The Chris Cuomo Project - How Kenny G’s Sound Stands the Test of Time

Episode Date: October 15, 2024

Kenny G (Grammy Award-winning saxophonist and author, "Life in the Key of G") joins Chris Cuomo to reflect on his remarkable career, sharing insights on how he maintains his signature sound and remains relevant across generations. From collaborating with icons like Barry White and Frank Sinatra to practicing three hours a day to perfect his craft, Kenny G opens up about the dedication behind his success. Follow and subscribe to The Chris Cuomo Project on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, and YouTube for new episodes every Tuesday and Thursday: https://linktr.ee/cuomoproject Join Chris Ad-Free On Substack: http://thechriscuomoproject.substack.com Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

I'm Dave, and saving with TD Insurance made me feel like I scored my own jingle. With over 30 ways to save, nobody seems like Dave. Save on home and auto like only you can at tdinurance.com slash ways to save. TD. Ready for you. Kenny G. Full stop. You know exactly who I'm talking about. You know the music. Na na na na na na na na na na na na na.

I'm Chris Cuomo. Welcome to the Chris Cuomo Project. How could I not want to talk to Kenny G? The man's a musical unicorn. Think about it. He's one of one. Nobody has ever sold the way he has sold since the 80s. He is still sought after.

He just did something with The Weeknd. Why? What motivates him? Who is he? How is he? Kenny G has a new book out called Life in the Key of G. You see the G stands for the G in Kenny G. See, I got that, I got that.

And I also got Kenny G to talk about how it is to be him and to do what he does. I wasn't joking when I said Kenny G is ageless, timeless, a true classic in our culture. But you say things have changed and that affect what you do, but also who we are. How so? Well, you were just saying, didn't you put out a record in 2021? I go, I've had a couple since then. And you went, hmm, hard to keep up with you.

But it is hard because the public doesn't know these things unless you wake up thinking about me and Googling me and looking me up on Instagram, you're not really gonna know what I'm doing. In the old days, there were a few radio stations that we all listened to. So if there was a new record, you would hear it and you would go, oh, I'm gonna go down to the record store.

And then they would know that the record was there and they would say, oh yeah, you mean his new record? Come right this way. And then on the way, you might pick up a few records you didn didn't even know you wanted and you'd learn it was an experience. We don't have that now So for me to reach people that I would I'm we're we're about the same age. I'm thinking so I'm thinking you're my audience. So how do I reach you not easy? It's not easy to reach you but it can't be that difficult for you because you have never stopped. Yes, I'm behind the nature of how prolific you are. Fine.

But that's a good problem to have though. Yeah, yeah. Because it means that you are prolific. And it's like never slowed down. No. How do you explain it? I'm motivated. That's how I explain it. I'm motivated. Like I practice this thing every day for three hours every day so I can get better.

So I'm motivated when I wake up, first thing in the morning, I grab the, I can't even wait to wake up. I'm excited about my practice session. What am I going to learn today? Am I going to be able to play the thing I was working on yesterday better, hopefully? And how long will it take until it's perfect? I don't know. I'm going to keep working on it over and over.

And that's fun to me. And moving forward and playing more gigs and getting different gigs and doing things like your show. I've never met you before. This is exciting to me. But I feel like I know you, which is so bizarre. Same here, same here, cause I see you on TV of course. That's all negative impressions.

Mine have been all positive, but I find that in like getting ready for this, it was a no brainer. I was messing with Greg, because everyone we talked to is, you know, there's always like some kind of political controversy, whatever we're doing. He was like, Kenny G has a book coming out.

Yeah, not political. And he was like, we gotta have Kenny G. I was like, Kenny, well, why? Is he taking a position in the Middle East? And he's like, no, no, you gotta have Kenny G. You cannot have Kenny G. And everyone you say your name to, one, it is, how many people have 100% name recognition? Think about it. Kenny G, nobody's going to ask me like, oh, you mean the guy, Kenny G,

the guy we play ball with? It's like everybody knows who you are forever. And when it first became, And when it first became, when you first became a thing, how surprised were you that you had busted through genre? Because no lyric, smooth jazz is not supposed to be something that we all know by one name. Yeah. How do you explain it? It's hard to explain. I'm going gonna say that the music has to have something to do with it. It's got to be something in the

melody that touches people. The fact that I had Clive Davis and his record company, Arista Records, behind me got it out there, but that still doesn't mean there are people are gonna like it. You know, you can lead a horse to water, but you can't make the horse drink it. Yeah, I got exposure. But the thing is, Chris, I have been playing my saxophone in clubs since I was 17, 18. I've watched people react to the way that I play. I wasn't surprised that when they

heard my songs that they were going to like it. I wasn't surprised because I've seen it that happened that way my whole life. Was I surprised to see my billboard up on Sunset Boulevard? When my first record got really famous? Yeah, that was like, whoa, that's pretty unbelievable right there. That was cool. Did you know, when did you know you were talented?

I think when I was 17, I didn't make the high school band. I didn't make it from- You got cut from your high school. It's like a Michael Jordan story. It's the same thing, yeah. From junior high, I thought I was good. I got to high school, I wasn't good compared to everybody else. I went, what the heck do I need to do?

I know, practice. So I practiced for a year, went back. And then I was way better than everybody. And I didn't realize I was getting better than everybody else. And that's when I realized, okay, maybe I can keep getting better. And then I got a gig with Barry White when I was in high school and then I knew if I could hold my own with those professional musicians, then I can do this.

How did you explain it to yourself? Sometimes when people are good at something, you have to come up with an interior story. Like how does Kenny from the Pacific Northwest wind up as a teenager being with Barry White's crew and he sticks? Like what did you have to believe about yourself to succeed? Well, okay.

