The Dollop with Dave Anthony and Gareth Reynolds - 309 - Big John and Harvey's Casino

Episode Date: January 9, 2018

Comedians Dave Anthony and Gareth Reynolds examine the incident at Harvey's Casino. SOURCE: The Atavist Magazine. "A Thousand Pounds of Dynamite" by Adam Higginbotham SOURCESTOUR DATES REDBUBBLE MERCH

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a week I fruit eater man of the people. Burbank Wanderer Dave Anthony. Where were you wandering? It's a story from American history to my friend. I want to know where you're going. Gareth Reynolds who has no idea what the topic is going to be about but where are you where are you wandering? Well I tell you what I got lost in Ikea yesterday. It's a big store. It's a biggest store biggest Ikea in the world and it is terrifying in there. That sounds like a black mirror. It is a black mirror and they keep having things to go shortcut this way it's not a shortcut. You just start new lives in the kitchen area.

Harold where are you? Families living in there. Yeah no for sure. Families. Oh look honey Sam got an A in an algebra. No he didn't because he couldn't get out of the store. He couldn't find his way out in the morning to go to school. Shut up they'll kill us if we don't keep the ruse going. My mom's here? No Dave we actually have a very special guest. Your mother's not here. My mother is here Pamela Reynolds. Why don't you say hello mother check the levels. Sibylance? Sibylance? Hello everybody. There we go. Wow she put on she had no accent. She's from Mississippi. The whole time then we get in here

she's just down. Conwoman from Mississippi. Accent. Yeah yeah. Welcome I'm sorry about everything. What about okay. No this one actually be fine for your mom you're not gonna be uncomfortable. Look we can handle everything. We've been through it now. Oh my god. She means cleanliness mother cleanliness. Someone who's clean. Imagine if that was what we had and you didn't say anything. And I'm just sitting here like. Oh my god that was terrible. Go start the car mom we should get it heated before we leave. Go start it. That was good. Hey guys this episode was based on the article a thousand pounds of dynamite by Adam Hagenbotham

which is an adivist magazine which is an awesome magazine you should all subscribe to. 1922. It's really weak. You're our Lord. Janos Burgess was born in here's one. Ready for this one? Sure. Yaz Barani an agricultural town in central Hungary. Jesus what just happened? I shouldn't have done that to myself. Yeah what's his name? Janos Burgess. Janos Burgess and he's born in the middle of Hungary. Yeah okay. He was an only child. Okay. His dad liked booze and hated Janos. Oh well Dave there's a little Janos in all of us. Hey. So he was sent to live with his grandparents when

he was three. Okay. So three's already worn. I was welcome. They're like great. Yeah this thing is awful. Go Janos. When he was 12 they sent him back. The grandparents are like we're done with him too. He's the worst. Yeah you don't have what's your Hungarian accent? Very similar to some of the other accents from Europe. We're tired of Janos. He's a bad kid. No Janos. We wait a while but he's not good. It's amazing how terrible child. Oh I feel like I'm in Hungary right now. Yes yes. Why wait? It's Nikos. When he was 15 he ran away to Budapest. Sure. Wow. Dave with the shush. And you know you're with a baller now. Budapest. He was taken in by

a butcher in his family. Oh boy. That happens. Okay. If you're on the streets in Eastern Europe often a butcher will take you in. Sure. Right. Yeah. He was a pilot in the Royal Hungarian Air Force. Okay. Janos claims after the war he worked for US military intelligence although there was no record. That seems to be the good cover job for the lunatic a lot of the times. Yeah they're just like I'm also in the FBI just so you know. You know I shouldn't be telling anyone this but I'm actually a CIA. Well yeah but you can't. You're not supposed to tell anybody. Yeah what are you going to do. Yeah. No I work for the CIA. Yeah. I mean I shouldn't be

talking about it but you seem cool. I actually work at the Pentagon. So. So. Don't tell anyone. Pinkies swear this. They don't pinkies swear. Absolutely. Stronger than the oath of office. I've always said. They slice an eyeball. Yeah. On the exchange fluids. Oh my God. You. Yeah. Clearly I've been in the CIA. I work for them. He was arrested by the Soviets and charged with espionage. Okay. His trial lasted seven minutes. Seven minutes. Yeah. Okay. Cool. So they really crank them through there and the Eastern Bloc countries. He was sentenced to 25 years hard labor in Siberia. Jesus after seven minutes. Seven minutes. That's quite. I imagine there

was like a hello. How are you. Was it the people's court. No. Oh that is seven minutes isn't it. Yeah. But edit it down. Yeah. But still. It's not a lot. It's not like there's a lot of time. They do like nine a day. They're like. Uh-huh. That's why Judge Judy's so great. Judge Judy is the most highest paid person on television and deserves every penny of it. He was there for eight years in a gulag and then released. And then a honest one back to hungry. He got the nickname Big John. Okay. Because he honest means John. Yeah. You knew that right mom. Oh yes. Yeah. We both knew that. Yes. Mother and I share a love of history. In

nineteen fifty five. He met twenty seven year old Elizabeth Newell who was waiting for her husband in a restaurant and he honest asked her to dance. And since she was getting a divorce from her husband and marrying Janos. Based on the dance. It must have been a good dance. So these are different times. No this still happens. What. In clubs and bars. I met my wife. Oh my god. There was a revolution in Hungary. I wish that was true. The next year. Okay. You wish there was a revolution in Hungary. No I wish that you had met your wife dancing. I met her dancing. Yeah. I wish you dancing. There's no way. I love dancing. Oh no

way. I can only imagine Dave when people are dancing. No it's you want to dance Dave. Fuck them. Fuck this. Exactly what happens. So there's a revolution in Hungary. They over through the communist government. That doesn't go well. The Soviets roll in with tanks. Okay. Kill everybody. And then that's the end of that night. Janos is on the wrong side. So he had to get out of Hungary now. Okay. Wait. So he's trapped. Well he would he would help over through the government. Right. So this role and he's like I guess I got to go. Okay. All right. So he's granted political asylum in the United States of America. Okay. It's our country.

Yeah. That's that's that's what we love. What do you always say my best country in the world. Oh absolutely. He and Elizabeth arrived in 1957. Okay. They went to California and worked on a farm. Okay. It's an immigrant thing we make. Oh I really work on a farm. Yeah. No that's what you and dad had to do. We did. Yeah. We did. Yes. After John got a job welding and pipe finning. They had two kids. Johnny and Jimmy. For some reason for some reason Jimmy has a different last name. Why do you keep the so the first names are super close. Well he's it's Johnny Burgess senior and junior and then the other kid is Jimmy and has a

different last name. I have no idea why he has a different last name. I couldn't ever I looked I couldn't figure it out. Well Dave this might be the time when kids got to pick their last name. Oh my God wouldn't that be great. That's why my kid's name is Finnegan but but poop. I'm Finn but poop. I'll be doing your taxes. That is currently 50% of your grandmother was Joan Burgess. Joan Burgess. That's true. She's related to this wonderful man born in 1920. Oh maybe his mom. This is getting a little too real. No relative. Big John started a landscaping business. He hated games and enjoyed fighting. He was a scary dude.

Other men were afraid of him. Okay. So it does sound like a relative of ours now. He had a cruel sense of humor and was a bit reckless. Okay. He became pretty familiar with dynamite as he used it to blast wells and trenches. Well pretty familiar with dynamite is the fun way of putting it. What's wrong with that. I don't know. Just seems like a pretty familiar means that you'll be you're into dynamite. You use dynamite a lot. Well. Oh there's not what I was picturing. He sort of looks like as like if Vincent Price went straight. Like if he was like you know I'm done with the acting game. I'm going to get into

dynamite now. He's probably a little bit older than you know he is when we are in the story. Sure. A little bit younger here. This is Big John. Maybe a little bit younger there. Yeah he's definitely under there. So he keeps building up his business and by 1972 he's a millionaire. Okay. He has three businesses and 26 employees. He buys Elizabeth a restaurant to run so things are just rolling. Okay. Things are it's the best best time ever. So this is the part of the story normally when you just got to savor the moment because it's all about to go terrible. No. And Dave denies it. I have listened. I do know. Okay.

He on three Mercedes but unfortunately lost his license for speeding so much. Oh. Okay. So he bought an airplane. Better. That's better. And safer. He would fly from job site to job site doing crazy low altitude stunts sometimes with the boys Johnny and Jimmy in the plane. Okay. He liked to buzz water skiers on a local lake or fly under highway overpass. Whoa. What is he doing? So he's a stunt man who's not being filmed. I mean he's got clearly has some I don't give a shit what's happening. Yeah. Thing going on. Hey Johnny Jimmy whatever your last name is. Let's get this water skier. Come on we're going to go under the 405. So so

yeah that's a that's a weird thing and everyone kind of gets to know him. No no a lot of times if a guy flies planes under bridges people figure as a guy should know I'm going to know this man. So at home he enjoyed working on inventions just like us. Okay. He was always working with wires and smoldering out in his workshop. So this man has a soft spot for dynamite and now he's getting involved in wires and welding and okay so his hobbies are great sniffing around what I could call a potential issue. He had good ideas but didn't have enough patience. It was offbeat often beaten to patents by other people. Okay.

