Stuff You Should Know - Selects: What Makes Lead So Poisonous?

Episode Date: July 1, 2023

The people of Flint, MI were horrified to find their drinking water was poisoned with lead. As we learn more about lead's effects and realize how persistent it is, the more worrying it becomes. What makes lead so toxic? Find out in this classic episode.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

So, there is a ton of stuff they don't want you to know. Yeah, like does the US government really have alien technology? Or what about the future of AI? What happens when computers actually learn to think? Could there be a serial killer in your town? From UFOs to psychic powers and government cover-ups, from unsolved crimes to the bleeding edge of science, history is riddled with unexplained events. Listen to stuff they don't want you to know on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,

or wherever you find your favorite shows. I'm Lars that pip in from the Real Housewives of Miami. I'm Marcus Jordan, CEO of Trophy Room. We decided to launch this podcast, separation anxiety. We can't live without each other. We can't. And I think we go through separation anxiety when we're not together. We kind of want to share our stories.

We're going to talk about everything and be brutally honest as far as relationships, whether it's your boyfriend, kids, even at work. There's no subject that we won't tackle in this podcast. Telling you everything. Listen to separation anxiety with Larson Marcus on the iHeart Radio app Apple Podcast or wherever you listen to podcasts. Hey friends it's Josh and for this week's sysk

selects I've chosen what makes lead so poisonous for 2016 episode that was recorded around the time of the Flint water crisis which apparently is still going on sadly. This episode is one of those ones that's filled with science, culture, history, all that stuff, so I hope you really like it. It's a good one. Welcome to Stuff You Should Know, a production of I Heart Radio. Hey and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh Clark with Charles W. Chuck Bryant and Jerry's to my right. So it's the stuff you should know. It's right. Recording in a new pop-up restaurant called Jerry's Burrito Shack. Yeah, Jerry's eating a burrito right now. A frozen one I guess, right? You didn't make that from scratch fresh Jerry. The frozen burrito right now. A frozen one I guess, right? You didn't make that from scratch fresh Jerry?

Frozen burrito is fine with me though. Yeah, some of them. Nothing wrong with any frozen burrito ever created. Yeah, I mean, there's this, they're very specific, you know. I mean, it's not like a fresh burrito, but it's its own thing that's still good. Right. Right. This you call it like a burrito tet or something weird like that. Something that differentiates it, you know? I agree with you, man. Yeah, but man, sometimes when that re-fried bean pops out and burns your mouth, that's just the best.

You have a hole on your gums for a couple days? Yeah, I'll throw a little cheese on top to cool it in the oven. No, to melt on top. Oh, that's an enchilada, then. Oh, that's an enchilada then. Not really. I think the enchilada makes the sauce, right? Yeah. Okay. That's what I'll say. Swimming in sauce. Right. Enchilada sauce. This may be your best intro yet. Oh, lay. Chuck, we're talking about lead today. That's right. Do you know much about the Flint, Michigan lead poisoning scandal that happened?

I should say blemish. Yeah, I posted about it on our Facebook while a couple of months ago and sort of was a part of a lively discussion there, but only from that and then this research. Yeah, same here. I mean, I was aware of it kind of. I didn't understand the details Yeah, but for those of you who don't who don't know about the Flint Michigan water poisoning but Flint Michigan Has faced a lot of problems since the auto industry went away

But one of them wasn't poor water quality They actually the people of Flint actually paid I think the highest rate or among the highest rates in the country to get their water. Their water was pumped from Lake Huron through Detroit and Flint bought their water from Detroit. Yeah, get that good, clean Detroit water, right? You know you're in a pickle when you're buying water from Detroit and that's the healthy water. So they're building a new pipeline from Lake Huron that goes around Detroit and Flint said, we're going to get in on that action.

And Detroit said, oh yeah, well, we're canceling our contract. Rather than pay for a short term contract with Detroit, the emergency manager, basically then the emergency mayor appointed by the governor himself, said, we're just going to tap into the Flint River. Yeah, not a good idea as it turned out. No, it's not because in Flint, Michigan, there were among other places something called Buick City. Yeah.

Buick City was a 400 plus acre car manufacturing plant. That made Buick's. And it really heavily polluted the river. Yeah. So much so that people in Flint, after just a few months of drinking this water from the tap, started losing their hair. Well, right away they said this looks entased awful.

Right, it's taste of chlorine, and the reason it tasted of chlorine is because there were E. coli breaks out breaks that they had to like treat the water with chlorine. And then it also, to some people, it smelled like sulfury as well. It looked terrible, but people started losing hair, started getting rashes.

Yeah. There was one kid who had an autoimmune disease already. He just stopped growing. Yeah. And it was bad news, but the people, the Flint government and the Michigan Environmental Protection Division basically said, no, we're following all the laws, everything's fine with the water.

Just go back to sleep, Flint. And Flint did something different. A bunch of them taught themselves the science of like water and sanitation and the drinking water laws. They became basically citizen scientists and they took it back to the flint government in the state government said you guys are wrong this is toxic water and we're being poisoned and you have to do something about it they finally did well i think the issue was

don't play dumb we know you know right why you making us tell you exactly and they kept that apparently the company line was, here's the science, here's the results of the tests, but the tests were terrible. If you want to know all about it, there's a really, really great article on 538.com called What Went Wrong in Flint.

It just really chronicles everything very well, but the big problem with Flint, isn't that there was chlorine in the water. It was that there was a bunch of lead in the water. Yeah, and the reason why there's a bunch of lead in the water is because there's lead pipes going to a lot of houses in Flint and the water that was being pumped through those pipes was so corrosive that it was bringing a bunch of lead with it and poisoning the city of Flint for months. Yeah, and the reason people use lead in pipes is because it's not corrosive. That's how corrosive the water was.

