Something Rhymes with Purple - Trumps

Episode Date: April 11, 2023

Gyles is fresh back from Jamaica and after visiting the spiritual home of James Bond, he’s channeling his 007 spirit and taking Susie to the casino for a touch of Gambling.  In our trip to 'the little casa', we will find out why trumps are so triumphant, why a gimmick at the gaming table might be magic and how your poker face is connected to your bragging rights and - as so often happens in English - we encounter ‘Jack’ in the form of the 'Jackpot' and 'Blackjack'. We love hearing from you, find us @SomethingRhymes on Twitter and Facebook, @SomethingRhymesWith on Instagram or you can email us here: [e-mail] Want even more purple, people? Join the Purple Plus Club by clicking the banner in Apple podcasts or head to purpleplusclub.com to listen on other platforms' Don’t forget that you can join us in person at our upcoming tour, tap the link to find tickets: www.somethingrhymeswithpurple.com  Enjoy Susie’s Trio for the week:  Ignotism: A mistake due to ignorance Grampus: One who breathes heavily/noisily Efflagitate: To demand eagerly Gyles' poem this week was 'Any Part of Piggy' by 'Noel Coward' Any part of the piggy Is quite alright with me. Ham from Westphalia, ham from Parma Ham as lean as the Dalai Lama Ham from Virginia, ham from York, Trotters, sausages, hot roast pork. Crackling crisp for my teeth to grind on Bacon with or without the rind on Though humanitarian I’m not a vegetarian. I’m neither a crank nor prude nor prig And though it may sound infra dig Any part of the darling pig Is perfectly fine by me. A Somethin’ Else & Sony Music Entertainment production.   Find more great podcasts from Sony Music Entertainment at sonymusic.com/podcasts     To bring your brand to life in this podcast, email [e-mail]  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Crypto trading involves risk of loss. See kraken.com slash legal slash ca dash pru dash disclaimer for info on Kraken's undertaking to register in Canada. Hello, purple people around the world. This is Giles Brandreth speaking to you from London, England, with my colleague and friend, in my view, the world's leading lexicographer, Susie Dent. Where are you today, Susie? I wish I could give you a novel answer.

I'd love to say that I was up a hill somewhere, but I am still, as I was throughout lockdown, I am still in my lovely little Oxford study. It's a bit small, but I love it. I have just been up a hill myself because I have just returned and slightly jet lagged. I've just returned from the beautiful island of Jamaica, which I know very well and I went there for a special reason. This year, in fact it was March the 26th, marked the 50th anniversary of the death of one of my heroes, the British playwright, actor, entertainer, director, film star, Noel Coward, who was born in 1899,

but died 53 years ago. Forgive me, 50 years ago, exactly 50 years ago. And I went with my wife, Michelle, because we're both Coward groupies, we went to his house where he died on Jamaica, a house called Firefly. And it's up a hill, quite difficult to his house where he died on Jamaica, a house called Firefly, and it's up a hill, quite difficult to get to because the road is not properly made up. And there, he had two houses. In fact, he had a sort of house called Blue Harbour, which was down by the harbour on the coast of Jamaica where he lived, and where his companions lived and where he kept his guests. But he built for himself a little house up the hill called Firefly, which has the most fantastic view. And we celebrated his extraordinary life.

Do you know much about Noel Card? Have you seen any of his plays? I have seen some of his plays, but not for a very long time. Do you know, I was realising the other day, I have not been to the theatre, apart from the shows that I do and that we do together, to actually see something since before the pandemic, which is appalling. So I need to get my cultural act together. As you were talking about Jamaica there, I was just wondering, didn't Ian Fleming have a house there as well? And name one of his films after his house. You're absolutely right. He had

a house called Golden Eye. And indeed, some of his films were actually made in Jamaica. I think the first one with Sean Connery was made there. There's a lovely picture of Sean Connery with Noel Coward. Noel Coward, Ian Fleming, they were all friends. They lived there in the 1950s, knew each other well. And indeed, I visited Golden Eye on my recent visit. It's now owned and managed by Chris Blackwell, who is a famous record producer, the founder of Island Records, the man who, in a way, discovered Bob Marley. Well, Bob Marley was already there, but he made him world famous through Island Records. So I've had a fantastic week. What a trip. And you have the tan to prove it.

