The Ryen Russillo Podcast - The De’Aaron Fox Market, Jimmy Butler’s Value, and Other Trade Possibilities With Chris Mannix. Plus, Why Paul George Is a Problem for Philly.

Episode Date: January 29, 2025

Russillo starts the show by breaking down the 76ers' start to the season, and keys in on Paul George (0:53). Then, he’s joined by Chris Mannix to learn more about De’Aaron Fox’s trade market, discuss Jimmy Butler’s value, explore the possibility of Cam Johnson to OKC, and list their NBA title contenders (13:29). Finally, Life Advice with Kyle (72:28)! Do I tell my friends my wife is getting fake breasts? Check us out on YouTube for exclusive clips, livestreams, and more at https://www.youtube.com/@RyenRussilloPodcast. The Ringer is committed to responsible gaming. Please visit www.rg-help.com to learn more about the resources and helplines available. Host: Ryen Russillo Guest: Chris Mannix Producers: Steve Ceruti, Kyle Crichton, and Mike Wargon Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

We've got a lot of hoops for you. Chris Mannix, the Darren Fox News, potential fits, what those trades would look like to those other teams. Is this even something that's going to happen before the deadline? We've got some stuff on Jimmy Butler, Beal, all the other names that you used to now. But also we're going to take a look at the title contenders and go through the list of like the accepted ones and the group outside of that and our issues with those teams.

I want to talk a little bit about Paul George and what he isn't and why he isn't on the Clippers and why the Clippers deserve a ton of credit for moving on and not doing business the way business is always done. And that relates to a bunch of different stuff we see in the NBAippers and why the Clippers deserve a ton of credit for moving on and not doing business the way business is always done. And that relates to a bunch of different stuff we see in the NBA today and life advice. Enjoy. This episode is brought to you by Amazon Prime. You know, Amazon Prime is not just a shipping subscription, right? Amazon Prime isn't just one thing, but a collection of excellent services. Amazon Prime offers a range of services including Prime Video, Amazon Music, and Prime Fast-Free

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You'll be solving customer challenges faster with agents, winning with purpose, and showing the world what AI was meant to be. Let's create the agent-first future together. Head to salesforce.com slash careers to learn more. Together head to salesforce.com slash careers to learn more. Slow night in the association last night, but I want to talk about the Sixers here a little bit, they beat the Lakers. Sixers have won three in a row. That's exciting. We could go through the schedule stuff and who's playing and who's not playing, but there's some good wins in there.

I still think all right, Cleveland, no, Mowgli, whatever Chicago. I don't think Colby white played Lakers last night, 80 left and they were on the back to back, whatever, man. When you have the Sixers record and are, I would think generally accepted as the biggest disappointment in the league so far, winning three in a row is a good thing. Bronte also played last night for the Lakers. I don't have a ton on that 15 minutes.

It was rough. Oh, five from the floor, the zero three one stat line. Um, they played him, reddit talked about like, look, we had the back to back. We thought maybe there was a nice little energy boost from this. Um, he did say that he put Bronnie in a tough spot. I think that's a coach being nice. I think that's kind of standard operating procedure in the NBA ownership, front office coach, hospitality staff.

Be nice, be nice to our NBA players, right? Because that's the way business is done. I also think he was deflecting a bit for a younger player, which is totally fine and part of the job as well, right? Said he's been playing great in the G League. I'm not gonna get into the semantics here. I don't know that great would be the word that I would use, but I understand, hey, a little bit of energy

and it looked pretty tough. But that's not why I'm here today. I don't know that great would be the word that I would use, but I understand, hey, a little bit of energy and it looked pretty tough, but that's not why I'm here today. I don't wanna talk about that. I've already touched on it. The 76ers, a few things here. They're one game behind the Bulls for the 10th spot in the East.

And even with Embiid out for 32 or 45 games this season, that's unacceptable to be 11th in the East. 18 and 27, the eighth worst record in the NBA. And we could talk about tanking if you want, right? Because I always feel like there's this red hourback philosophy that I always thought was like a really good lesson where he said, a year is not a long time. What he meant by that is like when you're building out your team, you're

thinking about the long-term stuff where like in the moment, it feels like a massive sacrifice to just go, I think it was, it had a lot to do with like drafting bird early, but it was, Hey, if this is something we think like long term is going to help us, like we have to sacrifice today for it. And it's really hard to sacrifice today, especially when it's the day to day of the results in pro sports here. But the tank approach isn't really as much about

the draft class and what you could add to this group, right? If you said like, Hey, we got bad and beat news for us here. Actually, do you have to shut it down? But you know, we're going to just ramp it all back up because that's what the contracts tell us we're going to do.

This is a team of wringing back, maybe add a big pick, but on top of that, the pick is owed to Oklahoma city, as you already know, we're going to just ramp it all back up. Is that's what the contracts tell us we're going to do. This is a team of wringing back, maybe add a big pick. But on top of that, the pick is owed to Oklahoma city, as you already know, because of the horror for Danny Green deal. And that pick is top six protected. So would it make sense? Like if you had another MV setback to go, all right, shut down Paul George and Max you just take 30 shots and maybe we can get into that top four. Well, if you look at the odds this morning of getting into the top four, because

that's how the lottery worked, it was like a 26% chance of getting into that top four. Does it make sense? Does it make sense if you're the Sixers and you're looking at the rest of that group of teams that you'd be competing with against like trying to tank against? Like, could you really make up that kind of ground? I don't know. That'd be tough.

There's a lot of losses coming the second half of the season for a bunch of those teams, especially with the Cooper flag prize, awaiting whoever lands the number one pick. Hell, I'll look at Portland sometimes. They beat Milwaukee last night and I'm like, I don't think they're good, but why is it like every time Portland subs somebody else in,

I'm like, oh yeah, cool. Let's see what he's gonna do tonight. Last night during the Sixers broadcast, we also saw a historic graphic for Embiid, which I understand everybody just dumping on him here. Last night was the 400th missed game of his career. So he's missed 400 and he's played in 446. If you want to be totally fair to Embiid, which I think is important, I don't think they necessarily wanted him playing those first couple years because they were trying to lose some of the games back to the tanking team here. Um, but the way he's played when he's been in the games this year, like you

hope he's hurt because it's been that bad despite him finding a way to still get his numbers. So I don't have more criticism for him be right now on all of this. This off season, we know the 76ers pulled off something that's damn near impossible. Uh, there's nothing that has made NBA fans more excited that is simultaneously massively disappointed them than future cap space. And the Sixers, because the Clippers didn't want to give Paul George a fourth year, found Paul George available for their four years and 200 plus million dollars and said,

we'll do it because this is actually going to work. And you pair that with in theory, the healthy Embiid and nailing the 21st pick in a draft with Maxi and getting a guy who's going to be an all star already has been an all star Maxi at 21. Like all this stuff is really, really hard to do. And then everybody has to play. You've got to see it come together. George didn't play last night. He's got a finger issue. He's missed 15 of 45 games at 34.

We all know this is the worst season he's had in years. You got to go back to like when he still wasn't the fully formed version of Paul George. To be fair, he's played better in January, shot the hell out of the basketball and the 10 games that he's played, the team's been three and seven. I would think that Maxie and the version that you paid for Paul George, the guy that's made multiple all-star teams in recent years of the Clippers, like that should be good enough. I'm not saying top four in the East, but that should be good enough

because it's not like everybody else on the Sixers team is terrible. I thought we spent a lot of time this summer talking about how good of a job they were doing, filling in all these extra roster spots. The Paul George that you thought you were getting for this season with Maxey should be good enough for this team to, I don't know if I'd say out of the

play in range, but closer to six than 11. How about that? Is that fair? But Paul George is going to have a weird career. I think about talking to the kids. I'm probably not going to have. If my son asked me one day and said, what was Paul George like? Papa.

And if my answer always starts with a sigh, I think that's all I really need to do. Do I need to say anything else? There's a few players that I would probably if I had an imaginary kid and said, what was this guy like? Other, other guys, I know I wouldn't say, right? We know how talented he is. We also know he's weird. Like he does a good job on his podcast every now and then they'll pop out. I'm like, what the fuck are you talking about? There's a report last night, Paul George was upset that he hadn't received a tribute video yet on his return that he hadn't received a tribute video yet on his return to Pacers games. And it was actually a good story.

It made the rounds. Like his quote was, yeah, it sucks. It sucks, I've been back this many times and it sucks. Like, why do you care about this stuff? And sometimes I allow myself to think, is somebody that says these things and cares about this kind of stuff, does that mean that like it matches his basketball personality with the size and

the skill and the handle and shooting and all that extra stuff? This is why this guy's still in moments when Embiid wasn't out there and they needed him to be aggressive offensively. It's like, is he out there right now? Like, oh, there he is, over there. So yeah, this hasn't been awesome this year with George, but his thoughts on not having a tribute video kind of mirror

some of the themes I was talking about the beginning of this is that. Tribute videos are nice. NBA players like to be treated nicely. Dwight Howard got a tribute video with the Hawks, and he says from Atlanta, well, he was with the Hawks and he says, he's from Atlanta. Well, he was with the Hawks one season. All right, but that's not even the worst one.

Raul Neto got one from the Wizards. He was there two years. People have a problem with Pat Riley in his comments about Jimmy Butler. Kindness cost $0.00 and zero cents because they're just so shocked that somebody's actually not being nice, even if that player, and again, Paul George isn't Jimmy Butler here, but if even in the Jimmy Butler case, you're like, hasn't been a sick

employee, they can't believe it's like, no, in the NBA, you're just supposed to be nice to everybody the entire time. I like that Pat Riley doesn't care. I know some of you look at it more straightforward that are not on Jimmy Butler's side, right? That are saying Jimmy Butler is under contract and if I have a contract, I have to show up to work. Yeah, and you're probably not like awesome

in the way that Jimmy Butler has been awesome in the past. Like I appreciate everything you're doing over there, wherever you are. But whenever you're doing like the NBA employment dynamic compared to your real world situation, it just never works. The pro athlete workplace, in comparison to the everyman thing, doesn't work. We don't expect everybody to be nice to us all the time.

And I don't know that is irrational about like the times. Imagine quitting a job, be like, yeah, I had to stop by there the other day. They weren't super nice. They didn't have a video for me. Um, but again, none of that real world stuff compares to any of this stuff. I remember one time there was a fight in an NFL game or maybe it was like, it might've been a inner squad thing.

Like, you know, the scrimmages that we see where everybody gets super pissed at each other towards the end of August. And there was somebody I was working with on TV that was like, well, all I know is at my workplace, I'm not allowed to fight people. It's like, yeah. I've like, for a lot of places, I would ask anybody that has that kind of approach to looking at the sports world, like, does your job involve avoiding paralysis once a week? Look, I don't really care about that part. Okay. I don't care about like comparing everyday workplace stuff to pro athletes. And you know who really doesn't care?

The NBA player under contract. They don't care. We're seeing it right now. It's Aaron Fox doesn't care. I don't have a big problem with Fox as I did say Ben Simmons before day one of the four year extension kicked in or maybe Damian Lillard having that extension and being like, okay, I also want

to leave and I only want to go there. And I wonder if Dame looks in Miami and is like, you know what, kind of glad I'm in Milwaukee right now. But yeah, history tells us the NBA player doesn't care because he's used to everybody being nice to him the entire time. The new CBA makes it harder. We've talked about that. The other thing that NBA history tells us on the business side of things is that Paul George gets a fourth year with LA. And I've thought about this more recently.

