The Ryen Russillo Podcast - More Lamar Playoff Struggles, Dan Campbell's Decision-Making, and a Chiefs-49ers Super Bowl With Todd McShay

Episode Date: January 29, 2024

Russillo starts the show with his thoughts on both conference championship games and discusses legacies (0:29). Then, he’s joined by Todd McShay to dive deep into the games, discuss what went wrong for the Ravens and Lions, and do an early Super Bowl preview (17:06). Plus, Life Advice with Ceruti and Kyle! Is it okay to be your friend's sperm donor (57:52)? The Ringer is committed to responsible gaming. Please check out theringer.com/RG to find out more or listen to the end of the episode for additional details. Host: Ryen Russillo Guest: Todd McShay Producers: Steve Ceruti, Kyle Crichton, and Mike Wargon Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

we'll break down the two games with todd mcshay we'll get a little look ahead to the super bowl we're going to talk about the losing teams in a positive way as well and then that big legacy question we know the rules gonna be a tough week for the MVP. And life advice. snow. A bottle of wine, yeah. And a snow day, again, no. But blueberry muffins with the delicious crumb topping, total yes. Get almost, almost anything delivered with Uber Eats. Order now. Alcohol in select markets. Product availability may vary by region. See app for details. Before we get to McShay, I just want to share a few thoughts that I have on the AFC NFC Championship games. You've heard me say it a million times. It's just my favorite NFL weekend. Everything that's on the line, the teams that you forget to lose in these, the teams that play in the Super Bowls that we almost never forget.

And the first game had all sorts of legacy stuff hanging out there, which actually felt somewhat relevant for the first time in a long time. It's kind of rare when you're like, actually, these legacy updates may actually matter. And then we had a great game between Detroit and San Francisco. It was kind of fun to see everybody feel like they were rooting for Detroit. I felt incredibly wrong for good chunks of that game. We'll get to it. San Francisco's down 24-7 at the half.

Detroit has the football. They're up 24-10. It's a fourth and two at San Francisco's 28. They go for it, and you have the Josh Reynolds drop. And that starts the Dan Campbell saga, second guessing throughout last night and into much of this week. So that was the first one that I had a hard time with, but let's look at all the numbers. I can just tell you how I felt in the moment. Cause I'm like, man, you're about to go up three scores at San Francisco, you know, a little

deeper into the third quarter, start playing the possession game in here a little bit. They're the number one seed in the NFC. You get to go up three scores against them, but that's not who the Lions have been. And we know this with analytics, right? You can't date them, you marry them. It's the same as playing black. You're playing every hand.

You can't play the numbers and then play feel and combine the entire thing to get the benefits of the math of it. So I understand that. We've talked about it plenty of times. So let's look at some of those numbers. The last two seasons, Detroit is 70% conversion rate of fourth downs between two and three yards.

Okay. The league average is 52%. They're really good at it and have been for a couple of years. We talked about the games in Campbell's career where why he went up against the Chargers and was like, I'm going for it because the game against the Vikings, he was so upset being like, let's decide it on the field. And this is who he's been the entire time. And it was kind of fun too. Lines of this incredible underdog story. You got people who've never cared about Detroit rooting for him because they'd had that much of a drought and any fan from any of these other depressed areas are like sympathetic towards it. Maybe you just don't like the Niners,

right? But you get the point. There was like a lot of neutral support for the Lions. So more people were invested in Lions games yesterday probably than they ever have been. So I like the going up 17. Then we have to ask about the kicker, Michael Badgley. So he was with the Lions for four games in the regular season after they got rid of the other guy. He was one-on-one between 40 and 49 yards in the regular season. He was 13 of 15 on extra points. He'd hit one 50-yarder all season long, and that was the 54-yarder against the Rams in the playoffs indoors. He is eight of 16 outdoors. So you can't assume that he's just going to make it. But what I don't like is the assumption that going for it is assuming a lot of other things as well. Hey, you can't assume he's going to make the kick. Well,

I probably should be able to assume that Josh Reynolds is going to catch it. And he didn't. And he dropped the pass on fourth and two. So again, I'd rather go up three scores. A lot of what I just shared with you tells you that I'm still wrong, despite the game that I was playing with my head, which I start to do in the second half of games that are close, or not even close, is like, okay, we've got to play the possession game here. Because if you're going up three scores on the road against the number one seed in the NFC,

you're looking at the projected possessions and how many times San Francisco is going to get the football back. They're probably only going to get it back three or four times. They got it back four times. So that would mean in the next four possessions, they're going to have to score 17 points just to tie us. And at that point, San Francisco hadn't been able to do any of that stuff on offense. San Francisco hadn't been able to do any of that stuff on offense. Well, they scored 24 points in the next four possessions. You've got the fumble.

And at that point, you're like, man, if they had fumbled and given up a touchdown on a 24-yard drive, they could still be up and maybe mentally reset. But see, the whole point of this argument is no matter what side you're on, you're just kind of assuming the outcome is better for the decisions that you wanted to make. So the next field goal I had no issue with because it was going to be really deep. That one was going to be, I think, a 57-yarder on the fourth and three from San Francisco's 30. And the one I think there's really no debate, it has nothing to do with analytics, it's just a mistake. Third and goal, you've got to keep your timeouts.

You've got to be able to stop the clock. You've got to get a three and out. You don't want to have to go to the. It's just a mistake. Third and goal, you've got to keep your timeouts. You've got to be able to stop the clock. You've got to get a three and out. You don't want to have to go to the onside's kick. Third and goal, they started to run it. Maybe they got a look they liked. I don't know if that's the right call against San Francisco, although some numbers would tell you it's the right call and you're kind of switching it up. Everybody's expecting a pass. These guys wouldn't run. They have to preserve their timeouts. There's no way they're going to do that. They're going to pass, catch them off guard, get in. Well, they get stuff. They have to burn their time out. And then that changes everything with the clock game that you're playing the rest of

the way. Because now you have to kick an onsides kick, which success rates around 4%. And you're going to do it with Kittle on the other side. And you know that that guy's just going to recover it if he has a chance to make a play on the ball. And so we're left here with like, hey, all the stuff we liked about Campbell doesn't mean he was wrong all the time. We're really results driven. We constantly count stuff. We don't add much to it. And that's why in the moment I'll ask myself with every decision, do I like this one or do I not like this one? I don't think because Campbell has done this all season long, that that means that every time he does, it just means it's right. So I push back on that a little bit. You want to tell me the kicker was part of the issue?

You want to tell me that their numbers in fourth and two and three are really, really good, and they are better than everybody else? I guess in the NFC Championship, I would rather just go up 17 points on San Francisco, knowing they need 17 in four possessions, despite the fact they put up 24 in four possessions and won the game. Shanahan entering the Green Bay game was 0-30 with San Francisco trailing by five points or more entering the fourth quarter. He finally gets that win against Green Bay. This game actually didn't even count because they weren't trailing by five

or more going into the fourth. And yet it's another game where it's like, well, Shanahan actually, look, he's probably due. It's a bit like the Harden playoff. You're like, can't believe it's going on this long. He has to be due. But if you hated Shanahan, you were loving it. Incapable of making adjustments. Now the script is out. But if you look at what they were doing the second half, it looks like they actually got back to script a little bit more

with the Debo stuff. They also got really lucky. The fumble, the Iuke stuff, none of the fourth down decisions working out for Campbell. And Purdy, who people are like, this dude was supposed to be the MVP. Now, granted, Lamar had just had his game previously, and he's going to win the MVP. But you get the point. And I still have moments of me like, is he going to be the guy back there for 10 years? I don't think the Garoppolo comparisons are close.