I have to say, did you do, James Bond style, did you do any gambling while you were there? Just a bit of poker at the casino table? I did not have a flutter, but you're quite right because Casino Royale is the name of one of Ian Fleming's novels. He was into gambling and casinos. As on a lighter note, not such a heavy gambler, was Noel Card. He enjoyed spending

a bit of money and indeed appeared famously in Cabaret Las Vegas, which is funded on casino money. You're saying this because, of course, this is our link to our theme today. We're going to talk about gambling and the whole world of really indoor gambling, not horse racing, because we've discovered, we've touched on aspects of gambling before, haven't we? We have, yes. We did an episode called Snakes, Ladders and a Live Show. I think it was back episode 104 and then episode 199, San Fran's Disco, where we touched on this world. Let's dig a little bit deeper into it, because I know, for example, Ian Fleming played different card games in the casino.

Blackjack. But before we get to that, the very word casino, where does that come from? And gambling, where does that come from? Yes. Well, first of all, I'm going to say a massive disclaimer at the beginning of this. First of all, we should say, shouldn't we gamble responsibly? But secondly, I am not a gambler. So if I sound like a complete ingenue when I'm talking about these games, please forgive me, because I've not really played any of them. And I think we have talked before about how my only exposure to that scene was when I was about 12, when my family went to Las Vegas. And I have to say, I hated it, but it's not somewhere for a 12 year old, that's for sure. Casino, of course, associated with gambling, as we've been saying, but originally it was a

public room and it was used for all kinds of entertainment, particularly dancing and music. And casino is a little casa or a little house in Italian. And ultimately, if you take it back far enough, you will find Latin there, casa meaning a cottage. And that of course gave us chalet as well. It's worth saying actually, that I think I could, not knowing that, have worked it out. And if one spends time just looking physically at a word, you see that casino, of course, casa, white house, casa blanca, as in Casablanca, the city. So casino, and eno often means a diminutive. So it's a little house. It is. We find different diminutives in different languages, but yes, that one definitely from Italian.

And gamble, you asked as well. That ultimately we think comes from game. And there was a very old word gameling, meaning the playing of games, gameling, G-A-M-E-L-I-N-G. So it's quite possible that that then morphed into gambling. Quite where the B comes from, we don't know. What about to gamble as into like a frisky young sheep would gamble? Yes, not linked at all. So that I think, I'm just going to look this up now, but I think actually it comes from the French. Yes, ultimately from Latin, but it came via French from the French, yes, ultimately from Latin, but it came via French from the Italian gambata,

meaning to trip up, and gamba was a leg. So they're frisky and they jump about playfully and lift their legs up, is the idea. Fine. So if you have a gammy leg, is that connected with that? It's funny. I was looking, this is entirely unrelated, but somebody was asking me the other day why we say it's giving me jip. And I immediately thought it was a derogatory reference to gypsies, which, you know, that's now a recognised ethnic label. They've been sort of receiving end of so many insults through history because anyway, they were thought to come from Egypt. That's where gypsy comes from. But giving me jit actually goes back apparently to the instruction to a horse to g up and it's sort of spurring something on just as a leg might be you

know there might be sort of pain being spurred on which is a really curious story anyway gammy that is originally with reference again to horse's leg and quite possibly is linked to that gamba but we're not completely sure okay so we've got've got gambling, we've got casino, and you go to the casino and you might play, as I know Ian Fleming did, creator of James Bond, who lived and worked at GoldenEye. And actually, when I was there, I sat at the desk at which he wrote his novels. I thought maybe this will inspire me. Yeah, took a snap. I must send it to you of me. I'll put it on Twitter, I will, so people can see me sitting at Ian Fleming's desk. But he went to the casino and played Baccarat. Now, what is Baccarat? Baccarat is also called chemin de fer,

which in French means railway. And I have absolutely no idea why it's called railway. And we don't have much idea about Baccarat either. It's a game in which three hands are dealt and players may bet either or both their hands against the dealers and I think Chimamda Fair differs from that in that they bet against each other as opposed to against the house but it's possible that Baccarat comes from a toponym and the French place Baccarat which was noted for its glass making but we're not completely sure there's another theory that it goes back to the Latin bacchi, which is a reference to Bacchus, the altar of Bacchus, where, of course, lots of indulgences were held. But the honest

