Taking 20 Podcast - Ep 232 - Continuing Adventures

Episode Date: July 28, 2024

How can you continue an adventure after the printed material ends?  The players want to keep going but you’re out of adventure to give them.  The story has to end, right?  Not so fast, my friend.  In this episode we talk about tips and tricks to continue the story out to the horizon.   #pf2e #dnd #dmtips #gmtips #aftertheend   Resources: Dragon of Icespire Peak - https://marketplace.dndbeyond.com/adventures/SRC-00041

This week on the Taking20 Podcast. It sounds sappy, but a lot of times that's what gets games to extend. Did you ever get that feeling at the table, by the way, that like, magic's happening? Not Flavius casts a spell, but you've got the right GM and a killer group and a world that just sucks you in. It's an adventure that's right in your wheelhouse. It's like making good chili. Thank you for listening to the Taking 20 podcast episode 232, giving GMs some tips for continuing pre-made adventures after the printed material ends. I want to thank this week's sponsor,

cows. I discovered that the cows on a nearby farm have been spying on me. I guess it's a stakeout. This episode is courtesy of Scott Nichols who sent me this idea when he donated to the podcast at coffeeko-fi.com slash taking 20 podcast. Thank you so much Scott. By the way, if you have any ideas for episodes, please send them my way either Feedback at taking 20 podcast comm send me a direct message on social media or be an awesome human being like Scott and donate to the podcast Sometimes as a campaign stretches on we grow attached to the characters We're playing we've dreamed up this cute halfling avenging the death of one of her parents, or the elven

prodigal scholar who embraced dark magic and is ashamed to return home, or the pirate who's haunted by the innocents they killed so long ago. We players love our characters and may not be ready to let them go yet. Or maybe there's more adventure to be had, tales to be told, treasure to be won in this world. No matter the reason, sometimes we want the story to go on after the closing card says fan in delicate calligraphic script and the heroes are walking off into the sun together. No matter the reason, suppose the group that you're in wants to continue their stories,

but there's no more printed story available. You've reached the end of Avernus, or you've solved the mysteries of Earthfall, or you've avenged the town of Whispering Pines. Great! Now what? By the way, I'm going to do anything and everything I can in this episode not to spoil the ending of actually published adventures, but don't worry, if I do have to get close to spoiling something, I will definitely warn you ahead of time So what do you do if the group wants to continue after the end after the original author of the adventure or module put down their pen

God, jeez, that's an old phrase Jeremy. Sorry after the original author saved their file and submitted it to the editor for review God that sounds worse somehow Anyway, how do you handle this as a DM? First off, let's collect some data from your players and yourself. Ask why do they want to continue the story? There are a ton of reasons why, and no way I could possibly cover all of them here. Maybe they're in love with the world building, the area, the region of this mythical world and want to stay there.

And if so, ask them if they'd rather continue the existing characters or start with brand new characters in the same world. Maybe they're in love with the characters that they've made themselves. And if so, you can always continue the story with these characters or, what I did once, their children who are trying to live up to the name of their adventuring parent. But maybe this group of people around your table want to keep the story going so they stay together. It sounds sappy, but a lot of times that's what gets games to extend.

Did you ever get that feeling at the table by the way, that like magic's happening? Not Flavius casts a spell, but you know, but you've got the right GM and a killer group and a world that just sucks you in it's an adventure that's right in your wheelhouse it's like making good chili you've got to have the right ingredients and sometimes when you mix them they just click suddenly you've got this perfect pot bubbling away nothing needs tweaking it's pure deliciousness same thing can happen with a game it's fun throws you some punches but doesn happen with a game. It's fun, throws you some punches, but doesn't leave you floored. The world's fascinating without

being an info dump. You worry that if you mess with even one thing, the whole vibe can shift. Just like that perfect bowl of chili can turn nasty with a rogue pepper or a bad batch of cumin. One wrong element can change the whole game and you don't want that. So you just want this game to go on forever. Ask yourselves, and honestly, the GM should ask the players, why they want to continue. Is it because they love the world? They love the characters? Or they love that they found that perfect bouillabaisse of gaming flavors that they love? I get that fear by the way. I've seen