I was young and I didn't, I don't, I wasn't, I wasn't experienced enough to get nervous. So I was 17, a high school band director says, hey, I was talking to a friend of mine, he's putting together the Love Unlimited Orchestra, which is Barry White's band, but if they put it together for the regions that he plays, and they're looking for a sax player that can solo soulfully but has to read music. You're the only guy in Seattle that can do that. The black guys in Seattle had

the soul but they couldn't read music. The white guys in Seattle could read music, had no soul. But the kid in Franklin High School could do both. Why did you have soul? Well, I grew up in the inner city of Seattle. Uh, the schools I went to were very, very racially mixed. I grew up listening to R and B music. I was part of that community and it just seeped into my heart.

Biggest gift that you've ever had in your life, you think for those years? Yeah. Because the way I play my saxophone is, I'm not thinking about the soulfulness. It's just there. I mean, I've heard, I mean, from all the, I would play in black clubs with black bands in Seattle, and they all said the same thing.

Man, that boy's got blue-eyed soul. You know, that was their way of saying, a white guy that's got soul. And I never tried to do anything except play. I wasn't trying to play with soul I just played the way it came out and it was just there so I had that and then I and anybody can learn to read music so I did that and then I was the guy and I got the gig with Barry White and which turned out great I was reading

all the charts and then at some point during the show for whatever reason I found myself soloing with the rhythm section and they're all these really old 30 year old black guys. To me they're old because I'm 17. All these guys are old. I'm playing with these old musicians and then all of a sudden they stop playing and it's just like a solo sax. I don't know why. They never told me this. So I just start doing all these licks I'd been practicing. And I look up and the audience gave me standing ovation. What did Barry White say to you?

Nothing. He was just doing his thing. Okay. The only time I ever talked to Barry White was at the Soul Train Music Awards. Years later, where I was one of the few white guys to ever get one, by the way, I have two. And I'm in the bathroom during the event, during the, whatever it was, it was a televised event. I'm in the bathroom for whatever reason. And in walks Barry White.

And it's just the two of us. And he walks in, as soon as he walks in, I go, Barry, I mean, you're not gonna believe it. I'm here tonight, I'm getting an award. And it's, my first gig was with you. If I didn't play with you, I wouldn't know I had blah, blah, blah. I go on to and he goes, hey baby, hand me a paper towel. That was it?

That was it. That's the only thing he's ever said to me. Hey baby, hand me a paper towel. And I said with pleasure. With pleasure. And I just was happy as could be. What part of the magic is the hair? What do you mean?

The hair. The hair has to be. Oh, the hair? What do you mean? The hair. The hair has to be. Oh, the hair. Yeah. It's like a trade. You have a trademark? Yeah, that is.

It's my, my grandmother gave it to me. Yeah, I mean, but it's like the thing. Yeah. I don't know that you're the same guy without it. I don't either. Not like Samson, but I mean like. I think it's like that. Yeah.

Yeah. I'm not, I'm not touching it. If it ain't broke. I've never seen anybody. Now I grew up all Italians, Jews and Queens. Right. Yeah. So I am familiar with the Italo fro or the Jew fro.

That's right. Yeah. I don't think I've ever seen it since I've heard of you where it's not called. Oh, you got hair like Kenny Jesus. I know right. For forever. Well, look, it took a long time. Have you ever thought about changing it?

No. Because? I'm not, I'm not going to, why? I, it's, I think it's, I think it took a long time. Have you ever thought about changing? No. Because? I'm not going to, why? I think it would ruin my career. Although, I will tell you, I played this one party at this guy in LA named Marvin Davis, Marvin and Barbara Davis, big shots. An oil guy from Colorado moves in and buys like 20th Century Fox, whatever, he has these parties. Dustin Hoffman's there, Sean Connery's there, Barbara Streisand, and I, for some reason, I'm in the mix. So, and of course, Kenny, if you're coming, will you bring your horn?

Of course I'll bring my horn. I got to play. So I play and as I'm walking, Don Rickles says, hey, Kenny, get a haircut. You're making a fool out of yourself. That's how you knew that you were doing the right thing. That's right. That was Don Rickles. I said, great, man. I'm on his radar. We were, again, in getting ready for this, even when people, because you became such a big deal in the culture,

that comedians had to look at it as a phenomenon that they would then make fun of. Great. Even then, it is done with love. Yeah. I was trying to find like, oh, remember that time that this guy hated you or remember this time that he didn't like.

It doesn't exist now. How have you avoided the things that happen to everyone else in the business? You know, I think I'm just not that interesting. You know? It can't be, you're one of one. Well, but- There is no other guy.

Yeah. Except for you. But I don't, you know, here, here's what, here's the, this will tell you in a nutshell how it works. I'm on the red carpet at an event, let's just say, and, you know, Tom Cruise walks by. Click, click, Tom, Tom, Tom, over here, Tom, over here, Tom. Somebody else, I walk in, hey Kenny, click, quiet, nothing. And I just keep walking along.

Nobody cares. Great. No, it's not it. Great. You have it totally wrong. Kenny, you have it totally wrong. OK, And I just keep walking along. Nobody cares. Great. No, it's not it. You have it totally wrong. Okay, I got it wrong. Totally wrong. There's no one to compare you to. Well, thank you. You're the only one.

What about Weird Al? No, I remember that, by the way. You know, he didn't take enough advantage of that, by the way. No, he didn't. You know, yeah, okay. He had a nice head of hair on him. He did. I gotta give it to him.

But you own an entire space. I gotta give it to him. Yeah. But you own an entire space. I'm telling you, Howard Stern always says that he has the best hair, but he doesn't. And that's why he won't have me on his show, I'm sure. He has never had you on the show? Never had it. That's crazy.

We tried to get on the show and they said, no, no, not with that hair. No, that's not what they said. But I'm just making a joke. Another dumb decision in Howard Stern's life. I wanna be on Howard Stern's, I'm a huge fan of his, I'd love to be on his show. I'll tell you what, he has developed

into one of the best interviewers in business. He is. Especially in your genre. His understanding of knowing how to talk to creatives like you about your process, Howard is very good at that. I'd love to do an interview with him. And also talk about the hair. I'm surprised, I think we're exactly the same age, I think.

