The Daily Stoic - Ask Daily Stoic: Ryan and Coach Buzz Williams (Texas A&M) Talk Habits, Time Management and the Lessons You Can Learn from the Pandemic

Episode Date: May 23, 2020

Today Ryan talks with Buzz Williams, head coach of the men’s basketball team at Texas A&M. They discuss the impact of the COVID-19 quarantine on college sports, the personal progress they have made during the pandemic, how they practice reading, and more.Get your copy of Stillness Is the Key for just $3.99 on Amazon: https://geni.us/StillnessSaleThis episode is brought to you by Future. Future pairs you up with a remote personal trainer that you can get in touch with from your home. Your trainer will give you a full exercise regimen that works for your specific fitness goals, using the equipment you have at home. It works with your Apple Watch, and if you don’t already have one, Future will give you one for free. Sign up at tryfuture.com/stoic and get your first two weeks with your personal trainer for just $1.This episode is also brought to you by Athletic Greens. Athletic Greens is a custom formulation of 75 vitamins, minerals, and other whole-food sourced ingredients that make it easier for you to maintain nutrition in just a single scoop. It tastes great and gets you the nutrients you need, whether you're working on the go, fueling an active lifestyle, or just maintaining your good health. Visit athleticgreens.com/stoic and receive 20 free travel packs with your first purchase.This episode is also brought to you by Shippo. Shippo is a top-to-bottom shipping solution that works great with small and large businesses. Shippo will help you get the lowest rates on postage for your customers from dozens of global carriers like UPS, USPS, FedEx, and DHL. Visit goshippo.com/stoic to get a shipping consultation and a six-month trial of Shippo’s pro plan (up to $700 value) absolutely free.***If you enjoyed this week’s podcast, we’d love for you to leave a review on Apple Podcasts. It helps with our visibility, and the more people listen to the podcast, the more we can invest into it and make it even better.Sign up for the Daily Stoic email: DailyStoic.com/signupFollow @DailyStoic:Twitter: https://twitter.com/ryanholidayInstagram: https://www.instagram.com/ryanholiday/Facebook: http://facebook.com/ryanholidayYouTube: https://www.youtube.com/dailystoicFollow Buzz Williams: Homepage: http://coachbuzzwilliams.com/Twitter: https://twitter.com/TeamCoachBuzzInstagram: https://www.instagram.com/teamcoachbuzzFacebook: https://www.facebook.com/TeamCoachBuzz/See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Hey, prime members, you can listen to the Daily Stoic podcast early and add free on Amazon music. Download the app today. Welcome to the weekend edition of the Daily Stoic. Each weekday, we bring you a meditation inspired by the ancient Stoic, something that can help you live up to those four stoic virtues of courage, justice, wisdom, and temperance. And here on the weekend, we take a deeper dive into those same topics. We interview stoic philosophers, we reflect, we prepare. We think deeply about the challenging issues of our time. And we work through this philosophy in a way that's more

possible here when we're not rushing to worker to get the kids to school. When we have the time to think to go for a walk to sit with our journals and to prepare for what the future will bring. Hi, I'm David Brown, the host of Wundery's podcast business wars. And in our new season, Walmart must fight off target, the new discounter that's both savvy and fashion forward. Listen to business wars on Amazon music or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, everyone.

Welcome to another episode of the Daily Stoic podcast. Today we have an awesome guest, someone I've gotten to know through one of my favorite people in the whole world. We end up talking about an interview, Coach George Raveling. Today's guest is a coach himself, coach Buzz Williams. He's currently the head basketball coach

at Texas A&M University. He's a fascinating guy who's previously the head basketball coach at Virginia Tech. And then at Marqu previously the head basketball coach at Virginia Tech, and then at Marquette, the head coach at New Orleans, which we talk a little bit about. I find Buzz to be very fascinating. He's a self-effacing guy. I think he somewhat plays up that he's not as smart as he is. I think he's a brilliant guy. He's a hella of a reader. That's one of the things we talk about in the interview, but not only reads, but sort of a man after my own heart

has a very regimented reading practice. He was telling me, and I got to see it when I went and visited it at Virginia Tech. He has notes from every book he's ever read. And it's in this big binder. I was lucky enough to speak to his team at Virginia Tech. And then I spoke to his team at A&M at the beginning of this season. And one of the things he's sent me after both talks

were the pages and pages of notes that he took. He uses different color pens. He has an incredible penmanship, which is also something I'm not quite good at. But he treats reading like an athlete treats the game of basketball or the game of baseball or the game of football. He's disciplined about it. He reviews his progress.