I think Purdy's a smarter quarterback. And his legs, he did stuff yesterday with his legs. He had three huge runs in the second half that you could argue offensively was what allowed them to clinch the game. So Shanahan gets one. Everyone felt like they were on Detroit's side. I will admit when they were up big, I'm like, are you going to get any of these games? Because I figured, well, look, with Sutton and Vildor, the corner and the numbers and how bad they've been, it's like, yeah, but that's not really where they threw. And for all the defensive line names, I'm like, where are they? Detroit's O-line was the story the first 30 plus minutes of this game. And I know Campbell afterwards said, we're likely, I'm paraphrasing it a bit, so I don't want to get a word for word, but he was incredibly honest

saying how hard it was going to be going into next year. They have drafted as well as any team in the league the last couple of years. Goff, who I've never been a fan of, I have to admit that he's good enough, right? He's good enough to get you in the mix. And I love that last touchdown because he was trying to make sure they moved the ball quick enough to at least get a chance at the end where other quarterbacks are like, cool, free yardage, and I'm going to get a touchdown. My stats are going to look good. It's like, no, the game is still on the line here. So I like that kind of stuff. The development of Gibbs, Laporta, I could just keep naming a million names. But yeah, there's a moment when they're up big and I'm going, what is San Francisco? Because it was

going to be fraud alert for them. We're like're like wait this team that destroys other good teams it's like wait they're frauds they're all frauds too like okay big fraud Fest here in the NFL but that was big time stuff not many teams to be able to come back down that many points in the NFC championship game all right let's get to uh off the theme of thinking you're wrong at points I can't believe I picked against my homes two weeks in a row I don't envision a scenario where that will ever happen again. I'm not going to say I'm never, ever going to pick against him the rest of the career. That would be somewhat bold in 2024, knowing we're probably going to be doing this for a while. But back-to-back weeks, I had Niners bills before the season started the Super Bowl. So maybe that leaked in there a little bit, a little bit of the

bills time. It's their time. and then after the Mahomes win I was like don't pick against him this week don't pick against him a little film breakdown reading stuff going around changed my mind a million times and uh and then I picked Baltimore because I just felt like it's going to be a completely different challenge after the lack of help for Miami and Buffalo's defense uh it's not my least favorite move to this day. Worst pick of my career, I think, or the one I hate the most. And look, I've been doing this a long time, so I got some doozies, but it's walking out of Bryant-Denny Stadium in 2011, November 5th. LSU wins 9-6 against number one LSU, number two Alabama, nine, six overtime win. And I left Stanford Steve and I went to watch LSU fans saying, fuck you, Alabama. And we're walking down the strip

there. And I was like, I will not pick LSU if they have a rematch for the national championship. I will not make sure I don't pick them. And he was like, I agree with you. And I was like, all right. And then I think we talked about whether or not Stanford and Andrew Luck would have more than nine points for about a half an hour and three course lights. So the point was, I was determined to not pick LSU if there was a rematch. Well, I get down to New Orleans for the national championship game. I'm hanging out a little bit because I'm on wipe me down. Right. And I'm just like, LSU has a chance to put together the greatest season ever in the history of college football they can beat this Bama team twice

and I pick LSU and they don't cross midfield pretty much and Fowler's like hey did you pick LSU in the rematch we're out later that night night. I go, yeah. He goes, what was it? What was it, Bri? The voodoo? The voodoo get in your system? Just the voodoo in the air? And I was like, gas tank on E, all drinks on me, Chris. I don't know what to tell you. I think it was the voodoo.

And I was pissed about it. I'm not as pissed about this, but I feel some regret. But let's talk about Baltimore's defense before we get to the other big topic after this game. I love some regret. But let's talk about Baltimore's defense before we get to the other big topic after this game. I love Kyle Hamilton. As an aside, I'm allowed to love him in a loss.

I love him. I love him. I love him. All right. There's nothing else to say. Baltimore's defense. They held Kansas City to five straight punts in the second half. Starting the second half, Kansas City going up against them.

Punt, punt, punt, punt, punt. And then a knee after the conversion. Spare me, that was by design, because they knew they were up and trying to run clock. Nobody tries to run clock the first possession, second possession, likely third possession of the second half. You want possession four or five? All right, maybe.

Maybe I'll give it to you. But that was not by design. That's how great Baltimore's defense was. But because Baltimore's defense was so great, maybe overshadowing a bit the Kansas City's defense is also incredible. Those defensive backs are nasty. They've done a really good job with this. We've talked about how young they are reinventing themselves on the defensive side of the ball. And this is even close to being what the other defenses were of the Mahomes the whole time. So they deserve their flowers as well. But in the first half, it wasn't that I thought Lamar, here we go, we're talking Lamar. I didn't think it was that he was

bad. I just thought it was a lack of opportunity. Kansas City had the first two drives of their game take up almost a quarter of game clock, 1447. You know, you've got the fumble. You've got the great escapes from Lamar. You've got the fourth down run, the catch to himself. But he had only five completions, including the one to himself in the first half. But I wasn't at no point in the first half was like, oh, Lamar is not playing well. I just feel like, dude, they don't have the football, the lack of opportunities. But then in the second half, I thought he was pretty bad. Kansas City's defense held the MVP to three points over eight possessions, not including the end of half possession. Baltimore was 3-11 on third down. Lamar had some tip balls at the line

of scrimmage would happen, but also some tip balls and throws out to the flat that didn't make a lot of sense. Chris Jones had one. Felt like there were two significant misses to the sideline. He missed every deep shot except for the blown coverages on the Zay Flowers touchdown and the Zay Flowers huge gain where then he got penalized for taunting. for taunting. We could talk penalties here, but I don't think penalties necessarily change everything unless you want to talk about the interception in the end zone, which I think was early contact. But at the same time, it's a terrible, terrible throw by Lamar into triple coverage. So the interception was awful. The numbers now for his playoff career are not great. But as I'll remind you again, I don't like saying that because someone hasn't won anything, they're incapable of winning it. I think I've done it with probably like less than five NBA players since I've been on the air where I'll just say, I do not think that person can win. And yet they probably still could if things happen, right? I don't like saying it with quarterbacks because we've seen quarterbacks that are average at best find a way

to be playing in the Super Bowl, if not randomly winning it every now and then. So even if I don't like somebody, it doesn't mean that they're an impossibility. But there was a lot of conversation this week about who Lamar was after Josh Allen lost to Patrick Mahomes. And I really didn't want to get involved. I didn't know that, you know me, I don't really get into it on social media with people despite seeing some of the stuff. I'm like, what the fuck is this conclusion? And I thought about doing an open and I was like, you know what, just gear up for the AFC championship thing here.

Because if you're picking Josh Allen over Lamar right now, you know, in some circles, people ask you where you are on January 6th. But the numbers are just not debatable to this point. You know, Lamar's drop off is significant in these six playoff games. Completion percentage goes from 65 to 57. Yards per attempt drops more than a yard. The QB rating goes from 98 to like 76. Interception percentage goes to two to three. The yards per attempt goes down as well. Lamar's QBR generally sits at the last three of the four years in the 60s. He's got one in the 50s. His MVP season, the QBR was 83, which prior to this season, and I got shit for this basically from

Ravens fans, but I was like, that's the outlier year because MVP year statistically is kind of like fluky compared to who he's been. And then he's going to win the MVP again this year. So, you know, at one point, one of the lessons maybe in this season was Lamar had zero attempts trailing by more than eight points all year long. So did we have to see a version of him yesterday that we actually didn't have to see all season long? And that's where the real truth is told about quarterbacks. That seems to be a fair question, but also pretty conclusive. And I'm just not there yet with it. But when it comes back to the Allen part of it, like Allen has a hundred rating in the playoffs. His interception percentage is one. He has a 21 to

four touchdown interception split with a five and five record Lamar's two and four with a six touchdown, six interception ratio. That's his split in the playoffs. Allen had the four touchdown, 390 total yard game at Kansas City two years ago in the overtime loss. Lamar's never had a game even close to that. Not even close. But I think the bigger lesson in all of this is that Mahomes is going to get us talking about maybe a Burrow, although Burrow got him once. Allen, who he's beaten three of the last four years, and now Lamar's season, which is ended by Mahomes for the first time,

which is probably going to happen again with how good this dude is. We're going to start looking at some of these guys like Ewing, Carl Malone, Stockton, Drexler, and my man Charles Barkley. That might be it. That might be the lesson, at least as of right now, that Mahomes is just ending all of these dudes' seasons

while we keep arguing about who's better after him. Todd McShay, fresh off a conference championship weekend. You're so hot. Come on. I mean, I come in and you get your arms, you're doing the patented puff up the biceps as if you need to even puff up the biceps. What was it, an arm day yesterday before the championship games? No, we did legs.

When it's conference championship day, that's auto legs because that's just one of the trenches. You're still going with this medium shirt and the biceps hanging out. I got it. This shirt's an XL. It did look like I was doing the LeBron Landry there a bit. I don't know why it's so hard for me to get that out. But yeah, this is a UMass t-shirt. I didn't go there.

Was this your safety school? Do they offer you? UMass? Yeah. Now, UMass did. Amherst did, Division III. But my head coach at Richmond, Jim Reed, was a head coach at UMass. So there was a connection. The funniest thing at Richmond, Jim Reed, was a head coach at UMass. So there was a connection.

The funniest thing at Richmond, right? I mean, this is clearly not why people are tuning in today. The funniest thing, though, Jim Reed, our head coach, and our defensive coordinator, Joe Cullen, who went on and been a coach in the NFL for a long time. You can look up some stories about my man, Cullen. time. You can look up some stories about my man, Cullen, but they were at Boston College, UMass, like hard, like malded, med-fed mass, hardcore accents, you know? And so we come down to Richmond the first year and recruiting class is like all mass holes. It's just a, so like,

you're this like lovely Southern girl, sophomore in college, Virginia, it's down South your whole life. And all of a sudden, there's like 18 to 20 mass holes rolling in. You can hear in the practice field, Joe Cullen screaming, do you feel the breeze coming off the James River? It was not normal. But yeah, that's my UMass story. Amherst, I don't know. I don't think you would have been a good fit for Amherst College.