And we have this hair and we're doing this, we've never met. Never met him and I would always want to. So did you have to... I've always wanted to meet you by the way. Please. I know I'm just saying that. That's easy. Support for the Chris Cuomo project comes from Shopify. Shopify

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Use the code Chris and you'll get an exclusive discount of up to 40% off. 40%! CozyEarth.com slash Chris. Check it out and tell them you heard about him on the podcast. Hook a brother up. So during, I know this seems like it's not interesting, but it is interesting to me. Brand is very interesting to me.

And no one ever said to you in the 80s and to the 90s and since 2000s, hey, you know, we're gonna like, try and evolve. We wanna evolve the brand. You know, maybe like, cause like everybody who was big in the eighties all cut their hair all of a sudden. Remember like from the seventies into the eighties,

Bon Jovi, all these guys cut their hair all of a sudden. You didn't. No, no, I can't, I can't, I can't. Never have. No. Have never had a period of short hair since you've become Kenny G. No. And by the way, you've become Kenny G? No.

No. And by the way, who made it Kenny G? Who changed the name from Gorlick to say, we'll just go with Kenny G? Good idea. It was a good idea. It was a good idea. It was from my first manager named Jeffrey Ross, who was Jeff Lorber's manager. Jeff Lorber was the guy, I was the sax player in his band.

He had a record deal with Clive Davis. So I toured with him for five years. Then one night after seeing me play hundreds of times, be with Jeff, Clive would come to see his artist, Jeff, and he came, Kenny, I think there might be a market for your sound. What do you think of the solo record? I went, let's try that Clive, that's a good idea. Of course, I'm inside of going,

yes, but yes, yeah. And so at that point, the manager, Jeffrey Ross said, let's, we should just call the record, Kenny G and leave off the Orlik from the Gorlik, which I thought was a good idea. You thought it was a good idea right away. Great idea. Yeah.

So does anybody ever approach you early on or at any stage and say, time to add words? Yeah. Clive told me that a bunch of times. And you said? Clive, no. And he goes, you're making career mistakes. I said, okay, I'll make them. But how did you rationalize it to yourself? Because I mean, look, you've played with a lot of artists, obviously, who are going to sing their own songs. Yeah. Obviously, there were lyrics and almost all of them,

even with the weekend, what you do. Yeah. So what did you believe that kept you from wanting to do what everyone does? It was just those gigs that I played early on where I'm just playing my sax, seeing the reaction of people. I didn't need the words. I already knew that it would connect for whatever reason. When I would hear,

oh, we've got to add lyrics, it's not going to work, instrumental music. Even when I played on Johnny Carson for the first time, they wanted me to do a vocal song, which I had agreed to do. When the curtain went up, I played an instrumental instead because on the live show, make or break your career curtain went up, I played an instrumental instead, because on the live show, make or break your career was that moment.

I played by instrumental. They were so mad on the show. Same people, you can't play the instrumental music on show. Nobody, you're never going to be on the show again. F you. We gave you this big shot and you took advantage of us. But what they didn't remember was that the world had seen what they hated and loved it. I knew that everybody watching was going to love what I did, and it became a big hit because I did that.

Then six months later, they call me back, hey, can you come back on and play that instrumental? Johnny wants you to sit on the couch. I said, yes, I will do that. Thank you. Nice invitation. How did you know that something that isn't Sepulchre, we've been listening to music without lyrics longer than we've been listening to music with lyrics.

But you weren't supposed to do it this way. No. And you knew that, and the people that you admired while you had your whole jazz set, if you were looking at popular music, there was no one for you to look at and say, I want to be that guy, because there was no one doing it. No. So how did you know?

Well, George Benson had some success. He had sort of about three million records. This was in like 85 or 86. His record, Breezin. So this was the guy. I said, OK, he sold three million records. That's three million records more than I'm doing. He started singing.

Yeah, and he had vocal songs on. But his song Breezin was an instrumental and that was such a great hit. Well, Chuck Mangione had a hit and who else had a hit? Herb Albert had a hit. But usually it's just one instrumental and then they are forgotten. So first of all, I went and drove from Seattle down to LA. So how did I find out who his manager was? I had to buy an album, looked down and goes,

he's managed by Fritz Turner management on Robertson Street in LA. Got in my car from Seattle, drove down to LA, knocked on the door and said, I'm here to see Dennis Turner, George Benson's manager. And they go, and who are you? I said, I'm a sax player. I have a record deal with Clive Davis.

They go, we'd never heard of you. I said, okay, but sax player. I have a record deal with Clive Davis. They go, we've never heard of you. I said, OK. But I want to meet Dennis, so I meet him. I said, Dennis, come watch me play. I want you to manage me. He goes, all right, I'll come check you out. So he checks me out and he goes, you got yourself a manager. And now he goes, by the way, you're

going to open up for George Benson at the Universal Amphitheater two weeks from now. And I'm going to give you $5,000 for the gig. So $5,000 for a gig, and I'm going to play in front George Benson at the Universal Amphitheater two weeks from now and I'm going to give you five grand for the gig. So five grand for a gig and I'm going to play in front of 6,000 people. Never done that before and that's how it started. From that, people saw me playing, I got exposure and little by little, people just connected.

But I knew because George Benson had done it, even though he added the vocals, I still think it was his guitar playing that really started it off for him. So I thought that there was a career there. How many times did you have to tell people, that is not evolving for me is to start singing, and or to have someone with me who sings. Like I don't need to do that.

I'll collaborate from time to time because I like the artist, I like the opportunity. Right. But that's not me, I don't have to do it. I still have to do it. Can you sing? No, I'm no Michael Bolton. Do you? How often, when he was a big deal early on,

how often would you get confused with him? Oh, because we toured together. Oh, that's not fair. OK. Oh, yeah, actually, I remember that. Yeah, the 90s. My sisters went. We did the Golden State Art Okay. Oh yeah, actually I remember that. Yeah, the 90s. My sisters went. We did the Golden State Art Center.

