Suggestible - Matrescence & The Shrek Multiverse

Episode Date: February 9, 2023

Suggestible things to watch, read and listen to. Hosted by James Clement @mrsundaymovies and Claire Tonti @clairetonti.New music, merch, live show info and much, much more available at https://www.clairetonti.com/This week’s Suggestibles:00:00 Claire's New Album, Matrescence17:40 Jacob Collier's Grammy Speech19:40 Lonely Island's Jack Sparrow20:24 The Shrek Multiverse22:44 Alice, Darling38:35 James' Souvlaki Hut VideoSend your recommendations to [e-mail], we’d love to hear them.You can also follow the show on Instagram, Twitter, Facebook @suggestiblepod and join our ‘Planet Broadcasting Great Mates OFFICIAL’ Facebook Group. So many things. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

We can wait for clean water solutions, or we can engineer access to clean water. We can acknowledge indigenous cultures, or we can learn from indigenous voices. We can demand more from the earth, or we can demand more from ourselves. At York University, we work together to create positive change for a better tomorrow. Join us at yorku.ca slash write the future. Join us at yorku.ca slash write the future. Bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bong, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bing, bong, bong, bong, bong, bong, bong, bong. Your voice sounds particularly practiced this week, Claire. It must be because you've got a live gig and album coming out tomorrow.

Oh my gosh, the nerves are so real. Hello everybody. Welcome to Suggestible Podcast, a podcast where we recommend you things to watch, read and listen to. My name is Claire Tonti. James Clement is here also. We are married and this is a podcast of things. And I have to say.

What do you got? This is the very first time on this show where I am only bringing my wonderful spirit and nothing to recommend. That's not true. You're bringing the album that you made. You're allowed to recommend a thing that you made. That's fine. Maybe I'll just do that every week.

I'm going to recommend a video that's coming up. No, that just came out. It's called Shrek 2 Caravan of Garbage. Do you have anything that you've worked on that maybe you want to recommend to people? That's funny you should say that. I'm not very good at this. All right, I need to get real, get serious.

Let's do it. So this week is potentially other than the week we got married and then the week when I obviously had my kids. This is probably one of the biggest weeks of my life. Oh, my goodness. To date, I would suggest. Yeah, maybe for the rest of your life. Maybe nothing will ever compare. Maybe when I die, that'll probably be a big week. Anyway, sorry, go on.

Don't make me laugh. I had hot chocolate and I feel very silly. So on Friday, I don't know if anyone notices, but I am releasing my album, Matrescence. It's coming out in the world on Spotify and YouTube and Apple Music. And it'll be on my website, Matrescence. It's coming out in the world on Spotify and YouTube and Apple Music. And it'll be on my website, claire20.com, if you want to go and purchase it for a direct download. And there's album artwork over there. And I also have T-shirts that are now live that you can buy. There's even international shipping if you so choose.

And also I have vinyl, which will be ready this week. So if you would like to purchase vinyl, and I have it which will be ready this week. So if you would like to purchase vinyl and I have it on pre-order at the moment but actually it will just be ready. So you can order yourself a vinyl over on my website and the big thing is I'm performing on Saturday at the Bronzy Boreham at 9 o'clock. I would argue the biggest thing is the album launching because the room only sits like 200 or so people.

The album could potentially go out to a billion people, Claire. That's so many people. I know. Too many some may say. So, yeah, well, so that's happening. So Saturday 1 o'clock if you would like to come to the launch and you're in Melbourne. Yeah.

If you're not in Melbourne, I would so love you to come, but it's probably a little far to fly. Would you say tickets will be available up to the day? I think they probably will be, yeah. We've sold a lot of tickets. Yeah. But I reckon there'll still be some available up to the day. So if you want to come along on the day and you think,

actually, maybe I would like to do that, come on, I'll be on. It's going to be a nice day. It's a nice room. Correct, exactly. Have a drink if you want, have some foods. Dr. Lois Peeler, who is an incredible Yorta Yorta woman, is coming to do the Welcome to Country and talk about Aboriginality and womanhood and motherhood and her advocacy work

with young Aboriginal women, which is just, I'm so honoured she's going to be there. Awesome, right? And then Woody Sampson, my cousin, is just a joy glitter bomb in a human being. Yeah. And their particular skill is creating a dance floor actually. Good vibes.

I have to say. Just good, solid vibes and also excellent songwriting. I think Woody might even just actually write a song on the spot. He's doing that at the moment and it's just insane to watch. Yeah. They play the trumpet incredibly well and Woody's just a delight. So you should come and watch Woody's set and then I will be on after them. And that's it.

