The Daily Stoic - Tom Segura On Career, Comedy, And Craziness

Episode Date: October 11, 2023

Ryan speaks with Tom Segura in the second of a two-part conversation about the changing landscape of stand-up comedy, the philosophical mindset that he brings to his work, how he manages his media diet, why kids made him more tied to reality, and more.Tom Segura is a stand-up comedian, writer, author, actor, and podcaster. He co-hosts the Your Mom's House podcast with his wife and fellow comedian Christina Pazsitzky, as well as the podcast 2 Bears 1 Cave with best friend and fellow comedian Bert Kreischer. He has made two stand-up comedy albums and five specials on video, including Disgraceful (2018) and Ball Hog (2020), and he has appeared on the comedy shows Comedy Central Presents, Live at Gotham, and This Is Not Happening. You can find Tom’s work at tomsegura.com and on Instagram @seguratom and Twitter @tomsegura, on his YouTube channel.📚 Check out Tom’s book I’d Like to Play Alone, Please at the Painted Porch, and listen to Ryan’s appearance on 2 Bears, 1 Cave at www.youtube.com/watch?v=1uLDWf6jM-c.✉️ Sign up for the Daily Stoic email: https://dailystoic.com/dailyemail🏛 Check out the Daily Stoic Store for Stoic inspired products, signed books, and more.📱 Follow us: Instagram, Twitter, YouTube, TikTok, FacebookSee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Flurred to sound, the purest salt you can get. Some call it the caviar of salts. Most restaurants don't use it due to its price, but at Chopstick House and Bar, we won't use anything else to finish our 100% Canadian steaks. Taste ultimately, I shrugged it all off. That is, until a couple of years ago, when I discovered that every subsequent occupant of that house is convinced they've experienced something inexplicable too, including the most recent inhabitant who says she was visited at night by the ghost of a faceless woman. And it gets even stranger. It just so happens that the alleged ghost haunted my childhood room might just be my wife's great grandmother.

It was murdered in the house next door by two gunshots to the face. From wandering in Pineapple Street Studios comes Ghost Story, a podcast about family secrets, overwhelming coincidence, and the things that come back to haunt us. Follow Ghost Story on the wandering app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can binge all episodes ad-free right now by joining Wondry app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can binge all episodes at free right now by joining Wondry Plus. Welcome to the Daily Stoic podcast where each weekday we bring you a meditation inspired by the ancient Stox, a short passage of ancient wisdom designed to help you find strength and insight here in everyday life. And on Wednesdays, we talk to some of our fellow students of ancient philosophy, well-known and obscure, fascinating and powerful.

With them, we discuss the strategies and habits that have helped them become who they are, and also to find peace and wisdom in their actual lives. But first, we've got a quick message from one of our sponsors. Hey, it's Ryan Holiday. Welcome to another episode of the Daily Stoke Podcast. This is part two of my interview with Tom Sagura, the excellent and very, very, very funny comedian. I didn't mention this in my intro last time, but we have a kid who works here at the bookstore. He was working here over summer break. He worked here while he was in high school and then he came here back this summer's name's Austin.

And he obviously likes books. We wouldn't work at a bookstore, but he was telling us how excited he was earlier the summer to go to a Barnes & Noble in Austin to meet his favorite comedian to get him to sign a copy of a book that he loved. And that was today's guest, Tom Sagura. He wrote this great book called I Like to Play Alone Please,

which is a collection of very funny essays. Tom Sina, a handful of copies when he was here at the Painted Porch to do this interview. And he walked out with a bunch of books that I recommended that as I'm saying, I will post. But I really enjoyed sitting down and talking with Tom. One of the funniest people on the planet, his new special sled jammer is hilarious. Ball Hog is great. This graceful is great, completely normal.

It's great. And then there's other one, mostly stories. You can check out. I think all of them on Netflix. You can watch his podcast on YouTube where he has an enormous following. One called Your Mom's House, which he hosts with his wife, Christina P. He's an excellent guest in the podcast. And his other one, two bears, one cave, which I was on. I'll link to that to thanks to Tom for coming all the way out.

And I'm looking forward to going and seeing Tom when he performs in Austin, which he does on a regular basis. He's working on new material, which is something we talked about at the beginning of the first episode, you know, what it means to sort of clear out, to work on something for a long time, get it out of the world, and then have to start over from scratch. Well, that's what I am in the midst of myself,

having just turned in my next book, and then needing to start on the next one. So I'll let you get into this interview with Tom Segura. You can follow him on Instagram at Tom Segura, find tourdatesatom Segura.com, check out his many, many specials on Netflix, and check out his new book I'd like to play alone, please, which we have signed copies of here at the bookstore. So when I got signed by a big time management company, I was like, oh man, it's like, and this was like,

whoever was saying like, you gotta try to get with these people. I was like, really feeling myself. Yeah. I was supposed to start a, on a new show I was working in post production, and this was gonna be like a pretty big rug post you working for set runs like this would be a 12 week

or 16 week kind of run and I was gonna, I got a promotion and they were gonna give me over time for the first time. Yeah. And they would work us like dogs and I just walked into my post supervisor and I was like, Hey man, you know this thing happened yesterday. I signed with a manager and I was like, Hey, man, you know, this thing happened yesterday. I signed with a manager.

I was like, so I'm not going to be able to like you. I made it. I've made it because I have a manager. Yeah. And then I remember I call. I was like, yeah, he goes, oh, you have an audition for this movie tomorrow. It's first time I had like a big audition.

And I was like, yeah, I quit my job and he goes, what? I go, I quit my job. He goes, why? I go, some working with you now. And he was like, oh, okay. Well, we'll see how that, like you didn't know what to say. And I was like, oh man, I just cut my life support. No, I feel like I accidentally did that.