The reason history tells us that Paul George gets the fourth year is because you don't want to just lose the asset for nothing. Right. I don't know if that's being nice as much as it's protecting the asset and feeling like, well, if we remove this from it, then we don't have the same salary slot. Look, you know all the different things, but the second apron and the new CBA,

maybe he's going to change a lot of this stuff. But yeah, normally, Paul George just gets that fourth year. Especially when you look at the ownership of the Clippers that Balmer, I was looking at the numbers this morning, I think he's worth more than the next nine or 10 NBA owners combined, but they didn't give George a fourth year. And ultimately they were right. Can you imagine paying Paul George 57 million three years from now? Cause that's what the Sixers are looking at

with that player option. I think he's supposed to be good enough at this age and what he had done the previous two years, he's supposed to be good enough at this age and what he had done the previous two years, he's supposed to be good enough to at least have the Sixers on some kind of life support here where they're not looking at the 11th seed this morning, but he hasn't been. So the Clippers saved themselves $211 million, which is a lot more expensive than a tribute video. The FanDuel kick of destiny is back and this time it's every manning for himself. This Super Bowl, two legends will take the field in a sudden death field goal

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states or 18 plus and present in DC. No purchase necessary. Bonus issued is novel travel bonus bets that expire seven days after receipt. Restrictions apply. Voidware prohibited. C terms at sportsbook.fandl.com. Gambling problem. Call 1-800-GAMBLER or visit rg-health.com. A lot of NBA for you today midweek so I'm happy to do it with so much football coming up the next few episodes and joining us now from Sports Illustrated SI.com and his coverage of boxing for Dizone is Chris Mannix. So what I wanted to do at the end of this, we'll talk a little bit about the contending group of teams and maybe how big

that list is in comparison to our hopes this summer. Uh, but I want to start with some of the stuff that we didn't touch on yesterday. Bill and I did his trade value annual piece and the deer and Fox news happened just as we were finishing up the taping. And I don't know that this is a shock, you know, it's, it's been a team that's tried its best here and maybe Fox just looking at the next stage of

his career. So let's just start with the news of Fox or at least Sacramento, I guess the report was that they were open to the idea of trade. And again, a lot of this stuff becomes semantics when it's not that insightful, but just kind of where you were at with this becoming a little bit more official yesterday. Yeah, to me, this is a page being taken out of the Anthony Davis playbook. If you go back to what, four or five years now, when Davis was in New Orleans, and he effectively declared that he wasn't going to sign a contract extension with the Pelicans. He was loud about it at that time. But that was a clear

signal to New Orleans that whether you get a trade done now or in the off season, you probably need to get a trade done or else I'm going to walk at the end of the season. This feels very similar. You know, back then AD was around the same age as D'Aaron Fox. They happen to have the same representation at this time. So I just think that this is a pure basketball play from D'Aaron Fox. I think he's looking at the next five or six years of his career. He's looking at the Sacramento Kings roster and what they've done over the last couple of seasons

and thinking he can do better somewhere else. You can argue really, Ryan, that kind of doing Sacramento a favor there. Like, yeah, sure, they want to resign him to a long-term deal, but if he's not going to sign that contract better to get started now on a potential trade that then have to kind of wait till this time next season and take whatever the best offer is on

the table. Yeah. I like the AD comp. Cause you're right. I mean, he's halfway through the deal this year. He's got the contract for next year. And that's what it was. Cause like that line has always moved.

And I love talking about that ofelo and LeBron, like who actually did it the right way. It really depended on who you liked more. Cause you feel like, well, look, LeBron was a free agent and he left as is his right. Where if you ask anybody with Denver during that mellow time, it's like, you know, you're not going to be able to get a job in the next year. You're not going to be able to get a job in the next year. You're not going to be able to get a job in the next year. You're not going to be able to get a job in the next year.

You're not going to be able to get a job in the next year. You're not going to be able to get a job in the next year. You're not going to be able to get a job in the next year. You're not going to be able to get a job in the next year. It really depended on who you liked more because you feel like, well, look, LeBron was a free agent and he left as his, his right, where if you ask anybody with Denver during that mellow time, it's like, yeah, mellow wasn't exactly doing us a favor because it was, it was brutal. Um, so I think the market for Fox, like at his best, you'd think this would be somebody that pulls in one of those all time halls because of his age. And I don't, I don't really like looking at somebody's value, like week to week with this. He's an incredibly impactful player. He's an awesome scorer. I don't think there's really

been any issues where you're bringing him in and worrying about disruption, like some of the other guys that have wanted to force their ways out. So what do you think the market is for Fox? I think it's robust for the teams that he'll indicate he's willing to resign with. I don't believe it's a kind of situation like it was with AD and the Lakers, where if you trade AD to Lakers, he was going to sign that long-term contract extension. If you traded him anywhere else, I mean, Rich Paul said this publicly at the time, like he's going to go to free agency. Wherever you trade him, he's going to go to free agency. I think if you can get an indication from De'Aaron Fox that he's willing to play in X city long-term, you should be willing to give up multiple

draft picks, young players, the kind of salary cap filler you're going to need to do to get there. So if I'm San Antonio, obviously that's something I'm looking at. If I'm Houston, which as you well know has been telegraphed to anybody that will listen, that they're not going to do anything at this trade deadline. They want to see exactly where they are with this group, but I think they would have to listen. Miami, in a similar situation, they would have to listen. I think the first thing you got to do is find out through you know, through Fox's reps, if he's willing to play there long term. And if he is,

you know, it's not a historic haul that you can get for him, but you can get multiple young players, multiple draft picks, and cap flexibility moving forward for him. How do you think the Houston deal works? Before you answer that, when I look at Houston, and I think Stone has done a terrific job with this group. The likelihood though is you're going to hit it on all these picks and then you're going to start making contract decisions. Clearly the Jalen Green thing, I give them a lot of credit for being that creative about

that being like, we know you score a ton of points and you're our top pick and we're supposed to just re-sign you to the rookie max. History tells you the teams always do that, but let's get a little creative with it because we're not sure. And this is still a lot of money upfront with all of it. You know, Jabari is somebody I really liked, but I think sometimes I have to be honest of like, what do you really think his ceiling is? And now you have, and then coming on and tearing it up and still other

guys that aren't even playing. Like I love just seeing Jay Sean Tate back out there because I really, I really like when they weren't good, I was like, you know, I think he might be all right. So there's a ton of different options on top of the contract stuff that you would think with Van Bleeve would have to be in part of this deal. So as much as you could say, hey, let's just ride it out

and evaluate our own guys so we don't move off as somebody quickly, the odds would tell you you might do better in the marketplace with some of the unknown pieces as opposed to then figuring out. We just don't have enough minutes to even know who this guy is. Yeah, that's a looming problem for the Rockets. I was watching that game against Atlanta last night. They just squeaked that one out at the end. But Jay Shontay comes off the bench,

had like 15 points for him in that game. They're getting contributions from a lot of different guys. There's a lot of different guys in that rotation can play. So I think whether it's this February, or probably more likely this off season, you've got to start thinking about packaging a few of these young players to get that one established star. And look, they've got some flexibility here, right? Like if you're going into this deadline, and you're looking to make a big deal, that Fred Van Vliet contract is terrific, $40-ish million, a team option for the next year that gives whoever requires him the flexibility to keep him or waive him and create salary cap space. Jabari Smith, I like, but with Thompson there, like how much overlap is there at that

kind of position? Like is Thompson going to be usurping all those minutes, you know, for the foreseeable future? I would, I would play him as many minutes as he could possibly play. I mean, if that guy ever develops a semi-reliable three point shot, look out, like he's a leap in the NBA. So I'd want to keep him out there for minutes. You got Cam Whitmore there, you've got Tari Eason there.

You've got a whole bunch of guys that, that can play. So I don't know if it happens, you know, before February 6th, more there. You've got Tari Isen there. You've got a whole bunch of guys that can play. So I don't know if it happens before February 6th, but definitely before the start of next season, you've got to put these kind of pieces together and go get yourself another star that fits. And look, Van Vliet's a good player right now, but he's not a long-term fit for this group. He doesn't fit the age timeline of most of these guys, and DAaron Fox does. So look, if I'm Houston, I'm talking to Sacramento about what it would take. I'm looking at what my roster would look like afterwards. I'm kicking over all the rocks to see if this is a real deal. It feels like it makes more sense just strictly based on age thing than waiting

out to see if like the Phoenix thing was a disaster because I think there were some rumblings about that whether it was Durant wanted Houston or they were willing to wait it out. But you start putting together these- Don't you think Phoenix though is gonna burn this down to like the foundation? Like I don't look at the Suns as being a team that's, whether it's now, definitely not,

but or the off season, whether or not they're gonna be open for business. I just think Matt Ishbia is gonna know, throwing logs on this fire and seeing what happens with this group. I wouldn't count on them, you know, dealing at Durant's, certainly not dealing with Devin Booker anytime soon. No, I understand. And I think we agree, but it's just the reality of the fact that next year is the last year

on Durant's deal. And if he isn't going to do something and if then Durant, based on his own history, decided like say Phoenix has a disastrous end to the season. I don't think it's out of the question that Durant would go, well, I'm not going to resign here anyway. And you know, you might as well go ahead and move on from me. I think that that stuff was, was certainly in the gossip, you know, world that we're in of like, Hey, you know, look out for Houston and a Durant thing. But I mean, there comes a time with Durant where you're like, okay, but know, look out for Houston and a Durant thing. But I mean, there comes a time with the rant where you're like, okay, but if I'm trading for

them, like how far am I extending out a guy who's still look, we understand how terrific he is and and being an all star again this year, but it might just make more sense. And I think there's always like a Pacers lesson that I have with what are you supposed to do? Like, especially like Houston's different than Indiana, but when they brought in Siakam like, especially, like Houston's different than Indiana, but

when they brought in Siakam, I'm like, well, if he wants to resign there, like at first I was like, okay, that's, that's an interesting deal. And then I remember talking about like the uncertainty of his future. And then somebody who knew texted me when they heard the podcast, they're like, he's it's a done deal. Like he's going to extend, he's going to stay there. You're like, yeah, if you're the Pacers, that's, that's probably pretty good for you. And if you're waiting on perfect, you're going to be waiting forever. And we could get like really creative with what other possibilities are better than De'Aaron Fox. If you're listening to this now and you're a Rockets fan and you know, Fox

isn't like perfect for you, but he's pretty good, man. I like, as far as like what your options are known versus unknown, it would make a lot of sense. And I think waiting until this, well, maybe they won't do anything, but waiting until the summer, if Sacramento is ready to make a move again, this is more on the DeAaron side of things, but if they're willing to make a move, I'd be worried about waiting if I were Houston. Uh, you always have to be worried.

Houston? You always have to be worried. But my sense is that San Antonio, if they do make an offer, is not going to put their best foot forward right now. There's no urgency in San Antonio. This is kind of another honeymoon year where they get a little bit better. They probably fight for a play-in spot this year. There's no urgency within the Spurs to, especially with Wemba Nyama, with 20, 21 years old, to do a deal right now. So I don't think you have to worry about them. I don't think you have to worry too much about Miami putting together an offer that will blow Sacramento away.

