's a moron. He's an idiot. Look at him. He's a complete idiot.

He couldn't even graduate. Look at him. He couldn't even get his shit together enough to turn in simple high school assignments. You expect him to know it's not okay to kill? He failed gym class, Your Honor. I did. Just because he didn't show up. He just didn't come.

Unbelievable. Which I thought wasn't fair, by the way, because I played basketball outside the whole time. That's not fucking... Give me a break. You fail me while I'm playing ball? It's not just smoking weed. I did it with a handicap, for Christ's sake. I mean, I was high, but I'm playing ball? I thought you were smoking weed. I did it with a handicap, for Christ's sake. I mean, I was high, but I was playing ball.

She has held steady employment for most of her adult life. Okay. During her adolescent years, she was active in Sunday school and church, and during the early part of her adult years was active in Sunday school and church, and played the piano to accompany the choir. Oh, by all means, then. That's mitigating. Hold on.

That sounds more like aggravating she she read a book that told her not to do this and she still did it let me see your hands let me undo those cuffs for you this is ridiculous head on out there i'm sure those cuffs are keeping you from playing that piece during the years of marriage to james hork smith while she was raising and providing for the children she was beaten at the hands of her alcoholic husband and in fact suffered a broken leg as a result. Yeah. She was responsible for the children's involvement in church and she is currently a model prisoner. I'm sure.

So the defense here in their closing, he said, consider the good things she's done. Yeah. Okay. Any list you got for you? She went to church when she was a kid. She left a child motherless and fatherless. And fatherless.

Yeah. He told the jury they have two choices. One was to recommend Nadine Smith be imprisoned for life. Yeah. He said, give her under your verdict what this woman never had, ever. Give her the freedom to read, to be creative, to find herself, to take a wine and painting class and go to do yoga and maybe just have coffee with the girls once in a while, you know, and just talk about their lives and things like that. Maybe get a side business going. Sell some LuLaRoe. Give her a chance to do these things.

Give her the chance to have a rosé kind of day come on now she's a franzia kind of lady um no but she he did say give her the freedom to read be creative and find herself the rest i care but that sounds just as ridiculous you know you could still do that in prison sure well that's what he's saying don't she could do it forever let her do it forever give her the day-to-day opportunity to exist in whatever she is allowed or chooses to involve herself in. Or we could just throw her to the dogs. Well, yeah.

He said, the other choice is death. Yeah. A quick and certain and immediate death for Nadine Smith. They will place a needle in her arm and she will die. They're like, now? Can we do that? Can I watch? Can we do it before lunch? Like the weekend?? Can I watch? Can we do it before lunch?

Like the weekend? Yeah. Like now? Let's do it after lunch. I might get sick. You know what? I want to have something in my stomach. It's grumbling.

It's grumbling. I don't want to be a distraction. This is a belly full of Varia tacos. Wow. So in the recommendation here, the jury finds that what she did was heinous atrocious and cruel and the judge then has to take that recommendation and says you ma'am may fuck off death penalty they're gonna give it to her they gave it to her death penalty now the recommendations believed to be the first since richard morris was sentenced to death in 1975 for killing Henry Ellis of Salisaw by driving an ice pick into his head.

That death penalty was reversed on appeal, though. The first in this county. So the Sequoia County clerk, the guy who said he never had a trial cost this much, said he also has never seen a woman being sentenced to death in this county. Is that right? He's saying it's a first. Now her son's got his trial oh that's not gonna go well dipshit greg over here yeah um they it's the same evidence yeah theresa testifies it's bad for him same case very and robin testifies the whole time not good

so a jury uh they convict him yeah of first degree murder just the same and they give him you sir may fuck off life in prison is that right state asked for the death penalty they gave him life with the possibility of parole how because he didn't actually pull the trigger he didn't stab or he didn't pull the trigger they looked at him as like a puppet of his mother Which is probably true, but I don't really give a fuck because this was awful. You could have said, Mom, enough. He went with her on every step of the way. Mom, no more. He reloaded and said, Shoot her.

Yeah. He could have not reloaded. He could have said, No, that's enough. I put them in. Don't waste them. Wow. So, yeah. He is given that. So, the state was pissed, too. They wanted the death penalty. Yeah, I do, in. Keep don't waste them. Wow. So, yeah, he is given that.

So the state was pissed. Do they want the death penalty? Yeah, I do, too. Yeah. So the execution date is requested for them. They put in for the execution date right away. They said no date has been set yet. Her appeal to the Supreme Court was denied.

Yeah. And they said the Supreme Court will agree to hear only cases in which that they have constitutional questions of, you know, whether civil rights violated, that sort of thing. And Smith's attorneys had appealed to the Supreme Court on constitutional grounds or had they appealed. The court agreed it could not hear the case because it had no constitutional merits. OK. They explained that several appeal procedures are still open to her. Here, they said, quote, this was just their first petition to the Supreme Court. They may apply for post-conviction relief, and if that fails, they may appeal that decision as well. There's a lot of appealing that you can do, obviously. So appeals on post-conviction relief, they said,

may be based on allegations of irregularities within the trial procedure, such as alleged errors by attorneys. That's my attorney. Fuck me over. Evidence that was unavailable at the time of the trial. Now we have DNA. Somebody else was there. One of her main things is during the trial, there was a blood spatter guy.