Yeah, too small. Too much trouble. Too hard, too. Too difficult. I mean, Richmond's a good school, but Amherst is weird. It's like too smart. Let's get into it. Where do you want to start? I already went for 15 minutes. I'm sure you did.

Let's start with the first game I guess right I mean the Chiefs I mean I came on the show last week and it was like Baltimore Baltimore Baltimore best team still remaining complete football team how about Andy Reid the thing that jumped out to me like and I feel like we don't talk about the 15-play script anymore, but Andy Reid's 15-play script was genius. And the reason I say that is, and it's not like, you know, it makes sense. It's not like only one person in the world could have thought of it, but you've got Joe Tooney's out, who's a star guard in the league, you know, and very reliable at that position.

He's out with injury. So you come in with Nick Allegretti, who has some starting experience, but he plugs in. So let's, let's like figure out what we've got going on in the offensive line versus this great defensive front seven early in the game. And it was, I mean, you just go down the script. The first 15 plays were drawn out and they got through those in the first two drives because they had two long drives, but 11 plays on the first scoring drive. It's come out quick game, like screen-ish type play to Kelsey. Outlet pass to Pacheco, had him flexed out of the backfield.

Screen right to Rasheed Rice. So it was quick game right, quick game left, quick game right to your three playmakers, right? Kelsey, Pacheco, and Rasheed Rice. And then they run, I think it was five of the next six plays they run the football. And it kind of set the tone for the game. And it showed that they're willing and they trust their run game. And they obviously wanted to get the ball in their playmakers hands, but they wanted to do it in an efficient way that was not going to get Mahomes stuck in the pocket as they were figuring out what they had with with Ali Allegretti

plugging in for Tooney and really then you get the next drive right 16 plays and um and 14 of the 17 points for Kansas City came on those first two drives so it was 11 plays from the 15 play script then the first four plays from the 15 play script, but then an additional 12 plays from that script. So their initial game plan was excellent. The thing that also stood out to me, and I don't know if you noticed this, we talked so much about like what Baltimore does and maybe they don't have an elite star, big name guy on their defensive front four, but they have so many simulated pressures. They played, they did so many different games up front, the versatility but they have so many simulated pressures. They play, they do so many different games up front, the versatility that they have with their personnel. But Baltimore came out and

I thought for the first quarter, quarter and a half, very vanilla, like four man rushes. Here are four guys. They're coming from where they, where their takeoff spot was. Right. And it allowed Kansas city to know who they were blocking, where the blocks were coming from. And early in the game, it just wasn't what we normally see from that Baltimore defensive scheme. It wasn't like exotic and different looking. They were so concerned with the gap discipline

and keeping Mahomes kind of bottled up and not allowing him to get outside and make plays on the run, that they weren't getting to Mahomes and they weren't affecting him. Now, they altered it and you started to see a cat blitz off the edge, Kyle Hamilton coming in and different more exotic things in the second half of the second quarter and beyond. And they shut Kansas City down. They shut them down in the second half. No points scored.

But I thought the lack of aggressiveness early on combined with Andy Reid's initial play script and all the work they put in during the week to figure out what can we do without our starting guard in there and also what's going to work best against Baltimore, what we projected they're going to do, was the difference in the game.

Legitimately, that preparation coupled with, again, the lack of exotic looks and the kind of vanilla four-man rushes that Baltimore is throwing at them, was what decided that football game on that side of the ball. Yeah, Kelsey goes off, but it was early And then there was a bit of a gap. Like I, I talked about it. I don't know how many times Kansas city's ever punted five times in a row. Like, I don't, I don't know that that would ever happen. And as much as I love Pacheco and you're right about the balance, because there were moments where I was like, I wonder if they're going to get away from this a little bit. Cause it almost feels like a handoff is just wasting an opportunity for my home to do something magical, but it's not like they gashed Baltimore at all. I mean, not even close. 32 carries, 89 yards, 2.8

as a team, 2.8 for Pacheco. His longest one was 12. Mahomes had the one for 11, so they contained it. But it was, I guess, enough in the early two scripts. Because when Thune was out, I was like, all right, you know, are you really going to pick them against this front that seems to always find a way and leads the league in sacks? And, you know, every time you're watching a Baltimore game, it's like, all right, these guys are flying around from all over the place. But then maybe the fear is if you get too weird that Mahomes is going to beat you with it because I left this game, you know,

at the half, I'm like, those two drives were incredible yes it was like hey these dudes are amped up about this and they're physical and it was chippy and you know i know baltimore was on the wrong side of the penalty with van noy but he was the third guy in man third guy in and that guy always gets the flag and then the clothesline in my home so that's always going to get called i mean it was out but you didn there. But didn't you feel like throughout the game, it was very obvious, and this doesn't always play out. We talk so much about experience, and this is the more battle-tested team,

but it was so clear to me which team has been through these wars before. Totally. Like the maturity of Kansas City versus the over-aggressiveness. Baltimore wanted to set a physical tone. You even heard, I think it was Romo during the broadcast saying like in our meetings, if Mahomes takes off and run, we're like, we're not going to allow him to just go and dive in without getting a shot on him. It was that mentality that you want to have without the governor that you need to have. It felt like that showed up several times in the game. Yeah, that's really good.

And despite the fumble on the strip, that's no points, because it looked like Kelsey was way over the first down marker on the front angle. And then from the back angle, I was like, wait, was he actually his knee down before the ball had crossed it? You know, I don't know if it was the camera playing tricks on all of us. So there's that, like, you're like, okay, this game might be over. And then Baltimore D finds a way to keep a minute. And then at the halftime score, I'm just like, I think it's Lamar had a

lack of opportunities. Like I wasn't down on Lamar. It's hard to watch the second half and not feel like he had a terrible second half. Is that fair? That's very fair. And like I told you, like this game to me broke down in two parts. The first part was what I was talking about, like kind of a vanilla scheme to start the game for Baltimore, the 15 play script for Andy Reid and the way they started, it kind of set the tone and really was the difference in the game. But then it had to be followed up with great defense. If the offense was not going to continue that after Baltimore made adjustments, the defense had to play one of its best games of the year. And that's exactly what happened. Like Lamar didn't look comfortable the vast majority of the game. And he completed a season low 41% of his passes versus the Blitz. And it's one thing to Blitz a guy.

It's another to Blitz and have the coverage look different enough and have the coverage hold up enough on the back end to make it successful. And Steve Spagnuolo has been doing this forever. He's the team that the Giants upset the Patriots and the pass rush that he always had there and what he's done in Kansas City. But to come up with that game plan to throw Lamar that far off his game and to frustrate him the way that they did, I thought it was remarkable. Safety blitzes, cat blitzes, the corner blitzes, different games up front. They just kept getting Lamar to question his decision-making.

And let's face it, we talked about how great Lamar was in the first game, and I know you and I mentioned it, 100 yards rushing in the first game of the playoffs, right? But if you really look at it, I think he threw for 152 a week ago. And so it's not like he came out and was dissecting, you know, defense in the playoffs and then looked, you know, and carried it on. Two playoff games, he was not nearly the decision maker and the accurate passer that he was. And then part of that obviously is good defense, but part of it quite honestly is not showing up, not being, I don't want to say prepared, but not having the answers to the tests.

And that's part of the offensive coaching staff. That's part Lamar. That's part his weapons. The other thing, too, remember how much I talked about Mark Andrews and Isaiah Likely? If we get Mark Andrews back, like the matchup problems that that can create, I don't have the stats in front of me. I mean, you can pull up your, you know, your past past charts and all your,

your different stats and everything, but likely in Andrews, it felt like they were even less of a factor than even likely had been when he was on his own. Right. I mean, they didn't, they, I can't remember in the game that they, that they showed up.

Like I remember Andrews had one first down. I can't think in my mind of any good critical plays or like consistently getting targets they just were kind of non-factors in the passing game five targets combined and I think there you go Andrew's point on the first one and then there was like likely you're like wait what like unless there's one catch early that I'm missing, but I remember both times hearing their names called. I mean, Odell's name wasn't called until a deep shot that was incomplete and that was in the second half. So it speaks to this Kansas City group of defensive backs who just get after you. Like there's one play that people, I think we're trying to claim that Zay was open behind the

defensive back going left to right. It was an overhead shot. And you're like, he's not open there. He's not even remotely open. The corner knows that that throw. And if the ball comes out, guess what he's doing? He's dropping back like a center fielder and catching it because Zay is standing behind him. Zay's not on a go route behind him separating.

