The Dollop with Dave Anthony and Gareth Reynolds - 344 - Charles Dederich and Synanon

Episode Date: September 11, 2018

Comedians Dave Anthony and Gareth Reynolds examine Charles Dederich and Synanon. SOURCESTOUR INFO MERCH BY JAMES FOSDIKE

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I'm keeping it new. It doesn't feel fun. It's new. It's exciting. There's nothing. It's a new position. That's what it's like. It's like I'm throwing a new position into the love affair. So my name is Dave Anthony. This is a podcast. Is that how we start? No. Okay. You're listening to the DELL-EV. Okay. This is a bi-weekly American History podcast. Each week I, Dave Anthony, read a story from American history to my friend Gareth Reynolds who has no idea what the topic is going to be about. I feel like I should have had a part in that. I, Dave Anthony, yeah, that's it though. We don't need it. I mean, that's good. I think we got it. Actually,

I think this might be the new way to do the intro. Kick it. What? And called it quote is jam-packed. Jam-packed? I'm the fucking hippo guy. Dave, okay. My name's Gary. My name's Gary. Wait. Is it for fun? And this is not going to come to Tiggly Quad, guys. Okay. This is like Adam. And a five-part competition. Now hit him with the puppy. You both present sick arguments. No, sleep, no, hippo. That's like no hippo. That's actually important. Hi, Gary. No. Nice to be done, my friend. No. No. Roder. Roder in the car. You looking at that? Badunk-a-dunk? Your cat's got its back to me. You like what you see? No. Little badunk-a-dunk? It's big. Huh? Little junk in the trunk? There's a lot of junk in the

trunk. Good amount of junk. Well, you know, I've started to, you know, you've made this seal comparison and people have really run with it. But, yeah, no, it's nice. But I think he's more of an otter. Okay. Well, we should probably start the podcast after that. March 22nd, 1913. Okay. Interesting. A little later for us. Charles Diedrich was born in Toledo, Ohio. Okay. He was named after his father, who was an alcoholic who died in the car crash when he was four. Okay. Not the dad. The dad didn't die when he was four. No, the dad. The son was four when the dad died. Surely. Yeah, no, you didn't need to. I felt like me. I know I missed some stuff on this show, but I caught that. I was assuming the four-year-old father wasn't driving. I was just making sure. I mean, my dad was too young

to go. Chuck's brother died when he was eight. Absolutely. Yep. By the time he graduated from high school, Chuck was drinking heavily. He kept drinking in college, and then he dropped out of Notre Dame after 18 months. Okay. So, so far, he's killing it. Yeah, the liver. Over the next two decades, his drinking lost him several jobs and two wives. So, drinking seems to be a theme we're starting in this one pretty early. He's into it. Okay, okay. It's sort of his jam. Okay. Facing divorce from his second wife, he went to Alcoholics Anonymous, and she left anyway. Okay, sure. He was 43, living in Southern California, and on unemployment. He stayed sober, but there was a lot he didn't like about AA, especially how they didn't allow drug users. Interesting to have a, right. Yeah,

and it, well, I mean, you know, it's minorly misleading, I guess. You're like, I don't, I quit drinking. It is minor. The drugs have helped. Yeah. So, Chuck went and set up his own group. Okay. An offshoot. Nine drinking druggers. Yeah. It started in 1958 in a seedy neighborhood in Santa Monica. 11 people came regularly. Okay. They explored what Chuck called, quote, a line of no lines. Hmm. Gonna need you to help a little there. Basically, they attacked each other, calling out those they thought were lying or egotistical. So it's just like a verbal assault on someone. It's just like a weekly argument. Tearing someone down. Think like a comedy roast, but real and not fun. Right. Okay. So they had a Monty Python sketch once a week. It wasn't like

a back and forth. You would just sit there and then everyone would just fucking rip into you. And you, and that was, and it was viewed as therapeutic. Yes. Okay. Right. For people. I wasn't sure if they were planning on having like a good meeting and then it just turned into like a dressing down. No, no, it's just being mean to someone. Okay. Interesting. I can't, I have mean at eight. I have to go to mean at eight. I have my meeting. The regulars loved it. They thought it was fucking great. Sure. Word got out of the mailman. Yep. Word got out. More people came. A lot of heroin addicts who heard one member had kicked heroin in the program. Okay. Chuck called the group the Tender Loving Care Club.

Okay. One day a member was saying they should do a seminar and Chuck thought they said Synanon. What is a Synanon? Well, that's not a word. Okay. Okay. It sounds Jewish-adjacent. So then he changed the name to Synanon. So he did- He liked the, he liked the word scramble. Okay. So new name. Now it's not Tender Loving Care. It's Synanon. Synanon. Yeah. Okay. In the early days, he reportedly coined the phrase, quote, this is the first day of the rest of your life. Well, that's a big one. Yeah. You know that one, don't you? Yes, I do. Yeah. I mean, I've, I've, I've said it to myself in a beer a couple of times in the last few years. A lot. A lot. Yeah. I've said it to myself. I say it to myself a lot. I say it to my half.

Look, I have to say it to myself in the mirror before I leave. Okay. It's become a bit of a tick. Morning. Morning. I have to go to the mirror. Okay. Bye. And he came up with a new form of group therapy called the haircut. So this is what it is. It's what we talked about. Members usually knew, had let every member tell them what their faults were. So a new guy comes in and then they just sit there and just fucking rip in you. And they're ripping them just off of not, no, no knowledge? Well, I probably, I guess the guy would probably share about himself and then they would just fucking let the guy have. Okay. Sounds good. Everyone would rip into the member. One person described it as quote, brutal, but on a verbal level. Okay. Sure. Yeah. Yeah. So it is, it's okay.

It's my dad. Right. It's full metal jacket. Yeah. It is, yeah. Full, as soon as this became known as the game. This is really weird. One member would talk about themself and then be brutally criticized by the others. Members are encouraged to be critical of everything. But when outside the game, everyone was supposed to be super nice to each other and no violence. So this is the verbal fight club. Yeah. Yeah. You just have these meetings where you just all out attack each other, but then out of there, you're like, yeah, I just not want to get. I love you, Jimmy. And then you hug and whatever. Yeah. But then you think back on it and you're like, wait a minute, I wasn't sharing a drink with anyone. That was awful. It was me in the parking lot alone. Oh my God.

Who did I hand it to? Who bombed that place? Oh my God, it was me. All right. So the cat's done. On the move. Sinanon grew to 20 people in its first year. Chuck leased a rundown storefront and moved the meetings there. And then he incorporated Sinanon. Okay. So now it's a corporation. Sure. As it's supposed to be. Absolutely. It hit 50 members in the second year. It's growth. Coming on. Chuck stopped funding it with his unemployment checks, finding financial supporters and pushing sober members to get jobs and then give their entire paycheck to Sinanon. Well, this is, I mean, this is fast, right? Yeah. I mean, and under two years, it's pretty quick. Yeah. It's already building your empire. So this became standard for all members.

So you are just giving the Sinanon all your money or Sinanon all your money? Yeah. Okay. They moved to a beach house. I like this. This is sort of like, you know, like the summer season. Yeah. Except people didn't like the idea of drug addicts being around. Oh, that's interesting. So locals wanted cited for violating zoning laws. Okay. Okay. And while local papers are critical, bigger papers like the LA Times wrote favorable stories. Okay. The combo of helping outcasts and fighting the establishment made Hollywood liberals jump on board. Okay. Wow. Stars like, just, you know, we don't give enough lip service to how dumb Hollywood, I mean, you know, for two people who live in it and get, you know, we really don't.