We had a big argument that night. I remember that night. We did so many, we did Jones Beach. We would sell these places out. We did Radio City. We did all these things. Great. We were really, okay.

So how it happened, I'm in my hotel. I've already sold millions and I'm playing for like maybe five or 6,000 people a night. I'm having a great time. I'm watching TV midnight at the Apollo. I see this guy that looks like he's from Metallica singing. You know, what was it? Georgia.

And he's, I'm going, this guy's got soul. I said, this guy's got blue-eyed soul. That's what I said. And I said, so I said, guys, who's this Michael Bolton? See if he wants to come on the road with me and just be a singer in my band, because he didn't have a big career. So he came out and just started singing songs, and he was so stiff.

So stiff. I said, Michael, you've got to loosen up, bro. Come on. And not that I would take credit for him becoming a better performer, but that's how it started. So pretty soon Michael made a record and people started to love him. Then he became my opening act and then we became co-headliners. So we toured and played all the time together. So even today I'll be at the airport and somebody will go, Hey, Michael.

And I'll go, yeah, F you. And then the guy walks away, that Michael Boland is an asshole. I do the same thing with my brother. Right? People say I'm Andrew, I immediately say I'm going to raise their tax. And it still works even though he's not in office. Yeah. Do you think it's harder to compose, create instrumental music than to have lyrics? Or do you think the lyrics are an additional burden? What do you think's harder? I think for me, it's easier to write instrumental music

But if you ask Elton John that question, he's gonna say your lyrics easy. So yeah now I would understand that and Except for one dynamic you can come up with lyrics that are better than the music. Oh It happens in songs all the time. I know what you mean. And you can sing about things where the language, the words matter because of what they're about. Right. But you only get one shot with an instrumental.

True. Either they pick up on the melody and the rhythm and the groove or they don't. Whereas you get multiple, look, there are plenty of people who I listen to. I don't really love the music. But the words hit you, right? Especially when it comes to hip hop.

You talk about your upbringing, the signature blessing in my life, the gift that I am milking to this moment is going to school in Queens in a completely mixed community where there was so much, I mean, there was no diversity. There was no majority. Like it was such like a bunch of like poor Catholics. You know what I mean? It was just working class Catholic and wherever they were,

Philippines, Haiti, Puerto Rico, China, wherever it was. And to this day, I just have an ingrained, yeah, I don't care what you are, we'll find some way to connect. You know what I mean? Like, you know, it doesn't, there is no barrier to it. And you were able to borrow from a similar thing, but almost somewhat unconsciously, right?

Cause it wasn't like, I wanna be this. Yeah, it's funny. My schools didn't have a majority either. Asian, white, black. It was about even all the way around. So same thing, I never thought about it's funny, my schools didn't have a majority either. Asian, white, black. It was about even all the way around. So same thing, I never thought about it like that, but we all figured out how to do stuff together all the time.

I remember different waves of, again, you've been a great nostalgia vehicle for me also in terms of like going back all the different times you've been relevant in my life, which is like, you know, all these different things. I think Christina picked one of your songs for our wedding. It was one of those songs. It does not surprise me.

Um, I wonder which one it was. Oh, she'll know. And then I'll expose that I don't know. And then that's a problem. No, we don't. We'll wait till here. Yeah. Okay.

So I only have so much of my emotional capital account, but I remember one, at one point, I forget which album it was, but you had All White on. Oh yeah. Okay. That's a Christmas record. And I thought he was going through a messianic phase. I was like, I knew it. I knew success was going to go to this cat's head. Now he's like some kind of messianic. Yeah, I know.

But it was so interesting to me in going back and reviewing it, that I wonder if it's possible for you to have the appreciation of what you have meant now to generations of people and not just in the country. Greg says to me when I'm looking at the book jacket he says you know they play a Kenny G song in China when it's time to go home. In the whole country? A whole country. Do they pay you? No.

What? Well, why are you shocked? That would have been a one and done for your old career. Who's your lawyer? I have sold over 150 million records in China. That's right, I have. Have you ever played there? All the time.

And you ever at one point, you know, hire yourself a little trade. Well, they, it's not going to make any difference. I've looked into this for, it's been happening since 1985. So I've been like, almost 40 years. How did they pick your song? Okay.

It is called Going Home. Called Going Home. They took the title literally. Why did I call it Going Home? Was because when I played the melody, it reminded me of my mom who had passed away like right around that time. And I was thinking about Seattle, but I was in LA.

And it made me think of her. So I thought, oh, it reminds me of home. So they took the title literally, but my instrumental melodies really connect with the Chinese people. It really does, for whatever reason. I go over there and I play my shows and they're always sold out.

The problem is, the first time I played there, my song going home, I put in the middle of the set. You all left. They all left. No, is that true? Seriously. I went, I finished the last note, I look up, they're all on their walk and out, what happened? They're trained to go home and hear that song.

Now it's my encore, it's my encore there for sure. You talk about your mom, what role did family play early on in helping you believe that you could do something that wasn't exactly pro forma? Well, my mom was a stickler for things, so I was always trying to be meticulous in what I did. So it kind of trained me to dot my I's and cross my T's, because if I didn't, I'd hear

from it, you know, and I didn't want that. I didn't want her yelling at me. Did you if I didn't, I'd hear from it, and I didn't want that. I didn't want her yelling at me. Did you tell her early on I want to be a musician? No. No, I never did. I didn't know I wanted to be a musician, so I didn't know how to tell her that. I was just going to school, and I got straight A's in all my stuff.

I was playing in the school band, then I went to college. You studied accounting. I studied accounting. My mom wanted me to get a Phi Beta Kappa K. So I said, okay, so what do I need to do that? You have to have a 3.95 grade point average and take these classes. I said, I'll just do that. But at the same time, I'm playing gigs with the black band at nighttime and I'm in the jazz band at college, but I'm in the jazz band at college, but I get all these. So I did that for her, and it was,

and it meant a lot to her. I still, you know, I have the Phi Beta Kappa Key. It's cool. And when you told her, this is what I'm gonna do. Yeah. Was there reservation, or you'd had so much success already

without, you know, wanting to do it full-time? She didn't ever ask me that question. She didn't ever make an opinion about what I should do with my life. Never once told me, I'm worried about this. The only thing that was hard was me getting her permission to play in the black clubs when I was like 18 or 19.

