The Ryen Russillo Podcast - Nuggets Control the West, the Kentucky Job, and NBA Draft Talk With J. Kyle Mann. Plus, What It’s Like to Play the Masters With Michael Kim.

Episode Date: April 11, 2024

Russillo starts the pod with Tales From the Couch and shares his thoughts on MIN-DEN and DAL-MIA (0:49). Then, J. Kyle Mann joins the show to discuss John Calipari's agreement to become Arkansas’s head coach and where Kentucky will go from here (20:26). Next, Michael Kim explains what makes Augusta National such a difficult course and reveals who he likes for the Masters (51:44). Plus, Ceruti and Kyle join for Life Advice (76:59)! How can I deal with rejection better? Check us out on YouTube for exclusive clips, livestreams, and more at https://www.youtube.com/@RyenRussilloPodcast. The Ringer is committed to responsible gaming. Please check out rg-help.com to find out more, or listen to the end of the episode for additional details. Host: Ryen Russillo Guests: J. Kyle Mann and Michael Kim Producers: Steve Ceruti, Kyle Crichton, and Mike Wargon **Photo Suggestion - Michael Kim Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Okay, a couple of things that we're going to do different on today's pod. I'm giving you a little taste of the couch. Huge win by Denver against Minnesota. Full breakdown of that game and some Dallas love at the very end. Nice dominant wind down in Miami. We got J Kyle Mann on Coach Cal. What's next in Kentucky What Went Wrong There, some of the NIL stuff and a little draft tidbit stuff, not a ton but a little bit.

And Michael Kim from the PGA Tour, I'm sure he'd rather be teeing off at Augusta than talking to us. We're going to talk his career, talk the field and his experience playing the Masters a few years ago. And we've got a bonus Kyle is back, life advice, just guys chopping it up. We gave you a good 45 minutes today because we know that people love it. It's the Ryan Rosillo podcast presented by FanDuel.

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bet with FanDuel, official partner of the NBA. The Ringer is committed to responsible gaming. Please visit rg-help.com to learn more about the resources and helplines available. And listen to the end of the episode for additional details. Must be 21 and older and President-Select states gambling problem call 1-800-GAMBLER or visit rg-help.com. Okay, a little tales from the couch for you. We're gonna do two games and really spend a lot of time on the headliner and that's Minnesota at Denver.

Not only a preview of what could happen in the playoffs, but more importantly, at least right now, because I still think seeding matters. I think seeding really matters at Denver and get a home game, a game seven in the Western Conference Finals. I would think that's something that you don't want to do. And the way Denver had the West last year,

it's just different. Like they've got to play strong the rest of the way. We'll talk about the schedules. I don't know that we're gonna get super in a matchups because this stuff could change just a matter of 48 hours. So the biggest thing that I look for when Denver's playing Minnesota is just kind of how both coaches work the Jokic-Nas matchup along with Rudy Gobert and Aaron Gordon. So if you look at this, the original assignment, the way this game will start is that they

want Nas Reid on Jokic and they want Rudy Gobert on Aaron Gordon. And this is good for Minnesota because Minnesota can use Rudy as somebody who's going to float. Now, if Gordon wants to play in the perimeter to try to grab Rudy away from the basket, then Minnesota is going to live with that. Like, all right, fine, Aaron, go ahead and take shots. A shot from the pruner from Aaron Gordon is a win for Minnesota. One, because Gordon's not shooting well this year.

It's not really who he is. Uh, number two, it's a shot that Yocic or Murray are not taking. Um, and one of the best parts about Denver's offense this year against most teams is that Gordon runs the baseline in that dunker spot. So whenever the help comes to Yocic, then Gordon's eating for free. I would point you to the Gordon game that he had against Boston, the one in Denver, where you're like, okay, well, you have to figure out a way to recover, but it's just hard to recover when you don't have that size

if your big guy is already on Jokic. But in this case, the second biggest guy is on Jokic, Rudy's left to kind of flow. Now, when I think about defensively, like the floating big, Rob Williams, when he was with Boston, they put these terrific defensive numbers, but it was very much based on like Rob Williams' assignment. If it was a non shooting Four then they'd be like go ahead just like Aaron Gordon like go ahead do whatever you want And then we're gonna let Rob Williams come to the rim and crash and deflect shots and all these different things like Rob Williams It's not as good of defense a player is where you go bear is but he was really good at that thing and

In this matchup, it's almost allowing gobert to be like, hey, you get to just kind of come and help. And I think it's a lot easier as the second defender actually to play defense because you're not on the man with the ball. You're not worried about, especially with somebody like Jokic, the toolbox of skills that he has at getting free right around the rim. You can just sort of wait until the shot goes up. So what I look for is the substitution patterns on how Mike Malone wants to get

Gordon in there or out of there. And I think last night was really telling with this. So when you look at Gordon's numbers in his four games against Minnesota, he's averaging 9.3 points per game. It's his third lowest points per game against any NBA team this season. He was subbed out at 531. Um, and then Minnesota actually brought Nas out as well. And if you look at him coming out Gordon at 531, he averages nine

minutes a game in the first quarter. All right. So we can get into substitution patterns, which most teams are pretty rigid on this kind of stuff, unless the game itself, like it dictates or foul trouble, that kind of stuff. So then you have Rudy on Jokic and you could see when it was just those two, Jokic doesn't really have any fear at going at Rudy one on one. I'm not saying it's easy, but he's not deterred at all. Minnesota actually closed with Kyle Anderson on Jokic in the first quarter.

And again, the NAZ foul trouble probably played into some of this where maybe Minnesota would have used him a little bit more straight up on him, but the reason he's in foul trouble, granted it's just J And again, the NAS foul trouble probably played into some of this where maybe Minnesota would have used him a little bit more straight up on him, but the reason he's in foul trouble, granted it's just, it's just that tough. Um, I think the most important thing on the Gordon sub stuff. And we'll move on from this. I promise is that Gordon was subbed out at 7 31 of the fourth quarter. He never came back in.

And that's when Denver's offense started to look like Denver's offense again. You know, watching Denver run away from Minnesota in the fourth quarter, just surgical in that fourth quarter, and we'll get some of those plays. Uh, I don't know that it was just because Gordon wasn't out there, but it was. It's a combination of a lot of different factors. I mean, it turned into a dunk contest at one point there for the Nuggets, but we've seen the Nuggets throughout the entire season.

You're like, okay, it's go time. This game is over. But to do it against Minnesota, who I thought did a really good job in the first half where the game's close at the half, it's 52-49 Minnesota at the half, but it felt like it was kind of a clunky offensive half for the Nuggets. It didn't look the way the Nuggets are supposed to look and that's a credit to Minnesota's the best defensive team in the league.

So the other matchup would be Jadon against Murray and it's just not the freedom, the level of freedom that we're used to seeing with Murray have on offense where he can kind of dribble and get into his stuff. Because McDaniel is going to pick him up as tight as he can. That's why he gets into foul trouble because he's so aggressive on the ball. But I think it's probably worth it. You could get into the debate of how smart some of the fouls are. And I think it'd be fair criticism there. Also the overall factor of how soon the opponent's getting into the bonus if he's taking

some bad fouls there but I think you take that with him because he's just so aggressive and he's fighting the entire time. It's not like Murray gets shut down. I mean he had 20 last night when they got it going with he and Jokic when they're pulling away in this game it started to look more like Denver's offense, but he was eight to 13, but he didn't take any free throws last night. So a lot of the Denver work to get Murray free is like, you almost have to set two screens

because James is gonna fight through the first one, or if you don't get a good angle on it, he's clear. Like there was a lot of stuff they were doing with Murray where it was like, all right, they have to set a couple of screens here just to try to get him free. Fourth quarter, as I mentioned, surgery, 88, 87 with 846 to go. Then six minutes later, it's 110, 94.

Christian Brown had a dunk on Rudy that was just nuts. I mean, he goes up, looks like he wants to go to his right hand. He's on the left side. So to then get clear of it and hope he can not get it blocked, he finishes with his left hand. He had another dunk in there that was sick. Peyton Watson's activity. I don't know if he's going to be a star,

but the way he's coming in and impacting these games with his defense and his energy, and there's still, you can see, he wants a little bit more offense or a little bit more freedom. He's just a freak out there, man. It's awesome. And it's a credit

denver's front office for finding somebody that you're like you know what because if you looked at like some of the summer league stuff you go okay there's there's way more offense in there but there's just not a room there's just not enough room in an nba game for the five guys all to get to do what they want to do on offense those are the tanking teams. But Watson in a limited version of him, because I wonder if there's this other version of him that will exist. I just loved his game last night. But Brown gets the dunk on Rudy. A question about Christian Brown. Does he look like a guy you would go to summer camp with that would lie about his father having a helicopter?

All right. A couple numbers here that I actually found a little surprising because you can very simply go well, that's Minnesota. They struggled again late offense, and I do think it's a a real thing that I'm going to worry about in the playoffs, and that's why you know, cat at least allows you this other offensive option that's super efficient that another team has to game plan differently for, but the way they've survived is that Naz Reid has been incredible this this whole run. So when you look at their records and you look at their number post cat,

you're like, wait, there wasn't really that much of a fall off. Does that like we could have a cat debate? We've already heard my version of the whole thing. But here's what surprised me a bit. I was looking at the fourth quarter offensive and defensive efficiency numbers for the league post all-star break. You know who has the number one offense in the fourth quarter after the all-star break? Minnesota. You know has the number one defense? Denver. So if we look at the field goal attempts for Jokic depending on the defensive assignments, Nas of his 20 field goals, six were against Nas, eight were

against Rudy, five were against Kyle Anderson, and then Luke Garza there at the very end. Let's talk a little bit about Ant. He had zero points in the fourth quarter, went zero for three after 15 I believe in the third quarter, and it was Christian Brown on him. But it wasn't like Denver just said, okay, we have to stop and let's blow up our rules and stop. And it was just very passive from Edwards. And I know what you're saying, Minnesota fans, don't worry. We'll get there.

Um, there was, I went back and watched the possessions this morning. There's standing in the corner, um, action run on the opposite side of him, not in the play. There's another play where he swings it. It was the right basketball play, so he swings it. Somebody else, they missed three. I felt like some of the guys went early instead of him. He just wasn't really aggressive. They had Edwards bring it up.

They ran horns. He switches into a Murray three where Murray wasn't up on him, so it's like, okay, this is open. But it up. They ran horns. He switches into a Murray three where, you know, Murray wasn't up on him. So it's like, okay, this is open, but it just wasn't very aggressive. He had one layup where he drove kind of one on three. It was really tough to even pull it off. And that's when they called the foul and then overturned it. So it just was slow. It wasn't necessarily this incredible design by Denver to like face guard them

off the ball or double him on everything and then force the ball out of his hands. He just wasn't really aggressive. And I know what you're saying for some of you, Hey, he had 51 two nights ago against Washington and maybe they shouldn't have played him that many minutes. I think he played 38. They got into Denver at 1 a.m. after that game because that game was in Minnesota. And that's the whole reason.

Like, I just hate the default. You've heard me say this. I hate the default. Well, that was back to back. Okay. All right. But you know, that game kind of played out the way I think a lot of us feel about the West as deep and as unpredictable as the West may feel like.

Denver just dismantled them in six minutes on offense against the defensive team. That just looks terrific. And look, there were a few moments there where we didn't see enough of it with Jokic and Murray where, you know, they got Rudy into a spot where he's kind of playing two on one, they get enough people out of the action where now it's Murray with the ball and Jokic it's very simple, but it's incredibly effective. Hey, just keep going towards the rim. Murray with the ball and Jokic, it's very simple, but it's incredibly effective. Hey, just keep going towards the rim.

So Rudy has to think about you on the other side of the lane as Murray is coming down one side with the ball in his hands, Murray hit a floater on one. Then they ran it again. Uh, was out of bounds. It was Denver's basketball. Uh, and then Jokic put a spin move on Gobert that was just filthy. So if we look at the West, Denver is now one game up on OKC in Minnesota. So that's the one, two and three seed right now. Denver finishes at San Antonio at Memphis.

Uh, you would expect that that's not going to be the hardest thing. Okay. C's home against Milwaukee and Dallas. And then Minnesota is home against Atlanta. I would try young back for the first game last night since February 23rd and then Phoenix. So I don't know what kind of jockeying that we're going to see there at the very end. Speaking of the rest of the West, I don't have to spend a lot of time on Dallas because they just destroyed Miami in the first half. Miami did make a push there late and Dallas closed the door

on them. That was so impressive from Dallas and I know Miami didn't have Roger and they didn't have Duncan Robinson, but I've actually liked Miami better after the All-Star break than I did before, but you never really know what to do with them. Are they just coasting? It doesn't really matter. I thought that game kind of mattered for Miami and Dallas looked like a complete level above them. When I say everything worked, I think Kyrie and Luca had 40 combined in the first half.

