The Greatest Generation - Secret Silk (DS9 S3E3)

Episode Date: September 10, 2018

When Keiko quits her job, Chief O’Brien must throw out the manual in order to fix the problems in their relationship. Meanwhile, after Quark gets into a bar fight with a drunk, his punishment requires that he defend himself both physically and mathematically. How can you tell if it’s a split diopter shot? What does Minkus look like today? Who is the best person to talk to about your domestic problems? It’s the episode that’s fine, really.

Priority 1 message from Starfleet coming in on Secured Channel. Hey friends of Disodo. Before today's episode, we just wanted to take a moment to talk about the historic labor actions being taken by writers and actors in the American Film and Television industry. If you're a fan of the work done by the people who make Star Trek, we hope you'll join us in standing in solidarity with the folks who actually bring these adventures to life. Over the past several years, the AMPTP, the organization that represents the American Film and Television Production Studios, have reduced the profit from movies and TV going to workers. And in so doing,

they've attempted to weaken the labor unions that represent those workers. They wouldn't even engage the unions on many issues in their negotiations. And so a strike was the only course of action to take. Adam, Wendy and I have been having a lot of internal discussions about how best to stand with the unions and we are continuing those conversations in a dynamic situation. We're doing our best to understand where the picket lines are in these digital spaces,

and we would never intentionally cross one. With the information we have, we feel like we can do more good talking about and supporting the strike and continuing our show as planned. We'll keep you informed about what all this means for greatest trek specifically. Today we're making a contribution to the Entertainment Community Fund. This fund exists to help all the people whose livelihoods have been put on hold because the AMPTP refuses to negotiate

in good faith with the unions. It provides financial support for writers, actors, and all the thousands of laborers who make the shows that we talk about here and without whom we wouldn't have Star Trek to cast pot about. Those folks are all out of work because billionaires, company shareholders, and the executives of these companies don't want to compromise on the length of their yachts. We hope you'll join us in supporting entertainment workers in a challenging time, especially after they've already endured several years of challenges brought on by the pandemic

and season two of Star Trek Picard. We've set up a page where you can also contribute. It's at friendsofdecotoforlabor.com. That's friendsofdececoto for Labor.com. That's FriendsOfDecoto for Labor.com. Link in the episode description. Okay, now let's get on with the show. Here's to the finest generation Deep Space Nine. It's a Star Trek podcast by two guys who are a little bit embarrassed to have a Star Trek podcast.

I am Adam Pranica. I am Benjamin R. Harrison. Back behind the mics after what do we get like three weeks in Adam and Ben time always imperceptible to the viewer at home. It has been a long time since we've recorded an episode of this show. Why did we even show them behind the curtain? I think they like seeing behind the curtain. Oh yeah. I think they like seeing underneath the kimono. That's an HR violation in in atbridge, Shimoda, LLC though. You can't do that.

Well, fortunately, we are the HR department, so we can look the other way on this particular instance of it. We're going to get away with it with just a slap on the wrist. Yeah. But then, like, years from now, they will find that our company had a culture of kimono looking behind from the beginning. It was some say baked into the DNA of the company. Would that be the upspread side or the Shimoto side of that family? I think you know which side it is Adam.

I have never been the baker in my family if we're talking about baking things in. That was always reshungety. I was the steeper of the tea. But respecting people's boundaries and personal privacy is not my strong suit. Of course I famously implanted a music box in de-anatroized brain. I also like to believe that my mash extermination of the Hushnok counted as just a slight overreach

in Shuman's privacy. Neither of these are things that I did with explicit consent. I see the air of my ways now. I mean, it was the 90s, it was a different time, but that's not an excuse. I'm personally just wondering when my rehabilitation tour can begin. Some nights I drive behind the Comedy Seller look

out look out the window at it and wish to get back to my roots. Hey yeah is anyone here from Out of Terror? Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha Specifically the Hushna Comorals? Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha Boy or my extermination powers time! Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha Let's check about Inflight Meals for a second. Specifically interstellar meals. Take my rubber away.

Please. Real type five by Kevin Uck's bridge there. Not a surprise. He's had a millennium to work on it. He's got a lot of material that is severely dated even by our standards, but he can be forgiven given his extreme age. Be quiet, Grandpa. Adam, I have a big old box here, and I actually got it before we left for the most recent

leg of our tour, but I'm excited to open it. You want to listen to me open a box? You should open that box in case there's food inside. Captain, I'm sorry to disturb you. I'm receiving a code 47. Verify? It is code 47, sir. Start lead emergency frequency.

Caption size only. The address is, it leads me to believe this is gonna contain comics. I'm opening it and holy shit Adam this contains a shit ton of comics. Whoa was it was the box like one of those coffin comic boxes? It's like it's like the priority mail medium flat rate box. Okay, right on top, I've got a Star Trek the next generation, 1989 calendar. And it's like a wall calendar, months to months.

That January. Oh, you got to see when 1989 can be reused, right? Yeah, we do. These are blown up photos that are not great quality. There's a Januaryous Captain Jean-Luc Picard as private detective Dixon Hill. There's Q in his in his judge get up from encounter at far point. In his big hat? Oh, here's the traveler. L'Occana Troy. No Shimoda.