Yeah, exactly, that really says something. It really does. And I guess we'll loop back later and talk about the lawsuits and all that stuff. Sure, that's sound good. Yeah, I think that's a great idea. Kind of bookend it. But let's talk about lead itself.

Like, what's the problem with lead? Where did it come from? That whole idea of using lead pipes is nothing new either. It's actually pretty old to tell you the truth. Yeah, well the Romans, of course, were the first to do almost everything, either Asians or Romans. Sure. Well, I don't know.

Africa. Oh, that's true. Yeah. So basically everybody except Europe as the migration expanded exactly. And don't forget all of the innovations going on in Mesoamerica as well. Shout out to anyone who came before us. Uh, but it's been going on since ancient times.

Romans using lead as lead piping for sewage draining and carrying water, even stored water and containers lined with lead. And in fact, this is pretty interesting. I think the English word for plumbing and the chemical symbol PB that is lead comes from the Latin word plum bum. Now plum bum is that plumbers crack? Oh nice. If it wasn't, it is officially now. Is that Plummers crack? Oh, nice. If it wasn't, it is officially now. You know, my friend Eddie, his young daughter asked him what Plummers crack was the other day.

And he said, I said, what'd you tell her? And he said, well, you know, told her what it was. He said, sometimes plumbers, they've been over a lot because pipes are below you. And sometimes their pants sag a little then you see their butt crack. Yeah. And she went, oh, okay.

The only thing I take issue with is the use of the word sometimes. All right. All the times. Other than that's a great explanation. So the Latin plum balm, which means lead. Yeah, which that has been mysterious to me for many decades, PB, doesn't make any sense.

Like why would they call it PB? Yeah, it's peanut blood. Right. And PB is, you'll find it on the periodic table, and the reason you'll find it on the periodic table is because lead is an element, a heavy metal, and it has all sorts of properties that make it very desirable. Yeah, really unique too.

Although super, super toxic is well-fined. Yeah, it's not often you can find something that is super malleable and soft, but also strong and dense. Exactly. Which makes lead perfect for water pipes. Yeah. Because it's also, it also resists corrosion, like you said. So you can run water through it. And as long as the water is not super bad, the lead won't rust. It will leach lead into the water, but it still won't rust, right? Right.

So it's also not very good at conducting electricity, which makes lead very useful for other things like soldering electrical connections. The electrical connection will remain the thing that transmits the current, the lead won't. It's pretty awesome. Yeah. Did you say solder? won't. It's pretty awesome. Yeah. Did you say soldier?

Solder, soldier? Yeah. I've never heard it pronounce that way. How do you say solder? A solder. You gotta say that L. I think the L-silent, unless it's regional. Maybe regional.

Regional to my brain. I think. Solder. You say that because you're from Toledo. Right. So the use of leg goes back, even before the Romans actually, but it first appeared mostly in art, like lead paint.

Yeah, it wasn't like, they described it in the articles in novelty. And it was, apparently it makes colors more vibrant and it's less corrosive, which is why you still, even in the United States, see lead paint on street signs because it's less corrosive. There's not a big... Oh really?

Yeah, that's what they say. It's still used on signs. Supposedly, up until, as recently as the 90s, and it may still be going on depending on the country that it's produced in, the ink on the outside of a plastic bread bag frequently has lead in it or it used to. Really? And it wasn't a problem unless somebody kept the bread bag and turned it inside out to store food in, then that food leeched the lead out of the ink.

Oh wow. It was actually like a big problem for a while. Huh. Well, I'm not sure that it is anymore. I couldn't find anything in recent. The most recent thing I saw was 1991 saying that yeah, it still happens. Right.

Well, it's less expensive as a paint, which is another reason, and the colors are more vivid apparently. But this hasn't been an problem in the US for a while, but in China, they still use a lot of lead in paint. And in 2007, there were massive recalls for everything China, they still use a lot of lead in paint. And in 2007, there were massive recalls for everything from door to the explorer toys to Sesame Street toys,

due to the fact that they had lead paint on them and little kids put everything in their mouths, including their toys, because they're big dummies. And they end up eating lead, which is a big problem. So there was a massive recall of Chinese products in 1997 because of this. No, it was 2007. What does it say, 97?

Yeah. You were harkening back in further to the urban dance squad day. Did you look them up? No. Oh, man. You're missing out. I don't think that's true. Really?

Yeah. Why, just because I like them. No, no, no, no. I don't think that's true. Really? Yeah. Why? Just because I like him. No, no, no, no. I remember them vaguely. Oh. Yeah, it wasn't like I'd never heard of the Urban Dance Quad. Now you have good taste of music.

Mental floss for the globe. Great. Like a legitimately great album of the... All right, I'll look it up. Yeah, I'll look it up. It's just weird that you say you think you're not missing out for no reason. No, because I mean, again, I remember urban nascot. For some reason, I put them in line with like spin doctors in 3-11, no, no.

Well, you know what I mean? 3-11 could be slightly compared because they were kind of a rock-wrap group, but they were Dutch. Urban nascot was? Yeah. Oh, okay. So that makes them cool in here. Right, automatically.

Yeah. Somebody who just picked this up is like, what are they talking about? I know. Angelott is urban dance squad. So lead paint in the United States is, well, it's still an issue in some ways because older houses still have it. But as of 1978, they said, no more. Get the light out. That's right, and they define it as any paint or surface coating that contains Lead equal or exceeding one milligram per square centimeter. Yeah, so basically In 1978 it said if you're going to manufacture something for somebody's home that people are generally going to come in contact with most people Don't come in contact with street signs.

Yeah. That's a deal. Right. Then you can't have lead in it. But again, any house built pre-1978 and there's plenty of them out there. Oh yeah. Very likely has lead paint in it.