He breaks down what he's doing. He's committed to it. And I think that's why he's partly why he's been able to accomplish all the things that he's been able to accomplish. But as a big fan of stoicism, that's what he had me come speak to the team about both times. He's got all our daily stove challenge coins. He's got a bus to Marcus Relius and his new office there at Texas A&M. So just a just a fascinating guy, super connected in sports is always looking to learn from different people. He asks lots and lots of questions.

As you'll see in the interview, I think he's someone that we can all learn from, whether we're interested in sports or not. One of the things I also think's interesting about Buzz and the schools that he's taught at, he's really kind of carved out a niche for himself as a coach who, you know, isn't at the biggest school, so he's not able to get the sort of cream of the crop athletes, but he's able to find the sort of the undiscovered gems. He's able to find guys with a lot of heart, and he's been able to accomplish with his teams, things that people just didn't think were possible.

He's gone really far in the NCAA tournaments many times over the years. Again, with teams that I don't think other coaches probably would have recruited, and I don't think they would have been able to lead as far into the tournament as Buzz has been able to do. And I think that's sort of a testament to his skill, his communication strategies, the way he's able to inspire his players. And yeah, this is just really impressive. And partly why I wanted to talk to him and bring some of his insights to you guys. He's on lockdown during this quarantine, like the rest of us, but it's been focusing on turning that into a live time. And I've just been lucky enough to see some of the impact and influence that Buzz has had.

The lives that he's changed as a coach, one of the most surreal ways that I felt that is about a year and a half ago, Jimmy Butler, who was then, I think, with Boston, was interviewed and was talking about how he'd read, he goes, the enemy, and I was trying to figure out how he could have possibly heard about the book, and it turns out that he had gone to a market and Buzz had been his coach and because

he has such a great relationship with his players over the years, that Buzz had recommended my book to Jimmy and Jimmy had read it and talked about it. And as it happens, Pao, the saw who we had on the podcast, heard about my books from Jimmy Butler. So, you know, this idea of passing books around how sort of ideas can worm their way through culture and the importance and the power of connection and influence and sort of trying to help people,

I think these are all themes that we talk about in the interview, so I'm really excited for you to listen to Buzz and I will talk to you all soon. in the interview, so I'm really excited for you to listen to Buzz, and I will talk to you all soon. Ah, the Bahamas. What if you could live in a penthouse above the crystal clear ocean working during the day and partying at night with your best friends and have it be 100% paid for? FTX Founder's Sam Bankman Freed lived that dream life, but it was all funded with other

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Follow Spellcaster wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, Prime Members, you can listen to episodes Add free on Amazon music. Download the Amazon music app today. You were telling me how you've been adjusting to what is now extended into you said a seven week spring break. Yeah, how how how's your routine look like in the midst of that? You know, Ryan, what happened? We were at the

SEC basketball tournament scheduled to play on a Thursday and six hours before tip off. The tournament was canceled and we were able to fly home as a program Friday morning. And when we got back, our administration had just told us that the only thing we knew to tell our team was that the following week spring break would be extended. So I wrote on my calendar spring break number two. And for whatever reason, I just kind of continued that.

And so currently we're in spring break number seven. And I think with each passing week, to be honest, I think our rhythm and our routine as a family, even within the things that I think that I have to be accountable for in my job, I think with each passing week, we've been more efficient, we've been better, and we've used time in a more productive way. I wasn't very good to be transparent with you in week number two. I'd never had a season in like that. This April is typically the second busiest month of the year as a college basketball coach. And so all that has transpired just like many across the world. It's unprecedented,

but in our industry, it's very unique because nothing that has taken place this month and to be honest with you last month has ever happened in the history of college basketball. Yeah, it must be weird as having gotten to visit with you in a couple of different college coaches. It's one of the few instances I've seen where someone has like some real power, you know, like you're not an elected official. You're like, you're like the dictator of the program, right? And it must be strange to suddenly be sort of reminded how little control one has over things.

