The Dan Le Batard Show with Stugotz - Hour 2: Expensive Backpack for 30

Episode Date: October 3, 2023

The crew reacts to the Dolphins spot on Stephen's A-List before discussing Pablo Torre Finds Out's recent investigation into the Draymond Green-Jordan Poole controversy. Then, Lucy takes us through the recent College Gameday controversy with Pat McAfee, and a few members of the show go to the Bucket of Death. Plus, Greg doesn't remember anything from his past including a spin around Bourbon Street with Ray Lewis. Also, Malcolm Jenkins joins us to discuss his new book "What Winners Won't Tell You." Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

You're listening to Giraffe King's Network. This is the Dunluba Tarshou with the Stugat's Podcast. Stephen A Smith right now, as we speak, is dancing on the television. Stugat's just asked asked why is he doing? Why is he pantomiming the crossover dribble? And it's because he's doing Steven Z list top five NFL teams. The dolphins were number one just a week ago last week. Last week, we all went crazy.

He is put the chiefs at number five now I am guessing that the dolphins have tumbled all the way out of his top no way that's what happens when you allow 48 points against the bills we will find out together but the 49ers are likely to be number one they are pretty exceptional the 49 Well, the bills looked good this week, Dan. All right, a little bit of drama there. We will get to that in a second. Saturday's just a prop in this, right? Look at former Indianapolis Colt head coach,

Jeff Saturday just sitting there. Like a teacher, like a student in a teacher's class, he is a prop who is just sitting there, a former NFL. It's only him, a former NFL coach. But Jeff, well, the way I understand is that Jeff Saturday will have his top five after Stephen A Smith, but who wants to follow Stephen A Smith? Okay, I don't know if that's the order. I just know that he looks like a student who is in a class. I'm sorry, we're boring you Roy. In a class

where he is looking up at Stephen A Smith and the list that now has the Ravens at number four, the Eagles at number three. Yeah, we're screwed. The bills are going to be number two or number one in San Francisco and the dolphins have fallen out of his top. Did you see the list? Cowboys. I didn't see it beforehand.

I'm just sneak peeking and guessing that what the obvious there is dance good at this Yeah, by the way, I'm not bored. I don't know this happens to you But when I get cold I start the yon reason so I'm not That's why we say thing about you just say if you're bored. I'm not bored. I'm actually excited about this list I want to see what you would never be bored during Stevens a list. Never, never, I did spoil it. You saw the list. So I'd be wild if the Niners weren't on there. Right. Steven a email to Tumey privately and I enjoyed your and you wait. Oh, David,

David, you were right. Look at these things. This is bad. You're not as fun when dolphins aren't on it. See now a board. I will get to Greg Cody in a moment because he's got a question about when you're too old to learn how to depth because he wants to learn a new greeting but he thinks he's aged out of new greetings. But before we get to that, Stu Gotts, I want to play sound. I don't think that

this has been reported elsewhere. Pablo Torre, his podcast has blown up. It is very popular. Pablo Torre finds out it's something that goes on a journalistic journey three days a week and has gotten enormous numbers. One of the things that he just reported here recently, though, was what Jordan Poole said to get knocked out by Dremont Green. Now, I had mentioned on the Is What It Is podcast that Cameron had reported something different than this, but they have different rules over there. They don't have to adhere to any journalistic standards. Pobletory is attempting to,

so here is the sound of him talking to documentarian Ezra Edelman about not the OJ documentary that Ezra won an Oscar with, but this story, this is evidently what, according to Pobletory finds out, was said by Jordan Poole that ended up getting punched in the face. You're an expensive backpack for 30. Is what Jordan Poole told Raymond Green that got him punched in the f***ing face.

So when you saw that text, what went through your mind? I was electrified. Why? Because it felt like looking at the arc of the covenant. Oh please. You're an expensive backpack for 30. Let's diagram the sentence. Number 30, Steph Curry, is the 30 in question.

You're an expensive backpack for 30. Expensive. A Dremon Green making $25.8 million a year expensive. And contextually, knowing that there's a lot of money issues surrounding the Warriors and that Dremon Green was going to be up for a contract extension after last season. Yes. And Jordan Pooline Greve was gonna be up for a contract extension after last season. And Jordan Poole was also going to be up for a contract extension.