Zeke and I are going to be playing all of the songs, all 11 songs on the album. I'm going to cry a lot. It's going to be really cathartic and wonderful. Oh, that's going to be embarrassing. You the songs, all 11 songs on the album. I'm going to cry a lot. It's going to be really cathartic and wonderful. You're going to want to come and see that. No, it's also going to be really fun. So I'm really excited. But, yeah, the actual album itself, you'll be able to listen

to the whole thing. My first single, Fear to Feel, obviously is out. The video is out. My second single, Free, is already out at the moment. But you'll be able to get the whole thing. Listen from the start to the end, I reckon. That's right. So if you listen to this on Thursday, then it's out tomorrow.

Yeah, it is, yeah. And, you know, just go on like something. Do the things that you said. So you listened to it actually from start to finish in New In Order. Yeah, I didn't like it. But look, that doesn't mean that other people won't like it, Claire. No, I really liked it. And what's really cool because you've been doing some radio spots

this week on real radio stations. I have on Australian Broadcast Corporation. That's right. That was one of them, among others, Joy FM and PBS. But, yeah, just hearing them on the radio was like really bizarre in a good way. I know. Just actually hearing my songs on the radio for the first time just blew me away. I really couldn't believe it.

It was so special. That's right. And those interviews were really fun to do as well. It was really, really exciting. And fun to record. They were. Correct. Exactly.

James, before we move on to your recommendation, do you have any questions about the album? Do I have any questions? Yeah. Sure. Okay, how about this, Claire? If the album was a type of bird, what kind of bird would it be? So annoying.

An eagle. Ooh, a bald eagle or a regular eagle? No, just. A brown eagle. And just an eagle, yeah. Nice. Of. Nice. Of some description. I can't think of any other eels.

I don't know. Brown eagle, bald eagle. I'm so tired. I can tell. Can you tell my brain? I don't know why you're like, what questions do I, I don't have any questions about it. You don't, about the writing process. I know all the answers to that.

So no, I don't really have any questions. Do you have anything you want to say? Is there anything that anybody wants to know or you want to share? I don't know. I don't know. That's not very helpful. How about this? Are you proud of what you've achieved and do you think it will resonate with people? I, I hope so. Because I think it already is resonating with people because you've already had people that have listened to it, like contact you and it's already gotten you like a bunch of opportunities and gigs and like situations and events and you're in contact with people that like it wouldn't,

you know. Yeah, pull me away actually. I will say because the album is called Matrescence, the reason it's called Matrescence is there was an anthropologist by the name of Dano Raphael who coined the term in the 1970s and it was brought back by Arely Aiton in 2008 who's a researcher from Columbia University. And it really means the transition into motherhood

that can take over 10 years and is equivalent to adolescence. And so just that fact alone has changed the way that I think about the way I went through motherhood. And every time I say it to another person, another woman particularly, but also just the people who give birth, it blows them away because they've never heard of it either, but it absolutely legitimizes. But they're also like, wait a minute, that's the thing that happened to me. Yeah. It legitimizes what happens to you. I was speaking to a friend about it today actually, because there is so much awkwardness that happens with motherhood.

You go from being like maybe I was very cool or like, you know, just like a person who knows who they are and like, you know, knows what they wear and what they like and then you become a mother and it's like being a teenager all over again. You don't know what to wear. You don't know what to fit your body into. You don't know how it works because it's changed all over again. Skin feels weird.

Yeah, your skin feels weird. It actually does feel weird. Your hormones are going crazy. You've got all these mood swings. You're trying to learn really fast how to do this new thing. On top of keeping a baby alive. Exactly, as well as being consumed by love for this little baby. But you're also kind of dealing with all this other stuff as well.

Your skin's changed, your hair changes, and socially as well, I think it's something we don't talk about. Your social circles really are impacted too. Yeah, definitely. So the friendships that you had may change depending on if they have kids or not or what kind of life stages people are at. Your habits change. So even just that alone, your habits change,

which means you can't always go out for dinner or go to the pub the way you used to. You can't just be like, see ya, and you walk out of the house. And you become a different person. And matrescence is learning how to do that. Yeah. And I think we give adolescents all of this kind of leeway and there's so much research about that transition and we know that it's like eight to ten years of their lives. Yeah.

And we kind of go, oh, isn't that hilarious? Look at these teenagers, you know, they're experimenting and some teenagers go through it, you know, really well and other teenagers flail around having no idea. That's true, it is, yeah. You know, it's the same with motherhood and some people will sail through it fairly breezy and other people will really, really struggle and it's so unique to each person.

And so that's kind of the message I really want to get out with this album. And I didn't mean to either. I wrote the songs before I knew what matrescence meant. That is true. And then it's kind of worked backwards because it kind of was that in hindsight. Yeah, but it was hindsight, right? Because really I was just writing very personally from my experiences and the experiences of the women around me or people that I'd heard

or TV shows that I'd watched of the experience of womanhood and motherhood and heartbreak. And it was interesting. I did a radio interview with Vision Australia on Friday and that interviewer, Chris, was so insightful. He listened to the album and he said I – I didn't hear that one. Do you have a copy of that one?