Zero. You know, I've said no, Ryan, to all of the different interview requests. Everybody, obviously, is looking for something to write, looking for something to post. And I've just kind of said no to it and tried to spend time away from my phone, time away from electronics, the internet, Twitter, things of that nature. I've tried to make sure that I've kind of recentered myself specific to those things. But one thing that I've told the parents of our players and even the parents of our newcomers. So, you know, most of college basketball, the players that will be new on the team will arrive

for the first summer session, which isn't late May. Like any other parent, they're asking me and our staff, what do you think that's going to be? I have no idea. I don't think our AD has an idea. I don't necessarily know that our president or a chancellor has an idea. Does that mean that it's going to end up being the governor's decision from the state of Texas?

There's so many filters and at some point is the NCAA going to be involved in what happens is the national association of basketball coaches going to have us say you're right. We don't know. The basketball coach has no input whatsoever because the decision is so far above them and it's so far above their program. And because we live in such a narrow existence, like when you can't control what time are we going to work and who are we going to recruit, where are we going to go, what time to practice, all of that's been taken away. And so it's been, there's been so many lessons and I've tried to keep up with those over the last 30 plus days. Each day I've been journaling in my normal journal, but then I started a new one in that

what was spring break number two of what are the lessons that I've learned from the virus and how can I take, how it applies to me as a person. Forget what my job title is or where I'm employed. What is it that I'm learning that can help me in all facets of my life for the rest of my life? You feel comfortable sharing what some of those big lessons are? I think the first thing, Ron, and you know this because of our friendship, I have always

thought that I was ultra-particular with my time. I think that there are certain daily disciplines that I do every day that I've been very consistent with for years. And I agree with those disciplines and why I do it. But I think one thing that I've noticed during the shelter and place time is, I don't know that I was as accountable for my time as I thought I was in what was our old normal life.

And I've noticed that maybe some of the things that I thought were important prior to this quarantine, they're really not that important. And you know, like as my coaching career has evolved, most of my staff has ended up becoming kids that played for us, that were a manager for us, that was a graduate assistant for us.

Almost 80% of my staff is comprised of that category. And one of the things as my career has evolved is, you know, if you look at a box score, that's a basketball coach, that's a term, that's a stat sheet after a game, how many shots did we shoot, how many did we make, what was the percentage, all of those normal statistics. And one thing that I've learned over the last few years is what of those statistics correlate

to winning? Because at the end of the day, what we need to do competitively is how do we win the game. So instead of looking at the entire box war, what of all of these numbers, what is most important that correlates to winning? And I look back and I would say one of the biggest lessons from the last 40 days is of all of the things that I once did, what correlates the most to what's important in my life because similar to what you just said, like when all of this gets stripped away,

who are you, what is your identity, and what is most important to you? And to some degree, how you spend your time and your treasure should be reflective of those priorities. And I think maybe not necessarily financially, but relative to time, I think that I had too much excess. It was just too much. And I didn't prioritize what I thought was most important.

You know, like, I've never spent this much time with my kids, and I look at my oldest daughter who's maybe 100 or 200 days away from going off to college. I don't know if she's going to go off to college based on what's about to happen, but she's scheduled to, and I look at the last 30 days, and I think to myself, was I good dad? Because I've spent so much time with her. Like I'm waking her up every morning to go train and I'm so excited to wake her up and she's 18 years old and she's a beautiful kid and she's always been a good kid.

But I feel convicted to be honest with you Ryan and my soul. Have I spent the last 18 years prioritizing other people's children more than I did my own? And like, I'm waking her up to spend the next two hours with her. I'm not saying I could do that every day within my job, but if I did that much more often than I ever had been,

would that really have impacted my job, but if I did that much more often than I ever had been, would that really have impacted my job? Or was I so caught up in, I've got to do these 19 things on my to-do list for the day, and really none of those 19 things correlated to what was most important relative to being a father. And I'm in truth, not to make this about me in truth. I feel the same way as a husband. It's just made me somewhat reprioritize maybe how I think of things going forward. No, that's so beautiful. And a lot to unpack. So I want to go through it.

