THE ADAM BUXTON PODCAST - EP.215 - DAUDI MATSIKO

Episode Date: November 27, 2023

Adam enjoys a short ramble and some beautiful music with British Ugandan singer-songwriter and guitarist Daudi Matsiko.Please be aware this episode contains a reference to suicidal thoughts. This conversation was recorded face-to-face in London on November 3rd, 2023Thanks to Séamus Murphy-Mitchell for production support and conversation editing.Podcast artwork by Helen GreenADAM BUXTON PODCAST LIVE @ LONDON PALLADIUM, Tuesday 19th March, 2024RELATED LINKSDONATE TO MUSIC FOR ALLPRE-ORDER DAUDI'S ALBUM - THE KING OF MISERY (BANDCAMP)DAUDI MATSIKO LIVE AT A L P H A B E T, BRIGHTON December 14th, 2023 (BANDSINTOWN)DAUDI MATSIKO - FOOL ME AS MANY TIMES AS YOU LIKE - 2023 (YOUTUBE)DAUDI MATSIKO - INSTAGRAMFRED ARMISEN UK SHOWS 2023SNL WEEKEND UPDATE - GARTH AND KAT SING HALLOWEEN SONGS - 2010 (YOUTUBE)SNL WEEKEND UPDATE - GARTH AND KAT SING MOTHER'S DAY SONGS - 2013 (YOUTUBE) Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Audio snapshot. The kitchen. Castle Buckles. Towards the end of November 2023. Even though it's not yet 4pm, the sky outside is dark. And within the hour, all the light will have gone. The clouds, which have been angry and grey and chucking down rain all day, are beginning to clear a little bit over there on the horizon towards Norwich Airport.

But it's not raining right now. Rosie is curled up on a special dog bed that my mum bought for her a few years back and which she never really used. And my mum always said, oh, she doesn't like it, does she? But she's got into it recently and she's looking very comfy on it today and I think the idea of going outside is not high on the agenda. Is it dog legs? Come on sweetie, we should go out, get some fresh air. It's good for the old mental health, you know. What do you think? My mental health is extremely nice just at the moment, so why don't you piss off outside into the cold and leave me here on my dog bed, folks? Now, come on, Rose, you've got to get out of the compound.

Rosie, walk. Good times. Crunchy gravel. Lovely grass. Chasing deer. Party time. Tell you what, listeners, I'll stick on the intro theme and hopefully on the other side of it, me and Rosie will be in nature. See you in a bit. I added one more podcast to the giant podcast bin. Now you have plucked that podcast out and started listening. I took my microphone and found some human folk. Then I recorded all the noises while we spoke.

My name is Adam Buxton. I'm a man. I want you to enjoy this, that's the plan. Hey, how you doing, podcats? It's Adam Buxton here. Oh yeah. Reporting to you from a muddy farm track in the east of England, Norfolk County to be precise. And I'm happy to say that my dog friend Rosie is here. She's on the lead. She's got the orange padded harness on,

which enables me to encourage her forward when she is particularly reluctant. But I think she's enjoying being out in the fresh air aren't you rosie are we going back now no we've only just left it's nice out here look it's not raining come on rosie it'll be fine you can't just lie in the dog bed all day almost positive i can actually yeah well it's not good for you. Come on. We both need a bit more exercise. Look, I think it might be a lovely sunset.

Oh, dear, she's very grumpy. How are you doing, podcats? Not too bad, I hope. Thanks for joining me for another podcast. This is a slightly shorter episode for you today with a bit of music in it from my guest for podcast number 215, Daudi Matsiko. Here's a few very brief Daudi facts for you. Daudi is a British-Ugandan singer-songwriter.