So sometimes we'll see those replays and people screen grab it and freak out about dudes yeah and everyone's i saw on twitter everyone's yelling at romo like why didn't he mention the you know zay was open in the back corner of the end zone the one all right the end zone is different but i'm talking about one was it a different one pressure the one i'm talking about specifically i'm but it might not even be the one that's being debated even though you know whatever i'd seen it out there. Yeah, I thought about the Houston game a little bit because I'd say the best thing the Texans did that whole game,

at least in the first half, was send some pressure at Lamar and were the throwing part of it wasn't great. But I think it leads to this. Because prior to this year, I'm like, the Lamar playoff doubts are totally fair and real, but maybe it's going to take him a little time here. And by the way, his first playoff pass this season was like the first playoff pass he had had in three years.

So there was a gap there of even knowing what he was going to look like when he got back out there. But we know what the rules are. The rules are when you have this kind of game, even if it's up against Mahomes, and really this game was about the defenses more than it was just the quarterbacks dueling. It's like, like okay now do we put him in this group is he temporarily is he permanently permanently I don't like doing almost any of these dudes but is he temporarily

in this group where you're going into the 24 season in week one where people are going to be like I don't care is he going to turn into Joel Embiid where it's, nobody cares what any of the regular season stats are because they think the playoff drop off is a real thing. The numbers tell us it's a real thing, but to predict that out for the rest of his career seems incredibly unfair for a 27 year old guy who seemed to really improve this year. Yeah. I mean, I even read someone this morning. He's like, he's the James Harden of the NFL now. Like, I don't know. I'll tell you what happened i i do my nfl nba qb thing every year and then another guy does it like the same day and he just changes all of the names around so he picked harden after i picked him i knew i could get you going on the end right well he couldn't he couldn't do word for word what i did

but he's done it like two or three years in a row and i find it slightly annoying so yeah when i see that's why you're wearing that t-shirt today i get it like we're sending messages today on the rassila podcast yeah there it is there it is you're doing arms today though all right so go ahead so so answer like you know what i'm saying like i like him and the reason why the mb one is better than harden is because everybody still kind of likes mb although he's losing his popularity vote uh and it took a hit this week after denver but i actually do think he was hurt but the point is this like if it was a guy i couldn't stand i might be although i'd like to say that my record is pretty clean on if i don't like a guy and i think he's good, I give him praise and the other way around. Yeah. But I mean, just listen to Lamar talk, man. You're like, this guy's awesome.

Dudes love this guy. So, I mean, I've got friends in the organization. Some of the stories I hear just about it's like the leading by example when he walks in the room, you know, but there is no question who he is as a dude and as a leader, even though he's not the most vocal guy, he's not doing all the commercials that like my homes and other guys are doing. Like he is the guy there is one, there is one alpha on that team. Uh, but, but unfortunately he's starting to build a resume. That's not ideal in the post season. And so we're in this era of sports media where we have to like, you've got to categorize someone and it's over and he's great in the regular season,

but he's terrible in the post. Like, I get it. We got to get people to tune in and to stay tuned in and all that. But he can be a great player. He can be the MVP of the league. He can have all this phenomenal talent and he didn't play his best game in the biggest game, unfortunately. But can we give some credit to that KC defense that's been outstanding all year long, that has a coordinator that's been outstanding throughout his entire career, that has done this consistently over and over again,

that has a cornerback in Snead that's shutting guys down for the most part. I think he gave up with the one touchdown he's given up all season long, and he's matched up against the number one wide receiver for the vast majority of the year. Can we give some credit to this organization, the Chiefs, and to the defensive side and what they've done and just kind of chalk it up to what's real? Or do we have to just sit here on Monday and talk about how Lamar sucks in the postseason? No, you can talk about LeJarrius Sneed from La Tech all you want. Yeah.

Because, you know, when you watch him play, you're like, where did he play? And you're like, oh, yeah, that's right. Yeah. Louisiana Tech. I love it. I love it. I just, it was, both games, they were very different games,

but both games were, if you love football and love strategy, they were fascinating to me. Andy Reid came out and actually put Kansas City in position and Mahomes executed it and their weapons executed it. Their offensive line continues to be great. No one wants to talk about the Chiefs offensive line. But then Baltimore, and no one's going to talk about this today, Baltimore for two and a half quarters got the answers to the problems that Kansas City was creating and was phenomenal. So to me, and then you got Spaggs dialing up what he was dialing up and creating all sorts of problems. And Baltimore still was kind of fighting and had chances at the end, but then they started to press. That's when Lamar started to press was later in the game.

And you could see the visible frustration on Lamar. And to me, if there's one area that you have to improve upon to be more like Mahomes and more like some of the other guys who have been great. We've talked so many times about how Brady, I can think about like 10 different times in my head where they played like shit for three quarters, but then Brady would never let it affect the next play. And I saw in Lamar a little bit of that, if you want to call it like post-season immaturity

or lack of experience or whatever you want to chalk it up to. I think in the fourth quarter, we saw the frustration and allowing past plays, the previous plays and other mistakes to magnify or to multiply, if you will. That to me is the area of growth that he needs to have in order to become that next step. But we're still talking about the MVP of the league this past year. So, you know, it really is a fine line between all-time great and just great. Yeah. All right. Let's get to the NFC. Campbell's decisions. Go through them. Ones you like, you like it all, you hate it all. Campbell made one terrible decision in this game.

The third down run? Third down run. Minute and five remaining. It's the only terrible decision he this game the third down run third down run minute and five remaining the only terrible decision he made in the game they they purposely for the right reasons avoided using a timeout that entire drive you had one chance let me just so the so that everyone who's tuned in here cannot understand it i think it's 4.9 chance you have of getting an onside kick in the NFL with the new rules now. 4.9. So by running the football, you were saying, if we don't score, we're going to have to burn a timeout. And we've now reduced, I mean, everyone talks about analytics and all, but this is simple.

You've now reduced your chances, whatever your chances were, if you kick a field goal or score a touchdown there and don't burn a timeout, significantly greater than 4.9% having to rely on the onside kick, even though it was a hell of an onside kick, by the way. But 4.9%. As a coach, I can't allow my team to have their chances reduced to 4.9%. There's got to be a better option. And yes, they were going to struggle to get in on third down, but if you throw the ball, it's incomplete, kick a field goal, then you can kick the ball off. You've got three timeouts. You're probably going to get the ball back with 40, 45, 50 seconds left, right?

Somewhere in there. Let's even say 40 seconds. Now we've got a chance, a better chance, in my opinion, than 4.9%. So that was the mistake. The other, kicking the field goals and going for it, that's who they are. And I think it's a mistake if they get away from who they are and you're sending a message. And now granted, it backfired in the worst possible way. And those aggressive play calls didn't lead to Detroit playing aggressively and going on and making great plays because their coach showed confidence in aggressive play calls didn't lead to Detroit playing aggressively and

make going on making great plays because their coach showed confidence in him. It didn't happen. It was one of the all-time third quarter meltdowns. And we can get into that in a minute, but you got to remember Dan Campbell went for 20 of 24 times and in plus territory on for fourth and three or shorter throughout the season. 20 out of 24 times he went for it. Of those 20 times, Ryan, they converted 17. That's who the Lions are. So why the hell are we going to get to the biggest game of the year

and change who we are and not be ourselves? We agree on the third down run. It's an excuse. It's really not debatable. Because you know if you get stuff there, then it's like you're going to be costing yourself an entire play like game clock here, and you're not going to get the ball back.

Yeah, 40 seconds. 40 seconds. So the fourth and two at the 28, even with the issues with Detroit's kicker, just the lack of confidence in the position in general, and that it's outdoors, he's eight for 16 on those kicks outdoors. I feel like the people that don't like going for it,

and it turns into this big analytic circle that can get a little annoying, but the assumptions that the kick goes in, it's like, well, hey, that's a big assumption. And then it's like, okay, but your assumption is that somebody's going to catch the pass, and in that case, Reynolds drops. It wasn't the easiest catch, but it's an NFL catch. You expect him to make, okay, but your assumption is that somebody is going to catch the pass. And in that case, Reynolds drops, you know, it was, it wasn't the easiest catch, but it's an NFL catch. You expect him to make that catch, especially on fourth down. Like, Hey, we need this one, man. Yeah. Whatever it takes, whatever it takes. Exactly. Is there any value to me arguing? Cause I don't, I don't think it's like passionate. Like the third

down run is a passionate argument. The first kick, it's like, okay, but you get a chance to go up 17 here. It's three scores. They're probably only going to get four more possessions. They technically got the fifth with taking the knee. So it really was four more possessions. It's like, they get to score 17 over four. Now, as I point out in the open, they score 24 over four, but you don't know that before you're doing it. Like, that's the thing I start to look at and, and I'll just, I'll just ask myself, like, how many times do you think this team's going to get the ball back here? Do you think it's two times? Do you think it's three times? And again, it doesn't even mean you're going to be right. But I just wonder if I'm wrong

for thinking that to go up 17 points on the one seed, like you might, you might have to do to do it but then again the analytic community would say well you can't just pick and choose when you want to be right be hanging out with this which which we've already covered a million times yeah yeah uh so you you're okay are you like when you were at home you were like go for it or you were like kick it because the second kick i have no issue with the kick was going to be deep as hell they're at the 30 um you know it just kind of adds to it unless you have an issue with it the face you're making right now but i mean that was going to be the 30 so we're talking about a 50 plus yard kick right no i i understand what you're saying and i'm like had they kicked a field goal i wouldn't have been like that's a

terrible decision yeah at all i wouldn't have but i would have said it's out of character it was almost a little out of character they kicked a field goal to go up 17 right before the half, right? Yeah, but see, that's the one where I'm adamant about taking the points because you don't get the payoff of field position after that because it's the end of the half. That's the Lovey Smith. Yes. Okay, what did San Francisco do here?