I guess that means that it's a good line. Steph's been carrying him. It's a good line. Stu got to your thoughts. It's just a line. I mean, perhaps we're overdoing it. What's that orc thing he was talking about? What are we overdoing?

He punched him in the face. I mean, I understand that, but it's just a line. We're breaking down the line that got him punched in the face. I mean, it feels like a bit more. He's saying that stuff's carrying him. You don't want any information on this. You just want, you don't want to know more. You are allergic to more information at every turn.

It's a sickness of yours. I have forgotten about the Dremond Green and Jordan Paul Incident. I mean, I don't think anyone's still thinking about it. It's a good job. I Pablo with how fired up You were in the moment when this happened that we would present you with the line that got said the thing that got Jordan bull punched in the face all this information all of this time that has passed Tell me so many knowing yeah, and yet here we are you don't care in the slightest two years later now But he wasn't the backpack though He's saying dream on is the backpack but the backpack is on the back of Steph Curry

carrying dream on so i don't think the line is quite holds up to screw you're saying the backpack is the person doing the work the backpack is the person carrying the backpack that is what in the backpack he's in step courage go sit the panel looks at the go sit go sit in the penalty box again. I don't know. I'm not going to go sit. Go sit in the penalty box. I'm not going to go sit. I'm not going to go sit.

I'm not going to go sit. I'm not going to go sit. I'm not going to go sit. I'm not going to go sit. I'm not going to go sit. I'm not going to go sit. I'm not going to go sit. I'm not going to go sit.

I'm not going to go sit. I'm not going to go sit. I'm not going to go sit. I'm not going to go sit. I'm not going to go sit. I'm not going to go sit. I'm not going to go sit. I'm not going to go sit.

I'm not going to go sit. I'm not going to go sit. I'm not going to go sit. I'm not going to go sit. I'm not going to go sit. I'm not going to go sit. I'm not going to go sit. I'm not going to go sit. I'm not going to go sit. I'm not going to go sit. I'm not going to go sit. I'm not going to go sit. I'm not going to go sit. I'm not going to go sit. I'm not going to go sit. I'm not going to go sit. I'm not going to go sit. I'm not going to go sit. I'm not going to go sit. I'm not going to go sit. I'm not going to go sit. I think he's called a rug sack for Harry's phone. He's not the backpack Alright, go sit in the penalty box. Thank you for Does he not understand that the back of the back of the

Harry minds up I explain it. I don't I don't know what happened there He deteriorates as the show goes on and as he ages They even have a back in my day. Wow. It's hot. Lucy. I'm sweating like a pig. That's the other thing He smells bad because the shirt. Woo! And it looks great. It looks great. It's the jewel. Yeah, look at him. The material on the shirt and the material on the feather jacket have made him stink. He is swampy and he smells bad. Harry Styles has a scent. It is an unpleasant one. and he smells bad. Harry Styles has a scent.

It is an unpleasant one. Lucy, I heard you today. You have no problem going after icons and people who are really liked. So you have told us, and I have unfairly framed you as someone who is actively trying to get Lee Corso off of Game Day. You have said you were just trying to help him.

But this has escalated some stugots. Washington State has a rabid fan base and their coach sided with Lucy on going after Lee Corso saying unpleasant things about what has become game days mascot. I don't know who you have viewed to this point as the star of game day. Herb Street. But Maca-Fee is encroaching on that space in a way that's more polarizing than Herb Street. Now, what is the latest with McAfee and Washington State Lucy? So basically after Washington State's head coach

went after Lee Corso for something that was not heard correctly. It was just a misheard statement. The apologies happened. It felt like everything was fine and moved on. And then this week during the college game day episode when they were showing old Crimson, which is the Washington State flag

that said every college game day episode. It is a tradition. McAfee went off on just how much he hates Washington state and how they shouldn't get any press and he'll say it all in the video here. We got seven this flag when they were one and eleven. It's a nine. We were. Yeah. Ten. Ten.

You were? That's wild. So when they sucked, you were, you were. And the week on the thing is called football show. Yeah. Yeah. And it'll success Ryan Leaf. Yeah.

Yeah. Change. Yeah. You've been there. And flying old beef. I don't want to waste Virginia flag flying up there every seven. I'm going to watch you stay. Now big beams up there. Like shut up.