Sad. What else do we got in here? This looks like a coloring book calendar. It's called the Star Trek, the next hysterical calendar. And the cover is wararf with like a suction cup dart stuck to his loaf And they kick me sighing taped to his back and You said this calendar was from 1988. Yeah, wow check it out. So you can't use an 88 calendar until 2044 shit dog and then after that 2072 that calendar Ben. I'm sorry to tell you almost worthless

There's a The March image is the The original series Enterprise with the millennium Falcon like hiding under the disc You know, you know when a like you know when they when they like park it on the back of the star destroyer and then float away with the garbage It seems like a lot of the humor from this is based on the idea of of Star Trek and star wars meeting up feels like some real science fiction carpet bagging Yeah, I cannot believe this exists

That's what people say about our show. Yeah. You can't reuse this episode until 2044 also. Yeah, I've got several copies of Star Trek, the next generation magazine. An issue of Sinitastique, all about Star Trek Deep Space 9, as well as an issue of Starlog magazine about Star Trek TV's base nine. Touchcomics really understands value because you want to go for that flat rate box if you're

stuffing it full of old magazines and calendars. Oh, here's a letter, I think. Oh man, letter is full of collectible card game cards. See, here's what it says. Dear Benjamin, the work you and Adam have done these past few years has kept me falling into the depths of my depression and Crapulence. Oh no! I keep thinking- Was that word Crapulence? Yeah. Wow.

I don't know that word, but I keep thinking of running away from it all, but the laughter and talk about hygiene and mental health has given me a bit of hope for the future. Enough to clean, they schmoots off my face, dust off my pants and test the world at the beginning and end of every week. In the box are a few Star Trek comic books I could find at work. They go as quickly as we can get them in and plenty of magazines for your quote research. Most importantly of all, they sealed box from the customizable card game for the series Mirror Mirror. According to the box, each pack holds 11 cards. There are 30 packs, meaning

you can spend half a season playing war. With long andper, Dave. Dave, thank you so much. Always great to hear that we have helped anyone in any way by doing this dumb show. Thanks for being plausible as it is. Yeah, speaking of implausibility, Ben, what would you say if I told you that quark could be installed as the leader of a Klingon house, would you be ready to believe that? I would, I would, Elaine Bennistyle shove you and say, get out.

Well, we have got the episode for you, Ben, as we talk about, deep space 9, season 3, episode three, the house of Quark. To the, to the, to the, to the, to the, to the, to you realize how action really is. But the action, I think, is going to be taking place in mourn's quarters because he's ready to lay that hammer down. Yeah, he gives like a fist pump to Quark and Ram as he leaves the bar with a beautiful lady. And it's not the quirk and ROM are like upset that that mourn is about to embark on some consensual love making with a lady from the bar.

It's that it's a really bad sign when mourn leaves the bar because mourn is usually the last one to leave and it's not closing time yet. Rule of acquisition 286. When mourn leaves, it's all over. Mourn is like one of the last customers they've got. And Quark is feeling really down about business. It seems that the recent excitement surrounding the founders and the Dominion

have really put a chilling effect on Deep Space Nine. It's not surprising to me that a scandal like the chance of death could keep people away from what we're to understand is not a really great place to get a drink or bite to eat. Yeah. Like people prefer the rep limit. Station traffic in general is way down, but Quirks bar is dead. And the only customer they've got left is a super drunk cling on. Yeah, he is like barf on the table drunk. And he wants another drink,

like most barf on the table drunks do, only he's run out of money. This guy definitely has been over served and needs to be cut off, but also they don't want to turn away another sale, given how dire the straits are. But yeah, the dude's pockets are full of moths and dust. And he's looking to start a tab on his good reputation, which does not necessarily inspire Quirk. I mean, you would think that quirk would be interested in getting

into the crediting business, right? You make so much interest. Yeah. That's true. I think the problem is this guy just doesn't look good for it. Yeah, they don't even, but they don't even like run a background check, you know, they don't, they don't give three addresses and say, which of these three have you lived at in the last five years or none of the above? Little experience material for you? Ben, they tell you never to fight a drunk. And I think what the scene that we get here is the reason why. This guy is angered at the idea of not having credit extended to him.

And even someone as feeble and as fight a versus quark is, is able to somehow trip this guy up to the degree that he falls on his own night. Yeah, he did. And just to confirm that quark reaches down and gets a big smear of blood all over his hand so that he can look at it, yep, can confirm that is blood. I don't think you want to touch the blood, do you like at a crime scene? Very strange choice. The only way I would forgive that choice if he'd been like, it's red. What? Wait, is it purple or red? Which is it? What's is it? Quark and, uh, and ROM like yell, yell at each other into the show open.

Ha ha ha ha. Star Trek in general has, Klingon continuity is, is totally screwed, you know? I think we just have to let it go. After the break, there's an investigation going on. Like, they haven't, the body isn't even cold yet. When there's like a really bad accident on the highway, they like pull a fire truck in front of what's happened

so that people don't see the dead bodies or whatever. They do not do that here. They have left all the windows to the bar open to the promenade and big crowd has gathered to just gawk at this dude. This crowd is all a titter about this and Quarxes this as an opportunity to make some money by by turning the situation into legend. Yeah.

In responding to odos in quarries about what happened, he kind of he kind of projects to the back of the room and he's answering the question as much as... He does that performative talking? Yeah, yeah, he's answering the question as much for Odo as for all the people assembled. Because if he's quirk the Klingon killer, he thinks that people will want to come drink in his bar. Drink in his bar.

If you get too drunk, he might kill you. It's gonna be great for business. Who wouldn't want to be killed by a Faringi? In saying that, that's kind of the core of the episode. That's the core problem. Right. The degree to which people do not want to be killed by a Faringi.

Yeah, and they come at that from a lot of different angles. Ben, there's a different kind of death happening in the quarters of Keko and O'Brien. I am Chief Miles and O'Brien. This is fucking spectacular. The death of Ambition seems to be all over Keko's face as she snips some bonsai trees dispassionately at home. This is a great split diopter set. She's working on the tree and she's kind of by herself and then Brian walks in and orders a beer from the replicator. And he is very deep in the background and she's very nicely framed in the foreground.