So for someone who's not, I don't have a super statistical sports mind, but I do remember when I saw you earlier this year about it, when you say like sort of stats that correlate, it's something like, hey, when we have more rebounds than the other team, we win 70% of the time. So you're looking at, hey, when I do X, Y, or Z,

does that correlate with winning? And you're saying when I do X, Y, and Z, does that correlate with me being happier, me being more connected with my family, me being healthier, stuff like that? Absolutely. You know, like, you know how I've always heard fired coaches when they take a year off that was unplanned. They took a year off because they got fired. And they split the year, trying to figure out how to get the next job. And once they got the next job, one of my questions with all of those people, regardless of sport, not just basketball coaches,

is what did you learn when you were not coaching that's gonna help you now that you're backing coaching. And to a fault, nearly all of them would say, every coach should have to get fired so that they could learn all of those lessons that come from the year off. And I've always thought to myself, man, I don't know if I want to get fired

because I don't know if I'm gonna get another job, but fortunately, and I mean this without sounding arrogant, I've never been fired, so I haven't experienced that, but why is it that they always say, man, what I learned when I didn't have a job is helping me now that I have another job. Well, whatever those lessons are, I need to learn those lessons possibly to avoid being fired, but why do I have to be unemployed in order to learn those lessons?

And I think some of that, to be honest with you, Ron, has happened during the shelter in place. Like I've started a two different list other than the lessons that I'm learning from the virus. I have two different lists. How can the virus extend my coaching career? And the second list is, how can the virus extend my life? Not just the lessons, but like, how does it correlate to look at all of this stuff that is good, that I'm learning from this difficult situation for many? How can I take these lessons and correlate it to when the rubber hits the road, it impacts my life as a person, as a man, as a husband,

as a father, as a leader, as a coach. How can I gain traction from those lessons? Yeah, and your point about sort of realizing that your time, it hits with me because like, as a writer, you know, you do a lot of traveling, they're speaking, there's business opportunities, there's consulting, there's all sorts of stuff. I would say yes to so many of them and I would go do them and they was cool and obviously I learned a lot and experience. I think I sold a lot of books because of it, but what was, I think, obscured to me is what the costs of that were. Not just a family, but as you said,

like even to the job itself. And so, I've been so incredibly productive. Like the writing has just been pouring out of me and I've been reading more. Like the last six weeks, seven, eight weeks, what it's reminding me of is, oh, when I travel, there is residue. Like it takes me a while to come back to my routine.

You know, it takes me a while to get reset. I'm not as focused as I think I am. So actually, I think what it's showing me is like you, I thought I was really routine based. I thought I was really structured. I thought I was really inefficient. I didn't realize that I may have been Actually my own worst enemy in a lot of ways

Absolutely, you know like with each passing week on that particular subject 18-year-old daughter 17-year-old son 14-year-old son 10-year-old daughter My wife is 18 much younger than me interesting for me to watch how each of those people regardless of their gender or age, how they've processed this. And one of the things that I have tried to do over the last, maybe six to eight years in my career as a coach is, I wanna be the best question-asker possible.

So when I get to spend time with Ron Holiday, I wanna ask the best questions. And when I get to spend time with the lady that cleans our office every morning real early, I wanna ask the best questions. And I've tried to become more aware over the last couple of weeks of asking my family really good questions on how they're processing this. And like with our team, I try to ask as many questions as I give them, tell them statements

throughout the time that I spend with them. And one of the things that my youngest son mentioned to me in this, that I've realized that if I want to, I can control what I do today relative to my time. And I was like, wow. Yeah, thanks for teaching me that. I know that, but I don't know that I've lived that near as well as I thought. Like, I leave my phone alone and I make my children leave their phone alone certain hours of the day. No TV, no iPad, no computer, no phone. We all put it, all of our electronics on the kitchen counter where the charging station is. Can't touch it. And in those three hours, like the thoughts that I'm able to think without

scrolling through my timeline or people giving me a text or calling, I've become much more efficient. I'm going to get back to those texts. I'm going to get back to those texts. I'm going to get back to those responses and voice bells, but being able to control my time and how I want to utilize my time is, I guess, like you, I thought I did pretty good. And I don't necessarily think that I was bad. But why is it that I have a better relationship with my children

and my wife during the quarantine, than I would when everything's normal. Why is it that I actually have more in depth conversations with my staff members than when we were in the office every day and I'm walking past them saying good morning? Like, well, it's because I have time. Well, I have that same amount of time prior to COVID-19. But hey, let me take my dogs on a walk.

I'm going to call two staff members until we get to the halfway point. And then I'm going to call two of our players on the way back. Well, that consistency has allowed those relationships to deepen, even though you would think that would be counterintuitive to what it was when we were practicing and playing games and doing work every day. My son like refuses to nap in a bed. He will only nap in a stroller or in a car. And so, so every day for 45 days in a row now, I've taken him for either a bike ride or a run. And like today was a run yesterday was a bike ride.