It's not out yet. Okay, cool. It's not coming out till after the album's launched. Oh, great. Okay, good. But he said something so thoughtful. I had never been interviewed by someone who was so thoughtful. He picked out specific lyrics from the songs and he said that I know the album.

I think my eagle question was pretty thoughtful, but go on. So he said that even though the album. I think my eagle question was pretty thoughtful, but go on. So he said that even though the album is about matrescence, it's actually really universal because it's about heartbreak and failure and transition and about, yeah, human fragility really, which is at the heart of what matrescence really is. It's just another one of those big life altering things. Like if you go through a trauma or a heartbreak, it can feel similar to that in some ways. And then it just made me think that's so interesting, isn't it? That yes, I'm

writing about matrescence, but also there's the deeper themes in there. So if you're not a mother or you're not even someone who has a womb and could have a child, I would be really curious to see what you think of the album because there's songs in there that are I think speak to heartbreak and grief and feeling stuck in your life and not knowing, you know, how to get out of a situation or being stuck on an idea or falling in love with an idea or a person and then having that kind of ripped out from under you and, you know,

even just coping with trauma that you've been through and how to hold on to your sense of self through all of that. So it is about matrescence but I was really grateful for that interview because I realised, I mean, he was a man probably in his 50s, you know, who. Yuck. No, but I found that really interesting. Yeah, that's really cool.

You know, because actually at the heart of it, human fragility is an emotion in all lives and the stuff that we go through. And everybody changes, you know. Yeah, but there's a kernel of truth in. An egg. An eagle's egg. Sorry, you know. Yeah, but there's a kernel of truth in. An egg. An eagle's egg. Sorry, go on. That is relatable.

I just mean that in all our experiences, regardless of what those events are, there can be really a kernel of kind of similarity. Oh, absolutely, yeah. Because they're all just human at the end of the day experiencing that stuff. Okay, one final question. Here we go. You're going to ask me about eagles and eggs? No, I got my answer.

If someone was to write, say, an album or a book or a script or a, I don't know, a whatever, a short story, an essay. Yes. A list of things to do. For the writing process, do you think it really is about writing what you know? Because I feel like you've had a run at this stuff before. And I don't know whether it wasn't that you didn't have things to say, but I feel like you had a certain kind of lived experience and all of that. And then you drew on that. And that's not to say that you have to wait

to a certain age till you've got lived experience to express yourself in a certain way. But this is obviously something you couldn't have done at like 20, like this exact thing because it's just not possible. Like you wouldn't have experienced any of this. So would you say there's truth in like do what you know? Yeah, definitely. I think, yeah, writing what you know, that sounds really obvious, doesn't it? And you hear that all the time.

I think. So what feels true to you would be more, because I know you're big on like gut instinct and you've also been like that for like promoting it and getting it out there, which has seemed to have worked really well. Because you're like, well, no, like you've spoken to people about like how to get it out there and you get a lot of really good advice and from people who know and maybe don't know what they're doing. And sometimes you get a bit of advice from someone who even knows what you're doing and

you're like, no, I'm going to do it this particular way. And it seems to have worked out like pretty much every time. I think, I mean, and I'm sure. That's a different thing though, obviously. No, I mean, there's a few things going on there. One of them is that I think you have to make art for you. And I saw a really great interview with someone who said this and I couldn't actually catch which musician it was, but he was saying that you have to make

art for you, the audience. And if no one else likes it, but you really enjoy it because you've made it just for you, great. And I don't think you should do anything outside of that because I think once you start chasing something that you want other people to see in your work. Like a trend or a. Yeah, I just don't think. Or you think this will work because that thing is popular. Yeah, and I'm sure people do and people do do that and get, you know, success.

Oh, of course, yeah. All kinds of things. I mean the whole YouTube model is based on that. Yeah. But I think in terms of artistry and musicianship or any kind of writing, what you're trying to do is create something that you enjoy and so then you can feel proud of it and maybe you have to get another job in order to create it because you, you know, for whatever reason.

But I think then you're making something that's really true and interesting. Yes. And I think it's also how being able to be completely vulnerable and sink really deeply into the way that you see the world and align what you're making with that. And I also, Elizabeth Gilbert in her book Be Magic said something great and I really love that too. She's like, for goodness sake, don't try and make art that's going to change the world. Like that's annoying too, you know?