And they say that he took like a week long course, but he pumped it up to sound like he had more expertise than he did. And there was a blue blouse that they found. And they said, whoever he said that based on the spatter, he thought whoever was wearing the blouse was the shooter. And they said, basically,

there's no way you could tell that. And that anybody who was wearing the blouse who was near Cindy could have also gotten blood. Unless the outline of a gun and arms is on the fucking sweater then how do you know so that is part of it so they say that guy shouldn't have been allowed to testify based on that but the defense was able to say you know how do you know that it was all disputed whatever so she says that letting the guy testify as an expert when he wasn't really an expert and didn't do it that well means that she should get hurt. Well, whose blouse was it?

Nadine's? Yes. Well, then let's move along. There you go. So she's saying, well, it wasn't me, though. I don't know what's going on here. So she contended there were several irregularities. Among these were possibility of a conflict of interest since the lawyers defended the co-defendants.

Wow, you chose this life. She said that. Her son there. The jury was improperly selected, of course. a conflict of interest since the lawyers defended the co-defendants. Wow, you chose this life. She said that. Her son there. The jury was improperly selected, of course, and the exhibits were admitted were highly prejudicial, meaning the autopsy pictures. I mean, there's a lot of pictures of a dead girl. That's not fair. And the jury was improperly instructed as well, obviously.

She's being housed at the Mabel Bassett Detention Center in Oklahoma City. Now, while on death row, Jimmy. Oh, boy. You know what, everybody? You can be on death row, but that doesn't mean you're not a lady. True. Yeah. Sometimes you get that not so fresh feeling.

And that's what she said. Yeah. She said, I'm a lady. She said, quote, I expect to be treated like a lady. Oh. She said in an interview or this. She's on death row. They're not even putting jackets over

mud muddles you're not even yeah i mean this is ridiculous you're not even allowed to be treated like a human never mind a lady i i believe they open doors for you that's as late as yeah that's only because you're cuffed and shackled other than that you can't do it yeah that's it she said this in her newspaper interview quote some corrections officers have smart attitudes i respect them and expect to be treated likewise and until i show otherwise i'm going to be treated like one i don't care what i'm in here for okay give it 15 years watch out you're about to get mine yeah you're gonna be get treated terribly common probably you're probably getting the same treatment as everywhere else yeah and you're a bit of a dick, too. Yeah. Because of her time there, she said that people have she wouldn't do press interviews.

She did this in the prison newspaper, this interview. She spoke to one reporter for Women's Inside News, which is a prison run newspaper here. And she says the possibility of her execution doesn't frighten her because she has the comfort of her religion. She said, my relationship with Jesus Christ has given me me strength i'm never lonely and i don't worry oh well then good cool great awesome bye then why would you bitch about anything bye just fucking see you no she's fine she said she's comfortable she doesn't need an hour of her uh rec time because she said jesus and her were doing jumping jacks earlier and calisthenics and shit and she said jesus is the best leader of the calisthenic thing.

She did sit-ups for Jesus. It's like crunches for Christ. That's what it was. So she complained she doesn't have the same access to religious services, law books, and educational opportunities as other prisoners. They don't educate death row prisoners because they're going to kill you get back to your pious pull-ups jeez yeah exactly fuck because death row inmates and a minute had have administrative segregation inmates are kept in the same area death row inmates suffer because of the behavior of other inmates they say in the

paper administrative segregation is the area ad seg where they it's for your fuck-ups you're constantly misbehaving people escape risks right people you got to take a look at the whole time the worst of the worst yeah a lot of times mental conditions down too because they don't have the capacity at mental hospitals so they just take the prisoners who need to be in an institution and just put them in a fucking cell and stare at them put them alone with nobody to why it's crazy they said this is what she said, death row and administrative segregation should be separated. If administrative segregation or disciplinary unit messes up,

we get the blunt end of it. Wow. They said only one cell on death row is dedicated to the ad seg area. The prisoners are housed in the same area because it makes sense to keep the higher security inmates in the same area. The prisoners are housed in the same area because it makes sense to keep the higher security inmates in the same area. Death row prisoners get one hour of exercise Monday through Friday and showers on Mondays,

Wednesdays, and Fridays. They said if the weather won't allow exercise in the cage death row pen there, inmates are allowed to do aerobics in pairs with a video cassette recorder in a glassed-in area outside their cells. Oh, my God.

It's almost like you probably shouldn't kill people. It's like, yeah, it's like it sucks when you kill people. It's like not fun afterwards. It's like they take everything great and rip it away from you. Super late. There's no boogieing in here whatsoever. Zero boogie to this place. Can't even groom.

Fuck, man. So they're allowed to use pay phones on mondays wednesdays and fridays for up to 15 minutes wow up to 15 minutes other than that they spend their time 23 hours a day alone in their cells obviously with the exception of jesus he's allowed in um she says she spends her time crocheting reading the bible and watching television yeah yep she said quote i like the Cosby show and clean program. I hate all these scumbag Hollywood types out there with their sex and their drugs and their mistreatment of others. I like the clean stuff when I can find them.

I love it. God, I hope we didn't kill her yet. I want her to know it's so bad. My favorite thing to do is to sit with Jesus and watch the Cosby show. He likes the Cosby show too. Two of the most victim-free things. Yeah, just totally.

She said, quote, after lunch I watch my soap operas. Days of Our Lives is my favorite. Oh, how about that? She likes the clean stuff, unless it's just plots about sex and murder. That's all it is there. She said her biggest complaint was the lack of religious services for death row inmates. She said that really is.