answer is we don't really know. Bacchus being the Latin of the god of wine. Wine and all sorts of sport in its broadest sense. Oh, really? I mean, he was sort of lust as well as alcohol. Well, we talk about Bacchanalian rites, don't we, though? We're fairly orgiastic, I think. Is Baccharac anything like Blackjack? Well, Blackjack is also, in English, we often call it 21 or 21. Ah. And it's a card game where you're dealt cards and the aim is to have a higher count than those of the dealer. But you can only go up

to 21, hence its name. Now, Jack, you're going to ask me about here. It's such, I mean, I have to give you a potted history of Jack really, because it's had so many different uses and we've touched on it before. So in the middle ages, Jack was a pet form of John and it was used to refer to any ordinary man. So, you know, Tom, Dick and Harry in the modern sense, that was Jack in the Middle Ages. As in Jack and Jill. Jack and Jill went up the hill. And by the 16th century, it also meant a young man. And that's why we have a Jack in a deck of cards, the knave, if you like. And then in the 18th century, a Jack was particularly an ordinary man who was a labourer.

And that gave us the lumberjack, the steeplejack, etc. So often an unskilled worker is contrasted with the master of a trade. And that's why we get jack of all trades and master of none, which is another phrase. And then a jack could also be something of smaller size. So the whole idea was kind of slightly looking down on the poor, normal, ordinary jacks of the world. So you have the jack in bowls, which is a smaller bowl, which the players aim at. You have the union jack, which strictly speaking is a small version of the national flag that you fly on board a ship and so on and so on. And a jack pot, it was originally

used in the form of poker. So the pool or the pot was accumulated until the player could open the bidding with two jacks or better. That's why we have a jack pot. So it, again, looks back to that use of the jack as an ordinary knave in a deck of cards. And it's in that sense, I think, that blackjack is used. And as I say, I don't know the ins and outs of the game, but I assume that a knave or a jack of a black suit then has some role to play in Blackjack. There also are jacks that are little small objects that you throw up in the air and they land. Do you remember that game? I love it. We've actually got a set here. You can still buy them. I played that for hours. They're called

jacks. And again, small object, as I say, just so that, you know, like the jack in bowls, etc. And given that we're creating links between all of this and Ian Fleming and Noel Coward, two writers of the same vintage who both lived in Jamaica, you mentioned Jack of all trades, master of none. Noel Coward was known throughout his life, read it from quite a young age, as the master. People in the theatre would refer to him as the master or master. He self-deprecatingly said yes, because master of none, that's how it comes from. But it was because he was regarded as a master of every aspect of theatre. Amazing. Because he directed, he produced, he wrote music, he wrote great songs. He was the master. Faro, or Faro, F-A-R-O. I think that's a gambling card game too, isn't it?

Yes, and it's one of the oldest, apparently, being played with cards. And we think, and you're seeing a thread here,ciful creations of whoever actually developed or devised the games. But the name Pharaoh, we think, derives from the picture of a pharaoh on an early set of cards. So this game was really popular in the 18th and 19th centuries. And it involves betting on the rank or number of a card drawn from a box. And you'll still find it in a few casinos, I think. Pharaoh, I would spell it P-H-A-R-O-A-H. This card game is spelled Faro, Faro, F-A-R-O. I mean, are the P-H and the F interchangeable? In fact, it's just the development of spelling. I think quite possibly this is where it comes from. I mean,

you know, even in centuries past, we loved to play around with, you know, with spellings and things. Do you remember OK started as all correct, O-R-L-K-O-R-R-E-K-T, centuries ago. So I have to put you up on Pharaoh. Spell it for me again. It's a really hard one. I'll get this wrong. P-H-A-R-O-A-H. Is that wrong? It's A-O-H.

Oh, thank you. I get it wrong all the time. Well, I get it wrong all the time too, clearly. And I don't always have you there to correct me, but thank you. Is Faro a place as well? I feel it is. I feel I've been to Faro once. Yeah, it's in Egypt, isn't it?

Oh, is it? I think I might've got this completely wrong. Let's look it up. Because I have been to Egypt, but I don't remember going to Faro. I felt it was more like Italy or somewhere. F-A-R-O. It, ah, Portugal. ThereA-R-O. Portugal. There you are.