That's also like. It's just like. That's like really obnoxious as well. I feel like. It's just really annoying. Yeah, remember like, I can't remember what it's called, but there was that like do they know it's Christmas song? It's like an 80s song about like famine in Africa

and it's about like kids starving in Africa. It's like they probably don't know it's Christmas. No. And that song was – I know it probably raised a lot of money and whatever and all that kind of stuff. But like you can't make something that's going to like heal the world is what you're saying. No, no, exactly.

Or I mean and you can try but she was saying in the end, for goodness sake, make it because it lights you up, because it's fascinating, because it's absorbing, because it's interesting, because it feels truthful, because it sits with how you see the world. And because art at the end of the day is like jewelry for your mind, you know. So you put everything that you can into it to make it as good as you can make it in terms of your own taste

and you don't leave anything on the table. Like you just go for it as hard as you can. Yeah, like next time I'll do this. No. I'll save this song. And kind of going, oh, that'll do. No, you do it as best that you can in the way that you can with the skillset that you have. That's what I've done anyway. And I've,

I haven't made it going, well, this is going to change everyone's lives. That's not why I'm making it. I made it for me. I made it because I needed to heal from what I'd been through. And I feel like art is a means to that healing. Yep. And all of this is such a bonus to me if other people resonate with what I've written and they find it healing too. Bloody fabulous. But I, the process of making it was so special and hard and vulnerable and wonderful and interesting and, yeah,

healing that all the rest of it, you know, this feels like just flying. It's like so much fun. Yeah. And that's why I keep having to remind myself that regardless of where things go now, I've just done, I've made something that I'm really proud of. Yeah, absolutely. That has really changed me and has helped me make sense

of what I went through. Yes. And so that's at the end of it. So, yeah, I think that kind of answers your question. Yeah, it does. Right, at the end of the day. And the other thing I would say is, which is something that Zeke, the music producer that I made the music with, said to me,

and also my singing teacher, Bianca, said as well, that you've just got to do it your way. Yeah. And no one really knows. It's something you say too. No one really knows. No one really knows anything. Jacob Collier, who's a musician I really admire,

said this in an interview at the Grammys recently. He just said, yeah, no one really knows. Everyone's just making it up as they go along. Everyone's trying stuff and seeing what works. And, yeah, some people have done it more than you, but also no one really knows for sure what will work and what won't. And the other advice he gave, which I really loved, was that by making yourself the biggest version of you that you can be and the best version of you, you're not going to make other people smaller. You're

actually allowing other people to expand. Okay, yeah. I love that idea. He said you be as big as you can be in your own space, in your own creativity, in your own world and stop kind of putting yourself down and trying to make yourself smaller and feeling like that imposter syndrome like, oh, it's the Grammys and I don't know if I should really be here. He said, no, the more expansive you are.

I think most of those people bloody shouldn't be there. I'm looking at that crowd. I'm like, what a bunch of dickheads. Hey, no. But do you know what I mean? Like the more that you can say to yourself, I deserve to be here, but not in like a self-absorbed sort of way, but in a I'm going to be expansive as a person, you then allow other people to also

find themselves and be expansive too it's not a finite amount of being able to like be fully who you are and I just love that he's an incredible musician oh my goodness his concerts like he does this audience singing it's just it's magical and he's just he plays every instrument under the sun I just admire him so much so I would highly recommend going to find that video actually. But, yeah, that would be my advice at the end of the day. No one really knows. You just have to go with your own gut instinct and try your best. This is sort of related, not really, but it is.

You know Lonely Island, they do the I'm on a boat and whatever. Yeah, yeah. They wrote that. Have you seen that weird Jack Sparrow song they did with Michael Bolton? No. It's basically a song where they do a duet with Michael Bolton and there's supposed to be this like power ballad and every time it goes to a chorus he sings about how he loves the Pirates

of the Caribbean franchise and how he loves Jack Sparrow and they keep trying to like wrangle him back like out of singing about Pirates of the Caribbean franchise and how he loves Jack Sparrow. And they keep trying to like wrangle him back like out of singing about Pirates of the Caribbean. Yeah. And it's like bizarre. Like it's like and they thought it was like this is really funny for us. Yeah. And then it's like their big one, probably their biggest song because it's

like we think this is funny. We don't think anybody else thinks this was funny. But it's the thing that they like. They're like this is fun. Let's do it. And it is. It's a really good song. Oh're like, this is fun. Let's do it. And it's amazing. It is.

It's a really good song. Oh, there you go. Cool. Excellent. All right. I'll have to check that one out. Yeah, definitely. But listen, Claire, that's the show. No, it's not.

There's more things we've got to talk about. What have you got to recommend? Well, look, what I've been doing, and you know this because you just saw me, because I've watched all the Shrek movies and recorded Caravan of Garbages for them, Actually quite early. They were finished like a while back because Lawrence is getting married. Congratulations, Lawrence. Congratulations, Lawrence.