Did they get back to kind of the idea of who they're supposed to be? Because it felt like from the first play of their first possession in the second half, it's like, hey, let's just get back to Debo being a threat and then it's going to open up everything else. McCaffrey goes off, but it almost felt like they were starting

the game in the second half. Go ahead. They went into halftime and Kyle obviously said what he said, but it was very clear Kyle had like, and that's why halftime is critical. It's an opportunity to take a minute, right? There's not 15 other decisions going on or things that you have to watch

and monitor. People in your head said, like, take a minute. All right, where are we? What the fuck is going on? I've got all these weapons. I've got Christian McCaffrey. I've got Kittle, but I've got Debo. And when our offense wasn't running well last week, it was when Debo was out with the

shoulder. We talked about it and he, I thought it was brilliant. I think it was Greg Olson was talking about it. I thought it was a brilliant self-reflection of during their production meetings with Kyle Shanahan. He said like, it's, like, you're in the middle of the game. When you lose a player and you know it going into the week, into the game, versus losing a player during the game. He said, like, now I'm looking down at my playbook, and it's like all these different plays and options that have – like, then Debo's the only – because of his versatility,

because of the player he is, he's the only one who can run these for us. And so the playbook shrunk significantly the week before you know against green bay so like right so he gets into halftime and looks like all right so it's not going well again but debo was out last week when it wasn't going well debo's here so it was like right away get the ball and it was a screen it was a reverse or whatever the the sequence was even one of the plays was a loss of a few yards. But they clearly came out, and Kyle was like, not only let's pick up the yards that Debo can pick up, let's send a message that we're going to ride or die with Debo in the second half.

And so now, defensively, you've got to adjust. Like, uh-oh, they're getting him involved, and that's going to start to open up other things. And that was kind of the early chess move, if you will, that I thought Kyle made, which was brilliant. He sent a message right away, Debo's our guy, account for him. If you don't, we're going to take it all day. And so it kind of, then it trickled down from there. Honestly, the biggest difference, they got Brock Purdy confident in the second half with some early easy stuff. And then Brock Purdy started playing the way that Brock Purdy has played the vast majority of his NFL career. And I say that

game manager, all that, like, I don't care about how you're going to classify him. What Brock Purdy does when, when this offense is clicking is he's decisive. He knows where the ball is going to go. And when the ball can't go there and he doesn't trust his arm or his ability to make the throw or the read, he's decisive with tucking the ball and running or getting off of that read and going to the next one. But I thought his decisiveness and aggressiveness as a runner changed everything.

Like, yes, the Brandon Ayuk off the helmet catch, and that was the play that turned the game and the confidence, and you saw the defense get a spark and all those things. But really, if you go back and study the second half of the game, what was different? Brock Purdy. 13 of 16 passing in the second half. He was decisive. He made his reads. When it wasn't

there, he understood, I can't take any more chances. We can't throw another pick. We can't make another big mistake. I've got all these weapons. If I can't get it to them, then that means they're covered and they've got six, seven, eight defenders back in coverage. And a lot of times, guys, backs turn to me. I've got to take off and run. I got to make this my game. And a lot of times guys backs turn to me, I've got to take off and run. I got to make this my game. And that's what he did. I, for you, 48 rushing yards that, that to me, his rushing in the second half was the dagger that changed everything. Critical times, third downs, they needed it. Keep the drives going. When he decided, Hey, I'm going to run the football, all 46 of his rushing or 48 of his rushing yards were in the second half.

That opened up it. Now I've got to worry about Debo. Now I've got Purdy running. We've got a lot more to think about than we had to think about in the first half. If we think about the Super Bowl and the matchup here, because when San Francisco is down big, I'm like, where are the guys? Hargrave, Bosa, Young. Obviously, the linebackers, I feel like, for the most part, are always terrific between Greenlaw and Warner. he was a higher pick and all that kind of stuff. But I'm just watching and I'm going, you know,

am I just guilty of the same thing everybody else is doing by just listing all those names and then wondering where they are? I mean, Armstead is another name that gets thrown in there. Big body, kind of athletic. I don't know. I've always been, I think I feel like I'm not studying the tape of it all, but I always felt like he was more of a name than he was just down to down wrecking anything when you're watching him play. And that Detroit O-line is incredible. So as I'm mapping out my thoughts on a Monday for the

podcast, I'm like the Detroit O-line is a story here. 30 plus minutes into this game, you know, 36 minutes into the game. The first note I wrote for Sam Fran as I was just kind of jotting things down, sitting on my couch watching yesterday, right? Where is the front four pass rush again? Where is it? Where are these guys? Yeah. And then all of a sudden, and I think it was Olsen said it on the broadcast. It was a good point made.

And it goes back. We've seen this throughout the history of the NFL. When you get a lead early in games, the pass rush becomes that much more dominant because they know the team has to throw from behind and all that. And even though there was never a significant lead for San Francisco, the second even they scored a touchdown, it was like you could feel Detroit start to press a little bit and start to get a little anxious. And offensively, they weren't in their rhythm and and Sam Fran like the pass rush got better and better and better as the game went on I know we're not previewing the Super Bowl today but I'm telling you like if Sam Fran's gonna win the Super Bowl they've got to get out to an

early lead they've got or at least like be neck and neck with with Kansas City early in that game and I know they've come back the last two weeks and everyone can jump in and say McShay what are you talking about they've proven it the last two weeks and everyone can jump in and say, McShay, what are you talking about? They've proven it the last two weeks. I get it. But when this pass rush and when this defensive front is at its best is when the offense feels like they've got to keep up, you know? Yeah, because there's a replay going around of Chase Young kind of giving up on that play. But Gibson 31 is the one that screws it up against Gibbs first.

I mean, he just completely whiffs on him. And then we're realizing like Gibbs, it's just crazy when somebody looks faster than everybody else in an NFL game. And that's what Jameer Gibbs is. I mean, he had that third and 12 run where he stops and just freezes the defensive back and then finds a way to turn it around. So like there was just all these things happening after the third and 12 run that converts there's another third and long and you're just like this detroit line is terrific i know bosa had the two sacks but i just watched the defensive line in warner when they have the ball when detroit has the ball i'm watching san francisco's d line and warner for most of the game and i'm i'm like all right and then it seemed it seemed to turn course there a

little bit there in the second half but i'm I'm wondering about that matchup because I have been guilty of it. I think a lot of us have of just loving the names and confusing familiarity with depth and being like, we need more plays. We need more plays out of this. That's why they signed Hargrave. It's why they traded for Chase Young. It's like, let's just keep adding to this position that's supposedly a position of strength. And sometimes I wonder if if Warner and Greenlaw actually make them look better. And that kind of leads to the next thing about Kansas City. I want to get two more things in, kind of just a quick first thought, look ahead to the Super Bowl.

Can I jump in real quickly? Off of what I said or something else? Whatever. It doesn't matter. Real quickly. I know everyone's spending today. I don't even know what I'm going to say, but I'm going to say something. Now, Campbell's taking all the heat, right?

And I was thinking about this before we came on. But what really happened? If Campbell stayed in character, and I mentioned the 20 out of 24 times in plus territory, fourth and three are shorter. He went for it. Campbell didn't do anything really outside of that run that we talked about with a minute and three seconds left, a minute and five seconds left, third down run. He didn't do anything out of character and stayed the course. You always want your leadership to stay the course of what has been successful and not in the biggest moments to kind of,

I don't know, maybe we kind of,'s, let's, let's play it safe here. Let's not do what we've done to get here. All everyone wants to talk about is Campbell and the decisions. Can we talk about the fact that offensively Detroit absolutely let this team down and really two players, unfortunately in, in critical moment. And it felt like the, the, the spot was too big. They got the – like, holy shit, we're going to the Super Bowl. Let's not mess this up versus let's keep our foot on their throat. And you had the third – three consecutive drives in the third quarter.