And the Kings have the ability to be patient as well. Certainly holding onto Fox beyond the deadline makes this season and the rest of it really uncomfortable. I get that. But I know that in their front office, they're not going to just reflexively knee-jerk deal this guy just because he may want to be dealt before February 6th. So I get there's risk with the Rockets

waiting beyond February, but I don I get there's risk with the Rockets, you know, waiting beyond February, but I don't get the sense right now that there should be an immediate fear of any of these other teams step into the plate with some kind of overwhelming offer that will blow Sacramento away. Okay, so that's kind of the sense that you get now. So it's the news, but within the next couple of weeks,

like do you think Sacramento goes, hey, we brought in Demar, and I understand why they did the Demar thing. Like I've explained it next couple of weeks, like, do you think Sacramento goes, Hey, we brought in tomorrow. And I understand why they did the tomorrow thing. Like I've explained it a couple of different times. It's just, if you're closing five is tomorrow or Harrison Barnes, you'd rather close with that. And they're just trying to raise whatever ceiling they could possibly have in a crowded West, but you know, they made the Mike Brown change where

they ate a ton of money on that. And it felt like it had to do with Fox. Fox said it had nothing to do with it. What was Fox going to say? Like, yeah, it was definitely me and they changed it. And Christie puts together a good start since taking over for him. So I mean, do you think it's just done, done, or is Sacramento hoping to maybe play the long game here and like, let's just get through the trade deadline, see how the season goes, and maybe we can revisit keeping him? Cause I imagine they'd rather keep him than be forced to trade him. Yeah, I, they would.

I do feel like it's probably done, done. He could have resigned last summer to a long-term extension. Now, obviously, there were other reasons he might not do that, the All-NBA, the Super Max, all the things that he could have earned in this coming season, but he didn't do it. And now he's saying he's not going to do it. I think the longest you could wait is this offseason. I don't think you can go into the training camp next year with the Aaron Fox part of your team.

And I do think you get to the summer and you get to the draft and all the other flexibilities out there. I think there's gonna be a really good offer for Sacramento. It's probably gonna be a rebuilding offer. Like you're not gonna get dollar for dollar value back from the Aaron Fox. Like you're just not gonna get it.

So the Kings, unfortunately, are, you know, probably looking at a pivot here, having to rebuild around young players and draft picks, which is a tough pill to swallow when they were a 48-win team last year, third in the Western Conference. So much excitement about, you know, like the beam, this entire, all the things that went to Sacramento kind of being reenergized, but I don't see any, uh, you know, we, we mentioned the Davis Pelican situation. Like it's kinda, they kind of put themselves in the Pelican situation where you get a bunch of draft capital and the young players back in return and you try to, to rebuild that way. I think that's the, an inevitability for Sacramento right now. Yeah.

I mean, it's a crazy reminder two years ago, they were the three seed, you know, uh, and you know, they, they had the, you know what I mean? It's like, this was the window. What a nice story. Stability in Sacramento. They've done a pretty good job of the margins. And then you're like, yeah, that's probably like your max and again, it's three seed.

Would you like, can, that's probably like your max. And again, it's three seats. Can I ask you this question? Like, do you, do you blame Fox for any of this? Like if I put myself in De'Aaron Fox's shoes and I'm looking at the Kings and it's kind of a mess there. You know, they bring Christie in and yeah, he's had some success, but like they're, they're trending in the wrong direction right now. And you look at the rest of the Western conference, I'm sure Fox is looking at that roster saying, all right, me and DeMontes are good, but can we compete with these elite teams? If I'm De'Aaron Fox and I have the opportunity, let's just say to tie myself to Victor Wemba-Yama for the next 10 years, I'd probably take it too.

I'd probably do the exact same thing and say, I'm not going to, I'm not going to demand a trade publicly and sit out and pull a Jimmy Butler, but I'm just going to tell you right now that I'm not going to sign a long-term extension. Do you, would you agree with what he's doing? I wouldn't be critical of Fox. I, I understand it and I don't know if that's being numb to this for so many years, although I do think that the tide is turning a little bit just because of the CBA and the lack of flexibility, there's going to be a wake up call for some guys here.

We're, I think we're seeing that with Jimmy Butler, which I certainly want to get to, or it's like, you don't get to just do whatever you want anymore, even though in the past it's basically what had happened for years and years. So, you know, I think that he's, he's done his best, you know, then it can also turn into like, Hey, maybe the team would be better if you were better. And he, you know, he's had a little bit of the ups and downs, but I think overall, like he's done his best, you know, then it can also turn into like, hey, maybe the team would be better if you were better.

And he's had a little bit of the ups and downs, but I think overall, like, he's been a really good player for them. He's young enough to probably wanna move on to the next part of this. And I think looking at Sacramento moving forward the next couple of years in comparison to the rest of the West, like, he knows,

he knows there's no chance at this. And he didn't sign the extension, even though there was more financially available to him if he had some of those other incentives, let's say, but he didn't do what some of these other guys have done where they've signed the four-year extension and then said, okay, now I want to move on. So I think a lot of it is just what the culture of the NBA is and in Fox's case, and he hasn't, I don't think, been like this crazy pain in the ass like some of these other guys have been.

I totally get it and I don't really have any criticism for him. Yeah, I feel the same way. We've all changed locations, we've all changed jobs. I think you said it right. He didn't sign the extension, get his money and then say, hey, I don't want to be here anymore. He's just saying, look, I'm going to fulfill my contract and I'm probably going to go somewhere else and if you want to get something for me before then, up and trade.

It sucks for this year because the Kings have been playing some pretty good basketball, but he's just doing what anyone else would do if they want a change of location. So it's a dramatic turn for Sacramento, but it's, it's, it's certainly not the same as, as what Jimmy Butler is doing in Miami. No, it's definitely not that. And it's also like each person is like, what's the track record? And when you're comparing Darren Fox track record, you can't compare it to Jimmy Butler or even some of these other guys we've spent talking about in the past few years of like, wait, this guy's doing this now. And so when this happened, it's not like any of us are really all that surprised. My first reaction was not like, Oh, I can't believe he's doing this now, even though I can understand how incredibly

disappointing it is for Kings fans. So, um, I think we've covered enough of that then let's just do the Butler part of it because this is, it's not really a take side. I don't, I don't know. I guess I'm surprised there are people out there kind of arguing Jimmy's side. And it's like, okay, so what are the points that you have? Because I think the management side of this on the Jimmy Butler part of it,

like Winhorse had a line the other day saying like, I could write a book about this. I'm not sure what's true or not. But let's just, I don't even need you to take the side. Let's just talk about his market and the likelihood of him being moved for the deadline in February. I think it's pretty high now. And if you would ask me that on Monday or Sunday over the weekend, um, I, I

would have leaned towards him staying because when I talked to teams about what Miami was asking for in exchange for Jimmy Butler, several of which those teams were still looking at Jimmy as this year, if he opts in next year, but no contract extension on top of it, there was risk to it. They were feeling that the asking price was too high. Young players, draft picks, contracts that don't go beyond 2026, which is what Miami is kind of looking at. Like they are looking at the summer of 2026 when they have BAM and TallyHero under contract and a whole lot of cap flexibility to try to lure free agents down there. You know, over the weekend, it just seemed like the

price was too high for everybody except for Phoenix. And Phoenix, despite their best efforts, has not been able to get anyone even remotely interested in Bradley Beale, not to mention Bradley Beale is remotely interested in going anywhere but a contender. I was explicitly told by someone close to him that unless it is a contender, Bradley Beale is not waving that no trade clause for a deal. So I felt we were nowhere over the weekend.

But the Jimmy Butler, George Costanza act continuing to try to get fired and walking out of the shoot around, that's changed some of the dynamics in Miami, at least according to the people I've talked to around the league, that the price has gone down a little bit. They're not looking for quite as much draft capital. They're not looking for quite as much in terms of Young Town. They still don't want salary that goes beyond 2026. That to me, if this deal gets done, you're not going to see any contracts that go beyond the 25, 26 season. But in terms of what they're asking for in return, it has dipped considerably in the

last 48 hours. And that's led me to believe that when we get to February 5th, Miami's probably just going to take the best deal on the table. What do you think the best deal is like of the reality deals of what could actually happen here? It's just hard to know what exactly is real at the moment. I do think Memphis is interesting. I don't think Jimmy wants to go to Memphis to continue with the Seinfeld references, but I do know that Memphis has had a level of interest in him and they do have what the Heat would want. Those contracts in like a Marcus Smart, a Brandon Clark, maybe throw one draft picked in there.

We know that the Grizzlies have been after kind of that wing defender because they were right there knocking on the doorstep of, you know, Doreen Finney-Smith before the Lakers swooped in to grab him. They're to me, they to me are a team to watch over these next couple of weeks. They're right there at the top of the Western Conference standings. They could use another experienced, proven player to match up with a team like Oklahoma City or Denver in the playoffs. It would be a roll the dice for Memphis. Cause you know, a couple of weeks ago, I had been writing that the Jimmy Butler,

the two teams he has basically been communicating that he didn't want to go to, were the Memphis Grizzlies and the Sacramento Kings. Basically saying like, look, don't, don't acquire me if, if there's an option to do it out there, but a lot's been changing Ryan these next, these last couple of weeks. Has Jimmy Butler's mindset changed? Has, uh, you know, has Memphis's approach changed? But that's a team I would probably watch because he makes a lot of sense in that rotation. He does make sense in the Memphis rotation. And right. You've heard all the same things. I think it's very specific to Memphis that he wants nothing to do.

And it would scare the hell out of me. Yeah. Like, can you come in and just see what this is like without any contract extension? And I mean, does he play hard for the rest of the year with a good chance at seeing what they can do in the playoffs? Does he think, hey, this is the best way

to increase my own value? Like if it's really about the contract extension, then show up and play great basketball and be into it. But I don't know, man, that would scare the hell out of me. If I'm Taylor Jenkins, I'd be like, you know, like, hey, what do you think? You're just like, because you're thinking about the basketball part of it going, that would be really nice for us. But now, now what?

Or does he get there and he loves John, he loves Jaren Jackson, he starts to like, like some of those other personalities where I think when Memphis is rolling, the personality of that team is, is a lot of fun, even if opponents hate it. I just wonder if he'd be into that kind of like, you know, I don't know if it's, it's, if it's still the same as, as the grind house and everything that we loved about those teams. But in a way, there's almost a personality fit for Butler

that he may not even be thinking about that once he got there. But again, past the summer, then it may be like, hey, a nice little run, some noise in the playoffs, and now this is a disaster that we've inherited, and was it actually worth it? And I don't have the answer to the math on that one. Yeah, I think if you're, if you're Memphis,

you've got to be really careful about what you're willing to give up for all the reasons you just laid out there. At the same time, I can certainly see a scenario where Jimmy fits in with those guys, with Ja, with Jaren Jackson, with Desmond Bain. You know, I'm curious to see what the Taylor Jenkins fit is. That, those are two personalities. I'm wondering if that would work,

but I can see a scenario where it works out. And if you get to the end of the season, let's say Memphis gets the conference finals with Jimmy Butler. Would they be willing to give him two years, 111 million? Probably not. Would they give him one year, 50 million

or whatever it may be on top of that? Maybe, maybe there's a compromise that can be reached where Jimmy can opt into his contract and effectively have a two year deal that will take him to the rest of his career. I mean, that's a situation that I think makes a lot of sense for both sides if they're both willing to kind of compromise on what they were optimally looking for.