And Ben's going over, so that's happening next week. But didn't get an invite. That's all I'm saying. That's just not a big deal. So my son and I, our son, have been watching the Shrek films and he's just been – Shrek 4 is set in an alternate timeline where Shrek doesn't exist. He was never born, right?

Yeah. And so I've been, he's been asking about multiverses and how the second timeline in Shrek works. So tonight, as I promised him and he reminded me, I sat down and I literally just mapped out the two, the Shrek, the regular Shrek timeline and then below a parallel Shrek timeline explaining how it works and the events that lead up to Shrek in Shrek 1 and how not having Shrek in the alternate timeline because it was never

born, how that would affect the timeline of that particular thing. And I'm like, what am I doing? At one point I was making hot chocolate and I heard you go, look, it's a pretty big concept to understand, isn't it, mate? So, you know, don't worry if you don't really understand it. We'll have another go at looking at it tomorrow. Also good to remember it's not real. Yeah.

You don't need to worry about it. But then I don't want to be like, maybe it is. I don't know. But he listens so intently, which is what I find so funny. But also they drop it in so many movies now, you know what I mean? It's a really important concept. It's going to come up sooner or later. May as well do it through the Shrek franchise.

Yeah, exactly. It's going to come up heaps. It happens all in like comic books and all of that stuff. Back to the Future. Oh, exactly. I basically did the back to the – there's a scene in Back to the Future too where Doc Brown like literally like draws it on a chalkboard and it's for Marty but it's really for the audience to be like, right, this is how time travel works.

Yeah, so when he comes to that, he's going to really understand it when we find, I can't wait to show him Back to the Future. It's pretty good. I like the scene where he kisses his mum. It's weird. Oh, yeah. It's a weird movie. Everything has problematic things, doesn't it?

Yeah. Some weirder than others. Hi, this is Katnett Unfiltered. If you know us, then you know that we do almost everything together, so accommodating seven kids and seven adults on vacation can be challenging, so we Airbnb it. And if you have a spare room in your house, you can be challenging. So we Airbnb it. And if you have a spare room in your house, you can Airbnb it. It's that simple. You can even Airbnb your whole house

while you are away. You could be sitting on an Airbnb and not even know it. Whether you could use extra money to cover some bills or for something a little more fun, your home might be worth more than you think. Find out how much at Airbnb.ca slash host. more than you think. Find out how much at airbnb.ca slash host. Anyways, I watched an incredible movie called Alice, Darling, stars Anna Kendrick, Wunmi Moksaku, Garnithio Horn. Now, the last name I'm really proud of because I was like, how do you pronounce this? I searched all around the internet. I found a video of her saying it and she was like, if you take the time to like learn somebody, you know, pronounce someone's name, whether it be me or somebody else,

it's, you know, it's really nice of you to do it and it's like a sign of respect or whatever instead of being like, can you give me a nickname? So I'm like, I did that. That's what I'm doing. And Charlie Carrick. So it's directed by Mary Nighy, who is actually the daughter of Bill Nighy.

Oh, wow. And it's written by Alana Francis. So this is the synopsis. Pushed to the breaking point by Simon, her psychologically abusive boyfriend, Alice, played by Anna Kendrick, rediscovers the essence of herself and gains a much-needed perspective while on vacation with two close girlfriends. So it's about an abusive relationship, Anna Kendrick and to the Charlie Carrick character. I'm going to call him Simon and I'm going to call her Anna Kendrick, okay,

if that's okay, Claire, if you're okay with that. But it's not about like explosions of like gratuitous violence and there's like a murder and like he hides her body and whatever and that's like a big revenge kind of situation. In a lot of ways it feels worse because it feels very real. Her boyfriend, he's like portrayed so like awful and frightening. And you kind of, as the movie goes on, you get glimpses of that. And you get more as it kind of progresses and she thinks back to like specific moments.

But there's also, well, the scariest thing is her reaction to him not only when he's around her but also when he's not there so like it's the way that she presents herself the way that she gets up like before she he doesn't put her makeup on in the morning like the way she dresses like the way that like what she eats and what she doesn't eat when like somebody approaches her or him approaches her, she like flinches. Like you see moments like that. And she, in addition to that, is justifying like her actions and the way she feels in relation to him and his actions,

if that makes sense. Because that's often how it works. People aren't in an abusive relationship and are like, this is abusive and this sucks, but oh well. There's a reason that they're there because this person has like broke them down like psychologically. And you see that it's a really realistic portrayal of what abuse, you know, can really look like. But it's also that of friendship as well, because she ends up lying to her boyfriend

and going away with some old friends who she doesn't really see anymore. Cause you see, sows the seeds of doubts of like you know you don't even like hanging out with them anymore and you always tell me that you know you don't feel the same when you're around hers and and you know stuff like that you know like sowing the seeds so the dynamic between them is great because she's she believes some of that you know what i mean like she's like i don't know if i even click with these people anymore and they they know something's wrong, but they're also annoyed at her because she's not the kind of friend that she used to be, or even the kind of friend that she, you know, that she was to them.