Detroit had three drives. Fourth down, dropped by Reynolds, turned the ball over. Next time they get the ball back, Jameer Gibbs fumble. First turnover of the game, right, for Detroit. And then the third drive of the third quarter was a third down drop, bad drop by Josh Reynolds again, and led to a punt. So you get the ball three times, start the second half with that 17-point lead, and it's drop on fourth down, turnover on downs,

fumble turnover to build momentum for San Fran, and then fail to catch a ball, a bad drop on third down. Now we get a punt. And now we're in the fourth quarter, and it's all tied up. So we can blame Campbell all we want, but this offense that has been great, and Jared Goff has been great and continued to be great yesterday. It was his weapons.

Like, he can't catch the ball. He can only throw it and put it in spots and hand the ball off. But those weapons that have been outstanding. Josh Reynolds was one of the big stories against the Rams, right? His old team, and everyone was talking about that. But he absolutely let them down. And Jameer Gibbs, a rookie, I get it. He's been outstanding. I've lauded him all season long and the decision they made. But that fumble is killer. I'm glad you said that about golf,

because about halfway through the season, I was looking at the retread guys, you know, top picks, not number one overall, but the first rounders. And how often do they win playoff games? They go to the next franchise because almost all these guys get another chance unless it's Jamarcus Russell. And it was almost impossible to find any path of success other than Tannehill doing it, where you had to, again, be a first round pick and then win as the primary starter on the next team. And we had Baker do it this year, and then we had Goff a few mistakes away from maybe playing in the Super Bowl. I hope that this is real.

The talent tells us that it is. I love that they got Jamison Williams involved the way that they did. Gibbs is really something special. Laporte is special. McNeil is special. Branch is really good. They've got to get better at the corners.

The O-line is really good. And during the season when I would talk about like, okay, if this team won the Super Bowl, this wouldn't be a surprise. I would never put Detroit in there because of their defense. I just wouldn't do it. And maybe there's some outdoor, indoor stuff with them that's fair to point out. But I just hope this is the start i hope this is like their first playoff scar with this group because goff has has done something i thought was impossible i felt completely justified in doubting him when i'm like mcveigh moved on from him after they made a super bowl like why are you even arguing with me anymore so i thought his career was basically done and now i look at him as like, how many quarterbacks do you name in the NFC before him considering lack of depth in that conference at the position? So

I know it stings and it sucks, but you have people that have no emotional attachment to Detroit feeling bad for you today and hoping it's not a fluke. And I don't think that it is because I still think that roster is really good, even though now they're not going to surprise anybody. that it is because I still think that roster is really good, even though now they're not going to surprise anybody. Yeah. And, but it doesn't help the green Bay is up and coming and that entire roster, it seems like it's 25 or younger. Caleb Williams could be in your division for the next several years.

And Minnesota was, you know, has a lot of talent, although I don't know that they're heading in the right direction, but that's going to be a brutal division moving forward. I think. That's a great point. Okay. Before we say goodbye here, the first thing you're thinking about, Chiefs-Niners? That first quarter is critical. I think it's critical for San Francisco to come out and

not be in the position that they're in because I think Kansas City defensively is too good to do what, you know, to do what, uh, what happened against Detroit, you know, to pull off a, to come back the way they came back. So, and you know, that Andy's going to script it out. Well, you know, that Kansas city is going to have some success you would assume early on. But if I just think Sam Fran has got to be in either a shootout or to get an early lead in that game to allow that pass rush is a different animal when the offense feels like they can't run the football and that they have to kind of keep up. That, to me, is going to be huge.

The offensive line play for Kansas City jumps out to me, too. I just think if they keep Mahomes clean like they have in the playoffs, they're going to be tough to beat. And I can't believe, honestly, I can't believe we're sitting here, Kansas City's back after watching them all regular season. I mean, all regular season, it was like Baltimore, Philly, then Baltimore, San Fran. I just felt like those two teams were destined to be here, but they turned it on in the playoffs. And if Kelsey plays the way that Kelsey played, we all knew they wanted to get Kelsey involved.

11 catches, did it versus zone, did it versus man, third downs, critical situations. I think there's going to be, honestly, I thought if Baltimore-San Fran was going to be the best matchup, but after watching those two teams play, like Kansas City, the way they're playing defensively and with Mahomes and Kelsey, I think this is going to be an awesome, awesome Super Bowl.

Is it okay to say that Kyle Hamilton has still been the most single impressive player in the playoffs? Absolutely. I'm going to circle it on my notes right here. I wrote a big, Kyle Hamilton is an absolute star. And then underneath it,

I put it in the bold letters, but. I mean, he's a star. And even the one touchdown he gave, I think it was the first touchdown he gave up all season long in man-to-man coverage to kelsey yeah that was just a brilliant throw and a brilliant catch and he was draped all over him i mean if that if that's your one mistake in coverage uh you know significant mistake that led to a touchdown in coverage that's the way to go now

yeah it was i mean he wasn't it wasn't like he beat him. He just made a great play. All right, we shouldn't end it on that. I can't wait that it's these two teams. Really excited about it. Great work today. What are we? Hey, Senior Bowls this week. Senior Bowls this week.

We're getting geared up for the NFL Draft 2. I know the Super Bowl is obviously a little bit more important than the Senior Bowl, but I may find out, I'm going to talk to Saruti, texting him, figuring out when you're taping. And I might just be like jumping in for five minutes here and there every once in a while. You've got to understand, right? I am bottled up.

I'm in a cage right now. I'm an animal locked up. And every once in a while, I've got to reach out of the cage and get some information out there. So I'm fired up to watch all the practices in the game and all the... Bo Nix from Oregon, you got Michael Penix Jr. from Washington, the top two quarterbacks that could go in the first, second day. We got a ton of talent down in the senior bowl. The East-West Shrine game just finished up. We're starting to get into draft season a little bit, and I'm going to be annoying

for you because you're my only outlet right now. Let's just call it what it is. We just have to do bonus Thursday pods. Actually, it will be Tuesday, Thursday after the Super Bowl anyway. All right, man. Talk to you soon. Later. All right, brother.

You want details? Fine. I drive a Ferrari. 355 Cabriolet. What's up? I have a ridiculous house in the South Fork. I have every toy you could possibly imagine. And best of all, kids, I am liquid.

So, now you know what's possible. Let me tell you what's required. Life advice. The email address is lifeadvicerr at gmail.com. Got a good Monday here. You guys had a late turnaround, right late you guys go with uh bill and sal last night it's actually one of the better ones because uh you know we only had the two games we had a 12 o'clock and the three o'clock so i mean i was done by like nine i think so it was actually one of the it was a nice one i was like should i go do something no i shouldn't shouldn't. The night is young. Did you think about it?

Man, I was like, ah, let's do a little night country, True Detectives. How about that? Oh, yeah, that's good. That's fine. I'm only too upset, but yeah. Yeah. Do you guys like it?

Jodie Foster. Yeah, my wife is hating on Jodie Foster. She's like, you show a little bit more respect. She's like, I just don't believe that she's this much of a tomboy. It's like, you know what? I can see it. She's in Alaska. I mean, you got to make up for that.

I think that kind of checks out. Yeah. She's seen the lambs or what? I can see it. She's in Alaska. I mean, you got to make up for that. I think that kind of checks out. Yeah. She's seen the lambs or what? Listen, I don't know. I hope she turns around because I'm not going to watch the show with her if she's going to keep talking shit on Jodie Foster. Wait a minute. Is your wife so young that she doesn't even know of the silence of the lambs? No, she does.

I just think she's like this character. She had opinions listen she has opinions on shows sometimes and this one she just was like she was just like this one i think i just don't agree with it and she she wouldn't let it go so we're only she's got some episodes in as well she's got opinions i didn't realize there's a good article on the ringer that i found this out about um company apparently the first season and the this season are like connected in a way oh because he was Russ was in Alaska well apparently the I don't want to do

this isn't really a spoiler but the guy who shows them the bodies that like dead guy yeah that's Russ's dad get the fuck out of here apparently that's true yeah I don't wait wait is this even in the show or are you just reading blogs about it no this is it well they don't tell you in the show but I guess they, I don't. Wait, wait. Is this even in the show or are you just reading blogs about it?

No, this is it. Well, they don't tell you in the show, but I guess they're, I didn't pick up on it, I should say. But yeah, that's people were saying that's, I guess, his dad. People were saying, dude, this is the ringer thing. All right.

Yeah, you know what? Actually, back off a little bit. Back off a little bit with the breakdowns just because it's too early. Are you guys going to watch the track? I didn't give anything away. I didn't give anything away.

Okay. All right. All right. All right. Sorry, spoiler alert. Yeah. There's bodies. We had a spoiler alert. We had a few follow-ups

on the debate about being pregnant. One was fairly vicious, which is to be expected. I would like everyone to move forward with this kind of philosophy and how you operate when you listen to it. Start with the default that we're all three pretty decent guys and the stuff we may not have said, we probably already think. Think of it that way.

