The Host Unknown Podcast - Episode 199 - The Holiday Is Over Episode

Episode Date: August 27, 2024

This week in InfoSec  (06:43)With content liberated from the “today in infosec” twitter account and further afield18th August 2004: Text messages sent to promote the video game "Resident Evil: Outbreak" stated "Outbreak: I'm infecting you with t-virus". This scared recipients, who were only about 7% less technologically savvy than mobile phone users today.https://x.com/todayininfosec/status/1825257955878641888    20th August 2003: Philippe Oechslin shared his technique he called "rainbow tables" during a talk at the 23rd annual crypto conference, Crypto 2003.It became a popular approach for cracking password hashes. Today it's less widely used due to adoption of practices that reduce its efficacy.https://x.com/todayininfosec/status/1825865870716870802 Rant of the Week  (10:59)This uni thought it would be a good idea to do a phishing test with a fake Ebola scareUniversity of California Santa Cruz (UCSC) students may be relieved to hear that an emailed warning about a staff member infected with the Ebola virus was just a phishing exercise.The message, titled "Emergency Notification: Ebola Virus Case on Campus," went out to the university community on Sunday, August 18. It began, "We regret to inform you that a member of our staff, who recently returned from South Africa, has tested positive for the Ebola virus."The message went on to say that the university has initiated a contact tracing protocol and asks message recipients to "Please Log In to the Access Information Page for more details" – the very activity phishing messages attempt to encourage in order to capture login credentials.The simulated attack was similar to an actual phishing message sent on August 1, 2024, as shown on the UCSC Phish Bowl, a collection of real and test phishing attempts.But the one sent on Sunday was intended to raise awareness of phishing rather than to actually steal information.In that, it succeeded. The message prompted the UCSC Student Health Center to publish a notice about a "Phishing email with misleading health information."On Monday, Brian Hall, chief information security officer for UCSC, sent out an apology to the university community. Billy Big Balls of the Week (18:20)Russia tells citizens to switch off home surveillance because the Ukrainians are comingRussia's Ministry of Internal Affairs is warning residents of under-siege regions to switch off home surveillance systems and dating apps to stop Ukraine from using them for intel-gathering purposes.Residents of the Bryansk, Kursk, and Belgorod regions were issued with the warnings amid what seems like Russia being thoroughly rattled by Ukraine's incursion into the country's southwest."The enemy is massively identifying IP ranges in our territories and connecting to unprotected video surveillance cameras remotely, viewing everything from private yards to roads and highways of strategic importance," said the ministry, according to Russian newswire Interfax. "In this regard, if there is no urgent need, it is better not to use video surveillance cameras."It is highly discouraged to use online dating services. The enemy actively uses such resources for the covert collection of information."These warnings were just two of many included in a public memo aimed at protecting the identities of high-value Russian individuals, including military personnel, law enforcement agents, and nuclear energy workers. Industry News (24:51)Iran Behind Trump Campaign Hack, US Government ConfirmsNew DNS-Based Backdoor Threat Discovered at Taiwanese UniversityMost Ransomware Attacks Now Happen at NightCISA to Get New Headquarters as $524M Contract AwardedAustralia Calls Off Clearview AI Investigation Despite Lack of ComplianceBackdoor in Mifare Smart Cards Could Open Doors Around the WorldSecurity Flaws in UK Political Party Donation Platforms ExposedCompany Fined $1m for Fake Joe Biden AI CallsFAA Admits Gaps in Aircraft Cybersecurity Rules: New Regulation Proposed Tweet of the Week (32:19)https://x.com/anon_opin/status/1826015107857416458?s=46&t=1-Sjo1Vy8SG7OdizJ3wVbg Come on! Like and bloody well subscribe!

I'll sell you his soon-to-be old role. Yeah. So what's happened? It's been a while. We're back. You've been hacked by North Korea. We're back. In the same time, Jav, you got hacked by North Korea.