The defensive rotations, the effort, just simple stuff like, hey, a guy has a catch at the rim, he's not my guy. Cleeva's walled up, Gafford's walled up. So let me just reach in the deflections. And then if Dallas wants to go fast, they go fast and get right up into court and get a really easy shot. I'll never understand why teams don't at least want to off a miss, push the ball, see if you get a nice, you know, after the break three,

you know, there's just open shots out there waiting, waiting for you. Take them, take their money. I don't understand why there's teams that just were like, nope, let me just, some of the point guards that drive me crazy where it's like, all right, I want defensive rebound, pass it to me every time so I can stop what we're doing and then make sure I get it in high pick and roll

and then that way I can decide if I want to take a shot or if I get an assist so everybody thinks like I'm this awesome team player because I have a ton of assists. I don't understand doing that. Like, and if Dallas wants to run the half court, they're going to do that to you. And now you can't sell out and double against Luka the way other teams have in the past because Kyrie's absolutely cooking and then Gaffer, who apparently just doesn't miss any shots anymore with two absurd field goal, make streaks that he's had this season.

with two absurd field goal make streets that he's had this season. So it's, it's tough to watch them and not be like, God, like, am I going to, am I going to get dangerous here with my wife? I wonder if anybody's at Dallas, you know, continues it's like moving a couple of games to go here before the regular season is over. I wonder how many people may actually pick Dallas to win the West. I'm not there. I'm, you know, look, this isn't breaking news. I'm just going to pick Denver again. I think I would have picked Denver again, even if Minnesota got them last night. And that season series is a, is it to a piece.

And even if Minnesota you'd be going, Oh, they'd won last night. They're up three one. They've got Denver's number. We saw it last year with the injuries and the guys that were out last year in the playoffs series, even though it went to five games, I feel like Minnesota gets so much credit for that five game series, uh, in the annals of NBA history. So we've covered Dallas.

I mean, a couple more numbers here. Last 15 games, Dallas is 13 and two number one defense in the league. Rebounding rate is up their eighth and pace their fifth and shooting. They just check a lot of bat boxes. And even when Miami would try to sell out against Luca, it's just, he's so big. It's like, Oh, cool. You're going to double team me to the sideline 30 feet away from the hoop. All right, cool.

I'll just back up here a little bit and then I'm going to throw a pass right over the top of you and now it's four on three. Uh, it's going to be a lot. I do not envy the coaches trying to figure out defensively, like what they think they can go to there and Kyrie's a little bit more locked in defensively. Jimmy Butler came into the game fourth quarter. You're like, all right, is Jimmy Butler going to get it going here? Nope.

One field goal attempt in the fourth. Uh, he came in, they immediately were looking for Kyrie. They were hunting him. They switched to Butler into him two or three times right away. And then Butler was like, nah, I'm good. Like this game's over. I'm not super into it. Butler's not a huge field goal attempt per game guy.

I mean, he's 13 for his career. You know, sometimes he'll sneak up a few beyond that, but he's, he's never been like an 18 or 20 shot guy with a team. And part of that is offset by how many free throws he always takes. He's always at like seven or eight because he's just really good at doing it. Remember what we tell you on this advanced scouting with Butler. Don't go for the extra up fake that he gives you that other players don't give you. Uh, and that's just a huge part of his game, but he just wasn't super engaged.

I keep kind of waiting to see him take over. Maybe we're all going to have to wait for the play in play off, whatever. Uh, I do wonder if 76ers fans blogs are jealous of the. Irrational MVP, Luca push right now where it's just really shitty. Luca. Like he's, he's been awesome. A vote for Yokech is not a bad vote. Dallas fans.

It's okay. But that's not what they're going to do. That's not what we do around here. And then Dallas with this with this run, I don't think anyone's going to pick the Clippers. If that's your final matchup, which it likely is going to be. Will anyone pick the Clippers or and I have this

just thing in my head where I'm like, will the Clippers just. Trick everybody like OK, we know we can do. We're good and it depends on how because we're receiving whether it's I'm like, will the Clippers just trick everybody? Like, okay, we know what we can do, we're good. And it depends on health, because we're already seeing whether it's the honest injury, and I may do this next week,

just going through like the last 10 years, because it's basically like two major injuries that derail a couple teams and sometimes derail what our preconceived notions were about who was going to win either the East or the West. And the honest part of it is really scary for Milwaukee and the Clippers, like you never know. You can be like, Hey, game one. Oh yeah.

Two guys are actually out. Like, wait, what? But I don't think it'll matter. I think a fully healthy Clippers with how great Dallas has looked and how they're going to close this season. I don't know if anybody's going to pick the Clippers, at least on the National Front. Bet the NBA with a no sweat same-game parlay from FanDuel every Thursday with TNT Thursdays. It doesn't matter if you're new to FanDuel or already have an

account, you'll get bonus bets back if your same-game parlay doesn't win on any NBA TNT game. NBA same game parlays are the perfect way to combine your bets for a chance to score a bigger payday. What I'm gonna do is share with the game that I've always kind of circled because I just think the Pelicans are a bad matchup for the Kings.

And the status report is of now, Ingram's gonna be out for this one. And we know that Monk and Herder have been out now for the Kings for a while. Both teams actually struggling a bit here recently, more so Sacramento, but they're both five and five in their last 10 and the Pelicans have won the last couple. Anyway, the point is that I just think physically the Pelicans are a bad matchup for Sacramento and it's played out that way this year in the regular season games they've matched

up against. So when I looked at the opening line, I was like, all right, Sacramento's favored by a point at home. So just have to stay with the Pelicans theory. Now, if you apply like, okay, well, who's more motivated, which is something we have to look at where I think we went three for four

on the Milwaukee Celtics thing, even though that line was like, okay, that line stinks and it stinks for a reason. I think this one based on the way they played kind of stinks again, but both teams are motivated to win this game because you have the Pelicans trying to stay ahead of Phoenix in the 6-7 and then Sacramento still kind of like if anything you'd probably argue Sacramento. Well, they're fighting us, fighting off LA behind them there too. So the line kind of stinks, but from

just the eye test over the season, because I remember the first time I watched it I was like, ooh, this might be kind of a weird match up here for the Kings. Now they have a six legged available for you on FanDuel. Harrison Barnes 15 points or more. Subbonus 8 plus assist. Fox 25 plus points. Subbonus plus 10 rebounds. Zion plus 25 points. CJ over 6 six assists that's going to pay out plus 4000 almost this game could be a free for all and that's why that number is at 215 and a half with what we've been looking at, but I just kind of like the Pelicans. And. The point in this little more straightforward. However you want to play just head to fan dual dot com slash Ryan Rye

and to bet the NBA with a no sweat same game parlay with TNT Thursdays. That's Fandual.com slash Ryan. Make every moment more with Fandual, an official sports betting partner of the NBA. Must be 21 and older in present select states. Gambling problem? Call 1-800-GAMBLER or visit rg-help.com. Minimum three leg parlay required. Refund issued is non-withdrawributable bonus bets expire seven days after receipt max refund $5 unless otherwise specified restrictions apply C terms of sportsbook.fandl.com. This is exciting. It almost happened a few times and then it didn't,

but J Kyle, man of the ringer joins us. One of our favorite basketball guys, Saruti really likes our guy here. So we're making it happen. I love Saruti. So that, that makes me happy. Anytime Saruti just starts waving his hands and talking about the Orlando Magic. I feel like he just, this geyser of pressure to talk about them builds up. And then he sees me. We were in frigging Sweden. Saruti

starts talking my ear off about the magic. I'm like, look at this beautiful terrain, Steve, but he's passionate. Like him back. Appreciate it. This landscape reminds me of Jaylen Sugg's shoulders. You're a Kentucky guy. You're a Kentucky guy. And it's official now. Cal goes to Arkansas. It's funny because I saw Mus at the Lakers Warriors game, the new SC guy. So I was like, what's up? Did you say hey? I did. I did say hello. Because, because at one point somebody from Arkansas invited me down to San Diego to watch him play or something and I was like yeah it's not gonna happen.

What do you think about his intensity in LA? Do you think it's gonna line up? Because that's kind of his thing behind closed doors. People are like must is a lot, you know. Like how's that gonna go you think? If Mick Cronin can make it work for a stretch, true. That's true. Then, then anything's possible. Cause I always think the, the culture part of it is like incredibly overrated when you hire somebody. All right. And when you think about Cronin who I'll still never forget, like a, a Jamie Dixon Cronin matchup at the XL center.

I went to a game there and Stanford Steve and I were sitting in like the at like a Jamie Dixon Cronin matchup at the XL Center. I went to a game there and Stanford Steve and I were sitting in like the press row area and we couldn't stop watching both coaches. We were like, oh my God, this is out of control. Like it was one of the funniest things I've ever seen at a game, it had nothing to do with the game. I think I was there to watch Vander blue and, good use of your time. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I lived in the, my apartment at the time was connected to the XL center. So it was so weird that one time when I first moved there, I went across the street

and grabbed a pizza. And then I was like, Oh, I think I'd get into the building this way. And I ended up like in the arena and it was closed. And I was trying to find a way to get back to my actual elevator from my apartment, but I ended up in like a freight elevator. I know this is why everybody tuned in, but yes. Um, I always think like the culture part of it is, is like, it's like a cool thing at the luncheons and the intros and maybe there's a longer leash with the coach. If you're like, Hey, he, he talks like us or he's, he's one of us or all that kind of stuff.

So I'm not worried about the most part about this. Let's just go to Cal though. What went wrong? What ultimately went wrong other than the wins and losses, which is a really easy way to probably answer this question. I think it's a number of things. You could go with the stylistic. I always tell people that I feel like 2015 was sort of a pivot point for a lot of things. You know, there's, you could go with the stylistic. I always tell people that I feel

like 2015 was sort of a pivot point for a lot of things that kind of overlapped at once. Cal was ahead of the game with the dribble drive stuff. You know, Vance Wahlberg comes in, he's coaching at Fresno State now and you know, Cal is ahead of the game and he overhauls the system and he puts the situ, this system in that's like guys attacking off the catch, fewer ball screens, beat your man one on one, get to the rack, get fouled, throw it up on the glass, get a dunk. Very fun when you have, you know, and that style works to recruit the best of the best when you have these like incendiary downhill point guards. And he had those guys for a while from that stretch from like, you know, 2000, honestly, the early 2000s all the way up through, you

know, that run. And, you know, as basketball started to change, this is just one of the reasons I think he started to have an issue is he liked to play that way. He also liked to pound it inside, beat you in transition, be more athletic than you. I heard somebody say one time they were like, if Cal could recruit the NFL combine, he would. He prefers seats, speed and size over everything. And then I think as the game started to kind of change, I think that 15 game that he lost against that like five out Wisconsin team that, you know, could, you could switch everything and it was fine. They had a guy that could, you know, at all five positions, they could shoot dribble pass.

He lost that game. I've heard people say that like personally that took a big toll on him, that that was, you know, the epitome of his style, length, size, athleticism, and they lose, you know, almost have an undefeated season. Uh, and you know, and then he does evolve slowly over time. He finally led to this past season where he started to just kind of really embrace the five out stuff, like aggressively hunting threes and things like that. Um, but when you start to look at the other part of it, I think early on in his really embraced the five out stuff, like aggressively hunting threes and things like that. But when you start to look at the other part of it, I think early on in his tenure,

he adopted the one and done thing first. He acts like it was some big idea that he had that coach K stole from him. It's not like it was some like crazy schematic innovation that, you know, only one person could think of. He was just like, Hey, let's get the, let's take the kids that are only gonna be here for a year and do a, it was a different way to coach and he got really good at it. But as I think the landscape of agencies

and things like that shifted with the LeBron and clutch stuff going away from the worldwide West part of the world, I think that affected his pipeline of talent. And then I think he just sort of got into this mode after 2015 from, you know, in 2019, where he was trying to recapture the glory kind of thing. So you start, you know, you start hiring old staff members and things like that. And you think it's going to be the exact same way it was. And it just wasn't. And I think at the end of it, I think his desperation

kind of made teams tight. You know, there are a lot of questions about their preparation down the stretch, like staff members pulling their weight, things like that. There's a lot of that out there that you can go find if you're interested. But I think that he just kind of stayed a little too long. So you know, I think it worked out the best way that it could because, you know, if they'd had to fire him, I think that the stench would have been, the sting would have been a little, uh, a little harder to bear, but since he went on his own, I think ultimately his legacy will

be okay, but it just, he just stayed a little too long, I think ultimately is what it came down to. First three years. And we see this with a lot of guys when they get the job, right? Like the, the destination dream job first three years lead a final four champs the next 12 years, one final four is last week, 16 was six years ago. I think the player development part of it, he's, he's a little underrated towards the end, like we know the headliner names, but whether it was maxi or quickly,

and I know you were locked into every one of those, but I remember before the draft and look based on where they got drafted, I think there was like, okay, who, who are these guys? Like what exactly are they? And I think Casey Wallace, who obviously got drafted higher, so Presti, his track record, you're like, okay, so they see something there. Like all of these guys are really good. Like if Wallace was on a different team, he'd be putting up like real numbers

right away and so the player development part, like I remember when Cal got all that shit of like, Hey, I had five first rounders and the lottery picks, like that's better than a national title. He came on with Ben Pelt and I very soon after and like was, was kind of selling that. And I always liked him. Like when we had him in studio, it's hard not to really like him. But what did Kentucky fans think of him getting the Arkansas offer after Kentucky's debating whether or not to even keep them around based on the buyout and then asking if Kentucky wants to counter it.

