Taking 20 Podcast - Ep 58 - The Evil Campaign

Episode Date: January 31, 2021

Sometimes it's good to be bad.  Evil campaigns can be amazing adventures unto themselves and can allow good role players to really stretch their wings and embrace being horrible people.  There are traps and potential gotchas to both running and being in a campaign.  Here's how to avoid them.

Ladies and gentlemen, thank you for tuning in to episode 58 of the Taking 20 podcast. This week about the evil campaign from both a player and a DM perspective. This week's sponsor is Diet Soft Drinks. Putting the eh in refreshment. Please go check out our YouTube channel, search for the Taking 20 podcast, and look for the videos with my logo. If you're watching this on YouTube, please check me out in podcast form. Please head over to www.taking20podcast.com or wherever fine podcasts can be found. When it comes to role-playing games, we love being the hero or heroine, right? Charging over the hill on our valiant steed at the first light of the fifth day,

we vanquish the evil and secure the lands of men against a once-in-a-generation threat. Arriving at the throne room to see the evil priest putting his final touches on a ritual to open the Maw of Malady, releasing hundreds of magical plagues to scour the world. Putting the lich down and tossing her into the closing portal, condemning her to an eternity of being ravaged by super mega syphilis and Celine Dion music. Absolutely tons of fun. But wouldn't it be good to be bad sometimes? Discarding the shackles of polite society, strapping on a shield that says no mercy, and burning a village to the ground. Look, we've all been there, but those damned arson laws in

our country really kind of keep you from doing that. Well, have I got a cure for you. The evil campaign is where you can embrace your id, destroy what others have built, force the horses into your bed, and ride over the horizon on the townspeople. Wait, no, flip that. Or don't. Who am I to judge? But evil campaigns are different in a lot of ways from your typical heroic adventures, and there are some gotchas to watch out for. So let's start with some tips for GMs running evil campaigns. First question you have to ask yourself, can you live with evil triumphing over good? Now you see that evil will always triumph because good is dumb. Some people can't. They get all icky when the bad guys walk out of the guild headquarters with sacks of loot and seven new halfling slaves and three heads to mount on a pike.

They feel uncomfortable as five people burn a civilian cruise ship and laugh mercilessly as the airlocks fail. It does take a bit of an emotional distance or moral flexibility to really enjoy an evil campaign. So my advice if you want to run an evil campaign is don't think about the fine details of what it would mean for 300 people to suddenly be exposed to the vacuum of space. Which, as an aside while we're here, most movies have that wrong. You don't instantly freeze in space. Yes, space is around 3 Kelvin, but heat transfer isn't efficient in space. You can't conduct heat away from the body, there's no matter that can conduct it away. There's also no matter to create a convection current,

so that heat loss doesn't happen rapidly either. What probably happens is that you die of lung rupture due to rapid expansion of the gas in your lungs, an embolism caused by ebolism, which is where the water in your body turns to gas, or hypoxia, where there's no more oxygen in your blood to keep your brain alive. So no, you don't freeze to death.

You'll drop unconscious in 15 seconds or less. You'll swell up like a balloon and float for millions of years, slowly turning into a freeze-dried husk until you're caught in a gravity well and either impacted an object or burned up in the atmosphere of a planet or absorbed into a star. Sweet dreams. If your PCs decide to jettison an entire crew of a ship, maybe just speak in vagaries like the bodies tumble towards the inky black void and not specifics like you see Jamie's final breath leave his body and the realization takes hold that this will be his last spacewalk. So make sure you can live with yourself running an evil campaign. Have a direct and frank conversation with your players about what is and

isn't allowed in the campaign, just like you would in a traditional good campaign. Allow players to set their limits as to what they would and would not enjoy. Avoid going over those limits. Rape, harm of children, self-harm, whatever they may be. Avoid them like the plague. All players need to communicate their limits to the rest of the table, and don't be shy about it. I mean, if you don't like, for example, eye trauma, now's the time to speak up. Evil campaigns work best for GMs when there is a clearly defined goal. Evil for the sake of evil just becomes boring quickly. Why are these miscreants and monsters working together? I mean, you have to have some sort of in-game in mind.

What does success look like for these evil players and at the end of the campaign? Are they defeating the big bad good guy or girl? Does that even make sense? The big bad good guy? Are they trying to retrieve some item for some evil monster or sponsor that's making them work together for this delivery? Let's get to the heart of it. There are different kinds of evil. Without going all metaphysical, what does evil actually mean? Evil can look very different to different players and GMs. Consider the Joker vs Darth Vader. Both are considered evil, but acted very differently and had different desires. One wanted to bring systems in line with the Empire.