Yeah. That's the problem. She said that's that's the one that's driving her nuts. We got a friend on days of our lives right now we do we do we absolutely do well she would have i hope she doesn't get to watch him well we'll talk about what she gets to watch oh boy she said if she talks to a minister it's through the bean hole which is the term the prisoners and corrections officers refer to as the slot yeah the bean hole bean hole my bean hole that sounds like

where you fart yeah doesn't it it's your ass man i got rippers coming out my bean hole tonight buddy i'll tell you what my bean hole sells something fierce is your bean hole burning right now do we eat too much of that um about once a year she gets a visit with her son which i'm shocked they let why would you let them visit with each other they're murderers together in separate the last time they were together it was bad yeah through a glass wall with a telephone you know just one of them but still i don't care what's the difference she uh smith said the only person she's allowed contact visits with is her attorney and she must wear handcuffs when she sees him yeah um when she's housed among other women um while she's housed among other women she would be executed among

the men she said state laws only allow executions to take place at the mcallister corrections department there yeah so they have officials have plans for how to deal with a female execution they said but it might present special problems. Yeah, anyway. So 1997 is one of her appeals. Oh, boy. 15 years later, five propositions of error here. They said that several of the propositions

contain separate allegations of error and several propositions are interrelated. One here, she asserts that newly discovered evidence, which proves that the blood spatter guy kenneth edie witness for the state lied about his qualifications as a blood spatter expert thus presenting a strong challenge to his conclusion that she was the shooter now to me the eyewitness accounts matter way more than well i'm not even i've toned completely tuned out by the time blood spatters come because i just heard everyone describe exactly how it happened blow by blow several different people

here uh the court addressed the issue of his qualifications as a blood spatter expert they said that they found based on evidence that he did not have sufficient training to qualify him as a blood spatter expert and he was not qualified to testify on the subject of blood spatter. Thus, they say, we held the trial court on application for post-conviction relief should have determined that the admission of the blood spatter testimony was error. We find so in this case. So that's one thing. Next, they claim ineffective assistance of trial counsel because there was a conflict of interest.

Yeah. Which, yeah. She claims her appellate counsel inadequately raised the issue of possibility of conflict when in fact it was an actual conflict. She fails to designate what records of relevant proceeding appellate counsel failed to submit to this court. They said an expert witness for her stated that counsel was ineffective because of failure to request a remand hearing for ineffective assistance of counsel.

Yeah. Okay. She also points this out. The defense counsel's expressed demand all above else. Oh, okay. The defense counsel in her case, I guess, said that above all else, you've got to save Greg. Told her that. Oh.

You've got to save your son. Yeah. Which I think he's just trying to be a human being at that point. Maybe he was trying to get out of the representation. If I represent him, it's going to be bad. Yeah. You have to save him. Let's get him a different lawyer.

And then she said, too, defense counsel's loyalty to Greg has demonstrated in his argument to sever their trial where he argued that because all the evidence in the preliminary hearing pointed at Nadine as the shooter, Greg would be unduly prejudiced in a joint trial. Which is he's doing his job as a lawyer. He's doing exactly what he told you he was going to do and said, you might not want someone to do that. Yes. That's the thing.

The failure to call Greg as a witness in Nadine's trial to corroborate her testimony for fear it might implicate and discredit him, thereby demonstrating, again, loyalty to Gregg. Well, the problem is if you put him on the stand in your defense, he gets cross-examined and they're going to eat his fucking lunch. They're going to eat his ass alive for that shit. And it's ridiculous. You can't expect. And then you can't bring that up later. You can't expect.

Because you got the bad outcome. Yes. And your whole thing was save my son was what you were telling him to do. Well, we did. Yeah. Defense counsel's strategy to use the alibi offense, which was that Teresa had committed the offense without corroboration from Greg or otherwise, where there was evidence implicating Greg as the principal actor in the murder. was evidence implicating Greg as the principal actor in the murder. They said, we've examined the record of post-conviction proceedings and considered the arguments and find that Nadine has failed to demonstrate that the defense counsel's representation amounted to an actual conflict of interest, which adversely affected his performance.

In her application for post-conviction relief, she contends that the attorney should have discovered the fact that she was involved in a serious car accident in 1966 that rendered her unconscious for a time and resulted in organic brain damage yes cte she's saying yeah she it's her and a defensive lineman of the same she said according to a post-conviction psychological examination obtained by her this organic brain damage particularly when combined with drugs and alcohol which she was on substantially impaired her ability to control violent impulses yeah it's like running the power eye for 12 years that doesn't mean you can kill people again it's a sad it's up the middle babe every once in a while you run the sweep and that's

put your head down first and go on the one we're pounding it in what am i supposed to do everybody goes high go low we got marsh on lynch that's that we're going so um they said that they uh he uh the lawyer testified in the post conviction proceedings that he obtained a variety of personal information from Smith prior to trial and that the only major injury she ever shared with him was when her ex-husband, quote, broke her arm or leg or something, is what he said. Broke her a lot. So apparently she didn't disclose to him that she had been in a terrible car accident. She didn't think of it as important enough.

She probably forgot, to be honest. Yeah, you know, scrambled a little bit. Smith never mentioned anything about a 1966 car accident or a head injury as for other medical information the lawyer asked smith whether she was on any medications she said she wasn't but he did not obtain her medical records although strout considered the possibility of having a psychologist examine her he ultimately concluded there was no basis for doing so because they weren't going for diminished capacity defense. So the lawyer concluded that Nadine was, quote, perfectly lucid, had a good memory and was simply under the influence of drugs and alcohol at the time of the murder.