Watch that state. I'm sick of you. Waste the time on this show. Just wait until you get to the pool. Still when you back over. I doubt it. I don't know. I don't know. I know't get back to the coach.

Of course I know. I know. You know, on the subject of that, you know, after a great. So college football fans are obsessed with traditions. So naturally, they love Olcrimson at College Game Day. And it started this sort of firestorm in the College Football, especially the Washington State community of people. And like, McAfee does not understand College Game Day.

He doesn't get it. He comes in. He's this big giant character. That's just not the way the show works. And so fans have just been super upset by this. And I don't blame them. Like Washington State, old Crimson, is like one of the cooler traditions in college football for such a small school to represent.

It's this big honor. Like the top post on Reddit was about how McAfee is just not right for the show. Isn't he just defending his course so like he's on the show? Yeah, but should he be doing that? I mean, the guy given on his dancer about Lee Corso or had an opinion about Lee Corso. If herbie would have done that, would we react differently? Like I don't think it's odd for somebody to just stick up for their guy Corso.

It wasn't, I mean, from like how that sounded to me, it was less sticking up from Lee Corso and more Washington state is small and stupid and why are we all looking at it. Well, it's ignorant in this particular space, right? When people, when a fan base cares deeply about their one thing and you bluster in a way that sounds uninformed and defensive anybody, I could see where a rabid fan base would be hurt by that. It's not like Washington state is being talked about a whole lot nationally, but the other thing that's being approached here that I want to talk about is the idea that McAfee

is an electrical wire that you are dropping on a set that is aged in front of you traditionally on what you expect from it tonally. And it is not Saturday morning aggressive. It is not Saturday morning polarizing. But MacAfee is here to be a star. They are paying him, I think, more than anybody on that set. And he's here to shake up things at ESPN and there. He's here to do things like that.

You don't want him to be a benign Saturday mornings as they've always been. You want him to be somebody who is instigating change. It's how you're paying him. Why are we so protective of a Washington state? Get over yourself. Because of this flag that they have on college game day. I mean, I like the flag. I like seeing it every week but the fact that we can't go after them.

I mean what's going on here? It would be like if I came on here and I told all the listeners. I hated them and they were stupid because it's you're you're going after that. Yeah. Well, that's that's him. Yeah. You're going after the fans that watch this show that make this show. It's it's about their tradition tradition of college football. And if you think about the people who watch college game day, they aren't the frack the frack guys that is mac a fees audience it's the old people who want to watch college game day in the morning and mac if you went to West Virginia he really has no room to be talking smack about anybody the reality is is the college game day is quaint it's about taking you from college town to college town and making you feel that camaraderie and his college

football becomes a big business. So does college game day, Pat McAfee represents that and it's a different tone from what we've seen that's made college game day one of their most successful products. At public mobile, we do things differently. From our subscription phone plans to throwing a big sale right now when no one else is.

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Subscribe today at publicmobile.ca. Different is calling. Pfff. Don Lebatard. Why are you so bad at this? Stugats. I can't answer that question. It's a good one, though.

I've been thinking about it a lot. This is the Don Lebatard show with this two guts. Tududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududududud Duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh, duh Accident prone Bobby Patrino Lucy is at least Lucy Lucy wasn't even here last year So she's paying penalties from this year. Yep Greg Cody still paying penalties from last season I would say this is actually worked out pretty nice for me because a lot of friends who I don't hear from have checked in to see if I'm okay I'm loving the attention. I'm getting to that. They think you've had a bad accident. Does this count though We've got does count. Yeah, I'm all paid up, Dan. The commissioner is not effective in any way. Impident and neutered is the...

Well, it's not falsehoods. I'll let you know this, Dan. I looked into this rock-rigged park that you discussed earlier, because I will be paying off tomorrow. I'm not coming into tomorrow. I'm just going to be going and paying off my punishment at a park. So, I looked into this rock-rig. Apparently this is a sea level game. If I were to go there, the highest point, are you okay?