Yeah. I'm letting myself kind of like think about him responding to the personalities on that team and being like, all right, let's, let's do this. Like every other cities, everybody else's favorite in the West and, you know, we're overlooked and granted, it's the availability of their own players. Cause you were talking about that Sacramento three seed, like Memphis was a two seed that year, but then they weren't healthy going into the whole thing. Maybe, but you know, history tells you,

assuming Jimmy's going to be on board long-term is the wrong assumption. Is there another name outside of the three that we just touched on here that we need, that's a big enough of a name that you think we need to pay attention to before the deadline? I don't know, look, Zach Levine's a big name, but I don't know if we should be paying attention,

honestly. I don't get the sense that there's a market for Zach Levine right now. He's having a great year, but that contract and the injury history has red flagged him to a lot of teams out there. So, you know, he's someone that we're gonna be talking about because we don't know what the Bulls are gonna do, but I don't get the sense that there is a bidding war right now for Zach Levin. Same thing with Vucevich in Chicago. You know, would a team like the Warriors, the Lakers,

or somebody like that like to get there, get a hold of him? Yeah, but he's got a big contract. It's probably going to be an asking price, a steep asking price back in return. Cam Johnson, another guy, Cam Johnson, I would guess will ultimately get moved. I think the asking price is pretty high right now. Multiple first round picks from what I've heard for Cam Johnson. Does that come down when the Nets who have just no interest in being remotely good right

now before February 6th? Maybe. But there's a low burn on these guys right now. Maybe that heats up when we get towards early February, but right now it's the guys we've talked about. Jimmy Butler, to a lesser degree, maybe De'Aaron Fox. Yeah. When I was thinking about Cam Johnson the other day,

just because the OKC part of it, right? So we look at the picks and they're like, well, they could do it if they wanted to, right? And it doesn't hurt them, but then it becomes a salary thing or it's like, okay, but if you're bringing on his contract, and even though it's one of the better contracts, at 20 million next year, 22 and a half the year after that, uh, still on the right side of 30,

then it makes a lot of sense, but they can have all these other financial commitments that they have to worry about. And historically, like, I don't think okay, see he's going to be a second April team. Um, but it reminded me a bit of like what Billy Bean used to do with the A's where he would trade for the big name player somewhere else knowing that he was then going to flip him like a year after that. And I wonder if OKC would be like, this is like big who makes a ton of shots. His shooting numbers are incredible. He's not just a big that stretches the floor. He can handle,

he can reposition himself to get his shot off, which is like just, I think a massive differentiator between like shooters, like can you shoot it when you have to change off the catch or can you only shoot it on the catch? And he's a guy that can change, uh, and get into a shot. So I think that just adds to the flexibility of, of just how much I love when OKC just repositions moves and everybody stays engaged to the possession. So I think he's like a good fit there as opposed to some of the other ball stopping spacing

that we have in the league. But the other challenge becomes, and again, I don't even know if that A's theory even works out. It's like, well, why don't we trade for Cam? It doesn't hurt us because we have all the picks. And then if we want to flip him, then we can flip him and then not worry about all the other contract stuff. It's just like, where are you getting the money to put

together for OKC on that side of it? Because you like all of the players. I'm assuming you like me, like so many of them, like Isaiah Joe is an important part of the rotation and he's under contract for multiple years moving forward, like a really good number. Um, I like Aaron Wiggins. I think he's one of the most underrated players in the league for like what he is and

what your expectations would be. I mean, I don't know if it's a, uh, a Ken rich Ousmane Jang thing where you're, you're trying to, I don't know where they're coming up with the money because. Unless they just go, Hey, these two are not worth what the cam in camps, potentially closing a playoff game for us in comparison to some of these other names. Like it's just challenging. Cause once again, they've done such a good job of who they've even spent the money. Yeah. And maybe it's, uh, the other Jalen Williams you'd have a conversation about,

though he's been, when he's been a available, uh, he's shown he can play. Um, but he makes like 2 million bucks. I know, you just start stacking salaries basically. Cam's what, Cam's a 20-ish? 22, and then it's, yeah, so it's 22 is the number for this year. It's weird, because it goes to like 22, it's 22 and a half, and then it goes to 20 and a half, then back to 22 and a half, so.

Well, that's an Oklahoma City type of deal. They love those descending contracts for one. I don't know what, I honestly don't know what the answer is. I can see them doing something like that just to kick the can down the road a little bit further. I think Ham Johnson would help them. I think his floor spacing would be useful to them. But to your point, they don't wanna give up these guys.

They like these guys. These guys are playing in this rotation. And when I go to Oklahoma City, I'm becoming a resident nowadays, going back there in a week. I love watching this team play. When I go there, they really want to see what they got in the playoffs.

Chet's going to come back after the All-Star break. And they want to see what this team can do when it's all together and make whatever decision they have to make next summer. I mean, when I was out there last time, Ryan, it's like, I'm having this long conversation with a Thunder official about Nikola Topic and what he's going to bring to the table next summer like that. We can't wait to get him into summer league and the lottery pick that from last year. Like they want to see what he can do. So there's going to come a breaking point with all these guys. And while a Cam Johnson deal would,

I can see how it makes sense for them to do, unless they can put together a bunch of guys aren't in the rotation right now, there's not many of them, because they go 10 or 11 deep most nights. Unless they can put together a package that will include guys they know they're not gonna hold onto,

I don't see them making a deal like that. Since you've spent so much time there, I'm just gonna ask. I don't know that I've ever seen it. And maybe, the weird thing about like age and rebuilding is I think the mistake is made. It's like, all right, we're rebuilding. So everybody has to be between 18 and 21 years old.

And you're like, well, that's actually stupid. And I remember like the first time somebody explained it to me. It's like, if you have 15 guys that all think they're going to be hall of famers and they haven't accepted their NBA reality yet, like I know you're rebuilding, but there's not a downside to having like a 32 year old on the team that's been through the wars, knows the NBA life and isn't expecting to make an all-star team that year.

knows the NBA life and isn't expecting to make an all-star team that year. Um, yet when you look at what. Okay. See is done. They're on the young side of things. Uh, they play basketball in a way where I don't know how they did it. I don't know if it's the coach. I don't know if it's Preston down. I don't know if it's player development.

Maybe it's their draft profiling of, of whatever they could be doing on personalities. But the buy-in from every guy that gets minutes from them is such a rarity in the NBA. Uh, and I don't want to say I've never seen this before, but they play so many players that have bought in. It's just almost unheard of to see this many dudes that get minutes all seem to be like totally locked into what their role is and what the team's approaches for that game. Um, look, maybe they don't win a title, but I think this is one of the most

impressive groups. I'm not talking from like a talent standpoint, but just their approach to it. Have you picked up on anything that even makes this possible that you've learned? It's definitely organizationally with Presti and with Dagnall, and the messaging is always crystal clear. Like this is who we are, this is kind of the role that you're probably gonna have.

And they rarely deviate from that. I mean, Alex Caruso is a great example. this is who we are, this is kind of the role that you're probably going to have. They rarely deviate from that. I mean, Alex Caruso is a great example. He comes in in that deal with Chicago and look, he's playing a different role than he played with the Bulls, at times playing a lesser role there. But you're not hearing complaints from Alex Caruso being there. You just signed a long-term contract extension with them. They're very good at the messaging part of all this, of letting these guys know, like, this is what we're about. This is the role that I want to see you play in. They don't deviate from that at all. Look, I think they benefit to a degree from the fact that these guys were all really

young. They're just getting into the NBA. Some of these younger guys, guys are two or three years in, and it's like, we just want to do the right thing. We want to play here. Now, that's going to change as they get a little bit older. They want to get contracts, and they get contracts. They want to play bigger roles.

They want to make All-Star, All-NBA, all that stuff. But for right now, it really is the perfect storm of rotation players that are either veterans that get it, and I would put Isaiah Hartenstein in that mix, I'd put Alex Caruso in that mix, and a bunch of young guys in their second or third years that are eager to just play a role on a winning team. Because even if, like I wanna do this on the contender part of it now, right?

Like the list of teams that could hold up the trophy where you go, well, that's a little surprising. Like I think as an example, like Houston would still be a little surprising if they won the NBA championship this summer. Okay. As much as I enjoy watching them, uh, that are like an auto go to last night, light night, but it's like, okay, I want to watch them against the Hawks. It's, I just have that much fun watching the Rockets play.

Um, I know what I would point to is like, it might be a little bit concerning. Even with Oklahoma city, I think there's some times offensively and maybe it's just Jaylen Williams being ready this year for the playoffs and going like, all right, I've got one under my belt and now I know what's asked of me. And he's just going to respond and be even better. But maybe like, I'm not saying Jordan Clarkson, but somebody like that, it can kind of come in at his best and be like, can you create a little offense on your own here

if things bog down a little bit? And again, maybe Chet ends up being that guy, which based on his profile, he very well could be that third guy that gets a little bit more into his own shot creation than what we saw in his first action. How long is the list for you now? Because I feel like the list was longer

of potential NBA champs this summer. And maybe that's because of Minnesota, maybe it's because of Dallas' health here a little bit. But if I'm just sharing mine with you, I have OKC, I'd have Denver in the non-surprise list. I'd put Cleveland in that list. And Boston still deserves the benefit of the Dow. And feel free to go in any Celtics direction you want to

in your own backyard after watching, well your previous backyard, but after watching what's been pretty average basketball the last month. Average basketball, though, they go three and one on that road trip. Yeah, they got tattooed by the Lakers, but they were forced to double overtime, or over time rather, by the Clippers, but they still managed to come out with, with a lot of wins in this game. Just to briefly detour to the Celtics. I have zero. I want this detour by the way.

So okay. But zero to me. I don't know where you stand on this, but zero concerned with what's happening right now. Like I've, I've been around them a little bit. I was around them on this West coast trip. There's a lot of going through the motions right now. Like a lot of like, right,

it took us six years to win a championship. Like the slog was real, the fight was real. Now here we are playing the Pelicans in the end of December and going on the road to play a beat up Clippers team in front of a small crowd at Intuit Dome. Like I don't, to me, this is the perfect example of a championship hangover, a team going through what they're going through. When they get to pass the trade deadline into March, I promise you, we'll be back here talking about the Celtics winning 10 of 11 or 11 of 13,

or whatever number it may be. They're just going to flip a switch. I just believe that, given this group. They're on a tier. I put Cleveland on that tier too. You know, they're better with Kenny Atkinson and the offensive changes he's made to that team. I still have the same playoff concerns though about the Cavaliers, some of which have been exposed over the last week or so. Like the defensive issues with their backcourt, the fact they play two bigs extensively that aren't three point shooting threats. Like you give a good team with a good coaching staff one team to focus on, and they're gonna find ways to exploit some of that.

So I do think Boston, even though they're behind the Cavs and the Standings, I'd still put them above Cleveland in that tier of championship contenders. Yeah, the Cleveland two big thing, I've been on it now for a while. I wonder how that'll play out against like say the Celtics trying to space them out or ignore

some of their spacing stuff. But I put them in the non-surprise list, which is an improvement from what I thought about them this summer because there's so much that I like about them. And I do think they're deep. I do think they have like a lot of different things they can throw at you, even if that fifth player hasn't really been perfect.