I thought it was split diopter too, but I kinda think it's a comp. And here's why. Kiko looks matted, and I've never used a split diopter, so I don't know if you can like rotate it back into square. Is that something that you can do with that kind of lens? Because when O'Brien walks into the foreground

on her same focal plane, both of them are in focus and I don't know how you do that with that kind of lens. I mean, he's so far back in the room that I think you could have that much depth of focus with that lens. It also might just be that they're shooting on film and they know that what looks focused when they compress it down to standard definition is different from what it would look like if you were projecting it or transferring into HD. I don't know, you might be right.

If it is a comp, it's probably motion tracked, right? Because the camera moves. It tilts up. It is so unique in this show, like this sequence and this shot. I rebounded a couple of times trying to figure out how they did it, because I was just unwilling to believe that it was split diopter given the walk to foreground. It seemed like something they never do.

You might be right that it's a mat. I'm looking at her ear and I'm not sure I believe the edge of it now. That's exactly what that supports my argument is her, is her matte ear. So she's probably on a green screen or something. That's what I'm guessing. Wow. And then they do a nice bit of cutting around it like because they cut to over o'Brien shoulder and then when they cut back to that original shot, they're using a standard lens.

Or they're both in the same frame. I don't know why you would do a comp for that shot. Yeah, so much work for that shot, right? But I kind of like, I really admired if that's what they did. Yeah, that's a mystery. I wonder if we had pulled an instigree card on this episode if we would have found out the secret behind it.

Number 4, Alphurrain, Catalyn 40, Dullin' What are you doing now? Number 4, Alphurrain, Catalyn 40, Dullin' Number 4, Alphurrain, Catalyn 40, Dullin' Not be gone, not be gone, not be gone, not be gone. Exactly. Yeah, so we have kind of two very independent stories in this episode, the Quark Kill to Klingon story and the Miles and Kiko are dealing with the fact that Kiko's school has shut down story. And they don't really overlap or intersect that much.

It's an episode of the week. We are not in arc mode at this point. A lot of what's happened to Kiko has happened off screen. Slowly but surely, her school has died because no one is going there anymore. The Bajorans on the station have started going to school on Beijor, leaving only Jake and Nog as the students. If you're a teacher, that's not going to do it for you. She's decided to pivot into tutoring. Can you imagine just Kako, Jake and Nag and a room together for eight hours a day? They

would drive each other nuts. That's a real like boy meets world situation, right? I would watch that show. Yeah, that'd be fun. Maybe that's a maybe that's one of the shows they should do with all these new CBS All-access Star Trek shows that they're trying to make the The boy meets world style DS9 universe show with Kiko as Mr. Fini. Yep That sounds awesome. Who's Topanga in this scenario? Is that Jake or Nog? I think that Topanga has got to be a dabbogirl. Yeah, okay.

But also she's vastly smarter than both of them put together. Nog is obviously Sean and Jake is obviously Cory. What's the, what's the do we be kid? Is it Mincus? Yeah, you're right. Hell yeah. Good grab. Really good grab. I'm going to Jackie and Laurie show you a picture of Mincus.

Present day Mincus. Just a... Mincus is all grown up and you won't believe what he looks like. Oh boy. He kind of grew up into a real boy band type, I think. He's got that look I mean like as a little kid. He's got a cleft in his chin like he looks like he's gonna grow up to be a hunk. God All I wanted in the world was a cleft chin and pubes If I had to pick one I I'd probably pick the chin.

Nobody really told me about pubes. No one tells you about pubes, Ben, you have to find out on your own. Yeah, I never wanted them when I started getting them. I'm like, what's this? No. And from then on, you made a decision. You'd never have them. Yep, that's why I'm sponsored by Jolette.

I like this O'Brien and Keko storyline. I mean, the fact that she is upset and feeling adrift is something that he really sympathizes with. And like his arc is how do I, you know, I'm the reason my wife and I are here on this station. And the, you know, the situation on the station has changed such that she is miserable. And I want to do what I can to remedy that. To even have an element of a Star Trek story

involved like a committed relationship and some of the realistic problems in something like that. These are real marriage feelings. And the way that they treat this relationship within this episode, I think, is so mature and confident and relatable. That feeling of knowing that your special person is struggling and not really knowing how to help is such an awful, powerless feeling.

And I think Kalamini's performance here is great. And so is Rosalind Chow's. Like they both act the shit out of this episode. It really comes out of left field that they're gonna have a great episode here because that is not really how it reads at the beginning. And then halfway through, it was like, holy shit, this is actually turning out to be

like a pretty amazing Brian and Keko episode. The way Keko says I'm fine really is pretty brutal. I think for anyone who's ever heard I'm fine really in a moment like that. But I think that it feels very real. If you're in a relationship with somebody for any amount of time, this inevitably happens where one person is unhappy and the other person has to puzzle through, is there something that like, is there like a way I can be helping find a solution to

the problem, or is this just a, I need to be, you know, here and sympathetic to this right now and like, or some mix of the two, like, that's what I'm fine really does. Like it never, I'm fine really, never stops the problem or like, or makes anything better. I'm fine really begins a process for the other person. Yeah. It's, it's interesting that it's set against the high drama of quirk playing Clion. Yeah. The tone swings so wildly back and forth in this. But somehow I feel like it kind of held together as an episode. I don't know.

I don't know why. Yeah, the tone is pendulous, Ben. Back in the bar, business is great. People are coming in wanting to meet the killer of Klingons and have a drink poured by the real-life quark. It was a furious exchange of blows. Even though the blood stain hasn't even been sufficiently clean from the middle of the bar.