Apparently, the highest point is only six feet tall at this park, but it's the highest sea level point in Miami. So I will not be going to that because you'll just be getting mad at that when I'm standing on top of a park bench. I just want you to go somewhere that's not near your house. I wanted to be a punishment. You selected a punishment. Well, there's a new wasn't a punishment day off. Anyone could have selected that. No, we're going to be doing a watch long tomorrow with my wife approves of that. Yeah, you want to tell people what that might be if your wife approves. Well, pending approval

tomorrow, we're going to be doing a watch long for the Marlins playoff game. It is an elimination game. We don't know which way yet because game one is tonight. So it's going to be either a elimination game for the Marlins or for the Phillies tomorrow night that we will be watching. Some of us will be watching it together. It's going to be a fun time had by all. We also set out the bat singing the mic sure yesterday. He may be stopping by. We don't know. He's a very busy man now that strikes over. There is work to be done in Hollywood now that the strike is over but there will be a watch party led by Billy Gill tomorrow.

The cast of characters we already have confirmed participants along with me Tony will be there. Okay not much of a cast of characters confirm participants someone else who works with the company it'll at least be Tony and Billy regardless. The Reaper is ready and how many people are picking from the bucket of death right now? We have four people picking today. Stugots, Lucy, Greg and Stugots and the bucket of death is brought to you by KFC's new hot and spicy wings.

Order an eight piece of new hot and spicy wings for 4.99, that has to be a typo. I could not get eight wings for 499. At participating KFCs, it's finger-licking good. Yeah, I'll be picking twice. You did have stew guys. I'll take one of those off your hands to you guys. I'll pick right. Greg was the other one. No, it was Billy. Yeah, it's really. Let's go ahead. This segment isn't quite messy enough. Now we have Chris Reed-Smut. have Chris Reed's partnership. The Panthers. Oh, I'm putting that one back.

The Panthers are. Nightmare Dog against the Lies. Who buys start this week? Yeah, there's buys. Four teams on buys this week. The Browns, Chargers, Seahawks and Bucks are teams of your looking for if you want a freebie. Hit me, a buy. I got the bills. I'll keep them. Five and a half point favorites against the Jaguars.

Yeah, let's do it. All right, Lucy. You have to keep them. Lucy's turn now. against the Jaguars. Yeah, let's do it. All right, Lucy. You have to keep them. Lucy's turn now. Let's go ahead and pick from the bucket there. Malcolm Jenkins is going to join us here in a few minutes. Service, helmet.

Thank you for your service. Oh, wow. You can choose any of the armed services. Oh, cool. Hey, memories about that. Air Force. Coast Guard. Yeah. all right. You know, we're going to let her look at the schedule. We will get back. Go in there. Oh, come on.

Are you going to or you can put it back? Are you going to keep it? I just keep it. She'll decide in a second. Okay. Reaper's going to go in to Stugots and Greg. Yeah, very confidently. She is taking it or you're just backing in general. The military and assuming it will work out for you. If you stick around and listen to Jess and I college football segment you will learn that one military school is undefeated. Yep. Okay. We'll see what the points for this. Lucy on that game. Oh, Scarred. She has Lucy on that. Stugots is now reaching in. Rommaging. Rommaging. I love a good rummage. Air Force is on a buy. So that is my choice. All right. Wow. Nice.

USA. Unless the swap helmet gets selected. Rattled in bones. I got a good one. What's that say? Swap. Swap. Swap. That was quick. Swap it in.

Well, don't do it. So now you pick another helmet to see what Lucy's going to get. I'm sorry, Lucy. Look at her for you. Bobby Patrino has heard. She got to enjoy that joy not at all. I get to wait to see how the week plays out for everyone Right. Okay. Golden Helmet would be drawn. That's right. Thank you. Someone's following the rules finally. Thank you

Chargers, okay. They're on a buy they're on a buy so you don't need to swap with me. You want the bills? You want the bills swap with me golden Hel bills he will negotiate later this week and see That was a you could also choose to put that back if you want to punish someone's to got why couldn't that happen to me The rummaging thing is already stew got some it's not funny. You're rummaging Already he asked I said okay great Seriously I said okay great Seriously The Browns another by team put it back. They're on the buy you good. It's a win It's a win to put it back though less unless unless I would have put a list to got swaps with you. I'm wearing it I like it. I'm a brownie

Chris you mentioned you mentioned and this is my life experience on Tuesday Just generally how I feel getting clear thing in the middle of the sentence. It's no, hey, you want something that does stugots, but more stugots. So he copycats the rummaging just does it more. It's not helpful. It is not something that makes my life better. I have to rate it back on Tuesdays.