And it's also, I saw an interview where Anna Kendrick was talking about the character of Alice and how it's intentionally she took on this role because it's not a character where like, you know, she's like soft and fun and bubbly and like charismatic charismatic and it's like like whip smart and funny and all of those kinds of things she's like none of those things and it's not that she's like unpleasant she's just not a good person to like to sit with and like be around and like be in the headspace of and like watch kind of go through these things like it's really uncomfortable and it's also it's interesting these things. Like it's really uncomfortable. And it's also, it's interesting that the way that it portrays their relationship, because if you looked at like the surface of the things that he's doing and saying, because he's not

like, again, he's not hitting her or any of those things. There, there is this kind of ominous kind of threat and maybe it would become violent at some point because these things often do but none of the things he's doing are like they're not illegal like you could easily if you were in that situation you could justify them to yourself or to somebody else or if you're explaining the way that he treats her or what has happened if he was spoke to the wrong person about that like maybe even on or the right person on the wrong day, it sounds like nothing. You know, it just sounds like, oh, so like he wants you to eat healthy.

Like that's good, you know, things like that, right? So it's little things like that. So the movie does a really good job of showing what an abusive relationship can look like on a very kind of, I don't know, like just grounded, realistic level. Almost like a mundane kind of ordinary day level. Yeah. Which I think is what the dangerous thing is about emotionally abusive relationships

because they can be not violent, physically violent at all, but they can erode someone's sense of self to the point where they no longer even know what they think anymore without that person validating what they're going to say. And it's, it's heartbreaking. There's some really powerful writing that's come out recently about those kind of relationships. I know in Bad Sisters, there's a really amazing kind of way of portraying one of the sisters, the guy that is murdered. The husband, yeah.

Yeah, the husband and their relationship. And you see how over time he's taken her spark and just taken everything from her, even though ostensibly you might think that, like, that one isolated incident doesn't look that bad. Yeah. But it's incrementally over time. On Tons, I spoke to Sam Buckingham who's a singer-songwriter who I really, really loved.

Yeah. Who escaped an abusive relationship, emotionally abusive relationship and it's a very confronting episode so I will put a warning. It's also beautiful and heartwarming and she's an amazing creative but she talks about that, that she didn't even know she was in an abusive relationship until she rang a helpline after she actually left him. Yeah.

And he had sort of twisted it around to make it seem like she was the villain. Yep. And she rang this helpline and they started sort of asking her questions and then they told her she was in an abusive relationship. And she was shocked and kind of said, no, I'm not.

Yeah, I would know that. I would know that, right? And then as it sort of started to unpack more and more and they talked more and more about the things that she had taken as just being part and parcel of a difficult relationship, she started to see there were patterns. And I think that's the key when you realise that things that are happening to you aren't happening in isolation,

that actually they've happened to a lot of people and particularly women over and over again. You know the other one that I think shows that really well is Made. Remember that TV show Made? I didn't watch Made. Yeah, you talked about it. It's just a brilliant watch. But that goes a long way to showing just the damaging nature of this kind of relationship. And knowledge is power too. So once you know that, then you can kind of

have more of an awareness. And I think also the other thing about emotionally abusive relationships from what I have read and the women I've heard speak, and not just women actually, non-binary people too and men, that you just think it couldn't happen to you is the line that a lot, like I'm smart is the line I've heard. I'm smart. I'm intelligent. I grew up in a particular way.

I'm savvy about people. I manage a team. I have this or that or this career or that career. I just didn't think that it could happen to me. Yeah. But particularly abusers in this way can be incredibly manipulative and incredibly clever. Because they are also smart.

Yeah. Yeah, exactly. And for whatever reason, whether it's their personality or what they've been through themselves or they're subconscious or whatever it is, they're also very, very clever so it can happen to anyone. So the more that you can start to see the red flags, the better. That sounds great. I'd really like to watch that.

Yeah, I would watch it after your show. But I really enjoy it. And, yeah, I love the friendships in it as well. They're portrayed like her two friends are really, are really great. And also that they're, they don't even particularly like her a lot of the time. But they do at the same time. It's more like a frustration and like an anger that what has happened to her than like, we don't like you.

That's because, yeah, I said that wrong. Because they do like her because they want, you know because they want the best for her, you know. Yeah. Yeah. And I think that's what's kind of interesting too and unusual to see and it's true that when a friend is in that particular state when they've been so broken down, they aren't fun to be around. Yeah.