Because I still lived at home. And so the leader of the band, this guy is Tony Gable. Tony Gable is 260 pounds, big black guy, 6'5". And he was my ally. The rest of the guys in the band didn't want me because I was white, but he was the leader and he goes, listen, good musicianship, good musicianship, he's in the band.

So I said, and I said, Tony, my mom's not gonna let me play in those clubs. And let me talk to her. So I invite him over to the house. Probably the first black guy that was ever at my house. So he comes over and my mom basically melted. She was so nice to him. I had never seen my mom so demure, so sweet,

because with me, she wasn't like that at all. I never saw her like that with my brother or my sister, and at the end of the thing, she didn't even say anything. I just knew that it was all cool, and that's how I got a chance to start to play like that. But she did see me play with Sammy Davis Jr. And I was in his thing, and it's all part of the show. So I was playing a flute solo or whatever,

and I do this solo, and then Sammy looks over. It's just part of his shtick and he goes, that kid's going to have his own band in a week, like something like that. And my mom was so proud. That's my son. He's going to have his own band in a week. I could. Great mom. I loved it. How talented was Sammy Davis? Unbelievable. So good. So good. By the way, Liberace, I play with Liberace. He was a virtuoso. I mean, I know we think of Liberace as just a flamboyant pianist, but man, that guy's chops were meticulous. He was unbelievably great. So perfect the way he played every note, every time. Never heard him make one slight mistake. And I've had, okay, I'm going to do that.

I'm going to play like that perfectly. Well, you never can, but I'm going to try. And I still try. You guys were watching. That is his original saxophone. Yeah. Like from high school. That's right.

And I get keeping the original, but shouldn't you have like a hundred from everybody who makes saxophones and over the years collected vintage saxophones and like, aren't you supposed to do that? Yeah, you're supposed to do that. Okay, I'll say. So you play every show. Every show with this one. And has it ever had to be repaired?

Oh yeah. Yeah, yeah, all the time. Little things change. Have you had it rebuilt? I'm a collector. No, no. No, you never put it in for like a renovation. Have you had it rebuilt? I'm a calligrapher. No, no, no. You never put it in for like a renovation.

No, it never rebuilt. It's just little tweaks. Like if this pad, like right now, this pad has a little tear in it, but it's still working. So I'm fine. But eventually this pad will have to be replaced. That means he has to take this little piece off,

put a new pad in and then that's it. Only one guy allowed to work on? Only one guy, one guy in LA. His name is Jay. He's great. Well, the other guy, he died. So he can't work on? Only one guy. One guy in LA. His name is Jay. He's great. Well, the other guy, he died, so he can't work on it anymore. How did you not lose it? How long have you had it?

Seriously. Like, why? I would have stolen it. No. Had I known that it was the only, I would have held that thing ransom. It's not even a close call. When I'm walking the streets with it, it is clutched very, very tightly in my hand. Especially now that we all know this is the one. Well, I don't live in New York,

so I don't walk streets a lot with my saxophone, but when I do, I have a different case that goes around my back. So that somebody can't- They'd have to steal the whole Kenny Jeep. They would have to, no, it's all over me. They'd have to take all of you. I'm saying, they don't just get the horn.

That's right, they'd pick me all, I only weigh 130 pounds. They'd go from Lawsony to kidnapping, but that's what they'd have to do if they could get it. Yeah. And this is the mouthpiece is so old that I had to put a bicycle patch on it to keep my teeth from biting through the metal. Because if they've are, let's say if the metal is this thick, I've already bitten through about half.

And I noticed that and thought, you know, if I keep doing this, I'm going to bite. One of these days I'm going to bite and the mouthpiece is going to split. So I started putting this has been On there not this pad, but this particular Technique for at least over 20 years you mean bicycle tape like for the handlebars bicycle patch It's from making a like a rubber pad like like when you have a when you have a hole in your bicycle How you mean for a tire for a tire? Yeah bicycle tire patch. So why don't you just get a new what's that piece called? Oh, no, tire, yeah, bicycle tire patch. So why don't you just get a new what's that piece called?

Oh, no. No, no, no. This is why, this is all part of the sound. Do you... Really? Yeah. You believe that the instrument is fundamental to your sound? It's a big part of it, yeah.

But that doesn't mean that... No, okay, if you... It's not that you can't play it on something else, but you feel this has its own sound. Um, it's a big part of it. Yeah. But that doesn't mean that, no. Okay. If you, it's not that you can't play it on something else, but you feel this has its own sound. If you gave me somebody else's saxophone was set up with their mouthpiece, their read and I played it, it would not sound like you, like you're used to hearing me. It was to me or to you. Certainly to you.

I'm, but would I get it? I think you would, I think you would, you would hear to you. But would I get it? Would they get it? I think you would. You would hear the difference. I think so. Now I have another, this mouthpiece is at least 45 years old. So the guy that made this may rest in peace. His name was Bobby Dukoff. So I called him up.

I said, Bobby, I need some more mouthpieces just like this one. He goes, what do you got to trade? Go, do you want a tenor saxophone I got? Yeah. So I go to Florida, I bring him this tenor. He goes, I'll give you six mouthpieces for the tenor. I said, I'll take them. So I have five more of

this vintage locked away just in case. Now, I've played them all. They're not exactly the same, but they're pretty close. I'm hoping I never have to ever use them. Now, does anyone agree with you about the subtleties in sound like this, like any of your sound engineers

or the producers that you work with, or is this really how you feel? They've never asked. They just go, play. Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, they'll say, that's too many notes, or more notes or something. Mostly it's, that's too many notes.