Like, I bought my first house, like with my, my paystubs, not my like 1099. You know what I mean? So I, like, I was like a regular person living life and then I had this artistic thing on the side that eventually overtook it. And yeah, you want, like you want to give yourself as much runway as possible. And I don't think people understand, it's like, if you blow up your life to pursue this thing, which sometimes you have to do to get out of stuff. But it's like, you're not going to have the leverage to not do shit that you don't want to do or that you shouldn't do because you don't have

any money and you literally need to live. You know, like, I got offered the first book, my first sort of offer to do a book came in like 2008 or 2009. Oh. And the opposite, which I ultimately did with the obstacles away, but the obstacles away didn't come out until 2014. He was going to say, okay. And Robert Green, who was my sort of mentor, was like, you have to turn this down. And I was like, are you kidding me? He's like, first off, it's a shitty deal.

Like, they're offering you no money upfront. It's not like a big publisher. Like, he's like, but that all of a sudden, content-wise, like, you're not ready to do this. And that was extremely hard. Like, you're getting your shot. And I have to be like, oh, wait for a later shot. That might not come around.

It's the hardest thing. It was so hard, but he was totally right. Because if I was, if I'm now looking back to the obstacle and what is the way I'm like, I'm a little young, it would have been insane to write that at 22 or something like that. It is. You're lucky that he told you, but you're lucky that you listened. Yes.

And I, it's a hard, I remember a very similar lesson. Everything was, there was a period where now it's like specials come out every week, and you can self-produce them. It's easier to, and it's fantastic for those comedies and also for staying up-com, it's great that you have so much coming out. But some people shouldn't be putting them out. Yes.

The, what happened before specials was albums, right? And so in like the early 2000s, is like, as albums, albums were the hottest probably in the late 90 like the early 2000s is like as albums albums were the hottest probably in the late 90s early 2000s and then it's a slow thing. It aligned with music where like album sales just started to decline. Yeah, but there were people who had like number one album. There's yes, big people. Big, big ones. So I remember right when I was like I'm probably only that's why it's a it was good that I listened also. I was like five years in maybe.

And I was working this weekend with David Tell, who's like, he's every comics favorite, and my favorite comedian of all time. I mean, he's just, he's amazing. And I was a huge fan. I couldn't believe I was working with him. And throughout the weekend, we're like, you know, just talking about this and that. And I was like, yeah, you know, I'm trying to figure out whether I should do it out, I think I should do it out. You know, you think I should do it out of them? And he goes, do you have an hour you're in love with? And I go, no, right.

He was like, I think there's your answer. I just kind of walked away. And I was like, oh yeah, just because somebody goes, you can record one, doesn't mean. Like that's literally when you should go, let's record or let's shoot this, is when you go, oh, this is fully cooked and ready to go. And anything other than that, like people are getting now

these opportunities to shoot these things. And you're like, hey man, have you been working this hour? Yeah, sure. It's not ready. Seneca, I have this word, euphemia, which he said is the sense of the path that you're on. And he said not being distracted by the past that crisscross yours, especially from those who are hopelessly lost. And that's extremely hard to have at any age, like, but I think younger, you know, you're like, well, someone's doing this and someone's doing this

because you're measuring yourself against all these other people. But then, even as you become successful, now all of a sudden, there's all these things that you can do. And it takes an immense amount of discipline, I think, also confidence, just like sort of self-awareness and sort of strategy to go like, here's when I'm, here are the things I want to do, here's when I want to do them and like not really paying attention to what other people are doing or everything that's coming into your inbox. It takes all those things, right? And then because

you also, that comparison thing, it also just shifts, you just compare yourself to new people, more successful people. Sure. People who are doing incredible things. But I also feel like you get this, if you're not too caught up in that chase and in your own ego and everything, you actually learn to like really settle into the fact that you intellectually grasp like, oh, like he's, I'm not comparing myself to what Ryan's doing, whatever he just did, like he's on his own path. And you kind of get this thing where you're like, you're not, you find that it doesn't make you go like, what about me? Like, you know, like you

did, I did do that at 25. And like now, when I hear about that, I don't go like, what about me? Like, you know, like, I did do that at 25 and like now, when I hear about that, I don't go like, like, what am I gonna do? You know, like. Well, it's also helpful to realize, like, some people are profoundly unhappy. And then other people don't like doing the thing. So like, like, I try to remind myself, like,

I like writing. Like, I like writing books. That's what I enjoy doing. So I didn't get into writing as it means to an end like I like writing. I like writing books. That's what I enjoy doing. So I didn't get into writing as it means to an end to do something else. That is the end. That is the end, yeah. And so, yes, there's definitely different opportunities

and different ways to monetize it. And some of that helps you do the thing. But if I'm like, well, so and so, just started a company or so and so speaking this many dates a year, I go, that's all great, but my main thing was writing. Like the reward for getting successful at this thing should not be that I don't get to do the thing anymore. If the reward for me is doing the thing,

if you hate it, like I'm sure there's stand-up comics who are good at stand-up comedy, but they love acting. Yeah, yeah. But they love writing or whatever. So for them, they're getting in and then they're getting out. Yeah, yeah. But they love writing or whatever. So for them, they're getting in and then they're getting out. Yeah, totally. But if you don't want to get out, don't follow the people who are getting out or you're going to get out and be unhappy.

I've seen both examples. It's fascinating to watch because you can tell the ones who like the first acting thing that comes in there, like I'll see you guys later. And they're fine because they're happy with that. What's more interesting almost is the people who turn down some of those opportunities that come when you have stand-up success. And you're like, you don't want to do that shit.

Yeah, you're like, really? You almost can't believe it at first because we're also kind of, we're all brought up. Now it's shifted. So if you're in your 20s now doing stand-up, you don't have the same kind of Model that we had but our model was like you do stand up so that you can get a sitcom

That was the win now people turn down those things left and right But you're also definitely not supposed to say no to things that could pay you a lot of money sure That's stupid and irresponsible. The other thing though that is crazy, that some people still have are unaware of, is that high, like high level big time touring comedians make way more money. Sure. And even like some of those talent agents who represent actors are just kind of learning this. They're like,

yeah, you know, like that committee is going to lose money doing your thing. Lose. Yeah. I guess they really want to do it. You know. I remember as I worked at a talent management agency when I first moved L.A. and I signed this YouTuber and I was like in the break room or something and some guy came up to me who was like a reality star television manager or something and he goes, I heard you sign this person on YouTube. He's like, what are you going to do? Commission ad checks. And I was like, yeah. And he was like, he just thought that was like the craziest thing in the world, which is of course now what everyone wants to do. Of course.