The things I've had to rush back into the house after I finished and write down had not only have they been inspiring and interesting and creatively fulfilling, but like, on the other side of this, like, I'm gonna sell those ideas. And ironically, we'll pay for, you know, a good chunk of whatever opportunities I lost because of this.

And so yeah, I would have told myself before, I'm too busy to drive home in the middle of the day to take my son for a bike ride and then jump in the pool. But it turns out that may actually be the smartest thing I could do every day. Yeah, that might be the play. How you were going about the game, this is forcing you to think of a different model within the game.

And yeah, I don't know if this is right, Ron. This is another list that I started. I've been trying to ask myself, what if 10 times a day? Oh. I'm not saying it's right. It's more of a question. I wanna ask myself, what if 10 different times a day in 10 different scenarios,

similar to what you just said. I'm gonna go home and pick up my son, and we're going to go somewhere for 45 minutes so he can rest. And then I'm going to come back home and make sure he's squared away with my wife, and then I'm going to go back to my office. And I'm going to give an hour and 15 minutes to that a day. You would have never done that prior to this. But what if, when this becomes our new normal, what if that hour and 15 minutes becomes a part of what you

do if you wake up in your own bed in Austin each day? An hour and 15 minutes is automatically position to that. And what I've been thinking are all of the different, what if scenarios that I've never had time to think about. Like people are asking me, think there's gonna be a college football season. And I'll always say, I will not make that decision, so I'm not sure where that stands.

I have a question for you, though, since you're asking about college football. Do you think that there will be a college basketball season? What if there's not one? Well, what if there's not one? Now it begins, well, if there's not a college basketball season, how would we go about training? How would we go about our recruiting?

And so all of these what if scenarios, obviously, are brought on from what we're all going through. But the what if scenarios, I think, force me to think how I can be prepared no matter which way this all unfolds. Because I think on the other side of this, all of the lessons that you've learned, that I've learned, and that everybody in the country has learned, the people that are gonna be the most successful, whatever success is to those people on the other side

are the ones that can pivot, just like a basketball player, that can pivot the quickest. And what you thought was coming home every day to be with your son to helping nap, you would never do that because you were in a groove at your office doing work. Now that might actually be the right play to get more work done. And I think that I've tried to make myself think in what if scenarios more so than ever before. Not always worst case scenario, because I think I'm wired to think worst case scenario,

but instead of maybe looking at things through the lens of worst case, let me just open my mind a little bit to what if, what if this, what if that? And think on that particular scenario and play it out, and I wonder if when I'm playing it out, it helps me to have more genuine thought processes on what's more important or how to change what we were doing

to make it more productive, more impactful. So it's for sure made me think different. Yeah, one of the things I got from Tim Ferris, we were here and I were just talking about it. He was like, I think this adds on to your what if thing. He was like, you should think about it in terms of experiments. So you'd be like, okay, what if I didn't touch my phone for, you know, five hours in the middle of the day every day, or, you know, what if I came home for lunch every day, or what if what if I said no to all incoming travel requests, or, you know, what if I took a year off, or what if I, you know, what if I decided to do two workouts

a day, or, you know, he says, but and you say, okay, okay I'm gonna do that for two weeks and I'm gonna see what happens because like we get intimidated by change right and so yes if you say hey from now on you can't do any extracurricular activities or from now on you got to do this people are like whoa whoa whoa that sounds like a lot but if you said hey for two weeks I want you to stop having breakfast and only eat two bigger meals a day Like I'm willing to try that and then you you can find out something about yourself about your body about your routine And this period is a great time to do experiments. Yeah, real good. I'm writing that down. That's very good I like well that that that was the next thing I was gonna ask you about because you are in addition to being a great

Journaler, which I think is a very stoke exercise. You are a notorious note taker. You showed me a binder. You've basically taken notes on every, you still have the notes for every book you've basically ever read. Walk me through that process and why you do it and what you feel like you get out of it. Obviously, my wife knows that there would be a couple of people maybe on our staff that know, I don't ever, you may be the only person outside my circle of influence that even knows that I do that. Ron, I went to a junior college out of high school, paid my own way, my first two years,