And we, and we, you know, we, when we obviously like have like a, you know, like we're more liberally minded, but keep in mind, I mean, we, this town is just vacuous idiots. When you hear that, it is so easy to believe that just a bunch of like people are just like, well, I can't believe they're trying to kick them out of the beach community. Come on, Becky, we're joining. I mean, let's give them a million dollars. It's all going to Sinanon. It's yeah, totally 100%. Right. All right. Stars like Jane Fonda and Leonard Nimoy were guests at Sinanon. Soon there was a, It's tough to hear Nimoy was in. Yeah. Soon there was a Sinanon, the movie. You got dumb ears. You got stupid ears. Look at your dumb ears.

No, they're not real. It's a character. Yeah. Oh yeah. Yeah. No, you're thinking of the show. Look, I'm a big fan. Thank you. I can't do this. Thank you. Yeah. I winked. Yeah, that's another Dave Wink. Waste of winks. Soon there was a Sinanon, the movie. What? In the works starring Chuck Connors and Eartha Kitt. Oh my God. Eartha Kitt. Making a film. All right. But Sinanon was then found guilty of violating zoning laws in Santa Monica and given 90 days to move. When they're violating zoning laws, that just means there's too many of them? No, I think they're a rehab clinic and they're not, they're in a residential place. Right. Okay. Right. Chuck got 30 days in jail.

Okay. But he fought, he still fought it and he in Santa Monica eventually came to an agreement. Sinanon could stay as a nonprofit club if it didn't treat drug addicts. Okay. But the heart of the concept was that. Yeah. Interesting. Interesting. So you would. Huh? It's a big note. I'm saying it's a big note. Okay. It's a large note. But that was okay with Chuck because his rehab program didn't work. Only 10% of people stayed clean. That's abysmal. That's not good. Both addicts left in less than a year. People are going back than normal. Yeah. Yeah. It's not great. Yeah. Chuck had been graduating addicts after a year or two, but he stopped. Now they had to stay forever. This is all really weird.

These are weird adjustments. Well, if they're, if they're, if they're making you not do that anymore, then the ones you have, you have to keep, right? I don't know. Because you're making money off of them. So if they graduate, now I love it. Let me see those margins. So it's just about money, basically. And they have to stay forever now. Everyone except board members had a job and all their money went to Synanon. So he stopped letting people leave. He then decided to go into self-improvement. Oh no. In the mid to late 60s, improving yourself mentally and spiritually was a huge fad. Oh no. The timing is not good. It's good. This is bad timing. Synanon started going after normal people who were looking to improve their lives. Uh-huh. Right. Anyone could participate

and members aggressively recruited them. It became more popular and people packed the house nightly. They did the game and danced to the sounds of Synanon. The house jazz band made up of former junkies. What's the Synanon band? The sounds of Synanon. The Synanon 6. Give it up guys. This is fucking awesome. Oh my God. They have a jazz band. More members came. Uh, wealthy people started to come. Of course. Some donated their cars, their furniture. People started selling their houses and giving all the money to Synanon. Come on. We've got, we have something like this in us. We can do something like this. A woman donated one million dollars. I mean, we can figure out something like this, David. Come on. A man gave Synanon

his mortgage company that was worth 900,000. His company? You should take my mortgage business. Okay. Another gave his advertising gift business called Advertising Gifts and Premiums or ADGAP. It sold small, crap like logo branded pens and keychains. I'm saying crap like, but they're just shitty like logo branded pens and keychains and shit that have like a corporation name on it. Like it's just fucking swag, garbage, shit. I love that stuff. Yeah, I know. They used the combo of ADGAP and Synanon get it to get in the door and offer services to corporations like RCA and Exxon. Okay. RCA Bank. That's another selling keychains to Exxon. Okay. This is, this is, this is what he got in the business. This is why. Yeah. To make keychains for oil

companies. Yeah. By the end of 1967, Synanon owned millions in real estate all over the nation, including 5 million worth in Santa Monica alone. Okay. Jesus. He's killing it. He's killing it. People are throwing money at it, literally. You can do something like this. Synanon bought 68 acres in Tamales Bay in Marin County near San Francisco. So that's like 30 miles, 25 miles right grew up. Yeah. Super close. It's a great area. It's a great area to own land. It really is. Yeah. It really is. Their Chuck wanted to build his Synanon City. He wanted to base. Synacity? Synacity. Wow. Syncit. Synacity. Don't help me. I've got it. No. He wanted to base ADGAP there and have a school so members could raise their families. This is where thing like it already

has a couple of red flaggy moments. What do you mean? But this is where when you're when you're introducing like schools into this, that's when it's problematic. You think it's weird? Yeah. When you're creating a new generation, that's a problem. Well, this is when Synanon became known as Synanon 2. What? The second Synanon. Don't help me. I've got these. No. No. SynSQL. I just said that. We added a minute ago. They were now 5,000 members. Branches were opening all over. Chuck wanted to cut loose, be not completely devoted. His first targets were the ex-drug addicts. Oh, this is just because they complained a lot. This is, I mean, this is how you run the cult offense. Yeah. I mean, this is pro-playboy stuff.

This is some fucking shit right here. But that's what it was all about. You're just not working out. I can't trust you. You're erratic. Yeah, out. Well, we're trying to quit drugs. Yes, and not here, though. He didn't do it like that. So he started holding marathon game sessions that lasted 72 straight hours or longer. Game sessions being the dressing down. Yeah, are you just fucking hammer people? Okay. Members were delirious and broken down at the end. Older members would drop out once they were given time to sleep and reflect on what had happened. The marathon sessions also became a way to indoctrinate new members. So that's the that's the classic cult sleep deprivation thing. The main Synanon compound was built in Timalus Bay.

Recruits dressed just like Chuck. It's normal. Denim overalls. Okay, I was going to say, does he change his outfit every day? But no, he's just got one consistent sort of good look. Come on, Eileen. Oh, no. So you. So it sticks even in night runners. That's what we have here. Oh, that's where this heads. And they played. They get the fiddle. It's coming. Yeah. And they played the game three times a week, three weeks a month. On the fourth week, they marathoned for 48 hours straight. Children played the game. Oh, no. They started when they turned four. Oh, God, you talk about a generation of assholes. Oh my God. Oh, God. The games became more vicious. During one game, they belittled a woman who was dying of cancer. Oh my God, what is going on?