It's in Portugal. Oh, okay. Got that completely wrong. I was thinking Faro still, clearly. There will be purple people who say, I can't believe it. They think they know so much. They know absolutely nothing. Faro's well known.

Everyone knows. They know zero. We can't even spell. Can't spell. Don't know that Faro's in Portugal. What do they know? We're not coming up Trumps here. That is a turn of phrase from the world, I'm sure, of gambling and cards, isn't it? Coming up Trumps. Yes. And you remember that, well, Trump has lots of different words in the dictionary. Some of them seem very appropriate. It can be to break wind. Trumpery finery is

something of very little substance trumperiness is something extremely showy but utterly worthless one of my favorites and trump in this sense is a playing card of the suit that ranks above others and it's an alteration of triumph so it actually triumph was the original that was used in cards as well. And Triumph, if you remember, goes back to ancient Rome when it was the grand entry of a really victorious general into the city. So it's all to do with victory, really. And anyway, so we turn up trumps when we produce a better outcome than expected because, you know, a hand with many trump cards is likely to be a winning one. Yeah. I used to play bridge. Do you play bridge? Have you ever played bridge?

No, I don't play any of this. My mum plays bridge and also she really likes Mahjong. Oh. Yes, which I've never played either. I've never played Mahjong and bridge I can't play any longer because I can't remember the rules

and the various things you have to agree, you know, what you're playing, you know, one no trumps and what they're worth and all of that. Oh dear. I'd love to be very skilled in it, I have to say. But you have to do these things regularly to be successful at them. You've got to give that commitment. I've been very keen in my time on board games. As you know, I founded the National

Scrabble Championships. I was once a European Monopoly champion. Above board, is that to do with the world of cards, gambling or board games? Board games are not necessarily so-called because they are played on a physical board, although that's how we apply it today. But actually, a board game was one designed to be played on a table. And another name for a table was a board, which is why we have a cup board. A cup cupboard was originally a table for storing cups. A sideboard was a table on the side. Board and lodging is food served at the table and accommodation. And the board game was then one to be played on the table. Bed and board. The bed is obviously the bed. The board

means the food that you'll get on a table. Exactly. When you go to stay somewhere and you get bed and board included. Exactly. And above board means above the table. And actually what it referred to was the player being open and honest and having enough integrity to keep their hands at all times on the table and visible so that they weren't trying to, you know, shuffle cards or sneak a winning card up their sleeve so that it would have an ace literally up their sleeve and, you know, get up to all sorts of shenanigans. If you are above board, you know, you're playing correctly. And as I say, with such morals and integrity.

Do you remember, you're probably too young, there was years ago a wonderful film with Robert Redford and Paul Newman, I think they were the stars, called The Sting. Yes. Which involved gambling that I didn't really understand at the time. But I do remember finding it very exciting. Oh, and one of the best theme tunes, signature tunes ever. I mean, that's often played on the piano, isn't it? It's gorgeous.

Yeah. Gorgeous song. Do-do-do-do-do-do-do. Isn't that it? I love to hear you sing. Do-do-do-do-do-do-do. I think it's that one. What a loss to the musical theatre you were.

We need to revive one of the Noel Card musicals from the 1930s and have you as the leading lady. You absolutely do not. You've got to get a gimmick or two. Gimmick, is that a word from the world of card games? Not so much. Gimmick actually arose in magic, believe it or not. So we're not completely sure where it comes from, but some believe it's a kind of anagram of magic that's got an A in it. But certainly the original sense was a piece of magician's kit. It was some sort of device for dishonestly either steering a gambling game or one used in a conjuring trick. And that idea of something tricky or ingenious, a gadget, if you like, then was transferred into a modern sense. Before we turn to poker, I'm showing you my poker face. I hope you think you can see it over the screen. This is my poker face. Are there any more phrases that come from the

world of card games? Oh my goodness, there are so many. But as you say, a lot of them come from poker. But what about doubling down? We often talk about, well, we're going to double down in our efforts, et cetera. And to double down was to double the bet once a player has seen the initial cards and one and any one additional card can be drawn. And so to double down is either to keep going in a dangerous situation or just to sort of, you know, stick with the plan,

even if it looks like it's going slightly wrong. Good. Any more? Well, no, let's go on to poker, actually. Or should we have a break first? Let's have a break and then we'll talk poker. drop out of the last day? How about a 4 p.m. late checkout? Just need a nice place to settle in? Enjoy your room upgrade. Wherever you go, we'll go together. That's the powerful backing of American Express. Visit amex.ca slash yamx. Benefits vary by card. Terms apply. Whether it's the weekend, the beginning of summer, or the end of the school year,