How old is he? I don't know, actually. I think he's in his 30s. I'm not sure exactly when he was born, but he's around there. He's younger than I am, I'll tell you that much. He is currently based in Nottingham, out there in the English Midlands, and that's where Dowdy teaches music when he's not playing his shows. I think I met him around about 2016, and I listened to some of his music and liked it, and we've been in sporadic contact ever since. Dowdy's first EP, titled A Brief Introduction to Failure,

was released in 2014, and he followed it up with another EP, The Lingering Effects of Disconnection, in 2015. That was the year that Dowdy was diagnosed with bipolar affective disorder, having lived with depression for several years before that. Various aspects of these mental health challenges sometimes feed into the lyrics for Dowdy's songs, which are delicate, intimate and deeply vulnerable, bringing to mind one of Dowdy's musical influences, Nick Drake, especially on Pink Moon, Rosie. That's getting out of this thing.

There you go, you are free, Rosie. Now, Gamble. There you go. You are free, Rosie. Now gamble. Over the last few years, Dowdy has toured with British artists like Go-Go Penguin, Keaton Henson and Portico Quartet. And he also played songs as part of a couple of my Ramble Book tour shows in 2021. This year, 2023, has seen the release of new singles, 2021. This year, 2023, has seen the release of new singles, Omo, I Am Grateful For My Friends, and Fool Me As Many Times As You Like, which have received support from DJs Giles Peterson and Lauren Laverne, and have been featured in several Spotify editorial playlists,

including the most beautiful songs in the world. that's good that he got in there this year because next year that playlist is going to be clogged up with all my songs wow look at the moon dog legs speaking of pink moon over there behind the clouds is full? It's hard to tell. It's a spectral presence. Oh, it's cold. The conversation with Dowdy that you're about to hear was recorded in London at the beginning of this month, November 2023, and we talked about how he started playing music, what it takes to maintain a musical career in the social media age and how his depression and bipolar disorder have affected him over the years, a subject that Dowdy is able to talk about

with characteristic directness and good humour. His songs are serious, but when he speaks, Dowdy is always smiling. If you want to see Dowdy play live after you listen to this, on the 14th of December, he's playing a headline show at the Alphabet venue in Brighton. He played an ecstatically received set at the Great Escape Festival in Brighton earlier this year.

So let's get into it. I'll be back at the end with a bit more waffle, but right now with Dowdy Matsiko. Here we go. Ramble chat, that's now with Dowdy Matsiko. Here we go. and find your talking hat. Yes! La, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, Doughty.

Yes. Good to see you. How did you get into music in the first place? Like, what's your deal? So my parents are Ugandan and... But you grew up in the UK, did you? I was born in Ilford and most of my childhood was spent in Cambridgeshire. We moved around a lot, but the kind of Cambridgeshire was where most of my growing up happened.

I think my dad had read something in the times something along the lines of like if you want to have well-rounded children they need to play piano it sounds like something the times would yeah it feels like you know my dad was trying to give us the best future possible and he was like all right i'm gonna get you piano lessons and so me and my brother and my sister uh big brother little sister we all had piano lessons and we went to this one teacher called rich Richard Batty who phenomenal teacher and my brother was doing jazz piano and he was really good and my little sister was doing classical and she was really great and I was trying to learn like I did my grade one and it was fine well I struggled but like I got to grade two and I decided I wanted to learn

that Brian Adams tune from Robinin hood prince of thieves of course everything i do i do it for you so i'm trying to learn that song why the hell did you want to learn i just loved it as a kid i absolutely was my prince of thieves despite it like when i was like 11 i didn't care about the inconsistencies of the film and like like that film was just um it's just fun it's just a fun movie i haven't seen that in a while that's one of my wife's favorites but that song was at number one for that entire summer i remember wow look into my eyes it's a great opening line you will see is that what the line is don't tell me that like the pre-chorus yeah i wasn't a fan of the middle eight, actually. I'm not really a middle eight fan in general.

I'm sorry. No, no, no. So you're sitting there in Cambridgeshire. I'm sucking at this song. You are channeling Bryan Adams. And I'm failing. And every lesson, when I went to Richard's house, he had a Les Paul on his wall.

It might have been a 60s or a 50s Les Paul, like a dead expensive guitar when I think about it. And I would ask him every lesson, oh, can I have a go on your guitar? Can I have a go on your guitar? Can I have a go on your guitar? And every lesson he'd be like, no, no, no. And he was like, fine, have a go.