The other wanted to watch the world burn and not build anything. Similarly, your PCs may have various goals. They may want to become evil tyrants or crime lords or forces of chaos. They may want to become some sort of social aspect of evil where they're a femme fatale or the less often discussed homme fatale, an attractive person who uses their looks to get what they want regardless of the destruction it causes for anyone unfortunate enough to be caught in their web. Do they want to be con men or con women, grifters who deceive others for their own benefit? Or do they just want to be Saturday morning cartoon evil? I will destroy the world! Even if the plan makes no sense.

Like the third Pirates of the Caribbean movie. Yes, I watched it. It's not good. The big bad has control over Davy Jones, a force of nature unto himself. And what's the first thing the big bad does with his power? Makes Davy Jones kill his pet kraken. Why? It makes no damn sense. And you know what? This isn't the time or place, Jeremy. Calm yourself. Happy place. Puppies and kittens frolicking in a meadow. I apologize, by the way. Saturday morning cartoon is a bit of an archaic phrase. There haven't been Saturday morning cartoons for a long time. I guess a better phrase would be kids cartoon villain evil. Examples of good kid cartoons are, okay, you've got a damn Kraken and you want to kill all the pirates. Send the fucking Kraken to kill pirate. You know, okay. You know what? Nevermind. I'm

sorry. Maybe it's better if I move on before the stupidity of that plot makes my ears bleed. Having a plan that makes sense will be advice I give to the PC section, so be on the lookout for that. And oh, by the way, don't even get me started about Nero's plan in the Star Trek reboot. Romulus gets destroyed and you get sucked into a wormhole backwards 30 years, so your big plan is to wait for one particular Vulcan to come through, make him watch his planet get destroyed, rather than saving the billions on Romulus in the 30 years you have?

Just unbearably stupid. Anyway, evil actions are subjective. While I don't want this to devolve into an episode about the nature of good and evil, it's important to know that not everyone categorizes evil the same way you and I would. What one group may call evil, another may call pragmatic or even necessary. Star Wars Episode 3, Obi-Wan tells Anakin that Chancellor Palpatine is evil to which Anakin responds that from his point of view, the Jedi are evil.

I'm not saying that Obi-Wan or Anakin are right. All I'm saying is that one of them killed a bunch of kids and I have to pick which one was evil. That's pretty compelling evidence on that side of the measure. Unless there's some sort of weird

apocryphal story about Obi-Wan going all King Herod on a bunch of Sith children. Just know that different PCs may have a different idea about what evil is, so make sure you discuss definitions of evil with the entire group, ideally during session zero. Now something to keep in mind from the GM perspective. In good campaigns, most of the world supports the players in their quest versus evil, but in an evil campaign, the reverse is true. If the characters are publicly evil and known to be evil, they may have a hard time finding help. They most likely can't drop into any random town, visit the blacksmith to sell armor after pressure washing what was left of the pallet and out of it. This is some nice armor here that I'm selling. Oh, wait, no, that's a vocal cord. I'll just

pick that off right there. There we go. How much will you give me for this breastplate? For evil parties, rest out in the open may be hard to come by in civilized lands. I mean, if they're just camping by the side of the road and anyone with any military gets wind of where they are, then here they come to save the day by killing them. It'd be a good idea for the evil party to have some sort of home base that they can return to when they need to rest and resupply. It could consist of loyal followers or conquered areas that begrudgingly do what the PCs ask of

them out of fear what would happen if they didn't. It's the old Machiavellian question, is it better to be feared or loved? Evil PCs probably won't be loved, so nothing says obey me like mounting a head on a stick. If you're running an evil campaign, a shorter campaign is probably better, especially if it's your first one you've ever run. Evil campaigns, if left to go too long, can rapidly descend into murder hobo campaigns. I'ma stab everything and everyone. The town sheriff, this horse, that couch, my friends, the air, my mom, oops, sorry mom, you shouldn't sneak up on me like that when I have my stabbing knife out. Keep the campaign pace quick. Keep it moving. Being evil can become rote very quickly, and the PCs many times will turn on each other,

so I'd say make this campaign shorter than normal. Decide very early on if you're going to allow player-versus-player actions. Are players allowed to steal from each other? Hide treasure from each other? Actively work against each other? Attack or even kill fellow party members? Form cliques and groups within the party, and ostracize others. Player versus player actions like that can cause hurt feelings very quickly and even split groups if everyone isn't on board from the jump. So make