But one instrument, I gotta think, I don't know. Too many notes or more notes or something. Mostly it's, that's too many notes. But one instrument, I got to think, I don't know, even the piano guys always have like a bunch of piano. But a Stradivarius violin or I bet if you asked Wynton Marsalis about his trumpet, I bet he's got the same trumpet he's used for a long time. I think, I don't know for sure. So I don't know him. You could throw a little brussel on that thing.

What do you mean? You know, you have to clean it up, you know, polish it. I know, right? I have no talent creatively, but I can clean like a virtual. No, no, no. You give me that thing for two hours. I don't, you know, it would change the sound of it. Tina?

It would, it would change it. And it used to be shiny. You just don't want to buff it up a little bit? No, no, no. I just don't want to mess around with it. I don't, I don't. I don't think your mother would like it. I want you to tell me. I know it's looking dirty now, but honestly, all of't want to mess around with it. I don't. I don't think your mother would like it. I want you to tell me.

I know it's looking dirty now, but honestly all of it just comes from me touching it. It's nothing. I think that that is so unbelievably cool. Yeah, me too. That you have the same one. Yeah, it's my sweet, sweet little horn. And all the music over all the year,

all the different things. It's all this one. Every little note that you've ever heard from my... on a record or somebody else's record, whatever I play a duet with whoever, it's this saxophone. This one right here.

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and you get 15% off at checkout store-wide. GetMainLobster.com. GetMainLobster.com. That will bring you closer together. I have two things that I want from you. One is the- Only two? Yeah, one is not the saxophone. No, the two things that are very interesting for me. One is from a humanistic level, one

is from a creative. So from the creative will be easier for you. From a creative perspective, who are the standouts for you in terms of who you've gotten to work with, who you wanted to work with, and why? Well, let's see, creatively, hmm... Doesn't have to be one, can be as many as a matter to you. Okay, well, I mean, Smokey Robinson was great to play with. He was great, because he was engaged. So doing a duet with him was amazing. Doing the duet with Frank Sinatra, I just got sent a tape.

It was a tape then. And they said, play on it, I wear. Just do what you think is good. I said, okay. And that was Phil Ramone was the producer. I said, okay, all right. And I put it up, I do my thing all alone, play my thing, send it back to him.

He goes, great. That was not as fun to do. It was fun enough. Why'd you do it? Why didn't you say, wait a minute, man, I'm Kenny G. I want to meet him. I want to be in the room with him. I'm not going to send me some tape. I'm not a studio musician. No, to be honest, the thing with Frank Sinatra,

I'm going, you wait, you thought of me? It's like he's got Bono, he's got Barbra Streisand, he's got whoever. Then we get the little instrumentalist on the same duets record. I'm there. I don't care what you would. Great. The mistake I made was I didn't think that Frank's vocal was very good. From what I heard, I thought it was a rough demo. So my mistake was I said, when I sent back to Phil, I said,

hey, sounds great. Send it to me when Frank does the real vocal. And he wrote back, he goes, that is the real vocal. I said, boy, it sure sounds great. Sounds great man, great job, great producing job. Quick fix, because otherwise, this ferris man shoes. He's like, oh, you know, it's like, hey, I don't like that sax player anymore.

So Frank Sinatra was huge, Smokey Robinson, huge. Who blew you away in terms of being surprised by what they brought to the table? Good question. When I did the thing for the weekend, I was surprised at how he was very much like me. Doesn't want to make any mistakes.

Like when we did the duet together, we did this live TV show, I guess it wasn't really live. And then when it was done, he said to this guy, he goes, hey, let me fix that one note I sang in there. I go, that's how I was thinking I said hey if you can do that I want to fix this one note I did my solo he goes fine I go I love working with you because nobody else will they hate it when I come to do something like if I do one of the TV shows like let's I do Kimmel right and I

play like just the one note I didn't it was a little little flat or whatever. Because I know it's not live. I'll go into the sound room and I'll say to the guy, hey, let me just fix that one note before you do the mix for tonight's show. Oh, bro, come on, we're going for lunch break. Okay, give me 10 minutes, come on. And then I make him let me do it over. I'm like that, he was like that and I love that about him.

Have you ever had someone who you really respected, um, listen to something and tell you that something was flat on it? Well, um, I've had, no, I mean, the guys I like, I used to work with a producer named Walter off an ACF and we'll, but we were like bros. So he was a, Hey, that note's a little sharp. Okay, that's fine. I don't mind all that. But another artist, never.

No, not one of them said, hey, you know, you're solo. Yet that note you hit, never, not once. Here's how it works with me. If I do a duet with somebody, it's always like this. Nowadays, you're never in the same room. I said, okay, send it to me. Tell me what you're looking for, like what are the spots you want me to play?

Most of the time they say, just do what you think. I said, okay. Then I send it to them and I go, okay, this is it. Don't come back to me with like, we're not sure we like that solo and everything. This is what I'm telling you. I already know. I know this is the best solo, this is the definitive sax solo, and that's the end of it. And if they start making changes, I go, that's it.

I'm out. Do you still follow saxophone players and do you have favorites still that you pay attention to or no? I took the old greats. Stan Getz, I listen to every day. I just love that melodic sound. Coltrane for the meticulous lines. I listen to Sonny Rollins, I listen to every day. I just love that melodic sound. Coltrane for the meticulous lines.

I listen to Sonny Rollins, I listen to Dexter Gordon, Cannonball Adderley is the great alto player. Paul Desmond from Take Five, you know? Yeah. So all the greats. All the greats. Just because, you know, here's the thing about the modern sax players.

There's a couple that are really, really great out there. They're really good. All the tenor players want to sound like Michael Brecker. May he rest in peace. They all want to sound like Michael Brecker, who was an unbelievable tenor player. So he took Coltrane's vibe and made it something different and made it his own sound.

All the young players want to be like Brecker. So they're all playing like Brecker. And they're playing Brecker better than Brecker. And it doesn't interest me that much. But when you go online, well, you probably don't do this, but when I went online, you have like generations of people who tried to emulate yourself. Yes, I've heard that. I've heard it. And they even have the hair, by the way.