Like, is that just the way all of them are wired, the way Cal's wired? Cause that'd be, like, even if I liked Cal, but I was a Kentucky guy, I'd be like, hey, fuck off. Yeah, I don't know if it was quite that strong, but the administration maybe felt that way. I think people just kind of like had this feeling of really? Like really? And I think the reason we felt that way is he just had a, he got to the point where, you know, I've always said this,

that like climbing cow was like a whole different animal. I always referenced this. There's this, you can go back and watch this. There's this Martin Luther King town hall meeting that cow was like the only white guy that was a part of it. And he's up there and he's got his big watch on and his nice glasses and he's slick and he's got a nice suit on. And he's selling this dream of delivering generational wealth and like just, you know, working with families.

And you can see his appeal and things like that. You can see why he was such a radical figure, like so appealing as a recru appeal and things like that. You can see why he was such a radical figure, like so appealing as a recruiter and things like that. And when he was climbing, his energy was, he's willing to talk to anybody, he'll go out, he's available all the time. Once he had stopped climbing, you talk about getting the dream job,

he gets to the top of the mountain. I think he kind of put up walls and almost became like a militaristic dictator where he was like, you know, he became paranoid, I think. He became really obsessed with criticism. He became obsessed with petty criticisms of him and stopped talking to people. So I think what happened was there was a disconnect between him and the temperature of the fan base. So you're talking about like him being surprised, him even throwing that counter offer,

I thought was like tone deaf. It was just like, no man, we're waiting for a reason for you to be out of here. Like basically they came out and held hands on TV, him and the AD because they had no choice. There was a 30, there were $33 million left on his deal. The school wasn't gonna pay that. They knew that he kind of wanted to, you know, obviously he wanted to get that money.

Arkansas came in and frankly saved the day for them. For them offering him that job was a nice way out. He violated his contract by not telling the AD that he was talking to them. So that was a nice, like, you know, wipe the sweat. Wow. We dodged a bullet there. So for him to come with a counter offer, which which just like, it's a lot, it was laughable. I laughed. I was just like, I mean, it's weird that he's gone, but, uh, it worked out the best way that it could.

So Izzo made some comments recently being like this job, right. And I had left go on Tuesday and he was talking about how like Jay Wright had to have this out of body experience to understand how miserable he was, even though he was incredibly successful. Miserable is probably not the right word. Like he emphasized just how tired he was and how when Jay stays and talks to coaches when they were on the road and Jay would just leave the meeting and be like, that coach is like losing it.

And Saban speaking out about where college athletics are headed. There's no, especially it's, I would say in the media and depending on your age, there's like no one going, hey, good point, because they're like, fuck you guys. You've made millions and millions of dollars. This entire system has been rigged and finally the players are getting compensated, even though it's still limited in comparison to the NCAA, keeping all the money. The transfer portal part of it's opened up.

I like to look at things a little differently and say, hey, if you worked in an industry 20, 30 years and all of a sudden it's completely different, you wouldn't be thinking about the money you'd be making. You'd be thinking about like, okay, what is my job right now? And the NIL stuff is probably comically overrated in comparison to like what's really happening with some of it, but at least it's happening. So I'm, I'm in favor of it. It, I don't feel like that's the Cal part of it at all because he just took another

job and Arkansas is going to be full of all sorts of energy, people that didn't want to get involved financially before now going to get involved. So it's a complete win for Cal. It's a win for Arkansas and it's all going to get involved. So it's a complete win for Cal. It's a win for Arkansas. And it's all those things, but like, it's a sport that you love. And I feel better about what's happening for the players, but long-term, I don't think these staples of the industry are like completely wrong

about their fear of the future. Yeah. I think what we're going to see is I think we're just going to, it's, it's sort of gonna accelerate. It's sort of similar to what's happened in the NBA with like the pace and space thing. If you watch the guys who are over 30, the numbers have really changed a lot because the game changed so radically.

I think it's similar to what we're, we're gonna see a new era of coach who's just more equipped and ready to do this. It's not gonna be as much of a system shock for them to come in. And I think we're going to continue to see a lot of that change even more. Like, you know, I've talked about, I thought if Kentucky in particular was serious about evolving and changing, they should hire a GM. I think that that pipeline is going to open up.

I think because I think one of the things that coaches are complaining about is that it's a lot for one person to handle. And I don't think that that's, that's wrong. Not that they aren't handling a lot as it is, but, you know, year by year, recruiting your guys to stay, figuring out ways to compensate them that are like very, you know, on the ledger and above board and everything. And you got to make, I know that Kentucky in particular had a lot of problem with that this year.

I know you bring in somebody that handles that, that handles identifying talent, makes sure that their deals are in place so that they work with the coach and then the coach can coach. I don't think that you can introduce significant compensation into the equation without really radically changing the way the org chart works for some of these. But I think that we're going to see fewer and fewer of the like long time established icons like Izzo and Cal. I just don't think it's going to happen as much because it's going to move quicker in my opinion. So what does Kentucky want? I mean, they think they can get Dan Hurley.

I mean, that's what a lot of the Kentucky fans are saying, uh, whether that's realistic or not, but, um, I would say they won Hurley, uh, they, I personally think they can get Hurley. I mean, the message boards are one thing, but I think they're going to they're doing they're going to do the comical thing of forcing them to say no, which always, you know, go up to the prettiest girl to dance and make her say no and she'll just be like, no, I thought that language always makes me laugh. Have the conversation.

I mean, I think a lot of people want Hurley and they see him as the best in the sport. I don't know. I'm a little dubious of that too because, you know, Donovan was, you know, before him was the last guy to repeat and you look at like what happened after he repeated. Sometimes I wonder, sometimes about like overrating the moment and the staff and the particular players that you have and it's like rating the moment and the staff and the particular players that you have. And it's like overrating how like replicable that is, you know, it's like, cause Donovan was good a few more times at Florida. Um, but he never quite got to that level again.

So that's kind of one thing that I've kind of had conversations with Kentucky fans about, I'm like, don't be certain that he's just going to come in and immediately win titles back to back again. Um, I think Billy Donovan is another guy that's kind of on the radar. Um, I have some, you know, concerns about him. titles back to back again. I think Billy Donovan is another guy that's kind of on the radar. I have some concerns about him putting in the, you know, he's the guy who came from the other world, like I was just talking about. How quickly can he get into it? But past that, I mean, you just start to enter a list of guys that I think Kentucky fans have a lot more reservations

about. And there's a little more desperation in the air that makes me a little queasy, rather than somebody coming in who's like attacking the job and ready to do it. There are some guys who want to attack the job, but I don't think like the Bruce Pearls, the Rick Pitino's, I just don't know that that's a good idea right now. I don't know why they wouldn't just hire Pearl. He can recruit, he can coach. He's not just the recruiter who can't actually like, when I watch his teams play, I'm like, man, and I know they lost a Yale this year in the whole deal. Like that's the thing too is if he made it to a C 16, he's probably the Kentucky coach right now. But you think so? I don't know. The show causes a big deal.

I think to the 88 UK, I'm pretty sure you know way more about it than I do. I just feel like since you already got the job after the show cause, like, doesn't it just make it easier? It's like the guy who gets in trouble, and it's like once a team signs them, then the next team's like, well, somebody else already signed them before us, so it's fine. Or like the SEC transfer in college football, where it's like, oh, your guy's awful. He got kicked out of the school And he's like, well, now he's on your campus. It's like, Hey, I think we're going to win the division. Um, yeah, I mean, again, you know it better than I do.

I just, I just think that Pearl has the personality for the entire thing. But if you're telling me the AD has an issue with his history, uh, okay. I don't know. He has the personality to do it. And I was telling somebody this earlier today, and if people don't know what's going on, I mean, Scott drew apparently, you know, they tried to, as I understand it, Scott Drew wanted the job. Nate Oates wanted the job, by the way, too. And that's a fact, and just kind of walked it back. And then, but Scott Drew's family apparently just kind of had,

the Baylor coach had reservations about coming up. And I think Kentucky tried to convince them to, that that it was going to be okay. okay and ultimately they decided not to do it. But I think this is a job you have to attack. You can't let it attack you. So I think you have to have a certain level of person. I don't know if you saw this, but Drew tweeted a picture of himself at a Mexican restaurant just like eating chips with a booster and apparently like thousands of people called that restaurant from Kentucky and like got on their Yelp page and flooded it.

So and you know, you get the flight tracker stuff. It's like SEC football. There's not many basketball schools that I think behave the way Kentucky does. They're really the only ones that do are football schools like the in the most of them are in the SEC. So you just have to kind of be wired for that and ready for that. And so that's the kind of person that they're going to have to look for. The problem is, um, uh, I don't know how many of those guys are out there.

Mark Pope, maybe I don't know from BYU. Um, so the search is about to get interesting, I hope in a good way. Yeah. Now, when you're talking about Pearl, you're, you're not talking about craft in that one. You're talking about the Chuck person part of it for hesitation and Kentucky. Uh, his show cause I'm pretty part of it for hesitation in Kentucky. Uh, his show cause I'm pretty sure it was for that. Yeah.

They had, uh, and then he got one for craft too, didn't he? Yeah. He got one for the Polaroid at, uh, at Tennessee. Um, so there's that. So he's kind of, but also, I don't know, it's, it's still, what is cheating anymore? I don't even really even know. I mean, like, cause they, the more they investigated the FBI thing, the more it

was just like, what's going on here? Was there like a Syracuse grad involved in this investigation? Like, uh, it's all ridiculous. Like I, I've said over and over again, like, I don't, I stopped caring about cheating, like with like the Aitin thing. It's like, yeah, this workforce that's being like stepped on for decades wants to be compensated when they're clearly needed and their value is what swings You know millions of millions of dollars changing hands. Yeah, they need to be compensated

I honestly don't even know what cheating is anymore. Yeah, if you think of like the Kelvin Sampson stuff and then used today's Like way of like look it was illegal to do what he did then like way of like, look, it was illegal to do what he did then because of text messages. And now you're like, wait, what? And the Aaron Kraft stuff with Pearl is a joke. The person's stuff with Auburn's like just so weird, but like I've watched all these docs.

I still love all this stuff. And I remember when the Louisville thing was starting and the way that was being teased, I remember one college basketball writer essentially saying like, we may not see a final four this year or something. And you were like, yeah, that's probably not gonna happen. That's, it was like, oh, it's the biggest coaches. It's the biggest programs. It's the biggest things like, all right, well, like, I don't know, the guy's probably gonna just get a

job in two years somewhere else. Because, you know, and that's exactly, I'm Petino. It took a little bit longer to come back to, uh, to the big East. But I think the lesson in this is the lesson that I always try to remind everybody, and it was when people wanted horrible out at Michigan. It's like, okay, fine. Like make your argument, but then who are you getting? And the same thing with the frustration with Ryan Day losing at Michigan three years in a row.

It's like, okay, he wins all the other games and granted Ohio state had massive advantage talent wise throughout the big 10 is going to change now with expansion, all those things, but still going to be really good. Um, like the list of people that you think will take your job tomorrow is not as long and it's not the names that you think that it's going to be in a vacuum. You're like, who wouldn't want the Kentucky job? And now with all of the bullshit that has nothing to even do with Kentucky, it has to do with the landscape, the list is just shorter. It's just shorter of people that are like, I

actually don't need to sign up for that. Even though I think these guys are so competitive growing up, I used to always think that if you're competitive, you've grown up in this competitive field, like that your industry is competition. You'd want to see how you would do at the elite of the elite.

And now you're like, oh, I'm going to competitive field, like that your industry is competition. You'd want to see how you would do at the elite of the elite. And now you're like, I don't know, like I'm making a few million here and I don't need to do that. And that's why I just think it's a good reminder for some of these blue blood programs in both ball or football and college basketball. It'd be like, all right, fine. You want your guy out. Who do you actually think you're getting?