So the cling on that he killed was, went by Kozak, and quark meets De Gore, who is Kozak's very angry and grieved brother, who wants to know exactly how this went down. And there's a lot of like instructing the viewer how Klingon's work that I thought was pretty well done because if you've watched every episode of TNG and Deep Space Nine up to this point, none of this is new to you, but it doesn't come across as a retread because Quark wouldn't have any context for any of this stuff. So when he's, when he starts by saying like, it just fell and DeGor is like, I'm going to kill you. And then, and then he has to walk it back and say like, he fought a brave and valiant battle right up to the end. It was

an honor to kill him. But tells you a lot about what DeGor wants his brother's death to have meant. And Quark's actions here seem very relatable, like he's saying whatever he can to avoid death at this guy's hands. Right, and that's a theme that really runs throughout this episode. Every time Quark thinks he's kind of figured out

how to talk to a Klingon, there's a new layer that is peeled back and reveals that he really doesn't have a great deep understanding of the Klingon conception of honor. He needs a like straight talk for teens style mentorship about how to have these conversations. And you know who would be great at that is Dan. Dan actually be awesome at that.

She gets nothing to do in this episode. No, not at all. She and Kira and Sisko are barely in the episode. The soul situation is complicated because if it's an accident, it means a dishonorable death. If you're killed by a Ferengi, it is also dishonorable. But I guess if you're killed by a Firingi, it is also dishonorable. But I guess if you're killed by a Firingi in combat, it's not totally dishonorable, and there may in fact be honor

in that death. It's a real puzzle. It's a death riddle. Rapt in a death enigma. O'Brien's first tack for trying to cheer Keko up is Romantic dinner. The kind of pays aren't ready yet. I pop some champagne. They knock boots a little bit. He's making her canopies. Amorous O'Brien is one of my favorite O'Brien. Yeah, always puts on a silk shirt, which was a real 90s move. I mean, it's kind of a throwback in his time period. But in the 90s, if you wanted to be an amorous dude, you put on a silk shirt. That was the last time you wore a silk shirt. Not since the 90s, Adam. Ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha.

Everyone did it. I had a pair of silk boxer shorts in the 90s. I was a kid. What was I doing with those? Yeah. You mean both, man. I'll tell you what I wasn't doing with those. Showing them to any girl.

Yeah. They were my secret silk. Yeah, like, I don't know how I got them, like what persuaded me that I needed them? I think I had it in mind that if you were gonna do some sexy times, you needed some sexy underpants, but that was still a decade away from me. Silk is way too ambitious of a fabric when you're like 15.

Yeah, yeah. And when you're starting to like learn how to deal with a smelly body, silk is not the fabric for you. That's really like varsity level fabric for somebody that's totally JV. Really shows a lot of stains and possible to clean. Yeah. Yeah.

You know what, we're kind of bad mouthing silk. Then we don't want to get big silk on our case. Every time we've bad mouthed something, I got a ton of shit for bad mouthing wadding toilet paper on this show. So. We clearly just can't come down on either side of big wad. Yeah, yeah.

Gold to cotton, the cup, gold to cotton. So. So by the morning after this amorous moment has lost a little bit of shine because on this way out the door post-coital O'Brien takes one last look at his lovely wife and she sort of does that thing that that check-off does when he has the bug in his ear, like as soon as he doesn't think he's being looked at, he kind of dead faces away, until like the middle of distance. C-D-L-F-S-E-X has checked out. And that's what K-Go does. He kind of slumps on the couch and is clearly still unhappy.

If every time my wife left the house to go to work, I was like, I guess I'll just be here all day and slump down the couch. That would be a real guilt trip. my wife left the house to go to work. I was like, I guess I'll just be here all day and slump down the couch. That would be a real guilt trip. I don't blame him for feeling bad about this, but I also don't blame her for feeling like, God, what am I going to do? Just sit in this house all day. I am the type that will most definitely wait for the other person to leave the room before actually emoting something like this? So for Keko to say that she's fine and then to so clearly not be fine in the presence of her husband,

I think she's really hurting and she doesn't quite know how to articulate that. I think Keko has before this episode turned the corner into a fully shaded sympathetic good character. I mean, it's kind of canonical their relationship, though. They barely knew each other when they got married. So the idea of like being vulnerable with each other and like actually expressing themselves might be kind of new to them. When people talk about like the honeymoon being over, I think that's what most people are describing is like when the vulnerability can creep in.

When you can like say something that is challenging without being worried that it's gonna be the end or whatever. Yeah. I mean, maybe this is the episode that our relationship needed. Also, around this time, a lady Klingon shows up in Quark's bar. My name is Grilka. She's just as freaked out and pissed off as a decor, but kind of in the opposite direction.

It was hard to recognize her as a female Klingon without the lursa and betor style decolottage. Yeah, the fact that there wasn't a window into under boob in her garment. She's definitely not from house cleavage the way they are. She's kind of foxy. Like, she's foxier than a full-blooded Klingon typically is, right? She is great. Yeah.

Like, her stepping onto the screen, she has a great entrance into this show. Yeah. And she just maintains that intensity throughout. She's so much fun. She's a ton of fun. She actually abducts Quirk. She hypospraises him in the neck. And when he gets hypospraed to revive him,

he is on Kronos in her house. There's an old man there explaining that he's in the, what used to be the house of Kozak. She's Kozak's widow. This has got to be so scary. Like waking up on Cronos is like a billion times worse than waking up on a plane to Vegas. That what they cut out of this scene right before before they revive him, is the guy telling the

computer to beam all the poop out of his colon so that he doesn't shit himself when he wakes up. Because that's got to be like a pretty standard thing that happens when you, uh, when you nudge someone away and be like, hey, you're on Kronos. What? The very next scene that they show is like like, hey, you're on Kronos. What? The very next scene that they show is the exterior of the Great Hall on Kronos. Now, it's like, there's no way this is Kronos, right?

There's some other Klingon planet. Sure, should it's Kronos? Like, they made it all the way there. Crazy. So, Kozak was the head of one of the great houses, like a moge-level house, apparently. And his death is a big political problem because Degor was an enemy of his. And in confirming that Kozak's death was honorable, Degor stands to inherit the land and property.

They're desperate to keep their family's house in order. And they're so desperate that they put a robe on Quark and a robe on Grilka. And then they make Quark repeat after Tuneck. And a kiss later, they're married. You are husband and wife. Congratulations to Quark and his new wife, Grilka. Bid, did you like this episode?