Uh, and I think, you know, essentially they would hope it would be Strews, um, closing those minutes. I would imagine the Celtics offense thing, you know, at times, but it was the same, like there were times last year where I was like, well, if they do this in the clutch and like a playoff game, like this could burn them. And then it ended up never mattering. And even when I was talking about their offense after the Loff game, like this could burn them. And then it ended up never mattering. And even when I was talking about their offense after the Lakers game, like even if you'd sorted,

if you sorted out like Boston's last 15, last 15, last 15, I think when I had done that, they were still fifth in the NBA over the previous 15 games in offense. So it's like, so I'm pointing. Yeah, I ran those numbers too. They're top 10 in defense too. Like, even when they were going through that malaise

where they were like, I don't know what they're 10 and 11, or they're just an average kind of team, they were still top 10 in defense too. Like, like even when they were going through that malaise where they were like, I don't know what they're 10 and 11 or just an average kind of team, they were still top 10 in everything net rating, defensive rating, offensive rating. So it wasn't like they had bottomed out into the bottom third. And we're looking at one glaring weakness that needs to be shored up with like a Walker Kessler deal, even though I would probably try to find a way to have someone but Luke Cornett playing some of those minutes. But there's nothing, there's nothing that you actually look at and say,

oh my God, this is a problem that we have to fix before February. Yeah, I think they just need to shoot it a little bit better. But sometimes I'll look so closely at the game and I'll see these things that I don't like and then I'll run some numbers and go, you're really gonna sit here and do 10 minutes on their offense when it's the third in the NBA this month. I mean, it's 10th in the NBA, the last 15, if I want to get like updated

in particular about it, but their net rating is still third best. I think it's some of the clutch stuff. And I think when you look at like six of the eight regulars declining on their three point numbers from where they were at in their career, like math just tells us that I don't think they're just going to continue to all shoot collectively that bad the rest of the season. So't think they're just gonna continue to all shoot collectively that bad the rest of the season. So I think we're on the same page there.

All right, do you add anyone else to that group of the four that I have? I'm with you on Houston. Even though like after that Atlanta game, there's something like 28 and three after having a lead in the third quarter. Like that's not a great example since they blew a big lead, but like they're closing games. after having a lead in the third quarter. Like that's not a great example since they blew a big lead,

but like they're closing games. They're like seven and three in games decided by three points or less. Like they're finding a way to finish even though we keep kind of saying, like at least I keep saying, that they don't have that one guy, the Durant, the Butler, the guy they can go to to get them a bucket

in the fourth quarter. Somebody's coming up with it, whether it's Jalen Green or Alprin Sengoon against Boston, it was Ammon Thompson. I still think this is kind of the year where they'll get to the second round and somebody with more experience will take advantage of them.

I'm still gonna buy the path that a lot of teams have had to take. I don't know what to make of Memphis because I went to the season thinking like, all right, well, shooting is gonna be their biggest problem. They're top 10 in the NBA in three point shooting. Like Jalen Wells has been outstanding. Because I went to the season thinking like, all right, well, shooting is going to be their biggest problem. They're top 10 in the NBA in three point shooting. Like Jalen Wells has been outstanding.

He's been a shooter for them. Desmond Bayne can shoot it. Morant's not terrible. They've just got, and they've been there before. A lot of these guys have been through the playoff wringer over the last couple of years. Them there to me are kind of the wild card in all this. Could they beat Denver in the second round? Maybe.

Could they beat Oklahoma City in the conference finals? Probably not, I wouldn't pick them to do it, but they've probably been deeper in the playoffs, the core of their team, more than Oklahoma City has. So the four teams you mentioned, absolutely. To me, the Grizzlies are the wildcard in all this. Grizzlies are the wildcard. All right. Real quick on the Houston thing though, because there's some numbers, like maybe it's the playing tournament or the in-season tournament, I should say, not the playing tournament. The in-season tournament where in that

Oklahoma City matchup where it looked like they just couldn't do anything offensively against them in that game. They couldn't initiate any of their stuff. I think the smaller point guard thing with Van Vliet, despite like, he holds up defensively the deflections. When you look back historically through Van Vliet, it's very simple to make the assumption, be like, oh, well, you're just gonna attack him and hunt him all the time. People look to attack Jalen Green before they do Van Vliet.

And when I look at some of the clutch closing stuff, it's crazy because they're, they're 17 and nine in their 26 clutch games. That's more clutch wins than any other team in the NBA. Their net rating, however, is 14. Like if you look at the net rating of where they're at, it is a very slim margin and they're closing out these games and they're getting wins. And I mean, there's, there's five teams with a double figure net rating

in some of their clutch stuff. And some of the teams are just so good that it doesn't really even matter. So I still, I love them. We've already covered it. I'm still not sure like what I'm really banking on unless like Jalen Green had just an all-time series. So you went with Memphis. I think Dallas has to be given the benefit

of the doubt a bit here just because of when they're healthy, but it's just, this has been a brutal stretch for them health-wise. I just don't know if they're gonna get all their guys back right in time. Like these injuries just keep piling up and piling up and piling up. And it's gonna get to the point where if they get

into the playoffs, it might be through the play-in, honestly, with all these injuries. You're right, they deserve the benefit of the doubt because of where they've been, but I just, I mean, when I talk to people down there, I mean, it's exhausting for them, like showing up to a practice, finding out who's gonna be out for how long. The lively injury was a real kick in the teeth to that team.

So I'm less optimistic about them just because I have no confidence that they're gonna get all their guys back on the floor in time for the playoffs. Okay, so make the Memphis case then. I just thought they weren't gonna be able to shoot it. I was really concerned. I mean, I wrote all this in a preview issue,

like who's gonna be the guy that steps up and makes shots? And nobody knew that Jalen Wells was gonna be that guy early on. Nobody thought he was going to step in and play that type of role. I mean, Desmond Bain obviously can, can make shots. Lou Canard is shooting well, obviously is on that team. So I, I think the fact that they are top 10 in the NBA in three point percentage makes them a player in all this because they've got a guy in job that can get him a bucket down the stretch. They've got depth at multiple positions. Like, you know, I just, they're an outsider here. Don't get me wrong.

Like, I'm not, if I'm ranking the tiers there, it's Oklahoma City, it's Denver, and I put Memphis, at this point, a decent amount behind the two of them. But if they get their act together and they shoot it in the playoffs, the way they're shooting in the regular season, they're a threat, man. They're a real threat to do something. Yeah, I love seeing Gigi Jackson back out there, although I doubt he's closing playoff games for you,

especially with Wells. That would be a problem. Yeah. I'm still holding out for like prime jaw, because we haven't gotten prime jaw yet this year. They're hanging on standings wise, and some of it's just the shot opportunity. He's not taking the same number of shots, which

means the same number of free throw attempts and look, the three points shooting for jaw hasn't exactly been something like you're freaked out about and closing out against. But, um, I'd imagine if he can put together just a nice stretch health wise here, and if it's timed at the right time, like I'd expect to see a little more out of him.

All right. So the teams that we didn't bring up, I think it's New York is probably going like, what about us? So what about the Knicks? Yeah. I mean, they were close to being on my list there because they're a team that in addition to being built to win regular season games, because they burn out a lot of guys, you don't need depth in the playoffs.

We know that if you've got seven guys that you trust, you can go with it. And Tibbs does have seven guys that they trust. I do worry about front court defense. That to me is a question mark. Townes awesome offensively, but what does he look like defensively in the playoffs? Is he exploitable? He was great last year against Jokic in the conference semifinals, really bad against Dallas in the conference finals.

Does that carry over? Are teams able to exploit him in the postseason? Kind of the same, a little bit of the same feeling with Brunson, he's so good during the regular season, but let's match them up with Boston, for example. Like what happens in a playoff series if he's facing some continued combination of Drew Holliday, Derek White, like what happens in a playoff series if he's facing some continued combination of Drew Holliday, Derek White, Peyton Pritchard, how much his efficiency

numbers ultimately go down. So I think they're right there. And maybe I should put them in that same category I put Memphis because I put Memphis below Denver and Oklahoma City. I'd probably put the Knicks beneath Cleveland and Boston right now. But they're right there on that next tier of teams. We haven't mentioned Minnesota yet, and that was a great win this past weekend against Denver. And I do kind of enjoy that matchup, although Nas against Jokic, and to your point too, like none of us love Kat defensively, but at least with

Jokic being in front of him. He did well. Yeah, he can make him work. It's not like obviously you're going to look at the box score and be like, man, he shut down Jokic. It's just, that's not a possibility, but knowing where everything is kind of going and then having Rudy play off of Aaron Gordon on that baseline stuff and then allowing him to float a little bit more there. We're giving them for the benefit of the doubt

because they have the best player in the world and we've already seen them do it and they've been playing really good. The defense has been good in this turnaround. Although specific to Minnesota, I think the ant matchup for them, if they were to land somehow in the playoffs against each other, like there's just not a great ant matchup for them, I guess the theory it's supposed to be Watson. They went with Christian Brown.

It's just, it's a bad matchup for having a deal with ants, physicality and athleticism. But I hate saying this about Minnesota. I don't, I don't even think about them as a title contender. I don't either. I don't either. It was, look, it was a bad deal at the time. It was a bad deal a few weeks ago,

and it was a bad deal now. Like they haven't gotten all the talk about depth and improvement in three-point shooting with DiVincenzo. It hasn't happened. DiVincenzo is not a bad three-point shooter, but he's what, like three and a half points down from what he was last season with the Knicks. Randall's Randall, right?

He's an inefficient scorer. He's not a great defensive player. Like they made a bad deal. They made a financial deal. It's as simple as that. And because of that, now they just dropped down a tier. And it's maddening to me. Like I get there are financial decisions

that have to be made with teams, but how do you make a financial decision with a team coming off a trip to the conference finals? Like a team that had made that leap to that next level, don't you give them one more chance to make that leap? Now I don't wanna go back down the rabbit hole, I get it. But like, they're not a, right now, they're not to me, anywhere close to the level of the teams we've already talked about.

They're not. And, you know, I've not been a cat fan. And so then when the team with a really smart front office trades him after making the Western Conference finals, like I feel like, hey, I don't need to make this argument anymore. If they did it, then why do I need to argue my position? But you're right. It hasn't worked out. Ryan, does Tim Conley do that deal? Like if, if all things are equal, if there's not financial pressure, I don't think so.

I don't think he does that. No, but this is the Rudy part of it. You know, that Minnesota fans never wanted to hear when you're like, Hey, okay. So you're bringing in Rudy, which at his best, I understand it, but he, he's the single worst, like heavy rotation guy with the ball. Like as far as like skills of catching and

handling it and all these things. And it's been kind of funny, like watching Dillingham not know yet where it's like you actually have noticed all the other guys at dribble, they're not going to make him that pass dude. Uh, and I think you've seen Finch kind of pull the plug on Rudy in some of these closer fourth quarter. And look, he was terrific against Denver. I'd also say that defensively,

I've never seen teams attack Rudy with like less fear than I've seen this year. And it's not to say he's still not good defensively. The guy plays his ass off. He sets a million screens. I mean, he really did. Like there's just guys that his size never chased down loose ball. So like, I'm trying to be nice about this a little bit, but like the Rudy transaction with his flaws, even with last year's run of like, is it worth it? Is it not worth it? That wasn't an every month answer.

It was like the big picture of it all. And, you know, it makes me sound like a hypocrite. If I haven't like cat and I was fine with the trade, but then it's like, yeah, but when you did this and the financial concerns, like you had to realize like something like this might happen. It, it dings the Rudy deal on top of everything else. And it's going to be like a weird reset with that team because they're going to have to reset this on the fly with Ann.