I've seen it. I've seen it and heard it. And it sounds corny to me. But how flattering is that? Like, this has never happened before. Very flattering. Very flattering. I just, you know, what happened was in the 80s when all of a sudden this radio station format came to life, Smooth Jazz, they call it Smooth Jazz, which I hated that name. Hated the name. Because it makes it sound like it's, it's not real jazz.

It's kind of like smooth. It's like, you know, anybody could do it. You don't have to be great. It's just smooth. It's like, ah, I hated that name. But anyway, then they started to sign a lot of people that had my sound. But they weren't very good sax players. But yet they now have record deals.

I thought, come on, I earned mine. Oh, yeah. You're just copying something and you're here. That's how it is though. That's why they say imitation is the greatest form of flattery. Yes, I was flattered. Because in the creative circles, you need a seminal to have all the derivative. You know, sometimes the derivatives become, you know, isolated value in their own way, but it has to start.

And I know it started for you with others as well, but you know, you've also become that. I mean, you're an icon. Well, I know two icons now. Oh, who's the other one? Brooke Shields. I know his friend of mine. I know. I mean, you're an icon. Well, I know two icons now. Oh, who's the icon? Brooke Shields. I know his friend of mine. I know Brooke Shields. She's an icon.

Yeah. And Kenny G. Yeah. Is an icon. Thank you. I mean, you can't say it about yourself, although Brooke will. Brooke will say, yeah, I'm an icon.

I introduce her as the icon. She will say that? Yeah. Oh, well. I'll say, well, you know, I'll be okay. I'll pay for this. She'll say, well, I'm an icon. So you should pay for it.

Because then I say, you know what's right is right. That's right. It's fair point. Now it's gets a little, you know, I wish her husband would pick up a few more checks. She's a nice person. You know, she is exceedingly nice. She is.

I met her and know her a little bit. I don't think I've ever been with any celebrity who gets the attention three, four generations deep. Wow. That she will get. Because she is a beauty. who gets the attention three, four generations deep that she will get because she is a beauty right now, today. And these people descend upon her and she is unfailingly nice. And not as a posture of weakness where like she has to,

she's tough, But she respects people, respects the connection to her opportunities. Great. And she's just a good person. And you know how you know it? People can't fake kids. When you see their kids, you're gonna see what they're about.

Now, as someone with three kids, they can go sideways on their own, it's not your fault. But if your kids are sweet and decent, yeah, and her kids are beautiful, but inside too. Great. And it's a great compliment to her and her husband Henshie who's not an icon, but he's no slouch in his own right. But now I know another one.

Well, thank you for putting me in that category. And you have two kids, but you have a son who is a musician also. Right. So how did you deal with it being okay for Max to be a musician when he's Kenny G's kid? Oh, easy, easy. Not easy.

As someone who had a great father, not easy. Not just easy. Oh, I know what you mean. I know what you mean. So how did you handle it? Well, okay. So he doesn't see me as the world famous. I'm sure he does now.

I get that. But he sees me as, oh, my dad's practicing. Wakes up in the morning. They wake up hearing me. I'm up before everybody else practicing. So that's what it takes to do what I do. So he just started practicing. So that's how it was. It wasn't like, oh my gosh, I've got to follow in this guy's footsteps. It's like, no, my dad practices all the time. That's what I need to do. And he does it. Were you worried about his ability to do it and thrive and succeed because of how tough it is and he's going to be your son?

Not worried. No, because this is what I've told him. And I believe this. You get good enough, the world will open its arms to you. Not good enough. You have to get great enough. If you're good, you got to have luck. You got to be really good looking, you got to have the right connections, the timing has to be right, whatever it is. If you're unbelievably great at something, the world will go right this way, please. And that's why I said to him, just get great. Be unbelievably, you know, be virtuoso on that instrument of yours, and who's going to say no to that? Nobody can. So that's, and he's really, really good. He's getting there.

He's all, I mean, he's almost unbelievably great on it. So everybody that hears him play says, wow, I've never, that's the best I've ever seen. As in metal, he's a metal player. He shreds like nobody, I mean, he's unbelievable. So he just needs a little bit more time and it'll all happen. How often do you play with him?

I don't play with him very often. He's metal. He's playing, you know. Kenny, do you love your kid or you don't? All right? I do love him. I'm not a judgy guy, but you know, I mean. I love him.

You gotta take care of your kid. I love him, I love him. You know, you gotta adapt. Oh my kid. I love him, I love him. You know, you gotta adapt, you know. Oh my gosh. You gotta bang that thing against the drums or something like that. I think he doesn't want to play with me. Why?

You got the hair? I got the hair, yeah. No, he used to have the hair and then he cut it. His hair is even more beautiful than mine. And I said, Max, you should keep that hair. It's a great metal hair. He cut it. He may grow it sometime again, but, um, yeah.

No, I, I, for, for the, for my kids, it's, they, they look at me like, this is my, this is what my dad does. He practices and practices and practices and he works really hard at everything he does and he tries to be great at everything he does. And then that's what they look at me. They don't look at me like, Oh, he's big, some big famous guy. Because to me, the most important thing is practicing and getting better,

not being on a stage and having people applaud me. I'm glad they do, but it's because of how great I am, because of how hard I practice. You are a little bit of a unicorn though, if you think about it. I mean, not only do you do something that literally nobody else does in the popular space, okay? But you have been relatively hassle-free in your existence. Everybody knows who you are. But it's like,

you know, I mean, like you don't have to deal with a lot of the things. A little bit of a unicorn. I love that. I love it. I mean, that means I get to go to Whole Foods and shop, which I do. And as I'm shopping, some people will look and then they'll come by and go, hey, I like your music. I go, thanks, where's the strawberries? You know, or something. All right, so here's the last animal.

From a humanity perspective, why music matters, what it meant to us growing up, okay? And what you meant, you know, here's the best I could get and may it rest in peace. My father introduced me to you. Seriously? Wow. Now he was a classical guy, right?

