Small Town Murder - #449 - Deadly Golden Girls - Willard, Missouri

Episode Date: December 21, 2023

This week, in Willard, Missouri, when bags of body parts are discovered along a farm, it turns out to be a very unlikely victim, that leads to a very unlikely killer. The evidence seems overwhelming, with everything from blood, to fingerprints, but is there someone else involved, that everyone is hiding, for some reason? And is there another murder?? A truly cruel, and heartless mess!Along the way, we find out that beer, wine, cheese & chocolate are apparently best consumed, with no children around, that bands don't want any murderers in their fan clubs, and that you shouldn't refer to someone that's supposed to be alive, in the past tense!!Hosted by James Pietragallo and Jimmie WhismanNew episodes every Thursday!Donate at: patreon.com/crimeinsports or go to paypal.com and use our email: [e-mail] to shutupandgivememurder.com for all things Small Town Murder & Crime In Sports!Follow us on...twitter.com/@murdersmallfacebook.com/smalltownpodinstagram.com/smalltownmurderAlso, check out James & Jimmie's other show, Crime In Sports! On Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Amazon Music, Wondery, Wondery+, Stitcher, or wherever you listen to podcasts!See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to Small Town Murder early and ad-free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. What if you married the love of your life and then stood by them as they developed 21 new identities? What would you do? This Is Actually Happening is a weekly podcast that features extraordinary true stories of life-changing events told by the people who lived them. Listen to the newest season of This Is Actually Happening on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. This week in Willard, Missouri, bags of body parts lead to the most unlikeliest of horrible murderers. back to Small Town Murder.

Yay! Oh, yay indeed, Jimmy. Yay indeed. My name is James Petrigallo. I'm here with my co-host. I'm Jimmy Wissman. Thank you, folks, so much for joining us today on another insane edition of Small Town Murder. We have a wild show for you today. I apologize if I sound terrible. I am sick as a dog, but we're going to do this anyway.

I think you sound terrible. That's all right. Yeah, I look terrible. I got a sinus issue and my face is swollen and I look bad. I look like I got the shit beaten out of me. So it's great. Yeah, I'm really having a fun time here. But this show will give me life, I'm telling you right now.

Quickly, before we get started, just want to say, shut up and give me murder.com. Tickets for the 2024 tour are on sale right now. If you're listening to this the second it comes out with early access, the week before it's out publicly, then they're still in the pre-sale mode. can get in there the password is turkey on those otherwise if you wait until the what was the 15th there the friday they go on sale they're on sale right now come out and see us the full list is on there sacramento san francisco kansas city oklahoma city austin So Kansas City, Oklahoma City, Austin, Phoenix, Tarrytown, Boston, Minneapolis. What am I missing? Milwaukee.

Milwaukee. Yeah, there you go. Durham. Yes, Durham, Nashville. Yes, and tickets are selling excessively fast. So get in there. Get in there fast. Yeah.

Make your plans. Put it that way. I'm shocked. Thank you guys so much. You did last year's show this year i guess tour is incredible you sold out everything and let's do it again and let's have big shows we can't wait yeah we're gonna have we have some real nice venues for you this year too real like beautiful places real beautiful places here we're gonna take you to some nice old theaters and uh

show you a good time i'm gonna show you is a good time all right this is good you definitely also want patreon patreon.com slash crime and sports is where you get all the bonus material and there's a lot too anybody five dollars a month or above which is not that much money you're gonna get a couple hundred back episodes of bonus episodes and new ones every other week one crime and sports one small town murder and they they cross over. So you'll like them all. And this week, because it's Christmas, this is going to come out, and we have families. Once a year, we take it easy on Patreon, and it's Christmas week. So we're going to do one episode, and it's going to be on this weird, quote-unquote, alleged cult called The Garden. There's a documentary on HBO Max about them, and it is just some real weird stuff.

Mix hippie people who want to be one with the earth with malicious survivalists and put them all in one group, and it's a strange, strange group that you get here. It's a very strange thing. Patreon.com slash Crime in Sports is where you get all that and a shout-out because Jimmy will. That said, disclaimer time, this is a comedy show it is we're comedians we're gonna say there's definitely gonna be jokes here people are gonna die that's a weird balance you might say but we make it work sorry the main rule here is we don't make fun of the victims or the victim's family

tell me more james why because we're assholes but we're not scumbags that's how that works here it's a basic deal here so if you think that sounds good wow are you going to hear a wild story today because this is a twisted weird story if you think true crime and comedy maybe should never ever go together i don't know maybe we're not for you maybe we are though maybe you're you could be misinterpreting what we're doing here you Yeah, you don't know. Either way, no bitching later. How's that? Right. There you go. That said, I think it's time, everybody. I think it's time to sit back.

Let's all clear the lungs here. Arms to the sky. And let's all shout. Shut up and give me murder. All right. Let's do this. What do you say, everybody? Let's go on a trip. Here we go. We are headed to Missouri.

Been a while since we've been to Missouri here. Definitely been a while. It's been, I think, since like April. Been holding off for this episode. We did this episode as a live show in some cities and it's a crazy-ass story. Any of the stories we do for live shows, those are really,

really insane because there's a live audience there so you know we need reactions and uh so we're gonna get them here so this is willard missouri it's in southwestern missouri so it's it's deep in missouri like it's missouri through and through about 20 minutes to springfield missouri. So down there. So it's like three hours and 20 minutes to St. Louis. Way, way the hell over there. It's in Greene County. They have a motto in this town. Oh, we love those. Okay, we love

a motto, and their website is hilarious by the way. It's interesting. It says right on it, community, education, family, growth, service. Yeah. Period after all of those. those pick three you can't have all five as your motto i'm sorry pick three maybe make a sentence with those words in there yeah yeah and then make that a motto if you don't just pick three then you may as well just why not

why stop there that's what i mean did they have like land 50 good words in a hat and they picked out five they were like we're all five's the limit that's all we can do what happened here on the willard website right on it there's a big thing and it's it's like a sign like in a window that's like taped up it's a picture of that that says help wanted help them they need help i don't know with what for the website or for the whole town to help us this place is a is a disaster please help us i don't know what they're asking for help wanted with no context to that at all just a picture of that uh history of this town the early people were mainly scottish, Welsh, and English, the first people that settled here. The first family that settled in Willard was a guy named Oscar Farmer, who was a farmer.

Well, hey. That works out really cool at that point. Couldn't be more on the nose. Absolutely. Well done. It began to flourish, this town, in 1884 when the St. Louis and San Francisco Railroad laid the first track of line running through Springfield running from Springfield Through Willard and then on to Kansas City So this became a stop between two main places and in Missouri and it was a big deal that became known as the high line

And today they made that what was that railroad is now the Missouri's premier rail trail for walking. Oh, it's a walk? Yeah. Yeah. It looks like a path. It's just a path through like an industrial area. There's like power lines and weird water towers and shit. You're like, this is it.

But there used to be a railroad here. Yeah. That makes the walk so much more interesting. That's Missouri's premier rail trail? That's the whole state, huh? I wonder how many they have. Apparently not a lot. So the city was first named Roberson after a guy named Dr. Roberson who had platted the town.

But then they realized there was another town like 50 miles away that was already called that. So they said, well, we can't do that. And that Chevy Chase movie ruined that. It destroyed it destroyed it yeah that's your cops and robersons there's like four people that understand that because even even people that nobody saw that you know what i mean that's such a chevy doesn't want no we saw it because we're weird comedy movie junkies when we were kids and we'd rent anything but people now jack palance i'll watch it sure what the fuck why not chevy chase i mean yeah it's so bad it's so bad i like vacation sure it's so bad jesus so uh the town became known as willard after mr william willard oh that's a great name willard Willard. William Willard. Your last name is Willard.

You can't name your kid William. He's Will Will. I mean, that's his W-I-L-L. First four of each name. He was from Lebanon, Missouri. He was a surveyor that worked for the railroad. So they just named it after him. Made it easy.

Now, they have a big road, US 160, the road through here, known as Olympian Boulevard, for some people that are in this town. A couple, two graduates of Willard High School have participated in the Olympics. Oh, Jesus. Yeah, Laurie Endicott, who did indoor volleyball, an idol to millions, obviously. And then another similar titan of sports, Jason Pyra it was a white guy who ran track so we don't know how successful he was and uh also a guy named bj flores is from this town who's a professional boxer who was 34 and five as a pro good boxer but he's more famous now than he was for boxing because now he trains Jake Paul as a boxer. He's Jake Paul's trainer.

Jesus, gross. That is, yeah. So nobody likes him. He posted, by the way, in February of 2022, BJ Flores posted that he was in the hospital because a dog bit his penis. Yeah. Not really. That's interesting. That's the story we're going with it was in a he suffered an injury and the doctor's report said dog bite initial encounter penile laceration

initial encounter that's his story and he's sticking to it if that's the story it was way worse he does have some some advice for you. And this is life advice for everybody here. Whenever you think you're having a bad day, just remember that story about the guy who was in the ER until 4 a.m. with a penile laceration from a dog bite. Yeah, his dog, Jake Paul. Yeah, I call my dog Jake Paul. He's about 6'2".

I call Jake Paul my dog. He gives teethy blowjobs. Did I mention I feed Jake Paul from a bowl on the floor because i do gotta tell him to stop licking his ass all the time he really likes doing that so um reviews of this town we don't know shit about it maybe it's a great place who knows yeah maybe it may be great well people seem to like it five stars here for willard from this person willard is a homey and small community on the outskirts of Springfield. I've always lived in Springfield

and went to Willard schools. There's a certain calming atmosphere here with plenty of small family restaurants and antique stores. I love Willard because it has small town charm and the benefits of a large school district. They make it sound like Doc Hollywood, but with a big school.

Everybody's super educated. Oh, it sounds like it. Yeah, well, five stars. I really like Willard. Okay. Terrific. It's a nice small place and has a lot to offer. There are plenty of restaurants and a grocery store and a few gas stations.

Is that right? You got groceries? Hold on. grocery store and a few gas stations is that right you got groceries hold on i can get gas in the town and then go to a grocery store jesus christ this is wild the modern day will never stop with the thrills and the chills i'll tell you what whole place with apples and uncle ben's wow amazing the schools are really good and the people are just good-natured. Okay. And then five stars. Born and raised here in small-town USA, Willard is a small, tight-knit community that supports each other and thrives.

Oh. Wow, everyone really likes this place. It has one of the top school districts in our state, and it shows. They really are proud of it. Yeah, on their website, too. They talk all about school district, and that's what we care about. I'd love to know where Missouri ranks in education. Not high, I don't think, at all. So if you're high in Missouri, though, where does that put you?

We don't know. I don't know. I don't know. So four stars here. The Ozarks have great traditional things for tourists to visit. Do they? Do they? Do they? Really?

You should tell everybody because nobody knows that. Ask that weird-looking man sitting in the tree playing the banjo. He'll tell you all about it, what there is for tourists to do in the Ozarks. We've got everywhere from abandoned mines to abandoned houses where your butthole in both places gets explored. Just the word the Ozarks doesn't have a great reputation when it comes to that. From Lakes to Wilson's Creek to the Bass Pro Shop and Silver Dollar City, which is an amusement park type place. It's not a dollar store.

We found that out on, yeah. It's not a dollar store, which much to our surprise. But you can get a skater boat. Oh, good one. A real good one. Three stars here. All right. If you're ever going to live in Missouri, you have to know that the weather is never

all caps consistent. Never. Is that right oh yeah it changes in the spring listen to this in the spring uh-huh one day it will be 75 and sunny and two days later it'll be snowing get out of here that's called the spring you in every place but san diego and miami that's possible that's the spring that's what the spring's weird you got jesus what a strange thing it's nice to have a variety but not if you're a weatherman you're you'll rarely be able to predict the weather oh boy i don't like that person at all gonna change you

guys because it's different get it oh my it's a real knee slapper there, reviewer. You son of a bitch. People in this town, 5,736. Wow. Pretty small town. That's not very big. Male, female, more females than males. Median age is lower than the national average, which usually in small towns it's a little higher.

In very small towns. There's a lot of people 15 to 17 years old oh here a lot of people from uh and then once they hit 18 from 18 to 24 it's way below average so that says you hit 18 olympics and then you leave to go to the olympics and have and have a highway named after you which is a great way to honor them. So then when it's the older people, there's more older people. So everyone's either 17 or 60 that lives here. All the young people leave.

It's 62% married, which is very high. It's normally 50-50, that sort of thing. Willard in race, 91.5% white, 1.2% black, 0.0% Asian, and we have 4.4% Hispanic here. Religion, 53.1% religious, so above the average. And not surprising, 20.5% of the people here are Baptist. Baptists are, as we know, the Catholics of the South or I guess the sort of the midwest southern midwest i guess i don't know what you call southern missouri that they were super south all the time no wait did he say midwest that's yeah midwest missouri is tough man because it's it really goes his many ways

swang james yeah i feel like that might that might vary from like area to area possibly in missouri yeah i guess yeah you could claim all kinds of shit there i guess yeah because it's That might vary from like area to area, possibly, in Missouri. Yeah, I guess. Yeah, you could claim all kinds of shit there, I guess. Yeah, because it's where you are. It's really in the middle of everything. You can kind of just pick what you want. As long as you don't say West Side, it's fine. Yeah.

Unless you're on the West Side of St. Louis. The East Coast is probably not going to work for you either. So other than that, you can pretty much pick your poison. 0.1% Jewish here. You can pretty much pick your poison. 0.1% Jewish here. In the last election in Greene County, 38.7% voted Democratic, 58.8% Republican, and 2.5% Independent. The unemployment rate here is about normal with the national average, and the median household income is low here, though.

It is $45,512 a year, which is well below the national average. Cost of living is also a little bit lower, though. Well, that's great. Hundreds average here, it's $87. Median home cost here, $200,400.

Okay. Not bad. That's a pretty low price. And maybe we've convinced you. Maybe you're like, damn it, I need a nice little small town, a couple of grocery stores

and a gas station, and I'm going to be thrilled. If that's the case, we have for you the Willard, Missouri Real Estate Report. All right, your average two-bedroom rental here is about $760 a month, which is cheap. About $500 below the national average. And there's an apartment complex that I saw here that looks like a nice new apartment complex anyway. So it looks like you can actually rent an apartment here. Your first house, well, you know when the first line of the real estate listing is calling all investors, that's a problem. Oh, no.

That's a problem. No, that's an issue. They call it. They say this eleven hundred twenty square foot manufactured home. It's a trailer. It's a long trailer. That's all it is. Single wide three bedroom, two bath, eleven hundred twenty square foot, super long, single wide trailer is exactly what this is. It says this home offers three beds, two baths and with a little tlc could be the perfect home tlc when they say tlc they mean uh loads of work everything in this

house needs to be replaced everything this place is a tlc it's a disaster truckloads of construction this means strip it to the aluminum and rebuild it is what it is. Because it's horrible. It's on half an acre, though, and $49,900 for it. So it's cheap anyway. And the land comes with it. It's not like you have to pay rent on the land. Oh, that's great.

No lot fees. No lot fees. House number two, three bedroom, three bath, tea bowl for each and every b-hole. That's nice. 2,0 2016 square feet. It's seven acres of land you get with this house. It is really interesting

because it's a seven car garage. There's more garage than house. The garage is like two lots wide and then there's a house that sits next to it. It's very strange. Someone used it as a car shop. So if you want to...

When you've inherited every family member's car, and it's just you and the wife. Yeah, that's all right. But you could make a lot of extra house out of it if you really had to. Not too shabby. $399,900 for that, though. That's fantastic. It's clean. It's nice.

Seven acres. It's nice. Seven acres. It's not bad at all. And house number three, six bedrooms, seven bath. Wow. This is a big old house. T-bowl for all your b-holes and one for the neighbors. 8,380 square feet. Ooh.

Bitter room. 1,000. 8,000. It's a giant hamster cage. It's all cedar-looking inside. Everything's made of wood. Oh,000. It's a giant hamster cage. It's all like cedar looking inside. Everything's made of wood. Oh, boy. They have every head of all of God's creatures are under one roof. It's like Noah's Ark, but just their heads is what they have on the walls. Six acres of property. There's a creek and a pond there. $1,375,000 for that, though.

What? It basically looks like a giant Cabela's, and it's like an outdoor shop is what it looks like, honestly. Oh, my. You could sell kayaks out of here, no problem. Jesus Christ. It's expensive. So, things to do here. Okay. Freedom

Fest. Yeah. Freedom Fest. It's basically a field with like a it looks like a like a flea market in the middle of it and then a stage where according to the pictures nobody watches the bands that are playing this is what it looks like happens yeah they have a uh they have bounce houses a parade cornhole games an aquatic center pool party oh a kid's watermelon eating contest which it says is on the stage so we all need to see that really there's a dog show also after that music from here we go we got three different bands we have betsy may and tyler giles nope nope i don't know something tells tells me they're country, though.

I bet you're right. Not a lot of real hip-hop Betsy Mays out there, I'm going to say. So that's original. Then music from the Hamburger Cows. So they'll be performing. I don't know what other kind of cows you've come across. Not the bacon cows? No.