Because it always ends up being like just a less impressive list of potential real candidates than I think the message boards ever want to believe. Yeah. And then you get the wave of the fan, the power that the fans have today. I mean, like I've joked that like she, she on owed has become a word, a term that these days, I mean, like I've joked that like, she, she on ode has become a word, a term these days. I mean, like Kentucky's football coach apparently was like lined up to be the Texas A and M, you know, the next choice for them and the fans just revolted,

you know, so it's, it is, it's a lot of pressure. It takes a certain type of person. I think Kentucky's been really lucky to have like double presidential term coaches more than once who've won titles. That's pretty unusual. This next time might be a shorter term. That's the thing about Danny Hurley is if whoever convinces him, or if someone did convince him to take another job, I don't even think that it would be for a

long term. I don't even know if he wants to be like the the long term, the Don at Yukon, because he stated that he wants to be the coach of the Knicks, which I feel like is perfect. Uh, Danny early as the coach of the Knicks just feels perfect to me. Um, so yeah, it's, it's more of a stress than it's ever been. So maybe that's a Donovan, maybe at this stage of his career, he wants to go back and do that. But in order to do it, I think that he'd have to really, really radically change the way, you know, a program is run specifically at Kentucky anyway.

Before we let you go, I know you released a draft show with KOC. I did some thoughts on ED and then Klingon, because I've watched enough of them in the tournament. I have not even touched on stuff, but if you watch the first, the arguments for the first potential picks, you're going to go like, what? Like even with Klingon, I was talking to Sruti about this earlier where I'm like, okay, he was thought to like at best be like the 10th guy, kind of that 10 to late lottery range. And now ESPN had him up to three and I was like, I like them, but man, three. And then it's a byproduct of what the draft is. And where the other side of it is like, I remember the Jonathan Isaac class where

I did all the work on those guys. And I'm like, Jonathan Isaac's going to go behind like four people. Like this is nuts because what he was as a prospect with his ceiling before all the injuries and then kind of being limited to a more defined role with what Orlando has in its roster now, like there was stuff Isaac was doing at Florida state. We're like, wait, in no other world would this guy even last. So a lot of it is based on the class. So I'd ask you this.

Are you starting to just the human nature part of it, spending more time with these guys and knowing that you watch college from wire to wire, are you talking yourself into more of these guys now just because of the familiarity? Uh, I'd like to think it's not like a familiarity bias. When you were talking about, um, I know you said you, with the prep, there's a guy, Alexander SAR that I'd be interested to get your thoughts on. Cause he's kind of in that class of that Jonathan Isaac, Jonathan Binder. I know you were, you had to, Ryan, you seem like you were like probably a big

Jonathan Binder guy back in the day. Is that true? Just get new it, do it bullseye. Are you kidding? Jonathan Bender guy back in the day. Is that true? Just get it. Knew it. Knew it.

Bullseye. Are you kidding? Now granted, I was loving him with the limitations that we had back then. Like, it's just so silly to me to feel comfortable talking about Jonathan Bender while I was a bartender being like, that guy's awesome. And then the truth is how much did you watch him? And it's like, I didn't, I only saw what was available like at that time, which was almost nothing.

And yet I was totally confident just sitting there with anybody else. And that's the trap thing that always kind of drives me. Could like barely watch the kid fell in love with them and told people that he was, he was going to be good based on nothing really. He was going to be good based on nothing really. He was gonna be good though to be fair. Yeah, you're on there with the embedded Windows media player clips.

Kids don't know what they have today. I'm watching like, yeah, just a swirl. Because I wasn't working then. Again, it was years before I thought that I was even gonna do any of this stuff. And I would just scramble and then I would sit sit and watch, I would sit and watch the draft and like try to keep track of what was going on. And then you'd see those clips, you'd be like,

now this guy sucks. Like you didn't watch him, you didn't do anything. You're only watching the draft broadcast. I just think it's kind of funny how comfortable we all were with our opinions with almost zero information. Oh, I was way cockier. Like I was way cockier before. I feel like the more I know, the more doubtful I get.

I think that's pretty normal or the more access to information. I think you and I sometimes should talk about just like the impact of video. I loved your synergy pod, by the way, because I'm on there all the time, too. But you asked me about the familiarity in the players and things like that. Kind of coming around to, and I said a little bit of this on the draft show, but I'll say it again, that when you're coming into a draft, we have this idea of like, okay, who's the number one pick and we have in our mind the idea of what that is.

We're like, okay, it's probably agree or disagree with this. It's usually we're looking for a hub, we're looking for a guy who's going to be like an inefficient volume producer who can like spread the love with the attention they get and share the ball. That's usually what we want from a number one pick. And if it's not that, it's probably going to be a big time defensive anchor or whatever. I don't know what it like, or a big who seems undeniable or a creator guard, something like that.

We don't have anything in this class. That's like a sure fire thing. We have some guys that are like a pretty, pretty alluring something like that. We don't have anything in this class that's like a sure-fire thing. We have some guys that are like pretty, pretty alluring, like creators. Like if you watch Rob Dillingham, like who played for Kentucky, he's like one of the more talented on-ball guys we've ever had here, but he's probably more of like a second unit flamethrower type guy. Like he's probably like a Lou Williams, Jamal Crawford type unless something changes. And then, but for me, you know, I'm looking at this class and I'm like,

one of the guys that I've really come around on is Klingen. That's the thing. Klingen is defensively, and my rationale for that was, you know, a couple of years ago we were, you know, Walker Kessler came, this was the one I've just been saying, he was a guy who was like in a redraft

would have come up a lot higher, just because he's like an impactful rim protector. Well, I think Donovan Klingon is better than Walker Kessler. So I was just like, okay, well, you know, if none of us are sure who is like the sure fire number one pick, no, no player in this class fits what I was talking about our typical expectation. I'm going to go with like a high floor of certainty. You know, I know people love Stefan Kassel. I'm just unsure he's ever a creator in a real

reliable way, but I know what Klingon is and I do think that he's gonna get better. That's a high level of room protection that I think you're gonna get. Now there's some people that believe in Sarr. There are some people who believe in a few different guys in this class, but I think if you're gonna roll the dice, it'll depend on me too, but I think if you're going to roll the dice, it'll depend on me too. But I think that he's somebody, I mean, are you in on him? Do you like him at all?

What, Klingon? Yeah. I do like him. And I like the Kessler conversation that you're having about that. I feel like Kessler was just because of what Auburn was doing. We didn't get to see enough of him too.

Like I've already covered all the Jabari Smith and the, and the Auburn guard trauma that I had PTSD when I was watching. He should go nameless, like start wolfing as they're down to Yale late, misses a free throw. I was like, this is the epitome of, of what I've seen from, um, I, I like it, but I, it's just like, it's kind of the ed conversation all over again. Cause like my whole point on Tuesday was it's not even about his defense, which is all everybody's been talking about for years. It's like, are you actually going to run enough offense with him to take advantage of what he has?

Like, that's not really what anybody does anymore. So if you're going to be drafted that high to your point, you have to provide some kind of defensive anchor. Like if you're going to be big and not an offensive, like top option, then that means you have to rim run and you have to protect and you have to be able to come over and help and all those things and Klingon has obviously a far better chance of doing those things than Edie does. But I think it's a byproduct of this draft and the uncertainty of like the three or

four guys that are considered in the mix for the number one pick where with Klingen, you're like, what's the offensive ceiling though, in comparison to the other guys. Um, and even if you don't like the other two guys, the foreign guys, you know, and watching them and again, I just haven't done enough. Uh, I'm like, I don't know what Klingon is going to be offensively. Cause right now, like what it, what is it? I don't think he's going to be overly complicated. I think he's a rim runner.

He is a lot of threddies. He catches lobs pretty well. And when you, when you compare them offensively, you know, Edie's two years older than him. I don't have the exact age in front of me. It looks, yeah, I mean, but in a couple years, if he was just, I was joking about watching them warm up. If he shoots, you know, jump hooks nonstop

for the next two years, I think he'll be pretty solid in that area. I mean, I don't know that he necessarily needs to be complex because I think he'll be pretty solid in that area. I mean, I don't know that he necessarily needs to be complex because I think he's going to be fairly scheme versatile. Like I think he moves pretty well for his size. The other thing is just health with him. Can he stay healthy?

Yeah. Klingon is going to be, he's almost 21 now, but, uh, I don't know. That's one argument, you know, as you dig into it, we can, we can pull it apart more, but, uh, I, I like him. I've come away just, you see just you saw the way he impacted. Did you watch the Illinois game like just his presence basically shook them beyond belief in that in that game? Yeah, I watched it.

It was horrifying if you're an Illinois fan. I mean, I even mentioned on a Tuesday to go 50 real minutes without a bucket, but it seemed like they were like, hey, we're going to just keep attacking, clinging and we're going to get them into foul trouble. And that's going to work. It's like, or he're going to get them into foul trouble and that's going to work. It's like, or he's going to block every single shot when you go up there. So I would look, I like him. I like him, but that's kind of the lesson of this draft is you're going to

find a pretty significant flaw with a lot of the top 10 picks. And that's the whole point. So we could talk about depth from 11 on down or, Hey, I kind of like this guy or this guy or whatever. But like the headliners for this one, like the the first impression with some of the players, it's like Rosace. You're just like, all right, you know, I haven't done it again. I don't want to start sitting here telling you I have definitive opinions on these guys like it's Jonathan Bender all over again.

So it's speaking of Vanderbilt, Marquette wasn't in the game that I was talking about but I did go to the XL Center to watch Vanderbilt because he was a He was a big name at the time. So I needed to correct that I didn't even catch the mistake if you one guy that I want to Kevin McCuller is my other guy that I like that I think is just is just hiding in plain sight and if you I'll we'll have to circle back if you haven't gotten to see him, but he's one of my favorite players. I feel like he's gonna pop in like a similar way

that like Jaime Hotkett's did this year. He knows how to play, he's gonna be ready to go. So just wanted to toss that in there, but. All right, early territory on that position. Thanks man, appreciate it. Always good to be here. This is kind of cool. I don't know what's gonna be cool for him. Michael Kim of the PGA Tour joins us now getting ready for

the Masters. So we're gonna do a little golf here. I imagine doing a Thursday pod with me is not as great as teeing off at Augustus. So I don't know if this is kind of a bummer for you. So thanks. I don't know if this is kind of a bummer for you. So thanks, I don't know. It's not as good as playing in the actual Masters, but this is a close second for a guy that listens to your pod all the time.

Right, and you would send in a life advice. Was it during Homa's life advice or was that just its own? That was during the visit with Homa, right? That was the visit with Homa. He's obviously a good friend of mine. We played in college together. So I thought it'd be fun to kind of put in my life advice in there.

It worked, it was good. All right, so let's get to, we'll do some master stuff here. It was delayed this morning. You've played in five events this year. So how does it work? Like I wanna ask some dumb questions here. I went through the 19 ways you can qualify for the masters

and looking at it this morning, I had an idea on some of it, not, but like, where is it for you right now? Like, how does it work for you when you realize, okay, like this, I didn't qualify because of this. Um, you know, for me as a PGA tour pro, really the easiest way is to win a PGA tour event. Um, that is, um, other than kind of like getting really into details,

that's probably the best, best way to get it in, uh, to get in. Um, otherwise it's top 50, um, For me, those two are probably the best ways to get in, which I unfortunately wasn't able to do, but always next year. So you played in 2019. Tell us the stuff you were thinking about that you didn't want anyone to know when you're actually like, I'm doing this and it's real. that you didn't want anyone to know when you're actually like, I'm doing this and it's real. I was first year just freaking out on the inside. Yeah, I get there Sunday. You just don't want to over prepare but the the practice facilities and you feel like you have to do so much homework. I played with Zach Johnson who had won there before. And so you're just

writing down note after note, just trying to get comfortable, trying to get a feel for that place. But at that time, my game was in a really bad spot. And so I'm trying to get my game ready. I'm trying to do all this homework. And to be completely honest, I probably knew I wasn't going to play well that week. So you've got all these emotions going like, maybe I might play well. I hope I can make the cut. It's kind of the thought process that was going through my mind at that time. God, that must have been awful.

It's like, I imagine if you're like a basketball player, it's like you're playing the NBA finals. You know you're going to be in the rotation, but you know you're not going to make anything once you get in there. It's just, it wasn't, I tried to enjoy it as much as I can, but you know, from like a professional game aspect, from my game, I was in a really bad spot. Did your friends know, did people close to you know that you were like, yeah, this probably is gonna be great? I mean, I wasn't playing very well up to that point,

so I felt like my agents and my coaches, the real inner circle guys that kind of knew what was up, probably knew, I wasn't, at that time, wasn't exactly open with how bad my game was at that point. So the close, the really close guys knew. So is Zach, because it's your first time and you know, you have a really nice resume, you know, coming out of the amateur ranks and winning player of the year at Cal. I, but golf is weird in that way.