She simply got fucked up and said, let's go out and get her. Let's boogie. As for her drug and alcohol use, he testified he was surprised during the first stage of the trial when nadine denied being under the influence of drugs and alcohol at the time of the murder according to him in his opinion she quote did not want her parents to hear evidence about her taking drugs and drinking she murdered a girl but don't tell him i'm drunk don't tell him i did it because i was all fucked up they said we find it unnecessary to decide whether the second stage preparation and presentation were constitutionally deficient because even assuming they were, the outcome of the second stage proceedings was not reasonably affected. They said it would not, in our view, have altered the jury's findings that the crime was especially heinous, atrocious or cruel or any of the other aggravators. The attorney and blood spatter thing here, they really get into the blood spatter here.

And they also said once Smith changed her story and denied shooting Cindy, the lawyer necessarily had to find a way to challenge the blood spatter testimony. Yeah, he's already put that in. Yeah, the lawyer testified that based on the blood spatter guy's preliminary hearing testimony, he said he knew how the guy was going to testify generally and thought it was an incredible theory that he could not imagine reasonable people accepting. So, yeah, they said. Yeah. So he admitted also that he was unfamiliar with blood spatter analysis. The lawyer was and did not know any other experts in the

field. He said that a report from an independent expert in blood spatter analysis would absolutely have been helpful to the defense, but that he and Smith lacked the funds to hire such an expert. And that he didn't think the court would entertain a blood spatter expert request in a case involving a retained defense counsel. Can I get, can I, can I please get some state funded shit for my private lawyer? Right. He said if I was a public defender, maybe, but not definitely not there. Also claims suppression of evidence.

Oh, oh, yeah. They hid some shit, said that the argument concerning suppression of evidence pertaining to this. First, the, they contend the prosecution failed to disclose the fact that Teresa was promised immunity from prosecution and return for her testimony. Second, they contend the prosecution felt to disclose the existence of a tape recorded conversation that Teresa gave to police and assistant attorney, Don Baker. They're saying the tape recorded statement has slight differences between that and her testimony of exactly what happened in different times or things like that.

So, yeah, they said that, you know, come on, what are you going to do? And she's immune. Obviously, she's the killer. So they said, you fuck off. That's denied. So then the U.S. Supreme Court refuses to hear the appeal of her, who is convicted. They said that she is the closest execution of all female death row inmates in the United States, they said, a spokesman for the attorney general. She's the one going first.

Well, it's later on, but she's the closest of anybody on there. She's the running out of appeals. Running out of time, yeah. So the case will move to step seven in the traditional nine-step appeals process oh my god early november 2001 is a clemency hearing for nadine she's out of now she's clemency it's the oklahoma pardon and parole board denies her clemency her attorney said she suffered from a head injury was trying to protect her son was also all fucked up on alcohol anything just great prisoner loves jesus don't kill her trying so hard yeah held down a job and all this type of shit and they say nope no ma'am death for you so december the 4th 2001

execution day wow cindy's daughter who is now 24 years old oh she speaks up here yeah because she said lois nadine smith did not just kill my mother she shot her nine times and tortured her it has been 20 long years without my mother and living with the thought of how lois murdered her and the horror and terror my mother must have felt knowing that this animal would be the last face she would see alive calling her lowest lowest yeah lowest yeah lowest nadine she said she took something away from me that no one can ever replace she was five her mother got killed that's just disturbing her last meal actually get the last meal last meal everybody no everybody. No, no, no, no, no. Barbecue ribs. Oh. Onion rings.

Yeah. Strawberry banana cake. Really? And cherry lemonade. Not bad. Pretty good meal. Not a bad meal. Yeah.

Ribs and onion rings. The cherry lemonade. I mean, for your preference. All right, whatever. I'd rather have some soda. But I do like something sweet. I like the cherry lemonade. I like something sweet with the barbecue. Strawberry banana cake sounds pretty good. I'd rather have some soda. But I do like something sweet. I like a cherry lemonade. I'll drink that.

I like something sweet with the barbecue. Strawberry banana cake sounds good. I've never heard of that. That sounds great. I'd like a strawberry banana yogurt. It's fantastic. Like a pound cake almost. Yeah, yeah.

That sounds real good. Barbecue ribs, onion rings. So that sounds delicious. Solid choices. No vegetables. Look at that. No, she's dying. She went fuck it all.

Yeah. Pile of ribs. Give me a Beattie's meal. Give me fuck it all. Yeah. Pile of ribs. Give me a Beatty's meal. Give me another onion ring in place of vegetables. Let's find out if I have diabetes. Give me all the sugar. Let's see if I'm shaking and twitching on the way up there. In her last words.

Oh, God. She's got something to say. She said, to the families, I want to say I'm sorry for the pain and loss I've caused you. I ask that you forgive me. You must forgive to be forgiven. Don't tell me what the fuck to do. That's a Jesus thing. No, it's not.

You must forgive to be forgiven. That's fine. But you don't tell me that. You ask for forgiveness and fuck off. You don't have to forgive to be forgiven. I don't have to do shit, first of all. You don't tell me shit. There's a lot of people on death row that are defiant as fuck.

And the families come in and go, we don't care how defiant you are. We've already forgiven you because you can't take anything from us. That's just a cliche bullshit. You have to forgive me. That way you can be forgiven. Otherwise, you're hating your heart for me. Well, Jesus won't like. Yes, exactly.