sure this gets communicated very early and that all of your players are on board with this decision. I've only run a few evil campaigns but I did talk to some colleagues who have run a few more, so here's a list of what I've put together. Most of the time, evil campaigns go one of four ways depending on cooperation and GM control. One, there's enough control and cooperation during the campaign where the characters work together throughout. It's just a traditional campaign just with an evil slant to it. Two, characters are cooperating, but there's some bickering, secrets, maybe some minor backstabbing. Three, characters start out with a common goal, but cooperation rapidly degenerates once the goal is achieved or motivations clash. And of course, four, very loose control by the DM, where the player characters happen to be

working together temporarily, but betrayals are not only allowed, but expected. So have that conversation with your players before the campaign starts. Do you say it's okay for your characters to bicker and get after one another, but the players should be having fun and cooperating? I think that's a good place to be. Remember, you're getting together to have fun. You're getting together to enjoy collaborative storytelling with one another, to roll some dice, maybe drink some beers, have some snacks, and just laugh with good friends. You want your players to have fun whether or not their characters are working together.

And as a reminder for the difference, if characters are hit with a mace, they take damage rolled on the dice. If players are hit by a mace, they tend to press charges against the person that swung it. Evil campaigns are still campaigns and they need a structure just like a traditional campaign would. Five room dungeon, three act structure, sandbox, the herald, some sort of structure around the campaign. If you just give them absolutely no structure whatsoever and say,

go hog being evil, then the campaign is going to turn into a village burning pillage fest where the characters are on the run from ever more powerful and connected good guys. Which, that may be exactly what you're going for, so if so, go for it. What I would do there is have a list of power players who will want the PCs dead and what they'll send and how they'll try to make that happen. For players who have been the good guy and on the side of right and justice and the Andoran way, playing a baddie can be a catharsis. It's freeing not to

have to rescue every waif that goes missing or kill every dragon that's harassing towns. Instead, you go talk to the dragon, be her eyes and ears, help her build her treasure hoard in exchange for a small cut. But even in evil campaigns, you want to maintain a sense of realism. Choices need consequences. But in an evil campaign, even more so than a good campaign, it's a balancing act. If you ever played the old Grand Theft Auto, the second you committed a crime, you were wanted throughout the city. Same thing was true with some of the older Elder Scrolls games. I could commit a crime in one town, and across the entire world, the local town guard already know to hunt me if I get within range.

Near instant communication. It's amazing. I'm pretty sure we could use that for some sort of telephone system. So if you treat your world that way, where the players become wanted instantly, it can quash the fun. But by the same token, if their actions have no effect on the game world and no consequences, why wouldn't they murder entire towns because they didn't like the color of their shirts? Or because members of the town think that the DC Universe movies are better than the Marvel ones? Monsters.

I mean, only psychopaths would wear blue shirts and think Batman vs. Superman is Oscar-worthy writing, so yeah, okay, the whole town's gotta go. So my advice is let player choices have realistic consequences, but keep an eye on your players because you don't want to be over-aconian or overly permissive. You're trying to find the fun. Occasionally evil choices can have consequences if you want to mix it up a little bit. Someone witnesses the PCs doing horrible things and runs. The local constabulary gets wind of a new space meth distribution center that the PCs have set up in the lower part of the station and come to investigate. In retrospect though an advertisement on the local internet network to come by and buy some space meth may

have been ill-advised by the players. At the very beginning of the evil campaign, ask the players to buy into the evil. It's just like a regular campaign. Encourage the players to embrace the dark side, even if they're, still one of my favorite phrases, you're the diet coke of evil. Just one calorie, not evil enough. The diet coke of evil. So what are some examples of evil campaigns? The players may have to work to advance the agenda of a larger evil entity, like a dragon, a devil, a demon, or a god. The criminal campaign, where the players are rising up within the ranks of the criminal organization or setting up a new criminal organization, making their organization the dominant one in a city or nation or whole continent. The murder hobo campaign,

where everything must die and the players are just the tools for the job. Or something I think that would be interesting would be a high society evil, a variant on a criminal campaign. PCs have to use social skills and well-timed combat and assassination attempts to climb the ranks of society. They have to maintain a genteel veneer while secretly plotting to poison Lord Dingleplop's food. If all else fails, you can run an evil campaign based on any of the seven deadly sins. Pride, greed, wrath, envy, lust, gluttony, and sloth. A fun evil campaign can be designed around any and all of them. If you're hunting for some sort of adventure ideas for an evil campaign, make them the big bad evil guy for some grand sweeping plot and have

adventurers come try to kill them as they rise to power. Some adventurers try to be the white knights and charge at them over the hill. Some of the adventurers coming to kill the PCs try to stealthily assassinate them. Some try to disrupt the PCs plans. Some may even try to take their place. them. Some try to disrupt the PC's plans. Some may even try to take their place. And for bonus points, make one of the good guy antagonists for the evil PC someone from his or her backstory. Someone they loved, respected. Someone who looked up to them. Maybe even the person who's the reason that they're doing all of this. Watch their reaction when it's the character's husband who's repulsed by her actions and feels the need to come face her himself. In a roleplay-heavy campaign, I'd love to see that play out.