And he was like, this is a D, this is a C. And I've picked these chords up really quickly. And then before we knew it, we were having guitar guitar lessons in secret and he came over to my house for dinner and he kind of told my parents i've been having guitar lessons in secret and their response was kind of a bit perplexed and they were like okay but they were quite keen on me um playing piano so they were like half and half the guitar yeah boy is a piano boy he's a decent piano boy not a dirty guitar boy and what was funny is that my dad actually had a guitar as well like he had a nice little tanglewood it was incredibly difficult to play like the action

so the distance between the strings and the fretboard was really high yeah um but i wasn't too bothered by the discomfort of it um like i used to but my first job when i was 16 no 14 like work experience was in a skate park and me and my mates would fling ourselves off the high things work experience in a skate park yeah man i knew what i wanted like i was what were you doing just like sweeping ramps basically like it was an indoor skate park it was called y2 skateate in Peterborough. Yeah, me and my friends were dead into skating, and that's all we wanted to do.

And, you know, I didn't want to go work at an accountant's thing or just file into the square. Exactly. When is this then? Early 2000s? That would have been like, maybe 2000, yeah, 2003 perhaps. Yeah. That would have been like 14, 15.

But yeah, that was cracking. That was good luck. But that was just to give an example of like just the recklessness of which my uh youth was filled with just yeah i've got a memory of jumping out my buddy mark's window and just for fun why really you're a danger freak not anymore i'm so i'm so risk averse these days i just could never imagine do i never had it in me to do that. Really? Oh, fair. Did you spend a lot of time in the countryside as a kid? Yeah. Okay. Well, I was going to make a mad claim then.

I was going to say maybe the boredom of like stuff we did out of boredom was just like ludicrous. Because you were out in the country? Yeah, we were just out in the spends, just messing around. And it was fun. A lot of good summers. Wow. Luckily, you have redirected your efforts to something productive, respectable. Respectable, yeah. Music.

Good for you. I mean, music doesn't mean... I feel like music in 2023 does not mean the same thing culturally that it did just 20 years ago, even. Do you feel like that? I think it's got to be genre specific, though. I think, yeah, it looks totally different now, like in terms of how to be successful. Like I've started my own little label and I have a lot of conversations with people I work with just like in terms of how do we like break through and what's being asked of artists well it's probably quite similar to what it's always been like but it just feels

like i so i'm running a campaign for this album release and there's a to-do list i can never get on top of like the ideal of what it is is like um no middlemen direct connection to your audience you've got full creative control yeah the reality is a bit more like a treadmill or like a is like no middlemen, direct connection to your audience. You've got full creative control. Yeah. The reality is a bit more like a treadmill or like a hamster wheel. Like you've got a carrot in front of your head and you're always chasing it.

That's how it feels emotionally. I would know if that's true. Absolutely. I mean, I crap on about this all the time. I mean, I'm aware, I'm lucky in that I've been around for a few years. I've got certain bedrock of audience members who will come with me and do stuff i don't have to constantly be reminding them that i exist i have

the podcast but i just think if things are good people will hear about them somehow yeah do you think that's totally naive no i think you have to be a little bit wise like if you're starting in music now like say i'd never had like because i've my first ep came out in like 2014 and and i've had loads of support like giles peterson on bbc6 music has been such a like positive force in my music career and the algorithm gods smile upon me and i get tracks playlisted and stuff and and that stuff's so fickle you know you can't like you can't really take it for granted but you also can't hold on too tight to it either but um i mean i i just feel really bad for people who feel that they have to do social media as part of i've met connecting with an audience i just think it's a it's a whole

other job i've met people who are absolutely like the numbers on social media are amazing like hundreds and thousands of followers and that kind of thing yeah and um they have like a look in their eye of sort of mild despair because it takes so much energy from a practical point of view it's not totally easy just no it's real and you kind of like i have to think about like the quality level as well quality level there's technical things that go wrong you have to figure out all sorts of fiddly bits and pieces so listen before we um talk a little bit more how about you play us a song is that all right yeah i'll get my guitar out okay and then um it might be a whiplash of mood we'll see how goes. It's musical performance time of the podcast. Go studio.