Celebration Cookies celebrate good times. This is Giles Brandreth with Susie Dent. Together, well, we're having a royal flush. We're getting our ducks in a rang. There's no dead man's hand on us. We're playing poker. Well, we're talking about gambling games and having a bit of fun with those and the etymology of the world of gambling. Poker, not a game I play, though I'm a great friend of Anthony Holden, who is a British journalist and writer who's just

published in paperback his marvellous autobiography. If there are people looking for a book to read, I recommend his autobiography, which is called Based on a True Story, which is a wonderful title for a journalist's autobiography. He's well known for having written biographies himself of extraordinary people from the present King through to William Shakespeare, Laurence Olivier. But he has been in his time a really good poker player. And he wrote a very successful book about poker. Do you remember where poker comes from? No, tell me. Does it come from the thing that is a poker that you stoke your fire with?

No, that is something that you poke or prod a fire with, as you say. No, we think it goes back to the German word Pochspiel, meaning a bragging game. So it's all about bragging and sort of, you know, bragging rights, I suppose. And the Poe in Poe-faced may have been modelled on the expression poker-faced. And here I should say that the Poe might look back to a use of that word to mean chamber pot or the kind of contemptuous pa-pa kind of thing. But anyway, yes, the need to keep a deadpan face when playing the game gives you bragging rights. So it's often to brag. Would you be any good at a poker face?

Yes, I'm not bad. I was always very sad that when I did, people overseas probably won't know this game unless it's syndicated abroad. But there is a comedy program called Would I Lie to You in which contestants have to tell these ridiculous stories. And you hear two or three stories and you have to guess which is the true one and which is the false one. And they didn't trust me with any lies, clearly, because I just only told facts that

actually had happened in my life, whereas I was desperate to fib because I think I would be okay at it. I think I could do the poker face, but when it comes to anything else to do with poker, I think I'd probably be rubbish. Oh no, it sounds good. Royal flush. I'd love to know what a royal flush is, though maybe it's what happens when you go to the lavatory in Buckingham Palace. It's followed by a royal flush. No, in poker, it's a straight flush. So you've got the ace, the king, the queen, the jack and the ten all in the same suit. And that's the highest possible value if a wild card hasn't been played so this is not the flush as in flushing the loo or flushed cheeks that's the sense of moving rapidly or springing up well the sense level with if you say oh yes that's flush a picture is flush or something is is level that's probably the same

idea of a river running full and level with its banks. But the hand of cards all of the same suit, probably, it's still quite watery, probably goes back to the Latin fluxus, meaning a flow, because you have a flow or a sequence of cards. And the royal was added because it's obviously something of high value. I mentioned the phrase having your ducks in a row. Does that have a poker connection? Well, ducks are a pair of twos or juices. And it's thought that duck might sound like deux, which is two in French. So we're not

completely sure where that comes from. I'm not sure about all your ducks in a row. I always think of those in British houses, suburban houses. We used to have those ducks on the wall, didn't we? Sort of flying, three ducks kind of flying upwards. We still do. Oh, do you? I may have to put a picture of that out on Twitter as well. Have you got some? We've got some that my son, about 40 years ago,

when he was a very little boy, at a fun fair, he was there for hours spending more and more money until he got one, all three ducks. Amazing. Shooting, you know, he had to get the bullseye with a gun and he then won one duck and two ducks then three ducks and we bought them in the bathroom flying up the bathroom wall they look magnificent i keep them with great pride oh how fantastic yes do send me a photo i'm not sure if that's where all the ducks in it having all your ducks in a row comes from but our producer has has made a note here against ducks, which I have to say,

it doesn't mean anything to me, but it will to poker players or anyone who is in this groove. Pocket ducks are the lowest pocket pair in Texas hold'em, but perform surprisingly well against big, slick and other non-pair hands. How's that for a bit of lingo? Well, clearly they speak their own language in the world of poker, don't they? The only way I can work out ducks being like the French deux is if you mispronounce deux. Because deux, I think in French is spelled D-E-U-X. If you see it written down, you say dukes gives you ducks. U-X.