You know, and they do seem kind of at odds with themselves. Of course. And especially when like you're telling somebody and they either don't hear it or don't want to hear it or they do hear it and then later they, you know, maybe something happens where, you know, they stay in the relationship or whatever, you know, or for whatever reason, which is also completely understandable. Like I get that.

Yeah. I mean, life is complex. Yeah. So. Yeah. And that is also tricky, isn't it? Once someone's opened up about how something is in a relationship and then they stay together and then they avoid you because they know

that you know some really difficult things. So, oh, gosh, complicated. But, gosh, Anna Kendrick chooses some really, really great roles. She's good. I really like her. She was on the show Hot Ones this week. She was. Which I enjoy.

You don't know what that is. I don't know what that is. I don't know what that is. No, she can do that thing. They eat hot wings and there's even spicier questions or something. Oh, there you go. Because they eat hot wings, yeah. I love that. Well, Claire.

Yes, James. I know that you love reviews, not only of your album. So like if you're listening on Spotify, you can get that five stars. Oh, yeah. Like honestly. Go on. It's so, this whole music business i realized i'm doing this all independently so i don't have a record label well you have people around you and this

is what i'm saying i have all these incredible friends and family and you who are supporting me and helping me to get the album out there but that's all i have so i don't have a record label i don't have a manager i don't have a big team. And so if you are out there listening to this right now, if you go to Spotify and you click on Fear to Feel or Free or listen to my whole album, hit a like. I know that you hear this all the time so I feel like a bit of a wanker saying this but it really honestly makes a big difference. And the other thing that makes a massive difference is if you add one

of my tracks to a playlist that you might play at your work or in the car or wherever, that makes such a massive difference. So just playing it more than once and if it sits in your playlist, you know, it's just, I can't even tell you. And the other thing is just going, hey, to a friend, I've had this thing, I know this musician or I listen to a podcast and here's this album, you might like it. And I think particularly if you've got anyone in your life who's about to have a baby or has just had a baby or is just kind of coming through all of that time, I think there's some songs in this album that will really, really, I think helped me anyway in writing them. And some women who I know have listened to them

and said they've helped them. So feel seen in their experience. So yeah, that would mean the world to me. And it would also mean the world to me. Oh, well, there you go. For people to do that for you. Yeah, I'm so passionate about this album. I'm so proud of it.

You should be. And I really believe in it and I really want it to be heard by as many people as want to hear it and should hear it. And so, yeah, and that's why I made the YouTube video as well, the music video. People have just, I've just been blown away. I keep crying all the time because people have been so lovely about it and I've really, I've just, it's been such a gift to have this time to really find myself as an artist and make something

that I'm really, really proud of and I've met so many amazing people and, yeah, so if you want to go and check out the video, I would love you to. It's just so proud of it. So, yeah, go watch, go listen. And if you can't and if you don't like it, that's cool. I totally get it. We don't want to hear about it though.

No, it's not for everybody. Yeah, and not everything is to everyone as well. So I totally get that. But if you're curious or you're listening to this and think, yeah, I could just have a little listen, I think you might get something out of it. So, yeah, it's really special. And just massive thank you, James, because I could not have made any of it without all of your support and running things from home

and looking after the kids. I did backing tracks on that one song. It probably helped. You did. You did a little shoot the kids. I did backing tracks on that one song. It probably helped. You did. You did a little shoop to boobs. I did. No, but honestly, it's a real partnership. I was speaking to a friend actually, well, my singing teacher,

Bianca, today about the album and about losing yourself as a mother and how often that can happen to women, particularly women. It can happen to men as well. It happened to Charlie Clawson. That's right. We talked about that on Fofop. But particularly it's more common for women and it's when you fall into the trap of all society's expectation or circumstance with work that you become the primary carer and you don't have someone

who's in it with you as an equal partner. And so you then fall into having the role of parent solely on your shoulders. Yeah. And that is also such an admirable and amazing role. And if you find yourself in that role, then that's so amazing. But if you don't and you can really lose yourself if you don't have a partner who's willing to share it equally with you.

And that's what I say to all my friends when they're thinking about having kids, that you don't want to take away your partner's opportunity to also be an expert for their kids. Yeah. Because that also leaves you then being the sole kind of, oh, everything falls to you. And that over time, it might feel good initially, but over time it becomes exhausting. And so I'm also just incredibly thankful that I've got a partner who's in it. Fitty, fitty. Who?