And it's, yeah, first off, if you don't understand how the business actually works, you think you're making a good financial decision, but actually long-term viability and independence is always going to be the best financial decision you can make. But you're just not, you're not supposed to like, I remember, this wasn't that long. In 2016, after Trump got elected, I got, and I more or less gotten totally out of the sort of media and marketing world, but I got offered a job as the press secretary for like a cabinet member. So I'd moved to Washington DC, I would be up there. I remember this. It would have been like a whole twist. It it would have been a, it could, you could see it, put aside from the fact

that the whole administration is unconscionable and I want to zero part of it. But it was that administration that offered you. Yes, yes. But it would have, I mean, who knows what I'd be doing now, right? I mean, I know what I'd be doing now because I'd be one of these,

it didn't work out well for anyone that took those jobs for the most part. Like the best ones had to like testify for the January 6th commission, right? And the worst ones are way worse. But the point is, it's hard when people want you to do stuff to be like, I appreciate it, but it's not for me.

Which is what you said, kind of, right? Did you, like, yeah, I kind of remember. I mean, honestly, what flashed through my head was, my wife's not for me. Yeah, which is what you said, kind of, right? Yeah, I kind of remember. I mean, honestly, what flashed through my head was my wife's gonna support me. I had my youngest was just born. I was like, my wife was gonna support me. When I do this distance, and then I was like, flash forward a couple of years.

When I think about why we got divorced, it's gonna be because I took a job in a city that I don't live in and don't wanna live in. Don't wanna live in. Yeah, and I was like, so it doesn't matter how good this is. One version of what I want my life to be is to not blow up the life that I currently have. And then it was like, then it was like the logistics of like,

then you gotta put all your money in like a trust. And I was like, my career was just starting also to, I was like, I work so hard to get to be a person who writes about whatever I want. Then I'm gonna have a job, like, or that show. What would your job have been? It would be, press secretary? Press secretary to a accountant.

So you're like, you do all their media stuff. You said you could do it too. Yeah, I definitely could have done it. I also think I would have liked to have you as my manager back then. Yeah, that would have been fun. But I also think I would have liked to have you as my manager back then. Yeah, that would have been fun. That would have been fun. But I also, again, yeah, I remember I was like,

these people all drive nice cars. They seem important. They have lunch at fancy places. Sure. But I was like, what do they fucking do? I know, you would have been suits every day too, by the way. Yeah, well, I was like, but they don't do anything. Yeah.

I was like, they literally don't do anything. They take a chunk of other people's money. I don't hate all agents or managers. I like mine and stuff too. But I'm just like, they don't do, their contribution to society is not a creative one. I was like, that doesn't... What are their facilitators basically, right?

I was like, that doesn't, that's not, that doesn't, that doesn't, I think everyone has kind of a unique potential, like a unique thing that they can contribute. And you've got to figure out what that is and do that. How long were you a talent manager? I wasn't a manager in the sense, because I was a kid, but like I was like an assistant and I was signing people.

So I was like going places. Yeah. So I was like on a desk for a little while, and then I got promoted to being like a new media person that I dropped out of college, and then I got fired in this sort of controversy. But, really? I think we might have told the story on your part.

I know what I'm talking about. Yeah, so I was working for Robert Green at the time, and so I had his books on my desk, and one of which was the 40 lots of power, and the manager of the company, one of the partners at the company, one of the partners was a fan slash friend that's who'd hired me who I was working for, but his partner became convinced that I was like plotting or scheming.

And was this after you had worked with Green? I was still working with, I was working with, I was doing these two things at the same time. I got you. But so then we sort of had it out. Wait, Kamizah, you were plotting to like take over. I know that I was just, yeah, that I was like an ambitious kid who couldn't be trusted and there's something crazy.

You could raise four day laws at power. It was hilarious and insane. And then I also had sucked. I mean, I hated it. Yeah. Any system that makes you do shit for a long time to maybe someday not have to do shit is probably a broken corrupt system. Yeah. Yeah. Like that, you know, they used to

start in the mail room. Then there's not really mail rooms anymore. But then you would start answering phones. Sure. And it was just the fucking worst. Yeah. So people love it. That's the crazy. Some it's some people's like, they love that business. You know what I mean? Like they yeah, you meet them and they're like, I started in that room and then I moved up to, and they just, you could just see them light up talking about it. They love it.

Yeah, I guess, yeah, I guess I should be more understanding. Well, I want to ask you, because you know how sometimes in conversation, I've seen you on other podcasts, you'll be like, oh, you know, Marcus Aurelia said that Senna could use to say this, are all those, do you stay fresh by still? Talking about them?

And like, you know, going back and reading parts of it sometimes, because I can't all just be from when you read it the first time, right? No, no, no, I think, so I think that's actually an interesting question. I think philosophy isn't something that you read one time. It's not like I read a novel or this,

like I read it and I got it. It's supposed to be this process that you're engaging in. So, to quote, Epictetus says you should write about it, talk about it, share it, and you should be engaging with it. And that's the process. So, that's what I'm doing just like as a person who's interested in the stuff. And then that's what I'm doing, just like as a person who's interested in this stuff, and then I have this extra benefit of because I talk about it and I have supposed to be writing

about it, I publish it. I'm engaging with it all the time, which is also the philosophical process. So, I have a recall because I'm supposed to be popularizing and sharing the idea. Sure. Engaging with it. It makes sense. It does. I think the same thing holds true for, I say this for health and fitness. Yeah. That you shouldn't, like, keep it to yourself.