The marriage was not good. Okay. They both drank and often and they fought. Yeah. Okay. Sure. I think that was everyone in the 70s. Yeah. Right. Big John thought Elizabeth was having affairs. Okay. He said she was a nymphomaniac and using the restaurant to bang dudes in. Like Ozark but with banging. It's also but then don't buy her a restaurant. What. No. But there's still like issues. You know what you got to do big John. Get rid of that restaurant. Yeah. For her part Elizabeth would take off for days at a time. There we go. So you can imagine where he was coming up with your fucking other dudes thing. It's like when she

goes out on a Monday and comes back on a Thursday and still I'm going to have to say Dave that's not the restaurant's fault. I feel like it's all the restaurant. No way. No way. Yeah. This is what happens when you open a restaurant. Yeah. Order the 109. You get to spend a week with the woman who runs it. There's just one item on the dessert menu. Oh yes. Liz. Yes. Liz cream. I'm coming with you. Let's get out of here. I've always wanted to see Aspen. What. I want to go to Aspen with you. You ordered. Big John made. OK. This is my restaurant. Yeah. I love you. We need to be back by Thursday. OK. Big John made Johnny and Jim work in the restaurant at

night and summers they work landscaping. They would actually have to sleep with the crew at night. OK. But that like they wouldn't go home at night when they're landscaping they would sleep. I'll tell you who respected the guys the crew. The crew is definitely like these. All right. I'll tell you what these guys are. They might be the boss's kid but I like the boss's kids. So he he would give them a haircut just once a year. Yeah. That's fair. Right after school ended. Sure. He would shave their heads completely with clippers. Sure. And then they got to work in the summer and their heads would burn and blister in the sun. Sure. OK. I guess they didn't have

hats then either. It was the one time when people don't have hats. Yeah. On the show. So at no point is he doing that as some sort of psychological thing or is he just not learning. Boy you know it'd be a probably better shave their heads in September. I'm sure it's when their head back. Oh well he also he also beat them. Good. OK. Good. Well we have clarity. So that's good with belts electric cables boots code hangers whatever he had. He'd roll into the room in the middle of the night while the boys were sleeping and just attack Johnny. Once when Jimmy was six he put his elbow on the table during a meal and Big John punched him in the face knocking out four teeth which is

which is a bigger etiquette foul. But you know what Dave of course has his back. Well is he going to put his elbow on the table again. I'll tell you what he's probably not going to do is put his elbow on the table or he's probably not going to use his elbow for anything anymore. Yeah. I mean yeah that's all part of the magic of Big John's training. How can you wear an elbow pad on your right elbow Johnny. I don't want to talk about it. Johnny started drinking at 12 and smoking pot at 14. OK. Those by the way in England standard numbers for. Yeah. Oh yeah. Today. It's not. No come on. It really isn't. I've seen your country. All right. Heat. Johnny turned his rage on Jimmy who would then turn to his parents

for protection. At that point Big John would beat up Johnny and then afterwards scream at Jimmy for being a snitch. Wow. You can't. How do you teach both sides of that. I know he is. He's taken care of both ends. What did you tell him. I know you don't tattle on people. Yeah. Otherwise they get beat up. Big John hated snitches. Sure. Yeah. Sure. So Elizabeth filed for divorce in November 1970. What about the situation was she not digging. There was an issue she had. I don't know. But she moved into a trailer behind the house. Oh that's OK. Sure. Sure. Where you go when you're divorced. Yeah. Yeah. Big John's sold the landscaping business and started flying to Lake Tahoe to gamble. There's just

a lot of bad moving. There's a lot of storm clouds. Yeah. In July 1975. Elizabeth pulled one of her disappearing tricks again. But this time it was different because she was found dead three days later in a field behind the house. Oh boy. So she can actually go very far. OK. So now it's now it's taking a turn. You feel the gear shift. Yeah. I'm wondering if she's got elbows. Yeah. That's actually a great question. The guy just shows up. I don't know who did it. But this she don't have elbows though. Whoever did elbows whoever did this was obsessed with elbows and stitches. So she had a lethal combo of valium and booze in her system in the corner rule that is suicide. But there was one issue.

Yeah that that's the map to a good time. Yeah. That's the same. Yeah. She only drank vodka and her stomach was full of whiskey and a bottle was not found. So what are what is. Well she butt chugged whiskey and they threw the bottle. Big John did what anyone does after his ex wife dies. After the funeral he walked around the house cutting her out of all the photos in front of the kids. Hey John what are you. What are you. How are you. How are you doing man. Are you grieving. And then he took her ashes out into the yard and just dumped them in the yard. The ashes of the pictures. No just ashes of her her ashes. Wait her. This is post cremation. No it's pre cremation. So yeah I said he just dumped it in the yard

which you're not usually you have a better sort of way to get rid of ashes. No I've always said I want to be I want to be dumped in the garden closest. Not a garden. I'm in the garbage. Yep. Did I say garden. Yeah I think of garbage as a garden. Yeah. If you leave it long enough life will grow. So. So he started spending a lot of money in dressing very well. He took the gambling up a notch. He liked Harvey's wagon wheel casino in state line in Nevada. It's a great spot though. Harvey's wagon wheel is great. One of the best. Yeah. If you get we go there on a day when Harvey's there and he's handing out wagon wheels. Thank you. You have a good time my friend. You will have a good time. Harvey's is one of the first

casinos built in state line a town on the south shore of Lake Tahoe in the Sierras on the border of California Nevada. Sure. It was opened by Harvey Gross and his wife in 1944. Mr. Mrs. Gross. Yep. Across the street was Harris his main competition. Tahoe took off as a gambling location and soon Harvey was killing it at Harvey's. Big John was treated as a big time gambler. Okay. Harvey's gave him the best room for free. He started to get his own suite every time. Okay. He knew the staff. He was invited to stay at Harvey's ranch. Wow. I was going to ask what's VIP life at the wagon wheel. Right. Stay at Harvey's ranch. Yeah. And they even let him fly Harvey's helicopter. Okay. That's a little

treacherous. I don't know. Does he have a license. I guess it's a question. He's got the plane license but not a helicopter because he can fly a plane. So they were like well try the helicopter. From what I can tell they were in the air and he goes take over that kind of deal. Oh there was one of those. So it's how you teach a kid. Yeah. It's exactly you're at a parking lot. You teach a kid how to drive a little. That's how I teach my kid to drive a helicopter. Fly one. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Well figured out quick. You know what I mean. No. He's a he's got it. Okay. So with this awesome treatment job. Big job of spending more and more time in Tahoe. The boys had to take care of themselves. Sounds like they

could do a better job. You know why don't we not beat each other and we get haircuts whenever. How about that. Fun little wrinkle. One day delivery trucks just showed up. Eight thousand and canned food in one. Two thousand one hundred pounds of beef in another. What three entire steers and four lambs. What two hundred pounds of hot dogs. Anything perishable put it all in the walk in a walk in freezer they had. Big John told the boys there was enough food to last them three years and took off to state line for a month. I mean what was he anticipating they were going to do. It's the 70s. This kind of should happen all the time. Is that right. I think so. Mother I used to leave you Cheetos I think. Very

much the same. Different. Big John fell in love again. Okay. With a helicopter April nineteen seventy six. He married an 18 year old waitress from the restaurant. He's born from the wagon wheel restaurant. Yeah. Or no from the restaurant Elizabeth. Yeah. She is no anymore because she got she's right now her ashes are in the yard. She's gone. Yeah. So seventy six. He was born in twenty two fifty four. Sure. She's 18. Sure. It's cool. Yeah. There's a lot to talk about for some reason the marriage only lasted a year. What. I know. Good Lord. Then he started dating another waitress. Joan Williams who moved in. We get to see her. Yeah. Oh. Okay. That's I could that's the only picture I could find

her. Well I like that she's her purse is enormous. She's got a book like books. Yeah. So she's a probation officer or something. Oh so she met. Okay. Oh right. Okay. She moves in. Okay. She like waitress on weekends at the restaurant but then had a real job probation officer by week right. Wait. Okay. Then a debt collector came around one day. I'm here for all the ham. You guys owe me nine pigs. Word is you got two hundred pounds of hot dogs. Yeah. So we're here for 150 pounds of your hot dogs and we're here for four of the pigs. Listen we ate the hot dog. Look we're with repo meats. We're here to do a job pal. Show us the mother load. Hey boss he said he's only got like half the hamburger. Bullshit

that kid ain't eating all that hamburger. Look at him. He's been weeks. I'll tell you what I smell hidden hot dogs like I've never smelled them before. This kid's sitting on a pile of cured beef. Hey boss. What. You better not be quitting because everybody's quitting. I'm going over to repo veggies. What the why. What is it with them. I got a I got like a digestive problem. We all look look I just the older I get the hotter it is. I find the right payroll company. I'm going to be paying you guys for the love of God. Give a man a five years to find a payroll company while he feeds you. I don't want to I don't want to get paid in Hamlet. How about this. Take a lamb. Sleep on it. I don't want

to take a like five lamb. Take a lamb. I don't have a walk in fridge. Take a lamb. So they're all packed in. Take the ones that don't pack. There's meat just pile on top of my fridge. That's called alpaca. That's not what that is. Oh man. This is supposed to be a cash economy. I don't even know. This is not a meat. I'll tell you how bad I am at this. I don't even know what that means. Helen left a month ago. And dad. So it turns out big John a bounce a couple of checks to Harvey's was I really want a picture that his main currency now is just beef or some sort of food. I mean I would. So it's nine hundred hot dogs. Who should I make that out to. There you go. So he owed about a thousand dollars which he handed

over when the debt collector came. A few months later the restaurant burned down. OK. OK. Police suspected foul play. OK. Big John got three hundred thousand in insurance money which he quickly lost the blackjack tables. OK. At Harvey's. OK. Great. He then sold this house to Joan to pay off his debts. Joan is the part time probation officer who lives with them. Right. OK. But even that wasn't enough. He still owed more money. So in nineteen seventy nine big John bounced fifteen thousand worth of checks at Harvey's. The debt collector came back and big John said he'd be up in Tahoe soon. He would pay off a thousand of what he owed when he got there. But he did not do this. OK. What he did do was go to

state line and lease a condo near Harvey's and hit the tables again. OK. Wait. But where does he owe the money to. Harvey's. So he's going to Harvey's and playing at Harvey's. Yeah. So what's the security like at Harvey's. Well this is. So this isn't like a. I don't think Harvey's mobbed up at all. You mean the wagon wheels clean. And this is a different time. Uh huh. So I just think that maybe they were like maybe he'll come around. It's Harvey like you know they'd already gotten so much money from him that maybe like now they would just cut you off. But I don't know if it was like that back then. Right. Yeah. Maybe they just weren't talking about it. So anyway that's just life at the wagon. Yeah. This is a family

joint. It's a wagon. It's the wagon wheel. So he keeps getting a gamble there. But life is no longer being kind to Big John. His health is failing. OK. He had two different ulcer surgeries and started drinking malox like water. Do you know what malox is. It's a chalky water. I don't think they have it anymore. They do. Do they. Well my dad was a guy who. You know what malox is. Right. I remember it. Yes. Yeah. So my dad would drink it like water too. It's like liquid tums or what. Yeah. It's. It's. Well a great. I always. Digestion ulcer. I actually like to do a maker's and malox which is on the rocks. It's kind of like a whiskey white Russian little malox little maker's Mark two ice cubes. Huh. Stir that

up. Drink it right away so it doesn't congeal into a hard concrete. Oh yeah. It's tasty. It was a bit of a pep tobismo. Yeah. Oh yeah. I'll do a pep on vodka sometimes. It's a nice color. Yeah. It's for a month. Yeah. Malox. It was a thing back then people just drank a lot of it, and alcoholics especially, and they would sometimes mix it with their actual alcohol. Oh, they really would? Yeah. Oh, my God.