games diminish because of a change in campaigns or people playing in them. It's not the same without Triven the fighter or Ox the bard or Lady Rowena butternuts the third. The game feels different and you just don't love it as much. But here's the only thing I'll say is a counter. Change is constant and who says you can't fall in love with an adventure all over again with a different set of characters or even a different set of players. So ask again Why do you want to keep this story going? Is it simply just the fear of change? Okay, so you've done soul-searching and you decide you do want to keep the story going after the end. So let's start with some warnings. One, if you're a new DM and this is your first

published adventure, proceed with caution. You're entering the world of what I'll later refer to as hybrid home brewing. Some of the world is built for you and the adventure, but you'll be designing the adventures, the enemies, and likely parts of the world that the party hasn't visited yet. If you don't feel comfortable doing that, then it is easy to get overwhelmed as a GM. For newer GMs out there, please run a few campaigns before you start trying to cobble an adventure onto the end of a previously published one. This is tough even for experienced DMs, and new ones can get over your head quickly.

It's your campaign and do what you like, but be realistic about how much work you want to take on. Second warning. Most campaigns end at a natural transition between games. Like a lot of low-level adventures end at level 4 or 5 before things get tougher to run. Some medium-level campaigns will end at level 10 before the PCs start getting abilities that can break the economies of entire towns. And a lot of higher level campaigns end at level 15 before the PCs get abilities that can shape the fate of the world. As your campaign progresses to higher and higher levels, they become harder and harder to keep balanced. There's a reason we recommend DMs, especially new ones, stick to lower level adventures when they

start. Adding more adventures after the end will drive the characters to higher and higher levels which are harder and harder to run. So by their very nature of having more powerful characters, the games won't be the same. Ok, alright, I'm sorry, enough warnings. If you're committed despite these potential issues, here are some tips on how you can continue that printed adventure above the max level after the end and lead it off into the horizon. One. The first thing you'll have to figure out is where to take the adventure. What is left for the PCs to do and accomplish?

One of the ways you can collect that list of things for them to do is to look for loose threads in the story. What do I mean? Things like baddies who escaped, that lieutenant of the big bad that was never seen by the PCs for whatever reason and survived the final push to the boss. Does that lieutenant try to rebuild the empire of the criminal organization under new leadership? Chances are if they do, they'll learn what the PCs did to take down their boss the first time and hopefully will be better prepared.

Of course, if you do resurrect the organization with the lieutenant, remember your PCs will be higher level and that lieutenant will eventually have to be tougher than the big bad since the PCs now need a tougher challenge. You may have to answer why that lieutenant wasn't the big bad in the first place. If the hobgoblin boss was, I don't know, CR 15 and the surviving human lieutenant in the org who takes it over becomes a CR 18 encounter.

How? Why didn't that lieutenant kill their way to the top before? Other threads you can use that continue the story would be aspects of the adventure that weren't addressed before the end. Maybe your group was meticulous at first, but as you got closer and closer to the end they stopped taking a lot of side quests and doing anything optional. got closer and closer to the end, they stopped taking a lot of side quests and doing anything optional. Those abandoned portions of the adventure can be picked up and used to continue telling the story. Another place you can find loose threads are tales that weren't fully told, rivals that weren't fully dealt with, people who needed help that the adventure writer didn't provide a method

for the PCs to assist. Now is your chance to add that to the adventure and keep it going. Tip number two. There's a term I used earlier called hybrid home brewing. Now what the heck do I mean by that? It means that you will be reusing parts of the published adventure and inventing new parts to connect to it. So what parts of the adventure can you continue to use? Taking an inventory of what could still be used to continue the adventure will be critical to determine what you can use if you're going to start designing from scratch. You can reuse some of the maps of towns and regions? Sure, absolutely.