And I don't like, the Denver game, like you said, was great, but, and I don't know what the numbers are against some of these other top tier teams offhand, but like I look at a matchup between Minnesota and Oklahoma City and I don't know how they match up defensively with the Thunder. Same thing, even with like a team like Memphis that can play a little bit smaller

when they have to. Houston, which is just scrappy with a bunch of wing guys and Sangoon, who's a monster on the perimeter. These are just tough matchups for Minnesota in the playoffs. Again, not that Cat was a great defender last year, but I would have much more confidence subbing Rudy out and going with the Cat-Nazried frontcourt than I do right now with a Nazaree Julius Randall front court. I think that's, that's a looming issue in the playoffs. I hope they can turn it around. Um, to at least be fun to watch. Yeah. At least be part of like, just, Hey, if this, and you know, maybe this or whatever, but like, you know, the Conley stretches for this year, and I know he's played better, but you know, I think the Jaden

McDaniels off ball cutting at times. It is like, okay, you know, this is, this is a little bit better. Even if there's other games. Even really good last couple of weeks. Yeah. Even if there's just too many games too, where he's just glued in the corner and you know, like, man, that's a lot of money for a defensive role player. Uh, but yeah, I mean, we're, we're coming up on February here and I don't know how anybody

could push back on just being underwhelmed by the Timberwolves, unfortunately. Let me ask one more question because it's, it's reflexively to talk about the Lakers, but I've just, I've watched every game they played this recent home stand. I don't know, I don't know what to make of them right now. Like the Philadelphia game kind of blew up in their face when AD went out. I'll kind of put that on a shelf right there. But during this this stretch where they won six of the last seven They had top five defense. I don't think they're a top five defensive team Don't get me wrong

But this is one of those things where the numbers you have to look at and say how much of this is sustainable Their offensive numbers were kind of right around what they've been all season long They were 11th and offensive rating during that seven game stretch, the 13th overall defense though, that went from 22 to five. Like how much of this are we buying into right now with the Lakers? Like are we, I don't consider them a championship team, but are we now looking at them as saying, all right, they get into the first round, maybe it's against Denver or somebody else. They can win a series. Like are we, have we bumped the Lakers up a tier at all the last couple of weeks? I'm glad you brought this up.

Cause I wasn't gonna bring them up cause I just don't think, you know, there's certainly none of the non-surprise list here. And I even said, cause I went to the Lakers Celtics game and it was really impressive from the Lakers. I thought they played their asses off. I thought they were smart with their approach. They were really physical and.

You know, they were just dominant wire to wire in that game. And when you watch the rotation, I think you would agree to like you go, Hey, there's a lot of guys that I kind of like in this. And if AD is rolling, um, I think the LeBron defensive stuff would likely just be better. There would just be more effort in the playoffs than what we've seen for long stretches during the regular season. Um, but. First round against Denver. the playoffs than what we've seen for long stretches during the regular season.

But first round against Denver. I don't know. If it was somebody else, like if you said first round against Memphis, I'd probably give them a shot, you know, because they do have this star power and they are playing better defensively. I don't know. Would you pick him against Houston? I don't know. There's experience coming to play in a situation like that. Fourth quarters, if they can keep it close, can LeBron and AD take over down the stretch? And to me, they're one of the biggest teams to watch in the next couple of weeks. They do have some moveable contracts. They do have some draft capital deal.

We saw AD make the most public plea possible to get a big man alongside him. Like how aggressive does Rob Pelenka get at this point? Like the better like the better his team plays and we'll see. I don't know what the injury is to AD and how serious that is coming off the Philly game. But like the better this team plays, the more pressures on that front office to do something to give them something that makes them better. I wouldn't listen to the players because the last time you did that you got Russell

Westbrook up there and kind of blew up everything around you. But if you think that, you know, Walker Kessler makes a difference, Jonas Fallon, Schunes makes a difference, even Vucevich makes a difference. I'm dying to know what they do for the deadline because the more they win, the more pressure, you know, comes up on Rob Palenka and his team. I do like them more now than I ever have, probably this season.

And it's not like all of a sudden like, hey, the road, but I think in D'Angelo Russell out of there just is a massive plus for so many of the different things that you want to do. And once that happens, like, okay, so they've got Finney Smith, Vanderbilt's back, which I know people have been waiting on for a long time. But I did the same exact exercises.

Like I made myself go, like, would you pick him against this team? Would you pick him against this team? Would you pick him against the Clippers? Yeah, I probably pick him against the Clippers right now. Do we even know? I thought Kawhi looked, so Kawhi's the first fourth quarter he's played all

seasons since he's been out. And I know the, Hey, I'm excited about Kawhi thing is usually put to your excitement is very, it's a very Charlie Brown, Lucy kind of example there. Like I can't wait. We're getting ready. The playoffs are coming. Well, he looked good. I thought he looked good.

Last time he did look great. He looked great. I just get, you gotta, you gotta have the calendar turn to April for me to like really start to get invested in Kauai. I don't know. Like I don't like people in LA, some of them think like getting Jared Vanderbilt back is like getting primed to Kembe Matumbo back in the lineup. I think he's going to make this incredible difference defensively. But I think Dorian Finney Smith has made an impact on that team. He's,

he's not this, he's not the guy who was three years ago, but he's still pretty solid and can still defend a few positions. They can make even a small move for another big, because I disagree with the premise of AD, right? The 2020 was like a lifetime ago, right? It was almost an entirely different NBA back then. Even if you brought that version of Dwight Howard and that version of Javelle McGee. I don't think they're going to make a huge impact on that Laker team. I do agree with the idea that they need somebody better than Christian Coloco or Jackson Hayes or inevitably Christian Wood. You need somebody better than one of those guys playing the non-AD minutes. That's when I think the Lakers get into some trouble. I don't think there

should be a center playing five next to AD for 30 minutes a game like there was five years ago. But getting somebody like that, that can usurp some of those minutes, take some of the physical load off him for five or six minutes per game, that's an idea I can get behind with the Lakers. I don't know if that's Valens-Hunis at this point defensively, but I almost felt like Washington signed him to be like, let's see what we can trade him for. Probably, it's an easy contract. Right. Just out there, let's just sign him and then we'll flip him before February. But yeah,

I like, I guess that's it. That's my headline. I like them more now than I have before. I still have a hard time figuring out how many teams I pick them more now than I have before. I still have a hard time figuring out how many teams I pick them against. What's the level? I can't figure out the level of this team. It's defensively specifically. Like they've been awful for most of the season defensively. But this recent stretch, they've been really good.

Now the schedule has stunk. We gotta be honest about that. Like the teams they're beating, the Washingtons, they go to Charlotte and win. Like they're putting up great defensive numbers against really bad offensive teams. But what's the level here? Like are they, when they get all their guys back,

are they top 15 at the upper half of the NBA defensively? Can they be that good? Because if they can be in the upper half of the league defensively, they could find a way to win a series here. And then it could get really interesting with those two guys. Yeah. And I'm making a huge assumption that LeBron is going to be more invested in it defensively in the playoffs.

I just have to imagine that he'll know he can't play the way he's played for such long stretches here defensively and that adds to it. But at least now, like at the best spacing lineup that they had was the worst defensive lineup. And now with Vinny Smith and Vanderbilt back in the mix, I think they can mix and match it a little bit better, but you can't take Reeves off the floor. You know that he's going to get hunted in hell. I mean, he's, he's like running a ton of their offense here, but he'd be probably off ball a little bit more in the playoffs, LeRon beyond the ball a little bit more in the playoffs, and then you have two new options that you didn't have there

defensively just hold up on the perimeter where they were just times, man. Even when you liked the names of the closing five, you're like, this is just, this is open season on these guys. Um, with the combinations that they had to pick from. All right, man, that was awesome. Thanks for doing this. Uh, anything to promote on the way out? Nope.

Uh, you can check out the new magazine that's coming out in a couple of weeks. A, a cover that I think you're really going to like Ryan. You can check out the new magazine that's coming out in a couple of weeks. A cover that I think you're really going to like, Ryan. I can't reveal it yet, but a cover that you're really going to be into. And of course, Dizone, we ramp it back up with all these shows starting this weekend as well. John L. Sullivan? No John L. Sullivan cover.

No retrospectives. A current cover athlete. I enjoyed his biography. I would recommend it to any boxing historians out there. Boxing was fun back in the day, man. Yeah. The guy, uh, he fell off a train once and was like, that's it done. Done drinking. Although I don't know if it was that incident in particular. It might've been that one. If that wasn't, it should be bought the train. If if anybody was gonna go out that night after falling off a train

It would have been John L. Sullivan, but he was done. No once he was done. He was like I'm out And man of his work. All right. Thank you so much man. I appreciate it. You got it You want details fine I drive a Ferrari. 355 Cabriolet. What's up? I have a ridiculous house in the South Fork. I have every toy you can possibly imagine. And best of all, kids, I am liquid.

So now you know what's possible. Let me tell you what's required. The email address is liveadvicerr.gmail.com. We've got Kyle. Morgan immediately just checks out. I don't know if I like that. I think you've proven yourself. We're playing down a man, dude. We kind of need a.

So Rudy's gone. He was texting me about the show yesterday and I sent him a like longer form thought about the show and kind of where I've been at lately. And he didn't respond. And then I realized like, you know what, we give him a break. Some of my theories, philosophies on things. Cause I was not going to call or text him this entire time he's away,

which is tough for me. Cause as you know, he's my muse. But when I sent him the followup to his really complimentary thing that he had had to say, I was like, but when I sent him this, the followup to his really complimentary thing that he had had to say, I was like, okay, wait, don't today's not the day. The week is not the week. Let the kid breathe. Let him breathe a little bit. Um, but war gone, I'll admit, like we'll just go behind the curtain here.

You've been in the mix now for a little while. I had no idea if I trusted you enough. Um, and not only do I trust you, now I look forward to you. In any form. Yeah. I praise. Thanks, man. That we can get. Yeah. Happy to be here.

Okay, yeah. You know, I don't know if you're like always going to be in the rotation, but goddamn if you don't deliver. So we'll just keep the camera up. That's what we want to do here. All right. Okay. Okay.

Season loading. Let's go. Yeah, here we go. Uh, the Carlton draft thing it's pronounced, I guess, draft from the Australian kid with no game, um, it's spelled a little bit differently. I will admit I have this weird draft draw hangup thing, um, because of the Waterloo Iowa crew, shout out to Waterloo. Uh, there was always this draw thing that I would hear.

And so then I kind of carried that over. Probably would not have happened, but without my Waterloo experience, I'd not be the man I am today. So I'm happy to make that mistake. This is where Kyle and Wargon are like, how is he doing this today? Okay. Let's talk Poughkeepsie. Here we go. These always make it to the top of the cube. Hi gang, especially fellow mid Hudson Valier Kyle, 34, 5'9", 180. No gym stats as I use machines since I've had a number of injuries. Only basketball comp I have is my old soccer buddies from college used

to call me Cory bad porn McGuetti. Okay. We're all huge Grantland fans is I could only drive the ball. Here's a quick one for you. I moved back to America after living in Europe for 10 years on accident. As I came back for a month. Thanks. Chechia vacation laws.

What? Um, to visit my parents and COVID happened and my flight back to Europe was canceled. I ended up finding a job in the crown jewel itself, but Kipsey during my normal, doing my normal IT work, the job itself was actually not bad because finding IT work in the Hudson Valley is quite difficult. However, I immediately could tell the woman, female, who hired me didn't like me and her buddies at work who she conversed with the most would actively avoid me. I had a peer at my company who I could trust enough to ask why it seemed like they didn't like me.

It was shocking for me as I get along with everyone, I've never had any bad job reviews or bad blood with coworkers in my life. He told me straight up it was because I was from Red Hook, a small town, 25 minutes north of Poughkeepsie. He said, they called me a city it, which is a play on the word city and idiot. Meaning I was a transplant from New York city. Here's the thing. I've never lived in New York city. I grew up in Red Hook, graduated high school there. My parents at the time still lived there.

My coworker then I want to tell me he also thought I'd be annoying since I'm from, since I'm from Red Hook. And that means I'm just a New York city transplant. I'd never heard of the stereotype of my life. Uh, especially since I didn't know a single kid in high school from New York city living there. And if anything, people from Poughkeepsie and South have a very heavy cultural influence from New York city, which my town did not.