Well, it tasted a little minty, right? Yeah, I remember. I think it did. Yeah. Oh, that's why you got to have a Maylox jupe it. Well, I would get the cream to mint and just pour it in and double the mint. You know what I'm talking about? Yeah, that's what I'm saying, man.

Little Baileys and Maylox, get yourself a little Baylox. In the spring of 1979, Big John was diagnosed with abdominal cancer. Okay. He was put in a hospital with acute gastrointestinal bleeding, but after he still went and gambled spending two or three weeks every month in Tahoe gambling to make back what he had already lost. Okay, so he's okay. He's a plan.

Does he have a plan? He's gambling to make back what he lost. Sorry. So his plan is to continue to gamble and... He's gambling to make back what he lost. Right. The plan. Oddly, this doesn't work.

This doesn't work? No. That's shocking. The manager put him up at Harvie's on New Year's Eve weekend and demands a room. Yeah, I need a room. He's with a woman who he's trying to show off to that he's a big time. That's how you do it. That's how you show off.

Have nothing set up. Have no reservation. Just show up and demand. But he used to be able to do that. Yeah, but still, he knows the deal now. Wow. He's not getting sweets at the wagon wheel no more. He don't know.

The manager put him up in his usual suite. Well, okay. But soon after the manager came back and said the couple had to leave the suite because there was another guest who needed it. Okay. Sure. He's getting kicked out of his regular suite. Yeah.

And he has put in a tiny room that they could barely walk around the bed in. He got bumped. Yeah. Seriously bumped. Yeah. He's obviously furious. The woman said to Big John, quote, I thought you were a big shot. I am.

This is when he has to just take a look out the window and go, I was a big shot. He just looks out at the vacant lot of the wagon wheel. They used to call me Big John used to cut. Not only was a big shot, they used to call me Big John, which is why I got the big room, not this goddamn closet. Hello. Not a damn it. Not a common mid-sized job.

Big John was 58 years old, dying of cancer and had now been totally humiliated. So they came up with a plan. The tear always, always bad words on the show. No. Probably not. A little while later, Jimmy shows up. Jimmy shows up at the wagon wheel. No.

Jimmy shows up at Johnny's house and Johnny's moved out of the house. I think I said that. Yeah. Johnny's now 19. That's Jimmy. We're looking at. That's Jimmy. Okay.

Johnny is now 19. He's a pothead and a roofer. Okay. Sorry. Roofer. It says something about the times we live in when now that to me means that it. Oh my God. What?

These are the guys. Yeah. These are your sons. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Look at that. It's like it's almost like if you said, give me a picture from the late 70s.

Yeah. Yeah. Throw the glasses on mother. Yeah. Yeah. Truly. Oh, holy. So on the right, Johnny is always high.

He grows pot to smoke and sell. Yeah. Right. So in other words, he deals pot. He's tan. He's rocking a thin little mustache. Yeah. They both are actually.

Yeah. I don't touch. He drove a van with a sticker that read when the vans are rockin. No, no, no, no, no, no, no. I'm not going to. He didn't. Yes, he did. Welcome to stereotypes.

Vans for sale. But that's probably, I mean, that truly is probably the heyday for that slogan. Oh yeah. Like this is before that's like when people would be like, oh man, that's hilarious. That is amazing. When the van, I'm mad, that's hilarious because that means sexist. Man that's hilarious. No, no, I think he's talking about wrestling or playing ball or whatever.

I told you guys, I'm doing crunches for the last time. I'll have to work out. Okay. Another sticker on inside on the dashboard said, ass, grass or cash, nobody rides for free. Wow. I mean. Yeah.

Yeah, man. That's right. What do you pay Dave? Let's say you get in. Those are your options. Like four hot dogs. No, I don't. How come I got to eat them with the lights off and I can't chew?

On Saturday nights, Johnny race motorcycles. Okay. Jimmy hated Johnny. Okay. Barely saw each other anymore. I think they hadn't seen each other in like three years at this point. Well, it definitely looks like one of them was just like, you know what, I'm going to go, I'm going to go a corporate route.

And the other one's like tennis for sure. Tennis. So Jimmy on the left, Jimmy is different. He's 18. He's smart. He was in a high school program for the Brainiac kids. It lives with his dad very, you know, you don't need to tell people about the Brainiac classes who are in the Brainiac classes.

That's not you. Absolutely. No, I was in all of them. Right, mom. I got homeschooled. She'd always. Yeah. I graduated.

Remember when you put me in the garage for the smart kids? I can't quite remember all that. Yeah. Yeah. You fed me rabbit heads. You remember. Yeah. Yeah.

Jimmy said, quote, Big John sent me to tell you he needs your help. Jimmy explained the plan. Okay. Big John was going to extort a million dollars from Harveys by building and planting a bomb in the casino. What? Okay. They're going to.

Okay. Keep going. Obviously insane. The boys ended up laughing about it, thinking it would never happen. But things got worse for Big John. In March, the IRS said he owed $30,000. Sorry. Just to be clear, Johnny is planning on building a bomb inside of.

Big John. Big John is not Johnny. Okay. Right. The boys are talking about it. The boys talk about it and they laugh about it and they're like, that'll never happen. The one thing we can agree upon is that if dad were to build a bomb inside of the casino, that would be madness.

So then Big John finds out he owes the IRS $30,000 and he starts talking about killing himself. Well, a bomb in a casino will do that. But in June, Jimmy called Johnny to tell him Big John had found the dynamite he needed for the bomb. Okay. Quite an update from the last time when you were like, imagine, anyway, oh, I should, before I go, dad has all the dynamite to build the bomb.

He won't shut up about, wait, are we doing this? Is this a thing? Yeah. Dad's, dad's going to do it. I got a run though. I'm a dealing pot at this event, but I got a run, but yeah, no, dad has all the dynamite to build the bomb inside the wagon wheel because the IRS is coming after him. All right.

I'll talk to you. Okay. Take care. Uh, so he did by found, I mean, he knew where it was, where he just needed to steal it. Were they hiding it or he just located where there's enough dynamite located where there's enough dynamite. Okay. The boys are still terrified of Big John and agree to help him.

Wow. That's a new level of fear. Okay. So he would get caught if he tried to get the bomb inside Harvey's, so nothing would actually happen. Yeah. I guess that's quite a, hey, you know, let's not say anything. There's no way we'll get a bomb inside of the casino.

So one night, Johnny picked up Big John and Jimmy in his van and they drove into the mountains to the helms. The options are cash. To the Helms Creek hydroelectric construction project. They were blasting four miles of tunnels in the mountains and Big John had scoped it out and security was not great. The day he went there, he just walked in and looked around and nobody said anything. Okay.

So much different time with explosives. Didn't that happen in the White House this week? I was just going to say the same thing. That's how that book got written, right? Just like act like you belong and just like, Hey, I'm going to take a bunch of dynamite. See you tomorrow, boys. What the fuck just happened? Sure enough.

They got there. They just drove through the gate. Yeah. They drove to a shack that was marked danger explosives. This is where the explosives are. They cut the lock on the shack. They filled the van with boxes of dynamite and blasting caps. How is it that they're able to get all this like it's liquor at a country club that's

closed? It's just the seventies. Well, here we go. This is where all that dynamite is. Those guys taking the dynamite. They're supposed to take the dynamite. I don't know, but I don't want to be rude, man. Yeah.

Yeah. Pass to the left. They drove the whole thing took about an hour. Nobody said a word. Okay. So I think that once dad gets to the casino, there's no way they'll be that polite there. The whole thing is just like nobody wants to be rude. So look like that guy's building the bomb.

Yeah. I don't want to be a dick. But when people show up and look like they're supposed to do stuff, people like, Oh, you're supposed to be doing that thing. That is part. Yeah. Even if it's taking dynamite. Yeah.

So they ended up stealing 18 cases. That's what Beverly Hills Cop is based on. Yeah. Okay. Keep going. Which is a true story. Yeah. It's a great documentary.

Third one falls apart. They stole 18 cases of dynamite. Holy shit. Which was a thousand pounds of explosives. Holy shit. They stole a thousand. Imagine how much the van was just like sagging in the back. Yeah.

What do you got in there? Just dynamite. Why do you think they got it from, I mean, I don't want to be rude. They put the boxes in the walk-in freezer, which had been purchased to hold all the meat. Well, they had a feast that night. I was just going to say, if the three stooges come over, someone's eating dynamite thick and it's a hot dog. That's for sure.

A nice barbecue. Yeah. That's right. It's done. The local paper ran a story about the theft, but no one seemed to care that much. Okay. Sure. Johnny's girlfriend noticed though.

She had been there when Jimmy came over to talk about the plan and she immediately broke up with Johnny. Okay. Wait. So what's that? Jimmy. So we have the first person in the story who was sent. Right.