She's an ass. She's being a twat to the end to the fucking last thing. Last thing she said. That's like saying, I'll pray for you. Yeah. Bless your heart. she's an ass she's being a twat to the end to the fucking last thing last thing she said she's that's like saying i'll pray for you yeah bless your heart yeah to be absent from the body is to be present with the lord oh that's exactly what she's doing exactly what she's being a fucking twat yep she also thanked her attorneys like she's accepting a grammy right and then give a good shout out to gersh give a big shout out to fucking electra records um so she uh is put to death by lethal injection at 9 13 p.m oh that night she got a one last

sunset huh yep witnessed by brandy yeah and her husband brandon brand Brandy and Brandon. Really? That's wild. Cindy's sister, Diana. Diana Secret is her name, which sounds like a movie character. That's cool. What a fucking sweet pop star. Yeah. And another guy who they listed as a friend of Secret. Oh, okay.

A secret friend. Paul Trapp's secret friend. They said witnessing the execution on Smith's behalf were four of her attorneys, a spiritual advisor and an investigator. The guy was trying to get her free, I'm sure. So Brandy witnessed the execution and she said, quote, if she really meant it, you have to forgive even though it's very hard and it doesn't help me at all. It does a little bit, but it doesn't bring back my mom. I wish she thought of this before she did what she did. We wouldn't be in this position.

Yeah, I mean, what she was doing was taking out, exacting vengeance on somebody. Maybe if you would have just forgiven, you dumb bitch. Yeah, and not done this shit. Not got fucked up and dragged everyone out at 5.30. Someone could have just said, it's 5.30 in the morning. Go back to bed. What are you talking about? Jesus. When we wake up, maybe in the afternoon.

Maybe when you wake up at nine, you'll have a change of heart. After fireworks, okay? How about that? Then Randy goes on to say, it's not completely over because I still have to go and do that until he dies. Meaning going to Greg Smith's parole hearing in May. To stop them? Of that year. Wow.

She said, I'm glad this part is over because I don't ever have to hear that she's got clemency or she's going to stay the rest of her remaining life in prison. She's got what the court handed down to her. Brandy's the badass that Jim should have been. Exactly. God damn. She got Jim's dick and balls. I don't know what happened there. In the divorce.

To the son's girlfriend's child so she was nadine was the last of three women on death row and al in oklahoma the other two were all executed earlier in the year we're cleaning out the broads everybody let's go now eight women were arrested while protesting the execution held on misdemeanor trespassing complaints after crossing a police line at the correctional center where she's being housed. They're anti-death penalty protesters. They prayed by candlelight outside. Nearby, a group of victims' advocates also stood by and had a vigil. One wore a T-shirt that said, the crime scene will return to normal.

What about the victims? Okay. So everybody go home. Yeah. Okay. I don What about the victims? Okay. Everybody go home. Yeah. Okay. I don't like either side of those. No, exactly. A couple of stats here.

She was the 63rd murderer executed in the United States in 2001. Wow. 746th executed since 76 in the United States. Eighth female murderer executed in the U.S. since 1976. 17th murderer executed in Oklahoma in 2001, 47th murderer to be executed in Oklahoma since 76, and the third female murderer to be executed in Oklahoma since 76. So at that time, only eight females had been executed in the whole country,

and three of them had been from Oklahoma. What is happening in Oklahoma? Wow. Damn. So now the Oklahoma? Wow. Damn. So now the son. Yeah. Greg. Oh, Greg.

He's serving his life sentence. He does not get out in 2001. No? Nope. He's at the Dick Connor Correctional Facility in Hominy. Yeah. But in 2009, he gets out of jail on parole. He is paroled and goes right back to prison.

For what? For possession of and goes right back to prison for what for possession of marijuana immediately back to prison the only time i've really yeah really been thankful for that law when you're on parole on a murder rap maybe don't have weed on you at that point maybe keep your fucking nose clean you did that's all uh he's given two additional years for the weed here and he's released again in april 2011 okay he gets out by 2013 he's back in jail again of course he's arrested again this is from an article behind bars saturday he is the state gave his name in talaqua and another man was hospitalized after an argument escalated to a stabbing oh my he's now stabbing he's now getting in bar fights and stabbing people wow

james gregory smith authorities allege smith stabbed another man david mcdaniel during a fight according to the detectives police were called to a local hospital saturday night when mcdaniel was treated for a stab wound to his upper chest he's going for fucking organs yeah the mcdaniel told police he and smith were arguing in the 600 block of sooner drive at some point mcdaniel told smith to leave smith did so but he returned a few minutes later in his truck a fight broke out after another confrontation and smith allegedly struck mcdaniel in the chest before driving away mcdaniel told police he felt some pain and noticed his shirt was covered in blood yeah because he stabbed he punched him with a knife he's a fucking chicken shit like his father.

They're all chicken shits, his family. He leaves and then comes back with a weapon. You are a pussy, bro. And then doesn't even like, I'm going to stab you. He acts like he's punching him. Right. So the detectives were called out to assist and Smith was found later, stopped in his car and arrested. The blood was evident on one door of his vehicle, by the way.

car and arrested the blood was evident on one door of his vehicle by the way he had the fucking guy's blood on his car yeah which was towed and stored obviously for investigation graves they said the detectives were working on a search warrant they hope will allow them to collect dna and all that kind of shit no weapons discovered um but he's being held and conflicting stories exist between smith and witnesses to fight, according to detectives. So he's back in jail. Then 2014, okay, he's out and back in again because at one point he's up for parole again in 2014. And a young lady named Alicia Mitchell started a change.org petition to keep him in jail. I'll just read it to you.