So Kyle, do people from Poughkeepsie really have these stereotypes of us, or was this company just full of odd people? Are we as Americans not supposed to move and live in the same place our whole lives? I can't imagine hating someone solely because of where they are from. Do people in California or Connecticut care about this? As someone from a small town, I can't imagine being forced to never move. Attached proof of job in Poughkeepsie. He, he sent us his parking permit. Okay.

Yeah, this is a very localized one, but we like to do this for our guy, Kyle. Yeah, so I mean, it's within the county. Do they think you're in from like the Red Hook downstate maybe? I don't know. Maybe you got to clear that up. But I mean, I grew up, I mean here, I'll never live on the other side of the river. I could tell you that, but Red Hook's on my side.

What's the other side of the river? What are some of those towns? It's like Highland, Kingston, like, I don't know. They're just, my dad always called them hillbillies as a joke and it just stuck with me. I took it seriously. So I'm, my dad always called them hillbillies as a joke and it just stuck with me. I took it seriously. So I'm not the other side of the river guy. I'm on the right side of the river

and when I eventually move back, it will be on the correct side of the river. But Red Hook's on my side. So I don't know. I've never heard anything weird about Red Hook. I don't know. I've heard like Reinbeck is like a nice place. People were like, oh, those people are rich over there.

I don't know if anybody's totally rich up there, but that's not true. Ryback's pretty nice. But yeah, this is strange. I'm wondering if maybe they're thinking you're from the other Red Hook, which is like down state. Maybe that's what that is. But yeah, you're on the correct side of the river, so I don't know what's going on. Orgon, you live in the city. Do you have anything to offer here that's remotely connected to this? Absolutely nothing. I've been up to like New Paltz area, but that's that's not what we're really talking about right Kyle No, definitely not what we're talking about. Yeah, I got nothing here Okay, did you just tell us are there two red hooks? Yeah, I think there's a red hook like near the city, right?

I don't I think there's like like a downstate red hook. Like I think that's the more famous one I think there's like a downstate Red Hook. I think that's the more famous one. I mean, Red Hook's like a small town north of Poughkeepsie. So I don't really know what this is all about. A duchess, a village in duchess County? Yeah, yeah, that's where duchess County cats. So that this should all be one group. Yeah, I'm confused.

And then you're talking about Red Hook, New York city being something entirely different. I think there's like a neighborhood or an area down there. Right. Yeah. I'm like, maybe they think you're from the wrong Red Hook. I don't know. But yeah, this doesn't, this doesn't matter. Red Hook is, is Brooklyn. Yeah.

This doesn't make, unless that's what they, all right. So now I was having a hard time following you, but I see what you're saying. Did they think that like you were from Brooklyn and that's why they did all these things? I don't, I don't really have a lot to offer other than maybe just a wider perspective on this. I think hating other towns, shouldn't that shit kind of go away after high school? Yeah. When you play your last snap, usually it starts to diminish and then you got like five years and then you got to get over it, I think.

I don't know. Like I hated Nantucket because I was just supposed to hate Nantucket. And we even got, I think my college years, there was a brawl at an after party once. Um, you know, nothing wasn't like anybody really got hurt. It was just like a stupid thing. And then I went to Nantucket like later on, I was like, this place is awesome. Like why, you know, imagine being like in your thirties walking down the street, like headed to the bookstore and you see some guy with his whale shirt on

and you're like, dick. I don't know what I mean the whale shirt, which is ironically in the Vineyard Vines thing, which I think local Vineyard people were like, why is the whale thing that's so much more associated with Nantucket on a shirt that has the Vineyard name on it? But you know what? I don't know that a lot of people even care about those politics.

So we'll, uh, I just asked. I've been vocal about, I don't like Vineyard Vines for some reason. I don't know what it is. I just not a fan. I don't think it's the right fit for you. I think there's a lot of people that appreciate the colors, the options. Yeah. I think I've just met a lot of people out and about in a Vineyard Vines.

I'm like, yeah, you're not somebody I'd be around, like just your behavior. And I think it's just been purely where I was and who was there, but, um, a lot of douchebags and vineyard vines, not saying all. So that's what you're saying. It's a red flag shirt for you. Yeah, I think so. In certain settings. Hmm.

Okay. I don't think that's, uh, I'm not shocked by that. I'm not shocked by that at all, but yeah, like the other towns, like what's your, do you have a rival town, Oregon? Where are you from? What's your hometown? I'm from Roxbury. So we didn't, we didn't fuck with Randolph, New Jersey. That makes sense. Right next door. Yeah. That was, were they the richer town or the poorer town? They were a little more wealthy. Everything was a little nicer in Randolph.

They were in Mendham.. Everything was a little nicer in Randolph. They weren't Mendham. Mendham had, had money. Do the richer towns get a bad rap throughout American history? From the poorer towns, yeah. Yeah. It sounds like a lot of times, like when you think back, like, oh, the richie riches, you know, like, I don't like those guys. You know what I think the goal should be? Live in the rich town and have everybody be pissed at you.

Yeah. I just know I was on the goal should be living in the rich town and have everybody be pissed at you. Yeah. I just know I was on the golf team in high school and we played Mendham and golf and it was at their country club and Mendham and their team was allowed to use the driving range and we were not allowed to use the driving range. There you go. Don't know what to do with nice stuff. They couldn't let you out. Yeah.

Can't trust these public school kids. Yeah. Okay. All right. Well, yeah, that one was a little, you know, it's a global audience, but. Maybe ask them if they want to go to the Duchess County Fair. Let them know you're a Duchess County guy. Maybe like, are you guys excited for this? He doesn't work there anymore. The German festival. He also said, he said he didn't care. But I think that is weird.

I think you should feel like you were right. And that they were weird that immediately they put up these boundaries, these walls around you. And now it makes more sense. Yeah, the crowd is bigger than Red Hook by the way. Red Hook's a village. I mean, they don't even have town status anyway. Yeah. I mean, we're talking real low population numbers

as I'm doing some research here on the side, but I know how much- You guys don't even have town status. Anyway. Yeah. I mean, we're talking real low population numbers as I'm doing some research here on the side, but I know I'm not sure. Who's in charge of that place. Uh, okay. Uh, here's, here's one about wife, a wife getting breast implants, 41 years old, six foot, one 85 live in the Northeast, work in finance, no basketball comp. However, the sore neck squat Squattober program in November, he did this set a new squat personal record of 335 up from my prior PR of a year ago, 315.

Ryan, you should give this a go next year. Since you mentioned you recently squatted for the first time in a while and disappointed your numbers. It wasn't even just that. Like if you don't do that movement in the natural squat stuff, but again, kind of regret going after it and likely shrinking a little bit during COVID. But hey, you know, it wasn't a lot going on. So it's a month-long volume-based

program that I've ran the past four Novembers. Great success. All right. I don't know that I'm ever going to get back to like just going hardcore heavy, heavy squats again. But anyway, I appreciate your guidance and suggestion. I also drive a sick GMC Sierra pick attached. Now Kyle and Rosilla will appreciate it. I recall Steve saying in a prior pod that trucks are unnecessary.

Probably one of the lowest approval rating moments for Saruti on the pilot ever. Just that. I think pilots, he got pissed off a couple of pilots, but yeah, more people with trucks than planes. Can you imagine big arms Saruti now after his baby's birth, not having a truck? Maybe now that his arms are bigger, he'll like that window down. I used to like driving around with my shirt off in the truck.

Cause that was just a showstopper. Not that I looked good, but it was just like that guy doesn't, that doesn't give me, cause it made me back in the day. It's just great. Couple of dudes fresh off a shift. Stick into the seat. Yeah. As you get out.

Dire straights. Just keep a towel in there like you're getting off a weight bench or something. Just towel it off. Just, hey, do we put shirts on? Of course not. All right. I could tell you having two boys playing sports and constant depot trips, it's an absolute lifesaver hauling stuff around

and never needing to ask to borrow a buddy's truck. Like I'm in the market for one. I really am. I miss having them. It's been a long time. I think it's time to go back to it. I just don't think I can fit it in my current parking situation. I saw a dually the other day, I think it was diesel.

It sounded awesome, pulled up right next to it. And then of course, living in LA, I was like, where does he park that ever? And he probably doesn't park it anywhere in LA. He probably doesn't live in, I think he, I think he had some kind of generator in the back of park it anywhere in LA. He probably doesn't live in, I think he had some kind of generator in the back of it on top of everything else.

I was like, God, look at all that equipment. Anyway, I've been married 13 years, have two kids, absolute best partner, friend I could dream of. We put the work in and have what I consider as close to a perfect marriage as you can have. I'm truly blessed as the product of multiple divorces. I've always dreamed of having the relationship I have now.

The best relationship advice I've ever received was prior to my marriage from my mom. She said to watch what you tell others because if you share 10 positive stories and one negative, that negative story will be the only that they remember. Using this approach, I always keep my conversations about my marriage with my friends positive and am thoughtful about what I share.

This approach has served us well. Wow, how about that guys? Kyle newly married, Oregon, you writing that one down? Yeah man, that's a good one. I feel like I've heard that one before. I feel like we put Kyle in a tough spot to follow that kind of advice just because of the rabbit content alone. Yeah, I mean I think she's shameless about the rabbits. It's fine. She's like, yeah, worth it. So that's fine. It's really the only thing.

Rabbits are what they are, yeah. Yeah, these are the only points of criticism I usually offer. No, but I think that's some heavy stuff. If you were to say to yourself, I am going to, no matter what, in all those tough times, because they're gonna happen, I am going to be positive about my wife every time

somebody asks about it. I think that'd be really hard to do. It would be because you could even talk about potentially the value of like venting to that one good friend about those disruptive times, should we say. Or you're being nice. He's, he's saying some stuff that he's going through and you're like, yeah, I hear you, dude, here's one thing about me. Right? Yeah. Right. Right.

Yeah. You want to have a little bitch fest? Another round. Now to the question. I have a strong group of eight or so core guys who I've been tight with 25, 30 years, we all text all day, live a few minutes away from each other. The wives are also friends, but not at the same level. The guys are as having kids can do.

My wife experienced some changes to her body. She decided to get breast implants and the surgery is planned in the next few months. She's planning on staying proportional. However, I'm assuming it will be noticeable to our friends. We belong to a lake in the summer and a few of them will be seeing her in a bikini. I don't like the idea of just sending out a text announcing it. I don't like that idea either.

No paper towel. Yeah. Well, I don't know. I mean, I don't, you know, it's not like this is an RSVP here. Hey, you're going to save the day coming up. I'm going to be at the lake house June 28th, right after the draft. Um, I don't know. I think the draft will be right around then.

He'll probably not be worrying about the draft. Uh, I don't like the idea of sending out the text. Anyone's going to be worried about the draft. I don't know, I think the draft will be right around then. He'll probably not be worrying about the draft. I don't like the idea of sending out the text anyway. However, I'd prefer if, as word trickles out, people aren't talking behind my back. Not sure of the best approach, but this feels a little bit like oversharing on my part.

My wife will be gradually telling the other wives as it gets closer, I'm sure some of the husbands will find out that way. I realize I'm most likely being over sensitive to this given these are essentially lifelong friends at this point. However, I have an aversion to sharing intimate details in my marriage. I should add that my wife is also pretty private

and considers this something, there's really nobody's business. Curious how the gang would handle this. Look, immediate reaction, I think you're overthinking this. I think that you did a great job of laying like the foundation of how you look at your relationship with your wife and what you want to share and how supportive you want to be and like back to the

positive thing that we're commending you on here. Cause I think that's really hard to do and most people couldn't do it. And the fact that you've stayed with this approach and that it leads to a really healthy relationship. These are all, all incredible things. But then I think it can get to the point where it's like, you're almost overdoing it. You're almost overdoing. These are all, all incredible things.