Tom, you're now insulin dependent. Yeah. I hit, like, four countries in five days. Did you? Well, technically, Tim was... Tim. Technically, Tom was always insulin dependent now he's just dependent on it from external sources technically you're all insulin dependent yeah

you're listening to the host unknown podcast The Host Unknown Podcast. Hello, hello, hello. Good morning, good afternoon, good evening from wherever you are joining us. And welcome, welcome one and all to episode, I haven't looked it up. Ooh, 193 of the Host Unknown Podcast. Wow, we are so close. We are so close. Are we going to do anything special next week? So close. What, for the 204th episode? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Are we going to do anything special for it? We'll see. Or maybe we stretch out to the 250th and do something special next year. I think we said that at every 50 episodes, right? Yeah, we do. It's like, oh, is it next week already oh god uh dear anyway gents how are we it's been such a long time hasn't it i don't even think we announced that we were gonna go offline yeah it's been so quiet my friday mornings are so much better Jav how have you been I've been great I I spent

like nearly a month uh traveling around mainly the east coast of the US and you lost weight as well somehow I lost yeah well that's because I took the whole whole fat all the kids with me and like um I I just saw the bills mounting up i mean the first the first week is fine and then you when you're like oh i've got three more weeks of this and like you know you know just eating junk food is like a hundred dollars a pop yeah well i know because you sent me all the email receipts didn't you for your you know you always put my email address in when you, yeah. But, but yeah, are you sure it's not when you were in Florida, didn't a gator didn't sort of take a leg.

Is that how you lost your, all your weight? Yeah. No, it's not been that much. It's actually turned the tide for me. So I'm really happy. It was just hot.

So, you know, you walk around in the heat, you sweat it out and, you know, you just see as, as you see how ungrateful your kids are for everything you're doing for them. And it was fine. It was fine.

Sounds like you had a great time. I did. No, actually, it was great. I went to Washington for the first time. I didn't see it before. And it was really hot that day, so for the first time I didn't see it before and it was really hot that day so we parked up we had a car we parked and we started walking around like we saw the White House and everything and honestly if you've if you've been there anyone listening and you see

the Secret Service dudes outside the White House they look like they're off the set of an action movie they're all like tanked they got like you know their guns and they got their wraparound shades and honestly if i ever need anyone protecting me i want one of those guys protecting me because i don't care whether they can fight or not they look the part i know i think trump's got different opinions on whether or not they're effective at protecting people it's all right it's all about that that that warm feeling that you get from the inside but it's also a bit in Trump's case that was his wee coming out a little bit

the bullet grazed the colostomy bag and talking of wet urine running down your leg andy how are you i'm good i've been away as well i sort of spent some time in uh well various places but mostly sri lanka um yeah and it was hot there it was uh very hot in fact everywhere's hot that i've been recently stepped out of abu dhabi airport one day at uh sort of 10 30 at night it was like 46 degrees that's a bit like uh last week tuesday in in uh in london uh yeah well i i wouldn't know like the air con in the office where i work is extremely powerful uh and obviously i'm someone that arrives at dawn and doesn't leave till dusk so I wouldn't know what the heat was like out there.

Leaving your coat on the back of your chair does not indicate that you're there at dawn till dusk. Stop giving away the tools of the trade, Tom. You know this is the old mouse jiggler. It's great when the clocks change and the days get shorter. I'm working dawn till dusk What is that, 10 o'clock to 3.30? Yeah, that's right

I just thought they were strippers But, talking of strippers, Tom, how are you doing? I'm alright I'm alright Health problems abound Which which happens at my age. I think I might have broken my ribs. It does. And I'm now on insulin once a day.

So, you know, it's great. We're fine. Everything's fine. And that all happened because you sneezed, right? Yeah. You put your back out, broke a rib. That's right. I sneezed, looked to my left, pulled my neck, fell over, getting out of bed putting my trousers on but uh yeah it's been a been a nice summer uh easing into the new job very nicely

and um yeah it's been uh it's been good it's been good so talking of easing into things as we ease out of summer shall we see what we've got coming up for you today uh this week in infosec is pride themed rant of the week is a sweet tale of a flesh-eating virus bully big balls is a story of how the turns have tabled. I think we got that right. Industry News is the latest and greatest news stories from around the world and Tweet of the Week makes the case for extra

intelligence among us. So, let's move on to our favourite part of the show, shall we? It's the part of the show that we like to call This Week in InfoSec. It is that part of the show where we take a trip down InfoSec memory lane with content liberated from the Today in InfoSec Twitter account and further afield. And today our first story takes us back a mere 20 years,

which just seems like yesterday, when text messages sent to promote the video game Resident Evil Outbreak stated, Outbreak, I'm infecting you with T-Virus. And this actually scared the recipients, who were only about 7% less tech savvy than mobile phone users today. And at the time, there was a quote from someone called Graham Clully.