Okay. In August of 2014, my mother Kathleen was put on a bus to another state through the domestic violence shelter in Tlacua, Oklahoma, to get away from her ex-boyfriend, James Gregory Smith, who had assaulted her and threatened to kill her. On October 9, 2014, he located her whereabouts in Bozeman, Montana, and held her against her will. Over the last couple months, she had been beaten, terrorized,

and her children's lives threatened. On December 5, 2014, and we'll give you the details of this, she was able to call the police and have him arrested. Today, she was notified that they may not be able to get him on kidnapping, meaning her life is still in danger. He has active warrants for assault and battery in Cherokee County and has left the state, but yet his parole has not been violated. He was arrested and is still in jail in Montana and Oklahoma still has not violated his parole. He and his mother kidnapped, tortured and killed his ex-girlfriend in 1982. Seems as if seems as if this pattern is a norm for him, except my mother got lucky and

was able to get away. But for how long? Help put this dangerous man where he belongs. Protect Oklahoma citizens from becoming another victim. I, as well as two of my mother's children and three grandchildren, are in danger from him. He won't stop until she is either dead or he is in prison for the rest of his life. Revoke his parole and extradite him back to Oklahoma. Domestic violence is a crime that cannot keep continuing to happen.

This man will continue to harass, stalk, and beat her until she is dead. Restraining order is just a piece of paper to this guy. It will not stop him. Yeah, he's terrible. He's a fucking psychopath. Yeah, this is bad. People wrote under it their reasons for signing. One guy wrote in 2014, I came to know Greg as Scott Fane.

So he had an alias. He's a fucking murderer and Google exists in 2012. His girlfriend, Kathy, I knew as Kat. We met in a place I hang out in. He knew I was looking for a helper in the course of my work fixing houses. I had hired him on and he worked out great. He then started to change. First, Kat would never be involved in any conversation.

When she would say anything, he would start yelling at her to stay quiet. he became argumentative with me to the point i had to let him go they stayed at my house due to inclement weather and as they were living in the tent and after uh as they were living in a tent behind the gas station oh my god he was living in a tent behind a gas station till the weather got so shitty he had to move in with his boss that fired him. Oh boy. Wow. A couple days later my tires were slashed. I wonder who did that. Weird.

Word on the street is he was out to quote do me wrong and I had the gut feeling he was going to hurt Kat sooner or later if someone did not intervene. Unfortunately I did not know enough about them to do any good. I came to believe this man is extremely unbalanced and needs clinical help. I found out more about Greg, Scott, James, whoever, after he was locked up in our jail.

Let me finish by saying he needs the authorities to take him back home before he hurts someone else or gets himself hurt. Now, Kat is Kathleen. Is that lady's mother's name? So, Kathy. beats women too just like dad yep another one said i'm signing because he should never have gotten out he's a monster and what he and his mother did was horrible he is showing that he is not rehabilitated put him back in jail another one said i don't understand why this cruel man isn't back in prison where he belongs for the rest of his life. He's a danger to society and he shouldn't have been granted parole in the first place after the torture murder he committed in 82. The petition was closed back then.

Only had 129 supporters, by the way. It was a small town. It didn't get out. It didn't go. That's almost everybody. Viral. Yeah. So he wasn't in jail and this is what he was doing, what she was talking about.

James Gregory Smith, 50, a convicted Oklahoma murderer who's also wanted for warrants issued in Cherokee County, is being held for felony kidnapping and a misdemeanor charge of domestic assault. His bond is $250,000 in Montana. According to a report published by the Bozeman Daily Chronicle, police in the community were dispatched to a motel last Friday where a woman called for help. Friday at about 9.15 p.m., Bozeman officers responded to an East Main Street motel after dispatchers received a call where a woman whispered, help me, and then hung up. Oh, my God. At the motel, officers found a woman who was extremely emotional she's terrified yeah she begged to be put inside a patrol vehicle she just ran up and said please put me in a cop

car he can't get me in there right you know when the police found her she claimed she had tried to flee from greg in colorado but he tracked her down to bozeman he had been assaulting her threatening to kill her and had kept her prisoner in the motel room for two months what the fuck he has held her against her will in a motel room for two months beating and tormenting her and threatening her the cops just kept her in the car right but yeah they kept her in the car yeah they said they they kept her there yeah she was uh she said she waited until he fell asleep this last time so she could call. She was so fucking scared. Even with him sleeping, all she could do was help me and fucking close it and hopefully he didn't wake up.

This woman's terrified for her life. That's crazy. The newspaper also reports Smith claimed he and the alleged victim were drunk when he was arrested and denies holding her captive. She's just drunk booze he gets all talking she gets all accused even she's a shit face she drinks five fifths so the court records show that uh there was a bench warrant issued for him when he didn't when he failed to appear in Cherokee County for court there. He was accused

of stabbing another man in a fight, that fight. And he was, by the way, assault and battery with a deadly weapon is what he was charged for there. And that's not, kidnapping isn't fucking, doesn't trigger the parole? Apparently not. He also faced a string of other charges

in Cherokee County, including assault and battery and possession of controlled dangerous substance in August of this year, driving under the influence, unlawful possession of paraphernalia, an open alcohol container in June of this year, and driving while impaired in May of 2014. Put him in fucking jail forever. You can't in Oklahoma unless you kill a woman. What the fuck is happening? It's not fair, James. This is crazy in Oklahoma unless you kill a woman. What the fuck is happening? It's not fair, James.

This is crazy. Dude, that's a violation. You can't take a man's God-given right. To drink and drive and do drugs and beat his goddamn girlfriend. That's freedom. What the fuck? It's America. Wow.