Yeah. You should talk about it because of the more you talk about it, you almost are prompting yourself to be accountable to it. Do you know what I mean? So if you're like, you shouldn't eat this for this reason, you're also having the extra benefit of reminding yourself why you don't eat that. Yeah, it's like when someone's like, so what do you eat? You go like, you say the things and then you're like, yes, if I have an eating that, that's

what I should eat. Or like, what do you do for workouts? So it's like, blah, blah, blah. And then it's like, if I leave here, three days a week, and I do these things, I think it's good to like have the conversation all the time. I'm Rob Briden and welcome to my podcast, Briden and. We are now in our third series. Among those still to come is some Michael Paling, the comedy duo Egg and Robbie Williams. The list goes on.

So do sit back and enjoy. Brighten and on Amazon Music, Wondery Plus or wherever you get your podcasts. Emily, do you remember when One Direction called it a day? I think you'll find there are still many people who can't talk about it. Well luckily, we can. A lot, because our new season of Terabli Famous is all about the first One Directioner to go it alone.

Zayn Malik. We'll take you on Zayn's journey from Shilad from Bradford to being in the world's biggest boy band and explore why, when he reached the top, he decided to walk away. Follow terribly famous wherever you get your podcast. It's terribly famous. What's about making it part of your identity is opposed to just this thing that you know. And then there's a benefit for me, obviously also of writing about it, is like I have to be like, oh, I can't,

I can't act differently. Which applies to the same thing, right? Because if you ask me about workouts and stuff and I'm like, then I can't be like, I'm just not, I'm not gonna do it this week. Yeah, yeah, sure. Yeah, someone told me like when people ask you to do stuff, you can reply like, I have a rule that, right? So like, you know, like, I have a rule I don't accept, you know, like free gifts or something

like that. You're saying to yourself what the rule, it's not, I don't actually need to know. You're saying to yourself, that's my rule. It's your reminder. And it's reaffirming. It's like with boundaries, you're like, sorry, like, I don't go in, I don't, you know, I don't go in other people's hotel rooms or something like that. Yeah, right, right. You're like, I don't do that other people's hotel rooms. Or something like that.

You're like, I don't do that. It's weird, I know, but that's me, it's not you. And then you don't find yourself in people's hotel rooms. You shouldn't be. Sure. Or if you're like, I don't do drugs. I don't do that. No, that's the thing, man.

I'm completely sober. If you're just like, sometimes sometimes not, then someone's like, you sure? Yeah, yeah. And then, yeah. Yeah, that's then then someone's like sure. Yeah. Yeah, and then yeah, yeah That's a good way to approach it. Yeah, yeah, but I Also some of the reasons I say them is then they get cut up and go and eclipse And there's also a performative element that's a little weird, but Yeah, people are like how do you know all this stuff? It's like well, it's my that's like my job

It is and you're literally, I was just in your office. Yeah. And there's just like crates of notes. So like, yeah, I could see, even seeing that go, oh, okay, at least like, I could see it. You're writing this chapter, you access this information, you're reminded yourself of this quote from this, you know, it makes sense how it kind of is.

When I actually learned that as a research assistant, that's how I started. Like my job was to find that stuff for Robert. It's crazy. So you sort of developed a habit, and then that habit generates the stuff that you do. 48 laws of power to me, by the way, feels like somebody talking about like the Godfather movie.

Yeah. And then you being like, oh, I haven't seen about like the Godfather movie. Yeah. And then you being like, oh, I haven't seen, like I haven't read that. Oh, really? But I've heard it, like I'm saying, I've heard it talked about in the same way, you know, like just the unbelievable, like the, and I'm still in like, I have to read this book.

Well, Bill Simmons had a thing where he's like, you should always have one movie that you haven't seen. And like, he's like, I've never seen the Big Lebowski. And he won't see it just as a bothers people, you know? I'll just still like get a rise out of there. That's kind of funny. So, but there are things like that where you're like, at a certain point, you're just like, I think like that ship,

the ship is past. And like, I feel it'd be weird to go back. And what funny thing is, if it's super influential in in pop culture and you wait a while, you'll see derivative versions of it. And then the original won't hit. It won't have the same impact. If you see a comedy, comedy especially because what happens is a comedy that is a breakout comedy has something in it that's kind of, even though there's no a totally original premises and stuff, there's something,

there's some quality of it that they're doing kind of for the first time. Sure. And then when it's a hit, there will be all these knockoff versions of it. And you will be, if you don't watch that original, you'll be unaware that you're watching knockoff versions of this big thing. And then when you finally go see it, you'll be like, oh, I've seen knockoff versions of this big thing. And then when you finally go see it, you'll be like, oh, I've seen like 20 versions of this. It won't have the same impact on you.

It's also a little awkward. Like I remember actually in Jim Gaffkin's first special, the company's central one, he has a joke, and he's like, is anyone seeing the movie heat? You know, and they're like, that's from eight years ago. Yeah, but I want to talk about it now. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And you're just like, you don't want to be,

you've been pretending that you've seen it, or just like not admitting that you haven't seen it, and now you have it, but to talk about it is to admit that you were late. Yeah, I'm late on, I'm late on shows almost all the time. Yeah, I mean, look, I'm out, I'm out at night, I'm performing at night. I do have a little bit of that thing too that I don't

know what the origin of it is where everybody's like, have you seen it? I'm like, oh, fuck off. Yeah. Yeah. Like, you know, like I... And then when I do watch those things, I'm like, this is amazing. Yeah, it's like I kick myself. Same. I still remember breaking, but everyone's about breaking, but I'm like, what is everybody talking about? And then I started breaking bad as the final season was airing, and I was like, this is outrageously good. Yeah, this is amazing. Because seeing this show was like,

I've got time. It was the most amazing show. But yeah, I mean, I haven't seen a lot of the big shows I completely miss. I just did that with succession. Like I started it just as finishing. And it was amazing. But also, I found that as I've had kids

and then as I've gotten bit like, it's not that I don't, it's like I don't need whatever those shows do for people. And so like what I really wanna watch is like a rerun of the office or sign filled for like the eight thousandth time or sports. Like I wanna watch something that like, the stakes are very low.