Jesus, Jimmy. Way better than that. And then doing a long set, they get an hour and a half. Everybody else gets 45 minutes. The Domino Kings follow that. And then the big fireworks show. So everybody line up. Oh, yeah.

It's going to be something here. Then after that, there's also the beer wine cheese and chocolate festival oh that sounds wonderful those are it's all things that i love that's good i was waiting for something bad to pop in there i was waiting for waiting for like mayonnaise to make an appearance or like something of that nature and then never popped up cheese pussy pizza come on yeah everybody everybody oh and poison there's all you got to watch out one booth is poison so Wine, cheese, pussy, pizza. Come on through. Yeah, everybody. Everybody. Oh, and poison. You've got to watch out.

One booth is poison, so you've got to avoid that one. I was waiting for it. Well, we're not going to tell you which one. Yeah. Because otherwise, beer, wine, cheese, and chocolate sounds too good. It sounds awesome. Where's the catch to this here? Yeah. They invite you to the 10th Annual Beer, Wine, Cheese, and Chocolate Festival,

a unique tasting and shopping experience for guests 21 and older, obviously. Included in your ticket is live music, which they don't tell you the band, so they must be wonderful. Worth the price of admission right there. There's a kid on a recorder in the corner. Yeah, just a guy with an accordion. Hot crossbones. Yeah. Educational seminars in the four categories.

That would be beer, wine, cheese, chocolate. Right. Or whatever the fuck it is. Yeah, beer, wine, cheese, chocolate. And live cooking demonstrations from some of our top local chefs. Okay. Don't miss out on the VIP pairings dinner happening before the festival. A four-course meal where each course is paired with a local beer and wine

so it's a get shit house festival four course and there's beer and wine with each course so that's eight drinks one of the 5,000 people that live here you've had eight drinks at least that's a lot for one meal

there's only a limited amount of tickets tickets are $70 a person Jesus! That's for the meal one meal. There's only a limited amount of tickets. Tickets are $70 a person. Jesus. That's for the meal and to get into the festival. This is what I like here. Both events are strictly 21 and older. No children, no exceptions. All caps.

No exceptions. Keep your fucking... Don't come to the... No, we're getting drunk and fingering each other. Keep the kids at home. This is going to be a wild night for mom and dad. Come to this gate trying to haggle with kids. Nope, not happening.

Leave them in the car. We don't give a shit. We're all drunken here. We're drunk and stopped up from too much cheese. Leave us alone. We're having a keys party. No shit. It's like eyes wide shut in here.

Leave us be. We all have weird bird masks on and shit. It's like eyes wide shut in here. Leave us be. We all have weird bird masks on and shit. Strange. So crime rate in this town, what we are interested in here, property crime is about one third below the national average. So pretty safe there. And violent crime, murder, rape, robbery, and course, assaults here is about half the national average. Oh, great. Yeah. It's a pretty safe little town. So let's talk about some murder that happened to and by some very unexpected folks, okay? Jesus. All right. This is a weird case altogether because it's just not what we come across very often.

When it's like you consider perpetrator offender you know it's like boyfriend girlfriend husband wife wife husband ex ex-boyfriend girlfriend of this person a new boyfriend girlfriend of that person oh kidnapper rapist you know all these different categories very rarely does this one happen so it's a So it's an original here. Let's go to October 6th, 1989. Okay. Let's take this all in. It's a quiet, nice day.

Willard, Missouri. Farm Road 105. Okay. Oh, yeah. Is that Olympic? It's not Olympic. That's 160. Okay.

Come on, Jimmy. Get your Central Missouri fucking roads right. Dude. Bro, you have a map out never what's wrong with you how many times have we have we cruised the highways and byways of central missouri you should know better you were the one driving you don't know what's going on here so farm road 105 which is just what it sounds like of yeah a road two-lane road on a like through farms and shit in the middle of perfect you know nowhere here there's a lady named jean walker who's a teacher at school and she's driving home after work so you know she's decompressing cursing about children oh boy Imagine what the car ride home for a teacher is like. I don't want to.

Those aren't even your kids. I was so mean to them. There was at least two that said my name on the way home, screamed it. Just, God, Jimmy! There's other people. Barbara, you little bitch. And this one, Tommy, I, God damn it. Jesus, I swear to God, I'm going to poison that kid's lunch.

I'm going to put something in his peanut butter and jelly. I'm so sorry, Miss Morgan. I still don't like you, but I apologize. Yeah, now we know why you were so grumpy. That's the thing. As an adult, I understand why teachers were grumpy. I'm like, oh, imagine having to watch that many kids that weren't even yours. And tell Mr. Morgan I apologize.

Jesus. Yeah. I can't imagine what it must be like when they go home. That's what I need. When they get to the house. Oh, Jesus. After that ride home and then it's still not done and they got to unload that shit to their spouse. Poor spouse.

So she's driving home and on the way home, this is crazy, she sees a black duffel bag on the side of the road. Yeah. So she goes, wow, that's weird, and just keeps driving. No, that would be the smart thing to do. She slams on her brakes like there's a kitten in the road and says, I'm so curious of what's inside this black bag. If I get questioned by the cops, i get at least bereavement pay right what yeah what are people's fantasies or what's in black bags on the side of the road first of all what's best case scenario right do they picture like oceans 11 and they were coming from vegas

with like a truck with the back doors open a van and one of the bags of money fell out as they went over a bump on a farm road baby face nelson threw one out in 1929 after he robbed a bank trying to get rid of the evidence. He's trying to make the fuzz swerve off the road. Throw whatever he had at him. Chase that. That's what I mean. Like, what is your goddamn fantasy of what's in there? To me, best case scenario, dirty socks.

Best case scenario. Best case, right? Best case scenario, somebody on their way home from a business trip decided they didn't want to wash those when they got home. Fuck it, I'll buy new ones. That's best case scenario. I'm not bothering about the luggage. It's never a bag full of unmarked bills. I'll tell you that right now.

No. With no ink all over them? No way. Never, ever, ever, never. Yeah. Even if it was money, it was from a bank robbery and it's covered in ink and that's why they threw it out. You can't use these.

It died. That's why they don't want it because they know they can't spend it. So. It's all a lighthearted nightmare on our podcast, Morbid. We're your hosts. I'm Alina Urquhart. And I'm Ash Kelly. And our show is part true crime,

part spooky, and part comedy. The stories we cover are well-researched. He claimed and confessed to officially killing up to 28 people. With a touch of humor. I'd just like to go ahead and say that if there's no band called Malevolent Deity, that is pretty great. A dash of sarcasm and just garnished a bit with a little bit of cursing. This mother****er lied. Like a liar. Like a liar. And if you're a weirdo like us and love to cozy up to a creepy tale of the paranormal. Or you love to hop in the Wayback Machine and dissect the details of some of history's most notorious crimes.

You should tune in to our podcast, Morbid. Follow Morbid on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to episodes early and ad-free by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. In May of 1980, near Anaheim, California, Dorothy Jane Scott noticed her friend had an inflamed red wound on his arm and seemed unwell.

She insisted on driving him to the local hospital to get treatment. While he waited for his prescription, Dorothy went to grab her car to pick him up at the exit, but would never be seen alive again, leaving us to wonder, decades later, what really happened to Dorothy Jane Scott? From Wondery, Generation Y is a podcast that covers notable true crime cases like this one and many more. Every week, hosts Aaron and Justin sit down to discuss a new case, covering every angle and theory, walking through the forensic evidence,

and interviewing those close to the case to try to discover what happened. And with over 450 episodes, there's a case for every true crime listener. Follow the Generation Y podcast on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to Generation Y ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus. She pulls over, gets out of her car, zips this bag open like a lunatic, and makes a discovery here, which is... And if we find out, too, about two minutes later,

this bag probably would have been found anyway, and she wouldn't have had to traumatize herself which is hilarious she finds unzips it sitting on top you see there are bloody paper towels first of all making a layer and on top of the bloody paper towels are bloody trimming shears oh and bloody paper towels now yeah a reporter later on would say quote she's curious enough to open it more and it's a pair of legs great what size are they she saw wow i'm looking for i've been looking for a pair of legs but she saw bloody trimming shears and bloody towels and paper towels and said i want to see what else is in here i'm gonna going to keep going. I'm going to keep going. She didn't say, whoa, hey now.

At the bottom of this is where the stacks of 50s are. Yeah. Well, they put this over so to keep the looky-loos away. You know what I mean? No one's going to go past layers of bloody towels to get to our money. Silly rabbit. I'm getting your money. They didn't depend on old Jean here persevering through it all.

Jesus Christ. So she opens it up. Holy shit, there's legs. What the fuck? Yeah. Just at this time, as she's reviling from this amputated legs in a bag, human legs, just at that time, her neighbor happens to pass by driving by her neighbor also happens to be the chief of police of course he is that's us that's a small town didn't have to do this at all

gene he might have saw that and went gee wonder what's in that bag since i as a cop you're the only person whose job it really is to be curious about that sort of thing and he wouldn't have been curious he would have saw the bag and said fuck legs i gotta open i know it's legs it's not gonna be money i know that much you know that's what he's gonna say i've been doing this a long time i know it's not retirement no that is a severed body part in there i'm sure of it so he stops and there are two more bags plastic garbage bags deeper away from the side of the road kind of by some shrubs also yeah and uh a quote is the body parts were stacked on the side of the road and it was an odd way to hide the body because it was a fairly well-traveled road

yeah obviously if the teacher and the chief of police were on it at the same time it's not like right now yeah it's not like it's a back trail or something. It's just there. So they discover this in one of the bags is a human torso. Oh, no. A torso. That's nice. This torso is cut in half long ways like you would do with a cow.

Yeah. Like what Rocky punched. Yeah, split in half, making sides of beef, which is, that's something right there. When somebody does that, it's one thing to cut legs off, but then when you start slicing torsos open, you're dealing with internal organs. You've got to have some stomach for that shit.

That's a real mess. Yeah, that's disgusting. Yeah, that's something I couldn't deal with, so that's wild. That's hatred. That's a very personal thing it's either that or it's a very professional thing one or the other because that's you know that's what the fucking mafia would do to people you know like it's efficient put them in a bathtub and butcher them out like a cow so being capable of that is oh you got to be cold that's cold to be able to do that to a human

that's something so the rest of the bags on the side contained more body parts as we'll talk about um also more bloody towels things like that so they find the legs they find the torso then they find another bag ahead. No arms, though. No arms. They know. They never, ever find the arms of this woman. It's a woman that they can figure out. But no arms, but the rest of it they have here.

Is the only tool that they found to do this the shears? They don't know, but that's what they found here. They don't know what it was done with, but that's what they found here. They don't assume that garden shears are going to open a human torso. Yeah, that's a... found here. They don't know what it was done with, but that's what they found here. They don't assume that a garden shears are going to open a human torso. Yeah, that's a... But this is disturbing. This is a...

I mean, it's bad. This is a game of hangman you can never lose anyway, but other than that, this is the most disturbing shit I've ever heard of. This is bad. You have the most dangerous landscaper on the planet just out there free. Jesus.

Oof, man, that's disturbing disturbing so they had to try to figure out who this was they figured out it's a woman an older woman they figured it's not a young it's not a teenager or a young woman so they're trying to figure it out so what they need to do is they have no fingerprints or anything so they need people to come forward and say i'm missing somebody i'm missing somebody and so the way they do this is they say well we have the head right the head's in pretty decent shape oh so let's go in who's that artist kid we hired down at the department to do them sketches call him up sit him down at a table and then plunk that head on the table in front of him. Tell him to sketch that out if he likes drawing so much.

The guy that draws when people do bad things around here. We haven't had anything bad. Let's get our money's worth out of him. Make it live, young man. This is just someone who really loved art. As a kid, they had dreams of doing artwork and being an artist, and now there's a severed head on a table before them, and they're like to as a kid they had dreams of like doing artwork and being an artist and now there's a severed head on a table before them and they're like make it look alive it was like oh shit get that book from the scholastic reader that showed you how to draw faces yeah

yeah they're not severed ones though they know god it gives you like vague shapes of faces and you can i remember that take hairstyles and eyes and nose and plug them onto the never could do it i suck it wrong so bad nope they don't have that i don't have that in my brain all those books were like it's so easy anyone can do it which made it even worse for me because i'm like not me you cocksuckers thanks a lot he said anybody and he just made me feel like anybody alone yeah like it was like remedial reading anybody can do it with some motivation no i don't have the talent for that so they did and they the police create a sketch of the head and um they released that to the media

anybody know this lady by any chance? You know, she's older than 50. That's all they really have. Maybe in her 50s, 60s, something like that. Head. Anybody missing someone without a head? Anybody? So the cause of death is found to be a single gunshot wound to the head from a.38 caliber bullet.

Okay. All right. Now, they released the sketch, and they talked to all the neighbors, of course. Two of the neighbors in this area heard a noise similar to the firing of a gun coming from the area around 10.30 on a night that they thought when they think some of this could have happened. Okay. So that's a problem we'll talk about later anyway. So let's talk about some people now. All right.

Okay. We have a horrible mystery of a dismembered body and a woman with a head sitting on a sketch artist table. Let's leave that for a second. We'll trade you all this for two arms. That's it. Yeah. Trying to figure this out. If only we could find the arms, that would help a lot. So, trade you all this for two arms. That's it. Yeah, trying to figure this out.

If only we could find the arms, that would help a lot, which is probably why you can't find them, because it would be easier to identify her. Let's talk about a lady named Wilma Plaster. Okay. Okay, Wilma. Wilma was born in Ozark County, Missouri, in 1923. Oh.

Oh, yeah. She meets her future husband when she's 15. Really? Yeah. He's only 17. Oh. Oh, yeah. She meets her future husband when she's 15. Really? Yeah. He's only 17. So let's all take a breath of relief there. Everyone was expecting, he's 32. And, you know, the pastor of her church or some shit.

But no, it's good. He's 17. She's 15. They meet. It's young romance. And they love each other. Yeah. All that sort of thing.

They marry. She's born in 27 then. 23. She's born in 23? She's born. They meet. It's young romance and they love each other and all that sort of thing. She's born in 27 then. 23. She's born in 23? She's born in 23. You were born in 21 then. Yeah, it's 21. They marry six months later. Yeah.

Quick little courtship. He's 18. She's 16. Yeah. Everybody's happy. World War II comes along. Poor bastard. Right in the fucking thick of it.

Absolutely. Her husband's name is Layton and Layton signs up for World War II and becomes a pilot in the Navy where he flew in the South Pacific. Awesome. That is a bad ass dude.

That's dog fighting and shit. That's crazy. Dog fighting the Japanese over the ocean in a single engine plane that is balls yeah you couldn't carry with a fucking wheelbarrow that's impressive get in a prop plane if it no hovered around the airport no if people were serving me champagne and feeding me meals during it and i had the best pilot in the world and everything else i'm not even getting in it this guy's like no'm not even getting in it.

This guy's like, I'll go up in it and I'll have, go ahead and shoot at me. I'll shoot back. I'll take off from a boat on the ocean. Yeah. And then I'll land on it. I'll return to that after I'm done shooting people out of the sky that are trying to shoot me from the sky.

Balls. He did it. Fucking sack on the sky. Did he survive it? Yeah. He made it through. He he made it through came out the other side and uh wow after that that he becomes a pastor of their the pastor of their church and i mean yeah he's a kind of a cool guy he's a world war ii pilot war hero guy that's story that's a cool dude yeah everybody was like gathered around him and looked up to him for that and um yeah so that's that's what it's like that's the wilma and layton and

that's they have uh the church is the center of their life she's the pastor's wife so you know somebody new comes into town she's the one who comes in and goes over and welcomes them and yeah she's she'll she'll show up at your door with pie you know what i mean she's bringing pie over like you just know it or or fried chicken get one of the two get the taste in your mouth it's coming so there's something happening here so they have a nice life they have four kids okay very nice uh which is wonderful and uh they raise their family and they're very happy for years and years. The kids end up when they move out, they have a nice life.

They don't even have like the, you know, empty nest thing where they then don't like each other anymore. Then they just start hanging out and going out and doing more stuff together. Once the kids move out and they, you know, have a great relationship there. It's so weird that people would meet when they're 17 and 15 as teenagers,

you know, that's like a junior and a sophomore in high school meeting and then actually still liking each other 50 years later is pretty impressive yeah it's rare if you meet i can't imagine staying with that girl i dated in high school no we would oh god one of us would be arrested by yeah how different have you grown just now you know i had 20 years to that so yeah different person they go out there's pictures of them like going out like they look like they're definitely going to do something country western because he's got like a country western shirt she's wearing like a like a colonel sanders tie hell yeah you know what i mean like a white They look like they're definitely going out doing some sort of line dancing or something. Yeah.

Some kind of country concert. I don't know. Branson. Hardcore Branson. Fantastic. So 1984 comes along now. Yeah. And they've been together for so many years.