A member said to her quote, you don't even deserve to have cancer. I think that's a compliment. That is. I think she went so far in one direction that she actually said something sweet. I don't think it's just saying you don't deserve. I would say that to someone. I think, but he's saying it in a bad way. Like you are not good enough to have cancer. I agree. He is saying that, but it comes out swinging so far, so hard that he's actually potentially comes around the other side. Yeah, it's the response to that. Thank you. And also like taking it terribly. Yeah. You know, but what he's just quote is you don't deserve cancer. Well, thank you. So Chuck Diedrich was now super into himself. That's shocking. Every sitting on branch had to hang portraits of Chuck and his

wife, Betty. Old timers had to hang the pictures of them in their homes. Oh my God. Chuck was said to be incredibly charismatic and funny, which is how he got away with all of this. He certainly wasn't good looking. He had a droopy eye and a booming voice. I mean, he wants I'll look him up while I read this. He once opened a graduation ceremony by dropping his pants and exposing himself and then said he had revealed quote the last mystery of Synanon. Wait, is he a comedian? Okay. He dropped his pants, showed his penis and said what? The last mystery of Synanon. These revealed the last man. Let's have a look here. Oh, good Lord. That's not good. Is it? Oh, Jesus. Chuck's doctor told the man to stop smoking. So he

ordered no one at Synanon could smoke. That's not terrible. That's unfair. That's totally where you go with this. No. So this was a nightmare because cigarettes and coffee were like the fuel of Synanon. Dude, also like, I mean, AA, like, yeah, that's where it came from. That's what it is. Like the amount of coffee and cigarettes. It's fucking X addicts. That's their jam. Yeah. So they smoked so much that a North Carolina tobacco company had donated 250,000 worth of cigarettes, but now they had to send them all back. Wow. 75 members left immediately. Wow. That really is a testament to how addictive nicotine is. I mean, 75 people. Yeah. They've probably tried for like two hours. Okay, that's good. You know, when I actually needed a reason to target anything,

I got up and I was like, I could use a coffee and now I'm leaving. I'm in my car. I had a bunch of coffees, but I think if I wait an hour or two hours, I think that'll subside. Yeah. Then I won't have the craving anymore. Are you leaving? I need coffee. I'm going out for coffee. I will leave right now. Yeah, I'd love to go. Yeah, let's leave. Let's leave here. Goodbye. Entirely leave here. We're going to a coffee place. Yeah, we'll return the cigarettes. Fucking dumbass. Then more left due to how Chuck and the elders handled the members being upset about the smoking ban. Wow. Smoking created quite a ripple. These people were called out in the games publicly. Okay. They were all going through withdrawal. That's not going to help you not want to have a

cigarette. Well, now think of the game. So the game is people going through cigarette withdrawal and coffee withdrawal, which is a thing. And now they're playing a vicious game of attack to the other guy. Oh, the sweat. The beads of sweat. At the peak of the smoking ban madness, during a game, one member challenged another to shave his head. Okay. And he did it. Okay. And then the challenger shaved his head. Oh, dear. Everyone started being challenged to shave their head. What? Okay. This is abnormal. Chuck's right hand man that shaved his head and pushed others to doing it, saying it was a real quote, slapping the face of middle class vanity. What? Yes. But this is, you don't, this doesn't happen. This isn't allowed to happen. No,

it's had happened. Okay. So middle class middle class vanity is just taking one right in the fucking keister. Right. Yep. Take that motherfucker. Yeah. Yeah. I don't have any hair on my head. How do you like that middle class? Let's smoke the hair. Oh, gosh. We should smoke the hair up. I could go for you. There's probably coffee and tobacco in the hair. Oh, man. That's I'll tell you what. Yeah. It's hitting some spot. It doesn't go down too easy. I'm shooting it. I'm also shooting it. Not everyone shaved their heads, but a lot did. That's so great that there are a few people like I agree. I'm not gonna agree a lot, but not that a lot. You know what I mean? I thought we were all going to do it. That's why I did it. Yeah, I wasn't. Well, most of us did. I mean, I

didn't want to. I know. I like my hair. I love my hair. Yeah. I mean, I like mine more probably. Well, no, but mine's gone. You can't weigh that. I think so. I also was going to shave it and then I saw how stupid you looked. And now I'm like, Oh, I should have hair. I should have hair too. Yeah, you made a bad choice because the guy was yelling at you. Yeah. Yeah. Boy, that was nuts. I know. Do you want some coffee? I love my fight. We can't have any. Right. I was going to say no. My answer was going to be a long stammery. No. Well, that's where we are. Yeah. All right. Well, what a crazy night here. Another one of these. The bald head led to roles in movies. George Lucas hired members to be in his first short,

THX 1138. Robert Altman put some in his film, California Split. And then it became a punishment for members. If someone spoke out of turn, Chuck or others would demand they shave their head. Shaved heads then became a mark of shame and a symbol of people who had gotten out of line. Yeah. Scarlet haircut. Full shaved head circle on that one. Still, Synanon kept. Give someone a bald mullet is what you do. If you really, that's what you do. You create another class. I like a bald mullet. Keep going. Still, Synanon was taking off. Branches open in Puerto Rico, Germany, Malaysia and other countries. Someone just probably walked in thinking it was a bank at one. Hello. Yeah. Hi. Hi. Hi. Welcome

to the branch of Synanon. How are you? Good. Can I help you with today? You just wanted to open an account. Well, you would need somewhere to put your money? Yes. Synanon works with that. Absolutely. So, what do you do for work? What? It doesn't matter. Fill out this and then get all the money to us and we'll have it here at Synanon. Oh, why? Here at Synanon, we'll have all your money. This is a new branch. Thank you very much for coming. That's actually a good idea. Yeah. And then you just take people's money and then leave and then you go live somewhere else. Yeah. No, you call it. I think that's how it works. You call it capitalism, the bank. Oh, that's right. Yeah. But even though they opened up branches in those places, membership didn't increase very much. It

was more about finding more customers for ADGAP. So, they're just going into other countries to try to find people to sell shitty pens and trinkets too. Right. Very weird side game. But it's now, that company is now making $10 million a year. Currently? No, in this story. In this point in the story, it's being $10 million. Oh, you almost don't need the idiots from Hollywood. No. Almost. Chuck Salary increased from $2,500 to $75,000. Pretty nice bump. Other members just got $5 a week plus room and board. That's solid too though. Also good. Also nice. Five a week. In 1972, the San Francisco examiner ran a story that called Synanon the, quote, racket of the century. Okay. So that's not, people are sniffing around. That's not a great story unless they're talking

about a tennis racket. I don't believe they are. They were accused of committing fraud because they no longer helped addicts, but still took donations to help addicts. It is bizarre that I hear it played back. Yeah. A few months later, the examiner fired the reporter who wrote the story. It turns out he'd written a series of stories about China, but had never done any actual investigating. He just sat in a bar in Hong Kong and made the stories up. Oh my God. So, wow. That's fake news. Yeah. It's fake news. What a time, huh? Yeah. Yeah. Just Hunter S. Thompson. Oh my God. Hong Kong. I love that guy. Oh yeah. Well, I mean, you just got to think he had a great time. Yeah. Like I'll, you know, at this point, I mean, obviously it doesn't really affect us right now.

So, I'll say in retrospect, what a great, well, it's just a party move. The best. What's you doing a story? Yeah. Yeah. It's a deep, deep investigation of the corruption. My friends and I are going to do another round of these Mai Tai. Yeah. Kim coming. I'm writing a great story right now. Great story. Yeah. Take some ginger beers and whiskies over here. So, after this sitting on file, the $32 million libel lawsuit against the examiner and the papers settled and paid sending on $600,000. Okay. Which was at the time the largest libel settlement ever by a major newspaper. And sediment. And sediment. Half went to a small group of sending on members close to Chuck and the other half went to Chuck. Interesting. Funny how the pies get

split. Yeah. It's an interesting way to divide it. Yeah. By the end of 1972, send it on looked nothing like it did when it started 14 years before. There were 2,000 members living on two huge properties in Marin County. One in Tamales Bay that housed the Academy and the other story of your father. Yeah. It is. Yeah. Okay. It's about my dad. Yeah. This is how my mommy and daddy met. Yeah. So that one's called the Academy. The other is called Walker Creek Ranch which housed the children. Okay. Interesting. Basically, it's almost like a resort. There's fishing, sailing, there's a movie theater, Dennis, doctors, a barber shop where they got their head shaved obviously. Yeah, that dude's like, hello. Just go ahead and shave it clean. Pretty easy.