He comes in and does stugots at a level 10 Stugant. It's a winning rummage. How can you complain again? He's got his helmet on his mic. What a clever funny thing. It's a winning rummage. Yeah, look at us. Bye.

Please get closer to the microphone. Couple of buy weeks, cut it up. The other thing that happens with their age is they deteriorate during the show and week later in the show as we go. Oh, by Thursday I'll be a disaster. It gets to be worse and worse, but Greg, you were asking and I don't know the context for this.

If you're too old to learn a new way of greeting, I don't know how it is that you came upon the need or they want to dep. Why do you want to now start dapping people up? It's not that I want to. It's that I feel like it would expand my, you know, salutation repertoire.

There have been occasions when my friends, you and you got in, I sometimes, when we're seeing each other for the first time, it's a little awkward because he's coming at me with a depth stance and it devolves into just like an awkward hug and I don't know what to do. And nowadays you don't do the regular handshake. Everybody's fist bumping. Should the depth be involved?

Now I'm just throwing it out there for conversation. It's something that would interest me to become, you know, conversant in, so to speak, but not if it's like outrageous that somebody my age would just now be starting to go like that. So expanding your game, looking to get a little bit younger, hip or perhaps, right? I wouldn't say younger, hip or I would just say more conversational in the greeting, you know, in the gesture of conversation. I was, I would just say hello. I was there though. I've got to reveal this story because I was, this is something that Greg Cody has been wrestling with for the better part of

15 years because I don't know if you remember the story I'm about to tell, but I witnessed it. It was on Bourbon Street and Ray Lewis was there wearing a fur and he went to shake Greg Cody's hand and bring him in for a shoulder and Greg Cody got spun around so that he was in Ray Lewis's lap. He got spun around because he didn't know how to do it. And he got just turned around like he thought he didn't know that Ray Lewis was bringing him in for a shoulder to shoulder And he ended up all the way backward and I'm now staring at what looks like Ray Lewis holding an old man in what would be Comfort those frontal carriages for babies that I don't know what those are called

Whatever when you hold a baby in the front the baby beorn. Yes, that's what it looked like Greg Cody in Ray Lewis is again wearing a fur in his lap. You remember this. Now that you mentioned I'd forgotten it but now that you mentioned it was a beautiful fur. You've been not a fur guy. I don't know. I don't know. I know. I know. I know. I know. I know. I know. I know. I know. This is your dad's life. I could wear a fur. How do you remember, but how do you forget that? I mean, I've lived an active life.

How many different people have you ended up in that position with? A couple of greats. You know, me on Bourbon Street, you know, all bets are off to begin with. I mean, I had to be goaded and remembered and reminded of that. Not even my most famous Bourbon street story involving him there was a place called the dungeon that he had to be dragged out on tom jordan's back and later that night uh... later that night he woke up in his bed with mashed potatoes in his hair that's not untrue you remember that's yeah i do well i remember the next morning

and that was the same trip where Tom Jordan and Dan Levitard Raced a hundred yard dash down. It wasn't down Bourbon Street. It was on like a side street headed to lunch Who is Tom Jordan my dad's old neighbor? PJ All right, I had Google them. I rash actor apparently Dan likes to travel with Jordan's huh? You remember that who won that raise you were Jordan He's you were often and puffing He's no peak arrow. I don't know about that. Why would you accuse me of that?

I don't remember quite like what your memory is fault it. You don't remember anything I don't remember quite like that. What your memory is fault it, you don't remember anything. You don't remember what he tackled up in Ray Lewis. That's true, yeah. When you're hugged by Ray Lewis in a fur coat, and you don't remember, it doesn't speak well of you. He's lived an active life. Yes, I have.

Still doing it, baby. And you know it. And you know it. Exactly, that can I think. It's a gaki. Wow, it's what. Exactly, it's not one of your words. It's a gaki. I don't sweat. Exactly. It's not one of your words. It's a gaki.

Who wants to feel my sweaty shirt right now? No, good. Put that on there. I mean, I tried your shoes on. It's a snack. I know you did. It is sopping. You put his deck shoes on? Yeah, I want to clean your feet.

Put the shirt on. No, he had a sock on. I did. Where were you, Chris? When we revealed earlier in the show? Things are moving very fast for you today, correct? Like that seat is complicated. I think you were here. You've been here for the entirety of the show.