And he survived single engine dog fights over the pacific and everything else now he's confronted layton's confronted with something that he can't beat here and uh brutal he is diagnosed with als which lou gehrig's disease as we know and it is that's about the worst disease you can get. I'm trying to think of a worse diagnosis, and it's tough to come up with one. I mean, I'm sure maybe there are, but, I mean, that's a race to the bottom there.

It's a bad one. Yeah, and that's parsing, like, who's more callous at that point. Yeah, who's worse, Bundy or Gacy? It's like, yeah, it's bad it's it's bad it it's rather be raped while you're alive or whether when your head's removed and you're in a forest which one or after when you've uh two weeks later when you're less a bunch of skin yeah how about that so it's a bad disease is what we're saying really bad um he's diagnosed with it and only five months and 15 days after his diagnosis he dies so i mean there's not a lot

you can do now i know there are treatments now though i don't know about 1984 what it was if it was just like whoa you're fucked i mean i don know. Maybe they just said that. They're like, ooh, hands off. You may have had a second person since Lou to get it. Just him and Lou. Man, not feeling so lucky now. So now Wilma's alone, and now she's got to find a life. She doesn't crumble. She's no wilting flower. No?

She still goes to church and everything because that's her jam. But, I mean, now she starts making friends and going out doing things and partying and you know going to branson and watching shows and oh yeah it's a if you don't know by the way um branson missouri is a strange hot spot for show business it's like a weird uh it's like a Midwestern Vegas without the gambling. That's the best way to put it. It's also small Memphis. Yeah, that's a good way to put it. Yeah, it's between Nashville and Vegas.

That's kind of like what they want it to be, but it's mainly just old people watching shows of other old people. But they draw huge crowds there. Huge. Massive. Massive. They have 10,000 seat fucking places that they fill. I mean, these huge theaters. People will go there, build a theater,

and then just do basically a residency in their own theater and just make hand over fist fucking money for years and years and years. It's wild. But hey, more power to you. So she meets a woman friend that they start someone to go out with because, you know, you've been married for this long and then your husband was sick and all that. So you haven't been going out on the town. Companionship.

Yeah. Something. Similar age, similar likes, interests, just a good friend that can go kill some time with. Somebody to talk to also, you know. I'm assuming after all that, maybe someone with similar experiences in their life. Sure. So Janice Cook is that lady, that they become good friends. They start hitting the town together, start going to shows, and they go country line dancing a whole bunch.

Fuck yes. They do some fucking Billy Ray Cyrus boot scooting, boy. Let me tell you something they absolutely fucking do it man so um you know she's she's making friends now there's actually church people that think wilma's getting a little wild oh look at her she's going out she's i can see her neck this is crazy you know like her neckline is below it just her neck. This is crazy. Yeah. You know, like her neckline is below it, just her neck. Oh, right. I mean, geez, it's crazy.

I saw her ankles last week. This is wild. See her clavicle, see her sternum. We got to reign her in here. This is wild stuff. I don't know what color her chest is. Yeah, but she's just enjoying herself. It's the 80s.

This is like 1987, 88, 87. I mean, people go out. They have a good time. She's trying to have fun just trying to blend in and she's not an old woman at this point no i mean she's what is she she's born in 23 so she's fucking 60 60 in her early 60s that's you know just sit in a rocking chair and retire and with a book at that age you're looking to have a companion and do things my mom has a 392 charger

same age yeah they're running around that's what i mean crazy race yeah my dad's in his late sick almost late mid 60s and he fucking always on his motorcycle and everything else it's just it's not a yeah you're not a crumble in your rocking chair age like it was back in the day yeah boy oh those people were like a hundred when they were 65. Like this person. How are you still alive tomorrow? Yeah. It's wrong with you.

Look at you. But nowadays people in their sixties are, they're doing great. So, uh, she's the same way. She, um,

she meets a man as a matter of fact, a couple of years later. Yeah. And 88, 89. She meets a nice man named Carl and he's a nice older gentleman he'll he'll stop by at church with her sometimes he doesn't live around here though so he has to come in to hang out with her he lives in arkansas so yeah he comes to branson to hang out that's how

they met and so yeah he comes and hangs out with her and janice and those two they go out cutting up on the music scene. Cutting it up. You know it. You know they're just having a ball here. And he's just a nice old guy, too, looking for companionship. Everybody says, wow, that Carl, she found a nice guy there. So October 3rd, 1989, Wilma's daughter Linda, who is her oldest daughter, I believe,

she tries to get a hold of her mom, and she can't get a hold of her mom, and she can't get a hold of her. Wilma's can't find her. They had talked like three days earlier, and Wilma, this is how Wilma's got a life. She's buzzing. She's not sitting around waiting for calls from the kids. She's happy to talk to grandkids and talk to the kids,

but at the same time, she's like, I'll talk to you when I have time, because Wilma's got to cut a rug rug here she's got some shit to do she told her daughter that i'm pretty busy i got stuff going on for the next few days i'll talk to you in a couple days call me back in a couple days which is cool as shit she's just like i'm doing stuff leave me alone give me 48 hours to be wilma i'll talk at you later i'm not babysitting go away no so like okay shit so linda waits if you know waits the requisite couple of days and then calls her back and uh she doesn't answer the phone so she's like that's weird she always answers the phone

but she also says i haven't talked to her in a couple days who knows what she's doing maybe she spent the night in branson yeah yeah yeah who knows so that's the october 3rd she can't get a hold of her and then october 4th goes by october 5th goes by then october 6th she still can't get a hold of her mom october 6th it's announced that the body is found in parts on the side of the road okay now linda just based on the fact that she hasn't been able to get a hold of her mom, is worried because she hears it's an older woman that they found on the side of the road. She thinks, my mother, obviously,

what are the chances of her... She just doesn't run with people who would... Right. She's not part of a cartel or anything. She... Yeah. Hangs out... No.

Out of a 63-year-old woman. She hangs out with a couple other 60 year old church people and they go country line dance and usually that doesn't end in someone's torso being cut in half for the most part so she's just scared so she doesn't know though so um um they say you know fuck this is this is weird so linda decides to go down to the police station and speak with detectives and make sure it's not her mom basically oh and uh they show her the sketch and they said that she shoved the drawing back to the detective and said quote it can't be it can't be my mother and don't show me that again oh she just it's good she's in denial

yeah i mean it wasn't even didn't even get halfway across the table to her she was like i don't want to see that wow which means it's it's a problem and um fucking bob ross over there yeah he's oh man he did a great job too i've seen like the picture of her alive and the sketch and you're like oh yeah you can put those together big time nice job to get that from a severed head is pretty good honestly it's impressive so uh the and then dental records now they know which dental records to check dental records would confirm that it actually is wilma plaster oh they have found so obviously family devastated you know the church is blown away by this sure she's just doesn't lead the type of lifestyle that normally leads you to be

dismembered on the side of the road yeah she's not like a college girl who you know went to some frat party or something i'm not saying that'll lead you there, but you know what I mean. Your lifestyle, the more people you're open to, it's just different. There's more stories of people going to a frat party and not leaving the same way they came than 63-year-olds

going to church and not leaving church the same way they came. Or even like Ted Bundy, who's just cruising for them in the parking lot. That's who he's targeting. a young pretty girl they're not like oh let me let me get grandma over there i bet you she's got some something i want like it's just not normal you know so leland was that the husband's name which husband layton her layton layton yeah cheesy poor poor lady like he would have never allowed this shit to happen no absolutely not this seems like layton would have uh he's a tough man up the fired up the plane he's a tough man and the

picture there's a picture of him too him and her standing by one of these single engine planes and he's in his like you know fucking state buff marshmallow man uniform with the with the fucking cravat and all that shit going and that little chef's hat on. Those baggy white pants. Yeah, little fucking burger chef hat on like he's about to whip up a burger and fries in the 50s. Cheese on that? That's fascinating.

There's a thin line between would you like fries and a shake with that or dodged Japanese dog. Yeah. Or war hero. Salute to you, sir. You brave, brave son of a bitch. Would you like another scoop with that or brrratatatatatata.

It's so weird. So strange. Entirely different guy, but they look the same. they look the fucking same very strange same uniform maybe that's why the pilots don't wear those anymore that's probably why uh the the burger shop boys did wear them so they felt tough yeah otherwise pink shake as japanese shoot at you through the air you don't want them screaming out i'll have fries with that motherfucker like that's air, you don't want them screaming out, I'll have fries with that motherfucker. Like that's,

I mean, you don't understand that anyway. It's in Japanese, but still to know that they know is not okay. It gives them power at that point. So they go to Wilma's house and her house looks like you'd expect a single 63 year old woman, 66 year old woman's house to look clean and pristine.

Yeah. You know, that's just how they all look. Raked carpet. Yep. They said the cops even said it smelled pristine in there. Didn't smell sour or just, you know, like nothing. Pristine nothing. Yeah.

Yeah, the only thing, though, as they looked around, the only thing they found out of place was that they figured out that the gardening shears and a knife that they found in the bags on the side of the road are from this house. There's a knife missing from the block that matches that knife, and there's a gardening shear missing from a set of gardening shears out in the garage. And they put that together. she has got the whole set also enough to where they're like oh she would definitely not lose one of them this it's got to be that one you know what i mean she has the trimmer the hedger she definitely has and there's a space right there for it you see it's like outlined on the garage wall puts it up there yeah wow she's got it together she had all the knives all of them i guess yeah not one missing somewhere that broke or somebody borrowed it yeah i used one as a tool and broke it yeah that happens i've done that myself i've done that a texas roadhouse one

in its place one year back in the day i just moved into a place an apartment i didn't have any tools or anything this was back in the day we got a christmas tree i used a knife from the block to saw the bottom of the christmas tree to get it to fit into the fucking in a stand i used a serrated to start with and then when i fucked that one all up i went to like the straight edge one and just really trimmed down the wood at the end there so that was we were missing all the big guns out of that set that was a problem it was an issue how awful is a roast with a paring knife. Sorry, I have to. It's Christmas.

Carve the turkey. Would you hand me that paring knife? How's the tree look? That's what I want to ask you. Even, right? Had to do it so it didn't tilt in the thing. You know what I mean? It wasn't even on the bottom.

Maybe that cheese cleaver. Unreal. Unreal. So I can carve the turkey. maybe that cheese cleaver unreal unreal i feel like such an idiot for doing that but i had to hilarious you know i was like 23 probably too which was also it's all i had i didn't have a fucking sawzall or anything of that nature so the they conclude that and also her car is missing from the garage. Oh, really? She's got a Chevy Beretta that's missing from the garage there. Yikes, he says.

That wasn't even like a thought. That just came subconsciously out of your mouth. Yikes. Had a couple friends with Berettas in high school, because they were a shit car you could get for $1,000 as a high school kid. 80s, you know, they're 10 years old, shitty Berettas. And man, were they hunks of shit. They rattled everywhere.

Chevy just made the worst sedans. Just the biggest pieces of shit. They all sucked. Between the celebrity. I mean, yeah, they all did. Ford, Dodge, Chevy, they were all pieces of shit. Yeah. Until the 90s, they started making nicer ones, some of them.

Yeah, but the 80s was just. Fucking Cordova. Oh, that's the 70s now. Tornado. What about a Tornado, Jimmy? How about that? Tornado, yeah. Tornado, a Cordova, and all that shit.

There's so many bad sedans. There are. Fucking Fifth Avenue, the New yorker they were just oh yeah awful cars no balls no god jesus so the shadow 160 horsepower giant four-door sedan like that's not gonna work so heavy so reliant k car yeah oh those pieces of shit the aries all those uh that's the same yeah just a square fucking car because they made the same the same body in three different brand names they do all that it'd be a dodge it'd be a plymouth it'd be a chrysler the same shit just a different name yeah it's all in a serious it's all a dodge omni. Whether it's an Omni or a Plymouth Horizon or a fucking Chrysler. Those are the three little ones, yeah. So the thing also they notice in the garage, and part of that is because the car is missing,

so they have access to the floor, is that the floor and everything in this garage is absolutely spotless. In a garage, the floor is dusty. There's people sweep their garages, but nobody mops their garages usually unless they're doing work with stuff on it. Right. She's got a Beretta. That thing's leaking all kinds of shit.

Oil everywhere. Oil, transmission fluid, all sorts of shit. Ah, antifreeze on the walls, for Christ's sake. Probably blood. We don't know what they're putting in there. We don't know what Chevy's doing in the 80s terrible our cars now now with a positive blood our cars bleed our cars will bleed for you that's how great our cars are so union employee blood all over this thing oh this is good this is assembly line blood right here. So they notice it's really clean, like cleaning product clean, too clean.

So they go, let's get the Luminol out and spray it on the floor here. And then everything comes to life because they find giant swirl patterns of blood in the middle of the room, in the middle of the garage. Are there any cleaning solvents that can beat Luminol? I'm not sure. i'm not sure i'm not sure if you i don't think so because you'll well the thing is it'll come up with like what the cleaning solution so like it'll glow a bunch of that cleaning solution so if there's a big spot with all bleach everywhere that's a pretty good indication that that's where it happened but that shit reacts with like the hemoglobin in blood. I can't believe I just spit that word out.

Spit that out, Jimmy. Spit hot fire. Hot hemoglobin fire. The shit that's in blood. And that's what glows. But like, is there anything that, I don't think there's anything that breaks that down fast enough that you can't see it. I'm not sure. I'm not sure either.

And in 89, I really don't know what they knew. I do know that I've never, ever, ever seen a crime show where blood was everywhere and they sprayed luminol and it didn't work. Yeah. Yeah. Bodily fluids are found. Yeah. Yeah. It's all a lighthearted nightmare on our podcast, Morbid.

We're your hosts. I'm Alina Urquhart. And I'm Ash Kelly. And our show is part true crime, part spooky, and part comedy. The stories we cover are well-researched. He claimed and confessed to officially killing up to 28 people. With a touch of humor. I'd just like to go ahead and say that if there's no band called Malevolent Deity, that is pretty great.

A dash of sarcasm and just garnished a bit with a little bit of cursing. This mother****er lied. Like a little bit of cursing. This mother f***er lied. Like a liar. Like a liar. And if you're a weirdo like us and love to cozy up to a creepy tale of the paranormal or you love to hop in the Wayback Machine and dissect the details of some of history's most notorious crimes, you should tune

in to our podcast, Morbid. Follow Morbid on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to episodes early and ad-free by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Welcome to the small town of Chinook, where faith runs deep and secrets run deeper. In this new thriller, available exclusively on Wondery Plus, religion and crime collide when a gruesome murder rocks the isolated Montana community. Everyone is quick to point their fingers at a drug-addicted teenager, but local deputy Ruth Vogel isn't convinced.

She suspects connections to a powerful religious group. Enter federal agent V.B. Loro, who has been investigating a local church for possible criminal activity. The pair form an unlikely partnership to catch the killer, unearthing secrets that leave Ruth torn between her duty to the law, her religious convictions, and her very own family. But something more sinister than murder is afoot, and someone is watching Ruth. With an all-star cast led by Emmy nominee Sanaa Lathan and Star Wars' Kelly Marie Tran, Chinook is available

exclusively and ad-free on Wondery+. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. I understand that anybody who's paid attention to the media would have to come to the conclusion that I killed my wife. Hi, my name is Zach Stewart-Pontier. I'm one of the filmmakers behind The Jinx, and I'm excited to bring you the official Jinx podcast. We'll be revisiting all six episodes of part one and watching along with part two as it airs on Max starting April 21st.

Bye bye. The official Jinx podcast. Listen on Max or wherever you get your podcasts. So they say like someone had a towel and just swirled something on the floor it's right in the middle and so the cops go well this is probably where she was dismembered because this is where the bulk of the blood is here a lot of blood shot in the head with a 38 isn't gonna like that no she didn't get her throat cut somewhere so she probably all her blood was still in her they dismembered her And so they figured they probably dismembered her pretty quick, too. Yeah.

She was ready to bleed freely like that. And, yeah. So the cops go to the neighbors, okay? And one of the neighbors said that he heard a loud bang on October 3rd. Yeah. Like a gunshot. He went into his garage because he said it sounded like something fell in there, like maybe a can of paint. Okay.

And decided that there was no cans of paint that fell, but who knows what the fuck it was. Heard a noise, never mind. Going back to bed. That's the thing. If you only hear one gunshot, you go, what was that? And you listen for more and you go, I don't know. Could have been anything, I guess.

Yeah. That's what you do. That's what you do. If you heard three more after 10 seconds you go those were gunshots i'm figuring out what the fuck's going on but one you go what was that noise a gunshot no that was fireworks was it this was it that i don't know cherry bomb it happens most people go was that gunshots and everybody goes i don't know maybe and they go didn't hear anything else yeah stop you go well i guess it's fine i didn't hear anything else. Yeah, you stop. You go, well, I guess it's fine. I didn't hear a scream afterwards. No scream, no sirens.

Let's get back to the party. It's like when you hear brakes screeching somewhere. You say, huh? You stop for a second. You don't hear, and you go, I guess everybody's fine. Open another beer. That's it. So, yeah, another neighbor, an old lady, said she saw a silver car parked at Wilma's house over the last few days on and off.