I've been bad. Another one? Yep. Naughty naughty. Bad man. They even had their own fire department. Okay. Interesting. Synan set up its own radio network called KSYN run by a former DJ. Hey, Synan in the morning, ladies and gentlemen. We are excited to have another glorious day here on Synan. 74 degrees. Another beautiful afternoon in Marin County getting you on the ones and twos. Marin County. Marin. Marin County. We actually got a new guy in the studio. We've got a spice up the morning. He's here to correct me on how to say the top. Marin, does that sound like a moron? Traffic not looking too bad. Main Street's a little clogged up right now. Got a pothole causing some backup. What? The four-way stop sign. Guys, keep it coming at the ones and twos.

Right now, we're going to play some edited Leonard Skinner edited. Let's go. Good to meet you, man. That was pretty good. I like our chemistry. I didn't do anything. Save it for the show. That's what morning radio is actually like. So, this radio network, which came to be called The Wire, would air Chuck's speeches at all Synan locations. Oh, man. Awesome. What a great radio station. So, he'd get on the mic and he'd ramble about Synan's philosophy and the future of Synan. And if you missed a speech, you could then go to a listening station at any of the branches. Since the beginning, Chuck had recorded every game he played in, every meeting he went to, and every speech he made. So, he's like sliver. What? I don't know.

But you could now go into the listening stations just hear his back catalogue. Of all the dread... Of the whole back chuck. Wow. Amazingly, things started getting dark. Weird. Weird. Didn't feel like that was going to happen. During the game one day, a woman kept interrupting Chuck's wife. Oh, boy. Chuck then got into a heated argument with the woman and then poured a can of root beer on her head. Hmm. This broke the cardinal rule of absolutely no violence against others, especially during the game. When confronted about it, later, Chuck had a great excuse. Quote, it was to teach her a lesson. And kind of funny.

And yeah, it was her own point of root beer on a lady's head. Yeah. Okay. I do like the standard of violence because that's aggressive, you would, but I, yeah. But you're not supposed to like do anything. You're just supposed to, it's supposed to be verbal. Right. Yeah. No, I get that. Cross the line. That's not verbal. No, no. Oh, the root beer's good. I like root beer. He had to drink. Yeah. It's actually probably top two worst sodas to get poured on you.

Have you reported a drink or anything on someone's head? Yeah, of course. Yeah. My buddy, it's great. My buddy Jake and I used to have this thing where we would hang out and we'd get drunk and we would play chicken over who would pour beer on our own heads. Yeah. Would both end up pouring beers on our heads. I wouldn't, I wouldn't, I wouldn't say this in a, like a pop.

Is this being recorded? Yeah. It is. Yeah. That's interesting. So it's now the mid-70s and Synanon wasn't working out as Chuck wanted it to. When it moved away from the rehab work, the donations dried up. Okay. And also members kept leaving. Okay. It sounds a little bit like the jerk.

So they had game clubs in cities. Game club. Dude, this is fight club. This is verbal fight club. They had game clubs in the cities. Mind if we argue in the basement? Yeah, yeah. But only when we're closed. Cities like Oakland, Santa Monica and Detroit. Wow. And they attracted people.

Like people come in to see what this was about. Hey, I'm looking to fight. I'm looking for so many yellow memes. Hey, I'm impotent and I don't call people back. I'm looking to get dressed down with publicly. You got it. Right. But even though they had these clubs, the clubs were rarely recruiting people. People would try it out for a month and then they'd stop coming.

Sure. Weird. Yeah, I can't imagine. You got it. Hey, you want to go to this new club where people just call you a dick? You know, it's almost like it takes people a month to figure out it's not good. It's pretty fucking great. Yeah. I went there and some guys like, you're a fucking asshole, you piece of shit.

You stupid motherfucker. And I was like, I love it here. It's awesome. And then I started thinking, why have I been down this month? That's right. Because I keep going to Shout Club. So now it's time for Sinon 3. Has there been a 2? Yeah, we said there was a 2 earlier when they moved to Tommas Bay.

Oh, that's when they shifted from the drug stuff? Yeah, when they went from like an AA sort of thing to now like an academy and now there's a hole. That's cool. They're making tons of monies a non-profit, but if the IRS audited them, they would be forced to hand over millions in taxes. So Sinon applied to be recognized as a religion. Oh no, why didn't I see this coming? It's so obvious.

But the government denied it. The government said no, but still kind of turn into religion. I don't think in this day and age, the government would approve a crazy, crazy philosophy as a religion. No, could you imagine? Like if there's like, it would be insane. Like, say Tom Cruise was in a, Chuck kept acting like a religious leader anyway.

You got to, dude. You got, by the way, play the part. You got to own it. Yeah. You got to own it. Well, no, once he applies to be a religion, then you know what fucking path he's going down. Yeah.

Yeah. So he decreed edicts, often contradicting previous edicts. Sure. He was also super impulsive. One day Chuck, he's sinning on money. I mean, if you're, you know, if you're like, on the fly, shifting edicts, it sounds like you're impulsive. Yeah. A new edict, changing the last edict.

Another edict. A new edict. Well, when was that? I'm addicted. When was everyone should get a Harley? What? Are you kidding? Well, he buys himself a Harley, a big Harley,

and then he'd super fucking loved it. So he bought smaller Harleys for all his advisors, his close advisors. And then he bought all the members. Many Harleys. Motorcycles, but lower level members had to pay sinning on back. Sure. Right. Of course. Everyone.

Well, because the bottom of the pyramid must pay. That's right. Yeah. So everyone has to ride a motorcycle, but not everyone knew how to ride a motorcycle. I mean, this really is like the brashness of cults. No one was trained to ride. So they just get on them.

It's not the sort of thing you just pick up on the fly, even though I sort of did it entirely. Chuck implored members to ride anyway. One old timer died and several others lost limbs. Lost? Wow. In Rex. What?

The DJ in charge of the in-house radio station lost a leg and it crashed. Hey, everybody, welcome back. On the ones and twos, not playing it like I used to. Actually, when you look at my limbs now, it is a two and one situation here coming in the morning. Ladies and gentlemen, traffic out there is a nightmare based on the new Harley edict. People are crashing into each other.

We got legs. We got arms. We got a torso laying on Main Street. Main Street is a no-go. I remember when that pothole was a problem, I sure do. We got, we're here in Marin County. You got something to say? Marin.

Marin? Marin. We're still doing it over here. God, I missed that leg. It's me. Hop in the morning. Let's go. Jack became more tyrannical.

Good. Tyrannical or tyrannical. Either way, but I still think after a Harley edict, you, I mean, I think that's a sign that you're headed that way. Yeah. Members were now being viciously gamed for misspeaking in public or not making their bets. This is, it's turning bad.

When his doctor- It's almost like human Twitter. Oh my god, it is human Twitter. It's totally human Twitter. Members were now being viciously g- Oh, I did that. When his doctors told them he needed to exercise more, Chuck announced a new program called The Fatathon.