Yeah. And I don't wanna to be emotionally manipulated. You know? I also feel like, yeah, I mean, I also have this thing where I'll watch two episodes or something. Yeah. And that. But one of the things about streamers

that I don't think we talk about enough is like, OK, so the old model was like, it's got to be good enough that you're talking about it and then you look forward to it every week. Yeah. Now the model is like, basically, they're just trying to steal as much time from you as humanly possible, right?

So you watch one hour of bloodlines or whatever and then it doesn't have to be that good. It just has to be good enough in the last five minutes that you let the auto place start the next episode. And so realizing that you're just kind of being emotional, for me realizing I was just kind of being emotionally toyed with to spend hours veged out in one sitting,

it kind of broke the spell of it for me, and then I go like, I like feeling good, and these things inherently make me feel bad. Same thing with like Twitter. The point of Twitter is to make you say there, hate yourself and humanity enough that you keep tweeting and checking, and you could also just not do that.

Yeah, I've all but abandoned, and not because I have some grand plan to do so, almost all social media. I mean, the only social media that I'm active on is Instagram. Yeah. Somebody manages, like does TikTok for me. Somebody does Facebook for me.

I don't even know, I don't even have a lot of people. And Twitter just kind of sits there. I sometimes just go, oh, I should repost that there. I don't really think about it. Right. I mean, that's sort of, you know, I'm happy about it. I'm not, I'm not bum, but that's the reality of it. I get more done when I'm not on those things.

I'm never on social media and I go, I'm so glad I did that. Like afterwards, I never feel good. It's not shame, but it's just like a, that triggered things that are not conducive in me to liking my life. Sure. Christophe DeFato, a body of mine,

really funny comedian, although a lot of people don't know. He's fantastic. He told me a few months back that he gave somebody else the login and what he does is when you see a post of his, he has recorded it, but he sends it to that person the post.

So he's like, I don't see anything. That's how it is for all of it gets done and it's scheduled. And everyone saw I checked to see how stuff's doing or messages from people that I actually know because that's the problem is that it is also how you interact with people. Or you find people that you wanna be friends with

because your fans of their work, and they connect with you like, oh shit, tagged me I didn't know that's like that's a sort of a high level cool thing that have but like like when I see like Elon Musk has 11 kids he's 11 he's 11 kids he runs three or four companies he's the richest person in the world and he tweets like 90 times a day. Almost like he owns the thing. But like, he should be too busy. No, I co-complete the agreement.

It's like what's wrong with you. And also, if you're in that position, let's say you sent some tweets, you're like, all right, this is like some, you know, kind of messages I went out to. He's just like, replying to a guy who's like, you're shit sucks. It's like cat turned six said something anti-stimetic. And I'm gonna be like, wow, you make a good point. He's replying to people who, and he's like making fun of them.

Like, you have time for this? How do you have time for this? Well, he's like seeking out culture war issues to like get mad about. I don't understand it at all. I really don't understand it. It's something these breaks in people's brains and in their soul and then it's a feedback loop where it

makes you worse. Like something about this too, the actual purchase of Twitter, I think might be related to his activity on it. Because he, you know, he made an offer that he was then did not want to. And then the SEC everybody got involved. They're like, they're holding you to this now.

And so this like, on paper, I mean, I don't know how anybody looks at this and goes, this is a great investment. It may be the worst investment of all time. It seems insane. And also when you compare prior purchases of massive social media companies by individuals and or companies for large amounts of money have all ended in disaster.

So when you look at an acquisition of something like this, for, you go, it's Twitter for $44 billion. And you're telling me that like this is like a savvy, and I mean, you know, I'm, I'm, because anyone torched their brand in a shorter amount of time? He was, you know, the other thing that's, I, I've never heard, I don't know, I've done for people who analyze this, but like, you know, one of the big things in, in brands globally is brand recognition, right? Like one of the most recognizable brands would be like Rolex.

Everyone knows what that is. A Coke, Mercedes, right? And Twitter is like a pretty well known thing and to change the name of it. Oh, that's a stupid on a whole. This is like, it's a strange thing to do. But I mean, people liked and admired and respected you on this. No, I know. It's a very strange, it's a strange,

it's a strange, and here's the thing, he has a bunch of super-fenets. That's pretty cool. They just suck. Yeah, he's, he's, he's a, people who are like, but they admire him in a way that doesn't even seem like somewhat rational. They're, they're, it's a messiah thing, right? Right. With their like, this guy is a God. And they actually believe that his, his motives in everything is to better humanity. I'm like, are you fucking out of your mind that you think that all of these things are just,

I'm just here to help people. You buy that. And do you ask these people and they completely do buy it? They think that it's, it's just the, the betterment of all humanity is why he's doing all these things like you think that's why he's been a 44 billion dollars Because he's such a champion of free speech like it's it's I Don't know man. It feels like I'm living in You know like make believe land when you when you hear these arguments and the worst part is When you decide to engage In that conversation, because you know how nonsensical it is,

it's like I'm not even gonna talk to one of those people about it. Well, one of my favorite ideas from the Stux is, Marius says, you know, remember, you always have the power to have no opinion. And he fundamentally lacks the ability to just not have opinions about stuff. It's like Paul Pelosi gets a viciously attacked

by a crazy person. And it's like, I'm going to speculate about why that happened. And I'm going to speculate something that if true, if not true, is abhorrently cruel, right? So what if I just, what if, what if I didn't have an opinion? And then if I do have an opinion, what if I just kept it to my fucking self? That's like a sort of basic discipline and decency that a human being has to cultivate.