I went to an N.A.I own way my first two years. I went to an NAI school my last two years. In my own small town way, there were 44 kids in my graduating class. I wanted to be a coach. I did not know that my career would entail what it has thus far and I don't mean that egotistically, it had a very small paradigm. And for whatever reason, I've always had an insatiable desire to learn. And I want to learn from anybody, from everybody. It doesn't matter what their business card says. I always think that there's something

that everyone knows that could help me. And I struggled reading as a child, my worst grades, by far, my absolute worst grades, were in any sort of reading, any sort of comprehension. And so as I began to become a teenager, I would have to write things down over and over, almost like it was punishment. Do not say mean things to Ryan, period, write that a hundred times just so I could get it in my brain where I could understand. I've taken notes every day of my life

since I've been in college, I started college late in my 17th year, and I have literally notebook after notebook after notebook. And then as I begin to write better, I think I begin to read better, and as I begin to read better, I think I begin to read better and as I began to read better, I think I began to write better. And then as my career began to become some level

of what I think most people would call public speaking, I became obsessed with every press conference of any sort, every post game press conference of any coach, college pro. I remember when Tivo first became the thing. I thought it was the greatest invention ever. I T-vote every press conference. And I would study them. I would rewind them. I would write down what they were saying. And then I would, you remember the small, dictophone that you could carry in your pocket. And as I would drive to work,

I would try to in different voices, act like the voice of someone asking me a question. And then I would respond in my voice. And then I would go back and listen to it at times write it down. I read a book a week. I don't read near as much as you do, and what I am reading probably is not near the depth of which that you read, but just kind of made

it part of my habit. I think it's a way not necessarily to skip some steps, but I think from those books, the life experiences and the wisdom that you can learn from books allows you maybe to have more wisdom to understand things at a quicker pace instead of having to live through all of it. And so I've taken notes and journaled maybe not exactly proper journaling. I think I've gotten better at that, but I have notes from every month of my life over the last 30 years. And I would say, Ryan, I've read a book a week every year for the last, you know, 10 or 15 years.

It's just part of my day. And I'm not saying that that's right. I also think that it's part of what I've had to do because I've always felt like I was behind. I think that started because I was such a slow reader and processor as a young kid and so I've always felt behind and I've always had maybe an invisible, I don't want anybody to think that I can't read or that I can't write. My grandfather, who I spent an inordinate amount of time with, my oldest daughter is named after my grandmother,

my oldest son is named after my grandfather. My parents were divorced when I was six months old. And I spent an inordinate amount of time with my grandfather. He was the typical World War II veteran. He dropped out of school when he was in fifth grade to help his family during the Great Depression. He could not read, he could not write.

And I think because I was a slow processor, I have just always had a maybe an internal drive of, I'm behind, I need to read more, I need to write more so that I can be on as my kids would say grade level. And so it's just been a part of my life journey, particularly as an adult. No, I love that. And it strikes me that maybe you're almost approaching reading the way that an athlete would approach the game, right? You're you're taking shots and shots and shots in the gym, then you're breaking down film, and then you're reviewing, and you're practicing it in the mirror. And I love that. And I think

that's why you are where you are. It's weird, though, for whatever reason, I think people, because you are where you are. It's weird though, for whatever reason, I think people, because reading is also fun, maybe they just don't see it as a discipline, and I like that you've broken it down into an activity and you're trying to excel at the composite parts. Yeah, I don't know, Ron, that I always thought that it was the right thing to do.

I just felt early in my career as a coach when I would watch a press conference and hear how well-spoken he was and how he handled his word usage. And I understand that I'm poor at that because I'm overly word-worthy, but I would watch that and I would be, if I was looking at it as a quote, competitor,

I would be like, man, I've got a long way to go. I've got to work at this and how can I work at this? I don't make enough money to hire a speech coach and I'm never gonna be at a school where the media person, it's the sports information director is handing me the stats. Like, I've got to manufacture this on my own so that when I go into a single mother's home, how am I going to be able to present to her that this experience for her son is gonna change his life for the better and how can I not be a salesman per se,

but how can I have conviction in my voice? And I think that the reading part of that, it became my habit because as time unfolded and transpired, I was realizing like even now I'm 47 years old and when I read a word that I don't know, I circle it. And I don't look it up on my phone, I don't want to look it up on my phone, I circle it. And when I get through with the book, I go back through that book and every word I circled,