Dave, don't stop. What's The Fatathon? Well, it required all members to spend a portion of the day jogging in place. So because, so basically he is just has a bunch of virtual hymns. Yeah. Whatever he does, they must do immediately after. Yeah. It's almost like a voodoo doll.

Like anything happens to anyone. The Fatathon. Yeah. And one woman refused to participate in The Fatathon. Interesting. And was public about it. So Chuck brought her- Something to do with a haircut.

Chuck brought her to the cafeteria and made her jog in front of everyone as they ate. Chuck's a normal guy. Yeah, he's a normal guy. Kind of chill sort of dude. Why did this all start for him when he was how old? Oh, he's 43, I think. When this really took fruition. Well, when he started it.

Right, okay. I was going to say you could blame it on early success. No. But no, this is, he's almost, it's almost like he's Kanye a little bit. Yeah, he's super fucked up. So after he made this woman jog in place, the woman told other members that she wanted to quit, but she couldn't because it would mean leaving her husband and two kids at Synanon. So this is really common at Synanon.

Oh, this is really common in schools. Yeah, once bus wants to leave, the kids are there because they've got all the kids in the other place and the kids are like being raised by everybody kind of deals. Mother, we can't go. We must stay at Synanon 3. That's right. In Synanon 3, Chuck saw something new.

He told his followers he wanted Synanon to be the vanguard of aggressive militant religions. Oh, good God. There should be a handbook. Yeah, but when you start a cult, you should get a scroll that's sort of like, huh, that's weird, we're headed right that direction. Yeah, well, I'm a hack. Yeah, it's serious. But also congratulations on inventing aggressive militant religions.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. He wanted Synanon to develop a reputation that would make others think twice about messing with them. It's just great. What is it? Synanon 3 is crazy. Synanon's aggressive behavior began with attacks on its own members. Okay. The drug rehab program was revamped and began taking in juvenile delinquents who were sent there by judges.

Okay. Dave, this... Yeah, because everyone thinks they're a fucking good group and that they're locked into saving people from addiction. So, of course, judges send them to... The kids were put into what was called the punk squad and forced to do the dirtiest, hardest work in the compound. They get it. And beatings of kids became routine. This is all shaping up really, really well.

Teens were being abused for slouching or making their beds wrong. The bed is a big player. Yeah, they're really into beds. So is Jordan Peterson, it's a thing. People get into beds making them not into bed. I'll stop talking, but... Are you hitting on me? Yeah.

But so they've basically... They've got these kids that they have doing work and they're just abusing them in this place. Well, and they're also probably like... It's sort of that prisoner mentality where it's just sort of like, oh, okay, you're here for rehab. You do all the bad shit so we don't have to and we're labeling it rehabilitative for you. But in reality, it's actually just because we don't want to take out the trash. That's right.

And then all the people in the... All the kids and the other... The members' kids, they're also being hit all the time. And they're all just being... I didn't go into that because it's not hilarious. Oh, no, I'm just... I'm about to go on a real fun riff, but... No, it's just like the perfect way to handle every level of maturation, obviously.

That's right. Sinan soon went after their neighbors. Sure, this is... So this is like... And this is like Farmland area. Right. So there were several yelling matches because members were driving aggressively. So they're fucking with people on the roads.

But they don't know how to drive. Wait, this is the people in Sinanon? Yeah, so Sinanon are now like fucking with people on the roads around the... To be fair, they've lost 81 limbs. They have lost 81 limbs. So... When two men's... Just two random guys' car broke down near the compound, Sinanon members grabbed them,

took them to a warehouse, tied them up. This is aggressive. And threatened to hurt them. Chuck came and joined and screamed in the men's faces that they should be fucked up. Then Sinanon called the cops on the two guys. The cops came. The cops came and were like, uh, yeah. So this...

Why did you call us criminals? Yeah, if you kidnap someone and punch them in the face, that's actually your bed? You ruined our ropes, officer. Your ropes? Yes. Look at them. They're coming in blood. Yeah, you did that.

Disgusting. You did that. That is not our blood. I think DNA evidence will show. It's their blood. It is their blood, exactly, officer. So if you will, cart them away. Read them the Miranda's.

I don't think you know how... I've already told them the one. They seem to have waived the first one right to remain silent. Are those overalls? Yes, we're all wearing these. That's what we wear. Are you in the Dixie Midnight Redders? I'm not familiar.

Are they on the radio station here? That's pretty much just speeches? I'm thinking of the future. Oh, well, it doesn't matter. Yeah, so haul them away, boys. Another case closed. Good to meet you guys. Strangely, the cops blame Synanon and asked the DA to bring charges of kidnapping.

It didn't happen. It's terrible. What? Why? Neighbor and rancher Alvin Gambonini started having disagreements over a ranch road on his property that Synanon had an easement on. Okay. When Alvin learned Synanon had bought $75,000 worth of guns, he became scared to plow his

fields. Oh, my God, yeah. Then one day, as he drove down his ranch road, 20 members attacked him as he drove home. Okay, and then they called the cops? He hurt our hands. He's with his wife and kids in the car. He's got three kids in a truck. They jumped all over the truck while he drove.

He managed to get away and stay for the home, but he was beaten and missing a tooth. Police were called. Only one member was arrested and charged. He got 15 days in jail. What's the DA's deal? I don't know. That thing I didn't look into, but it's a crazy part of this. So the massive gun purchase was picked up by the media and Synanon just said they had

a right to protect themselves. Wow. I mean, come on. We're a rehab place. Yeah. We can have guns. Yeah. February 1st, 1976, Chuck got on the wire, the private radio station.

Hey, we have a special guest in the studio. And read a long speech. The speech was titled, Childbirth Unmasked. No, Dave. Dave. Quote. Dave. David.

Why does a woman have a baby? Dave. Does a child mean value or is it just kind of a lark? What's happening with your cat? Oh, the ice machine? No, it's his electric feeder. Holy shit. That was the craziest cat moment I've ever seen.

Like that was, it's up on top of the fridge so the cat can't get to it. Because I was gone and so I set up the electronic feeder for him and I forgot to take the batteries out. So it's on top of the fridge and it just fed, but what it did to him, the like response time. Holy shit. Well, that's called Pavlovian. That is absolutely Pavlov's cat.

All right. So let's get back to this. Sorry. Sorry. Why does a woman have a baby? Does a child mean value or is it just kind of a lark? Do you think there is any appreciable difference between a person who moves their bowels several times a day and those once a day?

What is going on? Dave. On the radio? You're like, turn this up. Do you? Do you really and truly think that this natural process has any effect on the person doing it? What are you going to get out of that baby?

I understand it's like crapping a football more than anything else. What do you want to do that for, for Christ's sake? Jesus. And then he called Synanon Children a big issue because quote, every baby that we indulge a Synanon female takes up a bed and somewhere between $100 and $200,000 worth of energy. So they're too expensive is what he's saying. In 17 years, 150 children have been born at Synanon. Now Chuck was going to quote, control births like wealthy people in the world have always

done. Pardon? He ordered the men to get- What does he think the wealthy are doing? He ordered the men to get vasectomies and pregnant women to get abortions. Within five days or they'd be kicked out. Oh my God. Hundreds of members then left. Yeah.