So Johnny's girlfriend, who was there when they were joking around, now puts two or two together. It was like, oh my God, they stole that. I'm out of here. Baby, wait. Once he tries to build it in the casino, they'll say something. He's not going to get it in. Oh my God.

Why won't anyone understand that someone will stop him? It just can't be anyone. Big John was suddenly very happy. Okay. Yeah. He was working in the shop every day, welding and smoldering, probably whistling away. He had a project. You know, I have a mind.

I have a Mellox and Gin. Two weeks later, he had welded two rectangular boxes together using quarter inch steel. So there's a large box that could fit all the dynamite in it. Cool. And then it's 26 inches high, 24 inches wide, and 45 inches long. Okay. The second box is smaller and he welds it on top of the first one. And that's where like the brain of the operation is, right?

Sort of like the carry-on and check bag. Like the carry-on and check bag. Right. That's exactly how they describe it. That's how my mind works. That's a gap into my mind palace. It's an excellent mind. Thank you.

It really is really great. Thank you. It's a great mind. It's really great. See, sometimes Dave is sarcastic on the show. I wondered whether he meant it or not. If I know Dave, he meant that. Oh, we did.

Oh, absolutely. Dave. Hi. What's up? So it had eight separate fusing mechanisms. Good. If any of them were triggered, the bomb would explode. If someone tried to drill outside, the bomb would explode.

If someone tried to unscrew the screws on the top of the boxes, the bomb would explode. The lids also had pressure switches, so if someone took off a lid, the bomb would explode. So he's got... If the box was flooded, he'd rigged it with a floating device from a toilet, which would cause the bomb to explode. If someone tilted the box, the bomb would explode. If someone tried to insert something between the two boxes, the bomb would explode. And he put it in a timer, and once the timer was set, there's no way to stop the bomb.

Okay. So, wait. So, he's literally thought of everything? Yeah. Who's moving this with him? Anyone? I don't want to go with you. Just the whole thing is that we can't get it wet and don't tilt it at all.

Make sure the boxes don't separate. Don't put anything in the holes. Do not make new holes, and don't press the top. And we just got to sneak it into the middle of the wagon wheel. I mean, basically, he built a bomb that could not be disarmed. Right. That's... So are the kids still operating under the...

No one will be... No one will... Someone has to save them. I mean, come on. I think they're just terrified of them. It sounds like that might be the culprit the whole time, Dave. So the plan was to put the bomb in Harri's and give them information on how to move the bomb if they gave money, right?

So if they give a ransom, then he provides some information on how to move the bomb, and then they could take it out into Lake Tahoe and blow it up with the bottom of Lake Tahoe or something. Yeah. Well, don't get it too wet. So Big John worked on the bomb through the summer. I do love that he has his little project. I know he's happy to play now.

He's just happy back there listening to CCR, just smoking. Right. So what about looking at this as a guy is able to escape from his cancer issue? I'm having quite a renaissance summer. There's nothing wrong with the project. I'm fine to me again. Big John, he works on the bomb through the summer. Johnny and Jimmy didn't want to have anything to do with it, but they were also too scared

of Big John not to. I don't want to be rude. Joan typed up the ransom note. Cool. So that's good. She let Jimmy read it, but only after he put gloves on first. Sure. That's a mother figure.

Yeah. For sure. This is before they were cutting out of magazines. That guy flipped the script. Big time. Magazine cut guy. Oh, that guy. People were like, well, that's what we do from now on.

My God. I mean, there's one of what we were sitting here typing. We've been writing with our left hands for a decade. I mean, seriously, the guy who did the first magazine cutting, he's like, oh, he, why, he's playing. I didn't know what he was doing. And he's like, this is amazing. Or he's happy.

I want to kid that so many people right now, or he's got writer's block and he's like, I just don't know if this is right. Am I crazy? Maybe people will just be like, I think it's gobbledygook. Or over the top. Yeah. And then he drops it. He's like, it's as good as I thought.

It's amazing. It's the Sergeant Peppers of Ransom Notes. People are going bananas. I've changed kidnapping. Oh, my God. What did this guy do? You know what? Fuck this.

Okay. I'm just going to tell everybody I did it. Because it's so great. I don't care about getting away with it. That's how they caught the first guy. You like the Ransom Note, huh? You know it. It took a while and my wrist was starting to hurt.

A lot. Not easy to find all those whys. National Geographic's. You know where I found the whys? Family Circus. Oh, okay. That makes sense. Can you believe that?

That's amazing. Yeah. All right. Well, you're under arrest for the murder of nine people. I don't care. I understand that. That's a thing. So, on August 23rd, they were doing a little trial run with the bomb, putting it on a cart.

Because that's how they're going to get into the casino, right? They're going to put it on a cart and then they're going to wheel it across the parking line into the casino. Okay. Like a, what's known as a cartoon. Yes. This is called Ocean's Insane. As they were doing it, they were using a rope.

The rope snapped. One of the wheels rolled over Johnny's. Oh, my God. Oh, my God. Oh, my God. What are you thinking when anything goes wrong? Oh, my God. So the rope snaps, rolls over Johnny's hand and he's furious and he's done.

He screams, quote, I don't want nothing more to do with it. I'm out. And he leaves. And then Jimmy says, if he's not going to do it, I'm not going to do it. That's a great excuse. That's a great excuse. Right? Jimmy's got it.

The piggyback. The piggyback's a great one. Yeah. He's like, if my brother, I hate can't do it. I'm not going to do it. Look. I mean, this is crazy. But he's leaving.

The whole thing's falling apart because what he started, go after him first. So Big John called two friends, Felon Terry Hall and Felon Bill Brown. Okay. Both felons. Okay. Did I mention that? Yeah. You said felons.

Both were big time drinkers and out of work. Okay. So they need money. Uh huh. Big John told Bill he had a job that paid two grand for a day's work. Okay. So each of them get two grand for one day's work. Sure.

Bill said, that's all they know though. That's right. I'm going to vote who I got to kill. Okay. Okay. Potentially yourself. But we'll come down here and let's do this in person. So Bill and Terry slammed the beers.

They were drinking and headed over to Big John's house. Let's get some Maylux and then we'll head right over. Big John said he needed help delivering a machine to Harvey's. Okay. It's a bunch of hot dogs. You know all the meats I've been working with lately? Yeah. I put them all in a box.

Taking little Harvey's for a big surprise. That's nice. To be a buffet afternoon. That's nice. That's classy. That's nice. That's nice. You know you got a bad reputation but you're a pretty good guy.

Thank you. That's nice. Lots of meats. They call me Meat John. Sure. They should work on it a little longer maybe. Meat Johnny. Okay.

All right. Now. Hot dog. Don't do anymore. Hot dog John. Johnny hot dogs. Johnny hot. Weiner John.

Stop pitching. God. Hot meat. No. No. Bobby. Bobby hot meat. Johnny dog.

I don't even know. Have a cow. Have a cow. So these guys don't ask why. They have no questions about what they're delivering or why they're delivering it. That's when they seem to think this is all normal. That they're delivering a box or a package. Right.

Sure. That's what they say. Yeah. Do they get it? It doesn't. They're no point. They're like, why would you give us $2,000 to deliver a machine? Like nothing is questioned.

Does he? I mean, does he run? They're also drunk. But still, you would think you got to run them through the rules. You've got to. Oh, he does. He runs them through the rules. Okay.

So they're just like, uh-huh. Okay. Yeah. Okay. So don't get wet. Got it. Okay. Yeah.

Don't tilt it. Understand. All right. Cool. Okay. Okay. Yeah. You got it.

Okay, boss. Yeah. Two grand a day. What are you going to do? Huh? Yeah. Okay. Don't look at it.

I got it. Okay. Don't breathe on it. That's fair. Yeah. It's understandable. All right. Well, let's just do the job, huh?

Any more beer? Yeah. Let's just, I'll tell you. Can I put a beer on it? Yeah. Yeah. Oh, right. Because of the pressure on the top.

All right. Yeah. Let's do it. Let's do it. We'll drink the beer. I'll put the beer in the pocket. Beer hats. We'll put it on beer hats.

Beer hats. We'll put beer hats on. Okay. Here we go. Okay. So they leave it dusk. Big John drives. Because as, as you do when you're delivering your machine to Xena, you want to drive through

the night. Yeah. Well, and you also, you've got it. You've got to drive because the others are like, okay. Yeah. So why don't you drive? Okay. We'll just go six the whole time.

Okay. However you want to do it. You can't be like, Hey, watch this. I'll just do it you. Two turns. So they drink beers in the band the whole time. Okay. They're driving.

Okay. They drove all night and arrived at 5am. Okay. They had breakfast and then they went to a motel. Big John told Terry to get a room. But Terry was on parole. So he couldn't register a room under his name out of state. Okay.

So he wrote a fake name down on the card. They stayed in the room until that night. Okay. They drank and watched TV. Fun. Big John went out at 2.30am and told the guys to pick him up at a nearby airport. Okay. This is the kind of stuff that happens when you're delivering a machine to a business.

So I'm going to go out. Okay. Yeah. It's 2.30. Go ahead. Okay. Yeah. And then you guys are going to pick me up at 5am at the airport.

Okay. I'm going to slow it down enough so I can jump on the side. Okay. Yeah. Don't do a full stop. Okay. Got it. Yeah.

So you can jump on the side and get in. Okay. Whatever you want to do. You don't go ahead and take the machine over to the machine. Yeah. We'll take the machine that we can't get wet. Look at or put anything on top of. Yeah.

Okay. Great. Okay. Yeah. All right. See you guys in a bit. All right. Yeah.

No problem. Yeah. Oh, remember. My name is different here. Oh, yeah. I was in the van. I went to get him. But the van wouldn't start.

Oh, boy. A big John came back and called the tow truck and they got a jump and then the van was running again. What? Now they had to keep it running. Okay. Then he had Terry and Bill change into blue overalls and they drove over to Harvey's. Okay.