It also probably has lead pipes. Yeah. And there's a lot of lead around us all over the place. In places you wouldn't even think. Like there's lead in in leaded glass. Like a glass, I'm not really like a glass, you might be using, you conceivably could be drinking lead out of it.

Oh, but you don't drink out of leaded glass. Sure, yeah, they use it to make regular plain old dumb glass into more like crystal. It gives it like a ping when you tap it. It makes it the reflection a lot sharper. It also lowers the melting point. So, if you put it in the oven, it doesn't like, but it's conceivably bad for you.

You know who was on it long before the United States government, federal government was the city of Baltimore. In 1951, they banned lead pigment for interior paint. Very smart. For their housing. And since the 50s, it had kind of been phased out in different parts of the country. And then in 1971, we finally got the Federal Lead Poisoning Prevention Act.

And then it took seven years after that to fully ban the paint. The paint, lead paint. Right. There's another big source of lead that was all over the place in the 20th century. And that was in gasoline and cars. There was an additive in gasoline

that was added to gasoline called a tetraethyl lead, right? Yeah, you remember that, like fill it up with unleaded or fully let it. Right. And the reason that they added lead to gas was because there was a problem called knocking, right? Where in a high performance engine, when the gas entered the ignition chamber, the combustion chamber, it may just get so amped up that it would combust, it would ignite before it was supposed to, and this would basically disrupt the movement of the pistons, right?

So they knocked the thing. They knocked, they pinged, it did all sorts of bad stuff. The lead kept the gas from combusting or igniting before it was meant to. So it was a pretty great additive. The thing is, we already knew that lead was not good for you. At the time, we added it to gas anyway. And then it was finally phased out in the 70s,

starting in the 70s, I should say, because we started adding catalytic converters to our cars. Yeah, that helped that, and just are the process of the chemical process of refining petroleum just advanced, so we no longer needed it. Right, so it wasn't just crummy gas. It was pretty good gas. It didn't need lead. Yeah. If you run lead at gas through catalytic converter, it totally messes it up. And the catalytic converter is there to prevent emissions, so you run lead at gas through a catalytic converter, it totally messes it up, and the catalytic converter is there to prevent emissions, so you take lead out of gas. The problem we found is that during these few decades, from like the 20s till actually

1996, was the last year you could have lead in your gas in the United States. 1996. During this period, basically all the cars on the road were spewing lead, lead vapors into the atmosphere that would just go into the air and then come back into the ground and settle in the soil and water and your face. Yeah, I used lead and gas and I had to put it in my early VW beetles that I drove. Oh yeah. I had a couple of old vintage, well, not vintage, we bought them new.

Oh yeah. Yeah, my mom, she bought a 68-bitle brand new. Wow, that's neat. That's when I drove when I turned 16. Wow, I think it was still around, huh? Yeah, yeah, nice. Oh, you know, those things, they never die if you take care of them.

Did you like ever use duct tape or anything like that on it? No, but I did, funnier you mentioned. I had a whole, sizable hole in the rear floorboard. you ever used duct tape or anything like that on it? No, but I did. Funny you mentioned. I had a whole sizeable hole in the rear floor board that my friends call it the Flintstone scar. Because you could like put your feet down and run. So I did have a board. A running board.

No, just a board over the hole. But I mean, you could remove the board and run while you're sitting in the back seat. That's right Great car. Yeah, let us been added to cosmetics over the years Jewery pottery and then Today because everyone knows let us so such a jerk One of the only places you're gonna find in the US at least is in your car battery.

Your car battery, or your laptop actually? Yeah, which is why it's really important to recycle that car battery. Or that laptop. Don't throw it in the woods. Yeah, responsibly recycle your electronics and batteries. Yeah, if there's one thing that we've learned since the 20th century is that LED has some serious staying power and it has the very pesky tendency to get out of wherever we put it.

Right? Yeah. And if you put it in just a regular landfill that's not designed to accept things like lead, it'll just leach into the groundwater. And same thing with your e-waste, your laptops. And the reason that they're used in laptops is because the lead actually protects you from the radiation that would shoot out of your laptop screen into your face. If it weren't for the toxic lead in there.

That's right. Glass cathode rate tubes, like you find in your computer laptop screen. Yeah. Well, I don't know about your laptop. Your computer, your monitor. Yeah, I bet there's. But you should lead in there. You should responsibly recycle your laptop too. For sure computer, you're a monitor. Yeah, I bet there's. But you should let in there. You should responsibly recycle your laptop too.

For sure. For a number of reasons. Yeah, I know you did a, what was it called? Electronics recycling. Yeah, what was it? Like just a thought or... I have no idea what you're talking about. You did a video series where you like... Oh, sure.

Deep thoughts. I can't even remember, I created the series. Yeah, but you do one on e Eversy clean. Yeah, but nobody cared or watched so the world was not saved everyone said Chuck quit doing it All right, well, let's take a break. I'm gonna go cry to your for Man, what was the name of that series? I don't know. We'll go get forties and pour some out on the curb for them. Alright, we'll be back in a sec. There's a ton of stuff they don't want you to know. Does the US government really have alien technology? And what about the future of artificial intelligence, AI? What happens when computers learn to think?

Could there be a serial killer in your town? From UFOs to psychic powers, and government cover-ups, from unsolved crimes to the bleed-eed edge of science, history is riddled with unexplained events. We've spent a decade applying critical thinking to some of the most bizarre phenomenon civilization and beyond.

Each week, we dive deep into unsolved mysteries, conspiracy theories and actual conspiracies. You've heard about these things, but what's the full story? Listen to stuff they don't want you to know on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you find your favorite shows. What's up, fam? I'm Brian Ford, artist and baker, and host of the new podcast, Flaky Biscuits. On this podcast, I'm gonna get to know my guests by cooking up their favorite nostalgic meal.