Okay. And started smoking as soon as possible. Oh God. I just want coffee. Oh yeah. Oh yeah. Get these fucking overalls off. Oh.

I'm going to keep wearing mine. Yeah. But this is what Chuck wanted because he was calling this the squeeze. He wanted to push as many members out and leave only the very most devoted. So okay. Yeah. Pressure purge. Yeah.

In the state, hundreds of men got vasectomies in the compounds medic area. Well the dentist was great at those. One of the first operations. Oh no. Oh no. Are we going to hear about some? The surgeon accidentally cut an artery on the man's penis and his scrotum filled with blood like a balloon.

No. No. Dave. Dave. Like a bullfrog about to rib it. Oh Dave. Why? I think it's going well.

Oh boy. Well I'll tell you what I don't think I can have any more is children. Look at the size of my ballsack. Nine women had abortions. Chuck had no sympathy for them. Quote, having an abortion is like squeezing a boil. Nothing more. Jesus.

He would definitely be on the speaking circuit now. I mean. He told one couple they could keep the child if they gave him 30,000. They left. But Chuck himself did not have a vasectomy. Of course not. No, no, no. When he was questioned by some members why he said quote, I still might want to have

children. I mean I'm not crazy. I always thought of myself as a great daddy. Wow. Wow. I mean look at me. I'd be a great dad. Huh?

Come on. I can't let the hypocrisy gene die with me. Sadly Chuck's wife Betty died. He took it hard. He cried in front of members at the mention of her name. His sobbing was so extreme, members worried. Time for a game. Yeah, for sure.

Right now. You're having a game. Now you're crying? You're crying? I miss my wife. Do you miss your wife? Are you a big baby? I miss Betty.

Shave your head. His sobbing was so extreme, members worried about his health. Chuck then doubled down on the squeeze. He set up a labor camp. A labor camp. I'm wondering which way this is going to fall. There were 20, quote, dead beats. There were old timers that he wanted out.

So there's people who don't have money left, basically. And just go work until you want to leave. The old timers were scolded in front of the entire compound in Badger, which is like down in the middle of California. And then they were taken to a remote area. They were like treated like shit in Badger. In Badger. In Badger.

They were taken to a remote area and forced to do brutal jobs like moving boulders and building tin shacks in the hot summer sun. You! Drag that boulder over there! Move it! Now! Bring it back! Ha ha ha!

They had to live in tents and dig their own toilets? Sure. But they were rescued by one of Synanon's richest supporters, who's nicknamed the Harris. She called out Chuck during a game, and then he just blamed it on other members and shut it down. Wait. Wait. So.

So she's someone with money. He, so right, he had to scapegoat in order to preserve the financial valve. Yeah. So he was just basically like, I can't believe what they put you up to. Game's over! How dare they! How dare they! Ha ha ha ha ha!

Okay. So after two months of grieving for his wife, Chuck announced he was ready for a new woman. Oh god. He started wearing bright red suspenders. Oh dear. And called them his quote, courting suspenders. Oh my god. You, those that talk about an oxymoron, my courting suspenders, ah, my courting suspenders.

Oh fuck. Oh my god. It's pretty great. It's like my sexy scarf, my courting suspenders. He used the wire to tell everyone the type of woman he wanted, quote, I want a woman with a. This ends so creepily. This ends.

It ends great. It ends in love. I want a woman with a body of a 30-year-old, the wisdom of an 80-year-old in the intelligence of a 45-year-old. I'm not going to put it past this man to behead a woman and put another woman's brain in her and then stitch that onto a 30-year-old body. Well that's, that's just going to happen. Hello!

Chuck then behated no. And quote, a face that could get a contract in Hollywood, but with enough experience to have her face totally ruined. Um, the last power to run it back. So I think he's saying, I think he's saying he wants a beautiful young woman. Who doesn't care if she lost her beauty. But it, but like an older woman, he's saying an older woman's face is ruined. That's basically saying, because she's had experience, she's lived a life and now she's

a hideous monster because she's aged. You know, there's a lot more mysteries than what his penis looks like. He has a droopy eye. He's got a droopy fucking eye. He's got a droopy attitude. A dozen women were up for it. He is reality showing? He's great.

He's a catch. Oh my God. The first one had a dinner date with Chuck at his house but wouldn't get in the hot tub with him so she was out. I mean, honest to God, this, it's so trashy. The hot tub, the hot tub hurdle is like such a trope of like dating shows. Like, are they going to hit the hot tub? But this, this was like pre-hot tub.

Like Marin was known for hot, like, he just had like four people outside blowing the bubbles into it. They were literally, it was literally a round wooden thing. The hot tubs weren't like they are now. Hey, I know the kind of style. Don't fuck with me bitch. What did you say? Did you just talk smack?

I, yeah, we're doing the game aren't we? Oh, sorry. Nice beard. I like the patchy kind. Okay, you know what. I don't want to play. Oh you live alone with a cat? I don't want to play.

I don't want to play. I don't want to play. I don't want to play. I don't want to play. I don't want to play. I don't want to play. Man, remember when his feeder went off? Good times.

It was like, it would be like if oil just started coming through my floor, that's what it was for him. It was like jackpot. So the second woman, Ginny Sotrin, didn't reject his advances and just fucked him. Days later, she moved into his house. They got along. So he went on two dates out of the 12th? Yeah, and won the next one.

And the first one went into the hot tub, he was like, I love her. She's great. She's great. She loves my suspenders. She gets it. But so she moves into the house, they start, you know, put her together. But then Ginny called out Chuck's bad sexual performance during a game that had been broadcast on The Wire.

Oh yes. Oh yes. Oh man. Now, he should have been wearing his climax and condoms. Now, Chuck had always bragged about his sexual abilities and ridiculed members. How did that even come up? I know. And ridiculed members whose sexual inadequacies were outed during games.

Oh, so she just... So he screamed at Ginny, quote, you don't ever have the right to do that to me. You don't even know me. You don't ever do that in a game with me. But there's no rules. He couldn't let it go. He talked more and more about how good his sexual skills were bragging that he, quote, raised hell in bed.

And when an old son of a bitch like me gets to courting a younger woman, I come to bat with a whole lot of tricks. So he's just telling everybody this. He's just... Protests too much. Hey, look at me. Do I look like... Yeah, I look like a guy who knows how to fuck.

Yeah, but yes. Yeah. Yeah. I'm a fuck guy. For sure. When I look at you, I think for absolute... Fuck man. A big...

Yeah. Yeah. Say it. Yeah, for sure. I'm a fuck guy. You're a big... Would I have these suspenders on if I wasn't? These are my fucking...

No, these are my fucking suspenders. Oh sorry, I thought they were the red ones. These are yellow. Those are yellow. Those are different. Yeah. Hey, well, what a... You know...

I'm good at it. Yeah. I mean, well, yeah, you're allowed to do what you want. In and out. In and out. Yeah. Two times. I know what I'm doing.

Yeah. You know, you might want to learn conilingus. What? Nothing. Keep hammering away. They call me the hammer. Yeah, they should. For sure.

He started a campaign to promote better sex among couples. Oh my God, Dave. We're all gonna fuck. We're all gonna fuck. We're all gonna fuck. We're all gonna fuck. We're all gonna fuck. We're all gonna fuck.