I've got to resist the temptation to do my Jools Holland impression now. Oh, please just do it. Over in the corner, the marvellous Daudy Matsiko. His superb, beautiful guitar. Sitting there in his black boiler suit with his footstand for his right foot. Why do you like the footstand, Dowdy? It elevates the guitar slightly, so picking is easier. Beautiful.

And what are you going to play for us today? This is not a guy. I apologise. Don't apologise. I think that's, it might be the closest time we get to Jules Holland. So I really, yeah, thank you. What are you going to play?

Fool me as many times as you like. And this is from the new record. The new record, yeah, it's called The King of Misery.

Nice. Yes. That's what the world needs. Exactly. Just more. And that. But I'll just clarify, I'm not the king of misery and i explicitly say that on the record it's an ironical title and that comes out in january of 2024 we hope right yes yeah it's on um my my own little label

called really good uh with help from another label called albert's favorites chow to adam Scrimshire. Yeah, it's going to come out 19th of January, 2024. Hold my breath till I forget time Stop using sight Give up on trying Cause my chest's been tied For the longest time

Fool me as many times as he'd like As you like Hide behind doors In extinguished light Pick the right time To give me a fright Cause I've said I won't too many times Fool me as many times As you like

Fool me as many times As you like I have always hidden parts of myself out of view I chose not to see it And in the pit of my stomach I think I always knew The dark was always waiting My feet want to move forward but my eyes don't tell the truth And I'm too scared to move on

So just make me a part of you Bring me something new I don't do much changing I never did much changing I'll keep falling into fire Call me a fool If I am a fool I just want to feel less tired I don't want to

Keep breaking in two too Inside I can see who I am Every mirror I choose Whispers shame upon you Scared to admit

my heart's expired if I say that I do will it mean that I lose I lose Did you catch the tummy rumble at the end there? Possibly. I think you would have done. Nice.

That's not the kind of song that I would expect from the Brian Adams- Adams loving young dowdy. At some point I got incredibly depressed. When did that chapter of your life begin? So that was kind of around 2009. I was in Brighton and I didn't know anything about depression and I didn't really know how to handle what I was experiencing. And you'd never felt anything like that before?

No, not at all. And then that, you know, that journey, like, so I struggled with depression for the next, like, the next three years were pretty, pretty hard. But I think as well, I felt a bit displaced. I think I didn't really, I was struggling with my identity and I didn't know where I fit, I think, as well. That was one of the big issues but the depression I experienced far exceeded like the catalysts that the catalyst that sparked it I think when you say you didn't know where you fit like describe the kind of things you were thinking about that were preoccupying you that used to get you down so I think when I was

occupying you that used to get you down so i think when i was definitely from when i went to university there was this idea i think i had a lot of like everyone has a lot of potential when they're a young person and like i was gigging a lot and i was playing a lot of i was from all my a-levels i kind of played shows and didn't study very much but but i kind of had it in my mind that i was going to be a songwriter and then when I went to uni I kind of got a bit distracted from that initial goal and I just didn't know what to do like I essentially I was putting myself in multiple directions and I had lost confidence in myself as well like for some reason I remember at 21 years old I remember thinking about like having a life in music and thinking I was past it like

like I'd somehow missed the boat and I couldn't you know I'm too old to be playing music now I know madness right but that's why I think that was just the impression I got I think from working in the industry at the time and it was it was the wrong impression because it's not like that at all but for some reason in my, I convinced myself that I was too old. And also, I probably thought I wasn't good enough, I think, at the time as well. And that was difficult. And then also as well, there's family pressures to impress your parents. And you want to do right by them.