And you see how he is this incredibly successful person who just makes his life harder over and over and over again. Lighting that is these boards. I think he's bored. I think he has no one around him that can tell him anything. And then I think he's also fundamentally unhealthy and unbalanced in the sense that it's not normal to be doing all this stuff. So there's probably like uppers and downers that maintain the whole thing.

And that is bad for the human regulatory system. And you're also chase, I think, because you experience this, I've experienced this, which is when somebody goes, man, you're brilliant chase I think because you experience this I've experienced this which is when somebody goes Man, you're brilliant, right? Yeah, you're the genius. Yeah, and there's this part of you the first time that like you know, you get like this dopamine hit from it, right? They're like you're fucking so brilliant. Yeah, and But there's this part of your brain that goes that is Over the top superlative.

Yeah. That's hyperbole. Sure. And you get regulated and you go, like, you're not, right? Yeah. Or you tell your, like, I'm not. Like, it's nice to hear, but I'm not. And I think when you hear it from so many people, you have this choice where you go, like,

maybe I can just kind of float in the space all the time. Yeah. And I think he kind of does. I think he kind of goes, like, he likes the fact where you go like, maybe I can just kind of float in the space. Is it a little bit all the time? Yeah. And I think he kind of does. I think he kind of goes like, he likes the fact that Pete, like a serious newscaster will start their interview with by being like, you are a genius. Yeah. And he's just like, and I mean, he's obviously a very bright guy. I'm not saying that he's not, but I think you start

to like want to live that, you know, like to feel that 24-7. We can't see tomorrow, but we can hear it. And it sounds like a wind farm powering homes across the country. We're bridging to a sustainable energy future, working today to ensure tomorrow is on. Enbridge, life takes energy. Hello, I'm Hannah. And I'm Suryte.

And we are the hosts of a Red Handed, a weekly true crime podcast. Every week on Red Handed, we get stuck into the most talked about cases. But we also dig into those you might not have heard of. Like the Nephiles Royal Massacre, and the Nithory Child Sacrifices. Whatever the case, we want to know what pushes people to the extremes of human behavior. Find, download, and binge-read-handed wherever you listen to your podcasts. You have a great bit that I love. I won't be making a performance unless you want to. But it's about how once you had kids, you just like, you didn't have time for certain

stuff anymore. And I do think of all people Elon Musk should have no time for this. But even if you only have one kid or if anything, you don't have time to get in arguments with strangers on the internet. You just don't have time for it. No, you don't. You got to post and release. You had to move on. Yeah, you're just consumed by too many other things. Yeah. Like even, I don't know, I have a lot of freedoms because of my job, but even today, come here, I got to split, I got to go to a thing, then I got to get the kids.

Yeah, take them to this class, and then it's like, yeah, you're just regulated with things to do. But it's important, like, they could be like, oh, like family ties you down. It ties you down to reality. Yeah. Because to earth, because you can't do anything you want, every whenever you want it. No. And it's actually important that you have those burdens because they, it's like ballast. It's the last holes that keep you in line, man. Yeah. Yeah.

They're just like, Jesus, they're so funny, man. But yeah, no, they, they, they, I was thinking about how, how, you know, I was thinking about how, you know, I was thinking about on the way here, how my kids are the ones who have made me like be aware and laugh at my outrage when I've gotten upset. And I'm like, no one's ever done that to me, you know, in my whole life, like I'm driving. It didn't take it seriously. They don't take me, you know, in my whole life. Yeah. Like I'm driving. It didn't take it seriously.

They don't take it because you're a joke of a person. Yeah. And you are when you're doing that. I'm driving the car. Yeah. And I think about this that like how everyone else has reacted. I'm driving the car and it's like, you know, whatever they're doing back there. I'm like, knock it off.

Yeah. Hey guys, seriously. Hey, if you know, you know, I'm going to count to three. Yeah. You know what? When we I'm gonna count to three. Yeah. You know what, when we get home, then, taking the stuff away, guys, and then I'm like, I've heard about, you know, like, God damn it. And as I'm doing that, my youngest is laughing so hard.

And I'm in a full, like, full, like rage. Not at the front. You know, as you're totally impotent, you can't do anything about it. And then he's like, he's laughing so hard that I turn back and I start to laugh to myself. And that's the part that's never happened. You know what I mean?

When you go, I'm fucking serious. Everyone's like, all right, all right, all right. But this is the only time where I've done that. And then laughed and I'm driving. I'm like, that got me nowhere. Like how silly do I look? Then I even, in my own head, go, this is not worth getting as upset as I've just got.

And then this kid's just like, do that thing again. Like, he thinks it's a bit. Yeah, yeah, sure. No, as an adult, you have made up that it's not pathetic and ridiculous to be yelling in your closed metal box at someone else traveling 80 miles an hour away from you in their own metal box. But your kid, that's the most absurd thing in the entire world. They've also checked me in a different, like, at home.

I'm very upset about something and I've had them be like, hey, I'm like, what? He's like, I'm a kid, you need to talk to me. I'm like, what the fuck, man? Like, and I start laughing again. And then I realize that he's right. That's the crazy thing. Is this a fucking seven year old, just being like, as a kid,

you just need to talk to me in a normal voice. I'm like, okay. Could you please not paint the walls? Like, they weaponize stuff stuff and it's so brilliant. Like I was asking myself, I was like, hey, I need you to do this or whatever. And he goes, is it okay if I say no? Like, yeah, yeah.

And I was like, where did that's like, or you gotta put on your clothes and be like, my body and my choice. You know, and you like get these things. That actually, it's actually like a good point and that is a thing that you should know. And I'm glad that you know it. And why am I the only person that you're using it against?

You know, like a stranger, you probably like sure, put a new shirt on me. Like, but like me, I'm doing it. And you're gonna get in my way about it. But like, so where did you get this? And it just stops you, it's like when he was like, is it okay if I say no? It was so earnest that it stopped me cold.