We're all gonna fuck. We're all gonna fuck. We're all gonna fuck better. This guy clearly doesn't know how to fuck. I mean, it couldn't be... Like, he shouts at her. Yeah. And now he's like, everyone's gotta fuck better.

He... Copies of the Tau of Sex were handed out. Wow. The men were then encouraged to try tantric sex. Early ejaculation began to be ridiculed at games. What? Hot. In 1977, Chuck declared all married couples had to separate.

Okay, okay. He thought it would be good for them to go through what he called emotional surgery. Dave, and how close are we to him being allowed to have sex with those women? Oh, yeah. No? We'll see. No. Oh, wow.

It doesn't happen. So they were supposed to pick a new partner, or Chuck would pick a new partner for them. So he told everyone to split up. So he told everyone to split up. Yeah, he's basically doing a swapping exercise. It's a do-si-do. Yeah, they're... Yeah.

Even his children, Jade and Deed had to. Jade had already separated from her husband, so she was fine with it. But Deed really loved his wife. So Chuck held a game, a special game, and the group tore Deed apart. Oh, no. Chuck threatened to fire Deed and started walking away at the end of the game. Deed was crying. And he agreed to take a new partner.

Chuck assigned him a new wife, someone else's wife was now his wife. Sure. His own son. Sure. Over 300 members left after the swap order, but over 200 couples divorced and stayed. Wow. They had ceremonies where the couples split and took new partners. Why?

Why? Why? Why would you stay? He's great. It's just this... The cult mentality is so fascinating. Yeah. It really is unbelievable what people will put up with because they want to serve this dude.

Yeah, it's crazy. The premature ejaculating hot tub. Yeah. So Senora's managers made sure they... Everyone recoupled. So if people broke up, the people were there to make sure that they were... Y'all are doing it, right? You're marrying another fella?

I'm going to have to watch it go in if that's okay with everybody. Just put it down on your chart here. And insert it. Have a good sex. Chuck participated in one ceremony where he broke up with Billy using a Ouija... Betty using a Ouija board. So he broke up with his dead wife using a Ouija board. Oh my God.

And then got... I'm doing it too. Oh my God. Where I like. Oh my God. This guy. Last. So members are now emotionally distraught.

Yeah. In games, new couples would viciously attack each other over little issues in their new relationship that they didn't want to be in. Right. Chuck would then order people to go on, quote, drills. So this meant wherever they... Wherever they were, they had to have sex. Oh no.

What? He would tell them he would be like, now? Yeah. I think they would have sex. This meant they were to have sex no matter what they were doing or how they were doing it. Sorry. In front of him?

No, no. They would just have to go have sex, right? Wherever they were, wherever they were, whatever they were doing, he'd be like, you have to go... It's time for a drill. And then they'd have to go get it, a drill. And then they'd have to go somewhere and fuck. Oh my God.

If the people kept fighting, they were told to leave the group to figure things out. Is that what this new Fox dating show The Drill is about? I hope so. I bet it is. So this is still the squeeze, right? He's still trying to squeeze people out and see who will stick around. I mean, he is trying to create a situation where everyone leaves and people are like, we'll do it.

He's like, what is going on? Well, people are still staying. Yeah. But the community has been cut down by a third. Synanon now had less than a thousand members who had to prove their allegiance by choosing Synanon over their spouses. Sure. But word of forced vasectomies and violence, particularly child abuse, got out to the media.

Synanon was now under government scrutiny. Czech decided to control the media narrative and held a press conference. Oh, never good. He was overconfident and used... He's used to being very combative because of the games, right? Yeah. Right. Yeah.

Yeah. They all are, right? They're just assholes. The idea of taking your attitude from this world into the actual world is not good. So, he and his advisors came off as arrogant and aggressive. When asked about the State Department... The State Health Department's inspection, Czech said he'd quote, find out how many of those cocksuckers are practicing sodomy, how many are fucking cheap and everything else.

You want to investigate? We'll show them how to investigate. Oh, kiddo. So... He brought a very different attitude. That's not how you do a press conference. No. That's not how you handle PR.

No. No. No. Actually, now it is. Yeah, now it's back to that. Now it is. Now we've gone back. But it wasn't until really recently.

Previously, not yet. Yeah. So, shockingly, articles are negative about the press conference, if you could believe that. Fake news. Czech kept inviting reporters to send it on. One from Time Magazine interviewed Czech for over two hours. Not good.

Which, to him, he thought it was going great. Yeah, sure. It's a poetry check. And after the interview, he expected to be Times Man of the Year. Right. But the headline was, quote, life at Synanon is swinging. A once-respected drug program turns into a kooky cult. Yeah.

So, not the same. Not the same as Big Man of the Year. Literally what has happened. Yeah. Yes. Czech declared a war on time in any media... A war on time is funny. Yeah.

All right. Yeah. We're all fighting that one. And any media writing negative articles, Synanon went after every news outlet that ran them. Starting to sound really familiar. Yeah. After San Francisco's KGO ran a series of reports, Czech sent a spokesman to New York

to read a statement to ABC's shareholders. Sure. Good, good call, I'm sure. Quote, there is great danger for you, your wives, and your families. I am familiar with the element of that which now sits at your doorstep. I grew up with murderers and thieves and people who made their living killing. My father was one of them. Only you can stop the urge toward mayhem and violence you have instigated in our society.

By the way, I'm real good at sex. FYI. Also, they call me Mr. Fuck. Huh? Wow. Bold. Bold. Bold.

Smart. Big, but smart. All right. Sinanon fought back legally and physically. It filed a $76 million suit against time and a $40 million one against ABC. Around this time, two former members went back to Sinan to visit old friends at Sinanon. They were accused of being spies for time and severely beaten. Good.

Well, time to call the cops if you're Sinanon. Now Marin County, based on all this press and everything, began two grand jury investigations, one criminal, the other civil. The civil grand jury report was full of stories of fearful neighbors and recommended the sheriffs investigate the reports of child abuse and violence. Okay. It also represented the sheriff for deputizing two Sinanon members. Wow.

Oh, God. In 1978, Chuck handed over the director title to his daughter, Jade, who was only 27. It's time, Jade. Yeah. It's your turn. Have fun. He's super wealthy, obviously, from all the cash, but still made himself a Sinanon consultant and pulled a $100,000 year salary for life.

You have to have that. For life. Yeah. How else are you going to be able to? That happens to CEOs all the time. That's right. He decided to expand Sinanon's role to the national stage. He moved to D.C. to make more powerful contacts, but he couldn't know, because everyone knows

what he is there. Also, they've seen you. They are you. Yeah. You know what I mean? You're going into the den of fucking monsters. So he was just harassed by the press there. It was not the same as the West Coast press, much more harsh.

After Chuck threatened a reporter with a cane in front of two police, he fled to Europe. Okay. Wow. I mean, that's you. If you're threatening people with canes, you are ready for Europe. You are. You're ready to go. You're all ready.

How are you not in Bulgaria? You're ready to hit the streets of France. He took his lawyer and his wife to Southern Italy. A dozen of them. His wife is the one who... Ginny, the one, the second, the number two, the one who fucked them, the hot tub. A dozen of Chuck's confidants flew out to join them in a small town in Italy. It was supposed to be rest and relaxation, but it just turned into a giant drunken orgy.

They changed partners almost daily. Even Chuck started drinking again. Oh, Jesus. Yeah. I think we might have lost the thread a little bit. After that, he fell off the wagon and reached California and they were very upset. When he came back, he apologized to Synanon and worked to get back and everyone's good graces and soon all was forgiven because he's their leader.