Like I, I've just got back into it this year. I'm not very good. And one of the things I always think is kind of silly about it is you have to compliment the other guy, even if he sucks and it's a way to kind of break the tension, but there's no tension. It's like, we're not playing in anything that actually matters, but if you get paired up to somebody you don't know, and you screw up and then your approach doesn't hit the green and he'd be like,

oh, well, with that lie, you got it out pretty well. I was like, dude, you're just trying, I suck. That wasn't, none of that happened. Does that happen? I imagine it's who you're paired up with, but does Zach realize what you're going through, but at the same time, he's gotta worry about his game that day.

Yeah, at that time, golf is weird in that like you can have a really good practice session on the range, but as soon as you get onto the golf course, it's like completely different. And, you know, in the practice round, I was able to hide it pretty well. And then tournament starts and, you know, it wasn't, it wasn't the best. I remember I played with Ernie Els at a tournament a few weeks prior. Now I was just hitting it all over the lot. And he's like, so what have you done in your career so far? Kind of just making small talk. And I was like, oh, I actually won the John Deere Classic last year and whatnot. And I'm sure it's probably hard to believe right now. And Ernie kind of gave me the,

hey man, I've seen it all, I've been through it all. I know exactly what you're going through. It happens to all of us, even a guy like me. So that was pretty cool to hear. Golf is such a crazy mental game as much as it is a physical game. So I've been there and I always say like as a non-hardcore golf guy, it's a place that I've been lucky enough to go to with all the places I've gone to through my career that it exceeded expectations and the expectations probably have never been higher

for something that I was going to. And, you know, I didn't even really want to leave. I'd given my tickets to my college roommate for the last day. And I was like, yeah, I got to get back home anyway, you know, NBA, right. And then when I was leaving, I was like, I kind of wish I hadn't done that because it was that amazing. So explain to us, I don't know, this is probably, maybe it's boring. I don't know, but I'm over everybody

being like, oh, you're a scratch golfer at your club? Well, you'd shoot a hundred here. Okay, we got it. We fucking got it. It's hard. What is it though about it that maybe separates it? And I know conditions can play into some of the rotation of the US Open stuff and the scoring there

has sometimes been comically high in comparison to what other majors would be at. But what is it about this layout in this course that just the guy who's like really good at his club doesn't understand? I think it's just all the crazy amount of slopes. Everyone talks about it. It's way hillier than it looks on TV. And I feel like in recent years, TV has done a better job of how to explain it. But just like the shots of the lie itself doesn't match the shot you want to hit. So for example, like 13, the ball's above your feet. And when the ball's above your feet, um, the ball wants to draw more, but

the way the green is shaped kind of left to right, you actually want to hit a fade. So there's all these like weird little mismatches that, that makes you want to hit a certain shot, but it doesn't agree with what the golf course requires in a sense. And so it's, it's kind of like that for, for, you know, 16 out of 18 holes or 15 out of 18 holes where, you know, the par threes you have a flat line and it's fine. But the course just gives you so many weird, interesting lies that you have to hit shots that you, that the lie doesn't want you to hit, if that makes sense. Yeah, that makes a lot of sense.

Um, you talked about pairings and as soon as the pairings came out for the first round, you saw that Brooks Koepke, um, who's plus 1800. If you're looking at that part of this, uh, he's with Brian Harmon who's slow. So is it plus 500 that Brooks will punch him? Why the temp? I don't know exactly, but I don't know if they have like, oh, they played on the Ryder Cubs together last year. So I'm sure they're fine.

I'm sure Brooks understands. And you know, if you're a fast golfer on the, he's on lift,'s if you're a fast golfer on the on he's on live, but if you're a fast golfer playing professional golf, you understand that you're probably paired up with a with a slow or a one and you kind of know what to do if you're just waiting around all day. So the the pace of play part of it though, like can you because I've looked I've been to a few events where

I'll watch kind of how the guys interact and there's very little interaction until you're either teeing off, you know, most people are not taking the same path to the green, but are there times where you get paired with somebody where you're like, Are there times where you get paired with somebody where you're like, awesome or like, ah, this sucks? Oh, yeah. There's, I mean, there's 200 odd members on the PGA tour. There's going to be guys that you like and there's going to be guys you don't like. And you get the pairing on Tuesday, usually around noon.

And you're either like, oh, great. I'm, let's say I'm playing with Max. Max Homo is a good friend. That's great. Or you get paired with another guy and he's like, Oh, man, he's slow. And he complains a lot after every golf show. That's going to be a little tough to play with for the first two days. And this is like my 10th year as a pro. So there's definitely certain guys that I enjoy and certain guys that, that, that, you know, you don't necessarily want to be paired up with all the time. Okay. Homa.

Did you like being paired up with him? Oh yeah. Yeah. Um, like I said, you know, Max and I, we played together in college. So, um, and he's not slow or anything like that. And yeah, I've played countless of rounds with him. So super comfortable playing with Max. Not too chatty?

No. I'm kidding. I'm just kidding. Actually like during tournament itself, he's not like the most, he's not chatty by any means. Like he's kind of in doing his business. Um, I probably came up to him and talked to him more than, more than he comes up to me.

So were you better than him at Cal? Um, freshman year, he's a couple of years older. So freshman year, he was a junior. He probably, he was better. Um, sophomore year I did win player of the year. So, um, I guess I was a little, a probably, he was better. Sophomore year, I did win player of the year, so I guess I was a little bit better than him that year. I think it's okay to say that, yeah. But he won NCAAs, he won Pac-12s, I think he was like second or third in the voting anyway,

so it was close for sure. I always wonder like human nature. Now this is going to sound like I'm trying to get something out of you and this won't be the breakout video, but this is actually a terrible question. I shouldn't even ask it. Because I just think of like some of my friends and I know that if I had the background that you and Homa had, like some of my friends would be so happy for me if I were Homa. And then I know that there'd be other friends that if I played with them professionally, they'd be like, fuck him. that there'd be other friends that if I played with them professionally, they'd be like, fuck him. I don't expect you to sit here and say like, yeah, I'm actually kind of annoyed that that

home was done this well recently. And I'm on a podcast with you right now. Actually, this is terrible. This is one of the worst questions I've ever asked, but I think I have to leave it in as punishment. No, no, I think it's, you know, Max is really like a real good friend of mine. So I'm really happy to see how well he's done. And you know, Max has had his fair share of struggles. I think he came on the pot to talk about it a few years back. So, you know, when you've

seen a guy that has been down, but really worked his butt off to get back to an even better than where he was before, it's super admirable and I'm absolutely, totally happy to see him have all the success that he's had. Yeah, I almost feel like I need to explain it to the audience because we can see each other right now. But I knew there wasn't going to be an answer where you were going to be going like, oh, hey. But I think about the competitive part of it, but Max is just so likable.

I do love the guy. We're all rooting for him. I went to go see him at one of the programs at Riv and he let me and my buddy just follow him for the entire time. He's just like, hey, come up to Riv. He's like, come on Wednesday. He's like, bring a friend and then we'll just hang out.

And I was like, are you sure? He's like, yeah, dude, He's like, bring a friend and then we'll just hang out. And I was like, are you sure? He's like, yeah, dude, it's Wednesday. It'll be fine. Nobody's going to care. And you could just walk the course with me the whole time. And I think that there is a parallel there for you and why I hope so many listeners are going to start rooting for you after being on the pod is that. You, you had to go through it.

You know, you lost the card, you get it back. You're trying to find your game again here. And I imagine that's probably one of the coolest parts of the Homer relationship is that you guys can understand. Like I love talking to other people that are on the air because there's only a handful of people that I can really talk to about the stuff that I go through. And I imagine that's probably the coolest part

of your background, I've known this guy for a decade. Yeah, it's weird. Like he and I have had like similar trajectories where we both weren't like the most highly recruited guys out of high school. We go to Cal together. Um, you know, we both do really well and we get our PGA tour cards relatively quickly in a couple of years, and then,. And then we both go through some deep, deep struggles. And he's basically gone all the way back and far up.

And I feel like I'm on my way back up. And so it's been weird to see how our careers have kind of followed each other's. But at the same time, like he and I have never really like super talked about like the ups and downs on a deeper level for some reason. And it's like, it's almost like I can talk to you about these certain struggles, but because he's such a close friend,

I almost struggle a little bit more talking to him at times, even though he knows exactly way more than what we've gone through and kind of the thoughts and all that. Yeah, because it's such an individual sport. I imagine a lot of golfers are like, hey, I'm your buddy and I talk about it, but I don't want to get my own head while I'm sitting here with these therapy sessions with you. I always felt like, and I don't know if there's anything in golf that's close to this or sports,

because it's just cooler and more important. But when people ask me about on air stuff, I was like, I don't think you ever become great into just like, yeah, I'm good at this. And now I'm going to stop thinking about every single little thing. So I'm not saying, I'm not comparing the two, but I wonder with you getting the card back and feeling like

you're coming back, the skill is all there, right? The skill is inside of you. You know you have the skill. What is that process like to get to taking it easy on yourself and then probably playing your best golf again? It's weird. Do you think like, I thought like when I won my first PGA Tour event, like, you know, from Taking it easy on yourself and then probably playing your best golf again. It's it's weird Do you think like I thought like when I won my first PGA Tour event like, you know from that point on it's like

I've got I don't have my anything to lose. It's it's kind of rainbows and everything from that point on but It's weird how golf it's you still feel like every shot it's like you're living and dying with every parpa, with every tee shot you hit. And now that I've had my downs and now I'm back up, you think that like, I'm way more humbled, I have way more gratitude in playing on the PGA Tour, but at the same time, that urge of caring so much about every little shot never really goes away.

I hired a mental coach last year and talked a lot about acceptance of like, this shot may not go the way you want, but at the, at the end of the day, like that's a possibility and you kind of have to accept, accept all the, all the good and bad results. And it's just hard to do, you know, you've practiced, I've played golf for 24 years, I've been a pro for 10 and it's, it's just hard to kind of, they say, kind of get out of your own way. And that's a part of that. Um, but it's, uh, it's like, I feel like I'm going against every, every cell in my body, just going against human nature almost.

I let by trying to let go. Scotty Schaeffler is plus 400. I mean, that's a pretty significant gap between him and Rory. When I was looking at Fandool this morning on it where Rory's plus a thousand, I know Schaeff won it two years ago but what is it about his game right now that he'd be considered such an overwhelming favorite? He's just a ball striking machine. He hits it super long and straight. His iron game is incredible and really his only weakness right now has been his

putting but it seems like the last couple of weeks he changed to a different putter and that's helped him out a ton. And he's basically either won or been second in his last few events. And I think what he did on the final round of the players shooting, I don't exactly know what number, but maybe seven or eight under to come back and win the putts he's made. I mean, he's just firing in all cylinders right now. Who else do you like this weekend?

I really like Xander. I know he gets a lot of crap for not being able to finish out tournaments and win more often, but he's playing such good golf. He's had good success at that tournament. I think he finished second in 2019 to Tiger or something around that. And he's been playing awesome. And I know he's definitely one of the favorites there too. So if you had, you mentioned Scheffler just as ball striking. I think the answer is always, hey, if you could be a lead at any part of the game, everybody's going to pick putting.

Unless I'm wrong on that one, you can correct me. That is the old saying is the driver show putt for dough. Stats will actually tell you it's actually quite the opposite. Okay. Now I'm interested. Tell me. If you look at, there's this thing called strokes gained metric. It's much better stats than, it's like advanced metrics in the NBA.

It actually shows you instead of just kind of your standard field goal percentage and whatnot. If you look at the most important metric is actually your iron game. That is the most important for success in golf. And then right after that is driving. And then after that, it's around the greens, pretty similar to driving. And then putting is actually kind of last. that it's around the greens, pretty similar to driving. And then putting is actually kind of last. But to win a tournament, you do need to make a lot of putts. So it's a weird, it's kind of weird, but for overall consistency and to be like top of the leaderboard week in and week out, your iron game approach to the green is the most important.

I didn't realize this until it just happened, but, uh, home was paired with tiger later today. Have you played with tiger? I have not. I have not. I've, I've had lunch with them a couple of times just because he was sitting next to another buddy of mine and I kind of just joined him, um, as an excuse. But, uh, unfortunately I've never been paired with Tiger.