Are there NPCs that you can reuse and have them still be part of the character's story? Will you be continuing the adventure themes and general feel like it's horror, it's a sandbox, it's resource management, etc. or are you going to change it entirely? You don't have to reuse anything, but you certainly can. The aspect of the adventure I'll caution you about reusing are dungeons and or tactical maps. Chances are the players have likely already been there and done that. Reusing a dungeon may make the players feel like they're being cheated.

We've already been over to the Everflame dungeon, why the hell are we back? Oh, it's suddenly restocked again? K... That said, if there's a dungeon they never went to, oh that's a gift for you. Stock it with different and tougher monsters, new content, new purpose, new treasure, and reuse that thing. So, you may have to design or find dungeons appropriate for the new PC's levels and attach it to the adventure somehow. It's not difficult once you do it a few times but it'll still need to be done. Tip number three. Chances are you won't be the first GM to continue this adventure

especially if it's a popular one. Use your search engine of choice to look for discussions on forums, social media, discord, or websites by DMs who have continued this adventure past the end. Look for those and if you're not publishing your game for profit, borrow, borrow, borrow, steal, steal, steal their ideas to continue your game. Tip number four. You can use a pre-printed module as a continuation of the previous pre-printed module. That said, you'll need to find a way to connect the new printed adventure to the old one, and a new adventure would likely need to be appropriate level or at least very close, or possibly adjusted by you on the fly or ahead of time.

As an example, Dungeons & Dragons Essentials comes with a 64-page adventure, Dragons of Icespire Peak. Wizards of the Coast later published a follow-up series of three adventures collectively called Beyond the Dragon of Ice Spire Peak that were available through D&D Beyond and also subsequently for various tabletop platforms that you may be using. Those were Storm Lord's Wrath, Sleeping Dragon's Wake and Divine Contention I believe. Each of those could be purchased as a standalone product, or could be accessed for free using QR codes within the purchase of a physical copy of the Essentials Kit. I'll provide a link down in the description in case you want to learn more about that.

As another example, Waterdeep Dragon Heist easily connects to the adventure Waterdeep Dungeon of the Mad Mage. Dragon Heist is for levels 1-5, and Dun of the mad mage is for levels 5 through 20. The idea by the way is that the party likely sided with a particular faction in Dragon Heist. The faction could send the characters on the adventure that becomes dungeon of the mad mage. Neither adventure really gives a way to connect them but hell even if the players didn't like any of the factions in Dragon Heist the players could easily hear about the Undermountain dungeon at the Yawning Portal

Inn and next thing you know, you're off to the Undermountain to continue adventuring. Long ago I ran a campaign that was almost entirely stitched together from pre-printed modules. I know I'm missing a few of the names but I connected together the modules Crypt of the Everflame, Masks of the Living Gods, City of Golden Death, Daughters of Fury, pulled in details from the book Belk's Inhold of the Orc, specifically Skull Hill, to continue that part of the adventure, followed by adventures of my own making that connected fire giants who were subjugated by mind flayers, a corrupted druid, the young leader of men and the silver dragon

that loved him, an area called the Lydliss Sanctum, etc. etc. etc. I customized each printed adventure, tying it to one of the seven pieces of the Riven Regalia with adventures built around the seven deadly sins. So you can do that, you can cobble together an adventure from multiple pre-printed modules, but it may take some planning on your part to make sure it all connects together in a cohesive story. Tip number five, try to find out that you're gonna be continuing it after the end as far ahead of time as possible. That way you can customize the adventure as you go. If you know the PCs are gonna be chasing down a

loose thread that's left at the end of the adventure, start foreshadowing it where it's appropriate. Maybe during the final push, during killing the big bad, the escaping mage that sends a taunting message to the party that no matter what they do, and even if they kill the big bad, they're still going to escape. You can add more side quests or even a secondary main quest that continues after the players finish the adventure proper and leads into the next adventure. In other words, bring in aspects of that follow-on adventure into the first published adventure. Overlap them like wrapping paper, such the first fraction of the