Like how come they didn't mention how much it sucks for women to get... Hey, that's understood. If I walked around for nine months with a huge belly... how much it sucks for women to get. Hey, that's understood. If I walked around for nine months with a huge belly, I wouldn't like it either. But I think the best thing we can all do in society, but let's just keep it in this little sliver of our world. Assume the three of us based on talking for this long publicly,

like aren't bad people. And the baseline understood parts of the sacrifice of us based on talking for this long publicly aren't bad people. And the baseline understood parts of the sacrifice of pregnancy. Just make the assumption that we are on your side and we already know these things. And that's why we didn't do five minute preamble to the answer of the actual email. All right. I think that was the best way to do this. That's fair. Yeah. Pregnancy is hard, man. Didn't think we needed to say it. So is having a big belly. Yeah. Just because you're a dude and you strap a watermelon to your belly for 24 hours doesn't that was the best way to do this. Pregnancy's hard, man. Didn't think we needed to say it. So is having a big belly. Yeah, like, just because you're a dude and you strap a watermelon

to your belly for like, you know, 24 hours doesn't mean you know what the deal is. Do people do that? I don't know. It's probably like a dumb social media thing

for people to get attention. But yeah, I've seen it. I mean, I know they did in the office, but... That's right. I don't think he has a TV show. That's a TV show. So I don't know that that's it. Okay, before we get to one of the actual ones, I had to just read this one.

This one was titled Big B-I-G L-M-F-A-O. Remember when Ryan said Kyle Hamilton was better than anyone of the Chiefs secondary? Question mark, question mark, question mark, question mark, question mark. Watch ball buddy. Watch ball buddies up there would do better. I would ask this. You watched that game and didn't think Kyle Hamilton was the best defensive player in the game? Do better.

Nice. All right. Brought it back full circle. Okay. Let's get to actual ones here. Oh, wow. We got a new one here. All right. Brought it back full circle. Okay. Let's get to actual ones here. Oh, wow. We got a new one here.

All right. 44 years old, six, two way, way too much different spellings. Okay. Player comp for my playing days was a homeless and starving man's Boris D out slow as molasses,

useless at rebounding, but a crafty passer and money from deep. The preferred term is unhoused. I'm a legit. Oh, excuse me. I'm a legit. I'm a legal interpreter and have a contract with Homeland Security. I've been friends with a colleague of mine who inadvertently mentioned.

What's that? You're supposed to disclose that? Whoa. Yeah, I know. We could be on a list now after this with a basketball comp like that wouldn't be too hard to find out who this guy is he's just hanging out he's like he's even out there right now he's like yeah he's been out there for seven minutes it's boris dio okay um all right i'm friends with a colleague of mine

who inadvertently mentioned his hourly rate which was five dollars an hour more than mine because he got hired at the same time as me. He just assumed we were at the same pay rate. I didn't react, didn't disclose my rate to him. No big deal, except he is a rung below me on the certification ladder. Both our rates are really good, except now I can't get it out of my head that he's making $5 an hour more than me, which definitely adds up. And he has one certification less than me. I dug up my recruiting emails when I negotiated my rate and the recruiter told me, quote, this is the most I can offer you at your level of certification. So I accepted. But now I find out he is making more and is less decorated than me. What do I do? Do I email my recruiter? How do I handle that? Thanks, guys.

Welcome to life. All right. This is, I mean, you're 44, so I'd actually expect this email from somebody that's a little bit younger. Because this is, look, in my world, all we did is keep track of what everybody else made. All right. And as soon as you heard about somebody getting a deal at ESPN, you would be like, oh, my God, that guy got killed. We got a huddle up on this one. Or you'd say, are you fucking kidding me? You know what I'm saying? There was a lot more, are you fucking kidding me's by the way,

than just people being like, oh man, that dude got hosed on his kind of deal. Look, the goal of negotiators is to keep costs down. So they're going to tell you all sorts of stuff. They don't care. And they hope that nobody else tells anybody else. Right. Um, I've signed deals where the first thing someone told me is like, don't tell anyone else. And you're just like, oh, okay. Right. And then one time I was told like, don't tell anybody else. And I was kind of like, yeah, I think you're kind of, you know, this isn't really about me and what I'm making the whole time. So, uh, look, that sucks, but you know, you're the one that said yes to it. Like you could have countered and said, Hey, I needed a little bit more. Um, I would ask, are you married? Are you single? There's some

really weird stuff that's happened to me where I feel like people have offered me less because I'm not married and I don't have kids. I do think that that's a real thing where somebody be like, well, fuck this guy. Like this is plenty of money for him. He doesn't even need it. You know, that kind of shit. So, um, I would not email the, the contract negotiator, the recruiter immediately. All right. I would wait it out. I don't know if your contract, a contract, or if you are like, this is just sort of your rate, but I would, I would slow play this. Okay. I mean, I know that's maybe not for everybody, but I wouldn't go, I can't believe the other guy's making this. Cause now you're kind of

selling him out a little bit. Um, and I'll tell you, even if you're right, even if you're more decorated, even if you are just as valuable as he is, what people that are making decisions on salaries don't like hearing is when you go to them to say, I can't believe this other person makes this. And this is what I make. You want to know why I know that? Because I did it. I did it without an agent and sat right across from the talent negotiator at ESPN and went over the list of, Hey, this person makes this and here's the comp and then this and this and this. And they were like, fuck him to other people. Right. They didn't like, even though it was no different than what an agent would be doing and going, Hey, here's some comps and whatever. I just got sick of being like, wait, I'm paying 10% for you to get me the same rate that I could

get on my own. Now, granted there are other times when agents are far more valuable than that, but where I was at and everything I'd gone through at that point, I was like, this doesn't even make any sense. I'm just going to do it on my own. And there's something that's incredibly uncomfortable. I assume in your world, you don't have agents, so you don't have to worry about that kind of stuff. But speaking from experience, when you walk in, you know, kicking in the saloon doors, guns blazing, and start bitching about what other people make, even if you deserve to make as much, if not more than them, people don't like it. So I would slow play it. We're a time where you think that it's a reasonable raise.

I would go in and say, Hey, look, I need more money. Um, I think that there's some, you don't have to say specifically a person be like, I think, you know I think that there's some, you don't have to say specifically a person, be like, I think, you know, based on kind of some researching it out, look, people talk. I think I could make a little bit more. And if they say no, then it's up to you to make a much bigger decision. Yeah. It's kind of like art, right? It's like, it's not worth what you, it's only worth what somebody accepts for it, right? Like you're Peter Max and that dude's a fucking Rembrandtt i don't know maybe like uh maybe peter max will come back around right so it's really just it's what it's

not about what the other thing is it's about like what what time out what what's what's up with art kyle what do you mean you don't know about peter max i don't well i i just didn't expect to get a lecture this is amazing i'm just it's it's better it's well i guess i guess i'll derail this because uh i my iq is a little higher than you thought it was today i i guess we'll talk about that instead no i just uh i just mean that like you're it's not you shouldn't be mad about at the other guy or you shouldn't be mad at them about what they're giving the other guy it's all about what your piece of art is worth right so you you got to think about it that way instead of well this guy it's like you got to come up with your case that you have to make right instead of like oh this

dude i know for a fact this dude's making more than me and he's less than me you gotta you gotta say why you're the one who deserves more not comparatively i think okay not only did i know not know who peter max is i looked it up but i want that to be shared i wasn't going to sit here and pretend i knew who it was because i didn't off the top of my head know who it was now that i've looked i'm like oh okay some of this stuff you know it and you know that right now he's in a down cycle in the market oh well my mom was always a big peter max guy and then and uh she had like some trays and stuff that like they converted into like like prints and stuff that whatever it was just she was like yeah yeah i know he's not people's favorite but i like him so that's how i was i'm just using that as an example

it's colorful and if he comes back oh lady you know what my mom's got she's got some peter max you know to lose lot trek uh i don't know how i follow that up but um i'm not gonna have an art analogy what i would say is i i am i i get what you're saying i'm bad at this thing like i'm not the kind of guy in a... If the recruiter tells me, hey, this is the max I can go to, maybe it's a character flaw. I would be like, all right,

that's all we can do. Sounds like the max. I'm not a pushback guy. This is why I'm bad to harken back on I think last week's life advice. I'm not a good guy buying cars because I'm just not going to haggle. I don't want to haggle.