At one point, this silver car even pulled into the garage. Oh. So making himself at home, and that would mean that Wilma's car was not in the garage at that point. Can't be. Can't be. It's a one-car garage from the house here. So the police decide, decide well we got to find this and the only evidence we have and the only thing we have to go on is silver car

so they put an apb out on a silver car that'll do it that'll do it and the old lady who told she didn't know make model any of that shit she just said i don't know it's a silver car medium sized so there's a 10 million of those on the road as a matter of fact through the picture of her she is standing next to her silver car which is a silver like chevy celebrity she's standing next to and you're like that's that's how many silver cars you're standing next to one that's how she knows it's silver that's it like this like my car so they're searching and searching they want to find wilma's car because they figure that would be the easiest thing to find because it's an entire fucking car. Yeah.

Can't really hide it too well. We'll see. Somebody would probably dump her car or something. We also know the license plate of that. That helps as well. That helps. So they end up actually a hotel employee at the Ramada Inn in Springfield. As he's pulling into the parking lot to go to work, there's a radio broadcast broadcasting this information that there's a missing, this dead woman.

The police have come up with this car. They're looking for this car. If you see this car, please contact police. Here's the car, maroon Beretta. Here's the license plate. And this happens as the man is driving past her car in the Ramada Inn parking lot. Hey, look, maroon Beretta. He literally is like, there's a maroon Beretta license plate.

He looks. He's like, I'll be a motherfucker. That's the car. It's got to be the same feeling as when you're listening to the lotto numbers and you're looking at your ticket. And you're like, you didn't even. Right now. And you were just getting other shit. And you were like, that could be a Powerball too. Yeah, whatever. You didn't even think about it. Just draw them at your ticket. And you're like, you didn't even. Oh my God, right now. And you were just getting other shit and you were like,

that could be a Powerball too. Yeah, whatever. You didn't even think about it. Just draw them on your own. Yeah, it's in your cup holder in your car. You didn't even fucking take it inside. You didn't care. Right.

Yeah. So then you went out and got it. So they saw the license plate. They come, they search. They find the car. They tow it away. Looking for any evidence in the car they might be able to find. The other thing that's gross is they end up searching through all of the dumpsters in

the Ramada Inn, which, think for arms. Oh, they're still looking for those. They're looking for the arms. And we've got a car. It's here. Maybe they dumped the arms in the trash. It's as good a place as any to look with. So they sent these cops to pick through.

And hotels have massive dumpsters full of, I mean, the grossest shit ever because it's a hotel. Nobody cares. They live like animals in there. The amount of rubbers in there is crazy. The dumpster's half semen. Let's be honest. It's half semen, let's be honest. It's half semen.

Yeah, you've got to wade through it. Condoms and whatever else people are jacking it in. I don't know. It's just disgusting. Sheets and blankets at the hotel decided that bleach wasn't strong enough to fix this. Yeah, blood and bodily fluids of all kinds covering them. It's disgusting in there. Yeah.

And so someone had to pick through all of that looking for looking for arms too that's best case scenario is i find decomposed human arms that's that's great so uh that's what they all that's what they do and um at that point the police say okay we have a car we have something we feel like she's dismembered at home yeah but we don't know who to talk to so they talk to all of her friends and family and they say you you know, anybody we should talk to, any friends of hers that might know who she might have gone with. Maybe she met somebody and went with them or, you know, whatever. Just how can we do this? They ask.

Yeah. They ask the kids what she's been up to, you know, because they would know possibly what your mom been doing. And they said, well, she didn't have any enemies at all. She's a nice old lady. He went to church and, you know, did line dancing. Like,

well, who the fuck is she going to piss off? No, she was, she had a big, uh, she was selling Coke and this other cartel moved in and they said, not on our turf.

You know what I mean? It was a, it was rough. Somebody real pissed about her fucking watermelon crawl. Yeah. Yeah. Super upset about it. They said you should talk to her best friend Janice.

She's been her best friend since our dad died. She started hanging out with her and they've been best friends. So they talked to Janice and Janice said, well, we haven't seen each other in a while because Janice started seeing someone like having a serious relationship. So rather than hanging out with Wilma, Janice was hanging out with her boyfriend. Yeah. Which happens. You know what i mean they said the kids said wilma was actually kind of upset because janice sort of ditched her yeah i mean yeah you get a dude and now all of a sudden you

don't want to hang out but janice wasn't mad at her janice was just hanging out with her boyfriend so they're like i don't think janice would kill her because wilma was sort of a little upset that she has a boyfriend now that's not a real good motive for a 60-something-year-old lady to kill another 60-something-year-old lady. Jealous I'm having bread pudding, I'll murder you. Yeah, Jesus Christ. Dorothy would have stabbed Blanche in the face over a cheesecake long ago if that was a thing that happened on the regular. So upset I'm having a tapioca date, i'll kill you in your own home in your own home

so that's not a thing they said that she had ended her relationship with carl because they said any men that's who we really want to talk to yeah i said well she had a boyfriend but she ended the relationship and they said okay was he upset why did she end the relationship and they said well she ended it because she found out he was actually married and had a wife in arkansas so carl would just come to branson and live a whole nother life whole other life and then go back to arkansas and hi honey i'm home and that was that he's carl and branson he's charles in arkansas no shit so that's what he does so police are like we'd love to talk to this guy yeah a guy whose wife i mean not only his fucking deal him and his wife we'd like to talk to because she'd be as a reason to be pissed off

at wilma and this guy has a reason to maybe try to get her out of the fucking picture too so yeah we need to talk to carl so they talk to carl he talks voluntarily comes in oh they call him he drives from arkansas sits down with him he says well the whole time in question he was in arkansas and has plenty of witnesses and alibis and he never the time she's missing the whole time in question, he was in Arkansas and has plenty of witnesses and alibis. And he never. Oh, the time she's missing. The whole time she's missing. From October 3rd through the time the body's found.

This whole time he's never been in Missouri. So they're like, you know, they said that they did a whole thing. They looked into it. He never owned a silver car. He's never rented a silver car. His wife doesn't have a silver car. His brother doesn't have a silver car. He doesn't have a silver car he doesn't have access to a silver car also so they're like okay uh they go well it's not you obviously but what about your wife now she could be so mad if i'm with somebody

for 40 years we build a life and then i find out he's going out you know having a good time and boot scooting with some other broad in another state. I might be pissed off enough to do something about it. And Carl says, well, I can guarantee you it wasn't my wife. I know for sure. And they go, how the fuck can you be so sure? And he goes, because she never found out. That's why she never found out I was cheating on her.

And I'd like to keep it that way. If we could maybe keep this between us, if you know what I mean. Wink, wink. She doesn't know right now. She doesn't know now. You ask her a thing about a missing woman and she's going to find out right then.

That's when she's going to find out. So Carl's like, believe me, trust me when I say you don't need to talk to her because she doesn't know anything. So they're like, this is hilarious. What if you guys happen to have a largemouth bass so I can prove I was fishing? I'm going to stop at the store and grab a trout. Perch, anything.

I'll take a crappie. I'll do anything. A walleye. Rub it on my neck, make me smell fishy, and I can take it home. Give me a halibut. I don't care. I'll say it. I don't know how I found it in the lake.

It doesn't matter. I'll say I went to Alaska. I don't give a shit. It's fine. So that's funny. So they go, okay, we can rule Carl out. His alibi checks out in Arkansas, and his wife never knew, so it's fine. So they talk to Janice, and Janice says, we haven't been hanging out, but Wilma was upset

with me, but I was never mad at her. I obviously wouldn't kill her because she was upset with me about finding a boyfriend. I was too busy fucking my boyfriend. Like, who am I going to kill? What the fuck? So they go, okay. They go, but she did make another friend since we stopped hanging out so much. Is it paint can, man?

So that's a thing. No, no, no. None of the neighbors. She met another woman that she goes out on the town with named Shirley Jo Phillips. Okay. Now, Shirley Jo, apparently, Plaster, they had been going to, let me give a quote here. She became a member of a fan club for the Cody Brothers. They were a pair of brother singers who had a show in Branson.

Brother singers. Brother singers. Brother singers. And their picture, they look identical. Oh, really? They both look like low-budget Wayne Newton. Like country Wayne Newton, if you had to make them. I don't know. Country Wayne Newton.

It's a very weird thing here. And they had to do this show. And they said after she joined the fan club, became friends with a woman named shirley joe phillips who was the vice president of their fan club oh yeah wig so yeah so she became started hanging out they started going out going to events together concerts out for drinks dancing they're always seen together shirley joe comes to church with wilma they go that shirley joe's a shirley a nice sure is a nice girl and all that kind of shit and everything's nice um they asked shirley joe what is it that you liked about wilma plaster yeah and she said this must be a southernism

or something because this means something very different in other parts of the country she said wilma was my friend she first came on to me like a mother figure which just strikes the ear odd but I feel like she's I get what she's saying it just doesn't swear yeah but I looked at her like an older sister so oh that's what she says okay so she would look after me but I saw her as my equal She was like an older sister, because she's a few years older. She's not much older, by the way. She's, I think, eight years older than her or something. So like a sister range, definitely not a mother.

Certainly not a mother. No, definitely not. So Shirley Jo Phillips was born Joanne Jackson and became, she kept the Jo. That's the only part of that fucking name she kept two letters yeah uh she's born September 18th 1936 so actually 13 years so that's a good distance but still in the sister range no yeah well it may be in Missouri in the late back in the day but not now hopefully so she grew up in Atoka Oklahoma oh and uh she And she grew up on a hardscrabble kind of farm. Mom and dad.

I've never even heard of that place. It's got to be mad rural. And this is like toward the end of the Dust Bowl, too. So this is hard times in Oklahoma. This is southeastern Oklahoma this is in. Oh, boy. It's rough. eastern oklahoma this is in oh boy it's it's rough um they lived on 40 40 acres east of town but they're very poor because the farm doesn't produce a whole lot east of a town you've never

heard yeah yeah outside of that town that you've never heard of holy shit they had no electricity in the 30s still and no and then in the 40, as she's growing up, there's no electricity. So, I mean, we've already beaten Hitler and she doesn't even have a fucking, she can't plug something into the wall. That's wild. And no car either, which is tough when you live on a farm outside of a town. How do you get anywhere or do anything? Yeah, what do you do? How do you take your goods in to sell?

I don't know. You know? You got a horse them in? I suppose. You got a carriage a cart like it's 50 years earlier so her father is edmund jackson and he was the county treasurer for a little bit in the 30s like right when she was first born and leela would harvest that's the mother leela jackson is her mother she would harvest sweet corn and potatoes and peanuts and all that kind of shit. Sweet corn, potatoes, peanuts.

They also had chickens and cows, too. So they would do that. They'd make dairy and do that kind of thing, too. But it's things that you have to sell a shitload of. Oh, a lot. A lot. Yeah, yeah. This is a farm.

I mean, that's what they're doing. So they're not breeding like rare quail that you can yeah some fucking steak just yeah we know we jerked the cow off yesterday he's feeling great so shirley said quote i felt blessed with the crops this is shirley joe here it was strictly country living basically a happy life dad and i were extremely close he taught me how to fish how to take care of the horses he was the one who guided me mom was pretty strict okay so she definitely likes her dad better than her mom and that will continue throughout her life dad showed me how to do the fun stuff and mom was just like really mean about everything i suppose she was strict and dad was

just i guess outside it's easy you don't have to be that strict when you're teaching someone how to fish and take care of horses that's a party yeah homework is different yeah so she said that she was uh you know she said she's a well-mannered child and all that sort of thing she had to keep the house clean because her mom was out doing farm work. She said, I was fussy with my things. Very neat. I had to be. It was up to me and my sister to keep the house clean. Mother worked in the fields an awful lot.

And when she was home, she was canning. So she's not alone with all this shit. I have to can it to sell it. Yes. She said it was pretty much up to us to keep the clothes clean and ironed. That iron was heavy to the kind you heated up on the stove. Oh, dear God. It was just a piece of iron that you'd get hot and put on something.

With a hook on it that had like an ivory coating around the hook. Yeah, so you wouldn't fucking destroy your hand. So you wouldn't throw your fucking hand. Man. She said, though, it wasn't a bad life until she was 15, which is 1951. Her mother sought a divorce finally because she said her dad was a deadbeat okay in the divorce it said that edmund had quote failed to provide food shelter and clothing for the children that seems like it's a valid complaint that's a failure

it's all the shit you need yeah that's the first that's day one three things you need he's not giving any of it so fuck that so layla wanted custody of shirley joe she's the youngest kid should they have three kids shirley joe's the youngest she wants to keep her but in december of 1952 the court gave edmund custody he fought and got it yes and back then they would do that they just give it to the father a lot of times, which is really weird because you would think they would give it to the parent who could provide

the better life for the kid or whatever. Edmund doesn't even have a home. He lives in a boarding house with other guys. That's where he lives. It feels like Leela's argument had merit. It seems like it. He can had merit. It seems like it. He can't even provide shelter for himself.

No, it's fucking wild. See, he's in a boarding house with other men, so they can't have a teenage girl in the boarding house. That's not okay, obviously. So the thing is, though, her father, Edmund, is half Choctaw. Oh, great. He's half Choctaw, so he's half Choctaw so she was sent to the Goodland Indian School which was an orphanage oh

yeah which is not great it didn't sound like one no it sounded like somebody was trying to do something good but I think that's just a name I think it was just

somebody's last name a building full of people of poor children who they were trying to not help them very well it's Tom Good, who is a very mean man to children. Yeah. It's it calls it a school. It's more of an orphanage.

Yeah. She ends up leaving the orphanage and graduates from Oklahoma City High School and basically never turned back to look at a toka with her dad again. Didn't want to do any of that. So from 53 to 89 here from when she's, you know, 17 to current day, our story here,

she's married, she's divorced. She has a son. Oh God. Glenn, buddy Minster. We'll talk about him. He's a real prize.

He looks exactly like Cletus, the slack jawed yokel in live action from The Simpsons. That's exactly what he looks like. It is disturbing what a fucking dipshit hillbilly he looks like. I'm telling you. So she had lived in many different states, Shirley Jo. She's had a full life, man. She went to Michigan,

Washington, Texas, Missouri, Oklahoma as well. We know that because she was arrested in Oklahoma City and in Lawrence County as well for forgery and embezzlement. All right. And they were later dropped these charges when she promised restitution and paid restitution. I think it was a job. Okay. So we don't know if she was having like a don't tell mom the babysitter's dead situation where she was trying to float petty cash to the next paycheck and forged a receipt or something.

We have no idea what this is for. But whatever it is, there was money missing and she happened to have the exact dollar amount? She certainly took it. Yeah. Money she was empowered to watch over without her right to taking. Yeah. money she was empowered to watch over without her right to taking yeah so 1982 is when she moved to springfield and she had been doing temp secretarial work yeah and apparently that she has was terrible at that also okay well he said imagine she was fired repeatedly had problems at this job fired

from that job she's not good at all this shit at all. Hell yeah. Yeah. Corporate sucks, man. It's so hard. Yeah, you know, she can't go in temp work. You want to know who you are and if you're part of the team or not. Sure, we all get it.

So she is living in Springfield in an apartment right now. This is in 89. Driving a 1978 Cadillac covered in Cody Brothers stickers. Fuck yes. I mean covered. Like not just on bumpers. All over the fucking car. Like it's wrapped.

Like it's a wrap except an 80s wrap which is just stickers. It's just bumper stickers overlapping each other. Yeah. Her father died in the 70s. He's been dead a long time uh she has a burgundy cadillac covered with john paul cody fan club stickers jesus and one of her neighbors said quote my husband called it the john paul cody car the car had it written all over it so she's that lady with that crazy lady with the crazy car now 1989 may 1989, May of 89, because we're in October 89.

This is all going down with Wilma. Well, May of 89, Shirley has a fight with her mother, Lila. Okay. In May of 89, right around Mother's Day. They speak. Yeah. Well, they did up until now. Yeah.

Up until 89 in May. And then Shirley stops talking to her mother. Done with her mother. Had enough. Yeah. Up until 89 in May. And then Shirley stops talking to her mother. Done with her mother. Had enough. Done. Yes. So after her mother, after she's done talking to her mother, she really is in the Branson music scene a lot. Vice president of the fan club, like we talked about.

They go to restaurants and do all that kind of shit and hang out and do everything. They go to restaurants and do all that kind of shit and hang out and do everything. She met Wilma when one night they were all out at a table at a restaurant and someone told Shirley Jo to come over here because there's someone I want to introduce you to that I think you'll get along with. And that's Wilma Plaster. Hell yeah. That's how they became friends. She's a widow of a minister. And, you know, she said all of her friends said she's a real good person, and she's fun, and she laughs, and she's willing to do more things in her later years.

She's not so stiff. Isn't that fun? Fun. We see an older woman and another older woman that are not married, and we just go, you two should hang out, and then they do it. woman that are not married uh and we just go you two should hang out and then they do it but if guys meet another older man we're like you've made it this far by yourself you'll be all right you won't want to be together you don't hang out with me no we we you know we don't we don't oh you like dodge i like chevy i don't want to talk to you like men will find something i don't feel like talking to you women will make it work men don't form relationships in their 50s or later. No.