Yes, exactly. So you'd go dukes. Certainly in poker, we talk about pocket ducks. Other people say that the number two also kind of looks like a duck. So I think you have to stretch your imagination a little to get there. Any more that we should rattle through while we're in the world of gambling? Well, I think we talked possibly before, as we said about, you know, various things in poker, but passing the buck, just a reminder there, that looks back to a buckhorn knife that was passed around a poker table and basically indicated who was going to deal the cards. You have the buck stops here.

Similarly, going back to the buck stopping with the player who's about to, you know, to deal. The blue chip has a high value in gambling games. So blue chip company now is one considered to be a reliable investment of the highest quality. My favourite hand in poker is the dead man's hand. And that is said to come from a legend that Wild Bill Hickok was holding these cards, the aces and the eights, at the time he was killed in 1876. Oh, that's nice. Probably an urban myth, but rather an exciting one. It is, isn't it? By the way, if you can hear lots of footsteps and lots of juddering going up and down by my door, I should just say my lawn currently is a sea of mud. So I'm having it looked at. It just, yeah, did not do very

well with the British frost and then the rain. So some very lovely people have come to try and re-sow it for me. So I apologise for the noise. There may be noises at my end too, because the boiler men who have been coming and going for some weeks are coming again today. Oh, good grief. You need a new boiler. Why don't you just have a new one? We've got a new one. I can't tell you how much, I won't tell you how much it costs, because you will be appalled. And we haven't paid for it yet because they haven't quite finished and they're coming yet again to tinker and change. I can only apologise.

Well, you can only sympathise, never mind apologise. You don't need to apologise. No, that's true. Well, I can apologise for the noise my end and hopefully the teeny tiny strip of lawn that I have will be looking glorious by the end of it. But we should probably, you know, go to our correspondence because we have quite a bit waiting for us. If we go to our correspondence, I want us on another day, please, to return to

this subject because I want to say, faites vos jeux, rien ne va plus, and take you to the roulette wheel. Ah, okay, let's do that. But maybe we'll do that another time. Some of these subjects are so rich, we can't pack them all in. It's very true. And just before we go to the correspondence, Giles, just a reminder that Something Rhymes with Purple is on stage.

We have taken Purple live to the Ambassador's Theatre. We'll be there on Sunday, the 16th of April. Tickets have gone on sale. And our theme, well, it's absolutely one of my favourite subjects. It's untranslatables. It's those words from other languages that have no English equivalent and they're just either joyful or entirely necessary. And we would love to meet as many purple people as possible. So please do come along. For tickets and info, you can go to

somethingrhymeswithpurple.com or as always, follow us on social media. That's at Something Rhymes on Twitter and Facebook or at Something Rhymes With on Instagram. So this is a show where you and I appear at the beautiful Ambassador's Theatre on stage. This is a theatre, the heart of Covent Garden, not far from Soho. We're particularly associated for many years with the Mousetrap. It's where Agatha Christie's play, The Mousetrap, the longest running play in world history, first opened back in the early 1950s. It's now still running at the theatre next door, the St. Martins. But the Ambassadors Theatre is a beautiful theatre, as I shall be telling people, no doubt when we're there, I once produced a play there many years ago. So it's a theatre I

know and love. And we're there on Sunday, the 16th of April. So do get in touch. Somethingrhymeswithpurple.com is where you will be able to get your tickets. So that's exciting. And we meet people during the interval. We actually leave the stage, come down, mingle. So who's been in touch? Well, we have some wonderful, wonderful emails coming in. And yeah, just as well as buying tickets, please do get in touch with purple at something else.com. So the first question comes from Chris Spensley, who is asking about a very specific idiom. Hello, Susie and Giles. Chris here from Brisbane, Australia. I was wondering, another podcast I listened to was talking about the phrase a hill to die on and how perfectly suited it was to the myth of Romulus and Remus.