It could be anything from Twinkies to mom's Thanksgiving dressing. Sometimes I might get it wrong, sometimes I'll get it right. I'm so happy it's good because man if it wasn't I'd be like you know everybody not my mom. Either way we will have a blast. You'll have access to every recipe so you can cook and bake alongside me as I talk to artists, musicians and chefs about how this meal guided them to success. And these nostalgic meals,

fam, they inspire one of a kind conversations. When I bake this recipe, it hit me like a ton of bricks. Oh. Does this podcast come with a therapist? Ha, ha, ha, he can. Listen to Flaky Biscuit every Tuesday on the I Heart Radio app Apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

Hola, hola! It's your girl, Cheekies, and I'm back with brand new episodes of my podcasts, Cheekies and Chill and Dear Cheekies. Last season, I shared so many intimate stories with you guys and had conversations with some of my favorite people. This season, we're picking up right where we left off. We'll talk about everything from spirituality, relationships, women's health, and so much more.

And guess what? Dear Chiquis is also back. Segure contestando to a tus preguntas. I'll be answering even more of your questions. And honestly, guys, I cannot wait. Asi que not de pierdas, nune momento, de Chiquis and Shell, and dear Chiquis,

as part of the My Cultura Podcast Network available on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Alright Josh, we've talked a lot about lead so far in Ancelatus. Ancelatus. In Dutch, rock, rock bands. Lead comes from the earth though. Let's take it underground. Yeah, it's not actually, I mean it is naturally occurring but it doesn't naturally occur

in its pure form. Yeah, you don't just like dig down, you're like, hey there's a big hunk of lead. Right. Let me pull it out. Instead, lead atoms have, I think, four unpaired electrons, maybe. And it's outer shell. So it likes to form connections with other things. So when you find lead in the earth, you're going to find it in the form of an oxide or a sulfide

or something like that. Frequently, it's combined with silver. And so that means it has to be separated. And even the Romans back in the day, which by the way, these Roman led pipes that they used for baths and for sanitation and stuff, still intact today. Yeah, you can still dig those up and beat people with them.

You could, they're so strong. That's the other place you'll find a led pipe is in the hand of some dude coming at you or a game of clue. Oh yeah, that's right. It was bent even. The guy was hit so hard with that. Yeah. Colonel mustard. He was not to be trusted. He was not. But yes, the Romans, they had a pretty ingenious process called cupolation. The extent of that is basically the ideas that some precious metals, I'm sorry, precious metals, all precious metals won't oxidize, but dumb metals will. So, if you heat that junk up, it's going to separate.

Right. And they used to mostly to separate from silver, but these days we get most of our lead from something called Galena, where a lead sulfide is found, right? Yeah, and our process is sort of similar. It is very similar, like using heat to separate things. And this actually, very much resembles, do you remember our waste gasification episode? Yeah, I could remember which one this...

It was that one. It was that one, because the process is very similar. So you take some lead sulfide and you heat it up in the air. So there's the presence of oxygen and it converts into Lead oxide and sulfur dioxide, right? Yeah, you separate them out a little bit Then you take that lead oxide and you add carbon, and you again mix it with some air. And as that happens, the air combines with the oxide into carbon, no, the carbon combines with the air and becomes carbon dioxide, takes all of the oxygen molecules from the lead atoms.

So the lead, basically what amounts to pure lead, becomes molten and goes down to the bottom of the furnace and carbon dioxide goes out into the atmosphere. It sounds like a very safe process, basically. You're creating molten lead and carbon dioxide. Yeah, that's called roasting and smelting. And once that lead sinks, cools down, it's called a pig. It's just a big mess of lead, basically.

Yeah, like pig iron. Yeah. It's delicious. You're right. And then you have slag, which is the non-metallic byproduct of the smelting process. And you siphon and cool that down and it's waste product. Yes.

And like I said, recycling your car battery is important because there's also a process called secondary extraction where they get that lead out of your battery just you can keep using it. Exactly. That's the other good thing about lead. It is extremely reusable because again, it has a lot of staying power. So you're not going to use lead up. Right.

You know, which means you want to reuse it. Yes. Which you get to the point where we don't need to mine any more lead or process any more lead, just reuse the lead we've got. Or maybe find some great substitute that isn't so toxic, you know. Yeah, melt down those tiny civil war figurines. Oh yeah, those guys are so good. Sure. Okay. I thought they were. Yeah. So handling and painting those would lead paint is dangerous, right? Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes it is. Is that why we're losing so many civil war figurine buffs? I think so.

At an alarming rate. That's why they all have like spittle and drool around the corners of their mouths and like zone out while they're painting. Well, there's other reasons for that, but sure. Contributes. So, okay, Chuck, we mentioned lead refining and processing, smelting, roasting that kind of stuff, right? That does create emissions of not just carbon dioxide, but also lead vapor, which is not good stuff, and you want to control that kind of stuff, but it

is emitted. And it used to be, well, these days, lead emissions from refining and processing are actually the number one source of lead vapor emissions in the environment, right? But yeah, about 40 years ago, 45 years ago, that was not the case. The case was all those cars driving around on the streets emitting lead vapor.

Yeah, you used to account for about 78% if it came from your automobile. And since the phasing out and reversal, we now have 52% coming from the processing. And what is it down to road sources? It's a 13% fuel combustion. Yeah, not bad. No, not bad.

Still again, you basically wanted it like zero. As we're finding, as we'll see, that lead exposure in any amount is not good. And it goes from not good to really bad very quickly, apparently. Yeah, you know, let us know good. We mentioned kids chewing on something with lead pain. It's not good if you're redoing your house. And it's pre-1978.