We're done by then. It's over. We've had it. So Wilma said, or I'm sorry, Shirley said, in Friends, I really look for someone with whom I have things in common. Well, that's unique of you. That sounds so happy. That's what most people do. Someone I can meet for lunch, and if we're lucky and have money, we can go shopping.

Anything we do, I want us to have fun. And Wilma was that way also. She was a girl's afternoon kind of gal. Yeah, let's go out and get some lunch and go to the mall. We did so many crazy things together. I wonder what their definition of crazy is, by the way, compared to. Compared to what I believe. Yeah, we went to Tijuana and, you know, I don't hear that going on.

Played piss roulette. It was great. Neither of us had been in a helicopter, she said. Well, you know what? That pushes me out of my dare. I'm not doing that. No. One day we were driving to Branson and we passed the helicopter place next to the 7-Eleven, the helicopter place.

Next to the container store. Yeah, right there. Next to the self-storage, there's a helicopter place. So we said that, she said, I had a friend who worked there and I said to Wilma, let's go up. Okay. Wilma said, no, no, no, but we ended up on the doggone thing okay yeah at one point oh no no at one no no she's not jimmy list she's a master storyteller check this out how she wraps this up at one point this is a huge punchline so brace yourself at one point when we were up there

she reached over and grabbed my hand and said oh lord that's it that's the punchline that's her that's her big story but once we were back on the ground we laughed about it about what the fuck did you laugh about that you were scared what the fuck are you talking about remember that time you said oh lord was amazing. You were sort of scared for two seconds and then it was fine. Remember that? So she said sometimes. I would have shit my pants the whole time. Yeah.

Yeah. It wouldn't have been, oh, Lord. It would have been, I smell shit, is what people would have said. Oh, Lord, I apologize. I'm a grown man with shit in my pants. Oh, boy. That's bad. Can we land now?

This is uncomfortable. So she says, sometimes we do planned things, mostly in the evenings when we go to a show and maybe dinner. But we do unplanned things, too. We went bowling. We even talked about roller skating. We had a lot of fun at different times. We had conversations about the past and the future. A lot of girl talk

you know it's all very normal shit yeah just we're two ladies hanging out so they totally no stories to tell you i'm so sorry oh lord is the best i have we once went bowling does that help isn't that weird we talked about trippy right maybe one day i mean we didn't, but we discussed it. Because it's best for people in their late 60s to fall on hard concrete surfaces with their hips and ass. That's great for them. Fly around in a circle on eight wheels. It's going to go well.

I'm sure we're going to get messages from 68-year-old roller derby people, and that's a thing we will. But in general, though, people are made of a heartier stock nowadays too a 66 year old natey nine wasn't getting on roller skates if you're in your 60s and you're roller derbying reconsider that please i beg you yeah probably but then again i see there's like 75 year old guys that are skateboarding and i'm like please don't do that. No. Stop doing that. No. So I guess that'll happen. Or maybe their grandchildren hate them, and they're like, yeah, try a 1320.

You're going to hate this when I bust my pelvis and you have to take care of me. So the last Saturday in September, so I remember October 3rd was when Linda was supposed to call Wilma and couldn't get a hold of her. But this is the last Saturday. Shirley Jo spends the night at Wilma's home last Saturday of September. They went to church the next morning, which was October 1st. Okay. They went to church in Branson. Several people commented on Wilma's new friend and said, Phillips is a real sweet lady and all that.

And they were seen together at church. Then, uh, the, on October 2nd and 3rd, there are mixed, mixed stories of where or when they were seen. Uh, there's a place called the top rail lounge and they hung out there at some point because there's two different employees jimmy shelton and linda dorsey who are employees there and they both said they saw phillips and plaster wilma and shirley joe together at the top rail on the night of october 3rd but jimmy shelton had made a prior statement to the police that he saw shirley jo and Plaster together on Monday, October 2nd. But then later on, he says it's the 3rd. Yeah. Now, that's interesting.

And also, they said that there was another employee who said maybe they were there both days. Maybe. Everybody's drinking on the job. Yeah. Essentially, they were there at some point. No one knows when or how or whatever. Yeah. They don't fucking know.

But it was fun. Yep. They might have been there both days. One day, who the hell knows? So they can't tell. On that Monday, a friend saw Wilma at a garage sale. Oh. Then Tuesday, a friend told, or Wilma told her friend that she was going to Springfield on business.

Now, by Sunday is when her body's found, if we keep this together. her friend that she was going to Springfield on business. Now by Sunday is when her body's found, if we keep this together. And she said she will call her business by the way is the Cody brothers. That's business. Business. She would call her when she got back either late that

night or the next morning. So we'll call. But she didn't call on Wednesday. Never called. then thursday her friend drove to wilma's house and it was all dark in there and nobody was there so she's like okay well i guess if i don't know where the fuck will miss she never called me back and then sunday of that week is when she's id'd by linda so okay yeah um anyway uh they talk to then the day after Sunday, she's found. Okay. So that's October 6th.

Now we'll go to Monday. Now, Monday here, the next day after that, Shirley Jo Phillips drove to her friend's house in Olvie, Arkansas. Or Olvie, Arkansas. One of those. Okay. Never heard of it either, one of those. Okay. I never heard of it either. It's okay. Nope.

Shows up at her friend's house, some lady. Shows up at her trailer here. And what she does is, not for a social visit, this woman was surprised to see Shirley Jo. Shirley Jo goes into her car, into her Cadillac, and cuts out a bloody seatbelt. Yeah. That's normal.

Which side? It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter. Either way, if a seatbelt's soaked through where it needs to be cut out, it's not good. That's an explosive flow. That's a lot. That's not even heavy flow. I'll tell you what, buddy. it happened on the way here i'm so

embarrassed hadn't had it for about three years apparently i stored it up it all came out at once i guess it's a mucus plug or something i don't know i'll tell you what it looked like the elevator and the shining that's all i know it was horrible i gotta take this seat belt on out of here the shine and that's all i know it was horrible i gotta take this seat belt on out of here so she also washed and vacuumed the inside of the car and outside of the car and then when this woman brought up wow that wilma that's because that's your friend i saw what happened on the news this was big news you know what i mean so you're doing some weird shit also the weird shit and she said that shirley joe was super nervous when it talked to Wilma being found and all that sort of thing. Well.

Then, to top the cherry on top here, the coup de grace, they say, Shirley asks her friend, hey, can you do me a solid here? Sure. Can you do me a kindness? Yeah, because I'm fucking terrified. I'll do whatever. Can you do me a kindness? Yeah, because I'm fucking terrified. I'll do whatever. Whatever you need. Do you mind if I hide these black plastic garbage bags underneath your mobile home? Is that cool?

I'd love it. And then are you leaving? Sure. And then I'm taking off. But you mind if I... Okay. Perfect. Got it. Sure. So that happens on Monday. And by Tuesday, the curiosity is overwhelming for her friend. She waited? She waited a day and then said, what should I do?

I don't know. I saw her cutting out a bloody seatbelt, washing her car. Well, you should look in there. Who knows what's in there? I'd wait until her taillights are out of sight and then I'm calling the police. I'm not even looking in there. No. I know what's in there.

It's not good. It's not good. It's not good. So she opens the bags, and inside the bags are cardboard trunk liners with blood all over them. Sure. Rubber gloves with blood on them. Sure. And household cleaners, and a.38 caliber Smith & Wesson revolver.

God damn it. All of which have Shirley's fingerprints on them. Some of the items have blood on them. there's more things they found as well two arms uh no no arms never found the arms they are never ever ever found never found the arms gone oh my god uh cleaning solvents canceled checks from wilma's bank account wil's check register, checks and a check register in Shirley Jo's name, so both of their checks are in there, as well as all sorts of shit that we'll find out here.

Her fingerprints are on the trash bag as well as most of the items, if not all of them, contained inside. They test the handgun and they found out that it is, forensically or ballistically, the same gun that fired the bullet removed from Wilma's head. That's not great.

Then they have a witness who says they saw her very distinctive Cadillac, a big 78 covered in stickers, burgundy Cadillac on the farm road about the same time that Plaster's body was found a little while later yeah that day and you're gonna find right away so if she's on the road at all that day it's pretty much that's not good that's not great oh if that's not bad enough then that week they find out the police find out that someone who knows forged a four thousand five hundred dollar check on wilma's bank account two weeks before she was killed the check was written to shirley joe phillips and deposited in her account so um yeah wilma wilma had not reported the check to the police

as a stolen thing or anything like that. But they say that that's odd, especially when they compare the signatures. It's not Wilma's real signature on the check as well. Of course not. Shirley Jo stole a check, wrote it to herself, deposited it. When Wilma found out, probably the end of the month when statements come in, maybe she confronted her about it and maybe this is how this went down.

Oh, boy, that's a hell of a theory. But would somebody saw your chest plate in half over $4,500? In for a fucking penny, in for a pound, right? Isn't it one of those things? I mean, once you kill somebody, you can't go, well, the rest of it's too gross. If you're going to try to get away with it, I guess you get away with it. I mean, $4,500, I'm going to jail for a very long time.

Yes. They also learned that the gun that was fired was also used by shirley's son buddy minster really for target shooting the day on wednesday october 4th really yes uh on wednesday october 4th they saw also a car. This is Wilma's people here. Wilma's neighbors are saying they saw a car similar to the car that Buddy Minster drives as well, which is a silver car, by the way. Oh, no. Yeah. So this is getting crazy.

They also find tests conducted on Philip's car also indicate the presence of human blood in the car and the trunk as well really this is looking bad um not good at all really this is this is plea bargain time or at least really give us the explanation that something go away yeah now they discover though they check wilma's mail and they discovered a bank statement that contained a canceled check for the four thousand fifty dollars. That's what it was, not forty five hundred payable to Phillips and an endorsement on the back of Joanne Phillips, which is a an a.k.a. that Shirley Jo has handwriting expert determined that plaster did not write the check and that her signature was a forgery. And they also concluded that Shirley Jo disguised her penmanship

and handwriting samples she provided to the police on October 9th. Asshole. Yes. So October 11th, 89, with a fucking mountain of evidence, they arrest Shirley Jo. Really? I mean, what else are you going to do at this point? For Christ's sake, you've got to arrest her.

$4,000? Man, this is a lot. So they figure that, you know, she must have shot her in the house, dismembered her in the garage, put her in the car, took her out, threw all that shit away. Then they found out through looking at, like, you know, more luminol and everything that she more than likely walked into the house after that and took a shower as well. Oh, dismemberment. Yeah. They said she cleaned the house well enough to the naked eye that you didn't see signs of blood. She took a shower.

She probably thought she's cool. You know, no one's going to know. So, yeah, the police here, they are overwhelmed with evidence. Honestly, they also found a box of bullets that matched the same bullet of the same lot that was also in that garbage bag as well a statement from the cody brothers they had to put out a statement in the paper because they're like whoa there's a lot of stickers on that car every article mentions shirley joe's association with the Cody brothers. Every single fucking one. So Charles Smith, the manager of Cody Country,

said the fan club is a separate organization in the paper. They, quote, they do things on their own. I think they've had one function in two years. It's really just more of a fan club and name only we just we thought it was cute so we'd let it continue yeah we let them use pictures and shit like we send them like a signed picture to off to raffle off every once in a while uh and they said that also cody country did not select the officers they had nothing to do with shirley joe phillips we don't even know her we don't even know her. We don't even know her. So leave us the fuck out of this.

What are the chances she's blown one of these guys? She at least tried, we'll say. She really lied. Stickers all over the car. Yeah. Come on. Anybody who you cover your car in stickers of, you would fillate, I feel like. Right?

Guy or girl. Guy or girl. girl you got a car covered if you're a dude and you've got a car covered in fucking star wars shit you'll bang princess leia you will blow harrison ford tomorrow he doesn't even have to have the outfit on bang you'll bang princess leia today no matter what no matter well yeah you'll dig her up and you'll dig her up yeah if you have to which is. So that someone would want to do that. But scarily enough, someone would. There'd be some creep out there.

Oh, God, yes. So Shirley's mom, remember she stopped talking to her mom? Yeah. Well, they go to Shirley Jo and they go, well, when we were asking people about you, we obviously wanted to talk to your mother and we can't seem to find her. Can you help us? And no one has seen her since May. No one else has seen her since May.

So she cut her out of her life. Yeah. So she said, you want to tell us maybe where your mom is possibly or what happened the last time you saw her. So this is fucking incredible. This is what shirley joe says quote the last time i saw mom in may she was mad throwing a temper tantrum okay so last time i talked to her we thought i was telling her to just calm down she was she was upset with me and my sister why we owed her money oh that's why it's always about money with always

money uh my mother left my residence and got into a car okay then this this is the greatest thing ever quote i have no idea where mom is she always wanted to travel yeah she's in her 80s right now she was just gonna get in the car and drive drive to Reno from what the fuck are you talking about? Reno. Try Rio. Go down there. Oh, all the way down. Probably there.

So she always wanted to travel. I love the way she says this. I have no idea where mom is. She always wanted to travel. She did. That's the reinforcement. Mom was the type of individual who wouldn't let anybody mess with her business. She had a violent temper.

That's the way my mother was. I mean is. You can't do that and expect to not be put in handcuffs, correct? I mean is? Are you fucking kidding me? The worst poker player on the planet. That's the way my mother was. I mean is. Wow. i mean is wow holding cards going

oh two pair two pair how much do you think i should bet on shit what are my odds yeah when she said that do you think one detective looked to the other and was like so are you serious we just cuff her for this too now do we just charge her because that was that was crazy, right? You saw that too, right? She said that. We're looking for another body, right? This is insane. Should we get the cadaver dog?

Should we get him going? So, and they should because soon after that, in Broken Arrow, Oklahoma, body parts of a woman were discovered. Oh, no. Okay, yes. They said that the identity of the victim was unknown at the time. They found portions of one hand. They were definitely dismembered. They said she was killed elsewhere and dumped in a field somewhere.

They figure she was beaten to death in the area they found here. Or no, somebody was beaten to death in this area, but they're not connected to this case, they feel. Oh, we've got more fingers than bodies. That's the problem. Yeah, they find 10 pounds of a woman's body. Oh, for heaven's sake. They say the killer dissected the body, bagged and refrigerated the parts, then dumped them in a field.

Bagged and refrigerated? Yes. Then they end up, this is, they found this in May. Yeah? They found this in May. And now they take a finger and based on all the Shirley Jo stuff, they match a fingerprint from this, what they found in the field, to a mixing bowl in Lila's house. Oh, no. And find out it is Lila in that field. Really?

But they don't know it's Lila until October. They just thought they found remains of a woman in May. And now it's put together with, hey, your mom was also found dismembered in a field. That's weird weird and you're the last person to fight with her and uh she i mean is you i mean is her so that is fucking uh and also some of her possessions are found in a dumpster near philip's apartment as well some of leela's things as well um neighbors say they saw philip's dump clothes and personal items into the dumpster around that time police in broken arrow announced

they're trying to determine whether you know this it's all her and everything like that um but they found out it was her so shirley is real fucked here she's i mean uh she might be a serial killer this is oh and it's for money she owed mom money mom's piss she takes money from shirley she or from wilma she bumps her off how much money could she have possibly taken from leo it's i mean shirley should have been in the genovase fucking crime family like she'd have been she'd have been a high up she'd have been a capo no problem she's a fucking sheembering and disappearing old women. Old ladies. One of them is her mother.

Yeah. People that are looked for first. Yeah, you can't just kill an old lady. People are looking for, they usually have grandkids or somebody, kids that are looking for them. And we like to protect our old ladies. Yeah. At the age I'm at now i'm the most scared because these we are the least looked for people on the planet 45 year old white men nobody gives

a shit they'd figure you took off and went to fucking vegas and you're like you're at whatever the the fucking bunny ranch turned into they'd figure where's lamar odom he's probably next to him we wouldn't even look for you he's high-fiving lamar odom while they bang some four different ladies a prostitute yeah that's what they would think they wouldn't be he's fine he'll be back but old ladies you know where they are usually so yeah so they're gonna go to trial they're only gonna charge her for the wilma murder here so far i think oklahoma is gonna hang on to the mom shit and uh you know she ever gets out you can always have that because there's no statute of limitations right on killing your mother so happens to murder stay murder murder stay murder as well that's said on the

wire yeah as said by bunk now they talked shirley joe has no problem talking to the press before her trial which as we know is not smart but she does it and she even says that this is what a fucking lunatic she is she says quote i feel so bad though because some things are going to have to come out about wilma about her lifestyle and things she was into that will hurt her family what does that mean again like she was out there just come on man what do you look at four nights a week what could she have been doing honestly yeah that's that oh my god oh you're ruining the honor of the family jesus who cares fox tails everywhere everywhere fox tails fox fox triple x e tails listen to your stupid opinions and you'll understand that one some people like to have a tail and sleep with it and they're very

very concerned when the tail isn't all that it lives up to be. And you might ask, how do you put a tail on yourself? Well, find out. It's the grossest way possible. Called an assifier. Yep. It's got a root. We'll put it that way. Gross.