An ex-Synanon member named Phil Ritter had fled in the night after the vasectomy rule had come down. Sure. Interesting time to choose, but yeah, there's many. He left behind his wife and daughter, and then he divorced her and won back custody of the daughter, and then suddenly the two disappeared. He and the daughter. His wife and daughter, so they, you know, Synanon, that's what those places do.

That's it? Well, they don't know where they, he has no idea where they were. At that time, I didn't really follow up on this, but it's one of those... Do you think they were killed? No. They just went... They just put him somewhere else. Right.

Yeah. Ritter took Synanon to court to get his daughter back. The hearing was two weeks away when two thugs clubbed him in his driveway. They beat him to a pulp, shattering his skull. That led to spinal meningitis, but he somehow survived. Former members pushed local and state police to go after Synanon, but they did absolutely nothing. Yeah, that's a sigh.

Shall I exaggerate? Same month, Synanon lost a court case. A woman had checked into Synanon for help and was held against her will. Members constantly yelled at her and dragged her around by her wrists. Define help! They dragged her down by her wrists. It's crazy. Her husband hired attorney Paul Morantz, who negotiated her release.

She came out with a shaved head and far worse off than when she had gone in. Morantz filed a $5 million lawsuit for kidnapping and brainwashing against Synanon. A doctor suggested she suffered from a, quote, rape of the mind. That's fucked up for a doctor. Yeah. The use of rape in, like, medical terms... It's not. Unless it's actual.

Yeah. It's pretty dark. They're just, like, pretty liberal with just, like, tossing it around. Yeah. I mean, that's what cults are, right? They just fucking completely fuck your head. Yeah. Well, you gotta take the hair off if you're gonna wash someone's brain that well.

What? Huh? The judge awarded the family $300,000. A month later, a four-and-a-half-foot rattlesnake was put in Paul Morantz's mailbox and it bit him. Oh, my God. And they had to be rushed. Of all the snakes that put in a mailbox, that's the dumbest one.

A rattlesnake? Yeah, you'd hear it. Right. No, they cut the rattler off. Oh, well, there we go. Good night. Yeah. He survived.

And this was around when San Francisco's Jim Jones people's temple deaths, right? So that's, like, almost 1,000 people in South America who did the... Right, so at this point, he was like, well, we'll never kill that many. But people are like, oh, cults might be bad. I don't know what it is about that situation that doesn't sit right. Now, a lot of the blame of the deaths fell on the government, San Francisco government, California government, because they just... Sure, because they were complicit.

Totally complicit. They'd ignore him. They'd ignore him. I just totally had action and then getting money from him and all that shit. I mean, that's the thing about when we do these shows is you are able to hear from beginning to end and there's always these enormous lapses where people, you know, which we sit through right now. We'll sit through the repercussions of it in whatever, 20 years.

Nothing. The snake attack was heavily covered in the media. So like, he was the attorney's, like, given press conferences and like, it's a big fucking story. So law enforcement is now going to do something about sending on, because 1,000 people died and these guys did the snake bit. 1,000? Oh, because of the gym.

Right. Yeah. Who are called imperial marines, so part of his setting up a military religious situation was to create an imperial marine force. So these guys who go out and fuck people up. A space force. Space force. They confessed to leaving the snake from rents.

The imperial marines were the force within Synanon that was responsible for much of the violence that had been happening. Law enforcement came and searched the compounds and confiscated tons of material, including the tapes. Oh, dude. I forgot. You idiot. It's like Nixon.

Why? Yeah. Yeah. But he'd love to hear his voice. Yeah. No, it is. It's ego. Oh, man.

This one's just about fucking and operating. Is it fucking? I'm going to not let you take all these tapes. So he rants about morants and other lawyers draining Synanon's lifeblood. He said he had a little surprise for them and, quote, they're going to play by a different set of rules, our rules. I'm quite willing to break some lawyer's legs and then tell him. This dude is not ready for prime time.

No. Next time I'll break your wife's legs and then I'm going to take your kid's arm off. What is he talking about? Try me. He got too comfortable with limb removal. But he didn't, he just thought he was saying this to his flock, right? It's on the tapes. It doesn't matter.

It's still too much. Yeah, but you got to let it out, man. It's part of the game. It's like a skew of English. It's not English. It's like the off English. Chuck Diedrich was arrested. When they arrested him, he was really, really drunk.

He was in Arizona at a house shit-faced. He was so drunk he needed to be taken out on a stretcher. Oh my God, David really hit me with some punches here at the end. What? He was stretcher drunk? Yeah. Wow. Wow.

I've even heard of wheelchair drunk. He was charged with conspiracy to commit murder. More charges followed. And throwing up in an ambulance. When they heard his calls for violence on other tapes. Synanon was now facing multiple million dollar lawsuits from people they had attacked. Morant's sued for 32 million. But it was Synanon, so Chuck's followers fought back.

Right, of course. First with a PR campaign, members held question and answer sessions in public areas like college campuses. Really? Sure that went well. Who plus that? Then attorneys settled all suits except for Morant's. And that when they delayed, and they delayed the trial so long until he finally had to

settle. Okay. Just dragging it out. Chuck and the two imperial marines got plea deals, pleading no contest. The marines got a year in jail and then probation. Okay. Chuck was given five years probation because of his declining health. Man, fuck that.

Yeah, fuck off. Honestly. I know. Well. I know. But Chuck's probation required him to cut all ties. Like that, right? Yeah.

He had to cut all ties with Synanon. That's part of the, that's part of the plea deal. No contact. Authorities kept going after Synanon. It was stripped of its tax exemption status. Nine higher ups were charged with destroying evidence related to the snake attack. In 1985, the remaining heads were indicted for tax evasion and obstruction. The loss of income, the bad PR and legal fees took down Synanon once and for all.

In 1991, Synanon ceased operations and sold off its properties. Chuck died in 1997 in Bicelia where he lived with his wife, Ginny. Wow. Still with her. But, so he, he didn't go to jail, but then he lived for another fucking 12 years. Yeah. No. For sure.

Anyway. He was cool. Yeah. You can't physically, you can't allow someone's, the physical nature of their body to take away what their mind just did. Like they have to go. I mean I get it. The guy's dying.

What's the difference? No, there is a difference. But he wasn't dying. But he wasn't dying. No, I think if you have cancer and you're dying of cancer, what's the point of putting that person in prison? He's dying. But he meant someone who had cancer.

No. But I mean. I'm saying he didn't have those issues. Yeah. He just got off. I mean, even if, even if you do and you've created, there is a line where you've created and damaged enough lives where you're, there's supposed to be a little bit of like pain you receive to let you know that you're a fucking asshole.

A bad person? Yeah. You know. Take their eyes. Take their eyes. Exactly. Yeah. Is that weird?

Off with their eyes. Did you say that? Um. Well, I hope you're happy with what you've done here today. I didn't do anything here today. I sat here and I let you, I hope you're happy. I'm not happy. Give it to this guy.

Cat's up. Yeah. He's ready to eat. He's just like been, yeah. He's ready to, he's ready to have, take some game. Look how cute this guy is. Come on. Can you stay mad at this little guy?

It's heavy. All right. All right. All right. We're done. I love my boy. Bye.