And I was like, I mean, I guess. Yeah. It doesn't, this, what I'm asking you to do, I don't even know why I'm asking you to do it, it doesn't actually matter. Sure. So sure. Yes, you can, you can choose to say, yeah, you should choose to say no. And it kind of just stops you just like that.

It does. And it really makes you think about how stupid things are. Yeah, so why do we have to be on time? Why are these rules about, you know, like, I know do we have to be on time? What are these rules about? I don't know why we have to be on time. I just made up in my head that it would be bad if we got here at 1006 instead of 10. And I don't even want to go to the thing that I'm rushing this towards. And you don't want to go, so we should take our time.

Then we don't have to be there as long. It's like, great point. The other day, he picked up a copy of the Daily Stokes, she's on the counter, goes, oh look, it's Daddy's book, The Daily Butthole. Just like, great, appreciate that. And so there's also just an inherent and repeated humbling that happened to him. I get called so many names. Butthole is like one of the most popular.

Yeah. Yeah, the other day, I couldn't get this flashlight that I plugged in, it wouldn't come on. And then I, I come in the room and it's on, I go, how'd you get that to work? And he goes, I used my ass. I go, hey man, I go, no seriously, how'd you get to work?

He goes, I did. And I go, I really want to know. And then he comes over and he shows me that he used his ass to like, to push it into the wall. And I go, okay, he goes, maybe try using your ass. And I go, okay, thank you very much. Like, yeah, it's a lot of insults. I get a lot of insults from these guys.

I have learned, like, whenever my kids say that they've saw something or that something happened that I just have to believe them, you know, they're like, I saw a monkey riding a tricycle. And I'm sure you did. And then, sure enough, there's like a monkey riding a tricycle. Yeah. Actually, what happened with your son?

I don't remember exactly. So I won't, like, you don't have to say what it is. But your son has like a weird nickname, right? And my son goes like, can we send this to computer? And I go like, what the fuck are you talking about? And I went to my wife and I was like, what the fuck is, who is this person he's talking about? And it was your kid. Yeah. You know, you wanted to like send him something from Minecraft or whatever and I go, oh, okay. I just assume, like I assume you don't know

what you're talking about because you never know what you're talking about. And in fact, you always know what you're talking about. And I'm the one who doesn't know what I'm talking about. That's totally true. They say things that are, you know, when it sounds outrageous, it is actually true. Yes.

Yeah. It happens all the time, all the time. No, like I remember if you would come in our room in the middle of the night And go like something woke me up and we're like sure you did you just want to come in our bed And then one night I slept in his bed for so I fell asleep in his bed and then sure enough at like two in the morning Something my neighbors were doing woke me up And I was like it was actually a really good lesson to me, which is like Hear them like actually put them in.

Yeah. Because again, they might be wrong. Like there isn't actually a monster in the closet, but it turns out there's this thing that's lighting up. It looks like eyes. Yeah. And that's terrifying. And so it's also this hunt, like you think you know, but you don't. And if you just listen, they'll tell you.

And then the other thing I've tried to remember is a great piece of advice I got about printing. They said, the language of children is behavior. So like, they don't know what they're experiencing. And they couldn't articulate it if they did. So their behavior is telling you something. So you have to listen to that also. It's really interesting. Yeah, the behavior and and they basically tell you they do tell you they lie. Yeah, but they do tell you what happened. They don't they they every time like they tell me something that they saw or experienced. I could just got into somewhat of a fight at school. One of them did and I was like,

but I mean, I learned, you know, the story changed, but the bones were true, you know, the bones were true. Yeah, it's, it's like, I don't think my kids have ever said, I'm tired, I'm hungry. But when my oldest hit his brother, he was saying, I'm tired or I'm hungry. Sure.

You know, it's like they're speaking, they just don't have the words to say those things. And then so if I can sort of go, okay, they're speaking with their behavior and I have to like, I'm reading you loud and clear that it's time to leave this party. Yeah. You know, like you are telling me,

because actually we found this with my son, you would do this thing where he'd be like, I'd be like, you know, if you throw telling me, because actually we found this with my son, he would do this thing where he'd be like, I'd be like, you know, if you throw a sand at the beach again, we're gonna have to go home. And then it's like, oh, he wants to go home. He wants to go home, right? And actually, because why is he throwing an after we said this? It's like, oh, he didn't know he could just ask to go home.

Right. And because he didn't think that he has the power to tell the whole family that we can leave. But he does. You could say, like, hey, I'm ready to go and be like, okay, well, we'll wrap up. We'll wrap up. We'll wrap up.

We'll wrap up. We'll wrap up. We'll wrap up. We'll wrap up. We'll wrap up. We'll wrap up. We'll wrap up. We'll wrap up.

We'll wrap up. We'll wrap up. We'll wrap up. We'll wrap up. We'll wrap up. We'll wrap up. We'll wrap up. We'll wrap up. We'll wrap up. We'll wrap up. We'll wrap up. We'll wrap up. like your spouse isn't being a bitch, she's tired or hungry. Right. Or like the person in front of you is having a hard time.

Like they're not a monster, they're just having a hard time. They're not being that way on purpose. They would rather not be this way. Right. You can, it doesn't make it always possible to put up with it, but it makes it easier to put up with. If you have awareness, yes, because I think the big thing is that like most of us, a lot of us,

are living in this place in our head where voluntarily or involuntarily, you're not considering any of that. You're not considering it with your own kids. You can be like, the fuck would you throw the sand again for? You know? Yeah. And then you have to go like, oh, like you have to take yourself to the place where you go,

I should be reading behaviors. I should be reading the fact that like, and then I met up with Ryan the day, and like he was, you were acting a certain, you were, you know, whatever, like through a glass on the ground, like I should read into that. There's something that's causing that, you know? But the fucked up thing is we do it for ourselves. We go like, I'm not an asshole, I'm tired into that. There's something that's causing that, you know? But the fucked up thing is we do it for ourselves.