I don't know. Some dude. Wow. Well, I appreciate it. Thank you. No, it's been really nice seeing you do it. Honestly, it's been awesome. It's just, yeah, seeing you like light up and create this thing and also have it be good because imagine if it wasn't fuck

me that'd be awkward for me claire trying to talk you through that that's good actually that's good actually that's the funniest thing actually that's happened quite a bit because i'm so proud of it i forget and also i just don't have any fear because I have that intellect. So I just send it to people all the time. Yeah. And Charlie Clausen said this to me. He was like, it's awful. People send things to you and you're like, oh, God, it's a friend and what if it's bad?

And I realised like from their perspective, a friend that they didn't even know did any music sends you a song and a video clip. You're just going to watch it and cringe the whole time. That's why I didn't tell anybody even to this day that I'm on YouTube. Yeah, well, clearly we're very different beasts. I don't know. But it just hadn't occurred to me that that would be the overriding emotion.

Yeah, absolutely. But it's happened a lot. And then I have got when people have finally listened, people go, oh, thank God. Yeah. I've sent one thing to people, to my group chat. I don't send my videos to anybody. Wow.

I've never done it except one. Remember that one I did about the Suvlaki hut? Oh, yes. I said that to my friends because they all like football or whatever, and I'm like, here, this one's for you guys actually. What did they think of it? They liked it. Yeah, because that's actually one of my favorites.

Yeah, I like it too. It's so silly. Talk about passion projects, you know. So silly. I love it. Yeah, because that's actually one of my favorites. Yeah, I like it too. It's so silly. Talk about passion projects, you know. So silly. I love it. It's so funny though. Yeah. It's just so funny.

All right. Okay, that's it. Anyway, you can review the show. You review it. You do it in app, but do the Claire's thing first. And if you do that and you've got time, then I'll read the thing out. I think we've only got a couple of reviews left after this to read out, so more would be good.

This one's five stars. My goodness. It says, Claire is the best. Oh. It says, new neighbours are moving in right now and they're loud. Lovely podcast. That's from Ethan Rice. He's got two E's on the end.

Thank you so much, Ethan Rice. Thank you so much, Ethan Rice. You got a letter or are we going to leave it there? I do have a letter. Cool. This one is from a long-time listener, David Malofsky. Okay, let's do it. How fear to feel helped my ADHD. Oh, I know. Hi, Claire. I wanted to thank you for making fear to feel

such an addictive song because listening to it led me to finding a way to help with my ADHD induced time blindness. You just never know how art will help. Yeah. So backing up a bit, I have ADHD. I was diagnosed when I was a kid over 25 years ago. One thing I've always struggled with is time blindness, especially during showers as there's no clock in the shower. I usually listen to music and set a cue so I know when X songs play. I should probably get out.

But that's time consuming before each shower. So when you released Fear to Feel, I decided that it would become my go-to shower song because one, it's a banger. And two, I wanted to support you by listening to it as much as possible. Yeah. So now he's got a whole playlist of songs that are roughly five minutes long that help him to know when to get out of the shower. And then that he's got five minutes to get dressed. And so we weren't going to make Fear to Feel five minutes because that's way too long for a song. Usually it's like three and a half or something. That's true.

It is too long. It's not a radio edit, but I felt strongly that it just needed to be the length that it was, and I'm so glad we left it at five minutes, David. Thank you very much. You've done it again. You just never know. All right. So we've been to Just For Podcast.

Thank you, as always, to Royal Collings for editing this week's episode. I promise I will be back next week with some really solid recommendations. It's just been a very big time in this woman's life. Thank you, Blair. They're great. So thanks, everyone, for all the support and for coming along for the ride. And, yeah, listen tomorrow. Matrescence.

Matrescence. It's going to be in the world. Just type in Claire Tonti. You can't spell matrescence. Nobody can. Thatrescence. Matrescence. It's going to be in the world. Just type in Claire Tonti. You can't spell matrescence. Nobody can. That's true. C-L-A-R-E-T-O-N-T-I on Spotify and YouTube. Congratulations, Claire. Thank you. Oh, he's shaking my hand, everyone. I can't see.

I love shaking your hand. Sometimes I do it when you're talking to somebody and I just go off and start shaking your hand. You do do that and I forget. It takes me a while to notice that you're doing it as well because, you know, when I'm talking to someone, I'm really like barreling them and really listening intently. So anyway.

Let's do it. Thank you. Okay. Bye. Hi, this is Katnett Unfiltered. If you know us, then you know that we do almost everything together so accommodating seven kids and seven adults on vacation can be challenging. So we Airbnb it. And if you have a spare room in your house, vacation can be challenging. So we Airbnb it.

And if you have a spare room in your house, you can Airbnb it. It's that simple. You can even Airbnb your whole house while you are away. You could be sitting on an Airbnb and not even know it. Whether you could use extra money to cover some bills or for something a little more fun, your home might be worth more than you think. Find out how much at Airbnb.ca slash host.