You want to get a piece tested. You can't just be like, oh, let me sand off. No, the paint on this molding. No, because again, even if you think you've cleaned it up, there's still. There's lead right there, buddy. Yeah. You're not going to get rid of it. Apparently also, opening and closing your windows

in a pre-1978 house can create lead dust. Yeah, if you're lucky enough to be able to open your windows. Sure. That's a point. Mine are sealed shut. Yeah, or a nail chud or what have you. Yeah, just from years of painting, basically,

with probably lead paint. Guaranteed. No, it's not actually we had it tested Oh, did you yeah, I mean it wasn't 100% lead paint But you had to test it like all the way through like Yeah, yeah, yeah, but what I'm saying is pre-1978 It's not like that's the only paint that was used. I know you're saying that's why you get it tested right But did you get like all the layers underneath tested? Well, for any... Yeah, okay.

That was my all the layers sound effect. Like we hired a lead person. I got you. Good. Good. That makes me feel better. Yeah, and if there is lead and you want to get the lead out, you're going to have to hire someone that knows what they're doing.

Oh, yeah. They'll come in with their hazmat suits on to do so. Right. So, you can also get it from plumbing, although apparently with lead plumbing, it's not quite as much of a threat as you would think. You know, didn't that make you just want to like, never drink water again, knowing that you have

lead pipes in your house? You shouldn't necessarily be worried, because over the years, water sanitation experts have figured out that if you have good water, that's non-corrosive. It actually is not only non-corrosive, the water will leave behind a protective coating that coats the inside of the pipes that it runs through. Over the lead? Yes.

Over whatever it is. But yeah, it's going to leave a protective coat of other substances that aren't toxic. It's going to form a barrier for later water and the pipes. Right. And so you shouldn't necessarily be freaked out if you have lead pipes coming to your house. Right.

I mean, you got the money. There's definitely worse things you could spend your money on than replacing those pipes. Yeah. You know, moved to what? Copper. PVC. Well, copper can be a problem as well. There's actually a copper-led rule that dictates how non-corrosive a city's water has to be to follow this rule. And it's protecting not just against lead, but copper. You don't really want copper either, although it's not nearly as bad for you as lead. Interesting. So, if you have lead in your system, I mean, it goes into your bloodstream.

Doesn't matter how it gets in there, if you inhale it, it'll be absorbed through the capillaries and the lungs into the blood, or if you lick it, touch it, if you lick it, it's gonna find its way into your blood. And you can, I mean, it's really easy to find out if you have lead in your blood, you just get a blood test. I don't know why they would do this other test. I don't either. And not just a blood test unless it's

like prohibitively expensive or something. So, yeah, the other test is called the zinc protoporferin test. And that's a byproduct of red blood cells as they break down in the presence of lead. So rather than directly testing and it's not as sensitive either, you're like going around to see, excuse me, lead, I want to see if your shadow is detectable. It'll get it. It makes zero sense. Because you've got to take your blood for that too, right?

Sure. And it's not a jacket, you're it. Yeah. Doesn't make any sense. But the lead blood test is so easy that companies like 3M and plenty of others sell home lead blood tests. Oh, that's nice. Yeah, it is nice unless you're the parent who is freaked out giving one to your kid.

Well, that's true. Anything over equal to or greater than five micrograms per desoleter is bad if you're a kid. If you're an adult, you can tolerate a little bit more, but it's still distressing. Right, and that's how it's expressed. So, a microgram to a desoleter, which is what a 10th of a leader, right? And so five is not good. 10 micrograms in a desolator is where demonstrable, like behavioral and cognitive problems start to develop. Yeah, that's serious trouble.

But the EPA has said that there is, quote, no demonstrated safe concentration of lead in blood. Like, you shouldn't have any in you. Right. The problem is, is there nothing but toxic to humans, or is no benefit? Yeah. And we'll talk about it in just a second, but the problem with lead is that we're figuring out that we shouldn't be exposed to it at all, while we're also simultaneously figuring

out that we have awashed our planet in it. Yeah, from the last like a couple hundred years basically Yeah, you want to take a break? Yeah, all right. We'll come back and we'll talk about all kinds of fun stuff There's a ton of stuff they don't want you to know. Does the US government really have alien technology? And what about the future of artificial intelligence, AI? What happens when computers learn to think? Could there be a serial killer in your town? From UFOs to psychic powers and government cover-ups from unsolved crimes to the bleeding edge of science. History is riddled with unexplained events.

We spent a decade applying critical thinking to some of the most bizarre phenomenon civilization and beyond. Each week, we dive deep into unsolved mysteries, conspiracy theories and actual conspiracies. You've heard about these things, but what's the full story? Listen to stuff they don't want you to know on the iHeart Radio app Apple Podcasts or wherever you find your favorite shows. What's up fam? I'm Brian Ford, Artisan Vaker

and host of the new podcast, Flaky Biscuit. On this podcast, I'm gonna get to know my guests by cooking up their favorite nostalgic meal. It could be anything from Twinkies to mom's Thanksgiving dressing. Sometimes I might get it wrong, sometimes I'll get it right. I'm so happy it's good because man, if it wasn't, I'd be like,

you know, everybody not my mom. Either way, we will have a blast. You'll have access to every recipe so you can cook and bake alongside me as I talk to artists, musicians, and chefs about how this meal guided them to success. And these nostalgic meals, fam, they inspire one of a kind conversations.

When I bake this recipe, it hit me like a ton of bricks. Does this podcast come with a therapist? They can. Listen to Flaky Biscuit every Tuesday on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Are you ready for a second season of the Super Steakered Festy Club podcast? My name is Curly. And I'm Maya.