I don't want to do that. I'm probably too trusting of what people are telling me. But I do think you're right, Ryan. You need to use this at some point, but you can't use it immediately. You can't just be like, hey, I found this information out. Fuck you. I want five bucks plus interest. Give me 10 bucks extra an hour because then nobody's going to like you. But now you actually... What's everything in life? It's like you need leverage on something right especially in work like if you know everybody thinks they should be making more but most companies are going to be like well why do you have another offer somebody somewhere else and you still don't have that so that i don't even know how how far

this is going to get you they could just be like hey sorry you should have a look this guy asked for five bucks and he got it um so i i definitely would kind of slow play it uh but like yeah if you have a contract coming up, use that. You're not contract negotiation. It's probably not a contract thing. I think you've got to go six months. Some people don't like asking for raises that often. And some people ask for it too quickly.

And you're like, are you just going to keep asking for raises over and over again? Now, granted, if you are killing it and you are that important to what you're doing. And usually the person that keep going in asking for more and more money has absolute freedom, maybe more so in sales where they're like, look, I can just jump to this thing or I can do this, but I want to stay here. So you have to make it happen. Like some people can pull that off. Most people can't, you don't want to sit around forever. But what I think is a bad look is if you immediately go in and talk to the recruiter and say, Hey, I found out that fill in the blank. The other person's name is making $5 more an hour than me. They're less decorated. You told me that's the most you could pay me. And I believed you. And now, you know what I mean? Like you have to, now you have

the information, you know that there's a higher ceiling, make sure you stay valuable to the company and find kind of that window between six months from now to a year from now to go in and ask. And then who knows, maybe you end up making even more than the five bucks that's driving you crazy right now per hour, which adds. Yeah. Sorry, I interrupted. No, the other question would be the recruiter though can sometimes be separate from the company itself, right? So like it's, it might be fair and you're not going to screw yourself with the company to, to call it the recruiter and be like, hey, dude, you kind of screwed me on this deal. I'm not going to.

What the hell? Because how is that ever going to get back to the company you work for? Unless the recruiter specifically works for the company. I don't know. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. No, I do. But look, whether they're officially an employee or not, now we're going too far down the rabbit hole.

they're officially an employee or not. Now we're going too far down rabbit hole. That person gets a little feather in their cap. Every time they can go back to the person that's actually writing checks going, Hey, I got this guy at this number. I got this guy at this number. I'll never forget one manager who never negotiated any deals in the beginning was in charge of negotiating my deal because that's how irrelevant I was on the grand scheme of things. And he offered me a number and was like, this is the most we can do. It's hard and fast. And then I found out later on that it was just under what he made because he couldn't handle the idea of me in my early 30s making more than him. And I was just like, what? But at that point, I had no leverage. And I knew the whole time. Again, this is all just career bullshit that I repeat all the time. So I think we answered it.

Let's move on. Should we read a dream premonition? You know what? Maybe we'll save that one for a little bit later. Never going to be the first guy on that bus. You're not going to buy a ticket to the dream ride.

Should we go sperm donor? I don't think we've ever done one of those. Uh, yeah. All right. Hey guys, big fan of the podcast. 39 years old,

six foot two 30 NBA comp is a white American herb Jones. A lot of size there. An old friend of mine, uh, who we can call Doug got married recently and he and his new wife really want to have a baby. Unfortunately for them, several content consultations with fertility clinics and urologists have confirmed that Doug shoots blanks.

He's been very open about the whole process so far, and I'm never surprised or off-put when he brings it up. But he threw me a little bit the last time we discussed it was yesterday. We were watching the AFC Championship game at my place when Doug told me that he and his wife want to conceive through in vitro fertilization with a sperm donor. He told me that his wife put him in charge of finding the donor and he's been struggling with how to pick one. He mentioned that he specifically wants to know the donor so he can have insight into what aspects of his kid may come from their biological father. He didn't ask me to be the donor, but I got the impression that that may have been kind of dancing around the question, hoping I'd volunteer. At one point, he raised the rhetorical question, how do you ask someone to do that? That's actually pretty-

Does your grandpa still have hair? What's going on with him? Yeah. That's kind of a brilliant way to ask you if that's actually what he wanted to do. Hey, how do you even ask that? So my question is, should I volunteer to be their donor? My wife and I have two healthy kids of our own, so I know my boys can swim, and this would be a chance to help a very close friend of mine have the family that I know he and his wife desperately want. That said, I can't deny that I hung up on the idea

that I would be the child's biological father. I worry that I'd be too invested and feel like the child was mine. If I'm around Doug and he raises his voice with little Dougie Jr., am I going to feel protected? Hey, man. Hey, this is actually my son. Take it easy. Imagine. Hey, Doug, technically he's mine. So watch your mouth. You're out of line. The kid's like eight. Or will I just be able to let Doug raise his kid will it be weird in the future if I find myself pointing out

aspects of the kid that I think came from me he's really good on defense I should also add that my wife isn't on board well there's your answer I'm not on board there's your answer this sounds like a terrible answer he would have to beg me and come up with like a terrible idea. He would have to beg me

and come up with like a really good dissertation. He would have to beg me, man. Don't sign up for this. Let me finish the email and we'll get to your nose here. She's already said she definitely doesn't want me to do it.

But like me, she's torn. She doesn't seem torn. Well, I mean, she's probably a good person and aware of what. So what do you guys think? Am I hung up on nothing here? Do I owe it to my old friend to help him have a baby?

If I do this, would I have any kind of responsibility to this kid beyond the sort of a fun uncle role I usually play with my friend's kids? Thanks for reading, guys. And thanks for putting out such great work. OK. No way. Can't you go pick out like anonymous donors and read their stats like fucking baseball cards that's how can't you do that millions of people who who and you you know i mean you don't know every detail you don't know them personally but you're gonna know most of the things that kind of

matter can't you just say six three green eyes brown hair like no like no no disease or whatever can't you just do that like wouldn't that be better than like you and just being in the mix no way i mean the a clean break would be great i find it strange that this couple and obviously it's a shitty position to be in like obviously you know you're trying to figure out how you want to approach having kids when one of you can't but i just how how do you ask i would never ask one of my friends that's so strange strange. One, because yeah, you are literally the biological father of this kid. And that doesn't mean that you have to like, you're just going to always feel obligated to like be a part of it.

And not that you don't want to be, but now like you literally are. Whereas I think the whole point of a lot of them is that it's an anonymous donor thing and you just don't know. And it's a kind of a don't ask, don't tell. And that makes it just cleaner for everybody else. So I, man, I just, I kind of, I find this really uncomfortable to be honest with you. And then they ask you to be the godfather too. There's that whole thing. I don't tell and that makes it just cleaner for everybody else so i man i i just i kind of i find this really uncomfortable to be honest with you then they ask you to be the godfather too there's that whole thing i don't know are you gonna tell the kid too do you tell the kid that his real dad

is actually your your friend uh yeah eventually you have to and so that's kind of the thing i've been thinking about the most and we haven't touched on yet is like don't you think you have to think about the kid here a little bit and then at some point you'd want to tell him like hey you know what you grew up with us your dad your father had a medical thing and we use a sperm donor and it's the neighbor like what age do you tell that person because the kid the person has a right to know who the biological father is at some point okay uh and that itself is its own complicated thing of like how early do you tell a kid where kid, the person has a right to know who the biological father is at some point. Okay. Uh, and that itself is its own complicated thing of like, how early do you tell a kid where you're messing with their head and they don't quite understand the concept because you want to get

in front of it. But then it's like, well, how late is too late where it feels like you've betrayed them a little bit. And if you wait too long, then you're going to have like a real challenged. And it also depends on the temperament and also the relationship and the trust and love that you have with your child and all that kind of stuff. But like, if you wait too long, then you feel like you're completely betraying somebody. So look, I don't, I think your heart's in the right place, but if your wife doesn't want to do it at all, which is what it sounds like here, you can't be the only option in the world for this and if you're remaining friends i don't think you would treat it like your son i don't think you'd be weird at outdoor parties you know like i just don't i think i think

you're kind of like i think it's funny you're bringing it up because you probably talk about that with your buddies in this scenario just like we we are now. But I'd imagine that would wear off at some point because it just like, you know, whatever. But the dynamic, if you're that close, presents some real challenges and it doesn't sound like your wife is on board. Yeah, that's pretty much it. The other thing too is like, do you have a bigger friend group too? It's like, Hey, why did you choose this guy why didn't you choose me you're basically saying hey this is like the this is my ideal friend for breeding the best man the other guys are like what did i do wrong you know i guess he's got height so that's a good thing um but yeah kind

of awkward that's an incredible addition to it because you would have if you had a big enough core group you'd have one friend who no no doubt would just be like so you picked uh picked on huh yeah see this mom's balloons do you ever think of picking me you didn't any reason i mean we've been friends a long time literally never had the flu you know I ran a 4.6 in high school this has to have been a

this hasn't been in a sitcom or something it's got no it must be it must be just one of the ones we're not

thinking of because we don't know the plot of every episode of television that's ever existed all right that'll do it for us

yeah good luck good luck good luck with that thanks to Steve thanks to Kyle. Thanks to Wargon. Ryan Rosillo podcast. Ringers.

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