Are there anybody, anybody asking anything at any point? Okay. No. So just get naked in the van and put on blue overalls. Okay. Yeah. You got it. No one's asking a question.

We've got to choose some weed or something in our mouths. Should we call each other Apple seed? How do you want to handle it? Tell us what to do. Okay. So he stopped and stole license plates from another van on the way. Okay. So you got a bunch of license plates from that van.

Put it on this one. Okay. Yeah. Okay. They did not ask a question. Okay. No problem. Yeah.

You want, we should help. But you want to do it all yourself. Okay. Great. You do it then. Okay. Bill and Terry unloaded the box. Okay.

It was heavy and hard to move. Oh boy. Don't move it too much. They put it on a dolly. When they got into the doors, a guy inside Harvey's just let them in and guided them over to an elevator. Let me get that door for you gentlemen. There we go.

Move along now. Never said a word. The guy just never said a peep. We think there's hot dogs in here. Bill then went back to the van and Terry took the bomb up on a dolly. Oh my God. To the second floor. Oh my God.

Just chewing gum. Now Terry wasn't super drunk, but he definitely had a lot of beer. Jesus. He put, now he was told where to put it. Okay. Yeah. So he puts it in a room on the second floor. He took off the overalls.

Okay. So he puts it, he puts it down and he puts, it's got like, I don't know if it has wheels or what it has, but he puts plywood underneath each, I think it's a wheel underneath each wheel. Okay. And that's how he sets it up. Okay. Okay.

As you would do with a machine. Are you going to bring up a picture of a dolly? Oh my God. Look at the little box. So it's got wheels. Oh yeah. It's got a little. That's the actual thing?

Yeah. That's the bomb. Is that what you were picturing? Well, I wanted to do the photo. Yeah. The other one. Okay. Just get a couple of us in here.

Okay. You want us to smile? Let's do one with silly faces. Okay. Okay. You got it, boss. Boy, these people are going to love all these hot dogs. Yeah.

That's right, boys. So then as he had been told, he takes off the overalls and puts them in a Harvey's bag. All right, just got to get naked and put that clothes in Harvey's bag. And then John and then John told them to do that. So he did it. And then he went down the stairs instead of the elevator and went out through the casino, main casino floor and out the front door. Okay.

So he had stuff on underneath the overalls. Yeah. It closed. Okay. Big John, Terry and Bill then drove off. Okay. Okay. They bought more beer, drank a little bit and then stopped at a creek to pee.

So Big John is probably keeping them just drunk enough and not like really throw a lot of flags on the play. I 100% think that he's keeping them nice and buzz. Hey, you know, I was just thinking, have another beer. Okay. I don't mind. I really think that's what's going on. Put on ZZ Top.

So at the creek. The creek that they're peeing in. While the two guys are peeing, Big John throws the dolly into the creek. Okay. And for the first time, Terry, have a question. Hey, why would you throw away a piece of something like itself at 20 bucks? Hey, Big John. You know, we was just talking as we was taking a leak in the creek and why'd you throw the

dolly in? I mean, of all the fucking things. Of all the things. Okay. Okay. Why is it just weird to throw something with wheels away? So never mind having to leave a robot in a room. So Big John tells them they had just put a bomb in Harvey's.

Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Thanks. Thanks, BJ. And Bill and Terry are shocked. Okay.

You have to look, but you have to be like, boy, I'm an idiot. We are idiots. We are definitely idiots. I'm looking back now and I'm thinking there's so many times. Don't beat yourself up. There's so many times. Don't beat yourself up. How are we to know anything nefarious was taking place?

It was like change your clothes. Of course it was a little strange to take. Don't look anybody in the eyes. Of course it was strange that he demanded no eye contact. Don't shake the box. Of course there's not shaking. Don't chill the box. Don't look at the box.

Don't sell the box. Don't get the box wet. No, there was a lot of rules. Don't shake it. Don't put anything on it. Of course. Of course. But how are we to know that that's anything other than maybe.

The whole thing when we checked in, we're telling the different names. Yeah, I know that. We got drunk all night. He went at 2.30 in the morning. Look, look, look. We switched the license plate on the car. Oh, come on. My dad just do that all the time on family road trips.

Don't beat yourself up. Don't Monday morning quarterback yourself on this. I feel so goddamn stupid. Come on. We're not stupid. He's very, he's very shrewd. Fucking thing, though. This beer is so good.

Yeah. And I'll tell you, I think we can fish that dolly out and make a quick 25. God, you're right. You know what I mean? I like working with you. ABC. Always be. Choo.

Choo. Well. Yeah. Yeah. All right. Thank you. Big John to alleviate their fears that he had left. He had had, he had had Terry leave a note, drop it on the floor next to the bomb, telling

Harvie's to get everyone out of the building. So no one's going to get hurt. He's like, no, there'll be no one in the building if the bomb goes off because he left a post it near it. Well, he left it. No, it's a, it's a three page note to tell, tell people what to do. Instructions also get everyone out of the building. I mean, is that, does that sound like he cares?

Well, he cares about the people. I guess. Does he? Well, or else he just had the bomb go off. Yeah. But I don't like what, like, I mean, if you walk into a room and you have these two steel boxes and there's three pages of loose leaf, which one are you going to go? Huh?

I'm going to take a look at all the letter. I got to do the card first. You're going to love this story. Oh boy. On the way back, Bill and Terry got completely shitfaced. Okay. About a half hour later, a Harvey's worker noticed the strange box in the telephone exchange room of the casino.

Okay. It was on metal legs, balanced on pieces of plywood. He went downstairs to get security. The security guard had just taken a training course on letter bombs. Okay. He went in the room, he took one look, saw the letter on the floor, and told everyone who had gathered and was looking at the box to back away. Called the sheriff.

The sheriff arrived. The sheriff in the security guard poked the envelope with a broomstick. Wait. Are you? Wait. From behind the metal box. No, no. Wait.

Okay. Wait. This guy has just been trained and he's actually doing the right thing until people see him poking a letter and they're like, he has been trained. He thinks the letter's a bomb. He's been trained, just trained in a course on letter bombs. Has he? He has.

Are we sure? Yes. Okay. So he's poking it from behind the guard, the thing that was provided. Let me get on top of this box and I'll poke it with a broom harder. If they poke it, then they realize it's not a bomb. Inside the envelope are three pages. The security guard took one page and he leaned on the bomb while he read the page.

What is going on there? All right. Until the cop who was reading another page, Hey, my page has something interesting about the box. He pointed at the bomb and said, quote, that's a bomb. Oh, you know, it's crazy. Oh my God. I was thinking the letter was the bomb.

I had, I had it reversed. I had, you could say I could do that though, because look at the letter. Look at it. That makes so much. It was a very suspicious envelope. Now there's a big box here. That's nothing. But man, did that envelope look weird when I first saw it.

It looked really weird. Look at this funny metal ottoman. So the building is evacuated. It's Labor Day weekend. So everything is sold out all over town. The FBI comes, the parking lot at that point was full of old people in their pajamas, kids without shoes, people in total disarray being loaded onto buses. The security guards are trying to figure out how to lock a casino front door that had been

open 24 hours a day for 17 years. Well, Jesus Christ, there's no lock on this thing. Oh boy. There's not even a way to close it. Oh boy. We need the opposite of Houdini right now. The FBI and local bomb squad were taken aback by how well the bomb was built. Look at this.

None of the bomb squad guys had ever seen anything like it. There appeared to be no way in. The letter, quote, stern warning to the management and bomb squad. Do not move or tilt this bomb because the mechanism controlling the detonators will set it off at a movement of less than point zero one of the open and Richter scale. Oh my God. That's not actually a thing. No, but it sounds good.

But so what? It did sound good. The bomb squad guy was like, that's total bullshit. But what? I mean, I'm sure this is where we're going, but like, what are your, if you read that list of stuff you can't do, you're like, oh wait, he says, don't, don't try to flutter gas the bomb. There's a float switch and an atmospheric pressure switch set at two, six, zero to three,

three, zero. Both are attached to detonators to not try to take it apart. The flathead squirrels are also attached to triggers warning. I repeat, do not try to move disarm or enter the bomb. It will explode. Okay. Okay. And meanwhile, Terry had to drop that letter.

Yeah. My fingerprints are probably all over that thing. Oh, Jesus. It said the bomb was packed with a thousand pounds of TNT, which would wipe out Harveys and do damage to Harris across the street. There were three separate timers, quote, this bomb can never be dismantled or disarmed without causing an explosion, not even by the creator, God, God, I am baffled. It looks like even the screws have some sort of wire on it and I, boy, I don't even know

how to, how offensive is it that your son thinks that God's a man? Boy. What am I? No, I actually, Dave, I don't. Okay. I got that jack. So I believe it's the divine mother tentacle being the letter asked for three million in used hundred dollar bills to be delivered by helicopter to a middleman.

Okay. Wait, three million non fresh bills delivered to a middleman via helicopter. Okay. More details would come. Sure. Sure. We just got to have a couple beers. It said the, it said the details would come by post office.

So that was, I think that was also bullshit. Was there a part, was there a part B? They're just like, now they're in there. Oh shit, we need to hire a middleman after the money was received. The instructions would be given to disconnect two timers to the bomb could be moved somewhere. It would explode without harm. Okay. Quote, there will be no extension or renegotiation than transaction has to take place within 24

hours. He's done a pretty good, I mean, he's done a pretty good job. Yeah. Okay. Make sure that's clear. They x-rayed the box and they, yep, it was full of explosives and very, very complex. It seemed they were looking at the largest improvised bomb in US history. It was sort of scripted.

The FBI set up a control center. People drove down and parked nearby to watch. Of course. So where it's out, it's on the news. So everyone's driving out and check it out. Yeah. So our IQ is always kind of been hovering around the same area. It's just that we now have access to more terribleness.