Oh my goodness. Let's see a little prayer before we start this. This is going to be the best podcast episode you've ever done in our freaking lives. That's right. Season two, Super Secret Bestie Club. Super Secret Bestie Club. Super Secret Bestie Club.

Super Secret Bestie Club. LAUGHTER This is a best friends club, and you can definitely sit with us. Each week we'll talk about relationships, heart breaks and of course our favorite L word. Love. And. Horuscoves and astrology according to our point of view of course. We're not oracles but we know what toxic Virgo when we see one. I'm pointing to Curly.

Woohoo! Listen to the Super Seeker Bestie Club as part of the Microtuda Podcast Network, available on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcasts. All right, so before I left ITs that there is no function for lead in the body. It is nothing but toxic. And the way it behaves in your body in a negative way is really interesting. Your body, and this happens a lot. If you look, we covered the body mistaking something for something else quite a bit.

There should be a word for that. A case of mistaken identity. I guess that's it. But the body treats lead like calcium. So it's going to go where calcium goes in the body, including your bones, which is super scary. Yeah, lead settles in very comfortably into calcium receptors.

And it's not just bones, like that's what I always think of when I think of calcium. Like what you need calcium, because your bones are break or you get rickets if you don't have it or whatever. But calcium comes in handy throughout your whole body. And one of the big places that shows up is in calcium ions in your neuronal activity, right?

So when your neurons fire, one of the ways that they fire is because the calcium ions get them all excited and then boom, your neurons is fired. If lead is in that calcium ion channel instead of calcium, that boom doesn't happen and all of a sudden your neurons aren't firing as much as they would if the lead wasn't present. And now we have a big problem here. Yeah, and it's especially big problem with children because children's little brains are, you know, we've talked about plasticity before. They're constantly forming these new neural connections and any kind of lead and the mistake

in for calcium is going to disrupt those connections. And so your child is literally, their brain isn't going to advance like it should. Right, exactly. Intellectually, the apparently emotional centers like the amygdala can suffer. Yeah. It's been found to produce hyperactivity,

anti-social behavior, attention deficit disorder, all sorts of problems from the presence of lead, right? And like you said, it's worse for kids because their brains are still developing and forming. It's bad for anybody, but it's definitely worse for kids. The other way that it affects kids is that, so the regions of their brains aren't developing correctly. But then simultaneously, calcium is also important

in the formation of myelin, which is that protective sheath around the synapses between neurons. So that's kind of like flimsy, which means that the neurons aren't firing efficiently. So not only do you have brain regions affected, but the communication between brain regions are affected too in little kids.

And the upshot is, is that it promotes all sorts of problems with cognitive and emotional and behavioral development in children. Yeah, and like, literally, lower IQ scores. And we should say that's just like the most prominent horrifying effect of lead. There's a whole laundry list of other things that can happen to you. Like, kidney failure, pain in your bones and joints from all that lead settling into where the calcium is supposed to go. Yeah, how about a decreased sex drive and sterility and infertility for both men and women?

What else? Diary, lack of appetite, constipation? I think diary is the least of your worries if you have a lot of blood pressure. High blood pressure in large heart. It affects virtually every system in your body, basically. And the reason why, again, is because it mimics or takes the place of calcium, and calcium is incredibly vital. It's an extremely important mineral that you need

found throughout your body. And if a leg goes in, it's like, oh, I'm here instead. Yeah. It's not gonna do the stuff that the calcium's supposed to do, leading to all this cascade of horrific problems. Yeah, and one of the other scary things is that they, unless you have acute lead poisoning, you may not know.

In fact, you probably won't know that you're being slowly poisoned, and you might just think, oh, I have diarrhea, and I don't feel like having sex much anymore. Right. And you might be slowly getting lead poisoning. Yeah. And you just blame that on too many buffalo wings,

but boom, it's lead poisoning. Take care of both. Sure. You remember me and a kid in like lead pencils, like it was a big scare, like, you know, you got lead poisoning if you got poked with a pencil. Yeah, I remember that, but then I also remember learning that it's actually graphite used in pencils.

Yeah. We should have a, a bi-R-Age. We should have David Rieson. Oh yeah, how to sharpen a pencil. Man, he can school you on some pencils. He wrote a whole book on it. Literally wrote the book on pencil sharpening. Yeah, I still have let, or I guess graphite somewhere in my hand.

Yeah. From when I was jabbed very deep with a pencil that broke off. Wow. And it never left. And there's still just, it looks like a little black freckle. It's like you're in prison and got shanked. I know, I can't find where it is actually. Or shiv, maybe it's it's it's right there.

No, this is scratch. Good try. So we've talked about all the cognitive problems that can come about in behavioral and emotional disorders that can develop from lead. And this is like study after study after study has found this. So one of the big reasons why there have been so many restrictions placed on lead exposure. And recently, some people have, some researchers, including a couple, well, an economist, I believe, and an epidemiologist have kind of taken that idea that lead can create all of these behavioral problems and any social behavioral problems. And extrapolated to this idea

that there is a big rise in the crime rate in the United States and actually around the world that followed about 20 years the same trajectory of the use of lead and gasoline. Yeah, it was a super interesting article, very controversial like when it came, well, it still is. Sure. But yeah, it's very interesting.

Yeah, it's called lead. America's real criminal element, it was in Mother Jones, it was written by Kevin Drum, he's one of the all-time greats working today. And I think I've mentioned it before, but I strongly encourage anybody. It doesn't even matter if lead's the most boring thing in the world to you. Go read this article. You will just be riveted by it.

And Kevin Drum does a lot of... He does a very good job of keeping his extrapolations down as low as possible, although anybody can see by the evidence that he lays out that this is, it's pretty clear that lead is some sort of culprit in this. And it's been shot down in that, there's this idea that the science isn't settled. I suspect that it's the same mechanisms that force with climate denial.