She said that. She said, Wilma was a lovely person regardless, and I think she would forgive me for talking about them. She said, when I'm finished, there will be no secrets, and there will be a slate cleaned. I can go from here to wherever they send me, or I can go free. How about that? Yeah, I'm sure you will. Sure you will.

Either way, I'm going to go with everyone knowing everything from the day I was born to the latest breath I took. I can say this is over, finished, done with. Hanging in limbo is the hardest part. And if they give me death, I accept it. I died the day I was arrested. Okay. Drama.

Yeah. So during one of her court appearances, we meet a fella that Shirley Jo has been keeping time with. And he is the craziest person in this story somehow. What? Somehow, he's the craziest. His name is Jimmy Don Bunch. Sounds good. It's a good start.

We're on a good start. A rural Missourian named Jimmy Don Bunch sounds pretty good, who's in love with Shirley Jo. I guess, I mean, yeah, there's certainly the two-namer for a Jimmy, but- Jimmy Don. Jimmy Don is- That's a good one. Wow.

That's a good one. That really is. That's hammering it. That takes Billy Joe and says, pussy, and knocks him right out of the way. You fucking city boy. That's what that says. That's a guy that drives a two-wheel drive van with a big block in it. That's the man. hear that i think jimmy don's on his way oh here he comes well we'll find out exactly

what jimmy don's driving and it ain't his car put it that way so jimmy don but in the court appearance as they they took Phil and Shirley Jo away, he screamed, I love you, Shirley Jo! Hell yeah. So that's what we're dealing with. I'm just going to read this newspaper article because it is fucking wonderful. From the headline on down, Philips supporter faces new charges. Oh, the guy supporting a maybe fucking serial killer facing his own charges.

Facing his own charges. They're hilarious. They're way funnier than his. Jimmy Don Bunch charged with felony DWI. Okay. The man who said he wants to marry Shirley Jo Phillips. Jesus. An acknowledged alcoholic, Jimmy Don Bunch, 42.

He's also way younger than her too yeah i'm an alcoholic i'm an alcoholic that's a great way to be known in the newspaper an acknowledged alcoholic jimmy dunn bunch 42 wow that's what he does for a living acknowledged alcohol like if he well uh i drink if i'll shake if i stop drinking that's what i do if he for a living, sir? Well, I'll shake if I stop drinking. That's what I do. If he was a brain surgeon, it would have said, Brain Surgeon Jimmy Don Bunch, 42, was charged with. But instead, an acknowledged alcoholic, Jimmy Don Bunch, 42,

was charged Friday with his fourth DWI, a felony. Oh, God. Number four. In the 80s, number four. They'd let a lot of shit go back then, so that's a lot. He got away. He probably got pulled over and let go as many times as he drove drunk. I'm sure. And then drove home just blackout the rest of the time and nobody noticed.

He also may face additional charges after eluding Green County Sheriff's deputies for an hour Thursday morning. What? Thursday morning? Thursday morning after crashing the station wagon he was driving into a power pole and seriously injuring a woman who was with him. Oh, no. Okay, she was listed in serious condition at the hospital. Another man in the station wagon told deputies that bunch had held him and the woman hostage in the vehicle wow okay that man was arrested and then let go because they realized that he wasn't

they arrested him for resisting arrest because he wasn't he was like i've been kidnapped you fucking idiots that's why yeah so he was he was released because duh bunch Bunch, this is fucking great, man. They're talking about, by the way, they talk about how Bunch told the reporters that he would stand by Phillips and marry her no matter what the outcome of her trial is. And that he writes to her every day in jail. Jimmy Don. Jimmy Don is exactly right. So he yelled, I love you, Shirley Jo, as she walked out of the courtroom. Now, back to his chase and crash. After crashing the vehicle after an hour chase, by the way, an hour is a long time for a police chase.

You really got to want that. After crashing the vehicle in Elwood about 10.30 a.m. Oh, my God. In the a.m. He's doing this. Started at 9.30. Wow. And fleeing on foot from Deputy Robert Dodson, he crashed it, hurt this lady, and then got out and took off.

Holy shit. Bunch became violent, striking and kicking the officer once he caught him. Not great. Not great. And 42 is too old to run from the police. I have news for you. I'm 42 now. too old to run from the police. I have news for you. I'm 42 now. I'm not running from the police.

Fuck no. They'll get me so quick. Nope. Nope. Not happening. I just know better. I'm not running that hard from anything. I'd rather go to jail than pull a hamstring, so no.

So anyway, Bunch was finally handcuffed. This gets even crazier, by the the way this isn't the end of it he's finally handcuffed and placed in the patrol car before he kicked out a rear side window of the patrol car holy shit then they figure out the station wagon he was driving you know what it's full of what is that you'll never guess if i gave you fucking 10 options because they're the three things that don't go together at all and it's very odd yeah it is filled with quote from the newspaper frozen food clothing and musical instruments i give up i fucking give up with this case was costco unlocked what happened the shit is i got four french horns five pairs of sweatpants and a bunch of

fucking banquet hungry man tv swanson dinners what are you talking about and if the station wagon held more i'd go back for more i'd get my had my eye on an oboe i'm not gonna lie to you i really did oh my god all of these were believed to have been stolen from various Willard residences that morning. All before McDonald's stopped serving breakfast. He could still get an Egg McMuffin. Sausage biscuit right now. No problem. Yeah.

The officers were able to unwind with the McGriddles. That's insane. It gets even crazier. Okay. Somehow, if you would imagine, they take him to jail where you figure, okay, now he's going to be placated a little bit. Calm down. Sober up, motherfucker.

No, no. Once in his holding cell, he tore down a light fixture from the ceiling and then tried to cut his wrist with a tube of toothpaste. Oh. The bottom part that's sharp. Oh, yeah. It's harder. It's not that sharp. It's not. Oh. The bottom part that's sharp. Oh, yeah. It's harder, yeah.

It's not that sharp. Yeah, it's not. It's not vein-cutting sharp. No, it's like, hey, well, that poked my finger a little, but not like, oh, shit, get me some gauze. It's not that bad. So they asked the sheriff, this is my favorite line from a police officer about anybody,

or really my favorite quote about anybody by anyone that's ever recovered on our show quote they said what the fuck with jimmy don bunch the sheriff said quote it's nothing new for him he always he always does this kind of thing he's good for it what the fuck is this guy man jimmy don bunch is the craziest son of a bitch he always does it. Yeah, you know when you're chasing him. It's just Jimmy Don again. He's going to run.

He's going to try some karate shit on you when you catch him every time. You know that. That happens every time. You got to guard your eyes for the bear spray, but we'll get him. We'll get him. We got him. Wow. And then they said, do you think he was trying to kill himself when he cut

his hand and wrist with the toothpaste tube and the cop said well that wouldn't be a real good way to do it no he's just fighting gingivitis wow in his wrist no he's yeah his plaque buildup is non-existent in his fucking forearm so surely this is another interview she does with the press and the press is not like just like oh you know what do you think of the fall fashions like they're asking her tough question interrupt you know interrogation questions it's you know they're really they want readers and listeners want shit so sure they said and this is referring to her friend nora who is the woman in arkansas where she left the garbage bags under her trailer. This is a frustrating woman, this Shirley Jo, a frustrating human being, we'll say.

Did you visit a friend named Nora? Yeah. Her answer, Nora. Yes, that's a friend of mine. No. Not the question. Not the answer to the question. See how that works?

See what I mean? And she does this repeatedly. Yes, that's a friend of mine. Yep, that's a friend of mine. Not what I asked. She answered part of it. Did you visit a friend named Nora? She picked out Nora and friend and said, yes, those are right.

Visit. I don't know anything about that. Does she have a... Is she diminished? No. She's an that. Does she have does she have she diminished? No, she's an asshole. OK. She's a huge asshole. Oh, she's a huge dick. No, no, no. This is this gets better and better and better. Oh, great. I mean, this is she just she gets to be a bigger asshole over time. They said, did you leave something under her porch when you visited her?

They said, did you leave something under her porch when you visited her? Yeah. She said, I'm not sure. I'm not sure of anything at that time. Oh. Okay. They say, well, the prosecution and the police say that Nora said that after you left, and Shirley Jo says, mm-hmm, like she's on board. Yeah. That she looked under her porch and she found a garbage bag and she looked at it and there were some bloody things in there.

And she called the police and told them that you had left it under her porch. Oh. There's not a lot of room to wiggle in there. Right. Of what that question is, okay? Shirley Jo says, quote, oh, that I left them? That's what she said. Yeah.

Then she says, did she see anything that I left? Nobody proved that I was the one who put anything anyplace. There has never been any proof of anyone seeing me put anything anywhere. Okay. So is she saying that bag belonged to her friend in Arkansas maybe? It could have been anybody. Anybody who killed Shirley Jo and also had access to, or anybody who killed Wilma and also had access to both Shirley Jo and Wilma's checkbooks put that stuff there.

But that's ridiculous to say it's been hurt because no one saw her do it okay how'd your back how did your how did your checkbook get in a bag with hers also how did there's one set of fingerprints on everything and it's yours right right who the fuck else put it down there why are your fingerprints on it right but that's what she says no one there's never been any proof of anyone seeing me put anything anywhere. Okay? So the interviewer says, let's talk about what's inside the bag. Like, I'm not going to engage your bullshit, which is a great way to do it.

Yeah. She says this. I really don't want to know. I really don't want to go into that. That's just devastating. It sure is. For your defense, yes. It's horribly devastating.

It's a no way out nothing could be more devastating to your case a bag full of murder stuff with your fingerprints on it the you know this is fucking insane a bag full of somebody else's blood with your hands tying the knot on it not good yeah devastating a murder grab bag over here devastating opportunities of freedom this is fucking ridiculous so they said well they go on she says i don't want to know it's just devastating and they say the trash bag contains the weapon a 38 caliber pistol along with cleaning solvents car mats and checks from wilma's bank account. It turns out that a lot of the evidence in there pointed to you. Right.

She says this is balls. Quote, a lot? No, ma'am. I mean, I've seen more. I don't know. A lot? No, ma'am. She says there was not a lot of evidence that pointed to me.

You see how this trash bag thing with the gun in it and some bloody floor mats and fingerprints. And she says, my fingerprints. Yes, stupid. We've said this already. And you fucking know it because there's discovery. You know what the fuck the evidence says. But she pretends she doesn't know anything. You think that's a lot.

You should have seen what I dumped along the farm road. Oh, man, that was gross. Just torsos and shit yeah so they go on to say the prosecution says that the your fingerprints were on the outside of the bag and then on the inside of the bag the weapon was in there she says this quote well they can say whatever they want. Pardon me? No, they have to use evidence, and that's evidence. Yeah. She's like a cheating husband who got caught with his dick in his phone that he didn't send to his wife.

One me. I don't know. Somebody says they have this. Well, they can say whatever they want. They can say whatever they want. Well, they did. What do you say? I don't know. Whatever they say whatever they want. Well, they did. What do you say? I don't know.

Whatever they say. Fucking insane. Not a lot of evidence. Imagine speaking to this person. Oh, God damn it. You'd be like, are you fucking kidding me? I know why she's single. Yeah. No shit.

They said, well, no, Jimmy Don can't wait to marry her. Oh, that's right. Then again, he's not. He's been sober about 10 minutes in the last five years. So what the hell does he know? If he heals from his aqua fresh slashing. Yeah, he has no idea. Heals up from his fucking Colgate.

Colgate. His Colgate suicide attempt. They're not getting crest in there. No, no, no. They're getting Colgate. The Colgate's good. The total. Aquafresh is the bad one right is that i think so i think so i just know i never use pretty good yeah yeah so

shirley's son now they bring up his buddy minster because they're like this the guns also linked to him they said the gun that was found in the trash, it was tested and it was found to either be your gun or your son's gun. Okay. And she says, Trillie Jo says, see, that's where all of this goes. Circumstantial only. What? One of you killed her. That's the murder weapon.

So it's not circumstantial. One of you fucking did it. I got an idea. If we can't decide, I'd rather keep both of you than neither of you. I don't trust anybody from this family. Fuck off. A lot of circumstance. Yeah.

The body. Somebody else did it. My fingerprints. I don't know. They can say what they want. She doesn't know the difference between physical and circumstance. No. This is very physical.

She said, circumstantial only. I never had a gun. Okay? I did not own a gun. My son never had a gun. I did not own a gun. My son never had a gun. He did not own a gun. He told the police that he used that gun for target practice. Maybe he did, but he didn't own a gun that I'm ever aware of.

Okay, but he owned that gun. But then why did a bag that only has your fingerprints on it contain this fucking gun then? How does that work yeah so um glenn is interviewed by the police this is what's fucked up he's interviewed by the police about everything because they find out this these this body was cut up like a like a butcher would cut somebody up and they found out that buddy is a butcher by trade so So they were like, we'd love to chat with him. He volunteers to take a polygraph test and passes it. Really?

So they ruled him out. At that point, they were like, it's all Shirley. Buddy's innocent. Yeah. They've got no physical evidence of him other than his handiwork. I mean. Yeah. I mean.

That's pretty impressive. He told mom where to cut. So they said, if you didn't kill Wilma, who do you think did? Yeah. She said, I can't answer that.

I can't. I can't. Not I couldn't. Right, that's a fascinating answer. Yeah, there's a lot. Her words, you can, wait till you see later on.

She said, they said, you can't or you don't want to. And she said, I just can't answer it. And they said, because you've never had a thought about who did it. And she said, oh, yes, I've thought. I mean, yes, I've thought about it. I have.

Every Mother's Day. I mean. Weird. If I was innocent and in jail for murder, I would certainly think about who could have fucking done this. That would be on my mind a lot. I'd be begging to help with the investigation. It's fucking wild, man. They said, so, but you don't want to say?

And she said, mm-hmm. So that's that. She's thought about it. She has thoughts, but she won't want to say it. Okay. Now, in the trial, they put together, Phillips was with, Shirley Jo was with Wilma the last night she was seen alive. The day after the killing would have taken place, a car that was identified as similar to her car and the kid's car were seen in the area and pulling into the driveway and testing revealed the human blood all throughout her car. We got the bags with the murder weapons check made out to her fingerprints all over it she forged the fucking name on there there's a lot of there's physical

circumstantial just you know if you're not an idiot there's tons of evidence here there's a lot of evidence however your brain works yeah it will there's evidence for that part of your brain if you're a person that needs to see this oh well there we go we brain. If you're a person that needs to see this, Oh, well, there we go. We got this. If you're a person that needs that, well, that's there. You need a motive. Sure. How about the money?

It's all there. It's all there. Um, they said the knife found in Phillips. They also found a knife in Phillips apartment. That was the same brand as a knife found in the discarded bag where the body was found as well. So it was out of her, her block.

Um, so yeah, they also determined the forgery for the check the prosecutor must have been like this is do i even need to show up half of these days can i just do some paperwork and call it good i mean we can just like i'm gonna try i'm gonna wear you know what i'm gonna wear a bozo the clown costume for the entire trial just to show how hard and easy of a case this is because it is but i'm gonna cut the crotch out and just wear a cup and i'm gonna like a ball hanging out of each side every

15 minutes i'm gonna do one of those i'm gonna squeak one of them old-timey car horns and i'm gonna start stroking my dick for 15 seconds and then i'll stop but that's every 15 minutes 15 strokes and i'll put it away i call it 15 on the 15 i'm gonna do that the entire trial and i bet we still win i bet we still win that job still don't distract anybody from how fucking riveting this is wild so the prosecutor and his closing argument said the only thing standing between Shirley and that door ladies and gentlemen are the 12 of you he said and she is counting on

adding you and adding your names to the list of people that she has used jurors yep what do you want us to do fucking murder her that's what I mean that feels aggressive the defense had an objection saying that these were designed to personalize and instill fear in the jurors of their personal safety.

Which, well, I think it's just more of like she's trying to fuck you all over. It's one of those like you're going to let her pull the wool over your eyes, which you're going to be a clown, too. Yeah. So the verdict comes in and they find her obviously guilty. I mean. Yeah. What is she going to do? Yeah.

And she can't, like, get on the stand and say the things she said in interviews. The jury would be like, is this bitch for real? And a prosecutor would tear you a new asshole on that stuff. Boy. So here comes the sentencing. on that stuff boy so here comes the sentencing and i mean honestly her mitigating mitigators are she's never had a violent crime before but the we got her suspected of two pretty fucking violent things and the aggravator is this is a hell of a first fucking offense here this is wild shit this is crazy uh what you did was heartless brutal vicious the

heinousness of the act and all that comes up and the judge says you ma'am may fuck off death penalty wow yeah you don't see a lot of people in oklahoma you know missouri this is a missouri i mean missouri yeah you know you don't see a lot of 60-year-old ladies getting sentenced to death, though. That's not a normal demographic for the death penalty, really. That's something right there. Yeah, a lot of Reader's Digest audience getting into the chair. She was reading People magazine while they announced her sentence. So they're like, wow, that's interesting.