Well, when I was in, I think up to the serve, when I was in college, there was a plane crash where a guy had shot up, shot a pistol on a plane and the plane exploded and we were like, oh, it was like 15 minutes early. Holy shit. Let's drive up there and check that out. Oh my God. And then we're walking there and we're not walking to the car and we hear, and there's body parts over there.

We didn't think about that. Oh, we should roll. We should not watch it out of here. We were just thinking like it would just be like, you know, burning plane and stuff. You could upload it to YouTube. So glad Logan did not do that. You don't think about that stuff. Hey, why are you scarred forever?

We have this good idea. So the FBI, that army bomb squad was sent. The FBI sent 125 guys. Scientists came from Lawrence, the former lab. Like all these people are pouring in. Do you need these people? Well, you do need experts. They do want as many experts as they can get too many cooks, I say, Dave, too many cooks.

That's fair. They spent hours inspecting the bomb every possible way. By 3pm, the National Guard had set up a quarter mile perimeter around Harveys. Highway 50 was shut down. Boy, Harrah's was loving this stuff. Oh, fuck yeah. Well, they showed, they showed, or they didn't show, but I saw pictures of like people sleeping in the hallway in Harrah's because there were no hotel rooms anywhere.

So, the National Guard says, the perimeter, the highways closed down around 10 that night, they went to see Harvey Gross about the ransom and what he wanted to do. He was told the best thing to do would be to blow up the bomb where it was. Moving it, even with the instructions, could cause it to go off and kill the guys moving it. Harvey said, quote, there's no way I'm paying these sons of bitches any money. Okay, so he's, okay. He's a casino owner.

Okay. So Harvey's digging his heels in. Big John got back home late that afternoon, though Johnny and Jimmy said they wouldn't carry the bomb. Big John made them swear they would help with the ransom collection. Okay. So they're back in it. Now they try to back out, but Big John got angry and told them they had no choice.

Boy, the power you have over those two guys. They agreed. Big John told them to take two strobe lights he'd stolen, ski masks and jackets. Sure. Sure. So the guys are going to join the insane clown posse. Okay. What are they going to call juggalos in the future?

You boys ready to go to a rave? A 357 revolver, a 22, a 303 rifle, a box of ammo and a 12 volt motorcycle battery. That'd be for the strobe lights. Okay. Sure. Sure. They put all the stuff in Big John's gold Volvo. Big John.

Boy, not a detail to be overlooked. The first thing I thought of was just like, wow, could you have a less conspicuous car? So Big John and Joan drove her Toyota Celica. Glad Joan's still in the mix. Yeah. She's not. She's in this. Yeah.

Jimmy and Johnny followed in the Volvo. They dropped Joan at an airport near Sacramento and then the men drove in the Volvo to a remote clearing in the mountains above Lake Tahoe. Okay. So Jimmy and Big John got out, plan was to use the strobes to signal a helicopter that would be flying in. Sure. And when the pilot landed, they would hopefully not an epileptic pilot would be disastrous.

When the pilot landed, they would overpower him and Big John would then like John would then take the helicopter, which he didn't know how to fly. He only knew how to fly planes, but he had flown one, but not taken off. So he would take the helicopter and fly Jimmy and the money 40 miles away. And then Johnny would be waiting there with the Volvo and then Jimmy and the money would get in the Volvo. And Big John would fly to meet Joan at the airport near Sacramento and then they'd all go home.

Right. Of course. Yeah. Go home. Yeah. Boom, boom, boom. Back in time for the Walton. Can you see how that could not go well at all?

The explosive device was not the only improvised thing. All right. And then he lands. You guys beat the shit out of him. I with no experience shall fly it. And then I'm going to go meet your mom. I would like you to start addressing her as mom. But Big John forgot the battery pack for the strobe lights.

Oh my God. What? So where are you? Where are you? Just light your lighter fast. So they tried to steal one from a closed gas station. So they drive back away from. So they're about to get $3 million and they're stealing, they're shoplifting, they're trying

to lift batteries. Well, they're up in the mountains. There's nothing around. So they drive from the clearing, they get to this first gas station. It's closed, obviously. Can you imagine if you're the dad and your boys had to bring a battery? You built what they're calling the craziest bomb they've ever seen. Nope.

He forgot the battery. Not them. Big John did? Yeah. He forgot to put it in the car. Oh, you don't want to know the worst part. I did remember my wallet and I thought that's what I forgot. God damn it.

So he tries to break into like a car at a gas station, but the guy who runs a gas station lives there and he comes out with a dog and a gun and they run off. So then the only thing to do is they drive 30 miles down the mountains to Placerville and buy one at a shell station, they buy a battery at a shell station. Now we're offering two packs. If you want to actually take advantage, you can get two packs for the price. No, shut up. No, they were like, hey, man, we need a battery and the guy's like, well, tell me what kind

of car you have. And he's like, they're like, we don't care. Just give us one. He's like, no, I want to get this right. I got both. Do you have a Volvo or a Volkswagen or do you have a Chevy? Just give us the battery. Well, now you say that, but what I'm noticing that the Duracell has that the Energizer don't

have. I want to go get battery. So let me tell you about why I would go with Energizer. And then I'm going to tell you why you should go with the single and not the double. Okay. Right now we are running a special, okay, where you can get two Energizer batteries for $5. But in your situation, it sounds like you're not hard up for two.

Actually, I'm sort of thinking you maybe want to go now that I'm pitching it to you. I'm thinking we maybe do go Duracell. Well, now let me tell you why. Let me tell you why. Let me tell you why. There's a lady in line. She's snoring. Now, hold on.

Ma'am, you will wait your turn. Now, there is an ever ready, the third option that I have not even revealed until this moment. Anyway, they just throw money at the guy and take the battery. Okay. So they drive back. Now they're obviously way behind schedule. They're driven 30 miles out of the way to get a battery.

By the time Johnny dropped off Jimmy and Big John at the clearing, it's now midnight. What is the helicopter pilot just doing loops? Okay. The helicopter was told to be waiting at the Tahoe airport at 11 p.m. to wait for instructions. Now that's where he had gone at 2.30 a.m. when he left the hotel. So the guy's there, the helicopter guy is supposed to be there and he's told that the instructions would come either by a pay phone or be driven by a taxi. But the pilot is late because it turns out no one in the area wanted to help the FBI

and let them use their helicopter. Okay. None of the local agencies stepped up. Wow. So the FBI had to fly in a helicopter from Los Angeles. Takes time. So. It's adding a minute.

So right as the pilot landed the helicopter, everyone's freaking out, the phone starts ringing. Wow. Okay. It's 2, 12.08 a.m. and it's Johnny on the other end. So Johnny's dropped him off. He's driven to a pay phone. Sure.

Johnny uses Southern accent at first. Great. How you doing? And then immediately dropped it the next line. I only practice how you doing. Shit. How you doing? How you doing?

Are you ready for the instructions? Wait. What? How you doing? The instructions go as thus. He told the pilot the instructions were in the phone booth and then he had three minutes. On the underside of the phone booth, the pilot found a taped envelope. He hustled to the helicopter and gave the directions to another.

Could be a letter bomb. Yeah. Thank you. So he runs the helicopter, gives the directions to another FBI agent who's hiding behind the seats with a submachine gun. Okay. He is an ex-swat leader now at the FBI. The copilot seat had three bags on it, stuff with bundles of newspaper that looked like

three million in a hundred dollar bills, but they just had like a hundred on the outside. I mean, again, these are like movie tropes, but probably we're like, this is still early in that. Yeah. Well, I checked the top layer. All hundreds. This checks out for sure. The swat leader reads the instructions, so he hands the note, the pilot hands the note

to the swat leader guy. Okay. Follow Highway 50 west and after 50 minutes look for a strobe light. Land and find more instructions taped to a tree. Oh my God. They must just be like, this is ridiculous. Now the FBI has other plans. Okay.

High above this helicopter was a Huey carrying a six man FBI SWAT team. The plan is for the first helicopter with a SWAT leader to come down. They're going to hit their lights. That SWAT guy, the submachine gun is going to jump out the door away from the guys, roll out, then put on night vision goggles and hunt down the guys doing the extortion, right? And if that didn't work, if that didn't work, they bring in the guys from the Huey and just fucking blast the shit out of the place. So the Huey is flying above just in case.

Way above, so they can't even tell. Okay. Okay. Now Big John and Jimmy waited and they waited. Okay. And again, their plan is to just beat the snot out of the pilot. Yeah. Okay.

They're planning on fists against guns, submachine guns. Sure. For sure. And they wait. Uh huh. And then the helicopter comes because the SWAT guy had read the directions incorrectly and the helicopter is flying in the wrong direction. What is going, even the SWAT guy's like, I'm also an idiot just to be clear.

I too am dumb. I didn't go to brain school. All right. Here we are. Bakersfield. Oh man. So the pilot just keeps circling wider and wider trying to find this strobe light. We'll get there.

We'll get there. He just sees a house party. There it is. There it is. There it is. There it is. Right down there. And drop me off.

I'll put on the night vision goggles and beat them up. Finally gave up and just flew back to Tahoe. It was very cold. Big John used gunpowder to start a fire as he waited. What? Oh, that'll hit you. Johnny stood around waiting for four hours in the dark. No helicopter with his dad and brother came.

Okay. So Johnny drove to Joan. The two of them listened to the car radio where the governor said there had been confusion about the drop and they still wanted to pay the ransom. So the governor is just on an open channel being like, hello guys, we're still down. He's trying to reach the extortionist. So Johnny and Joan decided to drive back to get Big John and Jimmy because they know that they're just waiting there.

Someone's running out of gas eventually. But as they're driving, Joan slides off the road and crashed into an embankment. What? So now Joan is bleeding from her nose and her head. They got the two of them get in the Volvo and drive towards Jimmy and Big John, who they see just walking down the middle of the highway. What is, I mean, at any point is someone just going to admit this is going horribly? Hey guys, can we just take a minute and say how bad we're doing?