But he, I think because he wasn't burdened by the words and because your music is open, you title it. Yeah. And you have your own motivations that create the music. But it is up to the interpretation. Exactly. Exclusively of the listener. Right. And people hum your music. Yeah. And they will have their own inflections. They take ownership of the vibe. Great. In a way you can't do with lyrics. Because lyrics are what they are, right? The words are what they are.

And he was very drawn to that. The power of music in the modern space, what change have you seen in terms of what power music has, what it means, how it's used over time? I don't know if it's changed that much. I think it's all like what you said, it connects, it's a connection. That's the main thing. I love the fact that

my instrumental music is left open to interpretation. If I write a song that's sound, and a lot of my melodies sound sad, but I'm not a sad guy. So when I write these melodies, oh man, you must have been really sad. I wasn't, I was actually in a great mood. But the melodies come out sad, sounding,

but if you want to interpret it that, and that makes you feel comfortable, great. Oh, that song reminds me of my dad, great. Did you write that with your father in mind? I'm not going to say and probably didn't. But I'm saying, I love that you said it that way. That makes me feel really great. I'm glad your dad loved the fact that my music gave him room to feel what he wanted to feel or think what he wanted to think.

That's the biggest compliment. I think music is still that way with people. I mean, yes, the lyrics do dictate. But if somebody's talking about a love song, love means such different things to different people, they can interpret a different way. To me, it makes memories. So I think that's what music has remained the same.

Obviously, there's different forms of music that are different, but in general, I think it's just the way people connect and feel connected to each other through music. What do you want people to get from the book? Life and the Key of G. Well, first I just- What's the G for example? What's the reference?

Gorlick. Just kidding. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. What are you at? Oh, yeah. I look dumb enough for you to say that. That's right. Yeah, yeah. So what do you want people to get with the reference? Gorlick. Oh, yeah, yeah. What are you like? Oh, yeah. I look dumb enough for you to say that.

That's right. So what do you want people to get with the book? Actually, I didn't write it for that reason to put any kind of message out there. It just started off as an idea that I thought would have no legs because I didn't think it was a good idea to write a book. I'm not old enough. I'm not retired. And yet, the more we talked about it, the more I

thought, okay, and then I talked to the people from Folio Literary Agency here in New York and Blackstone Publishing. They said, no, this is gonna work, and so, all right, I'll try a chapter or two, and then, yeah, this really works, and it was cool. I want people to be, I want to be entertained by the book. I want you to find it funny, and I want you to be, I want to be entertained by the book. I want you to find it funny and I want you to be interested in what you're reading. If you were to learn something, you would just learn that you practice hard on something and you get good at it. It tends to make your chances of success better at whatever it is you're trying to become successful at, whether it's a relationship or a vocation or whatever, or whatever it is

you're trying to do, you put in the reps and the reps, like, I could be really nervous talking to you because I watch you on TV all the time, but I've done this enough times and I'm a little, I still am a little nervous, but I'm, but the nervousness is not going to stop me from being myself and being okay because of the reps. And a lot of people don't put in the reps and so they never get good enough to have the great experiences to enjoy their life better. So just put in the reps. They're hard at first, but they were hard for everybody at first, hard for me at

first, and then after enough reps, you go, I've done this enough time. Yeah, I'm a little nervous nervous but I've been here before, it'll be okay. Then you just be your best. Then that's great. The grind is the glory. When you are going to sit down to write for your next album, is it something where it's life-related, it's mood-related, or you heard something?

How do you know when it's time to create? It just feels like it's been a long time since I've done something, then I feel like I should do it. Then the process is very difficult because there is no way to do it. If I knew it, it would be so easy. Do these things, you write a great song. I don't know. It's like if I'm doing my practice session and I'll be doing things like... And those are little exercises I will do, you know.

And then, oh wait, I just like the... Let me sort of song like that. Oh no, I want to do... sort of song like that. Oh, no, I want to do it. Okay, I like that. And then they just. And then you just keep writing it down. I just keep going. Okay, where does that go?

And then maybe I'll come up with a melody I think is great. Okay, now I can use an iPhone to record it, which is great. Before I had to write the notes down. So I put it down there. Let me see if I like it tomorrow. And then what happens is if it's good, I'll end up thinking about it all day, some melody. And it's driving me nuts. Like, oh, I'm doing, I can't get it.

I said, stop thinking about that melody. And then I can't. And then I go to sleep at night and it's still rolling. So I go, okay, wake up and play it again. So I wake up and play it again. Yeah, yeah, it's still there. Okay, now where does it go go little by little by little and then hopefully it turns into something that's memorable the whole thing How does it gonna work? Now? I go to the piano. What do I think it's gonna be?

So, okay, I got to call my piano player friend. Listen, this is close. What do you think and then he'll send me some Okay, I like those chords. Let's see. Okay, and then we come up with something, ah, this is really good. And then, okay, what's next? Drums, no drums. Violins, no viola, I don't know. It's a long process and it's hard. It's a real alchemy. I don't like doing it.

I don't. Well, then you are some self-loather because you have done it a hell of a lot. It's true. Kenny G, I gotta tell you, this is a complete treat. Thank you. Me too. You serenaded my wife. I don't know how I'm ever going to top that, but I will take credit for it. Call me later. I'll bring it over later. I figured out what it is. The reason that it's ageless and timeless and classic is because

excellence never goes in style. Kenny G, you are one of one. Thank you very much. Thank you. Wow. Thank you. Kenny G, you are one of one. Thank you very much. Thank you. Wow. Thank you. I love him even more now.

Guy is an icon. And for good reason. Thank you very much for joining me here on The Chris Cuomo Project. Thank you for subscribing and following. Appreciate you checking me out on News Nation 8P and 11P every weekday night. And if you want this without ads, great, join the sub stack, five bucks a month, you get this ad free, you get it first,

and you get all the long COVID stuff that I've done with my doctor, Dr. Robin Rose, and my walk-in talks about philosophy and life lessons that I've learned, if not lived well. Let's get after it.