Graham Clully. Sophos. Graham Clully from Sophos. And he was quoted as saying, this marketing campaign seems particularly ill-conceived as there is so much genuine interest in the mobile virus threat at present.

And interestingly, there's now no real distinction between a mobile threat, a mobile virus threat and a I don't know, a laptop virus. They're all the same now. Yeah. Well, I don't know mobile yeah laptop virus they're all the same now yeah well i don't think uh people have uh you know you don't really get sold as easily antivirus for your mobile phones right it's most true people if you use ios it's a sandbox

operating system and you know lots of lots of reasons why it's better than a laptop. And people who use Android don't care about security, right? Exactly that, yeah. But at last, every time. Our second story takes us back a mere 21 years ago to the 20th of August 2003, and this is a proper Today in InfoSec, when Philippe Oshlin shared his technique called Rainbow Tables during a talk at the 23rd Annual Crypto Conference,

Crypto 2003. And this basically became a popular approach for cracking password hashes. Unfortunately, today it's less widely used due to the adoption of practices that reduce its efficacy, like salting and hashing your passwords. But back then this was simply, you know, you would dump, you know, sort of password hashes and just look them up. So you didn't even have to, you know, you literally had a reference of passwords. You basically had a book that told you what those hashes equaled, and you could guess the password from that. And this was a massive attack back in, I don't know, 21 years ago.

But I do remember, you know, we'd take our removable drives into the office and sort of swap rainbow tables with each other and like, you know, how big's your rainbow table? Oh, it's six gig. Oh, let me copy it. You know, knowing full well you've got so many duplicates, but there was a bit extra. It's very short-lived in the context of things. It was. I can't wrap my head around how this paper was published in or presented in 2003.

In my mind, rainbow tables are as old as cryptography. Like, you know, something from the 70s. Some IBM researcher came up with it in the 72s or something. As old as Rock 13. Yeah. I don't know where time is. Time is weird. I'm sure, like, you know, as they say, when they turned on the Hadron Collider and then COVID happened and all this other stuff.

We're just in this weird branch, alternate branch of reality right now. Well, you know what they say. Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana. He's back, ladies and gentlemen. This week in InfoSec. We're not lazy when it comes to researching stories. Nope.

We're just energy efficient. Like and subscribe to the Host Unknown podcast for more ESG adjacent tips. Right, let's get ranty. Listen up! Rant of the week. It sounds a mother f***ing rage. So we all like a good fishing test, don't we? We all think, you know, to one degree or another,

we think they're generally a good idea. There's plots and lots of caveats, but, you know, you can't... How do you train someone against something unless you sort of put them in a fairly realistic scenario? It's why we do war games. It's why we do tabletop exercises for disaster recovery. It's why we actually do pretend disaster, actual disaster recovery and pull cables out and stuff like that. You have to practice the thing that you want to defend against. So, you know, fishing exercises are great.

want to defend against. So, you know, fishing exercises are great. However, the University of California, Santa Cruz, were actually sent quite an alarming fishing email, to be honest with you. The message was titled, Emergency Notification Ebola Virus Case on on campus went out to the whole community on sunday august the 18th began we regret to inform you that a member of our staff who recently returned from south africa has has tested positive for the ebola virus now this is this is quite an interesting one. It's because that's serious. That's serious as hell, much like an attacker might use. The message went on to say the university has initiated a contact tracing protocol and asks the recipients to please log into the access information page for more details. The very activity that phishing messages attempt to encourage in order to capture login credentials. So it was actually, and before anybody jumps in and goes, oh my god,

that's awful. That's as bad as sending somebody a phishing email about a bonus when you're not going to be paying out bonuses and stuff like that. Funnily enough, the simulated attack was similar to an actual phishing message sent on August 1st, just a couple of weeks earlier. And a collection, but the one that was sent on Sunday was obviously just to trick people into clicking on it and to test their their abilities here so we've got a few problems here I think on the whole is that you know and and it's lucky we've got an expert on fishing here in in the podcast right now given you know given the you know I don't like to brag but thank you well i know i was going to say yeah exactly um but you know fishing exercises like this are only effective

if you're communicating clearly with your audience what you're doing and why you're doing it even indicating that uh there will be fishing simulations carried out. Scaring a bunch of, well, quite frankly, either impressionable or seriously hungover students that there is an Ebola outbreak on the campus seems to be a little bit excessive here. So I'm not sure. I know that there are plenty of people out there who would be ranting very clearly against this. As you know, I have many splinters in my bum from sitting on the fence as one of my clear medical conditions. So I'm not sure about this. I'm not sure if this is actually a good thing or not.