Death penalty for her. Yeah. And she's going to appeal, obviously, but she got the death penalty. Really? I thought she said if they give her death, she takes it. She's fine with it, she said. No, apparently not. Apparently she feels like she hasn't been treated fairly for all this.

She has an objection, huh? Yep. So the children, Wilma's children, said that they are satisfied. Her son's a doctor, Dr. Mark Plaster. Really? He said, we are all very, very satisfied. It's been a two and a half year

wait for this to come. By the way, Dr. Mark Plaster's also an attorney. What? They had a son. They're such good parents. They had a son who's a doctor and a lawyer at the same time. Wow. Can you imagine that?

Went to medical school and said, I'm going to do law school on the side. That's easy. I am tired of being right. I need to go prove how right I am. Yeah, this is insane. He said that the trial was needed to show his mother, a minister's widow, was a real person and not some newsreel clipping or some evidence here. He said she was a woman, a mother and a grandmother. She was a real person and we're proof of that.

The daughter, Linda, she said the juror's recommendation was a big relief. She said, I finally feel like we can bury mom with dignity and honor and love yeah and her other son don who is not a doctor and a lawyer so he's they were like it's okay we don't need you listen nobody's mark okay it's okay what is it dr mark esquire yeah he's that's who he is wow wow is he a phd md all that shit yeah dds he does fucking dental surgery he'll do all that shit he's fucking usda he judges me as well jurist doctor yeahate? Yeah, J.D., right? Yeah, I think so. So, yeah, Son Don said, I feel justice has been served. We certainly have no qualms here.

What could you have qualms about? Right. They didn't kill her then? They didn't chop her head off in the court? I mean, what else could you want? We didn't get to do it. Yeah. Her brother's a doctor.

He said he'd do it. I don't know. He said take her head right off. Mark, the doctor lawyer, said he's confident Shirley Jo's conviction will not be overturned. No. He said that Mike Williams, that's her lawyer, was trying every way possible to get Shirley Jo off at this trial or future trials. We are thankful he made an aggressive effort to help her. That way, over appeals.

Yeah. Thank God for him. He knows. That's over appeals. Yeah. Yeah. Thank God. He knows that that's the thing. People who don't know a lot about the legal system go, that son of a bitch fucking lawyer of theirs pulling these tricks. If they don't do that, they're going to get that shit overturned.

So you want that lawyer to be pulling everything out of their ass. A great lawyer that finds every legal defense possible. So it can't be overturned. And if it is, if it fails and this person is proven guilty, then they stay. That's how it works because otherwise you can say my lawyer sucked. So they said that – Mark also said that he was critical of defense efforts to convince the jury to recommend a sentence of life in prison with no chance of parole.

The reason was they said you shouldn't kill Shirley Jo because since she's been in church or since she's been in jail, now she's a born again Christian. So, oh, that's great. You can't kill her now. Obviously, she said she likes Jesus. So you don't get to you don't get to kill the pastor's wife and then read Jonah and the whale. Yeah. And you're fine. No, it's all cleared off.

Then you're good. You. That's the point. Yeah, that's that's what it's all cleared off then you're good you that's the point yeah that's that's what it's all about um so he said this quote we hope that's true about her conversion he said frankly though it made me nauseous we don't judge shirley phillips heart and soul the lord will do that then he gets raw dog we will pray her soul, but justice demands her life now. God damn.

Don't kill a lady whose son is a doctor and a lawyer. He will say some shit about you in the newspaper that will just fucking level the whole thing. I hope her death is super painful and then she goes to the Lord. Then she goes on to the Lord. That is something else. So I love love that her whole family is fucking funny they're not funny but i mean i just love their they don't give a shit they're just throwing it down that's a stinger of a quote that's great we'll get you to jesus real fast yeah we'll pray for your soul but we're gonna put you on the express route on up to him we'll electrify your ass right on up to him.

Yeah, that's right. Holy shit. I heard the lightning's the fastest way to get there. That's what I'm saying. We got Jacob's Ladder all put together for you, mister. Come on in. God damn. We built it all nice and good so during the appeal uh-huh she's got a bunch of things she actually says that there was a

uh an effective assistance of counsel and all that kind of thing yeah but her main point is and we'll get to some of her other points because anything can happen here. She says the prosecution withheld evidence. Oh, OK. Evidence is an audio tape made by police while interviewing a woman named Joyce Hagar. OK, now this took place on August 10th, 1990. This interview. So almost a year after them are almost a year after the murder.

Oh, 88. So apparently this audio tape, there's a statement given by Joyce Hagar to the police in which she says that Buddy Minster, Philip's son, told Joyce that he and his mom killed Wilma Plaster and that

his mom drove while he scattered the body. Whoa. Whoa. Okay. Then in addition to that, he told her, which makes sense by the way, because couple of the bags were like farther off to the side.

The duffel bag was like right on the side of the road, which is not a place where you place it. It's a place where you throw it and end up and you go, fuck it. Keep driving. Yeah. It's so that makes sense throw it and it ends up and you go, fuck it, keep driving. Yeah. So that makes sense. In addition to this, he also told Joyce Hagar, according to this audio tape, that he threw Wilma's hands into the creek.

Which they've never found. even said that Buddy told her not only that, but also he killed his grandmother for his mom and that both his grandmother and Wilma Plaster, he was the one that, quote, cut them all up. Oh, boy.

The existence of this tape was not disclosed to Shirley Jo's attorneys before the trial. That's a major, that's a Brady violation because that's exculpatory. But it's not really exculpatory because it doesn't say mom had nothing to do with it. I did everything. It said I killed with my mom and for my mom.

And I just did the cutting up. But she's saying for the death penalty, she's not actually, it's less heinous if she didn't actually do the cutting. It's her it's her argument here. So it was steal money. That's it. So the defense counsel had interviewed Hagar before trial, but Hagar didn't disclose that she had given a statement to the police as well. So Phillips position is that Hagar's tape statement is exculpatory because it negates her involvement in the murder and dismemberment of Wilma, which it doesn't, totally.

So the appeals court said, even viewing this evidence in the light most favorable to Phillips, it's difficult to understand how Buddy's alleged statement to Hagar that he killed, that he and his mom killed Wilma, and that his mom drove while he threw the body out. And the hands in the creek is exculpatory. The statement directly implicates Shirley Jo in the murder of Wilma. It actually corroborates it that she did it. It means we got another person we need to throw in there with her. And another person who's such a sick fuck he can pass a lie detector.

And tell a girlfriend or whatever Sammy Hagar's sister is about. Yeah. there with her and another person who's such a sick fuck he can pass a lie detector and tell a girlfriend or whatever hey sammy hagar's sister is about yeah that's what he can pass a lie detector days after he has after dismembered a woman a crazy thing it's not like time went by nothing that's that's a that's a scary person i have to say right there. They said Buddy's comment that he was the one who cut up the bodies is exculpatory, however, because it tends to clear Phillips of involvement in that aspect of the murder and dumping of the body. It is not exculpatory on the issue of guilt because it does not qualify or contradict the statement that the two of them both participated in the actual killing. contradict the statement that the two of them both participated in the actual killing. But Buddy's admission that he was the one who cut up the body with the inference that Phillips did not do so herself is both exculpatory and material to the issue of punishment. They said the evidence of Buddy's conduct is exculpatory because it shows that Phillips involvement in the dismemberment, if any, was tangential, tangential rather than direct because he's a butcher, she's not.

And Buddy, more than Phillips, was the depraved party because part of the death penalty is heinous depraved. Sure. Are you a sick fuck we don't need on the streets anymore? Dangerous society, right. And putting a bullet in somebody's head is one thing, but then going, all right, let's cut their torso in half is a whole other fucking thing. Open them up. Oh, boy.

So they said, moreover, the only aggravating circumstance found by the jury to support the sentence of death was depravity of mind based on the dismemberment of the body. Okay. So they said that we conclude that the exclusion of the evidence that Buddy dismembered the body was material because it so undermines confidence in the imposition of the death penalty and gives rise to a reasonable probability that the outcome of the punishment phase may have been different. Yeah. Yeah. So they say the state's failure to disclose the statements, which would have allowed Phillips to call Hagar as a witness, that's a problem. Now, Phillips argues that her counsel was ineffective for failing to investigate and present evidence during the guilt phase that her son, Buddy, killed and dismembered Wilma.

Oh, my God. Now she's throwing her son under the bus, which, like her son had an idea, let's kill your friend Wilma. Right. You filled out some checks and then you called. Remember what we did to Grandma? Yeah. You knew that Buddy's down for anything, allegedly. So part of this evidence includes opinions as to Buddy's bad temper.

Buddy's employment as both a butcher and in the euthanasia room of the Humane Society. Oh, my God. Buddy puts animals to sleep and then butchers other animals. He is a weird guy. I hope he is being watched every day. What a fucking weird guy. That's a weird. That's a terrifying man.

And he can pass a lie detector test days after doing exactly what he did. Yeah. We employ that person to do that. Allegedly. Allegedly. Allegedly. Yeah. So also his possession of scissors that he claimed could be used to dismember a body like butcher scissors. Yeah, big scissors.

Yeah. And butcher tools as well. Also, Buddy had passed a bad check. He has prior drug and alcohol abuse, a prior criminal record and all of that shit. prior drug and alcohol abuse, prior criminal record, and all of that shit. These matters are not relevant to any issue in the case, but they pertain to Buddy's character, which is a bad character, they say. So, other evidence, however, consists of statements made by Buddy implicating him in the crime.

He allegedly said his mother had been missing from her apartment for several days with the week of the murder, that his mother was taking the fall, and that he passed a lie detector test even though he was lying what the fuck these statements even taken at face value do not exonerate shirley joe as they do not even suggest that she was not involved with the murder they just complicate the fuck out of it they just make everything complicated now also phillips also claims her counsel was ineffective in failing to introduce georgia justices the georgia justice is a woman not a not a thing georgia justice this woman identification of buddy as the man she saw leaving the area where the body was found in a white car on october 6th around 4 p.m during the guilt phase justice testifies that she saw a

dirty looking man with shoulder length hair in the white car the council never asked if that was buddy that was the person you saw in the car just a dirty looking person with long hair which is absolutely the perfect description of this dirt bag of Cletus here. So Justice first identified Buddy as the person she saw driving the white car during her testimony nearly five years after the events in question. During the circumstances, or under the circumstances, Phillips has not established that she was prejudiced by the failure to elicit the identification. Even if the ID was sufficiently reliable, his mere presence in the area where the body was disposed

does not exonerate Shirley Jo. True. All of this can put him in, but that just means both of you did it. It doesn't mean that you're, because your fingerprints are all over all this shit. So you did something. And it's your friend and your check.

And you drove a state away to get rid of this shit. That's the other thing. You were the one doing that. She also claims her counsel is ineffective in their handling of the court's order to produce handwriting samples. She said she received conflicting advice from her attorneys on whether she should give a handwriting sample to the state. Okay.

Now, the conflicting advice, they say, came after the events of May 17th, 1990, when she refused to submit a sample. At that time, sheth 1990 when she refused to submit a sample at that time she was advised by a council to submit a sample and she didn't only the refusal of a may 17th decision was not influenced by her attorney and was admitted into evidence at trial so she can't blame her attorney when her attorney told her to do that and she didn't he can't force her yeah your attorney works for you they can't force you to do anything if you want to fuck your case up you can do that you're right welcome yeah so you're paying for it well probably not here probably this yeah this is a public defender further phillips does not attempt to allege that if all her attorneys had urged her to submit a sample that she would have

done so yeah so also they she does on religious references she said the prosecutor is accused of making improper religious references when he called the dismemberment a despicable unchristian act well i mean that's i would think that's pretty factual yeah i don't think anywhere in christianity it says you should cut people up and saw their torsos in half and hide their hands in the creek. Except when you argue over a baby. Well, you can do that.

That's true. But it doesn't say to put the hands in the creek and hide them. Truth. Yeah. Both of those parts were going to go to somebody. That's the thing. You got to take responsibility for the action. I'm sure there's like drawing and quartering in there somewhere too.

So who knows? I don't know. So they stated that Phillips had offered up her son as a sacrificial lamb, which they said is another religious reference, and argued that Phillips had placed her own kiss of Judas on her son. That's awesome. The appeals court said counsel should avoid excessive references to the Bible during closing argument. These brief isolated comments made during a 75 minute long closing argument do not, however, constitute excessive references. Three small references over an hour and a half,

an hour 15 is not that much. That's a long, that's a headline set. Oh boy, went hard. Yeah, they said the first is a claim that the state improperly shifted the burden of proof to Phillips. He said this, if an innocent person is completely blameless in this, had nothing to hide, what would they have done? They would have written

out these exemplars just like they do on every one of these other checks. What would a guilty person do? Disguise their writing, try to write differently, sign their name differently. What did the defendant do with these handwriting exemplars? Our expert told us she disguised her writing. What reason? For what reason? Maybe the defense counsel will answer that question for us. That's what they said. They said that's over the line there.

Phillips next asserts error by the trial court in allowing the prosecutor to allegedly misstate evidence by arguing that Shirley Jo's boots were the same size as the footprints found in Wilma's house. Now, Shirley Joe did object at trial, but the claim of error was not properly preserved for appellate review, it says here. So anyway, also improper argument. Shirley Joe argues that the trial court erred in failing to declare a mistrial based on a bunch of statements by the prosecutor. They go into everything. And then finally, mental health. She says her trial counsel was ineffective for failing to investigate and present evidence of her mental health, which she never said was in decline. She's an asshole, but I don't think she's crazy.

Those are way different things. You could be an asshole but i don't think she's crazy like those are way different things you could be an asshole she does crazy things it doesn't make her fucking crazy yeah she does crazy things because she's an asshole not because she's crazy there's a difference motivations there so they said at counsel's request phillips was examined by at least four psychologists and one sociologist before trial, and her counsel also obtained medical records and other information from her treating physician. Phillips characterizes all of this information as a wealth of mental health evidence, yet she still complains that counsel's investigation was deficient. They said that's ridiculous. She also says that the counsel was ineffective for

failing to litigate her competency to proceed to trial. And she says, I shouldn't have been able to go to trial. I'm way too crazy. She relies on one psychologist's testimony that she could not assist her attorneys due to her mental condition. One psychologist said that. She ignores, however, the testimony of three other psychologists who examined her, all of whom found she was competent to stand trial. Given these opinions by the mental health experts who examined her, it's not unreasonable for counsel to decline to litigate the issue of competency.

Sure, yeah. If it's three to one, you're not going to win that. That's a waste of time. It is, yeah. Waste of time. One more thing here is, like we said, the buddy stuff here. So with all the buddy stuff and everything like that, they find her still guilty as shit, but they commute her sentence. Really?

From death to life without parole. Okay, that's good. So now she'll get to be good and old in there, which will be fun for her. This is actually better, I think. Fuck off. Yeah, I like this a lot. Let's keep her around and make fun of her for years. What about Buddy?

Does he... Buddy never gets charged with ugots. What? Because they fucked up that whole investigation with the tapes and this and that. And he passed a lie detector test and he won't say he did shit. So that's all they have. He has to keep his nose clean the rest of his life. They never...

What do you think of the odds of that, R? Yeah. We'll find out more about Buddy, I'm sure. we'll do a follow-up on buddy and find out but like a legend maybe he turned it all around we don't know he's just made his life you know what he probably opened up like a little private school for like k through second grade just to give the kids a good jump on their educations i feel like reads themads a lot of Shakespeare and stuff like that. You know, classical music. Big fan of reading time is real important.

One of those. Yeah, yeah. Gotta get some hardcover time. So in the 2010s, she does a lot of interviews. Yeah. Also, she'll talk to anybody here. Fucking anybody, which is hilarious because she's such an idiot and all she does is incriminate herself even more. Yeah.

At the end, you're going to be very disturbed by what she says here this is coming up pretty quick here they said to her did wilma ever let you down she said yeah wilma let me down dying and being dismembered and all that's super disappointing exploded all over her garage and put me here and i had to dismiss i had to fucking put throw her away i had to fucking get rid of the parts it's going to take me a long time to get over that i couldn't believe it had happened i can't believe how she could do that to me i don't understand how that let her down yeah they said at this point, they just ignore that. And the interviewer says, was it about the check? Yeah. Like, obviously.

You know. You know. What's the motive here? She said, I can't tell you. I know you can't, but you should because it's already over. They said, tell me about the visit to Arkansas. She said, I can't tell you. No, you can't.

They said, tell me where you were the day Wilma was found. Yeah. Can't tell you no you can't they said tell me where you were the day wilma was found yeah can't tell you oh why can't tell you sorry what she can tell you though is that she still views herself as a notorious person that everybody knows about and she's very happy that everyone knows who she is really she said quote i say the longer i'm in here the better maybe people would forget but i'm still in the news my face is still in the newspaper and on tv wow that's what she this sick fucking woman said okay then here it is this interview is the most disturbing shit ever um you'll you find out exactly because they don't really know what happened to wilma because she was taken apart and her body didn't really show the signs of whatever we're gonna find out exactly

what happened to her because Shirley Jo is gonna tell us in her own fucking way in her own disturbing way this is like remember what they did with Ted Bundy will tell us in the third person what may have happened and he was like well I think it's one of these. Listen to this shit. Do you ever talk to Wilma? They ask her. She said, no, not really. No. I've talked with God about her. You know, she won't talk to me.