You get to do that. What the fuck is happening? What's happening? What does it take? Put this man in jail. What the fuck does it? What's happening? What does it take? Put this man in jail. What the fuck does it take? Holy shit. What dirt does he have on Dirt McGirt? I mean, assault with a deadly weapon, possession of a battery and possession of a controlled substance in August,

driving under the influence, unlawful possession of paraphernalia and open off off uh open alcohol container in june so those are separate year 2014 what the fuck this is why that girl was saying please don't let him out of jail when they arrested him again after this because this was all the charges and then driving while impaired in may of so may june august he all got arrested in all those fucking times lock him up until those months never come again. Wow. So the charges, they request $250,000 bail. They said the prosecutors are troubled by the previous murder conviction, calling it remarkably similar to his previous conviction, holding a woman in a fucking hotel room like that. Defense attorney requested that he be released on his own recognizance. He's clearly an upstanding citizen.

It was the booze. It's just the booze talking he denies holding the woman against her will and said that they were both highly intoxicated at the time of the arrest he said that he the two of them were working in the area and she's fine in addition to they say but now they say 250 000 bail and no contact with the woman he must stay 1500 feet away from her at all times kidnapping carries a maximum penalty of 10 years in prison and 50 000 fine and uh a maximum of one year on the domestic assault charge so he's back in prison after that yeah 2017 he's up for

parole again unreal up for fucking parole like parole let's look how do you go before a parole board and go i think i really got it this time i know you let me out for murder and then put me back and then let me out and i stabbed a guy i had a bad 90 days listen guys i think i'm gonna be okay this time um they say get the fuck back there for a while longer are you kidding me um then in 2021 there uh there's a post that the woman who posted the initial yeah uh about kathleen change.org yeah she posted again and two years ago parole denied again yeah he has been denied parole twice now hopefully he will continue to get denied please keep sharing and signing the petition so we can keep him behind bars for decades to come we don't need this guy out there he's a scary bad man how long is his sentence now don't know probably decades to come 30 years he

probably got years and years and you can get parole and now in 2014 this is the weirdest thing i've ever seen there's a a drawing. Look at this here. I'm going to turn this fucking thing. Look at this drawing. She looks so nice. That's Mean Nadine in, what is it? That is drawn by Robert Prizeman. She looks like a host of a cooking show.

She's smiley, looks great. He's a British man named Robert Prizeman. He made it in 2014 it is 15 by 18 centimeters without the frame yeah it's a drawing graphite on paper

so it's a pencil drawing why did he draw it? it is in the and this nothing screams Florida more than this the Florida State Museum of Fine Arts

in Tallahassee a fucking pencil drawing of a goddamn murderer they put that in their fucking moma there does he just die he did does he just draw um murderers that were executed some british guy's cocktail napkin pencil drawing trying to impress some gal that he met on bumble florida said we got a museum for things like that up in tallahassee is that that that trampoline neck jumping broadlets good shit damn it's this there's a mr potato head and ted bundy once put together and a sculpted silly putty from a girl who once

sucked off the green river killer we got all these things here for you. She rolled that silly putty into his penis. No shit. And that's there. So if you want to go down to Tallahassee, you can see this. And that, everybody, is Gans, Oklahoma. What a town. And a fucking crazy case.

The most. Wow. Wow. Disturbing. Poor Cindy. And we can't say poor Cindy enough. No. That was no way for anybody to go out.

Why? Why would they? Except for maybe Greg. Other than him, I can't think of anyone I really want to do that. So if you like that show, tell everyone about it. Please do. Get on whatever app you're listening on. Give us five stars.

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We had a while back a few weeks ago, David Meyerhofer. We're going to get to his confession because he sat down, gave it all up, and then went into his cell and strung himself up and he offed himself. He let it all out. We're going to talk about what a guy who kills that many people and children and women

and everything else. We're going to hear what he has to say. That's patreon.com slash crimeandsports is where you get all that and a shout out. You betcha. Where Jimmy will mispronounce your name even though he wants to get it right. And when does that shout out happen? I think it's right goddamn now.

Let's please, Jimmy, hit me with the list of the names of the people who we would never put the word mean before. Jimmy, hit me with them right now. This week's executive producer is Simon Shedd who just became a Canadian citizen. Congrats, Simon. With that English accent. producers are Simon Shedd, who just became a Canadian citizen. Congrats, Simon. Good for you. Eric Rodriguez, Susan Sobosinski, Kyle Norwig,

and a 64-ounce bottle of ketchup. Annette Hollywood, Becky Visser, and Marie Storm. Thank you all so much for what you're doing. You're fucking incredible. She'll storm for you. Other producers this week are Spalding Smales, Snicker Bar, Jeremy, no, Jerry's cousin Jeffrey at Parks and Rec, Peyton Meadows.

Yeah, it's Jerry Jeffrey. Obviously. Works for the Parks Department. Happy birthday, Jeffrey. I don't know. Happy birthday. Happy birthday, Boone. A person named Boone.

Boone. It's his birthday. Her birthday. Their birthday. Somebody's birthday. Good for you, Boone uh boone it's his birthday her birthday their birthday somebody's birthday good for you boone janice hill uh joe mitchell's face pubes skeet spiller nathan at gold standard maintenance and everybody at gold standard maintenance thank you so much for what you're doing wherever the hell you're at uh brenda bre Keough, Cassidy Jones, Anna Cattuz, Kautsa, and Jones, please. With cheese. Thank you.

Anna Kautsa, Alyssa Allison, Weiss, Erica Tarnacki has two patrons. I imagine they are ones for somebody else. Christy Petsanuda, or she just loves buying things over and over. She just likes it. Multiple times. Feels good. We don't discourage. Luke Cox.