I do it just like we did when we were in fifth grade and we're doing a vocabulary test. I'm gonna go look it up, what word is it? Underline the word, colon, right down the definition, the part of speech that it is. And I have a notebook after notebook of words like that I taught myself from reading, like literally we did when we were taking a vocabulary

test every Monday morning in English when we were in fifth grade and I still do that and I'm 47 years old. My eighth grade English teacher lives in Texas, her and her husband came to one of our games this year. And she's 74 and I gave her the biggest hug and I was an awful student because I couldn't, I wasn't reading on grade level, I wasn't writing on grade level. And I hugged her like thank you so much for the impact that you made on my heart, even though I was a jerk and how I responded,

it changed my life because your passion towards helping me learn to read and write and want to learn and read and write, even though I didn't want to at that age as an adult, relative to my job, it has changed my children's lives because of my ability to read and write and speak. And it was because of those things that were bad, so to say, when I was 13 years old. Well, I love the humility of that and that it's sort of an ongoing process of humility, right? Like, it's a idea of always staying a student.

It can be easy when you're reading to be like, just assume, you know, the word or not when I admit that you know the word, you're actually almost putting yourself back in the position of being an eighth grader or a 12th grader or whatever. And I think that's probably part of, it could be so easy to figure, to feel like, you know, everything and to internalize that. And I think to have a practice that keeps you humble is really great, which strikes me that it's sort of similarly, you've been equally disciplined from what I know about your pursuit, not just of learning from books, but also from learning from people.

You've sought out a number of mentors and advisors on your way to becoming a coach. Obviously, coach traveling being one of them and I'm going to talk to him in a week or so, I think. I'm curious how you think about that and what strategies you have for sort of also learning from the experience of others. Well, you know, my relationship with coach traveling is how I eventually got to you. And I stalked Coach Ravling for two and a half years. Brief context on Coach George Ravling is in the Naismith basketball hall of fame. Was the first African American coach in what was the PAC-8, which is the conference now known as the PAC-12, was

very successful and was injured in a car accident when he was 55 years old while being the head coach at USC Southern California. I did not know coach then, obviously, coach is 82 now. So he's two or three generations ahead of me. From 2000 to 2004, I was an assistant coach at Colorado State and coach. At that time was employed by Nike Phil Knight, had hired coach coaches, one of the first seven college basketball coaches ever offered a Nike coaching contract where there was some trade in barter involved in the contract, money slash gear, and I stalked coach for over two years, and finally met him in Houston, Texas, and literally spent the night in the lobby of a hotel after having dinner with him and waiting to walk with him. That was back before the TSA regulations when you could walk with someone to their gate.

The next morning he was leaving to fly back to LA and I walked with him to his gate and he has become in many respects, Ryan, even more than just the normal mention a mentor coach. I presented a coach at one of his Hall of Fame dinners. I was one of the coaches that presented actually that dinner is when he had bought everyone in attendance. You were there. Yes, sir. Ego is the enemy and that's that was what started. I was like, I said at the table with coats, and I was like, hey, coach, who wrote this book? And he's like, Buzz, I gotta get into you.

And you know how coach is so passionate about reading. I'm like, no, I'm kind of pissed off. And he goes, why are you pissed off? I just gave everybody in this room a book. And I go, yeah, I'm getting this book at the same time all these people are. And I'm supposed to be your guy who Wrote this book and why have it you told me he's like all buzz you're gonna love it and wait till I connect you with the author

He's here. That's what he's telling me at his table. I'm like coach. That doesn't make any sense He's here. You're giving everybody his book. So now everybody has the same opportunity I have to build a relationship with. I need to be ahead of everybody else. Yeah. Ha, ha, ha, ha. Ha, ha, ha, ha. But I think, I think, again,

I had my paradigm was so small. I was thinking, you know, if maybe someday I could get a 2A or a 3A high school job after being a JV coach, maybe I had to start in middle school. Maybe if I had a chance to do that, how cool would that be? Never, never having any concept whatsoever, all of the different things that have happened. And as they were happening, one thing that I always look back at is my paradigm was just broaden just enough to realize, well, there's a lot that I've

got to learn. I was 27 when I got the job at Colorado State. It was the first job run that didn't have a hyphen in the school name, or a direction. Every other school I'd been employed at, it was a directional school, or it had a hyphen in it. And when I was chasing down Coach Rav, when I finally connected with him, he said, in a flabbergasted way, what in the hell are you doing? Like what are you doing? Because I had been chasing him so hard and I was like, coach, I'm never going to betray my relationship with you if we ever have one.