We get it. We do like a brunch thing on Thursdays, me and God, and we bring her up and, you know, I say how she's doing. God said, she's still a little salty about that whole thing about dismembering her and you know but uh it's all right but she said i've talked with god about her and i know she's happy oh the balls on you she's happy to bring god into that and then say she's happy wings no arms she's thrilled she's thrilled yeah well fuck it you don't need arms when you got wings hey better deal better deal but i think right now it would be too difficult for me to try to talk to her the thought has never entered my mind never then she says goes on to this this she just gives herself all away but i have thought about

the person that killed my friend to me that person was really crazy just crazy then she says you know the coroner said my friend wilma was shot before she was dismembered but my feeling deep down is that she was tortured i just know that's true she tortured wilma fuck yes she did did she torture her to get her to sign another check what was the torture but she she just said she tortured her we know you killed her so she was gonna die that day anyway and she must yeah that's insane she's wow she is fucking unbelievable but my feeling deep down is that she was tortured. I just know that's true. I just know somebody cut one limb off of it at a time. Considering I'm the one that did it, I just know it's true. Wow.

That is fucking disturbing. She currently resides at the Chillicothe Correctional Center, where she will remain forever and hopefully will be croaking soon because it's been a long time. Sure has. 40 years. Yeah. She was still been a long time. Sure has. 40 years. Yeah. She was still alive as of a couple of years ago. Jesus. It's insane.

So there you go. That's Shirley Jo Phillips. What the fuck, man? Fucking crazy son and Jimmy Don Bunch. There's a whole cast of characters in this one. And of course, poor Wilma Plaster and her family, Dr. Mark Esquire, Linda. This is a lot. I don't even remember the other brother's name, which he gets a lot, I'm sure.

Unfortunately. I feel bad because he's a murder victim's family, but I forgot his name, and I have a feeling that they go, Mark's brother. Yes, that's me. Layton died, and then life got way worse. It's just everything unraveled. Everything unraveled. And this is a crazy one because like we said in the beginning, how often is it one older lady killing another older lady? Not over a man.

Not over this. Not over that. They're just friends. And this one. Over four grand. This is completely the weirdest thing ever. We haven't done a lot of cases that have this type of motive to them they're always something different with this small of a dollar figure of

like it's more the being caught right dude how dangerous is she it's crazy yeah it's because she got caught if she wasn't caught it's could have gone on god she killed her mom and was like well no one caught me for that one i I guess that's who I'm killing for. I guess I kill now. I guess I just kill now. Yeah, it's fucking crazy. So anyway, that's the whole mess there. That's Willard, Missouri.

And wow, that's a crazy one. And like I said, we did that one live a couple of times. And it was a lot of crazy to see the pictures of these people, too. It was a lot of crazy to see the pictures of these people, too. It was a lot of that shit. It's more fun when you get to really get into how long, what the story really is. I mean, we don't get to do that. I mean, at a live show, it's not two and a half hours of murder. We do.

Yeah, it's a little less. A two-hour show, but a lot of that's comedy, and it's less murder story. But that's the other thing, too. Definitely come see us at a live show. Hell, yeah. Do that, because our live shows are comedy shows shows you're going to see all the pictures you're going to hear all the evidence and that sort of thing see the pictures and but we're comics a lot of people and we've talked to and i'm not going to name names because i don't really care and i don't really know a lot of other podcasts that tour and shit but we hear from people all the time

i went to see other podcasts and they don't do good live shows. It's like a lecture, or they don't take it seriously. It's not the same. You guys do a fucking comedy show, and my sides hurt. It's a real show. We do a real show. We put it together, and it's a comedy show. We want to hurt you with laughter.

That's what we want to do. And you're going to hear a wild murder story and see all the pictures. And the environment of these live shows have gotten so cool. Like, the people, they hang out beforehand. People that don't know each other, they hang out. They fucking wear the merch. They organize going to bars together. It's cool as shit.

Anybody that goes alone will not be alone by the end of it. They're like, I don't want to go alone. Like, oh, my God, you'll have a million friends in five minutes. Like, everybody welcomes you into the fold. And it's not, like, weird. No one's like, ah, who they're like i don't want to go alone like oh my god you'll have a million friends in five minutes like everybody welcomes you into the fold and it's not like weird no one's like who are you i don't know it's all just friendly and oh great we're all turkeys here it's fucking wonderful so thank you by the way audience for creating such a cool environment to do live shows yeah you did it yeah we can't control who shows up for shows so you guys just we've had just the coolest audience show up for shows and you can buy tickets and be part of that audience right fucking now get on shut up and

give me murder.com head over all this everything's for sale right now uh we are going to be everything's for i'll sell you my shirt yeah i don't care whatever you got here so that is going to be we're going to be in all these cities here we We got Sacramento, San Francisco, Austin, Phoenix. We are Kansas City, Oklahoma City, Milwaukee, Minneapolis. Yeah, Medford outside of Boston, the big theater. Tarrytown, Nashville, and Raleigh-Durham. Durham is where we'll be. So outside of Raleigh.

So there we go. That's it. It's 12 shows. People, by the way, I just want to explain because some people who hadn't heard how we explained it before have said, oh, my God, there's no Chicago. Oh, my God, there's no this and there's no that. I thought they loved going to Chicago. I thought we treated you great. You do.

And we love going to Chicago. The thing is we were there less than six months ago and we sold over 2,000 tickets. So it's crazy. Just the math of it. They're like, give that a year. That's just the market tells us give that a year. They, you know, the venues are like, you just sold 2,000 tickets. Calm down. So we'll, the next year you will be the number one city we'll be going to trust us. And just places like that. Yeah. Philly, Pittsburgh,sburgh dc uh baltimore atlanta all these places that have been wonderful to us they're like why aren't you coming back seattle portland we will be back it's not that we don't want to go there it's really hard to do 30 shows

in a year we don't have time for it we do we do we put out with patreon we put out 20 recorded shows a month right it's a lot mix all the research and the recording and the editing and the up. It's a lot to squeeze in if we were on the road. This is two dudes doing this. Three days every weekend. Yeah, we have Allison and Ian that help us with research for both shows. But in the end, I got to put the show together how I want to say it. And we have to record it.

And we have to edit it and put it up. And it's not easy. We would love to come to these cities. And all the cities we're missing this year will be there next year we promise you that just like we missed most of these cities this year you know we didn't go to phoenix or new york this year yeah you don't think that either one of us wanted to make money without getting on a plane that'd be nice we would love that yeah so my own bed tonight trust yeah go home after the show trust us we would are all about that you guys have any idea what that dry hotel air does to a 42 year old man i snore and then i come home

and i and and i and i just my throat hurts for six days yeah we got home from texas a week and a half ago i'm still sick and on antibiotics with my face swollen up like a fucking monster so that's what happens 12 cities is a lot and it's fine so thank you for doing that yeah for buying i don't tell anybody anything about my life but i got two parents with terminal cancer and i'm not trying to run all over this country doing 30 shows a year and bring a common ass cold home to murk both my parents no shit and that of the other thing yeah that's that's the truth man we don't want to do any of that this isn't easy this is really fucking hard we'd love to believe me we'd love to be in every city every weekend making money doing live shows plus it's just fun we're in a theater with a book it's fucking great

doing a comedy show for people who appreciate it um the other thing we want to say if you want to get tickets we suggest get them as early as possible you see oh that shows in november i'm cool or even that boston show or that new york shows in december so i'll get them in like i'll see in october they will be well gone well gone yeah boston last year there was 1200 tickets at the wilbur 1100 tickets it sold in like a day and a half yeah i mean it was fucking done so there's some of these Nashville twos that sells fast. Oklahoma City, fast. Minneapolis, fast.

There's a lot of these cities. So if you're looking to go, make your plans well in advance and get all your tickets now and get in there because we can't wait to see people. We're sorry if that's an inconvenience to anybody that you have to do that so far in advance. But it's the easiest way to do it for everybody. So there you go go thank you to everybody who's already bought tickets and all

of you will buy tickets we're excited i have heard also if you buy tickets now by the time the show happens it feels like it's free you'll have forgotten all about the money it would have been gone anyway a year from now trust us that's the best way I've ever thought of, I've ever heard to think of anything. I'm going to start doing that. If I need something, I'm buying it. And then by the time I get it, I'm going to go, this is free. They'll be like found tickets by then.

Holy shit, look what I got. So certainly do that. You also want Patreon. Patreon.com slash crime and sports is where you get all the bonus material. My God, there's so much bonus material. Hundreds of episodes to binge on of back bonus episodes that have never been available on

anywhere but Patreon. And then you're also going to get two new ones every other week. Can't beat that. Four Patreons a month. This week, though, we're only going to do one. It's the one time of the year we only do one. We usually do every other week. We're only going to do one episode this time because it's Christmas when it comes out.

It's that weekend. My son's in New York from Arizona. You have a family. We don't have time for that shit at that point. So we'd like to see our children. Let's do that. Yeah. We're going to talk about a cult.

We're going to talk about the garden, which is an alleged cult where let's mix super earthy hippies that want to like live with the land mix that with malicious militia survivalist people who think the world is going to end at any second in a nuclear catastrophe those people are living in one fucking area together and having weird council meetings where they it's a weird setup man we'll talk all about it is it a cult is it not let's find out put it that way we'll we'll certainly have an opinion by the end of it we'll tell you that much it's on hbo max if you want to check it out it's like a seven part thing and it's pretty goddamn awesome it goes fast though it's one of those where you're like oh there's no more of that i want more you want to just follow those fucking people around so uh

check all that out patreon.com slash crime and sports also follow us on social media we are at small town murder on instagram at murder small on twitter at small town pod on facebook check all that that said jimmy hit me with the names of the most wonderful goddamn people who will never let us down who keep coming around and keep listening to awesome shit on patreon tell us who our best friends are jimmy hit me with them right now this week's executive producers are kyle norweg erica blanc or blank maybe and jordan bennett thank you guys so much for everything you do you are wonderful other producers this week are peyton meadows joanna writer tyler frazier music janice

hill scarlet horby sinesta vez jones on their jacksonville honeymoon good for you i don't know if they're real people they may be joking uh jake brown's brother caleb uh passed away he uh had a accidental uh overdose and uh sucks jake's uh family uh is uh jesus i'm so sorry sorry to hear that that's horrible hang in there j. You're a good kid. Other producers are S. Meyer. I imagine that's Seth Meyer. Tori Brock, Samantha Sennett. Sennett, maybe? Jason with no last name.

Jenna Klukey. Geig? Geig? Geig? Malloy? What? Christine with no last name. Bianca Arter.

Kelly Sachs. Grousteen. Jack Treffery. Treffery? Chris Bowden. Marica Franklin. Rashid Morris, Jane with no last name, Chris Clark, Debbie Heather Shaw, Amy James, Sarai with no last name, Big Kahuna, Julia with no last name, Dame Beck, Courtney Hornsby, Reagan France, TJ Curry, Brianne Soldovsky, Robert Von Schmidly, Brandy Heimbrock, Robert Von Schmidly.

Brandy Heimbrock. Katie W. Jess R. Howard. Melissa Green. Nathan Falk. Reese Page. Fiona Westrup-Evans. Christopher Greenan.

Jennifer Begin. Benign? Benign? Benign. Benign. Ben-yay? Possible. Karen Lapina.

Morgan with no last name. Chanda Mooney-Ham. Avery Harper. Dustin Iacovizisi. That's not right. Anti-Anita? Anita Peterson? Anti-Peterson. Anti-Peterson. Misty Stefani. Mist? Is this a typo?

I don't know. Heather Oster. Nuts. Hugs, not drugs. Amanda Smith. Willis Wood. Dakota Coyne. McCorkle's Bar and Grill. Oh, it's a fake Instagram account that somebody has AI'd a bunch of pictures of people eating in a restaurant at a bar and grill. It's actually very funny.

Miranda Elrod. Ashley. Somebody donated in their name. Miranda, I imagine it's the person that owns the Instagram account. Ashley, Allie, Jennifer, Thabo, Thabo, Thabo, Thabo, Thabo, Thabo, Thabo,

Farrah Roberts, Sarah Moore, Erica, Erica, Bowman, Bowman, Roger, Ben, Mike Morgan, Lana Emrick, Jolene Vaughn, Chris D, Megan with no last name, Jacob Wilson, Carrie with no last name, Jessica Sheldon, Carrie Ann Heckman, Holly Rowland, Caitlin King, Andrew Farrell, Alana Logan, Lily with no last name, Sarah with no last name, Stephanie with no last name, Ellie, Ellie, Ellie, Ellie, Ellie, Ellie Wakasugi, Jared Wilson, Greg the Sound Guy, Jen Wright, Amy with no last name. Ellie. Ellie? Ellie. Ellie. Ellie. Ellie. Ellie Wakasugi. Jared Wilson. Greg the Sound Guy. Jen Wright.

Amy with no last name. LK. This show brought to you by the letters L and K. Deb Murch. Carl Toussaint. Toussaint. Toysent. Holly Drew.

Alyssa Edwards. One of those. Elizabeth Golden. Emily Cook. Chris with no last name. Laura Martin. Megan Wood. Toby Geisbrecht, Holiday Deese, Brian Butler, Katie with no last name, Raina McCoy, Tigger with no last name,

Jen with no last name, Ash Squatch, 91, Dylan Hall, Jennifer Zimmerman, Mike with no last name, Catherine Haney, M. Shuttner, Elise, E-Liz with no last name. Paul, Powell, Paul Kruzeskizuk. Sonia with no last name. Tommy M. F. Herrera. Abigail Tuning.

Oh, motherfucking Herrera. Abigail Tuning. Motherfucking Herrera. Bailey with no last name. Sharon McGregor. Darren with no last name. David Hillen. Jeremy Williams.

Jeff with no last name. Rallamas with no last name. Justin Maine.. Jeremy Williams. Jeff with no last name. Rallamas with no last name. Justin Main. Kim Rapinoe. Rhonda Wall. Heather Hoyle. Mitchie Tyson. Mychie.

Mitchie Tyson. Mickey, maybe. Jessica Camps. Jamie McGinnis. Andy Fields. Lauren Christie. Amelia Poole. Tara Teresa.

Teresa Wishnew. Kevin Callanan. Olivia Rosler, Danny Diamond, Bobby Schutch, Brent Alton, oh boy, Albert, Robert Carter, No Mama Marlia, Linda Cossack, Kristen Derkens, Jeremy Wright, Susie Grant, Sandy McGeachy, Margaret with no last name, J.C., Mary Catherine Cozenza, born in the 90s, Paul Lenz, Amy Latham, Latham Moore, Rayon, Rayon? Rayon Watts? Like the fucking fabric? Jordan Van Westen, Kaisa Jansen, Arbs, Arbs, eh?

Christine Jower? Don't look at Jennifer Koons, Michael Korspiszik, Christopher Kummer, Kenny Smith, Rhonda Brodmeier, Teresa Martin, Shaiet Sh Shady Williams, Trey Lawler, lawyer, Sean Combs, probably not that one, Jocelyn with no last name, Raquel with no last name, Clint Barnett, Dana Lauren, Rebecca Gardner, Sabrina with no last name, Nathan Rose, Bianca Sternmaker, Justin Brockway, Jessica Nichols Seymour, Alex Peterson, Amana, and Paul. Ezra Coleman, the not as great Muta. It's a wrestler. It's the not as great one. Yeah, not as great as Muta. Sarah Cole, Kelly Corbell, Autumn Perez-Diaz, Robin Marie, Heather Abrams, Jamie Lynn Single, Allie Myers, Claire Stuckel, K. Thomas, Dr. DeMarco, D'Amique Thompson, Catherine Pakes, Cindy G., Taye Summer, Gary Ferguson, Jamie Price, Rodrigo Alonso, Kennedy Parker, Jacob Nielsen, Kevin K23, Angel Blackburn, Joe DeSalvo, Mahjong Hackensack, Thank you. Thank you. Thank patrons. You're fucking incredible. Thank you.

Thank you. Thank you. Unbelievable. And thank you again. You people are fucking awesome, and we just appreciate the balls off of you. Whether you have balls or not, we just appreciate the shit out of you. Or appreciate that they're off of you. Yeah.

Either way. Either way. Appreciate the tits off you. I don't know. Either way, we're just thank you for what you do for us. Honestly. You want to follow us on social media personally, real easy to do that. Shut up and give me murder.com.

Drop down menu, all the links to everything you could possibly want. That said, until next week, everybody, it's been our pleasure. Bye. Hey, Prime members, you can listen to Small Town Murder early and ad-free on Amazon Music. Download the Amazon Music app today. Or you can listen early and ad-free with Wondery Plus and Apple Podcasts. Before you go, tell us about yourself by completing a short survey at wondery.com slash survey.