Alright, enough about DMs. Let's talk about players. Players, if you want to be in an evil campaign, work together with the other players the vast majority of the time. Evil does not guarantee that you are a loner. Not everyone who is evil is the Joker willing to kill anyone and everyone just because. Remember, you're there to have a good time with the other players, so have fun in a cooperative manner. Until backstabbing can start and you've all agreed to it. Listen to your DM and contribute to the conversation about what evil means to you and your character.

Now is not the time to go all Cartman, Screw you guys, I do what I want! Karma's a bitch, and the DM will likely see it visited upon you. The best villains, by the way, think they are the hero of the story. They can justify why they're taking these actions that others view as evil. Tywin Lannister in Game of Thrones wanted to preserve his family's legacy because he watched his father almost squander it all away. Vicky in I, Robot wanted to rule over humanity because it saw that if people were left in charge, they would eventually destroy each other. Another piece of advice would be to use

your character's backstory to show motivation. The tragic circumstances of their early life, the evil influences that they've had. Have believable reasons for why your character is committing these dastardly acts. Power? Money? Fame? If the reasons are believable, you've got a great villain on your hands. I do need to expand this topic in a future episode. Good bad guys can make a story or campaign, so be on the lookout for that. So one of the things you need to decide, why is your PC evil? An interesting tenet I've always embraced is that evil can be rooted in fear. The evil actions are just a way to protect themselves. You fear being poor, so you do whatever it takes to acquire more money and more possessions.

You're scared that you'll fail at school or your job, disappointing your family, so you lie, cheat, and take credit for someone else's work to get ahead. You don't feel loved or desired, so you try to take that feeling from others or force those feelings onto others. The character has been wounded physically or emotionally and fears experiencing that again, so he responds to slight inconveniences in an escalated manner with violence, harsh words, and lashing out. Golly, I'm rapidly turning this into an episode of Nature of What Evil Is. Just have a believable reason for why your characters embrace the dark side.

Skynet, by the way. Skynet's plan makes no sense. You have a time machine and you want to go back in time to kill the leader of the resistance when he was a kid, but we've got modern weaponry there. Instead of the 1980s, send him back in time to the, fuck, 1800s, where his great-grandfather was from and burn the whole town, kill everyone in it. Take out John Connor's great-grandparents and voila. Think they're going to have technology in 1800s that's going to kill a Terminator? Of course not. It's not even going to come close. Terminator would just basically ruffle stomp its way through the town, burning everything and killing everything and everyone. Sure, it's more killing, but Skynet really bothered by that considering it nuked humanity almost into extinction? Sorry, bad villain writing pisses me off, and I may need to talk to someone about that.

In summary, DMs, have a plan for the campaign. Talk about what evil is as a group. Give the players some challenges. Get ready to cringe at the horrific actions being taken by your friends when you had no idea they were capable of... that. Players, work together. Talk about what type of evil you'd like the campaign to be. Define your hard limits of things that you don't want to see as part of the campaign. Come up with a believable reason for your character's worldview,

and then have your character go set fire to the diner's kitchen because there's a hair in his soup. Evil campaigns can be so freeing. Ditching the Goody Two-Shoes Act, whatever the hell that phrase means, and freeing your id to go all Tyler Durden on the world can be a nice break from the usual RPG fare. and freeing your id to go all Tyler Durden on the world can be a nice break from the usual RPG fare. But don't be surprised when the nicest player at your gaming table can amazingly roleplay the most conniving bastard in the galaxy. What do you think?

Do evil campaigns sound good? Do you have any other advice for evil campaigns and players? Do you want to see my head explode by pointing out another villain's plan that made no sense? Leave me some feedback at feedback at taking20podcast.com or leave a comment on the episode below. Thank you all for listening so much. I greatly appreciate it. Before I go, I wanted to thank our sponsor, Diet Soft Drinks. Sure, they may cause cancer, but your corpse will be hella thin. This has been episode 58, all about the evil campaign.

My name is Jeremy Shelley, and I hope that your next game is your best game.