follow-on adventure ties into the last fraction of the first one. Use foreshadowing towards the events of the next adventure. Give hints as to what's to come, what loose ends may need tying up when they get there. For example, if I were running troubles under Otari and I knew it would lead to an abomination vaults adventure, I would likely have the Thirsty Alpaca Inn collapse very early in session one, and better connect Tamalee's request to investigate her food and drink going missing to a more extensive warrant of underground tunnels that the's request to investigate her food and drink going missing to a more extensive warrant of underground tunnels that the PCs have to investigate that eventually

connects up to the gauntlet. You could have hazards like flooding swamp water that threatens not only the PCs, ooh but like non-combatant cobalt that the PCs have to decide if they're going to save. Maybe make the baddie part of an organization that survives the Big Bad's death or defeat at the hands of the party. Think Hydra from Captain America. Cut off one head and two takes its place. For every known member of the organization, there are others who operate completely in

the shadows. The defeat of the organization becomes the next phase of the adventure. How high up in the government does the shadow organization go? Well, is it the monarch? Are they in on it? Maybe members of their royal court? Their spouses? Their courtesans? In Troubles Under Otari, for example, maybe the Kobolds are working at the behest of one of the level bosses in the Gauntlight. Or maybe even working directly for the big boss of the entire adventure. That would allow you to start the Abominations Vaults just as troubles under Otari are starting to wrap up. Also if you know ahead of time and it makes

sense maybe recast some of the baddies in the first adventure as the named baddies in the second adventure or vice versa. Use some NPC that's prominent in the second adventure maybe as a key player in the first even if you have to wholesale find and replace one of the important NPCs in the first adventure with one in the second. Same could be done with places. Sure in the first, even if you have to wholesale find and replace one of the important NPCs in the first adventure with one in the second. Same could be done with places. Sure, in the first adventure, the climactic battle is in the ruins of a government building in an abandoned town. But who's to say that that same fight couldn't be in a temple instead, where the result of the climactic final battle, the sacristy is busted open, revealing secret worship garb of the

God of Death, leading to the second adventure where someone's planning a mass murder to get the God of Death's favor. The further you know ahead of time, the easier it is to connect the stories. That's what I did with the Riven Regalia adventure. I started out with a simple adventure and gradually cobbled the different follow-up adventures into a cohesive adventure about seven lost artifacts that the PCs have to collect before the big bad can use them to release untold evil into the world. And I know you're sitting there saying, I know, yeah, not exactly a unique premise Jeremy. Yeah,

you're right, but like I say, borrow, borrow, borrow, steal, steal, steal. There's nothing wrong with reusing good adventure ideas or prepented modules and customizing it to make it your own. Adventures by their very nature eventually come to an end, but just because the author of the adventure module says it has to end at level 6 doesn't mean that your table has to stop the adventure there. Make sure you know why that everybody wants to continue the adventure and cater to that. Figure out what's left undone at the end of the first campaign and continue with those loose threads. Attach another pre-designed adventure at the end

and start trying to stitch them together as far ahead of time as possible to allow for foreshadowing and to connect the stories with common NPCs, locations and plots between the two adventures. If you do, I'd be willing to bet that you and your players would have fun doing it. Thank you so much for listening, by the way. I appreciate everybody who downloads my episodes every single week. Wherever you found it, please like, rate, and subscribe to the podcast. Tune in next week when I'm going to have a very rare episode dedicated to a product review.

The Pathfinder Player Core 2 by Paizo and spoiler alert, I may be gushing just a little bit. But before I go, I want to thank this week's sponsor, Cows. Male cows can really hurt you if they get angry. My advice? Steer clear. This has been episode 232, Continuing Adventures After the End. My name is Jeremy Shelley, and I hope that your next game is your best game. The Taking20 podcast is a Publishing Cube media production. Copyright 2024. References to game system content or copyright their respective publishers.