So is the rant that they chose ebola instead of mpox this is true yes because that would have been far more topical and far more likely far more likely nowadays right indeed exactly yeah yeah that's my rant definitely that's what the rant is yeah that's the that's my rant they might as well have said you know oh no there is there's a virus that's going to infect your

Windows 95 machines you know that yeah yeah or like shingles is back well whoops

yes it is yeah shingles never went away yeah so where do you stand on this jeff i'm interested i i'm uninterested by the looks of it it's like yeah it's like what's the rant um you know people can get offended by any fishing topic any simulated fish if it's not done properly if you're if you do a fishing exercise and the person that receives it is left feeling caught

out or feel like they've been made to feel stupid or they've been penalized that is a bad fishing campaign but if people walk away thinking okay this was a good learning experience this is something that does happen in the world and here's how we can do better then then mission accomplished so a lot of it is the the actual simulated phish is only one part of the security team's responsibility or the awareness team everything else is around relationship building with your with your colleagues in the in the in the organization how you make them feel whether you're informant up front and and not and and i think that too many organizations now and they just do it because some regulation someone says somewhere says oh you need to fish your users or is part of a training campaign and they'll just

go and do the most basic thing they don't inform people uh sometimes they like to feel clever and send out stuff that's notoriously difficult and uh you know with the objective of catching people out as opposed to educating them or trying to make things better so i think in this case they did miss the mark uh they had the the student health center had to publish a notice about a phishing email with misleading health. And the CISO of UCSC also sent out an apology to the whole community. So maybe, maybe if Brian Hall, Chief Information Security Officer of the University of California, Santa Cruz, had invested in KnowBe4,

he may well have been in a better position. Just saying. I'm not even going down there. This segment was sponsored by KnowBe4. By Cofence. Rant of the week. In 2021, you voted us the most entertaining cybersecurity content amongst our peers.

In 2022, you crowned us the best cybersecurity podcast in Europe. You are listening to the double award-winning Host Unknown podcast. How do you like them apples? Nicely bobbed, I think. Jav, let's see what you've got for us this week. Billy Big Balls of the Week. Yes. What are the Billy Big Bulls?

So, this week You haven't read it yet, have you? It's shocking I have, yeah I have You read the headline Yes, I have, of course What do you think I did? It's a twist In the usual story where the Russian Ministry of Internal Affairs is warning

residents of under siege regions to please don't share stuff online, turn off your surveillance systems, don't go on dating apps because um there aren't hot ukrainian women in your area looking for you well they are but they're probably not for the intentions that you you think that that they're there for they're probably holding a machine gun or something so uh apparently um residents you know they've been issued these warnings um because ukraine is um identifying ip ranges in in certain areas and they're you then using that to connect to unprotected videos video fees like your your ip you know i assume they also have a lot of cheap chinese tech that they import for like you know a few rubles, and they

put it in place, and no one changes the default password. If there is a password on it at all, it's easy to just connect into. And so what they're doing is that they can then remotely view stuff from private yards, roads and highways of strategic importance. You know, and so they've said, the Russian said to the citizens in this regard, if there's no urgent need, it's better not to use video surveillance cameras, which kind of like defeats the whole object

of having a surveillance camera. But this is kind of like the digital version of like, you're more likely to be shot by intruder by your own gun if you have one in your house than anything else. So I think it's quite interesting. I think it's also interesting and it goes to show how far the cyber or the digital realm has such a role to play within the, you know, a physical kinetic war, and how it's kind of like the tip of the spear for many nowadays. So, you know, the warnings, they also, you know, they were trying to protect identities of high value individuals in Russia. So military, law enforcement, and even nuclear energy workers. So they're trying to protect

their Homer Simpsons, basically, in the country. And a lot of this stuff. And what's interesting is like, you know, individually, you might think, oh, there's nothing here. But if you ever seen like the footage, like from where they've stitched together multiple CCTV cameras and they see someone running or they're traveling and you see you can flip from one camera to the next to the camera. Even though there might be gaps in between, you can still map out people's routes. You can see where they live. You can see all sorts of stuff. And and that's where it becomes really interesting so i think this is something that you know to be a fly on the wall in a in a russian in a ukrainian like you know surveillance operation that's going about this that has