I loved it. I loved the the Klingon bird of prey with the tin cans strung to the back of it, the just married sign in the back window, warping off into the sunset. I love Grilka and Quark at the wedding cake like rubbing frosting all over each other's floor. Yeah that's fun. She throws a bouquet of knives. First in the catch is it is very dead. They're their first dance to Malorta. I'm not a dry eye in the house, just a real pretty moment.

Back on DS9, there's a little bit of a McLaughlin group. Issue a walk between Kira and Dax and Cisco, and they are just talking about some bullshit that does not matter in this episode because Anak is at the door and it's O'Brien, and he wants to talk to Cisco about personal matters. Personal matters of the type that Dax knows immediately that she should leave and Kira is like, I don't give a fuck, I'm gonna keep doing the work I'm here to do

because I'm a professional. To everyone's credit, O'Brien is like, oh, you guys are working, I'll come back later. And Cisco's like, no, no, it's cool. What do you wanna talk about? And he's like, oh, well, it was a personal matter. So we can talk about it later. It's totally fine. And Dax is like, K no, it's cool. What do you want to talk about? And he's like, oh, well, it was a personal matter. So we can talk about it later. It's totally fine.

And DAX is like, Kira, let's get out of here and Kira is very disrespectful. Let's be some kind of human thing. Kira, like me, is like Cisco and O'Brien, are you even that close of friends? Like, what the fuck are you talking about? What could this possibly be about that I can't be here for?

Do Cisco and O'Brien have this kind of relationship? This seems like an O'Brien to be sheer conversation to be having, and they have another one like that later, but this seems to be overstepping a professional subordinate to manager relationship. Right, because like they're so, like in terms of rank,

couldn't be further from each other, you know? Like, a brand has like an important job on the station, but he's an enlisted man. And Cisco is a, is an officer in sorrow. Would you be reluctant to talk about wife problems with the guy who is a widower? Like, hey, you remember when your dead wife was alive? How'd you make her happy?

Do you ever think about whether or not she was happy when she was alive? How do you think? Is she happy now? Do you think? I mean, if she wasn't assimilated, I mean. Do you ever think about that? Is she assimilated? I think it's a coin flip as to whether or not she assimilated been that's what I think yeah damn that's a dark

timeline yeah so in spite of how much we question how close O'Brien and Cisco are this is actually a really great conversation they have like they they are exchanging a a currency here that feels real and good. And this idea that it is easy for Cisco to do him this favor of granting him a cargo bay for an arboretum. Well, the station is mostly empty and always has been. And it doesn't seem like it's a growth curve

is exactly great right now. So I think Bay21 would be ideal. Cisco's like as long as Kiko doesn't worry about getting knifeed by a gemhidar because there's no active security in that part of the station. Yeah, everything's cool. Yeah. Like Cisco goes down a laundry list of things that are wrong with that cargo bay. Right.

It's also interesting. We just witnessed a marriage at knife point. And like, the idea of that occupying the same space with an episode about a dude just like doing everything he can think of to help his wife be happy. It's like, it's pretty fun. It is. Very whiplashy. Yeah. town. We get to see Gauron in the central hall or whatever the Klingon High Council is meeting with DeGor who is staking a claim to the assets of House Cosac and Gauron is like about to rubber stamp this when Grilco walks in and breaks the bad news to everybody. Enter! Husband! Like nobody is excited to find out that a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- a- here. Like, this seems like real low-rank bullshit for him.

I make claim to the title and property of this fallen house. You have a cancel jack or a paid bill? I thought he'd have more important things to do. Like, don't get me wrong. I am very thrilled that he's in this episode because I love him as a character, but this seems so beneath him. It's great house shit.

That's what royalties all about, right? Yeah. I don't know. I like how he struggles to say the word quark. Quark. Ankill us or? I get really stumbles him. I like the idea that you can be a different species and lead a Klingon house though. Like, what if in discovery when you saw those like holog a Klingon house though. What if in discovery when you saw those hologram Klingon leaders, what if it just happened to be a Ferenki? It's fun to get more Klingon world building here

because there's so much more to them than just winging batlets around and talking about honor and eating gross food. Yeah, and how fucking complicated is it that they're like cool with a Farenki dude leading the house, but a Klingon woman leading the house is like a big river to cross for them, you know? Like they're right.

What the hell is that? Okay, with a Farenki as the leader of a house then doing forensic accounting at any level. Right. Like that has been meath them. Turns out DeGor has been doing some accounting though. Quirk gets Grilka to open the books and let him look at her cling on spreadsheets. And he finds out that DeGor has been waging kind of a financial war against the House

for a long time, which is why they're getting less powerful. Like nobody with any honor on Kronos Things or cares about money, but to go as a real patock So he's been he's been working on that level the entire time You want to find yourself an accountant who's not a patock? Yeah, if you can yeah quirk wants to do some of this forensic accounting for Grilka and Grilka isn't thrilled about this, but she ultimately is a murer. He's like, let me do it.

I brought my accounting vest. I wasn't expecting to get abducted, but look, I got this vest. He's on Kronos, but he still remains true to his Ferengi roots. I did love his little PowerPoint presentation where he's trying to talk the, be going on through the forensic accounting wherein he has discovered what a, what a patock to go. Really is now if you go to the file marked devaluation of capital income, we can review the way it's a great team. Yeah, takes them on a long walk.