I think it's going great. I don't think it is. We're about to turn a quarter. So it's around six a.m. now. Oh my God. What's so? It's Wednesday, August 27th.

It's light out now and they have no money. Strobe's really going to take a hit. Now Joan is still bleeding, so they take her to a Placerville hospital. Okay. Big John told Johnny to call the sheriff's office and tell them to flip switch number five and wait for more instructions. Practice your southern accent. Now five is just a dummy switch, but he figured that would buy them more time from the 24

hour deadline. So five is a dummy switch at seven a.m. They start the drive back home. Johnny was late for work at the roofing company. So he's speeding. What's his excuse? I was. Okay.

So you know bombs, I was throwing a rave for a helicopter friend. So he's speeding. So he's not going to be late for work. And a California. He pulls them over and writes him a ticket. Oh my God. That's it. Okay.

The nerves. At Harvey's, they're obviously worried. The deadline has come and gone. Sure. They figured the bomb to blow up at any time. Every expert there has his own idea on what to do and how to handle it. The leading one was to use explosives to blow it up. That's what you got to do to use blow it up with a bomb.

So the idea is to use this well placed piece of brass that I'm not going to go into the technical things, but the idea is that you blow it in and it it's the fastest way to get this thing in there. And then it cuts off a lot of the wiring, essentially, it like says it severs the fusing mechanism. So it cannot blow up. So you shoot a, you basically shoot shrapnel into the bomb, hoping that it'll cut but you're doing it like you're, you're purposely blowing it in a direction and using a very specific

sure piece of metal. Sure. I think they should just put a bunch of water on it. Yeah. Yeah. That's a good idea. Put a little my lant there. Soon everyone there voted and agreed to blow up the bomb and whoever voted for Pee Wee

Herman. Haha. We're not cool boys. Okay. Trump. Who said Trump? Oh my God. That's crazy.

All right. Go. Come on. Let's focus on things that could happen. Um, a defensive defense contractor in Las Vegas made the brass piece and it was flown by helicopter to Tahoe. We got this pilot who's dying to fly. This guy loves flying.

He's bored. He loves it. Hey Jimmy. He's going to fly to Texas this time. Oh for God's sake. One time. The SWAT guy read the directions wrong. Okay.

SWAT guy. Yeah. There was no SWAT guy. That's an amazing wrinkle to this. By the way, the pilot invented a SWAT guy who's been with him a lot. It's kind of like his, well his Harvey to be honest, ironically. So at 3, 10 p.m., the lead bomb dude, whoever he is, positioned the explosives and the brass piece.

Okay. Around Harvey's, all tourists are lined up. Let's get closer. Some are wearing. Oh boy. Ready? Yeah. These t-shirts.

I got bombed at Harvey's. Oh my God. People are already, there are dudes selling shirts out on the street. Merch is already happening. Merch. They're selling the shirts that say I bombed at Harvey's and people have all got them on. Oh my God. I need one of those.

Gamblers were placing bets on what would happen. Okay. Okay. What's the line? What's the over-under? So as I said, there are tons of people waiting. Boy, we're- It's just, like, look at this, there's just all these fucking people staring at the hotel.

Yeah. Well, I always think of that when there's that picture that's Tsunami and there's like- Oh yeah. There's like a huge tidal wave and there's like people like taking pictures of it right before, you know, there is something where you just, you can't- Yeah, you can't take your eyes off it. Yeah. Yeah.

I agree. So a deputy called out a warning- Nice shorts on that guy too. Oh, there's always good shorts in the 70s. Nice look. Look at this. It sucks. Yeah, it's all right. Yeah, for sure.

A deputy calls out a warning over a PA of his patrol car. The county bomb squad guy said, quote, fire in the hole and touched a second wire to a battery, it was 346 PM, he then said, quote, holy shit, but no one heard it because Harvey's was blowing up. Oh my God. Wait, okay. The more that we were getting close to it, the more I was thinking shooting brass inside of a bomb doesn't sound that great.

And by the way, it's just because they hadn't heard from them. They were just like freaking out. Well, but I understandably, like, he didn't give a 24 hour notice. Yeah, but still, I think, like, I don't know. I mean, to me, it seems like the smartest idea, but look, nothing was going to work. Okay. Concrete and plaster rain down fragments of wood, metal and glass. Harvest blows up out from both sides of Harvey's, a cloud of white dust came out of the second

floor enveloping the building, the crowd whooped. Now, I couldn't find, I found, I found a video of them whooping at one point, okay, but then I couldn't find it again, but it literally people go, all right, all right, all right. So people are super into it. Of course, there are explosion, explosion. Oh, wow. Oh, wow. So it's done.

So Harvey's is done. Oh, geez. Yeah, it's, it's no, it was no joke. I mean, he blew up the hotel. I can't wait for the news to travel the big John about his, wow, game over. Yeah. They blew up the hotel. Okay.

So cloud of white dust came out of the second floor enveloping the building, the crowd whooped. A five story hole had been blown out of the middle of the casino. It reached from the fifth floor. We're still doing pie gal guys. We can still do pie gal. We're still doing pie gal in the dime slots. Those are still working. Kino's still going.

Kino's still going. And we're still doing the my ties too for once. A five story hole had been blown all the way from the fifth floor to the basement. Toilets and TV sets were dangling drywall clothing, sheets, waters pouring from pipes. Five minutes later, Jimmy called his sheriff substation just north of state line. How you doing? Quote, if you still want the exchange, I'll call back in one hour. Oh my God.

Yeah. Okay. And he hung up. Yeah. I think that went pretty good. I think they definitely sound frazzled on their end. I think we just might have gotten the upper hand, gentlemen. Oh my God, so great.

So I moved his head, sorry. I apologize, mother. He's moved it ahead or something. I'm super drunk. This wine is really great. Yeah. I apologize. It's all right.

Don't worry. I mean, I would hate for you to be offended by his behavior. I'm not a businessman. So Jimmy, we'll come to you when we're ready, Dave. Jimmy hangs up. Jimmy and Big John get into their car that they were driving in because they're going back to pick up Joan from the hospital. That's when they heard the news on the radio.

Okay. Oh my God. After they make the phone call and Big John said, quote, well, I don't have anything to live for now. Oh my God. Oh my God. So he's taking it hard. Yeah.

I'd say so. But it was just months of work. It was just a whole summer. Yeah. It was just a whole summer. Wow. 30 minutes later, they watched footage of the explosion in the waiting room at the hospital. Oh my God.

I mean, now watching it, you know, a stranger comes up. You believe that some fella apparently wanted money for it. Yeah. It's funny. Yeah. Big John watching it was pretty impressed. I gotta say, quote, it worked pretty good. I say we go to Harris.

The day after Big John called. So they all, they're all home. Big John called Bill and Terry and told him to come over to the house. I've got some interesting news. They were very scared. Okay. But went anyway. Big John started to tell them about his new plan.

Oh no. To blow up Harveys. Oh my God. He's blowing Harveys up again. What is this? The next day, he is talking about blowing up Harvey. Well, gentlemen, I realized we had a bunch of flaws in the first plan and then round two o'clock, I went to bed angry and I woke up at four a.m. and I had a revelation.

We need to blow up Harveys. We just, uh, we just again, no, but right now we need to do it again. Hit him where it hurts. It's got a hole in it and stuff flying out. There's still two thirds of the building that remains that I think is fair game, gentlemen. And I'm proposing that we take advantage of that. Now granted, we're going to have to sneak in there with another box. They won't be as good as the one I spent all summer on, but we'll get in there.

Let's get our hands in the middle guys. One, two, three. Oh, we got this. Only you. Uh, turns out, uh, Bill and Terry are super not interested. So then Big John gets mad and says if they told anyone about what they'd done, he would have them killed. Now they were obviously scared because they thought he killed his wife.

So they're right. Now I can do anything. Two days later on Friday afternoon, enough debris was cleared from around the hotel to open part of Harvey's casino for gambling. Oh my God. I mean, I cannot wait for Harvey's to get word on part B. You know, no, no, buddy, you didn't get the memo. That's from two days ago.

No, we found a new one. The old lake room was intact and back in action. It's just the best. And by the way, who's going, who's going? So, so you would have hit about 14, but unfortunately that piece of rubble made it bounce to double zero. Sorry, everybody. So I had a friend whose parents had a cabin up near here and right after this, we went

up there like a week later, okay, we went up to the cabin and he, and he liked to gamble. So he drove to Harvey's to, to state line and gambled and we stayed in like the kids area. So it was like a week later. And Harvey's, it wasn't Harvey's, but it was another place that he gambled, right? I mean, if there's a time when you're like, well, what about not going to stay live with the kids? Yeah.

Oh no, they just got hit. It's a lot like roulette. It's not going to hit again. So a $200,000 reward for information was offered by Harvey and the other casino owners. None of the witnesses could agree on what the suspect looked like. Then the manager of the Balaho Motel near the airport called. He said two men driving a white van checked in the day before the bomb was found. I'll never forget it.

It had a really funny thing on the back and said, if this van's a rocking, how did it go? Don't come up. No, no, no. If this van's a knocking, if this van's a sucking, don't come up. Don't help. Don't help. Don't help. Don't help.

Don't come to me. I'm fucking ladies in this van. How about that? That was it. That was it. Yeah. That was it. How about that?

I think so. If the doors locked, I'm masturbating. That was it. Yeah. That was it. That was the one. That was the one. Sorry, mother.

He said the guys that asked for jumper cables at 4am and checked out soon after. Real professional gentlemen they were. But Terry had given them wrong name because he was on parole. Right. He had, however. Oh no. That's not the right number. Smart, Terry.

The DMV. Well, I don't want to lie a bunch. Now, the DMV department had an application for a title transfer on file, meaning the van was in the middle of being sold or whatever. So they'd have searched for it by hand, which would take a long time. Okay. Friends who wasn't getting anything from the crime scene, they had a list of several hundred suspects and considered the IRA, Iranian students, and the mafia, but even hypnotized

witnesses to try to get details. That said, that's a great movie right there. After around a month, Jimmy was woken up by a noise in the middle of the night. Oh boy. It was Big John. He'd just come back from stealing another dozen cases of dynamite. That's not good news. We're getting the band back together.