got russia so spooked i think is is absolutely brilliant uh and i think it's quite a a turning of the tables so the video uh aspect of it is obviously fantastic it's always good to have the visuals but the whole tracking thing remember it was probably like 2011 when um dan cuthbert and greg uh uh glenn um released snoopy which tracked people basically like tracked people it basically said I'm this wifi device and it tracked people connecting to it and they tracked people from getting off a train in

King's Cross going across London based with this Snoopy stuff so this was back in what 2011, 2010 it was like we're talking a long time ago and so to now be able to add that video footage with it yeah I think this cyber war, people are pretty screwed but also And so to now be able to add that video footage with it, yeah, I think, yeah, this cyber war, people are pretty screwed.

But also the Ukrainian cyber security, offensive cyber security capabilities, really strong at the moment for obvious reasons. I mean, they hacked into Russian TV for quite a long period of time recently just to show their side of the story and there's a um yeah they're they're still liaising internationally you know to take out criminal gangs uh operating from ukraine because obviously that's diverting resources from the war so they're they're on point at the moment with their with their uh offensive cyber security capability.

So who's got the big balls? They are indeed. I think the Ukrainians, as always, they have the big balls. They're leading the war. They're leading the efforts. And they're, you know, just by doing just by an NMAP scan, they are scaring Russia into, like, turn off your cameras, turn off your routers, hardwire everything. There's just one guy pinging every single IP address in the Russian space,

in the Kursk region, just to freak people out. That's all. That's all it is. Yeah, so he's the Billy Big Balls or she is the Billy Big Balls definitely

thank you Jav Billy Big Balls of the week you're listening to the double award winning host unknown podcast i love that laugh that's very good right uh it is it is time and uh what time is it andy it is that time of the show where we head over to our news sources over at the

InfoSec PA Newswire who have been very busy bringing us the latest and greatest security news from around the globe. Industry news. Iran behind Trump campaign hack US government confirms. Industry news. New DNS based backdoor threat discovered at Taiwanese university. Industry news. Most ransomware attacks now happen at night. Industry news. CESA to get new headquarters at 524 million contract awarded. Industry news.

Australia calls off Clearview AI investigation despite lack of compliance. Industry news. Backdoor in Mep around the world. Industry news. Security flaws in UK political party donation platforms exposed. Industry news.

Company fined $1 million for fake Joe Biden AI calls. Industry news. FAA admits gap in aircraft cyber security rules. New regulation proposed. Industry News. And that was this week's Industry News.

Huge of true. I've got to say there's an above average number of back doors this week. There is. Yeah, I'm just trying to think. It's an interesting statement, Jav, that most ransomware attacks now happen at night. This is like security after dark. Yeah.

This is now that they've adopted a follow the moon approach around the world. So it's to catch people because most most SOCs, I guess, or most organizations staff their front load, their security presence during office hours, I'm guessing. Yeah. Yeah. Well, that's what the theory is. see the other theory could be that the attackers are coming from countries which aren't as professional as say india who who are used to working western hours and they're coming from countries which are not as considerate or there are countries which have ongoing load shedding and during the day when the air cons are on they have less electricity and internet access so they they operate at night. All plausible theories.

But also, when it says happens at night, whose night? Does the attack land at night or is it sent at night? So many questions with the quality of this research, right? I think we need to... I know.

I think we need to change our new source i mean we're just asking the questions right yeah uh so i saw this australia's information uh watchdog halts investigations on clearview ai's alleged unlawful use of facial recognition technology to collect the facial images and biometric templates from Australian residents. Someone's been bought off. Well, that's what I'm thinking, right? So the decision was made despite the firm never showing it was compliant

and digital rights activists have called for more scrutiny. I've got it. I've got it. So the Australian Investigation Organisation, whoever it is, called for more scrutiny i've got i've got it i've got it so the australian investigation organization whoever it is they've got a head person right and what happened was they were sat at their desk working and then suddenly a shot went through the window over their shoulder and they hit the ground and then suddenly this woman started firing at her went into the building grabbed him but then her son and this really big fella, real big muscly fella, rocked up and basically stopped her from killing him, you know, to stop the AI investigation. And the reason that they called it off was because this fella like peeled his skin off his arm like a glove and showed he was like an AI robot underneath.