The scene you referred to earlier with a Bash and O'Brien is a like, replamat scene. And O'Brien is a little bit just trying to get Bashir to like, comment on what he's looking at, you know? Like he's got the, he's got the iPad with the, with the design for the Arboretum that he's gonna build for Keiko. He's, he's looking at Bashir kind of like holding it out so that it's like impossible for Bashir not to say something about it, but Bashir winds up having actual relationship wisdom here. I understand why you want to continue the Positive character building with Bashir by giving a machine like this

But I've got a rewrite for this episode and that is switching the scenes between Bashir and Cisco and what happens in them because I think it makes far more sense for this advice to be coming from Cisco and far more sense for Bashir to have had some sort of unused lab on the station that he wasn't really doing medical science in, to offer to O'Brien as a place for her to do that work. Contextually, this makes no sense that Bashir has this kind of advice. Like, his entire character up until now has been one of, of not grasping even the basic idea of how to treat a woman or be in a relationship.

So, I mean, it's good advice ultimately, and it actually is the thing that triggers action for O'Brien, but I really wish that they put these words in someone else's mouth. Yeah, because it's like the core of the problem is that Keko is a capable and vicious woman, and there's like no obvious place for her to focus her energy anymore. And you know, an arboretum is not going to scratch the itch is basically what Bishir is saying. It's going to turn her career into a diversion, not the thing that she's actually like achieving things with.

But she says, you can't be happy turning your career into a hobby. It made me think a lot about how we have turned our hobby into a career. And how ultimately satisfying that is, compared to the reverse. I agree. Quark finds out that Degor, that house Degor has systematically ruined the finances of House, Kozak. Quark is really, it's really Degor's worst nightmare. Like, if Degor is a petalk that uses money to achieve his goals, like Quark is a fucking beast in that department. He is a certified petac with a lot of financial savvy.

DeGorz know dummy, though, because he's got Rom and his back pocket because he's sort of predicted Quark's financial abilities here. And it's like, I've got a peri to this financial thrust, and producing ROM here is really effective. Hello brother. And ROM is there to like discredit Quark's story, which originally do Goren needed this story to be that it was an honorable death,

but now he's gonna try and undercut it, and ROM is the only other witness to to the death to throw some doubt on on Quark's narrative. Right. And it turns into a we're gonna have to bat lift it out. Yeah, it's bat lifted down, right? Yeah. And Quark has a pretty savvy strategy here, which is toss the bat left and say, go ahead, kill me. You'd be a real asshole to do it because I'm unarmed. And I know that even if I was armed, it would be a totally lopsided fight. Like, what are you proving by chopping my head off

with a batleth? I really love how this unconventional strategy by him seems true to what we know that he knows. Yeah. He's not an expert in Klingon politics, but everything that he's picked up on in this episode leads to this point in a way that makes sense. Right, every time he acted with some confidence

in thinking he knew how a Klingon was gonna react to something, it's been wrong until this moment. But you've actually seen him learn the hard way each time. This actually makes sense that he would try this gambit here. Yeah, and it works. DeGlor is getting ready to swing on him and Gauron knocks him over. He's like, what the fuck is wrong with you, you dope? You have no honor.

Give me a fucking break. And they do the discomendation thing. Yeah. They do the cross the arms and turn the backs on him. It's a real like Wakandan salute situation. Am I doing this loop wrong? No, man. I think it's the fact you do it.

Yeah, they invented the Wakandan salute on cronos of all places. Ha, ha, ha. That means black Panther is canonical trick. I love that about black panther. Well, having dispensed his ruling, that only leaves the quark and grilka marriage to be dealt with. And you're only ever a slap and spit away from a divorce.

If you're in a cling on marriage, Ben, if that were the case here, we would have been divorced thousands of times. You and I wouldn't be in business anymore because that's how you dissolve a business also. Sure is. One, two, three, four, one. Have a time. Yeah, the button on the episode is that the bar is back to not being in great shape, but is holding on with it by its fingernails. And O'Brien and Kiko are up on the second level having a quiet drink together and O'Brien's

like, hey, listen, I might have a solution to this career issue that you're dealing with. I found out about this expedition that's going to some remote part of Bejor for six months to, and they need a botnist, like they need somebody with your skill set. Weirdly also has figured out a way for Molly to go with her, like, is like, I'm not going to take any responsibility for our child. You take her on this challenging trip into rugged terrain that has never been charted before. Like, can't the kid on the station, O'Brien, you dope.

Three-year-olds love camping, and parents love camping with them. Give me a fucking break. This is not a good idea, Chief. Not a great idea. Like, I understand that she would feel terrible not being with her three-year-old child for six months, but Like it's also established that it's while it is a remote part of Bay-Jour

It's only a three-hour trip by runabout and O'Brien can get one whenever he wants So put the kid in the runabout every weekend and head to Bay-Jour Did you get the sense that at the end of this scene that she would apply? It felt a little bit ambiguous the sense that at the end of this scene that she would apply, it felt a little bit ambiguous. Yeah, I don't think that they committed to it, but- What isn't ambiguous is like he has empowered her and motivated her towards chasing her career aspirations and that's good. That's good enough.

That's a satisfying resolution to their story in this episode. Because she feels changed to this agreement that they made, that they were going to move here and do this for a while. It's fucking sad when she says that over and over again. Like, she's clearly upset by this decision. She feels like obligated and pot committed at this point. Like her Rosalind Chow's performance in the scene is really great. And it's kind of heartbreaking. It is. Downstairs it's kind of heartbreaking. It is.

Downstairs in Quark's bar, we have a moment between a ramen quark that feel almost the same way, like they've become closer as a result of this adventure. Yeah, yeah, ramen is really looking Quark's asshole on this scene. Kind of touching, he just wants to hear the bedtime story about Quark killing a cling on. I love that that's what Ram wants. Tell me that like semi fictional version of the thing that we all just lived through again. Rama's totally the the Lenny to this George to Quark's George in the situation, right? Rama's Rama's petting the latinum.

Yeah. Did you like this episode? I did. I thought it was a really good episode. It was fun to see them kind of build on a lot of like established canon, the way like Klingon politics works and have discomendation works and stuff. All of that was really fun to see. I like that Kako is not, like, she's not a main cast character, but they're also not gonna just leave her in a kind of like established role and never think about what she would want as a person ever again.