The seat changes, you man. Were you not listening to that portion of the show where for some reasons Stugat decided, because my Tuesdays aren't- It's a penalty box. Fow foul enough. There's all that explains it in Rome. That explains it.

Bear thing. In your right, the Cody men do have wide feet. They do. Hell yeah. Yeah, I got boats man. I think Knos either they're wide. What's that boat that's like a flat boat? What's it called?

A flat bottom boat. I know. A catamaran. Pantoon. This is only 7 on a roof. And Lebatar showed with the Stugats, gamble on by draftkins. Don Lebatard. Well, Charlie sent this,

Charlie as far as I know. So just Charlie's title in my goal. You're going to stay in the next two guts. Uh, how, how familiar were you at the time with Chubacca? Like how you're upbringing, how much Chubacca in it. This is the Dan Lebatar show with this Tugats. If you're watching this on video,

you see in the background that Malcolm Jenkins has a book cover of him, it appears shirtless. If you look like that, you too, you'll cover of him appears shirtless. If you look like that, you too, you take photographs evidently shirtless. I admire this guy for a lot of different reasons, two-time Super Bowl champion, three-time pro-bola. A violent, nasty menace of a man. Malcolm Jenkins has a new book out. What winners won't tell you lessons from a legendary defender. Thank you for joining us, Malcolm.

I guess I will start there. What is it that winners won't tell us? I mean, it's a lot, essentially, what winners won't tell you in my story at least, is that winning isn't everything. If you want to be successful most of the time, it comes down to your mindset in a process. And really this book is not necessarily a sports memoir.

I take people through those memorable moments, but I take you inside of the helmet of an athlete. I'll let you know the worries, the concerns, but also all of the failures that ended up teaching me how to win consistently, how to be a part of and lead Super Bowl teams, how do we lead community groups and my family. And all the things that people have seen me do, a lot of the times we don't share that journey. And this is really me unveiling the process, all all the things that I've done in that 13 years of playing any NFL and all of the life lessons and huge moments that have made the difference in my life and maybe who I am today.

Why did you write it and how difficult was it to write? Ah, you know what? I wrote it because in 2020, like everybody else, I'm sitting at home and I'm thinking of things, I'm watching film, is that normally do. And I really just started to have an appreciation for all the things that I've been through in my career. I wanted to somehow contextualize that. And that took me in a two-year journey of ideating. And long story short, I ended up writing this book for a made-up work where I myself in about 30 days. And so I really had to put myself into a training camp mentality where I'm watching all of these old plays,

I'm trying to figure out what parts of my story actually matter and make it all flow into this narrative. And I wrote it in a way in which I want the reader to visualize these plays. I want them to feel like they're in my health and are in these situations. And so, you know, it was one of those things that is definitely new. I was a rookie in this. I've never wrote a book before, but I did apply a lot of the things that I've learned in football

the same way I prepared and executed there. I did for this book. So it's really transferable. The book itself is literally an example of of kind of the things I'm talking about. What are you talking about when you say the things that mattered about your life that are most relatable to the reader? You choose one. You can only choose one. The thing that matters most about your story is blank. I have to figure out that I was my own savior.

You know, most of the, we look for opportunities to find. We need this one person to give us a chance or we're comparing ourselves to other people and trying to be like them. I know that's true in sports, but it's also true just in light in general. We're so caught up in what other people are doing that oftentimes we don't see ourselves as the solution to all of our problems And once I started to look at myself and it's really evaluating myself not only as a player But as a man figure out what I was good at and what I wasn't in play from there constantly being curious constantly growing constantly learning That's when things started to change for me change in my career change in my family

And that is an uncomfortable process to change for me. It changed my career, changed my family. And that is an uncomfortable process. That takes a lot of accountability. It takes a lot of, you know, humility and, you know, a quote unquote, the self-scout of the sports. It's one of the biggest things that I think was the turning point for me. I had learned so much, but in order for me

to really apply those things, I had the first understand that the answer to every single one of my problems was me. When you talk about discomfort, it seemed uncomfortable from afar to see you trying to do the right things with the players coalition and having Kaepernick and others call you a sellout

because the anthem protests stopped in exchange for money to community efforts. Can you take me through with some nuance without it just being a back and forth? Can you take me through the discomforts of all of that and the complications in all of that as you were sitting here trying to get something you love, the NFL, to support a community and be a real leader. Yeah, I talk about poise a lot in this book and that was really one of those times where poise is the defining factor. You have to really think about one of the things they told us all the time and for long.