Like, oh, unsettled science doesn't prove anything. If you look at all the studies associated with this, the correlation between lead use and gasoline and therefore lead emissions in cars and criminal activity and it's declined. Again, it just follows it like 20 years after. And the whole idea is that when we started emitting lead into the atmosphere, kids started suffering these cognitive and anosocial behaviors.

And then about 20 years after these kids were born, they started actually carrying out criminal activity. And we saw a tremendous rise in everything from like murder to rape to muggings to everything. And the article is too long to really go into detail. Again, just strongly urge anybody to go read it. Yeah, the backlash that I've seen on the article wasn't to me like, it was all from scientists mainly. Yeah. I read a few of them.

They weren't poo-pooing the notion. They said this, what this means is it bears a lot more investigation. Um, but as much as you want, if you can't replicate it, it's still possible confirmation bias or just correlation and not causation, like could be a host of other issues that went into that. It could be. And Kevin Jordan makes the same point. He there's also a rise in the use of vinyl albums

that followed roughly the same trajectory as well. But, you know, of course, it needs more study for sure. Well, this one scientist said what you really need to do is follow what he calls a cohort study when you actually follow individuals along a long timeline. Yeah. It's just a tough study when you actually follow individuals along a long timeline. It's just a tough study. It bears a lot of, to prove something like this just takes a lot more data than they have. Right. And I think the guy you're referencing is firestone who is uh... yeah that was a good article wrote on the discover magazine blog and uh... you know he gives kudos to drum who definitely deserves it for

basically saying every time he says you know it's it's so obvious he can't be able to be just read you know have your head in the sand to it to deny he does say that, yes, speaking scientifically, it does require more study. But interesting though, and Drum followed it all over the world, he didn't just go to the United States, and saw the same thing in Canada,

and Australia and Great Britain, and the good news is, if that is the case, then we should see crime dropping forever. Yeah, but the problem is that it also should get us case, then we should see crime dropping forever. Yeah. But the problem is that it also should get us to basically mitigate the lead that is around in the soil and in the water and everywhere, in people's houses.

And the dollar amounts that he estimated would cost are pretty prohibitive, at least as far as like the public will goes from right now. But who knows, I mean, if enough science is done on it, and you get the scientific community vocally speaking about this, then maybe the public will change. Yeah. If you do have lead poisoning, you can get on meds. There's a prescription called Susomer, SUCCI-MER. That was beautiful. It's here that are succimer. I like how you said It can reduce blood lead. There of course always side effects with every medication And if you work if you've like if there's been a disaster and you get toxic lead in your body very quickly, right?

I'm thinking use something called, chel... Chelation? Chelation therapy. Chelation therapy. And that's when they use a collating agent. I'm not even gonna try that. I'm just gonna call it EDTA.

That's it. I'm gonna try it, okay. Ethylenidiamine tetrocetic acid. Ain't that bad. If you'd learn this from that. Tetrhesitic, super quick. I missed the last A. That's just a few letters off from supercalifragilistic.exe.

I mean, it looks like the alpha bet when it's on paper. But we'll call it EDTA and that's when it's infused into the bloodstream and actually binds. It basically says, lead, you're coming with me through the kidney out of your body. Right. But they use that when it's just an acute toxic dose that a person's been exposed to. If a kid's been found to be poisoned with lead,

actually, from what I read, one of the best treatments that they'll carry out, there'll be other stuff too, depending on how bad it is, but a really good, nutritious diet. Getting the kid foods that are high in things like calcium and high in things like vitamin C that help the body absorb calcium so that they can go displace lead in the body. Because if you got lead and you got calcium fighting

for the same place, if you can get the calcium in there, it's going to displace the lead and then hopefully leave the body. Interesting. So I'm going home. That's got to be hard on the kidney, so. I don't know. You know? Yeah, I think if you have an acute lead poisoning or a serious lead poisoning, it's not

good. But yeah, of course it'd be hard on the kidneys because one of the things is kidney failure. Yeah, an anemia. Exactly. If lead is definitely invariably in the ground and the groundwater and in the soil around us, and that's a problem, because it sort of works this way up the food chain in a weird way, because what you have are these tiny organisms. It gets in their body like plankton and microscopic plants and they

die and then other things eat that, their waste. And then it just sort of like bigger animals come along and keep eating these things. Yeah, it's not just humans that suffer from lead toxicity. Other animals too. Even the small ones. So should we talk about these flint lawsuits a little? Yeah. And then enchiladas and that will fully. Yep. We'll come to talk to enchiladas. I guess it depends on who manufactured it. So I did some reading on the lawsuits. Right now,

there's more than a dozen and probably growing. I'm sure. A few of them are class action suits on behalf of tens of thousands of fl residents and you know attorney has always looked their chops when they hear stuff like this. But there's some concerns. One is that the state of Michigan is like the city is broke so don't even bother. Right. The state of Michigan may be a barout to go if you want to get a lot of money but then they say that'll just get past along with the taxpayer. Yeah. And a lot of experts in the legal world say that'll just get pecs pass along to the taxpayer. Yeah. And a lot of experts in the legal world say that compensation is unlikely to begin with as far as money goes because of something,

a couple of things, one thing called sovereign immunity, which basically means the government can say, you know, giving water to the citizens is a core government function. So we're shielded legally from liability for doing that improperly. So like you can't sue us, we're trying to give you water. And the other thing is specific causation has to be proved. So not only do you have to prove that the lead came from that water and not like the lead pipes in your house or other like the lead paint in your walls maybe, has to come specifically from that Flint River water.