The fact that the writers are thinking about what does this mean for somebody like Kiko and then telling an interesting story about that is a real step forward. How about you? I really like the episode two, and if you were to just tell me what the ingredients were without a plot, I wouldn't say that I would be super thrilled

about it. Like, in assembling these ingredients and creating this story, I think what you have here is really great. I really like Grilka a lot. Like Grilka is a character, like I think one of my favorite characters that we've run into on Deep Space Nine. It's a great episode for Arm and Shimmerman too.

The actor who plays Grilka is Mary K. Adams. And I went looking at her career a little bit. And what I came across with some interesting trivia, actually having to do with Mary Chifo, who plays LaRAreal on Star Trick Discovery. Oh yeah. And Mary Chifo said that Grilka was her favorite Klingon character.

Wow. Uh, I really loved in Deep Space 9 Grilka. I loved her story with Quark and how she ended up having to work the system and become the leader of her own house, which was in a patriarchal species, so unique and thrilling, because she plays the rel as a full cling on. She used Grilka as kind of a jumping off point in how to play that character.

And I think in thinking about L'Areal, like you can see some Grilka in her. Definitely. In that performance. And I think that's really cool. Good find. Yeah, Definitely. In that performance. And I think that's really cool. Good find. Yeah, not all research is bad. You know it's never bad, Ben.

What? It's the ceremonial reading of priority one messages. That's where you slap me and then spit at my face. And then we read a message and then I slap you, spit in your face. And then we read the second one. We usually cut the slapping and spitting part out just because it's kind of gross on microphone. Right.

Priority one message from Starfleet coming in on Secured Channel. Need a supplement on that. supplement on that? supplement. supplement. Yeah, it's extra. How do you trust alone? Could be enough to buy this ship.

Ben, our first priority one message is of a personal nature. It is from Oneth. It is for Jen. Message goes like this. My dearest Jen, thank you for an amazing first year of marriage. I'm so lucky to have found the perfect kitty mama. Dragon companion. Dance partner, theater buddy, and best friend. Coming home to you every day is a gift. Here's to the decades to come and to our continuing adventures as a family. Love always Oneth. Is oneth a cat? I?

Don't believe cats have opposable thumbs and those are a requirement for Completing a priority one message form. Fair enough. Uh, wow. What a that's uh, what a lovely message. Yeah, that's real nice. First year's a big year. I mean, at any moment now, they're gonna be confiding weaknesses in each other. Oh yeah, vulnerability is just around the corner for you too. I can just tell. That's a big part in any marriage.

Yeah. I know you'll do great. Adam, our second priority one message is from Dennis from Minneapolis and it's for Ben and Adam. It goes like this. I'm six months behind on the pod and too lazy to look online so apologies to my fellow viewers if this has already been covered. If you could have any TNG or DS9 loaf, what would they be and why?

Important note, you don't become the alien in question. You just like get their loaf, man. Thanks for a life-changing show. Here to our absolute best. Ah, thanks, did it. Wow. Man, that's a great question. What loaf?

I love it when people ask us questions. Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha. Loaf, huh? Yeah. Loaf, huh? Yeah. Loaf without the alien. Huh. You know what, so much loaf out there seems difficult to clean. Yeah.

And a lot of it, I feel like you're going to want to go in there with a Q-tip. Lots of nooks and crannies in some of that loaf. So I'm inclined to choose less loaf versus more. Are you a more loaf person? Does data count as loaf? Because I think I would be data. I would look like data if I was gonna look like a character. I don't think that counts.

Yeah, it's gotta be, it's gotta have like dimension to it, right? It can't just be face paint. The easiest one would be be jordan, right? Just get a little nose, nose ridge, you know, a little bendy straw on the nose. Yeah, I mean, that's, that's the most comfortable to sleep in, I think. You probably get a lot of high fives if you had a Vulcan loaf. I think my choice is going to be the alien from the most toys with that rhythmic gymnastics ribbon stuck in his face.

It goes like all throughout. Cause that seems like something that's removable, right? Like that's almost a removable piercing of loaf. Yeah, that's a that's like jewelry in his loaf. And I got to say, like, I don't know whether this is like a good way to answer the question, but I think a lot about how I would sleep with that kind of loaf. I think if you become the alien, sleep would come easy to you because you're used to it,

but if I'm just a human wearing loaf, I think that sounds like a nightmare. And so I'd want at least semi-removable loaf in that case. And so that's why I'm picking rhythmic gymnastics loaf. Yeah, like I think we all know that Cardassian would be the worst loaf. Yeah, yeah.

Because I, we saw people walking around as cardacians at Star Trek Las Vegas that just looked very uncomfortable If you're doing cardacian play, I think you should win the contest. That seems like the hardest kind. Yeah Yeah, a lot of adhesive a lot of intricate little bits that have to go and you know under your nose would above your upper lip and stuff a lot of intricate little bits that have to go and, you know, under your nose, but above your upper lip and stuff. Rough, rough stuff. What if they're giving out dirty sheets at Star Trek conventions when you're checking with that hotel?

We'll never know. Yeah. Well, if you have a priority one message, and especially if you have a question for Ben or I that we could answer on the show, you can take it on over to MaximumFund.org slash Joe Botron or personal messages and questions or $100 and commercial messages for your great idea or business or $200 they are a great way to spread the word far and wide about what your interest are and help support the greatest generation. Hey Adam!

What's that been? Did you find yourself a drunk Shimoda? Drunk Shimoda! Yeah my Shimoda is a scene Shimoda bin and it's the one that you referred to earlier. The scene where Quark has Gauron and everyone else in the chambers clicking through their TIA-82s following along like with the accounting report that he's presenting. There is physical comedy happening there that is... All it is is a calculator and a Klingon's hand. And that is hilarious.