And then in the backdrop of all that as well, I had this religious upbringing that I'm grateful for. I don't resent it. upbringing that uh that wasn't great i'm grateful for like i don't resent it but i definitely had like those years i was plagued with like a sort of crisis of faith i guess that was difficult as well because i think it was quite foundational to me as a young person my like religious beliefs and i don't hold them now and i and i think i struggled because i think ultimately i didn't i didn't believe it i didn't know how to navigate that. And you felt sort of anxious and guilty about it. It felt like I'm just sort of imagining.

Yeah, yeah. I think I felt guilt, a lot of guilt, especially like when I went to uni, like I had a good time, shall we say. And you thought, now I'm going to have to go to hell. Yeah, exactly. I did like sign the papers let's get this done like and i and i struggled with that so i felt incredibly guilty about and um and then on top of that i was so depressed in the 2010s

well in 2010 particularly in 2009 that like i would uh like i was working in nightclubs and we were doing like coke and ketamine and that like um i spoke about this before recently like i was um i was probably like a bit suicidal like i i was i was so depressed like i um i was listening to your podcast um yeah that'll do it with uh with the gentleman who's doctors without borders javid abdelman yeah and he said that he saw that when he gets very depressed obviously to compare to make any kind of comparison to the life he's lived is it's not what i want to do but he did he describes a depression is sort of like a blackness like a silence uh like your internal voice kind of just like an absence of feeling almost yeah yeah and like for

me it was um it was more grief like i felt a lot of grief but then also i would think about the future and i would just see like nothing just blackness and i couldn't i just couldn't see myself existing and um i've got um bipolar affective disorder when were you diagnosed with that so 2015 i think okay and um i had my psychosis in 2012 what's the difference between those two so bipolar is like the condition of psychosis is like one of the one of the potential stages of the condition so you go through like quite long patches of being depressed and they might be followed by a period of like mania and mania like you kind of get pressure of speech so you talk really really fast and you're very excitable and you have you have loads of ideas and you've it's quite a

productive time you know if you're manic you can get loads of stuff done it's just that you will probably annoy your friends and like people be worried about you uh but then at the next stage from mania uh hypermania i think i'm getting that right is uh psychosis and that's when you completely leave the room like i saw things like i had hallucinations um i had to move back to my parents and like i thought they were like snipers on the roof gonna shoot me so i was crawling paranoia oh it's crazy it's really heavy and i would like crawl around like you, I wouldn't go walk past a window. I thought there was a lion outside my door.

And so I couldn't leave the room. And that was really bleak. How were your parents? Were they freaked out? They're amazing. In terms of like all children and parents have their ups and downs and stuff. But they are rocks yeah they uh they just kind of got to it and business only did it got me through it got me

back on my feet yeah and because for the first time it happened to me it was um 2012 and then i had like eight years of good times and then after making this album King of Misery I self-produced it and that was maybe a factor like an engineering and recording it was quite a high pressure experience um but also when the pandemic hit I again like I sort of I went into action mode right what are we gonna do with our money because I was a freelance musician and I had no like backup plan during the pandemic and stuff and so like I didn't have any income coming in and and yeah previously you've been making a living as uh doing gigs and playing shows yeah doing a bit of teaching here and there and suddenly that was gone yeah everything just

disappeared it was in one day as well it was like you know a lot of people experienced it but it was like shock and awe like everything just went in a moment. And it was like, I don't know how I'm going to pay rent. And I don't know how this is all going to... I don't know if my career is viable anymore. And I just got worse and worse. And my mental health dipped. And I think because when I was making the album,

I was also a bit depressed. Picking apart experiences and emotions that were like incredibly heavy that I struggled to talk about. I basically was just like, look, what am I afraid to talk about? What am I afraid to sing about? And do that. And naively, I thought it would be easy, and it wasn't. But I did my best.

I don't know. I hope when people listen to it they'll they'll connect with it but it was a really difficult thing to do and I didn't anticipate like I after even now I get a bit like kind of emotional I can feel my eyes getting weird but like but it's sort of like you yeah I wrote about having bipolar and and the existential crisis that it brought on. The record itself, I think it's quite life-affirming, what I made, ultimately. It takes you on a journey from a place of guilt to gratitude. They're two fairly distinct parts, endpoints to a beginning and an end of the record.