Like keep the main thing, the main thing. You'll hear a jail heard say that all the time. And in the midst of all the decay, as the media, you've got Trump, and his two cents, you've got the tension of racial tension in the country and everybody is focusing on what these athletes are doing on the field. And me being at the forefront of that and really having to decide what was most important,

we step into that space, one with the people in mind, like how to have impact on communities and change laws and policies and governance. And so I kept that the main thing. And then also you have to keep in mind who the main opponent is, who, what is the problem? The NFL is not a differential problem. They're not the solution to our racial issues in this country, nor are they the problem. So there's an opportunity for us to use this platform

to our advantage, it's an opportunity for us to give resources that we can push toward our goal. And in the midst of my own personal, you know, that was the year I'm leading a captain of the Super Bowl winning team. My family is going through its own problems. And I'm juggling all of this in real time in front of everybody.

So this is really the first time people will get a look at exactly what I was going through, my mentality, but it definitely was a difficult time to juggle all of those things. And it also led me to really focusing on my mental health coming out of that, because that was definitely one of those things that took a toll on me as a leader as just a man. And so it's one

of the most difficult things in this book, I think, for me to process, but it's definitely a new take on that time. Who or what is the problem, Malcolm? What do you mean? Well, you said the NFL is not the problem. What is the problem? We are, oh, we, we as a society are the problem. We have, you know, our social constructs have been around and have been corrupted from

the origin. And we've yet to truly be about face from those things. We've changed the narratives, we've changed the way that we communicate, we've changed, definitely made progress. But we've never gone back and actually corrected the problem. So we wonder why we continue to like see cycles, you know, racial division and racial tension. And because when you look at statistics like home ownership, that hasn't changed and for black Americans since the 60s, the racial wealth gap is still getting larger as time goes on is not getting to a place of equity. And whenever there's economic downturn like we just came out of and things like that, we

see those disparities show their heads, you know, constantly. So I think when the problem is that we can't imagine another way of doing things. And so we just continue to kick the can down the road, you know, we'll play the political game and then things get erased just with a new candidate or a new president or whatever comes in. And so we just do this cycle because it's hard for us all to take ownership in the way that we govern ourselves. It's hard for us to imagine a new way of doing things. And I think that that is truly the problem. And so the answer to that is, what we can continue to change, you know, this marginal change, but we have to be self-reliant. There has to be some actiniton taking, some self-determination and do things collectively

on your own, because you can't wait for the government or any particular leader to come save us. Can you walk us through because you are poised and you talk about poised in the book, you scuffled with Eric Reed, cappernick's partner in kneeling during the coin toss in 2018. There's a lot of stuff boiling to get to that point. What happened there and how did you feel about it afterward?

A scuffle is probably, you know, that's probably overboard. It was definitely a conversation. But, you know, to me, that moment was embarrassing. I talk about boys all the time, and that was one of the times that I felt like I had broken character, and I allowed the thing that I was trying the most to guard against. The thing I wanted most was the media.

I did not want to give the media that moment where they could pen to black men who were fighting for change in their communities against each other. We've seen that play played way too many times over over the course of history and and I fell into that same tribe and and afterwards the only thing I could play in my head is that line I heard from Jay Z when he says wise men told me don't argue with fools because people from a distance can't tell who is who and And exactly, that was what happened the next day. The front page has a picture of H&I, face-to-face,

and that's it, right? No context, no narrative, no buildup, just that. And nobody can tell the difference of who's wrong, who's right, or what this is even about. And so that's part of the challenge of being in leadership in a highly visible position, and that you don't always make the right choices. You don't always make, you know, the winning choice, but it's part of, you know, the story

and the narrative. You're indisputably, though, a great leader. So when you come home from that, I don't know how the game went, I don't remember, but who's soothing you and where is your shame finding solace? How forgiving are you of yourself because you want to avoid giving anyone the ammunition there? I'm telling, I'm my biggest critic. I've always been that way, whether it's, you know, what I'm doing in the community, what I say in the media, or what I did on the field. I was one of those guys that I watched the game.