I love that scene. That's an earned laugh. They've earned that over years and years of television. That's all you need to see to get a kick out of it. I love that scene and that was like the most absurd moment in the episode. That felt like that's like Shimoda on the floor. Yeah. I mean, that was great.

I mean, Gauron in that scene was when Shimoda just like for flipping the flipping that you know, he literally like throws it away at some point. He's like, I don't fucking care. I don't care about any of this crap. I loved that. Great charmodas. Yeah. I think that counts as a daily double ray.

Yeah, I think so. Yeah. They're in the same scene. Yeah. Got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got that, got A Greatest Gen Live Show is something you don't want to miss. Why? Well, it's a great opportunity to see me and Ben in person, but that's not all. FODs from all over gather at these shows to cosplay, to do pre- and post-show hangs, to make friends, and share their embarrassment.

Hey, let's make a pretty great name for a tour. Let's do it. The Share Your Embarrassment Tour is coming in August 2023, and we've got a bunch of dates in a lot of great places. Go to greatestgentour.com to get more info. That's greatestgentour.com for dates and ticketing information for the Share Your Embarrassment Tour. I'm Jordan Morris and I'm Jesse Thorne.

On Jordan Jesse Go, we make pure, delightful nonsense. We were open awesome guests and bring them down to our level. We get stupid with Judy Greer. My friend Molly and I call it having the spaceweirds. Pat Noswald. Can I get a ball-rock burger and some air-gorn fries? Thank you. And Kumail Nanjiani.

I've come back with cat toothbrushes, which is impossible to use. Come get stupider with us at MaximumFun.org. Look, your podcast apps are already open. Just pull it out. Give Jordan Jesse Goatry. Being smart is hard. Be dumb instead. Oh, Russ, hey, hey, hey, I'm about to count you in line.

These clouds are really freaking me out. I hate having to stand in line and boy, what do I? These giraffes do not smell good. No, they do not, and they've such short necks. But I'm hearing we need to get on this off. We've got to get on the art. It is about terrain, about a spout to destroy humanity. Hey, oh, sorry, sorry, sorry.

Are you Noah? Yeah, I know we look like humans. We're actually, we're podcasters. We are podcasters, so it's different. Have you heard of Ono Ross and Carrie? We investigate spirituality, claims of the paranormal, stuff like that. And you have a boat and say the world's gonna end,

so same like something for us to check out. We would love to be on the boats. We came to by two. What do you think? Ono Ross and Carrie, available on maximumfun.org GUNNIK GUNNIK GUNNIK GUNNIK

GUNNIK GUNNIK GUNNIK GUNNIK GUNNIK What do we have coming up in the next episode? The next episode is season three episode four equilibrium, while experimenting with a keyboard, the musically untrained DAX inexplicably plays a melody

she seems to remember from somewhere. That seems like a joke. That's the actual description they have on Netflix. Of course, Amazon went with a deadly secret from DAX's past, could mean the end of Jadzius' life. Oh, that sounds like a better episode. Yeah, stakes officially raised. So a big Dax episode coming up next week,

in which either, we spent a lot of time finding out how she learned to play keyboard or something threatens her life. Very exciting. Well, speaking of excitement, we're on square 94 of the game of buttholes. You're required to learn as you play, role. We're in some danger here, I would say, because four squares away, we've got a butthole that goes down to an eighth degree. We sure do. And six squares away we've got a more than hammered episode. Of course more than hammered is the power-hour episode which the Perfectly put Ben.

Why don't you roll that bone? Oh, shit, dog. We have landed square on square 100. Really? Really? Really? Well, for all those who have been lamenting the amount of Quark's bar episodes in this run of...

Have you heard of DS9? Much of that? I feel like we have lamented it. I mean, this is why I shouldn't lurk on our Facebook or our Reddit pages. Well, doing a more enamored episode is a great way. We're gonna recycle, we're gonna go back to one after that, right? And we'll have some new squares on the board

and maybe a few fewer quirk spars. I like that. I was just gonna ask what we were we were doing after this so that That sounds satisfying to me Right on it would be weird if we got separate roundabouts And we each had to roll and like one of us is doing a quirk spar and one of us is doing a naked now Jesus, I don't want to do that. Oh, that's a terrible idea. I don't why did you even say it out loud? One of us is doing a looking at each other during

and one of them's doing a naked now? We must take great care in making sure that never happens. Yeah, mutually assert destruction. Well, that will be the next episode of the greatest generation deep Space Nine in the meantime. We need your support to make this show. This show takes a lot of work to do every week and you can support it in many ways. You can go to maximumfund.org slash

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We love that shit. Here's the hashtag greatestgen on Twitter, where Adam is at Cut for Time and I'm at Benjamin R. Maybe not for long though. We also have Facebook group or so I'm told and I read it's up. Yeah those those places will live on even if we're not there. Yeah great communities. Go meet a special person. We had a proposal happen at one of our live shows that I believe were two people who met in that fan community. So yeah, that was really cool. Yeah, awesome. Yeah. We got to do a priority one message proposal and what a treat. We got to thank Adam Ragusia who makes all the custom music for the show, of course, Dark Materia, who made the original theme song, and our Card Daddy Bill Tilly, who makes trading

cards of every episode, and he puts them up on Twitter and Facebook. Yeah, I guess the best. So, one of the main reasons to stay on So Shmeed. Yeah, no kidding, if I left Twitter, I'd never see the card daddy. Yeah. Can't do that. So, private Twitter, just me and card daddy. Yeah, you could just unfollow everybody but Bill Tilly. I'd support that. Yeah, I'll think about that.

Well, with that, we'll be back at you next time with another great episode of Star Trek Deep Space 9, and an episode of the greatest generation Deep Space 9 which drunkenly plays Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound. Make it sound.

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