But my gut's feeling good again. I think we could do this for a while. He put... By the way, they put in no new security measures up there. He's still just given dynamite away. So he put it in the walk-in freezer. A few days later, he asked Jimmy to help him move it, and they drove a few miles to the H of town near Elizabeth's brother's farm.

Okay. So his ex-brother-in-law. Right. Big John had already dug a hole there, and they buried the dynamite about 700 pounds of it. Oh my God. Okay. The hit on the license plate came back from the DMV, and it was one John Burgess, Johnny.

An FBI agent came to Big John's house and asked about the van. John said it wasn't his, Big John said it wasn't his, and that it was his son's. Good guy. Good daddy. Nice dad. That's my fucking kid. Right? And that knucklehead.

He's always talking about building a coffin bomb. Nobody likes that punk. So he throws his kid under the bus. The FBI agents come back, I think, the next day. Uh-huh. Oh, so like I said, Johnny had sold it, and just gone back to roofing. So everyone's back at their thing. So everybody really handle, okay.

So he comes home, or he comes to the house, and then Big John, Jimmy, and Johnny come up with a plan, or a story for the FBI about that. We've got to blow the FBI up. It's a good one. So, Johnny would say to the FBI that he'd driven up into the mountains to look for a place to grow pot, and that the van had stopped running. Okay. So, he hitchhiked home and went back to get the van after a few days, and who knows what

the van was doing while he was away? Oh, somebody went. You seen the license plate, the bumper sticker situation? What I like about the plan is that this criminal returned the van. Thank you. I like that. When the FBI agents came back, Johnny gave them the spiel. So yeah, and then I came back and I was there.

So who knows what happened to it Tuesday to Thursday? He had no idea how it ended up at the hotel. He said when he came back to get the van, one of the door locks was open, which was weird. But now that I think about it, that is kind of weird. Also some cassettes had been moved around. Which I would never do. I keep mine alphabetized. And the agents told him his story was fucking ridiculous, and that he was clearly lying.

Whoa, gentlemen. We're all professionals here. Come on, boys. He was now on the list of suspects. What? Put the cassettes. By November, the Harvey's Explosion investigation was one of the biggest and most expensive in FBI history.

But the FBI had nothing. On December 1st, the investigation was scaled way back. You would now just be handled in a small office in Carson City by three agents. So they think they just got nothing, it's fucked and it's over. Big John got into a fight with his ex-brother-in-law and dug up the dynamite. He rigged some of it under a wooden bridge on the farm. You could hear the explosion all the way across town. Jesus.

So he's playing it cool. Yeah. You think that's a problem, Aaron? No? Can you hear the podcast? I was going to say. In January 1981, Johnny was served with a subpoena to testify before a grand jury in Reno. Johnny went alone.

The jurors listened to him. Johnny was very casual. Sure. He didn't think they could prove he was lying. Okay. Nothing came of it. The investigation was running on fumes. On May 13th, 1981, after 18 million repairs, Harvey's formally reopened.

Okay. The reward was now at $500,000. And Big John is making plans for his next score. He went to the new Harvey's to check it out. No. No. No. I mean, can you imagine being security?

Is that Big John? I don't want to be rude and asking. I mean, there's no way you'd come back. He also checked out, maybe doing this at the Bank of America building in San Francisco. Okay. So there was options. Yeah. The $500,000 reward is what finally led a guy to call.

He had dated a girl who told him what was going to happen before it did. Her name was Kelly Cooper. She was Johnny's ex-girlfriend who had been there the first day she told the plans. It was now on the full investigation focused on John Burgess, senior and family. Uh, they went, they dug up everything on the family, the gambling history, the association with Harvey's dynamite and even the embarrassment on New Year's Eve, uh, possibly killing Elizabeth burning down the restaurant. By July, 44 agents were working on the case.

Okay. Johnny and Jimmy and Big John were followed all day, all summer. Still the FBI could not find a single piece of evidence. They hoped to find that Big John was planning something else. Oh, of course. He was. Oh, goodness. At the beginning of August, Big John went to a Fresno electrical supply store and bought

20 switches. Right away. Right away. That's it. He's got 20 switches. Nope. He told Jimmy this time, Harvey would pay $5 million. Okay.

On August 12th. Idiot. We got dimmers. 1981. The FBI head agent went to Johnny's door and asked, uh, him again to explain his whereabouts and what he'd done on August 26th and 27th. We went through this. And Johnny did again, but this time the agent poked holes in his story and Johnny had trouble

answering any time he'd asked questions. Right. He was stumbling. So you can poke new holes in his story. Right. Uh, it turns out his story wasn't making sense. The next day that agent went in front of the grand jury and told them everything Johnny had said and the evidence that proved he was lying, Johnny was indicted for perjury and

arrested. Okay. Johnny came down voluntarily to talk. They both stuck to their stories for a while, but finally Johnny cracks and then Jimmy and he started talking. They wouldn't stop talking. Okay. Big John and Joan were arrested.

Uh, he blamed Johnny for shooting off his mouth. Okay. The boys were kept in productive custody in Fresno. How old are they? They're 19. Oh, okay. Uh, well, Johnny turns 21 while they're still young. Okay.

They're in the Fresno Hilton and they're allowed to order whatever they wanted. Oh my God. The fact that that's something you're telling me. Johnny had a blast. I wonder if I have that picture. Oh boy. I don't see it. All right.

Um, I had a picture of them hanging out with the FBI agents. It's just. Oh, so they just are like. They're there. Where? Right in the middle. Oh, right there. Okay.

Um, so they're hanging out with the FBI. The FBI agents on his birthday, give him a card signed with the nicknames he had given them. Oh, so there, I mean, the dads they never had in front of the president. Yeah. Right. Um, I mean, honestly, could it look like he's wearing a nighty more and he's white. So yeah, it's a hot look at the trials.

The boys were great witnesses. They had great memories. Big John after a while decided to act as his own lawyer and fired his lawyers. He told the prosecutors he built the bomb, but that he'd been forced by the mob to do it. Okay. Uh, as a lawyer, and if he blew up Harveys, his debts would go away. But if he didn't, they'd cripple him.

When he cross examined his sons, he suggested Jimmy put him up to bombing Harveys to get college money. He also suggested the leader of the Douglas County Fire Department bomb squad had blown up Harveys. So he's kind of swinging. Yeah, for sure. On March 7th, 1985, Janos Burgess was found guilty on eight counts. He got life in prison.

Johnny and Jimmy pleaded guilty and got immunity. They did not serve a day. Yeah. The FBI are like, come here, you scam. Come on, you guys. You're sentenced to nuggies. Bill and Terry got seven years each. Okay.

Joan got seven years, but it was later overturned on appeal. Okay. The boys never saw Big John again. Jimmy wrote a letter apologizing, quote, you are the smartest and most remarkable person in the world. I respect you more than anything, and I will try to be worthy of you. I often lie awake at night thinking of what I've done to you, I cry often at the thought of what I did.

It feels like the letter should go the other way, but that's fine. Yeah. I definitely think maybe to some extent there's a little bit of protectionism in that that you're just like, just in case you choose through the bars, like I just wanted to know I feel bad because the last of you want to hear is like, you're big John's out. Oh, I should have sent the letter. Big John died of liver cancer in 1996. Bill and Terry were released from prison in 1986.

Bill died in 1994 and Terry in 2005. Jimmy started a welding and fabrication business. He had three kids. Is that where you just weld and say you do other things? Yeah. Yeah, we weld and we make canoes and I'm vamping. I don't know anything. We're just welders.

He coached Little League. He raced cars in his spare time. He had a nice business and nice life going. Well, Johnny had a worse time. He had the same name as big John and so people didn't want the son of a bomber working on their roots. John. Yeah.

I mean, yeah. He moved to Bakersfield and started doing a lot of cocaine and that's that was law then right? Yeah. Yeah. His fiancee died in the car accident. He moved around. He was drunk and he got in fights all the time.

He would get locked up for a few months at a time at one point in prison. He wrote a book about the bombing and he embellished it and he published it himself. But as a novel, a year later, he had not sold a single copy. Boy, that's tough. A plexiglass. Your family won't even pick one up. So a plexiglass model of the bomb now exists and it is still used to train the FBI's explosive technicians in Quantico.

So it was so complex that they used it to train people. Still. Yeah, it's still considered one of the most complex bombs ever made. And what you didn't have was the plexiglass. Right. Yeah, they couldn't see it. Oh, wow. Crazy, right?

Yeah. Yeah, you weed them out real quick. Would you get it wet? Yeah, probably get out. Yeah, go ahead. Oh, good God, Jimmy. Wow. That's crazy.

That is crazy. And then the dollop has new art. Oh, so now we're just going to take a... Which is for sale. You see that, mom? We're going to go to Redbubble, Fosdyk's Redbubble page and you will find our art and that's the new... Oh, mother loves Jose.

Look how small he is. Yeah, here we go. Wow, that's not life-size. Life-size, he's like a... It's like a cow, it's like a small cow. Is that why he's in the water? He's comfortable and wail. That's cream.

It's not water, it's cream. Y'all noticed, I would point out that the jaguar's not fucking with him, so that tells you something. All right, so thank you for joining us. Thank you for coming, mother. It was a great fun. That was a long one. What did you think?

It was fabulous. Okay. Thank you very much. You're welcome. Yeah. Do you want to say thank you to Dave? Thank you, Dave. Thank you for coming.

We'll be right back. She's polite. The English you can just say thank you for anything, you know? I know. Yeah, it works. Yeah. Thank me, mother. Oh, thank you.

You're welcome. You're welcome, mother. All right, we sign bombs at the FBI, still uses people. To learn how to disarm bombs. Okay. Okay. Thank you.