I think as a professional golfer, you have a bit of, you know, your entree into that conversation is a little bit easier than the rest of us. So I'm sure that was fine. Yeah, I'm excited about that. I'm excited now to make sure I dial that in a little bit later today. So if you look at, because I saw an interview where you were talking about like your interest in coming over from Seoul and coming to the States and being in San Diego and it's like right around 2000, Tiger's blowing up, your dad gets you into golf, the whole deal. And then it's like, okay, you know, you took it really seriously to get the point of Cal and beyond everything we're talking about here. But like Tiger obviously introduced a new version of golfer where you're like, hey, you might be even better at this sport if you actually work out and shock.

If you're stronger, it's better. Flexibility, strength, taking care of your body. These things all apply to this sport too. So we've had a long run now of, of golfers all taking this really seriously. And you know, the equipment advances are just always going to happen because that's what happens. You get idiots like me to be like, yeah, I'll try those irons out.

So what I'd ask is like in basketball, because I know you're a big basketball guy, you wonder if the game has been solved, but also broken with what we prioritize, then you can get to the aesthetics of it. You know, baseball is certainly struggling with this stuff too. But I don't know what the next step is and there will be some other advancement, but I watching basketball now in the NBA, I'm like, I don't.

Like all of a sudden we have something where it's like, Hey, actually this whole three point thing didn't make any sense. I don't think that that's going to happen. It's just going to be maybe a more pronounced version of what we're seeing now. I remember when Darrell Mori, he was theorizing with his G League team, he was like, I want to just see maybe they're only allowed to shoot threes and then see what happens. And everybody thought he was nuts. And you're like, actually, Darrell's probably making a pretty astute point. Just like, let's get in the test lab here with it. Let's go ahead, shoot 83s again. Has golf kind of maximized

like this generation of golfers like is this kind of what it is? Like I can't, it can't be beyond physically what your generation is doing now, right? Like I don't imagine we're ever going to see this kind of jump from what we had in the 90s to what we've seen in the last 20 years. It's definitely similar, like whether you wanna talk NBA, NFL, or even baseball, where like the numbers have dictated how we play the game,

you know, with threes in the NBA or throwing more in NFL, or, you know, kind of going for home runs and baseball, it's, you know, for golf, it has meant we hit way more drivers than we used to. Even on holes where, like, you just hit like a forearm and like on a shorter hole, you just lay up with a forearm and hit it to your number and try to make greens or make birdies that way. Now it's, you know, what, what a lot of these guys call bomb and gouge. We just hit driver as far as we can and kind of go from there because the numbers show

statistically like that's the better way to play because you know, that, that four iron that, um, that you're trying to hit in the fairway doesn't go in the fairway a hundred percent. Now you're really behind the eight ball. And so there was this distance boom along with the technology that lets us hit driver a lot straighter than we used to before. And you know, I'm sure, well, they're talking a lot about rolling the ball back, making the ball go shorter, maybe making the driver be less easy to hit. Um, and so they might, the rules might kind of cut back on that, but you know,

there has, I do feel like we are. Trying to, you know, play the game as efficiently as possible. And I really, I don't know if there's another massive step that we can take. Yeah, that was an awesome answer. So far, what's the best point of your career professionally? Probably the two week stretch of me winning the John Deere Classic. And then, you know, that automatically got me

into the British Open. And so you take a plane from the John Deere straight to where it was Carnoosti, played a lot of Carnoosty. Just that two week stretch was definitely like golf was actually easier for, for just about two weeks at that point. That was definitely the best. Well, we're rooting for you, man. And I appreciate your support on the pod over the years.

And, you know, Max had told me, he's like, Oh yeah, you got it. You got to have them on. And it was just random. I hit you up. I was had told me, he's like, oh yeah, you gotta have them on. And it was just random. I hit you up, I was like, yeah, you gotta come on at some point.

I know it wasn't the next day, but this was good timing and hopefully we'll see you in the field next year. So thanks so much, dude. Appreciate it. I'm a big fan of you guys, thanks. You want details? Fine. I drive a Ferrari, 355 Cabriolet. What's up? I have a ridiculous

house in the South Fork. I have every toy you can possibly imagine. And best of all, kids, I am liquid. So now you know what's possible. Let me tell you what's required. The email address is lifeadvicerr at gmail.com. What is up to Saruti and welcome back Kyle in a non-video friendly shirt pattern. Wow, we're off to the races. It's really great to be back. Is this not good for video? Stripes.

Yeah, it's tough. So no stripes on video. Doesn't matter. Wow, sorry. I'll write that one down. No stripes on video. At least not for these guys. All right.

It's not really a rule. It's just an observation. Is drug rug an offensive term because that's kind of the material it's made out of? I don't know what it's actually called. I'm not a film. I don't know, but we're about to find out. Good IT on that.

Yeah, I don't know. How long were you guys gone? How long were you in Phoenix? I felt like too long It felt like too long. I think that's where we started. I think it was I think it was four days We went Airbnb route saved the company some money Had a putting green which I mean I spent like that though love that be with you and yeah I was gonna say that's what that's love that dudes came over Harry came over You know as you guys know. Harry the Harry. Like Harry what's his last name Harry? Against the odds Harry.

I just know AO Harry yeah. Yeah so he came over it was great. Chefed it up got some nice steaks from Whole Foods on the grill there. Grass-fed. It was really really nice the airbnb people were like yeah do what you want like it wasn't like there's, there was no like, you know, long list of rules. It was just, uh, people in Phoenix are pretty chill. It's like a work bachelor party. Anything get broken? Nothing got broken. Not one thing.

So let's talk about the video that I retweeted, Kyle in the wild, where it's you doing a bit of a good fellows run through. Little tracking shot there. Yeah, tracking shot you with Tate and you're in that nice kind of cool guy section of all the media row stuff. And then the first row of the actual people in attendance. So you're cutting through there, you've got your passes.

So clearly you're verified. And then you say hi to iron Eagle who's terrific. All right. My last encounter with iron Eagle, I saw him at net Celtics, said, hello, after what's up Sarah Kustak, huge fan of Tom Cruise and the survivor series. And so when I said hello to iron, I was like, Hey, can we get you on the pod before the final four?

He's like, ah, I don't want to do that. He's like, maybe after. And I was like, well, we're not going to want you after. He's like, hey, can we get you on the pod before the final four? He's like, ah, I don't want to do that. He's like, maybe after. And I was like, well, we're not gonna want you after. He's like, exactly. Yeah, dude. Which was just an awesome back and forth. It was like, all right, we're done here. Even though I've casually known him

for a very, very long time. You met him, you were really excited. I think that's the most excited I've ever seen. Anyone to meet IE Eagle. Then what happened? Well, my fly was down and I didn't. It was like you know was the first run into the arena and I was like let me definitely use the bathroom before and I don't

know. I just was like was that not a great zip? Let me check now that we're like through the scrum. Because the thing I did right before that was, you know, leave the bathroom. And I was really happy and you know, we were mic'd up obviously, but like we didn't know if Ian was gonna recognize us. He's been on the pod twice and he said nice things about Tate, but you know,

like maybe Ian's just like on autopilot there and he doesn't even know who we are. We're like, this is a good test. He does it. I'm very excited. I think I was something like, that's a win. Or we were very happy. And then I just kind of like, you know, grazed down to just like, let me just check. That would be crazy if my fly was down, right?

It was the last thing I did. And lo and behold, it was open. And, you know, it's just not what you want. Not what you want when you're with the capital J's at the final four in the nice section. So also the, in hindsight, the Harley Davidson shirt probably could have probably could have been picked a little differently. So glad we got there. It was a relatively new shirt. This is obviously a new shirt.

I'm just a new shirt guy. I get it and I feel like I got to wear it around. You're in a new shirt run. I've been there. I love it. Just got a suit for the Wooden Awards the other day, so I'll be in a suit tomorrow. Are you nominated for something? No, we just, you know, we got a long a long standing relationship with the wooden rewards, uh, one signing

podcast. So we're, uh, I, he said that I performed well last year. There was no, no issues. They have a fantastic open bar, no questions asked. Um, and everything we kept it all in check and they liked us and they have, they'll have us back. So if you ever need like Edie scouting things, I'm sure he'll be there. If you want me to like, there. Where did you get the Harley Davidson? And that's not just a Harley Davidson t-shirt. That's like the Harley Davidson Columbia stuff. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That was in Vegas at the FETSALS, like Vegas watch party week one, I bought it. It was

actually the same comedy club we were at. And I remember like, oh, I got to check out that Harley Davidson store. That's right by this thing. I got it, popped it on midday too, just did a complete outfit change and everyone loved that shirt, so. I got a Harley connection. Do you really?

Yeah, on Cape Cod. Yeah, no. He's my guy Bob, Cape Cod, was talking to him the other day. I really like the specific Harley shirts, like the one, like some from like weird, some place in like Florida or something. And it's like Harley-Davidson of the Everglades or something.

It's those are, that's my jam. Do you have any followups? Sort of. Not particularly. And obviously shockingly, not a Harley Davidson guy. Um, not that I'm, you know, anti-motorcycle, whatever, just didn't grow up with them, didn't know not my style, but honestly, you know, Kyle is, I've noticed a lot of camp colors for Kyle.

Is that a camp power too? Like, like the lay flat kind of thing. Yeah. Like lay flat power guy. Just maxed and relaxing at all times. Tommy Bahama, uh, Harley Davidson. Is that kind of what's like, I don't even know what, how to work with a large man.

Polo for that. Yeah. Okay. That's fair. Same with, same with Nautica too. Really Nautica. Yep. Yeah. It's okay, that's fair. Same with Nautica too, really. Nautica, yeah. Yeah, it's good stuff.

Simple guy. Yeah, my guys are over at Cape Cod, Harley Davidson, tell them Rusilo sent ya. Will do. 15% off. Yeah, I'm thinking about it. Probably not, probably not. Maybe a high five and how you doing.

When Kyle was walking around, and I promise we could do a couple emails here, but I just think this is too good. And you see this and then everyone loves it. Your approval rating is very, very high. I have a theory about like publicly consumed things. No matter what it is, there is the unobtainable universal praise where you may have it for a little while, maybe Morgan Freeman, and then there's a branch of universal praise to wait, is this guy actually good doubt that zags the universal praise and then there is zero praise. And then there's the universal praise to wait, is this guy actually good? Doubt that zags the universal praise.

And then there is zero praise. And then there is not what you are, the worst category, irrelevance. Like that's what I think about the Caitlin Clark stuff of her being criticized by all these other players, which I feel like is just, Hey, we do a lot of the same stuff. We can get into whatever category you fall into, but ultimately, hey, we do a lot of the same stuff. We can get into whatever category you fall into, but ultimately like a lot of us do all of the same stuff.

And to me, that was a moment of like, Hakelin Clark arriving. You're like, hey, it's just like the NBA. Like all these other people are gonna be threatened by you and dump on you. And then people try to tell me that I was wrong because it was a specific category of that. No, she's in college and then that doesn't happen.

And then immediately Draymond Green shit on Zach Edie like 48 hours later. And so the point is, it's like, no, I'm not wrong on this one. Don't find something that is right. And then immediately go, well, here's how you could potentially be wrong sent. Which is what a lot of us do. The reason I give you that whole three slash four tiers of publicly consumed content, whatever it is you're doing, is that your approval rating was incredibly high in the Harley Davidson shirt, also with your fly

down being pumped about iron Eagle, then trying to adjust your crotch as you headed to the tunnel with tape. Everybody loved it. Everybody loved it. And I started thinking about like the Kyle in the wild series, but I think this is the part that would happen with the talent department with Kyle is they would say, we don't know though. Is he a one?

Is he a one? He would say he's not a one. And maybe that's the kind of one you need though. It's like the guy who- You don't think you're a one? You think you're a two? Do you think you're a three? I mean, I don't think I would be lower than a three,

but I think there's a definitely debate to be had about a two, yeah. So you know you're not a one. That's what you're saying right now. Yeah. Yeah. I haven't pitched the Kyle show. You know what I mean?

Like I don't. The other thing is like I don't envy you guys at all for like having to have opinions. You know, I can kind of be like, yeah, I don't really know anything about that. And people are like, yeah, checks out. Like that sounds right. He doesn't know anything about that. And he's not saying anything about that. So like that's that's kind of where I like to be and you can't really be a number one

with that sort of attitude. So you know. Okay now Saruti you're kind of also in management which is one of my favorite things about Saruti. Give us your talent scouting report on if Kyle's a one two or three. I think your instinct is right. I think because sometimes I feel the same way too. Like I, you know, I posted a show before I posted many shows before I don't always feel like a one either. Sometimes I feel like I'm better as like a complimentary dude. Kyle, I think is the ultimate complimentary dude is everybody likes him whenever he's around vibes are higher and he says funny shit. So like there's, there's like, it's the perfect, it's like, make your corner three years.