We go like, I'm not an asshole, I'm tired. Exactly. But then for other people, we're like, they're an asshole. Yes, I read this thing one time about the justice system about how when somebody who's close to you commits a crime, but you know them well, or your wife. You plead to the court, like, she should, please show mercy, because you know this person so well.

So if it's someone I know and care for, treat them this way. Yes. When it's a stranger, you're like, fuck and drop the hammer on them, like put them away forever, right? Yeah. So it all depends on your relationship.

Sure. And like, your relationship to yourself, obviously, you're not closer to anyone. So it's always like, please have some compassion for what I did. Yeah, I read about a study one time that was saying, they could look at judges where they're just seeing the same case over and over again.

So like a traffic court judge or whatever, where it's like they could compare apples to apples. And the judges were more lenient in the morning and they would get less lenient towards lunch. and then after lunch, they would get lenient again, and then towards the end of the day, just because they're tired and hungry. And you're just like, oh, yeah. So we think, you know, we think we have these philosophical principles, these ethics or you know, these standards, we do.

But then our biology and our physiology is acting on it at all times. And we're pretty forgiving of ourselves. We go like, I am not a bad person. I just lost my temper in this moment. That was the worst moment in my life. But then other people we see as fixed or conscious or culpable for everything we do better. Yes. Yeah. But you didn't or they didn't do better, but they did it anyway, just like you know you're not supposed to eat donuts, but you passed a donut shop and you bought one. It doesn't say anything about you as a person necessarily. You made a choice.

Yeah. An individual action that doesn't necessarily represent the whole. Yeah. And the other lesson here is to have those, move your court time to 8 a.m. or 130. Yeah. Sounds like right. And then also probably like rich lawyers know this, and they is like different. Like what time are we?

Let's just risk that. Yeah, like people, there's a whole other level that some people are operating on. You, some clueless guys, now I've never gotten in trouble before, it comes from, you know, ends up with the 1150 court appearance. Yeah. And does three years in jail because he didn't, he wasn't afforded the same.

He was just one of the sandwich. Yeah. Well, they go back to that welfare thing. We're talking, like the reason poor people eat bad food and they use their snap benefits to do it is that one, they tend to live in food deserts. They don't, they don't go to whole foods where they're choosing between these things. They go to, they're choosing between 7, 11 and foodmark or whatever. And then also, willpower, they tend to think, is a finite resource. So if you have to ride the bus to work every day, like you're going to be more tired than the person who drives their luxury car to work

every day. And then when it comes time to choose what they're gonna eat for dinner, like they're not gonna be like, I'm gonna make something healthy. They're like literally just any calories. Anything, just put something in. Yeah. I did love the Ted Cruz bit though. I thought it was amazing.

Oh, thanks. I can see why you cut it, but it was spectacular. Well, I like to say, you know, in that, I say it in the bit, and I've said it, I've said it may or may not have been. Yes. The member of Yal said it, I've said it may or may not have been. Yes. The member of Yolk Cater, as they call it.

Great guy. The funny thing, I'll tell you this, the funny thing about that bit is, because I remember, we always say that we all talk about COVID, right? Yeah. So during the Trump years, all of us had, at least, it wasn't necessarily a joke even, like a harsh, I hate Trump, it, you just talked about him in some way. I had a bit that I don't even fully recall, I guess how sparingly I did it, but I had a bit about him about Trump. Sorry about Trump. And you would find that they would land really well. And then you could, you could

tell that you were in like a red market. Even though, my point is that even though it wasn't like a harsh, but bashing trumpet, it was more like about his personality, his bravado and stuff. And so you know, you just kind of, you just read just sort of these things in your head. You were like, Oh, that told me something. Like I was in Green Bay, I remember. And then they were like, they kind of pulled back. And I was like, this is a real red market, fine. Kind of move on. It's not even my forte to do.

But the final thing was telling that Cruz bit, you know, it's like a, it's the final thing that reveals saying his name. And that shit killed in every market. Including in Canada, in Central America, I did it. I did it in Europe. And you're like, this person is loathed universally. And then you kind of go, how does this person get elected?

If they're like, because I'm saying it in every city and everybody is like cheering for this guy being a bad guy in the story. Even the other senators don't like take groups. I mean, you know, the least popular. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I remember I asked Al Franken though and he was, he's a good joke about that.

Yeah, really funny bit about it. Yeah. And he was just like, even the shittiest people think he's a piece of shit. I'm like, he was pretty, yeah, it was pretty great. But yeah, it's funny that someone could be that universally disliked. How do you wake up every day? I don't know, and I don't even know, like, I almost respect it.

I do too. It's almost a version of we're saying, like ignore that don't read the comments, don't be like, he has to really be able to be like, nope, I'm right. I'm like to, to everyone. It's pretty wild. Yeah, there's like a Michael Scottness to it.

Yeah. Like, you're just the worst. Everyone thinks you're a fool, but there's some part of you that doesn't allow you to realize that or you would change. You're like, I'm pretty great. Yeah. Well, this is amazing, man. Thank you. This was a lot of fun. I'm sorry that I had to split early. Good.

We did a lot. Okay. Sweet. We did a lot. Okay. Sweet. Thanks so much for listening. If you could rate this podcast and leave a review on iTunes, that would mean so much to us and it would really help the show. We appreciate it and I'll see you next episode. Hey, Prime Members, you can listen to the Daily Stoic Early and Add Free on Amazon Music,

download the Amazon Music app today, or you can listen early and add free with Wondery Plus in Apple Podcasts. Okay, so if you had a time machine, how far in time would you need to go back to be a dominant basketball player of that year? I need to go to when Bob Coosie was playing. I would, in the plumber day, 27 year old Shay would give Bob Coosie the business. He's not guarding me.

Hi, I'm Jason G'Zepzion. And I'm Shay Serrano and we are back. We have a new podcast from Wondering. It's called Six Trophies. Whoa! And it's the best. Each week, Shay and I are coming through all of the NBA storylines finding the best, most interesting, most compelling ones

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