That's my working theory. and showed he was like an AI robot underneath. That's my working theory. Right, so, or an alternative theory is that Clearview AI turned around and said, look, with our facial rec tech, we have now discovered your OnlyFans account. And so if you don't call off this investigation, we go public with your history.

Yeah, well, I mean, it's a bit far-fetched has anyone asked a question i'm just asking yeah yeah i think mine's probably more grounded in reality but you know i'm just there's precedent for yours i i there is precedent uh anything else in here There's this story about A company fined for one million dollar For fake Joe Biden AI calls And we normally look at these And say who can tell

It's easy to tell we're AI And at DEF CON my colleague Perry Carpenter He took part In one of their their vishing um like voice fishing challenges and it was humans versus bots and he was in a team that had they and and they he just used all commercially available products they were like i think none of them were more than 20 a month subscription and the the prompts were very very simple and the bots were like so good they engaged in banter made jokes and they captured flags very very quickly um so there were 22 minutes and the bots captured 17 flags and the human team gathered 12

um the only thing that turning point yeah the human team won by a hair they won by about 50 points only because the judges determined that they'd captured some high value flags first. Right. So basically what he's saying, if you train the bot to go after certain flags first, then you're going to win. But the thing is, not a single person on the calls suspected them of being bots or AI generated.

Wow. That is amazing. Very good. We are amazing. Very good. We are there. We are there. Well, on that slightly depressing note, I think we'll move on, shall we? Industry News. People who prefer other security podcasts are statistically more likely to eject usb devices safely for those who live life dangerously you're in good company with the award-winning

host unknown podcast well so far this uh this episode we're basically starting to get a little bit scared of technology and AI. So why don't you take us home with something that's going to restore our faith in humanity, Andy? We're this week's Tweet of the Week. And we always play that one twice. Tweet of the Week. This week's Tweet of the Week comes from Anon Opin. I'm guessing anonymous opinion.

And they say, near all electronic items have gone through radical improvements since their invention, except microwaves. They're still pretty much identical to when they were invented. Something dodgy going on there. Definitely alien technology. Oh, God. Now you're going to have me thinking about that all day.

Yeah, yeah. I'm trying to think of something that isn't like that, and I'm really struggling. He's not wrong. He's not wrong. Even if you look at the most simple thing like a light bulb, see how many different variations that's gone through. Yeah, yeah, that's right.

That's right. But the microwave still badly heats your food yeah scorching hot on the surface a stone cold on the inside like yeah that's right that's right oh well there's joyous thoughts okay so that was uh this week's this week's right we've come barrelling into the end of the show just in time a little bit of a short one but you know we're just flexing our muscles again as we come back from our summer holidays or rather you two

now you two have come up back from your summer holidays but yes I think I think we did it. We did it. We didn't fall over and show our knickers. We didn't completely screw this up.

I think we're all right. Jav, thank you very much. You're welcome. And Andy, thank you. Stay secure, my friends. Stay secure. You've been listening to the host unknown podcast if you enjoyed what you heard comment and subscribe if you hated it please leave your best insults on our reddit channel worst episode ever r slash smashing security Security. So, I don't remember the show.

I remember the poster, but where I was staying in Cocoa Beach, I stayed there for a week. There's a road called I Dream of Jeannie Lane. Okay. Because there was a show that you probably remember from your teens, Tom. Bewitched. No, it was called I Dream of Jeannie. Oh, is that the one with larry

hagman yes that's the one yeah good old jr yeah yeah right yeah okay no not good old jr that's jim ross i'm talking about jr ewing uh and that was jim ross is a painter right no that's bob r. Good old JR. He does the barbecue sauce. I thought that was Heinz. No, if you've never had JR's barbecue sauce, you've not lived. Okay. It's like, oh, my God, oh, my God,

this must be at least 20 billion on the Scoville scale. You know, something like that. So anyway. this must be at least 20 billion on the Scoville scale. You know, something like that. So anyway. So yeah, I thought you might have enjoyed that bit of trivia because you went through your teens watching that show but I was way too young to remember it. It was in black and white. That's a long way of making an old man joke, so yes.

It was terrible. It was terrible. Welcome back.