I played the game, and then I'd get home and immediately watch it as fast as I could. I wanted to digest those things. And I did the same thing in this instance, and it was embarrassing. So that shame I've had to learn to control the things I can control. And really forgive myself that way I can forgive others.

But that took me some work for sure. When I get home, I listen to the grateful debt to one wind. I am told I read, are you a dead head Malcolm? I am not a dead head, but I won practice, you know, I was with the Eagles and they play music throughout the practices. And most of the time, it's pretty much exclusively rap music, but I'm one like I love all of John was a music and you know, I was the OG on the team. So one day, I told the one of the interns to just put on grateful day for the whole practice just to see that the reactions of my teammates.

They didn't necessarily appreciate it the most, but it was a lot of those coaches that came out of them hands. They were into it, right? Yeah, they were into it for sure. Little Bertha, right? But you're not a dead hit. You were trying to bother. You were trying to bother your teammates.

You were actively hostile with your music. I just like to change things up. I keep people on the feet, you know. Did a single teammate like the music? Not a single. Not a single. That's the kind of thing. Just the old man. All right. Play some fill in the blank for us here. The toughest teammate I ever had was blank. The toughest teammate I ever had was Darryl Sproul. The teammate that I was even though I don't like to admit it just a little bit afraid of was blank. Anthony Hargrove. You didn't stop us fast. You didn't think about that one for a while. Do you have a particular story there that you can help us understand why?

There was a time we all had a rule with, we called him John Bum, the first stop. That was his nickname. And we knew that you could play around with him, you can joke, but don't call him dumb. If you call him dumb, it was a dangerous situation. And I think one time, him and John that Bill McGotton got in a fight for argument because he didn't hear the drop

call that JB was giving them and I think he's JB might have messed up and called them done and it took about four or five delimits to break that one up so yeah we've learned our lesson there. The hit I still think about is blank. I know most people were probably thinking about me hitting cooks, but I still think about my second game in college running down on kickoff on how it stayed again to University of Texas. And I'm thinking I'm about to make my first tackle on primetime TV and I get absolutely demolished by a linebacker coming from the other side of

the field. And I literally, he's standing over me, celebrating, and I could only think to myself, like, take your time, because I'm not even ready to get up. I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I on my mom the next day and she asked me if I was sure that I wanted to continue playing football and I had to really contemplate the answer. But obviously I continue. The best leader I have ever met in football is blank. The best leader, I've been around some phenomenal ones. If I had a top three list, only one it would be,

I know, I'm gonna get to number one, but just for a day this. I don't know that man. I'm not a bad man in here, I don't know why that is. I think Jonathanville is probably my favorite leader just because I'm a defensive guy, I think it's harder to lead a defense. But he was a man and a month,

a man like I saw him garnered a respect of not only just the players, but the coaches, you know, the way that they moved around him was, was different. And it was somebody I'm out of myself after. When I looked at like leaders who I threw into for generations from John the Villains probably won number one. The guy that I'm most aw odd by playing today is blank. Ah, that is every year to some new like player that just blows the league up.

I'm still odd by, isn't it? That's hard to pick one. I want to say it's probably some more stag. Here's my draft prize. I can't believe he's still in the league. But I think I think you got I think I think these defensive linemen are getting crazy. Like, I look at the bolster twins and what they're doing, and it's just like, it's amazing. I mean, I just did to continue to play at that higher level. And then for new guys to start coming along, that almost make you forget about those guys is ridiculous.

You're thinking about the Miles Garrett, the Mike of my sins, all of these menaces on the defensive line. Who's the wide receiver most likely to keep you up at night the night before a game? In my career, that was Calvin Johnson for sure. Yeah, I get you. Yeah, I'm trying, I talk about it in the book. My very first snap in the NFL was one on one with Megatron. I talk about it in the book. My very first snap in the NFL was one on one with Megatron. I'll let you go read the story if you want to figure out how to end it.

But yeah, he's somebody that's giving me my nightmares my whole career. The name of the book is What Winners Won't Tell You Lessons from a legendary defender. Malcolm, thank you for making the time. Have admired your work from afar for a long time. I appreciate you guys having me. Thank you. defender Malcolm. Thank you for making the time. Have admired your work from afar for a long time. I appreciate you guys having me. Thank you.