You're not an asshole, but you're like the Draymond green. You're just the perfect role player of whatever you're asked to do in these situations. So that, you know, not to say that like you should, your ceiling should be any lower or whatever. I don't think like that. That's just, I think you're good at doing what you're doing. And sometimes knowing that you're good at what you are, what you're good at is kind of half the battle. So I, I, I agree with Kyle. Was that just a nice shot up and dribble? No, I'm kidding.

That's a joke. I do. I'm, I, when you say though, like I, and those are three jobs, maybe not a two joke. When, when you say, I, uh, I envy people who don't have to give opinions like that's the thing. Cause like, you know, that shit, when you see that stuff in the timelines, it's blowing up, like your email, your Twitter's blowing up because you said something or did something wrong.

That sucks. And like that's how you end up, yeah. Three times a week you're gonna have to do this for X amount of hours. If you're a two hour show guy, that's a lot of thoughts you gotta have. Yeah, and you could find a lane where it's just like, I say a couple of funny things and people like me

and like, you know, I'm a good vibe, good hang. Like that's awesome. I think a lot of people are happy you're not trying to be ones. Like if you know you're a two and me and like, you know, I'm a good vibe, good hang. Like that's, that's like, that's awesome. I think a lot of people are happy or not trying to be ones. Like if you know you're a two and you're like, hey, I'm a two, like Seruti was a two on his radio show. He didn't, he wanted to be a zero. It was like, I didn't even want to do this, man. The Seruti joke of she didn't even go here that I never get every single time. As somebody that was told that was face, he was never going to be a one and was only a two.

Like that was the worst thing you could have said to me, but I'm happy somebody said it because they're like, you're kind of a two. I was like, no, I'm not. Well, you just hear even like in my early like pod, like producing stuff, there was just like those producers that like clearly think they should be in front of the mic. It's like, everyone can see it. No one likes it. Even if you're not saying it overtly, it's gonna be the things that you do.

And I'm like, all right, well, make sure that's never you because that's the last thing I need. The brother Nero's of content. Yeah, tough nice. All right, all right, let's get to some emails here. But look, Kyle, I'm just telling you, if you ran for office, if you were elected, I think would be the real test of your approval rating.

But I was going to have to find out because I'm a big, big number two guy and that didn't come out right. Let's get this up emails. Nice. That was a number one joke. That was good. Okay. Let's get this in emails. This one is about Hinge. The two married guys, you guys, I'm gonna need one of you to get divorced to get back out there so you can help with some of this stuff. So just maybe playing that seed. What's up guys?

Five eight, player cop, a short Ty Jerome. I love Ty Jerome's game. Love it. I'll get right to it. I'm 25 single, pretty opposed to dating apps. However, recently a couple of my friends convinced me to download Hinge.

There's a bunch of prompts you can fill out to describe yourself a bit. One of them is a poll where you can write in whatever topic you want and have options to vote on. Do you guys know about this? I think so. I was kind of on Hinge. I had a small stint with Hinge,

I'm more familiar with Tinder. One of the most popular polls from the girls is Ryan Gosling versus Ryan Reynolds. Who votes for Reynolds in that option? Anyway, you'd honestly be shocked. Blake Lively, probably. Yeah, she did. She, yeah, good point. Counterpoint, Blake Lively. You'd honestly be shocked by how many girls have it. Being a huge sports guy and fan of the pod and perhaps I'm just kidding. No votes is low. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding.

I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding.

I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding.

I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. I'm't even know who that is vote. Like a classic bad looking. I'm just kidding. No votes is low. That's about the lowest number you can have. I didn't make curiosity vote.

Yeah, right. But we can consider that a team failure as I'm sure the rest of my profile has something to do with it. Oh wow, taking blame a leader here. Basically, is this the dumbest prompt you can imagine or should I stick with it and hope there's a 25 year old Rosillo stand out there for me? Um, and PS, we are going to say this.

If you're a mid twenties girl in Charlotte who loves the pod, maybe reach out to life advice and Kyle would be nice enough to connect us. You know what? We will. Oh yeah. We'll do it. Chances are nine of them will be fake, but we'll try to sort through those a little bit stricter.

When you cast a wide net, I mean. Yeah, right. Yeah. So we'll try to help you out if you're out there. All right. Hmm. Okay. I think we have two good ones and we haven't really even started. So we gave you a lot of Kyle because we missed them. 28, 5'10", 170, 200 bench, 275 squat, big home gym guy, basketball comp, poor man Shane Larkin. Shane Larkin was a fucking athletic kid. I hope you know what you're talking about. I got married this past fall to my long-term girlfriend. We met right at the end of our freshman year of college.

We've been together ever since. I'm a lucky dude. She's a high lottery pick type when it comes to what you're looking for in a partner. Always a good time, minimal drama, a kind person, a full on smoke show. We live in a city where a majority of my friends moved to post college. We have great late 20s social life with happy hours. Dive bar, if the rest of the emailers are not depressed. Group dinners, occasional house parties, but mainly like it was like,

what's this guy's problem, but mainly with my core group of guys and their girlfriends and wives, her core group of girls live in a different city across the state. Okay. So it's his core group is the social structure. Her girls are somewhere else and it sucks for her that we spend most of our time around my friends. She does like the wives rotating group of girls

that my friends are with, but it's just not her main group. We do travel to see her friends as much as we can, but you get the point. Yeah, life. Right. Six months ago, one of her best friends moved about an hour away from us for a job in a much more

suburban area than ours. She doesn't know anyone there. So as a result, she's been spending a shitload of time at my house. She's a solid hang and makes my wife happy to have around, but it started off with just a weekend every month or so, and it snowballed into every weekend. She now even throws in the random weekday night sleepover when she has a date in the city or at a random event, it's got to be too much. She even jokes that she should just move in another layer.

During the first few trips, I would pick up her dinner tab and drinks throughout the night and that's fine, but she's got to be in the city or at a random event. It's got to be too much. Even jokes that she should just move in. Another layer, during the first few trips I would pick up her dinner tab and drinks throughout the night. That's fine every now and then, but it's become expected that I pick up her whole tab. God, the first transaction is always the one that sets the tone, right boys? Which is probably encouraging her to take continued, increase the frequency of her visits. I think you understand what we're trying to say there. I'm overall happy. Yeah, right. I mean, she's fucking NIL deal. Um, new in-law. So I'm overall happy that my wife has a good friend to hang out with. My desired outcome is not that she never comes over, but how do I go about getting

this dial back without hurting my wife or offending her friend? She sends a picture of both to confirm, but also to show us that they're both. Really hot. So congrats. Definitely. Definitely. That was a part of that pie chart. Yeah.

He's like, Hey, by the way, they're wicked hot. Here's a pic. Uh, it's probably a lot of guys just being like, this is you're paying the tax, man, sorry. You have everything else is 10 in your life. So, you know, well, things is zero. The miscommunication is that she's getting the full host treatment. Right.

That's the issue here. Like that hasn't been dialed back. And it's like, you know, like at a certain point, you're not like, Hey, can I get you anything after, you know, you're here every weekend and you know, sometimes on Wednesdays. So I think there's gotta be some sort of way that you can like, not explicitly say, but like set the tone where it's like, you're not, you're not a tier one guest here. You're like, you know, you're like not really knocking anymore. You're kind of just opening the door. You know what I mean? So like, maybe there's a way you can, I don't know.

Can you start making jokes? Like, can you, can you like say, hey, like, wow, you really are on scholarship at this house for the last few, you know, like make a couple of subtle jabs at her. Like don't be a Dick about it, but like make it known that, wow, you're really kind of like just a part of this thing now and see how that goes, maybe talk it over with your wife first, but you got a weekend dish shift over here. Yeah. A couple. Yeah.

Yeah. Oh, good. Yeah. I was just going to put all that together. That's great. Great call. Yeah. I could just give her a pile of laundry and say,

hey, you know, I can fold it self. Hey, when you come over this weekend, you think you could get those big contractor leave bags? Cause we've got a big project coming up. They're picking up the leaves on Sunday and I just really could use some help. So when you show up on your normal time, can you just come with those big bags?

Like maybe there's something you could do just to be like, Just straight up ask her if she wants to split the cable bill, you know? You're kind of part of the family, right? This one's tough, but it starts with the wife. You can't go to the friend first. Yeah, you're right.

You have to. They'll team up on you. If your wife is this cool, it's starting to add up. Like, what are you more worried about? The pop-ins that it's every weekend? I mean, especially when it's new and it's your wife, like you don't want somebody there all the time. Like, you'll probably stop having sex in like five years, but, uh,

I would guess that there's just all different things that are happening right now where it's like, I just started my life. Even though you've been with her for a long time, every 20 and now that means you've been with her for like 10 years, but like, you've just started the adult phase of your life and this whole thing. And you would hope the other person is at least self aware enough to realize, but she could be selfish because she's really upset how, how bored and lonely she is so far away. Right.

In the beginning it's like, Oh, cool. She has her friend. But if you're thinking about her perspective is like the only social outlet I have is to go over there, but you hope you get that figured out later in life. Like we've already covered this of the couple of times where I was just so young that I didn't even understand like what a taker I was being and just say, Hey, my buddies who actually have real nine to fives and I'm visiting from another

town and I still don't really have anything going on in my life. And it's like, yeah, I'm going to go off four nights in a row and yeah, I may like bring somebody back and like, what do you, what the fuck's your problem? What do you guys know about Billy Bob's like, yeah, I'm going to go off four nights in a row. And yeah, I may like bring somebody back and like, what do you, what the fuck's your problem? What do you guys know about Billy Bob's getting some good, getting some good reviews from Billy Bob's on Thursdays.

What's wrong with you? Yeah. Yeah. Like you guys aren't going out on Wednesday. Like I'm in town. What's wrong with you guys? They're like, cause I have a fucking job. You know?

So, uh, this is a little different, you know, cause you're, you're getting closer to 30 here, but she may not have anything else as far as the tabs. You can just go to your wife and go, Hey, look, I shouldn't have to like take everybody out. Maybe you make up some story. Yeah. My, my husband, your wife goes to the friends, like he got murdered day trading this month.

All right. So at least there's some weird fake excuse. And all of a sudden you'd hope that she would kind of figure it out. But then of course, that some people just are, like they're psyched to be takers. They're just thrilled to go through life being complete takers. I don't know enough about her.

Like, is this in her background? Is this something she normally does? Or is it this very specific time in her life where she kind of needs this right now and your wife knows she needs it and it any all of these things that come up you hey tell your wife everything you just told us and it'll be cool not a big deal but that's not why we have these discussions because you're trying to balance all of these different things and i think you have to figure out like would your

wife come to an agreement? Cause it's obviously excessive. So we're on your side, but would your wife say, Hey, you're right. And this is kind of what she does. Or will your wife say, Hey, she needs this right now. And you know, we're going to be together forever. And this is just a moment in time that we have to be supportive of her. And I don't cause I don't know your wife,

I don't know what that answer is gonna be, but I think that's the game that you're playing here. Because if you went to her friend and not your wife, there's no way that goes well. Because no one wants to be- What do you mean by that? What exactly did you mean by that? Nobody wants to be told they're fucking up

even when they're fucking up, which we will use as a story for the next email. I've got one suggestion. Could you maybe try to convince her to do a home and home thing? Like, why don't you go over there? It's way easier to meet new friends when it's more than one person. So you guys go and you've got to get her set up her first weekend at college, like how she's doing in her apartment.

She can show you around her part of town. You just do that for the weekend. Maybe you do the trade off and then you're like, hey, maybe we could, you know, sidle up to a group of girls and we'll just get you started or something like, you know, on a Friday night. I don't know. But maybe you could convince her like, listen, as much as she's coming out here,

she's not spending time building a life there. So maybe, you know, this weekend and then, you know, two weeks later, you go there. What do you think about that? So there might be a way to like do some positive, take some positive steps without like, you know, making it seem like you're just grumpy and don't want people around

and people have to tiptoe around you. Our guy's right here. Our guy's totally right. Like, so that's, no one's gonna listen to this being like, he needs to be more understanding here. It's just the matter of what, what's your strategy to put this to the most amicable end or wean off of this,

the methadone of this living arrangement here's the other thing yeah any like decently catch guys who are looking for a girlfriend because that's an easy way to solve that problem most efficient answer that was that was the efficiency of a one right I don't have anything to say I could try to poke a hole in it but I really just can't. Yeah, and she's ridiculous, by the way. Is she in Charlotte? Yeah. Yeah. It took you a while. It took you a while on that one.

So good luck, man. Let us know how that goes. All right, last one. Learning to be more confrontational. Came to the right guys. Yes. What's up, long time. 59, 189.