And I was wondering, is this a grand coincidence, or is there something about that story that has fed into the idiom existing in the first place? Love the podcast. Have a great day. Well, Chris, isn't that interesting? We have a lot of listeners in Australia. And clearly, Chris listens to more than one podcast, which is slightly shocking to hear, but we can cope with it. A Hill to Die On. That sounds like the title of a great novel, if not one written by Ian Fleming. It's got a ring. Yeah. Now, I don't know the story. I mean, I've heard of Romulus and Remus, but I don't know what the story is and why it's connected with the hill. Do you?

I don't know that either. And I wish Chris had actually told us this because it would have been really interesting. But maybe he can write in and let us know. So a hill to die on is an issue that someone resolutely believes in and will defend whatever the cost. And it's often used to question whether the cost is disproportionate, in fact, to the cause. Now, the OED's first reference, believe it or not, was 1980. So very unlikely then that you'll find it going back to Romulus and Remus, except there may possibly have been sort of similar formulations in the Bible that kind of didn't stand the test of time and faded away. And the idiom became much more popular at the tail end of World War II, but not in that

exact phrase, which is why the OED only dates it to 1980. So there were sort of very similar things as a military term to explain the hill that soldiers were willing to defend and die upon. And actually other people, when looking for a very specific reference, point to Hamburger Hill. So that was during a really particularly gruesome battle during the Vietnam War in 69. That was a fortification that was subject to much controversy, wasn't it? But very little strategic value. So lots of things that you could point to with this one, but it seems to be much more modern in its current form than you might think. And it also does seem as though it's

actually just fairly transparent in that it's, you know, it is something literally, or not literally, figuratively, you are willing to defend to the end. You have been dipping into the Oxford News Dictionary while I've been dipping into Wikipedia. So I can tell you that Romulus and Remus are twin brothers whose story tell of the events that led to the founding of the city of Rome, of course, and Rome is built on hills. More learned purple people than we are can get in touch purple at something else dot com. But I hope, Chris, that gives you at least a bit of a clue as to where the phrase comes from and being much more modern than you and I would have thought. Who else has written to us? Well, we have, well, not a voice note this time, but Ella Bailey has been in touch. Can you read out her email? Do you have it there?

I have it in front of me. Hello, Giles and Susie. Thank you for all that you do. It's a nice thing to say. Thank you, Ella. One query that has been lingering in my mind is the use of the word pretty as a qualifying adverb, similar to the word quite. This is so common in casual speech today. I assumed it was a relatively recent addition to the word's meaning, until I noticed its same use in Jane Austen novels to describe someone as having pretty good opinion of himself, for example. Could you share an insight into when

or how pretty began to be used in this way? Oh, very intriguing question. Well, I'm pretty sure that my beautiful friend Susie will have the answer. It is lovely. And if you go back to the 11th of May, 1660, you will find, Ella, something quite similar in Samuel Pepys' diary, where he mentions Dr. Clark, who I found to be a very pretty man and very knowing. Now, he again is not using this in the sense of something sort of, you know, particularly applied to a woman as sort of being, you know, quite appealing in that way. He is using it to mean that the doctor was admirable, you know, sort of a fine fellow, if you like. And it's just one of dozens of senses that pretty has had over the centuries. And believe it or not,

it comes from a root meaning trick. And the very first meaning of pretty was cunning or crafty. And then it was followed by clever or skillful or brave, which of course were very admirable qualities, which is how the pleasing sense came in. This attractive sense of pretty appeared in the 15th century. Quite unusual in the journeys of English words where you think, how on earth did that step happen? That just, you know, that's a really big leap from that meaning to another. With pretty, you can pretty much follow the steps. Even if the modern sense has come quite a long way from the original, you can sort of chart its journey. And then from the idea of admirable and attractive, the meaning of considerable or great came. So someone can earn a pretty penny. And the only

one that doesn't quite fit the model is when it's used as an adverb, meaning fairly or moderately, as in, I'm pretty hungry. Not very, very hungry, I'm pretty hungry. And we're not completely sure why it was harnessed in slang to mean sort of fairly or moderately, because maybe it's the fairly, I don't know, it sort of slightly bucks the trend of something that is overall extremely positive. But yeah, what a journey it's had. And it's, you know, quite similar to nice, which has had so many different meanings over time and can be used in many different ways. But anyway, the Jane Austen sense that Ella discovered was, as I say, just one step in its very long journey. Yes. But you're saying you don't quite know because when Jane Austen's used there, it is pretty as a qualifying adverb.