But yeah, it's a slight incline. And that's one thing I love about the record. I think it's quite truthful in its ambition of just progress. It's slow and small. I find kindness through introspection. Yeah. You know, if I'm mindful of my interactions and how I am in the world and its relationship to me and that kind of thing,

I find I'm more, i'm kind and i'm empathetic and uh and so with my record i wanted if there was going to be a heavy emotional aspect to it which there is it's an honest one it's not like um we've not reached the destination at the end of the record how do you feel about playing another song yeah so i'm gonna play you a tune called i'm grateful for my friends oh yeah great uh during 2021 i went and did some shows where i read from my book ramble book and uh you came out a couple of times and yeah played a few songs and this was one of the songs was it yeah it was yeah and i really liked hearing it oh nice one do you know you um there was a line because when i was writing it we were messed we were emailing

about something or other and i we leave long gaps between emails yeah and i would sort of write an email and i'd lose confidence in it i wouldn't send it and that line there's a line about emails which is which was sparked by that experience. Oh, okay. By my late replying. No, it was me. It wasn't you. Oh, okay, good. I'm glad.

I think you're right. I think it was me not being very good on emails. All right. Not much fun these days, I guess. Humour, well, I used to have it. I don't laugh so easily. I wish that I was less depressing. Terror lives inside my chest. And yes, I find it overwhelming.

Disappearing to thin air. Oh, my hope there's not much left underwater taking breaths my lungs they have much to desire i had swimming lessons as a child I hope I still remember Was feeling dark But now it's death Shadows they whisper Surrender Embarrassment up ahead But I am grateful

For my friends I am grateful for my friends I am grateful for my friends Oh I am grateful for my friends Oh I am grateful for my friends I am grateful for my friends Write an email, don't hit send I lied, I didn't even write it I just said it in my head

And let the words delete themselves When I speak I second guess As they leave my mouth My words they tumble And undo themselves While I'll just keep on rambling at you Was feeling dark But now it's death Shadows they whisper

Pretender My bones they are filled with dread but I am grateful for my friends Oh, I am grateful for my friends Oh, I am grateful for my friends I am grateful for my friends Thank you, Danny. That was wonderful. Oh, thank you. And that's on the new record? that's the uh that's the final track so i'm giving away the ending okay spoiler spoiler i think it's good

to know though to go and into it's not going to be like the roughest ride Wait, this is an advert for Squarespace. Every time I visit your website, I see success. Yes, success. The way that you look at the world makes the world want to say yes. It looks very professional. I love browsing your videos and pics, and I don't want to stop. And I'd like to access your members area and spend in your shop. These are the kinds of comments people will say about your website if you build it with

Squarespace. Just visit squarespace.com slash Buxton for a free trial. And when you're ready to launch, because you will want to launch, use the offer code Buxton to save 10% off your first purchase of a website or domain. So put the smile of success on your face with Squarespace. Yes. Continue. Hey, welcome back, podcats.

Still a little bit of light out here in the Norfolk fields as I record this. Big old moon on the horizon still coming up. Not pink exactly. It's more custard. Custard moon's going to be my depression album when that one comes out. That was Dowdy Matsiko there before. Very nice to see Dowdy. Don't forget his album, The King of Misery, is out on the 19th of January next year, 2024. And the songs are on the record, embellished beautifully with saxophone and harmonium, cello, pocket pianos, bass synthesizers. All sorts of nice little understated production tricks there to flesh the whole thing out and give it some scope.

I've heard the album myself. It's lovely. it some scope. I've heard the album myself. It's lovely. I've put links to a couple of the videos for Dowdy's tracks in the description of today's podcast. And there's also a link to that show he's playing in Brighton on the 14th of December at the Alphabet venue. Go along, support Dowdy, support live music, support Alphabet. Feel the healing power of music speaking of which this is a good segue because i wanted to give a shout out to a great uh charity that i hope you might be able to support this one is called music for all they're based in the uk and they help disadvantaged individuals and community groups access music-making opportunities through donations of cash grants and musical instruments.