Hunter Van Landingham. The Spam Man. Naysa? Naysa. Naysa Daly. Bongo with no last name. Paula with no last name. Benjamin Griswold.

Taylor with no last name. Megan McIver. McIver. McIver. Taylor would know last name. Megan McIver. McIver. McIver. That's a, all right. McIver. Esther Marie Rico. Liza.

Liza. Adelisadoy. Atilisoy. Dave R. Chris K. Ben Stewart. Cindy Vandenbosch. Austin would know last name.

Charles Davis. Cheryl Crocker. Mandy Jones. Moo Jack. Meredith Howley, maybe? Maybe Hale, Christina Lavazza, Suzanne Jacobs, Jennifer Hunt, Blake Price, Brandon Coutant. Coutant?

What? Coutant. That's Coutant. Coutant? My grandmother would go. My Coutant. Yeah. Brandon Alsop, John Forrest, Junkie Monkey, Joni Roussau, Brent Blankenship, Grim79, Benny Mamone, Jack Dicker, Ashley Childers, Raymond Stocker, Shama with no last name, Stephanie Henderson, TJ, Garrett Shockley, Stephanie Colvin Covington, Katie Dobrynska, Sarah Mitch, Kate Salvatore, Christopher Herndon, Mary Jo

Damstrong, Vic Salvatore, Scott McAllister, PJ E.B., Susan with no last name, Jesse B., Cala Burge, Sarah Barnhart, David Askew, Timothy burleson christopher adams cheryl marie michelle layman uh joshua chandler garrison ford garrison ford what that's a good name it's like harrison 1800s or like harrison ford yeah yeah i was gonna say it sounds like somebody who's giving the speech of why alabama seceding from the union. Garrison Ford. Senator Garrison Ford will represent us now. Of Alabama. And he starts talking about... Oh, boy.

Horrible things. Eric Black, Austin Martin, Laura Benz, Kayla Jay, Alexi Del Rosario, Juan with no last name, Caitlin Elmer, BioHellHoundHD, SprinklesOnTheCake, CakeTopCock, Annie with no last name, Elizabeth Trapp, David Garcia, Gabriel, Gabriel, Gabriel, Faulkner, Will with no last name, Haley with no last name, Trudy Tallberg, Tallborg, Parker Henry, SayMoose2, Gabe Gasman, Austin Owens, Jamie Hama, Aslan, Aizalin, eiselin angelina angelia hausa salverson fucking hell kirk the turk uh cynthia cynthia whitlock daniel danielle patton maybe daniel patton i don't know which one it is it's d-a-n-y-e-l is that never seen that is that danielle or is that daniel which what are we doing? I can't tell. Oh, with yell. Danielle. It's got to be Danielle, right? I think it is.

Because the Y makes yeah. Yeah, I think it's a yell. If you said spell Danielle weird, I'd spell it like that. I'd put two L's maybe. Make it happen. I'd go, okay, I guess like that. Lindsay Bowley, Valentine Madrigal, Dennis Desgrosiers. Desgrosiers.

Absence. Desgratia. Denise Dennis Desgratia. Disgrosiers. Absinthe. Disgratia. Denise Dennis. Disgratia. Disgratia. Absinthe-minded. Melissa Wainwood. Travis Bremner.

Law Lee. Melissa Martin. Ziggy E. Kyle Garner. Emily McKenzie. Corey Thorsten. Thorstensen. Matt Sandage.

Kristen Hoffman. Maddie Springer, Hannah Peters, Susan Turner, Anna Costello, Nick with no last name, Luke Goldsberry, Benny with no last name, Matthew Jaliski, Corey with no last name, Kim Bagley, Coy Stevens, Adrian Jorgensen, Valerie Woods, Kelly Sachse, Susan with no last name, Sarah with know last name ruby soho tiffany uda uda gingia cameron attaway uh shana shana fennessey uh ryan adams mark mcclellan anna thesen tiffany amber's sister obviously and ryan adams with all of his albums you've got five bucks to throw guys guys a great guy a great guy. He's got so much money. So much money. Kaitlin Kaye. Justine Locker. Lisa with no last name. Adam with no last name. Kimberly Davis. Anthony Manzella.

Jeff Miller. Matthew Cabrera. Yes. Sandra Fellows. He's a good dude. He really is. He's a big fan. Melissa Perry.

Brooke Brady. Allison Hall. Tom's son. Declan Horace, I dare you to find a Horace. I don't know that one. There's an Anthony Michael sister on the other one. Chelsea Crum, Harry's kid.

Davey Talady. He knows who Harry Crum is. Sean Jernigan. Oh boy. Brian Dalton, Stellie Ford, Ellie Elder, Brandi Akins, Vanessa with no last name, Stella Ford, Ellie Elder, Ellie Elder, Brandy Akins,

Vanessa with no last name, Daniel Smith, Megan Masias, Gary Brown, and all of our patrons, you're phenomenal. Thank you. Thank you, you crazy,

wonderful, amazing, jive turkey bastards. We love you. We love you. We love you. Let's go out boogieing turkeys and hang out. You want to follow either of us,

easy to do that on social media. You can go to shutupandgivememurder.com. There's a list with all that stuff. Boom, boom. Links to it. Follow us. Keep doing it.

Keep coming back. And until next week, everybody, it's been our pleasure. Bye. Hey, Prime members, you can listen to Small Town Murder early and ad-free on Amazon Music. Download the Amazon Music app today. Or you can listen early and ad-free with Wondery Plus and Apple Podcasts. Before you go, tell us about yourself by completing a short survey at wondery.com slash survey.