But then I think it can get to the point where it's like, you're almost overdoing it here. Like to figure out the best way to tell your core group of guys that you've known 25, 30 years about breast implants, like who gives a shit? So many people are doing this now. It doesn't matter. Um, so you don't want to announce it to everybody. Okay. But you don't want everybody talking about people are going to say something about it.

They're just going to, and you know what the thing is? Come on. It's a bit, it's a bit, it's a bit like the hometown thing that we just talked about of like, do you want to be in the poor town or the rich town? You know, so like if Doug is texting Steve, hey, did, did Dale get an upgrade? Did Dale's wife do a little remodeling?

You know, that's going to happen. And I understand like you'd rather it didn't. Yeah, we'd all, we'd all like a lot of things to not be said about us behind our backs, but that's the reality. And this isn't a bad thing. You're in the nice part of town now. So to Cargara. I, uh, yeah, right. I'm just telling you like, I would, I would allow the, the flow of this to flow and, and however it's going to flow and not worry about it.

If these truly are your best friends, uh, the only thing will be like, wow, you know, did you see that? You know, maybe there'll be a wife in the group that's like, Oh, I can't believe she did that, you know, which is always like, what do you care? You know, you jealous or you're against it. Okay, fine. Like I get it. But my gut reaction to this is because you have been so good about that dynamic

of relationship and protective of, of like the sharing part of this, that you're like kind of cost trying to apply those same principles to what is something that's largely irrelevant to the friend dynamic. So I wouldn't, I don't think there is some, Hey, this's largely irrelevant to the friend dynamic. So I wouldn't, I don't think there is some, hey, this is the perfect way to do this.

It's just, I'm gonna go to the lake, people are gonna notice something will be said with you not knowing it and you're gonna be okay. Yeah, maybe just get your W eyebrows raised ready. You know, that viral thing that's been going around from the inauguration where W is just like, and you're going to be okay. Yeah, maybe just get your W eyebrows raised ready. You know, that viral thing that's been going around from the inauguration where W is just like... I can't even do the face, but maybe that's just...

It sounded good when you did it. I would save this for the lake. I think that's the reveal. It will be talked about by everyone. Probably, like, I was just thinking this was, like, I didn't have a friend whose mom had boob implants when I was a young boy. She said, yeah, two boys. Like, it would have been addressed

if all of a sudden my buddy Tyler's mom just came in looking, I mean, it just would have been addressed. It'll be talked about no matter what. And I just think, I think I just wait, let everyone find out in their own time. I think it would be weird, like, I can't even imagine how you would frame it. It would be more awkward than you're already prepared

for it to be if you tried to give somebody a little prep work, I think. Yeah, I mean, people are definitely gonna be talking about this behind your back, but not in a negative way. I think it's just something people talk about. And if you're close with these guys, maybe they'll talk about it with you too.

I don't think it's- There's gonna be a wife. There's gonna be a wife that doesn guys, like maybe I'll talk about it with you too. I don't know. There's going to be a wife. There's going to be a wife that doesn't like it. All right. Yeah, sure. I could draw a picture of her right now, by the way. But, like if your goal in life is to never have anybody ever say

anything like negative about you. Just do worse than everyone else. Just do worse than everyone else in all aspects. But I understand like this is all coming from a really good place. But I think your effort here should be. More focused on. Like not trying to avoid something that is unavoidable. And you know, like you ever want to play that game? You're like, I wonder what they said about me when I left.

You know, you just drive yourself crazy. Yeah, it doesn't sound like he has a one guy who's like the guy that doesn't have a wife and brought his own six pack and will be, you know, not three sheets to the wind, but maybe a bit of a wild card. Once it's time for everyone to get in the lake. And it doesn't even sound like he's worried about Tommy being like, whoa. It's like catcalling. Yeah, not catcalling, but just like maybe, you know, just not being as subtle as everyone else is going to be. So it doesn't even sound like you have that problem. Because then I would be like, all right, maybe we have to, you know, I don't want her to be.

It sounds like this guy's like John Sacramoni level cares about his wife, always says nice things about her, doesn't want her to ever feel uncomfortable, no jokes will be made. The goddamn tailor meals? You get the fucker for a million? That was a good one. Whoa.

That was, I think that was his best line of the show. Okay, all right. No, I just, you cranked it up a notch on the quotes. That's all. Yes, sorry just you cranked it up a notch on the go. That's all. Spread around the infield here right now. Anything you guys, I don't know. I mean, if you were,

if you were presented with this, you're just giving another in out. Presented with maybe doing it. Yeah. I think, think I mean almost all answers are like that sounds great you look great this is great I don't know if the if the money's right hands off there yeah yeah if the money's right yeah I mean if we're talking about well just interesting way of phrasing it if it's like all right well I guess we'll, we'll keep our cars for a

while because we got to do this. Maybe it would be like, I would take a financial way, you know, I'd be like, you know, I've been really thinking about getting rid of this Mustang. And if I have to keep driving for seven more years because of this, maybe not. But if the money's right, yeah, I think you just. Yeah. Yeah. When's that fair? I think you just, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. When's that fair?

I don't know, man. I don't, I don't know if I'm ready to do this with Wargon. So I've just, I think your quote was good enough. We'll just keep moving. We'll just keep moving up here. Uh, okay. That'll do it for the advice today. I also wanted to update the audience.

This is not significant at all. So there's no announcement really. Um, but we had said on a previous podcast, I was going to update the audience. This is not significant at all. So there's no announcement really. But we had said on a previous podcast, I was going to do a children's only episode where I was going to read a children's book. And we actually did that episode. We read The Little Island and it was going to be like kind of a silly thing they were going to do

on the podcast where then I was going to tweet it out like kids only, which actually, as I talk about it now, it seems weird. But I was reading a children's book based on the which actually as I talk about it now, it seems weird. But I was reading a children's book based on the amount of feedback that I've gotten over the years of people telling me that they put on the podcast

for their child to fall asleep. So I'm like, what a funny way to bring it full circle. I'll pick a children's book, went to Barnes and Noble, found this award-winning one, The Little Island. And I read it and it was like six minutes. I sent the clip to Sarutti to listen to, and that was all we were going to post. It was going to be like Wednesday's episode.

This is it. Nothing else. No monologue, which again, maybe puts adults to sleep. But in the middle of Sarutti listening to it, he goes, are we even allowed to do this? I was like, you know what? Wish I had thought about that. Cause you're right, like publishing and then you have to read it.

Yeah, do you have to read it, reach out to the publisher? And then it's all of a sudden people are like sending PDFs to each other. And it's like, we appreciate. So we can't release it because we don't know. And I don't even think we're going to bother asking. Cause you just know like on the corporate level of how much of a hassle this will be. And also like the publishers, like, what is this guy trying to do? People fall asleep to his voice.

Now he's reading a kid's book. I would think you would want me to read the book cause it's kind of like promotion of it. And it was a good book too. I enjoyed it even though I'm older, but we couldn't release the episode. And I know I had teased it saying we were going to do it. And you probably thought like, maybe I enjoyed it, even though I'm older. But we couldn't release the episode. And I know I had teased it saying we were gonna do it. And you probably thought like, maybe I was just fucking with everybody

and I wasn't even gonna do it. I don't even swear in it too, for the people that don't like the occasional swearing. So I thought that was important, if it was a kid's episode. So I don't know what to do. We're gonna try to figure this one out. And then of course, Allison was like,

you should just write a kid's book. And then she sent me like seven celebrities and all the kids books. Yeah, writing and I was like, I don't wanna do that. I mean, you could just write a kid's book. And then she sent me like seven celebrities and all the kids books. Yeah, writing. And I was like, I don't want to do that. Use that as a springboard and just put your own little touches on it and it's done. Maybe that's like an afternoon.

I don't think I want to do that. I know what you're saying, but like if I'm gonna write a kid's book, I'm gonna write it, you know, but I'm not gonna write the shit out of it. Yeah. And I'm also not going to do that too. So, um, there's that part of it.

So yeah, to the kids out there that are listening, my apologies. And I owe you one. I don't know how we're going to do it. I'm thinking about like a four year old falling asleep to your old NFL opens with the, uh, with the tackling sound in it. They're dozing off. I'm not saying Daniel Jones is going to be like a pro bowler, but I'll tell you, there was like two third down throws this week.

I'm like, I see it. I understand what they saw when they took him that high. It's just immediate, just drool all over the place. Um, so I think what we're going to try to do is I think we need to find a children's author that can just okay it. Self-published, yeah. Well, see, okay, but I don't wanna do that. And now I'm not mad at Kyle for saying it that way.

But then it turns into, then somebody sees the opportunity to be like, oh, this guy will promote my book or whatever. So I feel like you kind of had it already have done the children's author thing at a successful level for us to want to get on board with it. If that makes sense. Because like we do get pitched a lot of different things where I get it. I understand, but like almost the only person that would benefit from the pitch is the person that's pitching it, which I understand is kind of the motivation behind some of it. But like there has to be like a little bit of a give and

take where you're like, Oh, I'm excited to have this guest on, who will promote all those different things. I don't know how to fix this one unless we're going to hear from published children's authors that can give us the authority to read their book without then some copyright infringement that I think Saruti halfway through listening to the episode was just pretty smart to go, hey, dumbass, can we even do this?

I was like, yeah, you're right. I don't know if we can. What do we put Phil Collins' music bed in the background too while we're at it? Just, I think this now that you did this, I think this is solved in two weeks. I think you'll have this done in two weeks. I think the reach is far enough that somebody will

meet the specifications and we'll all feel good about it. I love you'll have this done in two weeks. I think the reach is far enough that somebody will meet the specifications and we'll all feel good about it. I love Alison. Everybody knows so much. I love Alison, our booker. When then she was like, no, no, this would be perfect. Just write a kid's book.

And I was like, are you insane? Just write a kid's book. I guess, I mean, look, if you read some kid book, you're like, when did you write this? Which day was this? But I think there's some magic in there. I think there's like a method to all of it that works where like something takes off,

is you just be like one poop, two poop, three poop, four, you know, like, does this, did this take a long time? What was the edit on this? Like. All right, L. Ron Hubbard, right? Yeah, right. So I guess I could just another recent idea that was one of the worst ideas she's ever had, I don't know that we'll ever share publicly.

She knows it's a terrible idea. And she's so upset about how bad of an idea is retroactively to when she thought this thing was gonna be a really good idea for me. And now she's just horrified by the whole thing. And I think that's the biggest thing. I think that's the biggest thing. I think that's the biggest thing. I think that's the biggest thing. I think that's the biggest thing. idea and she's so upset about how bad of an idea is retroactively to like when she thought this

thing was going to be a really good idea for me. And now she's just like horrified by the whole thing. She's going to hate that we did this, but I don't care. She's the best and whatever. I just wanted to share that. All right. That's enough rambling for this episode. We'll be back on Friday. We've got McShay, we've got, I think Tony Gonzalez on top of everything else. We're also going to be releasing an episode on the new Henry V book, which I finished up. That author is going to join us. Jones, incredible book. A lot of fun.

Warrior Prince. Yeah, man. Yeah. So there you go. Thanks to Kyle. Thanks to Wargon. Ryan Roussela podcast. Check out the YouTube page and Ringer Spotify. ["Ringer Spotify Theme Song"]

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