And you also have to prove that that directly led to the problem that your kid is having, and not, you know, other things. Well, one of the things I read was that, it's very possible that the lead came from the pipes in those people's houses, but that it's still on the provider of the water because they were supposed to be following corrosion protection techniques

that they lied about following, they weren't following them, so it got rid of that protective coating that had been on the lead pipes before and was bringing all that lead into people's homes directly. So it may have been lead from the people's homes, but it was the corrosive nature of the terrible drinking water that was being pumped through those that caused that lead to be brought into the people's homes. And then again, on top of it, the government was lying about using the techniques that they were supposed to be using to prevent that from happening. So now that they've switched back over to Detroit water, it's going to take a while for that protective film to develop on the pipes again.

So even now that the different water is coming through, it's still lousy with lead. And the sad thing is that some people in Flint are too poor to do anything about it. They still need water, so they're still drinking let it water even though they know that it's going to hurt them down the line. Well, and it's sad that it sounds like getting real compensation is maybe unlikely. Yeah, because a lot of these people who have kids, like if their kids suffer severe cognitive development problems, they're going to need help like the rest of their lives. Yeah, this one guy, he's a law professor, specializing in environmental law and name Noah Hall. He says what the probably the smart thing to do if you really

want to help these people is set up do what they did with the deep water horizon spill and set up a victim's compensation fund instead of doing it via lawsuit like legislate it. Maybe that would help I don Maybe that would help, I don't know. Yeah, I don't know. He basically said what the state shouldn't do is fight this. He's like, that would be big trouble. He said they should set up some sort of fund. So then they look like the good guy still,

but then I think you don't get all the dirty details dragged out in public, like you would with a lawsuit. Well, apparently there are already coming out anyway, like troves of emails have been released. The governor set up a task force to find out who was to blame and they turned around and they were like, uh, you. And he said, fire the task force. Right, exactly.

You're all fired. Yeah, I don't know what's going to happen, but it's very scary. Public health scare. Flint, uh, I know. Talk about a city that's been roughed up over the years. I know. Well, we're there with you Flint, hang in there. If you want to learn more about lead or Flint or criminal activity, you can check out all these different articles on the internet and

you can type lead into the search bar HouseOfWorks.com and it'll bring up a pretty great article. Since I said pretty great articles, time for a listener. I'm going to call this Finland Rules. Remember we did the dark money podcast and I was like, what's a good place? It's not correct. I remember. We heard from a lot of people in Scandinavia. Hi, I'm an American living in Helsinki for the last few years with my Finnish husband. Chuck, you were right on the money when you said there's very little political corruption here.

Of course, there's some, because they are humans after all, but the level compared to the states is laughable. When I asked my husband about it, he thought for a second and asked about corruption scandals. He said a few years back, there was something about a prime minister who accepted lumber from a company to build his house. Huh, that was it. It seems comical to me considering the states in an election year. Also, the campaign sees it as much shorter here and it's done a little different. A party runs, there are at least five major parties. That's crazy in and of itself.

Sure, like crazy good. Yeah. A party runs in whichever gets a majority of Alex from its ranks. The Prime Minister makes a cabinet out of a coalition of the other parties which receive high numbers of votes about that like you came in second you're on board to a minute come on

and here's your participant ribbon uh... campaigns are paid for by disclosed donations in public funds uh... you also made a comment about the high taxes here uh... many people usually americans usually Americans say that with distaste, that the taxes are so high here, but I've come to think very highly of it. I've discovered that I don't really need another pair of jeans or a new jacket.

What I need is an educated society around me in access to quality health care, and a truly equal society where everyone is safe and has their basic needs met. That is from Gabrielle. Wow, a lot of people hate your guts for saying that Gabrielle. That is so brave of you.

Thanks Gabrielle for writing in. I don't know how they say Adios and Finland, no she's American. Well, goodbye. Okay, thank you for writing in. If you wanna get in touch with us, you can tweak to us at syskpodcast, you can join us on facebook.com slash stuffychino, you can send us an email to stuffpodcast.housestuffworks.com

and as always join us on the web at stuffychino.com. Stuffychino is a production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts, my heart radio, visit the iHeartRadio app. So, there is a ton of stuff they don't want you to know. Yeah, like does the US government really have alien technology? Or what about the future of AI? What happens when computers actually learn to think? Could there be a serial killer in your town? From UFOs to psychic powers and government cover-ups,

from unsolved crimes to the bleeding edge of science, history is riddled with unexplained events. Listen to stuff they don't want you to know on the iHeart Radio app Apple podcasts or wherever you find your favorite shows. Rose! Fran, how did we make it to the second season of our podcast and we still have all these opinions? Ugh, pardon my non-binary vibes, but I'm just like, does it all mean to be explained? Hatch took the glasses off her face, put them on America, and those are Betty Blasso.

That's so shh. Yeah! In our second season, we'll be covering topics like David Lynch, Fanfiction, Golden Girls, and Star Wars with guests including Harry Neb, Frankie Grande, Bobby Finger, and Mark Indelicato. Like a virgin, it's proud to be a part of the Outspoken Network from I Heart Podcast. with guests including Harry Neb, Frankie Grande, Bobby Finger, and Mark and Delacombe. Like a Virgin is proud to be a part of the Outspoken Network from I Heart Podcasts. Listen on the I Heart Radio app Apple Podcasts for wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, I'm Delia Wilde, and I want to invite you to listen to my newest podcast.

We are startups in the sense that the atoms that make up our bodies are already existed in the true stuff. It's called the Oh My God Particle Show, or O-M-G-P-S, for short. Are you like me always wondering about the universe? Like, what the universe is made of, how it's going to evolve. So, I went to get some answers. Listen to the Oh My God Particle Show on the I-Hurt Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.