Yes. As a qualifying adjective, actually, she's using it as a pretty good opinion of himself. So pretty, in that sense, does fit the mould of, you know, considerably. It's the use of an adverb. Actually, I gave the wrong examples in pretty tired, sorry. But it's kind of, I don't know, it just doesn't quite fit. And this is, I feel like I failed Ella slightly because she has asked specifically, why is it used similarly to the word quite? We're not completely sure. But, you know, slang does take these sort of, you know, little steps away sometimes. And that's its whole point is to be slightly subversive. Well, that's it.

I like our show being slightly subversive. That's what we want. That's why people come to see us live on the 16th of April, the Ambassadors Theatre. Not, I imagine, if you're Chris Spensley in Australia, but possibly if you're Ella Bailey, who is closer to home. Susie, do you have a trio of words, interesting words that you'd like to share with us? I do. Well, we're recording this during the Easter holidays, aren't we? When children are at home and rogitating frequently. Sounds rude. To rogitate is to ask again and again and again, as in when are we going to get there, etc, etc. So that's to rogitate, but I'm not giving you rogitate. I'm going to give you efflagitate

because I think I've had rogitation before. Efflagitate, E-F-F-L-A-G-I-T-A-T-E, is to demand something eagerly. So your kids might be a flagitating for, I don't know, sweets, biscuits being taken out again, trampolining, you name it. They are a flagitating. So I thought that one was quite suitable for these to hold. Then, sorry about the noise off. Then you've got an ignatism. And an ignatism is a mistake made due to ignorance. I quite like that one. I like it a lot. I'm afraid I'm guilty of plenty of ignatism. I think we all are. And

then simply because I like the sound of this, a grampus, G-R-A-M-P-U-S. One of the senses of this is somebody who breathes heavily and noisily, not someone you want to be sitting next to. of this is somebody who breathes heavily and noisily, not someone you want to be sitting next to. Look, I'm trying to do a grandpa's impression, but it's more breathing, isn't it? Yes, you have got a poorly throat at the moment, haven't you? You've done extremely well. Well, I don't know. I've got a chesty cough and I've been in the sunshine, but maybe that's the effect of it or possibly being in the aeroplane for 10 hours on the way back. No, do you know what I would think it was? Is that you, Giles, never, ever stop. So I think what you have got is that illness that comes over you when you finally, finally let go and relax. And then your body thinks, I can stop with the adrenaline and now

I can be ill. That's what I think you've got. Oh, really? Well, I'm getting back to work, and now I can be ill. That's what I think you've got. Oh, really? Well, I'm getting back to work, getting the adrenaline going again. I don't like it. I'm not... Noel Card, you know, who you're talking about,

he said, work is more fun than fun. And on the whole, I rather agree with him. That's how you... yes. Do you have a poem for us today? I've got one. And in fact, it is by Noel Card because I've just been in Jamaica. We've been talking about Ian Fleming and Noel Card.

Noel Card wrote many many countless songs, witty ones, wistful ones, but he wrote a lot of poetry as well, published one volume of poems. And this is a poem that is not for vegetarians, but I like it. And it's called Any Part of Piggy. Any part of piggy is quite all right with me. Piggy. Any part of Piggy is quite all right with me. Ham from Westphalia, ham from Parma, ham as lean as the Dalai Lama, ham from Virginia, ham from York, trotters, sausages, hot roast pork, crackling crisp for my teeth to grind on, bacon with or without the rind on. Though humanitarian, I'm not a vegetarian. I'm neither crank nor prude nor prig. And though it may sound infradig, any part of darling pig is perfectly fine with me. You're right. Not one for you and me, but we could admire its artistry. Very coward-esque, I would say. Well, thank you to

everyone who has joined us on this journey to Jamaica and to casinos and back to Blighty. We really appreciate your company as always. And Something Wives with Purple, again, as always, is a Something Else and Sony Music Entertainment production. It was produced by Harriet Wells and Naya Dio, with additional production from Chris Skinner, Ollie Wilson, Jen Mystery, Jay Beale. And, well, he's back.

Yes, he is. What can we say? We haven't heard him during the show because he's actually a bit of a grampus. He he's back. Yes, he is. What can we say? We haven't heard him during the show because he's actually a bit of a grampus. He's heavy breathing. Well, never mind. It's cully.