But I promise you, I will never ask for anything except what is it that you think I should know when you look back at your career when you were my age. And I still ask coach that same question. We talk two or three times a week, not necessarily always in depth, but two or three times a month, we're gonna really talk and I always say the same thing.

Coach, I'm 47 now, when you were 47, what is it that you know now that you wish you would have had somebody tell you when you were 47? And I've tried to not embassable. I've actually tried to do it outside of basketball way more than basketball. How can I develop trustful relationships where I never ask anyone for anything?

I don't want anything from anybody other than the opportunity to have access to learn. I don't want a t-shirt, I don't want a tweet out a picture, I don't want anything other than I just want to learn and building those relationships and many respects for me because of the small paradigm that I've grown up within. Those relationships have been game changers for me. Well, you've been so generous with your time. Maybe that's a good place to close. I'm curious, so I'm 32 if you're 47. What do you know now that you wished

you known when you were my age that I should be thinking about? Yeah, great question. When I was 32, I was an assistant coach at Texas A&M and about to become the head coach at the University of New Orleans. That was in 2006 when I took that job. It was right after Hurricane Katrina, you probably have read about Hurricane Katrina at that time. It was one of the worst things that had happened in the United States. They interviewed five guys for the job.

I was able to get the job. And within 72 hours, I realized that I had made a poor decision mostly for my number one job as a husband and as a father. But also professionally, I knew because of Hurricane Katrina that the job that I had won it so bad as far as having the business card title, head coach, it was not gonna be the normal head coach opportunity, it was not gonna be the best chance to be head coach in a good way, I guess I should say.

And I think what I would say now is at 32, my ego was an enemy because I wanted to prove that I could do it. And now I don't even use business cards and I haven't used business cards since I was 33 because I was convicted that too much of the reason run on why I tried so hard to get that job 33 because I was convicted that too much of the reason Ron on why I tried so hard to get that job was so that I could

introduce myself as a head coach. And now, never ever do I ever say the head coach at Texas A&M and I have the printed business cards at Marquette or Virginia Tech or here because I never want that to get in my blood figuratively. Look at the chair that I sit in or the title that I have because I don't want that to impact the way that I lead or try to influence others. That's really, no, that's really beautiful. And yeah, the analogy for me is, is yeah, do you identify, you want that thing so bad, you want to be a writer,

you want to be a best-selling writer, you want to, whatever. But you can start, your identity starts to become associated with the accomplishment. And now, now you're compromised because you're, you've got to preserve it and you've got to brag about it. And now you're not you anymore. I think that your identity can't be rooted in.

It can't be built on what your title is, or what your position is, or what your income is. And I think at 32, too much. I think I was okay. I'm not saying that I was necessarily a bad person, but internally too much was based on, look where I'm at and look what I'm doing. And I'd just taken a job literally in the worst city

at that time you could have a coaching job. And it was, I mean, the arena, literally, there was no arena. That I did not, there was no locker room. Our players didn't have showers. It was the worst. And that's why two of the guys that were a part of that staff as a player and as a manager

are still with me now. That's how much it scarred my heart. But we have to live out of whatever identity or ID we embrace for our lives. And I think I was embracing too much of the wrong thing at 32 years old, 33 years old versus what I hope is, I hope that at 47, I'm embracing more of the things that matter or that are more important.

No, that's really beautiful. And thank you so much for sharing and giving me some of your time and and I'll let you get back to your family. I really appreciate this coach. I'm honored so thankful that you would even ask me to be on. Hey, just a cool heads up. Stillness is the key is for sale on Amazon iBooks anywhere that eBooks are sold right now at a steeply discounted price of $3.99. I don't choose this, the publishers in Amazon

put their heads together every once in a while and discount it, so that's available right now, check it out. I think it's some of my best writing. It pertains to everything we've been talking about here at Daily Stoic, you know, how can you slow things down, how can you get to that place of adoraxia that the Stoics talk about, place of apothea when we're not disturbed by outside passions. We're not roiled by internal tensions either, but we can focus as Marcus said, concentrate like a Roman,

deal with what's in front of us. Be still. That's what the book is about. It's the third in the sort of obstacles away. It goes to the enemy trilogy and now it's for sale for 399 on Amazon. Check it out. Anywhere books are sold. Hey, Prime Members. You can listen to the Daily Stoic early and ad free on Amazon music. Download the Amazon music app today Or you can listen early and ad free with Wondery Plus in Apple podcasts today, or you can listen early and add free with Wondery Plus in Apple podcasts.