189. Let us know what you weigh tomorrow. 29 years old. Haven't been hitting the gym recently, except for some quick body weight stuff here and there. Been keto for the last six months on top of playing basketball four days a week. Wow.

Oh, I've lost 33 pounds. That's why it's so specific. So feeling good. Player of comp, late career, Evan Turner, with the light dusting of Rondo on the fast break and Marcus Smart on defense. Do you hold up every single offensive possession in transition after a miss? Now for my issue at hand, all my life, I've been a

very even keeled guy, never too high, never too low. It's definitely a characteristic trait. All my friends know I'm the one who's going to be focused and calm in a moment of crisis or panic. I'm always the guy breaking up a fight or deescalating in a tense situation. Those are the positive sides of it. On the negative side, I'm so anti-confrontational

that I don't feel like I stick up for myself. I'm not to Saruti's level. I actually will send food back at a restaurant. See, that's the thing, is Saruti's like non-confrontational in some things very specifically, but he can be confrontational when he's fucking had it with you. I would say when he was younger,

but now I think you're very, I think you're non-confrontational, Seruity, in like the healthiest way possible. Like I admire your lane of like, all right, go ahead. And I went through a, not a physically confrontational phase, but just like a, you know,

I like to poke the bear, to be honest, and like to like pick arguments that didn't fucking matter. And then you just kind of one day realize that none of that matters. What am I doing? I'm just wasting my time. So that's why I can be viewed as passive sometimes where I'm just like, none of this is really worth most of my time. But yeah, plenty of stuff pisses me off still. Did you ever insult celebrities on social media? Never, never, never. Kyle? Um, no, I don't think so. I really don't think so. Probably not.

But almost definitely not. Okay. But it's really squarely in the, uh, in the ranks of the normalize no campaign still, right? We're all like, we all understand that. That's, I think we could all be better that way. Can you expand on that? No.

Yeah. See, that's it. I don't have to tell you why. Like that's a, you know, a lot of it became when people asking you for money and stuff, but you can, you can expand that into, into the rest of your life. Just say no, you don't have to say why.

Yeah, I think Saruti's non-confrontational thing is just, I'm not gonna waste the time on this. And it's not because you're afraid of it. I think it's cause you just go, man, fuck it. You want to get worked up about this? Go ahead. And honestly, a lot of us could learn from that. But anyway, our guy will send food back. It's not cooked all the way. But I do it in an overly apologetic way. The problem now is that I'm starting my own business, real estate property management

company related services like landscaping, plowing. And one of the keys to selling your services is rejection handling. I find myself so petrified at times in the thought of getting rejected that it can take me weeks to get started on the most basic outreach. Then at the first sign of someone being annoyed that I'm trying to sell them something, I shrivel up. I know I should be laser focused on continuing to persuade and try to offer value in some way, but I just default to ending the conversation so they don't get more annoyed. How have you guys dealt with similar anxieties? Maybe Suri has some insight. I don't get the impression that Brian has ever given two shits about other people's opinion in this way.

I'd love to be more like that. Did you in any way consciously develop that? I think the guy telling you he's never cared about anybody, I don't know, I think that guy's like almost like more insecure and lying to you because there's definitely been phases, especially when you do what I do. Like for me to pretend I don't care what people think of what I say would be a fucking lie. So that's not true. Now I would say in the non, like the day to day

part of me that has nothing to do with the job. I'm less concerned, uh, in general, but that's also just becoming a little bit older and maybe being happy about where you're at in life. Uh, so specific to like what you're talking about, like that's, that sounds like a bad match. Like when I had a coal call and sell minor league baseball tickets, like I didn't have any choice, man. I didn't, I had 12,000 bucks salary. I was already like in debt when I showed up. So every month I kept

working, I was poorer and more fucked. But at that kind of level of desperation, it's like, you better get on the phone. Of course, they left the part out where they keep all of your commissions until September, which I didn't really realize. They still want me to come back. And if you quit before then, then you're forfeit them or something like that? Yeah. With 20, 22 years of interest, by the way, if the Trent and Thunder want to do the math on that. So, like at that point, it's like, hey,, you want to eat the, again, the irony being that all the supposed commission that I was making never

even made. But if you're in a spot where you're selling your services and you're in this field landscaping and you've got to convince somebody and they're going to tell you like, no, because the first thing you do when you get a call from somebody that's selling you something is your basic instinct is just not to want to listen to the person anymore. Even if you're sometimes interested in that service,

you have to figure out a way to get over that. This isn't confrontation with a coworker. This isn't confrontation at a restaurant or at a gym like I just had, which I guess I'll tell the story, even though this is a long one. This is a confrontation for your own financial health. So what's a greater motivator to get over it than you being successful in this? Because if you can't get over that, you're not going to be successful. Coal calling and selling is like different

than maybe pricing and all these different things. And I would tell you, like most homeowners and people looking for the service, they're just so lost when they get an estimate that the number of people are gonna push back on the estimate is such a low number that you shouldn't worry about that part of it. But getting your foot in the door,

like the only thing I could tell you is try to find a way to disarm. Like sometimes if it's a topic with a guest where I wanna ask them the question they a guest where I want to ask them the question they probably don't want me to ask, I'll do a bit of a preamble to kind of disarm them from shutting me down. And I think you could probably apply that to a little bit of like, Hey, look, I get it, you know, handing out flyers and whatever, but new business, new guy

say I'm starting a family. Who knows if that's even true, but you get my point. Like disarm their human reaction of completely rejecting you in the best way possible. But I am obviously worried about you laying out your personality traits and then entering into something where you have to be not ruthless, but you have to be like, non-apologetic about everything. Any one of my friends that started their own business, they were fucking annoying in the beginning, but annoying with like a real purpose. And a lot of those guys that worked out for him, because they knew like, I'll be shameless in the beginning. Right. Right.

Yeah. I mean, it sounds like you're not a natural salesman, which is tough. Cause I'm not a natural sale. I was like a natural helper of customers, you know, like the first time baseball mom, like didn't bring the kid, but like, I got to get him a cup of bat and a glove. And I'm like, well, about how tall is he? Like I'm happy, like, but like to upsell people and like convince them, that's not my, that's not my gig, you know, the protection plan. I was always terrible at selling the protection. Right. Cause they're like, but there are upsell people and like convince them things. That's not my, that's not my gig, you know? The protection plan.

I was always terrible at selling the protection plan. Right. But there are some people that are. So, I mean, unfortunately it sounds like your best move would be to hire a salesman who like lives and breathes this shit. But if it's a new business, you probably have to do all that stuff yourself. Cause you're selling you the company, right? Your business probably isn't huge.

So if that's, if it's not an option to bring somebody on the team who's like, this is what I do. I get it done, and we'll all eat because we're talking commissions or something, that's tough. Maybe you have to go to like, I mean, this sounds silly, but maybe like a therapist to just be like, how do I get over this thing about this gross feeling inside where I can tell they don't want this for me, but I have to get it out?

Like, what do I, because it's something you just have to get over, right? And the lucky people already have it. But yeah, I don't know. I think there's got to be some sort of book you can read or talk you can listen to or, you know, whatever. But I think you got to like, you got to get over whatever that is that's stopping you from like, just hammering home your points to everyone. I think you got to be because I'm a terrible salesman too. I can never sell cars. I can never sell anything. Just not good at it. I don especially don't believe it if i do believe in it like you tell me no like i'm gonna probably. I'll fuck up yeah i can't thank you.

What do you like i would say like what i would want from somebody who like you know you're offering services that people need is like you're being like a pain in the ass so like be quick. Tell me why in like very simply why like you pain in the ass. So like be quick, tell them why, and like very succinctly why like you will be able to help their life be better, you know? Sell that and then if they, if it's still like, I don't know, maybe, because there's a lot of times too, like it's not an outright no, it's like, I don't know, like maybe blah, blah,

have a follow-up plan, literature, whatever, give them a card, something that they can go to for later on. Because you know, you're going to be able to persuade someone who doesn't want to have a conversation with the first place. But be quick, be succinct, be impactful right away. And then if you have some sort of thing, I don't know whether it's like a,

I don't think people even use cards these days, who knows. But some way for them to contact you later or think about your business when they actually do need whatever you need, that's the best way to do it. Because I've done that where people have tried to sell me stuff right away and I didn't need it but then like, all right, it's in the back of my mind for the next time that I need like a power washer or somebody to do some landscaping around the house or somebody to deliver rocks

like a homeowner. I'm doing all this bullshit in the backyard. It's about to be spring. I've got all these projects planned out. I don't want to do all of them. But I basically met the guy who does a lot of the stuff around the house because he was starting a family and I think we saw a flyer or we chatted, he chatted with my wife or something and that resonates. So, you know, you might,

even if you get rejected right away, it still lives in the back of people's minds. Just be nice, be normal, be a normal dude. And yeah, man, the life story stuff does help too. So if you've got anything going on, like, Hey, I'm just, you know, I'm starting this thing out. I'm trying to build a business. Like, you know, this is what I could do for you. That stuff goes a long way. Maybe you could John Taffer it too. Like you come in there and you're just like, this guy knows everything.

He's like, listen, there's 24,000 yards in this town and there's only 18 contractors that service the area. Do you really think that they'll like, maybe you could just come in like, wow, this guy knows his stuff. Like I should probably go with him. And what I'd really like to do is emphasize Santa Fe's history with the way we're going to use our mulch that's specific to this neighborhood. I'm worried about you, man, because you're talking about fear of rejection that will stall your entire outreach.

Like it just First of all, no one cares. Okay, like if you if you apply that to more things in life, we'd all be a lot happier. You going up asking, do you want me to do some work at your house and them saying no, who fucking cares? What does that mean? What does that actually mean? It doesn't mean anything. It doesn't mean then this relationship is ruined

with some stranger that doesn't wanna work on your house. It doesn't matter. You're almost likely never going to interact with that person again. When I had to do health insurance consulting, I wasn't even selling the insurance. I was selling ourselves, our company. Because again, two guys started the company. I was their first employee. The only reason they hired me is because they didn't have to pay me anything. And I was still bartending at night. But I don't know if the emailer is competitive, not competitive or whatever. But like at that point it was like, all right, I got a cold call. I got

to show up. I got to do these things. I might as like, I have a choice here. I can be bad at this. I don't want to do this. I don't want this to be my career. It actually is bumming me out a little bit. Or I can be like, all right, why don't you just be good at it? Let's see if you can be good at it. And once I decided that that was it, like I can drive to the middle of fucking nowhere in St. Albans, Vermont, and pitch some bus company to let us be their consultant. All right. So if I'm going to put on the one TJ Maxx suit that I have and I'm going to drive

all the way up there and spend money on fucking gas and go meet with these people. Well, why am I going gonna do a bad job? Why am I gonna, you know? I mean, I know that sounds like a little too simplistic, but like, once you get it there and you walk into your suite, you're like, all right, turn it the fuck on. Get them to sign this piece of paper.

And what we were selling was, I know I've told some versions of the story before, it was like the most absurd thing ever. We weren't even selling a service. We were saying we were gonna be your consultant because technically we were, but it was really about this company getting this 4% kickback from the insurance providers. Like to this day, I still was like, what do we do here? But what do we make?

They're like, you have your license? I was like, yeah, I don't know. I passed a couple of tests. I'm not quite sure what I do. Like, what do you do? It's like, I don't know. I have this whole spiel down. And every time I give the spiel, everybody signs a fucking paper. So I think that's what I do. And it was a real company. I think they sold the company for millions of dollars after the fact, like these guys are really smart, they figured out this thing. So the point is, it's like, to our emailer, you've decided enough

that this is what you want to do. And this is the field that you want to be in. I'm telling you somebody saying that they don't want your services is one of the nicest nos ever. It's not a girlfriend. It's not your wife saying pack up and start your bucket family telling you you're screwing up. It's on a school telling you, you can't come in. It's not you getting fired from your job of all the

life's nose. This is one of the easiest ones to handle because there's another one coming. And you're just gonna have to become numb to all of those knows because there's so many more coming for you in your life. And if you can't get past that, I worry about your long-term success.

I don't think we need to share my story. We went so long here. There'll be another time somebody has a competition and then we'll do it then. Thank you to Saruti. Thanks to Kyle. Thanks to Michael Kim and Jay Kyle, man. But if you get a little Kim momentum for him, the next tournament that he's in and thanks to Wargon for putting this together. Please subscribe to our YouTube channel, Ryan Roussillo. It's very simple, Ryan Roussillo Podcast, where you're Spotify. the must be twenty one older president select states and it was offering online sports wagering in kansas under agreement with kansas dark as you know llc gambling bomb call one hundred gambler visit and all dot com four slash r g in colorado

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