I know that a few of you podcats are musicians. Maybe you have a few musical instruments lying around that you don't use anymore, in which case maybe Music For All can find them a new home. To find out more, you can visit their website. There's a link in the description. At the moment, they are running a Big Give Christmas Challenge. One donation, double the impact. If you're able to help out with that, by fundraising or donating,

that would be greatly appreciated. If there's one thing I am certain of, it is the incredible therapeutic value of music. I do think music has got magic powers. In fact, I went to see some live music. Well, it was live music slash comedy, courtesy of American comedy legend Fred Armisen, probably best known for his many years in Saturday Night Live and the hilarious Portlandia that he did with Carrie Brownstein.

A documentary now that he still does with Bill Hader and Seth Meyers. And he started out playing in bands, hardcore punk bands in America, before he got into comedy. And music is still a huge part of his life and his obsessions so he's doing this tour at the moment called comedy for musicians but everyone is welcome and the guy that is promoting my podcast shows next year my live podcast shows link in the description to the palladium show in march is also promoting fred armisen's shows so he was nice enough to get me a ticket to fred's show in hackney last week on friday at the earth venue he had had Martin Newell there from Cleaners from Venus playing support.

That was very good. And I don't know if Martin is doing more dates on the tour. But anyway, Fred comes on and does an hour plus of music jokes, basically, that involve him playing the guitar and playing the drums. He's a brilliant drummer, very good guitarist. So if you're into your comedy and your music, it's a strong recommend from Buckles. But if you need even more cheering up, I've put a link to a couple of the Garth and Cat sketches from SNL, which I wasn't familiar with before. I'm not like a deep level Saturday Night Live fanatic.

So I hadn't seen these before, but it's Fred Armisen and Kristen Wiig. And they do these characters who are kind of a cheesy sort of singer-songwriter duo. And they write songs for public holidays and special occasions for halloween and mother's day and christmas and anyway they turn up and it's part of the news update section so the ones that i watched are with seth myers and he says garth and cat so you've written a new song for mother's day or whatever it happens to be.

And you're going to perform it for us now. And you've been practicing really hard. And they go, yeah. And then the deal is that Fred Armisen improvises a song. And Kristen Wiig has to sing along with him and anticipate where he's going with each line as closely as possible perhaps it's the kind of thing that they do in improv classes i'm not sure as a sort of trust slash symbiosis exercise but it is apart from being very funny it's so amazing watching them do this thing and watching her anticipate what he's going to do and try and join in with each line sometimes amazingly accurately as if she knows what he's going to say even though she doesn't like he genuinely is making it up on the spot they haven't rehearsed

it they're extraordinary Kristen Wiig is supernaturally funny. Anyway, there's a couple of links in the description for you. See what you think. Don't worry if you don't agree. That's okay. We can still be friends. That's it for this week. Come on, Rosie.

Let's get back before it's totally dark. I didn't bring the head torch. What a jerk. Thank you very much to Seamus Murphy Mitchell for his production support and conversation editing. Much appreciated, Seamus. Thanks to Helen Green. She does the beautiful artwork.

Thank you to all at ACAST. Thanks most of all to you. I appreciate you coming back and listening right to the end. Wow. Come on, come here. Come here. end. Wow. Come on, come here. Come here. Hey. No, it's good to see you.

That's okay. We can't love all the same things. The main thing is that you're here. Till next time. Oh, you've got to tread carefully out there. But look, I love you. And that's something. Bye! Please like and subscribe. Give me like a smile and a thumbs up. Nice like a pat with me thumbs up.

Give me like a smile and a thumbs up. Nice like a pat with me thumbs up. Like and subscribe. Like and subscribe. Like and subscribe. Please like and subscribe. Give me like a smile and a thumbs up. Nice like a pat with me thumbs up.

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